I'm excited for this. I think the initial expectations of 40 marines were a bit optimistic, but 30 tacticals, 5 dreads, two character, and a dread is a pretty nice box. The price is vastly lower than FW, which is the only comparison worth anything if talking about HH stuff. (well, there's the recast stuff, but even that isn't exactly cheap)
The monopose legs on the contemptor don't bother me. Starter sets have always (barring 3rd edition, actually) contained simpler models than you could buy at retail, and this is very consistent with the dreads in AoBR or DV. Further, multipart legs aren't very conducive to new players, which is, in theory, part of the market for starter boxes/board games. There are plenty of people that are excited about how much simpler the Assault Cannon will be to assemble than the FW one is, and I don't think they'll miss assembling a knee joint either.
The big thing this release does, almost as much as price, is dramatically lower the difficulty of actually building HH infantry. Resin is a great material, but I'd rather build hard plastic infantry than resin any day, especially when you want dozens of them.
Most assumed that the sprues we saw months ago were genuine, and these latest leaks show them to be right on the money. That must be the biggest pictured leak lead time we have had in ages.
Paradigm wrote: Hmm... need better pics. On one hand the deal isn't as sweet as I was hoping, on the other, there's still a good bit in there compared to what you'd pay separately.
From GW:
3x Tactical Squads= £75
1xTerminators=£27
1xDread= £28
2x Characters= £30 (or more, these days)
So you're essentially paying for the PA Marines and a character, and getting the rest free'....
Anyone else severely pained by seeing HH marines painted in the clean, colourful GW style rather than FW's perfect gritty take?
Deal isn't as good as you hoped? This is a _fantastic_ deal.
The price you quoted is £160; the box is £90, that's about 43% off.
This selection of models from forgeworld would be over £300.00; that's at least 70% off.
To clarify, I was referring to the fact that one 'leak' had said it would be 40 Marines, 10 Termies, 2 Dreads and 2 characters. Which would have been ridiculously awesome. As it is, and as I said, it still looks like a good deal, particuarly compared to FW, and if the game is as good as Space Hulk then that's even more value there.
rtb02 wrote: However from fw you can't buy 30 tacs, Contemptor, cataphractii and characters for 90 quid or so - there's the appeal for most.
You can't even come close to buying 30 tactical marines, 5 terminators, a dreadnought, and two plastic monopose characters from the 40k range for the $150 this is rumored to cost.
ADDED: Whoops, I see someone already made that point. But the dollar amount I came up with for equivalent models from the 40k range was about $276, so a pretty substantial savings vs. regular 40k prices.
Nice to see those sprue leaks from back in June were apparently accurate, other than that monopose Contemptor this set looks great, and frankly I had no plans to run a Contemptor with my Salamanders anyway, the Doredeo is the dread I'm after.
It seems HeroQuest / Space Crusade like dice are back. 3 symbols each. Only one color though. I'm quite interested what they will do with them mechanic-wise.
Warhams-77 wrote: It seems HeroQuest / Space Crusade like dice are back. 3 symbols each. Only one color though. I'm quite interested what they will do with them mechanic-wise.
Haha, this'll be wicked if this is a bit Space Crusade-esque:
AndrewGPaul wrote: I'll need to get some photos of the connections on the Forge World Contemptor, so I can see about magnetising this one.
Looking at the sprue picture magnetizing won't be too bad. The biggest difference in the arms is that the FW weapon arms don't include the shoulders (they are included with the body) where on this kit the shoulders are the same part as the weapon arm. So a careful cut to separate the shoulder and gun, then put some magnets in at that cut, is all you need to do.
Also it looks like modifying the kit to twist the torso looks very easy; as you can make that cut in a location that will end up inside the torso.
The shoulders are on ball joints that look the same as the FW model, so those are good as is.
After that the modifications gets slightly more difficult; cutting the hip to leg joint to re-pose the leg (it's another ball joint on the FW model) replacing the feet (if you have a FW contemptor you'll have extra feet)
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
As long as Forge World keeps doing their books (maybe call them "advanced 30k" or something) that would be utterly fantastic. Would love to play an alternative, simpler rule set with marines-on-marines.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
As long as Forge World keeps doing their books (maybe call them "advanced 30k" or something) that would be utterly fantastic.
I can see the games side by side. I just don't see FW up and quitting. It would upset A LOT of people. I know for one if the FWHH up and stopped I would be out for good.
-DE- wrote: Eisenkern Stormtroopers are stand-ins for imperial guardsmen, it's the Valkirs who are the space marine equivalents. And if you compare the prices, DFG models are only a tiny bit cheaper than GW. And only if you happen to live in the States, otherwise they're more expensive with less options and bits. Hardly a bargain.
Or unless you live in Australia where a box of 20 is $63 at full retail compared to GWs $65 for 10.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
As long as Forge World keeps doing their books (maybe call them "advanced 30k" or something) that would be utterly fantastic.
I can see the games side by side. I just don't see FW up and quitting. It would upset A LOT of people. I know for one if the FWHH up and stopped I would be out for good.
Read the post from Lords of WG:
Spoiler:
- THIS IS NOT A LIMITED RELEASE – this is a boxed game and the models maybe used for Forge World’s Age of Darkness. If you don’t own their books you are missing out.
- Follow up to the last point, BUY THE FORGE WORLD BOOKS THEY ARE OUTSTANDING AND WORTH EVERY DIME OR PENCE (for my English friends).
- The sales of the box will dictate what will be released next, how it will be released and when it will be released. ONCE AGIN, IF THESE SITES SAY THEY KNOW WHAT IS COMING OUT, THEY’RE LYING.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
Right...
40k is the main show. AoS is currently an attempt at damage control for their mishandling of WHFB.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
Right...
40k is the main show. AoS is currently an attempt at damage control for their mishandling of WHFB.
You should probably listen to Sad Panda... He's a 100% accurate rumor monger (I think he's still at 100%?)
Very interesting though. Heresy replacing LotR seemed to make sense.
I have most of the infantry I need for my XIIth Legion already. The Contemptor will be nice to have, and if the Cataphractii look good alongside the resin version, I'll be able to take my unit up to 10. If nothing else, the Mk.4s may turn into a good adversary force down the road (UM for some Shadow Crusade action?).
Regarding future kits...I have my fingers crossed for a plastic Spartan.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
Right...
40k is the main show. AoS is currently an attempt at damage control for their mishandling of WHFB.
You should probably listen to Sad Panda... He's a 100% accurate rumor monger (I think he's still at 100%?)
Very interesting though. Heresy replacing LotR seemed to make sense.
I stand corrected - that's what I get from being a newcomer to the forums. My apologies!
It just seemed odd to me. But heh, GW's ways are inscrutable.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
I think gwstill underestimates how little a VAST majority of us care...
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
I believe you, but I don't get it.
My group has zero feths to give for AoS. None.
I have seen more people in my group completely drop Fantasy/AoS than pick it up. I for one and trying to get rid of my Tomb Kings and they have been packed away in a rubbermaid container since.
I think I'd be more excited for AoS if I wasn't so excited for 40k. While AoS is the fantasy game I've been waiting 4 editions for, 40k 7th edition and especially the new Space Marine plastics are awesome enough to put everything else on the back-burner.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
I think gwstill underestimates how little a VAST majority of us care...
They won't have to estimate anything come February as they'll have the numbers by then and will have to post them for us soon after. I doubt they'll break up the sales between the various lines (they've never done that in the past) but it would be nice to see how AOS fares against the shrinking 40k fanbase.
@Sad Panda: I'm not sure what you mean above. Are you pointing out that thinking of HH/30k as a third keystone system to replace LOTR is incorrect? Or that the HH/30k game is just a one off board game like that assassin thing and not a new whole line of products?
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
The proof will be in the pudding, so to speak. I'll bet that HH boxed set + Tau 4 weeks will exceed all the AoS sales for the half year. Not that we'll ever know, since it isn't broken down by GW, and I am glad that GW is willing to stand by its new product. No matter how much new cover art they rebox, I'm still not buying Seraphon, though
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
The proof will be in the pudding, so to speak. I'll bet that HH boxed set + Tau 4 weeks will exceed all the AoS sales for the half year. Not that we'll ever know, since it isn't broken down by GW, and I am glad that GW is willing to stand by its new product. No matter how much new cover art they rebox, I'm still not buying Seraphon, though
Indeed - we'll definitely need to wait for the full year report. And even then, I can easily see an early 2016 CSM release boosting up sales just enough...
Must say, it's hard to understand why GW would accept such gakky pics as their customers' first glimpse of their new products. Then again, what do I know? If I was in charge of GW, I wouldn't totally eclipse AoS by releasing plastic HH, either. I honestly suspect the two issues are related: maybe GW believes that communicating with customers in the long term undermines their releases; like, people won't buy any AoS if they know they need to save pennies for HH.
@namiel - If the miniatures are Legion-specific, I will be buying 0 rather than 2 or 3.
@jojo_monkey_boyMade in ca - thanks I will add it to the OP
I don't get the price issues.
£90 is a steal for it.
Just the TAC marines alone would run you £144 plus weapons.
Yes there is mono pose stuff, but still a great deal.
I'll be picking up 2-3 sets I think to expand what I have.
The contemptor looks easy enough to chop and re-pose.
Yeah, I'm in full on negotiations with my wife about this already. I've been trying to tell her that I'm being good on cutting back on hobby spending, but this is so very, very good.
Yeah, I'm in full on negotiations with my wife about this already. I've been trying to tell her that I'm being good on cutting back on hobby spending, but this is so very, very good.
I am poised to take unilateral action. Damn the torpedoes!
Indeed. I'm getting two. 60 Tacticals, 10 Terminators, 2 Contemptors and a couple of Praetors for $300? It nearly costs that much to get 30 tacticals from FW.
I think there are three issues at play: First, a plastic HH release is an event of near-mythical for a lot of us; we have to understand that whatever GW does is not going to measure up to so many years of dreaming. Second, no matter how you look at it, this is a SM release and that ground is well-trodden to say the least. Third, all we have right now is a lame teaser and some incredibly bad photos. Once we have actual professional photos of this stuff, including 360 degree spin photos, I think it will be a lot more exciting!
Yeah, I'm in full on negotiations with my wife about this already. I've been trying to tell her that I'm being good on cutting back on hobby spending, but this is so very, very good.
I am poised to take unilateral action. Damn the torpedoes!
I'm not interested but I'm happy for those who want it. The 3rd box I won't be buying from GW, 30k is just not interesting to me sorry especially as its just marines vs marines
I can only hope we get Sisters or more Aliens eventually. If not ill just be spending elsewhere.
I'm just glad people want to buy it, just better chances they'll come out with an MKIII box so I can start my Iron Hands without messing with too much resin.
I think there are three issues at play: First, a plastic HH release is an event of near-mythical for a lot of us; we have to understand that whatever GW does is not going to measure up to so many years of dreaming. Second, no matter how you look at it, this is a SM release and that ground is well-trodden to say the least. Third, all we have right now is a lame teaser and some incredibly bad photos. Once we have actual professional photos of this stuff, including 360 degree spin photos, I think it will be a lot more exciting!
I do wonder if the boat has sailed though, and some time ago.
I had years of creating my own Pre-Heresy stuff (when the TCG and first books came out), then converting FW semi-PH stuff (the mkIV armour) etc. That was what, probably getting on for 10 years ago now (?!) Arguably even the FW releases were late in the context of how long the fluff had been about, the art book etc. And now these plastic minis have arrived, finally.
If this had come out in the late 00's? I would have crawled a mile through broken glass to get my hands on it. But now I've made the army, read the Heresy books until they started to turn into the literary equivalent of Lost, played with them through several editions of 40k (until 6th edition killed the game for me), and sold the lot of it. We're talking about a quite extended period of time if you can fall in love with something, play it to death, then eventually move on to something else (as most people do ).
What was also noticeable for me was how much less I got for my Pre-Heresy stuff (sold within the last year) when compared to what I got 3-4 years ago for a previous force. So, I don't think I can be the only one who thinks the same as this..
Great that GW are doing something 'new', but boy have they been slow to cotton on to it.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
You forget to add this pic to the end of your post Vash108..
Jackal wrote: I don't get the price issues.
£90 is a steal for it.
Just the TAC marines alone would run you £144 plus weapons.
Ah yes... the fallacy that what we're currently paying for GW figure boxes (such as terminators etc) is normal price, so these starter sets must be a bargain. Same with the AoS box set.
Jackal wrote: I don't get the price issues.
£90 is a steal for it.
Just the TAC marines alone would run you £144 plus weapons.
Ah yes... the fallacy that what we're currently paying for GW figure boxes (such as terminators etc) is normal price, so these starter sets must be a bargain. Same with the AoS box set.
:-(
If you want 30 Mk.4 Tactical marines right now it costs $250. It is a damn good bargain..
Jackal wrote: I don't get the price issues.
£90 is a steal for it.
Just the TAC marines alone would run you £144 plus weapons.
Ah yes... the fallacy that what we're currently paying for GW figure boxes (such as terminators etc) is normal price, so these starter sets must be a bargain. Same with the AoS box set.
:-(
It may not be 'normal' as in 'what you'd pay for an equivalent amount of plastic in other shapes', but when these are PA and TDA Marines and GW are the only company that makes completely equivalent PA and TDA Marines, then the comparison has validity. If you want MkIV Marines, your options are either this for £90 or several hundred quid from Forge World. Thus, this is inherently better value than the only alternative.
I'm not trying to defend the GW idea of bargains (look up my previous post a page or so back on the new RG/Tau box sets) but there is a lot in this set for the money, and it's a price I and many others are happy to pay.
Pacific wrote: I do wonder if the boat has sailed though, and some time ago.
It sounds like this may be too late for you but how many potential customers have "been there, done that" when it comes to HH? Even those who have, through FW, will welcome the opportunity to affordably fill out their ranks. I don't think we can say the "boat has sailed" just because a (very) few intrepid modelers like yourself had the skill, time, interest, and financial wherewithal to custom build Pre-Heresy or Heresy-era armies out of 40k parts.
While do people still whine about GW's pricing?
This is by no means a new thing.
No one likes it, but its there.
So he's, in the world of GW £90 is an absolute steal.
If you rather pay FW prices then don't let me stop you, you are more than welcome to.
I would rather buy them at an insanely cheap price and GS salamanders details on them all.
Also, don't forget its rare we get a box which can be used for a single army, rather than 2.
So you can build 2 or have a single larger army as a start to 30k.
This again adds more value to it for me.
Technically, every starter box they've ever sold can now be used to make a "single" army with the stupid ally/detachment rules. Also, people still whine because it is no more pleasant to drop a hammer on your foot and break toes the 10th time around than it is on the first and it's still painful if you only break a single toe as well.
Just a reminder that we need to stay on-topic. This is not the place to have a discussion about GW's prices generally. We don't even know the cost of this product yet, much less whether it will spawn a line of Catphract unit boxes, etc. Going by the AoS starter, we might speculate that it will be "cheaper" to buy the contents in the starter than in separate unit boxes. Whether those prices are low enough is a subject for another thread, which someone can feel free to start in the General Discussion board. Thanks.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Jackal wrote: Also, don't forget its rare we get a box which can be used for a single army, rather than 2.
So you can build 2 or have a single larger army as a start to 30k.
This again adds more value to it for me.
Me, too. At this point, I am looking at getting two boxes. I don't know if that means I'll do one legion or two. I have always had a hard time choosing a single legion -- I have a lot of love for III, XII, XIV, and XVI. I also like Thousand Sons a lot but I'd rather wait for FW for those guys.
-DE- wrote: Eisenkern Stormtroopers are stand-ins for imperial guardsmen, it's the Valkirs who are the space marine equivalents. And if you compare the prices, DFG models are only a tiny bit cheaper than GW. And only if you happen to live in the States, otherwise they're more expensive with less options and bits. Hardly a bargain.
i realized i had used the wrong box as a comparison as i was falling asleep...
that's what i get for posting at 4am, after a long night of painting...
at least i got to drift off dreaming about pre-ordering my box of plastic crack next week
Edit: sorry, Manchu...
we were posting at the same time...
looking at the sprues again, i am really excited...
there are a lot of great bits on there...
I think I'll buy one. I sold my Space Marines off years ago, and as this would be the only set I own, it would be nostalgic.
I can't see it expanding significantly beyond the boxset though- Horus Heresy is too expensive to get into for what is essentially the same game that's been cleaned up (by removing all non-human forces). And if AOS is anything to go by, then the future releases are going to contrast this boxset by being water-spurting-level expensive.
I am officially hyped for this. I am debating between making them Luna Wolves from Istvaan III (it would give me a reason to get the Abaddon v. Loken models), or Thousand Sons. I am leaning towards the Luna Wolves.
Ironwill13791 wrote: I am officially hyped for this. I am debating between making them Luna Wolves from Istvaan III (it would give me a reason to get the Abaddon v. Loken models), or Thousand Sons. I am leaning towards the Luna Wolves.
Just a fluff nitpick, they were Sons of Horus at Istvaan III, not Luna Wolves.
Ironwill13791 wrote: I am officially hyped for this. I am debating between making them Luna Wolves from Istvaan III (it would give me a reason to get the Abaddon v. Loken models), or Thousand Sons. I am leaning towards the Luna Wolves.
Just a fluff nitpick, they were Sons of Horus at Istvaan III, not Luna Wolves.
Vash108 wrote: I wonder if this will lead into a 30k game that will use more of an AoS rule system?
There is no separate 30K wargame. There is no third GW main game.
I think people still underestimate how much GW is into AoS. AoS is going to be big - very big - for christmas. And early 2016. AoS is still the main show.
I think gwstill underestimates how little a VAST majority of us care...
They won't have to estimate anything come February as they'll have the numbers by then and will have to post them for us soon after. I doubt they'll break up the sales between the various lines (they've never done that in the past) but it would be nice to see how AOS fares against the shrinking 40k fanbase.
@Sad Panda: I'm not sure what you mean above. Are you pointing out that thinking of HH/30k as a third keystone system to replace LOTR is incorrect? Or that the HH/30k game is just a one off board game like that assassin thing and not a new whole line of products?
Probably just what it says -- there will be no GWHH game sold in GW stores alongside 40K and AoS.
FW will continue doing its thing, and GW will produce this board game first, then later sell the sprues separately for interested 30K or 40K players. So this stuff may replace the Hobbit in terms of shelf space, but not in terms of being a new core game.
If that's accurate, it's pretty much the best outcome for my interests.
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Accolade wrote: I think I'll buy one. I sold my Space Marines off years ago, and as this would be the only set I own, it would be nostalgic.
I can't see it expanding significantly beyond the boxset though- Horus Heresy is too expensive to get into for what is essentially the same game that's been cleaned up (by removing all non-human forces). And if AOS is anything to go by, then the future releases are going to contrast this boxset by being water-spurting-level expensive.
Like I said, I'm hoping for a plastic Spartan.
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
Ironwill13791 wrote: I am officially hyped for this. I am debating between making them Luna Wolves from Istvaan III (it would give me a reason to get the Abaddon v. Loken models), or Thousand Sons. I am leaning towards the Luna Wolves.
Just a fluff nitpick, they were Sons of Horus at Istvaan III, not Luna Wolves.
Didn't the loyalists of the Sons of Horus revert back to Luna Wolves once they were betrayed on Istvaan III (although they got wiped out pretty much per the plan of Horus)?
Ironwill13791 wrote: I am officially hyped for this. I am debating between making them Luna Wolves from Istvaan III (it would give me a reason to get the Abaddon v. Loken models), or Thousand Sons. I am leaning towards the Luna Wolves.
Just a fluff nitpick, they were Sons of Horus at Istvaan III, not Luna Wolves.
Didn't the loyalists of the Sons of Horus revert back to Luna Wolves once they were betrayed on Istvaan III (although they got wiped out pretty much per the plan of Horus)?
They did, though only in name. I am certain they kept the green armour of the SOH.
Ironwill13791 wrote: I am officially hyped for this. I am debating between making them Luna Wolves from Istvaan III (it would give me a reason to get the Abaddon v. Loken models), or Thousand Sons. I am leaning towards the Luna Wolves.
Just a fluff nitpick, they were Sons of Horus at Istvaan III, not Luna Wolves.
Didn't the loyalists of the Sons of Horus revert back to Luna Wolves once they were betrayed on Istvaan III (although they got wiped out pretty much per the plan of Horus)?
They did, though only in name. I am certain they kept the green armour of the SOH.
Yah, I Imagen they didn't have the time or enough white paint laying around to fix that. XP What with all the virus bombing and fighting to survive going on.
Probably just what it says -- there will be no GWHH game sold in GW stores alongside 40K and AoS.
FW will continue doing its thing, and GW will produce this board game first, then later sell the sprues separately for interested 30K or 40K players. So this stuff may replace the Hobbit in terms of shelf space, but not in terms of being a new core game.
If that's accurate, it's pretty much the best outcome for my interests.
Pretty much this.
It may well replace LotR in shelf space, from the perspective of a store manager. I wouldn't know.
Just don't expect a full-blown (or AoS-minimized) new set of wargaming rules.
Huh, the cover is somewhat reminicant of the old Epic Space Marine box cover.
I already have too many Space Marines, but yet this set intrigues me. Price will be the determining factor, and sadly that'll probably make this a 'nope'.
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
My pipe dreams for future releases are the Spartan, and the Storm Eagle. Or an SE/Fire Raptor combo kit.
Lot of other stuff I could add, but those are the big bits of wishful thinking for me.
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
My pipe dreams for future releases are the Spartan, and the Storm Eagle. Or an SE/Fire Raptor combo kit.
Lot of other stuff I could add, but those are the big bits of wishful thinking for me.
don't expect a plastic Spartan that soon - they recently made the sides new (with tracks on it) and we should get a command Spartan from FW too^^
It would be interesting if a Horus Heresy game with it's own set of rules became their third game in place of LoTR/Hobbit. Right now it basically seems like their third game is selling minis for Kings of War.
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
My pipe dreams for future releases are the Spartan, and the Storm Eagle. Or an SE/Fire Raptor combo kit.
Lot of other stuff I could add, but those are the big bits of wishful thinking for me.
don't expect a plastic Spartan that soon - they recently made the sides new (with tracks on it) and we should get a command Spartan from FW too^^
I don't. I expect a LOT of things, if anything further at all, before the stuff I really want like flyers and Spartans.
I think there are three issues at play: First, a plastic HH release is an event of near-mythical for a lot of us; we have to understand that whatever GW does is not going to measure up to so many years of dreaming. Second, no matter how you look at it, this is a SM release and that ground is well-trodden to say the least. Third, all we have right now is a lame teaser and some incredibly bad photos. Once we have actual professional photos of this stuff, including 360 degree spin photos, I think it will be a lot more exciting!
Possibly yes. Though nothing will change how awful the contemptor looks.
I and many others have been waiting years for plastic heresy stuff. I think its safe to say its just very hmmm. Maybe with FW doing the heresy for a few years now its just diluted it all and its just not as exciting as it used to be
Jackal wrote: I don't get the price issues.
£90 is a steal for it.
Just the TAC marines alone would run you £144 plus weapons.
Ah yes... the fallacy that what we're currently paying for GW figure boxes (such as terminators etc) is normal price, so these starter sets must be a bargain. Same with the AoS box set.
:-(
Fallacy? Nah.
If you want decent heresy marines, you'd need to go to FW. These GW Heresy minis, although most likely inferior to FW, still save you money in that aspect. GW hobbies are expensive. Nobody twists your arm to buy &/or play. So, I was about to place an order with FW recently for the same minis that GW is about to release. FW = $496.20 usd. GW = $150 USD (majority guess). So that is a deal! However, what people pay for GW minis on a normal purchase is outrageous. It is the hobby we chose though. I find alternate ways to buy GW product and save 20-40% typically.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I only wish GW released the 30k minis by themselves. No need for a board, cards, etc... I will use the minis with the FW 30k books....
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
My pipe dreams for future releases are the Spartan, and the Storm Eagle. Or an SE/Fire Raptor combo kit.
Lot of other stuff I could add, but those are the big bits of wishful thinking for me.
I wouldn't hold your breath, especially for a plastic Spartan. As was mentioned, FW just redid the track sections.
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
My pipe dreams for future releases are the Spartan, and the Storm Eagle. Or an SE/Fire Raptor combo kit.
Lot of other stuff I could add, but those are the big bits of wishful thinking for me.
I wouldn't hold your breath, especially for a plastic Spartan. As was mentioned, FW just redid the track sections.
Yes, thank you, I know. Part of why I said "pipe dreams".
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
My pipe dreams for future releases are the Spartan, and the Storm Eagle. Or an SE/Fire Raptor combo kit.
Lot of other stuff I could add, but those are the big bits of wishful thinking for me.
I wouldn't hold your breath, especially for a plastic Spartan. As was mentioned, FW just redid the track sections.
Yes, thank you, I know. Part of why I said "pipe dreams".
Then again, what sort of reaction would you have got if you'd come on here 5 years ago claiming there'd be rules and models for Primarchs and that GW proper would be making pastic Heresy compatible miniatures?
I wouldn't take anything for granted, after all, which one of the old guard was it that said that if we were to see the Heresy on the tabletop it would be a sign GW were circling the drain?
Well... GW are going to have a bumper couple of financial reports after releasing Primarchs (even if it is through FW), HH space marines vs more space marines (SM are always their best seller) and they've brought Space Marines (of a kind) as the main Fantasy Army. Win win situation for the financials I guess. All those hoping to see GW go down will have to wait a fair bit longer.
I'm looking forward to seeing some clear pics of the HH box set and hoping it will bring some new blood to mini gaming in my school if it has a decent price.
Have we seen any pics of the Chaplin yet? As far as I know there are no specific Chaplins in 30K and you have to take a Legion Centurion with the Chaplin consul upgrade, since I would rather run him as a Champion or Forge Lord I'm wondering how much conversion work will be needed.
Imateria wrote: Have we seen any pics of the Chaplin yet? As far as I know there are no specific Chaplins in 30K and you have to take a Legion Centurion with the Chaplin consul upgrade, since I would rather run him as a Champion or Forge Lord I'm wondering how much conversion work will be needed.
Yes- the sprue pics we had ages ago. See the OP and you should see the Terminator character (who we now know to belong to the XIII Legion- The Ultramarines) next to the Chaplain character of the XVII Legion.
Azreal13 wrote: Did you hear the whistling noise as the point he was making went sailing over your head?
"The fallacy that what we're currently paying for GW figure boxes is normal price, so these starter sets must be a bargain."
I only read the words written and detected sarcasm, a touch of bitterness, and no "point" was gleaned from this statement at all. Unless you are reading into it and seasoning to your own taste.
The point I got, if there was a point to even get, is that the OP feels too many in this hobby set GW prices as the benchmark for said product, and when a new starter comes out, many will equate the contents to individual boxes and say "Yippie! I am getting a deal!" Not considering many starters are static poses and sometimes cookie cutter 3 parters that snap together. I get that point.
Manchu wrote: Just a reminder that we need to stay on-topic. This is not the place to have a discussion about GW's prices generally. We don't even know the cost of this product yet, much less whether it will spawn a line of Catphract unit boxes, etc. Going by the AoS starter, we might speculate that it will be "cheaper" to buy the contents in the starter than in separate unit boxes. Whether those prices are low enough is a subject for another thread, which someone can feel free to start in the General Discussion board. Thanks.
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
My pipe dreams for future releases are the Spartan, and the Storm Eagle. Or an SE/Fire Raptor combo kit.
Lot of other stuff I could add, but those are the big bits of wishful thinking for me.
I wouldn't hold your breath, especially for a plastic Spartan. As was mentioned, FW just redid the track sections.
Yes, thank you, I know. Part of why I said "pipe dreams".
Then again, what sort of reaction would you have got if you'd come on here 5 years ago claiming there'd be rules and models for Primarchs and that GW proper would be making pastic Heresy compatible miniatures?
I wouldn't take anything for granted, after all, which one of the old guard was it that said that if we were to see the Heresy on the tabletop it would be a sign GW were circling the drain?
Then again, what sort of reaction would you have got if you'd come on here 5 years ago claiming there'd be rules and models for Primarchs and that GW proper would be making pastic Heresy compatible miniatures?
I wouldn't take anything for granted, after all, which one of the old guard was it that said that if we were to see the Heresy on the tabletop it would be a sign GW were circling the drain?
Heck with that, 15 years ago I posted that I'd seen a poster in GW Cambridge which confirmed that the 3rd edition Space Wolves codex would include the Leman Russ Exterminator, and promptly got called a liar.
As for more kits going plastic, such as the Spartan and/or the flyers, I'd dearly love those, but don't expect them any time soon. I'd expect Deimos Rhinos and Preds first, for example. Which is a shame, given how much the Spartan, Storm Eagle, and Fire Raptor could benefit from being in plastic.
Rayvon wrote: I think the Deimos chasis would be a prime candidate for plastic
Yes please! Can't have legions without transports. If this box set is the beginning of a product line, I don't see how they could avoid making at least the Deimos.
I don't think its any coincidence that most of the big chapters (UM, DA, BA, etc) have had forgeworld upgrade packs released in the last few months, despite FW not having books that cover those legions yet...
slightly OT, but I hope we do get plastic deimos rhino, as I've always wanted to recreate this pic:
Nicky J wrote: I don't think its any coincidence that most of the big chapters (UM, DA, BA, etc) have had forgeworld upgrade packs released in the last few months, despite FW not having books that cover those legions yet...
slightly OT, but I hope we do get plastic deimos rhino, as I've always wanted to recreate this pic:
Spoiler:
What are those mutants in those pics they don't exist!
Nicky J wrote: I don't think its any coincidence that most of the big chapters (UM, DA, BA, etc) have had forgeworld upgrade packs released in the last few months, despite FW not having books that cover those legions yet...
slightly OT, but I hope we do get plastic deimos rhino, as I've always wanted to recreate this pic:
Spoiler:
What are those mutants in those pics they don't exist!
Any clarification on what the real price will be?
THis is 30K they exist. But they are being marinated right now,
Anyone else feeling a bit annoyed by the situational irony in this? Games Workshop always touting how they aren't a gaming company but simply a mini manufacturer. Then they promptly begin spamming overpriced board games. How about you actually finish a codex cycle first gee dubs.
Please note these pictures were sent to US via an anonymous source. We are not watermarking them, and they are free to use by anyone via Fair Use from a news media outlet.
At Spikey Bits we never hold the hobby hostage with images, please do not either.
Here’s our first clear shots of the new Horus Heresy box set, and it looks absolutely amazing. From the looks of this HEX based board, this is it’s own separate game from the Horus Heresy we all know and love from Forge World.
Perhaps the Battle For Calth will be similar to the 1-player execution force game that the Assassins came in?
Contents of the Box:
30x Tactical marines MK IV Plate
5x Catapharctii Terminators
1x Contemptor with Lascannon, Melta, Assault Cannon and CCW 1x Captain Aethon
1x Kurtha Sedd
There is new game dice, and some sort of legion specific game play “command” decks as well. We can also see what looks to be wound makers in front of one of the terminators too.
The description mentions a 48-page rules book that may perhaps contain Battle for Calth scenarios as well as datasheets for the named characters listed, and squads.
If you’re not sold yet that you need this box in your life, checkout the values on these kits if you bought them from Forge World.
So keeping that in mind lets break down the retail pricing from Forge World:
Artificier Armor Centurion, Cataphractii Terminator Praetor £31.50 For the set of two
Mk IV Maximus Marine Squad (x10) £46 plus £23 for the bolters
Mk IV Maximus Marine Squad (x10) £46 plus £23 for the bolters
Mk IV Maximus Marine Squad (x10)£46 plus £23 for the bolters
Cataphractii Terminator Squad (x5) £34 ea
Contemptor Dreadnought £32 ea (minus arms), plus £9.5 an arm x4
At those prices this box set comes out to a total of £348 which equals out to about
$522.00!!!
And that was the old prices before the recent “stealth” price adjustment that was reported this week!
Whether you play Heresy or not, you may not want to pass up a deal like this from Games Workshop.
Nicky J wrote: I don't think its any coincidence that most of the big chapters (UM, DA, BA, etc) have had forgeworld upgrade packs released in the last few months, despite FW not having books that cover those legions yet...
It's a coincidence. People have been asking about getting upgrade packs for a long time, and FW openly said a while ago that they were going to put out some basic upgrades for fans of the legions that haven't been featured in their own fluff book yet instead of making them wait years to start their 30k armies. And HH4 had some relics and campaign rules for the legions that hadn't had anything yet, while the next book is supposed to have at least brief legion rules for everyone as a temporary solution until they get their own books. So, I seriously doubt that this has much to do with the plastic 30k "game".
(Also, Ultramarines got a whole book recently, with full legion-specific rules/units/etc.)
@Jehan-reznor - Yay, some not totally distorted photos
You can see a bit more of the heads and space marine sprues than before, I think. The contemptor in that photo does look weird. The Cataphracti, though, look fantastic!
Marines look kinda boring. Well, they always do, but I thought the models in this set were supposed to be your "standard" multi-part plastic kit? Everything in that photo looks like it's in the exact same pose, except with some dudes turning their heads a different way. Is that really the best they can do?
Sidstyler wrote: Marines look kinda boring. Well, they always do, but I thought the models in this set were supposed to be your "standard" multi-part plastic kit? Everything in that photo looks like it's in the exact same pose, except with some dudes turning their heads a different way. Is that really the best they can do?
Not really -- they're mostly holding their guns a little differently, much the same as you'd seen in the configurations for Tactical squads. If you look at the sprues (the old leaks), you'll see that it's done the same way, with matching left/rights. It looks like they have all the standard poses -- at ready, looking down the barrel of the rifle, holding the gun at chest level, and then holding the gun at waist level; and then upper torso straight with lower and upper torso twisted. Plus the different leg configurations. Sort of your standard fare for Space Marines, except they all have bolters (which is the way it's supposed to be).
But anyways, Space Marines are a love-them-or-hate-them kinda thing. I've painted probably 300+ of the "basic power armor guys" (over 25 years, mind you), and every one is still unique to me.
Edit - oh yeah, they have the cool heads with the horizontal plume, like what you get in the Ultramarines upgrade kit, too! And of course, lots of Mk4 goodness. Mk4 parts really sparse in standard 40k kits.
Sidstyler wrote: Marines look kinda boring. Well, they always do, but I thought the models in this set were supposed to be your "standard" multi-part plastic kit? Everything in that photo looks like it's in the exact same pose, except with some dudes turning their heads a different way. Is that really the best they can do?
Judging by the sprue pics I would chalk that up to lazy/bad assembling more than anything else.
I think part of the wierdness on the contemptor is both legs being square-on. The resin kit having hip joints allows for the feet to be splayed outwards slightly, which gives it a more natural stance.
insaniak wrote: I think part of the wierdness on the contemptor is both legs being square-on. The resin kit having hip joints allows for the feet to be splayed outwards slightly, which gives it a more natural stance.
Yeah, I agree. I will reserve judgment until the final model, though, and then see if it can be modded easily to feel less... wooden.
You know that neat SM commander box that has a ton of nice options and is compatible with most SM bits and is cheaper than the clamshell plastic characters?
Why don't they make those anymore? :(
Edit: I just noticed on that sprue that the plastic contemptor has multiple weapon options. I think it has a Volkite weapon, a Kheres pattern assault cannon and a TL-Lascannon (Yay?) on it.
So do we have any details on the loadouts you can take for the tacticals, if the Cataphractii Terminators can take different weapons, and the details on the models. Because I really, really, really want to use this to build my DA army as greenwing.
Wyzilla wrote: So do we have any details on the loadouts you can take for the tacticals, if the Cataphractii Terminators can take different weapons, and the details on the models. Because I really, really, really want to use this to build my DA army as greenwing.
For Tacticals, the sprues have a Heavy Bolter, Missile Launcher, Melta Gun, Flamer and Plasma Gun. Plus assorted stuff for the sergeant.
Wyzilla wrote: So do we have any details on the loadouts you can take for the tacticals, if the Cataphractii Terminators can take different weapons, and the details on the models. Because I really, really, really want to use this to build my DA army as greenwing.
Have you looked at the tac sprues on the first page of the thread? You'll find part of your answer there...
No idea on the rest yet but alleged the terms have lots of options.
Contemptor has kheres, multi melta and fist, nothing more.
Indeed. I'm getting two. 60 Tacticals, 10 Terminators, 2 Contemptors and a couple of Praetors for $300? It nearly costs that much to get 30 tacticals from FW.
Yep. 2 boxes means enough models to start a HH legion force, and have a few bits left over for my 40K chapter.
2x 20 man Tac squads, a 5 man support squad with meltas, a 5 man heavy support squad with missiles, 5 man cataphractii squad, a contemptor and set of characters. Debating between UM or IF.
Then 10 tac marines, 5 cataphractii, a contemptor, and set of characters for my 40K marines to mix in some heresy era stuff.
The Tac Marines and Cataphractii are probably full kits for later release, while the Contemptor and character sprues are likely exclusive to the starter.
pretre wrote: Can't wait for FLG to start allowing preorders. I'll get at least one.
I already told my FLGS to hold me 2 boxes. Hope they show up, as the Tau Tidewall he was supposed to get never arrived :(
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
Spartan, not for a while I don't think. A Mk I land raider though, that seems really iconic. Probably some of the other staples too- Assault marines, Rhino, Dome turret predator, Bullock Jetbikes (rather than the uly Scimitars from FW)
Wait, so the Contemptor is not interchangeable with the FW line of weapons? And the legs look even worse in these sprue pics.
I like the Cataphractii, though. BUt why is one lower leg seperate? Knowing the new Assault Squad kit, they will only fit one way. So why, GW, why?
Ooh, lots on that Cataphractii sprue. Looks like enough hands for PF or CF/SB or dual LC all round, a sword for the sarge and a HF. And I'm impressed that they've given you full extra arms for the Dread, makes it very easy to swap parts with magnets or you could even save a few quid off a FW Dread! Looks easy enough to cut off the PF for another gun if that's what you'd prefer.
In case anyone was wondering just how much of a Legionnes Astartes force you'd get if you put everything in the box together, here's a quickie from Battlescribe (apologies if I've made any errors here, I'm not overly familiar with the LA list)
HQ:
Legion Praetor, Cataphractii Terminator Armour, Combi-Bolter and Power Weapon
Legion Centurion, Chaplain, Power Weapon and Plasma Pistol (or it might be a Volkite Serpenta, I can't tell from the pics)
Troops:
Legion Tactical Squad: 15 Marines, Power Weapon for the Sarge
Legion Tactical Squad: 15 Marines, Power Weapon for the Sarge
Elites:
Cataphractii Terminators, 4x Power Fist, 1x Heavy Flamer
Contemptor Dreadnought, Kheres Assault Cannon
Total: 1105 points
So 2 boxes, plus a kit or two from FW, and you're sorted!
Paradigm wrote: In case anyone was wondering just how much of a Legionnes Astartes force you'd get if you put everything in the box together, here's a quickie from Battlescribe (apologies if I've made any errors here, I'm not overly familiar with the LA list)
HQ: Legion Praetor, Cataphractii Terminator Armour, Combi-Bolter and Power Weapon
Legion Centurion, Chaplain, Power Weapon and Plasma Pistol (or it might be a Volkite Serpenta, I can't tell from the pics)
Troops: Legion Tactical Squad: 15 Marines, Power Weapon for the Sarge Legion Tactical Squad: 15 Marines, Power Weapon for the Sarge
Elites: Cataphractii Terminators, 4x Power Fist, 1x Heavy Flamer
Contemptor Dreadnought, Kheres Assault Cannon
Total: 1105 points
So 2 boxes, plus a kit or two from FW, and you're sorted!
Depends on the legion, but there looks enough for 2x 10 man tactical squad, 5 man support squad with Flamers/Meltas and, I think, plasma as well as a 5 man support squad.
That'll leave you 10 spare marines to equip with whatever - support squads, heavy support or seeker squads (looks to be combin-weapon upgrades on the sprues)...
Yeah, I kept it basic as I wasn't sure on the requirements/allowances for Vet/Support Squads. But yeah, if you can scrounge up a spare Special/Heavy or two (there's 3 of each type in the box by the look of it) you could definitely outfit a couple of 5-man units with support gear of your choice.
What's the specifics of a Pride of the Legion list? Just Vets as Troops, or are there other benefits/restrictions?
Cool. And can that be run by any Legion, or just specific ones? I'm still undecided on Legion (and on whether or not I'll be combining the box into one force or not), and possibly thinking Shattered Legions, who I guess won't be able to run that.
Paradigm wrote: Cool. And can that be run by any Legion, or just specific ones? I'm still undecided on Legion (and on whether or not I'll be combining the box into one force or not), and possibly thinking Shattered Legions, who I guess won't be able to run that.
There's also this fella from the Forgeworld downloads. Ignore the Alpha Legion special character and take note the Delegatus consul on the right - combine this download, with the HH boxed set and the Raid strategic missions from Book IV: Conquest, the Crusade Army List red book and you don't need any more resin to get started!
I like the Cataphractii, though. BUt why is one lower leg seperate? Knowing the new Assault Squad kit, they will only fit one way. So why, GW, why?
It allows them to put a bend in the knee without having to fudge detail due to the limitations of plastic moulding, which doesn't allow for undercuts (at least with the machines GW is using).
so the dread only has 3 arms total? it looks like each arm is in two parts. that kind of sucks I was thinking of picking up a spare body from forgeworld but I'll still be down one arm.
Honestly 2 of these from a discounter is a possibility. $240 for 60 Marines, 10 Termies, 2 Contemptors, and 4 Characters is solid. Combined with the right parts I could build a really cool 30k/40k army with this as the core.
I wonder if they will do a versus box set for each army (possibly with different mk's?), or if GW stores will start carrying FW in stores for the ability to customize.
It's odd that the decal sheet includes the decals to make the chaplain, dread, praetor, and terminators for either side, but it appears you only get enough UM tac markings for 10 guys, but enough for 20 WB tacticals.
shade1313 wrote: It's odd that the decal sheet includes the decals to make the chaplain, dread, praetor, and terminators for either side, but it appears you only get enough UM tac markings for 10 guys, but enough for 20 WB tacticals.
I think it's not a bad idea. Gives plenty of options as to who gets the dread, praetor, chaplain and terminators.
To me, that doesn't seem like an outlandish possibility, given GW's love of bigger kits and the fact that both 30K and 40K players could use them in their armies.
Spartan, not for a while I don't think. A Mk I land raider though, that seems really iconic. Probably some of the other staples too- Assault marines, Rhino, Dome turret predator, Bullock Jetbikes (rather than the uly Scimitars from FW)
It may be a while or never happen at all. BUT...30K is much more about the Spartans than regular Phobos pattern Raiders. Plus, I think something new makes more marketing sense than another Raider with different styling. *shrug*
Assault marines...could use some rules revisions from FW if GW expects to sell any to 30K players.
It will be interesting to see how GW follows up on this kits. The rumormongers point to more stuff in the pipeline, but who knows what that is, how much it is, and how quickly it arrives.
Alex C wrote: Kinda wish I'd kept my 2nd edition Space Marine vehicles now they're being branded as "Horus Heresy" and sold for rediculous amounts from FW...
The forgeworld ones are admittedly much nicer (and I say that as someone who kept my original marine army with all the old style stuff).
Alex C wrote: Kinda wish I'd kept my 2nd edition Space Marine vehicles now they're being branded as "Horus Heresy" and sold for rediculous amounts from FW...
The forgeworld ones are admittedly much nicer (and I say that as someone who kept my original marine army with all the old style stuff).
Yeah, I have two GW Deimos rhinos, and they are miles away better kits than the old MKI jobs.
Still, I think if you painted an older kit to match, and applied some brass eatchings or other iconography, I think they'd look fine.
And the MKI predators, Vindicators, and Whirlwinds were very nice kits, although again pale in comparison.
I started losing interest when the shoddy pics got posted but all the new info is pulling me back in.
People are saying one of the terminators is the captain, then what is the guy with the crest? Is that what a HH era sgt usually has or is it an ultramarine thing? Because that miniature is the one I like the most so far.
Rotgut wrote: I started losing interest when the shoddy pics got posted but all the new info is pulling me back in.
People are saying one of the terminators is the captain, then what is the guy with the crest? Is that what a HH era sgt usually has or is it an ultramarine thing? Because that miniature is the one I like the most so far.
The crested fella is the Sergeant, the one with the mini-banner on his pack is a Vexilla and the final upgrade, that I can't see, is a Nuncio Vox.
People are saying one of the terminators is the captain, then what is the guy with the crest? Is that what a HH era sgt usually has or is it an ultramarine thing? Because that miniature is the one I like the most so far.
The character with the crest is the Centurion, a mid-rank commander who in the FW rules can take various Consul roles like Chaplain, Delegatus ect. There is also a crested helmet on the sprue for the tactical marines, used for Sergeants.
Motograter wrote: The characters and dread look boring as hell. I'll likely keep the dread never the less but those characters will be sold straight off
If you don't want to keep the dread *Leaves business card*
For those who actually play the FWHH game, how does this box look? Do standard marines and terminators play a large role in your list building? Or do the things in this box take a back seat to units like Phoenix Terminators and the Palatine Blade squads?
@Nvs: I've no real experience playing HH, but there's going to be mileage in at least one set here. You'll need at least 2 basic Tactical Squads of 10-20 men if you're not running a Rite of War, and even then, the minis can cover all sorts of units (basic Tactical squads, Veteran Tactical Squads, Support Tactical Squads, maybe even Seeker Squads with a weapon swap) so you'll get use out of them. The Legion-specific units are usually pretty points-intensive, so starting out the Cataphractii are good (and from what I've read, more survivable in 30k as there's a comparative lack of AP2 stuff compared to 40k). Any why wouldn't you want a Contemptor?
Nvs wrote: For those who actually play the FWHH game, how does this box look? Do standard marines and terminators play a large role in your list building? Or do the things in this box take a back seat to units like Phoenix Terminators and the Palatine Blade squads?
From the basic marines:
Tactical marines - yes. 10-20 man units all with boltguns forms the majority of compulsory troops.
Also, veteran tactical squads (for pride of the legion) - 5 to 10 man units - I find are overpriced for what are, essentially, marine stats. Can be given veteran skills (Tank Hunters, Snipers, etc)
Seekers 5-10 man units - nice. You get combi-weapon's in the sprue which are a nice addition (and the entire squad can be equipped with them)
Tactical support squads - 5-10 man - excellent unit. Can't be taken as compulsory troops, but they all come with the same special weapon. Pick from Flamer, Meltagun, Volkite Charger (yes!), Volkite Caliver (lethal), plasma guns (Excellent)
Contemptors are generally, in my view, overpriced and underpowered a little. Contemptor mortis, not so much.
Cataphracts are good, but their use depends on the list you're building and your legion of choice.
Nvs wrote: For those who actually play the FWHH game, how does this box look? Do standard marines and terminators play a large role in your list building? Or do the things in this box take a back seat to units like Phoenix Terminators and the Palatine Blade squads?
From the basic marines:
Tactical marines - yes. 10-20 man units all with boltguns forms the majority of compulsory troops.
Also, veteran tactical squads (for pride of the legion) - 5 to 10 man units - I find are overpriced for what are, essentially, marine stats. Can be given veteran skills (Tank Hunters, Snipers, etc)
Seekers 5-10 man units - nice. You get combi-weapon's in the sprue which are a nice addition
Tactical support squads - 5-10 man - excellent unit. Can't be taken as compulsory troops, but they all come with the same special weapon. Pick from Flamer, Meltagun, Volkite Charger (yes!), Volkite Caliver (lethal), plasma guns (Excellent)
Contemptors are generally, in my view, overpriced and underpowered a little. Contemptor mortis, not so much.
Cataphracts are good, but their use depends on the list you're building and your legion of choice.
Cool, thanks for the overview. And regardless of legion, they all are using this layout for the bulk of their armies and then a few thematic units more inline with the legion's backstory make up the rest?
I've been holding off on any FWHH stuff till Thousand Sons are available, but I've been dying to get started and this box (or 2) seems like a good start so long as the models are useful
Nvs wrote: For those who actually play the FWHH game, how does this box look? Do standard marines and terminators play a large role in your list building? Or do the things in this box take a back seat to units like Phoenix Terminators and the Palatine Blade squads?
You will want at least one Tactical squad. They form the core of many Legion builds. Depending on your legion tactics you may want a bunch. Ultramarines are a tac squad leaning Legion as infantry units gain bonuses if they shoot at a target shot at someone else.
Caraprachts are good but they need support to really shine. I stick my Cataphracts in a big killy unit with a Primis Medicae and a Praetor. Those guys beat face. I plan on sticking Guilliman and a chaplain in there at cost of the Praetor for a big Spartan assault tank of doom.
Contemptors are decent. A little weedy in CC due to their low number of attacks but put them against chaff units and it will kill. The Mortis with dual Kheres is better.
bubber wrote: I don't like that helmet mark :(
need to get me some different ones.
You can always just get the upgrade kits from FW of the respective legion to replace them. even though I stopped playing 40k or GW games in general I am sorely tempted by this. Especially since some of my gaming buddies still play HH games. Two boxes, along with the special units/characters from FW and some of their upgrade kits and it should be a decent sized Death Guard army for a reasonable price. Still al lot but a whole lot more doable than a pure FW force, which is what kept me in from starting so far.
I am looking at with death guard or alpha legion myself
I don't know -.- my plan at the moment is to use the shattered legion rules to make some of every legion, but we don't have the rules for shattered legions yet so I can't really plan for it. Currently I'm into Blood Angels, especially after seeing the little bits of art for them at the 40k weekend.
Thousand Sons for me, but I could be waiting a long time :(
I'm just worried that since Thousand Sons are quite unique with all being psykers if they'll legitimately use so many tactical squads. Hopefully they just have a lot of IC mini librarians that join tactical squads or something along those lines. FW hasn't even released a HH librarian have they? I assume they exist in some capacity already in the rules for someone.
Everyone has access to Librarians, even World Eaters so long as they don't take their special Rite of War.
And it's almost guaranteed that tacticals will be useful for the XVth Legion. Everyone can find uses for them -- they're much more core to the 30K Legions than they are to 40K Chapters.
shade1313 wrote: It's odd that the decal sheet includes the decals to make the chaplain, dread, praetor, and terminators for either side, but it appears you only get enough UM tac markings for 10 guys, but enough for 20 WB tacticals.
I think it's not a bad idea. Gives plenty of options as to who gets the dread, praetor, chaplain and terminators.
No, it's a great idea to give the options on those, but it just strikes me as odd that they'd make the allegiance of the dread, characters, and termies flexible, but NOT the numbers of tacticals that can be made for each side.
It's a tough call for me. I've a small (as in skirmish sized) World Eaters 40k force that was very fun to paint, and they are one of my favourite Legions (Erebus is a brilliantly mischievous villain), but I'm not sure I can paint a whole force to a good quality these days so I'm also leaning towards the Shattered Legions, either the survivors of Istvaan III/IV (so RG, Sallies, Iron Hands and a few Loyalists from the that escaped the purges) or the force assembled at Macragge with UM, BA and DA along with a few others.... Or maybe the Defenders of Terra with the Scars, BA and Fists... decisions, decisions!
I am looking at with death guard or alpha legion myself
I'm already working on FW Salamanders, these guys in plastic will form the core of an Alpha Legion army, and I'll likely go back to resin when the Thousand Sons finally come out.
I'll be doing Death Guard. Already got Morti, Grave Warden, Darkshroud & Typhon as well as some troops.
Will be mixing & matching the armour patterns to represent them scavenging spares.
What's up with the tiny hex board? You think the game rules will actually be any good? Anyone try the Assassin game they did recently? was that any good?
Its kind of a great deal if you are into the HH...or just MK4 Maximus armored marines (and plastic Contemptor!)...since everyone has the same wargear (or at least very similar). you don't have to split the box with anyone...combine everything into one force and it's decent sized. Certainly a good deal for those who were intrigued by the FW resin stuff, but put off buying because of the price. I assume we are now up to $150 for one of these box games?
Fango wrote: What's up with the tiny hex board? You think the game rules will actually be any good? Anyone try the Assassin game they did recently? was that any good?
Never played the assassins game, but here's how I look at it -- it's a good deal on a bunch of 30K minis, with a free game also in the box. *shrug* I'll probably give the game a try at some point with my kids.
Samurai_Eduh wrote: Meh, the set is ok I guess, but nothing that spectacular.
I agree. If the price is low, sure, I'll grab it up as is, but I only really want the Contemptor and they will pop up all over ebay now. There's nothing here that really helps 100% what I wanted to do with my 30k army besides the basics, which I'm not in a rush to buy. I'm a bit underwhelmed. I think there was too much hype leading up to this and seeing it in full color, I want more. A lot more.
Dang it. I already have far too many TSons to paint already without needing to buy this set. Even at Canadian prices the thing should be a steal. Maybe I'll go off and paint some models right now to justify buying this...
Hopefully the almost guaranteed success of the game will convince GW to make more marks of armour in plastic.Thus far I have resisted buying any FW kits and I will be super happy if my patience pays off and I can get everything in glorious plastic instead.
I actually might play the actual game of this, as I hang out with people who really enjoy board games. I guess that really depends on whether the game is enjoyable and has replay value.
If it does end up being a decent game, then that does mean that I can't use all the models as one force... ugh.
Speaking of which, has anyone played the other Board Game boxes (Space Hulk, Assassins) and know if they're worth playing?
Wyzilla wrote: I guess now I'll have to re-write some of the fluff for my DIY Chapter for having a bunch of MK IV armor left over along with modified MK III helmets.
I'm reading a Horus Heresy novel & the Raven Guard, about 3,000 survived Istavvan and had hodge podged their armor with other chapters to survive.
Spoiler:
Then Raven Guard that were not on Istavvan swooped in and saved their brothers, about 4,000 RG scattered around in various duty locals, had perfect MK III- IV still....
Then Corax used armor from vehicles and whatever he could to remake all the armor. From MK II-IV, plus new stuff (MK V), and other metal.
What is interesting about the sprues on display is that their year of creation is listed as 2014. They've been sitting on these for quite some time now.
BrookM wrote: What is interesting about the sprues on display is that their year of creation is listed as 2014. They've been sitting on these for quite some time now.
Same for Age of Sigmar. There's a long lead time for these things. I think the date on the sprues are from when the moulds are made, but then they have to run enough to distribute, design all the packaging, the rules etc
Requizen wrote: I actually might play the actual game of this, as I hang out with people who really enjoy board games. I guess that really depends on whether the game is enjoyable and has replay value.
If it does end up being a decent game, then that does mean that I can't use all the models as one force... ugh.
Speaking of which, has anyone played the other Board Game boxes (Space Hulk, Assassins) and know if they're worth playing?
Space Hulk is a great game, very atmospheric and tons of tiles and missions means it has good replay value even though it is not that complicated.
I haven't played Execution Force, but almost all reviews I've seen agree that it's a fun game but with little variability, it lacks depth and is not just much of a game for that price, even if the miniatures value isn't bad.
BrookM wrote: What is interesting about the sprues on display is that their year of creation is listed as 2014. They've been sitting on these for quite some time now.
Same for Age of Sigmar.
IIRCAoS sprues say 2012. I was really squinting for any writing on the HH sprue leak pics (still in OP) but saw nothing.
BrookM wrote: What is interesting about the sprues on display is that their year of creation is listed as 2014. They've been sitting on these for quite some time now.
Same for Age of Sigmar. There's a long lead time for these things. I think the date on the sprues are from when the moulds are made, but then they have to run enough to distribute, design all the packaging, the rules etc
Yeah, this is why I laugh when people say 'Oh GW must need a good quarter so they made HH.' Yeah, only if they predicted that a couple years ago.
BrookM wrote: What is interesting about the sprues on display is that their year of creation is listed as 2014. They've been sitting on these for quite some time now.
Same for Age of Sigmar. There's a long lead time for these things. I think the date on the sprues are from when the moulds are made, but then they have to run enough to distribute, design all the packaging, the rules etc
Yeah, this is why I laugh when people say 'Oh GW must need a good quarter so they made HH.' Yeah, only if they predicted that a couple years ago.
Except, you know... they've needed a good quarter for about 10 years now.
Love the chaplain sculpt but there is no way i use him as a word bearer...gotta look more chaosy or have a hint of chaos in there...he would make a better ultramarine character actually
RedFox wrote: Love the chaplain sculpt but there is no way i use him as a word bearer...gotta look more chaosy or have a hint of chaos in there...he would make a better ultramarine character actually
I prefer the "just turned" look to Traitor Marines. Veteran warriors in archaic armor wielding ancient weapons is what I like to picture CSM as in 40k, rather than the "covered in spikes and mutations" look.
I just find them more menacing when the corruption is more subtly conveyed.
I mean like next year. I plan on getting Guilliman, this box set and a Xiphon interceptor to round out my Legion list. If I have any money left I'll get another box set so I can run the Ultramarine's legion specific rite of war and build some supporting infantry. Three 15 man tac squads, a 5 man plasma gun support team and two 5 man devastator squads with Lascannons and Volkite Culverins respectively. Trying to phase out my armor as I find it dies really quick in HH.
Dunno what I'm going to do with the extra characters. I might just sell them for like $10 to some people in my group who already have this stuff.
These would make a great addition to my HH Word Eaters. The Terminators would make a new addition, I can always go with another Contemptor for a Talon of two. Not sure on the bolter marines, as all my tacticals have bolt pistols and chainaxes.
I am still not sure why they have all the heavy and special weapons though. You cannot use them in the tactical squads.
I am still not sure why they have all the heavy and special weapons though. You cannot use them in the tactical squads.
I'm thinking they're intending to release them separately for use in 40k, hence why there are no 30k (or veteran) specific weapons in the kit.
It's possible they are actually *shock horror* trying to help you build your 30k army by giving you lots of leftover bitz for your support squads - which is possible, Dark Eldar Trueborn used to have access to Splinter Carbines, which were weapons you'd have left over from assembling a Scourge squad - but that doesn't explain the lack of 30k specific weapons.
Personally I think these are awesome. I'm trying to hammer out a full set of legion-specific army lists based on variants of six 'squads' (two game boxes or six squad boxes if they bring them out separately): 40 Tacticals (or 30 Tacticals and 10 Veterans) in various configurations, 3x 6-man support squads and 2x praetor/centurion made from sergeant bitz.
I'm not a fan of MKIV, however, if I do manage to get a box, they will all become Salamanders. Because the MKIV helmets have kind of a dragon look to them. And I've wanted Salamanders for a long time.
My apologies!
