The filigree plus the quite static pose funnily reminds me of the one third party 40K sculptor who was all the rage some years ago, what's his name again? ("some years" meaning everything between 10-20 yrs, I'm old)
MarkNorfolk wrote: All these resin characters characters are well and good, but I’d like something a bit more plasticity with a bit more general purposefulness, in either big or little Horus Heresy.
Like the Mechanicum stuff that's been shown over the last few weeks? The Legions have most of the roster in plastic at this point, it's been nice to see both Solar Auxilia and Mechanicum get the boost they desperately needed.
MobileSuitRandom wrote: The filigree plus the quite static pose funnily reminds me of the one third party 40K sculptor who was all the rage some years ago, what's his name again? ("some years" meaning everything between 10-20 yrs, I'm old)
Scibor - Which was my immediate thought when I saw this too.
MobileSuitRandom wrote: The filigree plus the quite static pose funnily reminds me of the one third party 40K sculptor who was all the rage some years ago, what's his name again? ("some years" meaning everything between 10-20 yrs, I'm old)
Scibor - Which was my immediate thought when I saw this too.
MobileSuitRandom wrote: The filigree plus the quite static pose funnily reminds me of the one third party 40K sculptor who was all the rage some years ago, what's his name again? ("some years" meaning everything between 10-20 yrs, I'm old)
Scibor - Which was my immediate thought when I saw this too.
That's him, exactly!!
A lot of the filigree is pretty ugly to boot. Some of it doesn't flow from the rims on the pads, but instead juts from it at right angles. At other times there are a sequence of curls that are all in the same direction, when you'd expect some opposing curls to create a natural flowing design. It definitely reminds be of the old press-moulded scibor designs too.
The wrist mounted weapon is better integrated into the armour than those of the sanguinary guard or dawnbreakers (EDIT: or grey knights) but it still looks a fair bit too large. I've always sworn that if I ever make some sanguinary guard that I'd try to incorporate the weapons into the armour more comprehensively than the tacked on oversized lumps we currently have. So I appreciate that they tried something a bit different with this mini.
MarkNorfolk wrote: All these resin characters characters are well and good, but I’d like something a bit more plasticity with a bit more general purposefulness, in either big or little Horus Heresy.
Like the Mechanicum stuff that's been shown over the last few weeks? The Legions have most of the roster in plastic at this point, it's been nice to see both Solar Auxilia and Mechanicum get the boost they desperately needed.
Yeah, the Mechanicum support box should be in people’s hands on Saturday (mine has shipped!) so they’re probably waiting for that before distracting people with new shinies.
I was excited to see that there were extra images. Except they were just cutouts from the one picture. Can’t we get another angle? Can we only afford one picture in this economy?
Not a fan. Whie the modern proportions are always welcome, cannot help thinking the manlet praetor & co pull of those decarative bitz better. This guy is too busy in all the wrong ways IMHO, but then again I never appreciated the HH IXth decor style with these golden hurlumhei's all over the models..
My horrors might have just became true. The MK V Assault squad resin kit now shows "SOLD OUT ONLINE" instead of temporarily out of stock.. I have been waiting over 6 months for these to come back in stock..
I am desperately looking for these types of jump packs for my RT era beakie army! I'd need 1-5 of these jump packs. Am willing to pay scalper prices for them as long as they are official FW resin ones. In fact, ended up finding some and paid through the nose to get em
EDIT: Seems that also the MK V resin tacticals are sold out online.. so now the only MK V models available are the new apotechary and a couple characters. Store snafu, or a plastic kit incoming..?
- massive box for HH incoming, themed Salamanders vs. Iron Warriors, as the 3rd edition launch box
- 40 to 50 minis included
- mentions "troops, Terminators, Dreadnoughts, gun emplacements"
- coming end of spring to summertime
- plastic Mk.II for basic troops
- Praetor Mk.II
- includes Saturnine Terminators ("apparently six alltogether, three two-man squads, with different loadouts") and Saturnine Dreadnoughts
- also comes with a Saturnine HQ/Praetor
- includes a "never before seen" gun emplacement
- comes with measuring sticks, templates (doesn't mention it, but probably dice and BRB as well)
As always, Valrak being Valrak, take it with a grain of salt. Adepticon will either confirm this or shoot it down in flames. Either way we should know in a bit more than two weeks.
- massive box for HH incoming, themed Salamanders vs. Iron Warriors, as the 3rd edition launch box
- 40 to 50 minis included
- mentions "troops, Terminators, Dreadnoughts, gun emplacements"
- coming end of spring to summertime
- plastic Mk.II for basic troops
- Praetor Mk.II
- includes Saturnine Terminators ("apparently six alltogether, three two-man squads, with different loadouts") and Saturnine Dreadnoughts
- also comes with a Saturnine HQ/Praetor
- includes a "never before seen" gun emplacement
- comes with measuring sticks, templates (doesn't mention it, but probably dice and BRB as well)
As always, Valrak being Valrak, take it with a grain of salt. Adepticon will either confirm this or shoot it down in flames. Either way we should know in a bit more than two weeks.
If it's the June/July slot Adepticon might be a bit early for anything beyond a cryptic 5 second video or whatever.
Aren't the Saturnyne (or however you spell it) Terminators the ones we've seen art for with Even Bigger Pauldrons (TM), and some gun mounted above their heads between the pauldrons?
True, but since when did facts get in the way of opinions?
Vakrak has been fairly consistent on these rumours; I am assuming he’s at least partially correct, allowing for his habitual vagueness about unit names. I’m not convinced that there is any real demand for these alleged Saturnine Terminators, but I guess they’ll be popular if they are suitably archaic looking. I’m not that excited about Mk 2 armour (I think Mk 5 would be better) - and the inclusion of Tigrus bolt pistols on the melee weapons sprue would suggest that it is actually Mk 4 armour that is being re-done next. I would also have thought that most people would prefer another plastic unit or vehicle to a ‘gun emplacement’.
The "Never seen before" gun emplacements could well be rapier carriers. Valrak may well be familiar with tarantulas, but not rapiers and therefore could have mistook a (presumably blurry) photo of them for something new.
I'm going to go out on a limb here and postulate that if indeed they are Saturnine terminators, they'll have "rebranded" them as siege terminators (Not that there's much to rebrand a single model and what? Two pieces of artwork?), which would suit their general "look". Although to be honest I'd be interested in what lore they give them, as there's never been anything more then nothing about them.
As for the Saturnine Dreadnought, again, postulating that it'll be a re-do of the Furibundus, which I believe there was a rumour about a good while back.
- massive box for HH incoming, themed Salamanders vs. Iron Warriors, as the 3rd edition launch box - 40 to 50 minis included - mentions "troops, Terminators, Dreadnoughts, gun emplacements" - coming end of spring to summertime - plastic Mk.II for basic troops - Praetor Mk.II - includes Saturnine Terminators ("apparently six alltogether, three two-man squads, with different loadouts") and Saturnine Dreadnoughts - also comes with a Saturnine HQ/Praetor - includes a "never before seen" gun emplacement - comes with measuring sticks, templates (doesn't mention it, but probably dice and BRB as well)
As always, Valrak being Valrak, take it with a grain of salt. Adepticon will either confirm this or shoot it down in flames. Either way we should know in a bit more than two weeks.
Some more info: In the comments he corrected himself that he meant 2x three-man squads of termis Also this is apperantly close to how the gun emplacement was described to him:
Spoiler:
He also talks a bit about which weapons the Terminators, Dreadnought and gun emplacement will have but I don't have time to write all of them out right now so just watch the video if you are interested
I'd hope for the same edition with an errata/balance pass.
MkII isn't my favorite, but I could find places for it. 2x 3 man units is odd for hh terminators. The 3 man units are mainly over in mechanicum and custodes, not astartes.
Gun turrets, that pic is from the firestorm redoubt, but the guns are compatible with the vengeance weapons batteries. If they do (re)make those as a proper plastic kit rather than the older China cast terrain sprues, I would greatly approve. More terrain is always better.
If all these rumors are true, it could look like
Mk II praetor
30x mkII marines
Saturnine praetor
2x3? Saturnine terminators
(Possibly it is not 2x3 units, but a unit of 5 with the praetor as the sixth model)
2? Dreadnoughts
2? Vengeance batteries?
41 models, with weapons batteries and a second dreadnought in place of a Spartan but otherwise about equivalent to the age of darkness box. I could see it.
Gun turrets, that pic is from the firestorm redoubt, but the guns are compatible with the vengeance weapons batteries. If they do (re)make those as a proper plastic kit rather than the older China cast terrain sprues, I would greatly approve. More terrain is always better.
Those Vengeance turrets were very poor models - the detail was soft and they were covered in lumpy-looking skulls. Improved, skull- free versions would be nice, but not particularly exciting. Plastic Rapiers would be infinitely superior.
I kind-of hope the Saturnine Dreadnought thing is true. I have a 40k army that has 140 guys converted from Stormcast Eternals that could use something different for a vehicle.
A modernized Furibundus Dreadnought would be a dream come true. MKII will probably get proper HH heads all hot and bothered (unless they flub it like they claim they did with the MKIII..), but I personally would prefer MKIV or MKV. No matter as long as we eventually get all marks in the 5 poses I guess..
I wonder if they will release new stuff focusing on the siege of Terra.
Bringing us closer to the day when GW finally tips the power creep into madness levels and makes the Emperor into a model. (He was teased in the old Custodes list).
But for now, I'm just waiting to see what comes next.
Lathe Biosas wrote: I wonder if they will release new stuff focusing on the siege of Terra.
Bringing us closer to the day when GW finally tips the power creep into madness levels and makes the Emperor into a model. (He was teased in the old Custodes list).
But for now, I'm just waiting to see what comes next.
I can't see them not EVENTUALLY doing SoT, or at least parts of it. But I also think it'll be after we get 2.0 versions of many of the primarchs (transfigured versions / maimed for perturabo, and probably late heresy iterations of many loyalists). So maybe ten years down the line.
If the Saturnine Terminator rumors are true, this is the start of "3 models to a box elite units" like most of the primaris range. With no reduction in cost. Hopefully not, but man do I hate that trend.
Lathe Biosas wrote: I wonder if they will release new stuff focusing on the siege of Terra.
Bringing us closer to the day when GW finally tips the power creep into madness levels and makes the Emperor into a model. (He was teased in the old Custodes list).
But for now, I'm just waiting to see what comes next.
I can't see them EVENTUALLY doing SoT, or at least parts of it. But I also think it'll be after we get 2.0 versions of many of the primarchs (transfigured versions / maimed for perturabo, and probably late heresy iterations of many loyalists). So maybe ten years down the line.
Fulgrim is the SoT version of him, I'm confused what you guys mean by SoT other than stuff like that?
Edit: Angron was also mentioned as being the version in the closing months of the Heresy, ready to duel at the eternity gate.
Angron was also forcibly transfigured. Poor guy never caught a break. Slave on Nunceria, slave to The Emperor, and then slave of a mad god. Only ever treated as a handy weapon.
Lathe Biosas wrote: I wonder if they will release new stuff focusing on the siege of Terra.
Bringing us closer to the day when GW finally tips the power creep into madness levels and makes the Emperor into a model. (He was teased in the old Custodes list).
But for now, I'm just waiting to see what comes next.
I can't see them EVENTUALLY doing SoT, or at least parts of it. But I also think it'll be after we get 2.0 versions of many of the primarchs (transfigured versions / maimed for perturabo, and probably late heresy iterations of many loyalists). So maybe ten years down the line.
Fulgrim is the SoT version of him, I'm confused what you guys mean by SoT other than stuff like that?
Edit: Angron was also mentioned as being the version in the closing months of the Heresy, ready to duel at the eternity gate.
Yeah I know. So we're missing Mortarion, Magnus, Peter-turbo, and Khan with Bike primarily.
I read on B&C that there's been some Reddit rumours doing the rounds, where they claim its actually MKIV and that the gun emplacements are rapiers. But everything's still pretty vague either way, Adepticon should solidify things I reckon..
Given there was art of a (slightly) altered Rapier in one of the books recent a plastic version seems very likely even if it's not included in this box.
All the LI scale models will get the plastic treatment in 28mil eventually. This is actually an awesome thing, since those Dreadnought Drop Pods have already been released for LI.
In fact, given what we already have for LI, most of the things we are still missing for 28mil HH are on the way.. The only question really is the order in which they will release
tauist wrote: I read on B&C that there's been some Reddit rumours doing the rounds, where they claim its actually MKIV and that the gun emplacements are rapiers. But everything's still pretty vague either way, Adepticon should solidify things I reckon..
tauist wrote: I read on B&C that there's been some Reddit rumours doing the rounds, where they claim its actually MKIV and that the gun emplacements are rapiers. But everything's still pretty vague either way, Adepticon should solidify things I reckon..
It's from 4chan...
-imgsnip-
So exactly as reliable as whatever Valrak is posting then? He's not Harry, he's a youtuber, so long as people watch the videos accuracy is irrelevant and he clearly posts anything that drops into his inbox that's even vaguely plausible, and he definitely often...let's be charitable and say "significantly extrapolates" from any info he does have. Or are we forgetting the last time we were definitely about to see a new box for Heresy with plastic MK5 and an all-new melee dreadnought chassis?
tauist wrote: I read on B&C that there's been some Reddit rumours doing the rounds, where they claim its actually MKIV and that the gun emplacements are rapiers. But everything's still pretty vague either way, Adepticon should solidify things I reckon..
These rumours sound good to me.. which is of course suspicious and therefore likely not true
Seriously though, a TDA which is a mashup of Tartaros and Indomitus, properly truescaled, sounds great to me. Not too thrilled about needing to rebuy the Liber Astartes though.. As for the "new dreadnought loadout", is there something still missing from the plastics we have now?
tauist wrote: These rumours sound good to me.. which is of course suspicious and therefore likely not true
Seriously though, a TDA which is a mashup of Tartaros and Indomitus, properly truescaled, sounds great to me. Not too thrilled about needing to rebuy the Liber Astartes though.. As for the "new dreadnought loadout", is there something still missing from the plastics we have now?
I'm looking forward to a cleaned up version of the game. Maybe they will fix some of the weird bits...
Maybe Fury of the Ancients will finally be playable (without the death threats from across the tabletop).
tauist wrote: These rumours sound good to me.. which is of course suspicious and therefore likely not true
Seriously though, a TDA which is a mashup of Tartaros and Indomitus, properly truescaled, sounds great to me. Not too thrilled about needing to rebuy the Liber Astartes though.. As for the "new dreadnought loadout", is there something still missing from the plastics we have now?
These rumours sound a bit less ‘out there’ than Valrak’s, and have the smell of authenticity (whatever that smells like). In particular, revised Mk4 just seems more likely than Mk2. I am in the minority which is fine with the scale of the Cataphractii, so I hope any new Termie armour is a new type and not a replacement. And Rapiers in plastic = awesome. But I agree that this version of the rumoured new boxed set doesn’t sound particularly exciting.
The biggest issue for me will be whether they tweak the rules to fix known issues and rephrase stuff that is badly written (which would be great), or revise them in the way they do with WH40k (bad, very bad).
tauist wrote: These rumours sound good to me.. which is of course suspicious and therefore likely not true
Seriously though, a TDA which is a mashup of Tartaros and Indomitus, properly truescaled, sounds great to me. Not too thrilled about needing to rebuy the Liber Astartes though.. As for the "new dreadnought loadout", is there something still missing from the plastics we have now?
iirc that basically sums up the Gorgon pattern termies? the forgeworld minis for them had basically Tartaros legs and lower arms, and Indomitus torso, shoulders, and heads. and the resin Gorgon termies have all gone out of stock on the warhammer store.
Yeah but Gorgon pattern is specifically an Iron Hands pattern so there's no reason why they'd include it unless all of a sudden they've changed it to be widespread to other legions. Which would be stupid.
For as loathe as I am to have to potentially buy another rulebook/liber, I wouldn't be as adverse to it if they fix some of the profiles/points costs for units. Bump the Contemptors up a bit (and maybe adjust it's stat line a smidge T6, Sv 3+), boost Tartaros units up to the same cost as their Cataphractii equivalents, as there's no reason at all that it should be cheaper. Price hike for lascannons in heavy support squads. Stuff like that.
SamusDrake wrote: I think this bodes well for a 30K kit a bit later on. With only two loadouts and no carapace weapon, I'd venture a bit cheaper than the Questoris kit.
The odd part is that it's supposed to be a Questoris. Guess the carapace weapon was one of the technologies that was around for 25,000 years, lost during the HH and then rediscovered later... kinda like Dominus Knights.
...which I would use as the basis of a guess as to what it's Mechanicum counterpart kit would look like, given a plastic update. I'd say that it would be 3-4 sprues instead of 5, and somewhere around £95 to £100.
The odd part is that it's supposed to be a Questoris. Guess the carapace weapon was one of the technologies that was around for 25,000 years, lost during the HH and then rediscovered later... kinda like Dominus Knights.
I would guess that it's because the Magaera and Styrix draw more power than their House-hold counterparts. Maybe the stronger arm weapons, and the ability to repair, doesn't leave enough power for a carapace weapon?
Its because those knights have Thralls in command.
The full, Onageresque Thrall-in-a-jar treatment.
Thats why they have no visible entrance hatch; the pilot cant leave on its own volition.
Its proper grimdark, but thats why i dont have those carapaces on my knights.
Well, apart from one, which i'll get round to swapping out eventually.
SirDonlad wrote: Its because those knights have Thralls in command.
The full, Onageresque Thrall-in-a-jar treatment.
Thats why they have no visible entrance hatch; the pilot cant leave on its own volition.
Its proper grimdark, but thats why i dont have those carapaces on my knights.
Well, apart from one, which i'll get round to swapping out eventually.
Managed to miss that! Where can I read more?
Please note that when I essentially ask “sauce?” on background it’s because I wish to know more, and am not calling the poster out. This disclaimer is necessary due to lack of tone of voice in text, and I don’t want anyone getting the wrong end of the stick.
SirDonlad wrote: Its because those knights have Thralls in command.
The full, Onageresque Thrall-in-a-jar treatment.
Thats why they have no visible entrance hatch; the pilot cant leave on its own volition.
Its proper grimdark, but thats why i dont have those carapaces on my knights.
Well, apart from one, which i'll get round to swapping out eventually.
Managed to miss that! Where can I read more?
Please note that when I essentially ask “sauce?” on background it’s because I wish to know more, and am not calling the poster out. This disclaimer is necessary due to lack of tone of voice in text, and I don’t want anyone getting the wrong end of the stick.
I have found no sources to support this, the few references to how they are controlled or piloted all imply that they are piloted in the traditional way, in that they mention or reference petsonality traits of the scions who typically pilot them, etc.
Box looks like a bad boxset overall, dread looks bad and so does the terminator character. Basic marines look good and close to the resin. No opinion/mid on the hydra platform thing and termies. Good value monetarily.
lord_blackfang wrote: "I saw the box everyone wants to know about but have no information to give about contents, only my subjective judgement of it"
Maybe it's like Schrödinger's cat.
Schrödinger's cat is a thought experiment illustrating the strangeness of quantum mechanics, suggesting that a cat in a box with a radioactive substance is both alive and dead until observed, highlighting the concept of superposition.
But in this instance, we cannot truly know the contents of the box until it has been opened and viewed.
Welp, if these rumours turn out to be correct, I'm happy for MKII fans.
Personally however, I will not be buying HH 3 box if the contents are what these rumours claim they will be. I got no use for MKII, a physical rulebook nor a Hydra flakk gun platform. Better just to buy the Saturmine termies individually (if I even fancy the way they look, a big if) and the epub rulebook later
tauist wrote: Welp, if these rumours turn out to be correct, I'm happy for MKII fans.
Personally however, I will not be buying HH 3 box if the contents are what these rumours claim they will be. I got no use for MKII, a physical rulebook nor a Hydra flakk gun platform. Better just to buy the Saturmine termies individually (if I even fancy the way they look, a big if) and the epub rulebook later
It's a core game now, it might not get epubs and pick up the mandatory app.
I'm a very long way from my books at the moment, so can't double check - but isn't the only 'new' thing here the combi-grav...? Otherwise it's all existing options?
Just slightly concerns me (given the talk of a new edition) that we've got a 40k-style datasheet thing with zero options, rather than them just saying IW Praetors/Consuls can take combi-gravs now for +x points which is really all it needed? E.g. Means you can't technically use this model for a Forge Lord consul or something, or convert the hammer and use him as a regular Warsmith (unless you also convert the combi-grav away).
Appreciate it isn't a massive deal on it's own, just really hope that isn't an indicator of the direction that the new edition of 30k is going to go...
I'm a very long way from my books at the moment, so can't double check - but isn't the only 'new' thing here the combi-grav...? Otherwise it's all existing options?
Yes, Combi-Grav is the only new thing and the points and rules are exactly the same as a Praetor Warsmith with the Grav Hammer and Magna-Combi. You're basically just forgoing the extra options for a Combi-Grav if you want the model WYSIWYG.
tauist wrote: Welp, if these rumours turn out to be correct, I'm happy for MKII fans.
Personally however, I will not be buying HH 3 box if the contents are what these rumours claim they will be. I got no use for MKII, a physical rulebook nor a Hydra flakk gun platform. Better just to buy the Saturmine termies individually (if I even fancy the way they look, a big if) and the epub rulebook later
It's a core game now, it might not get epubs and pick up the mandatory app.
It's still a Specialist Games studio game, not a Main Studio one. They've never done the app before.
tauist wrote: Welp, if these rumours turn out to be correct, I'm happy for MKII fans.
Personally however, I will not be buying HH 3 box if the contents are what these rumours claim they will be. I got no use for MKII, a physical rulebook nor a Hydra flakk gun platform. Better just to buy the Saturmine termies individually (if I even fancy the way they look, a big if) and the epub rulebook later
It's a core game now, it might not get epubs and pick up the mandatory app.
It's still a Specialist Games studio game, not a Main Studio one. They've never done the app before.
Isn't Kill Team also SGS? It got an app (although the app functions almost like a pdf viewer).
tauist wrote: Welp, if these rumours turn out to be correct, I'm happy for MKII fans.
Personally however, I will not be buying HH 3 box if the contents are what these rumours claim they will be. I got no use for MKII, a physical rulebook nor a Hydra flakk gun platform. Better just to buy the Saturmine termies individually (if I even fancy the way they look, a big if) and the epub rulebook later
It's a core game now, it might not get epubs and pick up the mandatory app.
It's still a Specialist Games studio game, not a Main Studio one. They've never done the app before.
Isn't Kill Team also SGS? It got an app (although the app functions almost like a pdf viewer).
No, it is a core game, although I suspect 30k will transition over. I don't see how they can see any kind of success and that level of investment and not want to pivot it under the main umbrella and known practices.
Its not exactly main/core studio either, there is (or was) a separate "publications team" responsible for warcry, underworlds, kill team, and the random board games and one-off self contained games.
I dont see Horus Heresy "transitioning". Theres a specific brand and market placement strategy that GW is pursuing w its games and product lines, making HH part of the "core" product model is not conducive to that.
chaos0xomega wrote: Its not exactly main/core studio either, there is (or was) a separate "publications team" responsible for warcry, underworlds, kill team, and the random board games and one-off self contained games.
I dont see Horus Heresy "transitioning". Theres a specific brand and market placement strategy that GW is pursuing w its games and product lines, making HH part of the "core" product model is not conducive to that.
What brand is that? It's all under the GW umbrella regardless to anyone who doesn't delve into the depths of individual publishment teams for the books.
I'm also how not following your stance on market placement. They're sinking a fairly large volume of resources into 30k and I arent sure why they wouldn't want to push that like the larger games, either it's successful and they want to expand the player base, or it isn't and it's not supported much. Either way I can't agree that keeping it smaller and selling less on purpose is the plan.
chaos0xomega wrote: Its not exactly main/core studio either, there is (or was) a separate "publications team" responsible for warcry, underworlds, kill team, and the random board games and one-off self contained games.
I dont see Horus Heresy "transitioning". Theres a specific brand and market placement strategy that GW is pursuing w its games and product lines, making HH part of the "core" product model is not conducive to that.
Agreed. Every time a resin model is released it shows they're not planning to move HH anywhere close to 40K/AoS where anything but plastic got erased.
And that can only be good for the HH community.
chaos0xomega wrote: Its not exactly main/core studio either, there is (or was) a separate "publications team" responsible for warcry, underworlds, kill team, and the random board games and one-off self contained games.
I dont see Horus Heresy "transitioning". Theres a specific brand and market placement strategy that GW is pursuing w its games and product lines, making HH part of the "core" product model is not conducive to that.
What brand is that? It's all under the GW umbrella regardless to anyone who doesn't delve into the depths of individual publishment teams for the books.
I'm also how not following your stance on market placement. They're sinking a fairly large volume of resources into 30k and I arent sure why they wouldn't want to push that like the larger games, either it's successful and they want to expand the player base, or it isn't and it's not supported much. Either way I can't agree that keeping it smaller and selling less on purpose is the plan.
Who says theyre keeping it small on purpose? Theres an excess of stock for most HH products, the resins sell out on release, but not much else does. The mk3 battle group box set was on shelves for months, theres still availability of the mechanicum battle group box, and the recent mechanicum hs box set is available everywhere still. The cerastus knight battlegroup is likewise still available everywhere and thats with 40k players snapping them up. The only heresy release ive seen go out of stock on any consistent basis is the deimos rhino, and theres some obvious reasons for that. GW is producing product in excess of what the market can absorb. Thats not to say HH isnt successful but "limited resources" are quite clearly not holding back thegrowth and development of the game.
chaos0xomega wrote: Its not exactly main/core studio either, there is (or was) a separate "publications team" responsible for warcry, underworlds, kill team, and the random board games and one-off self contained games.
I dont see Horus Heresy "transitioning". Theres a specific brand and market placement strategy that GW is pursuing w its games and product lines, making HH part of the "core" product model is not conducive to that.
What brand is that? It's all under the GW umbrella regardless to anyone who doesn't delve into the depths of individual publishment teams for the books.
I'm also how not following your stance on market placement. They're sinking a fairly large volume of resources into 30k and I arent sure why they wouldn't want to push that like the larger games, either it's successful and they want to expand the player base, or it isn't and it's not supported much. Either way I can't agree that keeping it smaller and selling less on purpose is the plan.
Who says theyre keeping it small on purpose? Theres an excess of stock for most HH products, the resins sell out on release, but not much else does. The mk3 battle group box set was on shelves for months, theres still availability of the mechanicum battle group box, and the recent mechanicum hs box set is available everywhere still. The cerastus knight battlegroup is likewise still available everywhere and thats with 40k players snapping them up. The only heresy release ive seen go out of stock on any consistent basis is the deimos rhino, and theres some obvious reasons for that. GW is producing product in excess of what the market can absorb. Thats not to say HH isnt successful but "limited resources" are quite clearly not holding back thegrowth and development of the game.
To me that reads "not selling as much as we would like" and they may take a leaf out of the other games to push it, but we'll have to wait and see (dreaded as that statement apparently is).
Was just wondering when the jump bears would come out.
I'm a little surprised they didn't wait on the tanks & Calix. The 'limited time' Heavy Support boxes haven't sold out on the GW store (and are widely available at a discount elsewhere), and based on the Cavas and Triaros pricing, any two of those kits is going to be more than the box of three.
(The HS box is 185 US, the Cavas 105, and the Triaros 92, so I assume the Karacnos and Calix are slightly more expensive individually, with a small chance of being the same price point)
A maniple of Thanatar can only have one Calix. The Karacnos is one per slot, but the Krios comes in squadrons of 1-3.
So, in terms of multiple set appeal its contents are limited.
I got two, because I’ve already got a pair of Thanatar, so I can field all four in a few combinations. The second Karacnos I’m in the midst of selling. The Krios will be a squadron, and I might be wanting more.
Yes indeed, but that heavy support boxed set was always a weird one, and unlikely to sell in big numbers. The model everyone really wants is the Krios.
Looking at them again, I'm really not a fan of the Ursarax. The design looks like a throwback to much earlier models.
What brand is that? It's all under the GW umbrella regardless to anyone who doesn't delve into the depths of individual publishment teams for the books.
It sounds like you are operating on a 5-10 year old understanding of GW's structure. Information from the past few years has clarified that there is a main design studio/team and a secondary design studio/team called Specialist Design Studio (SDS, not SGS as I erroneously called it earlier).
Classifying games as "core" vs. "specialist" seems to have become an outdated paradigm, from what people have been able to glean of GW's internal operations.
How are you even determining that HH and KT are "core" games, btw? The layout of GW's commercial website?
What brand is that? It's all under the GW umbrella regardless to anyone who doesn't delve into the depths of individual publishment teams for the books.
It sounds like you are operating on a 5-10 year old understanding of GW's structure. Information from the past few years has clarified that there is a main design studio/team and a secondary design studio/team called Specialist Design Studio (SDS, not SGS as I erroneously called it earlier).
Classifying games as "core" vs. "specialist" seems to have become an outdated paradigm, from what people have been able to glean of GW's internal operations.
How are you even determining that HH and KT are "core" games, btw? The layout of GW's commercial website?
In so far as you're diving the game rules owners into two teams, then you're also dividing the product lines into two.
Kill team is written by the core/main rules writing team to the best of our knowledge. Previously HH fell under the purview of specialist designs as you note.
Specialist design games are for the smaller niche games, hence the name. So it stands that if they're pumping money in and seeing growth, it stops being a niche specialist and might get handed over.
You literally confirmed my point whilst saying it's out of date info?
chaos0xomega wrote: Its not exactly main/core studio either, there is (or was) a separate "publications team" responsible for warcry, underworlds, kill team, and the random board games and one-off self contained games.
I dont see Horus Heresy "transitioning". Theres a specific brand and market placement strategy that GW is pursuing w its games and product lines, making HH part of the "core" product model is not conducive to that.
The boxed games team aren't responsible for Warcry/Underworlds/Kill Team. They just do the one off games like the Barnes and Noble ones. Those three games are just main studio games.
What brand is that? It's all under the GW umbrella regardless to anyone who doesn't delve into the depths of individual publishment teams for the books.
It sounds like you are operating on a 5-10 year old understanding of GW's structure. Information from the past few years has clarified that there is a main design studio/team and a secondary design studio/team called Specialist Design Studio (SDS, not SGS as I erroneously called it earlier).
Classifying games as "core" vs. "specialist" seems to have become an outdated paradigm, from what people have been able to glean of GW's internal operations.
How are you even determining that HH and KT are "core" games, btw? The layout of GW's commercial website?
In so far as you're diving the game rules owners into two teams, then you're also dividing the product lines into two.
Kill team is written by the core/main rules writing team to the best of our knowledge. Previously HH fell under the purview of specialist designs as you note.
Specialist design games are for the smaller niche games, hence the name. So it stands that if they're pumping money in and seeing growth, it stops being a niche specialist and might get handed over.
You literally confirmed my point whilst saying it's out of date info?
So, first, how do you know HH has been transferred to the main design studio? Valrak or other rumourmongers? Because HH was one of the few products where it was, in the past, 100% confirmed to be designed under SDS' remit.
I honestly have trouble keeping track of which products are main/SDS because there's no logic to it and because GW suppresses credits for their creatives. During the FW decades it was obvious, because of the resin/plastic split, but now SDS gets time on the HIPs STCs. Doesn't neatly divide by setting. "Smaller niche games" certainly doesn't cover it, because Underworlds is the very definition of a small niche game and is apparently main studio.
But, no, it doesn't stand to reason that a game would automatically be handed over. If you've employed 20 people to handle AoS and 40K, and 10 people to handle Necromunda and Horus Heresy, and then Horus Heresy grows, you can't just expect the 20 fully-tasked people to absorb HH without restructuring or personnel transfers. It cannot be a painless automatic pipeline of "whatever gets popular goes directly to the main studio." That's not to say it can't happen, and there are also apocryphal stories of the main design studio having a bigger appetite (trying to snatch up The Old World iirc, according to some reports).
What brand is that? It's all under the GW umbrella regardless to anyone who doesn't delve into the depths of individual publishment teams for the books.
It sounds like you are operating on a 5-10 year old understanding of GW's structure. Information from the past few years has clarified that there is a main design studio/team and a secondary design studio/team called Specialist Design Studio (SDS, not SGS as I erroneously called it earlier).
Classifying games as "core" vs. "specialist" seems to have become an outdated paradigm, from what people have been able to glean of GW's internal operations.
How are you even determining that HH and KT are "core" games, btw? The layout of GW's commercial website?
In so far as you're diving the game rules owners into two teams, then you're also dividing the product lines into two.
Kill team is written by the core/main rules writing team to the best of our knowledge. Previously HH fell under the purview of specialist designs as you note.
Specialist design games are for the smaller niche games, hence the name. So it stands that if they're pumping money in and seeing growth, it stops being a niche specialist and might get handed over.
You literally confirmed my point whilst saying it's out of date info?
So, first, how do you know HH has been transferred to the main design studio? Valrak or other rumourmongers? Because HH was one of the few products where it was, in the past, 100% confirmed to be designed under SDS' remit.
I honestly have trouble keeping track of which products are main/SDS because there's no logic to it and because GW suppresses credits for their creatives. During the FW decades it was obvious, because of the resin/plastic split, but now SDS gets time on the HIPs STCs. Doesn't neatly divide by setting. "Smaller niche games" certainly doesn't cover it, because Underworlds is the very definition of a small niche game and is apparently main studio.
But, no, it doesn't stand to reason that a game would automatically be handed over. If you've employed 20 people to handle AoS and 40K, and 10 people to handle Necromunda and Horus Heresy, and then Horus Heresy grows, you can't just expect the 20 fully-tasked people to absorb HH without restructuring or personnel transfers. It cannot be a painless automatic pipeline of "whatever gets popular goes directly to the main studio." That's not to say it can't happen, and there are also apocryphal stories of the main design studio having a bigger appetite (trying to snatch up The Old World iirc, according to some reports).
I can't confirm anything has been transferred to anything, because I was talking in a hypothetical future tense.
But the premises is completely sound that the bigger chunk of the studio, known for handing them most of the cash and the more popular products, might be given a game that is gaining traction and they wish to expand its appeal/base.
Honestly 30k is truly a unicorn of the GW fanbase as far as I can see. People seem to think it should remain the little game that could and not get touched by GW, yet have loads of plastic support pumped out. They want to see it being successful and grow but are adamantly defensive that it's a small niche product.
None of this really matters I guess, either it's becoming a core product on a 3 year cycle, or it isn't. People will like it or they won't.
Sigh.
If it is a new edition, I'll continue to pick up models, but I don't want new books.
I haven't bought anything past the Astartes & Heretic books. The campaign books don't do anything for me.
I probably should grab the Mechanicum book while its still available tho.
skrulnik wrote: Sigh.
If it is a new edition, I'll continue to pick up models, but I don't want new books.
I haven't bought anything past the Astartes & Heretic books. The campaign books don't do anything for me.
I probably should grab the Mechanicum book while its still available tho.
Same for me.
However, we know how GW work... the newer models they release won't have rules in the older edition so there's no stats for them so you need the new edition.
:-(
So, first, how do you know HH has been transferred to the main design studio? Valrak or other rumourmongers? Because HH was one of the few products where it was, in the past, 100% confirmed to be designed under SDS' remit.
I honestly have trouble keeping track of which products are main/SDS because there's no logic to it and because GW suppresses credits for their creatives. During the FW decades it was obvious, because of the resin/plastic split, but now SDS gets time on the HIPs STCs. Doesn't neatly divide by setting. "Smaller niche games" certainly doesn't cover it, because Underworlds is the very definition of a small niche game and is apparently main studio.
But, no, it doesn't stand to reason that a game would automatically be handed over. If you've employed 20 people to handle AoS and 40K, and 10 people to handle Necromunda and Horus Heresy, and then Horus Heresy grows, you can't just expect the 20 fully-tasked people to absorb HH without restructuring or personnel transfers. It cannot be a painless automatic pipeline of "whatever gets popular goes directly to the main studio." That's not to say it can't happen, and there are also apocryphal stories of the main design studio having a bigger appetite (trying to snatch up The Old World iirc, according to some reports).
It's still very easy to tell - systems that are still getting new resin models are SDS (given it was FW) and systems that don't are main studio (granted, it has been a little while since Legions Imperialis got some new resin weapons, but I'm sure it will at some point).
Interesting. Great to see the tarantulas back. Also, I wonder if the mounts will allow them to be fitted onto the Deimos Rhino chassis, ala scorpius. So Whirlwind and Whirlwind Hyperios become options
What were the rumours of the starter set again? Wonder if these would appear in them?
Yeah forgot about that. Kinda dumb imo, shouldve been designed with some degree of commonality so they could just manufacture one kit that could be built in two slightly different ways to fulfill the needs of both armies.
chaos0xomega wrote: Yeah forgot about that. Kinda dumb imo, shouldve been designed with some degree of commonality so they could just manufacture one kit that could be built in two slightly different ways to fulfill the needs of both armies.
Yes, it's an odd choice, considering how clever they've generally been with trying to make HH stuff as modular as possible and building multiple vehicles from a few base sprues, it seems odd that for something so basic and generic that they've gone for two different (but broadly similar) designs.
Well, at least the Hyperios variant can be used in Solar Auxilia right now. Can. Could. With the current rules no one would take them, they just suck - with every weapon option. I mean I also use suboptimal or not-that-good units because I like the models. These are just, well, Tarantulas (with a plain design) and in most games just wasted points (and money). So either they get better rules or GW can keep them lying on the shelf.
Matrindur wrote: Interesting that they come in boxes of two and currently they are three or more per squad if I remember correctly?
chaos0xomega wrote: Yeah forgot about that. Kinda dumb imo, shouldve been designed with some degree of commonality so they could just manufacture one kit that could be built in two slightly different ways to fulfill the needs of both armies.
Yes, it's an odd choice, considering how clever they've generally been with trying to make HH stuff as modular as possible and building multiple vehicles from a few base sprues, it seems odd that for something so basic and generic that they've gone for two different (but broadly similar) designs.
That's why I'm wondering if the missile launcher part will be its own sprue and we'll see generic whirlwinds and whirlwind hyperios models. Also, with Lascannon and assorted other tarantulas possibly coming, I wonder if they'll just retcon Razorbacks in Heresy?
I do hope they will also bring out the Auxilia ones from LI, since those have the classic Tarantula chassis which is same as the resin ones FW sells (or used to sell - are they sold out online by any chance?).
Not really a fan of these ones.. I mainly use the turrets for kitbashing Whirlwinds and razorbacks in LI/Epic
tauist wrote: I do hope they will also bring out the Auxilia ones from LI, since those have the classic Tarantula chassis which is same as the resin ones FW sells (or used to sell - are they sold out online by any chance?).
Both of them come close to but don't exactly match a generation of FW Tarantulas. The Marine ones are close to the later FW Marine Tarantulas that used the FW Razorback and Whirlwind Hyperios turrets.
The Auxilia is close to the original FW Tarantulas with matching bodies and longer flanges than the FW one had.
I can't get over those disgusting looking Thousand Sons Sekhetar bots they showed recently. The more I look at them, the more I think about them, the more it bothers me. GW literally just released plastic Castellax. Why in gods name would you not just take this opportunity to make plastic Castellax-Achea? You know? The Thousands Sons specific robots that already exist and are very well received? They could have brought a prohibitively expensive unit into plastic, made additional use of the Castellax frame that they just released, and add a new unit to 40k, maybe with an extra sprue for more chaos iconography. It's an existing psychic robot that only the thousand sons use, but no, they decide to come up with something out of the blue that is literally the same concept but designed worse in every way. Its like laughably anti-consumer. Just do what people want please.
And if these new tarantulas are specifically designed to not fit rhinos so they can't be used a whirlwinds (without conversion) that is just further proof that they are just trying to feth us.
The main reason is that these are from the main studio and the Castellax frame is by Specialist Games Studio, and they are essentially two separate companies under the large GW banner now and two separate profit centres. They have no interest in kits that involve components between the two companies because then they have to negotiate which bit of profit goes to which entity, which is why we don't have any 30K tanks in 40K either.
So using the Castellax frame was never going to happen, but it's still disappointing these don't look a bit more like it in terms of bulk, which I think really lets these down.
The Phazer wrote: The main reason is that these are from the main studio and the Castellax frame is by Specialist Games Studio, and they are essentially two separate companies under the large GW banner now and two separate profit centres. They have no interest in kits that involve components between the two companies because then they have to negotiate which bit of profit goes to which entity, which is why we don't have any 30K tanks in 40K either.
So using the Castellax frame was never going to happen, but it's still disappointing these don't look a bit more like it in terms of bulk, which I think really lets these down.
This is such a lame excuse, I don't believe that for a second. Cataphractii, Tartaros, pretty much any Legion-era marine unit is useable in 40K (last I saw anyways), as well as the entire 30K custodes range. They are not two companies, they are one entity choosing to make stupid design choices.
Err, no, most all of what you wrote there has been cut from 40k proper and moved to legacy (if it still exists at all). Legacy at this point is death row, anything legacy this edition will not get rules next edition.
chaos0xomega wrote: Err, no, most all of what you wrote there has been cut from 40k proper and moved to legacy (if it still exists at all). Legacy at this point is death row, anything legacy this edition will not get rules next edition.
That's not necessarily true, we have units in legends that got new rules every edition since 8th.
chaos0xomega wrote: Err, no, most all of what you wrote there has been cut from 40k proper and moved to legacy (if it still exists at all). Legacy at this point is death row, anything legacy this edition will not get rules next edition.
That's not necessarily true, we have units in legends that got new rules every edition since 8th.
Yeah there's deffo a good amount of units from heresy that have been getting rules every edition since 8th.
The Phazer wrote: The main reason is that these are from the main studio and the Castellax frame is by Specialist Games Studio, and they are essentially two separate companies under the large GW banner now and two separate profit centres. They have no interest in kits that involve components between the two companies because then they have to negotiate which bit of profit goes to which entity, which is why we don't have any 30K tanks in 40K either.
So using the Castellax frame was never going to happen, but it's still disappointing these don't look a bit more like it in terms of bulk, which I think really lets these down.
This is such a lame excuse, I don't believe that for a second. Cataphractii, Tartaros, pretty much any Legion-era marine unit is useable in 40K (last I saw anyways), as well as the entire 30K custodes range. They are not two companies, they are one entity choosing to make stupid design choices.
Well, considering they have removed lots of generic chaos marine units from 40k k-sons (that was actual 40k kits still in production), its strange to be baffled they dont include 30k units. They have even redesigned tanks like rhinos, landraiders and predators to have separate ranges.
And honestly, if GW suddenly included a 30k unit in a 40k codex I would consider it a temporary patch job, and would expect them to remove the unit next edition.
The Phazer wrote: The main reason is that these are from the main studio and the Castellax frame is by Specialist Games Studio, and they are essentially two separate companies under the large GW banner now and two separate profit centres. They have no interest in kits that involve components between the two companies because then they have to negotiate which bit of profit goes to which entity, which is why we don't have any 30K tanks in 40K either.
They are not two seperate companies. It’s funny how this myth continues to persist, people have been saying it since forgeworld came into being
There is still plenty of crossover with stuff like Custodes and Knights, not to mention marine vehicles that are just different patterns.
I mean, have you guys seen what they did with The Old World and Age of Sigmar? Beasts of Chaos are gone from AOS, because now they're back as an army in TOW. The more recent night goblins are still used in AOS, so TOW was given the older style night goblins.
GW has been deadset on keeping certain models to certain games for awhile now. Daemons (and I guess custodes) are some of the only overlap.
Alright let's be semantic them about the separation beetween Specialist Games (ExForgeWorld) and Games Workshop
"Specialist games" and "Games Workshop" aren't separate entities, but inside the enterprise they do have separate teams working on different project under different manager.
We can reasonably assume that Team 40K has an objective with a monetary bonus incentive, probably something generic along the line of "total 40K product sold this year".
If Team Specialist games release a product for Horus Heresy and Team 40k releases rules for it for 40K The manager from Team 40K could argue they have the right to count it toward it's bonus on total 40K product sold.
Maybe i'm biased because in France trade union are so strong but here it wouldn't just be that they could argue, it would be their non-negotiable rights to count it in their objective.
Ultimately the decision was made to the compatibility beetween 40K - HH and AoS - TOW because of a Human Ressource problem.
Yes the direction could have just paid the bonus but it creates problem down the line where everyone always get their bonus or the objective is too high and nobody does.
It would be good to see some Big tanks for both the SA and the Marines - and I'm curious if we might see other vehicles for the Mechanicum this year as well.
Dysartes wrote: It would be good to see some Big tanks for both the SA and the Marines - and I'm curious if we might see other vehicles for the Mechanicum this year as well.
Besides a return of the Macrocarid and Termite, there are no other mechanicum vehicles.
Fellblade/Glaive for Astartes would be a nice combo kit, maybe a third gun like the kratos has 3 options for the turret.
Sicaran variants and Sabre tank would also be useful
Solar Aux have the Baneblade/Hellhammer + Shadowsword and Aurox + Carnodon to go
Besides a return of the Macrocarid and Termite, there are no other mechanicum vehicles.
Fellblade/Glaive for Astartes would be a nice combo kit, maybe a third gun like the kratos has 3 options for the turret.
Sicaran variants and Sabre tank would also be useful
Solar Aux have the Baneblade/Hellhammer + Shadowsword and Aurox + Carnodon to go
No other Mechanicum vehicles? Ordinatus, Dark Mechanicum walkers, Moirax in plastic, new additions (anti-air unit?), Knights, ect. If the new edition is truly this year, we could see associated data sheets expand for factions too.
With GW being able to create larger plastic injection molds like the Cerastus Knight now, It should be only a matter of time (& good sales) until we see the super heavy units. They need to fill release slots for their alternative games after all
My guess is that we get another box set. Similar to the heavy support box for Mechanicum, they could release one for Marines and Solar Auxilia to generate more sales & release multiple vehicles at once. A heavy support box for Marines shortly after a new edition release would be peak.
MajorWesJanson wrote: Marines need a FA box more than a HS one. Say outriders with new mark of rider sprue, a Praetor on bike, Javelin speeder, maybe a sabre tank
That may be the case, but Marines Sicarian variants (Arcus, Omega, Punisher) and super heavys (Falchion, Fellblade, Glaive) are the kits missing from the online store. Plus "tanks" is our hint for releases this year, in which Marines have had none.....so far.
Interestingly enough the combi-weapons are sold out online now, that could be an fun plastic option kit.
Lathe Biosas wrote: We need to be realistic and hope for the one model that will change the game for the better and fill in the biggest gap in the history of the game...
Flyers for Imperial Knights!
Jump Pack upgrade sprue and done.
Combi-weapons as a sprue would be great. Special weapon sprue has 5 copies of 6 guns per sprue, doubled. To make combi a bit more useful, maybe do six copies of 5 combi weapons (1 per arm pose and a sixth with one hand for sergeants/characters) melta, plasma, volkite, flamer, grenade
I see Sicaran variants, Stormbird, and Aurox transport as sold out online on both UK and US webstores. I don't even see the Felblade or variants at all.
GaroRobe wrote: I mean, have you guys seen what they did with The Old World and Age of Sigmar? Beasts of Chaos are gone from AOS, because now they're back as an army in TOW. The more recent night goblins are still used in AOS, so TOW was given the older style night goblins.
GW has been deadset on keeping certain models to certain games for awhile now. Daemons (and I guess custodes) are some of the only overlap.
Sigh....
Beasts of Chaos are not gone from AoS.
As I type this they are 100% still in that game.
On June 1st they will be moved into Legends AoS wise. They will STILL be part of AoS.
Lathe Biosas wrote: We need to be realistic and hope for the one model that will change the game for the better and fill in the biggest gap in the history of the game...
Flyers for Imperial Knights!
Imagine a player plops a Gundam-Knight on the table, perched on a clear-plastic flying stand, whistling "Just Communication".
GaroRobe wrote: I mean, have you guys seen what they did with The Old World and Age of Sigmar? Beasts of Chaos are gone from AOS, because now they're back as an army in TOW. The more recent night goblins are still used in AOS, so TOW was given the older style night goblins.
GW has been deadset on keeping certain models to certain games for awhile now. Daemons (and I guess custodes) are some of the only overlap.
Sigh....
Beasts of Chaos are not gone from AoS.
As I type this they are 100% still in that game.
On June 1st they will be moved into Legends AoS wise. They will STILL be part of AoS.
The GW webstore doesn't sell any BoC models under the AoS title.
GW won't produce new lore, new rules, new models nor advertise them for AoS at any point from now on beyond random mentions in books as background lore here and there (and even then unless they've plans to actually bring them back with different models they will likely stop mentioning them altogether).
They also will re-release them but will only have square bases in the box; no round ones.
Furthermore their status in Legends means that they will be generally not eligible for top end tournament play
So sure they are still currently in the game; and they will still be in Legends. However on a very functional front they won't be in the game. If you want to use them you'll be running Legends rules which will have spotty acceptance (some clubs will accept; some won't same as for events with a bias that more events will likely refuse than accept). If you want to buy into them you'll have to source your own round bases (and chances are GW won't be updating/refreshing a base-conversion document- heck they've not updated the current one in utterly ages). etc...
So on a very functional front they are gone from the game.
Sure GW won't come to your house and prevent you from using them just like they can't stop you using a 3rd party army or home-brew rules - but GW won't encourage anyone to take up Beastmen in AoS
BrookM wrote: Beasts of Chaos have what to do with HH exactly..?
They're an example that shows how stingy GW is currently being with products that COULD be used in multiple game systems but aren't for "reasons." So while GW releasing an upgrade sprue for a 30k unit that would be perfect to use in 40k makes a lot of sense to us, GW's current way of handling their games doesn't mesh with that
We may be in for a decent Space Marine release looking at the missing kits from the webstore and some strong rumors. Considering the HH 2.0 rule book is sold out online, let's do a quick compilation of recent kit movement:
Kits Sold Out Online (without a current replacement) -
Mark 5 Armor
Sicaran Punisher
Sicaran Arcus
Sicaran Omega
Combi-weapons
Stormbird (probably not coming back)
Aurox
Charonite Ogryn
Carnodon (assumed to be revived)
There may be more and feel free to add, but any new edition box in tandem with some or all of these kits sounds like an expensive summer. It's worth noting that stock of Heresy products is abysmal, which is usually another tell-tale sign of a new edition.
Considering the stock of any GW product has been largely terrible for a very long time (especially HH), that's not an indicator of a new edition of the game, it's just business as usual.
Things like the rapiers and tarantulas aren't just out of stock, they have been completely removed from the webstore. So new plastic replacements seems all but guaranteed.
lord_blackfang wrote: We've had a few false alarms over out of stock items going plastic during this edition
This is true, the difference this time is most of those out of stock items were related to re-tooling of the sponsons on vehicles to incorporate the plastic sprue. I can't think of a single one of those kits that would require a re-tooling in resin.
Dropping from the webstore like this is exactly what happened with the LI Knight kits that are now moving to plastic.
With around three months to go there's just enough time to squeeze in some plastic marine kits before the new edition. Super-heavy tanks / rapier / tarantula seems like a solid pick for that.
xttz wrote: With around three months to go there's just enough time to squeeze in some plastic marine kits before the new edition. Super-heavy tanks / rapier / tarantula seems like a solid pick for that.
Before the edition would be nice, but that seems like too large of a release for before 3.0. Camba-diaz needs to be previewed / released & Legions Imperialis Mechanicum kits will come out in upcoming HH release slots.
As a reminder, HH 2.0 had the release of 12 kits initially:
- Mark 6 armor
- Contemptor Dreadnought
- 2 Praetors
- Spartan
- Kratos
- Rhino
- Sicaran Battle Tank
- 3 Space Marine Heavy Weapon sets
- Space Marine Support Weapon set
If we got 8 kits and continued support, I would be happy. The super heavy tanks, Rapiers, Sicarans, and Tarantulas all have possibilities for one kit to cover multiple variants too. Of course HH 3.0 is still speculation until officially announced, but all arrows point to new edition.
I thought by this stage we'd be discussing much more than rumours. The lack of anything substantive from GW about a new edition is starting to make me think that at most we are looking at some kind of boxed set later in the year.
The amount or type of kits that are temporarily out of stock does not seem to be any indication of whether a new edition is imminent. Even basic kits like Mk 3 Marines ,Cataphractii and Rhino are currently out of stock.
The fact that the Rapier has disappeared and the Sicaran variants are 'sold out online' almost certainly means that plastic versions are coming. But these are the kinds of kits that GW could release any time. They probably already have the sprues done.
The fact that the resin Mk 5 Marines are also sold out may or may not mean that a plastic replacement is on the way soon. Same with the super-heavies. But if you were planning a new edition of the game, you'd probably want a flashy big kit to give the release some added impetus. A plastic Fellblade would serve that purpose. And a new edition would also be propelled by another Marine type going into plastic - I still think Mk 5 would be the best choice (more so than the rumoured Mk 2). The current plastic Mk 4 Marines are still in production, so it seems unlikely that they are going to be re-done soon. Making whichever type they release Breachers as well would be a very smart move, IMO.
Snord wrote: The amount or type of kits that are temporarily out of stock does not seem to be any indication of whether a new edition is imminent. Even basic kits like Mk 3 Marines ,Cataphractii and Rhino are currently out of stock.
A drastic reduction in stock can mean re-boxing for re-branding, combining sprue's for variants, ect. Not a strong indicator by any means. The biggest indicator is the rulebook being "sold out online" or a discontinued rule set. Hopefully we're talking roadmaps and not rumors at some point soon.
Snord wrote: I thought by this stage we'd be discussing much more than rumours. The lack of anything substantive from GW about a new edition is starting to make me think that at most we are looking at some kind of boxed set later in the year.
Even covid only caused a few weeks of delay for the release of 40k 9th; it would have to be something major for GW to delay their biggest release of the year. Perhaps they were waiting for more news on the tariff situation before firming up their plans. However with all of the obvious reshuffling of the Adepticon schedule it looks as though things have been adjusted around the Summer release window. AOS battletomes were pushed back while 40k & KT stuff seem to have been brought forward earlier than expected.
I think the most likely course of events is that they'll focus mainly on 40k/KT in April, clear some of the HH backlog (Angron, LI), then tease the new edition aound Easter before ramping up the HH marketing going into May.
Okay, back on topic, rumours about the new starter aside, has there been anything concrete on the missing stuff?
Spoiler:
At the risk of a well deserved bop, i can't leave the bit unmade.
Anyway, would the next big reveal show be Warhammerfest? NOVA is August so unless they're completely giving up on summer for HH, it'd be whfest or bust for big reveals right?
Part of me REALLY hopes we don't see LI go down the path of legion specific models.
It's not that I hate marines but anything that isn't a tank is basically going to be near identical - you can't really change the appearance of a marine all that much at this scale like you can in 28-32mm
Even Dreadnoughts aren't all that big
I really hope GW doesn't do it - it just feels so DULL a direction to take things when they could create xenos/demons/other imperial factions/other non-loyalist factions and such that had much more visual variety.
Perhaps an upgrade pack for tanks or something so it doesn't create a billion models and listings and work and such
Overread wrote: Part of me REALLY hopes we don't see LI go down the path of legion specific models.
It's not that I hate marines but anything that isn't a tank is basically going to be near identical - you can't really change the appearance of a marine all that much at this scale like you can in 28-32mm
Even Dreadnoughts aren't all that big
I really hope GW doesn't do it - it just feels so DULL a direction to take things when they could create xenos/demons/other imperial factions/other non-loyalist factions and such that had much more visual variety.
Perhaps an upgrade pack for tanks or something so it doesn't create a billion models and listings and work and such
Thats not an LI specific image, those look like 28mm minis, so...
So, after the LIFAQ last week, and some of the resin character backlog for HH going up for pre-order on Saturday, what do people think we might see today for Heresy Thursday?
Dysartes wrote: So, after the LIFAQ last week, and some of the resin character backlog for HH going up for pre-order on Saturday, what do people think we might see today for Heresy Thursday?
Overread wrote: Part of me REALLY hopes we don't see LI go down the path of legion specific models.
It's not that I hate marines but anything that isn't a tank is basically going to be near identical - you can't really change the appearance of a marine all that much at this scale like you can in 28-32mm
Even Dreadnoughts aren't all that big
I really hope GW doesn't do it - it just feels so DULL a direction to take things when they could create xenos/demons/other imperial factions/other non-loyalist factions and such that had much more visual variety.
Perhaps an upgrade pack for tanks or something so it doesn't create a billion models and listings and work and such
Alpha Legion models have enough antennae to make them kinda stand out.
But I see your point. The whole point of Heresy Armor is that they were running low and just started slapping armor pieces together.
xttz wrote: Last time they posted nothing on a Thursday it was to do Heresy Friday for Valentines.
Perhaps there's something else queued up for Easter weekend.
I'm now assuming a new Sanguinius on Easter day.
I think with Easter Sunday being about Jesus rising they’ll go along the lines of the god-emperor’s namesake the Imperator Titan being rereleased in LI.
BorderCountess wrote: Didn't they make a "World Easter" joke a couple months ago? I swear, if they actually do that...
...then it will restore my faith in humanity.
That's an odd sentiment... but okay.
I've wondered for a bit, is there a correlation between a model existing in Legion Imperialis also soon going to see a release in Horus Heresy and vice-versa?
The internet, including several Heresy-focused YouTube channels, were convinced that a new edition is coming in the middle of the year, and there were some fairly specific (but not entirely consistent) rumours about the contents of a new starter box. But when nothing was announced at Adepticon, the wind went out of the whole thing, and now everyone seems to be scratching their heads in confusion. As we get closer to the middle of the year without anything said by GW, it should be less and less likely that a new edition will be launched. However, it can't be ruled out.
They may be half right. As in, there may be a new boxed set coming (highly likely). And it may contain an updated rulebook.
But, rather than being a new edition, it’s a Necromunda style “and this one has all the existing FAQ and Errata changes printed” updated rulebook. (Possible, but not nailing my colours to that mast).
Snord wrote: The internet, including several Heresy-focused YouTube channels, were convinced that a new edition is coming in the middle of the year, and there were some fairly specific (but not entirely consistent) rumours about the contents of a new starter box. But when nothing was announced at Adepticon, the wind went out of the whole thing, and now everyone seems to be scratching their heads in confusion. As we get closer to the middle of the year without anything said by GW, it should be less and less likely that a new edition will be launched. However, it can't be ruled out.
It's worth adding that for the last three years all we really got from Adepticon was:
a) A video trailer for AOS/40K/HH b) A confirmation that a new edition was coming (with a couple of models in the 40k year, but none for HH/AOS)
The lack of an Adepticon showing this year could just mean that GW didn't do a fancy updated trailer video for HH this time (or it wasn't ready in time). They also have a lot of 40k stuff to focus on currently to keep the codex releases on schedule.
The full reveal for all the models in the Age of Darkness & Skaventide boxes didn't happen until May, so I'm not going to panic unless we see the Dallas preview event pass by without news.
UK Games Expo (UKGE) is Fri 30 May - 1 Jun, but I think it's been a while since GW showed off anything there.
The US Open has Dallas May 22nd – 25th & Tacoma July 17th – 20th. AoS was announced at Dallas last year, with a general preview the week after (WarCom link).
They may be half right. As in, there may be a new boxed set coming (highly likely). And it may contain an updated rulebook.
But, rather than being a new edition, it’s a Necromunda style “and this one has all the existing FAQ and Errata changes printed” updated rulebook. (Possible, but not nailing my colours to that mast).
Well, the Necromunda rulebook did make a few changes to rules, but yeah it was pretty much that. And I would be just fine with that for HH too. Just holding out for the set with Mk VI armour and a Landraider Proteus.
I feel like GW lost a bunch of their event staff over Covid and have just never replaced it. We also saw their audio dramas vanish as well.
At the same time we've seen GW's output grow significantly over that time period. It could be something as simple as events were done as a side task to regular staff work and with those other areas doing so much the staff just don't have the free time to properly setup for events; and there's no real pressure/room in the budget ot hire people to do events and nothing but events.
Whilst odd, it hardly matters. Everything is streamed on twitch and posted to their website simultaneously with the exact same info. The only difference with the US events is that for people on this side of the Atlantic were mostly sleeping when the events happen at silly o'clock in the morning. If they did any real Q and A then I could see that being relevant, but not with their current approach.
IIRC, events that are UK based are often weekends and it's staff from the head office that get used for it.
Company that I used to work for did the same thing. You'd get one person from the comms team then people would get the opportunity to swap a work day for doing an event instead or just work an extra day.
I wouldn't be surprised if there just isn't the drive for people to volunteer for this sort of thing. It often means taking a weekend day to work that isn't your job.
robbienw wrote: It does matter. The events were really enjoyable.
I think we got our wires crossed. I understand that the old style games days were fantastic. Good access to the devs, artists, sculptors, cosplay, golden daemon, previews, participation games, etc. I was just responding in regards to the previous few posts which had been about possible rumors of a new HH have edition and when they might be previewed.
The sort of events that GW does their preview shows at aren't really like the old games days wherever they're held. They're largely tacked on to other peoples' conventions/ tournaments.
I whole heartedly agree that more events should be like the old games days and GW should put a bit more effort in to them.
re:new edition, part of me wonders if GW saw the response to the rumor and decided to scale back their plans from it
predicated on the idea that the rumor was ever real, and also won't be real in the future, of course, but it makes me wonder since the general response isn't especially positive, and has a lot of hostility
New Editions are big things for GW - lots of stock being produced; a new book being ordered; new box material; marketing material; videos; etc.... a lot of which is already well and rolling before the marketing begins.
So honestly I'd be shocked if they cancelled it. It would be a huge investment basically lost.
A few people complaining on the internet changing GW's plan? No chance. We don't even know what a new version of HH would entail to be responsive to it yet.
BrookM wrote: Or we could let this thread lie and not post again until there's actual news?
News and rumours, rumour is there's a 3rd ed coming and we expected to see it by now, but it largely been quiet. Then there's a gap in the release schedule after multiple weeks of no heresy Thursday.
I noticed that in the last couple of weeks the general amount of new models being presented is rather...limited, with the exception of a bunch of 40k Space Wolves
I think its less going wrong and more that they have pushed themselves hard to release so much across so many games so fast that it likely doesn't take much to cause a few wheel slips and then even a big firm needs to just have a breather.
Lets not forget along this backdrop GW has had production supply issues the whole time; warehousing and inventory issues plus now the whole Tariff war which is likely playing a huge mess. They might even be pausing a bit or slowing down to ride out the war and hope that things settle so they don't end up eating a huge bunch in short term fees (or their customers do) etc..
lord_blackfang wrote: So far all the Questoris loadouts including Canis Rex's unique guns are legal in HH, right?
Broadly, yes. It comes with reaper chainsword & rapid-fire battle cannon. The chainsword can be replaced by a thunderstrike gauntlet or an avenger gatling cannon, and the battle cannon can be replaced by a reaper chainsword, thermal cannon, avenger gatling cannon or las-impulsor.
"Please, do call me James. What have you got for us today?"
"I've designed a new Knight for Adeptus Titanicus! Its even has a void shield to withstand shots from a Titan. Pretty neat, huh?"
"That's amazing and just what we need! Send it to the 40K team for the next Imperial Knights codex! We've been after a Knight that can withstand fire from a trigger-happy Runtherd!"
I had a similar thought lol. It certainly would be more useful in LI (and AT although to a lesser extent), barring other balance changes to knights in general.
I hope he dont burn his fingers.
] doesn't like links.
but good value!
