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With the popularity of the following threads:
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/400146.page
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/399856.page

I thought it would be great to ask

What is the worst unit per codex that is too situational, too expensive, too inefficient to be fielded??



give reasons if you can

I love these threads because they give a lot of tactical insight to new beginners and a great ideas to search the forum on.




Here is my (partial) list:

Eldar: Shining Spears , horribly overcosted for S6 power weapons on the charge... that become useless in subsequent rounds of combat, really expensive models to buy as well
Dark Eldar: Mandrakes, horrible save, no power weapons, needs pain token for breath attack
Imperial Guard: Ogryns, not enough killing power for a large and expensive model, a tarpit
Necrons: Warriors, slow, expensive, mandatory as the only troop choice
Tyranids: Pyrovores
VM Space Marines: Scouts with sniper rifles, not enough reliably killing power on a static soldier
Tau: Aun 'Va, The space pope (neglible buff, fragile, horrible debuff on your own troops if killed)
Blood Angels: DC, rage units are expensive while being too easy to kite
Sisters: Penitent Engine, rage units are expensive while being too easy to kite
Daemons: Furies





happy to hear your insights, happy to be corrected

you can nominate multiple useless units if you like! Maybe a codex is full of them...


the other cool use would be to build competitive lists that make these units work in a reliable fashion

Vanilla SM: Devastators with anything but the lowest cost tier weapons like MLs.
Vanguard veterans. I can't decide between the two.

I'm going to go with the Shooty Terminators





*Ducks*

Hey now, those shining spears are S6 in the turn they charge, to be fair

Still horribly overpriced though.

My vote for Eldar actually has to go to the poor Swooping Hawks, Pathfinders, and Dark Reapers. As much as I want to love all three of those units, they just don't cut it for their price.

Amanax wrote:Hey now, those shining spears are S6 in the turn they charge, to be fair

Still horribly overpriced though.

thanks lol fixed
compare that to... was it 8pt rough riders? I don't have an IG dex

From what I say:

DE: mandrakes, I want to love them, but they suck all the time everytime
Eldar: Swooping hawks. Not really sure why I feel this way
Tau: Ethereals, in any form
Tyranids: pryovore/biovores. Needs no explanation
Vanilla marines: scout land speeder thingy
Orks: big guns
Chaos marines: chaos spawn
Nercons: flayed ones
Imperial guard: techpriests

Tau: Vespid - They are at best a terrible choice to bring and a terrible choice to upgrade.

Blood Angels: Whirlwind - I cannot see a reason why this thing would ever have a purpose.

BeefCakeSoup wrote:
Blood Angels: Whirlwind - I cannot see a reason why this thing would ever have a purpose.

Whirlwinds do have a purpose! You need them to make these (which are also better than Storm Ravens lol):
http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?t=6013

severedblue wrote:
Imperial Guard: Ogryns, not enough killing power for a large and expensive model, a tarpit

I'm going to have to disagree with you here. Ogryn may be a little overcosted, but they fit in quite well in foot lists. There are worse units in the codex that fill no roll at all.

My vote goes with techpriests and conscripts.

Techpriests because their special rule is too situational and they're an expensive killpoints. Conscripts because for 1 point less than a regular guardsmen, you get a unit with terrible leadership, less WS and BS, no special or heavy weapons, and no ability to take a commissar for the squad. With the ability to take very effective 20, 30, or 40 man blobs with regular guardsmen, conscripts have no use.

Mandrakes are probably only the second or third worst unit in the DE dex.

Worst for my money is the Dias of Destruction; a fast transport that is obligated to be filled with lots of expensive guys - is given two extra guns that it can't shoot if it moves over 6" (and pretty much has to move that far since it has to try to get its expensive passengers into assault). Oh, and you're not allowed to take any upgrades for it, so no Flickerfield, no Night Shields, no nothing - because certainly you can't get a 5+ save onto your biggest and most expensive unit. Thankfully, it's AV 13 and open topped - because...y'know...that's *really* hard to kill...

And it costs over 300% more than the regular Raider which has none of those issues. (not counting the obliagtory 350+ points it has to be carrying...

juraigamer wrote:From what I say:

Tyranids: pryovore/biovores. Needs no explanation

Biovores are awesome. It's just the pyrovores that are terrible.

juraigamer wrote:
Vanilla marines: scout land speeder thingy

The one that lets you get first turn charges and totally changes the dynamic of the game? No, that is objectively a good unit.

Well Shining Spears did have their glory days...
Rough Riders are 10, but they are not 3+ save jet bikes and can only use their lances once.

My list would be

Necrons: Pariahs, expensive, 1 attack each, no we'll be back, dont count as Necrons
IG: Penal Legion, 10 guardsman with lasguns and random abilities, no special or heavy weapons.
Orcs: Looted Wagon, really just all around terrible.
CSM: Spawns, no explanation needed.
Tau: Ethereals, spend points to let your opponent beat you easier
Daemon: Beast of Nurgle, random and just pretty darn weak
BA: Sanguinary Guards: Expensive, no invul, not a lot of attacks, limit to 5 guys.
Eldar: Guardian Defenders, they are really just expensive guardsmen
DE: Decapitator, cost a lot, not likely to do anything
DA: Tac Squad, get Deathwing Termies or Ravenwing Attack Squads instead.
SM: Legion of the Dammed, ridiculously expensive.
SW: Fenrisen Wolves: Easy to kill and cant score.
Tyranids: Pyrovore, no explanation needed...
SoB: Celestians, expensive and not many benefits.

Daemons: Beast of Nurgle and Herald of Nurgle.

Beast of Nurgle are worse (on average) in every way the 2 plague bearer and they cost the same amount of points.

Heralds of Nurgle are the only bad option in the HQ slot. They are slow, don't hit hard and for the points die faster can't take hits as well as most things.

I was going to post something about Templars, but then I realized that every single unit in the Codex has a use. Go figure.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:I was going to post something about Templars, but then I realized that every single unit in the Codex has a use. Go figure.

Because our Templar codex only has like a 3rd of the choices compared to 5th dexes

juraigamer wrote:Orks: big guns

No way.
3 kannons with ammo runts shoot like BS4 with krak and frag missiles all for less than 100 pts.
Lobbas means you canuse catapult models and happen to have a good range and do not need LoS.
Zzap guns are marginally better at av14 then the krak missiles and you use up the ammo runts at a slower rate.

But more precisely Flash gitz are the ony unit you do not see being fielded. Plus maybe 3 special characters. The ork codex is awesome.

These are the army lists I know well enough to make a valid assessment.

Necrons: Pariahs Just to damn expensive for what they give. To easy to kill.
IG: Ratling Squad. Snipers fall behind in a world of mech, and 10 points a model for T2 elite snipers. Why take them?
Orcs: Looted Wagon or Flash Gitz. Its a tie between the two. Luckly there are battlewagons/kans to take their place
Tau: Ethereals. Worst model in the game. Its the only model that makes your army weaker.
Eldar: Pheonix lords. Such beautiful models, such a bad IC.
SM: Tac Squads. They suck in shooting and suck in assault. Unless you play bikes or scouts you have to take them
GK : Nothing. You could randomize what units you took from the codex and still have a competitive army.
CSM : Thousand Sons. AP3 bolters with 4++ sounds great in theory. In play they just don't deliver.
SoB : Confessor or Canoness. With the special characters being such great buys, why run these?

CSM: Most undoubtedly Spawn, possessed are not so great either.

Necron: Heavy destroyers... 1w T5 with a big 'shoot me pls' sign painted over their head. also they take spots away from Liths.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:I was going to post something about Templars, but then I realized that every single unit in the Codex has a use. Go figure.

Techmarine?

labmouse42 wrote:SM: Tac Squads. They suck in shooting and suck in assault. Unless you play bikes or scouts you have to take them

Really? Granted they aren't the best, but tactical squads are not that bad. They are good at shooting, and perform decently in combat. The only reason they "suck" in close combat is because they get nom nommed by power weapons and get bogged down by units larger then themselves. Plus there are things that suck a lot more. Vanguard vets? They cost 30 points for an assault marine. Whoopie! Scouts suck pretty hard too, techmarines aren't very good either (excepting MotF), and Legion of the Damned are (sadly) not very good.

I dont believe this non-sense about my IG Techpriest being horrible. He's done some wonderful things for me, and he has a convenient price tag for when I just dont have enough points to wring out another squad. Besides, I love watching my 'useless' tanks find themselves back in the fight.

For SM: I say the Legion of the Damned. They just dont quite cut it.

For DA....I'm gonna say Scouts. They take up an elite spot....I mean, really? Why would I pay for BS 3 scouts when I could bring Dreads, Company Vets, or Termies in the same slot?

For my Guard....I'm voting for the Deathstrike. Yeah, its a nuclear warhead on tracks (which is cool!)...but its a 150 pt one shot missle that doesnt deny invulns and has a variable blast radius. In that same vein, I'd vote the Manticore....but I havn't field tested that one yet, so I'll withhold judgement.

For DE....it defaults to Mandrakes. I mean....they're so awesome!...until you realize that their inability to ignore armor means theyre useless.
If you take SCs in this list, I pass the buck to Kurdash The Decapitator...or however you spell his name. I mean, seriously, a melee oriented HQ needs to come in via reserves, can infiltrate to just outside an inch of enemy models.....but can't assault when he comes in. I mean, at least Guardsman Marbo has a Demo Charge and an AP 2 pistol....

Grey Knights....eh? I guess the Brotherhood Champion? 100 pts for an HQ with one wound....I find that hard to justify.

Daemons....for me its a toss up between Furies and Flesh Hounds....I guess it would go to Furies for their lower WS and Initative.

warpgrenade wrote:Necron: Heavy destroyers... 1w T5 with a big 'shoot me pls' sign painted over their head. also they take spots away from Liths.

but in smaller games were you need some close-to deacent Anti Tank and you will phase out in 2 turns if you bring a lith they still can fullfill a roll. Of cource im not saying they are anywere close to competitive with that point cost, but they are still above Pirahas

Teufelhunde wrote:

For DA....I'm gonna say Scouts. They take up an elite spot....I mean, really? Why would I pay for BS 3 scouts when I could bring Dreads, Company Vets, or Termies in the same slot?

DA have the old scouts, so they are BS4, WS4.

PraetorDave wrote:Really? Granted they aren't the best, but tactical squads are not that bad. They are good at shooting, and perform decently in combat. The only reason they "suck" in close combat is because they get nom nommed by power weapons and get bogged down by units larger then themselves. Plus there are things that suck a lot more. Vanguard vets? They cost 30 points for an assault marine. Whoopie! Scouts suck pretty hard too, techmarines aren't very good either (excepting MotF), and Legion of the Damned are (sadly) not very good.

Tac marines really are not that great at shooting. Bolters just don't cut it anymore. They cannot complete with the STR 5 storm bolters of GK nor with the FNP of armies. They can get one special weapon and one heavy weapon. That's that so hot.

The reason they made the 'worst' IMHO is because you have to buy either them or scouts, which are only marginally better (as they can at least be objetive holders)

Ever notice that Old One Eye STINKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ( I simply hate him as a nid player.... )

Jackster wrote:IG: Penal Legion, 10 guardsman with lasguns and random abilities, no special or heavy weapons.

Penal Legion are definitely not the worst unit in IG. They are good if used properly, although still outshined by the other troop choices. If you look at it as 10 guardsmen with lasguns and random abilities, sure they would suck. What they actually are, however, is a cheap scoring unit that can outflank, and depending on the roll you get they can seriously mess up the opponent's plans. On a non-kp mission, they totally change the game for you by outflanking near an enemy objective. Sure, they probably won't survive to claim it, but you force your opponent to get rid of that annoying 80 point unit.

If they roll knife-fighters, your opponent has to keep pretty much everything more than 12" away from the short board edges. I've had my knife fighters come in and pop tanks, slaughter heavy weapons troops, all sorts of good things.

In for a Penny extends their threat range to a potential 18", but they can no longer threaten vehicles. What they can do with that, however, is be a great 2-3 turn tarpit. Sure they die like guardsmen, but being stubborn will keep them in combat with devastators and the like for at least a couple turns.

Gunslingers is obviously the worst roll, but even with that they still make a great harassment unit and disruption in objective missions. Come in off the table edge, shoot 20 lasgun shots at something with a 30" effective threat range. Sure you'll only kill one marine on average, but if it's a long fang squad there goes their split fire ability, for example. Then, they have to turn and wipe out the legionnaires, to stop them from taking objectives.

I run a hybrid list and include the Penal Legion, and they have never let me down, even winning me a few key matches in tournaments here. For 80 points, what they do for you is really amazing, although as I said in the beginning, more veterans or bigger platoons is generally better.

As for what I think is actually the last choice pick in the IG codex? That has to be Mogul Kamir. Sure, techpriests are pretty bad, some of the Russ variants are bad, but Kamir is the only thing in the IG book that actually makes the unit worse when you pay the points for him.

Haha, well im a true blood I.G player and i have to say in terms of worst unit to field:

#5) Ogryns: pretty decent rules, over priced

#4) Techmarine: you have to be fielding ALOT of armour to make these guys even worth it.

#3) Ratlings: pretty good points/rules wise if the sniper rifles didnt suck

#2) Deathstrike: expensive, vulnerable, and so hampered by its own rules to fire it once that you would have to be crazy to take it. (Crazy like a fox?)

#1) Conscripts: overcosted, useless meat sheilds that one would be insane for even putting on the field. The amount of points you have to pour into making them "meh" makes them even worse. Only use would be Fluff.

oh wait you were able to include heroes too? lol shoot mogul kamir takes the cake then.

IG: A tie between Mogul and Nork. Runners up are Conscripts, Deathstrikes and Ratlings.
Tau: Ari'va and all other Ethereals, then Vespids, then Skyrays.