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Hello fellow dakkanaughts!

I have a friend at my FLGS who plays a 2k Draigo list. Usually two units - Draigo, paladins and a librarian and a unit of ten terminators plus an optional unit like a dreadknight or a vindicare/techmarine. I play Grey Knights, too. Usually a crowe list with purifiers. Is there a 2k army out there that plays well against a Draigo list in your standard 40k missions?

I've got a purified list as well. I run msu so I have two options. One, charge his pallies with my entire army dropping his init to 1 with psyk-out nades , and then acctivate force weps. 2, tank shock him off. If you tank shock 5 times he might fail one. Them just gotta try and run him off.

... 2 scoring units? Do you only play annihilation? He'd get dominated in an objective game.

I guess you have never faced a draigo list or seen one in action if your saying that....

The list will have 2+1d3 units that score typically thanks to draigos grand master status.

Also, consider the fact all he needs to do is smash your scoring units and then its a draw if you manage the same.

A fully wound allocated paladin force is very hard to stop.

You basically want to deal with them through S8+ and Ap2 so your killing rather than wounding. Melta guns are great but leave you open to being charged. Paladins damage output is actually not huge so combat is possible but you need the right tools for the job - Thundershield termies are great for this.

I run my draigo win very successfully and the only enemy that has ever given me pause is Dark eldar.

Fast enough that they are hard to catch. Spam S8, Ap2 weapons, tarpit assault force or armed with power weapons.... no good options in there.

My Mech-Guard would love to fight a Draigo list like that. I've got 9 TL Lascannons, 2 Demolisher Cannons, and 21 Meltas/Multi-Meltas, and that's just the things that pick up whole paladins per shot. 5 Plasma Cannon templates, plus plethora's of Autocannons, Hvy. Bolters, and Multi-Lasers.

I've seen tau put the screws to Draigowing enough times to be impressed, as well as drop pod melta lists, especially vulkan lists.

Demolisher cannon.

Seriously, Draigo wing is the least impressive list that army can run. They only have 5++. Termie armies are fun, but always have the problem of needing to avoid 1s. Any dead termie is always a serious loss.

Draigowing is a powerful army. It will no doubt dominate a huge number of opponents where other armies may struggle to do the same. But as a weakness it does have bad matchups. In those cases it is likely to be crushingly defeated. Those matchups are anything that messes with Leadership or can spam S8 AP2 guns (or higher). Typically this includes Guard (lascannons), DE (lances) and Tau (broadsides).

Knowing that you play Purifiers you should have no problems whittling the numbers down with your 5-6 Dreads. You do run 5-6 Dreads don't you?

Falchion squad purifiers Charge them (because if you don't you're gone) with a full 10, and as long as you defeat the psychic hood then they are gone once those force weapon turn on. Toss in your own Libby to add a couple more STR and it's game over. Emphasis on the charge thing though, GK charging GK is one of the coolest abilities ever, the defender will drop to Int 1 so carrying Halberds is almost useless unless you really think the combat will make it to a second round.(only really happens if someone remembered to bring their Warding Stave)

If you really want to be mean though then run a DL DE army or a TH/SS termy army. Anytime I joke about starting a draigowing I remind myself of the 30+ DL that will drop on my head, and a 3+ (assuming shrouding) cover save only goes so far :(

Don't forget to let crowe remove Draigo or the Libby from play if at all possible, most opponents keep the Libby close to Draigo to try and hood the ability, but cross your fingers and hope


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Ah yes forgot to add in the absolute awesomesauce which is a continuation of my Falchion squad comment. Falchion squad terminator squad with Banner. Each member attacks with 4 attacks each and the force weapons turn on automatically. Really you only have to get past the Hood again and they're gone. However, even if you don't activate the ID function they will still take a pounding.

Surtur wrote:Seriously, Draigo wing is the least impressive list that army can run. They only have 5++.

This is a little ill informed - they should have a 4+ cover or even 3+ most of the time. In combat a couple of swords or a warding stave means a 4++ or 2++ to take some PW hits as well.

I have seen seriously small draigo wings dominate large games due to the silly things you can achieve.

With a pair of storm ravens carrying 5 paladins one with draigo and the other with the librarian they are on you turn 2... and then things get ugly... not to mention shooting the TL multi melta at your demolisher cannong toting tank while keeping the 3++ flat out save

Draigo wing don't afraid of single lance/melta/lescannon (for example, 5ASM+1melta)...Draigo will take it.

To kill them , you need 4~5 AP2 weapons together.

The best unit to kill Draigo+paladins is 5 Lance Crypteks(if they have a ghost ark , that will be better) , with the help of the stalker's twin-linked marker.




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Another thing is , a good Draigo list has enough support range fire power --- GKSS, dreads, purifiers and vindicare, if you just put all your weapons on the death start, the killing things will be done by these small support units.


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You are playing a crowe wing, and your friend doesn't have a stormraven or a landraider, that makes the things easier: stay and shoot until they move with 12" of your puriers, and charge them

MSU GK don't get many Lances afaik

The OP should have at least three psyffle dreads and razorsbacks. Lots of razorbacks with psycannons inside to torrent the paladins to oblivion. Leave all cc equipment home as you are going to lose the combat if you get caught in cc. Never ever charge paladins. That way they can only destry one unit a turn. Keep your units apart from each other so that you don't get multicharged. Block his movement with razors. Kill everything else than paladins first as they are a very expencive unit that can only do one thing a turn. And if all else fails Tank shok might do the trick. LD10 can fail sometimes.

My Necrons would absolutely EAT that list up. The two units of Deathmarks + Despair Cryptek alone would end the game in a hurry, never mind the Heavy/Destroyer wings and Lanceteks.

IMO, the easiest way to defeat OP's friend with crowe wing is use 60putifiers with 24 psycannons and full psybolt upgrade.

What you need to do is stay there and shoot....96 S7AP4rending and 72 S5 AP5 will give FNP paladins about 9.8 unsaved wounds per turn







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azazel the cat wrote:My Necrons would absolutely EAT that list up. The two units of Deathmarks + Despair Cryptek alone would end the game in a hurry, never mind the Heavy/Destroyer wings and Lanceteks.

They don't afraid of Deathmarks + Despair Cryptek, S8(LD) AP1 can only give them little damages----cover about 4 or 5 targets, 4 or 5 wounds, 3 or 4 unsaved wounds, and nobody killed.

Mass lanceteks is the true answer I think


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Try this list:

HQ
Crowe 150

Troop
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 1hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 305
10Purifier, 1hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 305
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Very bad list when facing other player, but it can easily defeat OP's friend

Oh yes, how could we forget your S8 AP1 template that deepstrikes every turn?


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apple1988218 wrote:IMO, the easiest way to defeat OP's friend with crowe wing is use 60putifiers with 24 psycannons and full psybolt upgrade.

What you need to do is stay there and shoot....96 S7AP4rending and 72 S5 AP5 will give FNP paladins about 9.8 unsaved wounds per turn







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azazel the cat wrote:My Necrons would absolutely EAT that list up. The two units of Deathmarks + Despair Cryptek alone would end the game in a hurry, never mind the Heavy/Destroyer wings and Lanceteks.

They don't afraid of Deathmarks + Despair Cryptek, S8(LD) AP1 can only give them little damages----cover about 4 or 5 targets, 4 or 5 wounds, 3 or 4 unsaved wounds, and nobody killed.

Mass lanceteks is the true answer I think


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Try this list:

HQ
Crowe 150

Troop
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 2hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 310
10Purifier, 1hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 305
10Purifier, 1hammer, 4 psybolt, psybolt 305
---------------------------------------------------------------------
Not a good list when facing other player, but it can easily defeat OP's friend

Uh, wrong. It may wound against LD but unsaved wounds are still instant death due to being S8.

nope,based on the latest FAQ, it can only ik some LD 4 things

Fair enough, just checked.

OP here. In last night's game I ran the following 1850 list:

Crowe
2x Storm Ravens, TL MM, TL PC and Mindstrike Missiles
3x Purifiers, 1xhammer, 2xpsycannon, 2xhalbreds, rhino w/sl & db
3x rifledread
1x Termies, Thawn, 2xhalbreds, 1xhammer, 1xsword (deep strikes near the objective)

I've been switching my list around a lot the past couple of weeks seeing what works well, etc. Not always Crowe - never a draigowing. In last nights game I stupidly didn't think to unload my SR's into his draigowing (they were busy blasting his 10 man termie unit). I would think plasma cannons and mindstrike missiles would cause all kinds of pain from across the board.

The other issue I have is my friend won't play less than 2k games because he loves his draigowing. The GW store where we play is only open until 8pm and we don't get started until 6pm so we usually only get two or three full turns in before being told to pack up at 7:45. Normally his Draigowing shows up turn two and chases down one of my 5 man purifier units - then we have to call it for the night.

I like the idea of tank shocking him. I don't think I have enough rhinos to pull it off in the above list. I could drop the SR's and pick up two more rhinos, though. Can skimmers tank shock? I think it would be hilarious to have him fail and escort close to 3/4 of his army off the table with a single rhino.

Remember the MSM from the SR do very little to GK units, simply causing multiple PotW to one model.

I ran a 1500 draigo wing at an event and went 4-0-0 with it... Draigo, 2x5 paladins, vindicare, storm raven, dread knight - the army works at low levels just fine

Massaen wrote:Remember the MSM from the SR do very little to GK units, simply causing multiple PotW to one model.

I ran a 1500 draigo wing at an event and went 4-0-0 with it... Draigo, 2x5 paladins, vindicare, storm raven, dread knight - the army works at low levels just fine

But MSM is still good on Paladins, since there's no a justicar, for every PotW they need to roll to see who take it.
And the most important thing is SR can help you to get the chance of launching a assault----move 12", disembark, charge.

BTW, I think one of the biggest enemy of your list is another semi-Draigo wing list

Draigo,5paladins,vindicare,GKSS,storm raven, 2 psyflemen; the one who lost his storm raven will lost the game XD


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necron99 wrote:OP here. In last night's game I ran the following 1850 list:

Crowe
2x Storm Ravens, TL MM, TL PC and Mindstrike Missiles
3x Purifiers, 1xhammer, 2xpsycannon, 2xhalbreds, rhino w/sl & db
3x rifledread
1x Termies, Thawn, 2xhalbreds, 1xhammer, 1xsword (deep strikes near the objective)

I've been switching my list around a lot the past couple of weeks seeing what works well, etc. Not always Crowe - never a draigowing. In last nights game I stupidly didn't think to unload my SR's into his draigowing (they were busy blasting his 10 man termie unit). I would think plasma cannons and mindstrike missiles would cause all kinds of pain from across the board.

The other issue I have is my friend won't play less than 2k games because he loves his draigowing. The GW store where we play is only open until 8pm and we don't get started until 6pm so we usually only get two or three full turns in before being told to pack up at 7:45. Normally his Draigowing shows up turn two and chases down one of my 5 man purifier units - then we have to call it for the night.

I like the idea of tank shocking him. I don't think I have enough rhinos to pull it off in the above list. I could drop the SR's and pick up two more rhinos, though. Can skimmers tank shock? I think it would be hilarious to have him fail and escort close to 3/4 of his army off the table with a single rhino.

Skimmer tanks can tanke shock, but SR is not a tank...so you cant tank shock with it.

First off I have never seen necrons eat anyone up lol The best way to beat draigo is just forcing them to make tons of saves . Put a few wounds on then let cf and psykout help a 10 man squad to finish the job assuming the die are your friends that game. But why would anyone run a purifier spam of 60 purifiers without transport? haha you beggin to die? If you didnt et to shoot first you would take massive casualties before firing a single shot. lol Draigowing is a sturdy army for now but they have issues with massive amounts of shots.. You will eventually began to fail even 2s and with such a low model count you will feel it.

I prefer vindicators to beat paladins, but then again, I always prefer vindicators to beat anything. S10 AP 2 kills them good.

Panzerboy26 wrote:My Mech-Guard would love to fight a Draigo list like that. I've got 9 TL Lascannons, 2 Demolisher Cannons, and 21 Meltas/Multi-Meltas, and that's just the things that pick up whole paladins per shot. 5 Plasma Cannon templates, plus plethora's of Autocannons, Hvy. Bolters, and Multi-Lasers.

You best Pray that there isn't any ruins in his or her deployment area.......2+ cover save is hell


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mrblacksunshine_1978 wrote:

Panzerboy26 wrote:My Mech-Guard would love to fight a Draigo list like that. I've got 9 TL Lascannons, 2 Demolisher Cannons, and 21 Meltas/Multi-Meltas, and that's just the things that pick up whole paladins per shot. 5 Plasma Cannon templates, plus plethora's of Autocannons, Hvy. Bolters, and Multi-Lasers.

You best Pray that there isn't any ruins in his or her deployment area.......2+ cover save is hell

I do play GK, but my list is nearly Inquisitor list, DCA, Tech Priest, 2 stromraven and exxxxxxxxxxx. The main way I kill off the Dragio Wing is with the Stormraven and force them to take a Preils of the Warp, plus having 2 units of DCA and handle Paladins squad or Terminators.

Draigo wrote:First off I have never seen necrons eat anyone up lol The best way to beat draigo is just forcing them to make tons of saves . Put a few wounds on then let cf and psykout help a 10 man squad to finish the job assuming the die are your friends that game. But why would anyone run a purifier spam of 60 purifiers without transport? haha you beggin to die? If you didnt et to shoot first you would take massive casualties before firing a single shot. lol Draigowing is a sturdy army for now but they have issues with massive amounts of shots.. You will eventually began to fail even 2s and with such a low model count you will feel it.

Q:"But why would anyone run a purifier spam of 60 purifiers without transport?"
A: Just to defeat OP's friend XDXDXDXDXDXD
------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I've seen necrons eat a Draigo wing up.
1750 game
Game 1:
Draigo, libby and 10 paladins DS, killed 1 doomsday ark.

Stalker shoot TL gauss cannon, hit, marked, Draigo passed the save;
doomsday ark shoot the big gun, 10 wounds, Draigo lost 1 wound and 2 paladins killed.(with 3+ cover from the shrouding)
5 lancetek shoots, 5 wounds, Draigo passed the save and 2 paladins killed.
5 lancetek shoots, 5 wounds, Draigo lost 1 wound and 1 paladins killed.

next turn, the whole death star has been killed.

Game 2:
Draigo, libby and 10 paladins deploy on the table, move 6" and run first turn.
Necron player move 6" back and shoot, killed some paladins

repeat

3 turns after, Draigo and paladins gone.


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Happygrunt wrote:I prefer vindicators to beat paladins, but then again, I always prefer vindicators to beat anything. S10 AP 2 kills them good.

If they DS to the map, vindicators are good to kill them.

If they deploy as a line on the map, no.

Draigo-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"...... big blaster= A1 or A2 in this situation, and Draigo will protect them from single S10 AP2 wound.

apple1988218 wrote:
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Happygrunt wrote:I prefer vindicators to beat paladins, but then again, I always prefer vindicators to beat anything. S10 AP 2 kills them good.

If they DS to the map, vindicators are good to kill them.

If they deploy as a line on the map, no.

Draigo-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"...... big blaster= A1 or A2 in this situation, and Draigo will protect them from single S10 AP2 wound.

Yes, but I have 2 large blasts, and I will get to keep firing as I back up because I am out of their charge range,

I know someone already mentioned DE, but its worth saying again. Any Draigo Wing list without 3+ dreads backing it up is meat to a fully mech, nightshielded DE list. I have only had 1 game go beyond turn 4 against a Draigo Wing list and thats because he reserved everything.

Happygrunt wrote:

apple1988218 wrote:
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Happygrunt wrote:I prefer vindicators to beat paladins, but then again, I always prefer vindicators to beat anything. S10 AP 2 kills them good.

If they DS to the map, vindicators are good to kill them.

If they deploy as a line on the map, no.

Draigo-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"-Paladin-2"...... big blaster= A1 or A2 in this situation, and Draigo will protect them from single S10 AP2 wound.

Yes, but I have 2 large blasts, and I will get to keep firing as I back up because I am out of their charge range,

Psycannons have a chance to stop your vindicator since they are all 24" weapons.
But the best strategy is leave the vindicator to vindicare or psyflemen, and give Draigo and friends a stormraven XD

Anyway, with the vindicator


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gardeth wrote:I know someone already mentioned DE, but its worth saying again. Any Draigo Wing list without 3+ dreads backing it up is meat to a fully mech, nightshielded DE list. I have only had 1 game go beyond turn 4 against a Draigo Wing list and thats because he reserved everything.

Agreed, 24-6=18" psycannons can't hurt DE vehicles.

I really don't see any problem with purifers vs draigowing.

You can just shoot him with your mass psycannons and then assualt him.

If he is assualting you, you get shoot him more rending hits hurt.

In combat, if you can always keep out of range of his charge range in your tanks.

Also don't forget you have lots of S8 4 shot dreadnoughts, that can instant death many be 1-2 paladins 1 turn.

And there is always crowe to take out his draigo, even though you might not pass your LD you can always tie them up with you rerollable 2+ and 4++, or just distract him with crowe.

purifers should beat draigo wing no problem. You have more shooting, more forceweapons, more attacks, more mech, more fire support, and more "wounds"

he has about "40" wounds if his got 20 paladins and you should have about 40 wounds because you should have about 40 guys.

I don't know why people insist on Draigo wing, or even purifier spam tbh. ... My dark eldar have faced Both lists multiple times when they were the new shiny, and I've had zero issue tabeling them inside of 3 turns. Gk are already handicapped with small model counts, and you limit that MORE? I love it when ANY army fields less then 4 units.... It means I win.

To help with tatics.... Just sit back, and shoot the ever loving horse hair out of Him. You should be packing psy dread, and maybe some razorbacks, so sit back, snipe and whittle him down. Then go claim all but the one objective he's sitting on, and laugh as he auto looses.

@DarthSpader Ah but with my purifiers and Draigo lists I have tabled plenty of de, sw, ig, orkz etc. So personal exp may very greatly. Need to keep advice generic.