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It would probably look bad? IMO in 2500 points you should probably be running 3 Tyrannofexes.

2500 pts... I want to run Nine Carnifexes!

Aduro wrote:2500 pts... I want to run Nine Carnifexes!

Target Saturation; 9 Screamer Killers = 1440 points.
If you ran that with the Tervigon farm (~ 500 points)
You can probably run 1x3 HiveGuard 1x2 HiveGuard, DeathLeaper and another Tervigon.

That's 54 T6 wounds rushing your Guard tankline.

I'm pretty sure you can catalyst those Screamer Killers; and let the supergants clean up whatever is left over.

Batrep it up here dude. I dont need pics, more something like what shep did.

"heres unit x, it sucks because of reason A, unit Y is great though for reason B etc"

OK, I will post the pictures anyways, the battle report is rough to begin with.

Tyrant with Tyrant Guard (not sure loadout yet)
Alpha Warrior with Talons/Claws/Regen (he'll lead a squad of Stealers)
Brood of 3 Lictors
DeathLeaper
20 Horms with Sacs
24 Spinegaunts (I know they apparently suck but I'm using them).
10 Stealers with Sacs led by the Alpha
14 Stealers with Tals/Sacs led by BL with Tals
4 Raveners with RC's
Brood of deuce carnifi with tals/bio/glands (screamer killers)
Mawloc (or possibly TP).

At 2500, there is almost no reason to not go with the basic core of 2 units of 20 Termagaunts, 2 Tervigon with full upgrades, and 2 Tyrannofexes.

I was wondering what a potential ArdBoys (2.5k) Fex spam (9 fexes) would look like. Any of you awesome Nid players out there up to the challenge of drawing up a potential list?

Fex Spam is hard to do. The best you can do is take Carnifexes with Heavy Venom Cannons. 9 of those without at other upgrades are 1665. Better to just apply the principles of good tyranid list building and add things you have points for, like a second Tyrant.

Fateweaver wrote:Great thread. I'm so following this one.

The only thing I'm not sure of is Mawloc or Prime? I want to eventually run all 3 variants of the Trygon but since this is my only one for a while what would be better in your opinions?

Opponents are mostly Mech Guard, SW's, 50/50 Mech/Infantry SM army or Speed Freaks style Orks.

I would suggest magnetizing the options; Tail, jaw, mandibles, chest piece and back fealers. This way you are not locked into just one load out.

@Menelker Did you do or could you do a tutorial on how you magnitized the jaw?

The Battle Report is up!

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/275038.page#1268431

Enjoy

wyomingfox wrote:

Janthkin wrote:

Phryxis wrote:

a mass of gants were moving up, screening a tervigon into midfield.

Screening like "preventing them from getting assaulted" or like "giving them a cover save?"

I'm hearing talk about giving MCs cover saves, doing a Gant, Warrior, MC sequence to give a save, and it's dubious to me. In my experience playing Nidzilla, you can give an MC cover with terrain, or another MC. Nothing else is sufficient. That might just be local rules interpretations, but 50% cover is 50% cover.

I've never had a problem with Warriors giving cover to MCs - with no abusive modeling required, Warriors standing upright are more than waist-high to a Tyrant. Standing base-to-base, they screen more than 50% just fine.

I would agree that yes you can screen with warriors, I have done so many times in the past. However, this new codex has taken away the warriors resiliancy to blast weapons which is the biggest problem with this tactic. No more biker nob wound allocation combined with no more immunity to ID, means that pie templates and high strength pie templates are going to hurt such formations and dwindle your screen down pretty fast.

To be fair, giving the Warriors a big gun and an Alpha leading them can add a bit of wound stacking and S8 soaking potential.

Though on a flat table, the 'pretend that interestingly-posed models are posed normally for their race when checking LOS' rule could make it very difficult to consistently use them as a screen, especially with elevated enemy shooting and clicking turn clocks in tourneys.

wyomingfox wrote:(snip)

Three Waves with the mid nids sandwiched between guants and MC. If I play it right, the Alpha can stick with the HG granting them BS 5 and if the oportunity presents itself, they can jump into the guants as I close with the enemy, granting them BS 5 and WS 5. (Assuming that Apha grants his WS and BS to any nid?)

No, it only works for Warriors. In fact, the wording of it means that RAW doesn't let him do it in a Shrike (Winged Warriors) unit... >.<

I don't think it is such a terrible thing to assume that three hive guard, Warrior, or Zoenthrope can provide a cover save to Carnifex and other similarly sized models. No magic cylinder needed.

Besides, if pressed, you can always default to the -1 cover rule.

Ouch, that Wolf Priest was a pest!

I've been wanting to put together a small 1250 list for fun games using Doom of Malan'thia. We often play team games using a 1000 - 1250 points worth of models. I think there are a few ways to utilize Mr. Doom well and I really hope someone can come up with a decent small list for team play or just a small game.

Mr. Doom seems to work best with a Landing Spore of course. You could also use Tunneling Rippers - what? Well, let there be scatter on your shot. Let it scatter into your own rippers for twice the wounds. Sneaky but legal.I also like the Broodlord and Stealers in Pod - Yes, I would take a pod and on my opponents turn that aura is still working and then pumping my Doom.Then of course there is the Deathleape.

So there are options but how do you succesfully mesh them at 1250 or 1000 points? I don't want an army that relies on one trick to win even at low point levels. Has anyone tested this type of list out?

Menelker wrote:

Fateweaver wrote:Great thread. I'm so following this one.

The only thing I'm not sure of is Mawloc or Prime? I want to eventually run all 3 variants of the Trygon but since this is my only one for a while what would be better in your opinions?

Opponents are mostly Mech Guard, SW's, 50/50 Mech/Infantry SM army or Speed Freaks style Orks.

I would suggest magnetizing the options; Tail, jaw, mandibles, chest piece and back fealers. This way you are not locked into just one load out.

Im going to have a trygon and mawlok in my 1500, and upgrade the mawlok to a trygon in 2k. Im just going to build one as each, and tell anyone who complains about it to feth off. If both giant snake things are trygons its not really a wysiwyg issue.

Sexy report Mahu. I never quite realized how broken jaws was. The old nidzilla with 8 MCs+ infantry it wasnt hateful against, but now with the much more expensive bugs jaws really sticks the long dick of the law up the backside of nid players.

What are the general thoughts here on trygon primes/mawloks with regen?

I realize I'm low on anti-tank but even at 2500 I face normally just a single LR (which so long as I can shake or stun it I'm not too worried about) and like 2-3 Rhino squads and a predator.

In 4th my Lictors were always predator hunters, LRC shooting isn't that scary unless I'm super close (which if it's moving like it should be has greatly diminished firepower and with the exception of my gaunts and spinegants the rhino cargo is not that worrisome to my Tyranids.

I'll eventually get up to Apoc size (for us that is 9k+) and my next purchase will be some Hive Guard for popping rhinos early.

I'm going to try the VC on the Tyrant and see how well it does.

I'll post my results of my game up on the 31st and give a break down of how things performed for me. I realize the army isn't optimal but like with any new codex things change (I also don't have a way to proxy anything or counts as without trying to proxy SM's for nids and that's just wrong).

felixcat wrote:
I've been wanting to put together a small 1250 list for fun games using Doom of Malan'thia. We often play team games using a 1000 - 1250 points worth of models. I think there are a few ways to utilize Mr. Doom well and I really hope someone can come up with a decent small list for team play or just a small game.

Mr. Doom seems to work best with a Landing Spore of course. You could also use Tunneling Rippers - what? Well, let there be scatter on your shot. Let it scatter into your own rippers for twice the wounds. Sneaky but legal.I also like the Broodlord and Stealers in Pod - Yes, I would take a pod and on my opponents turn that aura is still working and then pumping my Doom.Then of course there is the Deathleape.

So there are options but how do you succesfully mesh them at 1250 or 1000 points? I don't want an army that relies on one trick to win even at low point levels. Has anyone tested this type of list out?

I'm also looking forward to trying out Doomie, my fleet devoured an Exodite World so we've got the perfect reason to have him knocking around. I mainly see him as being a potential dirty trick in Apocalypse or Planetstrike, where he won't be displacing other Elites. Might be interesting seeing what happens when he charges a Baneblade whilst charged up!

The Rippers trick is DIRTY, I love it - and don't forget your own Mycetic Pods are potential wound farms And good spot on the Broodlord trick - although, to be frank, poor old Doomie looks destined to die to Melta fire within two turns of arrival... just gotta hope for decent drain rolls sending everyone running to the hills :/

skipmcne wrote:

Aduro wrote:2500 pts... I want to run Nine Carnifexes!

Target Saturation; 9 Screamer Killers = 1440 points.
If you ran that with the Tervigon farm (~ 500 points)
You can probably run 1x3 HiveGuard 1x2 HiveGuard, DeathLeaper and another Tervigon.

That's 54 T6 wounds rushing your Guard tankline.

I'm pretty sure you can catalyst those Screamer Killers; and let the supergants clean up whatever is left over.

So I have until May to buy Nine Carnifexes and build two Tervigons....

Aduro wrote:

skipmcne wrote:

Aduro wrote:2500 pts... I want to run Nine Carnifexes!

Target Saturation; 9 Screamer Killers = 1440 points.
If you ran that with the Tervigon farm (~ 500 points)
You can probably run 1x3 HiveGuard 1x2 HiveGuard, DeathLeaper and another Tervigon.

That's 54 T6 wounds rushing your Guard tankline.

I'm pretty sure you can catalyst those Screamer Killers; and let the supergants clean up whatever is left over.

So I have until May to buy Nine Carnifexes and build two Tervigons....

Three; I stuck the third in the HQ slot.

HQ Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst 205

Elite
DeathLeeaper (140)
HiveGuard x2 (100)
HiveGuard x2 (100)

Troop
10 gant (50)
10 gant (50)
Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst 205
Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst 205

HS
Screamer Killer x 3 480
Screamer Killer x 3 480
Screamer Killer x 3 480

2495

While I wasn't an inherent fan of Nidzilla, that would just be awesome to put down on the table.

skipmcne wrote:
Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst 205
Tervigon Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst 205

Are they not 195 Points each?

Sorry, didn't notice there was a whole other page :p

lindsay40k wrote:No, it only works for Warriors. In fact, the wording of it means that RAW doesn't let him do it in a Shrike (Winged Warriors) unit... >.<

Thanks for the update . Guess that frees up some points to spend elsewhere.

2500pts seems like it'll be awkward for the new Nids book now that I think about it. If at 2000pts or less 2 Tyrannofexes are ideal (which it seems more and more like at this point :( ) then once it goes up to 2500pts you will likely need that third one to even hope to be competitive. You might need 9 Hive guard at that point too (oof). None of this helps solve the problem that is Jaws of the World Wolf either. At 2500pts maybe something like this:

Swarmlord
2x Tyrant Guard
3x Hive Guard
3x Hive Guard
3x Hive Guard
20x Hormagants: Toxin Sacs
30x Termagants
30x Termagants
Tervigon: Catalyst, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs
Tervigon: Catalyst, Adrenal Glands, Toxin Sacs
Tyrannofex: Rupture Cannon
Tyrannofex: Rupture Cannon
Tyrannofex: Rupture Cannon

It just feels to bland and boring. I hate it. But you get those crucial Rupture Cannons against AV14 and the like, and then piles of HG to try and deal with the eleventybillionandone light-medium transports that people will like to bring at this year's 'Ard Boyz with the whole trend towards mech and stuff.

The 1850 games I played with a Tyrant, Deathleaper, 2x Zoans in pods, Gaunts + Tervigons, Raveners and Trygone drop list were total loses to Mech Guard and Mech Space Wolves.

Going to try a more traditional walk and shoot list like the old zilla lists and see how that goes.

Caffran9
I think you need the death leaper in there to not get smoked by Jaws and help your Catalyst go off.

I hate the way these new competitive nid armies are shaping up. Same old gak just with new models. Lots of hive guard, the new tyrannofex, and tervigons.

Looks like poop. Im not arguing its validity as a winning army. But its same old crap. I think im going to go with maximum trygons/mawloks and try sneaky reserve games.

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:I hate the way these new competitive nid armies are shaping up. Same old gak just with new models. Lots of hive guard, the new tyrannofex, and tervigons.

How dare everyone want to use the cool new big units! Booooo!!! That said, I finally sat down and did... Math ::shudder:: and wrote up a tentative army list for a standard 1750 pt tournament.

HQ
Alpha Warrior w/ Boneswords and Deathspitter 95 pts

Elites
2x Hive Guard 100 pts
2x Hive Guard 100 pts

Troops
20x Termagaunts w/ 2 Stranglewebs 120 pts
20x Termagaunts w/ 2 Stranglewebs 120 pts
Tervigon w/ Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst and Onslaught 210 pts
Tervigon w/ Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst and Onslaught 210 pts
18x Hormagaunts w/ Toxin Sacs 160 pts


Fast Attack
20x Gargoyles w/ Toxin Sacs 140 pts


Heavy Support
T-Fex w/ Bio Cannon 265 pts
T-Fex w/ Bio Cannon 265 pts


It functions mostly the same as my old `Nid army, swapping out my big Fexes for T-Fexes, Warriors as Gaunt babysitters for Tervigons, and my Tyrant for an Alpha Warrior. Instead of a Lictor I get 4 Hive Guard and 20 Gargoyles.

Swarmlord-280

2 tyrant guard-130
Lash whips

2 zoanthropes-120

Spore pod-40

2 hive guard-100

10 stealers-140

10 stealers-140

24 termagaunts-120

Trygon -235
Regenerate, adrenal glands

Mawlok-195
Regenerate

Theres my 1500 point army list. I figure itll provide enough variety in deployment options to deal with most threats.

Aduro wrote:

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:I hate the way these new competitive nid armies are shaping up. Same old gak just with new models. Lots of hive guard, the new tyrannofex, and tervigons.

How dare everyone want to use the cool new big units! Booooo!!! That said, I finally sat down and did... Math ::shudder:: and wrote up a tentative army list for a standard 1750 pt tournament.

HQ
Alpha Warrior w/ Boneswords and Deathspitter 95 pts

Elites
2x Hive Guard 100 pts
2x Hive Guard 100 pts

Troops
20x Termagaunts w/ 2 Stranglewebs 120 pts
20x Termagaunts w/ 2 Stranglewebs 120 pts
Tervigon w/ Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst and Onslaught 210 pts
Tervigon w/ Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst and Onslaught 210 pts
18x Hormagaunts w/ Toxin Sacs 160 pts


Fast Attack
20x Gargoyles w/ Toxin Sacs 140 pts


Heavy Support
T-Fex w/ Bio Cannon 265 pts
T-Fex w/ Bio Cannon 265 pts


It functions mostly the same as my old `Nid army, swapping out my big Fexes for T-Fexes, Warriors as Gaunt babysitters for Tervigons, and my Tyrant for an Alpha Warrior. Instead of a Lictor I get 4 Hive Guard and 20 Gargoyles.

That looks lean and mean. If I were to play Nids, that would be pretty close to my list. I would likely only take 10 Terms in each though and take more Horms, drop the Gargs and take more Hive. Anyways, looks good....

Aduro wrote:

I grappled the shoggoth wrote:I hate the way these new competitive nid armies are shaping up. Same old gak just with new models. Lots of hive guard, the new tyrannofex, and tervigons.

How dare everyone want to use the cool new big units! Booooo!!! That said, I finally sat down and did... Math ::shudder:: and wrote up a tentative army list for a standard 1750 pt tournament.

HQ
Alpha Warrior w/ Boneswords and Deathspitter 95 pts

Elites
2x Hive Guard 100 pts
2x Hive Guard 100 pts

Troops
20x Termagaunts w/ 2 Stranglewebs 120 pts
20x Termagaunts w/ 2 Stranglewebs 120 pts
Tervigon w/ Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst and Onslaught 210 pts
Tervigon w/ Adrenal, Toxin, Catalyst and Onslaught 210 pts
18x Hormagaunts w/ Toxin Sacs 160 pts


Fast Attack
20x Gargoyles w/ Toxin Sacs 140 pts


Heavy Support
T-Fex w/ Bio Cannon 265 pts
T-Fex w/ Bio Cannon 265 pts


It functions mostly the same as my old `Nid army, swapping out my big Fexes for T-Fexes, Warriors as Gaunt babysitters for Tervigons, and my Tyrant for an Alpha Warrior. Instead of a Lictor I get 4 Hive Guard and 20 Gargoyles.

I like the list as well, except I'm wondering why the Hormagaunts are there. Sure, they are extra killy, but I don't see them as necessary with an already strong termagant base. I'd suggest using more gants or more gargoyles.

The Hormagaunts and Gargoyles are in it for pretty much the same reason... I like the figs. If I were to trade em for anything, it would probably be Venomthropes, for the same reason, but I want to make it nice and swarmy.

Menelker wrote:

Fateweaver wrote:Great thread. I'm so following this one.

The only thing I'm not sure of is Mawloc or Prime? I want to eventually run all 3 variants of the Trygon but since this is my only one for a while what would be better in your opinions?

Opponents are mostly Mech Guard, SW's, 50/50 Mech/Infantry SM army or Speed Freaks style Orks.

I would suggest magnetizing the options; Tail, jaw, mandibles, chest piece and back fealers. This way you are not locked into just one load out.

Lovely Trygon.

Kirika wrote:The 1850 games I played with a Tyrant, Deathleaper, 2x Zoans in pods, Gaunts + Tervigons, Raveners and Trygone drop list were total loses to Mech Guard and Mech Space Wolves.

Going to try a more traditional walk and shoot list like the old zilla lists and see how that goes.

Caffran9
I think you need the death leaper in there to not get smoked by Jaws and help your Catalyst go off.

Deathleaper is in no way a reliable answer to Jaws for a couple of reasons. First sometimes you'll roll a 1 and they'll be largely unaffected. Even if you dock their LD by 2 it won't be the end of the world for them. Also at 2500pts you're probably going to run into like 2-3 Priests with Jaws if they decide to take it. Deathleaper can sometimes help to stop one of them, but not even in a real huge way. Unless you get that -3 to LD he won't be very effective against it. He is nice to help get Catalyst off though since you aren't nearly as likely to encounter multiple hoods as you are multiple Runic Weapons (which he does nothing against anyway).