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 GoonBandito wrote:

 Acidian wrote:
I usually run with Celestine in my army, but if I wanted to try running a cannoness, do you guys have any tips on how to best equip her? Is it better to have her in a unit or by herself? Command squad seems a bit expensive for what you get out of it, and I would probably end up using heavy weapons in it if I did take it, so not the best place for a canonness to be loitering.

She's 'best' used in Melee with an Eviscerator/Rosarius/Mantle and a couple of Priests to buff the unit she's in imo. Celestians can work alright, or a Battle Conclave. The real problem you'll have is a lack of a delivery platform, since Rhinos or Repressors are your only real choice. If you are allying, attaching the Cannoness and the Priests to something that's half-decent in Melee can work wonders since the Priest buffs are amazing.

So you end up spending a lot of points on a mediocre sister unit and probably a Rhino to field her. I miss the days when she could just jump pack around and eviscerate vehicles by herself.

Ive got a 1000pt random team tournament coming up next weekend and ill be breaking out the old Witchhunter-style dex:

Uriah
2 X BSS (2 Flamer in Immo with MM)
Dominions (4 MG in Repressor)
Ordo Mallous Inquisitor (Warlord, Terminator armor, psyker, psycannon, daemonhammer, Liber Heresius)
Goon Squad of 2 crusaders, 4 DCAs in a Land Raider Redeemer

Plan is pretty simple, Uriah joins the Inq squad and then I scout the Doms and the LRR up towards the foe, melt something open and charge in with the blender squad to clean up.
BSS hold objectives, simple as that.
I know the LRR is a LOT of points but I really wanted to use the blender effect of the DCAs as well as keep them safe. I went with the LRR because the the fire-spewing fluff aspect.
Should be fun!

I'd say you'd be better off getting an Ordo Xenos guy with grenades and using the points freed up to buy a second priest with the Litanies of Faith (For two guaranteed priest buffs).

The terminator armor costs you your ability to make sweeping advances. The priest and Inq can both carry melta bombs if you run into walkers.

I'd trade the Terminator armour for some more DCAs myself. You're relying on that unit to rip and tear, it needs some more rippers and tearers.

 Acidian wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:

Mavnas wrote:
Dont we need d3 6s?

You roll saves first, then the d3 for number of wounds. So the D weapon sequence forces a single save, which if failed, causes d3+1 wounds.

This. Save the 1 Auto-wound, and then resolve the D3 (there is no +1) or the D6+6 Wounds if you fail that save.

Rarely matters on standard 1W sisters though =P

I have some trouble understanding this. Are you trying to use shield of faith to save against a 6 on the Destroyer table? If so, I think the wording in the book is "no saves of any kind are allowed" on a 6. (I don't have the book with me so I might be wrong). Which means you can't take inv saves against a 6.

However, it also says that wounds do not transfer, so a WK firing a wraith cannon and does D6 + 6 wounds can still only kill 1 sister in a squad.

I would say our best defense is the low cost units we have, and having MSU so a 400 point D-Scythe WG squad with serpent can only kill at most do 100 points in damage as long as you don't let their flamers cover multiple units.

Yes, confusion: The earlier posts were cut out from that discussion:

 BlackTalos wrote:
Yeah i'd agree that it would be quite situational.

And when it comes to D-Weapons, we are probably the best equipped. What other army can deny anything but a "6" with their own "6" on every single model?

 Acidian wrote:

 BlackTalos wrote:
Anyone got any experience with using assassins as allies then

I had a fight against them as Tau last week. Opponent tried to start his (female?) assassin 1" from my warlord, but I denied it by placing lots of units around my warlord which he would need to charge through first. I then spent the following round pumping 100-150 shots at BS 1 to kill her.

The sniper I took out with S8 missiles, launched 6 of them, he failed one save and I insta killed it.

The anti-psyker guy (kinda useless against Tau) took two rounds of shooting to kill since you have to fire BS1 at him as well. We had a rule discussion here because I used marker ligts at BS1 to target him, when one of them hit I could fire a missile at BS5 (In the tau codex it says that missiles are always fired at BS5). Anyway it failed to wound but if it had then it would have insta killed him.

The last guy, (a melee guy?) I just shot down without much difficulty.

So that was around 600 points in 2 rounds of combat.

I was asking more about getting the Assassins as part of a Sisters army. The Culexus (Anti-psyker) seems like a good choice for any AS player, as you can give him Warp Charge dice from your pool (which you have so much use for, as Sisters lol). That or Vindicaire, methinks. For the long-range Vehicle/specialist killer when your exorcists have better targets...

Mavnas wrote:
But that's heresy!

(OK, so this is why I was looking at the Deredeo Pattern Dreadnought. You can get skyfire, interceptor then shoot 4 times with a twin-linked S8 gun that rerolls armor pen and 3 times with a S6 missile launcher. I'm pretty sure it can reliably erase a single flyer the turn it comes in.)

HERESY! lol

I now suggest adding the Auto-cannons on your Imperial Knights.
Cause most of us Sisters player have the Knight, anyway =P

Anti-flyer shooting platform sorted! lol

Yeah, I was just relating to how a battle against an opponent that was using Assassins as allies and how that went.

I was actually fighting the sniper assassin again yesterday, and I killed him with Wave Serpent fire before he even got a shot of. He can be kinda scary with his precision shots to my farseer. They seem very expensive for what you get out of them though?

Anyway, the new IK with the anti-air option definitely seems interesting. I will probably buy one and do some sister battles with it later this month, see how it faires compared to adding a Firebase Support Cadre or Crimson Death.

I just thought it was worth a mention since a lot of Sisters of Battles players already have a knight.
Shame you need a full new box and can't just get the 1 Sprue they've added..... but at least the rules exist for conversions =P

I've always heard the assassins rarely make up their points, which is why i'm asking if their synergy with Sisters would work? I'd go on an assassins thread to know how they play/their rules on their own, and i know they can't join or be joined... but say you play 1700pts of sisters, would 300pts be worth a few more sister or an assassin, is what i'm trying to figure out =D

At 1700 you probably have everything you can slot into a CAD on sisters, so the question is more if there are other better things to ally in. The answer to that is yes, BUT assassin models look really cool so play them anyway, and they are good units just not crazy good.

 Acidian wrote:
At 1700 you probably have everything you can slot into a CAD on sisters, so the question is more if there are other better things to ally in. The answer to that is yes, BUT assassin models look really cool so play them anyway, and they are good units just not crazy good.

Or take a second CAD/Allied detachment of sisters.

I posted a list if you guys could take a gander and give me some input.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/647607.page#7814096

I only use vindicares when i have my bastion on the table. They have the height and range to see and shoot anything and get a nice 3+ cover save.

CANONESS: Assassins. We don't need their scum.
SISTER: No ma'am.

 Acidian wrote:
I posted a list if you guys could take a gander and give me some input.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/647607.page#7814096

You're off by 12 on the Retributors. There needs to be a 6th to take the Simulacrum.

I would lose the Plasma pistol and sword on the seraphim superior. The sword is just ineffective on a S3 model. The plasma pistol could cost you your charge if you kill the closest thing.

Another thing since you have free Heavy Slots, you could trade in one of those BSS squads for a second retributor squad, but with Heavy Flamers (4x rending HF!).

Mavnas wrote:

 Acidian wrote:
I posted a list if you guys could take a gander and give me some input.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/647607.page#7814096

You're off by 12 on the Retributors. There needs to be a 6th to take the Simulacrum.

I would lose the Plasma pistol and sword on the seraphim superior. The sword is just ineffective on a S3 model. The plasma pistol could cost you your charge if you kill the closest thing.

Another thing since you have free Heavy Slots, you could trade in one of those BSS squads for a second retributor squad, but with Heavy Flamers (4x rending HF!).

Right, I forgot I needed an extra Retributor there. My bad.

I am unsure why would the plasma pistol be a larger problem with getting into assault than any other weapon in my unit. They spam 4x flame templates from flamer pistols, flame template from celestine, and 14 bolt pistol shots. If I am worried about charge range then I have to keep the whole unit from shooting, not just the plasma pistol. Also they get reroll to charge. The plasma pistol is an extra S7 shot if I have to charge a vehicle or an AP2 shot if I have to charge marines or centurions. Regarding the sword, Is an AP3+ sword that bad on a unit that will be in assault as much as possible? She has 4 attacks on the charge, S3 is a problem against MC and centeurions, but MC is usually a death sentence for them to charge. Still, if I am tight on points the pistol is usually the first to go, followed by the melta bomb and then the sword, If I remove the superior as well, that's 40 points saved on upgrades.

4x rending heavy flamers sounds fun. Only problem would be getting them close enough to use them.

Seraphim aren't really supposed to be in combat. They're a fast moving shooting unit. Not saying it's never going to happen but that's not their purpose. The only time they should be in combat is to help out Saint Celestine.

 Acidian wrote:

Mavnas wrote:

 Acidian wrote:
I posted a list if you guys could take a gander and give me some input.

http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/647607.page#7814096

You're off by 12 on the Retributors. There needs to be a 6th to take the Simulacrum.

I would lose the Plasma pistol and sword on the seraphim superior. The sword is just ineffective on a S3 model. The plasma pistol could cost you your charge if you kill the closest thing.

Another thing since you have free Heavy Slots, you could trade in one of those BSS squads for a second retributor squad, but with Heavy Flamers (4x rending HF!).

Right, I forgot I needed an extra Retributor there. My bad.

I am unsure why would the plasma pistol be a larger problem with getting into assault than any other weapon in my unit. They spam 4x flame templates from flamer pistols, flame template from celestine, and 14 bolt pistol shots. If I am worried about charge range then I have to keep the whole unit from shooting, not just the plasma pistol. Also they get reroll to charge. The plasma pistol is an extra S7 shot if I have to charge a vehicle or an AP2 shot if I have to charge marines or centurions. Regarding the sword, Is an AP3+ sword that bad on a unit that will be in assault as much as possible? She has 4 attacks on the charge, S3 is a problem against MC and centeurions, but MC is usually a death sentence for them to charge. Still, if I am tight on points the pistol is usually the first to go, followed by the melta bomb and then the sword, If I remove the superior as well, that's 40 points saved on upgrades.

4x rending heavy flamers sounds fun. Only problem would be getting them close enough to use them.

4x Rending Heavy Flamers is fun, if somewhat overkill, especially if you take bolter girls in the same squad.

As to getting them there, you can Ally SM and get Drop Pods, Inquisition and get squadroned FA Valkyries, or Guard to do the same/Vendetta's. (Props go to the Elysians for this, cheaper flyers, 12 transport squadroned Vendettas, and space para's. But regular Guard works fine as well).

Just my $0.02.

Farseer Anath'lan wrote:

4x Rending Heavy Flamers is fun, if somewhat overkill, especially if you take bolter girls in the same squad.

As to getting them there, you can Ally SM and get Drop Pods, Inquisition and get squadroned FA Valkyries, or Guard to do the same/Vendetta's. (Props go to the Elysians for this, cheaper flyers, 12 transport squadroned Vendettas, and space para's. But regular Guard works fine as well).

Just my $0.02.

I don't like Imperial Guard or Space Marines, so I would rather not ally them in. Especially when I was trying to work the list around the 3 Crimson Hunters from Eldar that are the best anti-flyer units in the game bar none, and who also rocks 4x S8 AP2 Lance shots at BS4/5 to cover for the lack of Exorcists.

I would probably run them in an Immolator. I could go for another Repressor, but then I would have to order more from FW. I will have to try them out and see how I like them.

Celtic Strike wrote:Seraphim aren't really supposed to be in combat. They're a fast moving shooting unit. Not saying it's never going to happen but that's not their purpose. The only time they should be in combat is to help out Saint Celestine.

Well I do run Celestine in the same squad, unless if I want to tie up two shooty units in assault and I split her off. Because the Seraphim are 12" range, they usually find themselves, with my warlord, on the opponents table side with all his big guns pointing at them. Assaulting with them is not so much to do damage, but more to lock them in combat so they can't be shot at, lock another shooty unit in combat so they can't shoot at me, and then Hit and Run out in the end of opponents assault phase. Since they are in assault so much, and you might end up charging the same unit every assault phase, then the 4 attacks from the power sword superior should make up it's worth. I do agree that most of the damage is done in shooting though, and Celestine is the main damage dealer in assault.

It really sucks that Celestine is not Eternal Warrior.

 Acidian wrote:

Farseer Anath'lan wrote:

4x Rending Heavy Flamers is fun, if somewhat overkill, especially if you take bolter girls in the same squad.

As to getting them there, you can Ally SM and get Drop Pods, Inquisition and get squadroned FA Valkyries, or Guard to do the same/Vendetta's. (Props go to the Elysians for this, cheaper flyers, 12 transport squadroned Vendettas, and space para's. But regular Guard works fine as well).

Just my $0.02.

I don't like Imperial Guard or Space Marines, so I would rather not ally them in. Especially when I was trying to work the list around the 3 Crimson Hunters from Eldar that are the best anti-flyer units in the game bar none, and who also rocks 4x S8 AP2 Lance shots at BS4/5 to cover for the lack of Exorcists.

I would probably run them in an Immolator. I could go for another Repressor, but then I would have to order more from FW. I will have to try them out and see how I like them.

Celtic Strike wrote:Seraphim aren't really supposed to be in combat. They're a fast moving shooting unit. Not saying it's never going to happen but that's not their purpose. The only time they should be in combat is to help out Saint Celestine.

Well I do run Celestine in the same squad, unless if I want to tie up two shooty units in assault and I split her off. Because the Seraphim are 12" range, they usually find themselves, with my warlord, on the opponents table side with all his big guns pointing at them. Assaulting with them is not so much to do damage, but more to lock them in combat so they can't be shot at, lock another shooty unit in combat so they can't shoot at me, and then Hit and Run out in the end of opponents assault phase. Since they are in assault so much, and you might end up charging the same unit every assault phase, then the 4 attacks from the power sword superior should make up it's worth. I do agree that most of the damage is done in shooting though, and Celestine is the main damage dealer in assault.

It really sucks that Celestine is not Eternal Warrior.

This is how I use seraphim. It helps keep them alive by keeping them from being shot at. Celstine can hold her own in cc but it is more about protecting them from shooting. Then you hit and run and you are free to find a new target or just shoot the same squad again. My last game I shot and then assaulted a havoc squad in order to protect them from shooting as well as preventing the havoc squad from shooting up my transports. After my opponents assault phase I H&R and finished them off with shooting.

 MrFlutterPie wrote:

This is how I use seraphim. It helps keep them alive by keeping them from being shot at. Celstine can hold her own in cc but it is more about protecting them from shooting. Then you hit and run and you are free to find a new target or just shoot the same squad again. My last game I shot and then assaulted a havoc squad in order to protect them from shooting as well as preventing the havoc squad from shooting up my transports. After my opponents assault phase I H&R and finished them off with shooting.

Yeah, this is how I want to use them. Only problem I can see is if you are facing vehicle heavy lists then you might not have stuff to assault. Also, deep strike mishap with celestine and celestials would hurt so much.

I never deepstrike Celestine.

4 attacks = .66 wounds on MEQ on average. That power sword is 4/9ths of a dead marine per charge. It's worse than the pistol in efficiency. Plus now you have a 55 point model that is definitely not pulling her weight. The main purpose of the Seraphim Superior is to eat challenges for Celestine.

 pretre wrote:
I never deepstrike Celestine.

Yeah. I've deepstruck Celestine exactly once and that's because 2 of my opponent's 3 ObSec troops were scouts riding in landspeeder storms in reserve. Gave me a chance to drop right in next to them and have fun flame times. Usually its much better to start her on the table and take advantage of LOS blocking terrain to close.

Mavnas wrote:
4 attacks = .66 wounds on MEQ on average. That power sword is 4/9ths of a dead marine per charge. It's worse than the pistol in efficiency. Plus now you have a 55 point model that is definitely not pulling her weight. The main purpose of the Seraphim Superior is to eat challenges for Celestine.

Alright, I will drop the sword onward. I think the seraphim superior could use eviscerator at one point, and I just kept it in my head that she was still decent in melee. As pietre made me aware of, the sword is worth one Repressor upgrade by itself.

Thanks for the help!

Edit: Pretty happy with the new list, dropped 2 extra seraphims, pistol and sword and made room for repressors across the board and combi-plasmas for my BSS. Not sure if combi-melta might be, plasma is a tad more versatile and has 2 shots. I also have the converted models ready with plasma.

I think the plasma is more useful since you can spam melta.

I think that combi plasma is fine as well. You get plenty of melta anyways and it can be nice to double tap in order to get that extra meq kill in there.

Anyone else here going to Killadelphia this weekend?

PanzerLeader wrote:
Anyone else here going to Killadelphia this weekend?

Yes. I am. I'll be representing with the sisters.

 frgsinwntr wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:
Anyone else here going to Killadelphia this weekend?

Yes. I am. I'll be representing with the sisters.

Nice. I'll be there with my Sisters/AM list as well. What are you bringing for a list?

PanzerLeader wrote:

 frgsinwntr wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:
Anyone else here going to Killadelphia this weekend?

Yes. I am. I'll be representing with the sisters.

Nice. I'll be there with my Sisters/AM list as well. What are you bringing for a list?

currently....

HQ celestine 135
HQ 2 priests, one with litanies, all with mauls, one is warlord 95
Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265
Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265
Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145
Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
HQ Master of the forge with bike, shield eternal 165
Troops 5 scouts with bolters, sargent with melta bomb 60
Heavy Sicaran battle tank with lascannon sponsons, schisms of mars 200

the marines are white scars....

 frgsinwntr wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:

 frgsinwntr wrote:

PanzerLeader wrote:
Anyone else here going to Killadelphia this weekend?

Yes. I am. I'll be representing with the sisters.

Nice. I'll be there with my Sisters/AM list as well. What are you bringing for a list?

currently....

HQ celestine 135
HQ 2 priests, one with litanies, all with mauls, one is warlord 95
Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265
Troops 20 sisters, 2 melta guns, mb sargent 265
Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145
Troops 5 sisters, 2 melta, MM immolator with dozers 145
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
HQ Master of the forge with bike, shield eternal 165
Troops 5 scouts with bolters, sargent with melta bomb 60
Heavy Sicaran battle tank with lascannon sponsons, schisms of mars 200

the marines are white scars....

Nice. But with that list, you might as well go Iron Hands and give your Sicaran It Will Not Die and improve the Master of Forge's repair rolls. There are some really nice relics in the Clan Raukann supplement that would boost your Sisters shooting as well, like the Tempered Helm. 35 points, allows all friendly units in 24" to use the bearers LD for morale and one unit in 12" to reroll To Hit rolls of 1 in the shooting phase.

I'm running the following:

Celestine
2x5 Sisters, HF, flamer, Rhino
3x5 Dominions, 4x Melta, combi-melta, veteran sister. 2 have Immolators with multi-melta, dozer blades, and laud hailers.
3x Exorcists
Company Command Squad, master of ordnance, lascannon
Veterans, 3x plasma, chimera
Vendetta
2x Wyverns

Lets link up for a drink on Friday or Saturday.