Yeah... I mean, some people are 5something, some are nearly 7 feet tall, even with power armor when it's built to fit them.. .it's gonna be a different size. You've gotta have the proportions right, but i like mixing suppliers sometimes to get some variance in body type for squads... and race too.
sing your life wrote:They could be testing the waters, since a starter set is usually bought by people new to this hobby, so Corvis Belli can see if people are fine with having complex pewter miniatures to work with when they start, or if it would be better to offer the newbs styrene.
EVERY time CB has been asked they has basically said "We like metal".
It's more than that. In the BoW interview about Icestorm, Bostia explained it like this. Icestorm is the introductory set for new players, there to draw them into the Infinity game. They want to put their best foot forward, and and show them what they're getting in to. They make metal models, not plastic. They don't want Icestorm to have plastic models, and give new players the false impression that there will be other plastic models in the future, or others already in the current range.
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GrimDork wrote: Yeah... I mean, some people are 5something, some are nearly 7 feet tall, even with power armor when it's built to fit them.. .it's gonna be a different size. You've gotta have the proportions right, but i like mixing suppliers sometimes to get some variance in body type for squads... and race too.
See I've got no problem with this (I use this excuse for my older models that look like Gorillas next to new models) - physical dimorphism just hasn't been done yet with actual models. If it's just a case of them wanting to make him bigger and more heroic, that's cool. They can't expect it to be the automatic assumption though, since until now they just haven't done that.
MRPYM wrote: Wait, they are only making 5000 copies?
After that its gone?
No. bostria said ( to me, after the Interplanetary) that when this run sells out, they will worry about what to do, but nezt runs won't have the Csu for example. From what I'D understood, there will be other runs after this one. It all depends on how well it sells I guess.
If this is true, I can't see it not getting more print runs. I've seen plenty of hubub around the web with people climbing out of the woodwork eager to start this game, lured by the prospect of a 2 player starter they can split with a friend and/or easy access to terrain. I can see this starter selling very well, and expanding their player base quite significantly, so I can see them wanting more print runs of the starter set. I don't even think the 5000 will last until the end of the year, let alone into next year like they predict.
I'm just relieved to see that the HI (Father-Knight, Mobile Brigada-- the 'Diva of the box' segun Bostria, and ORC) are all on 25mm bases and not 40mm like they did with poor Tarik.
About the translation of the rules... I thought that too, so I downloaded and read the ruleset in Spanish. I can say it is not really an issue of bad translation.
I just hope they don't sell out at GenCon before my GenCon Ninja buys my copy. I wanted to make sure I got the CSU, and to have a copy before the NOVA Open tournaments. I may end up running a demo or two there. Depends upon what the TO needs me to do. It will be nice to have a copy of Icestorm, just in case.
The fluff is meh and the art is even meher. It's almost all "manga" styled artwork but when you get into Campaign Paradiso and Human Sphere you have a mixture of the two styles.
i could not disagree more with this...
i think the books are beautiful, and well worth collecting...
i have V1, V2, Human Sphere, and Paradiso, and i don't even play the game...
i bought them because i love the art and fluff...
as far as what is available on the market, i think that CB have produced something unique in the wargaming world...
to me it is worth it to put my money where my mouth is in support of the world they have created...
i will definitely be getting V3, too...
The fluff is meh and the art is even meher. It's almost all "manga" styled artwork but when you get into Campaign Paradiso and Human Sphere you have a mixture of the two styles.
i could not disagree more with this...
i think the books are beautiful, and well worth collecting...
i have V1, V2, Human Sphere, and Paradiso, and i don't even play the game...
i bought them because i love the art and fluff...
To be fair, I'm not really a fan of the "manga" art style. That puts a lot of V2 into question for me.
Especially when compared to Human Sphere and Paradiso, which have some of the "manga" art style and then it's offset by more realistic art plates.
as far as what is available on the market, i think that CB have produced something unique in the wargaming world...
to me it is worth it to put my money where my mouth is in support of the world they have created...
i will definitely be getting V3, too...
From what I've seen of the artwork in V3? It's a lot more of the realistic art plates--which is a huge selling point to me. They are trying to tone down the cartoonier aspects for their art which is great.
to be honest, Kan, i'm not a Manga fan, in the sense that i don't watch much of the genre, or collect the comics, but when the genre does grab me i get hooked...
when Robotech first came to America, it ispired me so much...
same goes for Ghost in a Shell and Appleseed...
for me Infinity art ticks the same boxes...
i do like the newer style of the prints that came with the art book, but the simplistic style of V1 appeals to me, too...
i am looking forward to the new book, though...
The 'manga style' really barely exists. I don't understand why people still talk about it.
What you have is a sleek futuristic style. techno armor, holograms and white plastic hexagons. Relatively realistic humans in a cartoony form. Occasionally, pink hair. But that's around anyway IRL!
For example, all the Human Sphere and Paradiso Art was pretty colorful, but generally realistic. Except for some Aleph stuff, but they're all androids anyway.
Killionaire wrote: The 'manga style' really barely exists. I don't understand why people still talk about it.
People talk about it because it's something that was very evident early in the game and is slowly being bled out of the game. For people that got into the game because of it, it's a bad thing because the game is losing the identity they liked. For people who got into the game for other reasons and don't much care for the manga aesthetic, it's a good thing because it's losing the identity they didn't much like and gaining an identity they do like.
For me, I love the new art direction, and have never much been into anime/manga. The new art in the books looks miles better than the art in the second edition rulebook, and the models have become, arguably, the best sci fi models on the market.
But I can certainly understand the position of, say, Knight, who (apparently, a page or two back) quit the game over the changes.
As in artwork? Just open up the second edition core rulebook and flip to a random page.
For models, it's mostly about the design choices. The pilot arms hanging out of the TAGs is very reminiscent of the Landmates in Appleseed (of which Geckos a very, very similar). The original Kum riders on their monobikes were lifted right out of Venus Wars. The Maghariba Guard is clearly a Tachikoma (Ghost in the Shell spider tank).
-Loki- wrote: As in artwork? Just open up the second edition core rulebook and flip to a random page.
For models, it's mostly about the design choices. The pilot arms hanging out of the TAGs is very reminiscent of the Landmates in Appleseed (of which Geckos a very, very similar). The original Kum riders on their monobikes were lifted right out of Venus Wars. The Maghariba Guard is clearly a Tachikoma (Ghost in the Shell spider tank).
InB4 someone chimes in with "the rules are free to download". I don't have the book or any CB products for that matter as I may be getting into the game with N3 but no sooner. That's why I was wondering if there are some sample images on the web to show visually what people are talking about with this change in art style.
-Loki- wrote: That's why I was wondering if there are some sample images on the web to show visually what people are talking about with this change in art style.
I'm familiar with the concept art as I've lurked for a while in this thread for years but I haven't seen any "change" from manga style to anything else as, at least to my untrained eye, it looks relatively unchanged. I looked for some of the older IMO fugly figs like the current ORCs or the old monowheel Kum riders (to name two) and didn't see them. I suspect the pics on the page you linked are all from the "new" style, whatever that may be.
Sorry, I thought it was clear but I meant within Infinity. I'm familiar with Manga style art going back to BESM for years but I've yet to see any personally within Infinity though admittedly my experience here is quite limited.
Just wanted to pop in here and point out that Neal at the Warstore is offering a pre-order on Operation: Icestorm, available on the Infinity pre-order page (or here for the direct link).
At 15 Infinity models for $100 ($108 with shipping), that's less then $7 a piece. There have been recent kickstarters that haven't been such good bargains, and that's without factoring in the rather nice paper terrain.
warboss wrote: Sorry, I thought it was clear but I meant within Infinity. I'm familiar with Manga style art going back to BESM for years but I've yet to see any personally within Infinity though admittedly my experience here is quite limited.
Spoiler:
That's fairly old concept art there. Mebbe it shows you how they drew motifs off anime elements.
Knight, who (apparently, a page or two back) quit the game over the changes.
I have too much of their minis (almost everything with exception of knights) to casually do this. I'll pick some of the older stuff and occasionally play the game with others. If I can get it somehow, I'd still like to get two new Fusiliers, so I can wrap up the current project. Or use their new guns with Indigo.
Like I said, others like the new stuff, especially Nomads. And I know someone that would be over the Moon for having something like Father Knight (he had been drooling over Ajax and Tarik for ages, looking at them with envy) in his MO.
I'll pipe down once we get some sun over here. This must be how summer in Britain looks like, rain with amazing 10 minutes of sun in a month.
That's why I was wondering if there are some sample images on the web to show visually what people are talking about with this change in art style.
The style of concept art remained unchanged. Probably also the closest to manga, imo, was also stated that the guy that draws the pieces (or rather just ties them together as supposedly a lot of different artists are working on their own projects) really loves it. The art itself developed and somewhat distanced itself from earlier publishings, depending on what you're looking at (comics, art pieces or designs). I don't really have a problem with this particular development as it reminds me on some comics I've read in my youth, with the saturated colours instead of white-gray-black and more attention to detail.
The fluff is meh and the art is even meher. It's almost all "manga" styled artwork but when you get into Campaign Paradiso and Human Sphere you have a mixture of the two styles.
i could not disagree more with this...
i think the books are beautiful, and well worth collecting...
i have V1, V2, Human Sphere, and Paradiso, and i don't even play the game...
i bought them because i love the art and fluff...
as far as what is available on the market, i think that CB have produced something unique in the wargaming world...
to me it is worth it to put my money where my mouth is in support of the world they have created...
i will definitely be getting V3, too...
to each their own, i guess...
cheers
jah
Couldn't agree with this more.
You don't have to like the massive-eyes and short skirt, Sailor Moon style art to like Manga. There is a tremendous amount of extremely cool, more 'serious' artwork in the form of Ghost in the Shell, Akira, Appleseed, Patlabor.. and dozens more. It's something we've never had in the west, and so much of comic and movie design influence comes from these Eastern sources.
The cover of the new Operation: Icestorm box is pure Manga influence, and if you get the art book (which I recommend to any fan of not just Infinity, but of this style of art) it is absolutely full of it. And, that is relatively recent concept work and design, a lot of which I'm guessing will probably appear in N3 and other books going forward.
IMO, you can't separate the two; Infinity has Manga/Anime in its DNA, you couldn't start to try and treat or remove it without killing the patient, or leaving them a hollow shell of their former self. It's like seeing a Mini convertable that isn't being driven by blonde 30-40-something, absolutely unthinkable.
Sometimes I do really wonder if Kan has ever made a positive post here.
In any case, Infinity is Infinity, the art, however you call it, manga, euromanga, realistic, the poses, the combat heels, the metal models, the fluff, the rules, all these and most importantly the team behind them has made Infinity the success it is and will be, you cannot take its different parts apart and still have Infinity.
CB is adamand about metal models for a variety of reasons, they like doing things in house and keep quality control at the highest levels and plastic does not fit Infinity, to get the quality and poses Infinity models have each model would need to be 10 or more parts and who would want that, besides when most of you in my opinion speak about "plastic models", you do not mean plastic models, but multiparty, multiposed models, that is not what CB is about and I have seen the relevant thread in the discussions subforum, for me CB is better doing what they do best, mind blowing metal monopose models we all love.
It's something we've never had in the west, and so much of comic and movie design influence comes from these Eastern sources.
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Something being relative, I'm not saying the upper comic is Infinity but it draws (or it drew) on similar inspirations and I find their styles similar in few instances. Art isn't tied to the borders, I'm sure you could find some indie artists from Italy, Spain or France that had their own take on all this. I don't consider Infinity the first case in how it blends its styles but they do it in their own way, I give them credit for that.
NoggintheNog wrote: So, I looked at the cost of the gencon pack from corvus belli, with shipping it was £92 and some change.
I can live without the Cosplay Bolt, so saved £30 and got it from Wayland.
This is what I'm gonna do but I've never used Wayland and I'd rather use someone I have before, so I'm waiting for Arcane miniatures or preferably element games.
NoggintheNog wrote: So, I looked at the cost of the gencon pack from corvus belli, with shipping it was £92 and some change.
I can live without the Cosplay Bolt, so saved £30 and got it from Wayland.
This is what I'm gonna do but I've never used Wayland and I'd rather use someone I have before, so I'm waiting for Arcane miniatures or preferably element games.
I can understand that.
For what its worth, I've been buying Infinity stuff from wayland since the very first Beasts of war infinity week got me into the game 3+ years ago, and have never had any issues at all.
I've had slow delivery on a couple of 40K products in the past, but GW supply chain doesnt help there, and things always arrive eventually.
Every wayland preorder I've ever made has been shipped on the day it was supposed to be.
Isnt the biker girl - Penny? Only going to be available from CB too?
Best I can figure is 92 pounds delivered, which is a huge chunk of change, probably equivalent to my whole dwarf kings quest kickstarter pledge when it CV ones next week
NoggintheNog wrote: So, I looked at the cost of the gencon pack from corvus belli, with shipping it was £92 and some change.
I can live without the Cosplay Bolt, so saved £30 and got it from Wayland.
This is what I'm gonna do but I've never used Wayland and I'd rather use someone I have before, so I'm waiting for Arcane miniatures or preferably element games.
I can understand that.
For what its worth, I've been buying Infinity stuff from wayland since the very first Beasts of war infinity week got me into the game 3+ years ago, and have never had any issues at all.
I've had slow delivery on a couple of 40K products in the past, but GW supply chain doesnt help there, and things always arrive eventually.
Every wayland preorder I've ever made has been shipped on the day it was supposed to be.
I might just bite the bullet then... I'll see what Element say when they reply to my email. Thanks though
heartserenade wrote:I'll be sad if the Reverend Healer doesn't get a retail release. It looks glorious without being too cheesecake-y. It's just the right amount for me.
It's not going to get retail release, or at least not that one. The Reverend Healer and Father Knight are exclusive to O:I
Buzzsaw wrote: Just wanted to pop in here and point out that Neal at the Warstore is offering a pre-order on Operation: Icestorm, available on the Infinity pre-order page (or here for the direct link).
At 15 Infinity models for $100 ($108 with shipping), that's less then $7 a piece. There have been recent kickstarters that haven't been such good bargains, and that's without factoring in the rather nice paper terrain.
I didn't realize that The Warstore upped its 'flat rate' to $6.95!
You mean the last deus ex game wasn't a aleph diva simulator?
Yeah warstore shipping has been higher for months now at least, i didn't like it much either, but it's not terrible. Miniature market has a much more shoppable interface though so i've been throwing my money that way more often.
I like The Miniature Market too, but they seem to be a lot slower than The Warstore to add 'new things' to their webstore - expecially for Infinity stuff.
True that. I tend to use MM more when I am doing small package sizes as the $2 first class shipping is nice. But once you get over the weight requirement then it is only $1 difference in their cheapest shipping from warstore.
I still have to use warstore a lot for hobby supplies and paints though.
I love Neal and the Warstore, so if I cannot get this through either of my local shops (Atomic Empire or Game Theory) I will be ordering through the Warstore.
I wouldn't be surprised if many other UK retailers are getting their stuff from Wayland acting as a distributor, rather than direct from CB, which would explain why Wayland tends to have stuff up earlier
Looks like I'll be going direct to CB since I'll be wanting all three things anyway, even with 20% off from wayland its cheaper to grab it from them if you did want everything thanks to the free penny makes it ~£4 less even with shipping, looks like I'll end up with a PanO army when I've not even played that much with my aleph yet.
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if many other UK retailers are getting their stuff from Wayland acting as a distributor, rather than direct from CB, which would explain why Wayland tends to have stuff up earlier
Erm no, its because we take release and product launches really seriously.
The thing is, it's all well and good to have a website exclusive (well, maybe not 'good', but 'correct'), but some people really dislike international orders...
Just got an email from element games and it should be up for pre order this week so I'll wait for them as I've used them before and been very impressed.
Compel wrote: The thing is, it's all well and good to have a website exclusive (well, maybe not 'good', but 'correct'), but some people really dislike international orders...
I love the Infinity models but I hate having to pay for them...
But I guess if you decide the goods are worth the cost, then you get it anyway.
Ordered direct from CB, as I wanted the gen con pack. As I was paying postage anyway, I splurged on a couple of bits and bobs for my new pan-o and nomad factions. HURRY UP AUGUST!
£96 for the gencon pack (+MO patch) from CB £66 from Wayland for just the box, followed by £22 for the Bolt & Patch from CB
I don't really want the Penny, but for £8 it's probably worthwhile (even if only to sell on later).
Decisions, decisions...
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Compel wrote: I asked this earlier but noone really replied. - Are there any other infinity website exclusives that they'd sock which other places wouldn't?
Dunno about miniatures, but they sell some patches for clothes with all the faction/sectorial logos.
Compel wrote: I asked this earlier but noone really replied. - Are there any other infinity website exclusives that they'd sock which other places wouldn't?
The Cosplay Bolt and the Bootleg Penny can only be bought via thier store (or GENCON) right now. Penny will go on sale normally Later this year, but the cosplay bolt is gone forever after GENCON.
Also heard this back from Miniature Market today. Preorders should pop up this week
I am actually resisting buying it, while I do have a use for both factions, I am trying really hard to focus my efforts on one faction and not be distracted. I really want to stick with the CA armies.
Compel wrote: I asked this earlier but noone really replied. - Are there any other infinity website exclusives that they'd sock which other places wouldn't?
A rather nice 15mm historicals range!
Otherwise, I don't think so, possibly just some of the tournament packs (where you can get the old exclusive mini).
PsychoticStorm wrote: Sometimes I do really wonder if Kan has ever made a positive post here.
Sometimes I do really wonder if PsychoticStorm has ever made a negative post here.
Criticizes improves things, being always happy and +1 does not help CB or anyone, just be agree ... to disagree
if we take time to post something negative, that means we care and want to improve the game.
I feel it weird that people react so badly to criticize here,
I'm happy to love and hate Infinity, i've preorder the box and I will love painting the reverend healer I real hope that this new starter box will bring more people to Infinity because there's not a lot of people playing the game in my area ...
Alpharius wrote: I think generalizations are a bad thing, no matter what!
(Ha!)
I've seen a few times in this thread where people are stating that "You can't be critical of Infinity in here!" and that's just not true.
Though I am amused at seeing "DAKKA" accused of being overly positive!
I don't usually play the rebel role but I'll continue to grump away heedless of the sea of positivity at this forum! Hrumpf... As for this thread in particular, I'd reference folks about 10 pages back. It is true except for Kan as he is a sometimes grumpy source of useful and helpful information so he gets a pass. I'm still waiting for my paypal petty cash btw.
Many people have yet to be disillusioned from the company. CB may make mistakes, but they don't make many and they're doing well for a rapidly expanding company.
Many people were on the boat for a Wyrd-can-do-no-wrong mentality, but it took one catastrophic Kickstarter to change all that.
As long as nobody calls us nattering nabobs, it's cool And I thought we would need to get Yasbir to balance out PS. I suppose it may be how you present your opinions too. the whole this sucks versus this needs improvement sort of thing. Ah well. Things may go ugly in a hurry if someone doesn't stamp out a little brushfire that's starting here
If you don't know the rules (like me), it is worthwhile for sure. If you do, not so much. From what I remember there were only two or three things mentioned as changed in N3 from the existing video. Apparently climbing a building no longer requires a check to succeed but rather a long(?) skill/action at the end of which you succeed automatically. (feel free to correct me if I flubbed that). Dodging as an ARO gives you free movement and there is some new kinematic skill that increases the amount you get to help close combat units that are being shot dip, duck, dive, and dodge their way into base to base. I feel like there was one more thing they mentioned that I can't recall at the moment.
Hmm, i'm not raking in cash hand over fist like i'd like to be. As excited for this as I am, even the pan-o stuff, I'm gonna have to step back and think about it carefully. Sure, my Qapu khalqi would love to have the corregidor stuff, and the other models are pretty slick.. and sure those pan-o models are nice enough that i want them even though i haven't had anything to do with pan-o to date...
But i could get morlocks and uberfallkomando... etc... I think the starter is just so damn shiny it's giving me a case of ''all the things'' syndrome. Hmm hard to say, will have to think about it. Of course if i go to gencon and i see it in person i probably won't be able to resist it... hrmm.
The reverend healer though.. would go well with my bakunin stuff, and there's no guarantee she'll be available later. I guess the question i've really got to ask myself is do i want the healer/starter stuff, which i can order from mini market, or is it worth picking up the complete pack to get a bolt and penny for 10 bucks each.
warboss wrote: If you don't know the rules (like me), it is worthwhile for sure. If you do, not so much. From what I remember there were only two or three things mentioned as changed in N3 from the existing video. Apparently climbing a building no longer requires a check to succeed but rather a long(?) skill/action at the end of which you succeed automatically. (feel free to correct me if I flubbed that). Dodging as an ARO gives you free movement and there is some new kinematic skill that increases the amount you get to help close combat units that are being shot dip, duck, dive, and dodge their way into base to base. I feel like there was one more thing they mentioned that I can't recall at the moment.
The other one mentioned was taking measurements from the front edge of bases now instead of the middle.
Indeed! Thanks for filling the hole in the swiss cheese that is my memory!
On an unrelated train of thought, what are the chances of multiple poses of heavy infantry being sold as a boxed set? I like the look of the new mobile brigada but, looking at the weedy previous offering, it doesn't look like there was a boxed set of 3 sold as a link team. The only ones I could find were the HMG single mini blister and the leg lifted up variant in the Corregidor starter. I know that Infinity contracted their SKUs a while back; did they used to have enough poses/variants sold together as a link team? Do they generally do that with HI or generally not?
So a few new tid-bits and a "never hurts to review the basics" sort of thing. Sounds watchable. Thank you for answering.
GrimDork, find some one to split the box with you. Not me, I want the whole thing, as already noted. Or use one starter box as a gift to a fellow gamer to get them playing?
Yeah, i'm not sure what i want to do. I've nearly talked myself out of getting penny and the bolt, though $10 bucks a piece is not bad for the bolt and a steal for penny... And i suppose i could use the d20's and a good way to ease someone into the game. I'm probably gonna go in for the everything pack in person, i will just be inclined to sell off some of my older models to justify it.
Space marines just don't seem to be destined to get any paint with all of this new awesome coming out.
From the demo game in the video, they just did a standard 3v3 deathmatch between Alguaciles and Fusiliers. They didn't use Lieutenants, but that's probably because it was the first intro mission. Also didn't use Retreat perhaps because it was an intro mission.
* Rolling for first turn/deployment is same (opposed WIP).
* Cover rules same (-3 vs shooting, +3 for armor). Needs base contact.
* ARO seems unchanged so far. ARO shoot can still be declared at any point during a movement.
* Order declaration is the same (Active player Short Order -> Opponent ARO -> Active Player second Short Order)
* Can still split burst across multiple targets
* Rolling under a stat is still the norm. Only exception is Armor rolls where you try to roll over.
* Critical hits same (Auto-wound).
* Orders still counted at the beginning of the turn
* Can still voluntarily fail a Guts roll. Failure means seeking cover as usual at distance half-movement.
Changes:
* Measuring is from edge-to-edge rather than center-to-center of a miniature. This is important for shooting because you're measuring from the FRONT of the shooter to the front of the target.
* Silhouette template exists if you need a 'neutral' template for the sake of Line-of-Sight. Used to settle doubts.
* Climbing is no longer a roll. It's now a long order. Distance is first movement stat. Can "climb" stairs and other easily climbable terrain as normal movement.
* Successful Dodge grants you a 2" move regardless of your model's MOV stat.
* Kinematica lvl1 allows this Dodge to be 3". Kinematica lvl2 allows this Dodge to be 4" (probably. Carlos wasn't certain about the numbers or the English translation of the ability). Many Melee-oriented units will have this ability in order to "Dodge" their way into close-combat.
warboss wrote: Indeed! Thanks for filling the hole in the swiss cheese that is my memory!
On an unrelated train of thought, what are the chances of multiple poses of heavy infantry being sold as a boxed set? I like the look of the new mobile brigada but, looking at the weedy previous offering, it doesn't look like there was a boxed set of 3 sold as a link team. The only ones I could find were the HMG single mini blister and the leg lifted up variant in the Corregidor starter. I know that Infinity contracted their SKUs a while back; did they used to have enough poses/variants sold together as a link team? Do they generally do that with HI or generally not?
Let me put it bluntly:
Mobile Brigada? If they do not get a box, then Corvus Belli has really screwed the pooch. As it stands right now, Corregidor has NO "link team" boxed set like any other faction has. They have no special weapons box for the Wildcats, no Alguaciles box, and if they fail to release a Mobile Brigada box they have missed the point.
Mobile Brigada have four different profiles. A Lieutenant option with a Multi Rifle+Light Flamethrower, a "basic" profile with the same loadout, a Boarding Shotgun profile, and a HMG profile. They also have AVA 6 in Corregidor's sectorial.
So if ever there were something that would work perfectly as a boxed set of 4? The Mobile Brigada are it.
Watching the icestorm mission 1 demo game. I find it interesting the way moving and cover interact. I've never played more than a demo game of infinity so I didn't realize that to move into sight of someone and have cover, you had to be touching cover beforehand. So, you cant run from the open to a corner to establish cover and get it from the ARO, but you could run along a wall of cover into view of the enemy and have your cover.
Unless i'm missing something. Seems a bit nitpicky, and potentially unrealistic, but good to see it happen so i know what to expect.
Mobile Brigada? If they do not get a box, then Corvus Belli has really screwed the pooch. As it stands right now, Corregidor has NO "link team" boxed set like any other faction has.
Except Shasvastii. But you knew that, right?
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GrimDork wrote: Watching the icestorm mission 1 demo game. I find it interesting the way moving and cover interact. I've never played more than a demo game of infinity so I didn't realize that to move into sight of someone and have cover, you had to be touching cover beforehand. So, you cant run from the open to a corner to establish cover and get it from the ARO, but you could run along a wall of cover into view of the enemy and have your cover.
Unless i'm missing something. Seems a bit nitpicky, and potentially unrealistic, but good to see it happen so i know what to expect.
Well, the thing is your opponent decides where along your movement path he will shoot you. If he decides to shoot you before you are touching terrain, then you're not in cover. I guess if he's feeling charitable, he could decide to shoot at you once you've reached your cover.
GrimDork wrote: Watching the icestorm mission 1 demo game. I find it interesting the way moving and cover interact. I've never played more than a demo game of infinity so I didn't realize that to move into sight of someone and have cover, you had to be touching cover beforehand. So, you cant run from the open to a corner to establish cover and get it from the ARO, but you could run along a wall of cover into view of the enemy and have your cover.
Unless i'm missing something. Seems a bit nitpicky, and potentially unrealistic, but good to see it happen so i know what to expect.
Yup, thats the way it always been.
And you are not just running next to the wall, you are hunched over keeping your head down while moving next to a wall. Try the same thing in the middle of the steet.
Well, that makes sense for 90% of the scenarios, it's just that in the video they picked the worst move to describe it, he ran from out of line of sight, basically slamming his shoulder into the corner to start shooting... so his opponent had nowhere to actually shoot him before he got there... at least from what i could see. But i guess i see now that what i'm harping on is at best a minority case, and it makes for more tactical gameplay otherwise so not a big deal.
I guess we can consider him to have hit the corner, saw the baddie, duck back around but too late, whereas coming from the wall itself the whole time we would have assumed him to do that leaning around the corner thing off the bat.
Actually, he ran in the open, towards a corner, then slammed his shoulder into the corner to start shooting. His opponent took the shot before the shoulder-wall slamming.
A smarter move would have been to move towards the wall, remaining hidden, and then move along the wall. That could have been done in the same Order, if I evaluated the distances/line-of-sight correctly.
Yeah, i may have missed who was shooting, i may have been looking at a guy on the other corner or something. And they did the move specifically to show some of the tactical depth, he had half an order left where he could have moved to the wall but he just held off specifically to show us the nuance.
Don't get me wrong, the requirement to touch the cover results in some rather weird situations, like having to use a laser pointer to confirm line-of-fire and then taking the shot without the cover modifier...
warboss wrote: Indeed! Thanks for filling the hole in the swiss cheese that is my memory!
On an unrelated train of thought, what are the chances of multiple poses of heavy infantry being sold as a boxed set? I like the look of the new mobile brigada but, looking at the weedy previous offering, it doesn't look like there was a boxed set of 3 sold as a link team. The only ones I could find were the HMG single mini blister and the leg lifted up variant in the Corregidor starter. I know that Infinity contracted their SKUs a while back; did they used to have enough poses/variants sold together as a link team? Do they generally do that with HI or generally not?
Let me put it bluntly:
Mobile Brigada? If they do not get a box, then Corvus Belli has really screwed the pooch. As it stands right now, Corregidor has NO "link team" boxed set like any other faction has. They have no special weapons box for the Wildcats, no Alguaciles box, and if they fail to release a Mobile Brigada box they have missed the point.
Mobile Brigada have four different profiles. A Lieutenant option with a Multi Rifle+Light Flamethrower, a "basic" profile with the same loadout, a Boarding Shotgun profile, and a HMG profile. They also have AVA 6 in Corregidor's sectorial.
So if ever there were something that would work perfectly as a boxed set of 4? The Mobile Brigada are it.
I'd be surprised if MBs got a box actually. There are only really two unreleased profiles the BS and HMG. Are they going to do another sculpt of the MR LFt profile to go in a box or put the MB from the starter in a separate box as well? Or would the box just be 2 x BS and 2 x HMG? With the resculpts of the Alguaciles i think its more likely that they will get a support box. How popular are 5 man MB link teams in Corregidor lists?
mrondeau wrote: Actually, he ran in the open, towards a corner, then slammed his shoulder into the corner to start shooting. His opponent took the shot before the shoulder-wall slamming.
A smarter move would have been to move towards the wall, remaining hidden, and then move along the wall. That could have been done in the same Order, if I evaluated the distances/line-of-sight correctly.
This. A reactive model can choose when its ARO take place. So if they're shooting against a model break from one set of cover to another they're not going to wait until its back in cover before opening fire, rather when it's in the open and an easier target.
Ditto for a model charging into the open then into melee. An ARO-ing model will shoot before the model is in combat and risk shooting his comrade.
warboss wrote: Indeed! Thanks for filling the hole in the swiss cheese that is my memory!
On an unrelated train of thought, what are the chances of multiple poses of heavy infantry being sold as a boxed set? I like the look of the new mobile brigada but, looking at the weedy previous offering, it doesn't look like there was a boxed set of 3 sold as a link team. The only ones I could find were the HMG single mini blister and the leg lifted up variant in the Corregidor starter. I know that Infinity contracted their SKUs a while back; did they used to have enough poses/variants sold together as a link team? Do they generally do that with HI or generally not?
Let me put it bluntly:
Mobile Brigada? If they do not get a box, then Corvus Belli has really screwed the pooch. As it stands right now, Corregidor has NO "link team" boxed set like any other faction has. They have no special weapons box for the Wildcats, no Alguaciles box, and if they fail to release a Mobile Brigada box they have missed the point.
Mobile Brigada have four different profiles. A Lieutenant option with a Multi Rifle+Light Flamethrower, a "basic" profile with the same loadout, a Boarding Shotgun profile, and a HMG profile. They also have AVA 6 in Corregidor's sectorial.
So if ever there were something that would work perfectly as a boxed set of 4? The Mobile Brigada are it.
I'd be surprised if MBs got a box actually. There are only really two unreleased profiles the BS and HMG. Are they going to do another sculpt of the MR LFt profile to go in a box or put the MB from the starter in a separate box as well? Or would the box just be 2 x BS and 2 x HMG? With the resculpts of the Alguaciles i think its more likely that they will get a support box. How popular are 5 man MB link teams in Corregidor lists?
The popularity is not the issue. The simple fact is, again, that Corregidor has several units which are: A) High AVA(Alguaciles, Wildcats, Intruders, Mobile Brigada, Hellcats, and Tomcats) and B)lacking in actual infantry boxes. They have one with Tomcats, but that does not even include the "basic" Tomcat profile.
And really the box would easily be 1x MR, 1x BS, 1x HMG, and 1x of the ever so popular 'placeholder sculpt'(read: guy or girl waving a pistol and/or CCW while in some silly action pose) that they've been churning out in the recent boxes which are not intended to be the "support" boxes and it is not an unreasonable expectation for a box. Especially since the MR/LFT model that would easily be usable for a Lieutenant and/or Link Team Leader is going to be stuck in the stupid vanilla Nomad starter box alongside the Alguaciles.
Mobile Brigada? If they do not get a box, then Corvus Belli has really screwed the pooch. As it stands right now, Corregidor has NO "link team" boxed set like any other faction has. They have no special weapons box for the Wildcats, no Alguaciles box, and if they fail to release a Mobile Brigada box they have missed the point.
Mobile Brigada have four different profiles. A Lieutenant option with a Multi Rifle+Light Flamethrower, a "basic" profile with the same loadout, a Boarding Shotgun profile, and a HMG profile. They also have AVA 6 in Corregidor's sectorial.
So if ever there were something that would work perfectly as a boxed set of 4? The Mobile Brigada are it.
I obviously wouldn't have an issue with that. I was just surprised from doing a quick search that they didn't already have one. I'd prefer to buy one box and get the 3+ that I need than try to hunt down bits from other starters.
I'd be surprised if MBs got a box actually. There are only really two unreleased profiles the BS and HMG. Are they going to do another sculpt of the MR LFt profile to go in a box or put the MB from the starter in a separate box as well? Or would the box just be 2 x BS and 2 x HMG? With the resculpts of the Alguaciles i think its more likely that they will get a support box. How popular are 5 man MB link teams in Corregidor lists?
Are there any existing HI boxes with multiple figs? It seems like a natural cutoff point would be 3 per box for HI, 4 for MI, and 5 for LI. I don't know if CB follows that kind of logic or just instead prefers a per faction # for link teams or just a static number of figs per box for everyone.
I think Ghazi set a good precedent for boxes of units with limited options. They have precisely 2 loadouts - chain rifle or boarding shotgun. Two models in the box had those, and two were proxies.
They could do the same with Mobile Brigada. A HMG, a Boarding shotgun, and two proxies. Maybe an additional rifle and a single proxy. There's ways to do that box.
Man, I wish Ice Storm would be a staple and not just a limited edition thing. It's a perfect starter. I would love to get one in the future (current money plans doesn't cover Ice Storm) but if it's just limited to 5000... hope they print more of it.
To be fair, it might become a staple. I get the impression that the 5000 initial print run is testing the waters. If it sells like hotcakes, there's no reason to not do more runs. If it doesn't sell well, then they won't have a huge amount of stock left over to warehouse until it sells.
True. It's not like I think CB can do no wrong, it's just that I still have a lot of trust in them because you know, they haven't broken my trust yet as a customer and they're very open to the community.
Why in the world would they talk about putting a Limited Edition model sticker on the box if they weren't planning on continuing the box without the sticker?
It says there is a yellow sticker on the box, but no idea what the sticker says on it.
Think the sticker just denotes that the box contains the security lady miniature inside, which then won't be part of the box post the pre-order period if you were to buy it once it has gone on general sale.
Yeah, the 'yellow sticker' boxes are the pre orders boxes with the CSU model. The boxes without the yellow sticker are just the regular boxes without the CSU model.
I'm trying to organise a 'learn to play' weekend to coincide with the release of icestorm. Which weekend does it drop? First of September is what I think I've seen, but I do tend to make mistakes with model releases for some reason
Bear in mind that for most people this weekend is pay weekend, don't be surprised to see them going faster once we hit Thursday onwards, plus BOW ramps up coverage towards the weekend.
I have never played or looked at infinity before but I have go say the pictures I got through on waylands news sheet looks outstanding. Great value for your cash compared to GWs new box set.
First for me to get excited at all over another game.
Mastiff wrote: Thanks. It seems like some of the most interesting Japanese-themed models are mercs.
What are the limitations on using mercs in a game?
Not really existent anymore. There was a "Mercenary Army List" that basically let you use Mercenary units and reduced AVA of any faction's stuff. Otherwise they are specifically available in a Sectorial not vanilla.
As an example? Senor Massacre is available in Corregidor, Scarface in Qapu Khalqi, Yojimbo with JSA.
Mastiff wrote: Thanks. It seems like some of the most interesting Japanese-themed models are mercs.
What are the limitations on using mercs in a game?
Usually, you can't.
Oftentimes, though, some Sectorials will have access to specific Mercenaries. Notable examples are the Ariadna French Sectorial gets the Anaconda TAG, and the Merc-loving Haqqi QK Sectorial get Druze and Scarface and Kaplans.
For the time being, you're not allowed to run Mercenaries in a normal list that doesn't explicitly list them as allowable choices under tournament rules. Of course, you can take these things with your opponent's permission.
There will eventuallybe a "White Stars" Mercenary Sectorial that will allow you to take exclusively mercs.
Well, I think it would be good to talk about the difference on being legal for an ITS tournament, and legal for a friendly game. Mercs are legal for friendly games, that's why they are included in the Infinity Army web-app. Wether you are going to use ITS restrictions or not in a friendly game, is something you should agree with your opponent.
So you should be able to try all of them in your army (not at once, I guess) just for fun.
Mastiff wrote: Thanks. It seems like some of the most interesting Japanese-themed models are mercs.
What are the limitations on using mercs in a game?
Usually, you can't.
Oftentimes, though, some Sectorials will have access to specific Mercenaries. Notable examples are the Ariadna French Sectorial gets the Anaconda TAG, and the Merc-loving Haqqi QK Sectorial get Druze and Scarface and Kaplans.
For the time being, you're not allowed to run Mercenaries in a normal list that doesn't explicitly list them as allowable choices under tournament rules. Of course, you can take these things with your opponent's permission.
There will eventuallybe a "White Stars" Mercenary Sectorial that will allow you to take exclusively mercs.
Mercs in sectorials are ITS legal though right? I could legally use Señor Massacre in a Corregidor force?
Mastiff wrote: Thanks. It seems like some of the most interesting Japanese-themed models are mercs.
What are the limitations on using mercs in a game?
Usually, you can't.
Oftentimes, though, some Sectorials will have access to specific Mercenaries. Notable examples are the Ariadna French Sectorial gets the Anaconda TAG, and the Merc-loving Haqqi QK Sectorial get Druze and Scarface and Kaplans.
For the time being, you're not allowed to run Mercenaries in a normal list that doesn't explicitly list them as allowable choices under tournament rules. Of course, you can take these things with your opponent's permission.
There will eventuallybe a "White Stars" Mercenary Sectorial that will allow you to take exclusively mercs.
Mercs in sectorials are ITS legal though right? I could legally use Señor Massacre in a Corregidor force?
Yes.
It's also worth noting that "White Stars" is one of two, potentially three Mercenary Sectorials that are currently planned to be in Acheron Falls.
White Stars--Druze, Scarface, the "nastier" mercenaries like Senor Massacre and McMurrough.
Beyhan Resources Ltd--A Haqqislamite mercenary company. This would be the Kaplan and some as yet unknown things.
The last one is supposed to be the "Van Orton Military Contracts Foreign Company", a group which is supposedly tied to the Nomad Black Hand.
Erasoketa wrote: Well, I think it would be good to talk about the difference on being legal for an ITS tournament, and legal for a friendly game. Mercs are legal for friendly games, that's why they are included in the Infinity Army web-app. Wether you are going to use ITS restrictions or not in a friendly game, is something you should agree with your opponent.
So you should be able to try all of them in your army (not at once, I guess) just for fun.
Yeah I think that's one of the interesting consequences of CB selling those tournament packs.. especially those cheap mini tournament packs. It has really encouraged competitive play, but when any game can be played using the ITS rules and the results can improve your ITS ranking, many people - probably most - treat it as the default way to play and it seems like people forget (or want to forget, in Kan's case ) that the rules in the book that allow a merc force, or a vanilla force with mercs, is also totally legal for non-tournament play.
That said, it is probably going to change in N3. Pethaps we will see rules for a vanilla merc force in N3 (based on the rules in 2nd edition) and the merc sectorials in the book after that. Or maybe the merc rules will be dropped from N3 entirely.. and we will only get to field them in sectorials or as dedicated sectorial forces which represent specific mercenary companies. Fluff wise I would be okay with that and I suppose it wouldn't be a terrible thing if the list-building aspects of ITS and non-ITS games were consolidated.
I just remember that they have said that they were not planning on putting rules for Mercenaries in the way that people were used to from N2 into N3. Corvus Belli themselves have said that the mercenary rules were kept out of ITS play for a reason--notably that the lists were "messy".
You're getting rules in Acheron Falls. Two different mercenary companies are confirmed, with a third being a potential. That will not change mercenaries that are part of Sectorials outside of making them having a potential secondary list where they can be fielded.
Also just remembered that Valerya Gromoz is part of White Star.
I just remember that they have said that they were not planning on putting rules for Mercenaries in the way that people were used to from N2 into N3. Corvus Belli themselves have said that the mercenary rules were kept out of ITS play for a reason--notably that the lists were "messy".
You're getting rules in Acheron Falls. Two different mercenary companies are confirmed, with a third being a potential. That will not change mercenaries that are part of Sectorials outside of making them having a potential secondary list where they can be fielded.
Also just remembered that Valerya Gromoz is part of White Star.
But then I think there is a difference between wanting to use the older mercenary armies rules and wanting to use a normal army (generic or sectorial) and then add a couple of Yuan Yuan, or Saito Togan, or Luthien Sforza. There are a lot of mercs who aren't available to anyone in ITS in this moment. I guess the mercenary companies will change that when they are released, buy until then, there is still a simple way to use them in a friendly game.
I cannot think of any mercs that would be unavailable to Sectorials or vanilla off the top of my head. With Infinity Army Builder not loading properly, it's hard to figure out exactly what might be missing.
Probably just Yuan Yuan and Luthien Sforza. QK really can field a lot. And Corregidor has a couple that I thought weren't ITS legal. Still, not everyone collects all the factions, so being able to try most of the mercs would be impossible for most with the ITS restrictions.
Crappy mercs if they are deppending only on one single client.
Usashi wrote: Very nice. I like yojimbo render. And seams we have another artwork with penny fighting aragatos
Spoiler:
This is interesting. It looks like two models; one mounted, one on foot? And is it JSA, or merc?
I was considering picking up Penthesilea and adding her to my JSA, but this works so much better.
A large number of people lobbied CB to produce both a Mounted and On Foot version of Yojimbo. Looks like CB listened to us. Gotta love it when that happens
They sold Icestorm at this Interplanetary event, with 70 players there. I bet they sold 50 copies minimum, plus extra as people bought for friends. They'll do that amount that easily at GenCon. Given the numbers on the forums, and who will order... I think they'll have close to 500 sales and pre-orders by 1 Septemeber. After that, no idea.
I would like to take this opportunity to point out that the Alguacile models in Icestorm are a really, really good redo of the ones that were in the old boxset (based on the same concept art). I'm looking forward to fielding them all at the same time as part of a Corregidor 2-group horde list.
Also, another WOOT for CB listening to their players and putting out foot and mounted Yojimbo. That model is going to be a joy to paint!
Oh, and a minor boo for them re-doing the Hac Tao when the old models are just fine. We need new things or holes in other lines (like Birgada) filled, not redos of HI that have been biggershoulderpadized.
Ooh there's another sectoral coming up that can use Kaplans? Excellent!
I'm starting to become torn between ice storm +/- penny and bolt, vs filling out my Bakunin with riot grrls, morlocks, uberfallkommando, and getting the QK starter to chill with my Kaplans. Both options have roughly the same cost and head count (ordering pieces from MM, or getting bundle at gencon), guess it comes down to filling out my current groups or getting yet another faction.
That white stars faction sounds pretty neat too, bunch of the nastier mercs.
-Loki- wrote: I think Ghazi set a good precedent for boxes of units with limited options. They have precisely 2 loadouts - chain rifle or boarding shotgun. Two models in the box had those, and two were proxies.
They could do the same with Mobile Brigada. A HMG, a Boarding shotgun, and two proxies. Maybe an additional rifle and a single proxy. There's ways to do that box.
Just watched the design video from the BoW Icestorm week (and managed to get past the first minute this time, probably because warren wasn't oni t!). Looks like the MB profile is being updated to include a combi rifle profile as well. So they could do a box based on the unreleased profiles combi, BS and HMG maybe with an additional combi or 'proxy'.
-Loki- wrote: I think Ghazi set a good precedent for boxes of units with limited options. They have precisely 2 loadouts - chain rifle or boarding shotgun. Two models in the box had those, and two were proxies.
They could do the same with Mobile Brigada. A HMG, a Boarding shotgun, and two proxies. Maybe an additional rifle and a single proxy. There's ways to do that box.
Just watched the design video from the BoW Icestorm week (and managed to get past the first minute this time, probably because warren wasn't oni t!). Looks like the MB profile is being updated to include a combi rifle profile as well. So they could do a box based on the unreleased profiles combi, BS and HMG maybe with an additional combi or 'proxy'.
Going by the Mobile Brigada in the starter, that would be one badass box set.
it would probably also cost as much as a TAG due to having 4 enormous HI in it.
-Loki- wrote: I think Ghazi set a good precedent for boxes of units with limited options. They have precisely 2 loadouts - chain rifle or boarding shotgun. Two models in the box had those, and two were proxies.
They could do the same with Mobile Brigada. A HMG, a Boarding shotgun, and two proxies. Maybe an additional rifle and a single proxy. There's ways to do that box.
Just watched the design video from the BoW Icestorm week (and managed to get past the first minute this time, probably because warren wasn't oni t!). Looks like the MB profile is being updated to include a combi rifle profile as well. So they could do a box based on the unreleased profiles combi, BS and HMG maybe with an additional combi or 'proxy'.
Going by the Mobile Brigada in the starter, that would be one badass box set.
it would probably also cost as much as a TAG due to having 4 enormous HI in it.
Similarly, I'm guessing the Antipode box coming next month is gonna be quite expensive, they're pretty big chunks of metal.
Savnock wrote: I would like to take this opportunity to point out that the Alguacile models in Icestorm are a really, really good redo of the ones that were in the old boxset (based on the same concept art). I'm looking forward to fielding them all at the same time as part of a Corregidor 2-group horde list.
Also, another WOOT for CB listening to their players and putting out foot and mounted Yojimbo. That model is going to be a joy to paint!
Oh, and a minor boo for them re-doing the Hac Tao when the old models are just fine. We need new things or holes in other lines (like Birgada) filled, not redos of HI that have been biggershoulderpadized.
I wish they'd redo the Securitate model. That model holds a special place in my heart for being the first Infinity figure I painted because it's the only one I had my hands on at the time.
Indeed the improvements are amazing, I love the old compared to new, it shows how long CB has improved, on something that looked great back then.
I should add that I have no issue in somebody criticizing Infinity, especially constructive criticism, but a constant negativity without a real suggestion kinda gets wearing after a protracted time period.
So for those of you with better attention to detail...
I know the 6 models from each faction will become their new nilla starters. Eventually.
The CSU, do we assume now is the only chance ever to obtain her?
Do we know if the father knight or reverend healer are going to be sold at retail separately, eventually? I'd like to get the healer to fill out my observance roster.
Father-knight and Reverend Healer are exclusive to the set and will not be released outside of it, CSU is exclusive for preorder and will not be available outside of preorder.
PsychoticStorm wrote: Father-knight and Reverend Healer are exclusive to the set and will not be released outside of it, CSU is exclusive for preorder and will not be available outside of preorder.
Those specific sculpts, that is. I think it's pretty much guaranteed that there will be other sculpts of those units as time passes.
PsychoticStorm wrote: Father-knight and Reverend Healer are exclusive to the set and will not be released outside of it, CSU is exclusive for preorder and will not be available outside of preorder.
Those specific sculpts, that is. I think it's pretty much guaranteed that there will be other sculpts of those units as time passes.
That was my take on it as well. Those versions are unique, but given they are creating profiles for both, and the design video that appeared on beasts of war yesterday showed several weapon loadouts for each as well, I'm guessing that there will be models for both.
Having said that, at ebay prices, anyone could end up paying £40/$60+ just to get the reverent healer and the CSU, and so for me if someone wants a couple or all three of the exclusives, buying the whole set is a no brainer.
Let me start by saying that the event was magnificent. Esbozos, Vigo has gathered an incredible amount of prizes, among them a 1:1 Spitfire replica made by Artyfakes. The Vigo tournaments are among the biggest Infinity events in the world, rivalled only by Granada and Barcelona in terms of the amount of players attending.
This year we had 80 players, which meant 40 tables. That unfortunately meant that some tables were more sparse than we’d like, and some of the players, especially those outside of Spain, were not prepared for that. However, this was more than made up for by the positive attitude of all parties involved.
Another interesting thing was the pace. There was only 1 hour and 30 minutes for each game, which meant that you’d have to be moving and thinking very fast in order to make it under the time limit. It’s something that I liked a lot, as it made the game feel more cinematic and more dynamic. There was no time to waste arguing LoFs or Covers. My opponents were very agreeable in that regard.
The foreign players included me, Ian/IJW from Britain, Andreas from Norway, Ivan from Russia, Konstantions from Greece and 2 guys from Warsenal and 2 more from the Krug podcast (“Hello!”). I’m pretty sure there were some more “extranjeros” but I haven’t had the pleasure of talking to all the people on the tournament.
We have received a very warm welcome, some of us having travelled thousands of kilometers from our respective countries. Personally, I was staying in Madrid for the week before the tournament and have had the pleasure of driving to Vigo (some 450 kilometers) in the car of Bardulf, along with his friend Aljo, a very friendly Warcor pair from Madrid. I’ve used the website form to contact them, and although the road was very long, it was very nice as it gave me the possibility of exchanging views about Warcoring in different countries.
The event itself: CB staff was present almost in its entirety. I’ve had the pleasure of talking to most of them and they’re very open and positive people. Gutierr is a treasure trove for any Infinity fluff fan. I was able to get some interesting stuff from him, especially regarding Tohaa, but that’s something I’ll probably describe in an article on Data Sphere. A mini-interview, authorized by the spring from which the Infinity background comes.
5 rounds over 2 days and 80 players meant, that you couldn’t be sure about your standings until the ery end. We know Dexter from Krug podcast was the leader on day one, but he got overtaken by some local players on day 2. In our tournaments, not maxing your points, or at least not going straight “sevens” usually means the top is out of your reach. Here, after getting only 12 points from 3 games on day one, I was still able to make it 9th with 29 points after day 2.
The Seminar:
Fausto was talking about his sculpting times with CB. He’s responsible for , i.a, O-Yoroi, Phoenix, Penthesilea, Karpal Singh and the Morat redesign, where he had a free hand in updating the look of the sectorial. He’s a traditional sculptor who went 3D. He presented how he created models, first doing ragdolls, then putting armour on them, etc. so that they all keep the same size, unless Cb doesn’t want them to (New Father Knight was on purpose made beefier than regular dudes, CB mentioned “heroic” scale in regard to him)
New photos:
Ghulam (Sniper, ML and Hacker – Sniper redesign for Haqq, so it looks like SSD Dragunov, and a special hacker backpack)
Terracota Soldier – basic HI grunt for the Invincible sectorial, probably around 30 poins (just my speculation)
4 art pieces that didn’t make it to the Art Book – Penthe vs Aragoto, The Wall in Ariadna, manned by Minutemen, Class differences in Yu Jing (pronounced Dschu Dsching by Gutierr, in case anyone wondered) society and an EI structure.
Some quotes from Bostria:
“Some photos (of the starter, that we see in the seminar) are shopped to put in more scenery. Miniatures are not shopped. We have Angel Giraldez for that.”
“We have to tone down our ideas. Keep coolest designs for coolest units” (regarding Father Knight and his Over 9000 coolness factor)
“Trauma Doc Remake, because we wanted to”
We were shown sales figures. 4 Dire Foes made it to the top 10, along with O-Yoroi and Myrmidons, some very old boxes. CB said they’re surprised that these particular boxes sell so well, when talking about the TAG and the Myrms.
Yojimbo on foot and with Bike.
Jannisarry HMG (Bostria: “That’s the kind of remake no one expects. But we release it anyway”) – New HMG design for Haqqi.
Dogwarriors, packed in boxes of 4 (If I understood correctly,I suffered from a little Information overload) – 2 guys and 2 werewolves in each.
Kutail, a new Symbiont+Holo 2 Tohaa guy. Said to have some “Other cool tricks, too”
Warcor with a camera drone.
Great Warcor pins that will be available to all the warcors via the store soon.
Cosplay and Trivia contest featured as well. Cosplay had some remarkable costumes, such as a mini-Joe Scarface or a true Caledonian cosplayed by a user called “Bala perdida”, with no underpants on. How do we know? Don’t ask.
Some trivia questions were trivial some were tough. Examples include: “ If a Kozak sniper shoots from 37 inches vs an Agema Mk12 in cover and rolls 13,12,7 and the Agema rolls 9, what happens.” Or “Which of the following TAGs is of Pan-O manufacture.” Or “Which model does this element belong to”.
Interesting gameplay information, apart from the Kebab and King Kong tactics includes:
Warcors are ITS legal units, at least until Palanka says otherwise.
Interestingly, first Classifieds are rolled and only then are lists chosen.
New bootleg ideas, thrown around the table included a “Tohaa Delegate assaulted by hentai-tentacles” or “Atalanta vs Soap, Bath”. I wouldn’t get my hopes too high about those two, though.
Regarding Icestorm: 5 thousand copies now, and after they run out (Bostria predicted end of the year) they’ll do another run, without the CSU. All the rest of the things should be still in, not certain about the dice.
We’ve seen some other things, but been asked to keep them secret for the time being. They will be revealed in time, but so far, the 3rd edition is looking to be the bomb.
I’ve also seen the internal testing table in CB. Check it out:
The room was a sports hall, with no A/C. That’s why I’m wearing such a fancy linen shirt on Day 2. Otherwise, I’d be sweating like a pig, like what happened on Day 1.
Sorry for the lack of illustration in between the wall of texts, but I am currently busy with some other things.
Here's the album to the photos taken during the event, though. You can use them to illiustrate what I wrote.:
Alkasyn wrote: Let me start by saying that the event was magnificent. Esbozos, Vigo has gathered an incredible amount of prizes, among them a 1:1 Spitfire replica made by Artyfakes. The Vigo tournaments are among the biggest Infinity events in the world, rivalled only by Granada and Barcelona in terms of the amount of players attending.
This year we had 80 players, which meant 40 tables. That unfortunately meant that some tables were more sparse than we’d like, and some of the players, especially those outside of Spain, were not prepared for that. However, this was more than made up for by the positive attitude of all parties involved.
Another interesting thing was the pace. There was only 1 hour and 30 minutes for each game, which meant that you’d have to be moving and thinking very fast in order to make it under the time limit. It’s something that I liked a lot, as it made the game feel more cinematic and more dynamic. There was no time to waste arguing LoFs or Covers. My opponents were very agreeable in that regard.
The foreign players included me, Ian/IJW from Britain, Andreas from Norway, Ivan from Russia, Konstantions from Greece and 2 guys from Warsenal and 2 more from the Krug podcast (“Hello!”). I’m pretty sure there were some more “extranjeros” but I haven’t had the pleasure of talking to all the people on the tournament.
We have received a very warm welcome, some of us having travelled thousands of kilometers from our respective countries. Personally, I was staying in Madrid for the week before the tournament and have had the pleasure of driving to Vigo (some 450 kilometers) in the car of Bardulf, along with his friend Aljo, a very friendly Warcor pair from Madrid. I’ve used the website form to contact them, and although the road was very long, it was very nice as it gave me the possibility of exchanging views about Warcoring in different countries.
The event itself: CB staff was present almost in its entirety. I’ve had the pleasure of talking to most of them and they’re very open and positive people. Gutierr is a treasure trove for any Infinity fluff fan. I was able to get some interesting stuff from him, especially regarding Tohaa, but that’s something I’ll probably describe in an article on Data Sphere. A mini-interview, authorized by the spring from which the Infinity background comes.
5 rounds over 2 days and 80 players meant, that you couldn’t be sure about your standings until the ery end. We know Dexter from Krug podcast was the leader on day one, but he got overtaken by some local players on day 2. In our tournaments, not maxing your points, or at least not going straight “sevens” usually means the top is out of your reach. Here, after getting only 12 points from 3 games on day one, I was still able to make it 9th with 29 points after day 2.
The Seminar:
Fausto was talking about his sculpting times with CB. He’s responsible for , i.a, O-Yoroi, Phoenix, Penthesilea, Karpal Singh and the Morat redesign, where he had a free hand in updating the look of the sectorial. He’s a traditional sculptor who went 3D. He presented how he created models, first doing ragdolls, then putting armour on them, etc. so that they all keep the same size, unless Cb doesn’t want them to (New Father Knight was on purpose made beefier than regular dudes, CB mentioned “heroic” scale in regard to him)
New photos:
Ghulam (Sniper, ML and Hacker – Sniper redesign for Haqq, so it looks like SSD Dragunov, and a special hacker backpack)
Terracota Soldier – basic HI grunt for the Invincible sectorial, probably around 30 poins (just my speculation)
4 art pieces that didn’t make it to the Art Book – Penthe vs Aragoto, The Wall in Ariadna, manned by Minutemen, Class differences in Yu Jing (pronounced Dschu Dsching by Gutierr, in case anyone wondered) society and an EI structure.
Some quotes from Bostria:
“Some photos (of the starter, that we see in the seminar) are shopped to put in more scenery. Miniatures are not shopped. We have Angel Giraldez for that.”
“We have to tone down our ideas. Keep coolest designs for coolest units” (regarding Father Knight and his Over 9000 coolness factor)
“Trauma Doc Remake, because we wanted to”
We were shown sales figures. 4 Dire Foes made it to the top 10, along with O-Yoroi and Myrmidons, some very old boxes. CB said they’re surprised that these particular boxes sell so well, when talking about the TAG and the Myrms.
Yojimbo on foot and with Bike.
Jannisarry HMG (Bostria: “That’s the kind of remake no one expects. But we release it anyway”) – New HMG design for Haqqi.
Dogwarriors, packed in boxes of 4 (If I understood correctly,I suffered from a little Information overload) – 2 guys and 2 werewolves in each.
Kutail, a new Symbiont+Holo 2 Tohaa guy. Said to have some “Other cool tricks, too”
Warcor with a camera drone.
Great Warcor pins that will be available to all the warcors via the store soon.
Cosplay and Trivia contest featured as well. Cosplay had some remarkable costumes, such as a mini-Joe Scarface or a true Caledonian cosplayed by a user called “Bala perdida”, with no underpants on. How do we know? Don’t ask.
Some trivia questions were trivial some were tough. Examples include: “ If a Kozak sniper shoots from 37 inches vs an Agema Mk12 in cover and rolls 13,12,7 and the Agema rolls 9, what happens.” Or “Which of the following TAGs is of Pan-O manufacture.” Or “Which model does this element belong to”.
Interesting gameplay information, apart from the Kebab and King Kong tactics includes:
Warcors are ITS legal units, at least until Palanka says otherwise.
Interestingly, first Classifieds are rolled and only then are lists chosen.
New bootleg ideas, thrown around the table included a “Tohaa Delegate assaulted by hentai-tentacles” or “Atalanta vs Soap, Bath”. I wouldn’t get my hopes too high about those two, though.
Regarding Icestorm: 5 thousand copies now, and after they run out (Bostria predicted end of the year) they’ll do another run, without the CSU. All the rest of the things should be still in, not certain about the dice.
We’ve seen some other things, but been asked to keep them secret for the time being. They will be revealed in time, but so far, the 3rd edition is looking to be the bomb.
I’ve also seen the internal testing table in CB. Check it out:
The room was a sports hall, with no A/C. That’s why I’m wearing such a fancy linen shirt on Day 2. Otherwise, I’d be sweating like a pig, like what happened on Day 1.
Sorry for the lack of illustration in between the wall of texts, but I am currently busy with some other things.
Here's the album to the photos taken during the event, though. You can use them to illiustrate what I wrote.:
Also, lifted from my New England Infinity mailing list:
JD wrote:So, Beasts of War has a video talking about some of the changes to camo in 3rd edition
- attacks made from camoflague are no longer normal roles, they are now face to face rolls. Apparently this rule in 2nd edition caused to many issues with changing the tempo/timing of the game. However, there is now an additional -3 modifier to the ARO roll for being "suprised". So, for example, a TO camo troop revealing himself and shooting at an enemy who shoots back in ARO is being hit on a base -9 (-6 for TO camo and -3 for surpise), -12 if that TO camo trooper is in cover
- no matter how many modifiers are being stacked, no shot will have modifiers greater than +12 or -12, those are the max. So no revealing (-3 for surpise) a TO camo cutter (-6 for TO camo) in cover (-3) at the back of the board (long range -6) to have the target ARO at -18. Its capped at -12. Not huge, but its something.
- the F2F roll for a revealed camo trooper is important when dealing with template weapons (chain rifles, chain colts, flame throwers) as these don't make face to face rolls and ignore the surprise and camo penalties, so camo troops don't want to reveal themselves close to troops with template weapons.
That's a bit of a change - but definitely easier to explain.
It is a fundamental change that changes the whole game for the best, it also unifies the active and reactive rules, the modifiers cap is also a nice touch many should appreciate.
is it a cumulative cap, or a cap on the total you can subtract/add.
ex: Shooting at guy with TO camo, through smoke.
shooting through smoke: -6 BS shooting at TO camo target: -6BS
combat camo: -3BS
---------------------------------------------------
-15BS
Now also say I'm using a combi rifle at 12".
Combi Rifle at med range: +3 BS
Do I apply the cap to all the negative modifiers first? So my -15BS goes down to -12BS, then add +3BS for range, to get -9BS final?
OR
Does this cap apply to all possible modifiers? In this case it would ultimately be -12BS?
In short does this mean the best or worst bonus you can have is +12BS or -12BS respectively? or does it mean we apply the cap somewhere earlier in the accounting process?
Likely a question for the rules page, but this is potentially a significant change!
Comparing the old with the new ones I definitely see the improvement over the years and especially in the more heavy armoured figures. The old basic, light infantry still looks pretty nice to me.
if they're factions you like get it, it's a good deal
if you're not interested in the factions then waiting won't hurt, as the scenery is coming on it's own,
and if this does well there may well be different boxes in the future, although from the BoW video interview it may not be as simple as that as they wanted the starter to be ultra simple, to the point of not considering factions that didn't let them do a simple 2 colour (ie red/blue) set,
so from the sound of it factions requiring complex mix/camo colours will not show up in such a set as they risk confusing a total beginner
The reason I mention first of "many" is from their website. Where it says This year CB will heat the summer with the release of its FIRST Battle Pack! (bolded for obvious hopeful referal)
I`m hoping for more. Hell i`d likely buy each of them given time but may or may not pick up the first one depending on availability and what not
Pre-ordered from Element Games just now. Bad timing with the DKQ from Mantic but I'll manage. I'll just stay in for a few weekends and paint!
Initially I'm going to spray the Nomads Red and Pan O Blue, to trick 'normal' people in to thinking it's an ordinary board game... Then the indoctrination begins.
JD wrote:So, Beasts of War has a video talking about some of the changes to camo in 3rd edition
- attacks made from camoflague are no longer normal roles, they are now face to face rolls. Apparently this rule in 2nd edition caused to many issues with changing the tempo/timing of the game. However, there is now an additional -3 modifier to the ARO roll for being "suprised". So, for example, a TO camo troop revealing himself and shooting at an enemy who shoots back in ARO is being hit on a base -9 (-6 for TO camo and -3 for surpise), -12 if that TO camo trooper is in cover
- no matter how many modifiers are being stacked, no shot will have modifiers greater than +12 or -12, those are the max. So no revealing (-3 for surpise) a TO camo cutter (-6 for TO camo) in cover (-3) at the back of the board (long range -6) to have the target ARO at -18. Its capped at -12. Not huge, but its something.
- the F2F roll for a revealed camo trooper is important when dealing with template weapons (chain rifles, chain colts, flame throwers) as these don't make face to face rolls and ignore the surprise and camo penalties, so camo troops don't want to reveal themselves close to troops with template weapons.
That's a bit of a change - but definitely easier to explain.
I'm wondering how this affects camo attacks in ARO: do ARO camo attacks get the extra -3 modifier for surprise?
That would definitely help balance out the major drawbacks of your opponent getting shots back at you.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Regarding the "evolution" of the minis and sculpting: The faces and weapons are way better. And the detail is amazing.
However I really don't care for the elements that have been added in, many of which are pretty typical "macho/heroic" sculpting style elements that other games have already overdone (GW/PW) and which I loved CB for leaving out.
These include:
-big shoulderpads;
-everyone being a bodybuilder;
-powerarmor suits with skinny little legs that a human couldn't fit inside;
-backpacks on everyone, probably to bulk them up.
-less crouching poses, more static "I'm a bodybuilder rraagh" poses
-squarish armor
IMO the last issue is the most serious: the rounded, Shirow-inspired aesthetic of the best older models has been left behind rather than refined. CB would be much better served making their digital sculptors get better at making anatomically correct sculpts and distinct rounded shapes, which will make them look less like everyone else's products. They are losing both a lovely aestethic and one of their competitive advantages.
Don't get me wrong, I still love the figs. The new Alguaciles are amazing. But the Fusiliers' over-fed/over-equipped look is not good. Nor is the HI that a human can't actually fit inside of.
Having more squared off armor makes sense in a few cases. Like Haqqislam.
I for one don't mind more troops wearing backpacks, either. The old Fusiliers, for example, were seriously lacking in equipment. Where were they keeping spare magazines for those huge guns?
And, to be fair, the legs (and arms) being way to skinny on the power armor has always been an issue. How is anyone supposed to actually fit into the Wu Ming or the newer Janissary armor?
Speaking of, I'm loving the new redesigns. I'm not sure why they seem to be updating the basic Ghulam designs along with the specialists, but they look good. So does the new HMG Janissary. I'm not a fan of the skinnier PA for the Janissaries, but it works out great for the Ahl Fassed, which is what I'll be using him as.
Also interesting that they're redesigning the Hac Tao again. The HMG version was already a slight redesign of the Multi-Rifle version. I'm surprised they're not going to just stick with that version.
IMO the last issue is the most serious: the rounded, Shirow-inspired aesthetic of the best older models has been left behind rather than refined. CB would be much better served making their digital sculptors get better at making anatomically correct sculpts and distinct rounded shapes, which will make them look less like everyone else's products. They are losing both a lovely aestethic and one of their competitive advantages.
This depends on the aesthetic they want for the faction. As mentioned, it works for Haqqislam. In the art book, they said they wanted them to look high tech, but more utilitarian high tech, not the sleek and expensive high tech of Pan Oceania and Yu Jing.
This resulted in the more angular armour we saw starting with the Jannisary redesign in the starter, as opposed to the rounded-to-the-point-of-looking-anti-aliased remotes and Maghariba Guard. Also the addition of enough pouches to make Rob Leifield jealous on some units, like the Muyibs.
Is that 1-10 list the best sellers? Though there's no Penthesilea who was apparently the best selling ever, or is it within a specific time period?
First of all its a list of top ten boxes not blisters, from what I remember it includes boxes that have at least older than 6 months to clear out the new releases spikes from their data.
Regarding the "evolution" of the minis and sculpting: The faces and weapons are way better. And the detail is amazing.
However I really don't care for the elements that have been added in, many of which are pretty typical "macho/heroic" sculpting style elements that other games have already overdone (GW/PW) and which I loved CB for leaving out.
These include:
-big shoulderpads;
-everyone being a bodybuilder;
-powerarmor suits with skinny little legs that a human couldn't fit inside;
-backpacks on everyone, probably to bulk them up.
-less crouching poses, more static "I'm a bodybuilder rraagh" poses
-squarish armor
IMO the last issue is the most serious: the rounded, Shirow-inspired aesthetic of the best older models has been left behind rather than refined. CB would be much better served making their digital sculptors get better at making anatomically correct sculpts and distinct rounded shapes, which will make them look less like everyone else's products. They are losing both a lovely aestethic and one of their competitive advantages.
Don't get me wrong, I still love the figs. The new Alguaciles are amazing. But the Fusiliers' over-fed/over-equipped look is not good. Nor is the HI that a human can't actually fit inside of.
CB can do better than this, and I hope they will.
I do not get the big shouderpads comment as the pic illustrates, there has been no significant change in the shoulderpad ratio from almost 10 years ago to now.
It is logical to have a well developed body in miniatures that represent a professional soldier and the fact that everybody commented on the lack of webbing on normal troops when dire foes appeared with webbing is the real reason on why the new models appear with backpacks not to "bulk up the models", now not all factions share the same aesthetics, some are more round, some are more squarish, depending on faction.
Is that 1-10 list the best sellers? Though there's no Penthesilea who was apparently the best selling ever, or is it within a specific time period?
First of all its a list of top ten boxes not blisters, from what I remember it includes boxes that have at least older than 6 months to clear out the new releases spikes from their data.
For anybody who has not seen it, and thanks to Alkasyn
Cajas Top 10 ventas= Boxes Top ten sales. Lovin' the Spanglish there. La Real Academia Española is dispatching operatives to Vigo even as I type
Your box came in 4th, PS. Good show. I guess the GoT theme to Fleeting Alliance really helped that box. Sadly, Angus's box is not up there. Poor Angus
With that one, you basically get 2 PanO as the 'civvie' is still a Fusilier. Maybe a significant number of sales are to do with what civvie model there is?
Though maybe it could be game effects too. Oda is quite good, maybe that's true for the other popular DF boxes?
Which boxes would one expect to be popular? the O-Yoroi is what drew my attention to Infinity so maybe that's why it is up there? And biker girls seem popular too.
Savnock wrote: ... Nor is the HI that a human can't actually fit inside of.
The digitally sculpted HI are designed by starting with the same human dolly that's used for that faction's LI and adding on extra layers of armour on top of the LI and MI designs. In other words, all the new HI actually have a human inside.
There's some mention of this in the BoW 'Designing Operation Icestorm' video but the seminar at the Interplanetary went into more depth.
I sort of agree with the roundedness compared to more crisp-edged new designs, but apparently that's to make the models nicer to paint and to help distinguish the separate elements of each design. Kneepads on the fusiliers were given as an example, the transition from fabric on the thigh to the kneepad was accentuated to make it clearer that it's two different materials.
like Bolts, Bipandra will have more sense in v3 ... i hope
Bipandra is a nice mini but not competitive imo PanO dont waste order to heal they kill stuff
that 10 box list is very strange, ALEPH support pack ? oO there must be a lot of ALEPH player
About Bipandra: in Neoterra, Fusiliers are AVA 5. One of the link dies, you simply replace him with Bipandra. Also very useful when link members go down. Really, I'm *perfectly* happy paying that 0.5 SWC for Bipandra - it's a great unit.
Also, WIP 13; that's 65% likely to heal, vs 75% for a really, really good doc. TBH, I don't see why PanO shouldn't heal - when it's appropriate (as with all factions, ever). The times either my doc or my engineer got a crucial unit back on it's feet... I've lost count.
Bipandra is almost worth it just for the sixth fusilier (especially when playing an HMG, 2xML link, hehe) let alone the doc options. Also, specialist, so only 9|0.5 more expensive than the paramedic you want as a specialist anyway - so even outside of links, she's okay.
As for taking docs/mechanics in PanO: they're 4/5 pts more expensive than the cheapest (25mm-based) ordermonkeys you have. I find it easy to find a place in my lists for those. YMMV, but I find many players discount support staff for PanO more because it's somehow become forum gospel rather than on own experience.
Cool, shotguns sound pretty slick now, especially the combi or rifle plus light shotgun. I can maybe buy the range penalty on the sniper rifle.. hmg worse at close range seems odd though... i mean i see what they're doing for game balance, and i really like that, but it's i dunno less believable in some ways.
Certainly it looks to make the game look potentially more fun, which is totally cool. Which is how they explain it, they're not aiming as much for realism as playability, probably a good call.
Automatically Appended Next Post: As for taking paramedics and so on... even if they only had 10 wp, having a chance to get one of your dudes back up seems pretty... well, important. Plus all of that mission gobbledegook i don't understand yet.
I remember what you've said, you're willing to pay the SWC tax for NCA link team. I agree that you'll get more mileage in the link team, since you can also snatch objectives with her and the causalities will be right near her. Doctor has 60% to pass and Bipandra has 65%, honestly not making a difference. Outside of the sectorial... for now I can spend those points elsewhere and not regretting anything. YMMV indeed.
I run Doctor and Engineer on regular basis and they make a difference, though you wish you wouldn't need them. Doesn't change the fact they'll be the joke of every other player with gloriously superior WIP.
JD wrote:So, Beasts of War has a video talking about some of the changes to camo in 3rd edition
- attacks made from camoflague are no longer normal roles, they are now face to face rolls. Apparently this rule in 2nd edition caused to many issues with changing the tempo/timing of the game. However, there is now an additional -3 modifier to the ARO roll for being "suprised".So, for example, a TO camo troop revealing himself and shooting at an enemy who shoots back in ARO is being hit on a base -9 (-6 for TO camo and -3 for surpise), -12 if that TO camo trooper is in cover - no matter how many modifiers are being stacked, no shot will have modifiers greater than +12 or -12, those are the max. So no revealing (-3 for surpise) a TO camo cutter (-6 for TO camo) in cover (-3) at the back of the board (long range -6) to have the target ARO at -18. Its capped at -12. Not huge, but its something.
- the F2F roll for a revealed camo trooper is important when dealing with template weapons (chain rifles, chain colts, flame throwers) as these don't make face to face rolls and ignore the surprise and camo penalties, so camo troops don't want to reveal themselves close to troops with template weapons.
That's a bit of a change - but definitely easier to explain.
I'm wondering how this affects camo attacks in ARO: do ARO camo attacks get the extra -3 modifier for surprise?
That would definitely help balance out the major drawbacks of your opponent getting shots back at you.
I'm rather happy with the HMG getting a close range reduction. I mean you could argue that it's less maneuverable and easy to get snapped on a close range target, which is what things like the Sptifires are for.
But gameplay wise it means my HMG actually sits back and performs a proper supression/support fire role, allowing the 'lighter' equipped units to be more door to door.
So no more Nisse Rambo for me. Huzzah! Hexas you're back in the game.
Really like those changes. It will give some real choice in list building now. HMG's are no longer going to be the go to weapon for raking up kills at all ranges.
Boarding shotguns are going to be seeing a lot of use I think, especially amongst infiltrators and AD troops. Maybe even in backfield support troops to defend against said infiltrators and AD troops.
Corvus Belli wrote:In light of the intense clamor following our announcement of an imminent closure of the forum, the Corvus Belli team have decided to heed the voice of the Infinity community. This means the two Official Forums (international and Spanish-language) will remain open and active as official hubs for players and fans.
We at CB are moved by the reaction of the community, which demonstrates your concern for Infinity as a game and as a hobby whose dimension transcends the game table. That so many of you would feel so deeply involved with the Infinity universe and its community is immensely gratifying to us, as it reflects our own feelings about this game.
We initially felt that closing the forums was a regrettable but necessary decision, but your strong opposition has convinced us that we must find another way. The forums will remain open, but some technical readjustments will be forthcoming in order to guarantee the smooth running of the website despite its massive traffic.
Our reversal does not in any way mean that we withdraw our support of the data-sphere.net and infinitywarcors.com forums. On the contrary, we believe the Infinity community deserves quality alternate spaces to grow and communicate freely, and we will endeavor to provide these forums with all our help and support.
Additionally, we emphasize that the performance of data-sphere.net or infinitywarcors.com has not affected our decision. In fact, we apologize to them for this step back and appreciate the work they have been doing these past few weeks to welcome Infinity community.
Corvus Belli wrote:In light of the intense clamor following our announcement of an imminent closure of the forum, the Corvus Belli team have decided to heed the voice of the Infinity community. This means the two Official Forums (international and Spanish-language) will remain open and active as official hubs for players and fans.
We at CB are moved by the reaction of the community, which demonstrates your concern for Infinity as a game and as a hobby whose dimension transcends the game table. That so many of you would feel so deeply involved with the Infinity universe and its community is immensely gratifying to us, as it reflects our own feelings about this game.
We initially felt that closing the forums was a regrettable but necessary decision, but your strong opposition has convinced us that we must find another way. The forums will remain open, but some technical readjustments will be forthcoming in order to guarantee the smooth running of the website despite its massive traffic.
Our reversal does not in any way mean that we withdraw our support of the data-sphere.net and infinitywarcors.com forums. On the contrary, we believe the Infinity community deserves quality alternate spaces to grow and communicate freely, and we will endeavor to provide these forums with all our help and support.
Additionally, we emphasize that the performance of data-sphere.net or infinitywarcors.com has not affected our decision. In fact, we apologize to them for this step back and appreciate the work they have been doing these past few weeks to welcome Infinity community.
Chemical Cutthroat wrote: Why were they planning to close the forums in the first place? I must have been Internet-dead when this started up.
Judging from the post about it staying, it had something to do with the bandwidth and maintenance required for the forums was degrading the rest of their site.
Corvus Belli wrote:In light of the intense clamor following our announcement of an imminent closure of the forum, the Corvus Belli team have decided to heed the voice of the Infinity community. This means the two Official Forums (international and Spanish-language) will remain open and active as official hubs for players and fans.
We at CB are moved by the reaction of the community, which demonstrates your concern for Infinity as a game and as a hobby whose dimension transcends the game table. That so many of you would feel so deeply involved with the Infinity universe and its community is immensely gratifying to us, as it reflects our own feelings about this game.
We initially felt that closing the forums was a regrettable but necessary decision, but your strong opposition has convinced us that we must find another way. The forums will remain open, but some technical readjustments will be forthcoming in order to guarantee the smooth running of the website despite its massive traffic.
Our reversal does not in any way mean that we withdraw our support of the data-sphere.net and infinitywarcors.com forums. On the contrary, we believe the Infinity community deserves quality alternate spaces to grow and communicate freely, and we will endeavor to provide these forums with all our help and support.
Additionally, we emphasize that the performance of data-sphere.net or infinitywarcors.com has not affected our decision. In fact, we apologize to them for this step back and appreciate the work they have been doing these past few weeks to welcome Infinity community.
At first I didn't think the move to Datasphere was a particularly bad move, but then seeing how the relationship had apparently soured with some of the 3rd party suppliers, and (I have to be honest here) what appeared to be a little of 'Mugabe' syndrome on behalf of the Datasphere admins, I'm now quite glad that the official forums will stay open.
Hopefully some development will come in that regard, but good on CB in any case. Like they've said, nothing at all wrong with having multiple forums and it will surely help the community.
I do not get the big shouderpads comment as the pic illustrates, there has been no significant change in the shoulderpad ratio from almost 10 years ago to now.
Uhm, what? Those shoulderpads are clearly larger (especially on the horizontal, because the second layer/rim was expanded quite a bit both in bulk and in coverage). They are also placed way higher, which increases their visual impact on the miniature significantly. That ridiculous, topheavy placement is the thing that I least like about the new HI, and counteracts the best part about the hold HI (the non-macho/spacemarine shapes of the HI, and the clear influence of Shirow in making things fit to bodies).
Yeah, moar shoulderpads. That and the much-more-raised collar are really distasteful to me. I still like the sculpts overall, but the more-prominent and arger shoulderpads things is worrying because it has been an overdone element in so many other mini games (GW, Warzone, and the many derivatives).
It is logical to have a well developed body in miniatures that represent a professional soldier[...]
Most well-developed bodies and most professional soldiers do not look like bodybuilders with pecs and biceps the size of their heads. They look like people who run... y'know, like the bodies on older CB sculpts did. I really don't get why you're arguing this point: the new sculpts are clearly muscled-up to Stallone levels. If you're okay with that, just be okay with it- don't deny it.
[...]and the fact that everybody commented on the lack of webbing on normal troops when dire foes appeared with webbing is the real reason on why the new models appear with backpacks not to "bulk up the models", now not all factions share the same aesthetics, some are more round, some are more squarish, depending on faction.
There I can agree with you, and see your point. I do think the packs on the Fusiliers are too big, but the ones on the new Alguaciles are decently sized. Point taken, you're right.
Savnock wrote: ... Nor is the HI that a human can't actually fit inside of.
The digitally sculpted HI are designed by starting with the same human dolly that's used for that faction's LI and adding on extra layers of armour on top of the LI and MI designs. In other words, all the new HI actually have a human inside.
There's some mention of this in the BoW 'Designing Operation Icestorm' video but the seminar at the Interplanetary went into more depth.
Look at the pic of the two Orcs above. The new one... the human's waist would have to be waspishly tiny if the suit there is more than a couple centimeters thick. Same with their quads. And the hips.
Now look at the older sculpt. Thicker legs (so legs can fit inside), thicker midsection, slightly wider pelvis (and maybe slightly shorter torso, looks like). A human could actually fit inside.
I get that they start with a humanoid dolly underneath... but those proportions must be pretty supermodel. Not much chance that a 200-pound guy could fit his hips or legs inside that suit, especially if the myomer cables are as thick as they look.
I sort of agree with the roundedness compared to more crisp-edged new designs, but apparently that's to make the models nicer to paint and to help distinguish the separate elements of each design. Kneepads on the fusiliers were given as an example, the transition from fabric on the thigh to the kneepad was accentuated to make it clearer that it's two different materials.
Good point. I just think that a lot of us liked painting the rounded surfaces (harder for beginners, true), and will miss them if this sharp-angles style takes over. Like the pecs on the Orc above again, or the armor on the quads- much more fun surfaces to work with.
I'm wondering how this affects camo attacks in ARO: do ARO camo attacks get the extra -3 modifier for surprise?
That would definitely help balance out the major drawbacks of your opponent getting shots back at you.
Yes?
At least, as far as we know right now!
Thanks for the answer (even if it's just that they didn't rule out ARO camo attacks, which N2 does not include). Looks like camo snipers will be worth way, way more in the new edition. Here in the Seattle area we've played with very crowded tables because we have lots of great urban terrain (thanks to deflatermouse's terrain-building addiction), but in other metas with wide-open tables like Spain I bet sniper AROs make warbands and bikes less powerful in N3.
Shoulder pads are of the same height. Width is harder to judge because of the angle but judging from the ORC photos on the website, the new one might be a little wider but not incredibly so.
Savnock wrote: Uhm, what? Those shoulderpads are clearly larger (especially on the horizontal, because the second layer/rim was expanded quite a bit both in bulk and in coverage). They are also placed way higher, which increases their visual impact on the miniature significantly. That ridiculous, topheavy placement is the thing that I least like about the new HI, and counteracts the best part about the hold HI (the non-macho/spacemarine shapes of the HI, and the clear influence of Shirow in making things fit to bodies).
I don't have an old-style ORC, but I just looked at the new ORC arm next to a Montessa Knight and yes, the shoulderpads are bigger, but most of the visual difference is indeed from the position rather than the size.
Savnock wrote: ... Nor is the HI that a human can't actually fit inside of.
The digitally sculpted HI are designed by starting with the same human dolly that's used for that faction's LI and adding on extra layers of armour on top of the LI and MI designs. In other words, all the new HI actually have a human inside.
There's some mention of this in the BoW 'Designing Operation Icestorm' video but the seminar at the Interplanetary went into more depth.
Look at the pic of the two Orcs above. The new one... the human's waist would have to be waspishly tiny if the suit there is more than a couple centimeters thick. Same with their quads. And the hips.
Now look at the older sculpt. Thicker legs (so legs can fit inside), thicker midsection, slightly wider pelvis (and maybe slightly shorter torso, looks like). A human could actually fit inside.
I get that they start with a humanoid dolly underneath... but those proportions must be pretty supermodel. Not much chance that a 200-pound guy could fit his hips or legs inside that suit, especially if the myomer cables are as thick as they look.
It's the same dolly as the Fusiliers, which are slightly idealised but decidedly not supermodels.
The waists on the two models in the photo are identical, pretty much down to the pixel. I think you're getting visually misled on this one, partly by the old ORC's gun butt sitting into the waist area.
Spoiler:
Take a look at the old female ORC and the Swiss ML:
I do wish to see some tweaks to the units. Some appear to be absolute bananas, such as Riot Grrls (MSV and access to wide area of different weapons), Loup Garous, Karakuri are also woow. So wish all my Kamau had X-visor now.
Overall seems nice, yet to find some clear synergy in my PanO, but if they find a way to make a CC a viable alternative as opposed to shooting with a hand pistol at close range. I dare to say it will make PanO fun to play, as long they don't go overboard with hackers and PanO Knights will actually be worth the title of CC specialist.
Quick mention on the Dire Foes. Really mixed bag, Konstantinos, Yuriko, Anyat, Thrasymedes and Keesan are popular in general or specific. I haven't seen a list anywhere with Isobel, Yasbir tends to be overlooked (small community but not seeing any interest from on-line forums though I find him really great), Bipandra is where it is and so on. I can say that those civilians I've ordered from Shae are top notch too.
Also of note, just how TINY models are, male or female. When they're not wearing any armor... well, here's my engineer I was fiddling with.
Spoiler:
That head might as well make him Dr. Billy Quizboy.
And besides, PanO is one of the highest tech factions. Their Heavy Infantry are likely to be slimmer and trimmer than say my Az'rael or the Mobile Brigada. And just look at the few HI that Ariadna get. I mean the Tank Hunters are MI and they're superbulked out.
Everyone is crying because the old PanO models were the best of the old guard. The old ORC is a classic model, but they want to release a box in keeping with modern refined sculpts.
Now look at the Yu Jing invincibles, the new vs old Hsien, the thunder thighs Guija. Nobody cries when the ugly puppies get put to sleep.
Speaking of which!
Any chance for a Guija resculpt? That thing is such a fattie. Would it be in the new Yu Jing sectorial?
Anybody seen new invincibles? will that unit cease to exist & be replaced by new terra cotta fellows?
Anything on a new Shang Ji? I love the unit & the model is dope, but we could use more poses & loadouts.
Most well-developed bodies and most professional soldiers do not look like bodybuilders with pecs and biceps the size of their heads. They look like people who run... y'know, like the bodies on older CB sculpts did. I really don't get why you're arguing this point: the new sculpts are clearly muscled-up to Stallone levels. If you're okay with that, just be okay with it- don't deny it.
Most well-developed bodies and most professional soldiers do not look like bodybuilders with pecs and biceps the size of their heads. They look like people who run... y'know, like the bodies on older CB sculpts did. I really don't get why you're arguing this point: the new sculpts are clearly muscled-up to Stallone levels. If you're okay with that, just be okay with it- don't deny it.
Can we move this flame war off the news & rumor thread?
It's no longer news that some like the older designs. Make a new thread to nitpick how wiry or musclebound stuff ought to be.
Alpharius wrote: However, I hope this means that they're thinking about moderating their forums a bit...more...now too?
Agreed. It's a good source of news if you can sort through the gifs and talk of international cuisine in the news threads, but the personal snipes tend to turn into compelete thread derailing bitchfests, and the culture there has changed over just the last year from being quite welcoming of new people and ideas into a toxic quagmire of attitudes that have semingly been brought over from other game communities.
They really need a few full time, even volunteer, moderators to cut through the gak and get the forum on track again.
Remember guys, we have a whole forum for general discussion now, and I think when we are getting down to the specifics of arguing if one shoulder pad or another is bigger by a matter of pixels, we have probably moved off of the news and rumours side of things to the general discussion side of things.
Sorry for derailing. I see the points most of your make about HI, especially IJW (good illustration, thanks). Still disagree about the LI but I'll start a thread for that if the trend continues when the next round of new LI come out.
Back on-topic, was there any mention of missile launchers in the new ranges vid? Can't watch right now, just wondering if the stuff discussed in the chart is all we know.
Also, Bladerunner2019, hilarious fat-shaming of an inanimate object. Almost spit my soda out. That said, most of us who were Appleseed fans love that sculpt.
Yeah aren't there quite a few weapons.. like the odd smg and such?
I wonder if the -3 modifier on the hmg makes the pistol more viable at close range to shoot down someone trying to charge you? 6 better to hit than the hmg... but 4 worse damage, and no special ammo loaded generally. Hmm.
I doubt it. These are the most common weapons in the game. There are more changes to come. Ammo will be getting changes too. CB has really done good work with N3. The book can't release soon enough. And All the profile updates.
Red Harvest wrote: I doubt it. These are the most common weapons in the game. There are more changes to come. Ammo will be getting changes too. CB has really done good work with N3. The book can't release soon enough. And All the profile updates.
There is Friday's BoW video too.
Seriously CB. I will dutifully buy your rule book and operation: icestorm.
Give us the Army list & rules PDFs so we can start playing already
Bought mine at Warstore yesterday. In before the hike, booyah!
Bladerunner2019, I'd be in the same crowd buying rules but want them NOW.
But CB are smart digital businessfolks, and sadly the lesson of digital product release is to put the hardcopy or whatever out a couple months before, then release the free digital rules. Gives those of us who would buy the object but could be lazy just a little more incentive to get off our butts and give our financial support to the company.
I've seen similar with music albums from smart labels: It's why vinyl releases often lead digital ones by a month or two. Not too long or someone will bootleg off the vinyl, but just long enough that the hardcore fans can't stand it and buy the object/album/book/whatever.
GrimDork wrote: Yeah aren't there quite a few weapons.. like the odd smg and such?
Just a few, yes.
Spoiler:
2nd edition range bands:
Previewed N3 range bands:
Assuming nothing gets split up (for example HMGs and MLs getting different bands) that's only about a third of the guns. It's very much the most common third though.
The Operation:Icestorm release is very important for Infinity, and their contents (2 starter packs) affects directly to other references in our catalogue. The following references will be discontinued:
Koni wrote: The Operation:Icestorm release is very important for Infinity, and their contents (2 starter packs) affects directly to other references in our catalogue. The following references will be discontinued:
Koni wrote: The Operation:Icestorm release is very important for Infinity, and their contents (2 starter packs) affects directly to other references in our catalogue. The following references will be discontinued:
Red Harvest wrote: Koni, while you're here... When will the N3 Quick Starter Rules be available for us who can't get a copy of Ravage en Espanol?
People that has bought the magazine is pretty upset about the content. Seems that it doesn't contain the QSR, but pretty much what w have already seen in BoW this week.
@Koni Expect the unexpected... Operation : Heatwave, containing all the other minis. Nailed it.
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JD wrote:So was watching another demo game on Beasts of War, and got some tidbits.
1) Apparently to represent their "servo muscles", most heavy infantry will move 4-4 instead of 4-2 now. Medium infantry move 4-2 to represent the fact that they have armor, but none of the "mechanical advantage" of power armor to support the weight. Nice boost to heavy infantry (some needed it, others didn't), but not sure the MIs needed any further disadvantage in this game. My only question on this is, what about heavy infantry like Guarda De Assaulto and Aswira that already had 4-4 to represent their speed? Will they jump to 6-4 like a tag?
2) The Grenzer is apparently armor 3, BS13
3) Reverend healer has mimetism, armor3, Doctor
Good of you to post the new miniature pics here Knight, but can I ask why you spoilered them?
They look awesome anyone and I don't think are too dissimilar from the existing range - hopefully they should slot in nicely alongside the ones I already have painted up!
I think Alpharious asked a while ago to put spoilers on pictures, maybe mixing it up with something.
CA players love Exrah! Others simply loathe the hideous almost immortal bugs they are.
Quick recap:
MSV 1 - we already know it's -3 for ODD and TO. MSV 2 - stays the same. MSV 3 - needs to discover camouflage markers before he or she can shot them. However his or her attempt is always successful. In addition he or she doesn't apply Surprise shot! penalty. Ignores all other camouflage penalties as now.
AD3 - in case of PH failure you scatter 16" no matter how much you failed. (Yikes!)
Infiltration - in case of infiltrating over your half of the table you always roll PH-3 test. Should you fail you need to deploy it in your usual deployment zone. (This one is actually nice and beneficial for infiltrators).
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JD wrote:So was watching another demo game on Beasts of War, and got some tidbits.
1) Apparently to represent their "servo muscles", most heavy infantry will move 4-4 instead of 4-2 now. Medium infantry move 4-2 to represent the fact that they have armor, but none of the "mechanical advantage" of power armor to support the weight. Nice boost to heavy infantry (some needed it, others didn't), but not sure the MIs needed any further disadvantage in this game. My only question on this is, what about heavy infantry like Guarda De Assaulto and Aswira that already had 4-4 to represent their speed? Will they jump to 6-4 like a tag?
2) The Grenzer is apparently armor 3, BS13
3) Reverend healer has mimetism, armor3, Doctor
Interesting!
Do we have a link were that 4-4 HI is coming from. I can see the plain no frills HI becoming 4-4 as they need some thing to bring them up to the level other HI units. But, most HI already have it pretty damn good.
Knight wrote: I think Alpharious asked a while ago to put spoilers on pictures, maybe mixing it up with something.
I believe that was only for quotes/repeats of pictures that were already posted in the same thread? Basically because you would have a string of about 10 photos, then exactly the same thing again underneath in quotes with the addition of 'Wow awesome!' as a comment
Kanluwen wrote: The 4-4 on HI is coming from people who have their copies of Icestorm.
That what I was thinking. So they don't really have a clue about other HI getting 4-4. As only the ORC, MB, Iguana Operator, and the Knight are listed. The first 3 are no frills, and the last is a badass oversized Knight who get the top of the top equipment, like all knights.
Knight wrote: I think Alpharious asked a while ago to put spoilers on pictures, maybe mixing it up with something.
I believe that was only for quotes/repeats of pictures that were already posted in the same thread? Basically because you would have a string of about 10 photos, then exactly the same thing again underneath in quotes with the addition of 'Wow awesome!' as a comment
The new Ghulams look nice, but not frothing-over-the-mouth-I-need-to-buy-them-once-and-for-all-or-my-life-is-incomplete nice. But I'll still be getting a box, fo sho.
If they're like theother 4 infantry boxes (2 identical bodies, separate arms and heads), then it would be easy to twist the head of the female Ghulams to a more natural location. Looking far away instead of looking at the ground for the Sniper Ghulam, for example.
Another idea is to buy a Chandra, then put her head on one of the Ghulam girls. That way yo don't get a repeat head! The Chandra girl's head is quite cute.
Noir wrote: So they don't really have a clue about other HI getting 4-4. As only the ORC, MB, Iguana Operator, and the Knight are listed. The first 3 are no frills, and the last is a badass oversized Knight who get the top of the top equipment, like all knights.
That's one way of putting it. The other is that of the three HI in the booklet that are 4-2 in 2nd edition, all three are 4-4 in 3rd edition, including the low tech/semi-obsolete Mobile Brigada which is one of the lowest-tech powered armour suits in the game.
Bostria also said something in one of the videos about HI generally defaulting to 4-4 now to represent their servo-motors taking up the weight of the armour, while MI will mostly stay at 4-2 because of the lack of servo motors.
Put those two together and it certainly sounds like most other HI will be getting 4-4.
Okay those are very nice! I really like the look of the HMG in particular, but what's up with all of these Missile Launcher dudes having their left arm in the same clenched-fist pose. Perhaps they are lifting miniature weights so their right arm doesn't get too buff (by comparison) from shouldering a launcher all day
Edit: I also like the recommended army list for the Nomads when the player wishes to expand on the force in the starter. The Iguana is of course very shiny and the Interventors are shiny in their newness, pretty capable in their own specialisations and of course they will introduce hacking and remotes (or whatever the heck the Pandas are) too.
So looking now at my Ghulams (the new ones that came with the starter) and these newer ones, there are a few minor changes.
-Now they have sleeves! The new medic also has 'em so I'm not surprised. The old ones either have cut off sleeves or they rolled them up so we don't know what they actually look like.
-The "shoulder armor" is now just one piece instead of two.
-Knee armor is shaped a bit differently. The triangle thing inside has deeper crevices on each side now, while the old ones have shallower crevices.
-Shoes are more uniform-y now. The other Ghulams have different shoes: the girl had zip-up high boots with no lace while the men have laces on theirs with a bit of an extra layer both on the toe and heel area. These new ones have boots with pattern that would go well with their sleeves.
Overall I don't think it's too different. I don't think Ghulams are the kind of soldiers that would have a very strict uniform code, anyway.
I'm a bit unhappy with the female heads since they seem to be identical and although it's not an unattractive face, it's not an attractive one. But I guess we can't all have supermodel faces.
Noir wrote: So they don't really have a clue about other HI getting 4-4. As only the ORC, MB, Iguana Operator, and the Knight are listed. The first 3 are no frills, and the last is a badass oversized Knight who get the top of the top equipment, like all knights.
That's one way of putting it. The other is that of the three HI in the booklet that are 4-2 in 2nd edition, all three are 4-4 in 3rd edition, including the low tech/semi-obsolete Mobile Brigada which is one of the lowest-tech powered armour suits in the game.
Bostria also said something in one of the videos about HI generally defaulting to 4-4 now to represent their servo-motors taking up the weight of the armour, while MI will mostly stay at 4-2 because of the lack of servo motors.
Put those two together and it certainly sounds like most other HI will be getting 4-4.
See that is disappointing, I was hoping YJ would become the 4-4 HI faction. They already have less HI then PanO and YJ is the HI faction, and YJ HI's aren't really all that special as is.
I like the new Ghulam but i already have three so dunno if I'll be too worried about getting them. The new ones look more like hafza than the old, don't they?
Reverend healer has.. a lot of things going on. Is it a bit odd that she's listed as HI but only has one wound, are there any other one wound heavies? Looks like a good all-rounder, especially if she can link with moiras.
GrimDork wrote: I like the new Ghulam but i already have three so dunno if I'll be too worried about getting them. The new ones look more like hafza than the old, don't they?
Reverend healer has.. a lot of things going on. Is it a bit odd that she's listed as HI but only has one wound, are there any other one wound heavies? Looks like a good all-rounder, especially if she can link with moiras.
Noir wrote: So they don't really have a clue about other HI getting 4-4. As only the ORC, MB, Iguana Operator, and the Knight are listed. The first 3 are no frills, and the last is a badass oversized Knight who get the top of the top equipment, like all knights.
That's one way of putting it. The other is that of the three HI in the booklet that are 4-2 in 2nd edition, all three are 4-4 in 3rd edition, including the low tech/semi-obsolete Mobile Brigada which is one of the lowest-tech powered armour suits in the game.
Bostria also said something in one of the videos about HI generally defaulting to 4-4 now to represent their servo-motors taking up the weight of the armour, while MI will mostly stay at 4-2 because of the lack of servo motors.
Put those two together and it certainly sounds like most other HI will be getting 4-4.
See that is disappointing, I was hoping YJ would become the 4-4 HI faction. They already have less HI then PanO and YJ is the HI faction, and YJ HI's aren't really all that special as is.
They have less HI then PanO now.
YJ is getting an entire Sectorial next year based around HI. It's the "Invincible Army". The Zuyong Invincible that I posted on the previous page? That is the "LI" that is coming in the Invincible Army starter pack.
Noir wrote: So they don't really have a clue about other HI getting 4-4. As only the ORC, MB, Iguana Operator, and the Knight are listed. The first 3 are no frills, and the last is a badass oversized Knight who get the top of the top equipment, like all knights.
That's one way of putting it. The other is that of the three HI in the booklet that are 4-2 in 2nd edition, all three are 4-4 in 3rd edition, including the low tech/semi-obsolete Mobile Brigada which is one of the lowest-tech powered armour suits in the game.
Bostria also said something in one of the videos about HI generally defaulting to 4-4 now to represent their servo-motors taking up the weight of the armour, while MI will mostly stay at 4-2 because of the lack of servo motors.
Put those two together and it certainly sounds like most other HI will be getting 4-4.
See that is disappointing, I was hoping YJ would become the 4-4 HI faction. They already have less HI then PanO and YJ is the HI faction, and YJ HI's aren't really all that special as is.
They have less HI then PanO now.
YJ is getting an entire Sectorial next year based around HI. It's the "Invincible Army". The Zuyong Invincible that I posted on the previous page? That is the "LI" that is coming in the Invincible Army starter pack.
I know I was going to put that in (). But, didn't becouse it doesn't change that fact YJ HI's are nothing speacial, even the Zuyong as the cheerleader are bound to be just a basic HI, CB really will have to up the bar with YJ HI to make them not look ehh, vs PanO as MO has some really nice loadout on theirs.
Those Ghulams are ok, nothing special though. Love the Terracotta Soldier. And I only need the Iguana and then I can play that Nomad list (well when I get my O:I obviously...)
I'm all hyped about 3Rd edition now. All those rules changes and tweaks sounds awesome. CB is doing a great job play-tasting everything and putting a lot of effort into reshaping the game.
I like new terracotta soldier but I'm a bit puzzled. Is that a new unit or just a resculpt of the old Invincible model?
New HMG looks gorgeous. I wish CB made some weapons conversion packs so it would be possible to update old miniatures with new fancy guns as well.
The only way to get weapon packs is to buy the Spec Ops blister. :(
I like those Ghulam just fine. Hacker pose is like Icestorm Alguacil pose, more or less-- rifle down, finger pointing. Glad to see the box is 50%-50% too. Now I can field a nice Ghulam link.
200? Whoa, but Wayland sells to all of Europe too, no? Maybe my estimate of 500 sales in August was way too low. Ah well, I somehow don't mind being wrong about it.
Red Harvest wrote: The only way to get weapon packs is to buy the Spec Ops blister. :(
I like those Ghulam just fine. Hacker pose is like Icestorm Alguacil pose, more or less-- rifle down, finger pointing. Glad to see the box is 50%-50% too. Now I can field a nice Ghulam link.
200? Whoa, but Wayland sells to all of Europe too, no? Maybe my estimate of 500 sales in August was way too low. Ah well, I somehow don't mind being wrong about it.
Wayland is also a distributor for many small stores, so there's no guarantee that all the sales are simply private individuals.
Noir wrote: So they don't really have a clue about other HI getting 4-4. As only the ORC, MB, Iguana Operator, and the Knight are listed. The first 3 are no frills, and the last is a badass oversized Knight who get the top of the top equipment, like all knights.
That's one way of putting it. The other is that of the three HI in the booklet that are 4-2 in 2nd edition, all three are 4-4 in 3rd edition, including the low tech/semi-obsolete Mobile Brigada which is one of the lowest-tech powered armour suits in the game.
Bostria also said something in one of the videos about HI generally defaulting to 4-4 now to represent their servo-motors taking up the weight of the armour, while MI will mostly stay at 4-2 because of the lack of servo motors.
Put those two together and it certainly sounds like most other HI will be getting 4-4.
See that is disappointing, I was hoping YJ would become the 4-4 HI faction. They already have less HI then PanO and YJ is the HI faction, and YJ HI's aren't really all that special as is.
They have less HI then PanO now.
YJ is getting an entire Sectorial next year based around HI. It's the "Invincible Army". The Zuyong Invincible that I posted on the previous page? That is the "LI" that is coming in the Invincible Army starter pack.
That and it isn't like fast HI were completely exclusive. Though we still do boast the fastest one in the game (6--6 baby).
PanO has been superior to us in options and cost since 1st Edition. But that trend can definitely shift in the new edition. The ORC appears to be paying a high cost for its BS14, I can only imagine how much cheaper the basic Shang Ji will be now.
And of course, while PanO have received their HI-centric sectorial, Yu Jing have not. I figure the Invincible Army will give us a wide variety of options and give us a lot of unique strengths. And I think getting widespread 4--4 HI will help us out a lot more in the long run (especially if the Zuyong gets it instead of the 4--2 many have been predicting). A fast Daofei will be a dream, especially if White Banner and/or the Invincible Army give an AVA of greater than 1. Fast Wu Ming will make an excellent assault spearhead (especially with the BS and grenades getting improved).
If they find some way to reward the already fast HI then that will be cool as well. But most things getting moved to 4--4 is no skin off my back. We still hold the HI speed record on the Su-Jian (which may get a faster combat mode!) and we are still the only faction with an infiltrating/camo'd HI that will get a lot of use out of becoming faster.
Let the others have ARM4 MOV4--4 HI, we'll spread the love in different ways.
Usashi wrote: I'm all hyped about 3Rd edition now. All those rules changes and tweaks sounds awesome. CB is doing a great job play-tasting everything and putting a lot of effort into reshaping the game.
I like new terracotta soldier but I'm a bit puzzled. Is that a new unit or just a resculpt of the old Invincible model?
New HMG looks gorgeous. I wish CB made some weapons conversion packs so it would be possible to update old miniatures with new fancy guns as well.
At this point, no one has any clue. Ever since the Shang Ji came to town, the vanilla Invincible has had zero purpose for existing. So popular opinion is that the Zuyong/Terracotta is the original Invincible, reimagined as a true line infantry HI unit instead of just being the faction's generic HI with a pure-fluff line infantry designation (seriously, one mission ever has used this distinction for a purpose, and the Invincible is too expensive to use).
Yu Jing is already stuff with a lot of no-frills HI (Wu Ming, Shang Ji, original Invincible). Adding the Zuyong as a brand new unit without taking out the normal Invincible (or re-purposing it) would just stuff even more in there. Probably better for the old one to just get re-named Zuyong and give it a new role as a cheap line trooper heavy. But we wont really know for sure until the 3rd Edition book rolls out and we get to see if the Zuyong supplants the basic Invincible or is added alongside it.
I highly suspect the Zuyong is either a rename of the basic invincible (to seperate it from the elite Shang Ji or those new heavy assault type Invincibles), or is a new category of ultra low-end HI.
Stuff like ARM3, 4-4, BS12, BTS3 guys with even less frills to make them even cheaper.
Killionaire wrote: I highly suspect the Zuyong is either a rename of the basic invincible (to seperate it from the elite Shang Ji or those new heavy assault type Invincibles), or is a new category of ultra low-end HI.
Stuff like ARM3, 4-4, BS12, BTS3 guys with even less frills to make them even cheaper.
It's not a rename of the basic Invincible. It is an entirely new unit, purportedly HI classification but with points costs/stats equivalent to MI.
Pacific wrote: That hacker is the coolest looking Haqqislam hacker yet I think.
Ahem.
Spoiler:
Big fan of that box though. It's spurred me to finish painting my old Ghulam (and find an old HMG hopefully), so I can get the new ones done. Also that way if I ever play Spamislam I'll have a different Ghulam squad for each combat group!
At this point, no one has any clue. Ever since the Shang Ji came to town, the vanilla Invincible has had zero purpose for existing. So popular opinion is that the Zuyong/Terracotta is the original Invincible, reimagined as a true line infantry HI unit instead of just being the faction's generic HI with a pure-fluff line infantry designation (seriously, one mission ever has used this distinction for a purpose, and the Invincible is too expensive to use).
Yu Jing is already stuff with a lot of no-frills HI (Wu Ming, Shang Ji, original Invincible). Adding the Zuyong as a brand new unit without taking out the normal Invincible (or re-purposing it) would just stuff even more in there. Probably better for the old one to just get re-named Zuyong and give it a new role as a cheap line trooper heavy. But we wont really know for sure until the 3rd Edition book rolls out and we get to see if the Zuyong supplants the basic Invincible or is added alongside it.
Koni wrote: The Operation:Icestorm release is very important for Infinity, and their contents (2 starter packs) affects directly to other references in our catalogue. The following references will be discontinued:
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