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One little tidbit that I hadnt seen mentioned: units may not move within 1" of any unit, friend or foe, unless charging.

No mroe butting troops right up next to each other anymore...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
One tidbit I havent seen mentioned: Units may not move within 1" of ANY unit, friend or foe, unless charging.

There is also a Start of Turn phase, to clarify "when" all those different effects happen, finaly!

Yes I will be curious to see how the doomwheel is errata'd - I mean, it moves kind of like a spawn, but the FAQ has it moving like a chariot so it gets 1 free pivot while moving. Have to see.

I'm more stoked about the 25% for rare for Skaven though - whew - 2 warp lightning cannons and 2 doomwheels in a 2250 list? Nasty, nasty nasty.

Can I just ask... About this whole wizards and bound spells malarkey, what about the Bluescribes? They count as casting a random bound spell every turn, but as the power level counts as the casting roll of the spell in question, does this mean it is cast automatically? Or do you need to roll, and a 1/2 still counts as a fail? Or am I interpreting this all completley wrong?

If it counts as a Bound Spell with the same casting level as the original spell... it would be a regular spell now, to my understanding. Only difference being it's impossible for them to miscast.

zioN wrote:Can I just ask... About this whole wizards and bound spells malarkey, what about the Bluescribes? They count as casting a random bound spell every turn, but as the power level counts as the casting roll of the spell in question, does this mean it is cast automatically? Or do you need to roll, and a 1/2 still counts as a fail? Or am I interpreting this all completley wrong?

I think it's you roll for which spell you get which then becomes a bound level at the cost of the spell which you then need to meet with rolled power dice; so basically you are casting a spell like normal without any bonus modifiers and it's random. The Fey Enchantress has a similar ability and both aren't very good under the current rules.

Of course getting extra power dice is pretty great under in 8th so I'm not exactly crying big tears for a Demon special character.

Ixquic wrote:

zioN wrote:Can I just ask... About this whole wizards and bound spells malarkey, what about the Bluescribes? They count as casting a random bound spell every turn, but as the power level counts as the casting roll of the spell in question, does this mean it is cast automatically? Or do you need to roll, and a 1/2 still counts as a fail? Or am I interpreting this all completley wrong?

I think it's you roll for which spell you get which then becomes a bound level at the cost of the spell which you then need to meet with rolled power dice; so basically you are casting a spell like normal without any bonus modifiers and it's random. The Fey Enchantress has a similar ability and both aren't very good under the current rules.

Of course getting extra power dice is pretty great under in 8th so I'm not exactly crying big tears for a Demon special character.

I way told that the power level of a bound spell was like the lvl of the wizard, in that you add it to your casting roll. Or is that only with magic items power levels?

zioN wrote:

Ixquic wrote:

zioN wrote:Can I just ask... About this whole wizards and bound spells malarkey, what about the Bluescribes? They count as casting a random bound spell every turn, but as the power level counts as the casting roll of the spell in question, does this mean it is cast automatically? Or do you need to roll, and a 1/2 still counts as a fail? Or am I interpreting this all completley wrong?

I think it's you roll for which spell you get which then becomes a bound level at the cost of the spell which you then need to meet with rolled power dice; so basically you are casting a spell like normal without any bonus modifiers and it's random. The Fey Enchantress has a similar ability and both aren't very good under the current rules.

Of course getting extra power dice is pretty great under in 8th so I'm not exactly crying big tears for a Demon special character.

I way told that the power level of a bound spell was like the lvl of the wizard, in that you add it to your casting roll. Or is that only with magic items power levels?

I'm pretty sure neither get that unless it was under magic items and I missed it. The benefits of bound items seem that you know the spell by default and that it can't miscast (although you can lose the spell on double 6s.)

I just checked a few sites, and I think you're right. The info I was going off has changed recently... >.< Problem solved!

Seems like the Bluescribes are just power dice collectors now...

Looking at the book again and just noticed that everything now has a chance of causing a wound no matter how low the strength is or how high the toughness is! For example in the Watchtower scenario it gives the tower stats of toughness 8 and 6 wounds so in theory this could be destroyed quite easily by a 20 strong unit of Goblin archers (4+ to hit then any hits wound on 6+ so should take average of two turns to destroy...).
welcome to he wotrld of shooty armies that become hero/monster killrs...

Mick

Average would actually be roughly four player turns, not two, for 20 Goblins. Assuming they were within short range, and 20 was the number of shots and not the number of total Goblins (unless it was a ten wide front). You aren't going to take it down with small fire in a reasonable time. It doesn't mean that it's not silly, though: Could you imagine if I tried to have my home taken down by letting a few dozen people with bows fire at it for a couple minutes?

Mattbranb wrote:Yes I will be curious to see how the doomwheel is errata'd - I mean, it moves kind of like a spawn, but the FAQ has it moving like a chariot so it gets 1 free pivot while moving. Have to see.

FAQ nothin'. The book itself has it moving like a chariot.

Pg. 67: "The Doomwheel moves and manoeuvres like a chariot with a few exceptions."

Minsc wrote:Average would actually be roughly four player turns, not two, for 20 Goblins. Assuming they were within short range, and 20 was the number of shots and not the number of total Goblins (unless it was a ten wide front). You aren't going to take it down with small fire in a reasonable time. It doesn't mean that it's not silly, though: Could you imagine if I tried to have my home taken down by letting a few dozen people with bows fire at it for a couple minutes?

ya my wood elf army however now loves to shoot down big things.

Also thunderous stomp is so awesome. My treeman has gone from a meh attacker to a badass. I played a couple more games yesterday and the treeman had got to be my most consistant unit/model now.

Something else I noiced - The Hand weapon/shield bonus is no longer limited to infantry. Even Cav/monsters can use it. However, you no longer get it if you are using a magical shield.

Just double checked, and there is a paragraph at the bottom of the 'Parry Save' bit with exclusions. Frenzy prevents it, as does being mounted.

Easily missed though fella. Had to actually double double check!

skyth wrote:Something else I noiced - The Hand weapon/shield bonus is no longer limited to infantry. Even Cav/monsters can use it. However, you no longer get it if you are using a magical shield.

I remember while I was reading the new awesome 5 point enchanted shield that you still get the parry save as well as it being a 5+ armour save shield. I admit I can't recall where exactly I was reading that (the shield itself or magic armour section rules) but I think atleast the enchanted shield still gets it.

I know the magic armor section says that magical shields don't get the parry bonus.

You are indeed correct here Skyth. Magic Shield grants the armour bonus, but no Parry.

skyth wrote:I know the magic armor section says that magical shields don't get the parry bonus.

Does that not kind of nerf Magic Shields for anyone who does not already have a Ward Save?
It is like saying you can have a +1 Armour Save but loose your 6+ Ward Save against penetrating attacks...

There's a reason Enchanted shields are going down to 5 points...

Furthermore, Ward Save items have increased by at least three-fold for quantity - two of which are better than the old item and one of which gives you the Parry bonus non-stop anyways.

I just can't get over that price, I'm sorry. What are we expected to pay $75 for? Because it's printed in full color finally? They should have been in full color anyway when they were being sold at $50 (are codices and army books going to jump to $50 when they finally start printing them in color, too?). 1,000 extra pages of useless fluff padding? That's all well and good, but if you're going to pull that crap then you should offer me a book with just the rules, the stuff I'm actually going to use, at a reasonable price.

This kind of crap is going to hurt the hobby. Do you really think anyone's going to get into the game when they see that just the main rulebook alone costs almost $80?

But I'm sorry, I forget where I'm posting. Now time to be bombarded with "GW is a business blah blah blah".

For $75 and 500 pages, I'd almost rather GW split the thing into 2 volumes - an A4 softback for the Rules, and an A4 hardback for the Fluff and Hobby. It'd save space in the backpack, along with a pound of weight.

Well those that want the softback rules, they will be included in the forthcoming starter set.

Sidstyler wrote:I just can't get over that price, I'm sorry. What are we expected to pay $75 for? Because it's printed in full color finally? They should have been in full color anyway when they were being sold at $50 (are codices and army books going to jump to $50 when they finally start printing them in color, too?). 1,000 extra pages of useless fluff padding? That's all well and good, but if you're going to pull that crap then you should offer me a book with just the rules, the stuff I'm actually going to use, at a reasonable price.

This kind of crap is going to hurt the hobby. Do you really think anyone's going to get into the game when they see that just the main rulebook alone costs almost $80?

But I'm sorry, I forget where I'm posting. Now time to be bombarded with "GW is a business blah blah blah".

Do what me and my buddies do with rulebooks: buy 1 for the group. Our rulebooks (the clubs) stay behind the counter at my FLGS and only we can get them from behind it. If anyone wants tehir own set of rules by all means but this saves us all money. Plus, the rulebook is at a central location so we don't have to worry about them being at someone's house who is sick or getting kicked out into the doghouse for the night and can't make it to play a couple of games. There are 5 of us so for this book it would be ~$16 or $17 a person (after tax) for the book. Not too bad huh?

Has anyone said or noticed how sturdy and well built this behemoth of a rulebook is? I don't mind the price tag or the extra million pages of fluff, as long as it doesn't fall apart easily. Will I have to gut and bind the parts I need to have a nice, secure and tidy rulebook for my gaming?

Also, any reports of tables flipping over after someone placed the rulebook on their side of the table, with nothing of relative weight on the opposite side?

I just can't get over that price, I'm sorry. What are we expected to pay $75 for? Because it's printed in full color finally? They should have been in full color anyway when they were being sold at $50 (are codices and army books going to jump to $50 when they finally start printing them in color, too?). 1,000 extra pages of useless fluff padding? That's all well and good, but if you're going to pull that crap then you should offer me a book with just the rules, the stuff I'm actually going to use, at a reasonable price.

This kind of crap is going to hurt the hobby. Do you really think anyone's going to get into the game when they see that just the main rulebook alone costs almost $80?

But I'm sorry, I forget where I'm posting. Now time to be bombarded with "GW is a business blah blah blah".

When I preordered the rulebook, the perspective I had was that for $75 plus 6% sales tax (thanks Maryland), I'm getting a product that will last me 5-6+ years. Aside from a few noticeable exceptions, none of my $50+ each video games in my collection have anywhere near that long of a play life. I remember a 40k podcast(can't recall the name) that had a segment called "noobs corner" where they broke down the price and relative shelf life of a starter set and how the initial sticker shock isn't so bad when you put in how every aspect of the hobby will probably hold your attention longer then a decent video game.

Not trying to convince you that its a great value or anything, you're obviously an adult that can decide that for himself, just giving you my thought process for when I made the purchase.

Plus I'm a WHFB addict, which probably says more about why I made the purchase then my explanatory paragraph above.

Oh, and how dare you!? GW is a business blah blah blah. Insert obligatory overzealous and aggressive fanboy rant here

AAARGHHHH! Not fair, it's not fair I say!

I brought out my old orc army, and played a very good GT player with a tooled up Dark Elf list. We did 2500pts. He had most of the usual bells and whistles, I took arrer boyz, big blocks of orcs and black orcs, and some random stuff like squig herds and pump wagons. Maybe a little artillery, but not more than a half dozen bolt throwers and rock lobbers. Well, maybe a little more than a half dozen.)

I was kicking his butt up until turn 4. My shamag got off waaagh! and we charged everything. Then his head exploded rolling for the miscast. Dark Elfs running everywhere, and then his level 1 hiding out in a wizards tower tosses Purple sun with total power, and kills 26 orcs, my general, and his hydra. We fought valiantly one but slowly ran out of steam after that, and he got the win at the end.

Insanely awesome game, but I was so robbed! Still, orcs and gobbos are definitely not at the back of the bus in 8th edition. Tomorrow I'll test out blocks of 60 nightgoblins.

Being stubburn and having a battle banner is insanely useful for a horde grinding down elite units.

A lot of fun. I like rolling up the random mission, the random terrain, placing it, and rolling for sides. Made the game very enjoyable to have a full table, and terrain that didn't slow stuff down. Well thought out I think.

For tournaments, I'd go with judge placed terrain, or a system to limit the time it takes to set up the board. But for friendly games, I'll always use the terrain generator.

Arrer boyz charging out of a river of blood and routing dark riders. Fun fun fun.

mikhaila wrote:Insanely awesome game, but I was so robbed! Still, orcs and gobbos are definitely not at the back of the bus in 8th edition. Tomorrow I'll test out blocks of 60 nightgoblins.

Being stubburn and having a battle banner is insanely useful for a horde grinding down elite units.

and a lord for every unit right? lol I've been trying to get one of my friends to pull out his gobbos to see what it is like, and would love to hear how well/fun it is.

mikhaila wrote:Dark Elfs running everywhere, and then his level 1 hiding out in a wizards tower tosses Purple sun with total power...

Heh, if a level 1 managed to get the spell, someone was a very lucky boi! And the amount of lords you can take with these new rules is pretty gud!

Sounds excellent, mikhaila! I'm itching to try it out... I'll probably be playing again today, but unfortunately with 7th ed rules :-/.

*envy*

Has anyone said or noticed how sturdy and well built this behemoth of a rulebook is? I don't mind the price tag or the extra million pages of fluff, as long as it doesn't fall apart easily.

The sample book in my local GW shop is still in good shape after several days of much handling by many different people, but I also have the same concern. I find the occasional lack of quality to be more annoying than GW's pricing. I can live with their pricing when the quality is high, but on the few occasions it has been not it is most annoying. As we all know, the issue with the new printer of their army books spanning from the last Dark Elves release all the way up to the last Warriors Of Chaos release was most irritating and I still see books from that period falling apart out there with customers who don't realize Customer Service would replace those for them. The army/figure cases are my other complaint. The high price tag would be fine if they lasted forever, but the sturdy cases suffer from weak latches and hinges and I see broken ones all the time, often rendering expensive cases completely usesless.

If I buy this new $74+ WFB rule book I will be most careful with it. It's annoying enough that it will be obsolete in 4 or 5 years, but I'd really hate to have it fall apart before then. The fact that it is so thick, 528 pages and weighing 5 pounds, means that it could easily be damaged by its own mass if not handled carefully.