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Drk_Oblitr8r wrote:I'm 100% sure Deff Dread is a townie..

I agree with you, I don't find [BishopGore and Lord-Loss] suspicious. Although, I find the fact I don't find them suspicious makes me a little suspicious of them

Fifty posted a fair bit during Day 1, though he was quiet towards the end.

I want you to look at the two parts of your post above and consider them for a little bit. Then I want you to tell me why you're 100% certain on DDRE but that you trust LL and BG so much that you now don't trust them. This makes no sense to me. Theoretically you don't find them suspicious because they haven't done anything suspicious and consequently that suggests they are more likely to be townish, not less likely. If you find them suspicious it should be for a reason other then that they appear to be very townish, yes?

the_ferrett wrote:Thorr: You actually. I find that without outside influence, my estimates rely stongly upon who would be least effected by a 'guiding' force like an inquisitor. Obvious choice is the one already guiding the ship. Which means you. Sorry mate.

If I'm reading you correctly you're saying I am most suspicious because I don't appear to need an Inquisitor to lead me around? Isn't that a state we want all of the town to be in? Presumably my self-confidence in not needing to follow the Inquisitor comes from me having played more games of Genestealer/Mafia then many of the other players here - this in no way seems to then suggest that I am either town or scum - why do you think it's worth making that logical leap to deciding my experience then means I'm a Genestealer?

Because I can't see snyone else and saying so would be an admission of inexperience.

Drk_Oblitr8r wrote:Besides ferrett, I find Fifty suspicious, as I don't think I remember him posting yesterday

If you look closely, you'll see I didn't post in the run up to the lynch, due to a variety of facts. I was filling in application forms, so was online on the forums, but did not have time to read this thrad sufficiently well to post. Once the ban was in, I could not post, ((except my OOC post to point out it was the night phase to some people)). Since then I have posted again. I'd like to see a breakdown of who has posted the most in this thread, not including filler posts and weasel posts that add nothing.

If my lack of activity was a smoke-screen for a suspicious vote, I would agree with you that it was scummy. As it stands, I was voting for you at the time, along with a few others... Can any conclusions be drawn from that, other than the fact you do not like being voted for? I do not think so.

Arheiner wrote:@Thor/DDRE-I have been inactive here, yes but thats because I forgot this was playing too for several days, and now i'm back. Just looked over the thread and it looks very blurry right now to me, and no obvious suspects at all. Also interesting is the amount of comparisons with other parts of the forum, Seems more tactics are coming into this game than other ones.

I'm not buying it.

"Whoopsy daisy, didn't see you lot were still about and talking." Is an extremely poor excuse. It says to me, either you show disinterest in the game, which is never good or that you were trying to blend into the back round. Perhaps you have something to hide, perhaps not. Yet I can't help but feel it is unlikely that you missed this thread when you were still frequently having looks at the other. They are both in the same forum section, thus missing this one seems unlikely. Plus, your post was a perfect example of talking but not really saying anything.

So, just to get you talking a bit more, whom do you find suspicious?

Shas what do you think?

Shas seemed to have done the same as Arheiner and hasn't posted since the start of Day Two?

He has indeed, which is why he(Shas'O) and Arheiner are now my top suspects, speaking of Shas not posting in a bit...

Gornall, would you mind giving Shas'O a prod?

Edited to add letters in bold.

Ferrett, I find you suspicious because you answer most questions with a question. You don't want to answer vague questions but are happy to be given direct questions. Vague questions are a good way of interacting, you can't ask specific questions until some comments made in a vague question require specific answers.

So you wanted a question from me? Why, when faced with a choice between 2 people and knowing that a lynch is important on day 1 to gather evidence to make Day 2 worthwhile, did you fight it so hard?

I'm impressed that LL thinks I'm a backbone of the town, since I have to admit that I've been so confused by the circles run in this game so far that I've not been posting nearly as much as I otherwise would. That and starting a new job.

Right now I am suspicious of Ferrett (see above) and the comment of Drk_O's of him being so sure DDRE is a townie... I'm unsure what he has done to be so definitely pro town. It's the first really suspicious thing I feel Drk_O has done this game.

I get the feeling that Drk_O is pointing at DDRE and saying "townie" so that when Drk_O gets caught, everyone will think DDRE is a 'stealer too, and lynch DDRE instead of the real 'stealer.

Heh, weasel. I 'like' that.

Bishop. Tell me: Which one of these would you be able to answer more easily? "How does diamond work?" or "What is the molecular structure of diamond?" For me, its the second. The first enables me to guess what you want given context, but even then its mostly guesswork, the second enables me to make a thought out and logical decision and points me to the starting point of my search. Sometimes all you need is a good question.(And no this isn't a filler post, this is answering a direct question).

If you asked me how diamond works, I would ask what precisely you meant, but also give you a few snippets of what I thought you might be asking. The idea here is to give out information to let people get a handle on you, to be honest enough to know that sometimes people aren't asking "How does diamond work" but are actually asking "Are you trustworthy? Are you keeping your cards close to your chest or openly talking with us?"

You don't come across as trustworthy. You seem paranoid and uncooperative. That's not pro-town from my point of view.

And who said weasel? Oddly enough I was trying to work that pun into my post on the other thread, but it didn't come across as funny in my mind, so I dropped it.

The weasel thing came from Fifty - saying weasel posts shouldn't count for a post count. I'm not sure what a post count would give us (other then proving I spend too much time on this site) but if someone wants to undertake it more power to them.

the_ferrett wrote:Because I can't see snyone else and saying so would be an admission of inexperience.

Why is it important to you not to admit inexperience (especially since you just did so)?

I'm going to drop down my vote now;

Vote: Drk_O

Yeah, it's nothing shockingly new from me, I know, but I still think he looks scummy. Also, hopefully the vote will encourage him to come explain his DDRE read and how it relates to his LL and BG reads as well. Drk_O's lynch will also give us more info on DDRE, whom I consider pretty scummy in connection with Drk_O but I'm not sure I see evidence of either of them being scummy with anyone else. Also, Drk_O's flip will give us more information on everyone who was/wasn't on the Drk_O bandwagon yesterday.

ferret is probably my second most scummy at the moment. It's hard because I'll admit he might just be really unsure of what to do, but when his unsureness manifests as multiple players (certainly more players then there are Genestealers) requesting he does more 'A' and his response is to immediately do more 'B' I am forced to wonder why he's being so intentionally obtuse about the whole thing. Either he's inexperienced and should be willing to take the lead a little from others, or he should have his own method and be able to explain them. Instead he mostly seems to be sitting around and telling us our methods are weak/bad but he has no alternatives and doesn't want to help us. That's terrible and could very easily be a way for a Genestealer to try to stay under the radar.

I still disagree with the shas'o lynch idea - other then just not posting much I can't think of anything he's done that's scummy. I would like to ask anyone rooting for a shas'o lynch to ask themselves why they're choosing shas'o over Arheiner. If you can't answer that then you need to reexamine your decision.

Current Vote Count:

0- Thor
0- DDRE
0- Lord-Loss
0- Fifty
0- Arheiner
0- BishopGore
0- Brother Stynier
1- Drk_Oblit............(Thor)
1- Shas O'vera........(Fifty)
0- Ferret


With 10 Alive, it takes 6 to lynch.

Thor665 wrote:

Drk_Oblitr8r wrote:I'm 100% sure Deff Dread is a townie..

I agree with you, I don't find [BishopGore and Lord-Loss] suspicious. Although, I find the fact I don't find them suspicious makes me a little suspicious of them

Fifty posted a fair bit during Day 1, though he was quiet towards the end.

I want you to look at the two parts of your post above and consider them for a little bit. Then I want you to tell me why you're 100% certain on DDRE but that you trust LL and BG so much that you now don't trust them. This makes no sense to me. Theoretically you don't find them suspicious because they haven't done anything suspicious and consequently that suggests they are more likely to be townish, not less likely. If you find them suspicious it should be for a reason other then that they appear to be very townish, yes?

With Deff Dread, I think I may have read too much into n0t_u's "Gah, you fools" post. In the scrambled part, there was "ead" amongst it, and figured it meant DDRE. While I know posting useful info in such a post is against the rules, I don't think it'd matter much because he was dead anyway.

It makes less sense to me when you explained it. But I think it's something similar to what the_ferrett is talking about. Making themselves look like up standing townians, as a cover for something more sinister. I'm just keeping an eye on them for now.

Of course 'ead' could also be 'dead' or 'read' just as easily. I'm not sure what to think of you trying to base a read of 100% off of n0t_u's post. Even if we were going on the presumption that his message was about DDRE what makes you think the scrambled message was DDRE is innocent as opposed to DDRE is a Genestealer? <--very serious question.

Well, the post said innocent, rather clearly. So, I assumed it meant innocent. Although, it was rather clear, as I said.

Good point, I hadn't looked back at his post.

How much of your 100% on DDRE is from this post?

Thor665 wrote:Good point, I hadn't looked back at his post.

How much of your 100% on DDRE is from this post?

100% ^_^"

So your 100% clearing of DDRE is based on the concept that n0t_u broke the rules and left us a clue in his death post and that also Gornall missed it/didn't care?

Yeah...I may just stick with the possibility you're a scumpair considering DDRE's commentary about you yesterday.

@ferret - what are your thoughts on this conversation?

@Drk_O - do you still find Fifty suspicious now that he has explained why he posted less during the end of Day 1?

@DDRE - what is your read on Drk_O clearing you? Do you agree/disagree with his logic?

My read would be that not_u said "lead innocent" So he either cleared someone or found nothing in the way the syntax of his sentance read. Either that or his death message has ALOT missing.

I am of course rather grateful, that at least one person believes in my innocents. However, basing it off a disjointed death blurb isn't overly wise. Looking back I do seem scummy, it would be hard for one not to say at least one thing that could be taken as scummy(IMHO).

As for you considering me and Drk_O a scumpair because of what I said about him, and(I'm assuming)the drastic change it has taken. I now have other suspects, and while I still hold Drk in great suspicion(perhaps he is scum, trying to merely make us look like a scum pair), Ferret and Arheiner are now top of my suspect list.

Thor665 wrote:The weasel thing came from Fifty - saying weasel posts shouldn't count for a post count.

Well, that would be in an ideal world. I am nto sure it is really possible to distinguish weasel from worthy in a black-and-white way. It will all be shades of grey, sadly.

I still disagree with the shas'o lynch idea - other then just not posting much I can't think of anything he's done that's scummy. I would like to ask anyone rooting for a shas'o lynch to ask themselves why they're choosing shas'o over Arheiner. If you can't answer that then you need to reexamine your decision.

For me, it is that he has been called on his lack of activity and been asked to explain it, but each time he posts (very infrequent) it is to either say he is inexperienced, or to really add nothing. He just seems to me to be someone who is trying to stay under the radar by being uncontroversial, and needs to be more active so we can make a judgement of whether he is town or 'stealer. With the posting he has done so far, I don't think we have enough to go on, and that desire to hide himself is quite scummy.

I have not been looking as closely at Arheiner, but if what you say is true, I would feel a similar way about him.

I worry that Dark_O has achieved the same as he did in the last game - lots of pressure in the first day phase, followed by attention drifting away. I do feel pressure needs to stay on him too, and I see him as a possible vote towards the end of the day.

Thor665 wrote:So your 100% clearing of DDRE is based on the concept that n0t_u broke the rules and left us a clue in his death post and that also Gornall missed it/didn't care?

Yeah...I may just stick with the possibility you're a scumpair considering DDRE's commentary about you yesterday.

Well, if you put it like that it sounds like I'm crazy. But I never said Gornall missed it/didn't care. I just figured there wouldn't be much he could do about it, or at least n0t_u thought so, or it didn't matter cause he was dead anyway..

@Drk_O - do you still find Fifty suspicious now that he has explained why he posted less during the end of Day 1?

I didn't find him suspicious because he posted less at the end. I found him suspicious because I didn't remember him posting. He didn't leave a lasting impression. Although, that could probibly be our (Thors and I's) fault because of our interactions yesterday.

the_ferrett wrote:My read would be that not_u said "lead innocent" So he either cleared someone or found nothing in the way the syntax of his sentance read. Either that or his death message has ALOT missing.

I didn't consider he would have said "lead" and "lead" in the same sentance.

hmm? what have i missed? my computer is really gakky today, and i cant be on very much do to the damn GCSE's and the exams and the course work

Shas'O do you at least have anyone that you find suspicious?

well, i know that most of you would call this voting without reason, but im not exactly good at this sort of game, but still, i'll voice my opinion.

vote: Drk_O

So instead of answering my question in a normal manner, you go about it by making a vote without an explanation to it? Why is Drk_O suspicious to you?

shas'o vera wrote:well, i know that most of you would call this voting without reason, but im not exactly good at this sort of game, but still, i'll voice my opinion.

vote: Drk_O

It's not really an opinion, you're just doing something.

Most of us would call it voting without reason, because of a couple of things...

1. You didn't state or outline your reason. You didn't even say there was one.

2. You didn't explain your reason.

3. I like fish.

So, with the exception of the 3rd thing, you had none of the above things. (Not that you did, or could do the third)

You can see where I'm going with this can't you?

Shas'o vera's posts, from start to finish.

shas'o vera wrote:hmm, interesting

What is?

translation: Look at me post. But don't look too closely. Nothing to see here.

shas'o vera wrote:in my opinion, i think its the one who tries to use as much logic as possible to try and make everyone else seem guilty

Not quite scummy, but certainly very misguided, and possibly a ploy to discredit the use of logic from the outset...

shas'o vera wrote:damn, this may be my second game but im still a bit of a noob at this, sorry about not saying anything that helps anyone in any way.

But not sorry enough to do anything about it. Just a post to say "don't look at me, don't look at me. The reason I am quiet is that I am new, not because I am a genestealer." This is my second game too, and I can post plenty. I think you know exactly how to play, and your chosen method in this game is to play the n00b

shas'o vera wrote:

n0t_u wrote:No, it's not quite that simple. Plus I wasn't doing something to avoid looking scummy I was avoiding doing the very thing that would look scummy which was bandwagoning. I came back to the game today after thinking it through and decided to vote for Vulkan, yet there were a few people before me and if I did it would appear to be bandwagoning, as there would be three in a row.

Thus I simply did a filler post to try to avoid the headache of trying to convince everyone that I wasn't simply jumping on the bandwagon >_>

ah, you decided to stop bandwagoning to avoid looking scummy? in my opinion, this seems like your just trying apease the one's who think that bandwagoning is scummy, but if you tried bandwagoning with those who thought you scummy, then maybe they would give a slightly different opinion of you wouldn't they?

Well, here we see a coherent post that proves he can challenge people when he wants to.

shas'o vera wrote:

n0t_u wrote:Maybe, but being one that sees bandwagoning as scummy it would be a hypocritical move for me

As I've clearly demonstrated in this game, I'm not really looking to be subtle.

So, you quoted not_U, but added nothing...

shas'o vera wrote:yeah, it failed, i know.

shas'o vera wrote:well, what happened was that i was going to comment on his quote, forgot what i as going to say and on top of that my computer crashed halfway through, so what you see was the result of a bad head and a rubbish computer

And when, questioned you just announced that it (the unsuccessful quoting?) failed. Why not explain why you quoted it - what you found interesting about it, or what suspicions it raised? Did you quote it by accident, but know you are not allowed to edit posts? You must have some sort of idea about the post and what it was you wanted to say, even if you can't remember exactly.

shas'o vera wrote:well, as you all can tell im kind of inexperienced at this sort of thing, so i'm not entirely sure who to vote for now, everyone seems to be using logic to stop people voting for them, in my opinion, they all seem scummy to me

Thor already addressed this. I think you find it hard to use logic, because you know you are the 'stealer and thus find it hard to apply logic that proves you aren't, because you are!!

shas'o vera wrote:hmm, well, i was thinking of not casting my vote untill the second dayphase but i guess your plan works as well.

But still, despite acknowledging that voting is a good idea, you don't do it. Is this because you don't want to antagonise people, because it will make people want to vote for you? That doesn't mark you as a 'stealer automatically, if so, but it does make me think you are not thinking from a town perspective, because you should be thinking as part of a large collective, and your methods seem to point to a lone or a small group mentality.

shas'o vera wrote:hmm, by the looks of things, everyone seems to be going to lynch Dark_O personally i woulud vote for him because he hardily tries to contribute to the disscussion at all, and because he hardily ever posts anyway. but i only wish for him to explain himself, nothing more.

Vote: Dark_Obliterator

but on one condision, that my vote doesn't lead to his lynching.

Did you target Dark_O because he already looks like getting lynched, so if he does then even if he votes against you, it won't matter 'cos no-one will side with him? I mean, the funny thing is about this post, is that I feel a similar way about you. I am voting for you to make you write more. You almost started interacting with someone in one of your earlier posts (not_u), but then you backed away from that approach again. I want you to do more of that. If you do, you, then you may convince me with what you write that you are innocent, or you may convince me you are guilty. As it is, I would be perfectly happy for you to be lynched.

shas'o vera wrote:may i ask, what exactly leads you to believe that i have an anti-town role in all this? for all you know i could be the inquisitor or another one of those type of roles.

He already answered that. He said that it was because of your posting patterns after a townie got turned 'stealer. Did you ask a question in return to avoid answering his question?

shas'o vera wrote:A night time post Shas made that he shouldn't have, so I won't comment on it

shas'o vera wrote:hmm? what have i missed? my computer is really gakky today, and i cant be on very much do to the damn GCSE's and the exams and the course work

What have you missed? I can understand that it is hard to keep up sometimes, and you want to post just to show you exist. As a teacher I also know GCSEs are a hard time, and that when I was filling in job applications I was a bit absent too, but cmputer gakkiness should not be a factor. This doesn't mark you out as scummy, I will admit.

shas'o vera wrote:well, i know that most of you would call this voting without reason, but im not exactly good at this sort of game, but still, i'll voice my opinion.

vote: Drk_O

You keep saying you are not good at this game, and yet you are good enough to know we will say this is voting without reason. I think you know exactly why you are voting Dark_O - because you know he is likely to be the next lynch. But, you can't admit your reason, so you just say "I don't know why".

I'll tell you one thing, everyone - If Shas does turn out to be a 'stealer, I don't think Dark_O would be one too.

In summary of the previous posts, I believe Shas'o vera's strategy is to stay quiet so as not to antagonise anyone, hoping he thereby avoides getting voted for. If anyone challenges him, he claims n00b status, admits his failings, but does nothing to address them, as this would involve pointing a finger, something he heas decided not to do to avoidn getting any pointed back at him.

Fifty has a good post, also Drk_O (though I almost rue having to admit it) did a very townish and sensible reply to shas' post as well.

I would personally like to see another 2-3 votes on each of them, or for someone to present a case on a third party. I think more votes will help pressure shas to do...well, anything, and also I'd like more votes on Drk_O for my aforementioned theory concerning him and DDRE - at the very least I think people ought to be willing to offer their opinions on the connections I'm seeing and also their opinions on Fifty's case against shas.