Fairly Solid Necron Rumors - (updated 5/5 with new stuff)

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**Kevin949**

Kanluwen wrote:
RutgerMan wrote:necrons, a 4+ save?? Man, they better make that a heck of a codex or I will travel to Nottingham personally and kill the guy who wrote it XD I only hope that Necrons, will still be Necrons but pls c'tan, don't let them have a 4+ save -.- that's sooo not necron!

Let the sky keep falling!

A great many vocal Necron players for a long time have demanded they "stop being lumped in with Marines just because we have a 3+ save".

You don't anymore. You're now equivalent to the Tau or Marine Scouts with their 4+ save or Stormtroopers from the Guard Codex. It's the "Carapace" level of save. Not really anything to be upset about when that's your basic save for your Troops choices which are supposed to be receiving points drops and various upgrades to them alone, not to mention the army being overhauled.

Immortals are supposed to be retaining the 3+ save to represent their role as 'elite' troops.

I think the T5 and Assault weapons easily represented their role as "elites" in the current codex.

**Darkvoidof40k**

winterman wrote:
In the new fluff it sounds like the C'Tan were mainly killed off by the Necrons (or something like that), so the C'Tan that you field in the game are just remaining shards of their power.

Wait, what?

I hope this is in regards to the other C'Tan that were killed way in the past (absorbed mostly by the Nightbringer in the previous fluff IIRC) and not the 4 we know to still exist. Or something a bit more dramatic and cool then simply the Necrons killed them (something the Old ones themselves failed to do...)

Agreed. Otherwise there will be a whole new level of Nerdrage invented just for such an occasion. It will be worse than the Blood Angels, it will be worse than Draigo, it will require a full cleansing of the GW studio. All shall burn in holy fire. None shall be spared! (except for perhaps Rick Priestly and Jes Goodwin)

**wyomingfox**

Well he says that the C'tan were "mainly" killed off. That phrase still leaves room for survivors. In the previous fluff, I recall several C'tan turning on thier brotheren and consuming them, with the Nightbringer, being tricked by the Deciever, being the first to do so. In this case, the C'tan were "mainly" killed off as well. Maybe, they are just tweeking the fluff to suggest that the surviving C'tan used their Necron servants to dispatch thier rival kin rather than through an all-u-can-eat C'tan buffet.

**Bastion of Mediocrity**

I'm just glad phase out is gone, didn't happen alot, but was something I would forget about at times and have it bite me in the glutes.

Not happy about dead star gods (other than that star-child god . . . .but that is just the chaos in me talking), I would like to have seen more fleshing out of the C'tan. Oh well . . . .

I can definitely live with 4+ save at 12 points per model!

**Maelstrom808**

winterman wrote:
In the new fluff it sounds like the C'Tan were mainly killed off by the Necrons (or something like that), so the C'Tan that you field in the game are just remaining shards of their power.

Wait, what?

I hope this is in regards to the other C'Tan that were killed way in the past (absorbed mostly by the Nightbringer in the previous fluff IIRC) and not the 4 we know to still exist. Or something a bit more dramatic and cool then simply the Necrons killed them (something the Old ones themselves failed to do...)

I have a feeling that something fairly rediculous will justify the killing off of the Nightbringer and Deciever. The Outsider and Void Dragon will essentially be retconned into not making into or out of their sleep (or simply be ignored all together). I really don't know how else he'll get around the whole Void Dragon/Ad Mech thing other than to somehow pretend it never existed.

Edit:

Well he says that the C'tan were "mainly" killed off. That phrase still leaves room for survivors. In the previous fluff, I recall several C'tan turning on thier brotheren and consuming them, with the Nightbringer, being tricked by the Deciever, being the first to do so. In this case, the C'tan were "mainly" killed off as well. Maybe, they are just tweeking the fluff to suggest that the surviving C'tan used their Necron servants to dispatch thier rival kin rather than through an all-u-can-eat C'tan buffet.

Good point. They could leave the Void Dragon alive as right now he has no influence really on the crons.

**Scarey Nerd**

winterman wrote:
In the new fluff it sounds like the C'Tan were mainly killed off by the Necrons (or something like that), so the C'Tan that you field in the game are just remaining shards of their power.

Wait, what?

I hope this is in regards to the other C'Tan that were killed way in the past (absorbed mostly by the Nightbringer in the previous fluff IIRC) and not the 4 we know to still exist. Or something a bit more dramatic and cool then simply the Necrons killed them (something the Old ones themselves failed to do...)

I don't know, the idea of the fury of the Necrontyr at their metal prisons leading them to bind their masters with the scientific sorcery is kind of cool. It's not the direction I'd have preferred, but I can see how someone might like it. It's a pretty big retcon, but seeing as there aren't many Necron books in BL that even mention the C'Tan, I guess I could let it slide.

**Mr.Malevolent**

I'm definitely excited if these rumors come true. As far as GW "Squatting" the Pariahs I say, who cares? I've never liked the Pariahs and never had any use for them in any of my Necron lists when I played them. I dont see GW sweeping them under the carpet, they could be re-named for these Elite C'Tan choices as many of you have mentioned. I'm just glad Necrons are getting an overhaul because by the Ruinous Powers they need it so bad.

**Darkvoidof40k**

Scarey Nerd wrote:
winterman wrote:
In the new fluff it sounds like the C'Tan were mainly killed off by the Necrons (or something like that), so the C'Tan that you field in the game are just remaining shards of their power.

Wait, what?

I hope this is in regards to the other C'Tan that were killed way in the past (absorbed mostly by the Nightbringer in the previous fluff IIRC) and not the 4 we know to still exist. Or something a bit more dramatic and cool then simply the Necrons killed them (something the Old ones themselves failed to do...)

I don't know, the idea of the fury of the Necrontyr at their metal prisons leading them to bind their masters with the scientific sorcery is kind of cool. It's not the direction I'd have preferred, but I can see how someone might like it. It's a pretty big retcon, but seeing as there aren't many Necron books in BL that even mention the C'Tan, I guess I could let it slide.

Not many; true. But as just one example, I'll go ahead and point out the brilliant little novel called Nightbringer.

Combined with the HH stuff on the Dragon, I can't see GW killing off "The Big Four".

**Maelstrom808**

Mr.Malevolent wrote:I'm definitely excited if these rumors come true. As far as GW "Squatting" the Pariahs I say, who cares? I've never liked the Pariahs and never had any use for them in any of my Necron lists when I played them. I dont see GW sweeping them under the carpet, they could be re-named for these Elite C'Tan choices as many of you have mentioned. I'm just glad Necrons are getting an overhaul because by the Ruinous Powers they need it so bad.

I never cared for thier fluff, but they provided a potentially great anti-psyker platform. I hope that is retained (and improved upon) somehow.

**Just Dave**

wyomingfox wrote:Well he says that the C'tan were "mainly" killed off. That phrase still leaves room for survivors. In the previous fluff, I recall several C'tan turning on thier brotheren and consuming them, with the Nightbringer, being tricked by the Deciever, being the first to do so. In this case, the C'tan were "mainly" killed off as well. Maybe, they are just tweeking the fluff to suggest that the surviving C'tan used their Necron servants to dispatch thier rival kin rather than through an all-u-can-eat C'tan buffet.

I like this theory.

The idea that someone suggested earlier of an almost rebellion against the C'tan linking with the 'crons apparent development of individuality and personality also makes some sense.

I'm not saying what I would rather happen, but both these theories make some sense at the very least...

**Azure**

To be honest, I've always thought that the C'tan would have used their Necrons as the harbingers of doom for their fellow C'tan, pitting them against eachother and trying to get to the other god. When one became over run, the other C'tan would come and fight him to the death, victor got all the Necrons still around. If he does the fluff similar to this, it'd allow for some special options for taking a certain Lord, maybe one dedicated to a certain still-living C'tan, such as special wargear or opening up the FOC to units that would be more populous in a Void Dragon army over a Nightbringer one. Still sad about the Pariahs though T..T

**Puscifer**

That new stuff sounds pretty awesome. Liking the idea of Crypteks.

**Darkvoidof40k**

Puscifer wrote:Liking the idea of Crypteks.

Hm, I've just had a thought. It would seem to me that their name is a combination of "Crypt" and "Teks" (ie Techs) - perhaps this is suggestive of their rules/fluff? Obviously we know they can join other units.. but maybe they can specialize in certain "areas" of technology.. You guys know what I'm talking about.

The Techs of the Crypts. Interesting stuff.

**dancingcricket**

blaktoof wrote:TBH these all sound like major improvements.

i get the feeling the tomb blade jetbikes will somehow be reaver jetbike rip offs.

Warriors going from a 3+ save to a 4+ save isnt that bad honestly. Considering the cost reduction they are getting and the new WBB thats a large buff. Most of the fire necrons took was either ignoring WBB by being ap 1-2 or double strength, which the new WBB reportedly ignores and they still get their save, albiet at 5+ instead of 4+.

Considering you are paying 33% less per model (from 18 to 12) they are also arguably tougher against small arms fire with the 4+ save over the 3+ save pointwise. You are going to fail on average 16% more wounds but considering you spent 33% less points if you look at the unit as a pool of points you are actually losing less points than if they were 18pts and 3+ save against small arms.

Overall the rumors make the necron army sound very strong. With the rumored loss of army wide phaseout gone and not being squad based in a way this will make 3 monolith builds stronger as it takes out the weakness of being able to make the monolithes disappear by killing necron units, of course in objective based games you can't claim anything still if you just have monoliths left but....you will probably see more 3 monolith armies :(

I predict this codex will suffer from what the nid codex does to some extent. There will be a lot of really good things in elites and fast attack but in some way they will be very specialized. Many people will build armies based around repeats of elite and fast attack slots then have min troops, just because the elites and fast attacks will be that good. This will probably make the army seem weak because it will be meant to be played as a semi hordish robot undead army and people will buy them as elite small armies.

Going to have to disagree on this sounding like improvements. 3+ save to 4+, 16.6% more casualties from successful wounds sounds like it gets worse, even if there is a price reduction. And the new WBB is not a net benefit, at best it's a wash. Sure you get to use it on everything, but honestly, I always did. I kept res orbs on the table, near the units, for most of the people I've met who played necrons, the exceptions to WBB never really came up as they did similar. And the only thing that ignored WBB without the resorb were close combat armor ignoring weapons and double T weapons - not the AP1 or 2 like you thought. So WBB is getting a worse value, no idea if you get a second chance at it, but you don't have to be quite so clumped up anymore. A wash at best.

For the lower cost, that's great. 60 points less for a squad of 10, good. I wonder though, if that cryptek and his res orb added to the squad so you get back to a 4+ WBB is going to be about 60 pts?

Someone else mentioned that the extra numbers would help out with surviving combat as you now had more attacks to direct back, making it easier to not get swept. Only true to a limited extent. The morale test is off the difference you lost by, so if you don't have a way to come close to the numbers of unsaved wounds it's not going to matter much, or if you don't get a higher I so you can get away. 7 attacks back against a marine squad instead of 4 to bounce off there armor isn't going to make much difference.

**Leggy**

Until I hear otherwise, I'm going to assume the bit about Necrons killing off C'Tan doesn't apply to the surviving 4. In fact, i'm gonna lump it into the current fluff saying that the C'Tan turned on each other. It's easy to assume their Necron servants helped out a bit. Maybe some Necrons, unhappy with their ascended metal forms, rebelled against their C'Tan masters while all the chaos ensued.

Basically, i'm hoping for additional, character-filled detail, not a 360 degree retcon

**Da Boss**

These rumours have re-awakened my interest in 40K a bit. Sounds interesting. Let's see what plastics come out!

**AgeOfEgos**

dancingcricket wrote:

Going to have to disagree on this sounding like improvements. 3+ save to 4+, 16.6% more casualties from successful wounds sounds like it gets worse, even if there is a price reduction. And the new WBB is not a net benefit, at best it's a wash. Sure you get to use it on everything, but honestly, I always did. I kept res orbs on the table, near the units, for most of the people I've met who played necrons, the exceptions to WBB never really came up as they did similar. And the only thing that ignored WBB without the resorb were close combat armor ignoring weapons and double T weapons - not the AP1 or 2 like you thought. So WBB is getting a worse value, no idea if you get a second chance at it, but you don't have to be quite so clumped up anymore. A wash at best.

For the lower cost, that's great. 60 points less for a squad of 10, good. I wonder though, if that cryptek and his res orb added to the squad so you get back to a 4+ WBB is going to be about 60 pts?

Someone else mentioned that the extra numbers would help out with surviving combat as you now had more attacks to direct back, making it easier to not get swept. Only true to a limited extent. The morale test is off the difference you lost by, so if you don't have a way to come close to the numbers of unsaved wounds it's not going to matter much, or if you don't get a higher I so you can get away. 7 attacks back against a marine squad instead of 4 to bounce off there armor isn't going to make much difference.

Provided the rumors are correct and I understand them;

With any cover saves---Necrons are more durable than Vanilla Marines
Without cover saves---Necrons are less durable only against AP4 Weaponry----AP 1,2 and 3 the Necrons are more durable
In hand to hand, Necrons are more durable than Vanilla Marines (Not taking ATSKNF into account)

**kenzosan**

At the c'tan being killed but still usable, my reaction to that rumor: "ward killed off the sisters and c'tan. Now they are both teamming up to sucker punch him." But seriously, this is why fluff out of contex is so bad. It could totally be only a couple c'tan died. Heck we don't even know how the c'tan work as elites either. So idk if jumping that gun is wise.

**AgeOfEgos**

To be honest, I've always hated the C'Tan fluff. It seemed wedged into the 40kverse as a stopgap/hole filler...so I wouldn't mind seeing it die.

Considering it's made an appearance in the HH books though, guess I'll have to shut up and like it.

**Da Boss**

I thought the Dragon stuff was pretty clever, but I could live without the other fluff.
I'll buy this codex anyway, and have a nose around.

**tiekwando**

dancingcricket wrote:
Someone else mentioned that the extra numbers would help out with surviving combat as you now had more attacks to direct back, making it easier to not get swept. Only true to a limited extent. The morale test is off the difference you lost by, so if you don't have a way to come close to the numbers of unsaved wounds it's not going to matter much, or if you don't get a higher I so you can get away. 7 attacks back against a marine squad instead of 4 to bounce off there armor isn't going to make much difference.

I think you might be referencing me, in which case I don't think they are more survivable because of extra attacks, its more just I can live with them being destroyed. Before my warriors did next to nothing the entire game (reserved for most of it, running away the rest) because I was worried about phase out. With that being removed, I do not have to worry as much about my 120 point troop choice being swept (though it is now easier). Sure I do not want to loose the troops, but I can definitely live with it.

Another way of looking at it (though obviously flawed) is that instead of 360 points for two squads of 10, i can have 3 squads of ten. Although each squad is less resilient to sweeping advance (4+ save being worse than 3+) you have to do it 3 times instead of 2.

Hope that makes sense.

**Mar**

Also with phase out gone losing an entire unit to a SA is less of a big deal, still not nice but not game crippling.

**Aduro**

I am cautiously unoptimistic of these new rumors. WBB dropping down to a 5+, followed by armor dropping down to a 4+? I'm not sure I like the sound of that. Some of the stuff sounds nice, some of it not so much, so I'll wait and worry until the book comes out.

**Sasori**

I think with the introduction of open topped transports, the chances of your Necrons standing around to get swept in close combat is lessened a lot as well.

In all reality, I like the direction it's going, primarily with phase out being gone.

**necr0n**

With the cryptek holdin a VoD and a res orb and ten 17-point immortals with assault weaps..... t4 s3+ 4+++++ and teleporting every movement phase? AND THEY ARE TROOPS? why you pplz complaining? necrons are not gonna be horde. I'm pretty sure every1 is gonna play with the new AWSOME units and forget about the old warriors

... AWSOME rumorz

bring us moar please?

**Scarey Nerd**

necr0n wrote:With the cryptek holdin a VoD and a res orb and ten 17-point immortals with assault weaps..... t4 s3+ 4+++++ and teleporting every movement phase? AND THEY ARE TROOPS? why you pplz complaining? necrons are not gonna be horde. I'm pretty sure every1 is gonna play with the new AWSOME units and forget about the old warriors ... AWSOME rumorz bring us moar please?

I might be projecting my own worry here, but I think people are saddened by the idea that Warriors - one of the only unchanged sculpts reportedly - aren't even gonna be useful, meaning that an entire army needs to be bought, rather than updating some models.

**Balance**

AgeOfEgos wrote:To be honest, I've always hated the C'Tan fluff. It seemed wedged into the 40kverse as a stopgap/hole filler...so I wouldn't mind seeing it die.

Considering it's made an appearance in the HH books though, guess I'll have to shut up and like it.

I liked it, but a major tenet of getting into the 40k setting, to me, is that everything is turned up to 11. Every Codex is completely and totally devoted to showing how awesome the featured army is. The Necrons were big players a few epochs ago and they're scary now, but Chaos has spent all that time getting smarter, tougher, and nastier.

**necr0n**

Scarey Nerd wrote:
necr0n wrote:With the cryptek holdin a VoD and a res orb and ten 17-point immortals with assault weaps..... t4 s3+ 4+++++ and teleporting every movement phase? AND THEY ARE TROOPS? why you pplz complaining? necrons are not gonna be horde. I'm pretty sure every1 is gonna play with the new AWSOME units and forget about the old warriors ... AWSOME rumorz bring us moar please?

I might be projecting my own worry here, but I think people are saddened by the idea that Warriors - one of the only unchanged sculpts reportedly - aren't even gonna be useful, meaning that an entire army needs to be bought, rather than updating some models.

I can see what ur saying, i got 51 warriors myself(i know its not a lot but im a relatively new player) but still warriors wont be useless, I see it more like a buff as well. Just get 40 warriors on the table-top(two 20-model squads) with their RO's inside vehiles or even VoD. I think you can see my point. Plus with the new elites and the units in general (and ofc havin Phase Out gone) I dont think any enemy will focus on our warriors ^_^

**Aduro**

Cheaper Warriors does give me a reason to field the ~60 I've got built and painted...

**tiekwando**

I don't know. I hope warriors go down to 5-20 per unit so that I can take one or two squads and sit in cover on an objective. I mean t4, with 4/3+ cover save (assuming they hide their heads

) and a 5+wbb save means its going to take a lot to kill them outside of assault. Especially for 60 pts!

Now if they stay at 10 minimum, then I might just go with the rumored immortals. For 5 extra ppm you get (assuming weapons are the same) +1 armor save and a much better weapon. And the squad is only 85 points instead of 120.

If i can VoD them last turn to grab/contest my opponents objectives for cheap, then that is even better.