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GW has consistenly told us that hobbies are expensive, and that we just need to suck up the price increases. This happened to another niche hobby about 10-15 years ago.
This is the hobby of reenacting. Now, as wargamers, we enjoy to command our armies of miniatures. I love it, the art, the game systems. Its great!
But, we have the cost issue, especially with GW products. Warhammer 40k is the premier gaming system out there, and I would say Flames of War and WarmaHordes are in second and third place.I would also say that they each have a somewhat similar cost. Typically, (for 40k, at least) a 2000 point army is going to run you 200-500+ dollars.
Reenacting has a similar cost, and it has gone up by leaps and bounds. Just in the past few years, prices have gone down. In the WWII scene, Band of Brothers made the hobby extremely popular. Most kits for just a basic infantry impression doubled in cost. Right now, I think Red Army would be the most inexpensive impression out there, and would run you 300$. That's a uniform, shoes, rifle, etc. Around the early 2000s, most kits, be it German, American, Russian, whatever, would be about 500-600$ And, you don't even have to buy an updated rulebook or codex every 5-6 years! I know since prices have gone down, I have bought more for my impression than in the past 5 years. GW should get a clue! My personal unit has collectivley bought more for their kits as well. Maybe instead of selling less to make more, they should lower prices so we can buy more! I would love to be able to finish out my Eldar.

My point is, perhaps there is light at the end of the tunnel. Maybe if sales drop dramatically, GW will be convinced to lower prices, much like the reenacting sutlers have done recently.

Dear Customer,

Thank you for your interest in The HOBBY. We like to take the time to respond to individual hobbyists as much as possible.
We are dedicated to producing the finest miniatures on the market and to providing games that showcase the fun that THE HOBBY can provide.
We are certain you will agree that our products are top notch and we look forward to your custom for a long time to come.

Thanks again for your interest in The HOBBY.
Happy collecting, modeling, painting and gaming!

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privateer4hire wrote:Dear Customer,

Thank you for your interest in The HOBBY. We like to take the time to respond to individual hobbyists as much as possible.
We are dedicated to producing the finest miniatures on the market and to providing games that showcase the fun that THE HOBBY can provide.
We are certain you will agree that our products are top notch and we look forward to your custom for a long time to come.

Thanks again for your interest in The HOBBY.
Happy collecting, modeling, painting and gaming!

Your Friends

The Company

I would applaud the excellent satire here, if only it wasnt the absolute 100% answer you will get.

Top post though.

The other thing GW forgets, as well as GW fanboys, is this.

Yes other hobbies are expensive, but at least you can shop around to buy your stuff. You then don't get stopped from playing around of golf due to the clubs you have or stopped from playing LARP because you didn't get you weapon from a recommended supplier.

The same is true for mini wargaming for the vast majority of players (i.e. those that don't attend tournaments or play in GW stores)

Will you people please stop crying?

Miniature wargaming is one of the least expensive hobbies out there. Play Magic and you'll spend more in a year than you will on wargaming.

Scuba diving, paintball, skydiving, dirt biking, BMX, rock climbing, video games, etc. all cost as much or more than wargaming.

I think your big complaint is that you can't just play one thing/army and are 'forced' to keep buying so it seems expensive. It's not how expensive it is...it's how much you chose to spend on it.

Gotta catch 'em all Pikachu?

Oooh, you should boycott!

As the prices go up, I buy fewer models. GW can price their stuff as they like. The consumer can say 'no.'

That's what's generally missing from this conversation. You can say no. You can not buy that tyrannofex, put off buying that next squad of terminators. GW s not putting a gun to your head. You want to buy their models, but you don't like their prices. You will have to manage your money when making purchases. Say "no." Say "I'll buy it later." GW is not responsible for the disconnect between what you want and what you can afford.

Yeah, wargaming is still a pretty cheap hobby in comparison to many out there. Besides, 40k isn't the only wargame out there; far from it. Invest your money elsewhere if it bothers you so much. There are dozens and dozens of great games, new and old, out there for infinitely cheaper than trying to build 2500/3000 pts of 40k or Fantasy.

I also wouldn't say 40k is the 'premier' wargame available.

Bat Manuel wrote:Will you people please stop crying?

Miniature wargaming is one of the least expensive hobbies out there. Play Magic and you'll spend more in a year than you will on wargaming.

Scuba diving, paintball, skydiving, dirt biking, BMX, rock climbing, video games, etc. all cost as much or more than wargaming.

I think your big complaint is that you can't just play one thing/army and are 'forced' to keep buying so it seems expensive. It's not how expensive it is...it's how much you chose to spend on it.

Gotta catch 'em all Pikachu?

100% the truth....

I stopped buying GW's B.S. after the FC cherade. They had a "Price increase" there as well.

Now I am roughly on my way to another four or five more games, that are 3X LESS expensive for the WHOLE set, then one army of GW's take your pick flagship games.

Not so much call it a boycott. Just expand your horizens and take the amount of one GW purchase, and price yourself another game system of the hundreds that are avalible out there.

50.00 goes a long way for ..... (insert title here)

30.00 goes a long way for .... (insert title here)

20.00 goes a long way for ... ( insert title here)


Point here being, GW is not the only gane in town, especially when there are now countless numbers of other companies with free to download rules, etc. on the internet. all you need is the 20 bucks or so to begin, that you are on your way.

Sorry to break it to you, but GW is not the only game in town.

Go on ahead and continue the arbitrary price increases and take the piss. Thanks GW!

If it wasn't for your stupididty I wouldn't have taken the opportunity to find the ten or so other random games that I really like better then 40K, and give me the same if not better experiences with.

Tigerone wrote:

Bat Manuel wrote:Will you people please stop crying?

Miniature wargaming is one of the least expensive hobbies out there. Play Magic and you'll spend more in a year than you will on wargaming.

Scuba diving, paintball, skydiving, dirt biking, BMX, rock climbing, video games, etc. all cost as much or more than wargaming.

I think your big complaint is that you can't just play one thing/army and are 'forced' to keep buying so it seems expensive. It's not how expensive it is...it's how much you chose to spend on it.

Gotta catch 'em all Pikachu?

100% the truth....

Although there are many wargames out there which are considerably cheaper to play than the GW games... which is kind of the complaint, rather than wargames are expensive in of themselves.

SilverMK2 has nailed it on the head.

The Perry Brothers can make fantastic plastic models at about half the cost of GWs plastics - that often look much better than their GW equivalents (no Skull Overdose, for example).

Mantic makes adequite rank&file for about one QUARTER the cost of GW.

And the less said about GW's "Finecast" the better. Would it seriously kill them to inspect the bloody things?


It's not "Wargameing is too expensive!", it's "GW is charging WAY too much for minis that aren't all that special!"

Bat Manuel wrote:Will you people please stop crying?

Miniature wargaming is one of the least expensive hobbies out there. Play Magic and you'll spend more in a year than you will on wargaming.

Scuba diving, paintball, skydiving, dirt biking, BMX, rock climbing, video games, etc. all cost as much or more than wargaming.

I think your big complaint is that you can't just play one thing/army and are 'forced' to keep buying so it seems expensive. It's not how expensive it is...it's how much you chose to spend on it.

Gotta catch 'em all Pikachu?

Miniwargaming generally I can agree with being less expensive. GW, oh hell no.

I can build a Competetive Standard MTG Deck for under $100. I can buy Video games and most miniwargaming armies of other systems for under $100. I can rent video games for $10 a month. A codex release will never invalidate my SCUBA gear, Paintball guns, motorcross bike, BMX bike, rock climbing harnesses, etc... For $100 in 40k I cannot even build a 500 point army unless I buy into the starter.

With GW parts of my army will be invalidated, become useless, or subpar that they aren't able to be played effectively. Each new edition requires me to learn a whole new ruleset, along with everything that goes with it ( RAW vs. RAI, no FAQs or Erratas for months, etc...).

Btw, You can get Yourself a decent Flames of War 2000 points army for less than 50-60 pounds, so it is not really that expensive as 40K or WarmaHordes (the latter, I've heard is darn expensive).

Right now in the midst of GW's price hike, PP has a summer sale going on for WarmaHordes. A complete 25point army which would equate to a 1500-1750 point GW army for under $130, with a free rulebook. Not to pricy in my eyes.

Do we need another business model / price thread? There's already three or so just in this sub-forum.

UsdiThunder wrote:Right now in the midst of GW's price hike, PP has a summer sale going on for WarmaHordes. A complete 25point army which would equate to a 1500-1750 point GW army for under $130, with a free rulebook. Not to pricy in my eyes.

They did the same thing during last year's price hike. I wonder how many people have jumped ship completely, and how many now play both.

Let me tell you, the Warmahorde section of Dakka is gettin busy with "I'm new" threads...

Surtur wrote:Let me tell you, the Warmahorde section of Dakka is gettin busy with "I'm new" threads...

Infinity just got their own section on the forum

I still get no better entertainment value for my dollar than the money I spend on 40k. I get literally hundreds of hours of creativity and fun out of every kit and book I buy for it. If I felt unsatisfied with the dollar to entertainment level I was getting I would simply not spend the dollars. I have many hobbies and pass times, 40k is the cheapest by far. I don't think threats and proclamations are required by every dissatisfied customer, it's established GW can't be bothered with people complaining about prices because those that are complaining have already spent the money years earlier. It's still a great hobby value to get into and GW makes their money on the new players and the new armies not us old veterans buying a paint pot or box every now and then. I feel everyone who is scraping for money right now but I think excessive angst about the prices does nothing but poison your own hobby experience.

Surtur wrote:Let me tell you, the Warmahorde section of Dakka is gettin busy with "I'm new" threads...

And SUDDENLY, more and more people become interested in Flames of War, after having their due with 40k...

Bat Manuel wrote:Will you people please stop crying?

Miniature wargaming is one of the least expensive hobbies out there. Play Magic and you'll spend more in a year than you will on wargaming.

Scuba diving, paintball, skydiving, dirt biking, BMX, rock climbing, video games, etc. all cost as much or more than wargaming.

I think your big complaint is that you can't just play one thing/army and are 'forced' to keep buying so it seems expensive. It's not how expensive it is...it's how much you chose to spend on it.

Gotta catch 'em all Pikachu?

In my experience, MTG is really cheap. Certainly cheaper than Yugioh or Pokemon TCG by a long shot. And while TCGs aren't that cheap, Warhammer is more expensive.
But even then, for the £300-500 it'd take me to make a basic army from the ground up to 1500-2000pts, I would have a good few thousand cards to play with in any given system.

My Dark Eldar coven however, has been purely converted from the ground up, using other models, as even a 2000pt Coven bought using the actual models compared to what I have would be utterly extortionate, as it is, it's still cost a good £200+.
To buy 8 Haems, 12 Grotesques, 30 Wracks and 3 Talos would be roughly £450 for those, add in the 5 raiders, 3 venoms and razorwing and you're looking at aout £700 for 2000pts. And we're just getting ANOTHER price rise, so that'll likely become £800-900 for a 'proper' coven.

Yes, certain hobbies are more expensive, but even then, you have a competitive market, you can shop around and find the best prices / best quality, and if 1 company dicks you around, you don't use them - you have a choice.

Games Workshops prices are high, and are getting worse, especially for the 'flavourful' lists. My original DE I put together a few thousand points for what.. £150-200. You really were able to play the game with pocket money. Sure you had the older vets, with more disposable income that could get several armies / more variety, but as a child, I could take my money and by something every month, and it didn't take long to get an army.

Now, as an adult, I have to save a significant amount each week, to do basicly the same damn thing - there's no way I could have got into the game on pocket money at these prices, and frankly, I see a lot of kids come in store, their parents go 'what's this, what do I need' then they pretty much go 'holycrap that's expensive', decide against it.

@Ovion: To be fair, a Haemo Coven is probably one of the more expensive lists you could have demonstrated with. Why not say that playing 40k is expensive because making a sisters army is so spendy?

Guess none of you have ever looked around at the other hobbies out there, huh? I worked at a HobbyTown and saw some crazy stuff. $3000 remote control cars, $2000 r/c planes, model railroads with 1000s of dollars in time and material. And none of these are one time purchases. Or like the pool players who play at the pool hall I work at now, who spend thousands on a stick, but don't have a pool table of their own.

Thinking this is the only hobby out there that costs money is ridiculous. If you love it, you will make a portion of your budget fit it.

Bat Manuel wrote:Will you people please stop crying?

Miniature wargaming is one of the least expensive hobbies out there. Play Magic and you'll spend more in a year than you will on wargaming.


Gotta catch 'em all Pikachu?

That is the biggest thing that keeps me from magic.
And the fact i have to shop around for good cards. I can go into a game company and get models.
I go down to my Hobby town, A basic airsoft gun is 50$, More better ones rune up to 200$ or more, Thats half of what i earn in a month.
But here is the thing, GW isnt listening AT ALL. Everyone wants a SOB codex and models but they dont release them.

hotsauceman1 wrote:But here is the thing, GW isnt listening AT ALL. Everyone wants a SOB codex and models but they dont release them.

Everyone? Really? I mean, I know SoB are pretty cool and all, but everyone? Wow. I understimated how popular the army was.

pretre wrote:@Ovion: To be fair, a Haemo Coven is probably one of the more expensive lists you could have demonstrated with. Why not say that playing 40k is expensive because making a sisters army is so spendy?

If you notice, I said a 'basic' army will generally run you £300-500.
I also said that the more 'esoteric' or flavourful forces cost a LOT more.
ALSO - Sadly, A coven is NOT one of the more expensive lists.
Foot Guard, Sisters, Green Tide, Wraithguard, and others are worse. Most any bike list, any given Drop Pod army, a zergling rush style gaunt force, gunline tau, using squads of landspeeders, vypers, sentinels... actually, MOST Fast Attack choices... and LOADS of other more interesting, fluffy or just 'different' lists / units cost SIGNIFICANTLY more to the point of damn near extortinate, especially when with Finecast, individual infantry models can be £10-20. If you want to do anything more interesting than basic troop + basic transport + basic HQs with 1-2 'interesting' units, is generally really expensive.

I don't find MTG that expensive either. If I do a draft it's £12 for an entire evening's entertainment, which I only do once a week if I go. I usually get a better selection of cards than if I bought the usual packets for myself and I spend the whole night gaming. I've won several boosters in recent events making it really very good value. Contrary to what some claim, you don't need to spend a lot to build a winning deck. I drafted and traded for my current deck which got me to the semi final of the recent game day. I think my deck would cost under £100 if you just went out and bought it from online traders, but that's not how I do it.

I sometimes buy several packets or various boxes of cards, but I doubt I spend more than £15 a week on average. Some weeks I spend nothing on it. But every time I play I have a lot of fun and I've met a lot of great people. I can build different decks all the time rather than just play with the same set of miniatures. That's why I play MTG and not Warhammer.

Most hobbies cost money, some cost a lot. But it's value for money that people respond to, and I don't think GW offer it any more. They are just plain expensive compared to other systems that are more rewarding to get into. Aside from a personal preference for the fluff and aesthetic (which I do like) the only thing that Warhammer has in its favour as a system is that it's ubiquitous and you can find a game in most stores. Is that really a good reason to stick with it?

The other thing about MTG is that it's played mostly by adults, and the few young kids that come along are quite grown up too, something else that doesn't fit my experience of GW. The other things I like are RPGs, and aside from a few books, you really don't need to lay out much for them at all. The idea that you need to bankrupt yourself to have a good time, or even play in a competitive manner is total nonsense.

kronk wrote:

UsdiThunder wrote:Right now in the midst of GW's price hike, PP has a summer sale going on for WarmaHordes. A complete 25point army which would equate to a 1500-1750 point GW army for under $130, with a free rulebook. Not to pricy in my eyes.

They did the same thing during last year's price hike. I wonder how many people have jumped ship completely, and how many now play both.

I'm waiting to see what 6th edition brings. I've already sold my Nids and Eldar as those were Armies I liked. If 6th ed craps all over my Orks then I will sell the Army I loved and go full bore into Warmahordes.