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Darkvoidof40k wrote:Guess I was wrong. Was going off a rumour I read the other day.

Remember, deep breaths and don't count on anything until the book is in your hand and the FAQ is out.

pretre wrote:

Exergy wrote:in your list it's a power weapon.

Not in 6th edition, it isn't. Pretty sure it says if it isn't specified, it is a sword. Pretty sure if you want to take a maul or axe, you need to specifiy in your list. Again, we have to wait for the book, but good luck getting away with that.

Also, are you going to magnetize your guys so you can swap the weapons when you see what your opponent is playing?

I play DE and am getting out of the agonizer/power weapon business all together and calling all my greeny special ccw venom blades until I figure out what to do. If I wanted to do the PW thing, I have more than enough models to pull out whatever I like.

pretre wrote:

Darkvoidof40k wrote:Guess I was wrong. Was going off a rumour I read the other day.

Remember, deep breaths and don't count on anything until the book is in your hand and the FAQ is out.

Problem for me is I won't be buying the BRB, too expensive for me. I'm stuck waiting for september for the starter set(s) to be released, in which case I'll be picking up the chaos one to get models and the small rulebook. If they only do one set and put the DA in there too, well, I'll be ecstatic.

$75 for 4 years of entertainment is too expensive? Might be in the wrong hobby.

pretre wrote:$75 for 4 years of entertainment is too expensive? Might be in the wrong hobby.

£45 for me.. and although I could walk out the house and buy it right now, I've yet to buy a BRB over 3 editions. This hobby's expensive enough without paying the same for a book that I can get with a whole bunch of minis as well.

He has a point. £45 for the book OR £65 for the book and the models and the templates and the dice and some objective markers and all the other jazz too... PLUS you can sell the other army on Ebay...

JbR of the Endless Spire wrote:He has a point. £45 for the book OR £65 for the book and the models and the templates and the dice and some objective markers and all the other jazz too... PLUS you can sell the other army on Ebay...

Not to mention when AoBR came out it was £40, and £30 on sites like Weyland games.

I'm presuming that in September they'll stick to form and start off with the starter sets at a low price, then they'll take a hike up the expense mountain.

Really hoping they just do one set, after all I can't see how anyone could learn from the starter set with just one army. Unless they try and force you to buy both, but I doubt that'd be very successful.

Darkvoidof40k wrote:

pretre wrote:

Darkvoidof40k wrote:Guess I was wrong. Was going off a rumour I read the other day.

Remember, deep breaths and don't count on anything until the book is in your hand and the FAQ is out.

Problem for me is I won't be buying the BRB, too expensive for me. I'm stuck waiting for september for the starter set(s) to be released, in which case I'll be picking up the chaos one to get models and the small rulebook. If they only do one set and put the DA in there too, well, I'll be ecstatic.

im waiting for the starter set too. if there are cultists in there and they look anything like my imagination I am going to be fielding an entire army of them and so am going to be buying a TON of them.

pretre wrote:useless nonsense somehow related to my post

You assume too much. Learn to read.

@Scott: Umm. No idea what point you're actually referring to. You might want to work on the quoting and paraphrasing bit of your posts.

One thing I have to question about is the whole Chaos don't have Thunder Hammers or shields of any kind. Why is this? TH/SS was around before the heresy as was man portable Pcannons (though in VERY limited number) so why is it that chaos can't take them? Or just come up with an equivalent... Maul = Hammer rather than getting its own set of rules.

EDIT: I get that they are trying to differentiate the two armies, but surely they could just do something like a SW codex or BA codex for chaos. A debased version of the original codex with added chaos specific units and removed Loyalist specific units (such as vanguard and sternguards). Like how SW can get thunderwolves and BA deathcompany, instead put in possessed, cultists, chosen etc. change the names and tweak the rules for certain loyalist items etc. Simples.

Exergy wrote:Got the rulebook in hand and reading the stuff about power weapons. Dont see any 5++ as people have been talking about.
When it comes to power weapons you have to determine what kind of power weapon it is. The rule book says look at the model, if its a sword or dagger its a power sword. If its an ax or halbard its a power ax and if its a club or mace its a power maul. Listen below for convinence.

The issue here is that in your army list it still says power weapon. So you can make an army list, say guard and see what your opponent is playing and take out models accordingly. You are playing against orks, man I need some help wounding, take mauls. You are facing Deathwing, man I need the axes. You are facing Sisters and maybe it is best to go with swords. All are power weapons and so your list has not changed, only the models you took out of your case.


Sword S= AP3
Ax S+1 AP2 I1
Maul S+2 AP4

I dont know what all the complaining is about (directed to the whiners, not OP). Anything that adds a little more variety and variation into the game is fine by me. I saw the dumming down of weapons and power weaponry as something that made the game more dull.

Just to reiterate that this is a throw back to 2nd Edition I dug out my 2nd ed. reference card. Lets take a look shall we:

Any SWORD type weapon, gave you a parry (opponent rerolls one die to hit, against you.) not sure if P-Swords give you a 5+ invuln, but would be similar.
Power Axe - str 6, -3 save mod (if used 2 handed) OR str 5, -2 save mod (one handed use)
Power Fist - str 8, -5 save mod, NO INITIATIVE NEGATIVE (Hail to the king baby!)
Power Maul - Str 5, -3 save mod
Power Sword - Str 5, -3 Save mod, gives you a PARRY

just for comparison's sake, chainswords use to be a str 4, -1 save mod, and PARRY. made it worth it to give to a guardsman
Also in 2nd Pistols could be used in CC, so you give your space marine SRG a chainsword and plasma pistol, he hit at str 6 in combat, got a parry and NO GETS HOT.

Back in the day you either took a P-Fist or a P-Sword, Axes were used as a rarity (i had a couple Death co with them) NO ONE TOOK MAULS, unless you were a fool (no parry, and i think the same point cost as a p-sword, or very close)

So I see a lot of the same kinds of things being brought back in a more streamlined fashion.

I like!


lol now looking back, i forgot about long and short ranges, Ogryn's Ripper gun, short range 0-6 inches AUTO HIT lol

man I miss 2nd ed, gonna have to go back and find someone to play some small games with. The game was literally HERO HAMMER. my space marine capt kills your entire team, game over lol.

the thing that gets me is that larger games will now take a lot longer to play with all this added complexity

JbR of the Endless Spire wrote:One thing I have to question about is the whole Chaos don't have Thunder Hammers or shields of any kind. Why is this? TH/SS was around before the heresy as was man portable Pcannons (though in VERY limited number) so why is it that chaos can't take them? Or just come up with an equivalent... Maul = Hammer rather than getting its own set of rules.

EDIT: I get that they are trying to differentiate the two armies, but surely they could just do something like a SW codex or BA codex for chaos. A debased version of the original codex with added chaos specific units and removed Loyalist specific units (such as vanguard and sternguards). Like how SW can get thunderwolves and BA deathcompany, instead put in possessed, cultists, chosen etc. change the names and tweak the rules for certain loyalist items etc. Simples.

Simply put.. the current chaos codex is trash. It's still a competitive army book.. but it's just not chaos. In the 3rd ed codex they didn't have that stuff still, but there were a lot of other awesome things to off-set that.. such as daemonic gifts (I am a BIG fan of these), legion rules and such.

TheLionOfTheForest wrote:

Exergy wrote:Got the rulebook in hand and reading the stuff about power weapons. Dont see any 5++ as people have been talking about.
When it comes to power weapons you have to determine what kind of power weapon it is. The rule book says look at the model, if its a sword or dagger its a power sword. If its an ax or halbard its a power ax and if its a club or mace its a power maul. Listen below for convinence.

The issue here is that in your army list it still says power weapon. So you can make an army list, say guard and see what your opponent is playing and take out models accordingly. You are playing against orks, man I need some help wounding, take mauls. You are facing Deathwing, man I need the axes. You are facing Sisters and maybe it is best to go with swords. All are power weapons and so your list has not changed, only the models you took out of your case.


Sword S= AP3
Ax S+1 AP2 I1
Maul S+2 AP4

I dont know what all the complaining is about (directed to the whiners, not OP). Anything that adds a little more variety and variation into the game is fine by me. I saw the dumming down of weapons and power weaponry as something that made the game more dull.

Just to reiterate that this is a throw back to 2nd Edition I dug out my 2nd ed. reference card. Lets take a look shall we:

Any SWORD type weapon, gave you a parry (opponent rerolls one die to hit, against you.) not sure if P-Swords give you a 5+ invuln, but would be similar.
Power Axe - str 6, -3 save mod (if used 2 handed) OR str 5, -2 save mod (one handed use)
Power Fist - str 8, -5 save mod, NO INITIATIVE NEGATIVE (Hail to the king baby!)
Power Maul - Str 5, -3 save mod
Power Sword - Str 5, -3 Save mod, gives you a PARRY

just for comparison's sake, chainswords use to be a str 4, -1 save mod, and PARRY. made it worth it to give to a guardsman
Also in 2nd Pistols could be used in CC, so you give your space marine SRG a chainsword and plasma pistol, he hit at str 6 in combat, got a parry and NO GETS HOT.

Back in the day you either took a P-Fist or a P-Sword, Axes were used as a rarity (i had a couple Death co with them) NO ONE TOOK MAULS, unless you were a fool (no parry, and i think the same point cost as a p-sword, or very close)

So I see a lot of the same kinds of things being brought back in a more streamlined fashion.

I like!


lol now looking back, i forgot about long and short ranges, Ogryn's Ripper gun, short range 0-6 inches AUTO HIT lol

man I miss 2nd ed, gonna have to go back and find someone to play some small games with. The game was literally HERO HAMMER. my space marine capt kills your entire team, game over lol.

Heh.. haven't seen 2nd ed rules before but those seem pretty similar to Necromunda, if it's anything like that then I'd love to give it a go. Is there anywhere to get the rules? Preferably a PDF.

lukyboi wrote:the thing that gets me is that larger games will now take a lot longer to play with all this added complexity

It's not that much more complex.. besides, anything over 2000 always took quite awhile, unless you're some sort of fast tournament player.

but i have no self restraint!

i start setting up on a 6x4 table, and suddenly its full of tanks!

seroiusly though, its hard enough keeping track of who ran, who moved, and who shot without adding in having to remember to alter profiles for different power weapons and suchlike

Pen and paper is your friend.

You just need 3 different models for the guy in question, or magnets.

But GW will probably clarify that you need to write what the weapon is down in your army list.

lukyboi wrote:but i have no self restraint!

i start setting up on a 6x4 table, and suddenly its full of tanks!

seroiusly though, its hard enough keeping track of who ran, who moved, and who shot without adding in having to remember to alter profiles for different power weapons and suchlike

Honestly invest in an extra set of dice devise a system that tellwho did what so you can remember.

They have squad markers in the boxed sets probably. Just to make noting squad actions easier I suspect.

EDIT: also try ebay there are places you can buy sets of markers for your army. Like a run marker, hiding marker etc.

There are lots of 3rd party markers avaliable for real cheap.

The quote I was looking for.

"A Powerweapon is either a powersword, a poweraxe, a powermace or a powerlance depending on what the model seem's to be equipped with. If the rules state that your model wields a powerweapon, bend down and inspect your model - if it seems to be fielding a club, it's a powermace, if it wields a spear, it's a powerlance"

lukyboi wrote:the thing that gets me is that larger games will now take a lot longer to play with all this added complexity

Not really. Things will be dying much quicker, especially since cover saves are getting universally lowered.

yeah, I think 6th will be geared to faster gameplay. Which encourages bigger games, which encourages you to buy more models.

kinda like 8th edition for Fantesy. The rules encourage a bigger game because of the ease of playing with bigger units.


A shrewd marketing plan by GW while also catering to people who already have huge model collections. My armored company playing friend will be happy he can fit all of his LRBTs in a legal list.

How does this work with staffs?????
Or a chaplains force weapon.

Those will have +2Str and be AP4.

hotsauceman1 wrote:How does this work with staffs?????
Or a chaplains force weapon.

It's covered in the book. And chaplains don't have FW.

Typo
But thanks. one more day, i cant wait. im taking a 2 hour bus ride to get it.

I for one will not be changing my models around for this. I will print out my list in sheet form for my competitor, and it will tell them what the models have. I play mainly with friends, but even outside of that unless I'm going to a hardcore tournament I think they would understand...I don't want my Banshees to have anything other than a Power Sword.

Exergy wrote:The quote I was looking for.

"A Powerweapon is either a powersword, a poweraxe, a powermace or a powerlance depending on what the model seem's to be equipped with. If the rules state that your model wields a powerweapon, bend down and inspect your model - if it seems to be fielding a club, it's a powermace, if it wields a spear, it's a powerlance"

What's this powerlance?

See Shining Spears and Autharchs for Powerlances.