Lord Damocles wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Doubt on the Volkite Vindicator, why would a wall busting tank have a gun that's bad against inorganic matter?

Why would GW give Furioso Dreadnoughts a ranged arm weapon otherwise specific to the Deathwatch..?

I think you got the timeline flipped and reversed there…

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

Duymon wrote:
It's almost as if the big influx of Hh players has somehting to do with mainstream support from gw with updated plastic and not having to deal with forgeworld hard to get resin kits and rulebooks /s

Assuming the flag by your name is correct, you're in the USA, so riddle me this - how, exactly, is placing an online order from FW trickier (or more of a roadblock) than placing one from any other online seller?

FW comes with a bigger price tag.

Some people don't buy from "any other online seller", they buy from their FLGS or a specific online seller that they trust/like.

FW stuff often comes with flaws that warrant the part being replaced.

Lots of people prefer plastic to resin.

Even in the US I've heard reports of FW occasionally taking a long time deliver (there was a thread on it recently and I recall several Muricans complaining their orders were taking weeks to months to be shipped).

Some people don't like the proportions of the old Space Marine models and want something that will match the aesthetic of the Age of Darkness box they just bought.

The person I was replying to - notably, not you - claimed that FW models were "hard to get". While I'll acknowledge that they're harder to get than walking in to a GW/FLGS and picking up a box off the shelf, or a blister pack/clamshell from a rack, that's also true for a, many GW kits; and b, kits from many other lines.

None of the points you raised directly addressed the question I was asking - what makes ordering from FW so much harder than ordering from anywhere else online. You've got a couple of points that may highlight potential customer service issues (potential flaws (not exclusive to FW), and occasional delayed shipping), but they don't make it any harder to order the items.

My point on this is quite simple - people go on about how FW is such a barrier to buying something, yet it is no different than anything else you have to order online. I'm not going to start complaining about how "hard" it is if I need to order a book from Amazon, or Direct Only kits from GW, or paints from Warcolours, or brushes from Rosemary & Co - online shopping is part and parcel (heh) of the world today, and has been for, what, at least a decade now. Yet when it is FW, people choose to act like it is a gigantic barrier to entry.

Your other points might be valid reasons for not wanting to order from FW, but in terms of actually completing a transaction, they make no difference whatsoever.

Currently my only FW purchases have been two IF Contemptor dread bodies and two Heavy bolter Rapier carriers. I'm planning on using plastic arms for the Contemptor (as it is better cost wise) and magnets to allow many options.

 Azazelx wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

Umm, yeah, it's not really "new hat" syndrome so much as it's "don't want to pay $136 for a 10 man breacher squad" syndrome. But sure, lets pretend that the reason people didn't collect HH for the past 10 years was something other than the insane price and the pain of having to deal with FW and FW resin.

The issue really seems to be that people are getting bent out of shape by the fact that not everything has been updated for a game that's only just been re-released and is in it's (plastic) infancy and they want (insert unit here) re-released in plastic RIGHT NOW BECAUSE I WANT IT!!!
Let's not also forget that the AoD box is a great new army start for a Marine army, just short a few special/heavy weapons, so GW is playing it cool with releases and going with a methodical rate rather than spamming and overwhelming the market with too many new AoD releases as they have no real way of knowing just how many boxes sold were to 40k players.

Drama, drama, draaaaaama!

I literally haven’t seen anyone getting bent out of shape. What I have seen is people talking about what state the range is currently in and what they’d like to see next. Then I’ve seen people such as your good self, trying to make drama out of nothing.

I just don't want to pay the price of 40 plastic Tacticals for 10 rather squat, resin Breachers, y'know?

That just strikes me as a poor business decision.

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
I just don't want to pay the price of 40 plastic Tacticals for 10 rather squat, resin Breachers, y'know?

That just strikes me as a poor business decision.

How dare you been so entitled!

You can buy some compatible "generic boarding shields" and just stick them on the plastic kits?

Has anyone thought about using the upcoming Kill Team / Space Hulk walls for Zone Mortalis?



At first glance there's not much of it, and there's a few too many doors...

I imagine like the Zone Mortalis, we’ll see separate kit releases for this. Which I’m tempted by, as I’d be very surprised if these are entirely incompatible with ZM, and these look a lot more interesting to paint.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I imagine like the Zone Mortalis, we’ll see separate kit releases for this. Which I’m tempted by, as I’d be very surprised if these are entirely incompatible with ZM, and these look a lot more interesting to paint.

They also look like they should be cheaper to purchase, as the walls are all one piece as opposed to the ZM walls which are at least 5 each.

 jojo_monkey_boy wrote:

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
I imagine like the Zone Mortalis, we’ll see separate kit releases for this. Which I’m tempted by, as I’d be very surprised if these are entirely incompatible with ZM, and these look a lot more interesting to paint.

They also look like they should be cheaper to purchase, as the walls are all one piece as opposed to the ZM walls which are at least 5 each.

Oh bless your little cottons!

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Oh bless your little cottons!

Oh I know. But as they say, hope springs eternal.

I think you take your pick depending on the type of environment you want to create. To me the Kill Team stuff is ideal for creating cramped, claustrophobic rooms and corridors. I’d go for Zone Mortalis if I wanted something more open and multilevel.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I’d go for Zone Mortalis if I wanted something more open and multilevel.

Or if you'd recently decided that you could live with only one kidney and had solid black market organ buying networks to make use of.

beast_gts wrote:
Has anyone thought about using the upcoming Kill Team / Space Hulk walls for Zone Mortalis?

Spoiler:

At first glance there's not much of it, and there's a few too many doors...

Agreed on all points.

 jojo_monkey_boy wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I’d go for Zone Mortalis if I wanted something more open and multilevel.

Or if you'd recently decided that you could live with only one kidney and had solid black market organ buying networks to make use of.

Yeah, that too.

I hope for Assault Marines and a real Starter Set.

But I doubt - they will show only a Praetor and a Vehicle - I guess...

Titanicus didn't get a "starter box" until 18mo after the game came out....

I fething hope it doesn't take that long for AOD.

The big box is the starter box.

Yea it has a massive single-faction army, at a crazy discount, rules, dice, templates, etc and is not a limited item. Seems pretty startersetty to me. Sure the sticker price is high, but it actually gives you enough models you can have meaningful games with. I don't see the point in a smaller box that doesn't let you play a real game.

General discount bundles would be welcome, of course. Like, I dunno, whole Predator Squadrons, Leviathan Talons...

I was thinking something ZM with some terrain and no big stuff. $150 is more palatable to more beginning players than the $300 launch box aimed at those already interested.

Something like;
Delagatus
5 Terminators
10 Tacticals
5 Breachers
5 Despoilers
With some wall/door sprues and a paper game mat
Should equate to same # of sprues as half of the AOD box

ZM locks you into a play style whereas the AoD box is one or two armies of gully generic units that can be turned into most of the Legion infantry choices.

I’ll be honest, I was kind of surprised that the rule book doesn’t contain Zone Mortalis rules. It also assumes the smallest game you’re going to play is 2000pts.

I’d love to see a low point cost Combat Patrol or Kill Team size game actively supported for this setting.

How can it lock you in when you can use the units in full size 30k games? That's why I chose units that would he beneficial for all legions

AoD has a starter box, you're describing what seems to be a ZM starter box.

yeah there's nothing in the box thats not "widely useful" everyone's going to have a use ofr MK VI marines, terminators and a dread. the only thing in the AOD box that won't be included in nearly every list is proably the spartan, and I bet a LOT of lists will include one of those

 Dysartes wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

Duymon wrote:
It's almost as if the big influx of Hh players has somehting to do with mainstream support from gw with updated plastic and not having to deal with forgeworld hard to get resin kits and rulebooks /s

Assuming the flag by your name is correct, you're in the USA, so riddle me this - how, exactly, is placing an online order from FW trickier (or more of a roadblock) than placing one from any other online seller?

FW comes with a bigger price tag.

Some people don't buy from "any other online seller", they buy from their FLGS or a specific online seller that they trust/like.

FW stuff often comes with flaws that warrant the part being replaced.

Lots of people prefer plastic to resin.

Even in the US I've heard reports of FW occasionally taking a long time deliver (there was a thread on it recently and I recall several Muricans complaining their orders were taking weeks to months to be shipped).

Some people don't like the proportions of the old Space Marine models and want something that will match the aesthetic of the Age of Darkness box they just bought.

The person I was replying to - notably, not you - claimed that FW models were "hard to get". While I'll acknowledge that they're harder to get than walking in to a GW/FLGS and picking up a box off the shelf, or a blister pack/clamshell from a rack, that's also true for a, many GW kits; and b, kits from many other lines.

None of the points you raised directly addressed the question I was asking - what makes ordering from FW so much harder than ordering from anywhere else online. You've got a couple of points that may highlight potential customer service issues (potential flaws (not exclusive to FW), and occasional delayed shipping), but they don't make it any harder to order the items.

My point on this is quite simple - people go on about how FW is such a barrier to buying something, yet it is no different than anything else you have to order online. I'm not going to start complaining about how "hard" it is if I need to order a book from Amazon, or Direct Only kits from GW, or paints from Warcolours, or brushes from Rosemary & Co - online shopping is part and parcel (heh) of the world today, and has been for, what, at least a decade now. Yet when it is FW, people choose to act like it is a gigantic barrier to entry.

Your other points might be valid reasons for not wanting to order from FW, but in terms of actually completing a transaction, they make no difference whatsoever.

Notice how I was referring to the "big influx of Hh players", as in, new players.

There were countless times I'd be playing HH in the past at the FLGS and we're get some people interested in the game only to tell them that they couldn't buy any of the stuff at that store and that they'd have to go online. Sure, we showed them the website on our phones or tablets and they always responded "oh cool I'll take a look later". Only a small fraction of them ever ended up joining.

Compare that to now. We can just tell them "oh, you can get started if you buy that big AoD box right there" . Once they buy that box, they're instantly invested and the chances of them hanging around increase dramatically. Miniature sales work pretty much the same way.

It's true that going online is easy as hell and ordering off FW is just like any other website, but having people do it on their own instead of in the store causes a lot of them to lose steam and/or have second thoughts and not follow through.

So despite how little of a barrier to entry you think online only is, apparently it was pretty huge to the new / casual warhammer players base off of how much HH has exploded since 2.0

 Dysartes wrote:

Duymon wrote:
It's almost as if the big influx of Hh players has somehting to do with mainstream support from gw with updated plastic and not having to deal with forgeworld hard to get resin kits and rulebooks /s

Assuming the flag by your name is correct, you're in the USA, so riddle me this - how, exactly, is placing an online order from FW trickier (or more of a roadblock) than placing one from any other online seller?

.. Have you seen forge world's north American order page? it's CONSTNATLY out of stock of just about everything

BrianDavion wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

Duymon wrote:
It's almost as if the big influx of Hh players has somehting to do with mainstream support from gw with updated plastic and not having to deal with forgeworld hard to get resin kits and rulebooks /s

Assuming the flag by your name is correct, you're in the USA, so riddle me this - how, exactly, is placing an online order from FW trickier (or more of a roadblock) than placing one from any other online seller?

.. Have you seen forge world's north American order page? it's CONSTNATLY out of stock of just about everything

And that's different to gw/flgs online store being constantly out of stock...how?

Gw store even uses same software so literally 0 difference. Flgs might at least show out of stock differently. Well they could let you order, take your money and let you wait for your order months. Up to preference do you want to wait for stock or order, pay and wait unknown time for stock to come.

tneva82 wrote:
And that's different to gw/flgs online store being constantly out of stock...how?

Things come back into stock with GW/FLGS. FW stays out of stock for longer periods, returning to stock at random and without warning, and then selling out almost instantly.

Just ask the AT crowd what it's like.

Technical 30k has a Launch Box, big box with many Models and a big Hardcover rulebook, have fun. A nice set with good content but not very useful for hobby newbies.

There is no Intro Set for completely new Players with a Mini Rulebook, Intro Booklet ect. to a smaller price tag which takes newbies at the hand.

I'm not sure GW is aiming at that market with HH though

Yeah, you would think that a starter box would be a no brainer. But if I recall with Indomitus and Dominion the smaller starter sets were released very soon after the limited release box. I guess the thing is with AOD not being a limited box maybe they see no reason to release a smaller, more new player friendly set?

Which is a shame given that most of the prices of the new releases have been quite good when compared to most 40k and AOS releases.

If 30K is following the open-narrative-matched format then a revised starter set should be in the works and this side of Christmas. Probably about £110.

Otherwise I can't see how 30K is going to be successful outside of the dedicated tournament audience.

When HH was made with focus for a tournament audience, I guess we would have a similary streamlined ruleset like 40k.

Maybe we will see a Starter Set with the NOVA previews, but I doubt we can await any one later that at this date or for Christmas announced.

What do we reckon for the starter sets? 40k/AoS style tiered system or Start Collecting!/Combat Patrol style? Or both?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

RazorEdge wrote:
When HH was made with focus for a tournament audience

When was Heresy ever tournament focused? I don't think it's ever been billed as a competitive rule-set.

Same here, I'm sure it's made as a form of a "Gentleman's Game" for retro/traditional gamers.

I guess there will be not a tiered system. Maybe like KIllTeam - one Starter with two small Armies,small Rulebook, Intro booklet. Maybe 20 Mk6 Marines, 5 Terminators (Tartaros?), 1 Dreadnought and 2 Characters. Like the AoD Box it can be used for two players or for a single Player as one small Army. There could be a Scenario in the Intro Booklet were two such Starters get combined.

 Dysartes wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Dysartes wrote:

Duymon wrote:
It's almost as if the big influx of Hh players has somehting to do with mainstream support from gw with updated plastic and not having to deal with forgeworld hard to get resin kits and rulebooks /s

Assuming the flag by your name is correct, you're in the USA, so riddle me this - how, exactly, is placing an online order from FW trickier (or more of a roadblock) than placing one from any other online seller?

FW comes with a bigger price tag.

Some people don't buy from "any other online seller", they buy from their FLGS or a specific online seller that they trust/like.

FW stuff often comes with flaws that warrant the part being replaced.

Lots of people prefer plastic to resin.

Even in the US I've heard reports of FW occasionally taking a long time deliver (there was a thread on it recently and I recall several Muricans complaining their orders were taking weeks to months to be shipped).

Some people don't like the proportions of the old Space Marine models and want something that will match the aesthetic of the Age of Darkness box they just bought.

The person I was replying to - notably, not you -

Yeah, this is a public forum, when you reply to someone you're replying to everyone, so I'm not sure why you think that's "notable".

None of the points you raised directly addressed the question I was asking - what makes ordering from FW so much harder than ordering from anywhere else online. You've got a couple of points that may highlight potential customer service issues (potential flaws (not exclusive to FW), and occasional delayed shipping), but they don't make it any harder to order the items.

The person you were quoting didn't say "hard to order", they said "not having to deal with forgeworld hard to get resin kits". My points that specifically addressed your point in the context of the original post were...

Some people don't buy from "any other online seller", they buy from their FLGS or a specific online seller that they trust/like.

FW stuff often comes with flaws that warrant the part being replaced.

Even in the US I've heard reports of FW occasionally taking a long time deliver (there was a thread on it recently and I recall several Muricans complaining their orders were taking weeks to months to be shipped).

So we have 1) Lack of availability from regular retailers, 2) Flaws that may require them to send out another part before you get the part you're actually going to use making it harder to get that part and 3) Shipping delays. I could add another one there that FW stuff is often out of stock (if I had a penny for the number of times I've wanted to buy a bundle to avoid paying for shipping, had to wait for one thing to come back into stock, then the thing I was going to bundle it with went out of stock... I'd have a few pennies ).

Unless you were simply attempting to move the goal posts by translating "hard to get" into "hard to order". In which case, ummm, okay? Yes, I fully agree that the process of "add to cart" and "checkout" is similar to other online stores.

The other points I just threw in there, cos, ya know, getting a bit tired of hearing "Instead of wanting plastic kits you should just buy FW like I've been doing for the past 10 years!". As If FW wasn't the reason they didn't get in to HH before So I was just heading off other avenues of discussion before they reared up once again.

My point on this is quite simple - people go on about how FW is such a barrier to buying something, yet it is no different than anything else you have to order online. I'm not going to start complaining about how "hard" it is if I need to order a book from Amazon, or Direct Only kits from GW, or paints from Warcolours, or brushes from Rosemary & Co - online shopping is part and parcel (heh) of the world today, and has been for, what, at least a decade now. Yet when it is FW, people choose to act like it is a gigantic barrier to entry.

When you add in the poor quality control, long shipping times, the fact you can't just buy it from any store... it is more of a barrier.

I rarely buy GW direct only kits for the express reason I can't buy them from local stores that I like to support, when I do buy them it's usually when I can get them from somewhere that isn't the GW webstore. I buy my warcolours from my FLGS. I buy my Kolinsky brushes from my FLGS. I don't buy my books from Amazon. Admittedly I do tend to buy preorders online, but that's more because I don't know when I'll have free time to visit the store so better if it just shows up at my door than have it sitting at the FLGS waiting to be collected.

When a company makes their products exclusive to their own website.... charges an arm and a leg for it... takes weeks to months to deliver it... frequently delivers crap quality that needs to be replaced.... then yeah, I'm probably not going to be buying many products from that manufacturer regardless of whether or not it's name is "Forge World".

 Snrub wrote:
What do we reckon for the starter sets? 40k/AoS style tiered system or Start Collecting!/Combat Patrol style? Or both?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

RazorEdge wrote:
When HH was made with focus for a tournament audience

When was Heresy ever tournament focused? I don't think it's ever been billed as a competitive rule-set.

I can only assume he's got this absurd idea that the only people willing to dump money on an army are the die hard tourny try hards.

RazorEdge wrote:
When HH was made with focus for a tournament audience, I guess we would have a similary streamlined ruleset like 40k.

BrianDavion wrote:

 Snrub wrote:
What do we reckon for the starter sets? 40k/AoS style tiered system or Start Collecting!/Combat Patrol style? Or both?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

RazorEdge wrote:
When HH was made with focus for a tournament audience

When was Heresy ever tournament focused? I don't think it's ever been billed as a competitive rule-set.

I can only assume he's got this absurd idea that the only people willing to dump money on an army are the die hard tourny try hards.

It's just a grammar mistake, he means 'if'.

JWBS wrote:
It's just a grammar mistake, he means 'if'.

Ooh. That, when combined with the post directly above his, makes a lot more sense.

Right, confusion cleared.

beast_gts wrote:
Has anyone thought about using the upcoming Kill Team / Space Hulk walls for Zone Mortalis?

Spoiler:

At first glance there's not much of it, and there's a few too many doors...

Yeah might be a bit of a problem, as Zone Mortalis areas are supposed to be accessible to things like dreadnoughts and the like. Those doors basically cut off access.

I think the Necromunda terrain is probably better for it, less doors, etc. so you can make areas large enough for bigger models to fit through. Also GW has done so many different bundles for that stuff over the years that you can amass a fairly large collection of it at a reasonable price.

Racerguy180 wrote:
Titanicus didn't get a "starter box" until 18mo after the game came out....
I fething hope it doesn't take that long for AOD.

Huh? It had a starter box from day 1 - the Grand Master Edition that the game launched with.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I’ll be honest, I was kind of surprised that the rule book doesn’t contain Zone Mortalis rules. It also assumes the smallest game you’re going to play is 2000pts.
I’d love to see a low point cost Combat Patrol or Kill Team size game actively supported for this setting.

HH is designed and balanced around higher points levels. Thats just how it is. Too many people assume that points values scale infinitely - but they don't. They really only work within a narrow range of values - above or below that range they cease to be effective as a balancing mechanism. For 40k, the game plays best from 1000-2000 pts. For 30k its really more like 2500-3500.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

tneva82 wrote:
And that's different to gw/flgs online store being constantly out of stock...how?

Things come back into stock with GW/FLGS. FW stays out of stock for longer periods, returning to stock at random and without warning, and then selling out almost instantly.

Just ask the AT crowd what it's like.

Exactly this - there are several FW-resin-only AT items I have literally *never* seen in stock.

BrianDavion wrote:
I'm not sure GW is aiming at that market with HH though

HH is aimed at 40+. Noobs continue to play AoS & 40K.

chaos0xomega wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
I’ll be honest, I was kind of surprised that the rule book doesn’t contain Zone Mortalis rules. It also assumes the smallest game you’re going to play is 2000pts.
I’d love to see a low point cost Combat Patrol or Kill Team size game actively supported for this setting.

HH is designed and balanced around higher points levels. Thats just how it is. Too many people assume that points values scale infinitely - but they don't. They really only work within a narrow range of values - above or below that range they cease to be effective as a balancing mechanism. For 40k, the game plays best from 1000-2000 pts. For 30k its really more like 2500-3500.

Yeah, I get that. That’s why I suppose I’m wish listing for a different game. I’m more of a collector/painter but I’ve no desire to collect 3000pts of anything or play a game that size. I’ve always thought 40K was too big and Kill Team too small. That’s why I don’t really play anything.

… my first world problem


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Strg Alt wrote:

BrianDavion wrote:
I'm not sure GW is aiming at that market with HH though

HH is aimed at 40+. Noobs continue to play AoS & 40K.

And that’s exactly the kind of attitude that always put me off the HH community.

SamusDrake wrote:
If 30K is following the open-narrative-matched format then a revised starter set should be in the works and this side of Christmas. Probably about £110.

Otherwise I can't see how 30K is going to be successful outside of the dedicated tournament audience.

It doesn't follow the 40k/AoS game design. There isn't "ways to play" its just the one way. The way the game scales also means it doesn't work at very small point levels. The AoS/40k starter sets are roughly one unit + an HQ/hero, a formula which doesn't work with the HH system. The smallest level of workable game is about 1k points unless you go for the old Victory is Vengeance rules from Extermination but that's basically HH Kill Team.
As for not succeeding outside of tournaments, the vast majority of HH events are narrative focused and organisers often make it very clear that if lists are considered overly competitive (i.e. bringing large amounts of broken or cheesy units or combos) then players will be asked to change their lists. If HH managed to do well without resorting to appeasing the competitive crowd for the last 10 years I think it can manage now.

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
Yeah, I get that. That’s why I suppose I’m wish listing for a different game. I’m more of a collector/painter but I’ve no desire to collect 3000pts of anything or play a game that size. I’ve always thought 40K was too big and Kill Team too small. That’s why I don’t really play anything.

… my first world problem

I grew up playing 2nd edition, most games were a few squads and maybe 1 or 2 tanks/dreadnoughts/etc.

I liked that size for 40k, could get an army together reasonably quickly and when you have games where you move individual models it becomes so tedious when you have more than a handful of squads.

Years ago I built a Tyranid horde army for the cool spectacle of it... the first movement phase of the first game I thought "what have I done, this is not fun"

GW killed the games where large numbers of models made for fun games (at least to me), things like Epic, Warmaster, and yes even WHFB.




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

And that’s exactly the kind of attitude that always put me off the HH community.

 Gert wrote:
As for not succeeding outside of tournaments, the vast majority of HH events are narrative focused and organisers often make it very clear that if lists are considered overly competitive (i.e. bringing large amounts of broken or cheesy units or combos) then players will be asked to change their lists. If HH managed to do well without resorting to appeasing the competitive crowd for the last 10 years I think it can manage now.

If GW are putting so many HH models into plastic, they clearly want to sell it to more than the existing crowd of resin whales.

As it gains more mainstream popularity, the culture will change, the existing playerbase will be overwhelmed by the newbies some of whom will want to play narrative, some will want to play armies that don't fit in the fluff, some will want to play competitively, etc etc.

And I shan't shed a tear for the cranky old grognards (ya know, the ones crying about how they've been buying resin marines with dwarfism for the past 10 years and that is the correct way to enjoy HH).

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:
Yeah, I get that. That’s why I suppose I’m wish listing for a different game. I’m more of a collector/painter but I’ve no desire to collect 3000pts of anything or play a game that size. I’ve always thought 40K was too big and Kill Team too small. That’s why I don’t really play anything.

… my first world problem

I grew up playing 2nd edition, most games were a few squads and maybe 1 or 2 tanks/dreadnoughts/etc.

I liked that size for 40k, could get an army together reasonably quickly and when you have games where you move individual models it becomes so tedious when you have more than a handful of squads.

Years ago I built a Tyranid horde army for the cool spectacle of it... the first movement phase of the first game I thought "what have I done, this is not fun"

GW killed the games where large numbers of models made for fun games (at least to me), things like Epic, Warmaster, and yes even WHFB.

I agree. Older editions of 40k and WHFB were great because the game size fell into this weird middle ground between a skirmish game and "mass battle" like we have in modern 40k. You'd have an HQ character, 2-3 small units of line infantry type troops, a unit or two of specialists (like bikers or heavy weapons teams), and a tank (or in WHFB terms - a Hero, 2-3 units of infantry, 1-2 units of cavalry, and like a dragon or a cannon), and that was just a solid really fun game size.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
If GW are putting so many HH models into plastic, they clearly want to sell it to more than the existing crowd of resin whales.

As it gains more mainstream popularity, the culture will change, the existing playerbase will be overwhelmed by the newbies some of whom will want to play narrative, some will want to play armies that don't fit in the fluff, some will want to play competitively, etc etc.

I'm not denying that won't be the case, there will for sure be a lot of new people coming along. That being said, a shift in the culture of the wider community is going to be less drastic IMO.
Ignoring the chuds discussed below for a moment, there is still a huge focus on narrative and authenticity when it comes to HH armies which influences the kind of events that are popular in the community. As well as this, one of the major draws to HH (both in the original version and now) is the higher degree of balance between the various armies (barring a few exceptions *cough*Custodes*cough*). Generally speaking, the game is a lot more forgiving of TAC lists, as well as themed armies with Rites of War. The consistency of the rules (i.e. not a rapid replacement of Codexes or supplementary material) means that while a specific issue might stick around for a while, the players don't have to fork out £30 every 6 months for new rules to play the game.
Obviously there will be a competitive driven section of the HH community growing, I just don't think it will ever come to eclipse the narrative section.

And I shan't shed a tear for the cranky old grognards (ya know, the ones crying about how they've been buying resin marines with dwarfism for the past 10 years and that is the correct way to enjoy HH).

Nah those chuds can get in the bin. I can't stand the modeling elitism from a fair chunk of the HH crowd who in the same breath will use de-Nurgled Plague Marines for true scale or will buy recasts. One person especially has some exceptional hobby talent but is a massive gak head towards new people just asking questions about what would be acceptable to use for certain units. My favourite example was this individual doing a massive rant on how no Primaris models should ever be used for HH units, then a day later is posting about their converted Outriders using the Primaris bikers. It's truly pathetic the amount of vitriol these kinds of people spout while being massive hypocrites.

 Gert wrote:

It doesn't follow the 40k/AoS game design. There isn't "ways to play" its just the one way. The way the game scales also means it doesn't work at very small point levels. The AoS/40k starter sets are roughly one unit + an HQ/hero, a formula which doesn't work with the HH system. The smallest level of workable game is about 1k points unless you go for the old Victory is Vengeance rules from Extermination but that's basically HH Kill Team.
As for not succeeding outside of tournaments, the vast majority of HH events are narrative focused and organisers often make it very clear that if lists are considered overly competitive (i.e. bringing large amounts of broken or cheesy units or combos) then players will be asked to change their lists. If HH managed to do well without resorting to appeasing the competitive crowd for the last 10 years I think it can manage now.

Ah, so 30K is a very different beast then.

Having watched Ash's review of the Mechanicum book, I notice the Armigers are 200 points each, 50 more than their 40K counterparts. Is just just a rarity or a rule of thumb for 30K in that the units are more expensive?

Generally speaking, HH units are cheaper than their 40k counterparts.

SamusDrake wrote:
Ah, so 30K is a very different beast then.

Having watched Ash's review of the Mechanicum book, I notice the Armigers are 200 points each, 50 more than their 40K counterparts. Is just just a rarity or a rule of thumb for 30K in that the units are more expensive?

I think in 30k vehicles are more expensive than in 40k right now and basic marines are less.

Cheers for that Gert and ph34r.

SamusDrake wrote:
Cheers for that Gert and ph34r.

one exception however being dreads which are, i thnk it's fair to say, underpriced pts wise.

but that is honestly my only gripe about the books.

Found this on Reddit after it was mentioned at Valraks last Stream on Youtube:

Hey Folks,

someone posted this on the 30k sub before he removed it by himself.


Mk6 Assault Marines with Bolt Pistol and Chainsword options - 5 man sprue will accomplished by the expansion sprue from the Tactical Squad Set.

Mk5/6 Expansion Set with close combat weapons - two identical sprues with two variants of each close combat weapon

Mk5/6 Expansion Set for Breacher Squads

Mk5/6 Expansion Set for Destroyer Squads - can be combined with tactical or assault squad sprue for Breacher with or without Jump packs

Deimos Pattern Vindicator - Standard and Laser Destroyer variants get accomplished with a new Tank Destroyer Variant (weapon looks like a new Melter variant)

Expansion Sets for two Sicaran Assaul Tank / Tank Destroyer Variants

New Dreadnough Variant is wip - Maybe Furibundus Variant - "from the same time period as the Mk2 were introduced" (earliest pattern of "mass produced" Dreadnoughts?)

Mk2 and Mk5 Tactical Squad are both wip - there will be also a seperate

Mk2 Expansion Set for Close Combat Weapons Both Sets are planned for army sets as "Launch" releases in the future.

Two new plastic Preatorii are planned - each with Mk2 and Mk5 armour As said earlier - there will be a yearly Army Box set with new stuff First of such sets will replace the AoD Box next year

what do you think? Are those rumours believable?

https://www.reddit.com/r/Warhammer30k/comments/wwu25r/horus_heresy_rumours/

Maybe some of this will be revealed at NOVA, but take some salt.

That sounds more like wishlisting and guessing than leaks

Maybe the expansion sprues for Mk6? But I doubt they would suddenly swap to Mk5??

Not even quality wishlisting.

"You'll get everything you want, and soon!"

Yeah. That does sound very wishlist-y.

The assault sprue upgrade and the deimos stuff makes sense but mkv and ii are highly unlikely unlikely as they want to push mkvi since it's still new.

I could see Mk II or V, but not yet, I dont think they would announce it soon. Assault marines and upgrade boxes I can see, and Vindicator with extra weapon option would make sense. They may want to make some consuls in plastic before more Praetors though. Or other characters like a Techmarine or Apothecary conclave kit.

Yeah, Consuls & support characters make near-term sense

I don't particularly want to see close combat marine variants handled with an upgrade sprue for MkVI. The MkVI poses in the tactical set are too passively posed for a CC variant.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I don't particularly want to see close combat marine variants handled with an upgrade sprue for MkVI. The MkVI poses in the tactical set are too passively posed for a CC variant.

Yeah, and there’s only 5 poses already.

I don't see where this "rumor" mentiones the body sprue from the Tactical Squad for Assault Marines. Sounds to me new Assault Marines Spure + Command Sprue from the Tactical Squad.

Mk6 Assault Marines with Bolt Pistol and Chainsword options - 5 man sprue will accomplished by the expansion sprue from the Tactical Squad Set.

Mk5/6 Expansion Set for Destroyer Squads - can be combined with tactical or assault squad sprue for Breacher with or without Jump packs

"Breacher" seems to be a misstype or copy paste error and means Destroyer.

Death guard upgrades

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/08/25/heresy-thursday-down-and-dirty-death-guard-upgrade-kits/

 zedmeister wrote:
Death guard upgrades

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/08/25/heresy-thursday-down-and-dirty-death-guard-upgrade-kits/

Unironically some of the best bits GW has produced in years.

Well, if anyone wanted a bunch of Death Guard style Mark II/III helmets then these are right at home.

The wide variation between home run and utter shambles continues on the upgrades, love these.

Yeah, those look really clean and amazing. It makes me wonder what happened with some of the others.

I think all of the upgrade heads have been great, apart from the PAW Patrol heads.

My Sons of Horus heads arrived today and they’re beautiful.

I hope that MKVI Assault squad rumour is true. Don't mind if rhe same upgrade sprue as with the tacs is onboard, as long as we get 5 new poses.

After that, I only wish for a Proteus Land Speeder and some plastic Dreadclaws. Well, Caestus Assault Ram can be re-released in plastic as well I suppose

Too bad that those Helmets are FW Resin.

They fit with those the 40k Plague Marines wear.

Really nice.

Hopefully, everybody has calmed down a little after the excitement of the Space Wolves helmets

No one can doubt that those folks at GW have humor....

I guess the sculptor for the helmets must've been a big Death Guard fan, and not really big on Space Wolves

The sculptor just remembered that if it isn't broken, you don't have to fix it.

 blood reaper wrote:
The sculptor just remembered that if it isn't broken, you don't have to fix it.

Spoiler:

Especially if it's from Jes Goodwin.

I really like these yeah. The order they’re revealing them in is baffling, though.

These look ace! Should I ever do another Legion then DG are a worthy contender.

mod edit - PLEASE stop quoting entire posts just to reply with a single sentence.

 blood reaper wrote:
The sculptor just remembered that if it isn't broken, you don't have to fix it.

Shame the most recent Plague Marine kit didn't take a hint

Far be it from me to defend the new plastic plague marines, but there are options for these style helmets. Just not in large enough quantities :(



(And yes, this is a Space Marine Hero, not a standard PM. But the kit still has the option)

I don't understand why so many of the Legion-specific MkVI helmets don't look like MkVI.

 Lord Damocles wrote:
I don't understand why so many of the Legion-specific MkVI helmets don't look like MkVI.

Very few Legions are really strongly associated with Mk VI

 Lord Damocles wrote:
I don't understand why so many of the Legion-specific MkVI helmets don't look like MkVI.

At the risk of sounding churlish, I’m not sure they’re meant to, so much as Look Recognisably Legion.

MkVI has such a distinctive helmet, it’s hard to tie to a Legion and keep that Womble aesthetic. I’d rather what we’re getting (not so much Space Woofs), than Womble Helmets With A Legion Icon somewhere.

Those Death Guard helmets look amazing. They also serve the role of having a true scale, somewhat-Mark III-looking Death Guard army without having to buy the actual Mark III kits (which are now officially out of stock).

 Lord Damocles wrote:
I don't understand why so many of the Legion-specific MkVI helmets don't look like MkVI.

But it does? This is literally Mk VI helmet with 'hounskull' part replaced with flat respirator grill like in several other legion upgrades (funnily enough, defeating whole point as the missing bit is full of sensors and filtration elements not to mention angled armor deflecting hits away from face making it better than other SM helmets, but that's what you get when inept legion designers care more about looks than functionality). Yes it's inspired by Mk III look but if you look closer, it's Mk VI still and the resemblance is largely superficial.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I don't particularly want to see close combat marine variants handled with an upgrade sprue for MkVI. The MkVI poses in the tactical set are too passively posed for a CC variant.

Yup, look at all these dynamic and totally not passive poses of previous Forge World CC units

 ImAGeek wrote:
Yeah, and there’s only 5 poses already.

As opposed to resin that often had 2-3 poses in 5 men squads?

I mean, yeah the FW models are static. But I don't know if that means GW will only release a melee upgrade sprue without having some alternative poses.

It is weird that these FW heads flip flop on whether the MK6 upgrade has the little sensor at the top (like these and the IW have)

 Irbis wrote:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
I don't understand why so many of the Legion-specific MkVI helmets don't look like MkVI.

But it does? This is literally Mk VI helmet with 'hounskull' part replaced with flat respirator grill like in several other legion upgrades (funnily enough, defeating whole point as the missing bit is full of sensors and filtration elements not to mention angled armor deflecting hits away from face making it better than other SM helmets, but that's what you get when inept legion designers care more about looks than functionality).

"It does look like MK VI helmet"

Proceeds to list exactly the reasons why it doesn't look like a MK VI helmet

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

 Irbis wrote:

 Lord Damocles wrote:
I don't understand why so many of the Legion-specific MkVI helmets don't look like MkVI.

But it does? This is literally Mk VI helmet with 'hounskull' part replaced with flat respirator grill like in several other legion upgrades (funnily enough, defeating whole point as the missing bit is full of sensors and filtration elements not to mention angled armor deflecting hits away from face making it better than other SM helmets, but that's what you get when inept legion designers care more about looks than functionality).

"It does look like MK VI helmet"

Proceeds to list exactly the reasons why it doesn't look like a MK VI helmet

But good on Irbis for defending... something... I guess.

Regarding FW’s boring looking assault marines, I’d much rather have them than a marine dancing on a flying stand, legs akimbo.

Look at the differences in Tactical Intercessors and Assault Intercessors both only have 5 poses. This would kinda indicate what direction (Sprue-wise) at least that the breacher, assault, despoiler, etc.

Fairly neutral poses, as in the mkvi marines work better for duplication than overly dramatic poses repeated. Also easier to convert a neutral pose to dramatic than the reverse.

Please GW no flight stands or jumping off rocks for assault marines!

Well, these seem unambiguously great to me. They knocked it out of the park on this one. Might make me do Death Guard to be honest.

At a minimum I'd hope any mk VI assaults would be as dynamic as the 2nd version of the FW MK VI's

RazorEdge wrote:
Too bad that those Helmets are FW Resin.

Is that really that big a problem when it's one piece/single part helmets and shoulder pads?

I hate resin as much as the next guy, and would prefer plastic any time, but... they're just helmets.

I have zero issues with Helmets, paulrons, torsos etc being resin....most of my primaris have mkiii/iv FW pauldron.

Large chunks like storm eagle(hybrid) kit make me want to run into a wall...face first without benefit of PCP(not that Elephant tranquilizer is a benefiit)!

 Irbis wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I don't particularly want to see close combat marine variants handled with an upgrade sprue for MkVI. The MkVI poses in the tactical set are too passively posed for a CC variant.

Yup, look at all these dynamic and totally not passive poses of previous Forge World CC units

Spoiler:

 ImAGeek wrote:
Yeah, and there’s only 5 poses already.

As opposed to resin that often had 2-3 poses in 5 men squads?

I never said I was a big fan of the existing resins one, lol. At least there's 2 walking stances instead of only 1 as in the tac marine set I guess. Interestingly the MkIV Despoiler squad has a set of running legs that didn't make it into the Assault squad.

But yeah, not the biggest fan of the FW MkIV assault marines, the MkV is a bit more dynamic but still not my favourite kit in the world.

To me, the logical thing would be to make a Despoiler squad, then just have an upgrade sprue with jump packs that you can buy separately.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
Too bad that those Helmets are FW Resin.

Is that really that big a problem when it's one piece/single part helmets and shoulder pads?

I hate resin as much as the next guy, and would prefer plastic any time, but... they're just helmets.

It's mainly the price, $3AUD per head is a bit much.

If we’re wishlisting id love to see some 30k terrain. Specifically pre-theocracy Imperial architecture, possibly not even ruined.

Non-ruined buildings? That really is Heresy...

The Fronteris stuff is both not ruined and not covered in skulls

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 Irbis wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I don't particularly want to see close combat marine variants handled with an upgrade sprue for MkVI. The MkVI poses in the tactical set are too passively posed for a CC variant.

Yup, look at all these dynamic and totally not passive poses of previous Forge World CC units

Spoiler:

 ImAGeek wrote:
Yeah, and there’s only 5 poses already.

As opposed to resin that often had 2-3 poses in 5 men squads?

I never said I was a big fan of the existing resins one, lol. At least there's 2 walking stances instead of only 1 as in the tac marine set I guess. Interestingly the MkIV Despoiler squad has a set of running legs that didn't make it into the Assault squad.

But yeah, not the biggest fan of the FW MkIV assault marines, the MkV is a bit more dynamic but still not my favourite kit in the world.

To me, the logical thing would be to make a Despoiler squad, then just have an upgrade sprue with jump packs that you can buy separately.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

RazorEdge wrote:
Too bad that those Helmets are FW Resin.

Is that really that big a problem when it's one piece/single part helmets and shoulder pads?

I hate resin as much as the next guy, and would prefer plastic any time, but... they're just helmets.

It's mainly the price, $3AUD per head is a bit much.

For your entire army I agree. But, it’s not too bad to tart up a Veteran squad here and there. Just little touches to help them stand out.

it's probably not financially viable to special helmet up an entire army unless you're capable of taking the official Forgeworld parts and making copies of them, like I did by copying my dark angel praetor head to slap on the bald calth praetor

You can also print them, and the STLs will be out weeks before the official pack.

Mkiii/iv back in stock on the US webstore, with no email notification...way to go GW!

Glad I snagged 2, been waiting....

Yeah I'm so glad I'm into molding and casting. It's opened up so many annoying possibilities. Kit comes with parts to make 20 models if you could just duplicate 5 parts? No problem!

axotl wrote:
Yeah I'm so glad I'm into molding and casting. It's opened up so many annoying possibilities. Kit comes with parts to make 20 models if you could just duplicate 5 parts? No problem!

What is your preferred product? I've looked into this before and when I've found pics/videos of people doing it, it always looks a bit bleh.

Some dudes plagiated the new DG Helmets already in less than 24h and put them online on a 3D Printing Database Site... Looks more like someone leaked the original files and turned them in STLs than self designed...

Mk4 are back on german GW Web Store too.

Copying is easy requiring zero talent.

tneva82 wrote:
Copying is easy requiring zero talent.

You really didn't think this through, did you, given the Death Guard helmets are basically just copied from earlier models

tneva82 wrote:
Copying is easy requiring zero talent.

Sounds like you've found a way to get rich quick, just fire up Blender and crank out a few armies

Racerguy180 wrote:
Mkiii/iv back in stock on the US webstore, with no email notification...way to go GW!

Glad I snagged 2, been waiting....

And MkIV gone again already.

Mark III are still up, at least

I got an email two weeks a go and when i looked on the site they where still out of stock.
So i did click the link in my email and i could order them an they arrived yesterday.

 skeleton wrote:
I got an email two weeks a go and when i looked on the site they where still out of stock.
So i did click the link in my email and i could order them an they arrived yesterday.

The category pages don't always update when things come back in stock - you need to check the individual product page.

In a rare criticism from me?

I really wish GW would sort out their website stock indicators.

1. I know it’s pretty lazy of me, but I don’t want have to, and frankly shouldn’t have to, click through to know what is and isn’t.

2. If it’s temporarily out of stock, the serial “no I don’t know what they get out of it either” whiners won’t get such open goals when something is only sold out and in fact awaiting a new production run.

Duymon wrote:
At a minimum I'd hope any mk VI assaults would be as dynamic as the 2nd version of the FW MK VI's

Maybe it's just me, but I find there's something quite unnatural about those poses. Like the weight of the model isn't in the right spot and the angles of the legs aren't right (the dude with his right leg high in the air looks like a dog lifting it's leg to take a leak). Are the torsos separate on those? Some of them (top right and bottom right) feel like the torsos are twisting too far into an unnatural position.

Part of it is the the feet aren't flush. For most SM models these days, the boot is bent as if its in contact with the ground and as if the foot is flexing.

These are just precariously balanced (though probably blu-tacked) on the base. So they look both floaty and unnaturally stiff.

I think the mkvi shown above look like a person standing in an action pose vs an actual action, say running or walking, being captured as in a photo/frame of a video. It makes them look subtly off. The new mkvi look much more natural.

Either/Or wrote:
I think the mkvi shown above look like a person standing in an action pose vs an actual action, say running or walking, being captured as in a photo/frame of a video. It makes them look subtly off. The new mkvi look much more natural.

%100. I like a lot of the vehicles that FW has made, but the posture and the proportions of their marines are consistently poor, unfortunately. The new plastics are an enormous improvement.

Those mk6 just stuck on the bases like that do look odd, but they are far superior for posing and sticking in your own poses. I feel like they were designed for that rather than just to be stuck to the base in those unnatural looking "stock" poses

I have a large amount of the resin mk6 in my raven guard but also 40 of the plastic mk6 from the box and both have their pros and cons. The plastics are still wonderful for quickly putting dudes together as the stock poses are very good and each marine goes together in a couple of minutes, while the resin takes a lot longer to get a result. More potential, but a lot more work to get that potential.

Some of the issue is that normally feet are kept forwards when running, but the wide stance of older sm models and angles on some of the joints makes the legs twist instead. And also the waists on at least two of them are over twisted.

I wonder if we will get like breacher upgrade and assault upgradd.

I think a mix of the 2(plastic/resin mkvi) would give the most variety(as of yet) posing

Yes those running poses look bad, whether they're wholly unrealistic I'm not sure (I have heard that when modelling a motion like this it's better to go with a less realistic but aesthetically more pleasing pose, but like I say idk). One thing for sure I don't like is how they all have leading foot planted and trailing foot raised. I think this always looks worse when trying to convey motion, I think this configuration should be used for 20% of the squad, not 100% as is the case here.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
In a rare criticism from me?

I really wish GW would sort out their website stock indicators.

1. I know it’s pretty lazy of me, but I don’t want have to, and frankly shouldn’t have to, click through to know what is and isn’t.

2. If it’s temporarily out of stock, the serial “no I don’t know what they get out of it either” whiners won’t get such open goals when something is only sold out and in fact awaiting a new production run.

it would be good wouldn't it?

but clearly they won't as their software backend isn't great given all the issues they have with it

and even if it wasn't i sadly suspect market research shows that making you click through to the actual product page to find out if it's in stock or not (if only so you can click a notify me when it's back link which it would also be nice if GW would fix)

Racerguy180 wrote:
I think a mix of the 2(plastic/resin mkvi) would give the most variety(as of yet) posing

This would be true, but the resin MKVI have:
• larger helmets
• smaller backpacks (with a different joining mechanism)
• larger hands
• shorter thighs

Therefore, mixing and matching the new plastic MKVI and older FW resin MKVI requires quite a lot of conversion work. Not sure it's wort the effort in most cases. Better to wait a while longer and getting the Assault Squad torsos to go with the 5 tac torsos we already have with the AoD kits.

Voss wrote:
Part of it is the the feet aren't flush. For most SM models these days, the boot is bent as if its in contact with the ground and as if the foot is flexing.

These are just precariously balanced (though probably blu-tacked) on the base. So they look both floaty and unnaturally stiff.

Yes! That's part of it, I hadn't noticed until you mentioned it. Though I don't think that's the only thing.

They're all flat footed.

20 or so years ago when I went to convert Blood Claws charging forward, I'd cut the "toes" off the marine and glue it at an angle like the model is springing forward. So teenage me had a better idea of how to create dynamic Space Marine poses than FW do?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Either/Or wrote:
I think the mkvi shown above look like a person standing in an action pose vs an actual action, say running or walking, being captured as in a photo/frame of a video. It makes them look subtly off. The new mkvi look much more natural.

Yeah, it feels a bit like a static person standing in an action pose rather than an actual action shot.

I think part of it is what Voss said, but I still think there's more to it than that.

I think the weight is in the wrong place on a lot of them. I think it comes from the hips? The hips need to be leaning towards the direction of motion, but in those models they're very upright.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Bobug wrote:
Those mk6 just stuck on the bases like that do look odd, but they are far superior for posing and sticking in your own poses. I feel like they were designed for that rather than just to be stuck to the base in those unnatural looking "stock" poses

I have a large amount of the resin mk6 in my raven guard but also 40 of the plastic mk6 from the box and both have their pros and cons. The plastics are still wonderful for quickly putting dudes together as the stock poses are very good and each marine goes together in a couple of minutes, while the resin takes a lot longer to get a result. More potential, but a lot more work to get that potential.

I'd have to see some better built versions. Certainly the torso isn't doing the models any favours, but I think the root of the problem is in the legs, so maybe you can mitigate it with better posing of the arms/torso/head but I feel like they'd still look a bit "off".

Those MKVI look so unnatural because their legs are too far apart. People run with their legs close together and straight back, where as those ones have "split" thighs like they're standing in a braced position, just with one leg thrown back. Their forward leg is also very straight, as if they're standing still, rather than bent from the impact from the previous step or ready to explode into the next. You can get a similar, and equally unnatural positioning, with a little bit of cut work on 3/5 of the MKVI in the new kit.

At best those guys look like they're taking their absolute first step in a run, but even then they're too flat flooted.

You can get pretty good running stances with 2/5 of the new MKVI, specifically the two with the left legs you attach, by simply swapping the designated legs. A little bit of filing / cutting will make the bend more dramatic and the stance believable for someone actually in motion.

 morganfreeman wrote:


...

You can get pretty good running stances with 2/5 of the new MKVI, specifically the two with the left legs you attach, by simply swapping the designated legs. A little bit of filing / cutting will make the bend more dramatic and the stance believable for someone actually in motion.

Do you have any picts of such conversions? Very interested in any mods to the new MKVI kit models

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
In a rare criticism from me?

I really wish GW would sort out their website stock indicators.

1. I know it’s pretty lazy of me, but I don’t want have to, and frankly shouldn’t have to, click through to know what is and isn’t.

2. If it’s temporarily out of stock, the serial “no I don’t know what they get out of it either” whiners won’t get such open goals when something is only sold out and in fact awaiting a new production run.

I just wish GW would axe that embarrassment of a website that Tom Kirbys wife made and was paid 5million£ for.

It's a relic of web design 1.0 and I know of some anglefire and geocities sites that looked more professional then it does.


I do like the DG heads. But in all honesty its really hard to mess up DG heads.

I would kill for Mk2 armour in either plastic or resin. Please bring back the old SKU's that middle management culled after Mr Bligh passed away. Stuff like the only generic Mechanicus HQ unit, the knight Atropos, the volcano cannon ordinatus, macrocarid explorer would be kinda nice.

 Mr_Rose wrote:
If we’re wishlisting id love to see some 30k terrain. Specifically pre-theocracy Imperial architecture, possibly not even ruined.

Correct. With a nice flat roof to place your tac squads on.

Death Guard MTO coming next weekend (with some random SW torsos):

Some FW order stuff next week.

Death Guard Cataphractii Shoulder Pads, MkIII Torsos and Space Wolf MkIII Shoulder Pads. And yes they again rip on the MkVI helmets, describing them as “everyone’s favourite” helmet.

Oh, excellent. The old cataphractii pads are being brought back!

 zedmeister wrote:
Oh, excellent. The old cataphractii pads are being brought back!

Didnt they only make cat pads for like 6 legions then stop?

Yeah the majority of Legions missed out.

They actually designed Cataphractii pads for all 18 legions but Tony C vetoed it and we only ever received a handful. Another galaxy brain decision from FW

 Marshal Loss wrote:
They actually designed Cataphractii pads for all 18 legions but Tony C vetoed it and we only ever received a handful. Another galaxy brain decision from FW

Source on this? Sounds like a standard FW move though.

 MajorWesJanson wrote:

 zedmeister wrote:
Oh, excellent. The old cataphractii pads are being brought back!

Didnt they only make cat pads for like 6 legions then stop?

Yeah, the Alpha Legion and Iron Hands ones were particularly good

 Marshal Loss wrote:
They actually designed Cataphractii pads for all 18 legions but Tony C vetoed it and we only ever received a handful. Another galaxy brain decision from FW

If that’s true, then it probably had something to do with how much money they weren’t making on them.

With all the excitement about new plastic kits, it’s easy to forget that not long ago, Heresy was in a pretty dire state with many kits discontinued. I’m hoping we might see some of them making a return…




… macrocarid explorator.

If we're reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally lucky and all be good little boys and girls and piss in GW's pockets enough about how much we love 2.0 then maybe they'll release the rest of the cataphracii pads that good nixed.



Maybe.



Maybe...




Maybe not.

Or.... yes, maybe...

 tauist wrote:

 morganfreeman wrote:


...

You can get pretty good running stances with 2/5 of the new MKVI, specifically the two with the left legs you attach, by simply swapping the designated legs. A little bit of filing / cutting will make the bend more dramatic and the stance believable for someone actually in motion.

Do you have any picts of such conversions? Very interested in any mods to the new MKVI kit models

I don't know how to embed images, so here's a link to some quick pictures I took this morning

https://imgur.com/a/NG45xGW

These are pretty basic and very sloppy conversions, primarily because I didn't have any green / grey stuff on hand to gap fill and don't mind some sloppiness in general line infantry (I'll have 80+ of these mother fethers). But good for a basic idea of what you can get with a relatively simple leg swap and a little bit of cutting.

Doesn’t really count as news but they finally updated the Imperial Fists Terminator Praetor page and description to the correct armour type.

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/imperial-fists-legion-terminator-praetor-2021

 morganfreeman wrote:

 tauist wrote:

 morganfreeman wrote:


...

You can get pretty good running stances with 2/5 of the new MKVI, specifically the two with the left legs you attach, by simply swapping the designated legs. A little bit of filing / cutting will make the bend more dramatic and the stance believable for someone actually in motion.

Do you have any picts of such conversions? Very interested in any mods to the new MKVI kit models

I don't know how to embed images, so here's a link to some quick pictures I took this morning

https://imgur.com/a/Ka5Dk78

These are pretty basic and very sloppy conversions, primarily because I didn't have any green / grey stuff on hand to gap fill and don't mind some sloppiness in general line infantry (I'll have 80+ of these mother fethers). But good for a basic idea of what you can get with a relatively simple leg swap and a little bit of cutting.

Much obliged sir! I downloaded your pict and will try to reverse engineer what you did. Left legs are pieces numbered 3, 15, 21 & 28 (whole leg), So I'm assuming you just use the pieces 3, 15 and 21 with the "wrong" torsos..?

 ImAGeek wrote:
Doesn’t really count as news but they finally updated the Imperial Fists Terminator Praetor page and description to the correct armour type.

https://www.forgeworld.co.uk/en-GB/imperial-fists-legion-terminator-praetor-2021

Wow, only took 'em months.

 blood reaper wrote:

 Marshal Loss wrote:
They actually designed Cataphractii pads for all 18 legions but Tony C vetoed it and we only ever received a handful. Another galaxy brain decision from FW

Source on this? Sounds like a standard FW move though.

The designer told me & others at a Horus Heresy Weekender years back. Wasn't much of a surprise after Mark Bedford spoke about the same thing happening with his Myrmidon weapon packs during a seminar

 Snrub wrote:
If we're reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally lucky and all be good little boys and girls and piss in GW's pockets enough about how much we love 2.0 then maybe they'll release the rest of the cataphracii pads that good nixed.



Maybe.



Maybe...




Maybe not.

Or we could just stop supporting them. The only way a capitalist is taught a lesson is when sales stop. There are many other fine games on the market, some much cheaper and better supported with rules than Warhammer.

Maybe take that argument to a forum for those better supported games then?

 Togusa wrote:
Or we could just stop supporting them. The only way a capitalist is taught a lesson is when sales stop. There are many other fine games on the market, some much cheaper and better supported with rules than Warhammer.

How is that in any way related to what I posted?

 tauist wrote:

 morganfreeman wrote:

 tauist wrote:

 morganfreeman wrote:


...

You can get pretty good running stances with 2/5 of the new MKVI, specifically the two with the left legs you attach, by simply swapping the designated legs. A little bit of filing / cutting will make the bend more dramatic and the stance believable for someone actually in motion.

Do you have any picts of such conversions? Very interested in any mods to the new MKVI kit models

I don't know how to embed images, so here's a link to some quick pictures I took this morning

https://imgur.com/a/NG45xGW

These are pretty basic and very sloppy conversions, primarily because I didn't have any green / grey stuff on hand to gap fill and don't mind some sloppiness in general line infantry (I'll have 80+ of these mother fethers). But good for a basic idea of what you can get with a relatively simple leg swap and a little bit of cutting.

Much obliged sir! I downloaded your pict and will try to reverse engineer what you did. Left legs are pieces numbered 3, 15, 21 & 28 (whole leg), So I'm assuming you just use the pieces 3, 15 and 21 with the "wrong" torsos..?

Didn't realize imgur was twitching out and only took one picture, so I fixed the link and got the other two.

I'm not sure of the specific part numbers (I actually just matched the pegs / slots originally), but a basic run down is this:

For the left legs, swap them between the only two hip-parts that are missing left legs. Ergo use each one with the other part. File down / cut off the peg / nub in each one that slots onto the respective leg. You can just glue these flat and it'll look alright. Alternatively you can cut the left leg a bit, basically removing the 'joint' section from the part which is connected to the torso, and then attach the leg. Doing so will give you a more dramatic sweep and show greater movement / momentum. You can even cut farther up / deeper for more, but it'll start to look super tacky if you go to far.

For the one which has no feet (the one on the left in the images), use the appropriate right 'foot'. I never found a reason to swap that out or modify it, as it's basically perfectly suited for looking like it's running already.

 morganfreeman wrote:

 tauist wrote:

 morganfreeman wrote:

 tauist wrote:

 morganfreeman wrote:


...

You can get pretty good running stances with 2/5 of the new MKVI, specifically the two with the left legs you attach, by simply swapping the designated legs. A little bit of filing / cutting will make the bend more dramatic and the stance believable for someone actually in motion.

Do you have any picts of such conversions? Very interested in any mods to the new MKVI kit models

I don't know how to embed images, so here's a link to some quick pictures I took this morning

https://imgur.com/a/NG45xGW

These are pretty basic and very sloppy conversions, primarily because I didn't have any green / grey stuff on hand to gap fill and don't mind some sloppiness in general line infantry (I'll have 80+ of these mother fethers). But good for a basic idea of what you can get with a relatively simple leg swap and a little bit of cutting.

Much obliged sir! I downloaded your pict and will try to reverse engineer what you did. Left legs are pieces numbered 3, 15, 21 & 28 (whole leg), So I'm assuming you just use the pieces 3, 15 and 21 with the "wrong" torsos..?

Didn't realize imgur was twitching out and only took one picture, so I fixed the link and got the other two.

I'm not sure of the specific part numbers (I actually just matched the pegs / slots originally), but a basic run down is this:

For the left legs, swap them between the only two hip-parts that are missing left legs. Ergo use each one with the other part. File down / cut off the peg / nub in each one that slots onto the respective leg. You can just glue these flat and it'll look alright. Alternatively you can cut the left leg a bit, basically removing the 'joint' section from the part which is connected to the torso, and then attach the leg. Doing so will give you a more dramatic sweep and show greater movement / momentum. You can even cut farther up / deeper for more, but it'll start to look super tacky if you go to far.

For the one which has no feet (the one on the left in the images), use the appropriate right 'foot'. I never found a reason to swap that out or modify it, as it's basically perfectly suited for looking like it's running already.

You're a saint and a scholar!

cheers

 Togusa wrote:

 Snrub wrote:
If we're reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally lucky and all be good little boys and girls and piss in GW's pockets enough about how much we love 2.0 then maybe they'll release the rest of the cataphracii pads that good nixed.



Maybe.



Maybe...




Maybe not.

Or we could just stop supporting them. The only way a capitalist is taught a lesson is when sales stop. There are many other fine games on the market, some much cheaper and better supported with rules than Warhammer.

Yes, the lesson they will learn when sales stop is "theres no demand for this product, discontinue everything" - which is the opposite of what we actually want to occur.

Horus Ascended. Coming next year from FW, in resin.



NOVA Open Reveals – The Warmaster Is Ascendant in His Monstrous New Model

So Emps is absolutely next up in the character series, isn't he?

Nah, there’s like four or five “ascended” primarchs yet unless they decide to use the plastic daemon primarchs for them instead.

 Mr_Rose wrote:
Nah, there’s like four or five “ascended” primarchs yet unless they decide to use the plastic daemon primarchs for them instead.

Five? Well,

this model is the first in a new Character Series from Forge World, representing each of the Primarchs at the height of the Heresy – whether they’re fully under the sway of Chaos, or rallying to defend the Imperium in its darkest hour – giving us a fresh look at the driving characters of this epic saga as they lead their Legions into the biggest battles.

10 years until we see Khan on his jetbike...

 zedmeister wrote:

 Mr_Rose wrote:
Nah, there’s like four or five “ascended” primarchs yet unless they decide to use the plastic daemon primarchs for them instead.

Five? Well,

this model is the first in a new Character Series from Forge World, representing each of the Primarchs at the height of the Heresy – whether they’re fully under the sway of Chaos, or rallying to defend the Imperium in its darkest hour – giving us a fresh look at the driving characters of this epic saga as they lead their Legions into the biggest battles.

10 years until we see Khan on his jetbike...

I always wanted a model of Ferrus's headless corpse strewn on the battlefield!

this model is the first in a new Character Series from Forge World, representing each of the Primarchs at the height of the Heresy – whether they’re fully under the sway of Chaos, or rallying to defend the Imperium in its darkest hour – giving us a fresh look at the driving characters of this epic saga as they lead their Legions into the biggest battles.

So.....we doing all the loyalist Primarchs but now they're looking angry? Althought I would like to see fallen-but-not-yet-a-demon-prince versions of Lorgar and Morty

The only thing I don't like about that model is the base. Would've preferred the steps inside the Vengeful Spirit, no doubt to match an equally chonky Emperor mini.

Otherwise it's simply fantastic.

Edit: wrong thread lmao

Hmm. Ascended Daemon Primarchs. We’ve pretty much got 3 out of 4 Big Boys in plastic, and let’s face it Fulgrim is all but a given in those stakes.

Not sure how I feel about Normal, Resin Daemon and Plastic Daemon ones. I mean, Angry Ron in particular is clearly and noticeably informed by his Heresy mini.

It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, they do to throw Iron hands players a bone during this series - it ain't like they're going to want to buy "Ferrus Manus' decapitated corpse" as a figure, after all.

Yeah, I worry that if they do more ascended Primarchs they'll start with the main 4.

I'd rather they stick to Logar, Peturabo and... umm... would anyone else have ascended beyond those two? Conrad died. I doubt Alpharius would have. So really just those two.

 Dysartes wrote:
It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, they do to throw Iron hands players a bone during this series - it ain't like they're going to want to buy "Ferrus Manus' decapitated corpse" as a figure, after all.

Emperor's Children player might.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The only thing I don't like about that model is the base. Would've preferred the steps inside the Vengeful Spirit, no doubt to match an equally chonky Emperor mini.

Otherwise it's simply fantastic.

No doubt that when the Emperor is released thay'll also have a super special limited bundle of both him and Horus together with a unique diorama base like they did for Sanguinius so he could later be posed with Ka'Bandha

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yeah, I worry that if they do more ascended Primarchs they'll start with the main 4.

I'd rather they stick to Logar, Peturabo and... umm... would anyone else have ascended beyond those two? Conrad died. I doubt Alpharius would have. So really just those two.

Konrad was still around at the Siege I thought? Always been my understanding he didn’t let himself get all assassinated until at least The Scouring?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yeah, I worry that if they do more ascended Primarchs they'll start with the main 4.

I'd rather they stick to Logar, Peturabo and... umm... would anyone else have ascended beyond those two? Conrad died. I doubt Alpharius would have. So really just those two.

If they're talking height of the Heresy, that would seem to rule out Kurze and Alpha/Omega as Daemon Princes, though not as models - did Perty and/or Lorgar go DP during the Heresy or afterwards, though? My memory of their timelines are a bit fuzzy.

I would expect to see a bit more of an impressive, Chaos-fueled Lorgar this time around, though - never really been a fan of Lorgar's series 1 sculpt.

Looking forward to the updated Siege of Terra version of Dorn, chainsmoking and on a scenic base littered with used Adderall bottles.

 xttz wrote:
Looking forward to the updated Siege of Terra version of Dorn, chainsmoking and on a scenic base littered with used Adderall bottles.

And with a handlebar moustache!

 Dysartes wrote:
It'll be interesting to see what, if anything, they do to throw Iron hands players a bone during this series - it ain't like they're going to want to buy "Ferrus Manus' decapitated corpse" as a figure, after all.

IH are my legion. Am I sad that I won´t get a new Primarch? Nope cuz they are stupidly expensive. In addition I like to use non-special characters in HQ slots. So in the end I am not missing out on anything.

I'm looking forward to the Ghost of Ferrus appearing during the siege to kick ass so they can justify making a model for him

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Hmm. Ascended Daemon Primarchs. We’ve pretty much got 3 out of 4 Big Boys in plastic, and let’s face it Fulgrim is all but a given in those stakes.

Not sure how I feel about Normal, Resin Daemon and Plastic Daemon ones. I mean, Angry Ron in particular is clearly and noticeably informed by his Heresy mini.

I doubt we'll see the big 4 in resin. As you say, Angron is clearly influenced by his Heresy art and both Magnus and Mortarion have Heresy art that is just their plastic 40K models.

I love the model but I can't help but giggle a bit that they have to primarisize the original primarch.

 warboss wrote:

Spoiler:

I love the model but I can't help but giggle a bit that they have to primarisize the original primarch.

To be fair, only forgeworld models are so tiny. Especially the original Horus Heresy marines lol

I stayed up until 3 AM just to find out there won't be any more HH plastics for months.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I stayed up until 3 AM just to find out there won't be any more HH plastics for months.

This is my take as well, minus the staying up late.

It's a cool model, but is worthless outside of to SoH players and "collectors".

Whelp, guess it's back to relying on 3rd party 3D printed bits.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yeah, I worry that if they do more ascended Primarchs they'll start with the main 4.

I'd rather they stick to Logar, Peturabo and... umm... would anyone else have ascended beyond those two? Conrad died. I doubt Alpharius would have. So really just those two.

I'd be surprised if they go for the God-aligned Primarchs. Of the three we have in plastic (well almost three), only Magnus isn't in that form by the Siege. It's a bit weird with Magnus though since unlike the rest of the Traitor Primarchs, there's never really a set time for when he becomes a true Daemon Primarch. He does kind of explode a bit on Terra but he seems to just be regular old Magnus when he meets with Horus and his brothers.
Angron gets forcefully ascended on Nuceria during the Shadow Crusade, Mortarion goes Daemon en route to Terra and Fulgrim is first when he kicks about in the Eye with Perturabo.
That being said it all depends on what exactly the article means when it says the "height" of the Heresy. After all, Horus becomes empowered by the Pantheon during 09.M31 and the Siege begins at 14.M31. Both Fulgrim and Angron become Daemons before Horus gets to Molech, however and with the upcoming plastic Angron I doubt we'll see a new resin version of him.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I stayed up until 3 AM just to find out there won't be any more HH plastics for months.

Was there any mention of when the Mechanicum book will be available in the US?

Nope, but those things never really get mentioned on preview streams nor Warhammer Community.

 Tannhauser42 wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
I stayed up until 3 AM just to find out there won't be any more HH plastics for months.

Was there any mention of when the Mechanicum book will be available in the US?

Not yet, nor would they - its not the kind of thing they discuss, and in the past when product to the US has been delayed they have a tendency not to follow up on it with any sort of announcement or anything, it just shows up at retail without fanfare.

 warboss wrote:

Spoiler:

I love the model but I can't help but giggle a bit that they have to primarisize the original primarch.

Have they? I'm not going to necessarily argue that it's a worthwhile use of resources but an 'ascended' version of Horus is a fairly established concept and I'm not even convinced this new one is that much bigger physically than the non-juiced up version.

JimmyWolf87 wrote:

 warboss wrote:

Spoiler:

I love the model but I can't help but giggle a bit that they have to primarisize the original primarch.

Have they? I'm not going to necessarily argue that it's a worthwhile use of resources but an 'ascended' version of Horus is a fairly established concept and I'm not even convinced this new one is that much bigger physically than the non-juiced up version.

If the picture is to be believed, it's a bit of an upsize.

Aren't a lot of the Primarch models a bit undersized currently? Does Horus fall into that category?

I'm a bit torn, on the one hand I'd rather they work on new stuff instead of revising existing models that are only used infrequently, on the other hand, some of the current Primarchs are a bit underwhelming and I'd like to see them take another stab at them.

Heresy Thursday – Assassinate Enemy Infiltrators With Their Own Weapons

Clade Vanus Infocyte Assassin:

Yeah a lot of Primarchs are somewhat undersized

Lorgar, for one, iirc, was basically the size of the new super-sized Praetors

Something unexpected...

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/01/heresy-thursday-assassinate-enemy-infiltrators-with-their-own-weapons/

It also sounds like there may be other kinds of new assassins coming.

The Vanus Assassin, I have to say, is one I never thought would see the tabletops.

They always struck me as an information warrior, the type of Assassin who ruins the reputations of their targets and gets their people to turn against them. Like if there was a 41st Millennium version of Twitter, and cancellation literally meant death.

Twin pistols and mechadendrites is not the image that came to mind.

I like the Vanus model, and hopefully opens up some interesting tactics.

A tabard is a bit of a weird choice for an Assassin in 40k TBH, but otherwise that's quite fun.

Wow, that's an amazing model! I could definitely use her in Inq28 or something similar.

Damn you, FW. Just when I find enough excuses to avoid the hassle/cost of your products, you drop this on us!

Cypher226 wrote:
I like the Vanus model, and hopefully opens up some interesting tactics.

The description sounds like it will be variations of the trope "Stop Hitting Yourself". I am guessing from calling down the enemy bombardment on their own forces, getting automata to register their own forces as hostile and firing on them, etc...

However if they are even on the battlefield at all, then surely something must already have gone wrong.

Iracundus wrote:

Cypher226 wrote:
I like the Vanus model, and hopefully opens up some interesting tactics.

The description sounds like it will be variations of the trope "Stop Hitting Yourself". I am guessing from calling down the enemy bombardment on their own forces, getting automata to register their own forces as hostile and firing on them, etc...

However if they are even on the battlefield at all, then surely something must already have gone wrong.

Ooh! A Titan! Let see how we can alter your firing solutions...

OK, yeah that’s completely unexpected. Neat though. Wonder if she’ll get 40K rules? Be funny if she can h4XX0r Necrons…

 xttz wrote:
Something unexpected...

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/01/heresy-thursday-assassinate-enemy-infiltrators-with-their-own-weapons/

It also sounds like there may be other kinds of new assassins coming.

I think this may well be my favourite mini GW have ever made.

I’m so impressed with the Horus Ascended model. The Sons have always been a top contender for which legion I’d do and this might tip them over the line.

Love to see previously lore stuff get models - nice one too.

Now I want to see them against the Tau in 40K

Cannot wait for the Venenum Clade to get their mini.

Not sure what GW mean by new "character series" for the primarchs. Horus ascended is just a nicer model than the original and slightly better scaled - are they just going to bigify the primarchs?

As other people have pointed out we already have models for all the primarchs that went daemon before the end of the heresy (i.e. the seige), except for Fulgrim, so...?

 Boringstuff wrote:
Not sure what GW mean by new "character series" for the primarchs. Horus ascended is just a nicer model than the original and slightly better scaled - are they just going to bigify the primarchs?

As other people have pointed out we already have models for all the primarchs that went daemon before the end of the heresy (i.e. the seige), except for Fulgrim, so...?

You know, famous Primarchs at the tail end of the heresy. So trampled Sanguineous, modelled so Horus can use him as an alternative base, decapitated Ferrus strewn across the battlefield, Rogal Dorn as an armless skeleton and so on.

 Boringstuff wrote:
Not sure what GW mean by new "character series" for the primarchs. Horus ascended is just a nicer model than the original and slightly better scaled - are they just going to bigify the primarchs?

As other people have pointed out we already have models for all the primarchs that went daemon before the end of the heresy (i.e. the seige), except for Fulgrim, so...?

likely it'll be some of the older primarchs updated to look better (some of the older models haven't aged as well as they could have) and new weapons options. for example a lotta people I know are expecting we'll get Dorn with a sword and shield.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Wha-Mu-077 wrote:

 Boringstuff wrote:
Not sure what GW mean by new "character series" for the primarchs. Horus ascended is just a nicer model than the original and slightly better scaled - are they just going to bigify the primarchs?

As other people have pointed out we already have models for all the primarchs that went daemon before the end of the heresy (i.e. the seige), except for Fulgrim, so...?

You know, famous Primarchs at the tail end of the heresy. So trampled Sanguineous, modelled so Horus can use him as an alternative base, decapitated Ferrus strewn across the battlefield, Rogal Dorn as an armless skeleton and so on.

Dorn died well after the heresy and is a good example of what they could do given he's depicted with differant weapons in SOT


general thoughts on what we could see:

Dorn: Sword and Board
Gulliman: using the Gauntlets of Ultramar
Russ: using his spear.
Sanguinius: just an improved model but rules reflecting his "I WON'T DIE THIS DAY!" thing.
Jaghati Khan: On a jet bike
Alpharius: Headless as a display piece on Dorn's base... or Omegion
Ferrus: wasn't there a scene in MoM where he appers as basicly a "legionarrie of the damned"? that'd be a pretty awesome ferrus model
Perty: won't actually get a new mini so Iron Warriors can be salty about being ignored.(I joke I joke but he's a tough one as he's not changed much physically over the heresy and largely has used the same weaponry)
Lorgar: a chaos'd up Lorgar would be good, the guy took a level in bad ass following Istavan

 MonkeyBallistic wrote:

 xttz wrote:
Something unexpected...

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/01/heresy-thursday-assassinate-enemy-infiltrators-with-their-own-weapons/

It also sounds like there may be other kinds of new assassins coming.

I think this may well be my favourite mini GW have ever made.

Nice model but I am unsure how it fits in with the current stuff. Is it a legal option in either SM or Mechanicum list? I would have preferred more helm and shoulder pad images.

Is it plastic?

No idea, but I’m assuming Forgeworld for now.

I would point out that not all of the character series are Primarchs; I’ve just been reading Eye of Terra and Lorgar has a vision of a near Daemon Prince sized Argel Tal, so it’s entirely possible that they could be doing some of the secondary characters.

I think the image of Mortarian from SOT is far enough removed from his 40k form to justify another model tbh.

 Strg Alt wrote:

Nice model but I am unsure how it fits in with the current stuff. Is it a legal option in either SM or Mechanicum list? I would have preferred more helm and shoulder pad images.

Agents of the Emperor/Warmaster in the Imperial book probably.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
The Vanus Assassin, I have to say, is one I never thought would see the tabletops.

They always struck me as an information warrior, the type of Assassin who ruins the reputations of their targets and gets their people to turn against them. Like if there was a 41st Millennium version of Twitter, and cancellation literally meant death.

Twin pistols and mechadendrites is not the image that came to mind.

yup same here. but she will make a great base for female mechanicum models I reckons. I hope that is a data spike of somekind on her hand.

As for Horus, looks good. as usual the base is jank as hell but thats a easy fix. I don't think perty (I think it was the iron cage and offering up the Imperial Fists geneseed that elevated Perty finally to demon prince then going and playing with the daemoncabula in his spare time) and lorgar (I think logar asended on Sicarus then went into seclusion and hasn't been seen in 10,000 years or so) went full demon prince until after the siege but they may rewrite that in the books. i've only read the first two terra books so far.

im kinda sad that there is no new plastic stuff coming out soonish™/© as its a good way to bring in newish people who don't want to deal with resin. I mean the resin is there but choice is nice.

As for the BL books there are tons of stories yet to tell. The scouring lasted 7 years. the imperials dealing with the twin deaths of big e and mal. The traitors running for the EOT while stopping and stealing anything that isn't bolted down along the way. The IronCage with Dorn getting humbled by Perty, Death of Konrad Curze by M'Shen. The High lords sleezing their way into power and totally ruling in 'his name'. The retaking of Mars and purging of the dark mechanicum. The breaking up of the legions and the Grey knights re-appearing after years of training in the warp. I wonder if they will keep the Emperor lucid enough just to help them turn the Golden Throne into the monstrosity that it becomes and lay down some laws like Malcador the Hero, the breaking up of the Legions. Guilt tripping the remaining primarchs you know bad daddy stuff.

There is more then enough meat left on the bone to milk a Scouring Series for another decade. I hope ADB gets to write the death of Curze, I think hes earned it. I'd also like to see the Ironcage from both sides like A thousand sons/prospero burns was supposed to be.

We do still have enough upcoming releases for another month of heresy, then they will hopefully announce some new stuff. Predator, Land Raider, and 2 missing HW kits will make for another meaty wave, painful on the wallet.

beast_gts wrote:
Horus Ascended. Coming next year from FW, in resin.

Great... Can't wait for a late war dead Sanguineous. : T


Also, we get a niche assassin and yet nothing new for core units.

ADB has already written the death of curze in the night lords trilogy.

This has become a thread where I now need to worry about spoilers for the HH novels, lol.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
This has become a thread where I now need to worry about spoilers for the HH novels, lol.

Horus kills Dumbledore

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Horus kills Dumbledore

Now that would have been a real twist ending.

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Horus kills Dumbledore

Is that before or after Spock tells Horus "No, I am your Father"?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
This has become a thread where I now need to worry about spoilers for the HH novels, lol.

Spoiler:

Horus loses.

I was very nervous on whether I should click "show spoiler" or not

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I was very nervous on whether I should click "show spoiler" or not

It's 100% something you already know.

If it's not, then wowee, do you have a spoiler incoming!

"I was there the day Rosebud slew the emperor"

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

 lord_blackfang wrote:
Horus kills Dumbledore

Is that before or after Spock tells Horus "No, I am your Father"?

The reply "it's morbin' time!" from Horus was genius.

 FabricatorGeneralMike wrote:
As for Horus, looks good. as usual the base is jank as hell but thats a easy fix. I don't think perty (I think it was the iron cage and offering up the Imperial Fists geneseed that elevated Perty finally to demon prince then going and playing with the daemoncabula in his spare time) and lorgar (I think logar asended on Sicarus then went into seclusion and hasn't been seen in 10,000 years or so) went full demon prince until after the siege but they may rewrite that in the books. i've only read the first two terra books so far.

Lorgar was exiled by Horus before the Siege and is likely already on Sicarus with Kor Phaeron building the new home of the Word Bearers.
The Iron Cage is when Perturabo ascends and that hasn't changed.

As for the BL books there are tons of stories yet to tell. The scouring lasted 7 years. the imperials dealing with the twin deaths of big e and mal. The traitors running for the EOT while stopping and stealing anything that isn't bolted down along the way. The IronCage with Dorn getting humbled by Perty, Death of Konrad Curze by M'Shen. The High lords sleezing their way into power and totally ruling in 'his name'. The retaking of Mars and purging of the dark mechanicum. The breaking up of the legions and the Grey knights re-appearing after years of training in the warp. I wonder if they will keep the Emperor lucid enough just to help them turn the Golden Throne into the monstrosity that it becomes and lay down some laws like Malcador the Hero, the breaking up of the Legions. Guilt tripping the remaining primarchs you know bad daddy stuff.

There is more then enough meat left on the bone to milk a Scouring Series for another decade. I hope ADB gets to write the death of Curze, I think hes earned it. I'd also like to see the Ironcage from both sides like A thousand sons/prospero burns was supposed to be.

I'd be surprised if we saw the Scouring in any great capacity as Dawn of Fire is GW's new "big series" to replace HH. At best we might get a last gathering of the Primarchs in the final Siege book where Guilliman proclaims his plans for rebuilding the Imperium but certainly not a series in the same vein as HH or even War of the Beast.
Also, ADB has done Curze's death already and the Grey Knights were let off the leash at the end of the War of the Beast around the same time the Inquisition split into the Ordos Xenos and Malleus.

I still wish we got more of the Great Crusade - now that's a setting that would be fun to game in...

And Isn't "Chaos Undivided" no longer a thing? (Or is it?)

Just who is ascending Lorgar and Perturabo, and how?

Do the big 4 still play a part...somehow?

Also, this will our chance to finally get an Omegon (as Alpharius) model!

(Will be same as existing, only without the spear?)

 Alpharius wrote:
And Isn't "Chaos Undivided" no longer a thing? (Or is it?)

It was, then it wasn't for a time, and now it is again.

I wasn't sure - thanks!

Do we have any pictures of Ascended Lorgar and Perturabo anywhere?

I don' think we do, but I'm not 100%.

Lorewise, post-Heresy, I think Lorgar was in a 10,000 year pout meditation and Petruabo was...pretty much also not doing much?

Lorgar

Perturabo did some stuff but generally, the Daemon Primarchs don't really leave the Warp unless they're really bored. The Great Game is much more important to them, even those dedicated to Chaos Undivided.
He orchestrated a civil war in his Legion to purge those he viewed as weak (classic dad moment), he made a machine plague that destroyed the Forge World of Toil in M32, and he helped Abbadon invade Medusa during the 10th Black Crusade (which needs to be rewritten because its utter guff) but didn't actually fight.
Perturabo mostly spent his time gathering data on Imperial defences in Segmentum Obscurus and when the Rift opened he launched a massive invasion. Then he lost a fight with Mortarion and the Death Guard as well.

 xttz wrote:
Something unexpected...

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/01/heresy-thursday-assassinate-enemy-infiltrators-with-their-own-weapons/

It also sounds like there may be other kinds of new assassins coming.

That's the nicest Necromunda figure in a while.

RazorEdge wrote:

"When I ascended to Chaos, everything about me became more mighty. The very ground rebels at my step. The air seems to vibrate, as if my presence offends it. Small animals freeze in terror, or simply die of shock. Plantlife moves at an unnatural rate, almost as if trying to leave my presence. I truly am a vessel of Chaos, ready to bring the galaxy to heel. My mace on the other hand did not grow... and just looks really tiny in my hands now. I wish my brothers would stop laughing at that behind my back..."

RazorEdge wrote:
Lorgar

So great ape lorgar..... Lovely I fess.

Boosykes wrote:

So great ape lorgar..... Lovely I fess.

Well, when rolling on the Chaos attributes table, sometimes one lucks out with iron hard skin and being able to breathe fire, other times it's short legs and uncontrollable flatulence. Ya roll the dice, ya take yer chance.

 Shakalooloo wrote:

Boosykes wrote:

So great ape lorgar..... Lovely I fess.

Well, when rolling on the Chaos attributes table, sometimes one lucks out with iron hard skin and being able to breathe fire, other times it's short legs and uncontrollable flatulence. Ya roll the dice, ya take yer chance.

Father, I accepted the gifts you chose to ref....'parp'.........

 Shakalooloo wrote:

Boosykes wrote:

So great ape lorgar..... Lovely I fess.

Well, when rolling on the Chaos attributes table, sometimes one lucks out with iron hard skin and being able to breathe fire, other times it's short legs and uncontrollable flatulence. Ya roll the dice, ya take yer chance.

Has anyone bought the decal sheet? If so, how big is it, as £20 for a sheet of decals feels incredibly high, but if it does genuinely give a long way then I guess its more palatable?

BigOscar wrote:
Has anyone bought the decal sheet? If so, how big is it, as £20 for a sheet of decals feels incredibly high, but if it does genuinely give a long way then I guess its more palatable?

Do you mean the decal sheets for the different legions? I bought the Space Wolves one back when it was still sold by FW. It's massively overpriced, but it's also pretty good. It's the size of an A4 sheet and in the case of the SW one, most of the single colour decals can be mirrors by applying them upside down (not sure if that's true for the other Legions).

The decals themselves are reasonably good quality, the carrier film is pretty thin compared to other decals I've used when building scale models which means they blend into the surface you apply them to better than a thicker decal would.

If you're interested in a sheet, see if you can find some close up pictures of it and try to figure out how far it will go, they're not all created equal. For some Legions a single sheet will cover a moderate sized army, for other Legions you might need 2 or 3.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:

BigOscar wrote:
Has anyone bought the decal sheet? If so, how big is it, as £20 for a sheet of decals feels incredibly high, but if it does genuinely give a long way then I guess its more palatable?

Do you mean the decal sheets for the different legions? I bought the Space Wolves one back when it was still sold by FW. It's massively overpriced, but it's also pretty good. It's the size of an A4 sheet and in the case of the SW one, most of the single colour decals can be mirrors by applying them upside down (not sure if that's true for the other Legions).

The decals themselves are reasonably good quality, the carrier film is pretty thin compared to other decals I've used when building scale models which means they blend into the surface you apply them to better than a thicker decal would.

If you're interested in a sheet, see if you can find some close up pictures of it and try to figure out how far it will go, they're not all created equal. For some Legions a single sheet will cover a moderate sized army, for other Legions you might need 2 or 3.

Cool cheers. I was looking at the Blood Angels one as it has a ton of IX and vehicles transfers that would be useful.

My main gripe is how hard it seems to be to get squad marking transfers in high quantities. Realistically I'd like about 30 tactical marine markings, but they just don't give you those arrows in high quantities it seems and you end up having to paint them on.

BigOscar wrote:
Has anyone bought the decal sheet? If so, how big is it, as £20 for a sheet of decals feels incredibly high, but if it does genuinely give a long way then I guess its more palatable?

I have bought the new Iron Hands decals. Top quality though if you want to create your force consisting of a single company/clan then you would need to buy an unreasonable amount of sheets. Also only the surviving clans (present in 40K in the IH chapter) have the advantage of having slightly more decals on the sheet.

Going back to the discussion about Assault Marines, what does a MkVI jump pack look like? Have GW ever released one before?

Same as MkVI I believe, so back to the twin chunky turbines from the single turbine of MkIV.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Going back to the discussion about Assault Marines, what does a MkVI jump pack look like? Have GW ever released one before?

I'm assuming it'll look something similar to the Dominion Zephon figure's Jump pack

Duymon wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Going back to the discussion about Assault Marines, what does a MkVI jump pack look like? Have GW ever released one before?

I'm assuming it'll look something similar to the Dominion Zephon figure's Jump pack

Damn! That Zephon dude flies as graciously as a drunk bumblebee.

Duymon wrote:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Going back to the discussion about Assault Marines, what does a MkVI jump pack look like? Have GW ever released one before?

I'm assuming it'll look something similar to the Dominion Zephon figure's Jump pack

Nice, if that's what they come out with in bulk for the MkVI assault marines I'll be happy with that.

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
Going back to the discussion about Assault Marines, what does a MkVI jump pack look like? Have GW ever released one before?

IMO that's the same Jump Pack as what the MKV marines are wearing. That's what I'm using for mine anyway. Here's some Rogue Trader era references:

https://www.ninjabread.co.uk/rogue-trader-crimson-fists-squad-taurasi/

https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/04/sunday-preview-join-the-battle-for-middle-earth-with-next-weeks-pre-orders/

We are finally getting those heavy weapon packs and the Predator next week

Unless I'm forgetting something the Proteus is the only plastic release left now

Hey neato, reference cards.

Aaaaah shucks. Of course the Predator and lascannons would drop straight after Into the Dark. I'm skint, will only be able to get these a whopping one week after release. Here's hoping those Predator's wont be sold out by then..

Nice. Was waiting for the heavy weapons. Should be getting the voucher from W+ soon, will be grabbing them with it.

 Matrindur wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/09/04/sunday-preview-join-the-battle-for-middle-earth-with-next-weeks-pre-orders/

We are finally getting those heavy weapon packs and the Predator next week

Unless I'm forgetting something the Proteus is the only plastic release left now

Finally! Now can we please have a North American release for the Liber Mechanicum?

Very good.
Now all I want is the Rhino to be back in stock as well...

 tauist wrote:
Aaaaah shucks. Of course the Predator and lascannons would drop straight after Into the Dark. I'm skint, will only be able to get these a whopping one week after release. Here's hoping those Predator's wont be sold out by then..

Agreed. My poor wallet

 Matrindur wrote:

Unless I'm forgetting something the Proteus is the only plastic release left now

Also the other half of Predator turret weapons.

I wouldn't put it past GW/FW that we will only be getting these variants for Predator & Sicaran in plastic. Easy enough for FW to make new SKUs of the remaining variants based on these new plastic kits, just adding the more exotic turrets as resin bit upgrades..

Eh. They did the Leviathan half and half.

 tauist wrote:
I wouldn't put it past GW/FW that we will only be getting these variants for Predator & Sicaran in plastic. Easy enough for FW to make new SKUs of the remaining variants based on these new plastic kits, just adding the more exotic turrets as resin bit upgrades..

As I was assembling the sicaran it seemed like a plastic venator would be an easy job - basically replace the one sprue that has the top hull plate and turret.

The rest of the variants are just turrets so I fully agree FW can handle those, but for the venator I'd much rather deal with that top piece and gubbins in plastic than resin.

Am I going mad, or are the White Scars a new treat not previewed?

The Land Raider remaining, it's about time to announce further plastic kits.

 ScarletRose wrote:
As I was assembling the sicaran it seemed like a plastic venator would be an easy job - basically replace the one sprue that has the top hull plate and turret..

There was a rumour about a Assault Gun / Tank Destroyer on Sicaran Chassis in Plastic.

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Am I going mad, or are the White Scars a new treat not previewed?

Spoiler:

They were. But it was a while ago now.
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2022/07/21/heresy-thursday-feel-the-wind-through-your-hair-with-these-white-scars-upgrade-packs/

 Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote:
Am I going mad, or are the White Scars a new treat not previewed?

You, uh, you ever seen your name, buddy?

Those White Scars legionary helmets are generic looking enough that I could seriously consider replacing my sergeant helmets with them. I like that ponytail thingy much more than that roman centurion style brush that comes in the MKVI kit

At least I’m not going mad.

Almost certainly in the market for those Lascannons. However, given the set also has Volkite Wotsits and Autocannon, I suspect it’s going to be the most popular HW set by a wide margin, and thus be in an out of stock frequently.

Finally Lucius! And the praetor, and the upgrades. Damn, want to start saving some money for this winter, might be good that it's now and not later.

Lucius has a helmet option apparently, looking forward to seeing that.