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I guess that kinda makes sense, maybe I'm silly but I'd rather see grey knights treated like their own marine chapter with a codex like dark angels or space wolves, and then a separate Inquisition codex that's all inquisitors and their henchmen

Necron *wishlisting* has been going on longer, prolly because it's an older book. I believe Harry on Warseer said that they've only now started on Necrons. My guess is that means late 2010 or 2011.

FYI, another usually reliable source on Warseer (75hastings69) just said he's almost positive Tyranids are next up. While nothing is confirmed or guaranteed, I think Tyranids have to be the heavy favorite to be next based on the circumstantial evidence.

That's a shame. I would have loved to see a consolidated inquisition book. Oh well, at least that means there will probably be a sisters book too.

Personally I didn't really care for the concept of grey knights as a stand alone army. they would be great as a couple supporting units, but the idea of "a chapter of spacemarines, but better, all with pychic powerz" never really gelled with me. I would rather see them as a small group of specialized librarians from a whole bunch of chapters that specifically assist the inquisition with demons as the Grey Knights. but that's just me, threadjacking.

Back to the main thread, I can understand why 'nids are coming out soon with space hulk inbound, but I would have much rather seen DE or necrons, as those two codecies REALLY needed the update, rather than Nids, which still does relatively well.

Necrons and DE definitely need updates very badly, but I think they're prioritizing Tyranids for several reasons:

1) Tyranids sell more than the DE and Necrons - possibly more than both put together.

2) Tyranids were probably the army most broken by 5th edition. Yes, Necrons took a hard hit, but they still have access to things that kill vehicles efficiently. Tyranids have jack. They are also no longer fast since everything can run, Genestealers became merely good instead of game-breaking (a good change, but they still need some retooling), and Gaunts, Rippers, and anything swarmy got neutered to hell by the No Retreat rules.

3) The vast majority of the Tyranid codex is simply unusable. I realize that DE and Necrons have this problem, too, but it's nowhere near as bad as what's in the 'Nid book, in my opinion. This issue ties in with 1) and 2) above. Sure, GW is happy that they're selling Carnifexes like hotcakes, but 70% of the available units just sit on game stores' shelves waiting to become useful again.

I'm excited for the new models, and I hope they make the bugs considerably more diverse. If this codex turns out anything like the IG book in terms of versatility, I will be absolutely thrilled.

Jervis has commented repeatedly that there would not be a combined Inquisition book, Andy Hoare confirmed earlier this year that he would be working on the Sisters and, at around the same time, it was confirmed by Phil Kelly that he was working on Grey Knights after he finished Space Wolves (and he started Space Wolves after he finished Dark Eldar, who are just waiting on minis now). This is all very, very old news.

Necron rumours have been around a long time, but they were repeatedly shot-down as wish-listing. Necron development started around 6 months back, and a Codex takes around 18 months to complete, eliminating any possibility of Necron being the first release of next year.

Nids are an `easy' army, and Games Workshop are putting out a lot of easy armies at the moment so that the harder ones (eg Dark Eldar, Necron) can have more time dedicated to them. This way, they end up `right' in the end. In development time, an easy Codex could be done in a year, or maybe less, whereas Dark Eldar have been in the works for years.

You know, if His Jervisness has indeed said GW won't combine the Inq books, I think it's a lost opportunity. They have a ton of codexes in rotation, doing a little something to reduce that without just Squating armies would have been a boon to all.

Or just manning up, getting ahold of some fething professionalism and some goddamn sense of responsibility for your fething job and increasing the rate of output without sacrificing quality. Yeah, that'd work too.

Elric of Grans wrote:Jervis has commented repeatedly that there would not be a combined Inquisition book, Andy Hoare confirmed earlier this year that he would be working on the Sisters and, at around the same time, it was confirmed by Phil Kelly that he was working on Grey Knights after he finished Space Wolves (and he started Space Wolves after he finished Dark Eldar, who are just waiting on minis now). This is all very, very old news.

Necron rumours have been around a long time, but they were repeatedly shot-down as wish-listing. Necron development started around 6 months back, and a Codex takes around 18 months to complete, eliminating any possibility of Necron being the first release of next year.

Nids are an `easy' army, and Games Workshop are putting out a lot of easy armies at the moment so that the harder ones (eg Dark Eldar, Necron) can have more time dedicated to them. This way, they end up `right' in the end. In development time, an easy Codex could be done in a year, or maybe less, whereas Dark Eldar have been in the works for years.

grizgrin wrote:You know, if His Jervisness has indeed said GW won't combine the Inq books, I think it's a lost opportunity. They have a ton of codexes in rotation, doing a little something to reduce that without just Squating armies would have been a boon to all.

Wholly agree with that! Getting one functional ally system to work, even if it's slightly underpowered, I think the majority of gamers don't use allies for that. Just make the two armies be able to use more than 50% of their units (without be laughed of the field that is).

grizgrin wrote:

Or just manning up, getting ahold of some fething professionalism and some goddamn sense of responsibility for your fething job and increasing the rate of output without sacrificing quality. Yeah, that'd work too.

My initial reaction, but, how many people are wokring for GW anyway? Honestly curious. Because you can't tell me that they need 18 month to come up with, say, the C:SM codex or the Daemon codex. At least not the gaming part of it.

Greets
Schepp himself

P.S. and this thread is getting seriously out of topic. For rules suggestion I can recommend the thread in the 40k "proposed rules" section.

Does any1 have a clue about what new bugs were looking at?(please no wild speculations)

The tyranids are once again in GW's vein of easiest first, so it makes sense that they're being done. It really seems like GW is working ahead of itself quite a bit. The Dark Eldar codex is "done", the Tyranid are "done", the different marine codices are all being "done" or rather written at the same time; Grey Knight and SoB are being worked on. I think this points to the fact that GW is actually trying to get the sort of headway they've wanted, that will give them the ability to better focus on more troubled codices.

Its good that the rumors seem to point to the codex being more than just a patch job and that they will be adding more to it.

I just see Grey Knights and SoB becoming less distinctive when they're separate armylists from the inquisition. Grey Knights will just end up being generic space marines with even fewer special rules. SoB will be "female" space marines. Atleast when each were part of the inquisition they had more than their "marine-ness" going for them. What will GW really add to these two armies? They will likely do what ever takes the least effort: SoB with Valkyries, predators, land raider redeemers; Grey Knight Scout, Landspeeder, drop pods, vindicators... etc effectively they will become like every other marine army.

Sisters were originally a separate army anyway, so this should be a good move. Codex: Sisters of Battle was better than Codex: Witch Hunters --- less meaningless filler. Grey Knights, on the other hand, always have been, and should always remain, a part of the Inquisition.

Necros wrote:I guess that kinda makes sense, maybe I'm silly but I'd rather see grey knights treated like their own marine chapter with a codex like dark angels or space wolves, and then a separate Inquisition codex that's all inquisitors and their henchmen

And that's exactly what we're going to get, minus the Inquisitorial part. Just Codex: Grey Knights and Codex: Sisters of Battle and all the Inquisitorial things will either simply be cut from the game or Jervisified to the point of extreme generic-ness.

Should be awesome fun!!!

Elric of Grans wrote:Sisters were originally a separate army anyway, so this should be a good move. Codex: Sisters of Battle was better than Codex: Witch Hunters --- less meaningless filler. Grey Knights, on the other hand, always have been, and should always remain, a part of the Inquisition.

Just because something was initially or previously done does not mean its worth repeating. While I agree those codices are largely filler, I think the Inquisition is a lesser of two evils. Without the Inquisition to fill the codices, GW will resort to something far worse; they will make them generic by puttting generic filler units in. Grey Knight Scouts... Sister of Battler Predator... Grey Knight Bikes... Sister of Battle Land Speeder... While those sound cool, do those things really bring anything more unique than the inquisition-- no. They're the same old units. It will be GW's opportunity to show us something new, I just doubt we'll get it.

I had this argument only last week. Count the number of units in Codex: Witch Hunters. Off the top of my head, it is something like 17. Now, count the number of them that are Inquisitorial. You get three. There is so little Inquisition in there that considering it an `Inquisitorial' Codex is a joke. Codex: Witch Hunters is just Codex: Sisters of Battle + Codex: Assassins + a little noise.

As for unique, you consider Inquisitorial Storm Troopers more unique than Justifiers (the Sisters' Land Speeder)? At least those units have different stat lines! Inquisitorial Storm Troopers just tacked `Inquisitorial' to the front.

Codex: Sisters of Battle was fine for 2E and 3E, so why GW needed to screw it up for 4E is beyond me.

Pull the Allies rules entirely, along with the Inq Lord & Inq, DCA, and Imperial Assassin. Inq Lord & Assassins can pull from C: DH / C: Inq.

Then it's merely a question of replacing the ISTs with Arbites and restoring Frateris Militia.

If SoB need extra units, a couple Predator-class Tanks would make sense, with HF or Melta sponsons distinct from the basic HB / LC kit that SMs get.

But the idea that SoB would get bikes and SM Land Raider variants (aside from the Crusader/Redeemer, which would fit nicely if they lost the twin AC for a twin MM) is a bit off, IMO.

grizgrin wrote:You know, if His Jervisness has indeed said GW won't combine the Inq books, I think it's a lost opportunity. They have a ton of codexes in rotation, doing a little something to reduce that without just Squating armies would have been a boon to all.

Or just manning up, getting ahold of some fething professionalism and some goddamn sense of responsibility for your fething job and increasing the rate of output without sacrificing quality. Yeah, that'd work too.

Another important factor here is the marketing angle. GW doesn't want their releases cannibalizing one another. Thus they space them out. Also, they have production constraints which limit them to a certain number of new releases every year. These are both important and shouldn't be overlooked.

Having said that, it obviously occurs to one that if prices weren't so high, releases might be able to be pushed slightly less far apart. It also suggests that GW can't really support three core systems as well as it should. (And that's not a knock on LotR/WotR...all I'm saying is that there's a numbers game at work.)

My FLGS just got word that 'the Tyranid battle force and Codex will not be available for restock for the next few months. draw what conclusions that you want from that.'

Buckethead wrote:My FLGS just got word that 'the Tyranid battle force and Codex will not be available for restock for the next few months. draw what conclusions that you want from that.'

OMG, they've been eaten by the Squats!

I picked up a copy I saw down at my FLGS the other day, thanks to the dude that noted they were no longer stocking them.

Grrrrrrrr.... There's some 'Nid stuff I need, mainly another Carnifex, they're not going to stop restocking that are they? My 40k budget is already spoken for the next few weeks saving up for Space Hulk and it would take me a couple weeks more to get the money for a 'Fex.

I highly doubt that they'll stop restocking Carnifexes. I doubt that they'll be recast, and they sell like hotcakes. Mind you, GW does do a pretty decent job at shooting itself in the foot.

But seriously, I don't see Carnifexes disappearing from shelves en masse.

Nurglitch wrote:I picked up a copy I saw down at my FLGS the other day, thanks to the dude that noted they were no longer stocking them.

If you're referring to the codex, you picked the worst time, son.

Nah, the worst time would be the last week of January.

the only reason I can think of to pick up the current dex now is simply to make sure you "preserve" the current batch of fluff before it gets axed in the new genericized version. Tyranids have had mountains of stories and background lost to changes in Editions and rulebooks, so I don't expect them to go about it any differently now. I hope I'm wrong though, and they write up all sorts of new background to inspire me again.

i not sure this may just be in my eyes but in the septmber white dawft in the age of rock campian they say that phil kelly was aloud to use his trygon in the campain, could this because they let him use the new codex or is that going a bit far .
any way i think there doing tryanids now as they sell better

Just off the top of my head, but I wouldn't mind a unit upgrade to biovores or something that was basically a Carnifex sized creature that puked up 2d6 or some other large number of spore mines a turn at a target unit. Maybe make it it's own heavy support unit. Just have a large, tough Carnifex style walking tank whorfing piles of spore mines on things at 24" would be pretty neat and cinematic in a way too.

yeah that would be cool. It could possibly even be built onto the fex body with an upgrade sprue.

I dunno why there's so much biovore hate out there. Maybe just because they're not "competitive", but I always think they're hella fun to play with. I did a tourney once with my nids, I lost triumphantly against a dark eldar army.. the guy wiped out everything on the last turn, all but 1 biovore, so he charged with his big leader guy who only had 1 wound left and he missed on every swing, then my biovore bit his head off. The other player ended up in 2nd place losing first by like 2 pts because of my brave little biovore refused to die

I'd love to see them get some nice new rules in the new book, and new models too

They don't really seem to do much right now, and compete with much more valuable things as it is. I'd rather make them similar to Drone Sniper squads. 0-1, but you can take up to 3 broods that can have 3 individuals each. Maybe 30-40 points a model, and give them a selection of spore mines to choose from like Sternguard get ammunition.


Edit: I say this because I've been playing the Lost Planet 2 demo where you and a team of 3 other players work together to take down a giant electic salamander akrid that splits his face open and lashes at you with huge chameleon style tongues. Imagine that guy, but spewing spore mines. They want to play up the living ammo idea, make spore mines prevalent as weapons instead of either an overpriced mortar or fast attack choices who give up kill points by doing wha they were made to do. Spore Cysts upgrades really need to launch the mines in addition to whatever the Carnifex does, not poop one at his feet and maybe hurt him in the process.

Railguns:

Carnifex already have a Spore Mine upgrades allowing them to poop a Spore Mine every turn, though the utility of then throwing them somewhere useful would be something.

Something I could have sworn they'd do with the Orks was to make the Kannon into a sort of light-Battlecannon (So: S8, AP3, Heavy, Blast), so take this with a grain of salt, but I'd imagine that they'll make Spore Mines Big Blast weapons, and possibly leave them off the Force Organization Chart. Having a rain of Spore Mines going on while the swarm advances is pretty fun and characterful, but it's a pity that you can't have it while other Tyranids blacken the sky and rise out of the earth.

My gaming group already discounts kill points from Spore Mines, whether bought as a Fast Attack choice or from Biovores, and I expect that'll get settled in the next codex as well.

They used to essentially be Space Marine Whirlwinds with the added benefit of the missed shots staying on the table. They probably won't give them another weapons' signature profile if they hold to the design policy that led them to change it in the first place. Probably, because they've been all over the place with design philosophy over the years.

I figure they're safe with Acid (S3 AP3), Poison (S-, AP-), and Frag at S4 AP5.