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if GW were to re-release two forces (anything but SMs), say Chaos and Xenos race (either tau, crons or DE) and make a new equivalent of AoBR along with a minor advance in the 40k storyline justifying it, the sales would move away from SM's. This would still leaving Chaos, for new players that think 3+ saves is the only way you can have a good army.
and open a window for a race that really needs updating to attract new players and boost their sales.

its never going to happen, but it would solve lots of the problems everyone is moaning about...atleast not in 5th ed

I've suggested CSM vs IG as the 40k6 Starter Box - it's very doable.

Yeah I agree, Black Legion Vs Cadia would be kinda logical.
but that still wouldn't solve the problem of other xenos races needing an update. it would just lead to even more players taking up IG

The more players taking up IG, the better. IG are regular humans of 40k, and anything that pushes 40k over towards more of a GEQ baseline would be a good thing.

Otherwise, what? Eldar vs Orks? Now it's generic Fantasy in Space. Necrons vs Tau? Even worse, as it's generic Sci-Fi. Sisters vs Dark Eldar? Worse yet again, as it's bad movie pseudo-fetish Sci Fi.

Guard vs evil Marines isn't too far from the iconic imagery, and would be a refreshing minor change from all SM, all the time.

I've suggested CSM vs IG as the 40k6 Starter Box - it's very doable.

I would actually buy such a starter box. Albeit begrudgingly because I consider CSMs to be just another form of SMs.
Though I would very happily buy a starter box that contained Tau and Necrons, Or Tyranids and IG, or Eldar and Dark Eldar.

CSM are a more radical change from vanilla marines than say templars or blood angels.

a slaaneshi CSM army Vs DE would be hilarious! maybe quite sadistic, but funny none the less

H.B.M.C. wrote:I think they would do well to put some more promotion into their other races, but I have no issue with a company putting time and effort into its biggest selling item.

Since none of the poll choices are really worth choosing, I'll add my +1 to this post. SM keep getting all the love because people keep buying them. GW could try and shift away, such as by releasing an IG and CSM starter box, but if all the sales research shows that the SM starters are going to be the best sellers, why fiddle with a successful formula in exchange for something that might not do as well? It's a business choice.

That would easily fit under choice #3...

I dont care bout the kits since I play orks and I could loot the stuff into my army but just too much updates I think necrons need a good new update

I understand sm getting more love due to sales but they dont need all the love. Id love to have a starter box without the sm, even if it was grey knights, just something a little different.

We, as veteran players, would all love starter boxes with stuff other than marines.

The actual target demographic for the starter boxes, new players, pretty much all want marines, or at least want them far more than anything else.

You'll see the end of IgoUgo before you see no marines in a starter box.

Polonius wrote:We, as veteran players, would all love starter boxes with stuff other than marines.

The actual target demographic for the starter boxes, new players, pretty much all want marines, or at least want them far more than anything else.

You'll see the end of IgoUgo before you see no marines in a starter box.

I agree completely, I belive the sun will fall from the sky before GW releases a starter box in wich Marines are not the star army,the thing is (and I belive they have with AoBR) is for GW to make the second army interesting as well,thus creating interest in armies other than Space Marines.

FITZZ wrote:

Polonius wrote:We, as veteran players, would all love starter boxes with stuff other than marines.

The actual target demographic for the starter boxes, new players, pretty much all want marines, or at least want them far more than anything else.

You'll see the end of IgoUgo before you see no marines in a starter box.

I agree completely, I belive the sun will fall from the sky before GW releases a starter box in wich Marines are not the star army,the thing is (and I belive they have with AoBR) is for GW to make the second army interesting as well,thus creating interest in armies other than Space Marines.

And since nearly all vets have a space marine army anyway, it's not exactly wasted on us.

Polonius wrote:

FITZZ wrote:

Polonius wrote:We, as veteran players, would all love starter boxes with stuff other than marines.

The actual target demographic for the starter boxes, new players, pretty much all want marines, or at least want them far more than anything else.

You'll see the end of IgoUgo before you see no marines in a starter box.

I agree completely, I belive the sun will fall from the sky before GW releases a starter box in wich Marines are not the star army,the thing is (and I belive they have with AoBR) is for GW to make the second army interesting as well,thus creating interest in armies other than Space Marines.

And since nearly all vets have a space marine army anyway, it's not exactly wasted on us.

Exactly Polonius,and,if we have no real interest in a Space Marine army we still get excelent swaping foder due to the amount of people who will want them.

I don't see how people can say SM don't get the most attention. It's way obvious.

There is a SM codex and then there are sub-codexes (if you get what I mean) for Dark angels, Space wolves, Blood angels, Black templars. Demon hunters are basically space marines as well.

There are NO sub-dexes for any other army. Nothing for the Ork klans, Tau septs, Eldar worlds, etc.

The fact there are like 6 SM books (am I forgetting any?) and no more than 1 for every other army can't be disputed. Yes GW focuses more energy on SM than any other army.

But does this affect the game?

Well, think what it would be like if there were even 2 sub-codexes for each other army and then you tell me whether or not you think the game would be more diverse.

FITZZ wrote:

Polonius wrote:We, as veteran players, would all love starter boxes with stuff other than marines.

The actual target demographic for the starter boxes, new players, pretty much all want marines, or at least want them far more than anything else.

You'll see the end of IgoUgo before you see no marines in a starter box.

I agree completely, I belive the sun will fall from the sky before GW releases a starter box in wich Marines are not the star army,the thing is (and I belive they have with AoBR) is for GW to make the second army interesting as well,thus creating interest in armies other than Space Marines.

So we will never see another Imperial army in a starter box? I do agree with you, but it's sad that GW are limited to only SM vs "Evil" (or Greater Good)

Iron Priest wrote:

FITZZ wrote:

Polonius wrote:We, as veteran players, would all love starter boxes with stuff other than marines.

The actual target demographic for the starter boxes, new players, pretty much all want marines, or at least want them far more than anything else.

You'll see the end of IgoUgo before you see no marines in a starter box.

I agree completely, I belive the sun will fall from the sky before GW releases a starter box in wich Marines are not the star army,the thing is (and I belive they have with AoBR) is for GW to make the second army interesting as well,thus creating interest in armies other than Space Marines.

So we will never see another Imperial army in a starter box? I do agree with you, but it's sad that GW are limited to only SM vs "Evil" (or Greater Good)

IG are simply a niche army. That niche has gotten bigger lately, but just because they're "normal" humans doesn't make them the basic human army.

Personally? I'd love to see plastic sisters in a starter box, along with eldar. But it won't happen.

I've played around with many armies (including Squats "back in the day") but many of them were SMs/variants. Love SMs. Still have to say they get too much "love". I've lost count of how many SM+variant codices have been published while the Necrons, DE, WH, DH and (until their recent popularity) 'Nids have been left to languish in the gloomy pit of long-gone editions.

Archonate wrote:You gotta understand the non-SM player mentality. We don't look at chapters as independent armies. To us they are all just 'Space Marines'.
We know that 'Space Marines' were the first codex to be released in 5th edition. Just this month 'Space Marines' got another new codex, and from what we hear, 'Space Marines' will get yet another new codex right after Tyranids.
Convincing a non-SM player that SMs aren't being favored amounts to trying to convince them that there have been no SM releases since the vanilla codex... which is ridiculous.

My first army (back in the dark age of RT was a homebrew SM chapter. The WiP army I'm working on now is Squats counts as SM (heavy on the exo suits, basically). But given the amount of time I've had in the hobby (albeit on and off), and even though I'm a SM lover, I'd have to +1 Archonate on this.

Shas'o Nom Nom wrote:I don't see how people can say SM don't get the most attention. It's way obvious.
There is a SM codex and then there are sub-codexes (if you get what I mean) for Dark angels, Space wolves, Blood angels, Black templars. Demon hunters are basically space marines as well.
There are NO sub-dexes for any other army. Nothing for the Ork klans, Tau septs, Eldar worlds, etc.
The fact there are like 6 SM books (am I forgetting any?) and no more than 1 for every other army can't be disputed. Yes GW focuses more energy on SM than any other army.
But does this affect the game?
Well, think what it would be like if there were even 2 sub-codexes for each other army and then you tell me whether or not you think the game would be more diverse.

+1 again. I played 40k before chaos space marines (or Tau or Necrons or Dark/Craftworld Eldar) existed (yeah, that makes me old... ) so the current variety in armies is definitely better than it used to be. It does mean that they've gone towards more and more generic army lists to keep the work (and cost) minimal for that many different armies. I'd have a nerdgasm if they actually spent even a few pages in the basic xeno codices listing some simple "differences" for each of the craftworlds/klans/septs beyond a crapload of fluff. 3ed C:CSM had it with the legion-specific tweaks but then got blanderized for their 4ed release.

Still, it's important to remember two things. One is that GW is misnamed, they are (admittedly) a miniatures company, as opposed to a "game" company. The second is that they are a company, and while it may suck that SMs get most of the effort and attention, they are what pays the bills every month. Without the SMs, GW would go the way of the dinosaur and rather than a bland codex, we'd have none at all. In other words, I checked all of the options .

---- edited to add a giggle ----
As I hit submit, I looked at Polonius' post above mine and mistook his join date for the post date and thought I had just necromanced a 4-yr old thread corpse

I vote you need a better poll, checkmarks just make me indecisive :(

But all in all, I'm fine with it, I think the xenos could use some TL&C, but the space marines are humanities finest warriors, not to mention the poster-kids for GW's marketing. Even guys who aren't technically 'space marines' get called that if they are 1.Wearing Powered armor, and 2. Kicking alien @$$.

yea-no. I'm not okay with it. Part of (maybe even a lot of) 40k's strength comes from the very fleshed out fluff, most of which is contingent on other races interacting with each other or (mostly) the imperium (spehhhhhhhhs).

people are never happy :p

Of course space marines get extra attention but people do kick up too much of a fuss over it. Yeah it's annoying for them having their race sidelined but all these threads don't serve a purpose bar allownig them a chance to whine (Not all do whine I know so their the nice xenos to shoot) but it gets boring for me atleast with all the anti space marines suck comments.

Suck it up, GW made it like this so just sush or complain in silent. we all know the arguments and know the complaints. their a broken record now.

Same with those people's claims that they took xenos to be unique and different... oh violin to you good sir not taking space marines due to them being so popular and your race being an underdog.

Though to the ones who don't I do like fighting you in games, breaks up marine vs marine matches for me

This is sort of a loaded question. I think other races get plenty of love. Unless you're Dark Eldar. Or Demon Hunters, I guess.

Yeah, they got more attention. Let's look at the new smurf movie for example. They could've made any other faction much more popular, however they chose to do sm. I would love it if they spent a bit more time with other armies, but if they left sm to rot, profits would go down. I know alot of people who got back into sm when 5th ed came out. So no, I don't mind GW milking the sm for all they're worth.

Polonius wrote:Personally? I'd love to see plastic sisters in a starter box, along with eldar. But it won't happen.

What a beautiful dream . . .

I think it's about the worst thing about 40K, but it gets even worse when GW can't even keep things consistent between marine releases.

The marines = Profit = Moar releases is a self fulfilling prophecy. Before the Ork codex was redone, I was often the only ork player at tournaments. For years on end. Nowadays, Orks are everywhere! Why, because they got a new codex with great fluff, flexible and characterful rules and brilliant new models (finally, a battlewagon.).
I saw the same thing with Eldar when they were redone, and I expect something similar with Tyranids. Think about how great it would be if DA and BA (as the least divergent) were folding into Codex Space Marines, leaving room for Lost and the Damned. You know it makes sense.
Or how about some Ad Mech? Space Marines clog the release cycle with similar armies. It's dull.

Do you reckon the Ork craze will last though? It will be interesting to see what happens with this Tyranid dex.

Yah SM makes more money BUT, if they destroy all the other races for SM to the point where the other races have no advantages and no one wants to play them people in general will stop playing Warhammer 40k, as it will become very monotonous.

Manchu wrote:Do you reckon the Ork craze will last though? It will be interesting to see what happens with this Tyranid dex.

I agree, I'm going to buy that dex even though I have no interest in playing 'nids (not another Horde army!)

As for the Ork craze, I'd say until the 'dex goes out of date and the releases dry up completely. For example, if we wait close to a decade for the next update.

Zarco wrote:Yah SM makes more money BUT, if they destroy all the other races for SM to the point where the other races have no advantages and no one wants to play them people in general will stop playing Warhammer 40k, as it will become very monotonous.

Ease back on the Death bell just a bit ,as ridiculous as some of GWs actions seem to be/are,"destroying" other races most likely isn't on the aggenda (well unless their sqauts or LATD...maybe DE).
I get that your speaking metaphoricly,but rest assured that,statisticly,there will always be players who seek out armies other than SM/MEQ,I don't see a mass 40k exodus in the near future.

Manchu wrote:Do you reckon the Ork craze will last though? It will be interesting to see what happens with this Tyranid dex.

heck, I play orks and I get smashed by nids ALREADY. (Yay, a closecombat army with troops that have higher initiative and more attacks than mine, oh and they scout and get rending...)

I'm intrested in whats going to be in the new nid codex, yet another army I need to learn how to beat.