Roughly a week ago a thread was started on Dakka claiming that the owner of the company Resin Forge was none other that Daniel Mandelbaum.
A couple of days ago, I received a Cease & Desist letter sent on behalf of Resin Forge and the owners of the company listed in the letter: Mr. Daniel Mandelbaum, Mr. Jason Martin & Mrs. Kim Hernandez, essentially asking me to stop defaming their clients (which would be both Resin Forge and its owners), claiming that this defamation has led to improper personal information being shared as well as alleged threats of bodily harm up to and including death.
If you'd like to read the contents of the letter yourself, I have included a copy of its text at the end of this post in spoiler tags.
To be perfectly clear, none of the posts in this previous thread were made by me, nor were they representative of my personal views as the owner and administrator of this website. I personally have no firsthand experience dealing with Resin Forge or its owners by their given names in any capacity.
While I do not acknowledge that the existence of this previous thread on Dakka constitutes me defaming Resin Forge or its owners, I do believe that the contents of this Cease & Desist letter acknowledging that Daniel Mandelbaum is indeed the owner of Resin Forge essentially makes that previous thread redundant and therefore I have no issues complying with the request to remove that information (and as such the previous thread has since been removed).
While this thread will be left open for replies, it is very important to remember that no posts defaming, threatening or harassing Resin Forge or its owners will be allowed. Anyone breaking this rule will have their post edited or deleted and their account may be subject to further disciplinary action. Please remain classy!
Here is the C&D letter text contents for those interested in reading it:
We represent Mr. Daniel Mandelbaum, Mr. Jason Martin, Mrs. Kim Hernandez and their company Resin Forge LTD (hereinafter referred to as "client"). If you are represented by legal counsel, please direct this letter to your attorney immediately and have your attorney notify us of such representation.
It has come to our attention that your website www.dakkadakka.com is spreading false, destructive, and defamatory rumors about my Client.
You are hereby directed to CEASE AND DESIST all defamation of my clients character and reputation.
My client has spent years in this profession, building a positive reputation. We realize that your Website is a Community and the posts as such where not written by yourself, however the posts are defamatory and causes substantial harm to my clients repuation as a business owner. Though you have a First Amendment right to state an opinion, you do not have a right to make false and defamatory statements against him.
The defamatory statements on your Website involved
• Alleged statements regarding business transactions which never took place.
• My clients participation in alleged criminal activities (To quote your (mod)majortom11, “Mandelbaum is a known scammer”), further quotes have been attached to this email as screenshots.
Leading to statements regarding Personal Information about his whereabouts, his family etc. (mothers Obituary) AND more importantly, threats of bodily harm against my client. My client has even received Death Threats due to your Website. (Not to mention the financial consequences for his company).
Accordingly, we demand that you please correct and retract the statements immediately.
If you do not comply with this cease and desist demand, my client is entitled to seek monetary damages and equitable relief for your defamation. In the event you fail to meet this demand, please be advised that my client has asked us to communicate to you that he will pursue all available legal remedies, including seeking monetary damages, injunctive relief, and an order that you pay court costs and attorney’s fees. Your liability and exposure under such legal action could be considerable.
Before taking these steps, however, my client wished to give you one opportunity to discontinue this illegal conduct by complying with this demand within 2 days.
Sincerely,
M. Duerkop, CEO
Britcons LTD
Update 5/13:
I have been provided with enough evidence to say with certainty that there is no such company as britcons.com (their website has since been taken down for those not following the proceedings of this thread day-to-day).
The Cease & Desist email was sent by someone pretending to be Michael Duerkop, the CEO of this fictitious company.
The real Michael Duerkop is just a photographer in Germany who owns the (long dormant) britcons.com domain. He has recently had several of his online accounts compromised (such as paypal, Facebook, go daddy, etc) and whomever compromised these accounts then used them to create the Britcons.com website that used to be there and send the Cease & Desist email from the info@Britcons.com email account (that they created).
Now, and this is very important, there is no evidence proving who was responsible for compromising his accounts and creating this charade. It is entirely possible that someone created this fake website, etc, and then went and misrepresented themselves to Resin Forge as being able to provide legal counsel. So please refrain from making any statements as though you *know* who was responsible, even if circumstantially it may seem obvious to you.
I will not be reinstating the previous thread, because as I've said a few times now, I'm much more comfortable with the way the information is presented in this current thread as opposed to the previous one.
I also will not be looking to pursue any legal actions for this whole matter because frankly I have no interest in wasting any more of my time on this ridiculousness. The entire point of the original thread (and this one) continues to be just to identify that Daniel Mandelbaum is an owner of Resin Forge, which has been amply accomplished by this point.
Update 5/13 #2:
I want to reiterate again that there is no concrete proof one way or another as to who it was that claimed to be Michael Duerkop and emailed the C&D letter.
I can confirm that the 'real' Michael Duerkop did receive a paypal payment from Resin Forge, however at the time that payment was sent whomever was pretending to be Michael Duerkop (and had the Britcons.com website up and running) also had access to that paypal account.
It could have been someone from Dakka, it could have been someone from Resin Forge (just sending themselves payment to themselves through his account), or it could have even been the 'real' Michael Duerkop who did it and is just now claiming to have had his accounts hacked.
So again, there is no proof as to who had control of the real Michael Duerkop's accounts and sent out the C&D letter. Or in other words, the ONLY person I can verify that did not send that C&D letter and pretend to be Michael Duerkop is myself (and even that you'll have to just take my word on).
So again, I'd ask everyone to please refrain from assuming that you know who it was that pretended to be the CEO of Britcons.com and sent that C&D letter. Could it have been someone from Resin Forge? It is possible, but it is also possible that someone else pretended to be Michael Duerkop to them and then claimed he could provide them with legal services.
The most important thing is: I DON'T CARE. I complied with the Cease & Desist letter (whoever it may have been sent by) and have no further interest in trying to figure out who allegedly hacked the real Michael Duerkop's online accounts and sent the C&D email.
Do you know about Ken at Popehat.com? He's a free speech attorney who is also a gamer and regularly connects bloggers / forums with pro bono representation in cases like this.
The thread was taken down. So as of this point in time there should be no need for representation. I guess time will tell though if that holds up though.
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It is allegedly a company in Germany, that among other things, offers legal counsel.
Whether or not this company actually exists or the C&D was actually written by someone else is irrelevant to me. The point of the previous thread was ultimately to establish that Daniel Mandelbaum was the owner of Resin Forge, something this C&D letter does beyond any shadow of a doubt and therefore I have no problem removing that previous thread.
Surely no one would imply this C and D is not on the up and up? It looks legit to me....
...
Regardless, as Yak said, we have now confirmed 7 ways to tuesday that Resinforge is owned by Daniel Mandelbaum, including confirmation from Mandelbaum himself now. That's all we ever wanted.
At the end of the day, Resin Forge is either in whole or in part owned by Daniel Mandenbaum and his past history here on DakkaDakka and on other sites speaks for itself, irregardless of how he behaves today under other identities or entities.
I'll gladly take this on. I was personally harassed at work by Daniel Mandelbaum. I have like 900% evidence to that end.
Investigate all you want. Also, PI's are not lawyers, and I'd take their threats with the largest grain of salt in the land.
I'd love to hear how that goes! Don't think you can get any more solid proof of harassment!
I understand why Yak pulled it. I personally appreciate how long he left it up and can only hope it helps (more) people from getting screwed over by him.
Also, isn't the statement of facts proven by multiple witnesses as well as previous posts and activities call out of the bounds of what is considered defamation?
The collection of posts detailing transactions that members made that were not honored is a long way from defaming a company or individual.
A history of companies traced to an individual that did not honor sales on multiple transactions according to members of Dakka I find hard to identify defaming a business.
To warn others of a disagreeable level of "service" is a public service of it's own, so evidence of "malice" is not there.
Some individuals would understandably get a bit excited since it seems they have first hand knowledge of not receiving what was paid for.
With what discomfort this person is getting from their dealings is deserved and is very funny to see them resorting to legal methods to try to smother the outcry.
My client has even received Death Threats due to your Website.
That seems like a rather ambitious statement to make, never mind that it has been stated as a fact.
Ignoring the obvious irony that they are making these allegations whilst at the same time demanding that nobody else make allegations about them, have they provided any evidence of these 'death threats'? Have they provided any evidence that Dakka is the source of these 'death threats'? Have they provided any evidence to support this in any form at all?
From here (a rather uncomfortable wooden chair in front of a screen), it seems a mite hypocritical.
Even if someone is involved in multiple businesses where some customers do not end up receiving the goods/services they paid for, that does not make that individual a 'scammer' unless that person is convicted of some wrongdoing or there is actual verbal/written proof of intent from that individual to scam/defraud.
So please refrain from using loaded and improper terms (like 'scammer') and instead stick to actual verifiable facts.
In addition, if you find personal information regarding an individual and want to collate it and publish it on your own website, feel free to do so, but please do not post it in this thread.
Talizvar wrote: The collection of posts detailing transactions that members made that were not honored is a long way from defaming a company or individual.
Whether or not it's actually defamation (and, as you said, the evidence speaks for itself) this person can still cause a lot of legal trouble for the forum owners. Since the whole point of the thread was to establish that a specific person was behind the company and everyone already knows to avoid them once that fact is known the thread was redundant and there's no reason for the forum owners to take the risk.
Of course the irony here is that by making this legal threat he's accomplished exactly what his "enemies" have wanted all along, and done more damage to his own reputation than any "defaming" thread ever could have.
- This guy allegedly performed some less than honest business through his website. The thread outlining such activities has resulted in him receiving threats, so he's asked us to take it down, confirming Yak's initial idea that he was in fact, in charge of the company?
I wonder if Resin Forge will address the issue on Facebook and announce that Daniel Mandelbaum, part-owner of Resin Forge, has send a legal document requesting that DakkaDakka no longer post that Daniel Mandelbaum, part-owner of Resin Forge, is a bad person.
Talizvar wrote: The collection of posts detailing transactions that members made that were not honored is a long way from defaming a company or individual.
Whether or not it's actually defamation (and, as you said, the evidence speaks for itself) this person can still cause a lot of legal trouble for the forum owners. Since the whole point of the thread was to establish that a specific person was behind the company and everyone already knows to avoid them once that fact is known the thread was redundant and there's no reason for the forum owners to take the risk.
Of course the irony here is that by making this legal threat he's accomplished exactly what his "enemies" have wanted all along, and done more damage to his own reputation than any "defaming" thread ever could have.
The word is out, unless a class action lawsuit can be made to bring all these failed transactions together into a big picture: he is counting on the individuals feeling the lost money being insufficient to press charges.
He can always just start another company and it all can start again. Easy fix.
It is not justice, but is a very practical solution he may take.
Has there been any suggestion that the other forums have been sent C+D letters, and other people within the community. This needs to be a community based push.
Doctadeth wrote: Has there been any suggestion that the other forums have been sent C+D letters, and other people within the community. This needs to be a community based push.
Given that everything started and/or originated on Dakka Dakka, it would be the natural and only website worth targeting; all other sites or blogs are either too minor or have already taken down or heavily moderated the subject to death.
Our staff consists of current and former members of military and law enforcement communities. We believe that nothing can replace military experience when it comes to the line of work we are in. We employ and maintain operators and Subject Matter Experts (SMEs) who possess the finest operational talent available on the planet. All members of our operational staff have had recent, real-world experience in virtually every combat theater or hotspot on the globe. They are the true "Silent Professionals."
*Cue A-Team theme tune.*
Did somebody say something bad about you on the internet? Are toy soldier websites causing you trouble? If you have a problem, if no one else can help, and if you can find them, maybe you can hire...
You have prove positive that he is RSO etc etc etc and you take down an entire thread based on a C&Dfrom some German company and collapse like a chocolate teapot filled with hot water.
Way to go to make him think he can bully his way through things.
Would it be too much to ask to get victims of Matthew and Jason to actually contact these private investigators and present the evidence of this trio's wrongdoing?
Whilst cease and desist letters fired off at defamatory activity is an easy task, when presented with hard evidence of their employers legal wrongs it would be difficult to recover from.
I have a feeling that the only reason these people in germany were hired, is that they might not be doing all the background research of their clients that might actually be of benefit.
You have prove positive that he is RSO etc etc etc and you take down an entire thread based on a C&Dfrom some German company and collapse like a chocolate teapot filled with hot water.
Way to go to make him think he can bully his way through things.
Just pathetic.
Where is the problem? The point was to establish Mandelbaum was the owner. He confirmed it himself via this document. Take it easy.
You have proof positive that he is RSO etc etc etc and you take down an entire thread based on a C&D from some German company and collapse like a chocolate teapot filled with hot water.
Way to go to make him think he can bully his way through things.
Just pathetic.
Why is it pathetic?
Look, I can appreciate your perception of Yakface having "collapsed". The fact of the matter is that if we kept the other thread up (which, let's face it, was starting to deteriorate with individuals going off topic and mockingly making the "threats" which RSO and his cohorts are referring to), it would do nothing but get unwieldy.
With this new development?
We start a new thread, and what's more have Daniel Mandelbaum/RedStarOne...and his fellow individuals named on a supposed legal document. That's all the proof we really need at this point that it's RSO.
He's done more to damage his own "company" than we ever could have.
You have prove positive that he is RSO etc etc etc and you take down an entire thread based on a C&Dfrom some German company and collapse like a chocolate teapot filled with hot water.
Way to go to make him think he can bully his way through things.
Just pathetic.
Yeah seriously. Way to to just bend over for the guy. No matter how you try to convey it, it's quite obvious yak's using "we don't NEED that thread now!" as an excuse to not look like a total wuss caving into something from a "company" that looks like somebody made it on their day off.
The moderators and other members who put the effort in on the last thread invested a good deal of work into documenting the past activities and unsatisfied customers of a particular person behind multiple businesses and aliases. Plenty of information on the individual's past activities has been compiled in the past and is still linked here.
The folks in question shared their information with the community to help people know who they were dealing (or potentially dealing) with. Having done so clarified matters for a number of people, including The Hairy Painter, Aerethan, and other people who were able to take constructive action, including disassociating themselves from a business that was no longer appealing, obtaining a police report confirming the identity and involvement of Mr. Mandelbaum, etc.
The thread served its purpose. This thread serves the same purpose.
What outcome would you like to see, fullheadofhair, Griever? Would you like to invest your time, money, and other resources into putting more information online and perhaps coordinating action by past unsatisfied customers? Can you perhaps provide a more macho example of how to protect and assist the community?
The moderators and other members who put the effort in on the last thread invested a good deal of work into documenting the past activities and unsatisfied customers of a particular person behind multiple businesses and aliases. Plenty of information on the individual's past activities has been compiled in the past and is still linked here.
The folks in question shared their information with the community to help people know who they were dealing (or potentially dealing) with. Having done so clarified matters for a number of people, including The Hairy Painter, Aerethan, and other people who were able to take constructive action, including disassociating themselves from a business that was no longer appealing, obtaining a police report confirming the identity and involvement of Mr. Mandelbaum, etc.
The thread served its purpose. This thread serves the same purpose.
What outcome would you like to see, fullheadofhair, Griever? Would you like to invest your time, money, and other resources into putting more information online and perhaps coordinating action by past unsatisfied customers? Can you perhaps provide a more macho example of how to protect and assist the community?
How about deleting the threats which should never have been there in the first place which are totally against #1, post your proof which you maintain is very solid and therefore stand behind you comments and ignore the C&D. If it is good ol' RSO what have you got to fear as your are just publishing the truth.
Sorry to anyone disappointed in my chosen course of action. I don't know what else to tell you.
To be clear: moderators, besides charged with enforcing site rules, are in no ways representatives of this website or its owners.
I personally have no firsthand knowledge or experience with Resin Forge and its owners.
Dakka is a community forum, not a blog site hosting editorials. A user, who happened to be a moderator, started that previous thread.
I believe that some of the terminology used in that thread could be misinterpreted by some (such as yourself it seems) that it was an editorial piece posted on behalf of Dakka's owners, which it was not.
Having seen many of the facts behind that thread, I do believe that it was created in good faith and for good purposes, but it is not a particular thread that I want to hitch this website and my own future behind regardless of how serious the threat is or isn't.
Why would any of the folks involved post any more information about how they originally ascertained his identify and association with this business? What purpose could it serve other than to help him hide better next time?
Why should Dakka bother fighting a person known to send barrages of insulting and angry emails at all hours of day and night, and who calls people at their place of work and makes threats and bizarre accusations? Why should Yak risk even a small chance of dealing with even a trivial or fraudulent lawsuit? To what end? The entire point of this exercise was to warn the community that this new business was associated with a particular individual, so folks can make informed decisions. That end has been achieved.
You have prove positive that he is RSO etc etc etc and you take down an entire thread based on a C&Dfrom some German company and collapse like a chocolate teapot filled with hot water.
Way to go to make him think he can bully his way through things.
Just pathetic.
Pathetic would have been to quietly remove the original posts without explanation. Yak posted the entire C&D letter, giving a definitive answer to the question that started the previous thread, as well as providing new information for the offended parties to pursue if they so choose. He's been open and transparent on a topic he has no obligation to be involved in.
So, go get 'im fullheadofhair and greivous. I look forward to the full-throated, righteous offensive you plan on mounting against Resin Forge to put the world right again. Do post a link so we can watch how it should be done.
How about deleting the threats which should never have been there in the first place which are totally against #1, post your proof which you maintain is very solid and therefore stand behind you comments and ignore the C&D. If it is good ol' RSO what have you got to fear as your are just publishing the truth.
1) Dakka posts a thread saying "We have reason to believe that Resin Forge is Daniel Mandelbaum, be careful. That was the purpose of the thread, to establish that Resin Forge is in fact Daniel Mandelbaum. 2) Daniel Mandelbaum sends Dakka a letter admitting he is the owner of Resin Forge and he wants us to take down the thread where we shared that we are suspecting that he is the owner of Resin Forge. 3) Yakface takes down the thread of "we think he is" and replaces it with a "hey guys, he admits it" thread.
Really no reason for outrage here, mission accomplished.
Why would any of the folks involved post any more information about how they originally ascertained his identify and association with this business? What purpose could it serve other than to help him hide better next time?
Why should Dakka bother fighting a person known to send barrages of insulting and angry emails at all hours of day and night, and who calls people at their place of work and makes threats and bizarre accusations? Why should Yak risk even a small chance of dealing with even a trivial or fraudulent lawsuit? To what end? The entire point of this exercise was to warn the community that this new business was associated with a particular individual, so folks can make informed decisions. That end has been achieved.
There were several actually - made in jest obviously but still should have been deleted purely IMHO to keep the thread free of taint so C&D couldnt have had any traction.
Anyhoo, we can agree to disagree. As you quite rightly point out I have neither time, emotion nor money invested in this enterprise so while I strongly disagree in principle with what has been done i can understand why it was done. Maybe if I had time and money invested I would have done the same thing. So I will keep further thoughts to myself.
yakface wrote: Sorry to anyone disappointed in my chosen course of action. I don't know what else to tell you.
To be clear: moderators, besides charged with enforcing site rules, are in no ways representatives of this website or its owners.
I personally have no firsthand knowledge or experience with Resin Forge and its owners.
Dakka is a community forum, not a blog site hosting editorials. A User, who happened to be a moderator, started that previous thread.
I believe that some of the terminology used in that thread could be misinterpreted by some (such as yourself it seems) that it was an editorial piece posted on behalf of Dakka's owners, which it was not.
Having seen many of the facts behind that thread, I do believe that it was created in good faith and for good purposes, but it is not a particular thread that I want to hitch this website and my own future behind regardless of how serious the threat is or isn't.
This is the the simplest and most efficient manner of dealing with the situation. Did the topic get the results that was needed? Yes.
Did people get informed? Yes. The C&D is essentially nothing if there is success of the purpose of the topic. Once that has happened then the topic on hand can be removed.
To myself Yakface did the right thing. He also knows that there are others on this site that will help him out at a time of need.
"Cowardice" is never something I would have associated with Dakka. This Mandelbaum character has a long and well-documented history, even members of Dakka staff have been left out of pocket by him, but look at Dakka run away at the first sign of a C&D.
This really does seem like a capitulation/retreat. Please correct me if I am wrong.
HMBC, The thing is that DAKKA itself is only the forum. Yakface has no obligation to go and prosecute Daniel/Matthew simply because he posted on dakka, even if he did use Dakka to scam.
However, the victims of Matthew and Daniel are the ones who should be moving forward with this investigation, including refuting this C+D order, and presenting evidence of this trio's wrongdoing to their legal firm.
I believe that some of the terminology used in that thread could be misinterpreted by some (such as yourself it seems) that it was an editorial piece posted on behalf of Dakka's owners, which it was not.
Actually I thought it was totally a Dakka sponsored thread, hence my annoyance when it appeared to cave and like HBMC the word cowardice sprung to mind when the thread was so adament about 100% proof.
Now having read that, I withdraw my comments and understand that the original mod thread was no different to me posting one up.
I do stand by the comment that it should have been moderated better to keep it on the very straight and narrow,
You started the thread Tom, and you did so with the only aim being to see if this guy was connected to Resin Forge? Say for sake of argument that had been 100% proven within the thread (no C&D), you would have done, what, then? Closed that thread? Locked it away with a “Mission Accomplished” jpeg of George W. Bush and called it a day?
If the aim of that thread wasn’t also to warn people, then I question why you started it. Isn’t one aspect of the Swap Shop to point out bad traders and things like that. How is this different?
Closing the thread isn’t really what strikes me as strange – remember that even I posted a “So what now?” post in that thread as it seemed to have reached its logical conclusion – it’s the fact that it’s almost as if now that it’s proven we should never mention it again for fear of the big bad (potentially non-existent) lawyers.
H.B.M.C. wrote: "Cowardice" is never something I would have associated with Dakka. This Mandelbaum character has a long and well-documented history, even members of Dakka staff have been left out of pocket by him, but look at Dakka run away at the first sign of a C&D.
This really does seem like a capitulation/retreat. Please correct me if I am wrong.
Dakka has no staff. It is not a LLC.
It is me on the hook. One person. If Dakka gets sued, that means I'm getting sued. If I can't pay, that means a lien on my house.
I did not make the statements in the original thread, nor were they representative of my views. They were the views of one user, who is a moderator for this site.
While I believe fully in the reasoning and facts behind posting that original thread, I am not in love with some of the choices made in presenting those facts, and so I see no point in drawing a line in the sand behind something that is better supported by the words of the company itself through its own Cease & Desist letter.
Doctadeth wrote: HMBC, The thing is that DAKKA itself is only the forum. Yakface has no obligation to go and prosecute Daniel/Matthew simply because he posted on dakka, even if he did use Dakka to scam.
Fair enough. That makes sense. I’m certainly not calling for Dakka (or Yak) to lead any charge against this guy, or act as some sort of rallying point. It just seemed as if Yak was saying “It’s proven now, but let’s never mention it ever again. Ever.”
Doctadeth wrote: However, the victims of Matthew and Daniel are the ones who should be moving forward with this investigation, including refuting this C+D order, and presenting evidence of this trio's wrongdoing to their legal firm.
The part that seemed missing to me was the other threads related to this individual, which were very helpful in the deleted thread as I hadn't encountered him before. I see they are included in the links in the OP, though, so that's all good. Maybe they could use a little more emphasis as being links to threads related to him.
Definitely not lawyers - in this email / forum posting you can see him offering his services to someone with an adverse interest to a previous client and revealing client information.
(WEHR was a stock scam, looks like his company was trawling around looking for PI work from defrauded investors)
hotsauceman1 wrote: Im confused, What is wrong with this guy and his company.
In the past, Mr. Mandelbaum has allegedly been involved with now defunct websites and businesses in which some of their customers claim to have never received the products or services they paid for and in some cases never received a refund either. Those businesses/sites have since closed up shop giving those customers no recourse as to how to get their money back.
While involved with these former businesses, he has allegedly gone by a number of different aliases and claimed many different excuses as to why these customers didn't receive what they were promised, such as family members dying, products lost in the mail, etc.
There are some that claim to have firsthand information linking some of these aliases and former businesses all together and link this all to Mr. Mandelbaum, and if you do some searching on your own (including the links embedded in the original post of this thread) you can come to your own conclusions about who and what you believe.
It is me on the hook. One person. If Dakka gets sued, that means I'm getting sued. If I can't pay, that means a lien on my house.
That is another annoyingly good and understandable point. I am assuming that tomorrow you will have the appropriate insurance coverage in place for libel and defamation.
I've been thinking about what I am about to say for the last few days: would it be possible to go to GW and "inform" them to what has been going on (despite most people not getting product), and possibly have them press charges? I'm sure if someone were to figure out how to contact someone at GW besides customer service, something could possibly come of it...
Also, mods, I would just like to thank you about how you have handled this situation. I have never seen forum mods care about their community this much in the 15 years that I've been using the Internet.
That is another annoyingly good and understandable point. I am assuming that tomorrow you will have the appropriate insurance coverage in place for libel and defamation.
Everything you just said makes perfect rational sense, and I don’t find myself disagreeing with any of it. I appreciate you taking the time to respond to me directly (far better than sending me a PM calling me an idiot).
I do have a question though, and this is key to my concern (keeping in mind that I have no dog in this fight – I’ve never had any contact with ResinForge, it’s owner, nor any of the other stores that came before it):
Do you have a problem with people using this website to warn people away from ResinForge? I’m not talking about posting personal information or making threats or anything like that – just people warning people off ResinForge as they would any other potentially bad trader?
baritowned wrote: I've been thinking about what I am about to say for the last few days: would it be possible to go to GW and "inform" them that he is a known recaster (despite most people not getting product), and possibly have them press charges? I'm sure if someone were to figure out how to contact someone at GW besides customer service, something could possibly come of it...
Also, mods, I would just like to thank you about how you have handled this situation. I have never seen forum mods care about their community this much in the 15 years that I've been using the Internet.
Despite people mentioning recasting, I don't think that there has ever been a complaint of anybody coming forward and stating that they have received a recasted product from him. There has been lots of "how can he maintain profit margins without recasting?" type questions, but nobody that has ever stated that they even suspect that a piece they received was a recast. Which is one of those things that can cross the line from facts into accusations that have no proof.
Saying "he is a known recaster" is one of those things that Yakface is trying to look out for since he may either be on the hook for those statements or at the very least has to spend a lot of personal time and effort fighting them even if there is no real case.
baritowned wrote: I've been thinking about what I am about to say for the last few days: would it be possible to go to GW and "inform" them that he is a known recaster (despite most people not getting product), and possibly have them press charges? I'm sure if someone were to figure out how to contact someone at GW besides customer service, something could possibly come of it...
Also, mods, I would just like to thank you about how you have handled this situation. I have never seen forum mods care about their community this much in the 15 years that I've been using the Internet.
Despite people mentioning recasting, I don't think that there has ever been a complaint of anybody coming forward and stating that they have received a recasted product from him. There has been lots of "how can he maintain profit margins without recasting?" type questions, but nobody that has ever stated that they even suspect that a piece they received was a recast. Which is one of those things that can cross the line from facts into accusations that have no proof.
Saying "he is a known recaster" is one of those things that Yakface is trying to look out for since he may either be on the hook for those statements or at the very least has to spend a lot of personal time and effort fighting them even if there is no real case.
Ah gotcha. I edited my original post, and I believe Yakface shouldn't be on the hook for that. Gotta love this justice system.
Anyway, it would be a good way for GW's legal team to redeem themselves. After the Spots snafu and taking Natfka down, they need something positive.
Everything you just said makes perfect rational sense, and I don’t find myself disagreeing with any of it. I appreciate you taking the time to respond to me directly (far better than sending me a PM calling me an idiot).
I do have a question though, and this is key to my concern (keeping in mind that I have no dog in this fight – I’ve never had any contact with ResinForge, it’s owner, nor any of the other stores that came before it):
Do you have a problem with people using this website to warn people away from ResinForge? I’m not talking about posting personal information or making threats or anything like that – just people warning people off ResinForge as they would any other potentially bad trader?
It depends on why people are being warned. To my knowledge, Resin Forge hasn't had any customer service issues yet that haven't been satisfactorily resolved by the company.
The goal of all of this in the first place (and I'm making assumptions here since I wasn't involved with making the original thread) was to warn people who the owner of a new company was, since that information had not been made public.
The reason that is pertinent information is because customers of other companies that he was allegedly involved with in the past have ended up coming away without the goods and services they paid for and have felt scammed. Some of those former customers claim to have very solid firsthand accounts tying the aliases behind those companies to Mr. Mandelbaum.
But at the end of the day you're still having to trust the claims of people on the internet over the claims of another person or people on the internet. The problem is, once an individual makes the choice as to which 'side' he believes, then before long that information is then referred to as though it is fact, and you start getting people slinging around dangerous terms like 'known scammer' and 'known recaster'.
I think it is entirely possible to simply present the FACTS as they stand as the warning. Then people can choose who they believe themselves and decide who they are comfortable doing business with.
I believe that way the warning can exist just as strong to those who want to listen while never diverting into any territory that could ever be construed as defamation.
Ah gotcha. I edited my original post, and I believe Yakface shouldn't be on the hook for that. Gotta love this justice system.
Anyway, it would be a good way for GW's legal team to redeem themselves. After the Spots snafu and taking Natfka down, they need something positive.
Yeah, I don't think that Yakface wouldn't be able to fight this and put a stop to it.
But I totally understand not wanting to face the giant headache of having to go through the system in dealing with this. Especially since Daniel Mandelbaum send us a letter admitting that he is the owner of Resin Forge in order to shut down a thread where people where thinking he might be the owner of Resin Forge.
I think it is entirely possible to simply present the FACTS as they stand as the warning. Then people can choose who they believe themselves and decide who they are comfortable doing business with.
I believe that way the warning can exist just as strong to those who want to listen while never diverting into any territory that could ever be construed as defamation.
But wasn't the post that served as the "warning to others" the one that was removed?
Not that that prevents a frivolous lawsuit or the costs associated with getting it thrown out.
That's really good to see actually, but you hit the nail right on the head.
This really isn't about whether or not the C&D is bogus, or the firm behind it is a complete sham or whether or not Resin Forge would really have the stones to go forward with litigation if I ignored the C&D.
If I truly felt in my heart for a second that me removing that original thread and replacing it with confirmation of Mr. Mandelbaum's involvement in Resin Forge via their own C&D letter was some huge disservice to the miniature gaming community, then I would have hired a lawyer and fought tooth and nail to keep it up.
But the whole point of the original thread was to get the message out that Daniel Mandelbaum was involved with Resin Forge, something completely accomplished by posting their C&D letter. So to me, I see this as a non-issue win.
Because unlike any other former company he was allegedly involved in (that I'm aware of), Mr. Mandelbaum is now 100% officially tied to this company forever. Hopefully that's all the motivation he needs to keep this operation going and pleasing its customers fully for years to come. However, if that turns out not to be the case, then we will have clear record of those involved with running the company to help identify them yet again should they ever choose to start yet another business/site after this one.
I think it is entirely possible to simply present the FACTS as they stand as the warning. Then people can choose who they believe themselves and decide who they are comfortable doing business with.
I believe that way the warning can exist just as strong to those who want to listen while never diverting into any territory that could ever be construed as defamation.
But wasn't the post that served as the "warning to others" the one that was removed?
Of-course the more we argue about this the more it stays at the top of the discussions. Weird that. But I suppose now it has Mandelbaum's name actually attached to it.
Those owed money by Daniel/Mattew/RSO/etc need to put together some sort of report to the police. It's the only way anything will be done. If the police don't seem much help generally, it could be pursed through claiming mail fraud which I think is taken quite seriously in the US. There's a wealth of evidence to aid in identifying him and ensuring he can be found for contact by relevant bodies. I absolutely think that the incident of harassing someone at work should be rolled into any sort of group claim.
If he isn't tackled through the correct channels, we'll be seeing this again in a few months. If he closes ResinForge he'll start something new in the very near future.
If I truly felt in my heart for a second that me removing that original thread and replacing it with confirmation of Mr. Mandelbaum's involvement in Resin Forge via their own C&D letter was some huge disservice to the miniature gaming community, then I would have hired a lawyer and fought tooth and nail to keep it up.
You see, this is why Dakkadakka is awesome. I am sure you would have had the community behind you.
Is there a general warning against this guy in the Swap shop? Keeping a semi locked article tracking this guy's online actions doesn't seem like a bad idea and (although I have no legal background) might keep the possible C&D letters away?
Talizvar wrote: The collection of posts detailing transactions that members made that were not honored is a long way from defaming a company or individual.
A history of companies traced to an individual that did not honor sales on multiple transactions according to members of Dakka I find hard to identify defaming a business.
To warn others of a disagreeable level of "service" is a public service of it's own, so evidence of "malice" is not there.
Some individuals would understandably get a bit excited since it seems they have first hand knowledge of not receiving what was paid for.
With what discomfort this person is getting from their dealings is deserved and is very funny to see them resorting to legal methods to try to smother the outcry.
It is me on the hook. One person. If Dakka gets sued, that means I'm getting sued. If I can't pay, that means a lien on my house.
Why in the hell are you NOT incorporated? That is a really, really BAD business decision. Spend the $ 500 a year. You are making enough to do so, so there really is no reason not to be incorporated. You yourself make the case. Why have your personal assets at risk for a few hundred $?
And this whole C&D is a joke. Who the hell cares what some alleged and fishy company in Germany thinks? A C&D isn't a legal document. It is a nasty letter from someone. I once told the law firm that sent me a C&D to go stuff their C&D where the sun doesn't shine and that their client was a fraudulent ass. Never heard from them again.
One of the things that I know about Daniel is that he can actually be a pretty talented guy when it comes to models. He has been known to make some pretty dang good conversions and he wouldn't have been able to get so many orders in the past before everything appears to fall apart if he wouldn't have some talent behind him.
My sincere hope is that this is indeed a company ran by 3 people and that the other two are able to keep everything legit and are able to keep Mandelbaum to run it like companies he has been associated with in the past. Maybe, just maybe, some of the members who report that they felt scammed in the past will have reason to report that they no longer feel scammed at some point.
But even if this is the turning point to a new future, I see no reason to not let people know "Hey, Daniel Mandelbaum is involved here, proceed at your own risk." And his C&D sends the message of who is pulling the strings pretty loud and clear.
I still find it interesting that the Resin Forge website has made no notice of "Hi, Daniel Mandelbaum here, part owner. Our lawyers send a C&D to Dakka, problem solved"
I have sympathies for Yakface in avoiding the risk of a lawsuit, which even if frivolous can cause loss in terms of legal fees owed and time wasted.
Under the circumstances it is not improper that he complied with the Cease and Desist. However as a member of the Dakka community I am offended that someone of unsafe reputation accuses this community of being the cause of death threats. Dakka is not that type of community, we don't condone death threats any more than we condone, say, confidence tricksters in the miniatures gaming industry.
Threats to the gaming community need to be exposed for the common good. Those who make genuine death threats need to be actioned upon for the protection of individuals victimised by them. Those who make baseless accusations equally need to be exposed for the protection of community members, who are in danger of being slandered with false evidence of what are very serious crimes potentially warranting custodial sentences. Death threats are no joke, whether real threats or fake reports of ones; so, where is the evidence for them?
If no evidence is forthcoming it is unfair to further conceal any individual making such accusations, and their aliases; as it would be detrimental to forum members to be exposed to such individuals without forewarning. It would also be helpful to the larger community to have a clear understanding of what said individuals might be trying to hide.
In any case, Yakface has done the right thing by keeping us informed of potential threats to our collective reputation by the links in the OP while removing the thread in question.
I have to admit to being a little concerned about the precedent being set here. In the future, what's to prevent any individual or company mentioned on these forums from filing a defamation case over any negative feedback, no matter how well-deserved? Will those cases also result in removed threads?
If no one can give honest opinions or feedback without fear of being squelched by legal threats, I'm afraid there's no point to the forum's existence anymore.
Creeperman wrote: I have to admit to being a little concerned about the precedent being set here. In the future, what's to prevent any individual or company mentioned on these forums from filing a defamation case over any negative feedback, no matter how well-deserved? Will those cases also result in removed threads?
No defamation case has been made. This was simply a cease and desist with the threat of one, as unlikely as it might have been actually happening.
yakface made the logical move in accepting it, since it proved 100% what the other thread was all about - confirming it was Mandelbaum. Nothing would be served in doing anything else, because it's mission accomplished.
d-usa wrote: One of the things that I know about Daniel is that he can actually be a pretty talented guy when it comes to models. He has been known to make some pretty dang good conversions and he wouldn't have been able to get so many orders in the past before everything appears to fall apart if he wouldn't have some talent behind him.
My sincere hope is that this is indeed a company ran by 3 people and that the other two are able to keep everything legit and are able to keep Mandelbaum to run it like companies he has been associated with in the past. Maybe, just maybe, some of the members who report that they felt scammed in the past will have reason to report that they no longer feel scammed at some point.
But even if this is the turning point to a new future, I see no reason to not let people know "Hey, Daniel Mandelbaum is involved here, proceed at your own risk." And his C&D sends the message of who is pulling the strings pretty loud and clear.
I still find it interesting that the Resin Forge website has made no notice of "Hi, Daniel Mandelbaum here, part owner. Our lawyers send a C&D to Dakka, problem solved"
Shame his new business partners are so elusive then, if they exist. The last time he had real partners was for the MWC site/blog and they came here to aggressively defend him. Months later there were tears because he'd used them as a means to cheat more people.
If Daniel were to turn over a new leaf, and was genuine in his complaint 'how can I pay anyone back when I you keep stopping my businesses', or words to that effect, why hasn't anyone prior to Resin Forge been paid for their losses? If Daniel has made it up with anyone, they should be encouraged to post. But I doubt anyone has received a dime.
baritowned wrote: I've been thinking about what I am about to say for the last few days: would it be possible to go to GW and "inform" them to what has been going on (despite most people not getting product), and possibly have them press charges? I'm sure if someone were to figure out how to contact someone at GW besides customer service, something could possibly come of it...
Also, mods, I would just like to thank you about how you have handled this situation. I have never seen forum mods care about their community this much in the 15 years that I've been using the Internet.
I have already informed them and unfortunately there is not a lot they can do (they are however watching these threads with interest and the very fact that it has been proved that Daniel is involved with Resinforge may go a long way to any decision made by the ever so happy boys in the GW legal office )
The Cease and Desist letter company looks quite fictitious. There's no contact information, no site maps, and nothing that shows this company can legally do what they are doing.
This could be interesting, because if this is fake, yak, you could actually issue a lawsuit.
on that site at no point does it reference germany, use german or even use german terminology, secondly there is no actual contact information (address etc) - something required for businesses operating in the EU. Oh and its copyrighted 2013, not many companies keep their website that up to date.
the only britcon i have ever heard of and can find using google is from the uk is an engineering firm from my home town:
http://www.britcon.co.uk/ the only german reference i can find is for a military convention, similar to adepticon but for dressing up as military figures etc
i also note (after receiving one of these mysef in the past) the contact details are incomplete, there is no contact number for example, though i acknoledge this may be out of choice. In addition as already pointed out the Ltd is not a german standard. there are too manythings look wrong with this to me. if these details are on the origional then i suggest the mods at Dakka check them.
also as a follow up the postal code from the address is wrong its is 91052 and the actual one is 91058, i appreciate this may be a typo but if so it wouldnt take your to the address of kanalstr 2 when on google maps, and this address appears to take you to a residential address - just with a quick look
finally the only mention of an M duerkop i can find on the net relates to the author of a few documents in the late 70's relating to deviant behaviour or in 1915 where one was prosecuted for trading with the enemy.
there is something very fishy about this C&D, and the legal team in the office agree, but with out a scanned copy showing all detail that cant comment more as they suspect that some details have been left off when posted.
Doctadeth wrote: Would it be too much to ask to get victims of Matthew and Jason to actually contact these private investigators and present the evidence of this trio's wrongdoing?
Whilst cease and desist letters fired off at defamatory activity is an easy task, when presented with hard evidence of their employers legal wrongs it would be difficult to recover from.
I have a feeling that the only reason these people in germany were hired, is that they might not be doing all the background research of their clients that might actually be of benefit.
Either the company Britcons is legit, in which case they will not work against the interest of their employer -- Daniel Mandelbaum, associates and Resin Forge LLC.
Or, they are a sham company set up for some odd purpose, in which case they will not be in the business of sorting out refunds for mail order people in the US.
on that site at no point does it reference germany, use german or even use german terminology, secondly there is no actual contact information (address etc) - something required for businesses operating in the EU. Oh and its copyrighted 2013, not many companies keep their website that up to date.
Look at the address on the C&D letter mate, seems you already have!, I do think it is strange and there is no britcons ltd registered in the UK either
on that site at no point does it reference germany, use german or even use german terminology, secondly there is no actual contact information (address etc) - something required for businesses operating in the EU. Oh and its copyrighted 2013, not many companies keep their website that up to date.
Look at the address on the C&D letter mate, seems you already have!, I do think it is strange and there is no britcons ltd registered in the UK either
those comments about the address refer to the site not the letter - though thats dodgy too with regards to addressing! there are too many holes but i guess we could all be wrong
As assorted others have posted, the C&D is singularly lacking. One would have to see a scan of the original, but I'd be unsurprised to find out that it's all just made up and codswallop. Not least because whoever sent it evidently knows bugger all about the law.
Given Mr Mandelbaum is resident in the US, one would have expected him to be retaining US counsel. Who would then inform him that the DMCA safe harbour provisions protect the owners of a site from comments made by individuals on that site (so you can't sue youtube because of a posted comment on a video). Or, of course, they don't inform him of this.
Moreover, there are significant legal protections in the US for freedom of speech, and while by no means absolute, courts have a trend to interpret a statement made on internet fora such as 'he is a scammer' as 'in my opinion, he is a scammer'.
In no way is this putting name and descriptor into the same post...
Purely for my own curiosity I went and had a look at the britcons website and it seems very basically designed, in under an hour by the looks and not something you would associate with any company that would be sending out legal threats or advice. Also the source code of the website is quite sloppy. Interestingly the owner of the domain is hidden and they have used a domain proxy company to register the website to keep the owner hidden. Why would a company do this? I just can't figure that bit out.
Also it's a self edited website http://www.squarespace.com/ anyone could register a domain by proxy and setup a site like this in under an hour to seem legitimate.
Interestingly if you do a google search of britcons it comes up with...
BRITCons
www.britcons.com/
Welcome to: britcons.com. This Web page is parked for FREE, courtesy of GoDaddy.com. This web page is parked FREE, courtesy of GoDaddy.com. Share a ...
Which to me seems like the website hasn't long been up and running. All could be innocent and all but doesn't it seem rushed to you guys?
If you do not comply with this cease and desist demand, my client is entitled to seek monetary damages and equitable relief for your defamation. In the event you fail to meet this demand, please be advised that my client has asked us to communicate to you that he will pursue all available legal remedies, including seeking monetary damages, injunctive relief, and an order that you pay court costs and attorney’s fees. Your liability and exposure under such legal action could be considerable.
If you do not comply with this cease and desist demand within this time period, [CLIENT NAME] is entitled to seek monetary damages and equitable relief for your defamation. In the event you fail to meet this demand, please be advised that [CLIENT NAME] has asked us to communicate to you that she will pursue all available legal remedies, including seeking monetary damages, injunctive relief, and an order that you pay court costs and attorney’s fees. Your liability and exposure under such legal action could be considerable.
Fun fact, that lawyer company he listed are going to very unhappy with him... that's not a legal company;
That's a civil engineering, construction and steelwork contractor based out of Scunthorpe, UK.
http://www.britcon.co.uk/
Also Ltd is not in use in german companies, its AGAB etc, LTD is a UK name for a limited liability company (of which I have two) and they are NOT on the companies house as a limited company, therefore they are not a ltd company in the UK
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Inquisitor S. wrote: Guy on Facebook pointed out to me it's even the wrong postcode for said city and street.
C&D letter was probably copied by Yakface, theres a chance it is a typo, so not enough to go on.
Oh another fun fact, go to the about us page of the "Britcons LTD" They are security company... They are not a law firm, also every major law firm I've come across tends not to be LTD...
http://britcons.com/about/
I'm not sure what it means exactly, but the domain Britcons is valid from June 12 2012 to June 14th 2014. However, it says the registry for this domain was updated on the 7th of this month. Registered through GoDaddy so I can't see who actually owns the domain. The dates that the domain is valid might just be how long GoDaddy has the rights to said domain. The server that hosts the website is in New York. I don't know if that means he bought the domain for a short period of time, or what. This is to say if it *were* fictitious. Going back I did find some looking for work type ads for "Britcons" from 2012 on a random page. Like I said, I don't know what it means, but I did as much digging as I could. However, I do find it kind of odd that someone living in Texas would outsource a C&D from a company that is supposedly based in Germany. Who knows.
ETA: I got ninja'd a while back. Thats what I get for going off and doing something, then coming back and posting a reply.
Looks like Britcons prides themselves as a veteran-owned business, and a good number of veterans play wargames.
So it is possible that a veteran who wargames and also knows someone with Britcons liked the ResinForge facebook page and decided to lend a helping hand.
Just to throw our 2 pence in, i just googled the address and the nearest match was a construction firm in scunthorpe, UK. No securtiy firm found at all. That and as others have said, Britcons is a british name not a German one, and the LTD is mainly British by use. This whole thing reeks of a last ditch defence by a certain someone.
Roughly a week ago a thread was started on Dakka claiming that the owner of the company Resin Forge was none other that Daniel Mandelbaum.
A couple of days ago, I received a Cease & Desist letter sent on behalf of Resin Forge and the owners of the company listed in the letter: Mr. Daniel Mandelbaum, Mr. Jason Martin & Mrs. Kim Hernandez, essentially asking me to stop defaming their clients (which would be both Resin Forge and its owners), claiming that this defamation has led to improper personal information being shared as well as alleged threats of bodily harm up to and including death.
Out of curiosity where was the post mark from on the envelope?
Resin Forge Store
30 minutes ago
---- News Update ----
Due to the high volume of business, and requests by customers for a Resin Forge Service Number, we can now be reached at 1-214-632-6446, 9am-9pm, US, Central Time, Monday - Saturday. Please have any and all pertinent information and/or documents you may feel will help, when calling so that we can help you in a prompt and professional manner.
I know that they posted their number, but this just seems crazy enough for them to claim "Look, they now poster our number on DakkaDakka, they are wanting people to call me and threaten me!"
Probably better served with something like "Looks like they posted a number on their Facebook now".
That way, if for some strange reason their Facebook post is gone in the future, Dakka doesn't look like we posted a number that they didn't provide.
Britcons - We tailor our services to meet your organization's unique security & legal needs, wherever you do business.
vs.
Sharp End - We tailor our services to meet your organization's unique security needs, wherever you do business.
Britcons - Our goal is to provide a specialist niche service to those clients who require qualified help.
vs.
Sharp End - Our goal is to provide a specialist niche service to those Government departments and Principals who require qualified instructors with unsurpassed specialist skills and experience.
-----
The rest of the Britcons site seems to be even more directly ripped off from a variety of private security websites:
Britcons International will provide you with a Project Manager who will be directly accountable for your project and who will design and implement a solution exclusively for you.
Sharp End will provide you with a Project Manager who will be directly accountable for your project and who will design and implement a security package exclusively for your company.
We provide our professionally executed services to meet the complex demands of today's world. We have broad international expertise and years of experience working in remote, dangerous and austere environments. We integrate our many competencies to provide solutions that fit each customer and situation.
We provide expertly conceived and professionally executed services to meet the complex demands of today's world. We have broad international expertise and over 60 years of experience working in remote, dangerous and austere environments. We integrate our many competencies to provide solutions that fit each customer and situation, and bring a culture of compliance, accountability, and relentless performance to each program and task.
Our staff consists of current and former members of military and law enforcement communities. We believe that nothing can replace military experience when it comes to the line of work we are in. We employ and maintain operators and Subject Matter Experts (SMEs) who possess the finest operational talent available on the planet. All members of our operational staff have had recent, real-world experience in virtually every combat theater or hotspot on the globe. They are the true "Silent Professionals."
Our staff consists of current and former members of elite units within the military and law enforcement communities. We employ and maintain operators and Subject Matter Experts (SMEs) who possess the finest operational talent available on the planet - US Navy SEALs, Army Rangers, Special Forces, Air Force Para Rescue, British and Australian SAS as well as State Law Enforcement tactical trainers and SWAT personnel. All members of our operational staff have had recent, real-world experience in virtually every combat theater or hotspot on the globe. They are the true "Silent Professionals."
-----
The brticons.com services page, Consulting & Investigations section:
Spoiler:
Britcons International provides its clients with a broad range of information and knowledge from which to make key business decisions. In today's competitive global enterprise, information and knowledge are the drivers to mitigating risk in all facets of the business. Among the company's consulting and investigations areas of activity and service are:
fraud and abuse investigations
Personal protection and threat assessments
Security vulnerability and risk assessments
Intellectual property protection
Security management and performance analysis
Electronic security system design and operational integration
Litigation support and expert witness testimony
Travel security intelligence and logistics management
Secure Transportation of Executives and Business Travelers
Strike Security Services and Asset Protection
All of these capabilities and services are built around the core concept that a close and candid partnership between Britcons International and its clients produces the most effective outcomes.
In each case, Britcons International forges a team of the most experienced individuals appropriate to the situation and the client's needs. This team might be composed of experienced corporate security management, investigators, forensic accountants, legal analysts, law enforcement, and professionals from other specialized fields, as required.
Andrews International provides its clients with a broad range of information and knowledge from which to make key business decisions. In today's competitive global enterprise, information and knowledge are the drivers to mitigating risk in all facets of the business. Among the company's consulting and investigations areas of activity and service are:
Due diligence related to individuals, organizations and issues
Occupational fraud and abuse investigations
Personal protection and threat assessments
Security vulnerability and risk assessments
Intellectual property protection
Security management program audits and performance analysis
Electronic security system design and operational integration
Litigation support and expert witness testimony
Travel security intelligence and logistics management
Secure Transportation of Executives and Business Travelers
Global Positioning System (GPS) - Emergency Tracking & Monitoring Service
Strike Security Services and Asset Protection
All of these capabilities and services are built around the core concept that a close and candid partnership between Andrews International and its clients produces the most effective outcomes.
In each case, Andrews International forges a team of the most experienced individuals appropriate to the situation and the client's needs. This team might be composed of experienced corporate security management, investigators, forensic accountants, legal analysts, law enforcement, and professionals from other specialized fields, as required.
The brticons.com services page, Specialized Services section:
Spoiler:
Our clients' risk profiles are unique to their business environments, with security needs that often extend beyond traditional uniformed security services. We are a single source security provider with the capabilities to meet diverse security needs. As an international security and risk mitigation services provider to customers in a range of industries and geographic locations, Britcons International's portfolio includes: personal protection/threat management; special event security; a range of consulting and investigation services; background screening services; and disaster and emergency response to the private and public sector. Additionally, Britcons International provides training to numerous clients in the field of security management, asset protection, criminal law, CPR, AED and first-aid.
Our specialized service programs are managed and deployed by seasoned professionals, with decades of experience in each service area, providing broad-spectrum solutions that meet our clients' unique enterprise objectives and help mitigate security and asset protection vulnerabilities.
Our clients' risk profiles are unique to their business environments, with security needs that often extend beyond traditional uniformed security services. We are a single source security provider with the capabilities to meet diverse security needs. As an international security and risk mitigation services provider to customers in a range of industries and geographic locations, Andrews International's portfolio includes: personal protection/threat management; special event security; a range of consulting and investigation services; background screening services; and disaster and emergency response to the private and public sector. Additionally, Andrews International provides training to numerous clients in the field of security management, asset protection, criminal law, CPR, AED and first-aid.
Our specialized service programs are managed and deployed by seasoned professionals, with decades of experience in each service area, providing broad-spectrum solutions that meet our clients' unique enterprise objectives and help mitigate security and asset protection vulnerabilities.
Creeperman wrote: I have to admit to being a little concerned about the precedent being set here. In the future, what's to prevent any individual or company mentioned on these forums from filing a defamation case over any negative feedback, no matter how well-deserved? Will those cases also result in removed threads?
No defamation case has been made. This was simply a cease and desist with the threat of one, as unlikely as it might have been actually happening.
yakface made the logical move in accepting it, since it proved 100% what the other thread was all about - confirming it was Mandelbaum. Nothing would be served in doing anything else, because it's mission accomplished.
Regardless of how logical and understandable a move it may be, the takeaway from this for anyone thinking about scamming wargamers is that they will likely be able to get any negative characterisation of their "business" removed from the forums, or at least extremely heavily toned down(note how everything has become legalish; "alleged" this and "improper terms" that), because they know that the person ultimately responsible for Dakka as an entity is on the hook for any potential legal action, and so is disinclined to fight any C&Ds sent unless they're completely outrageous in their demands. Even if those C&Ds are highly suspect and appear to come from a company that doesn't exist in the form described.
And I might be mistaken, but I was under the impression that the other thread was about informing the community of the danger of dealing with Resin Forge, since it was made clear in the OP of that thread that Mandlebaum's association with Resin Forge was already confirmed. "Warning: doing business with this guy could well be a serious mistake" and "This guy who might possibly allegedly have not always fulfilled his orders according to some people has sent us a C&D" both link Mandlebaum and Resin Forge, but are two completely different characterisations of the facts, one of which might be more palatable to a lawyer, but doesn't do nearly the same job in conveying justifiable caution to anyone giving it a perfunctory browse.
Kilkrazy wrote: No address or phone number.
No business registration.
No phone number for the proprietor.
Next to no results on searches either for a company that claims to have been operating for 3 years. This implies they're either BS or have been sitting on their hands around the computer trying to figure this whole internet thing out.
I think this sums it up adequately.
I don't think the names being similar even has to be pointed out as coincidental; even that part's lazy. Makes you wonder if they purposely did this because they were cocky or maybe even to try and throw people off since it wasn't as good as the other covers they've made.
It doesn't actually matter if the Britcons is a front or not. The point is that a response had to be made to the C&D.
If it should turn out that the Britcons is a sham, that would be a reason to be suspicious about Resin Forge and its proprietors. However it is not proved.
I'm not going to read this whole post as I am revising for my Bar exams. However, if dakkaawesomesauce needs some free (unofficial) guidance on anything, let me know via PM.
Hehe, I would love to see him daring to take this all the way to court. He would be shooting himself in the foot but then again, given the intellect displayed so far I wouldnt be surprised.
Anyway MajorTom, what can I say other then "I told you so" and also that my offer still stands!
Fishy enough for us to be singing sea shanties while fishing out of a fish shaped submarine with Captain Birdseye and a plate of fish fingers to use as bait.
Regardless of how logical and understandable a move it may be, the takeaway from this for anyone thinking about scamming wargamers is that they will likely be able to get any negative characterisation of their "business" removed from the forums, or at least extremely heavily toned down(note how everything has become legalish; "alleged" this and "improper terms" that), because they know that the person ultimately responsible for Dakka as an entity is on the hook for any potential legal action, and so is disinclined to fight any C&Ds sent unless they're completely outrageous in their demands. Even if those C&Ds are highly suspect and appear to come from a company that doesn't exist in the form described.
And I might be mistaken, but I was under the impression that the other thread was about informing the community of the danger of dealing with Resin Forge, since it was made clear in the OP of that thread that Mandlebaum's association with Resin Forge was already confirmed. "Warning: doing business with this guy could well be a serious mistake" and "This guy who might possibly allegedly have not always fulfilled his orders according to some people has sent us a C&D" both link Mandlebaum and Resin Forge, but are two completely different characterisations of the facts, one of which might be more palatable to a lawyer, but doesn't do nearly the same job in conveying justifiable caution to anyone giving it a perfunctory browse.
And that is precisely the type of rhetoric that shouldn't be used.
The facts can and will speak for themselves without resorting to supposition to hype things up.
I don't want to say anymore except that I'm completely comfortable with replacing the information from that previous thread with this one here.
Anyone who wants to post the facts of firsthand experiences they have with any business, that will always be allowed on this site and will never be taken down. Its when people who don't have firsthand experience start jumping in and making claims that they don't personally have any knowledge of besides what they read from someone else that the problem starts.
Kilkrazy wrote:It doesn't actually matter if the Britcons is a front or not. The point is that a response had to be made to the C&D.
If it should turn out that the Britcons is a sham, that would be a reason to be suspicious about Resin Forge and its proprietors. However it is not proved.
yakface wrote:
alarmingrick wrote: So, Yak is the latest "victim" of Mandelbaum?! Is the C & D from a real company?
Yeah, as I've said repeatedly now, it doesn't matter if Britcons is a sham company or not.
I am much more comfortable with the information being 100% verified and presented how it is in this thread than it was in the previous thread.
Right guys i can tell you right now that that website is a sham. Just from flicking through it i can tell you that the site has not been designed by a proffesional, nor anyone else. Hell my little brother could feasibly pump out a better website than that in a day or so on Adobe Dreamweaver 6, which i bet is the one they used.
gak well that proves it. The site just got taken down, its gone. Big con front, intended to scare, nothing more.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Yup just to confirm it is definetly gone, officially taken down and the domain unclaimed. Sneaky Mandelbaum is sneaky.
You don't mean to imply someone went to the trouble of setting up a fake company in Germany last June in order to try and scare off people discussing another interest of theirs or their history?? Surely not... That would be absurd. Who would do such a thing?
I have long felt like a relic with no place in our modern, wishy washy society. To be outspoken and blunt, to call things by their proper names without any "beating about the bush". Its something I've always subscribed to, and it just doesn't work in the modern world. This whole fiasco just proves it!
Clearly and obviously any impartial observer that has perused both threads knows what has gone on, but we can't t say so because of rules? Its analogous to literally hundreds of things in news and politicis and soceity at large that on a daily basis are detrimental to the world, and even though everyone knows it, nobody can talk about it/them/those.
If you are shameless enough, all you need to do it make a paper trail and you can get away with bloody murder.
master of ordinance wrote: gak well that proves it. The site just got taken down, its gone. Big con front, intended to scare, nothing more.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Yup just to confirm it is definetly gone, officially taken down and the domain unclaimed. Sneaky Mandelbaum is sneaky.
I love how over the top this thing was.
A website called 'bitcon' (bit... con) that has got paid expert super mercenaries that might or might not do house calls to people that people have problems with...
In the end it doesn't really matter. The objective, first hand evidence is there to be had. This latest development is also something you can use to form your opinions. In my opinion, things are as clear as they have ever been.
master of ordinance wrote: gak well that proves it. The site just got taken down, its gone. Big con front, intended to scare, nothing more.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Yup just to confirm it is definetly gone, officially taken down and the domain unclaimed. Sneaky Mandelbaum is sneaky.
I love how over the top this thing was.
A website called 'bitcon' (bit... con) that has got paid expert super mercenaries that might or might not do house calls to people that people have problems with...
Subtle.
Exactly what i was thinking. Now the only question is: can we take legal action against him for this?
I think what Yakface is too polite to say (I swear, that man never has negative thoughts about people!) is that this is done. Nothing else matters, as the original goal was:
Declare that one of the employees of Resin Forge is Daniel Mandelbaum
This has been confirmed by the C&D at the beginning of the thread. For those of you who are viewing this as a competition, the goal has been achieved and those wishing to achieve this goal have won.
There's no need to do anything further. There is a LOT of information available in the community from people who have had experience dealing with Daniel Mandelbaum, and those who are curious can go find more.
master of ordinance wrote: Exactly what i was thinking. Now the only question is: can we take legal action against him for this?
There is no "we" here. There is only Yakface. Not even us moderators are involved.
MajorTom11 wrote: In the end it doesn't really matter. The objective, first hand evidence is there to be had. This latest development is also something you can use to form your opinions. In my opinion, things are as clear as they have ever been.
I am with you here Tom. <Please don't use that kind of terminology, we want to keep this thread on the level> I, quite frankly hope never to have dealings with him.
Isn't that a legal no-no in the US? I somewhat recall one of the resident lawyers bringing that up in the Romeo vs TastyTaste C&D.
Yes generally if a time is in another state either a courier or sister firm in said state will deliver because lawyers will notorize everything as it starts the chain of custody. Generally speaking most law firms now a days pay for a local sheriffs deputy deliver the letter of intent as most people won't turn away a cop.
Kilkrazy wrote: A "con" means a confidence trick which is a kind of fraud done by fooling people with false names, businesses, etc.
Woah, all this time I wasn't actually aware that con was short for confidence trick. I just figured conned was a word all of its own that meant like swindle or defraud or something.
infinite_array wrote: So... is there any legal action that can be taken for receiving what is essentially a threat being backed by a false company?
There is actually.
Assuming Mandelbaum is in the US. And Yakface is in the US, and depending on the states involved, then there might be SLAPP laws in place.
SLAPP laws are intended to stop pernicious threats of litigation 'I might sue you', they're commonly used in free speech cases such as this by lawyers acting for the defendants. In essence it's throwing down the gauntlet to the other side and saying 'step up'.
If, as looks likely here, there is no legal firm involved, unless Yakface is blanking/hiding any additional information, then the C&D can be entirely ignored. If a lawyer does appear, then I'm sure people can pass on the information to one of the many First Amendment blogs who will publicise it and, quite often, obtain cheap or even pro-bono representation.
Unless there are significant details left out, I strongly believe this is fake laywery shenanigans.
Kilkrazy wrote: A "con" means a confidence trick which is a kind of fraud done by fooling people with false names, businesses, etc.
Woah, all this time I wasn't actually aware that con was short for confidence trick. I just figured conned was a word all of its own that meant like swindle or defraud or something.
It is a word of its own as well, meaning to take the watch on a ship.
Did the Britcon site have glaring spelling errors and lots of full caps? All my correspondence with RSO had both. Glad I saw the thread on Dakka and dodged that con-bullet.
I believe this was all easy to call from the second it happened. The internet is smarter than Daniel.
I agree that the old thread served it's purpose well enough. I've sent my full statement to key people involved, and should they give me the go ahead, I will post a full account of my personal experience with Daniel Mandelbaum and Resin Forge in this thread.
Yakface, if you wish I can email said account and the relevant evidence to you as well.
Isn't that a legal no-no in the US? I somewhat recall one of the resident lawyers bringing that up in the Romeo vs TastyTaste C&D.
Legal documents ought to go directly to the recipient by hand, which normally requires a courier. With an email the intended recipient may not receive the document and sensitive information risk disclosure. I dont know if that has any bearing on its validity, as I am not a lawyer I wont attempt a conclusion. However an email C&D is not a proper C&D, it's just flaming with lawyerspeak. Perhaps Yakface could have just ignored as trolling, however he saw mileage to do otherwise.
In any event anything that looks legalistic ought to be taken seriously unless you have legal advice to the contrary, getting legal advice from random people on the internet is generally an unwise move.
Please remember folks, however much you feel anger towards Resin Forge and their owners for this apparent shenanigans regarding the C&D, we want to keep this thread polite and factual.
So some more tidbits (not that it really matters), all from contacts and sources (helps to have a big German support base )
Also laut Handelsregister erlangen / nordbayern gibt es keine firma britcon ltd. Der name duerkop ergibt auch kein ergebnis
According to the Bavarian trade register (where all companies are listed, legal obligation) there is neither a company Britco nor somebody called Duerkop.
Also somebody called the neighbours of the supposed lawyer's address. They said somebody with the name of the "lawyer" had lived there in the past, but not anymore. Talk about digging out fake identities stolen from unsuspecting people.
Please correct me if I am mistaken, but I thought all such legal documents where supposed to be handed over in person by a carrier of some sort. And not on email?
Also I do understand that Yakface dose not wish to hinge his future on what some individual may or may not do.
We see the use of C&D letters so often in our hobby that we all 'basically' know what they are, how they work, etc. Do other industries see the use of the C&D letter as prevalently? I mean, obviously with GW using it we see it a lot here, but it's not limited to GW in the wargaming realm.
Is that the norm outside of our nichle little corner of the hobby world?
We see the use of C&D letters so often in our hobby that we all 'basically' know what they are, how they work, etc. Do other industries see the use of the C&D letter as prevalently? I mean, obviously with GW using it we see it a lot here, but it's not limited to GW in the wargaming realm.
Is that the norm outside of our nichle little corner of the hobby world?
Why not spread the love? Start up a plant/e-service/strip-a-gram/pharmaceuticals megacorp/farm/cafe/sewage inspector subcontractor etc etc and advertise as 'space marines'. Soon any and every industry can know the joys of C&D.
Bottom line for me is I stearing clear of this company. I have never dealt with them nor do I know of anyone who has BUT when enough people yell fire one should seek a better place to stand.
We see the use of C&D letters so often in our hobby that we all 'basically' know what they are, how they work, etc. Do other industries see the use of the C&D letter as prevalently? I mean, obviously with GW using it we see it a lot here, but it's not limited to GW in the wargaming realm.
Is that the norm outside of our nichle little corner of the hobby world?
A friend of mine gets C&D letters almost daily from his torrenting of his pr0n collection
2. Is sending a C&D letter to a US citizen from a fictitious company a crime?
theoretically yes to both questions
1 Fabricating a Company is classed as an Identity crime (Identity theft) and is against the law in most of the world
2 Since it is classed as Identity Theft (even if you made up the company yourself ) the sending of a C&D would be a crime also as you are attempting to get something through duplicitous means
also due to claiming to be a company from Germany now makes it an International crime (we have Interpol for this in the EU i'm not sure which branch of the Federal Law enforcement agencies covers this for you guys in the US)
Its covered under The Identity Theft Deterrence Act (2003)[ITADA] amended U.S. Code Title 18, § 1028 apparently
We now know that Daniel Mandelbaum is a part of "Resin Forge".
And, as a fact, I can state that while he was doing business as "Matt Bonder" using the Conversion Corner webiste, he took money and models from me to do conversion work and that, to this date, he still owes me hundreds of dollars for money paid for conversion work never performed and/or delivered.
So, at least we now can speak of the facts involved here.
Kilkrazy wrote: Probably not in this case since it hasn't been used to obtain money by false pretences or something like that.
It doesn't matter anyway. Yakface has no desire to involve himself in a civil action against Resin Forge.
The objective of confirming Daniel Mandelbaum as the proprietor has been achieved.
Point, Fraud isn't just limited to money.
Points which determine fraud in the US (from Wikipedia)
1 a representation of an existing fact;
2 its materiality;
3 its falsity;
4 the speaker's knowledge of its falsity;
5 the speaker's intent that it shall be acted upon by the plaintiff;
6 the plaintiff's ignorance of its falsity;
7 the plaintiff's reliance on the truth of the representation;
8 the plaintiff's right to rely upon it; and
9 consequent damages suffered by the plaintiff.
It very clearly meets all but 9, and 9 can be argued as a loss of intellectual property (as, my understanding of it, IIRC, yakface owns the rights to republish our rubbish indefinitely internationally).
And, yes, my own experience is that real C&D's arrive as real paper. Dark Reign got one from Games Workshop a while back.
Sorry to be the one to cast doubt, but if everyone here is fully accepting that this C&D is ficticious and sent with the intent of fraud, how can anyone accept the information in it as 100% accurate?
Cheers
Andrew
PS Just playing devils advocate here, look before you leap.
What really frustrates me is these types of people are allowed to prey on our community because people deem it not worth the effort to hold them to account. So why not fake a company or send "illegal" threats or any number of other crimes because hey none is going to bother with him. It gets annoying after a time.
AndrewC wrote: Sorry to be the one to cast doubt, but if everyone here is fully accepting that this C&D is ficticious and sent with the intent of fraud, how can anyone accept the information in it as 100% accurate?
Cheers
Andrew
PS Just playing devils advocate here, look before you leap.
If that's in reference to his identity, he's made a comment on Facebook a couple of hours ago acknowledging that he is involved.
AndrewC wrote: Sorry to be the one to cast doubt, but if everyone here is fully accepting that this C&D is ficticious and sent with the intent of fraud, how can anyone accept the information in it as 100% accurate?
Cheers
Andrew
PS Just playing devils advocate here, look before you leap.
Posted a few pages back, google cease and desist letter, second result look for defamtion and theres a template letter there,then look at the first post a lot of it is word for word, even the grammer is spot on the same
Man this stinks. In addition to some of the other stuff noted so far - I ran a quick (not complete) deception model on this. Its comes up to be most likely – 93% DECEPTION. I do not have the time to run a full model while I’m at work. Additionally I only have some facts at hand, some facts (evidence presumed to be facts), but require more to finish it. I would honestly doubt this is a real organization/company. As to the OP (Yak) pulling the old thread and informing Dakka of this – right call man. You have to look out for yourself and by extension Dakka. I applaud you and your efforts and wish you the best in this. I will send you a message later tonight.
I am not a lawyer and will not delve into the area. I am an experienced deception detection analysts among other useless life-skills. I applied what evidence I have/can – some links websites are blocked to me right now. I know most of you have already formed opinions based on what others have been looking at – I have as well. I have stuck to facts wherever possible – I have tried to layout my assumptions – not portraying truth. Please remember deception – conmen – live in the grey world trying to blur reality. I have tried to layout some of those anomalies to show some possible areas that may have inspired creativity – if this is in fact not true. I have not been able to prove my theory yet, but will try to.
My wife owned businesses in Germany, two locations – one was in Bavaria (The Free State of – which contains Nürnberg). This is not what her ID numbers looks like to run a business in Germany and to be upfront, I will not provide my wife’s documents, or mine to anyone else.
I have lived in Germany for a total of 9 years. The last time was for 6 years, in which my foreign born spouse decided to run a business during my multiple deployments to the Middle East. This letter is not addressed or formatted properly for a German Business (from my experiences/documents). It does not look anything like the paper work I have on houses, cars, law documents (translated/typed in English for me and or German either). There is a lack of contact information – letter heading issues, proper addresses, personal identification formatting issues.
Deception detection - there are multiple half-@$$ inconsistencies here. Hopefully one of the German brethren can do something more and faster.
Examples/links used to determine the likelihood of deception:
1) A Germany based company would most likely title the address as Nürnberg (with a freaking umlaut symbol “¨“) instead of Nuremberg (an Anglicized version without the umlaut). While I have been there multiple times – I have seen some translations of Nuremberg – but on official/business documents it is has been Nürnberg for me.
2) Below are some links showing probable “plagiarism” in the creative process of this document’s fabrication.
3) The address in an oxford journal shows the probable inspiration for the address on the document provided. See this link: http://chemse.oxfordjournals.org/content/36/6/539.full.pdf 4) This address in Erlangen appears to be a residential home. It could be a business, but doubtful. There are hotels nearby. Without a street view to reference or someone near there I cannot confirm or deny if it is a home or business – trying to stick to facts. Running businesses out of homes is a common practice in Germany, and businesses are often interrupted by homes and apartment buildings in many streets, but this seems unlikely in this case given the inconsistencies and incongruities to date. https://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=Kanalstr.+2+%2B+91052+Erlangen+Germany&ie=UTF-8&hq=&hnear=0x47a1ff25f3c575b5:0x35187d6933ad0010,Kanalstra%C3%9Fe+2,+D-91058+Erlangen,+Germany&gl=us&ei=lN-MUfSqAoWq4AOQ04GICQ&ved=0CC8Q8gEwAA 5) It looks like someone has been creative with the business name by adding the letter “s” after Britcon - http://companycheck.co.uk/company/02463833 6) I have tried to contact the second business link to confirm whether or not the company exists, but again there are issues. (This business is on Kanalstrasse/Kanalstraße but is Berlin) http://www.list-of-companies.org/Details/11115973/Germany/TEMA_FISCHER_GMBH/ and this one http://www.list-of-companies.org/Details/11167563/Germany/TEMA_TEXTILMASCHINEN_RICHARD_LEBHERZ_GMBH_CO_KG/ is in 91052 Erlangen but not on a Kanalstrasse/Kanalstraße in 91052 Erlangen, outskirts/part of Nürnberg.
7) My European GPS shows this as a residential home as well – but that is not proof in and of itself – it does not show as a business or industrial zone.
8) I cannot find a Bramblestrasse/Bramblestraße anywhere near Nürnberg or Erlangen, I think this may have started the Bramble-bumble http://www.siriusfacilities.com/en/business-parks/location/munich_rupert_mayer_str./description. 9) There seems to be no listing of the business in either area of Germany provided on the letterhead – in English or German to date.
1. Summary of Link referenced in –the address is the key 3) - The Influence of Molecular Structure on Odor ... - Chemical Senses
chemse.oxfordjournals.org/content/36/6/539.full.pdf
by M Czerny - 2011 - Cited by 4 - Related articles
Mar 25, 2011 – Center, University of Erlangen-Nuremberg, Schuhstrasse 19, D-91052 Erlangen, Germany. Correspondence to be sent to: Michael Czerny, ...
I will say that was worded very well and not trollish at all. If you know people that are owed something or have a claim, they have a way to reach our customer service line. Please share it as no sites appear to share it and if the claims against one of our owners is true, then it will obviously be corrected. Our reputation here at RF is perfect and it will stay that way. I will simply say again, there is a number that RF can be reached at above. Please do share it to those friends that feel they are "owed something"
Nothing wrote above was ment in disrespect or trollish. Its just been a long night.
As for the legal firm. We have documents and payments as records. Claims against us over that are easily refuted to any law enforcement agency who can see the evidence for themselves. I cant speak more on that but in general that's not the point of the customer service line. Make use of it, that's why its there.
From the RF facebook page. Perhaps Alpharius should give them a little ringy dingy and get his money back.
Has anyone contacted the Federal Bureau of Investigation about Daniel Mandelbaum before? Perhaps in reference to his past history? If it has not been done before it might be worth considering now; especially if this is indeed a made up company and the owner's name has been misrepresented (as that could possibly be considered identity theft).
It's a wonder that disgruntled customers haven't tried to have charges pressed for various fraudulent actions. Wire and mail fraud carry pretty heavy penalties, I believe, if such allegations were proven.
The problem with these case is that individually, most(if not all) of the victims aren't out enough to make it worth the time for law enforcement agencies to pursue.
That's why people keep mentioning to contact X if you feel you have been wronged. It really takes a group effort for these types of cases to move forward.
rigeld2 wrote: He won't.
"This is Alpharius. I gave you money for stuff back when you were X business..."
"This is Resin Forge. Not X business. Go away."
If Daniel Mandelbaum was not operating as a limited liability company, he is still personally liable for the debts incurred when he was running X business., unless he entered into personal bankruptcy.
shade1313 wrote: It's a wonder that disgruntled customers haven't tried to have charges pressed for various fraudulent actions. Wire and mail fraud carry pretty heavy penalties, I believe, if such allegations were proven.
Mods please delete this if it is off topic, but I do believe it's pertinent to the reason why some form of action hasn't been taken.
Up until the last time Mandelbaum had issues with his business was with Three Stage Studios. During that time it was revealed that the man we thought was Matthew Bonder was named Daniel Mandelbaum. Until then he was still able to operate under an alias.
This would make it very difficult to try and find someone if they are using an assumed alias/using someone else's name. I think for some people like Alpharius, it may be too late to get their product and/or their money back through legal means.
Exactly what Platuan4th said;
Say hypothetically I ordered from RF, or TSS or RSO or whatever, and on the high side say I ordered in excess of 300 bucks. Hypothetically I never recieved the product or reimbursement.
1.) Hiring a lawyer and paying the ensuing court fee's to bring this to small claims court would FAR outweigh the 300 dollar loss I took from the hypothetical transaction.
2.) Even if the court were to grant monetary restitution for court fees and lawyer expenses as part of the settlement, these types of disputes can be drawn out for months, if not years. Most people have jobs, lives, families, and simply can not be bothered to deal with this kind of gak for protracted periods of time.
3.) Should I be approached by a lawyer pro bono to help me with my hypothetical purchase, number 2 still applies. As a military officer it is EXTREMELY difficult to get ANY kind of time off from work just for ONE event, getting home for the birth of my first daughter was retardedly hard, I couldn't even imagine trying to take off multiple days over multiple weeks over multiple months, and I'm sure many civilian sector jobs are roughly the same.
4.) The emotional investment required to get caught up in protracted litigation (which could potential run in terms of years, but not likely) is WAY too high for a couple hundred of dollars that I hypothetically lost, and in the end it is simply not worth it.
Do all of these assertions only contribute to the success of less than honorable business practices in this hypothetical situation? Absolutely. Does this allow a hypothetical "con man" to continue to divulge people of their money? Absolutely. So what is the best way to combat this you might ask? By doing exactly what MajorTom and Yak have done in this, and the last thread. Warn the community, confirm facts, let individuals make up their minds for themselves and avoid the potential legal gakstorm themselves while providing a much needed service to the community.
While IMHO that cease and desist letter is utter $#!%, Yak is definitely making the right move in exposing the individual while protecting himself legally, no matter how "bogus" the threat may be. I applaud Yak, MajorTom, and all the extremely resourceful community members for their work and their genuine concern for the community, you have my thanks!
rigeld2 wrote: He won't.
"This is Alpharius. I gave you money for stuff back when you were X business..."
"This is Resin Forge. Not X business. Go away."
If Daniel Mandelbaum was not operating as a limited liability company, he is still personally liable for the debts incurred when he was running X business., unless he entered into personal bankruptcy.
rigeld2 wrote: He won't. "This is Alpharius. I gave you money for stuff back when you were X business..." "This is Resin Forge. Not X business. Go away."
If Daniel Mandelbaum was not operating as a limited liability company, he is still personally liable for the debts incurred when he was running X business., unless he entered into personal bankruptcy.
He may be. Resin Forge is not.
Actually, if he's the owner and it's not one of the business types that explicitly disconnects the assets of the two beings, Resin Forge IS liable as legally(in that case), Resin Forge IS Mandelbaum.
rigeld2 wrote: He won't.
"This is Alpharius. I gave you money for stuff back when you were X business..."
"This is Resin Forge. Not X business. Go away."
If Daniel Mandelbaum was not operating as a limited liability company, he is still personally liable for the debts incurred when he was running X business., unless he entered into personal bankruptcy.
He may be.
Resin Forge is not.
Actually, if he's the owner and it's not one of the business types that explicitly disconnects the assets of the two beings, Resin Forge IS liable as legally(in that case), Resin Forge IS Mandelbaum.
At least according to my textbooks.
This is correct. Unless the company(which we still have no public address for, or any legitimate DBA registration or FID, is an LLC, or some form of legal corporation, the default is Sole Proprietorship, in which said proprietor is 100% legally and financially responsible and accountable for the company and any lawsuits, settlements, fines etc.
It has a M Deurkop as the registrant and looks to be associated with a freelance photographer in Nuremberg, Germany who specializes in 'tactical/military' photography.
Perhaps he doesn't know his name is being used in this manner?
I have contacted this person, and he knows nothing about this, can the above details be removed? he claims to have recieved quite a few phone calls
Well there is that. The person who made the C&D impersonated someone and the site associated with that document is now gone.
What now Daniel(since I know you read this)?
All of your "proof" seems to be evaporating faster than you can make excuses for it.
Just a general question, but it seems the legal firm in the C&D that was sent to Dakka's Admin/Owner has gone down. Do you know why this is? I would assume any decent law firm can handle a modicum of site traffic. Are your lawyers actively working to resolve this issue?
Like · Reply · 35 minutes ago via mobile
Resin Forge Store
Lex reported them for using legal templates which is not even illegal. That's my understanding based on what his own hate page on us has said. its also worth noting no one has shared out customer service number on his page, and if they have he just removes them. If people are owed anything by one of our owners, they have a customer service number they can use. No one has yet at all. 800 views in over 4 hours and people just ignore it. (and yes like him we have screen shots of his admission to getting it taken down because of templates. legal ones that are used all the time.)
Apparently Lex has the power to make 'law firm' websites disappear.
[Sidenote] Using templates (we call them precedents up here) is common practice for actual law firms. However, there are some copyright issues with regards to using someone else's precedent. Usually you pay for access to the really good / specialized ones (for example the top flight Wills and Estates precedents up here cost about $300.
Holding yourself out as a lawyer or pretending to practice law when you aren't a lawyer is illegal though.
Do we have any sort of confirmation on the legality of sending out a false C&D? Ive seen a few people weigh in with there thoughts but can anyone confirm whether or not an actual law was broken with this action?
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also I too would be interested in seeing what would happen if Alph gave them a call, seems they are basically inviting anyone that believes they had a problem in the past to give them a call. I'd have my doubts on the outcome but even if there is the off chance of getting some restitution might be worth a go
Boilerplates are a standard way of doing basic legal work like C&Ds. You can often get them free or for a small fee.
The one from Britcons seemed to be based on the C&D template offered free by a US based law firm. They did advice people to use a lawyer to draw it up in full.
Boilerplates are a standard way of doing basic legal work like C&Ds. You can often get them free or for a small fee.
The one from Britcons seemed to be based on the C&D template offered free by a US based law firm. They did advice people to use a lawyer to draw it up in full.
Not only that, Lexicanum is but one page who is trying to unearth what seems to be a conspiracy of sorts it's certainly one of the ones with the most weight.
And since its clear dakka itself reads this, why has no one called? Its been 2 hours and not one call. Seems odd to say the least. Make claims on a site we can not defend ourselves but then not even bother to call the number we put up that you all claimed we never would.
I'm not the best at doing corporation searches, but the number listed is a texas number and I can't find a taxable entity named "Resin Forge LTD" on the texas look up site. Perhaps it is a numbered company or registered out of state.
Are people actually not calling the number? Seems to me I'd personally be wary about it in case it's some sort of...trap to record some of these alleged death threats. Then again, I'm a cautious fellow
Interesting facebook thread from Mandelbaum.... Your being called out....Dakkanauts Activate!
(btw Mods/Yak, not sure if reposting this is against your rules but it doesn't seem like it, since they wont post here its nice to see their "side" but if it is just edit it out guys :] )
"Resin Forge Store
5 hours ago
---- News Update ----
Due to the high volume of business, and requests by customers for a Resin Forge Service Number, we can now be reached at 1-214-632-6446, 9am-9pm, US, Central Time, Monday - Saturday. Please have any and all pertinent information and/or documents you may feel will help, when calling so that we can help you in a prompt and professional manner.
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3 people like this.
Resin Forge Store Several sites also wanted this. Here it is.
Like · Reply · 3 hours ago
Resin Forge Store I want this to be very clear. Its 9. Anyone that has a complaint against any of our owners , call. To claim our 3 owners are a single person is once again 100% incorrect. Frankly the fact this has been read over 700 times and hasnt been shared to say lex or any other sites that bashes us daily, shows they are not "scams" . Dakka posted this, which we 100% allow as its a public update. They are correct they can post that. It was also polite and them to remove it if we did remove this but, we have no plans to.
This gives anywhere there a chance to make whatever claim they have as well which is why we thank them for posting it.
Anyone that has bought from us clearly sees one of the owners names on the account.
Like · Reply · about an hour ago · Edited
PERSONS NAME REMOVED I think the issue is not with RF 'per se' but with the involvement of Mr Mandelbraum, from what I gather. Several other 'enterprises' of his seem to have, allegedly, left not a small number of persons unhappy and out of pocket in regards to unfulfilled orders / lack of communication etc....
The issue appear to be compounded that the legal firm that you have allegedly retained appear to not ave verifiable bone fides - again, maybe unfairly, leading to a suspicion that all is not what it appears to be with RF.
I personally have not been affected by Mr Mandelbraun in the past, but do have several friends who have - all of which would love the opportunity to discuss these issues with him.
As you state, RF has several owners - the only advice I would give is disassociate yourselves from Mr Mandelbraum as it seems to be he who is the root cause of the bad feeling in certain parts of the community towards your otherwise fine company.
Like · Reply · about an hour ago via mobile
Resin Forge Store I will say that was worded very well and not trollish at all. If you know people that are owed something or have a claim, they have a way to reach our customer service line. Please share it as no sites appear to share it and if the claims against one of our owners is true, then it will obviously be corrected. Our reputation here at RF is perfect and it will stay that way. I will simply say again, there is a number that RF can be reached at above. Please do share it to those friends that feel they are "owed something"
Nothing wrote above was ment in disrespect or trollish. Its just been a long night.
As for the legal firm. We have documents and payments as records. Claims against us over that are easily refuted to any law enforcement agency who can see the evidence for themselves. I cant speak more on that but in general that's not the point of the customer service line. Make use of it, that's why its there.
Like · Reply · about an hour ago
PERSONS NAME REMOVED Just a general question, but it seems the legal firm in the C&D that was sent to Dakka's Admin/Owner has gone down. Do you know why this is? I would assume any decent law firm can handle a modicum of site traffic. Are your lawyers actively working to resolve this issue?
Like · Reply · 48 minutes ago via mobile
Resin Forge Store Lex reported them for using legal templates which is not even illegal. That's my understanding based on what his own hate page on us has said. its also worth noting no one has shared out customer service number on his page, and if they have he just removes them. If people are owed anything by one of our owners, they have a customer service number they can use. No one has yet at all. 800 views in over 4 hours and people just ignore it. (and yes like him we have screen shots of his admission to getting it taken down because of templates. legal ones that are used all the time.)
Like · 39 minutes ago · Edited
Resin Forge Store And since its clear dakka itself reads this, why has no one called? Its been 2 hours and not one call. Seems odd to say the least. Make claims on a site we can not defend ourselves but then not even bother to call the number we put up that you all claimed we never would."
Given the history of harassment from this individual, I would imagine most would not want to give their personal phone numbers to them; for fear of further harassment.
Titan Atlas wrote: Are people actually not calling the number? Seems to me I'd personally be wary about it in case it's some sort of...trap to record some of these alleged death threats. Then again, I'm a cautious fellow
just guessing here but given the fact that RSO has a track record of being in contact to resolve issues then having a wide assortment of excuses for refunds / product not making it back it could just be an issue of people view it as more trouble then its worth and dont want to go through the marry go round of reasons again. But as I posted above, if you've been wronged I think its at least worth a shot
ironicsilence wrote: Do we have any sort of confirmation on the legality of sending out a false C&D? Ive seen a few people weigh in with there thoughts but can anyone confirm whether or not an actual law was broken with this action?
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also I too would be interested in seeing what would happen if Alph gave them a call, seems they are basically inviting anyone that believes they had a problem in the past to give them a call. I'd have my doubts on the outcome but even if there is the off chance of getting some restitution might be worth a go
In the UK this is covered under Communications Offences( Improper use of public electronic communications network - Communications Act 2003, section 127 and Section 1 of the Malicious Communications act 1988) and and can carry a sentence of up to 6 months or a fine , I dont know what that translates to in the US .
Cyporiean wrote: Given the history of harassment from this individual, I would imagine most would not want to give their personal phone numbers to them; for fear of further harassment.
That is what Caller ID block is for.
Side note, the person who answers is the same person who tried to get me fired. Don't think I'll forget that voice anytime soon.
Or they are relying on the line of thinking i expressed earlier in the page, most people aren't going to go through all the trouble to recoop an (in the grand scheme of things) insignificant amount of money.It's a shame really, because it plays into RF's hands to project an image of innocence (if their post about "no calls" is to be believed).
At the end of the day though it is "mission accomplished", the community has been warned and individuals are armed with the necessary data to make informed decisions on their own.
As we in the military community might say, good work S2 (Military Intelligence).
@Yakface : There is no lawyer with the surname Duerkop listed with the German law society. That makes this fraudulent (Impersonating a lawyer and giving legal advice/sending legal notice) and 100% illegal no matter what country(s) are involved, ASSUMING the person who sent the C&D is purporting to be legal counsel. If so, report it to police and let them handle it.
Just FYI, here is a listing of ALL lawyers listed in the city and postal code listed in the C&D (This information is entirely public and all lawyers are required to be registered with their countries law society, currently practicing, retired and disbarred). None of them are the one listed in the C&D;
Spoiler:
Michaela Weiß
Nürnberger Straße 71, 91052 Erlangen
Lars Kittel
Bauhofstrasse 5, 91052 Erlangen
Till Richter
Gebbertstraße 54, 91052 Erlangen
Dr. Oliver Rothhaupt
Bauhofstraße 5, 91052 Erlangen
Nils Reimer
Reinigerstraße 6c, 91052 Erlangen
Manuela Ramming
Nägelsbachstr. 49a, 91052 Erlangen
Peter Hampel
Nürnberger Strasse 71, 91052 Erlangen
Katja Franke
Henkestrasse 104, 91052 Erlangen
Stefanie Apking-Gorißen
Zenkerstrasse 19, 91052 Erlangen
Ulrike Arlt
Hofmannstrasse 32, 91052 Erlangen
Dr. Carsten Bissel
Nürnberger Strasse 69-71, 91052 Erlangen
Sven-Wulf Schöller
Hofmannstrasse 59a, 91052 Erlangen
Dr. Christopher Lieb
Apothekergasse 2, 91054 Erlangen
Burkhart Eugen
Hindenburgstrasse 14, 91054 Erlangen
Michael Baczko
Harfenstrasse 4, 91054 Erlangen
I make this post only with the warning that the lawyer and the accountant I share an office with handle claims that mostly deal with the medical field. I also had to out myself as a gamer to do this. I talked to the lawyer about the C&D and he says it is probably one of the worst fakes he has seen. He said “I could do better during my lunch.” I talked to the accountant and the owner of Resin Forge would be liable for any passed business dealings if he didn’t separate himself from the company. Using a supplier database I use for my job as an inventory specialist at a large surgical hospital I am able to search for legitimate businesses. I do this due to the fact that companies some not legit at all send large hospital bills all the time. I can’t find any company registered for a tax ID in the United States called Resin Forge. No tax ID normally means no legit business. If that’s the case its fraud, plain and simple.
AndrewC wrote: Sorry to be the one to cast doubt, but if everyone here is fully accepting that this C&D is ficticious and sent with the intent of fraud, how can anyone accept the information in it as 100% accurate?
Cheers
Andrew
PS Just playing devils advocate here, look before you leap.
According to Resin Forge's Facebook page they employed the so-called law firm that sent it. In other words it wasn't sent as a fraud, it was sent to make Yakface take the thread down.
If there are any fictitious elements to the letter you would need to ask Resin Forge about them.
At the risk of receiving another inappropriate PM on my warseer account from RF alluding to police rapports as happened less than 20 minutes after I posted in the original warning thread, I would just like to point out that fabrication of legal documents of any kind is considered a severe crime, at least in Denmark, and is often sidelined with acts of physical assault and murder in terms of conviction in a court of law (again this is at least the case in Denmark) and I have a distinct feeling that this is not looked upon lightly in the United States either.
So if this is indeed a proved beyond doubt to be a false C&D letter I would say it is the receivers moral obligation as a citizen to report this to their local and/or federal agencies as this is no light matter indeed.
Again I have no involvement in this case except for my last comment and the rather weird personal reply to it I received, but I can only hope that those afflicted by the actions/misdeeds of this man and his affiliates(be they real or fictional) takes proper legal actions.
Devoted-to-the-machine wrote: I make this post only with the warning that the lawyer and the accountant I share an office with handle claims that mostly deal with the medical field. I also had to out myself as a gamer to do this. I talked to the lawyer about the C&D and he says it is probably one of the worst fakes he has seen. He said “I could do better during my lunch.” I talked to the accountant and the owner of Resin Forge would be liable for any passed business dealings if he didn’t separate himself from the company. Using a supplier database I use for my job as an inventory specialist at a large surgical hospital I am able to search for legitimate businesses. I do this due to the fact that companies some not legit at all send large hospital bills all the time. I can’t find any company registered for a tax ID in the United States called Resin Forge. No tax ID normally means no legit business. If that’s the case its fraud, plain and simple.
He claimed in emails to me that "He needed to make 10k in profit before having to register with the IRS and get an FID or DBA". Which as I recall, the 10k minimum is for personal reporting only, not for businesses, and ALL legal retailers in Texas and likely every other state are required to register DBA's within 30-90 days of opening.
So he's reading, but being very selective about what he replies to. If I was a legitimate business owner I might want to address claims that my law firm was bogus and the contact person for said firm was disavowing any knowledge Resin Forge, and my business wasn't properly registered.
Resin Forge Store That is a good point but when we take the steps with a valid phone that we are here, ready to anwser, to correct any of the 'claims' made and no one takes us up on it except (see Below)
We just realized who called with call block and asked for "Eric" to clearly test out number or some other non sense -
Aerethan wrote:
"Side note, the person who answers is the same person who tried to get me fired. Don't think I'll forget that voice anytime soon. "
Resin Forge Store Funny we did just get 1 call with someone asking for Eric. That's beyond odd so we assume its simply a misdial and not someone calling to just check the number. They did call with *67 as well too.
It looks like the britcons.com domain was hi jacked or something as it has been down for a year or so and owner is unaware of how or why it came back up
Was the email address the letter was recieved from a @britcons.com domain?
I find it interesting that experienced lawyers sending out C&D letters don't have any legal means to protect their companies website and prevent Lexicanum from shutting down their site by going "they used a template!"...
Devoted-to-the-machine wrote: I make this post only with the warning that the lawyer and the accountant I share an office with handle claims that mostly deal with the medical field. I also had to out myself as a gamer to do this. I talked to the lawyer about the C&D and he says it is probably one of the worst fakes he has seen. He said “I could do better during my lunch.” I talked to the accountant and the owner of Resin Forge would be liable for any passed business dealings if he didn’t separate himself from the company. Using a supplier database I use for my job as an inventory specialist at a large surgical hospital I am able to search for legitimate businesses. I do this due to the fact that companies some not legit at all send large hospital bills all the time. I can’t find any company registered for a tax ID in the United States called Resin Forge. No tax ID normally means no legit business. If that’s the case its fraud, plain and simple.
He claimed in emails to me that "He needed to make 10k in profit before having to register with the IRS and get an FID or DBA". Which as I recall, the 10k minimum is for personal reporting only, not for businesses, and ALL legal retailers in Texas and likely every other state are required to register DBA's within 30-90 days of opening.
He has done none of these.
It takes literally 10 minutes to register with any state as a S.P. There is no limit as to how much "profit" you have to make because if that was the case then most businesses would have to register for years because it takes years to get into the black. Now filling out the paperwork for an L.L.C that is entirely different and if your smart you just hire a law firm to handle it. The difference being every year you have to pay the state fee for the L.L.C (i.e I pay $500 a year to keep mine).
MarkyMark wrote: It looks like the britcons.com domain was hi jacked or something as it has been down for a year or so and owner is unaware of how or why it came back up
Was the email address the letter was recieved from a @britcons.com domain?
They hijacked his old website and then started using his name to run their business? Sounds as though he's been the victim of identity theft.
czakk wrote: So he's reading, but being very selective about what he replies to. If I was a legitimate business owner I might want to address claims that my law firm was bogus and the contact person for said firm was disavowing any knowledge Resin Forge, and my business wasn't properly registered.
Resin Forge Store That is a good point but when we take the steps with a valid phone that we are here, ready to anwser, to correct any of the 'claims' made and no one takes us up on it except (see Below)
We just realized who called with call block and asked for "Eric" to clearly test out number or some other non sense -
Aerethan wrote:
"Side note, the person who answers is the same person who tried to get me fired. Don't think I'll forget that voice anytime soon. "
Resin Forge Store Funny we did just get 1 call with someone asking for Eric. That's beyond odd so we assume its simply a misdial and not someone calling to just check the number. They did call with *67 as well too.
Kinda odd that a supposed reputable business would provide call by call update about their customer service line? Hardly seems professional or reputable, seems like the RFFB page is devolving into a child like logic of argument.
I love the classic Daniel move of ignoring questions he doesn't want to answer.
Why are Kim and Jason not on here? Why have we not heard from them?
I tell you what Resin Forge. You know damn well who I am. You know where I work. If Kim wants to call me, she's more than welcome to. Just ask the front desk to transfer you to me.
BREAKING: Resin Forge accuses LEXICANUM of taking down their lawyer's homepage. Singlehandedly!
*dramatic pause*
We reached out to the Lexicanum and this is what they have to day: YES, we did indeed report the lawyer's page. You know to which institution? To the internet, we reported them to the internet and we are not ashamed. Nice that the Internet apparently immediately reacted and had that page taken down!
UPDATE: On further inquiry a representative of the Ordo Lexicanum was overheard uttering the following:
"Apparently. I am amazed by my powers. Thinking right now about which page to take down next" (followed by maniacal laughter, abruptely cut short by a bolter shot)
Lex apparently did not report the site and did not have it magically taken down
Devoted-to-the-machine wrote: I make this post only with the warning that the lawyer and the accountant I share an office with handle claims that mostly deal with the medical field. I also had to out myself as a gamer to do this. I talked to the lawyer about the C&D and he says it is probably one of the worst fakes he has seen. He said “I could do better during my lunch.” I talked to the accountant and the owner of Resin Forge would be liable for any passed business dealings if he didn’t separate himself from the company. Using a supplier database I use for my job as an inventory specialist at a large surgical hospital I am able to search for legitimate businesses. I do this due to the fact that companies some not legit at all send large hospital bills all the time. I can’t find any company registered for a tax ID in the United States called Resin Forge. No tax ID normally means no legit business. If that’s the case its fraud, plain and simple.
He claimed in emails to me that "He needed to make 10k in profit before having to register with the IRS and get an FID or DBA". Which as I recall, the 10k minimum is for personal reporting only, not for businesses, and ALL legal retailers in Texas and likely every other state are required to register DBA's within 30-90 days of opening.
He has done none of these.
10k is the personal amount though in state taxes this can differ (so I am told). I haven’t found anything to prove his company is actually legally a company. I do this sort of stuff for a living. Legit companies don’t hide their information. It’s normally a red flag for our finance department if they have a hard time finding what we call “pedigree information.” If my company was contacted in such away we wouldn’t have paid any mind to it.
If finance got a bill and needed to check inventory against claimed charges it would be sent to me. If I can’t find inventory for the claimed charges I would need to check other information like taxes. In this case I would need to know that taxes on our side of the inventory matched tax information on the requesting company’s side. If I can’t find tax information on a company I submit it normally as a fraudulent claim. I can’t find anything business tax related connected to him or his company.
Now my company being a large surgical hospital we got ourselves one of them PI firms too. I have had only minimal contact with them. Mostly my dealings with them are about illegitimate companies seeking compensation for services or items. They don’t have a website. They say the reason why is due to the fact that they don’t advertise publicly a service that is private. This company is large and very good (so I am told).
CURNOW wrote: kind of admiting that someone from resin forge did call you at work here Aerethan
Oh I know. I've already got evidence out the back about Resin Forge calling me from Daniel's phone, which he used as Matthew Bonder back in 2009, claiming to be "Jason". At this point I'm not confident there is any such "Jason" person involved, and if there was I'd want photo ID proof at this point.
It has to be said again. What kind of professional business discusses stuff like this on their Facebook? Even with no other history about this guy, that would be highly suspect.
pretre wrote: It has to be said again. What kind of professional business discusses stuff like this on their Facebook? Even with no other history about this guy, that would be highly suspect.
I'm finding it hard to keep up to be honest. Posts seem to be here in pictures and not on the FB page... Am I missing something or is this some form of censorship?
pretre wrote: It has to be said again. What kind of professional business discusses stuff like this on their Facebook? Even with no other history about this guy, that would be highly suspect.
They are not a legit buisness. I am making this claim personally. I am willing to givee my information to Daniel and he can try and sue me.
The company here us just a security consulting company. The signer is the CEO of that company. According to current law, there it's no legal action that may be taken by any sane lawyer.
Perfections wrote: The company here us just a security consulting company. The signer is the CEO of that company. According to current law, there it's no legal action that may be taken by any sane lawyer.
If you need help in court, I'll do it for free.
Which company is a security consulting company? And legal action against who? cryptic reply is cryptic.
Flippa wrote: I'm finding it hard to keep up to be honest. Posts seem to be here in pictures and not on the FB page... Am I missing something or is this some form of censorship?
he posts without thinking ,people screenshot it before he notices he has slipped up but then he deletes stuff { about 90% off all stuff posted on his fb page in the last 49hrs hase been deleted by him }
Cyporiean wrote: Given the history of harassment from this individual, I would imagine most would not want to give their personal phone numbers to them; for fear of further harassment.
Pretty much nailed it there.
Anyone who has had ANY dealings with "Daniel Mandelbaum" knows the ridiculous lengths he goes to in terms of bombarding you with phone calls and emails.
As for calling them up and stating who is owed what - laughable.
"Daniel Mandelbaum" knows full well what he still owes me - I'm sure he's got an accurate record of our conversations and e-mails. At this point, he really just needs to pay up. But, given how long he's dragged this out already (going on 4 years now since I initially contracted with him for the conversion work), I'm clearly not holding my breath.
Perfections wrote: The company here us just a security consulting company. The signer is the CEO of that company. According to current law, there it's no legal action that may be taken by any sane lawyer.
If you need help in court, I'll do it for free.
Well it's kind of looking like there is no real Britcons company and the name and website being used was taken from some poor photographer in Germany who had his identity stolen.
Hopefully he gets in contact with his local police, and MarkyMark upthread said he would like to get in contact with Yakface, so perhaps we will learn more.
Perfections wrote: The company here us just a security consulting company. The signer is the CEO of that company. According to current law, there it's no legal action that may be taken by any sane lawyer.
If you need help in court, I'll do it for free.
Which company is a security consulting company? And legal action against who? cryptic reply is cryptic.
The company here putting up the C&D.
Any legal action taken against yak.
And britcons IS a real security consulting company based in Germany.
As someone was alluding to above: what does any of this deally matter if he is not taken to task? Skimming through it sounds like he has broken laws. So who is going to press charges? We can talk all we want and keep creating threads when he pops up with a new company, but until he is taken to court he is just going to keep on trucking. And, surprising to some here I am sure, there are a lot of war gamers out there that don't read DakkaDakka. So he will continue to make money off of new victims.
All that is necessary for evil to prevail is for good men to stand by and do nothing.
Perfections wrote: The company here us just a security consulting company. The signer is the CEO of that company. According to current law, there it's no legal action that may be taken by any sane lawyer.
If you need help in court, I'll do it for free.
Which company is a security consulting company? And legal action against who? cryptic reply is cryptic.
The company here putting up the C&D.
Any legal action taken against yak.
And britcons IS a real security consulting company based in Germany.
Indeed Britcons is a security consulting company (http://infoguys.com/directory/ListingDisplayPrint.aspx?lid=3104) that is not listed at the address listed in the C&D however (nor can that address even be found with google maps). They are not a law firm. True, anyone can send a cease and desist letter, however, sending one does not necessarily mean you have adequately, or even legally asserted or protected your own rights. Sending a threatening cease and desist letter under false pretenses, or for malicious reasons, could even be a crime that exposes you to potential counter legal action. Before accusing someone of breaking the law and demanding action, especially if you are demanding payment, you should consult an attorney.
I don't believe there can be any legal action taken against Yak either, especially as the offending thread has been removed already (when confirmation of the intend of that thread has been given simply by receiving the C&D).
Kilkrazy wrote: It doesn't matter anyway. Yakface has no desire to involve himself in a civil action against Resin Forge.
Sure, sure. But, you know - creating a fake website to misrepresent yourself, practicing law without a license, impersonation, maybe fraud - these aren't civil matters. They are criminal ones. I wish some of the principals here would refer this to their state attorney general. At least make the effort, see what they say.
Alpharius wrote: Anyone know what Resin Forge's direct e-mail address is?
Daniel Mandelbaum owes me some money, and I'd like to submit an invoice to him/them.
Thanks!
He said on the Resin Forge FB that if he owes you any money just call that number, it would be interesting to see how that goes
An email is better, since it's far easier to keep a record of, and therefore far harder to deny the existence of; not that I'm saying or implying that RF would deny its existence.
With a phone call, all it takes is for someone to put the phone down on you and then deny the call ever took place; something that, again, I am not saying or implying that RF would do.
Alpharius wrote: Anyone know what Resin Forge's direct e-mail address is?
Daniel Mandelbaum owes me some money, and I'd like to submit an invoice to him/them.
Thanks!
He said on the Resin Forge FB that if he owes you any money just call that number, it would be interesting to see how that goes
The issue with a phone call is that, while instantaneous, it removes any paper trail and could result in a "he-said-she-said" over the details at a later date. For anything concerning money, contract terms, etc. its best to have it properly recorded for future reference.
wouldnt it be funny if he didnt fake the C&D letter but actually thinks its real and somone has scammed him into thinking they were a real law ferm and has charged him for the service :]
CURNOW wrote: wouldnt it be funny if he didnt fake the C&D letter but actually thinks its real and somone has scammed him into thinking they were a real law ferm and has charged him for the service :]
Can we pitch in for legal representation? Once you (Yak) gets a clear handle on things, you would be more confident to tell him to feth off.
It seems to me, that there is no possible way that a thread which lists people who are saying they got ripped off by a company could ever be legally classed as defamation, surely it just isn't possible? If you go onto Amazon or Ebay and give someone 1 star out of 5, they can't sue you for saying so. It seems to my admittedly amateur legal mind that the bloke is massively taking the slash.
How about making a Kickstarter?
I would chip in for a lawyer, I bet gak loads of people including many that do not use this forum would do as well. I haven't paid for DCM because of my issues with a couple of those that moderate the site, but Id happily pitch $25 in to help give the finger to a man that appears to have no moral fiber at all.
Alpharius wrote: Anyone know what Resin Forge's direct e-mail address is?
Daniel Mandelbaum owes me some money, and I'd like to submit an invoice to him/them.
Thanks!
If you can track down a physical address for him, you could try filing a case against him in small claims court. It's really not all that difficult or expensive. Additionally, any expenses you incur can be included in the award. Typically, depending on the local and state fee structure, the filing fees are between $100 and $150. The forms are also simple enough to do without having a lawyer. Just make sure you can document the damages you are claiming, because that'll be one of the first things the judge asks to see.
The negative is that collecting on the debt after the judgement. There are fun things like garnishing bank accounts or filing a FiFa lien, but sometimes they're more work than is worth the money involved. Also, the judgment could be avoided through personal bankruptcy.
Though, that being said, collecting on a FiFa lien can be a lot of fun, in a deeply vindictive sort of way.
FB User 1 I have a question for you. What authorities could Lexicanum report this legal firm to, that would result in an immediate takedown of the website?
Like · 1 · about an hour ago
FB User 2 You state that your legal representatives page was taken down by being reported by a community forum, yet follow it up saying that it is your understanding based on what the forum page says? Have you not contacted your own legal representation to confirm why their site was taken down?
Like · 37 minutes ago
Resin Forge Store That was based on a comment made on a page which we have a screen shot of. But yes, we clearly now have to do more research ourselves.
Like · 25 minutes ago
Resin Forge Store FB User 1 Thats not my job to know.
This would beg the question of how they would know that Lexicanium did it then if they can't explain how they did it.
Regardless of how logical and understandable a move it may be, the takeaway from this for anyone thinking about scamming wargamers is that they will likely be able to get any negative characterisation of their "business" removed from the forums, or at least extremely heavily toned down(note how everything has become legalish; "alleged" this and "improper terms" that), because they know that the person ultimately responsible for Dakka as an entity is on the hook for any potential legal action, and so is disinclined to fight any C&Ds sent unless they're completely outrageous in their demands. Even if those C&Ds are highly suspect and appear to come from a company that doesn't exist in the form described.
And I might be mistaken, but I was under the impression that the other thread was about informing the community of the danger of dealing with Resin Forge, since it was made clear in the OP of that thread that Mandlebaum's association with Resin Forge was already confirmed. "Warning: doing business with this guy could well be a serious mistake" and "This guy who might possibly allegedly have not always fulfilled his orders according to some people has sent us a C&D" both link Mandlebaum and Resin Forge, but are two completely different characterisations of the facts, one of which might be more palatable to a lawyer, but doesn't do nearly the same job in conveying justifiable caution to anyone giving it a perfunctory browse.
And that is precisely the type of rhetoric that shouldn't be used.
The facts can and will speak for themselves without resorting to supposition to hype things up.
I don't want to say anymore except that I'm completely comfortable with replacing the information from that previous thread with this one here.
Anyone who wants to post the facts of firsthand experiences they have with any business, that will always be allowed on this site and will never be taken down. Its when people who don't have firsthand experience start jumping in and making claims that they don't personally have any knowledge of besides what they read from someone else that the problem starts.
You can call it rhetoric if you like, personally I would call it examining the existing evidence and forming a completely justifiable opinion, which, barring a change in policy on this site, can be freely shared with others providing it is phrased politely. Just as I can read about Mat Ward's writing style, decide he is a bad writer, and discuss that opinion. Just as I can examine Kirby's recent actions in running GW, decide he's a poor businessman out for himself, and discuss that opinion.
It's also worth noting that it was the "rhetoric" of the previous thread which prompted Mandlebaum to begin making public mistakes(police report, harassing calls to forum members, deleting questions on Facebook etc etc), mistakes which confirmed his identity to everyone without requiring the OP to reveal the methods by which his identity was discerned, meaning they can be used again in future.
And frankly, if a wee bit of hype makes it more likely that someone who would otherwise have been taken by this "alleged" scammer is warned off, that's something I'm completely comfortable with. You can take whatever position on this you like, obviously, as it's you that has to deal with the consequences, but I maintain that this thread isn't as effective as the previous one in conveying the potential risks of dealing with Mandlebaum, which was the objective whatever the current "oh all we wanted was to confirm his name anyways" party line is.
A Kickstarter for the wholesale pursuit of bringing This schmuck to justice would be epic.
Sadly, given the lack of desire by any of his victims to actually pursue a case in this matter, I do not see anything more coming of this most recent set of discoveries than has happened before.
It is a shame, too. Stealing over the internet can be such a lucrative business due to the lack of victim effort.
It is good that some of the forums do warn others about the issue, at least.
And that C&D letter was made up by RSO, I bet. It had a total lack of lawyer talk.
Hang on a sec... I'm getting confused with all the stuff going on. Has it been verified that this C&D was, in fact, sent by Mr. Mandlebaum? That it is from an actual attorney? Or is it a fake that was sent by someone pretending to be Mandlebaum to troll Yak?
I'm not trying to defend or derail, I'm honestly confused as to where everything is at currently due to all the conflicting statements, theories, and accusations flying around.
The issue with a phone call is that, while instantaneous, it removes any paper trail and could result in a "he-said-she-said" over the details at a later date. For anything concerning money, contract terms, etc. its best to have it properly recorded for future reference.
'This call may be recorded for suing one's ass off purposes.'
Breotan wrote: Hang on a sec... I'm getting confused with all the stuff going on. Has it been verified that this C&D was, in fact, sent by Mr. Mandlebaum? That it is from an actual attorney? Or is it a fake that was sent by someone pretending to be Mandlebaum to troll Yak?
I'm not trying to defend or derail, I'm honestly confused as to where everything is at currently due to all the conflicting statements, theories, and accusations flying around.
It was not sent from an attorney.
It was *possibly* sent from a "security consulting" company based in Germany (whos address and city does not match the one on the C&D)
It makes threats of legal action and the pursuit of monetary compensation over statements NOT made by nor endorsed by Yak.
That's all that can be 100% confirmed at this point afaik.
Breotan wrote: Hang on a sec... I'm getting confused with all the stuff going on. Has it been verified that this C&D was, in fact, sent by Mr. Mandlebaum? That it is from an actual attorney? Or is it a fake that was sent by someone pretending to be Mandlebaum to troll Yak?
I'm not trying to defend or derail, I'm honestly confused as to where everything is at currently due to all the conflicting statements, theories, and accusations flying around.
See Rorschach's post above
Also, does anyone see where Lexicanum was proven to have reported the Lawyer's page and gotten it taken down?
Please tell me if the image isn't working, I'm at work and I had to hand write the url (also the image would be work blocked for me)
Anyone considred filing a friendly notice to the Texas State Attorney General with a brief rundown on some of the questionable activities that have taken place? Doesn't cost any money and at the end of the day, who knows they may take action against the company at no cost to dakkanauts.....
The issue with a phone call is that, while instantaneous, it removes any paper trail and could result in a "he-said-she-said" over the details at a later date. For anything concerning money, contract terms, etc. its best to have it properly recorded for future reference.
'This call may be recorded for suing one's ass off purposes.'
True, but that may give an unscrupulous person a reason not to communicate by phone. In many jurisdictions you have to consent (implied or otherwise) to being recorded.
Also, does anyone see where Lexicanum was proven to have reported the Lawyer's page and gotten it taken down?
**snip**
Please tell me if the image isn't working, I'm at work and I had to hand write the url (also the image would be work blocked for me)
Is there any chance you could re-post the image without the last two replies shown? I don't think that those are the sorts of replies/discussions that are needed in this thread.
Do you even have to tell the guy you're recording the coversation? or can't you just say at the end.. "BTW, I recorded this, thanks. I'll send you the youtube link in a few..."
Necros wrote: Do you even have to tell the guy you're recording the coversation? or can't you just say at the end.. "BTW, I recorded this, thanks. I'll send you the youtube link in a few..."
Nope legally you are obligated in the U.S to inform an individual if a call or conversation is being recorded otherwise it can be construed as entrapment.
Necros wrote: Do you even have to tell the guy you're recording the coversation? or can't you just say at the end.. "BTW, I recorded this, thanks. I'll send you the youtube link in a few..."
Nope legally you are obligated in the U.S to inform an individual if a call or conversation is being recorded otherwise it can be construed as entrapment.
Not simply entrapment. Federal wiretapping laws are pretty strict on who and when a person can be recorded with and without their consent. On top of that, there are "right to privacy" issues that arise in the face of being recorded without your knowledge. A simple attempt to gather evidence can suddenly turn into you being given the perp-walk.
Necros wrote: Do you even have to tell the guy you're recording the coversation? or can't you just say at the end.. "BTW, I recorded this, thanks. I'll send you the youtube link in a few..."
Nope legally you are obligated in the U.S to inform an individual if a call or conversation is being recorded otherwise it can be construed as entrapment.
Actually the laws vary from state to state, although I don't know which state's laws would apply. In NY you only need one of the parties consent to record
Flippa wrote: Can't you all band together and just file a class action lawsuit against him?
Hate it when my post goes on the last page and gets missed... unless you're ignoring me
By my understanding, the amount of damages suffered by the victims of the alleged scamming are not large enough to qualify for class action status in the USA.
They could still pursue civil litigation on their own, if they wanted to.
The issue with a phone call is that, while instantaneous, it removes any paper trail and could result in a "he-said-she-said" over the details at a later date. For anything concerning money, contract terms, etc. its best to have it properly recorded for future reference.
'This call may be recorded for suing one's ass off purposes.'
True, but that may give an unscrupulous person a reason not to communicate by phone. In many jurisdictions you have to consent (implied or otherwise) to being recorded.
Actually, in most parts of the USA, you do not need to inform the person on the other end of the phone of the recording. As long as one person knows, it's not considered wire tapping or anything. If I remember from the last time I researched the subject, only 11 states require all parties on a telephone call to know a recording is taking place.
Necros wrote: Do you even have to tell the guy you're recording the coversation? or can't you just say at the end.. "BTW, I recorded this, thanks. I'll send you the youtube link in a few..."
Nope legally you are obligated in the U.S to inform an individual if a call or conversation is being recorded otherwise it can be construed as entrapment.
Not simply entrapment. Federal wiretapping laws are pretty strict on who and when a person can be recorded with and without their consent. On top of that, there are "right to privacy" issues that arise in the face of being recorded without your knowledge. A simple attempt to gather evidence can suddenly turn into you being given the perp-walk.
"Federal law requires that at least one party taking part in the call must be notified of the recording (18 U.S.C. §2511(2)(d)). "
State laws are sometimes more strict. California, Connecticut, Florida, Hawaii, Illinois, Maryland, Massachusettes, Montana, Nevada, New Hampsire, Pennsylvania, and Washington are the 11 states that require all people on a call to be aware of the recording.
So.. if just 1 of the parties needs to be notified, that sounds kinda silly... I mean, the guy doing the recording already knows about it, so he notified himself when his brain told him to press record. Or does he have to write himself a letter saying he's going to record a conversation with so and so?
<tinfoilhat>Or is it just worded that way so the the government can track and record everything you do without you knowing about it?</tinfoilhat>
I hate legal stuff, it hurts my brain. My GF is a contracts lawyer, when she talks about work stuff I just smile and nod and pretend I'm paying attention, when I'm really just thinking about what color my next army is gonna be
Saldiven wrote: Actually, in most parts of the USA, you do not need to inform the person on the other end of the phone of the recording. As long as one person knows, it's not considered wire tapping or anything. If I remember from the last time I researched the subject, only 11 states require all parties on a telephone call to know a recording is taking place.
If that is true then I stand corrected. I personally would still not record without the other's consent, if only to avoid issues at a later date.
<tinfoilhat>Or is it just worded that way so the the government can track and record everything you do without you knowing about it?</tinfoilhat>
Unless you're talking to the government, it doesn't work that way. Tapping would be listening without the knowledge of both parties conducting a conversation over the phone.
Saldiven wrote: Actually, in most parts of the USA, you do not need to inform the person on the other end of the phone of the recording. As long as one person knows, it's not considered wire tapping or anything. If I remember from the last time I researched the subject, only 11 states require all parties on a telephone call to know a recording is taking place.
If that is true then I stand corrected. I personally would still not record without the other's consent, if only to avoid issues at a later date.
Most big business agree with your position. It's safer that way, especially if you're a big company that deals with multiple states through a call center. It's easier to just give the disclosure about recording to everyone than to check with every phone call whether you're required to do it or not.
Necros wrote: So.. if just 1 of the parties needs to be notified, that sounds kinda silly... I mean, the guy doing the recording already knows about it, so he notified himself when his brain told him to press record. Or does he have to write himself a letter saying he's going to record a conversation with so and so?
Think a phone bank setup like a customer support line, etc. A new Agent might not know he's being recorded unless told. Although, in actual practice, most phone queues I hear these days announce they may record for quality assurance anyway.
I've heard an interesting way to confuse a cold-caller sales pitch is to notify the caller that you're recording the call. At best, it flusters the, at worse the ones that are selling a scam might drop the call completely. In general, I don't approve of messing with telemarketers or customer support agents as it's the bosses that are making them be horrible, and ost would probably much rather have another job, but there are some that maybe deserve it.
guidsgjg wrote: Interesting the RFFB page refuses to address the circumstances behind their legal representatives sudden "disappearance" from the internet.
Must have been Lex again This legal conflict is even more hilarious than the Chapterhouse lawsuit, and that means something. Resin Forge really seems to badly copy GW lawyers.
I think the first step now would be Yakface emailing back, asking who exactly emailed and what legal expertise the author has.
In Texas, it is perfectly legal to record a phone call with the other party not being aware. You cannot however record a call that both parties are not aware (a spouse and a third party for example). He is located in Texas so chances are any calls will be recorded.
Interesting the RFFB page refuses to address the circumstances behind their legal representatives sudden "disappearance" from the internet.
Must have been Lex again
The Lex is for RF what Matt Ward is for GW (anti)fanbois. Just put everything on it. We already stated clearly what we did.
And just for the record: very soon he will probably say that the Lex broke into his bank accounts and cybercriminally stole all the money of his clients. And a Lex-Ninja gang broke into his office/ workshop/ house and stole or destroyed all models and conversions. I wish to have this recorded as proof that we not only have the power to take down any web page in minutes but that we also possess the power or being able to predict the future.
Too funny =). The fact that this company is officially pointing to the lexicanum facebook page as to why their legal representation can not be reached is laughable. No self respecting business would ever publish a statement like this, and that fact alone has shot their credibility in my eyes to nothing.
Another quick question for Yak regarding the C&D ..
It states "within 2 days" for compliance. Was this emailed? If so, it can't be taken seriously. Any C&D needs to be mailed, registered mail at that, to the person named, fwiw.
I don't know if this was brought up before so sorry if I missed it. Not sure about Germany but it is a crime in the US to represent oneself as an attorney and not actually be one, barratry is the term for it.
agnosto wrote: I don't know if this was brought up before so sorry if I missed it. Not sure about Germany but it is a crime in the US to represent oneself as an attorney and not actually be one, barratry is the term for it.
Yep, brought up and shown that the person signed on the letter is not a lawyer. Then again, it does not state they are "legal" representation either (though RF claims they are, supposedly)
Perfections wrote: The company here us just a security consulting company. The signer is the CEO of that company. According to current law, there it's no legal action that may be taken by any sane lawyer.
If you need help in court, I'll do it for free.
Which company is a security consulting company? And legal action against who? cryptic reply is cryptic.
The company here putting up the C&D.
Any legal action taken against yak.
And britcons IS a real security consulting company based in Germany.
Indeed Britcons is a security consulting company (http://infoguys.com/directory/ListingDisplayPrint.aspx?lid=3104) that is not listed at the address listed in the C&D however (nor can that address even be found with google maps). They are not a law firm. True, anyone can send a cease and desist letter, however, sending one does not necessarily mean you have adequately, or even legally asserted or protected your own rights. Sending a threatening cease and desist letter under false pretenses, or for malicious reasons, could even be a crime that exposes you to potential counter legal action. Before accusing someone of breaking the law and demanding action, especially if you are demanding payment, you should consult an attorney.
I don't believe there can be any legal action taken against Yak either, especially as the offending thread has been removed already (when confirmation of the intend of that thread has been given simply by receiving the C&D).
Infoguys allows anyone to make an account and a listing for free.
The Britcons listing is a free one. The webpage it contains no longer exists, having disappeared earlier today after Mandelbaum was confirmed as proprietor of Resin Forge by his C&D sent from Britcons.
The address given given by Britcons in Infoguys is false. That is, it doesn't exist.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Alpharius wrote: Anyone know what Resin Forge's direct e-mail address is?
Daniel Mandelbaum owes me some money, and I'd like to submit an invoice to him/them.
