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 Overread wrote:

 vipoid wrote:

Wakshaani wrote:
Home for lunch.

STILL nothing about Reanimation?

Dude.

Perhaps they're embarrassed by the rules for it?

Reanimation is mentioned at the end as coming in a community article. So likely when we are closer to the pre-order window.

Most likely after pre-order, or at best the week before depending on how many preview articles they have for the release, following the pattern Warhammer Community has established for preview articles for codex/battletome releases.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Manfred von Drakken wrote:

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:
So the non-codex marine chapters are supplements, but the Chaos monogod Legions are still separate codices?

Thousand Sons can't work as a supplement since they can't take most of the units in Codex: Chaos Space Marines, like Chaos Space Marines. Or, anything with flesh that isn't a Sorcerer. Heck, even excluding named characters and daemons, there are more units in that Codex they can't take than units that they can.

That was intentional though. The restrictions for both Death Guard and Thousand Sons are arbitrary just like the ones that were done for the Loyalist Angels and Wolves for the longest time.

Basically this. Wrath of Magnus gave Sons access to every unit from the base Chaos Marines list in addition to their newer unique stuff only to turn around and yank all of that away in "exchange" for the Disc mounted Tzaangor and Vortex Beast, so it's not like there's no precedent for them to have access to some of these things.

I am just... frustrated I guess by how much hair-splitting there is in terms of different unit options. Are heavy intercessors really filling a hole in the line? Did they really need five unique weapon options? Did the new landspeeder simply need to have three different names and dataslates for changes in weapon loadout?

Whatever. At least the models are gorgeous. And it is good that GW will be quickly updating BA and DA rather than leaving them in codex-supplement limbo.

And I want the Death Gourd. WANT

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Manfred von Drakken wrote:

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:
So the non-codex marine chapters are supplements, but the Chaos monogod Legions are still separate codices?

Thousand Sons can't work as a supplement since they can't take most of the units in Codex: Chaos Space Marines, like Chaos Space Marines. Or, anything with flesh that isn't a Sorcerer. Heck, even excluding named characters and daemons, there are more units in that Codex they can't take than units that they can.

That was intentional though. The restrictions for both Death Guard and Thousand Sons are arbitrary just like the ones that were done for the Loyalist Angels and Wolves for the longest time.

for DG you could arguably have a point, but for 1k Sons the lore pretty much supports that

My presumption is the new multi-part bikes will come out with the DA, to make them a real release, as opposed to the SW and BA, who will Just share in the models shown.

I’m excited about the DW, and would be even moreso if I knew they were getting an upgrade sprue (just for the shoulder pads for Phobos and Gravis).

The Necrons continue to look great, top to bottom.

And I like the new SM infantry stuff.

 dienekes96 wrote:
My presumption is the new multi-part bikes will come out with the DA, to make them a real release, as opposed to the SW and BA, who will Just share in the models shown.

Don't count on it. There's still no multi part suppressors. Various characters never became available individually. In fact, there's a few primaris candidates for Legends if we go by what models can be purchased through GW. Gravis Captain, primaris ancient, primaris Lieutenant with auto bolt rifle... Possibly others I can't think of right now.

Zustiur wrote:

 dienekes96 wrote:
My presumption is the new multi-part bikes will come out with the DA, to make them a real release, as opposed to the SW and BA, who will Just share in the models shown.

Don't count on it. There's still no multi part suppressors. Various characters never became available individually. In fact, there's a few primaris candidates for Legends if we go by what models can be purchased through GW. Gravis Captain, primaris ancient, primaris Lieutenant with auto bolt rifle... Possibly others I can't think of right now.

Bikes seem like they would have more universal appeal than suppressors. Suppressorsa also have their weird for fly infantry aesthetic. Given the changes we have seen to the initially somewhat derpy gravis dudes, perhaps these will go off into the sunset with a slight variant with new model replacing them.

BrianDavion wrote:
regarding heavy intercessors. I think GW's goal with Primaris Marines has been to enable a Marine player to play ANY of the companies, including a reserve company viably. honestly I think with this wave Primaris are "mostly complete" unless GW decides to give us a primaris terminator troop unit down the line.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 BlaxicanX wrote:

 Sasori wrote:


If GW wanted to do it right, they would make it mandatory for every Imperium release to have a simultaneous xenos or chaos release that coincides with it. C:SM/Necrons, SW/Tau, SoB/Deldar, Iron Hands supplement/Orks, IG/Eldar, Blood Angels/Eldar supplement etc.

that'd just mean GW half assing the second release while they focus more on the one that sells better

Space marines will never be complete. And new GW's pace of production and marketing actually create a serious worry for marine bloat. I am out of marines for this reason. I can't (well don't want to) afford the treadmill, it's too much, and I have a feeling it will never stop. Marines sell too well, GW now releases too aggressively.

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
So all fw units are in one book? So everyone gets to pay for rules for factions they don't play? Good to see that the pa business model continues.

Better that then four different books.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
So all fw units are in one book? So everyone gets to pay for rules for factions they don't play? Good to see that the pa business model continues.

Better that then four different books.

And uniting them will also simplify annual updates.

yukishiro1 wrote:
"What haven't we given Space Marines already guys?

<long silence as everyone thumbs through codexes looking in vain for something Space Marines don't yet have>

"Uh...3W troops choices?"

Seeing as though things start with the miniature team and then the rules guys make rules for whatever they output, that conversation would have never happened. It'd be closer to "We made more Marines in Gravis Armour, this time with bigger bolters. Work out what the rules should be. Here are the concept sketches. Have fun.".

 privateer4hire wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
So all fw units are in one book? So everyone gets to pay for rules for factions they don't play? Good to see that the pa business model continues.

Better that then four different books.

And uniting them will also simplify annual updates.

Getting rid of 100+ Datasheets does that already.

Yeah, it seems to me that they planned a range of each armor type, probably from the start. Marine primaris troops are pretty close to redundant, but there are slight differences. Personally, I would have liked to see some more variety in elites/fast/heavies, but maybe they'll do that too (which will make the range WAY too large, honestly.)

I guess having all these different options be troops is better than if they were another slot, slightly stronger and slightly more expensive, but probably never fielded. Perhaps this design decision is a response to the large amount of underused non-troops in the old marine line?

This all feels like it hasn't been handled as well as it could have, but it could also be much worse. At least the models are nice!

Yep as expected.. In the grim darkness of the far future there are only marines..

I hope this all means they wil just churn out all the books over the SM next 6 moths and allow people to play indomitus heresy 42k in peace for the next year while everyone keeps playing warhammer 40k 9th edition with their npc factions.

At least I have the excuse to buy cool kits from mierce over the next few months as there is nothing on offer for me.. Was contemplating starting a small Nid army as a side hustle but naaah... Id rather give my money to another company for awesome looking minis.

Imperial armour though... that's something. (Maybe the wraithseer will be not nerfed) so I'll stick around and play some games.

 Argive wrote:
Yep as expected.. In the grim darkness of the far future there are only marines..

I hope this all means they wil just churn out all the books over the SM next 6 moths and allow people to play indomitus heresy 42k in peace while everyone keeps playing warhammer 40k 9th edition with their npc factions.

At least I have the excuse to buy cool kits from mierce over the next few months as there is nothing on offer for me.. Was contemplating starting a small Nid army as a side hustle but naaah... Id rather give my money to another company for awesome looking minis.

Imperial armour though... that's something. (Maybe the wraithseer will be not nerfed) so I'll stick around and play some games.

Codex releases are tied to model releases. They're going to put all the marine books out quickly because the marine models are already out. There's no reason to think that if they weren't releasing all the supplements, that it would bring us Xenos any faster. Those will come when their models are ready, unless they're not getting anything. But given how much they're investing in Necrons now, I'd wager we'll see big updates for the various out of date Xenos.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

yukishiro1 wrote:
"What haven't we given Space Marines already guys?

<long silence as everyone thumbs through codexes looking in vain for something Space Marines don't yet have>

"Uh...3W troops choices?"

Seeing as though things start with the miniature team and then the rules guys make rules for whatever they output, that conversation would have never happened. It'd be closer to "We made more Marines in Gravis Armour, this time with bigger bolters. Work out what the rules should be. Here are the concept sketches. Have fun.".

I wish more people actually understood this, GW is a miniature company first and foremost with the rules as secondary. been that way for a very long time.

Drudge Dreadnought wrote:Yeah, it seems to me that they planned a range of each armor type, probably from the start. Marine primaris troops are pretty close to redundant, but there are slight differences. Personally, I would have liked to see some more variety in elites/fast/heavies, but maybe they'll do that too (which will make the range WAY too large, honestly.)

I guess having all these different options be troops is better than if they were another slot, slightly stronger and slightly more expensive, but probably never fielded. Perhaps this design decision is a response to the large amount of underused non-troops in the old marine line?

This all feels like it hasn't been handled as well as it could have, but it could also be much worse. At least the models are nice!

On one of the voxcasts Jes straight up said that all of the primaris units were done at the same time. So as they would fit together as a cohesive whole range. It's safe to assume that once all the primaris stuff is out, the design choices will make sense...hopefully.

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:

 Argive wrote:
Yep as expected.. In the grim darkness of the far future there are only marines..

I hope this all means they wil just churn out all the books over the SM next 6 moths and allow people to play indomitus heresy 42k in peace while everyone keeps playing warhammer 40k 9th edition with their npc factions.

At least I have the excuse to buy cool kits from mierce over the next few months as there is nothing on offer for me.. Was contemplating starting a small Nid army as a side hustle but naaah... Id rather give my money to another company for awesome looking minis.

Imperial armour though... that's something. (Maybe the wraithseer will be not nerfed) so I'll stick around and play some games.

Codex releases are tied to model releases. They're going to put all the marine books out quickly because the marine models are already out. There's no reason to think that if they weren't releasing all the supplements, that it would bring us Xenos any faster. Those will come when their models are ready, unless they're not getting anything. But given how much they're investing in Necrons now, I'd wager we'll see big updates for the various out of date Xenos.

Id hope so but any optimism or goodwill is loong gone.
Fingers crossed they can "get it done" in like 6months and not drag it coz who can be bothered anymore?
Marine players complaining about having to buy allt he new marine books and models, and non-marine players complaining about having nothing to buy. Seems like there is a very obvious solution but im no space engineer that's for sure.

Anyway have no expectations, dont get dissapointed. Back to my 40k hibernation it is

 Argive wrote:

 Drudge Dreadnought wrote:

 Argive wrote:
Yep as expected.. In the grim darkness of the far future there are only marines..

I hope this all means they wil just churn out all the books over the SM next 6 moths and allow people to play indomitus heresy 42k in peace while everyone keeps playing warhammer 40k 9th edition with their npc factions.

At least I have the excuse to buy cool kits from mierce over the next few months as there is nothing on offer for me.. Was contemplating starting a small Nid army as a side hustle but naaah... Id rather give my money to another company for awesome looking minis.

Imperial armour though... that's something. (Maybe the wraithseer will be not nerfed) so I'll stick around and play some games.

Codex releases are tied to model releases. They're going to put all the marine books out quickly because the marine models are already out. There's no reason to think that if they weren't releasing all the supplements, that it would bring us Xenos any faster. Those will come when their models are ready, unless they're not getting anything. But given how much they're investing in Necrons now, I'd wager we'll see big updates for the various out of date Xenos.

Id hope so but any optimism or goodwill is loong gone.
Fingers crossed they can "get it done" in like 6months and not drag it coz who can be bothered anymore?
Marine players complaining about having to buy allt he new marine books and models, and non-marine players complaining about having nothing to buy. Seems like there is a very obvious solution but im no space engineer that's for sure.

Anyway have no expectations, dont get dissapointed. Back to my 40k hibernation it is

Same here.
Enjoy your primaris stuff.
Nothing for me in these releases, money saved. Period.

So...I continue to just be...very confused by primaris.

Currently, gw has taken the concept of Devastators and Special Weapon marines, and smashed them together into an aspect warriors esque series of units.

And they also decided "hey you know scouts? Those need to be FOUR separate kits.

But then..."Assault Marines? What are those?"

It is bizarre. I hope once the bloat gets truly insane they write in some kind of Firstborn schism as that range is too modern to just scrap

I don't think it's that hard to understand. If you release one Primaris Devastators kit that let you build all however-many-variations-we-are-up-to-now, people only need to buy the one kit and magnetize. Especially since if you don't let people mix and match, you have to give them 3x each weapon in the same kit, so you can't even bilk them the old way by not giving enough of each weapon.

If you release four or five or six or however many kits it is up to now separately, with just enough details different to make them not interchangeable, you can hit people up for several times as much $.

the_scotsman wrote:
So...I continue to just be...very confused by primaris.

Currently, gw has taken the concept of Devastators and Special Weapon marines, and smashed them together into an aspect warriors esque series of units.

And they also decided "hey you know scouts? Those need to be FOUR separate kits.

But then..."Assault Marines? What are those?"

Sure goes to show how magnificently simple and effective the original squad layout of Tactical, Assault, Devastator is, doesn't it? Elegant both in model-buying terms and in lore.

 Platuan4th wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
So all fw units are in one book? So everyone gets to pay for rules for factions they don't play? Good to see that the pa business model continues.

Better that then four different books.

And uniting them will also simplify annual updates.

Getting rid of 100+ Datasheets does that already.

Odds on them remembering to do a FW Legends PDF for anything that doesn't make it into the Compendium?

 Dysartes wrote:

 Platuan4th wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
So all fw units are in one book? So everyone gets to pay for rules for factions they don't play? Good to see that the pa business model continues.

Better that then four different books.

And uniting them will also simplify annual updates.

Getting rid of 100+ Datasheets does that already.

Odds on them remembering to do a FW Legends PDF for anything that doesn't make it into the Compendium?

0, considering they couldn't even release a mistake free datasheet for their preview.

 dienekes96 wrote:
My presumption is the new multi-part bikes will come out with the DA, to make them a real release, as opposed to the SW and BA, who will Just share in the models shown.

I’m excited about the DW, and would be even moreso if I knew they were getting an upgrade sprue (just for the shoulder pads for Phobos and Gravis).

The Necrons continue to look great, top to bottom.

And I like the new SM infantry stuff.

Don’t Know about Phobos, but gravis are he same size as terminator shoulderpads.

Feels very much like primaris are closer to horus heresy organization than first born.

Not Online!!! wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

Spoiler:

 Platuan4th wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Gadzilla666 wrote:
So all fw units are in one book? So everyone gets to pay for rules for factions they don't play? Good to see that the pa business model continues.

Better that then four different books.

And uniting them will also simplify annual updates.

Getting rid of 100+ Datasheets does that already.

Odds on them remembering to do a FW Legends PDF for anything that doesn't make it into the Compendium?

0, considering they couldn't even release a mistake free datasheet for their preview.

Those are two very different things, though - providing limited ongoing support for units no longer on sale vs. being able to proof-read a datasheet.

Speaking of the latter, did they comment on the error during the stream, as I'd hope people caught it "live". If not, has anyone dropped them an email to see if they know if it is fixed int he book?

 Leth wrote:

Don’t Know about Phobos, but gravis are he same size as terminator shoulderpads.

Regular Marine pads(firstborn and Tacticus mk-x) fit Phobos left shoulders just fine. Although they do lack the small cutout in the bottom corners. So you have to watch out for arm posing and chest gubbins clashing.

So at this point we can call this.

The GW stratagem the whole time was to provide huge numbers of models for each of the armor types so that players could build themes around their Marine armies. Rather than chasing the most op options, we can for the first time build an entire coherent theme for our armies and play them on the battlefield.

I am extremely happy with today's product reveal. My view is that once we get past this, we will see a switch to other army factions. And, I'm not less worried about options being left ignored, especially after seeing Flayed Ones, a unit that was literally zero evidence for getting new models along with the new burrowing destroyers, which I found to be quite awesome.

Seeing the new Catachan Sargent, I'm willing to bet Guard is in store for a major revamp in 2021-2022, which makes me even more happy!

The new marine kits look great too, I'm a huge fan of the cables on the Eradicators, and themulti-melta looks great! The new Necron characters also look amazing, and I hope to see the named ones show up in the future too! All in all this is probably the best time to be in the hobby, COVID-19 junk aside. It's gonna be a beautiful day once we get that under control!

Right? I am sitting here thinking I got at least 3-4.months minimum before I will be able to get a game in, perfectly happy to get the windows update period of the game out of the way and just build and paint.

So Destroyers, are there three types now then? Original floaters, Skorpekh spider legs, these wraith tail guys?