Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
Times and dates in your local timezone.
Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.
2014/10/28 21:07:41
Subject: Re:Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
AtoMaki wrote: I would actually turn it around, and make the Novices' Act of Faith an ability to copy the (already used up) Act of Faith of a nearby Sororitas unit. Like, the Novices watch as Retributor Sister Angela tears apart a heretic Land Raider with her heavy bolter and they are all like "That was awesome! Let's do the same!" With an added rule that they gain +1 Ld after successfully using an Act of Faith, because they are now filled with
Spoiler:
self-importance
religious fervour.
That's a cute idea, and I like it...
... but I'm not 100% sure that it really fits the grim-and-dour Sisters vibe the studio presents. Though, if we want to go that route, arm the Mistress with a power-ruler.
I kind of like the Simulacrum stand-in idea, but maybe make it require an Ld test to trigger, rather than be automatic? Fluff-wise, the nearby Sisters look over and see their Novices standing firm in the face of the enemy, and have their own resolve bolstered. If the Novices are cowering, though, the Sisters are rather... displeased, and thus are not further emboldened.
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
2014/10/28 21:59:29
Subject: Re:Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
AtoMaki wrote: I would actually turn it around, and make the Novices' Act of Faith an ability to copy the (already used up) Act of Faith of a nearby Sororitas unit. Like, the Novices watch as Retributor Sister Angela tears apart a heretic Land Raider with her heavy bolter and they are all like "That was awesome! Let's do the same!" With an added rule that they gain +1 Ld after successfully using an Act of Faith, because they are now filled with
Spoiler:
self-importance
religious fervour.
That's a cute idea, and I like it...
... but I'm not 100% sure that it really fits the grim-and-dour Sisters vibe the studio presents. Though, if we want to go that route, arm the Mistress with a power-ruler.
In my opinion, the idea itself is hard to implement without breaking the Edge-O-Meter, entering the Magical Kingdom, or going a little bit silly-billy. If I had the choice, I would go with the last, so that the Sororitas would have something against the Darkness Induced Apathy. Oh, and the Mistress should carry a neural whip, because grimdark and whatnot.
My armies:
14000 points
2014/10/28 22:14:12
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
Oh, I think you could fluff the "me too!" Act of Faith so it's not necessarily silly. "Example of the Elders" or some such.
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
Have you ever read/watched Gunslinger Girls? Adorable teenage females (anime females no less!) brainwashed, trained to kill, and thrown into lethal combat actually get so grimdark that it makes 40K look romantic.
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
GSG is a great show. Kinda surprised there wasn't a one-off character from the Assassinorum as an homage to it.
But, basically, yes, with proper indoctrination and training, a pack of 14 to 17 year olds could be an effective combat unit, especially because we're talking about kids who have already, from a very young age, indicated that they are both extremely pious and very receptive to the Imperium's indoctrination, and have been training, physically, mentally and spiritually, to do exactly this for most of their lives.
Turning them into little killing machines, filled with the fires of zealous faith, is simply a matter of taking the effort to do so at that point.
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
2014/10/29 08:15:00
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
Actually, the GSG thing is why I tend to think of Novices as being 10-14 year olds - anyone older than that is probably suitable to serve as a fully invested Battle Sister.
"That time I only loaded the cannon with powder. Next time, I will fill it with jewels and diamonds and they will cut you to shrebbons!" - Nogbad the Bad.
2014/10/29 16:45:28
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
I tend to do the same, probably mixing my 40K love with my Wheel of Time love, and seeing the Sisterhood and the White Tower in similar lights.
Personally, I'm thinking that the Novice stage should start for the Sisters much earlier than it does, and last longer. They don't need most of what the Schola teaches, and could otherwise gain what they do need through the Sisterhood.
IMO, a Sister should be a Novice from like 12 to 21, and then take the final vows on Holy Terra.
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
2014/10/30 19:50:33
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
I have to say, though, that the idea of a Sororitas Bike Squad is really cool. I am thinking something more for Scouting/Outflanking rather than the beatsticks that Marine bikes tend to be.
Maybe something with Hit-and-Run and Infiltrate?
Also, there is this image from the 80s, which makes everything involving Nuns, guns, and motorbikes awesome:
Spoiler:
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
2014/10/30 20:41:41
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
SisterSydney wrote: I really like J3f's Rage idea. Or Hatred, which admittedly Sisters already have easy access to but applies in situations where Rage doesn't, e.g. a disordered charge.
Probably making the Novices an area-effect Simulacrum equivalent is too potent -- but I think making them a Laud Hailer equivalent (reroll AOF within 12" or something) would be cool without making them an auto-take.
And then there's the Novices potentially getting bonuses or penalties from their first Leadership test.
That's three flavorful things, none of them too complex to implement or overpowered.
Careful there, I'd pick 1 of those special rules and stick with it. If you give them too many special rules you'll have to raise their price and you'll end up with Novice Sisters that cost more than the Basic Battle Sister.
SisterSydney wrote: I really like J3f's Rage idea. Or Hatred, which admittedly Sisters already have easy access to but applies in situations where Rage doesn't, e.g. a disordered charge.
Probably making the Novices an area-effect Simulacrum equivalent is too potent -- but I think making them a Laud Hailer equivalent (reroll AOF within 12" or something) would be cool without making them an auto-take.
And then there's the Novices potentially getting bonuses or penalties from their first Leadership test.
That's three flavorful things, none of them too complex to implement or overpowered.
Careful there, I'd pick 1 of those special rules and stick with it. If you give them too many special rules you'll have to raise their price and you'll end up with Novice Sisters that cost more than the Basic Battle Sister.
Agreed. Plus it adds needless complexity, which bogs down an already complicated game. Keep the rules as simple as you can without completely sacrificing flavor and tabletop tactics.
40k is 111% science.
2014/10/31 03:32:59
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
Yes, I need to write something up for the new Novices and then start whittling down..... but at the moment I just spent three hours driving and have to wake up at 6:15 am to get helicoptered out to a Dutch warship, I kid you not.
Psienesis wrote: I have to say, though, that the idea of a Sororitas Bike Squad is really cool. I am thinking something more for Scouting/Outflanking rather than the beatsticks that Marine bikes tend to be.
Maybe something with Hit-and-Run and Infiltrate?
Also, there is this image from the 80s, which makes everything involving Nuns, guns, and motorbikes awesome:
Spoiler:
Yes, that cover's on my mind too...... and my Sororitas Bikers (way up in the original post) do have Scout and Hit & Run (but not Infiltrate), so great minds think alike....
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
So, we tried out the Novice Squad, because the idea caught the imagination of our SoB player. I was playing against them in both cases, first as a suit-Tau (with a FW CQC ubersuit), then as a Chosenwing CSM (with two Maulerfiends and one Ectofiend too). Both was in 1750 points, Maelstrom missions.
We used the originally proposed stats (WS3, BS3, S3, T3, W1, I3, A1, Sv4+, 8ppm), with slightly bulked out equipment (carapace, boltgun, ccw, frags&kraks), and the random Ld, Copycat Act of Faith and +1 Ld for successful Act of Faith special rules I proposed. The Mistress was optional and she came with a Neural Whip, the Novices could swap their boltguns for bolt pistols or S4 shotguns, and they could take up to two special weapons.
There were two 15 strong Novice squads, one with a Mistress (this squad also had shotguns instead of boltguns), the other without her. Both squads had dual flamers. The rest of the SoB army was two 10-strong melta/HFSoB squads in Rhinos, two 5-strong melta/HFSoB squads in MM Immolators, two HB Retributors, 10-strong Dominions with meltas in Rhino, and Seraphims with a Jump Pack Eviscerator Canoness.
I think the unit is pretty well balanced. They were, like, nothing overtly special, but they felt nice and flavorful. The Copycat Act of Faith gave them a big tactical flexibility that, in turn, counterbalanced their mediocre base stats. In the first battle, the Mistress Novices killed the CQC ubersuit by copying the Retributors' rending AoF then finishing the job in close combat. It was pretty awesome. In the other battle, the same squad caught a shooty Chosen squad in sweeping advance but this time, they rolled an Ld6+Stubborn for random Ld and got Psychic Shriek'd to death.
My armies:
14000 points
2014/11/01 19:33:44
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
In the grim darkness of the far future, neural whips are the first resort of the progressive educator.
Atomaki, awesome that you playtested a version of this. The copycat Act of Faith is definitely in, I think. Randomized Leadership is a bit too complex to keep track of for most people, though, I suspect. I've got some ideas I'm going to write up soon.
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
SisterSydney wrote: Randomized Leadership is a bit too complex to keep track of for most people, though, I suspect.
Well, there is a whole army out there with random Ld (and five-bazillion modifiers for it) for every unit. Personally, we had no problems with tracking random Ld on two units.
My armies:
14000 points
2014/11/02 21:04:38
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
SisterSydney wrote: Oh, I think you could fluff the "me too!" Act of Faith so it's not necessarily silly. "Example of the Elders" or some such.
Is it bad that I initially read that as "Example of the Eldar"?
Greebo had spent an irritating two minutes in that box. Technically, a cat locked in a box may be alive or it may be dead. You never know until you look. In fact, the mere act of opening the box will determine the state of the cat, although in this case there were three determinate states the cat could be in: these being Alive, Dead, and Bloody Furious.
Orks always ride in single file to hide their strength and numbers.
Gozer the Gozerian, Gozer the Destructor, Volguus Zildrohar, Gozer the Traveler, and Lord of the Sebouillia
2014/11/03 00:41:01
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
Here's my rewrite of the Novices, without random Leadership but with copycat Acts of Faith and extra effects from the death of the Mistress:
Novice Squad: 95 points (Troops):
Spoiler:
When a prospective Sister of Battle graduates from the Schola Progenium around age 12, she is sent to the Adepta Sororitas for what is typically a six-year Novitiate. As a Novice, she learns the Sisterhood's traditions, rituals, tactics, and weaponry. A strength-augmentation harness worn over her carapace armour allows the teenage girl to handle the weight of the holy bolter, letting her train from the first day of her Novitiate with the weapon she will most likely use for the rest of her life.
As a matter of both military doctrine and maternal instinct, the Sisterhood tries to keep its Novices safe, by the standards of the Imperium. Novices do sometimes accompany Battle Sisters on campaign as pages, serving their elders and observing the Sororitas way of war first-hand while being carefully graded for their skills, piety, and nerve. Older Novices being considered for the Orders Militant are even organized into squads and sent into combat as a form of live-fire training, albeit against weak targets and with extensive backup. Only as a desperate measure would the Sororitas throw their "Little Sisters" into pitched battle. But desperate times call for desperate measures, and in the grim darkness of a waning Imperium, times are desperate all the time....
Rules:
Spoiler:
Force Organization: Troops
Unit Composition: 1 Mistress of Novices, 9 Novices
Unit Type: Infantry; Mistress is Infantry (Character)
Wargear (novices): Carapace armour, boltgun, frag and krak grenades
Wargear (Mistress): Power armour, boltgun, bolt pistol, frag and krak grenades
Special Rules: Act of Faith, Shield of Faith
Crisis of Faith A Mistress of Novices spends years guiding and guarding her young charges. To see her killed shakes them to their souls. The bereaved Novices may fall apart at the death of their mentor -- or they may seek to avenge her with a reckless fury that older and wiser soldiers would not dare. If a Mistress of Novices is removed as a casualty, her squad must take a Morale Check at the end of the phase. (This is in addition to any Morale check caused by casualties, losing a close combat, or any other reason). The Novices naturally do not benefit from the Mistress's Leadership, but they may still benefit from other characters'.
If the squad fails this Morale Check, it not only must Fall Back as normal, but immediately and permanently loses the Act of Faith and Shield of Faith special rules.
If the squad passes this Morale Check, it immediately gains the Fearless and Preferred Enemy special rules.
Little Sisters Full-fledged Sisters of Battle may tease the young Novices mercilessly, but they are fiercely protective of them. Any adult Sisters of Battle gain the Preferred Enemy special rule as long as they are in the same combat as Novices.
An adult Sister of Battle is any model with the Acts of Faith and Shield of Faith special rules that is not itself a Novice. Note this applies to a squad's own Mistress of Novices, who therefore has Preferred Enemy in any close combat.
Act of Faith: Emulate the Elders Still learning the ways of the Adepta Sororitas as they are, Novices depend on the example of their elders -- even when those elders are rank-and-file Battle Sisters themselves barely out of their teens. One use only. This Act of Faith may be used in any phase during which a unit of adult Battle Sisters successfully performed an Act of Faith within 6" of the Novice Squad. If successful, the Novice Squad immediately performs the same Act of Faith.
An adult Sister of Battle is any model with the Acts of Faith and Shield of Faith special rules that is not itself a Novice.
Dedicated Transport:
A Novice squad with ten models or fewer may take a Rhino as a Dedicated Transport.
Options:
Add up to ten additional Novices: 8 points per model
One Novice may take an item from the Special Weapons list.
The Mistress of Novices may take items from the Melee Weapons and/or Ranged Weapons lists.
The Mistress may take melta bombs: 5 points
Design Notes:
Spoiler:
Start with a basic Battle Sister @ 12 ppm.
-1 BS: -10 points
-1 Ld: -5 pts
Replace Power Armour with Carapace: -5 pts (per a PM from Ovion)
Total subtractions: -20 points
Little Sisters: +10 points
Essentially Preferred Enemy for the Mistress in close combat but not shooting (10/2 = 5 points) plus potentially other Sisters units, again in close combat but not shooting (10/2 = 5 pts), potentially for multiple Sister squads but only under very specialized circumstances (which I figure cancel out). So 10 points.
Crisis of Faith: +/-0 points
A tricky one to cost. First, it potentially causes the unit to take a morale check when it otherwise wouldn't have to, which is bad. Second, assuming no Independent Character has joined the unit, it's a Ld 7 test, so about a 50-50 chance to succeed or fail. On a succeed, it adds two special rules (+20 points), and on a failure, it takes away two SRs (-20).
NET: -10 points
Divide by 3 for high-quality troops, which these still are relative to Guardsmen: -3.3 pts. Then take -1 more because they don't have Bolt Pistols.
12 - 4.3 = 7.7 points, round up to 8.
But the Mistress is a standard Battle Sister (12 pts) with the Veteran Superior upgrade (10 points), so it's a squad with nine 8-pt models (=72 pts) and one 22-pointer: 94 points, round up to 95 for sanity's sake.
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
I'd loose the preferred enemy special rule everywhere. Preferred enemy means years of training against certain foe. And you can't just get it emidiately. What you can get emidiately is rage, for example...
And about Little Sisters special rule. I think that giving regular sisters explictly benefical extra rules based around novices is not a good idea. Scouts don't give special rules to space marines, conscripts don't give special rules to guardsmen, etc. Yep, you can justify it with fluff and tell that it's a different case but in all fairness, you can justify anything with fluff.
All in all, a nice idea and ballanced playable unit with reasonable price. From my experience as an ork player, the sheer avaliability of cheap bodies - no matter how tough or killy - is an important factor. I have lots of games won thanks to a squad of grots or an artillery krew that rush forward and stand in the way of something like an imperial knight or an uber deathstar making it impossible for the enemy to move forward without wasting a turn on something that costs 20+ times less than they do.
But don't bloat it with lots of special rules.
This message was edited 8 times. Last update was at 2014/11/05 09:53:27
2014/11/05 11:50:27
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
Thanks. So that's one vote for "too complicated," which they may well be.
I thought about Rage and Hatred before settling (for now) on Preferred Enemy. The usage of PE is weirdly inconsistent: the rulebook says it comes from years of training, but then some Tyranids can get it from a good Instinctual Behavior roll, and Battle Sisters can get it by praying really hard. So it's basically just a way of giving troops something that's a smaller bonus than Rage or Hatred but which applies beyond the first round of close combat.
As for cheap bodies, well, the Novices are definitely 1/3 cheaper than adult Sisters, but if you really want expendable bodies for this army, try some Frateris Rabble.
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
Would require some looking into to figure out if they are really strong, or really weak though, the whole system where they buff eldars in the same combat, yet the eldars buff them in return with letting them copy acts of faith is very intresting, and makes them flexible at one hand, yet dependant at the other.
The way crisis of faith works too makes it confusing, on one hand you do not want to lose the mistress, on the other she can block AP4 shots that would be far more lethal to the novices.
Honestly I'm baffled by them, and that's not something that happens often.
The closest comparison I've got is scouts, who have higher S,T,I and LD-and very different rules. or fire warriors who got slightly inferior stats, but better guns, and about equal rules.
8 PPM is probably about right than.
The only thing that bothers me is the "crisis of faith" pass, it encourages to suicide the mistress while having an attached canoness in order to reap a very powerful squad (compared to what you paid for)
I'd lower the bonuses gained from it. fearless and PE are both very, very powerful abilities to gain that way, stubborn and hatred would be better to give a similar feel, but less power and less suicidal encouragement.
can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now.
2014/11/05 16:47:38
Subject: Re:Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
Useful points. Maybe Fearless & Hatred (i.e. Zealot) as a compromise? I do think it fits for them to manifest the suicidally reckless courage that Fearless embodies; it seems a better fit to fluff than Stubborn.
There is definitely the possibility of having an Ld10 Canoness (or Palatine) babysitting them while you suicide the Mistress, but that's an awful lot of points and effort tied up in buffing one otherwise mediocre squad.
They're definitely intended (in this version) to work far better alongside adult Sisters than without them, so I'm glad that's coming through.
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
I'd just like to point out that the elder Sisters benefit from them, not the Eldar sisters. The latter would be xenoheresy.
"That time I only loaded the cannon with powder. Next time, I will fill it with jewels and diamonds and they will cut you to shrebbons!" - Nogbad the Bad.
2014/11/05 19:04:01
Subject: Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
SISTER KORIANDER: We would never traffic with Xenos!
SISTER RAVEN: No matter how cute their red hair was!
SISTER KORIANDER (blushing): I -- didn't think you noticed.
Ahem.
BoomWolf wrote: Would require some looking into to figure out if they are really strong, or really weak though....
They're meant to be an unpredictable unit. In the right circumstances, where they pull off the right AOF at the right time, buff other Sisters in a crucial melee, then lose their Mistress and go berserk on the enemy, they can punch weigh above their weight. With a little less tactical adroitness and luck, they're overpriced Inquisition Acolytes.
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
I'm a little late to the discussion, but there is one thing I would like to add:
The Strength 3 for the Novices seems appropriate to me, as it is specifically mentioned that they are equipped with "A strength-augmentation harness worn over her carapace armour allows the teenage girl to handle the weight of the holy bolter,"
If the strength-augmentation harness is enough to let them carry boltguns, I'm sure it would assist them in a melee.
-Praise The Emperor-
You say Fiery Crash! I say Dynamic Entry!
*Increases Game Point Limit by 100*: Tau get two Crisis Suits and a Firewarrior. Imperial Guard get two infantry companies, artillery support, and APCs.
2014/11/05 19:49:42
Subject: Re:Vigils, Thrones, & Novices: Infiltrators, Bikers, & Child Soldiers for the Adepta Sororitas
Thanks. Never too late to comment! I envision the harness more like Vasquez's .... machinegun-holding-thing in Aliens, so in melee it might be as much a hindrance as a help, though. S:3 is just what normal human folks get standard.
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
SisterSydney wrote: Thanks. Never too late to comment! I envision the harness more like Vasquez's .... machinegun-holding-thing in Aliens, so in melee it might be as much a hindrance as a help, though. S:3 is just what normal human folks get standard.
In the Imperium, I would imagine that the strength-enhancing harness is similar in design and function to a servo-arm... which most definitely grants melee bonuses.
ETA: To expand on that a bit, I imagine it appears as a metal frame that locks around the Novice's torso, with an articulated limb that her real arm straps into. It follows her range of motion through simple pressure-plates, and ends in a gauntlet-like hand. The servo-motors, hydraulic musculature and similar systems grant this thirteen year old girl the ability to heft, brace and otherwise manipulate a boltgun. Punching someone with this machine of iron and steel would be like hitting someone with a pneumatic hammer... which is extremely capable of shattering skulls.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/11/05 20:42:43
It is best to be a pessimist. You are usually right and, when you're wrong, you're pleasantly surprised.
14000 points 
.
can neither confirm nor deny I lost track of what I've got right now. 