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Post by: MightyGodzilla
 Platuan4th wrote:I know everyone's gonna find it odd, but I hope Belial has a Storm Bolter and the Sword of Silence in the new Dex. I really like my Belial conversion...
If in the new codex they opt to give you only one loadout instead of the 3 I find the SB/ SoS combo the most fitting. DAs needs their swords.
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
I think that, if this rumour is true, Belial will provide a benefit to a Deathwing army, rather than being the only way to field a Deathwing army.
I much prefer it that way.
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
whoadirty wrote:
I'm curious about the design of the new flyer. When they say they wings are shaped like the Aquila, do they mean there is another ship called the Aquila, or are they just referring to the Imperial symbol?
There is the FW Aquila lander... which doesn't really do anything except transport 5 models and has a HB in the nose. For a b* tt-load of points, mind you. But the flyer is sweet. So if they use the wings, I'm all for it. Will still be using my ST conversion though. How much money do you expect me to throw at this hobby?
No, please, don't say it.
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Post by: B3AN
 Ronin_eX wrote:Hell, they may be decoupling him from DW-as-troops so they can turn him in to a special character rather than a named character with all the personality of white bread. Right now, the sole reason for taking Belial is that his TH/ SS version is cheap as chips compared to a vanilla SM captain with the same loadout and he allows for DW armies. My guess is that the rumours that he is going to be limited to one loadout, along with Masters getting access to TDA, mean that he will be getting an upgrade to something that could go toe to toe with Ghazkul. If he isn't going to be a hyper-efficient but bland choice, then it makes sense for GW to make him a bit of a combat monster. Dark Angels need a combat monster character as most every one of their characters qualifies as a bland but sometimes effective support unit. It is good to have a few of those, but having a big centerpiece beatstick would be nice.
For people who want a low-cost alternative for DW armies they will hopefully be able to run a Master to represent a more generic MotDW (with the upshot that all of us with TDA-equipped master who aren't the MotDW will be able to use them again!).
I think making RW and DW squads troops allows for a lot more variety out of our lists and I hope that bit turns out to be true (and it seems plausible since GW have really been making sure to load up on standard troop options without needing to take pre-req characters). This allows them to make Sammael and Belial special characters without making them an army tax for people who field DW or RW armies. So for people who like using named characters (or using their rules) they can still do that and actually have something that adds an interesting angle to the army (hopefully) and for those that don't, it gives them the freedom to ignore the named characters and take their own with precise customization.
Thanks Ronin and everyone else who replied to my question. I hope his model is amazing. I guess I didn't really think about how bland of a character choice he is currently.
61837
Post by: Hrontore Da Death Bringer
 GhostOfCaliban wrote: mattyrm wrote: GhostOfCaliban wrote:As an aspiring DA player, I really hope this Codex: Dark Angels stands them apart from the rest in a unique way. The way BA and SW codex's did for them. New rules for "Get's Hot" would be great. My first game with the Dark Vengeance set was a disaster lol. I lost SM Sergent, PC, AND PG to "Get's Hot" within two rounds of shooting.
You are aware that you get your armour saves right? I'm just asking because that seems staggeringly unlucky, I think in all of my 40k career Ive only lost 2 or 3 guys to gets hot. If your unlucky enough to roll a 1, you dont usually follow it up with a 1 or a 2! And when I very first started playing I remember thinking a gets hot roll was at ap2. 
/facepalm ... I probably wasn't paying attention. I am new sooooo... But HEY I won my first game last night against some Chaos and he was rocking a Daemon Prince with flying and marks. Shot him out of the sky and grounded his butt. LUCKY rolls I have to say. He failed his cover save from Dive too. He saved against the wound from falling though. Also not a single failed Gets Hot! lol. Automatically Appended Next Post: I second that!  *breaks out cardboard dance floor* 
Return of Cypher Plox?! *breaks out boombox*
63733
Post by: B3AN
Now THAT would be something! A new Cypher model + updated dual pistol rules. O.o
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Post by: Praxiss
 Mathieu Raymond wrote:whoadirty wrote:
I'm curious about the design of the new flyer. When they say they wings are shaped like the Aquila, do they mean there is another ship called the Aquila, or are they just referring to the Imperial symbol?
There is the FW Aquila lander... which doesn't really do anything except transport 5 models and has a HB in the nose. For a b* tt-load of points, mind you. But the flyer is sweet. So if they use the wings, I'm all for it. Will still be using my ST conversion though. How much money do you expect me to throw at this hobby?
it does look pretty cool. the wings on a Stormtalon coudl look nice.
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Post by: B3AN
Barakiel - named Techmarine/master of the forge! Note: barakiel is known as Angel of Lightning in references
So in the DV model roster, there is a Termie named Sgt. Barachiel. I wonder if either the spellings are just similar or that Techmarine rumor was misheard.
1
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Post by: Brother SRM
GhostOfCaliban wrote:
Barakiel - named Techmarine/master of the forge! Note: barakiel is known as Angel of Lightning in references
So in the DV model roster, there is a Termie named Sgt. Barachiel. I wonder if either the spellings are just similar or that Techmarine rumor was misheard.
I personally don't buy any of those "upgrade character" rumors. It seems like they were starting that up with Orks, IG, and Space Marines and just kind of petered out.
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
They were usually expensive, at least with IG, for a relatively delicate model on the tabletop. Especially now that challenges will be all over the place.
42149
Post by: MightyGodzilla
 Brother SRM wrote: GhostOfCaliban wrote:
Barakiel - named Techmarine/master of the forge! Note: barakiel is known as Angel of Lightning in references
So in the DV model roster, there is a Termie named Sgt. Barachiel. I wonder if either the spellings are just similar or that Techmarine rumor was misheard.
I personally don't buy any of those "upgrade character" rumors. It seems like they were starting that up with Orks, IG, and Space Marines and just kind of petered out.
They worked pretty well for the Space Wolves tho. A few characters (of your total list) that don't take up force org slots are pretty cool IMO. Company masters and librarians shouldn't fall like this, but if there's going to be a squad of scouts why not Namaan, if there's a 1-3 selection of Chaplains now why not Asmodai...etc etc.
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Post by: ph34r
Brother SRM wrote: GhostOfCaliban wrote:
Barakiel - named Techmarine/master of the forge! Note: barakiel is known as Angel of Lightning in references
So in the DV model roster, there is a Termie named Sgt. Barachiel. I wonder if either the spellings are just similar or that Techmarine rumor was misheard.
I personally don't buy any of those "upgrade character" rumors. It seems like they were starting that up with Orks, IG, and Space Marines and just kind of petered out.
Seems to me a victim of the "no model, no rules" policy.
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Post by: Compel
Grey Knights, Space Wolves and Blood Angels all have upgrade characters as well.
Necrons don't have any, Dark Eldar might have 1, I'm not sure though....
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Post by: whoadirty
Mathieu Raymond wrote:whoadirty wrote:
I'm curious about the design of the new flyer. When they say they wings are shaped like the Aquila, do they mean there is another ship called the Aquila, or are they just referring to the Imperial symbol?
There is the FW Aquila lander... which doesn't really do anything except transport 5 models and has a HB in the nose. For a b* tt-load of points, mind you. But the flyer is sweet. So if they use the wings, I'm all for it. Will still be using my ST conversion though. How much money do you expect me to throw at this hobby?
No, please, don't say it.
I am hoping the rumoured weapons are true as it would be exactly how I did my ST conversion (in my gallery).
The Aquila lander does look pretty cool though.
11
Post by: ph34r
 Compel wrote:Grey Knights, Space Wolves and Blood Angels all have upgrade characters as well. Necrons don't have any, Dark Eldar might have 1, I'm not sure though....
True, but if I'm not mistaken those all have models, yes? With the exception of maybe the Terminator Justicar for GK?
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Post by: Kanluwen
Dark Eldar do not have Duke Sliscus or Lady Malys off the top of my head.
Justicar Thawn is not available for Grey Knights.
Space Wolves only just this year got Arjac Rockfist.
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Post by: ph34r
 Kanluwen wrote:Dark Eldar do not have Duke Sliscus or Lady Malys off the top of my head.
Justicar Thawn is not available for Grey Knights.
Space Wolves only just this year got Arjac Rockfist.
On that note DE still don't have the bomber either. I would expect DE to get a mini wave at some point in the future, but if that giant release list was fake, who knows when.
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Post by: Anpu42
There is also a Loki sorry Lucus Model
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
whoadirty wrote: Mathieu Raymond wrote:whoadirty wrote:
I'm curious about the design of the new flyer. When they say they wings are shaped like the Aquila, do they mean there is another ship called the Aquila, or are they just referring to the Imperial symbol?
There is the FW Aquila lander... which doesn't really do anything except transport 5 models and has a HB in the nose. For a b* tt-load of points, mind you. But the flyer is sweet. So if they use the wings, I'm all for it. Will still be using my ST conversion though. How much money do you expect me to throw at this hobby?
No, please, don't say it.
I am hoping the rumoured weapons are true as it would be exactly how I did my ST conversion (in my gallery).
The Aquila lander does look pretty cool though.
I must have missed it, but what was said about that flyer's loadout? Automatically Appended Next Post: We went with the same loadout, cool. So I'm technically golden.
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Post by: Micky
Brother SRM wrote:
I personally don't buy any of those "upgrade character" rumors. It seems like they were starting that up with Orks, IG, and Space Marines and just kind of petered out.
Brood Lord?
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Post by: Backfire
 H.B.M.C. wrote:I think that, if this rumour is true, Belial will provide a benefit to a Deathwing army, rather than being the only way to field a Deathwing army.
I much prefer it that way.
Seconded. I've always thought "You have to field Cpt. Blahblah to play army X" has always been lame. So it means that every say, Salamander army has to be led by Vulkan. Wow, the diversity. If GW is backing up from this policy, it's great.
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Post by: Brother SRM
 Micky wrote: Brother SRM wrote:
I personally don't buy any of those "upgrade character" rumors. It seems like they were starting that up with Orks, IG, and Space Marines and just kind of petered out.
Brood Lord?
He's not a named special character, and that was also like 3 years ago.
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Post by: pretre
Stickmonkey wrote: just heard a rumor that there is a AA option for DA dreads...one that will likely make it to all chapters eventually.
Codex release at the end of November White Dwarf (December issue) and a release in December
So PA command squad could get a single heavy weapon, apoth, standard, etc. A TA squad the same, but that the RW command squad was 3 bikes and a attack bike w hvy weapon, or 5 bikes, but not a LS. The history here does not point to GW breaking the concept that a RW full squad is still 10 man strong, 6 bikes, a AB, and a LS.
DA version of Vanguard?
Most like. But they have some form of hunters from hyperspace type rule in addition. And they might have some new DA special weapons...dark claws or dark swords, you know, to egg on the stereotypes..
Deathwing Terminators
SB, PS, LC, TH, SS, AC, AssC, PC, HF, CML, CF, PA, and PF are all the options I've heard rumored. Default is standard SB PF, Sgt w SB PS. Of note, AC and the PASS combo both are new info that's been whispered to me.
Plasma Predator
Heard a deviant rumor that they have meltagun sponsons as an option too...
So PC, AC, LasC w HB, HF, MG sponsons. Supposed to be a new kit with BA Pred style sponsons and DA icons included.
Dreadnoughts
Sounds like the HVY slot dread is the standard, and the specialist DA dread is Elite. and either can be upgraded to ven...for what that's worth now.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Man, I hope SM isn't going all TDG on us here. Automatically Appended Next Post: Tastytaste being mysterious wrote:My Opinion:
I actually don’t think they are getting a Flyer. Inner Circle sorta fits with what I have been hearing. Super Techmarine sounds like the answer to the Warpsmith. Fortification is pretty solid, but don’t expect army specific fortifications just yet it should be an addition to the current list.
Here is some tip bits of what I know about the new Dark Angel codex that should hold you over.
Expect Dark Angels to be the ones that get Hatred: Chaos Space Marines. In fact, expect a “hatred type” trend to continue especially considering the addition of Allies.
GW wants (along fluff lines) to have armies counter other armies in extremely specific ways. In addition, and I am going to be nice and vague about this, but I bet you can figure it out if you do some research. The new major unit for Dark Angels is something Games Workshop is currently in court over over with a certain other company that already made them. If that doesn’t ring a bell, let me say it is a unit that perhaps only the Masters of the 2nd Companies would know about.
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Post by: SickSix
Truescale Storm Raven?
Jet Bikes.
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Post by: pretre
Yeah, I agree that he is probably hinting at jetbikes.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
I think Tasty is at his worst as a rumor monger when he tries this 'Not the sons of Guilliman' BS, but that's just me.
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Post by: Ronin
Jet bikes eh? gonna be fun zooming around as space marines.
And no, I dont mean "zooming" as in "zooming" flyer special rule.
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Post by: Platuan4th
AD Mech: Hey, Dark Angels, remember how we said that you guys have the last Imperial Jetbike in existance?
Azrael: Yeah?
AM: We, uh, we found an old unopened box in the back, you guys want 'em?
20774
Post by: pretre
Nah, DA will pull a BA and find the STC. The Ad Mech will get pissy and DA will be all 'UNFORGIVEN!!!!'.
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Post by: Minx
SM marked some of his comments as speculation (unlike tDG).
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Post by: pretre
Minx wrote:SM marked some of his comments as speculation (unlike tDG).
The problem is that when you post rumors, whether you mark it as speculation or not, you're still putting it out there and saying 'This is what's coming'.
52872
Post by: captain collius
This list brings so much hope.
By the way if we get jetbikes and keep them from the ADMech. Eduard Khil upgrade cahracter for ravenwing he grants you the right to play the trolololo song at anytime you want during the game as a many times as you want.
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
With all the different rumoured goodies, it's going to be hard to stick to a pure deathwing army. Not that this is bad.
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Post by: Ozymandias
I'm hoping you are right. I love my DW, but I'd love to field other stuff ad well.
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Post by: Minx
 pretre wrote:Minx wrote:SM marked some of his comments as speculation (unlike tDG).
The problem is that when you post rumors, whether you mark it as speculation or not, you're still putting it out there and saying 'This is what's coming'.
No, if you are speculating as a rumour monger and marking it clearly you are obviously not saying "This is what's coming". Summaries and quotes of said non-rumours sometimes do not contain the same caveat though.
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Post by: MightyGodzilla
Well we got rules for jetbikes in the BGB. Might as well use them.
62229
Post by: Minx
And FW just released some lovely jetbikes 
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Post by: pretre
Minx wrote:No, if you are speculating as a rumour monger and marking it clearly you are obviously not saying "This is what's coming". Summaries and quotes of said non-rumours sometimes do not contain the same caveat though.
And that's the problem. Like it or not, once you start spouting off rumors people listen to what you have to say. You don't get the luxury of just spouting off because someone's just going to quote you without the caveat and suddenly people are believing that's the next new thing.
With great rumor power comes great rumor responsibility.
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Post by: MightyGodzilla
If the jetbike thing is a 1, then I hope GW makes their own jetbikes that are closer in form to Sammael's than those flying penises that FW made. Honestly whoever designed those travesties should be pistol whipped.
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Post by: Minx
 MightyGodzilla wrote:If the jetbike thing is a 1, then I hope GW makes their own jetbikes that are closer in form to Sammael's than those flying penises that FW made. Honestly whoever designed those travesties should be pistol whipped.
I like them way more than GW attempts at designing imperial jetbikes.
Btw phallic shapes are not very rare, e.g. skyscrapers and rockets, but there's no need to call all of them penises. Is that a not very well hidden fetish of yours?
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Post by: Brother SRM
Added to the OP. I figure if anyone's going to get jetbikes it's going to be Dark Angels. It would be funny for Space Marines to end up out-Eldar-ing the Eldar though! Imperial jetbikes would at least be a better selling kit than recut bikers, which Space Marines frankly need.
53623
Post by: Ronin_eX
Just thought I would post this as it is semi-related. But it would seem the Warriors of Chaos rumours from Harry and Hastings are that it wont be an army book release but an update wave ala Daemons. Will still probably take up the whole month, of course. But as WD updates are a new thing we don't really know how GW handles them alongside major releases yet. But either way, WoC will apparently not be a full army release, so take from that what you will.
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Post by: MightyGodzilla
Minx wrote:... Btw phallic shapes are not very rare, e.g. skyscrapers and rockets, but there's no need to call all of them penises. Is that a not very well hidden fetish of yours?
I think it's cute how you're all prudish.
Brother SRM wrote:Added to the OP. I figure if anyone's going to get jetbikes it's going to be Dark Angels. It would be funny for Space Marines to end up out-Eldar-ing the Eldar though! Imperial jetbikes would at least be a better selling kit than recut bikers, which Space Marines frankly need.
I think DA only jetbikes would be a pretty good feature for the codex that could seperate our DAs from vanilla marines, SWs, BAs, or GKs. I don't know how much I would use them but I like the idea of the first legion wielding some old tech. I also don't think it would out eldar the eldar in anything but sales as the eldar and dark eldar have extended rules for their jetbikes which are pretty damn cool in their own right. Wishing it were the end of November truth be told.
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Post by: Minx
MightyGodzilla wrote:I think it's cute how you're all prudish.
I'd rather say it's immature and not funny and nothing to do with being prudish.
Ronin_eX wrote:Just thought I would post this as it is semi-related. But it would seem the Warriors of Chaos rumours from Harry and Hastings are that it wont be an army book release but an update wave ala Daemons. Will still probably take up the whole month, of course. But as WD updates are a new thing we don't really know how GW handles them alongside major releases yet. But either way, WoC will apparently not be a full army release, so take from that what you will.
Here's hoping the DA get a proper 'dex with their first wave. Then again there was a rumour that GW wants to push out the majority of their models in prior waves before the codex/army book gets released.
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Post by: B3AN
MightyGodzilla wrote:If the jetbike thing is a 1, then I hope GW makes their own jetbikes that are closer in form to Sammael's than those flying penises that FW made. Honestly whoever designed those travesties should be pistol whipped.
I don't know, just think how funny it would be to defeat your opponents with an army of SM's straddling steel "penis" bikes. I for one would do this just for that particular satisfaction. lol!
No Homo.
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Post by: Kroothawk
pretre wrote:Minx wrote:No, if you are speculating as a rumour monger and marking it clearly you are obviously not saying "This is what's coming". Summaries and quotes of said non-rumours sometimes do not contain the same caveat though.
And that's the problem. Like it or not, once you start spouting off rumors people listen to what you have to say. You don't get the luxury of just spouting off because someone's just going to quote you without the caveat and suddenly people are believing that's the next new thing.
With great rumor power comes great rumor responsibility.
Doesn't mean that people are not responsible for making correct quotes.
Doesn't mean that people are not responsible for having obviously false attitudes towards rumours and rumour posters.
Doesn't mean that rumour posters are forbidden to post an opinion or speculation, just because there might be one other poster in the world misinterpreting him.
Sometimes posters have to adapt to the world, not the world to each poster.
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Post by: Brother SRM
According to Harry over on Warseer ( summed up here by Kroothawk) November will be the Warriors of Chaos release. So yeah, color me surprised that Stickmonkey's prediction for November was wrong
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Well, if I recall correctly, there were VC in January and then Empire in April, otherwise it has been a rather dry year for WHFB, correct? I'm not against giving those players a little love. Not that I'm about to pick up that game ever again... but the minis are useful for 40K, sometimes.
Played an awesome game this weekend with a mainly deathwing army. I rolled a lot of 1s, but it was so much fun. The only downside is having a whole turn of shooting come your way while you can't really do anything. Of my 26 terminators, I had 7 left standing, not enough to secure more objectives.
20774
Post by: pretre
 Kroothawk wrote: pretre wrote:Minx wrote:No, if you are speculating as a rumour monger and marking it clearly you are obviously not saying "This is what's coming". Summaries and quotes of said non-rumours sometimes do not contain the same caveat though.
And that's the problem. Like it or not, once you start spouting off rumors people listen to what you have to say. You don't get the luxury of just spouting off because someone's just going to quote you without the caveat and suddenly people are believing that's the next new thing.
With great rumor power comes great rumor responsibility.
Doesn't mean that people are not responsible for making correct quotes.
Doesn't mean that people are not responsible for having obviously false attitudes towards rumours and rumour posters.
Doesn't mean that rumour posters are forbidden to post an opinion or speculation, just because there might be one other poster in the world misinterpreting him.
Sometimes posters have to adapt to the world, not the world to each poster.
Sure, sure. I don't disagree that there is some responsibility for the reader/re-poster.
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Post by: MightyGodzilla
RoninEx said up this thread a bit in regards to Warriors of Chaos. Just thought I would post this as it is semi-related. But it would seem the Warriors of Chaos rumours from Harry and Hastings are that it wont be an army book release but an update wave ala Daemons.
I don't really follow that thread as they're not my thing, but if it's true it wouldn't mess up a DA release, I kind of half thought their release would be towards the end of November beginning of December anyways from what I read here. White Dwarf is trying really hard to avoid sucking so I could see both a DA spoiler and a WoC rules update in next month's edition.
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Post by: Minx
Stickmonkey said it's going to be a December release (pre-order and/or WD pictures in November). So all is well, if the pesky Hobbits don't meddle with things.
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Post by: Brother SRM
I'd be sincerely surprised if The Hobbit wasn't the be all-end all for December, since that's when the actual movie comes out and demand will be highest.
Warriors of Chaos will probably take up the vast majority of their update issue, like Daemons did.
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Post by: Harriticus
MightyGodzilla wrote:If the jetbike thing is a 1, then I hope GW makes their own jetbikes that are closer in form to Sammael's than those flying penises that FW made. Honestly whoever designed those travesties should be pistol whipped.
This is likely, as those jetbike designs are old pre-Heresy stuff. Jetbike tech is more or less a lost art in the Imperium, but SM Forges are still bound to make more modern versions.
Anyway I noticed the rumor about no flyer, I assumed they'd just use Stormtalons...
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Well there is a rumour of the ravenclaw, and its mates the griffindor, hufflepuff and slytherin. A walker, heavy tank and fast vehicle, respectively.
No pretre, do NOT add me to the rumour-mongers.
Since I saw that rumour about jetbikes here a few days ago, I have been chopping up a bike and a BFG cruiser and cobbling them together. A bit long, but not that ugly.
63733
Post by: B3AN
Mathieu Raymond wrote:Well there is a rumour of the ravenclaw, and its mates the griffindor, hufflepuff and slytherin. A walker, heavy tank and fast vehicle, respectively.
No pretre, do NOT add me to the rumour-mongers.
Since I saw that rumour about jetbikes here a few days ago, I have been chopping up a bike and a BFG cruiser and cobbling them together. A bit long, but not that ugly.
I'd like to see that WIP. Post it man! 
20774
Post by: pretre
Mathieu Raymond wrote:Well there is a rumour of the ravenclaw, and its mates the griffindor, hufflepuff and slytherin. A walker, heavy tank and fast vehicle, respectively.
No pretre, do NOT add me to the rumour-mongers.
Since I saw that rumour about jetbikes here a few days ago, I have been chopping up a bike and a BFG cruiser and cobbling them together. A bit long, but not that ugly.
Added! Lol.
Do not field Dumbledore against a Slytherin. Snape missiles pretty much take you out immediately.
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
So keep in mind that the BFG cruiser has been in my collection for a while. I have been scouring the net for more, but haven't been able to find any NIB.
I'm of two minds about it: one the one hand, I like the no-nonsense look of it right now, but it on the other hand, it doesn't scream ravenwing.
I have a slew of assault cannons, I could add some, too.
3
31456
Post by: Bolognesus
Mathieu Raymond wrote:So keep in mind that the BFG cruiser has been in my collection for a while. I have been scouring the net for more, but haven't been able to find any NIB.
...that looks like the 'vanilla' imperial cruiser kit - which is still available, new, from GW itself.
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Yes, at their usual cutthroat prices. I'd actually settle for built ones, tbh, but even those go for quite a price on eBay.
61627
Post by: KalashnikovMarine
So the AA dread? Isn't that just a Mortis dread?
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Well, it might be, or it might be limited by the application of the skyfire rule. If it requires 6s to hit ground units... it might not make it into my list. I would rather have a regular mortis dread, and flak missile equipped devastators.
11
Post by: ph34r
Mathieu Raymond wrote:I'm of two minds about it: one the one hand, I like the no-nonsense look of it right now, but it on the other hand, it doesn't scream ravenwing.
Uh, yeah, it currently screams "I am sitting on a Mars class cruiser". Have you considered removing the obvious macro cannons, fighter bays, etc.?
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
It's actually a Dictator, but I don't want to sound pedantic.
I was actually thinking about shortening the front end by one section. I actually enjoy the look of the fighter bays, as massive air intakes for the jet engine. Macro cannons, not so much. I might cut it off. What about the back? I have some of the feathered poles, but should I? I just don't know.
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Post by: B3AN
Mathieu Raymond wrote:It's actually a Dictator, but I don't want to sound pedantic.
I was actually thinking about shortening the front end by one section. I actually enjoy the look of the fighter bays, as massive air intakes for the jet engine. Macro cannons, not so much. I might cut it off. What about the back? I have some of the feathered poles, but should I? I just don't know.
Its a WIP, it won't always look like a SM riding his favorite childhood toy Dictator.
Any rate, I think it has lots of potential to be awesome. You should open a thread for this WIP so I can Sub.
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Post by: davethepak
Umm....
I actually like it. Kind of clever, very gothic....in fact, kind of cool.
However, shouldn't that be in one of the modeling threads?
Just askin....
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Post by: B3AN
He had mentioned that he was working on that, so I asked him to post his WIP. Because it was relevant to the thread talking about jet bikes. Sorry if you disagree, blame me if you wish.
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Post by: davethepak
No blame really....just an observation that the thread had gone a bit...on a tangent.
Perhaps think of it as me saying that I think the bike IS neat enough of a WIP to deserve its own thread in another forum?
Anyway....back to DA....
As a guy enamored with bikes - I am very interested in a new DA dex. I am curious as to what jet bikes would bring ....over bikes and at what cost (yes, I know tactically what they bring...).
I already have a sizable investment in bikes (oh, you don't want to know...) I welcome new stuff...but also am not always fond of the recent trend to make the newer models the best units in a dex.
I am however, especially interested new bike options, possible jet bike units (command squad? vets only?) and a new flyer/speeder thing...
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
I'd like to see jetbikes replace the attack bike or have a bunch of them in lieu of the landspeeder in the ravenwing assault squadron. Keep the support squadron full of landspeeder goodness.
A single jetbike with either a heavy bolter of multi-melta, just like it is right now, but with a single wound to compensate for the added mobility.
Then a few jetbikes with assault cannons, for some serious suppression fire.
48019
Post by: Cyrax
Stickmonkey wrote:Troops:
Terminators
Tactical squad
Ravenwing Bike squad not sure how it differs from ravenwing assault squad. Current attack squadron 6 bikes 1 attack bike and a Land Speeder
FA:
Ravenwing assault squad
Ravenwing support squad Current support squad, 5 Land Speeders
Assault marines
Ravenclaw air superiority fighter
I believe Ravenwing assault squadron will be full jetbikes with min 3 max 5 or 10.
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
But jetbikes would count as scoring units? I don't seem them as a valid way of holding ground. I'm interested in your rationale though.
48019
Post by: Cyrax
Stickmonkey mentions three types of ravenwing: bike squad in the troops, assault and support in the FA. I assume support squadron is the same full Land Speeder squadron and the bike squadron is the current attack squadron. Therefore the assault squadron should be the one with the jetbikes, it also fits the knight theme. I don't understand your question about the objective holding, can you clarify?
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
Stickmonkey wrote:Just a bit to clarify, as people are getting wild here...
Ravenwing Bike Squad (new troops marine bike squadRON of unknown composition)
Ravenwing Assault Squad (Seems to be the existing attack squadRON, i.e. 3 bikes base, add up to 3 bikes, add attack bike add landspeeder)
Ravenwing Support Squad (Seems to be the existing support squadRON i.e. up to 5 landspeeders)
None of these are even remotely space marines on bikes with jump packs.
And no one has said anything about any of these units being jetbikes.
Also no confirmation names are changing, from "attack" to "assault", just reported to me as "assault"
Cheers.
48019
Post by: Cyrax
That's a bummer. So is jetbike rumor false or for another unit?
15717
Post by: Backfire
Good, whole jetbike thing would have been silly.
15115
Post by: Brother SRM
I don't think jetbikes were ever anything beyond wishlisting and conjecture based on Sammael.
62229
Post by: Minx
Notice how SM did not confirm or deny jetbikes. His sources have just not seen or heard about them.
Edit: I wouldn't really hold my breath for them though
32907
Post by: Nvs
In a codex where bikers and terminators are now expected to be troops, you'd expect an 'elite' version of the two to still exist to further enforce the ideas behind the ravenwing and deathwing. I'm sorry, but just making bikers and terminators troops isn't enough in my opinion. Even if the goal is to move away from deathwing/ravenwing lists and back to dark angels lists, you'd still expect terminators and bikers to stand out in a DA list more than in Space Wolves or even Grey Knights.
Jetbikes would certainly do that. 'Jousting' Knights on bikes may do it too if we're to believe an assault squadron is designed around assaulting bikes. Especially with the new power lance and chariot rules. But a plasma cannon toting terminator? Going to need more than that.
15717
Post by: Backfire
As a Dark Angel player, I want to play Dark Angels. I'm not interested playing special-toys-bells-whistles-chapter which tries to be 'different' for sake of it. If I wanted that, I'd play Grey Knights or Space Wolves.
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
 Cyrax wrote:Stickmonkey mentions three types of ravenwing: bike squad in the troops, assault and support in the FA. I assume support squadron is the same full Land Speeder squadron and the bike squadron is the current attack squadron. Therefore the assault squadron should be the one with the jetbikes, it also fits the knight theme. I don't understand your question about the objective holding, can you clarify?
It seems to be moot as the whole jetbike thing seems to have been kabashed, but here goes:
If there were going to be jetbikes, and those were going to be available as troops, would it not be weird, since troops are usually used to secure objectives, and jetbikes do not seem very well suited for that role. A real life example: None of the speeder bikes in Return of the Jedi were really able to hold prisoners, or even a position for a long time.
Yes, that was humour. Sorry.
But since it would make more sense to have as either elite, fast attack, or not at all it seems, they I withdraw my objection, ladies and gentlemen of the court.
33735
Post by: White Ninja
Agreed a guy on a normally bike can be expected to actually hold a objective or location by getting off of the bike should the need arise. If a jet bike is super rare and impossible to recreate they would risk losing the objective normally over losing the bike. The idea of jetbike troops really seem like wish listing and cool as it might be Im not sure I would like it.
53623
Post by: Ronin_eX
Well, that is the thing. StickMonkey is a pretty good rumour-monger, but if we go to the rumour-tracking thread his hit rate is on the fair side of 50/50. So depending on where most of his rumours are coming from (assuming multiple sources and equal distribution from them) half of what he is reporting may be inaccurate (and he makes sure to point this out in his own posts). Despite conducting himself like a jackass, TastyTaste has pretty good track record (though a ton pending right now may upshift or downshift that by a fair margin). Given that knowledge TT's prediction of Jetbikes is a pretty solid one. We will still need to see, but Tasty is a bit more of a solid source. So if we have to compare and contrast based on track records then the Jetbike is actually looking likely (I had kind of given up on it, so this surprised me).
Could still be a load of bunk, but with Tasty saying something it lends an air of actual credibility to what simply seemed like baseless wishlisting. I suppose we will see.
32683
Post by: Rex-Nine
Up to 5 land speeders in a squad sweet!
48019
Post by: Cyrax
Mathieu Raymond wrote:...If there were going to be jetbikes, and those were going to be available as troops, would it not be weird, since troops are usually used to secure objectives, and jetbikes do not seem very well suited for that role. A real life example: None of the speeder bikes in Return of the Jedi were really able to hold prisoners, or even a position for a long time. ...
I didn't mean jetbikes would be troops. I've falsely assumed 6 bikes+attack bike+Land Speeder formation to be the troops and the assault squadron in the FA to be the jetbikes.
3309
Post by: Flinty
You can do that using the current codex.
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
@Cyrax: alrighty. We were in agreement, I had just misunderstood you.
Imo, it depends if they have a teleporter beacon or not, Sure, they grant T5 to the rider, but I just don't see a squad of them being that über unsupported. Hence I think it might be a bit more wishlisty than based in truth.
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Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
I would wish for them...
Although... It does reek of silliness... As was stated before: Sammael is supposed to have the last existing Imperial jetbike... Sooooooo...
Maybe they'll ret-con it like Hollywood did with Clash of the Titans... Pegasus was the last remaining winged-horse, and Pegasus was his personal name... NOT the name of the herd... Changed to, oh, look there are lots and lots of pegasi... And the stallion looks like a night-mare... Hmmmm...
I would still use them... And be thankful for the cool models...
48019
Post by: Cyrax
Or maybe DA just lied about the existing jetbikes.
20774
Post by: pretre
Ronin_eX wrote:Well, that is the thing. StickMonkey is a pretty good rumour-monger, but if we go to the rumour-tracking thread his hit rate is on the fair side of 50/50. So depending on where most of his rumours are coming from (assuming multiple sources and equal distribution from them) half of what he is reporting may be inaccurate (and he makes sure to point this out in his own posts). Despite conducting himself like a jackass, TastyTaste has pretty good track record (though a ton pending right now may upshift or downshift that by a fair margin). Given that knowledge TT's prediction of Jetbikes is a pretty solid one. We will still need to see, but Tasty is a bit more of a solid source. So if we have to compare and contrast based on track records then the Jetbike is actually looking likely (I had kind of given up on it, so this surprised me).
Could still be a load of bunk, but with Tasty saying something it lends an air of actual credibility to what simply seemed like baseless wishlisting. I suppose we will see.
Take a look at Tasty's longterm predictions. They are really low. Whereas Stickmonkey is about 50/50 on longterm. TT is boosted by him having the Chaos codex 3 months early and posting a ton of stuff from it. I still consider Stickmonkey's longterm better than Tasty's.
49272
Post by: Testify
I guess this has been answered already but what's with this:
The new major unit for Dark Angels is something Games Workshop is currently in court over over with a certain other company that already made them. If that doesn’t ring a bell, let me say it is a unit that perhaps only the Masters of the 2nd Companies would know about.
What does that mean?
11
Post by: ph34r
 Testify wrote:I guess this has been answered already but what's with this:
The new major unit for Dark Angels is something Games Workshop is currently in court over over with a certain other company that already made them. If that doesn’t ring a bell, let me say it is a unit that perhaps only the Masters of the 2nd Companies would know about.
What does that mean?
It implies jetbikes. It seems like most people consider the inclusion of a unit of jetbikes at this point to be extremely unlikely.
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Post by: Volkov
I have been playing Ravenwing as my main army since 2nd edition, and I would give my left testicle for jetbikes
24020
Post by: vitki
I'd give your left testicle for some jetbikes too. 
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Mine are useless, so if you're looking for spares ones, let me know.
GW is greedy, after all.
63733
Post by: B3AN
Mathieu Raymond wrote:Mine are useless, so if you're looking for spares ones, let me know.
GW is greedy, after all.
Um...phrasing? lol Useless what... 
61627
Post by: KalashnikovMarine
In anticipation of the glorious new codex for the sons of Caliban I did a quick Mortis dread conversion.
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Post by: B3AN
Where did you get the AC's and Iconography? FW?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, maybe PM me with that answer as to keep the thread rumor "focused"? lol
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Post by: AlmightyWalrus
The iconography is from any random vehicle kit and the "torso" looks like the one from AoBR. The Autocannons look like thye're from the Aegis Defence Line, but I'm not sure.
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Don't be afraid to understand correctly. I did mean my testicles!
Now that everyone is grossed out...
KM: you are a man after my heart. After 2 Mortis conversion, I can't get over how cool they look. And effective on the battlefield, to boot.
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Post by: KalashnikovMarine
 AlmightyWalrus wrote:The iconography is from any random vehicle kit and the "torso" looks like the one from AoBR. The Autocannons look like thye're from the Aegis Defence Line, but I'm not sure.
It is in fact the AOBR dread, iconography was lifted from a Dark Angels Ravenwing Upgrade Sprue and a venerable dread kit, the Autocannons are an unknown, I bought this dread (unmodified) off of the Swap shop and it came with these arms. They are not GW or Forge World though. The missile launcher is from the Sentinel kit and the reason it's on there is because I misread the wargear listing for a Mortis dread. *facepalm* looks cool though, so it stays.
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Post by: Son 0f Dorn
Fresh news, everybody! A new character entry for Cypher has been spotted today! You can find it at Apocalypse40k
39575
Post by: Darkseid
IIRC Cypher lost his c'tan phase knife in the fluff and rules a while back. I'm reluctant to believe that this scan is legit.
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Post by: Son 0f Dorn
It's not a scan, it's a photo. And BL is not cannon. Even if it were, GW could just use a version of him the day before he lost it if they chose. Everything's subject to change if it suits their needs; just ask the Newcrons.
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Post by: Compel
Remember, there is no canon, though there are plenty of cannons.
"Everything you have been told is a lie."
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Post by: Darkseid
 Son 0f Dorn wrote:It's not a scan, it's a photo. And BL is not cannon. Even if it were, GW could just use a version of him the day before he lost it if they chose. Everything's subject to change if it suits their needs; just ask the Newcrons.
Sure it is a photo; but that is not the point.
While Retcons are always possilbe; the story was published in the WD as were the rules.
39277
Post by: Son 0f Dorn
Compel wrote:Remember, there is no canon, though there are plenty of cannons.
"Everything you have been told is a lie."
Autocorrect, my nemesis.
Darkseid wrote: Son 0f Dorn wrote:It's not a scan, it's a photo. And BL is not cannon. Even if it were, GW could just use a version of him the day before he lost it if they chose. Everything's subject to change if it suits their needs; just ask the Newcrons.
Sure it is a photo; but that is not the point.
While Retcons are always possilbe; the story was published in the WD as were the rules.
Well I suppose it's all beside the point. I'm not here to sell it to you, but just to present it as something intesting. I've spoken to the guy who took the photo and have no reason to believe he's lying and it also fits with November release rumors. So, there it is for those who choose to take it or leave it.
39575
Post by: Darkseid
Son 0f Dorn wrote:
Well I suppose it's all beside the point. I'm not here to sell it to you, but just to present it as something intesting. I've spoken to the guy who took the photo and have no reason to believe he's lying and it also fits with November release rumors. So, there it is for those who choose to take it or leave it.
Anyway, assumed this is a GW product, how come it's supposedly only availabe in spain and through which medium? WD?
Also Cypher has quite some stats, seems that GW decided that he is indeed more than just a space marine.
4001
Post by: Compel
So, is that from the Chaos book or Dark Angels one?
Cause, Dark Angels would be... interesting.
48019
Post by: Cyrax
WS-7 BS-8 S-5 T-5 W-3 I-7 A-3 Ld-10 S 2+
Special Rules: Independent Character, Deep Strike, Eternal Warrior, Hit&Run, Fleet.
Equipment: Artificer armour, Master crafted Bolt pistol and Plasma pistol, Frag and Krak grenades, C'tan Knife.
C'tan Knife: Melee weapon, bearer's S, AP 3, Instant Death
An interesting point from that page:
"This character is only valid in Spain for 2 months after the publication date (September 2012). If you want to use him in a non-GW event, consult the TO for permission."
So, we have mention of the same Stone of Infernal Fire which sounds a lot like the Hellfire Stone from Dark Vengeance. We also see that this character entry is only valid until the month of November, when the new Dark Angels codex is expected to drop. Looks like a form of confirmation to me, and one can't help but wonder what this means for GW. Is this for a specific event? Or could they be using new units in test markets? Some big implications there... Either way, we'll know for certain in a month!
61627
Post by: KalashnikovMarine
Seems like a special event to me. I suppose we'll have to see if he's in the codex when it drops.
63733
Post by: B3AN
So if Cypher is indeed a solid release, does this mean that there might be rules to build and play a "Fallen" army included in the DA Codex? Why the hell would he be in it if there wasn't?
62229
Post by: Minx
from warseer: "Photoshop to look professional and used to demo dark vengeance in a store. The person who "leaked" this says it was laying out in a GW store, the store owner let him take a picture, and then told the guy they made it for use in their local game. I'm not sure how any of that constitutes a DA rumor." <- so it has nothing to do with the upcoming 'dex?
63733
Post by: B3AN
Minx wrote:from warseer: "Photoshop to look professional and used to demo dark vengeance in a store. The person who "leaked" this says it was laying out in a GW store, the store owner let him take a picture, and then told the guy they made it for use in their local game. I'm not sure how any of that constitutes a DA rumor." <- so it has nothing to do with the upcoming 'dex?
A valid point. Has anyone heard ANYTHING new that actually constitutes as a rumor? I'm dying for some solid material here!
48019
Post by: Cyrax
via Faeit 212 (a Must Remain Anonymous Source)
Cypher was going to be the bonus model in the Dark Vengeance Limited Edition set.
There was additional fluff that involved how he set up the events.
The model was replaced with the Interrogator chaplain and the fluff portions removed.
It's not a leak, it's not a fake, it's just something that went nowhere.
http://natfka.blogspot.co.uk/2012/10/the-truth-behind-cypher-leak-revealed.html#more
63587
Post by: Rysaer
Y U Crush My Dreams?
I'm still holding out in hope, He'll be in the new book..... god I hope he is in the new book
13937
Post by: BrassScorpion
A valid point. Has anyone heard ANYTHING new that actually constitutes as a rumor? I'm dying for some solid material here!
It won't be long now (just a week or two depending on the next White Dwarf release date) till we know for sure from GW what is coming November. There certainly are a lot of rumors about what GW is releasing in November, including some Warriors of Chaos and possibly Dark Angels as most people have seen by now. Here's the only thing certain so far about The Hobbit and December in the GW official statement below, so maybe we are getting something cool for a Warhammer system in November. I wonder how well this product for The Hobbit will do. It's been about 2 years since GW had a major release for the LotR related game systems. When Fellowship of the Ring was in theaters GW was selling their related gaming product in high profile massive chain stores like Borders Books, but Borders is sadly gone now and who knows if any large chains will give GW product that kind of exposure this time around. -------------------------------------------------------- From a recent GW financial statement the CEO declared: "What I can say is that we will release some amazing products this year. Products that will surprise and delight Hobbyists. We plan to do so every month, including December 2012 when we will release our new Hobbit range to coincide with the film. And... ahh, but that would spoil the surprise. You will just have to wait and see. You will not be disappointed." from http://investor.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Preliminary-announcement-2012-final.pdf
36276
Post by: Zweischneid
 BrassScorpion wrote:A valid point. Has anyone heard ANYTHING new that actually constitutes as a rumor? I'm dying for some solid material here!
It won't be long now (just a week or two depending on the next White Dwarf release date) till we know for sure from GW what is coming December.
There certainly are a lot of rumors about what GW is releasing in November, including some Warriors of Chaos and possibly Dark Angels as most people have seen by now.
Here's the only thing certain so far about The Hobbit and December in the GW official statement below, so maybe we are getting something cool for a Warhammer system in November. I wonder how well this product for The Hobbit will do. It's been about 2 years since GW had a major release for the LotR related game systems. When Fellowship of the Ring was in theaters GW was selling their related gaming product in high profile massive chain stores like Borders Books, but Borders is sadly gone now and who knows if any large chains will give GW product that kind of exposure this time around.
--------------------------------------------------------
From a recent GW financial statement the CEO declared:
"What I can say is that we will release some amazing products this year. Products that will surprise and delight Hobbyists. We plan to do so every month, including December 2012 when we will release our new Hobbit range to coincide with the film. And... ahh, but that would spoil the surprise. You will just have to wait and see. You will not be disappointed."
from http://investor.games-workshop.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/07/Preliminary-announcement-2012-final.pdf
Sure sounds good for the Hobbit. But I am increasingly doubtful that they'll be able to squeeze Dark Angels into it somewhere.
63733
Post by: B3AN
See why wouldn't they release them both? Is there alot of players out there who collect BOTH SM and LoTR? I'm not sure there is. I would say they could release both at the same time. I know that DA players who are waiting for the new codex could give two #@$!'s about the Hobbit minis. Just saying.
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Actually, more like three #@$! at this point.
32831
Post by: brothernoah
Just saw a cypher model on GW. Should add some weight to the rumors.
49371
Post by: Benamint
Cypher was always on the website....
36276
Post by: Zweischneid
Yeah. Cypher was always there. Way back in the day, he also had rules. According to Faeit212, the pics of Cypher were the original "limited edition" figure for the limited edition Dark Vengeance that, eventually, was replaced with the Chaplain.
On an other note, if they really/ever do an "allies-supplement/expansion", I think GW could really use the allies rules to make Cypher work. Use Cypher as HQ for an allied detachment for your Chaos Space Marines (and, possibly others, Dark Eldar? Eldar?) and you might unlock a limited list of (non-Death Wing, non Ravenwing) units from Dark Angels (e.g. Fallen Angels) to ally with in ways that is normally prohibited by the "standard allies chart".
686
Post by: aka_mythos
If GW does an Allies supplement for 40k I'm more inclined to believe that they'd actually have a unit entry for Fallen Angels than just say "use "x" unit from "y" codex... even if that unit is just a preselected combination of chaos space marines plus veterans of the long war or some such.
32354
Post by: Yojiro
Out of curiosity, any clue on who's writing the DA codex?
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
It's a secret ... a dark secret
32354
Post by: Yojiro
As long as it's not... He-Who-Shall-Not-Be-Named...
64808
Post by: CIsaac
 Yojiro wrote:
As long as it's not... He-Who-Shall-Not-Be-Named...
Not Lord Cypher-mort!
32354
Post by: Yojiro
Let it not be so! I wouldn't like to see Cypher becoming a warp entity that suddenly pops out of the warp to "help" the DA's... or have Jetpack-using terminators, who will have Angel claws and Angel hammers and Angel Shields and veterans that carry master-crafted Angel pistols.
Away with you, Cypher-mort!
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
Mat Moldeward
51383
Post by: Experiment 626
NO Kroothawk, the name's been Tabooed!!! Now you just ensured You-Know-Who will destroy it!
61931
Post by: barit
So in fear of naming the one-who-shall-not-be-named... is he actually writing it?
49922
Post by: furbyballer
well there aren't that many 40k writers and we know its not Kelly so there is a better chance its him.
4183
Post by: Davor
Cruddence perchance? Hope mot, didnt like how he handled tyranids. I think I will take matt sard over cruddence. Sob nuf said.
16457
Post by: Ronin
I keep hearing Jeremy Vetock all over the place (forums, blogs, etc). Seems likely to me, but we wont know til the book is in our hands.
42149
Post by: MightyGodzilla
It'd be nice if some of those Oct 19th combo kits were DA based.
63733
Post by: B3AN
This is the first I have heard of these combo kits. Either I missed a comment on the thread or I'm forgetting. Could you elaborate a bit on this Mighty? Much appreciated.
41664
Post by: ShatteredBlade
Don't care who writes it, so long as DA gets an update
63733
Post by: B3AN
Don't say that HE might hear you! lol
I didn't experience the "he-who-shall-not-be-named" incident. However, I have heard plenty about it. My ONLY hope for this codex is that it is NOT a "beta" test for nilla SM Codex. That would be just awful. To get something amazing like Re-rolls for "Get's Hot" and new Plasma weapon variants for vehicles only to see them go to the SM Codex. I would make a Fallen Angel CSM army if that happened.
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
GhostOfCaliban wrote:
This is the first I have heard of these combo kits. Either I missed a comment on the thread or I'm forgetting. Could you elaborate a bit on this Mighty? Much appreciated.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/483354.page
We will see if it turns out true.
32354
Post by: Yojiro
No, no. Just... no.
I don't want GK 2.0 to be my beloved chapter's codex 
36303
Post by: Puscifer
From the rumours I've been hearing in the ether regarding the disturbing power of the DA, I think it might be Matt Ward.
I kid you not.
42808
Post by: Marthike
Yojiro wrote:
No, no. Just... no.
I don't want GK 2.0 to be my beloved chapter's codex
I do. As long there is a update then I don't care as long as its slightly less OP than necron, GK is ok.
20774
Post by: pretre
from Faeit:
Poxy Proxy Predator wrote:
CODEX DARK ANGEL NEWS!!
Couple of weeks ago I asked a guy on Facebook who has inside links at gw, he just got back to me saying Ward is doing The Dark Angel Codex.
Some random guy heard it on Facebook!
60720
Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured
Hey don't knock it
stick random facebook guy on the rumour tracking thread
20774
Post by: pretre
I was probably going to leave him off since it was a pile on.
Just for giggles though...
43845
Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
I can see it all now***
From a very young age, El'Johnson, known as the Lion, held a deep feeling of regret... Remorse even... Having not been born to be an Ultra... So he set out a master plan to fool everyone...
His mentor, Luther, schemed with him... Luther would stay behind, on Caliban, to lure the forces of Chaos there... And when the Lion returned, the two worked furiously to blow up the planet, and kill the Lion... Leaving his sons to fend for themselves in a cold, dark galaxy... In hopes that Guilliman would take pity on the miserable wretches known as the Dark Angels, and allow them entry into his hallowed legion...
32354
Post by: Yojiro
 Skipphag da Devoura wrote:I can see it all now***
From a very young age, El'Johnson, known as the Lion, held a deep feeling of regret... Remorse even... Having not been born to be an Ultra... So he set out a master plan to fool everyone...
His mentor, Luther, schemed with him... Luther would stay behind, on Caliban, to lure the forces of Chaos there... And when the Lion returned, the two worked furiously to blow up the planet, and kill the Lion... Leaving his sons to fend for themselves in a cold, dark galaxy... In hopes that Guilliman would take pity on the miserable wretches known as the Dark Angels, and allow them entry into his hallowed legion...
That, good ser, sounds just about right for Matt Ward.
320
Post by: Platuan4th
Yojiro wrote: Skipphag da Devoura wrote:I can see it all now*** From a very young age, El'Johnson, known as the Lion, held a deep feeling of regret... Remorse even... Having not been born to be an Ultra... So he set out a master plan to fool everyone... His mentor, Luther, schemed with him... Luther would stay behind, on Caliban, to lure the forces of Chaos there... And when the Lion returned, the two worked furiously to blow up the planet, and kill the Lion... Leaving his sons to fend for themselves in a cold, dark galaxy... In hopes that Guilliman would take pity on the miserable wretches known as the Dark Angels, and allow them entry into his hallowed legion...
That, good ser, sounds just about right for Matt Ward.
Get over it. If the Fluff Master of the studio who makes sure all books conform to the direction of the fluff that they want let Ward's stuff through, then that's what the Studio wanted. No ONE author has entire control of a book. Blame the studio as a whole for the new retcons, not Ward.
43845
Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
I didn't actually lay the blame anywhere... Was just making a jest...
Much in the light of the Ostrogoths...
They now claim to be descendants of the Guilliman...
36944
Post by: VardenV2
GhostOfCaliban wrote:
Don't say that HE might hear you! lol
I didn't experience the "he-who-shall-not-be-named" incident. However, I have heard plenty about it. My ONLY hope for this codex is that it is NOT a "beta" test for nilla SM Codex. That would be just awful. To get something amazing like Re-rolls for "Get's Hot" and new Plasma weapon variants for vehicles only to see them go to the SM Codex. I would make a Fallen Angel CSM army if that happened.
I have a terrible feeling this is exactly what is going to happen. I HOPE that they get enough unique things to separate them from SM as much as say, Blood Angels have. In core terms, they are the same as SM they just have a little twist in some areas. Just like with 4th to 5th., i fear that both CSM and the DA may become the guinea pig/standard for which other 6th edition codexes will be measured against. This means that most likely, cool things like relic blades, characters, terminator troops, bike troops etc will be given as "unlockables" to regular are SM bc "Hey, why do they get cool stuff and we can't :( *pouty face*"
I seriopusly hope that they give a lot of cool unique stuff to DA that is GOOD as opposed to just cool. I feel that a lot of the creative new units keep getting overlooked because a lot of the better stuff is just gonna be DW/ RW which is what we already have (although they are pretty badass).
I want my codex to be good, unique, not OP, and not be retconed for stupid reasons or to incorporate mediocre models and rules. Here's hoping. I am excited nonetheless but mostly because I want DA to go back to how they should be instead of a minor laughing stock of the SM codices.
-VardenV2
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Post by: Platuan4th
Sorry, wasn't aimed at you, but at the Ward hate in general. The constant, petty, childish complaining is getting exceedingly tiresome, especially since, like any creative industry, no one person makes every single decision.
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Post by: pretre
Platuan4th wrote:Sorry, wasn't aimed at you, but at the Ward hate in general. The constant, petty, childish complaining is getting exceedingly tiresome, especially since, like any creative industry, no one person makes every single decision.
Seconded! Take the Ward crap to one of the 5 different threads on it somewhere on this board and leave the rumors threads alone.
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Post by: KalashnikovMarine
pretre wrote: Platuan4th wrote:Sorry, wasn't aimed at you, but at the Ward hate in general. The constant, petty, childish complaining is getting exceedingly tiresome, especially since, like any creative industry, no one person makes every single decision.
Seconded! Take the Ward crap to one of the 5 different threads on it somewhere on this board and leave the rumors threads alone.
Thirded! Motion passed! and be sure to attend the annual Dakka Burning of Matt Ward in Effigy for the Evils He Has Committed Upon Us In Hopes For a Bountiful Harvest potluck and chili cook off next week!
In actual news I'm getting fairly nervous about the codex coming out any time soon at all...
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Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
Faeit just posted to BoLS... Ward is the writer... and Jetbikes.
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Post by: dkoz
Pretty new to 40K who is this Ward guy and why do so many people seem to hate him?
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Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Care to provide a linky-link?
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Post by: pretre
dkoz wrote:Pretty new to 40K who is this Ward guy and why do so many people seem to hate him?
Do a quick search.
The Faeit rumor was posted a page or so back.
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Post by: Brother SRM
dkoz wrote:Pretty new to 40K who is this Ward guy and why do so many people seem to hate him?
Don't even bother looking. It's mostly a bunch of overblown nerd whining and frankly not worth your time.
I'll add that Mat Ward is likely the author to the OP.
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Post by: Rakeeb
Welp, time to buy a Dark Angels army so that I can rule the meta.
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Post by: Neronoxx
So. Much. Griping.
Seriously, i think most people have just scapegoated ward. His codexes are fine. There are worse books.
And hey, his are fun and interesting.
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Post by: Thanatos73
Rules wise I never had a problem with Ward's books, they're interesting if a bit overpowered in areas. Certainly nothing to hate him about.
His fluff is very hit or miss though, with some being okay and some being utterly horrible.
One thing that does bother me are his naming of wargear. I certainly don't want Dark or Angel attached to half the items in the book. Dark Fists or anything the like, although annoying do not make me hate the author.
Jetbikes would be awesome though!
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Post by: B3AN
Thanks Kroot!
Also, anyone have a link to the so called BoLS comment made about Ward writing the codex and the confirmed Jet Bikes?
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Post by: d-usa
 Thanatos73 wrote:
One thing that does bother me are his naming of wargear. I certainly don't want Dark or Angel attached to half the items in the book.
I for one welcome our new Dark Angel overlords, wearing their angel armor and smiting enemies with their dark swords and angel-fire rounds and dark plasma cannons.
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Post by: B3AN
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2012/10/40k-rumors-dark-angels-author-is.html
Here it is. I got off my lazy butt and looked it up lol. Ok...well...I didn't ACTUALLY get up.
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Post by: Macok
Thanatos73 wrote:One thing that does bother me are his naming of wargear. I certainly don't want Dark or Angel attached to half the items in the book.
Sure sure, because Kelly and his Canis Wolfborn, Lord of the Wolfkin riding his Thunder wolf armed with Wolftooth Necklace, Wolf tail talisman, two Wolf claws, Saga of the Wolfkin who can be accompanied by Fenrisian wolves is so much better... His entry also has a note reminding us he is in fact "THE WOLF KING".
Yes, it's 10 uses of 'wolf' for just one guy.
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Post by: Souleater
Except Kelly wasn't the originator of some of those terms - they existed for years previously.
His additions didn't help, I grant you, but he didn't start it. But having seen how bad that was surely Blood Angels could have steered away from the names.
I am betting a cybercookie on 'Plasma Blades'.
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Post by: Macok
Agreed, but.. neither was Ward. Yet somehow it's his fault even if BA and GK don't suffer from this syndrome as much as SW. Necrons seem to avoid this problem completely.
When book signed by MW does something it's his fault. When some other name is on the cover and the book does the same thing much, much worse the author is being excused.
I'm not defending everything he does but this particular instance is not justified by any means.
Often Space Marine chapter's armoury has stupid, repetitive unmatched naming convention. It's not his trademark. That's WH40k Totally Unique Space Marine Wargear Syndrome ( TM).
I call your 'Plasma Blades' and raise you 'Plasma Claws'
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Post by: MightyGodzilla
So we're hearing tbat Ward is the author. No updated word on th release date? Hoping to see something about it in the next WD. Truth be told I'm totally jonsing to read it and buy the new stuff. Dark/Caliban Green crack....and I wants me some.
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Post by: whoadirty
We should start to see leaked WD pages any day now, shouldn't we?
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Post by: Brother SRM
Don't forget the other overpowered Mat Ward rulebooks, Codex: Space Marines and Warhammer Orcs and Goblins! Those both practically broke the meta in half!
Oh wait they didn't. Shut up and stop your complaining about who may or may not be writing the codex. When it comes out we can judge whether it's on the level, overpowered, underpowered, or whatever else you think it may be. We can even start the same repetitive and boring conversations about how X author does Y. Until then, hold your breath.
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Post by: Quintinus
Brother SRM wrote:Don't forget the other overpowered Mat Ward rulebooks, Codex: Space Marines and Warhammer Orcs and Goblins! Those both practically broke the meta in half! Oh wait they didn't. Shut up and stop your complaining about who may or may not be writing the codex. When it comes out we can judge whether it's on the level, overpowered, underpowered, or whatever else you think it may be. We can even start the same repetitive and boring conversations about how X author does Y. Until then, hold your breath.
Codex Marines "new and improved" Stormshields did screw up things for a while, you really need to work on your sarcasm. And let's not forget the other Warhammer Fantasy book by that same author which didn't just break the meta in half, but completely annihilated it. In any case, this is just rich. I'm sure my Dark Angel friend will enjoy his new overpowered codex at any rate haha Time to break out the Vendettas! Though at least the Dark Angel book will have some cool new units. I like the sound of the Inner Circle dudes.
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Post by: ShatteredBlade
I just up he doesn't screw the fluff. His rules are strong, this I will give him. But if Dark Angels are super saved by Guilliman and look up to him like the Blood Angels, erf.
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Post by: Davor
Come on guys go to general for the matt ward talk. At this rate this thread will be locked since its all about matt ward now. We already have a thread about him, move it over there please.
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Post by: djones520
Brother SRM wrote:Don't forget the other overpowered Mat Ward rulebooks, Codex: Space Marines and Warhammer Orcs and Goblins! Those both practically broke the meta in half!
Oh wait they didn't. Shut up and stop your complaining about who may or may not be writing the codex. When it comes out we can judge whether it's on the level, overpowered, underpowered, or whatever else you think it may be. We can even start the same repetitive and boring conversations about how X author does Y. Until then, hold your breath.
Irony much? Complaining quite a bit about people complaining.
I don't like the way Matt Ward writes a codex. His recent history of it has made me real leery about starting DA up, even though I was once gung ho about it. Who are you to tell me to shut up about voicing my concerns about it?
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Post by: Soss
I have to say that I am pleased to hear that Mard Ward is writing our codex. I was worried that some other unnamed person was going to try to take on the Dark Angels. With Ward, at least we can be assured of haveing a competitive codex, even if the fluff isn't the greatest. Lets just hope that he tones it down a little.
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Post by: Brother SRM
djones520 wrote: Who are you to tell me to shut up about voicing my concerns about it?
I'm someone who is as tired as everyone else should be of this irritating circle of whining about Mat Ward we've been having since 2010.
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Post by: djones520
Brother SRM wrote:djones520 wrote: Who are you to tell me to shut up about voicing my concerns about it?
I'm someone who is as tired as everyone else should be of this irritating circle of whining about Mat Ward we've been having since 2010.
And I'm tired of the people whining about people who complain about it. You read through some of these threads, they seem to outnumber the people who dislike Ward.
That being said, in discussion forums people are going to discuss things, especially things they don't like. Yelling at them and telling them to shut up just puts you in the bad territory though. You don't wanna read it, then just move along.
Then again this is the interwebz...
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Post by: Da Mediokre Painta
djones520 wrote: Brother SRM wrote:djones520 wrote: Who are you to tell me to shut up about voicing my concerns about it?
I'm someone who is as tired as everyone else should be of this irritating circle of whining about Mat Ward we've been having since 2010.
And I'm tired of the people whining about people who complain about it. You read through some of these threads, they seem to outnumber the people who dislike Ward.
That being said, in discussion forums people are going to discuss things, especially things they don't like. Yelling at them and telling them to shut up just puts you in the bad territory though. You don't wanna read it, then just move along.
Then again this is the interwebz...
And I'm tired of the people whining about people whining about the people who complain about it. You read through some of these threads, they seem to just enjoy whining about things GW related.
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Post by: Experiment 626
If Ward is writing the DA codex, it will prove to be very, very interesting...
GW has been shifting it's focus to less and less overt power creep, and more options/themeing of lists. Granted it's far more evident in Fantasy since they've now had 5 new edition army books, but the recent CSM codex has pretty much mirrored what's been happening in Fantasy...
Here's hoping we don't get into a system where most books come out balanced with very few (if any) 'no brainer' options, but 2-3 other books keep up the horrendous power creep that ruined 7th ed Fantasy/5th ed 40k.
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Post by: lord_blackfang
Sounds good to me, I'll use this book to run White Scars so I don't care how he butchers the fluff. I'll have cool bikes and jetbikes and flyers, good enough for me.
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Post by: Darkseid
 lord_blackfang wrote:Sounds good to me, I'll use this book to run White Scars so I don't care how he butchers the fluff. I'll have cool bikes and jetbikes and flyers, good enough for me.
There is not a lot to bucher in the first place. Hunt the fallen fluff is an old hat and fairly hard to belive. Inquisition would have been all over these guys looooong ago given their behavior. Ward can only help the DA fluff.
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Post by: MightyGodzilla
Inquisition don't suspect anathing. In 40k land the DA's are on the up and up to everyone but us the readers. They're literally beyond reproach (unless you're a Space Dog), and have got the clout and firepower to lay down the hurt to anyone who would go snooping around. Secrets. Remember? Inquisitors are like the keystone cops.
Now a DA whistleblower who took a walk to Terra and spilled his guts to the capital I and all the ensuing drama between a newly excommunicated chapter and their former brethren.... that'd make for some excellent reading. Oh the explosions...oh the bolter fire!!!Dan Abnett put away your hack HH project and get on that!!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
My original point was that Ward or anyone could ruin the fluff because it really ain't that bad. But we the reader fans may have forgotten that it is pretty much a secret to the 40k universe. We just have gotten almost no story advancement in the last 20 years since the first DA material came out.
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Post by: catharsix
whoadirty wrote:We should start to see leaked WD pages any day now, shouldn't we?
What about Warriors of Chaos? I thought that they were getting a minor release before 40K... Or am I so out of the loop that I missed a something?
C6
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Post by: Brother SRM
 catharsix wrote:whoadirty wrote:We should start to see leaked WD pages any day now, shouldn't we?
What about Warriors of Chaos? I thought that they were getting a minor release before 40K... Or am I so out of the loop that I missed a something?
C6
It's all very up in the air right now, and people aren't ruling out the idea of GW doing two releases in one month. I honestly don't think they will, but we'll know soon I guess.
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Post by: Compel
I wouldn't think it's too unlikely.
I mean, they did basically rerelease all of Lord of the Rings not too long ago.
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Post by: whoadirty
catharsix wrote:whoadirty wrote:We should start to see leaked WD pages any day now, shouldn't we?
What about Warriors of Chaos? I thought that they were getting a minor release before 40K... Or am I so out of the loop that I missed a something?
C6
One of the rumours has been WoC will be a WD update in addition to a DA codex release. Doesn't seem too out there, they could release 2-3 new kits for WoC, and a similar amount for DA. GW only needs to cover the new codex entries for DA, and can release a DW kit later.
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Post by: DakotaBlue
I just can't wait to get the new codex and plasma spam all over the board. Everyone in my city is playing termi armor spam right now, and I want to laugh mallevolent.
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Post by: Yojiro
DakotaBlue wrote:I just can't wait to get the new codex and plasma spam all over the board. Everyone in my city is playing termi armor spam right now, and I want to laugh mallevolent.
Lock and Load, brother! 
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Post by: VardenV2
Yojiro wrote:DakotaBlue wrote:I just can't wait to get the new codex and plasma spam all over the board. Everyone in my city is playing termi armor spam right now, and I want to laugh mallevolent.
Lock and Load, brother!
With this in mind, I don't want it to become Codex: Plasma Marines.
I'm not super stoked about Ward writing the codex as I have always been a more "rule of cool" gamer as opposed to competitive. But that's not to say that I won't enjoy a powerful codex. I just don't want it to be a game-breaking cheesy dex that everyone hates me for playing. Above all I want the fluff to be expanded in a good direction. I don't want it rewritten. I want it to be expanded and added to...not that hard but Mr. Ward could potential muck it up -.-
In addition, I will hate for being seen as a bandwagoner if the dex is good. I have played Dark Angels since 3.5 and always will probably. If it's cheese, it is my well-deserved cheese. If it is like CSM then w/e at least it's not a broken dex and I will still enjoy it. *fingers crossed*
-VardenV2
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Post by: kronk
Well, I guess I can put the DA models that came in the starter set as allies to my chaos when this new book comes out. I can call them Fallen DA.
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Post by: ShatteredBlade
 VardenV2 wrote: Yojiro wrote:DakotaBlue wrote:I just can't wait to get the new codex and plasma spam all over the board. Everyone in my city is playing termi armor spam right now, and I want to laugh mallevolent.
Lock and Load, brother!
With this in mind, I don't want it to become Codex: Plasma Marines.
I'm not super stoked about Ward writing the codex as I have always been a more "rule of cool" gamer as opposed to competitive. But that's not to say that I won't enjoy a powerful codex. I just don't want it to be a game-breaking cheesy dex that everyone hates me for playing. Above all I want the fluff to be expanded in a good direction. I don't want it rewritten. I want it to be expanded and added to...not that hard but Mr. Ward could potential muck it up -.-
In addition, I will hate for being seen as a bandwagoner if the dex is good. I have played Dark Angels since 3.5 and always will probably. If it's cheese, it is my well-deserved cheese. If it is like CSM then w/e at least it's not a broken dex and I will still enjoy it. *fingers crossed*
-VardenV2
I know the feeling. I'm going to blow the dust off my DeathWing models, field them, then promptly get called cheesy most likely.
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Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
 ShatteredBlade wrote: VardenV2 wrote: Yojiro wrote:DakotaBlue wrote:I just can't wait to get the new codex and plasma spam all over the board. Everyone in my city is playing termi armor spam right now, and I want to laugh mallevolent.
Lock and Load, brother!
With this in mind, I don't want it to become Codex: Plasma Marines.
I'm not super stoked about Ward writing the codex as I have always been a more "rule of cool" gamer as opposed to competitive. But that's not to say that I won't enjoy a powerful codex. I just don't want it to be a game-breaking cheesy dex that everyone hates me for playing. Above all I want the fluff to be expanded in a good direction. I don't want it rewritten. I want it to be expanded and added to...not that hard but Mr. Ward could potential muck it up -.-
In addition, I will hate for being seen as a bandwagoner if the dex is good. I have played Dark Angels since 3.5 and always will probably. If it's cheese, it is my well-deserved cheese. If it is like CSM then w/e at least it's not a broken dex and I will still enjoy it. *fingers crossed*
-VardenV2
I know the feeling. I'm going to blow the dust off my DeathWing models, field them, then promptly get called cheesy most likely.
I have a slight advantage in that arena...
My 3k of Angels of Absolution are 2nd ed models... So, if anyone wants to cry about it... I am NOT hoppin' on tha bandwardgon...
Still, if they are cheesy... I'll prolly just play them a few times, and then return them to the shelf.
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Post by: Harriticus
Oh goodey Matt Ward. I can't wait to see what kind of shenanigans they're gonna pull off. In b4 Ezekiel puts Slaanesh in a headlock.
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Post by: VardenV2
 Harriticus wrote:Oh goodey Matt Ward. I can't wait to see what kind of shenanigans they're gonna pull off. In b4 Ezekiel puts Slaanesh in a headlock.
I'd lol. Ezekiel is basically the most useless character to ever exist. A regular librarian is just as good/better because he is cheaper... plus DA powers are pretty crap. Good thing they can take all those Divination powers. Potentially cover ignoring re-rollable plasma spam with bikes... yeah... good night sweet everything.
-VardenV2
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Post by: DaddyWarcrimes
VardenV2 wrote: Harriticus wrote:Oh goodey Matt Ward. I can't wait to see what kind of shenanigans they're gonna pull off. In b4 Ezekiel puts Slaanesh in a headlock.
I'd lol. Ezekiel is basically the most useless character to ever exist. A regular librarian is just as good/better because he is cheaper... plus DA powers are pretty crap. Good thing they can take all those Divination powers. Potentially cover ignoring re-rollable plasma spam with bikes... yeah... good night sweet everything.
-VardenV2
Have you compared Ezekiel to a regular Librarian lately? He's got more wounds, a mastercrafted force weapon, artificer armor to let him laugh at all the AP3 power swords out there, makes nearby units Fearless, and isn't saddled with being an Ld9 psyker. Ezekiel is actually pretty solid for what he does. Load him up with Biomancy powers and let him run wild and you'll be pleased with the results.
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Post by: TheLionOfTheForest
Don't forget his master crafted bolt pistol, that's gold Jerry, gold!
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Post by: Kroothawk
The Aegis over at Warseer wrote:At the Italian Games Day Phil Kelly said that every chapter of space marines is going to have one or more unique unit (like thunderwolf cavalry or sanguinary guard) that differentiate it from other chapters. I don't know if that include codex chapters (like imperial fists or salamanders) or if there will be one for all vanilla chapters and one or more for chapter with their own codex, but it still interesting (New DA special unit?).
Anyway, he also said that SM and BT codex are both far away in the future, so I wouldn't expect them soon.
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Post by: SoloFalcon1138
I've been playing Dark Angels for over two years now. To have Ward rewrite the "hard mode" Space Marine codex into probably the next "OMGWTF its sooooo overpowered" codex will be a nice change. I'll just cut the fluff section out and replace it with the old ones...
Now please, let's keep this thread to actual rumors and not yet another Ward-whine...
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Post by: Absolon
So I was talking to one of my local GW workers and he kind of hinted that the Dark Angels may not be released until the March/April 2013 timeframe. Anyone else hearing anything since it seems that nothing is happening this year
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Post by: Quintinus
 SoloFalcon1138 wrote:I've been playing Dark Angels for over two years now. To have Ward rewrite the "hard mode" Space Marine codex into probably the next "OMGWTF its sooooo overpowered" codex will be a nice change. I'll just cut the fluff section out and replace it with the old ones...
Now please, let's keep this thread to actual rumors and not yet another Ward-whine...
Yeah man it must be so hard having the ability to take Terminator troops with the ability to spam cyclone missile launchers and storm shields. I'll grant you hard mode for everything else though.
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Post by: barit
 Absolon wrote:So I was talking to one of my local GW workers and he kind of hinted that the Dark Angels may not be released until the March/April 2013 timeframe. Anyone else hearing anything since it seems that nothing is happening this year
The world has gone to hell in a hand basket, they better not make us that long - I will judo chop someone out of rage and impatience...
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Post by: KalashnikovMarine
I very much doubt it'll be spring, not after putting DA in the starter set.
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Post by: Absolon
It looks like the release has already slid into 2013, so who knows
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Post by: SoloFalcon1138
 Vladsimpaler wrote: SoloFalcon1138 wrote:I've been playing Dark Angels for over two years now. To have Ward rewrite the "hard mode" Space Marine codex into probably the next "OMGWTF its sooooo overpowered" codex will be a nice change. I'll just cut the fluff section out and replace it with the old ones...
Now please, let's keep this thread to actual rumors and not yet another Ward-whine...
Yeah man it must be so hard having the ability to take Terminator troops with the ability to spam cyclone missile launchers and storm shields. I'll grant you hard mode for everything else though.
Its hard to call it spam when you only get 5 at a time. At least fearless doesn't grind them away anymore...
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Post by: Quintinus
SoloFalcon1138 wrote: Vladsimpaler wrote: SoloFalcon1138 wrote:I've been playing Dark Angels for over two years now. To have Ward rewrite the "hard mode" Space Marine codex into probably the next "OMGWTF its sooooo overpowered" codex will be a nice change. I'll just cut the fluff section out and replace it with the old ones...
Now please, let's keep this thread to actual rumors and not yet another Ward-whine...
Yeah man it must be so hard having the ability to take Terminator troops with the ability to spam cyclone missile launchers and storm shields. I'll grant you hard mode for everything else though.
Its hard to call it spam when you only get 5 at a time. At least fearless doesn't grind them away anymore...
You've still got 6 troop slots. And yeah at least they don't need to worry about melee with stormshields anymore either.
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Post by: Abadabadoobaddon
I am going to laugh so hard when this Ward marine facemelter hits the shelves and the "new balanced direction" exemplified by the new weaksauce CSM codex folks have been touting lasts all of 1 codex release. I predict DA psychic powers will make Tzeentch want to headbutt my dog until they both scream.
Also looking forward to the Secret Fists.
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Post by: Brother SRM
Vladsimpaler wrote:
You've still got 6 troop slots. And yeah at least they don't need to worry about melee with stormshields anymore either.
They're also going for about 250 points per troop slot. Deathwing are solid, but there's nothing else the codex does that other Codices don't do better.
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Post by: SoloFalcon1138
Brother SRM wrote: Vladsimpaler wrote:
You've still got 6 troop slots. And yeah at least they don't need to worry about melee with stormshields anymore either.
They're also going for about 250 points per troop slot. Deathwing are solid, but there's nothing else the codex does that other Codices don't do better.
Except for mixed weaponry and Fearless, Deathwingers are just terminators. But, unlike Grey Knights, we still require a character to unlock them as troops. And, unlike every other Marines codex, our Land Raiders are still stuck exclusively in the Heavy Support slot.
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Post by: whoadirty
Absolon wrote:It looks like the release has already slid into 2013, so who knows
They could still slip them in late November or early December.
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Post by: Absolon
My guess GW has contractually agreed to only release Hobbit stuff in Dec. That would leave a Nov release with no tease or WD support, and I just don't see that happening.
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Post by: Quintinus
SoloFalcon1138 wrote: Brother SRM wrote: Vladsimpaler wrote: You've still got 6 troop slots. And yeah at least they don't need to worry about melee with stormshields anymore either.
They're also going for about 250 points per troop slot. Deathwing are solid, but there's nothing else the codex does that other Codices don't do better.
Except for mixed weaponry and Fearless, Deathwingers are just terminators. But, unlike Grey Knights, we still require a character to unlock them as troops. And, unlike every other Marines codex, our Land Raiders are still stuck exclusively in the Heavy Support slot.
Said character is pretty inexpensive and the fact that he gives you access to FNP for one squad (for an additional cost but not huge) and can have a TH/ SS for free is pretty good. Anyway I'm not denying that you guys are working with an older codex but honestly you guys made it out of 6th not only relatively unscathed but in some ways even stronger, whereas a great many of other armies got weaker due to power weapon nerfs or cover save reductions. I'm just looking forward to my friend who is playing Dark Angels with his new Ward "facemelter" codex (props to Abadabadoobaddon) against my "balanced" Chaos codex.
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Post by: Leth
Someone was saying that at the GD the developers were talking about doing books in sets, so that they were play tested against each other for balance purposes. Something like in a set of three.
If so that should help with a lot of the power creep issues that plagued parts of 5th edition.
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Post by: whoadirty
Absolon wrote:My guess GW has contractually agreed to only release Hobbit stuff in Dec. That would leave a Nov release with no tease or WD support, and I just don't see that happening.
Just because November is including some WoC releases doesn't mean it couldn't also have DA releases. Less likely, but still possible.
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Post by: Ozymandias
 Abadabadoobaddon wrote:I am going to laugh so hard when this Ward marine facemelter hits the shelves and the "new balanced direction" exemplified by the new weaksauce CSM codex folks have been touting lasts all of 1 codex release. I predict DA psychic powers will make Tzeentch want to headbutt my dog until they both scream.
Also looking forward to the Secret Fists.
Weak sauce CSM? Clearly you haven't seen Nurgle marked everything with Epidemius yet...
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Post by: H.B.M.C.
>Doesn't think CSM is weaksauce.
>Mentions a unit from a different Codex to show how it isn't.
>Fails to see the irony of that.
Sorry Ozzy, but pointing out a combination from a different Codex in no way makes CSM a powerful 'Dex and, as always, Doobie is spot on with his comments. I predict that Azreal will give Ahriman a run for his money.
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Post by: Macok
H.B.M.C. wrote:>Doesn't think CSM is weaksauce.
>Mentions a unit from a different Codex to show how it isn't.
>Fails to see the irony of that.
I want to play too.. (not directed at you H)
> Think overpowered codex is bad for gameplay
> Say my codex deserve to be one
Because every other race was powerful all the time so they do not have to be powerful. Special Snowflake Syndrome go!
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Post by: Spartan089
H.B.M.C. wrote:>Doesn't think CSM is weaksauce.
>Mentions a unit from a different Codex to show how it isn't.
>Fails to see the irony of that.
Sorry Ozzy, but pointing out a combination from a different Codex in no way makes CSM a powerful 'Dex and, as always, Doobie is spot on with his comments. I predict that Azreal will give Ahriman a run for his money.
Also not everyone is a nurgle player or willing to take allies, just further highlights the flaws with the book.
I agree...wish Ward had written CSM instead of doing Dark Angels, at least we wouldn't have had the half  excuse we have, broken or not.
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Post by: Abadabadoobaddon
 Ozymandias wrote: Abadabadoobaddon wrote:I am going to laugh so hard when this Ward marine facemelter hits the shelves and the "new balanced direction" exemplified by the new weaksauce CSM codex folks have been touting lasts all of 1 codex release. I predict DA psychic powers will make Tzeentch want to headbutt my dog until they both scream.
Also looking forward to the Secret Fists.
Weak sauce CSM? Clearly you haven't seen Nurgle marked everything with Epidemius yet...
How long until the daemons codex gets redone? Fzorgle is gone. Why would tally survive?
CSM codex was GW basically doubling down on the gavdex. If DA is GW doubling down on the jervisdex I will stand corrected. But for some reason I just can't imagine Ward doing that.
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Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
I played CSM with the 3.5 dex... And IMHO, it was way, way OP... I absolutely hated the nerf-herder dex that just went the way of the dodo... And actually rather like the new CSM dex...
I have always been a Chaos Dread fan... AND the last dex made them worse than useless... AND the new one made them shiny again!!!
But I'm still jonesing for a new DA dex.
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Post by: kronk
whoadirty wrote: Absolon wrote:It looks like the release has already slid into 2013, so who knows
They could still slip them in late November or early December.
That would be the first December Codex release that I've ever heard of. Not likely, but possible, I suppose.
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Post by: Brother SRM
Vladsimpaler wrote:
Said character is pretty inexpensive and the fact that he gives you access to FNP for one squad (for an additional cost but not huge) and can have a TH/ SS for free is pretty good.
Anyway I'm not denying that you guys are working with an older codex but honestly you guys made it out of 6th not only relatively unscathed but in some ways even stronger, whereas a great many of other armies got weaker due to power weapon nerfs or cover save reductions.
I'm just looking forward to my friend who is playing Dark Angels with his new Ward "facemelter" codex (props to Abadabadoobaddon) against my "balanced" Chaos codex.
Belial also kind of sucks. He's okay, but he's basically just a Space Marine captain who has to take a TH/ SS to get a decent invuln save, yet can't get Eternal Warrior or any survivability if he wants to take advantage of his I5. And getting FNP in one Terminator squad is nice, but hardly gamebreaking.
Dark Angels didn't come out much worse for 6th than they did for 5th, but that has more to do with the fact that Terminators are better now than anything really specific in their codex. Space Wolves Logan's Heroes lists with lots of Terminators are about as strong, and a Space Marine list with lots of Terminators will do just fine as well. The rest of the Dark Angels codex is an overpriced mess without any options.
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Post by: Ozymandias
H.B.M.C. wrote:>Doesn't think CSM is weaksauce.
>Mentions a unit from a different Codex to show how it isn't.
>Fails to see the irony of that.
Sorry Ozzy, but pointing out a combination from a different Codex in no way makes CSM a powerful 'Dex and, as always, Doobie is spot on with his comments. I predict that Azreal will give Ahriman a run for his money.
This is 6th edition man, the concept of a single codex has changed. Hell, I started running Azrael with 50 guardsmen, my DA just got a lot more competitive.
Abadabadoobaddon wrote:
How long until the daemons codex gets redone? Fzorgle is gone. Why would tally survive?
CSM codex was GW basically doubling down on the gavdex. If DA is GW doubling down on the jervisdex I will stand corrected. But for some reason I just can't imagine Ward doing that.
I thought you hated fzorgle? Hence the calling of it fzorgle. Now it's gone and you're moaning it's loss...
But I gotta stop, arguing with you two is giving me flashbacks to six years ago...
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Post by: ShatteredBlade
An overpriced mess, this describes the Dark Angels codex very well at the moment. At this point I'd even be happy if Cruddace wrote it. To put it in the words of Dr. Evil, just throw me a frickin' bone here!
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Post by: captain collius
Just make us relevant again.
LET ME USING MY FRICKIN PLASMA PA ARMY!
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Post by: Maelstrom808
As long as it has the options to competitively run as a regular MEQ list in addition to DW and RW, I'll be happy...and isn't completely OTT on the power curve...but that might be too much to hope for.
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Post by: VardenV2
 Maelstrom808 wrote:As long as it has the options to competitively run as a regular MEQ list in addition to DW and RW, I'll be happy...and isn't completely OTT on the power curve...but that might be too much to hope for.
Agreed. I love DW/ RW but i long to use some actual SPACE MARINES for once. And maybe even some scouts that aren't a totally useless elite slot? Hopefully some of the 'new' shiny units will be power armor wearing dudes who look awesome. Then I can let my terminators be troops and my power armor be the elites. Dat role reversal.
-VardenV2
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Post by: DakotaBlue
VardenV2 wrote: Maelstrom808 wrote:As long as it has the options to competitively run as a regular MEQ list in addition to DW and RW, I'll be happy...and isn't completely OTT on the power curve...but that might be too much to hope for.
Agreed. I love DW/ RW but i long to use some actual SPACE MARINES for once. And maybe even some scouts that aren't a totally useless elite slot? Hopefully some of the 'new' shiny units will be power armor wearing dudes who look awesome. Then I can let my terminators be troops and my power armor be the elites. Dat role reversal.
-VardenV2
An inner circle power armour unit plox. With swords, plasma guns and stormbolters.
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Post by: Brother SRM
DakotaBlue wrote:
An inner circle power armour unit plox. With swords, plasma guns and stormbolters.
So basically veterans, which are already an option? I mean, they don't have all of those things on each dude (unless you pay serious points) but they can take a lot of stuff.
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Post by: Puscifer
Well according to Stickmonkey we are not getting DA until next year.
I call shenanigans myself, but we will have to see.
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Post by: gobbledog
Sorry fellow Dark Angels fans, but our boys are not in Novembers WD....not even a hint.. Novembers release is indeed WoC...lots of them. But for those in Oz at least the mini update / supplement will not be released with novs WD...apparently there was some delay in getting them printed.
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Post by: Puscifer
And December is the Hobbit.
DAMMIT!!!
Oh well... I better start getting good with my Deathwing before the dex comes out.
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Post by: Yojiro
Annoying that we have to wait for longer but that means I can save more and indulge in my impulse buying like a true capitalist pig!
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Post by: Brother SRM
Considering I've got two Dark Vengeance sets worth of Dark Angels to paint, I can stomach the wait
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Post by: VardenV2
Yeah, it was either November or January. November seems too soon but January is ssoooooooooo far away X_X. Oh well.
I am away at college anyway so I can't really get a game in, but I was hoping to have a whole month of Christmas break at home where I could build and paint and play with my new shiny Dark Angels... sigh... looks like it's gonna be the summer then -.-
-VardenV2
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Post by: Absolon
Looks like the reliable rumor mongers have posted on BOLS that codex Dark Angels is now in the April 2013 slot. Hopefully it doesn't slip to the summer release slot at this rate
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Post by: pretre
Yeah, Stickmonkey just laid out his vision for dates on releases. This is really his weakest mongering style though. Oh well.
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Post by: ShatteredBlade
Doesn't look like we'll be seeing anything about them for a while. Oh well, I suppose it gives me time to further touch up the new Tac squads I'm actually getting for DA
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Post by: gobbledog
We have waited this long for a new dex....we can wait a little longer.. The unforgiven are patient.
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Post by: DakotaBlue
Brother SRM wrote:DakotaBlue wrote:
An inner circle power armour unit plox. With swords, plasma guns and stormbolters.
So basically veterans, which are already an option? I mean, they don't have all of those things on each dude (unless you pay serious points) but they can take a lot of stuff.
Yup, exactly what we got but with some spice on it, like preferred enemy or something, and being as costy as purifiers, for example.
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Post by: KalashnikovMarine
Brother SRM wrote:Considering I've got two Dark Vengeance sets worth of Dark Angels to paint, I can stomach the wait
This, I got two thousand points to work on, I can wait XD
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Post by: CIsaac
I'm in the same boat. A dozen bikers, twenty marines, ten terminators, special characters, et al. It'll take a while to get them to all done with my every other day painting schedule.
I'm saddened it'll be a while for our codex, but at the same time it allows me to have my army ready to go by the time it's out and put something nice looking on the table.
(I hate fielding partially painted armies)
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Post by: VardenV2
Fuuuuuu - I don't want to wait that long! I guess I will be getting lots of Orks for Christmas and my birthday in March if this is true. W/e. I like my DA enough as they are, but I want NEW stuff. I have been playing basically the same list for what feels like a decade. I added in some Black Templar allies to change things up a bit and I guess this gives me plenty of time to gather and paint that portion of my army... but still, grrrrrrr.
-VardenV2
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Post by: Kroothawk
No wonder these trenches look like the Dark Angel Fortress:
Stickmonkey 25th September:
Rumor is there is something else for the heavy slot too, but no info specific to it.
Fortifications:
Siege cannon ( this is supposedly the Techmarine cannon described earlier)
Battle bunker
Stickmonkey today:
Well, thats the bunker i mentioned in my DA thread.
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Post by: Brother SRM
Yes, please let this fortification that is absolutely blanketed in IG be a DA only fortification. Why would you even think that? Besides, if the Fortress of Redemption, a building with giant angels and DA iconography on it, isn't DA-only, this thing won't be.
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Post by: ph34r
Brother SRM wrote:Yes, please let this fortification that is absolutely blanketed in IG be a DA only fortification. Why would you even think that? Besides, if the Fortress of Redemption, a building with giant angels and DA iconography on it, isn't DA-only, this thing won't be.
My thoughts exactly. I had to stop myself at laughing at the idea that someone thinks this could possibly be DA only.
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Post by: SoloFalcon1138
Can't wait for this thread to start discussing actual Dark Angels rumors again...
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Post by: B3AN
Agreed. This thread should just be locked until new rumors are able to be shared by the OP. There are page after page on non DA rumor related posts. Can we get a clean up OP?
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Post by: Nivek5150
Well, I'm pretty damn bummed out. My buddy who has been doing this awhile convinced me to go halfsies on the DV set, and Dark Angels were to be my first army. I expected to get the codex within a reasonable time frame... Maybe I'll use them as vanilla marines until then.
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Post by: B3AN
I did the EXACT same thing Nivek. SAME THING. So now Im rolling BA as my first army. DW / RW in the works for DA Codex release though.
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Post by: Kroothawk
Presenting a first pic of the fortification entry of the DA Codex IS news.
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Post by: Minx
It looks more like general imperial stuff though. SMs source probably just mistook this for DA and there won't be an extra fortification entry in the DA 'dex.
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Post by: ShatteredBlade
I have to say that terrain is growing on me. Almost makes me regret that I sold my Guard Army.
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Post by: B3AN
http://diceandbrush.blogspot.de/2012/10/first-look-nov-white-dwarf-pics.html
Not DA Specific fortification. Scroll down the pics in this link. Its an Imperial Fortification. The image is from the Nov WD.
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Post by: Brother SRM
GhostOfCaliban wrote:http://diceandbrush.blogspot. de/2012/10/first-look-nov-white-dwarf-pics.html
Not DA Specific fortification. Scroll down the pics in this link. Its an Imperial Fortification. The image is from the Nov WD.
Still absolutely perplexed that anyone thought it was DA specific, like at all.
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Post by: Kroothawk
GhostOfCaliban wrote:http://diceandbrush.blogspot. de/2012/10/first-look-nov-white-dwarf-pics.html
Not DA Specific fortification. Scroll down the pics in this link. Its an Imperial Fortification. The image is from the Nov WD.
Just read my first post on this page ... and compare the iron wings with the iconography on the Fortress of Redemption (also built by DA and now used by all).
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Post by: B3AN
Kroothawk wrote: GhostOfCaliban wrote:http://diceandbrush.blogspot. de/2012/10/first-look-nov-white-dwarf-pics.html
Not DA Specific fortification. Scroll down the pics in this link. Its an Imperial Fortification. The image is from the Nov WD.
Just read my first post on this page ... and compare the iron wings with the iconography on the Fortress of Redemption (also built by DA and now used by all).
It says "Imperial Defense Network" on the page next to it. That's the name of the item. Not DA Defense Line. Lots of other chapters in WH40K have wings and skulls. (Blood Angels for example to name one of many.)
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Post by: Kroothawk
GhostOfCaliban wrote:It says "Imperial Defense Network" on the page next to it. That's the name of the item. Not DA Defense Line. Lots of other chapters in WH40K have wings and skulls. (Blood Angels for example to name one of many.)
Okay, then don't read my post.
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Post by: B3AN
Kroothawk wrote:
Presenting a first pic of the fortification entry of the DA Codex IS news.
You mean THIS post? The one were you clearly call it an entry from the DA Codex? Being entirely wrong at the same time? THIS post? Cause it's NOT from DA Codex. It's from WD. Read MY post.
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Post by: Kroothawk
Kroothawk wrote:Stickmonkey 25th September:
Rumor is there is something else for the heavy slot too, but no info specific to it.
Fortifications:
Siege cannon ( this is supposedly the Techmarine cannon described earlier)
Battle bunker
Stickmonkey today:
Well, thats the bunker i mentioned in my DA thread.
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Post by: Darkseid
Just fetched form Warseer:
Today a guy posted some rumors on the GWTilea italian board...
He told he has some rumors about DA coming from a UK playtester...
Basically what it says is that DW and RW will have 4 units each and some other info too...
DW should have:
Command squad- 2 wounds like GK paladins... WS5 and BS5... command squad upgrades... upgrades for attached chaplain and/or attached librarian... very expensive unit...
Elite squad - Close combat specialistic unit with mastercrafted weapons and specific options... WS5
Troop squad - the DW squad we know now but without any speacial ability... i guess they will be just fearless without DWA... chaplain in TDA can attach...
Heavy Support squad - BS5... no access to assault weapons but access to heavy weapons... AP3 Stormbolters...
RW should have:
Command squad - 2 attacks... WS5... all the guys can take sergeant upgrades... command squad upgrades...
Troop squad - like the bike squad in vanilla codex (3-10 bikes and 2 bikes can become a single attack bike) but with RW special abilities and options
fast attack squad - 1-5 attack bike squadron can split into 2 units
LS squadron - 1-5 LS with access to all equipment as per vanilla codex plus the specific RAM version (rumored to take LC too) they can split into 2 units
New kind of dread that can take terminator options...
Very big transport flyer with room enough for 20 marines (the rumor says 20 tda but i guess it will be 20 PA or 10 tda)...
Chaplains that can act like a single unit or join squads like SP in BA army...
Another guy i know told me about a rumored name for a DA veichle... VENGEANCLAD or similar... maybe it will be the dread with terminator options...
Codex should be out between february and april...
I hope you can enjoy this rumors... and take them with a lot of salt...
This all sounds good but at the same time it sounds hard to believe.
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Post by: Ronin
Brb, going to the store to pick up a bag of salt.
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Post by: tuiman
Wow, I hope the RW stuff is true, I picked up a couple of sets of dark vengeance bikers, but at the moment using the vanilla codex as they do bikes better, however this would make an awesome all biker army.
None of its probably true though ):
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Post by: KalashnikovMarine
 Ronin wrote:Brb, going to the store to pick up a bag of salt.
Grab me one as well please!
Vengeanclad? Just give us our Mortis dreads for the Emprah's sake!
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Post by: Ferrum_Sanguinis
Damn was really hoping DA would get released this year. Oh well, guess Necrons will be my next army after all...
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Post by: TheLionOfTheForest
I have it on good authority that Ezekiel will be able to consume men with fireballs from his eyes and bolts of lightning from his arse!
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Post by: KalashnikovMarine
 TheLionOfTheForest wrote:I have it on good authority that Ezekiel will be able to consume men with fireballs from his eyes and bolts of lightning from his arse!
He'll also be wearing a skirt for some reason.
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Post by: TheLionOfTheForest
You can't mess with someone with a 6ft long sword wearing a plaid skirt!
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Post by: wyomingfox
I think you guys are confusing Ezekiel with Draigo.
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Post by: Abadabadoobaddon
I heard that Ezekiel, like all future SM special character psykers, will be Mastery Level 5. Because... well you know why.
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Post by: str00dles1
 Darkseid wrote:Just fetched form Warseer:
Heavy Support squad - BS5... no access to assault weapons but access to heavy weapons... AP3 Stormbolters...
I hope you can enjoy this rumors... and take them with a lot of salt...
This all sounds good but at the same time it sounds hard to believe.
Because Matt Ward is doing it, this I can actually believe
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Post by: Quintinus
Darkseid wrote:Just fetched form Warseer:
I hope you can enjoy this rumors... and take them with a lot of salt...
This all sounds good but at the same time it sounds hard to believe.
Sounds like a Mat Ward facemelter alright.
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Post by: Vhalyar
To shoot the aforementioned ass-lightning, of course. It is the darkest secret of the Dark Angels.
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Post by: davethepak
GhostOfCaliban wrote:I did the EXACT same thing Nivek. SAME THING. So now Im rolling BA as my first army. DW / RW in the works for DA Codex release though.
Play the DA.
Really.
If you like them, play them. If you think they are cool, play them. Who cares if the book is old.
Also, maybe it is... know what, that will make you a better player.
Really.
An outdated dex forces you to up your game as they are usually somewhat behind on the powercurve - this is a good thing.
They are still marines, so will still be very forgiving with their decent saves and good statlines - play them.
As someone who learned 40k on an outdated dex (tau and 5th - and still my primary army) I can say do not underestimate this factor.
After cutting my teeth on tau and older necrons (and later nids...I am a glutton for punishment) this has a great impact on my skills as a player.
When I play more recent dexes, they seem almost easy in comparison.
So if you want to play them, play them. Have fun.
The fact it will make you a better player in the long run is just freaking gravy when the new book comes out.
just my perspective...
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Post by: B3AN
davethepak wrote: GhostOfCaliban wrote:I did the EXACT same thing Nivek. SAME THING. So now Im rolling BA as my first army. DW / RW in the works for DA Codex release though.
Play the DA.
Really.
If you like them, play them. If you think they are cool, play them. Who cares if the book is old.
Also, maybe it is... know what, that will make you a better player.
Really.
An outdated dex forces you to up your game as they are usually somewhat behind on the powercurve - this is a good thing.
They are still marines, so will still be very forgiving with their decent saves and good statlines - play them.
As someone who learned 40k on an outdated dex (tau and 5th - and still my primary army) I can say do not underestimate this factor.
After cutting my teeth on tau and older necrons (and later nids...I am a glutton for punishment) this has a great impact on my skills as a player.
When I play more recent dexes, they seem almost easy in comparison.
So if you want to play them, play them. Have fun.
The fact it will make you a better player in the long run is just freaking gravy when the new book comes out.
just my perspective...
Yes I do agree that playing an older dex will perhaps teach me to endure a beating against newer codex. Thus helping me to learn how to play the game. However, I have a lot of disposable income. So I will probably end up playing both armies. I love both Chapters fluff equally. I think I was pushed towards DA because of the DV set more than it was liking them more than the BA's. I also read the BA codex after purchasing the DV set. I was a little miffed that I didn't read it before hand, but I got a start on my future DA army and I got the mini 6E RB so not a total loss. Besides it's not like I'm restricted to playing ONE army. So WHEN and IF the DA codex drops I will be purchasing alot of new minis then as well. I should have my BA's finished (loosely using this term as I'm sure I will always purchase more) by then and ready to build a face melting plasma spam DA army.
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Post by: KaryudoDS
davethepak wrote:
Play the DA.
Really.
If you like them, play them. If you think they are cool, play them. Who cares if the book is old.
Also, maybe it is... know what, that will make you a better player.
Really.
This right here. I've played WH40K on and off again since 3rd and have always had DA as my marine army. If you like a faction then I would play it instead of just using a different book. The DA book is old but it's able to beat other armies, newer or not. My only issue with it right now is that if I don't have Terminators, Bikes, and use Deathwing Assault, then it feels like I'm playing the game wrong when I could do everything else with C: SM and have points left over so. I mean with a full company of Terminator armor you'd think we would have crazy things like Deathwing with jumppacks and lascannons, but instead they just say we like plasma even though I'm pretty sure Space Wolf can bring more plasma to a fight and use it just as well...
Certainly a few tweaks I would like to see in a new book, but I'm not about to use another till it comes out.
On the other hand BA with DA allies? Why the heck not? I found my old Death Company squad so I was thinking of using them as allies after I added a little more to it.
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Post by: MightyGodzilla
Salty rumors. Ithink what I'll pay attention to most is the release date that Italian playtester guy cited. Feb to April. I was hoping for something sooner. Not spending money on new DA in 2012 is killing me slowly. As far as the other new rumors I got mixed feelings on them. For me
Would like to see jetbikes in more of an honor guard (means 0-1) fashion as opposed to retconned mass jetbike tech for the descendants of the I Legion.
BS5 units seem like a waste to me. A little too over the top vs whats established for 40k Marines. I guess in really low numbers. Same for 2 wound Dark Palidans...do that and there's an arms race brewing. More termie Hw options I'm down with..make the DW different by bringing home the 2 heavies per squad thing back.
Giant flyer thing will probably happen. I'll buy one too if it looks as cool as the Storm Eagle.
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Post by: Ralis
Just some thoughts I've had concerning some of the rumored units.
1. Unique flyer-- I don't think it makes sense for DAs to have a unique flier, maybe a custom variant of stormtalon/stormraven would be cool.
2. Plasma Predator -- Now this would be cool,
3: Inner Circle -- This doesn't make sense to me, It makes for good fluff, but wouldn't it be comprised of Chapter masters, captains and the like? AKA We already have them as HQ choices.
4: I would like to see something that works like the blood angels Sanguinary Priests, that you take a unit of 3, but then can divide them with your other units to give them bonuses. This might be were Interrogator Chaplains would work good.
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Post by: Billagio
Ralis wrote:Just some thoughts I've had concerning some of the rumored units.
3: Inner Circle -- This doesn't make sense to me, It makes for good fluff, but wouldn't it be comprised of Chapter masters, captains and the like? AKA We already have them as HQ choices.
My guess is it would be something like a necron royal court. You can take them seperatly, or take a court with them all attached.
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Post by: PredaKhaine
Copied from BOLS
Rumor followups courtesy of Stickmonkey
Deathwing
Honor Guard Terminator squad unlocked by select HQs (Belial - others???). One such unit per HQ, only one may carry a Chapter Banner. Other banners exist however. Models are W:2 WS/BS:5 Non-scoring. Can take Apothecary.
Elite Terminators are W:1, WS/BS:5. Unit has new CC options neverbefore seen on termys. Unit size max of 5. Vanguard Strike upon Deepstriking!
Troops Terminators are standard DW. Sergeant may upgrade to to Chaplain. Can take new options such as Plasma Cannon. Up to 10 models per unit. No more Cyclone/CC option on single models. Mix of CC and Ranged models still permitted withing unit.
Ravenwing
RW Command Squad is only unlocked by select HQ characters. One banner option for RW. No apothecary for RW, with a "Mini-Chaplain" upgrade instead. This option provide a Litanies buff his unit only.
Troop RW squad matches the current RW bike squad, minus the Speeder.
RW Attack Bikes - plasma gunner option
RW Land Speeders - plasma gunner option
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Post by: Cyrax
I'm not fan of RW losing their apothecary, but for the rest I thank our spiritual liege.
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Post by: Ronin
Came back from the store with my bag of salt (was a big bag!).
Got plenty to spare.
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Post by: Kanluwen
Ralis wrote:
3: Inner Circle -- This doesn't make sense to me, It makes for good fluff, but wouldn't it be comprised of Chapter masters, captains and the like? AKA We already have them as HQ choices.
Those guys are certainly part of the Inner Circle, but there's more to it. It's not just the "Highest Ranking" members of the Chapter...it's those who are considered the "Most Trustworthy". Those who can keep a secret. Those are the kinds of individuals admitted to the Inner Circle.
But not just the high ranking guys. Oh no. You could theoretically have a Scout Sergeant who was elevated to the Deathwing and Ravenwing both as part of the Inner Circle.
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Post by: pretre
Man, Stick is certainly amping up the rumors. Hmm. Added to the tracker.
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Post by: Compel
I suppose having a small group of power armoured guys in the inner circle would help too in some situations where the deathwing and ravenwing aren't too helpful.
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Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
Out of curiosity...
I've heard many on this thread bemoan not having a "proper Mortis Dread"... I was under the impression that a "Mortis Dread" was just a dreadnought with 2 main ranged weapons, instead of 1-ranged / 1-CCW...
If this is not the case... Then what is a "proper Mortis Dreadnought"?
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Post by: Death By Monkeys
A proper Mortis Dreadnought is one with two identical ranged weapons - like two TL Autocannons or two TL Lascannons. A lascannon and ML does not a Mortis make.
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Post by: KaryudoDS
PredaKhaine wrote:Copied from BOLS
Rumor followups courtesy of Stickmonkey
Troops Terminators are standard DW. Sergeant may upgrade to to Chaplain. Can take new options such as Plasma Cannon. Up to 10 models per unit. No more Cyclone/ CC option on single models. Mix of CC and Ranged models still permitted withing unit.
Always thought they needed more heavy weapons, and models per squad as an option but no Cyclone/ CC? I've seen this posted but I still don't get why they would do it. I could maybe see keeping the storm shield off a heavy weapon but it doesn't seem like it would have much effect on lighting claw models. Just seems like my cyclone would live long because it would have no reason to be up front in this edition.
Liking the idea of several types of DW/ RW squads a bit though, would add a little uniqueness to their units.
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Post by: KalashnikovMarine
Getting the rules from somewhere that isn't forge world would be lovely as well.
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Post by: Vaktathi
If it weren't for Mat Ward I'd say most of these sound like the insane ramblings of a demented fanboy ranting about his fandex, taking one aspect of an otherwise rather adherent chapter and going all out bonkers with it.
Alas, I fully expect all sorts of silly inexplicably DA specific terminator stuff and the like with entire FoC's of terminators
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Post by: pretre
 Vaktathi wrote:If it weren't for Mat Ward I'd say most of these sound like the insane ramblings of a demented fanboy ranting about his fandex, taking one aspect of an otherwise rather adherent chapter and going all out bonkers with it.
Alas, I fully expect all sorts of silly inexplicably DA specific terminator stuff  and the like with entire FoC's of terminators
Not to ruin this great tear you are on but remember that it isn't just Ward that takes one aspect and goes crazy with it, that's GW as a whole. (see, Skulls, Wolves, etc).
Keep on beating that dead horse though! Oh, and don't forget to mention Finecast.
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Post by: jmurph
Skipphag da Devoura wrote:I played CSM with the 3.5 dex... And IMHO, it was way, way OP... I absolutely hated the nerf-herder dex that just went the way of the dodo... And actually rather like the new CSM dex...
I have always been a Chaos Dread fan... AND the last dex made them worse than useless... AND the new one made them shiny again!!!
This is sarcasm, right? Dreads are more or less the same and were mediocre last go round- 4th and crazed made them stupid. Alot of people played them wrong with 5th LOS. 6th HPs makes them very meh and plasma on them worse (one of the few places Chaos could get it). Not that they have ever been great. An option to boost front AV to 13 would have been really nice.
DA really could use some Mortis dreads for them. I expect alot of Dark stuff of Vengeance, though.
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Post by: Skipphag da Devoura
The general meh-ness of dreads in 6th is directly proportionate to the general meh-ness of all vehicles in 6th...
The 3.5 Chaos dex made the dreads slightly crazy, and so, slightly dangerous if they didn't have LoS and/or range to enemy models... They only went crazed on a single roll result (1 I think, but it might have been 6), then you rolled for result...
The 5 Chaos dex made them completely crazy, and horribly dangerous if they were closer to your units, than to enemy units... They went crazy on a 1 or a 6, and that was the result as well...
This one makes them slightly crazy... and not generally killing your own units...
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Post by: pretre
How about we stay on DA?
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Post by: Ronin_eX
Well I feel better hearing that from Stick, still a little leery though. But I am starting to hope for a proper Deathwing Honour Guard unit that is tough as nails (and I am personally hoping for 2W). Losing scoring sounds like a good trade for a dead hard combat unit.
Increased heavy weapon choices for things is great, though I'm wondering what role a PC will actually play in a DW squad. I just hope the cost isn't too high so that it sees some use next to the assault cannon. Either way I'm sure the model will look great if it is something we will be getting. Losing the CC option on CMLs kind of bites though, there is a model I wont be able to use, and unlike the metal ones I had to futz around with when the last codex dropped, good luck getting that apart without ruining it. Hopefully that was just something found in one iteration of the playtest and got dropped. It they brought back the targeter as an option for it then that may be neat, but I doubt that will be a thing. But I tend to be less of a fan of reigning in changes like that unless GW is pretty open that it will be a change for all codices (i.e. the SW get an entry in their FAQ saying such a combo is a no-go as well). Because it always stinks as one of those things they are going to test out and then change back at the next opportunity if the backlash is bad. But then, the last codex made me kind of paranoid about that.
The idea of swapping in Chappies to lead DW squads is actually kind of awesome. I hope that ends up being true.
Glad to see the speeder may get the nix from the troop squad. It always seemed like a weird setup to me and was also kind of needless. I wonder if that means we may see multiple Attack Bikes in one unit?
The RW Command Squad sounds interesting. Losing the Apothecary is no fun (another model some will not be able to use) but a chappie upgrade is interesting.
Overall it sounds like the constant re-implementation of the RW/ DW command units is going to be a sticking point here. No two codices have had the same load out and each new codex has seen me tearing apart one unit or another as it has become obsolete. In 3rd they introduced the command squad and the DW got a Techmarine, Apothecary and Standard Bearer. In 4th the Techmarine was dropped (since they stopped being part of command squads long prior to that) and the independant version had no TDA option. Now it looks like RW are sharing the same fate (possibly) with their Apothecary. And my current command squad would have been fine save for the possible loss of CML+ LCs.
Oh well, this new one at least sounds interesting so I shant complain too much. But from the sounds of it, they are finally adding enough new stuff that I may buy new Dark Angels to pad out my force. I pray the April release is accurate, because I will need to save for that month.
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Post by: Cyrax
Stickmonkey wrote:HQ:
Azrael - Artificer or Terminator options. New model. Lions Helm grants 3+ Inv., Lion's Wrath grants Gets Hot rerolls (army-wide?), Master crafted Plasma Blaster (see Horus Heresy book?), Sword of Secrets is Sx2 Master Crafted Power weapon. Watcher in the Dark model is W:1 5+ Inv, with no other stats. It cannot be targeted by anything including blasts, and must stay within 2" of Azrael or is removed. Watcher can take Look Out Sirs.
Belial - Terminator armor. New model. Eternal Warrior 2+ Inv!!! Grants Elites Deathwing Termys Heroic Intervention if he is attached. Cannot take options, Master Crafted Strombolter. Sword of Secrets is a Relic Blade with an additional effect. Belian grants a buff to Termys within 6".
Sammael - If mounted in his Speeder, unlocks scoring Speeders. Can also take his normal bike.
Azmodai - Current model (finecast) Unlocks no units. His Litanies grants a longer ranged more potent buff.
Ezekiel - Current model (finecast), Psyker Level 3
Barakiel - Master of the Forge. Armed with a "Reaper Cannon" - 36" S:5 Assault (6 or 12?) AP:3 Extremely Expensive in points.
Librarian - Power Level 1 (upgrade to 2)
Company Master - Power Armor, or Terminator armor
Interrogator Chaplain
Command/Honor squad Terminators or Bikes with Belial or Sammael respectively, Apothecary, Standard bearer, 1x Heavy weapon upgrades. W:2 regardless of armor, or bikes.
Elites:
Chaplains / Brother-Interrogators - Unit size 1-3. Chaplain style death masks, dual bolt pistols and power maul. (can upgrade pistols). B-I have an increased BS over regular chaplains and can operate independantly as IC or join units, B-I only buff the unit they join with litanies (more potent version), while non-upgraded chaplains buff a 6" bubble. B-I are only characters if independent, and cannot leave attached units (similar to Wolfguard).
Inner Circle Unit Terminator armor. W:1, Heroic Intervention if Belial is attached to the unit. WS/BS 5. They get a cover save upon deepstriking. "Lion-themed" visually. Entire unit can purchase Sergeant upgrades. No heavy weapons, Unit max size:5. Categorized as Deathwing Assault Unit
Dreadnought - Venerable and Mortis options. Categorized as Deathwing Assault Unit.
Scouts - Land Speeder Storm as dedicated transport. "Markerlight" effect targets one enemy unit - other Dark Angels units then get a bonus (reroll to hit?) versus the unit as long as the Scouts are within line of sight to thier "Fallen" target. Teleport Homer. Sergeant Namaan (WOOHOO!!) returns, granting Reserve rerolls to all Death Wing units.
Techmarine
Veterans
http://www.belloflostsouls.net/2012/11/40k-rumors-dark-angels-hqs-and-elites.html http://www.lounge.belloflostsouls.net/showthread.php?24243-DA-Rumours
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Post by: Ronin
The more I see these rumours the harder it is for me to tell if someone isnt just making it up like some fandex. Scoring Speeders? S8 power sword? 2+ Invul on Belial?
Kinda interesting that the Inner Circle unit we've been hearing about is actually the elite Terminator Deathwing unit. Was always under the impression it was PA (and thus led to much speculation)
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Post by: Cyrax
Current codex used to have a scoring speeder, the one which was purchased with the RAS, I don't know if the 6th edition changed that.
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Post by: Backfire
Cyrax wrote:Current codex used to have a scoring speeder, the one which was purchased with the RAS, I don't know if the 6th edition changed that.
No it doesn't, vehicles don't score in 5th even if they're troops.
Have to say that most of the above rumours sound really really lame. Like fandex written by 12-year old. Urgh.
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Post by: Yojiro
Sounds about right.
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Post by: Sasori
I don't think there will be a 2++ on Belial. I don't know of anything off the top of my head (even in Apoc) that has a 2++.
These seem a little far-fetched.
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Post by: tuiman
 Sasori wrote:I don't think there will be a 2++ on Belial. I don't know of anything off the top of my head (even in Apoc) that has a 2++.
These seem a little far-fetched.
Warding stave for grey knights (I know its not the same thing but its still a 2++) and the armor you can get for a dark eldar archon
It could even be something like a warding stave, will have to wait and find out I guess
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