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Yeah they do I believe

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:
dont they also have disgustingly resilient?

Danny76 wrote:
Yeah they do I believe

Only the Nurgling have DR among the critters, and only work vs Damage 1 weapon.

I'm tempted to run a nightmare hulk list, even though I don't think it really pans out in the meta. Under-tooled teams / inexperienced players you can probably bully out and devour in combat, but teams kitted out with multi-damage or properly playing the objective game should beat them. Figure something like this:

Gnasher-Screamer [L]
The Writher [Z]
Big Spike [C]
Glitchling
98

Almost tempted to not take any of the critters, since they feel mostly like casualties waiting to happen, but the glitchlings have too much character and that DR to make me believe they can stick around a little.

The main thing keeping me from doing this is that I feel like I could make a Counts As nightmare hulk team that's far more interesting to me than the box ones Or would have to do some hacking to make the box models more palatable.

EDIT: Gods dammit, picked up the Gellerpox half of the box Guess I'll report back!

- Salvage

I probably should double check the rules, but is there anything stopping a player from swapping out one of the hulks for a plague marine for some fire support?

That seems like it might help a bit.

I too am trying to figure out how I want to run my hulks, but I'm knee deep in painting poxwalkers at the moment so I'm probably going to figure out a way to use them effectively as well.

I doubt Gellerpox Infected are Death Guard faction

drbored wrote:
It's pretty clear from using the special tactics that only come in the starter boxes that they give you an advantage. They give you more options, more ability to do the things you need to do to win, and sometimes your opponent wont have the same, either because their faction doesn't have a starter set or didn't buy the one for their faction.

That said, the starter sets are a really good deal. You get the markers, the minis, some terrain, as well as the tactics and extra missions. Anyone complaining about the price clearly hasn't invested in any GW product recently. Call it 'pay to win', I call it 'supporting a game I love'.

they do. But, look, you can literally go onto 1d4chan and find every single tactic. Some shops will have owners that are super anal and demand you buy the box, but, really, screw that. The tactics are easily available.

As for pay to win, like, yes. But the very concept of a miniature wargame is pay to win. You literally buy the best units based on the best list you (or the internet) can come up with, and win with it. The power scale of units and entire factions is blatantly not balanced and you can always buy the new hot thing.

Some people are in the hobby to win, and the price to win constantly is not cheap. Although if you are in wih the right crowd, it isn't as bad as you think either. At the top, those guys trade out armies, paint for each other, and borrow stuff pretty regularly.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Tiberius501 wrote:

 Inquisitor Kallus wrote:

Chopstick wrote:

 Tiberius501 wrote:
So I have a question: I know they've only been out for a few days, but, going off point costs and stats, how do people think the Rogue Traders and Gallerpox will do against other kill teams? Can they face down Deathwatch/Space Marines or Thousand Sons?

Early days, but interested in people's initial thoughts

The commanders are very expensive (45 pts min for RT, and 65 pts min for the gelleprox) so you will have to leave out some models to get them in.(RT team w/o commander is exactly 100 points) The rogue trader will heavily rely on the admech guy and the rotor cannon gunner combo to weed out first before the other can close in and attack/shoot or throw a grenade. So it's important for the other team to neutralize the rotor cannon gunner first. For that reason they would do well against CC team like Harlequin, All genestealer Nid, or the Gelleprox infected.

The gelleprox infected, I don't think there are something too complicated here, they have the stratagem to teleport next to you, so you either kill the big guy until next round, or try to kill the swarm of distraction critters with -1 to hit

If you take commanders both teams go to 150 points

Yeah so no Elucia in normal games but that’s fair enough and would probably be bad anyway. I’m slightly concerned Grell with his rotor cannon will get focused every game and the team will be toothless but I’ll have to see

I am not certain you have to take vhane as a commander. But if you do and she isn't playable, then the kill team isn't playable. The entire team revolves around her and the CPs she brings.

 Boss Salvage wrote:


The main thing keeping me from doing this is that I feel like I could make a Counts As nightmare hulk team that's far more interesting to me than the box ones Or would have to do some hacking to make the box models more palatable.

I was thinking the same. Some flavour of Ogryn, perhaps the FW ones or some bullgryn converted to more resemble that style.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

stratigo wrote:

As for pay to win, like, yes. But the very concept of a miniature wargame is pay to win. You literally buy the best units based on the best list you (or the internet) can come up with, and win with it. The power scale of units and entire factions is blatantly not balanced and you can always buy the new hot thing.

I am afraid that is not so simple. Wargaming is.. uh.. "pay to play", for obvious reasons. But the games not necessarily have to contain units that are more powerful than the average, and sold at an higher price. It actually does NOT happen.
In fact, in the past, many moved accusations to GW of "buffing" units with a shiny new models. They were rightfully told that very often, new models had actually really mediocre rules. Malice vs incompetence etc.

What happened here is that there is a box to buy in addition to the basic game. Such box has more rules, and these rules make units shown in the basic game more functional.
Now if it happened after a reasonable amount of time, one could take it as a "patch" - it often happens in this kind of games.
But in this specific context, with a short amount of time between the basic game and the new box, and with the basic game containing rules that are absolute stinkers (see the Mek Grenade above), people have a reason to be concerned.

You either decide to get on the supplement treadmill or you don't. There are many games out there that don't have that model of selling supplements with more rules material sprinkled through them. Then there's also the option of going with rules sets that have gone through the supplement treadmill and are now done and you can pick the best material. Or go for "community editions" of various games.

Many games also are really good without the supplemental material. Games can easily be ruined by imbalanced crap in later books. The expansions with mutated humans did Gorkamorka no favours, for example. It's entirely possibly that when all is said and done, the best form of Kill Team might just be the basic box and book and that's it. No kill zone cards, no faction set cards. No command supplement.

The issue comes in trying to figure out what to play with other people. If you rely on playing organised play events then you're out of luck and your options will be to jump on the supplement treadmill, stick to base game material and likely be at a disadvantage or opt out.

Take a page from the RPG community and start forming a gaming group rather than being reliant on strangers. If I can get 8 people together to play some mad homebrew 1974 D&D knockoff game twice a month, you can find 2 or 3 people who want a more relaxed approach without the reliance on getting the latest supplements for Kill Team.

This post of course, is only really directed to people who are objecting to the supplement treadmill style of rules release. If you're cool with Killteam being released that way, just enjoy it. So far the base game plus a few of the faction starters has been fun for me and my group. Well, after my friend blocked about half of the mid height windows on the terrain with plasticard with a brick texture.

 BaronIveagh wrote:

 Azazelx wrote:

How long did the judge give you for the serious assault that you appear to have waited until he'd broken 10 of your figures to deliver?
Because if I were in the same position, "don't touch my fething models, dill weed" would have been the first thing they got after breaking one piece on one of them. Though even that seems unlikely. Both the chance of it happening, or the chance of it happening to my models while I was anywhere nearby.

It's good to know you can teleport, Azazelx.
Oh, and good luck getting an assault conviction in Pittsburgh if they were deliberately breaking your gak, in front of a room full of people, even if it took a moment to reach him.

"Teleporting" has nothing to do with calling out people's online takes that sound embellished at best and imaginatively fanciful at worst.

You're right, though. The police and courts always discount apparently serious, apparently sustained, assaults if someone breaking toy soldiers is involved. Because gaming conventions filed with geeks in Pittsburgh are akin to the wild west or the show at a WWE event.



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 H.B.M.C. wrote:

Vorian wrote:
It does mention it.

No it doesn't.

 Crimson wrote:
It was not a GW game.

Neither is Wrath & Glory, which is mentioned.

You're not stupid. You know exactly why the product from the former licencee with competing, current games isn't mentioned while the current licencee is.

Pointing it out is one thing, but playing charades around it is kinda pointless, unless you're waiting for an ignorant or imaginative apologist to step up so you can blast them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Stormonu wrote:

ecurtz wrote:
There's a long tradition of 3d doors on a 2d board going back at least to HeroQuest.

<Glances at shelf where lies Heroquest and Warhammer Quest>

Touche

I suppose I'm surprised that with the other Kill Team releases they just did they didn't go for 3D walls. Spaceship corridor walls at that. It would have been a nice retro touch if they had done (plasti)card walls, in the same sort of line as old Necromunda.

I'd guess because they'd then need to provide a LOT of (modular) walls that they could also easily sell in a separate terrain set, and they wanted to keep this box smaller than the core game. Would have been good, though.

New stuff! ZOMG!

Commanders Expansion Set:


Commander Boxes:






New Kill-Teams:



New Kill-Zone:

 Azazelx wrote:
You're not stupid. You know exactly why the product from the former licencee with competing, current games isn't mentioned while the current licencee is.

Pointing it out is one thing, but playing charades around it is kinda pointless, unless you're waiting for an ignorant or imaginative apologist to step up so you can blast them.

This is a conversation from over 10 days ago. It's 5 pages back in the thread. Why are you even bothering?

And all the 40K FFG books are still on sale.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2018/09/22/sep23kill-team-weekender-the-doors-opengw-homepage-post-2/

Commanders is coming! New kill team boxes including Commander options, the tau and necron kill team and a wall of martyrs kill zone.

Noice!

Edit: Beaten to it!

Hmm... does anyone recognise what kit these fallen pillars are from:



I'm talking the piece in the bottom right, the piece in the bottom left, and the piece that starts around the centre (below the central Genestealer) and carries on to the left.

They look like moulded pieces of terrain, not bits of the new ruins kitbashed into something else. There are even skulls moulded into the rim of that central piece.

Have we seen these before?

Actually, come to think of it, there's a better pic of that central one here:

Look like new barricade esque scatter terrain.

Hm, the Wall of Martyrs kill zone looks a bit sparse compared to the others. Sweet board tho.

Commanders sounds nice with Psyker rules added. With 40 dudes in it, that should be usually one fighty and one psyker character per faction.

So unfortunately for the GSC they didn't get the 3 arms gunslinger as commander, but had to stick with the boring Iconward. (probably the only way GW can sell this model)

Hopefully they can get the broodlord as an alternate commander.

Pics drom the Weekender from “Chapter Master Valrak” on Facebook:

So it looks like the commanders are just the existing HQ kits repackaged in a Kill Team box with some extra tokens and cards? Kinda lame, but more would probably be too ambitious to do for every faction.

On the bright side it means Necrons can run a model with a damn warscythe. Assuming the commander rules are allowed at all in matched play that'll really help.

I wonder what the price difference is between "clampack" and "clampack w/tokens + box!".

Also I just noticed that none of the Chaos factions have a box in that lineup. Harlequins, too. I wonder if there's a reason they've been excluded.

Hope this includes a Wolf Lord on Thunderwolf, or something. 40 commanders for 16 factions gives quite a few options...

At the very least, we’ll have:
1. Primaris Librarian
2. Commissar
3. Techpriest Dominus
4. Necron Lord
5. Deathwatch Watch Master
6. Genestealer Cultist Iconward
7. T’au Fireblade
8. Succubus
9. Ork Warboss
10. Broodlord

That leaves 6 more factions (Death Guard, Thousand Sons, Heretic Astartes, Harlequins, Craftworld Eldar, Grey Knights), with room for factions to have two or more Commander types too. I’m guessing we’ll see most plastic HQs appear in the expansion.

Nice, this means Wall of Martyrs will be available generally, not only through webstore like before. Definitely getting like 3-5 sets of those.

Chopstick wrote:
So unfortunately for the GSC they didn't get the 3 arms gunslinger as commander, but had to stick with the boring Iconward. (probably the only way GW can sell this model)

Hopefully they can get the broodlord as an alternate commander.

There's "more than 40" Commanders. I'd be shocked if the Primus doesn't show up, and the Patriarch is listed as one of the options there. I'm thinking that we will see the 3 armed gunslinger show up here though.

For my part, I'm frustrated by the Commissar being in here. You want to talk about "the only way GW can sell this model"? That's the perfect example--especially in light of the nerf beatdown that the Commissar got for 40k proper.

Hopefully there will be some non-Primaris Marine characters.

Kind of liking the character boxes. It’s very inkeeping with the game being an easy pick up. And they may be priced well enough for stocking fillers come Chrimbo.

 Kanluwen wrote:

For my part, I'm frustrated by the Commissar being in here. You want to talk about "the only way GW can sell this model"? That's the perfect example--especially in light of the nerf beatdown that the Commissar got for 40k proper.

Well the Commissar is a unique model, the Iconward on the other hand, it's a Hybrid Acolyte with a bigger flag and no option that you can also build one from the Acolyte kit, like seriously why is this model even exist?.

Did Admech really need another reason to have to have a TPD model? Maybe an Admech box could get a Techpriest model as the HQ just for once?

Fingers crossed for someone with a jump pack. Or a chaplain.

Then my chaplain all stars team can come to fruition!

Curious what the prices for these expansions will be vs. the individual blisters. I know I'm not alone in hoping for a discount!

Price will likely be similar not a discount. There is no scenery or bundling to get the discount from.

 Arachnofiend wrote:
Also I just noticed that none of the Chaos factions have a box in that lineup. Harlequins, too. I wonder if there's a reason they've been excluded.

That is because non of the Chaos factions have a Killteam starter box yet. All of these commanders match the killteam+terrain boxes they have released.

OK, I know the Deathworld Forest got alot of flakk for lack of LOS blocking terrain, but it contains ALOT more individual pieces than the Wall of Martyrs.

Also, looking forward to Commanders. Hopefully we see more Psykers.