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Should be AP 3, it's basically a really crappy version of a battlecannon of a leman russ

My codex also says it's AP3.

Mine too.

Anyone else considering Necron Allies? Warriors are great against any vehicle, are resilient, and fairly cheap. Albeit it's expensive, sticking them in a Ghost Ark further adds to their survivability and firepower. Only problem is that the unit starts to add up in the points, and the Overlord that would be taken has to ride in a Command Barge due to Convenience rules.

Just food for thought.

I think the optimal necron allies loadout would be a CCB Olord, a Night Scythe with warriors, and a Doom Scythe.

Gets your warriors into vehicle popping glance range quickly, mucks around with pew pew lightning, and the doom scythe just draws lines across people, all while your orks are slogging up the middle, laughing their green asses off at all the explosions.

AresX8 wrote:Anyone else considering Necron Allies? Warriors are great against any vehicle, are resilient, and fairly cheap. Albeit it's expensive, sticking them in a Ghost Ark further adds to their survivability and firepower. Only problem is that the unit starts to add up in the points, and the Overlord that would be taken has to ride in a Command Barge due to Convenience rules.

Just food for thought.

I'm torn on taking a potential ally.

I could do Necrons and model them as tinboyz. Ramshackle Scythes would be neat.

Inspiration:

WAAAGH! Grimcog: http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/271328.page



I could take Imperial guard. Blood Axes, Grot soldiers, or do a penal legion with guardsmen modeled as slaves and a runtherd for a sarge.

Inspiration (for grot army):

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/227091.page

I could take Chaos Space Marines (not that I want to) and either have pirates like the Red Corsairs or forge a shaky alliance like in Dawn of War: Winter Assault.

I could take Tau. Enslaved Fire Warriors, Dakka Grots, or Flash Gitz for troops. Meganobz with mega dakkaguns for Broadsides.

I could (though it's not recommended) take Grey Knights for an ally:

The Orkwisition! Orkwisitah Orky - Da - Madda and his retinue. Servytas, Jokey Grot Technicians, and a ninja grot (vindicare assassin).

The list goes on and on.

Here's a question: Do Markerlights, and those Necron Triarch Stalker designation things, and other devices that modify BS or otherwise make it easier to hit things- do those work for allies, and more importanntly, Orks?

Anvildude wrote:Here's a question: Do Markerlights, and those Necron Triarch Stalker designation things, and other devices that modify BS or otherwise make it easier to hit things- do those work for allies, and more importanntly, Orks?

No, Orks don't have allies, we have another enemy army on the field who we aren't going to smash today.

sirlynchmob wrote:

Anvildude wrote:Here's a question: Do Markerlights, and those Necron Triarch Stalker designation things, and other devices that modify BS or otherwise make it easier to hit things- do those work for allies, and more importanntly, Orks?

No, Orks don't have allies, we have another enemy army on the field who we aren't going to smash today.

I think he's asking if items or abilities that grant "+1 BS" will count towards snapfire and the like.

I'm curious about that myself.

Dakkajetz can purchase +1BS and they have a flyer rule that gives them +1BS too I think.

If that is infact the case than Dakkajetz never have to deal with snapfire... they always shoot at the equivelent of BS3.

But I'm probably wrong.

A rule setting a stat will always overrule all modifiers. So even if you quadruple your BS and then add the number of boyz to it, snap fire will still be at BS1.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Capt. Camping wrote:So, if we are talking about shoota style now, will it be good to have a Killkannon in the battlewagon and transporting 12?

It will never be good to have a killkannon unless it drops in points, gains range and/or increases in strength. For those points you could simply outfit your battlewagon with four big shootaz and rokkits and a kannon. Then put 20 shootaz inside.

Dr. What wrote:

Capt. Camping wrote:So, if we are talking about shoota style now, will it be good to have a Killkannon in the battlewagon and transporting 12?

Maybe if it's carrying Lootas.

I don't think killkannons are very good, but apparently there's a difference in some Ork codices.

Some (like mine) say it's AP4, but I just saw 2 claims of it being AP3.

Can anybody verify?

Mine says S7 AP3 Ordnance 1 Large Blast. Short range: 24". A very costy upgrade, those points could be used to line up some big gunz instead.

Dr. What wrote:I could take Tau. Enslaved Fire Warriors, Dakka Grots, or Flash Gitz for troops. Meganobz with mega dakkaguns for Broadsides.

Like this?



Been running my 'Orksides' for a few years now in Apoc. games.
Over at Da Waaagh!, we've been doing some Klan rules since the last codex came out and the old Chapter Approved rules died. I added some 'Meganob Gunslingaz' into the Bad Moon list which were essentially more expensive broadsides. Check the sig. Some of the guys have done some pretty pictures:

Marklerlights are for friendly tau models only.

A killkannon pucks a much needed punch against a flanking assault marine squad compared to a lame kannon

Seeing as passengers can fire at a different target to a vehicle, dakkawagons have the potential to blow up 2 tanks a turn, assuming loota fire is coming out one way and death the other

Personally i think running the killkannon in a green tide is a good idea, however 2 boomgun wagons is also nice, its all about killing MEQ! We can pwn anything else (there isn't enough terminators for the tide)

Anybody else feel like Battlewagons are still viable, but Deff-rolla's might be dead.

Rules that affect this:
-Cant disembark if a vehicle goes more then combat speed
-All vehicles can fire all weapons if moving cruising speed
-improved leathality of Lascannons
-All vehicles get extra movement during shooting phase
-Can't ram during the shooting phase

It just seems like the Deffrolla BW is never going to catch a vehicle that keeps moving. And since all vehicles can fire even if moving cruising speed, our enemies can keep moving and shooting until they get lucky.

Just my thoughts.

I suppose, Tau Hammerhead with multi-tracker is going to screw everything, seeing as it is a fast skimmer tank

I think deff rolla's are good if used in the green tide, but nowhere else or they are just singled out. The tank will advance at same pace as tide (6 inches) and will ram any vehicle driving up to the tide (will save the tide from a land raider redeemer for example)

mrfantastical wrote:Anybody else feel like Battlewagons are still viable, but Deff-rolla's might be dead.

Rules that affect this:
-Cant disembark if a vehicle goes more then combat speed
-All vehicles can fire all weapons if moving cruising speed
-improved leathality of Lascannons
-All vehicles get extra movement during shooting phase
-Can't ram during the shooting phase

It just seems like the Deffrolla BW is never going to catch a vehicle that keeps moving. And since all vehicles can fire even if moving cruising speed, our enemies can keep moving and shooting until they get lucky.

Just my thoughts.

Maybe I misunderstand you, but when am I not going to move 12" and ram someone? Are you saying you'd only ever move 6, so you could fire everything, despite having the option to move 12 and catch up to that vehicle and Deff Roll it?

I can solve both of your problems.

Movement Phase, disembark your squad 6 inches in front of the battlewagon (slightly to the side so it can steamroll straight ahead at a rhino), and then move it 12 inches into somethings face.

That way you can disembark! Your troops can shoot! You can ram! And nothing in the ork arsenal is better than D6 S10 against a vehicle so, no "i want to fire my zzap gun at it...".....KRUMP

Can't ram the turn something disembarks.

Well that just sucks D:, Disembark turn before.

Just seems like it'd be better to have BW's be mobile weapon platforms now then Post-Ram Assault delivery system.

The way every vehicle is more mobile now, our 12" ram doesn't seem that viable anymore.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

matphat wrote:

mrfantastical wrote:Anybody else feel like Battlewagons are still viable, but Deff-rolla's might be dead.

Rules that affect this:
-Cant disembark if a vehicle goes more then combat speed
-All vehicles can fire all weapons if moving cruising speed
-improved leathality of Lascannons
-All vehicles get extra movement during shooting phase
-Can't ram during the shooting phase

It just seems like the Deffrolla BW is never going to catch a vehicle that keeps moving. And since all vehicles can fire even if moving cruising speed, our enemies can keep moving and shooting until they get lucky.

Just my thoughts.

Maybe I misunderstand you, but when am I not going to move 12" and ram someone? Are you saying you'd only ever move 6, so you could fire everything, despite having the option to move 12 and catch up to that vehicle and Deff Roll it?

A smart opponent is always going to stay 13"+ away from our BW's. And now that vehicles can move at least 6" in the shooting phase, how do we catch them? we can't Ram during our 6" movement during shooting.

So basicly, the only viable builds (competitive) we got left is: bikernobs
(Shooty) green tide.

Whereas in last edition we had:
Trukkspam
Kommandospam (15x3 kommandomobs outflanking, one coming from the rear with snikrot and ghaz was scary)
Kanwall
Dreadstomp
Battlewagon deffrolla rush
Green tide
Nobspam
Biker-nobspam

Add a side dish of koptas on any build, and/or small kommando mob with snikky and warboss

What the fug does gw have against orks?!!

thats a good point, with premeasuring its now basically guaranteed you wont be in ram range, if the opponent has a brain, or if he wants his vehicle to die on purpose. If i was up against a battlewagon id park 14 inches away and screw him over.

So, then, BWs have gone from Deffrolling to Dakka spamming?
I think that's still pretty nice.
It's a long shot from being obsolete.

Jag_Calle wrote:So basicly, the only viable builds (competitive) we got left is: bikernobs
(Shooty) green tide.

Whereas in last edition we had:
Trukkspam
Kommandospam (15x3 kommandomobs outflanking, one coming from the rear with snikrot and ghaz was scary)
Kanwall
Dreadstomp
Battlewagon deffrolla rush
Green tide
Nobspam
Biker-nobspam

Add a side dish of koptas on any build, and/or small kommando mob with snikky and warboss

What the fug does gw have against orks?!!

MegaNob Wing seems viable

As does:

Rokkits Rokkits everywhere.
Loota spam

I think Battle Wagons as the foundation for a Speed Freek Rokkit list would be viable.
3x BW w/ RPJ, Riggers, (maybe 'ard case), and 4x rokkits.
or Dakka list with the same + 4x big shootas and Lootas.

I woudn't discount the BW list yet. There is still a ton of mileage there.

I'm not saying BW are dead, just Deffrolla's

(which makes my 5 Deffrollas at home very sad)

How about my 11 Ork dreds? Think they are smiling right now?
=(

I think 15x Burna's, with 3 Meks, and 2 Big Meks w/ KFF's, and grot oiler on all meks, and your 11 dreads are smiling

They get flamers, and 5 meks with 4+ to repair a hull point each turn

(Im thinking 2 Deff Dread Troops and 9 kans here, the big boys go first)

Orkaswampa wrote:I think 15x Burna's, with 3 Meks, and 2 Big Meks w/ KFF's, and grot oiler on all meks, and your 11 dreads are smiling

They get flamers, and 5 meks with 4+ to repair a hull point each turn

(Im thinking 2 Deff Dread Troops and 9 kans here, the big boys go first)

Interesting. I'll have to mock this up and see what it looks like.

Please, post your results! All of the talk about the Dread Bash/Kan Wall sounds bleak. As a guy who is three Killa Kans away from finishing his army, I am so disappointed by the discussion! I would love to find ways to make the build work in 6th Edition.