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 Lynata wrote:
As the Liber Sororitas notes, the orders are much more compatible to each other, and transfers are not a rarity. Bonus: novices get trained by the Orders Famulous, so any new Sister that joins an Order Militant can be deployed to the field immediately rather than having to spend a decade in some Astartes Scout Company.

Huh. I didn't know that (I don't have the Liber Sororitas). So the girls train at the Schola Progenium until, what, age 12, and then are trained during their Novitiate (to, what, age 16? 18?) by the Famulous? How does that work?

It strikes me as odd since the Famulous are described explicitly as non-military -- not non-combatant, even the goddamn babies are combatants in the grimdarkverse, as soon as they get their first tooth they'll bite your legs off -- but specialized in intrigue, diplomacy and maybe the occasional assassination. They seem an odd choice to train Battle Sisters, who'd need intensive tactical and physical training, or for that matter Hospitallers, who'd need specialized medical knowledge, or Dialogus linguists, etc. etc.

 Lynata wrote:


There is a single regiment of Imperial Guard Storm Troopers, and 2E Codex fluff has declared its size with 10.000 troops. That is even less than there are Battle Sisters - does that mean they are more awesome?

Totally

So with the new SoB codex around the corner , anyone thinks they will get more viable. With some plastic models they could be a nice ally to imperial guard armies . Unless they don't rise the pre model cost that is.

I don't think that they'll be majorly changed, I think they're just gaining the trappings of a 6e codex until an actual codex, with accompanying models, comes. But we'll see what happens.

But hey, they're perfectly viable as is. As for allies, stick Uriah Jacobus in a guardsman blob. He gives +1 attacks and FNP. Fun!

A different question: Do we know how many Cardinals and how many Shrine Worlds there are? I'd argue that each of those things should get its own Minor Order for local self-defense.

All I can recall is that Sebastian Thor reformed the Ecclesiarchy to disperse power into more Cardinals with smaller dioceses....

 Troike wrote:
I don't think that they'll be majorly changed, I think they're just gaining the trappings of a 6e codex until an actual codex, with accompanying models, comes. But we'll see what happens.

But hey, they're perfectly viable as is. As for allies, stick Uriah Jacobus in a guardsman blob. He gives +1 attacks and FNP. Fun!

I think we might see some points adjustments, namely to fit in with 6th Ed better. Namely drops on Heavy Flamers and Battle Sister Squads. But that's just me thinking wishfully I guess.

ClockworkZion wrote:

 Troike wrote:
I don't think that they'll be majorly changed, I think they're just gaining the trappings of a 6e codex until an actual codex, with accompanying models, comes. But we'll see what happens.

But hey, they're perfectly viable as is. As for allies, stick Uriah Jacobus in a guardsman blob. He gives +1 attacks and FNP. Fun!

I think we might see some points adjustments, namely to fit in with 6th Ed better. Namely drops on Heavy Flamers and Battle Sister Squads. But that's just me thinking wishfully I guess.

I doubt they will modify anything that is already written. They may add a few little hings like warlord traits but I wouldn't expect anything else s that sounds they are expending effort on it. Iknowthey say they are being worked onfor a full new codex and models but we have heard it all before, so I will believe it when I see it in my hands.

andrewm9 wrote:

ClockworkZion wrote:

 Troike wrote:
I don't think that they'll be majorly changed, I think they're just gaining the trappings of a 6e codex until an actual codex, with accompanying models, comes. But we'll see what happens.

But hey, they're perfectly viable as is. As for allies, stick Uriah Jacobus in a guardsman blob. He gives +1 attacks and FNP. Fun!

I think we might see some points adjustments, namely to fit in with 6th Ed better. Namely drops on Heavy Flamers and Battle Sister Squads. But that's just me thinking wishfully I guess.

I doubt they will modify anything that is already written. They may add a few little hings like warlord traits but I wouldn't expect anything else s that sounds they are expending effort on it. Iknowthey say they are being worked onfor a full new codex and models but we have heard it all before, so I will believe it when I see it in my hands.

Changing 12 to 10 isn't exactly that hard.

That said I did say "might" as in "there is a chance, but it is not certain".

andrewm9 wrote:

ClockworkZion wrote:

 Troike wrote:
I don't think that they'll be majorly changed, I think they're just gaining the trappings of a 6e codex until an actual codex, with accompanying models, comes. But we'll see what happens.

But hey, they're perfectly viable as is. As for allies, stick Uriah Jacobus in a guardsman blob. He gives +1 attacks and FNP. Fun!

I think we might see some points adjustments, namely to fit in with 6th Ed better. Namely drops on Heavy Flamers and Battle Sister Squads. But that's just me thinking wishfully I guess.

I doubt they will modify anything that is already written. They may add a few little hings like warlord traits but I wouldn't expect anything else s that sounds they are expending effort on it. Iknowthey say they are being worked onfor a full new codex and models but we have heard it all before, so I will believe it when I see it in my hands.

What he said.

They've had long enough, its entirely possible there's a complete dex sitting there waiting on models, and the WD dex is actually a draft version of it they threw out to keep sisters players happy while they waited for the models to be plausible. They'd have had to re-write it for 6th anyway, so...

To steal someone's nice point from Warseer:

They're going to have to re-word it first for sure, then the editor has to go through it.

But then the design team (not rules studio, but the guys who lay out the books) have to layout in any digital and print formats if relevant, and re-style and apply and draw art assets (like the funny borders and backgrounds they like to have in the new full colour books) to fit the 6th edition aesthetic which the old WD article won't.

There's a lot more work than just making up the rules and faqs. The 6th edition codices are actually exquisite compared with the majority of game rulebooks out there and are technically superior to even the Forge World ones (bar pehaps the HH books) in design effort.

So yeah, with all that work being expected not making other changes would be a bit odd.

And we should be expecting this work too as the WD codex was made for a magazine, not for a tablet or ereader and the unit description section was an intentionally disorganized mess to keep us from guessing what was in what slot until the second half came out.

Nobody_Holme wrote:
They've had long enough, its entirely possible there's a complete dex sitting there waiting on models, and the WD dex is actually a draft version of it they threw out to keep sisters players happy while they waited for the models to be plausible. They'd have had to re-write it for 6th anyway, so...

I doubt any of us are happy with the current situation and when the codex rolled out in 5th I generally believed that it sucked. In 6th it is functionally a lot better, but its not very much fun to play IMO. I can make a pretty hard list with it in fact, but its not what I want from the codex. Further its a very unforgiving army to play.

SisterSydney wrote:Huh. I didn't know that (I don't have the Liber Sororitas). So the girls train at the Schola Progenium until, what, age 12, and then are trained during their Novitiate (to, what, age 16? 18?) by the Famulous? How does that work?

It strikes me as odd since the Famulous are described explicitly as non-military -- not non-combatant, even the goddamn babies are combatants in the grimdarkverse, as soon as they get their first tooth they'll bite your legs off -- but specialized in intrigue, diplomacy and maybe the occasional assassination. They seem an odd choice to train Battle Sisters, who'd need intensive tactical and physical training, or for that matter Hospitallers, who'd need specialized medical knowledge, or Dialogus linguists, etc. etc.

That's actually not from the Liber Sororitas but one of those little known things I ripped out of the articles about Anastasia and Ephrael Stern that were posted on the GW website:

"Raised at the Schola Progenium facility at Antigone's Harbour, Rosetta Anastasia was singled out by the Order Famulous as a potential recruit for the Adepta Sororitas at the age of twelve years. The agents of the Sisterhood were impressed by her pious spirit, which, matched with her latent fighting skills, made her ideal material for the battle sisters of the Orders Militant. During her period as a Novice, Anastasia was indoctrinated into the ancient beliefs and traditions of the Sisterhood. [...]
At the age of seventeen, Anastasia stood with five hundred of her fellow Novices and took the Oaths of Adherence in the Ecclesiarchal Palace on Terra. The Ecclesiarch himself blessed the assembled Novices in a ceremony that lasted throughout the night, and culminated at dawn with a superior from each of the Orders Militant stepping forward to lead each of the girls off to don the armour of their new Order for the very first time. [...]"
- archived GW: Inquisitor RPG, Sister Anastasia

"Regardless of her unknown roots, it is evident that Stern was singled out from an early age as a candidate for the Adepta Sororitas. The Arch Drill-abbot of the Schola Progenium submitted her for consideration, and one Sister Patricia of the Order of the Holy Seal accepted her, shipping her out on the next available vessel bound for Terra.
The records of Stern's period as a Novice indicate that she excelled during all the stringent trials and ordeals required of her, and she took the Oaths of Adherence along with five hundred other Novices at the Eclessiarchal Palace on Terra. At the completion of the night-long ceremony she was chosen to join the Order of our Martyred Lady, and dispatched to Ophelia VII."
- archived GW: Villainy & Infamy, Ephrael Stern
(note: the Order of the Holy Seal is an Order Famulous, too, based in ... the Convent Prioris, Terra)

To my knowledge, there's no explicit general description of what actually happens between Schola indoctrination and being a full Sister, but the only two accounts that mention the experiences from different individuals happen to be consistent enough for me to consider this as a standard for now.

It's worth pointing out that the Orders Famulous have at times been described not only as diplomats, but also as chamberlains and governesses, in the latter role assuming responsibility for the education of children of Imperial nobility. Given that Schola indoctrination and training is very general and has nothing to do with the Adepta Sororitas (obviously contradicted by Mitchell's novels, mind you), a Schola graduate who has been accepted into the Sisterhood need additional tutoring in the Sororitas' ways. Apparently, a Novice Sister's eventual assignment is not chosen/declared until after she has finished her novitiate, so Famulous training would be something that is deemed useful for all the Orders, such as history and prayers, but also first aid, combat, or the use and maintenance of certain general equipment that could be found in any convent (for example boltguns). The Famulous also need to crank up the existing brainwashing and turn an already devoted mind into one that appreciates and shares her fellow Sisters' penchant for humility, penance and corporal mortification.

As the 2E Codex already hinted at, Order-specific training would follow when a freshly anointed Sister is "adopted" by a Sister Superior, who would build on anything the new member of her squad would have learned before. A possible example that springs to my mind could be a Superior from the Orders Hospitaller using a new "adoptee" first only as an assisting nurse, but slowly expanding her skillset from the basic first aid she already knows from her novitiate to proper surgery. A Superior from the Orders Militant on the other hand would deepen a talented Sister's experience with special weapons such as melta or flamer.

That's how I'm connecting the dots, anyways. Does it make sense?

Makumba wrote:So with the new SoB codex around the corner , anyone thinks they will get more viable. With some plastic models they could be a nice ally to imperial guard armies . Unless they don't rise the pre model cost that is.

One can only hope. I will see them as viable as soon as the Codex doesn't try to "force" me to field a Special Character as HQ anymore. Give us back our old Kickass Canoness and her Wargear dammit!

They don't even need plastic kits imo, GW just needs to market them in a 10-girl box again just like they do with the Valhallans or Iron Guard. Price difference to plastic Cadians is minimal, at least in UK. That being said, I know that a lot of other fans would prefer plastic for conversion work. Matter of preferences, I suppose.

That's fascinating stuff. Doesn't completely rule out there being other forms and even other locations for initiation from Novice to Battle Sister, but given that Anastasia was sent from somewhere all the way to Terra and then all the way back out to the Cadian region, which is hella far away, it strongly suggests that even far-flung Minor Orders get all their personnel directly from the Eclessiarchal Palace, which means a lot of shuffling teenage girls back and forth across the galaxy.

That gives me an idea for a modelling project.

An Imperial transport vessel, all relic-looking with stained glass and gothic arched windows.

Painted yellow and named "Via Ecclesia".

 SisterSydney wrote:
That's fascinating stuff. Doesn't completely rule out there being other forms and even other locations for initiation from Novice to Battle Sister, but given that Anastasia was sent from somewhere all the way to Terra and then all the way back out to the Cadian region, which is hella far away, it strongly suggests that even far-flung Minor Orders get all their personnel directly from the Eclessiarchal Palace, which means a lot of shuffling teenage girls back and forth across the galaxy.

Sisters are trained on Terra and Ophelia VII, they just get their actual "swearing in" on Terra it seems.

Psienesis wrote:That gives me an idea for a modelling project.

An Imperial transport vessel, all relic-looking with stained glass and gothic arched windows.

Painted yellow and named "Via Ecclesia".

Huh. If you do this, be sure to post pictures!

For inspiration, how about an Ecclesiarchy Galleon from the works of Mr. Blanche?

The thought was actually inspired (a bit) by this webcomic:



... and the thought of a Church Bus in Space makes me laugh.

 Psienesis wrote:
The thought was actually inspired (a bit) by this webcomic:

Spoiler:

... and the thought of a Church Bus in Space makes me laugh.

"If you kids don't behave back there I'm turning this Space Bus around and we're going back to Ophelia VII!"

"Awwwwwwwwww."

ClockworkZion wrote:"If you kids don't behave back there I'm turning this Space Bus around and we're going back to Ophelia VII!"

"Awwwwwwwwww."

Okay, that got added to my Sisters art folder. Source?

"Lost in Space", a webcomic by artist Jordan Mead that was hosted on Librarium Online ages ago. It's long offline, but I happen to have a huge folder of it, and there's more where that came from.



And something for the Space Marines


Imperial Guard!


IG + SW


I should maybe re-upload the entire archive again somewhere some day... I've done that in the past and specifically asked his permission to do so. This stuff is way too funny to not be posted somewhere.

He's lucky that was only a bolt pistol.

I so want to see all of these now.

Ah, yes... Lost in Space, the one time a comic artist got away with portraying the Sisters in a comedic and lighthearted way without getting slaughtered by the fanbase.

Probably because that one with the Mistress establishing her position in the Chain of Command makes up for all the sex jokes... (and the armour really does stay on).

That, and he makes fun of everyone and anything equally.

Myself, don't really care too much about the minutia fluff of the universe, Sisters are my favorite army for the aesthetics and that's good enough for me.