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You think the 5th ed codex is bad go back to the days of the 3rd ed rulebook list. You could have platoons of rough riders with sentinels as part of the platoon. A modern military platoon all on horseback alongside walking tanks, that doesn't sound like a platoon to me!!!! OMGWTFBBQ!

btw whats fluff?

Fluff Definition
Fluff is the collective term for the background, stories, artwork, and fictional history of Games Workshop's world of Warhammer 40k. In the twenty or so years that Warhammer 40k has been around, hundreds of books, articles, art pieces, etc were created to represent the Games Workshop universe. These pieces of fiction are often represented in the armies available to play in Warhammer 40k. Often, characters, battles, and tactics are gleaned from these written sources, and Fluff players rigidly adhere to their respective backgrounds. Building an army list comes easily to Fluff players, as they choose their characters and units based on whichever models appeal to them, or whatever is most representative of their chosen background. Like players termed WAAC, a Fluff player is often more than the sum of his parts.

dark6spectre wrote:btw whats fluff?

Basicaly it all the stories and background regarding a subject. Gernaraly when you read a unit discription it is the the part befor the Rules

Anpu42 wrote:

dark6spectre wrote:btw whats fluff?

Basicaly it all the stories and background regarding a subject. Gernaraly when you read a unit discription it is the the part befor the Rules

Gotcha by 41 seconds

cmac wrote:

Anpu42 wrote:

dark6spectre wrote:btw whats fluff?

Basicaly it all the stories and background regarding a subject. Gernaraly when you read a unit discription it is the the part befor the Rules

Gotcha by 41 seconds

I cheated with google.

I return to Shanghai tomorrow, then google will be censored

Well I expected to come slap down some fool on how IG do not suck...and I get this thread. Now I feel all warm and fuzzy inside

Iron_Chaos_Brute wrote:Well I expected to come slap down some fool on how IG do not suck...and I get this thread. Now I feel all warm and fuzzy inside

It's all about the positive vibes man! Share the love.

Btw: with the sig, Tony is part of our Shanghai gaming group (all 5 of us in a city of 20-25m), he is 15 and Chinese and i'm "trying" to school him to be a better man. A second chance maybe? I may be wasting my time.

I played the last 3 guard codexes. The newest one gives you a ton of options, although there are some units that did not get much love from the writer in mho. I do miss the doctrines, but they do give 90% of the options as either upgrades or paticular characters. They are simplifing the books to new gamers I think. They also cut out many of the nid bio morphs, and the space marine trait system. This is both good and bad but understandable.

I love the new orders. I use the Creed/Kell combo and Vox's for every one. The only unit I have problems with is my RRs who cant make a leadership test to save thier life [and usaly in means life or death]

cmac wrote:

Iron_Chaos_Brute wrote:Well I expected to come slap down some fool on how IG do not suck...and I get this thread. Now I feel all warm and fuzzy inside

It's all about the positive vibes man! Share the love.

Btw: with the sig, Tony is part of our Shanghai gaming group (all 5 of us in a city of 20-25m), he is 15 and Chinese and i'm "trying" to school him to be a better man. A second chance maybe? I may be wasting my time.

OK, I go for expected English on a flag basis because I have no other way to judge. Sounds arbitrary, but I have to differentiate somehow. Sig changed.

This thread made me 'lol'.

Seriously....whut? WHUT?!?

Your arguements make no sense and you seem to be getting all angry that humans are a weak-ish race stat-wise, which we are. You're then complaining that the Guard are a horde army, which they always, ALWAYS have been, whether focussing on tanks or infantry. Then you seem to go on a rant about how your friends all tell you Guard suck and you agree as well because you've glanced at the Codex.

Seriously dude; go and read the basic background on the 41st Millenium, and then read the Guard background too.

You're getting all angry for....no good reason whatsoever.

L. Wrex

Iron_Chaos_Brute wrote:
OK, I go for expected English on a flag basis because I have no other way to judge. Sounds arbitrary, but I have to differentiate somehow. Sig changed.

Cheers dude, i'm trying to get him to add something that will indicate the non-native speaker status. Some of his threads are absolute shockers. The charity case only lasts for so long however..

I miss the 2nd editon Codex :(

Vhalyar wrote:Ah, so that was a troll. Good one!

Protip: Trolls can only be killed with fire or acid.

I find your IG - Tau/DE comparisons hilarious.

Awesome.

If you are so worried about the fluff, you would realize that the fluff is perfectly fitting for the IG. They are innumerable, being drawn from the thousands of planets of the Imperium of Man. Their technology is not going to be as advanced as others who have to provide technology for a lot fewer soldiers (eldar, tau). Ever been in the army? Those of us who have know that it is hard to stretch out weapons and gear when the army goes through too rapid of an expansion... I remember the look on my battlebuddy's face when we got handed M16A2s while other companies were doing checks on their brand new M4s with the fancy RIS gear. We had to get the RIS foregrips from another manufacturer, because there were not enough of the M16A4's to go around.

Anyway, point being: the fluff is fine. If you don't like how the army has changed since last edition, that is not a reason to say it sucks. It obviously doesn't, because of the reasons mentioned above.

Wait so your forming an opinion on something you haven't read or tried? I gotta admit after coming back to 40K after a few years and reading the 5th ed i was a little vexed about removing the Doctrines, but considering that we can now field tanks in threes (I cant remember if we could do that in 4th ed) and we have a hell of a lot more to choose from with regards to Heavy support plus what has been said about the platoon changes. My personal opinion, why yes I do like the idea of a horde of troopers ready to laser spam every thing that got too close and blow everything else that isn't to hell with a manticore. If your not into that use veteran squads for a smaller harder fighting core.

From a gameplay perspective, the current IG dex is one of the best they've ever had. It puts IG as the gunline army of 40k. I especially love the flexibility of the current IG dex. One thing is for sure, a good IG army/player always puts the fear of the Gods in my army.

dark6spectre wrote:all i am saying as that the new army list seems utterly stupid here: 1 platoon command squad, 2-5 infantry squads, 0-5 heavy weopon squads,, 0-2 spec wep squads, 0-1 conscript squads.

does that sound like a platoon. this is giving people the chance to field 1 troop choice filled up with those options. its pathetic. a platoon should only consist of a platoon HQ and infantry squads, with maybe the option for 1 heavy OR 1 special squad. its utterly stupid. and i already have an army to my liking. its called 4th Edition IG. and yes, it makes complete sense. you can never play an army WRONG unless you are not following the rules. the Codex is set up PRIMARILY for Hordes.

You can still build IG lists that look like the old lists, it's just that now you're not required to - you can change things up to represent an airborne force, or a mechanised force of elite troops or a defensive network of heavy weapons.

You're right that this means people can produce lists that don't follow modern military structure... but 40K has never been about replicating modern militaries. It never has and it was never meant to. It's heroic fantasy, blood opera really. The design of the IG draw from a range of historical periods and units for its inspiration, to produce a stylised but entirely unrealistic fighting force. They fight other ludicrous but stylish armies - this isn't a bug but a deliberate and explicit design feature.

If you want something focussing more on realistic modern warfare then Flames of War might be more your thing. You still end up with companies with unrealistic levels of support, but the core is still a company structure, and the support isn't as excessive as 40K.

I personally think the IG Codex is the very best one out there....

JEB_Stuart wrote:I personally think the IG Codex is the very best one out there....

It's the only one that frightens me in the right hands, to be honest. The sheer amount of armor IG can take is a bit scary.

Locclo wrote:It's the only one that frightens me with the right wallet, to be honest. The sheer amount of armor IG can take is a bit scary.

Because, lets be honest, all that armor is expensive.

i love the IG codex, and i don't think you can really argue against it the way you are since it has so many options, that you can really format your army to fit your needs to a much greater extent than the old codex allowed you too. this makes it a much better codex, since it gives the most amount of people options to make an army which works for them.

dark6spectre wrote:CMAC what? anyway think about it. Tau are very humanoid and they have armour. Cadians have armour. bit of a similarity. only difference is they have smooth body fitting armour and floaty stuff while IG have thick, blockey armour and stay-on-the-ground stuff.

This is correct. I hate the new Guard 'dex, it's so unrealistic. I mean, Space Marines are humanoid and have armor too, why are Guard so much weaker? And Tyranids. Tyranids have carapaces, and Guard have carapace armor! The only difference between Guard and Tyranids is that Guard have stay-on-the-ground stuff and Tyranid have walky, chompy stuff.

What I'm saying is that Guard should be like Tyranid Space Marine Tau, only with blocky armor and stay-on-the-ground stuff.

The OP best be trollin'.

Rube wrote:

dark6spectre wrote:CMAC what? anyway think about it. Tau are very humanoid and they have armour. Cadians have armour. bit of a similarity. only difference is they have smooth body fitting armour and floaty stuff while IG have thick, blockey armour and stay-on-the-ground stuff.

This is correct. I hate the new Guard 'dex, it's so unrealistic. I mean, Space Marines are humanoid and have armor too, why are Guard so much weaker? And Tyranids. Tyranids have carapaces, and Guard have carapace armor! The only difference between Guard and Tyranids is that Guard have stay-on-the-ground stuff and Tyranid have walky, chompy stuff.

What I'm saying is that Guard should be like Tyranid Space Marine Tau, only with blocky armor and stay-on-the-ground stuff.

glad so see someone agree. i need to change my post name to :Imperial guard overall, now suck. Ok space marines is a bit too far, they deserve to have small but powerful numbers. but if you think about it, cadians are similar to our modern militaries. and maybe others too. the thing is IG is shown out as completely weak compared to units similar to them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

sebster wrote:

dark6spectre wrote:all i am saying as that the new army list seems utterly stupid here: 1 platoon command squad, 2-5 infantry squads, 0-5 heavy weopon squads,, 0-2 spec wep squads, 0-1 conscript squads.

does that sound like a platoon. this is giving people the chance to field 1 troop choice filled up with those options. its pathetic. a platoon should only consist of a platoon HQ and infantry squads, with maybe the option for 1 heavy OR 1 special squad. its utterly stupid. and i already have an army to my liking. its called 4th Edition IG. and yes, it makes complete sense. you can never play an army WRONG unless you are not following the rules. the Codex is set up PRIMARILY for Hordes.

You can still build IG lists that look like the old lists, it's just that now you're not required to - you can change things up to represent an airborne force, or a mechanised force of elite troops or a defensive network of heavy weapons.

You're right that this means people can produce lists that don't follow modern military structure... but 40K has never been about replicating modern militaries. It never has and it was never meant to. It's heroic fantasy, blood opera really. The design of the IG draw from a range of historical periods and units for its inspiration, to produce a stylised but entirely unrealistic fighting force. They fight other ludicrous but stylish armies - this isn't a bug but a deliberate and explicit design feature.

If you want something focussing more on realistic modern warfare then Flames of War might be more your thing. You still end up with companies with unrealistic levels of support, but the core is still a company structure, and the support isn't as excessive as 40K.

actually i would have started flames of war had the model infantry look so gay. its uber-size heads. if it was 40k scale i would definetely be already playing it

OMFG. So, OP is complaining that the new IG codex lets you build armies that don't fit his vision of the IG (but still let him do that).

The best thing about the new codex is the variety of builds available. You can build an infantry platoon with 100+ men for a heavy infanty company, a platoon with 35 guys in chimeras for a mech infantry platoon, 50 guys on foot for a light infantry platoon, 55 guys with 18 heavy weapons for a heavy weapons platoon, etc, etc.

Why is this a problem?

ETA, the codex now has quite a few strong builds and hordes isn't one of the best.

I don't think Rube was serious, he must have been sarcastic in that reply because nobody is that ignorant.

Cadians are nothing like our modern military. Join the army and try it. I WAS an 11-C in the US Army, and if you had ever served you would know that.

Try reading some of the posts. It is apparent that the IG is a caricature of a human military force. Read some literature man, because right now you are just being ignorant.

If you don't like them, don't play them. Don't post a hate thread on them, since a lot of people play them and obviously like them it just looks like you're sour grapes. Go and play another game then... there are more realistic depictions of warfare out there.

Stop wasting our time with this drivel.

EDIT: Ninja'd by Scott-S6!