Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

Kirasu wrote:
Afterall, even toughness 8 is only AV11/12 yet people routinely go berserk over how unfair wraithlords are

That would be because most armies can't 1 shot Wraithlords like they can AV 12 models.

The problem with Wraithlords is T8 coupled with wounds and the fact that those wounds have no bearing on their effectiveness(which is superior to an AV12 model that can be one shotted or have weapons removed).

slowed is not a synonym for stupid, ugly, or other derogatory sentiments. Please do not use it as such in the future. Thanks! ~Manchu

You're right, I can totally make out the pilot hanging outside the walker and the sleek, skinny limbs!

Wrong.

But comparing something that looks like a metal insect with oversized groin to a box on two tree stumps while claiming 20yo aesthetic establishment is ok?

Warboss Narznok wrote:Does anybody else find this thing ridiculously slowed looking??

Yes.

biccat wrote:

Warboss Narznok wrote:Does anybody else find this thing ridiculously slowed looking??

Yes.

It's almost like 1/3 of the thread was devoted to people saying something along those lines...

Pyriel- wrote:But comparing something that looks like a metal insect with oversized groin to a box on two tree stumps while claiming 20yo aesthetic establishment is ok?

And yet, in spite of those differences, they still have way more in common than with the Dreadknight.

I like it to be honest.

And I can even see it without the GK hanging at the belly, just cover the torso add a nice head and voila!

Platuan4th wrote:

biccat wrote:

Warboss Narznok wrote:Does anybody else find this thing ridiculously slowed looking??

Yes.

It's almost like 1/3 of the thread was devoted to people saying something along those lines...

Only 1/3? Where's the orange monkey anyway? That could yet swing it for me...

To be fair Flash, I pulled 1/3 out my ass. It's almost definitely more than that.

Dreadknight=

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/172/420247015_244c0bceed.jpg?v=0

Okay, so here is the plan, 1 box of GK termies and PAGK's and a box of sang guard. Mix and match and voila! BA vets

I actually preferred the old stormbolter version with two almost separate barrels instead of the new ones. Ah well.

On another note, I can not wait for a tutorial on how to paint that silver, blue washes are certainly a key part of the recipe.

ColdSadHungry wrote:

Che-Vito wrote:Did you miss the "all Grey Knights have Power Weapons" part of the new Codex? That is a HUGE difference, and one that I cannot avoid in tournaments.

Looks like I missed that part. Are we sure that this is the case? ALL Nemesis weapons are power weapons? I don't remember that being in the leaked codex. I just don't believe that GW would give every model in an army power weapons.

You did and they do. Just check out the advanced order for the PAGK.. Every model has a blue tinted sword

Commander Cain wrote:Okay, so here is the plan, 1 box of GK termies and PAGK's and a box of sang guard. Mix and match and voila! BA vets

I actually preferred the old stormbolter version with two almost separate barrels instead of the new ones. Ah well.

On another note, I can not wait for a tutorial on how to paint that silver, blue washes are certainly a key part of the recipe.

I do agree that the detail on draigo's sword is fething epic
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?prodId=prod1140064a
real nice storm shield too.

Kanluwen wrote:

The Dwarf Wolf wrote:My problem with the Dreadknight have not to do with rules or fluffy, the ideia of GK champions with equipment/powers that make them MC is very nice. Those guys are supposed to face daemons, the big, ugly daemons...

My problem with dreadknight is that ugly model. Said that, if i ever use a GK army, it will probably have some Angelic knight, floating on the air in a great terminator army, and BIG weapons...

PS: tecnically, the new codex is called Grey Knights, so it dont replace daemon hunters and witch hunters. SO allies keeps in... (well, we know GW will say something about it in future)

Yes, it does replace Daemonhunters and Witchhunters. Try to pull that crap around here, you'd likely get asked to leave and never return.(

That "crap" was a joke. But let me ask: do you really gona deny another player from use a nicely converted/kitbashed Inquisitor in his IG army? Or those old GKs he like so much as "Fast Attack"?

Where's the grounds that Grey Knights replaces Witch Hunters?

Kirasu wrote:

ColdSadHungry wrote:

Che-Vito wrote:Did you miss the "all Grey Knights have Power Weapons" part of the new Codex? That is a HUGE difference, and one that I cannot avoid in tournaments.

Looks like I missed that part. Are we sure that this is the case? ALL Nemesis weapons are power weapons? I don't remember that being in the leaked codex. I just don't believe that GW would give every model in an army power weapons.

You did and they do. Just check out the advanced order for the PAGK.. Every model has a blue tinted sword

Have we actually been told specifically that all GK nemesis weapons are power weapons? Just because they are blue doesn't mean they are. A regular PAGk that you can take for 20 points has a power weapon? Im going to check out the leaked codex but since there is not summary or wargear section in it, I don't know how anyone can be sure of this. I'm a GK player myself but I would consider this army to be broken if ALL GK had power weapons.

Balance wrote:Where's the grounds that Grey Knights replaces Witch Hunters?

Non-existent grounds.

Someone was being silly.

1. The leaked book is incorrect.

2. Most of the people talking about all of them being power weapons have supposedly seen the copy of the book in the Black Box.

pretre wrote:

Balance wrote:Where's the grounds that Grey Knights replaces Witch Hunters?

Non-existent grounds.

Someone was being silly.

Oh. Thanks.

ColdSadHungry wrote:I'm a GK player myself but I would consider this army to be broken if ALL GK had power weapons.

Can we wait until a few games are played at least? Geeze.

I know a codex that gets all power weapons, furious charge AND invulnerable saves for their basic troops. Are they broken?

The Dwarf Wolf wrote: But let me ask: do you really gona deny another player from use a nicely converted/kitbashed Inquisitor in his IG army? Or those old GKs he like so much as "Fast Attack"?

Is there something in the IG codex that they "Count As"? Like a Kommisar or a stormtrooper squad?

If yes, sure. Put them on the table. I like to look at pretty models.

If no, but you want to use the old ally rules (which I despise), then no. Pick a codex and play it. Or, up the points to 7500 and we'll play Apoc. Bring whatever you want.

kronk wrote:

If no, but you want to use the old ally rules (which I despise), then no.

If it's a Daemon Hunter, I'd agree. However Witch Hunters are still allowed the Allies rule, since nothing ahs replaced their book yet.

AgeOfEgos wrote:

TBD wrote:

Che-Vito wrote:Did you miss the "all Grey Knights have Power Weapons" part of the new Codex? That is a HUGE difference, and one that I cannot avoid in tournaments.
Psycannons, also played an important role in my lists, and they are significantly better (when frankly, they performed just fine beforehand)

You also seemed to miss that playing a 3e codex that is not as competitive, is fine by me. I'm the guy that will drop 500 points on the 4e Last Chancers, and play them, because I can still make them perform for me, even if they are a bit expensive for what they can do. All I was hoping for, with the 5e codex, was an update on outdated rules, and an update on the Allies section. Instead, the made a lot of newer OP wargear, got rid of some of the old...and got rid of Allies.

Wait, so you are a tournament player complaining about your army getting more competitive rules

Sorry, but it seems like your hopes & expectations just weren't very realistic.

The part that really doesn't make sense to me is the complaint about the new rules being too strong...while complaining about allies being removed.

The only time I ever saw Grey Knights in a competitive setting was when they leased out their Inquisitor/Mystic entourage to the Guard. Which, given the abundance of times I've seen that, they must have an entire planet dedicated to Inquisitor/Mystic factories.

You've not played a game against me then

The only bad thing about the dreadknight is the pilots dangling legs. Doesn't matter though since at least half the haters will get one in a month.

Interesting release, looks like they got the quality over quantity thing down and prices to match ><

CT GAMER wrote:

ancientsociety wrote:

it had to be done I guess...

It was right there! They were just begging me to do it...

ColdSadHungry wrote:

Kirasu wrote:

ColdSadHungry wrote:

Che-Vito wrote:Did you miss the "all Grey Knights have Power Weapons" part of the new Codex? That is a HUGE difference, and one that I cannot avoid in tournaments.

Looks like I missed that part. Are we sure that this is the case? ALL Nemesis weapons are power weapons? I don't remember that being in the leaked codex. I just don't believe that GW would give every model in an army power weapons.

You did and they do. Just check out the advanced order for the PAGK.. Every model has a blue tinted sword

Have we actually been told specifically that all GK nemesis weapons are power weapons? Just because they are blue doesn't mean they are. A regular PAGk that you can take for 20 points has a power weapon? Im going to check out the leaked codex but since there is not summary or wargear section in it, I don't know how anyone can be sure of this. I'm a GK player myself but I would consider this army to be broken if ALL GK had power weapons.

The leaked codex not having a wargear is a minor issue.. If PAGKs have "nemesis force swords" then they are power weapons.. Since the advanced order says they have nemesis force swords and they are also painted blue like EVERY OTHER power weapon in their range basically then yeah Im pretty certain

Also, through deduction and investigation its pretty easy to figure out the answer.. All of the HQs, the terminators, justicars and everything that has a power weapon in every other SM book also has a "nemesis force sword".. Id really start thinking of your Gks as overpowered then as you said :p

They did away with variable effects for the same weapon.. All nemesis force swords are power weapons, thus anything that has such a wargear item has a power weapon.. Everything in the book has said wargear item (the Gks anyway)

Can also think about the opposite.. If nemesis force weapons are *not* power weapons then no model in the army has a power weapon including characters. That makes little sense considering every single librarian in known existence has a power weapon basic same with terminators

pretre wrote:

ColdSadHungry wrote:I'm a GK player myself but I would consider this army to be broken if ALL GK had power weapons.

Can we wait until a few games are played at least? Geeze.

I know a codex that gets all power weapons, furious charge AND invulnerable saves for their basic troops. Are they broken?

i know it's premature to be doomsaying but lets take a squad of PAGK who have the halberds for +2 initiative and use hammerhand for +1 str and have power weapons - even if charged, they will most likely get first strike against most things and deny armour saves to their opponent. Don't get me wrong, Im going to be playing with a big grin on my face but based on what we think we know so far, it does sound more than a little cheesy


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kirasu wrote:

The leaked codex not having a wargear is a minor issue.. If PAGKs have "nemesis force swords" then they are power weapons.. Since the advanced order says they have nemesis force swords and they are also painted blue like EVERY OTHER power weapon in their range basically then yeah Im pretty certain

Also, through deduction and investigation its pretty easy to figure out the answer.. All of the HQs, the terminators, justicars and everything that has a power weapon in every other SM book also has a "nemesis force sword".. Id really start thinking of your Gks as overpowered then as you said :p

They did away with variable effects for the same weapon.. All nemesis force swords are power weapons, thus anything that has such a wargear item has a power weapon.. Everything in the book has said wargear item (the Gks anyway)

Can also think about the opposite.. If nemesis force weapons are *not* power weapons then no model in the army has a power weapon including characters. That makes little sense considering every single librarian in known existence has a power weapon basic same with terminators

But in the current codex, NFW only count as power weapons in the hands of TAGK upwards. If a regular PAGK has one, it's not a power weapon. Could be the same in the new codex?

ColdSadHungry wrote:

pretre wrote:

ColdSadHungry wrote:I'm a GK player myself but I would consider this army to be broken if ALL GK had power weapons.

Can we wait until a few games are played at least? Geeze.

I know a codex that gets all power weapons, furious charge AND invulnerable saves for their basic troops. Are they broken?

i know it's premature to be doomsaying but lets take a squad of PAGK who have the halberds for +2 initiative and use hammerhand for +1 str and have power weapons - even if charged, they will most likely get first strike against most things and deny armour saves to their opponent. Don't get me wrong, Im going to be playing with a big grin on my face but based on what we think we know so far, it does sound more than a little cheesy


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Kirasu wrote:

The leaked codex not having a wargear is a minor issue.. If PAGKs have "nemesis force swords" then they are power weapons.. Since the advanced order says they have nemesis force swords and they are also painted blue like EVERY OTHER power weapon in their range basically then yeah Im pretty certain

Also, through deduction and investigation its pretty easy to figure out the answer.. All of the HQs, the terminators, justicars and everything that has a power weapon in every other SM book also has a "nemesis force sword".. Id really start thinking of your Gks as overpowered then as you said :p

They did away with variable effects for the same weapon.. All nemesis force swords are power weapons, thus anything that has such a wargear item has a power weapon.. Everything in the book has said wargear item (the Gks anyway)

Can also think about the opposite.. If nemesis force weapons are *not* power weapons then no model in the army has a power weapon including characters. That makes little sense considering every single librarian in known existence has a power weapon basic same with terminators

But in the current codex, NFW only count as power weapons in the hands of TAGK upwards. If a regular PAGK has one, it's not a power weapon. Could be the same in the new codex?

at least they don't all have fleet or counter charge or something ridiculous like that. i play neither tau nor GK, but i get the feeling the two will have some very heated battles, with all of these insane armour and invul saves the Gk have your best bet is going to be throwing high strength low ap shots, which in a shotty heavy to balanced tau army your going to have.

As for anyone else, time to watch Gk make heads roll. *covers CSM protectively*

kronk wrote:

The Dwarf Wolf wrote: But let me ask: do you really gona deny another player from use a nicely converted/kitbashed Inquisitor in his IG army? Or those old GKs he like so much as "Fast Attack"?

Is there something in the IG codex that they "Count As"? Like a Kommisar or a stormtrooper squad?

If yes, sure. Put them on the table. I like to look at pretty models.

If no, but you want to use the old ally rules (which I despise), then no. Pick a codex and play it. Or, up the points to 7500 and we'll play Apoc. Bring whatever you want.

Yeah, looking at that side... you are right, there is few things on a IG Command Squad that you could not "count ass" some Inquisitorial Retinue options...

Wow, that Dreadknight looks like it could jump an entire flock of sharks.