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 ClockworkZion wrote:

 kodos wrote:

Justyn wrote:

Considering it's Ragnar, I'd almost expect them to be a Bloodclaw unit.

nuMarines can have close combat weapons?

if Space Wolves would stay true to their rules (so that they deserve their own book)

we should have Primaris Recruits armed with Pistol & CC weapons, Primaris with Bolter & CC Weapon (counting as armed with Pistols for melee) and Primaris Veterans with different Heavy Weapons to choose from

Primaris would need to adept the Space Wolves way and not Wolves to the nuMarine stuff

Honestly they need to give them a supplement and add/restrict things in the supplements instead of relying on seperate codexes for Marines. That way they only need to update the supplements on a much rarer level, but they can inject new things into the Marine line whenever they update the core.

Just keep Grey Knights as their own thing and we're golden.

Space Wolves are tricky, as they are the only Marines who never accepted the Codex Astrates and kept their own stuff

So by default, having a Codex Space Marines and a Supplement for each bigger Chapter works for everything but Wolves as they don't use the stuff everyone else has.
At least in theory they would have different setups/options for their vehicles including the use of different tanks/flyers, different units with different weapon layouts

Now with having access to the same Primaris as everyone else and everyone having access to SW vehicle setups there is no reason to use a full Codex for any of the Marines.

Justyn wrote:

I fully agree with you. However I don't see GW doing any such thing any time soon. .

just another missed chance to get things done and a sign that GW does not care about (or just have no long term plan and decide on the fly what they do with each faction)

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Grimskul wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Oh wait... I just realised that every PA book has multiple name generators.

Can you imagine the Space Wolf name generator? How many variations on "Wolf" do you think they'll fit in there? And will it be possible to roll "Wolf Wolf"?

I mean they literally have a special character called Canis Wolfborn already so I don't what else this name generator is going to add lol.

Moon Moon

I can actually see there being a moon moon in universe.
Just imagine a really dumb wulfen getting up to some sillyness.

He just runs to the objective point yelling "the thing, gonna get the thing!", and every space wolf present is like "oh goddammit brother moon moon, why did we bring him along?"

 kodos wrote:
Space Wolves are tricky, as they are the only Marines who never accepted the Codex Astrates and kept their own stuff

Only?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Space Wolves are tricky, as they are the only Marines who never accepted the Codex Astrates and kept their own stuff

Only?

When he says"only", he's obviously including the Black Templars, who don't even use tactical squads.

 posermcbogus wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Space Wolves are tricky, as they are the only Marines who never accepted the Codex Astrates and kept their own stuff

Only?

When he says"only", he's obviously including the Black Templars, who don't even use tactical squads.

Black Templars accept the codex, but most of it only applies when a chapter is not on a crusade.

so basically, if you wanted to bypass limitations of the codex, you just decide that you go on a crusade?

Tell me, why excactly didn't Huron use that excuse?

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Crimson wrote:
If there is a new primaris unit I really hope that it is not SW specific. They should steer clear of that bloat train.

With how they've been doing chapter upgrades, I'd be surprised if we see any chapter locked Primaris units until they start bumping the Oldstartes into Legends.

I'd be, personally, fairly irritated if Space Wolves got a Chapter Specific version of Infiltrators/Incursors instead of Raven Guard.

Not Online!!! wrote:
so basically, if you wanted to bypass limitations of the codex, you just decide that you go on a crusade?

Tell me, why excactly didn't Huron use that excuse?

Because you can't rule a small domain and call it a crusade but you can wander the galaxy killing things and call it a crusade.

 kodos wrote:

Justyn wrote:

Considering it's Ragnar, I'd almost expect them to be a Bloodclaw unit.

nuMarines can have close combat weapons?

if Space Wolves would stay true to their rules (so that they deserve their own book)

we should have Primaris Recruits armed with Pistol & CC weapons, Primaris with Bolter & CC Weapon (counting as armed with Pistols for melee) and Primaris Veterans with different Heavy Weapons to choose from

Primaris would need to adept the Space Wolves way and not Wolves to the nuMarine stuff

Or they could get rid of forced pretend differences like this and make more choice for all.

ALL marines should have chainsword as an option.

Still hoping Ragnar's new model is good, and not a fury Wulf Abomination.

 Jidmah wrote:

 posermcbogus wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Space Wolves are tricky, as they are the only Marines who never accepted the Codex Astrates and kept their own stuff

Only?

When he says"only", he's obviously including the Black Templars, who don't even use tactical squads.

Black Templars accept the codex, but most of it only applies when a chapter is not on a crusade.

Ehm, no? Black Templars aren't Codex-compliant even on paper. The current Codex (pg. 34) even calls them "hugely divergent from the Codex Astartes".

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:

 Jidmah wrote:

 posermcbogus wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Space Wolves are tricky, as they are the only Marines who never accepted the Codex Astrates and kept their own stuff

Only?

When he says"only", he's obviously including the Black Templars, who don't even use tactical squads.

Black Templars accept the codex, but most of it only applies when a chapter is not on a crusade.

Ehm, no? Black Templars aren't Codex-compliant even on paper. The current Codex (pg. 34) even calls them "hugely divergent from the Codex Astartes".

Indeed, and as opposed to the Dark Angels and Blood Angels which are (according to GW and no rabid fans) Mostly Codex Adeherent

The Space Wolves do diverge by having different names and mutants but apart from the WULF Wulfs most of the their unique units are no more divergent than hundreds of other Chapters.

 posermcbogus wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 kodos wrote:
Space Wolves are tricky, as they are the only Marines who never accepted the Codex Astrates and kept their own stuff

Only?

When he says"only", he's obviously including the Black Templars, who don't even use tactical squads.

Templars are why I think applying the same treatment to Space Wolves is the right method. Yes they're not codex compliant, but at least with Primaris everything is interchangable enough to warrant just giving everyone a core book and maybe slapping a bespoke rule in called "Wolf Pack" that says Space Wolves don't use Scout, Tactical, Devastator or Veteran Squads and instead replace them with Blood Claws, Grey Hunters, Long Fangs and their own scouts.

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/05/space-wolves-lore-part-2-to-slay-a-beastgw-homepage-post-4/

TL;DR Ragnar's attack on Ghaz goes badly, so they shove some primaris bits into him.

 Lysit wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/05/space-wolves-lore-part-2-to-slay-a-beastgw-homepage-post-4/

TL;DR Ragnar's attack on Ghaz goes badly, so they shove some primaris bits into him.

Yeah, it seems we may be seeing a round 2 box set.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Lysit wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/05/space-wolves-lore-part-2-to-slay-a-beastgw-homepage-post-4/

TL;DR Ragnar's attack on Ghaz goes badly, so they shove some primaris bits into him.

Yeah, it seems we may be seeing a round 2 box set.

It lends credence to the rumour of Ragnar + Phobos Marines given they specifically mention infiltrating.

I have no idea how power armoured dudes infiltrate an Ork world but there we are.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Lysit wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/05/space-wolves-lore-part-2-to-slay-a-beastgw-homepage-post-4/

TL;DR Ragnar's attack on Ghaz goes badly, so they shove some primaris bits into him.

Yeah, it seems we may be seeing a round 2 box set.

It lends credence to the rumour of Ragnar + Phobos Marines given they specifically mention infiltrating.

I have no idea how power armoured dudes infiltrate an Ork world but there we are.

Probably at night when Orks can't see very well. Plus it's no less silly than Ravenguard infiltrating while wearing jump packs.

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 Lysit wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/05/space-wolves-lore-part-2-to-slay-a-beastgw-homepage-post-4/

TL;DR Ragnar's attack on Ghaz goes badly, so they shove some primaris bits into him.

Yeah, it seems we may be seeing a round 2 box set.

It lends credence to the rumour of Ragnar + Phobos Marines given they specifically mention infiltrating.

I have no idea how power armoured dudes infiltrate an Ork world but there we are.

Probably at night when Orks can't see very well. Plus it's no less silly than Ravenguard infiltrating while wearing jump packs.

Pretty sure Orks don't see well at the best of times. I think any marine infiltration is pretty dumb, particularly that Dreadnought

Marines infiltrating makes perfect sense if you remember that as a tactic its not all about being Solid Snake or Sam Fisher and sneaking right past the enemy, rather moving though weak areas in their lines or avoiding enemy strong points.

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
Marines infiltrating makes perfect sense if you remember that as a tactic its not all about being Solid Snake or Sam Fisher and sneaking right past the enemy, rather moving though weak areas in their lines or avoiding enemy strong points.

Indeed but given that Orks are a green tide of ever-spawning mushroom beasts whose numbers grow exponentially I'm struggling to envision where the weak areas would be? Are they like; "Aha! On the Eastern Fringe there's only 143,000,000 Orks! We'll sneak in there!" *Other wolves howl and clash drinking horns quietly.

Sure, they'd kill a fair few Orks all sneaky-like. But since Orks are hardwired to actively find and engage in fighting I don't think it's take long before a green mass, thousands strong is WAAAAAAGGGGHHH!!!ing towards them?

Also they plan to sneak to Ghazzy? Like he doesn't have a ton of Nobs and Underling Warbosses knocking around? It seems a stupid plan at conception stage.

Try reading Storm of Iron where the iron Warriors infiltrate close to the planetary defences.
Marines not infiltrating would be far more surprising, and especially Phobos marines which is basically their entire deal and the armour is suited and designed especially for it.

A weak area can be literally anywhere. They aren't gonna be completely blanketing a world in bodies.

Sure they would get a bunch of them coming down on them, but an Ork getting killed isnt gonna magically make the rest suddenly know exactly were things happened. We have ground work for how an insurgency against the Orks works in Legacy of Dorn. They dont just magically know.

They probably snuck to where Ghazzy was camped and then launched their attack.

Or its the Space Wolves and they think Drop Podding directly into the Ork Camp is a successful infiltration of Enemy Lines. Which considering Airborne Assaults are considered to be Infiltrations of Enemy Lines, they arent technically wrong.

 Lysit wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2020/03/05/space-wolves-lore-part-2-to-slay-a-beastgw-homepage-post-4/

TL;DR Ragnar's attack on Ghaz goes badly, so they shove some primaris bits into him.

Now in the PA book will we read about Ragnar's hunt and fight with Gaz ending with Ragnar's defeat, going primaris and vowing vengeance? Or start with Ragnar being rescued, upgraded, then Gaz fight round 2 electric boogaloo, ending with a draw...

 bullyboy wrote:
Try reading Storm of Iron where the iron Warriors infiltrate close to the planetary defences.
Marines not infiltrating would be far more surprising, and especially Phobos marines which is basically their entire deal and the armour is suited and designed especially for it.

I don't need to read Bolter Pron, it still won't make sense to me. It didn't make sense in the Beast Arises series for me, either. I understand the principle, I just think that against certain forces (Orks, Tyranids for example) it's an impossible task. They're too numerous and have no qualms about engaging the enemy. It'd be like trying to infiltrate a gigantic beehive.

Edit - I'll stop giving my opinions on infiltrating marines, it's not really on topic.

I hope that Ragnar does not hold Ghaz' to a draw at any point. If the intention here is to raise Ghaz' to 'Beast' level that would utterly undo it. Beast Orks go toe to toe with Primarchs and the Emperor, not 2nd/3rd in command captains.

Wasn't there a dawn of war mission where you had to use scouts to sneak up on a ork base and assassinate the commanding nob?
It was probably like that.

They do not cover ever centimeter of the planet. You could land far away from the front line (if any) and then use your suppressed noise / electromagnetic fields armor to walk a few days / week as you are a space marines until rear support bases like ammo stocks, hq, etc... Launch a bold and quick assault by surprise, destroy everything, eat a few brains to get info, and quickly withdraw in the mountains, caves and woods. Or even the sewers of a big city etc
Marines are very well suited for that.
How would the disorganized orks handle this ? Probably badly.
I reckon that tyranids would do well as they would all feel the death / destruction of their siblings and where and when it is exactly

Who knows where this will end - maybe in...The Beast Falls?

 Alpharius wrote:
Who knows where this will end - maybe in...The Beast Falls?

And so the beast falls over ragnars spent bullet casings, slipping and breaking his neck.

Dudeface wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:
Who knows where this will end - maybe in...The Beast Falls?

And so the beast falls over ragnars spent bullet casings, slipping and breaking his neck.

The space wolves deploy their mightiest weapon - a wet flight of stairs.

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:
Try reading Storm of Iron where the iron Warriors infiltrate close to the planetary defences.
Marines not infiltrating would be far more surprising, and especially Phobos marines which is basically their entire deal and the armour is suited and designed especially for it.

I don't need to read Bolter Pron, it still won't make sense to me. It didn't make sense in the Beast Arises series for me, either. I understand the principle, I just think that against certain forces (Orks, Tyranids for example) it's an impossible task. They're too numerous and have no qualms about engaging the enemy. It'd be like trying to infiltrate a gigantic beehive.

Edit - I'll stop giving my opinions on infiltrating marines, it's not really on topic.

I hope that Ragnar does not hold Ghaz' to a draw at any point. If the intention here is to raise Ghaz' to 'Beast' level that would utterly undo it. Beast Orks go toe to toe with Primarchs and the Emperor, not 2nd/3rd in command captains.

Yarrick has a short story that tells of the Ork invasion that kicked off his "now it's personal" vendetta with the Orks and he does a fair bit of sneaking around an Ork infested city.

Orks aren't the Hive Mind, they're egotistical brutes who have worse night vision than most humans.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Alpharius wrote:
Who knows where this will end - maybe in...The Beast Falls?

And it's sequel: "The Beast is still Falling (boy that's a long staircase!)"

 ClockworkZion wrote:

 An Actual Englishman wrote:

 bullyboy wrote:
Try reading Storm of Iron where the iron Warriors infiltrate close to the planetary defences.
Marines not infiltrating would be far more surprising, and especially Phobos marines which is basically their entire deal and the armour is suited and designed especially for it.

I don't need to read Bolter Pron, it still won't make sense to me. It didn't make sense in the Beast Arises series for me, either. I understand the principle, I just think that against certain forces (Orks, Tyranids for example) it's an impossible task. They're too numerous and have no qualms about engaging the enemy. It'd be like trying to infiltrate a gigantic beehive.

Edit - I'll stop giving my opinions on infiltrating marines, it's not really on topic.

I hope that Ragnar does not hold Ghaz' to a draw at any point. If the intention here is to raise Ghaz' to 'Beast' level that would utterly undo it. Beast Orks go toe to toe with Primarchs and the Emperor, not 2nd/3rd in command captains.

Yarrick has a short story that tells of the Ork invasion that kicked off his "now it's personal" vendetta with the Orks and he does a fair bit of sneaking around an Ork infested city.

Orks aren't the Hive Mind, they're egotistical brutes who have worse night vision than most humans.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Alpharius wrote:
Who knows where this will end - maybe in...The Beast Falls?

And it's sequel: "The Beast is still Falling (boy that's a long staircase!)"

Ghaz finally reaches the bottom : "Oi have been falling fer three 'OURZ!"
It was then that the space wolves revealed the most heinous aspect of the staircase - it is in fact an escalator that sends whoever's on it straight back to the top. And it's still wet.