Clockpunk wrote: Sweet zombie Jesus, those Squitors are a lot pricier than I expected!
I'm curious what you thought their price would be then; it looks like a 10 model box (though clearly a 5 model sprue doubled) for $2 less than the same number of Liberators who they're fairly analogous to in the army. Granted, the price for Liberators is daffy as well, but it seems fairly standard by GW pricing.
Well Sequitors cost more points than Liberators, Liberators cost more points than they are worth, and Sequitors cost less points than they are worth. All factored in, buying Sequitors is like getting 16 Liberators for the same price, which mean's you're getting a 60% discount on what the dollar value actually is! GW is practically giving them to us at that price!
Sequitors are the same price as liberators so no surprises. The black coach is a huge kit so £70 is not a surprise.Aventis, though, is rather pricy. If it includes the onfoot guy it is a bit better. If the chainrasps really are just 10 minis, it is a very expensive kit. The ghouls for example are a full multipart kit and are 20 minis for the same price.
Chikout wrote: Sequitors are the same price as liberators so no surprises. The black coach is a huge kit so £70 is not a surprise.Aventis, though, is rather pricy. If it includes the onfoot guy it is a bit better. If the chainrasps really are just 10 minis, it is a very expensive kit. The ghouls for example are a full multipart kit and are 20 minis for the same price.
They have stated it includes the on-foot guy if you build Aventis.
The Chainrasps are so expensive the reselling price from the starter sets will probably go up. Did not expect that. They and Firestrike are certainly the two releases out of their two armies that have sticker shock. Good thing I don't want any more Chainrasps right now after building 22 from the starter The Black Coach being really expensive was to be expected, so no surprise there.
That leaves one unit choice in Nighthaunts (outside the FW Mourngul) where I feel like complaining about their price: spirit hosts. I want big swarms of those actually spooky guys as battleline over boring 'rasps, but they're kinda pricey for the amount you'd want. And I can't think of a bundle with them that wouldn't drown you in Hexwraiths?!
TwilightSparkles wrote: Not looking so daft for buying 120 odd chainrasp at around £14 per 20 now
Though I'm now thinking bladegheist and harridans will be 5 per box £20-25
I wouldn't expect that price. The Bladegheist are so similar to the already released Grimghast, that I have been assuming they'll be priced the same. At least I hope so... I want thirty. :-p
Yeah, the screwjob on boxed Chainrasps is probably going to shoot the crap out of me trying to wait until the Nighthaunt half on Ebay gets down to around what the Stormcast half goes for. Or even just being able to get the Chainrasps alone for 25 bucks like most of the previous starter grunts go for.
Sooo, GW is back to primaris officers prices after backlash temporarily driven them down, eh? Oh well, hopefully outrage will work again...
Kanluwen wrote: They have stated it includes the on-foot guy if you build Aventis.
If you believe Aventis and generic foot guy can't be kitbashed into two generic guys (because how GW would really prevent that) I have this nice cozy planet to sell
Just my opinion, but chainwrasps are Poodoo. It's that 5+ Ethereal save that makes them soo bad. I play Nighthaunts, but it is a very popular army, so a lot of my games are mirror matches. Nighthaunt vs. Nighthaunt your going to want a 4+ save. Grimghasts are better for Battleline, So are Spirit hosts.
Chainrasps are actually fantastic for their points, and average more damage than Spirit Hosts (20 attacks at 4+/4+ with rerolls above 10, vs. 16 attacks at 5+/4+ for each grouping).
They are also quite a bit cheaper than reapers and hosts, which is why they are at a 5+ instead of a 4+. They would be one of the most busted units in the game at a 4+ for their points.
6" move and fly is also worth mentioning on such a cheap unit.
They will also hold objectives better than any other unit in Nighthaunt, and only compete with Skeletons and Zombies on that front in Legions.
Can't get anywhere near 40 bodies for 280 points in Nighthaunt with any other unit.
Smellingsalts wrote: Just my opinion, but chainwrasps are Poodoo. It's that 5+ Ethereal save that makes them soo bad. I play Nighthaunts, but it is a very popular army, so a lot of my games are mirror matches. Nighthaunt vs. Nighthaunt your going to want a 4+ save. Grimghasts are better for Battleline, So are Spirit hosts.
We'll have to disagree. Have you guys been playing a lot of games, because in my experience they suck. I agree they can hold objectives, but they will be contested by other units and you will get tie games in tournaments. They have a lot of attacks, but they are meh attacks. Nighthaunt vs Nighthaunt they won't hold up.
I have to go with Myrmourn Banshees as MVP. hit 4+, wound 3+, -2 rend, d3 damage, 4+ unmodifiable save, d3 damage, Dispel a spell within 18" or an endless spell within 6" at +3 if full 12 taken, +1 attack if they dispel AND a large unit discount!l. Throw in a mounted Knight of Shrouds to give them +1 attack, you could be looking at 36 attacks for d3 damage each, -2 rend. One unit of 8 Myrmourn Banshees tore down a unit of Chainwrasps and the Vampire Lord standing next to them. I also throw the Spirit Torment in for healing and re-rolling1's. Now that is a unit that will strike fear, maybe not the first time your opponent sees them, but every game thereafter!
Smellingsalts wrote: I have to go with Myrmourn Banshees as MVP. hit 4+, wound 3+, -2 rend, d3 damage, 4+ unmodifiable save, d3 damage, Dispel a spell within 18" or an endless spell within 6" at +3 if full 12 taken, +1 attack if they dispel AND a large unit discount!l. Throw in a mounted Knight of Shrouds to give them +1 attack, you could be looking at 36 attacks for d3 damage each, -2 rend. One unit of 8 Myrmourn Banshees tore down a unit of Chainwrasps and the Vampire Lord standing next to them. I also throw the Spirit Torment in for healing and re-rolling1's. Now that is a unit that will strike fear, maybe not the first time your opponent sees them, but every game thereafter!
You forgot to add the lantern giving +1 to wound as well banshees are a brutal unit maxed out i love them.
Mymourn banshees are obviously strong, but you have to have battleline and chain rasps are cheap and have a permanent 5+ in a system that rewards horde units. The Nighthaunt book is great because it seems neatly balanced and most units have a role, but chainrasp are quite obviously very strong. Shifting a unit of 40 of them (that can deep strike and also withdraw to the general) is going to be very difficult. 280 for 40 is a steal.
On topic: I finally managed to get a box of Myrmourn Banshees this week at the FLGS - after the online store I ordered my Soul Wars together with screamer ladies canceled the Banshees! They couldn't get them and decided that holding up my order for a week was enough. Strangly enough I was told that as a response to an email sent them about possibly cancelling the Banshees - with the package already in the delivery truck So the domestic/EU distributors must've gotten some more.
Off topic: I got some Dreadblades, too. One will be turned into a Hexwraith since I built one of my originals as a Black Knight for Skirmish. The other one will be turned into a proper knight as a bodyguard foe the Lady Olynder once my army grows, his horse already has barding, now he just needs a proper helmet, the spare lower legs from the Karl Franz kit and a shield. Voila, "Queen's Guard" ghost knight.
The question is what else would make a proper Queen's Guard outside of KoS(oS). I'm reasoning that Valerian told his Queen that stark raving mad - and incorporeal - shroudguard members might be nice, but a solid wall of steel around you has it's benefits as well, no matter if you're a ghost or not. Especially when you enemies are shooting magical lightning or holy handgrenades.
And I really want some Star Wars Imperial Guards looking dudes to break up Olynder's white ghost stuff and the black-clad commoners/chainrasps. What to use, though, both rules wise and models. More imposing looking Grave Guard convetsions (read: bigger ) with Bladegheist rules, as the GG profile has an actually worse save in comparison?!
The problem I see and experience with Chainrasps is that they don't do anything but tarpit. And if your opponent is smart he kills all your buffing leaders and then the Chainrasps. Most Tournament lists find a strong unit and spam it. If you spam Chainrasps (3 full battleline) it will cost you 840 points. You will not have enough to buy all of your heroes and elite units. Sure, you will get to an objective, but an elite unit will plow right into them. So what I have seen is that just about nobody fears Chainrasps, yes they can hold objectives for a little while, but in the end game your support units will be dead because they had to do all the heavy lifting against Characters and elite units, while your Chainrasps camped the objective. Then, your opponent decides which objectives to take and which to contest. Leaving you with a minor victory or a tie, neither of which will place you at the top of the tournament. So I guess what I am trying to say is Chainrasps are good for tarpitting, but their damage output is not that great. That means that while you can hold up a unit, another way of looking at it is that other units can hold up a Chainrasp unit as well. I chose Nighthaunts because I wanted the opposite of a tarpitting army (if you want that, play Maggotkin all day long). Looking at the Battalions, arguably one of the strongest is the Dread Riders. But to take that Battalion will cost too many points if you are also taking maxed out Chainrasps. I guess it's a style of play issue, but I think you win tournaments by making your opponent react to you. If my opponent takes expensive units and camps objectives, I'll ignore them, kill everything else, and then decide which objectives I am going to capture and which I will contest. It is possible that as I go about killing everything except Chainrasps my opponent will get antsy and pull them off the objective to try and stop me, but again, he is reacting to me. I would like to know how Chainrasps have worked from other people because I am trying to make an effective tournament list. Some things look good on paper but not so good on the field.
Honestly Smeelingsalts, it kinda sounds like you don't pay this game competitively.
No shade if you do or don't, but your post completely glosses several important factors.
1st. Chainrasps have decent damage output for how durable they are. Compared to most other horde battleline units, chainrasps can easily out swing and out tank with some Nighthaunt heroes, which are good enough in their own right to not be considered tax.
2nd. In your posts scenario, you likely won the game. Objectives are 100% controlled by model count. Bringing hordes of chainrasps ensures you will control objectives, especially against elite units who will struggle past the 5+ save. Many elite units rely on their rend to do damage. Without it they are glorified clan rats.
3rd. Our Heroes/Spells are very good at dealing with Hordes and Elites. Reikenor and Olynder will gladly whittle down your opponents forces.
4th. The debuffs. With 2 wizards, this is relatively simple to accomplish.
Take a Mourngul, pop the -1 to wound on a unit of chainrasps, hide the mourngul next to the rasps, and mystic shield them. Nobody is going to get through there, save Archaon or Nagash.
Nighthaunts are a super flexible and versatile army. I haven't even gotten into command abilities, our core abilities interactions or relics and battalions.
Also, if you are using Chainrasps, you don't need to take 3 max units. Its all about making a balanced army. You need hammers and anvils, hunter-killers and objective campers.
I just use a single unit of 20. They have yet to disappoint.
Thanks, its cool, no shade but I do play competitively, and that is why I am so concerned about tarpit units. I just don't think they put out enough damage. In my area there are a lot of Nighthaunt players and I see and play a lot of games. So far, Chainrasps are underwhelming. Now I will admit, Nighthaunt vs Nighthaunt may not be a very good stick to judge by, since our armies both have the same abilities, but my units hit harder and have a better save compared to the Chainrasp players.
Smellingsalts wrote: Thanks, its cool, no shade but I do play competitively, and that is why I am so concerned about tarpit units. I just don't think they put out enough damage. In my area there are a lot of Nighthaunt players and I see and play a lot of games. So far, Chainrasps are underwhelming. Now I will admit, Nighthaunt vs Nighthaunt may not be a very good stick to judge by, since our armies both have the same abilities, but my units hit harder and have a better save compared to the Chainrasp players.
Nighthaunt vs Nighthaunt is a terrible stick to judge by--and the idea that tarpit units don't put out enough damage being a bad thing is ridiculous.
They're tarpits. They're not there to carve their way through the enemy, they're there to lock things down or force them to flee and take a penalty.
Pre-orders are up on the New Zealand site. Chainrasps are $83 for "... 20 push-fit components, and is supplied with 10 Citadel 25mm Round bases..." so the kit does have only ten models
Ghaz wrote: Pre-orders are up on the New Zealand site. Chainrasps are $83 for "... 20 push-fit components, and is supplied with 10 Citadel 25mm Round bases..." so the kit does have only ten models
Yep
"this kit assembles 10 Easy To Build Chainrasps" glad I picked up another 20 for £18 the other day but the bits sellers are already upping the price.
Ghaz wrote: Pre-orders are up on the New Zealand site. Chainrasps are $83 for "... 20 push-fit components, and is supplied with 10 Citadel 25mm Round bases..." so the kit does have only ten models
Not only that, but it's the ghostly blue-grey plastic...so it's just them reboxing the stuff from Tempest of Souls.
Well at least we know what will be in the Nighthaunt Start Collecting!
Ghaz wrote: Pre-orders are up on the New Zealand site. Chainrasps are $83 for "... 20 push-fit components, and is supplied with 10 Citadel 25mm Round bases..." so the kit does have only ten models
Cripes. I'm glad I have all the Chainrasps I'll most likely want (60, since I wound up with 3 portions of the Soul Wars box via trades).
I feel like I just grabbed the last decently priced Chainrasps on Ebay. As people have said, the minute this pricing was confirmed, everyone on Ebay doubled the price of their Soul Wars Chainrasps.
Luckily snagged a set of 20, for $40 shipped, but they were even cheaper a week ago when you could get a whole Nighthaunt box-half for $65.
NewTruthNeomaxim wrote: I feel like I just grabbed the last decently priced Chainrasps on Ebay. As people have said, the minute this pricing was confirmed, everyone on Ebay doubled the price of their Soul Wars Chainrasps.
Luckily snagged a set of 20, for $40 shipped, but they were even cheaper a week ago when you could get a whole Nighthaunt box-half for $65.
The more GW changes, the more they stay the same. At least atrociously priced Fyreslayers make more than one thing, and aren't just a reboxed starter set kit.
Genuinely surprised at the pricing. $5 less than 10 reapers is a bit nuts. I'd have thought 20 for that price. Oh well. I have 100 and don't expect to need more.
The comparison to Storm Strike makes it really hurt. That's the same price and also is a bunch of new monopose figures, but there's 15 instead of 10 and you get other stuff in the box.
AegisGrimm wrote: Ah, but Storm Strike doesn't have models that people are going to want to field a bunch of, does it?
Myrmourn Banshees and the Stormcast side of things, for sure, people will want multiples of.
The issue is the Glaivewraith Stalkers and the other 'bits' that it comes with. I'm really not sure what possessed them to release the Chainrasp this way.
AegisGrimm wrote: Ah, but Storm Strike doesn't have models that people are going to want to field a bunch of, does it?
Correct. Storm Strike has 15 models in total (7 Stormcasts and 8 Nighthaunt) and not a single Chainrasp model.
Sorry. Was being sarcastic, bit it didn't carry over as text.
By that statement I meant that this was a well-calculated decision to milk a core troop that people will surely want multiple boxes of. Really sucks as it screwed the secondary market of the Nighthaunt starter half for those of use who dont want/need the Stormcast.
Its (kind of) like if Liberators/Bloodreavers had been released as 10 of the push-fit starter set models for 40-60 bucks.
In my eyes they are not ideally taken in 5-man units anyways. Nighthaunt are big on returning slain models but they cannot do anything about a unit that is destroyed entirely. Certain context can make a 5-man unit more useful but in such a case it would be simple to run two such units. What would be irksome is if it was something like a 7-man box.
Agreed. That's why I was going to take them as a 15-man unit
GW's Facebook guy gave a little feedback on the complaints about the Chainrasp pricing...
Warhammer Age of Sigmar wrote:Hi Andy,
We're very aware that you are a champion of this hobby, and we're grateful for all the incredibly helpful contributions you make on this page answering people's questions.
We're passing everyone's feedback received over the weekend on up the chain, and rest assured that this is amongst that feedback.
Thank you for sharing this with us, we truly do appreciate it.
Those bladegheists have some really neat swords. I hope there’s going to be a Free Peoples unit that has non-rotten equivalents at some point because that would look awesome with some plate armour.
Mr_Rose wrote: Those bladegheists have some really neat swords. I hope there’s going to be a Free Peoples unit that has non-rotten equivalents at some point because that would look awesome with some plate armour.
Eehh, sorta?
I guess I really just want greatswords that look sharp and easy to manoeuvre; the old greatswords look like their blades weigh 50lbs or something, and they’re having a hard time just lifting them, never mind performing combat manoeuvres.
Especially that dude at the back who’s like “oh no, I leaned it too far!” and is about to fall over backwards…
Edit: could do with a new look too; slashed sleeves and doublets are, like, sooo last incarnation.
Agreed. That's why I was going to take them as a 15-man unit
GW's Facebook guy gave a little feedback on the complaints about the Chainrasp pricing...
Warhammer Age of Sigmar wrote:Hi Andy,
We're very aware that you are a champion of this hobby, and we're grateful for all the incredibly helpful contributions you make on this page answering people's questions.
We're passing everyone's feedback received over the weekend on up the chain, and rest assured that this is amongst that feedback.
Thank you for sharing this with us, we truly do appreciate it.
We'll see if anything comes of it.
I have it! GW releases a 10-man box with a ridiculous price knowing everyone will hate it, then waits a month and releases a 20-man box at a way better price and everyone applauds! It's just like new coke!
By the looks of it, there's no duplicates in the 10 man box. I haven't seen any nighthaunt up close yet but it seems like a hard bunch of models to make a multipose kit for; if theý'd have gone with a 5 man box we'd likely have had half the poses available? Seems like a reasonable tradeoff for more model variety, TBH... But maybe I'm missing something.
Ghaz wrote: That sounds like something Kirby would have done but in reverse (replace 20-man boxes with 10-man boxes).
I think if anything does happen it will be a price cut on the 10-man box, with later runs maybe being 20-man boxes.
Ehhh...I can't see a price cut(it's not really something GW does)--but I could see a Nighthaunt Skirmish set that features them at a discounted price.
The price cut would realistically be the only option available if they want to do something before the release this weekend. It's too late to do a reboxing since the product is already on it's way to the retailers and most likely would have to wait for the next run of Chainrasps.
I frankly don't see anything happening at all, its not like pricing changed on any Fyreslayers box, (short of the Start Collecting set that came out after some time).
AegisGrimm wrote: I frankly don't see anything happening at all, its not like pricing changed on any Fyreslayers box, (short of the Start Collecting set that came out after some time).
They have changed some stuff though. Liberators were £30 for 5. Now they are £37.50 for 10.
We are all pretty used to high prices for GW products, but the chainrasps still stand out.
AegisGrimm wrote: I frankly don't see anything happening at all, its not like pricing changed on any Fyreslayers box, (short of the Start Collecting set that came out after some time).
The Magmadroth and Carnosaurs both got shuffled off to Direct Only.
Midnightdeathblade wrote: Any word on a box release for Castigators? The Warhammer community post made it sound like this is the last release for both armies.
Castigators are priced in the book in units of 3 - they clearly planned this around the ETB box. So no, there won't be any more Castigators. TBH it wouldnt be necessary. There are already too many unit choices - I say this as a Stormcast player.
AegisGrimm wrote: I frankly don't see anything happening at all, its not like pricing changed on any Fyreslayers box, (short of the Start Collecting set that came out after some time).
The Magmadroth and Carnosaurs both got shuffled off to Direct Only.
Aye but both are also sold in the getting started boxed set for those factions - and with all the other models there's just no reason to order one alone from the GW website since ordering alone is the same price as with all the other getting started stuff. I think its just there because the GW store is also akin to a product description and faction outline page (which is why they also double list product boxes which have multiple builds within them)
AegisGrimm wrote: I frankly don't see anything happening at all, its not like pricing changed on any Fyreslayers box, (short of the Start Collecting set that came out after some time).
The Magmadroth and Carnosaurs both got shuffled off to Direct Only.
Aye but both are also sold in the getting started boxed set for those factions - and with all the other models there's just no reason to order one alone from the GW website since ordering alone is the same price as with all the other getting started stuff. I think its just there because the GW store is also akin to a product description and faction outline page (which is why they also double list product boxes which have multiple builds within them)
Actually, you cannot buy neither the Magmadroth nor the Carnosaur solo. Both items' pages outright tell you you are also gettin the units of the start collecting (because that's the only box they sell for them now.
AegisGrimm wrote: I frankly don't see anything happening at all, its not like pricing changed on any Fyreslayers box, (short of the Start Collecting set that came out after some time).
The Magmadroth and Carnosaurs both got shuffled off to Direct Only.
Aye but both are also sold in the getting started boxed set for those factions - and with all the other models there's just no reason to order one alone from the GW website since ordering alone is the same price as with all the other getting started stuff. I think its just there because the GW store is also akin to a product description and faction outline page (which is why they also double list product boxes which have multiple builds within them)
Actually, you cannot buy neither the Magmadroth nor the Carnosaur solo. Both items' pages outright tell you you are also gettin the units of the start collecting (because that's the only box they sell for them now.
Which IIRC is a good thing because you used to be able to buy them solo which was the same price as the start collecting which contained them and other models. So they got rid of the solo option to avoid people mistakenly purchasing just the one.
It's great to see those iconic (once the biggest!) models on sale. Though I must admit I never liked the design of those dragons - I totally see where they got the inspiration and why they are shaped like that (old wyrms - and when the ywre all metal GW didn't want to be making and shipping solid slabs of metal for heavier/larger bodied dragons).
I find bones white PVC holds up to heat so much better than finecast. Bones eventually goes back to its old form but once finecast bends it's permanent. You have to heat it up and manually bend it back.
So the battletomes for Bonesplittaz, Beastclaw Raiders, Seraphon, Fyreslayers, and Pestillens are no longer on the web store. Not "Last Chance to Buy". Not "Temporarily Out of Stock". Just gone. Let the speculation begin!
EnTyme wrote: So the battletomes for Bonesplittaz, Beastclaw Raiders, Seraphon, Fyreslayers, and Pestillens are no longer on the web store. Not "Last Chance to Buy". Not "Temporarily Out of Stock". Just gone. Let the speculation begin!
No they aren't. They are in the US store.
EDIT: Sorry, looks like the physical ones are missing. They just have the electronic ones. Probably a reprint? But like you say, if they were just running low and doing another print run it would probably say temporarily out of stock. Not sure why they would remove the physical books and leave the electronic ones.
If they were pulling those books, they would have pulled the digital versions as well. I agree that it's probably just a reprint (maybe updated with AoS 2.0 rules but probably not).
Ghaz wrote: If they were pulling those books, they would have pulled the digital versions as well. I agree that it's probably just a reprint (maybe updated with AoS 2.0 rules but probably not).
It's worth noting that all of those books also had the actual rules for original AoS in the back of them.
Ghaz wrote: If they were pulling those books, they would have pulled the digital versions as well. I agree that it's probably just a reprint (maybe updated with AoS 2.0 rules but probably not).
It's worth noting that all of those books also had the actual rules for original AoS in the back of them.
I know that Idoneth didn't.
Ironjawz and Disciples of Tzeentch have the 1.0 rules in their battletomes.
Could be a staggered thing. Do these and then the next ones up until the Daughters of Khaine.The e-pub versions can still be sold as that's easy to update through a new patch.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: Could be a staggered thing. Do these and then the next ones up until the Daughters of Khaine.The e-pub versions can still be sold as that's easy to update through a new patch.
Ah, good point. Probably an minor update to the print versions to remove the 1.0 rules from the back then.
What's weird is that there isn't any sort of pattern that I can see. Bonesplittaz and Beastclaw raiders already have Allegiance Abilites and Artifacts in the tomes, so they aren't just adding the GHB rules to the tomes, and it isn't just about the age of the tomes since Everchosen and FEC books are still available. Tzeentch and Ironjawz have the 1.0 rules in the back, so it doesn't seem to be that either.
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: Could be a staggered thing. Do these and then the next ones up until the Daughters of Khaine.The e-pub versions can still be sold as that's easy to update through a new patch.
Ah, good point. Probably an minor update to the print versions to remove the 1.0 rules from the back then.
Seems like they'd probably do all of them then. The Sylvaneth tome for example has the 1.0 rules. They actually handled this in the errata as well. That's what this is about:
Pages 141-144 – The Rules
These rules are no longer used. Use the most recent
core rules instead.
Like I said, it could just be a case of staggering them so they don't all disappear off the site at the same time. And if they are updating the rules in the back to 2.0, they may as well update everything, such as points for the books that never had them, allegiance abilities etc at the same time to get them all up to the same standard.
I'd guess when they sell down the point a re-print run is ordered they'll be pulled for an edit to v2.0 instead, so there won't be any 'planning' as such, rather it will depend on what people buy
(unless they have planned updates in the works which will occur as normal)
I've been wanting and trying to buy the new Stormcast and Nighthaunt battletomes for quite a few weeks now - they've been OOS for a while.
This is a bit different as those two books are really new, while the ones that were mentioned are some of the early books.
Also the Nighthaunt and Stormcast books are still listed on GW's website (albeit they're listed as Temporarily Out of Stock Online). The books mentioned above are missing altogether.
Ah well. A shame about the lack of hats but it makes more sense this way.
Also, yeah, cool herdstone;like how it’s chained down, just in case someone tries to steal it…
Mr_Rose wrote: Ah well. A shame about the lack of hats but it makes more sense this way.
Also, yeah, cool herdstone;like how it’s chained down, just in case someone tries to steal it…
Well, beastmen tend to live in the rougher neighbouhoods!
Chains also help against it being toppled over by drunk giants, minotaurs headbutting each other or excessive pumbagor...reproduction. Oh, and dragons taking off nearby or landing outside the markerlights to show off.
Already got Tzaangors to be fair, whcih might hint at more to come. I'd be amazed if Pestigors didn't come back at some stage given how much love Nurgle gets from GW.
This Battletome deals with more than just the brayherds, it compiles many of the bestial creatures of Chaos into a single unholy tome including Bullgors, Dragon Ogors, Tzaangor and more besides. A Beasts of Chaos force represents the untamed inhuman nature of Chaos is all its glory – a single army, with powerful, overlapping allegiance abilities, magical lores, and spells.
Chikout wrote: How has someone got the October white dwarf already, and what other Secrets does it contain?
Usually it's someone at the printers that does those kinds of leaks.
GW themselves have said it's a September release though. So it'll probably be riiiiiiiiight at the end of September, coming out in October so it won't be in September's White Dwarf.
Minotaurs are beautifull. I have the 5 mierce ones+hero+9 gw ones+doombull.
And GW has just gave me an excuse to buy a box of tzaangors and dragon ogres. Thanks, Roundtree.
This Battletome deals with more than just the brayherds, it compiles many of the bestial creatures of Chaos into a single unholy tome including Bullgors, Dragon Ogors, Tzaangor and more besides.
Bolded was unexpected, but very, very much welcome.
From the lore standpoint, Tzaangors hate regular beastmen because they are so over the top savage, so I thought they would remain a part of DoT. The combination of the other factions was getting me excited enough, but now I have a reason to paint my Tzaangor Skyfires and their Shaman!
eflix29 wrote:I hope we can play full Minotaures, maybe they will be battleline if the general is a Minotaure Lord...
Twisting catacombs Minotaures could make an army of their own in AoS
Spoiler:
YES! Man I hope they do allow for Minotaur led armies. I’ve got enough minotaurs to do it, and that’s just more interesting to me than a bunch of beastmen. TC, Mierce, scibor, have all made amazing 3rd party minotaur models, so we’re spoiled for choice for models. I’d love rules for a minotaur magic user as well.
Mysterio wrote:Sad that it wasn’t the return of the Chaos Dwarves.
Maybe someday...
Doubly sad that the plastic Minotaurs are going to showing up again in official GW pics - maybe they’ll get a better paint job this time around?
Agreed. I’d love to see CD come back, but at least they have some representation in the rules thanks to the FW stuff. It would be a bit silly for them to get a reboot before slaanesh makes a full come back imo. I would buy them though!
I think the current plastic minotaurs are fine, but the do need better paint jobs. They and the beastmen have WAY too much flesh showing imo. I paint all mine as though they have a ‘thin layer of fuzz’, so they don’t look like a bunch of naked bodybuilders... I feel the Shaggoth (or whatever it’s called now), needs an update badly, as I’ve never liked that model. The beast boars could use updates as well. Plus, I’m a little sad we have yet to see pestigors, khornigors, and slaanagors yet, since those tzaanagors are amazing!
I already loaded up on Mierce Miniatures minotaurs during one of their 50% off metals sales...I just need to come up with a musician conversion for the mierce minotaurs.
Usually behind you...... maybe soon but with few/no new models?
They will receive at least a few models. All new/updated battletomes with spellcasters were confirmed to receive unique endless spells with their battletomes back when they did the Malign Sorcery reveal on Warhammer TV.
I think goblins will get a larger release to exaggerate the fungusness- I am making assumptions of course, but it makes sense to me that some cave style goblins arrive in the same style as the Cave Shaman and the previewed troggoth.
So I'll be able to use all my Beastmen, eh? All "however many were in the gor+ungor box set" of them!
Beastmen are so cool but always lacked something in the model department. Be it being a metal only range, to nice infantry but no other units in plastic to finally "oh god it's in plastic but as bad as the plastic rat ogres kit and the cool stuff got finecasted". The minotaurs are just BAD and I dislike the scaly parts of the dragon ogres as well. I was close to starting an army in 6th, but Centigor and Khorngor price stopped my teen self. New releases were sadly never as good as the big standard gors. I might get a few more infantry beastmen to buff what I have to useable size as an allied unit and the endless spells to convert them into other Nurgle stuff, but I won't start a new army.
Unless those minotaurs posted above come out soon. They'll soon be done with KS orders and sell those amazing cows, right? Please? I could use a 3 cow unit, maybe more.
I assume goblins are coming later with a bigger release, yeah. We've seen that fungus troll previewed. I hope they take the chance to recombine some more factions and include spiderfang in there.
The fact that they're apparently willing to do more "Legions of Nagash"-style recombining makes me hopeful that one for Skaven is coming. That's a group that's currently broken up to the point of absurdity.
This is the type of book you'd want to see after Khorne and Slaanesh got their coming 'upgrades', as it would mean that the benefits of (potential) new Beastmen, like the Tzangors, would filter through to this new book.
Sadly it's coming out before then, which means Beastmen will be frozen in stasis for another cycle.
And no plastic Shaggoth. That's a shame, 'cause as awesome as that model is it'd be nice to have a big new super-duper plastic one. They could even do it like the GUO kit and include a special character (Kholek Suneater, naturally!).
H.B.M.C. wrote: This is the type of book you'd want to see after Khorne and Slaanesh got their coming 'upgrades', as it would mean that the benefits of (potential) new Beastmen, like the Tzangors, would filter through to this new book.
Sadly it's coming out before then, which means Beastmen will be frozen in stasis for another cycle.
And no plastic Shaggoth. That's a shame, 'cause as awesome as that model is it'd be nice to have a big new super-duper plastic one. They could even do it like the GUO kit and include a special character (Kholek Suneater, naturally!).
Not really. As long as they include the correct keyword with the potential new beastmen than it works just fine.
TheWaspinator wrote: I assume goblins are coming later with a bigger release, yeah. We've seen that fungus troll previewed. I hope they take the chance to recombine some more factions and include spiderfang in there.
The fact that they're apparently willing to do more "Legions of Nagash"-style recombining makes me hopeful that one for Skaven is coming. That's a group that's currently broken up to the point of absurdity.
The herdstone is cool, but you gotta build your own. And add trophies after each game if you defeat your opponent. It's tradition.
I hope more armies get books like this or Legions of Nagash. I think it'd be a really good thing if all the splinters of factions were made whole again.
eflix29 wrote: I hope we can play full Minotaures, maybe they will be battleline if the general is a Minotaure Lord...
Twisting catacombs Minotaures could make an army of their own in AoS
Those mini's are great any everything, but is there a way to obtain the mini's outside the kickstarter? I passed on them when the kickstarter was active because AoS was going through a bit of a lapse in my area and now I don't see them on the the company's store. :(
This Beasts of Chaos book is excellent news. I painted one unit of them Tzaangor and hated them so much they got shelved. They may get some table time as part of a Beasts army now.
The Ghorgon/Cygor model has a ton of options, it would be cool if they made a character or named model with a certain build from it.
Hulksmash wrote: Not really. As long as they include the correct keyword with the potential new beastmen than it works just fine.
My point is I think that this makes "potential new beastmen" a less likely thing.
I don't think it does, under the current paradigm. GW won't shy away from putting Slaangors or whatever they are called into the Super Dooper Slaanesh Tome and making them usable by Beasts of Chaos despite not being in that book. Warscrolls being scattered all over the place is a normal thing for AoS.
eflix29 wrote: I hope we can play full Minotaures, maybe they will be battleline if the general is a Minotaure Lord...
Twisting catacombs Minotaures could make an army of their own in AoS
Those mini's are great any everything, but is there a way to obtain the mini's outside the kickstarter? I passed on them when the kickstarter was active because AoS was going through a bit of a lapse in my area and now I don't see them on the the company's store. :(
The KS is still in the process of delivering, I'd expect to see them in the Zealot store once it's complete
Does anybody have a link to that piece of art that has Freeguild soldiers fighting alongside Stormcast Eternals? I've been digging through this topic for some time now but I can't find it.
BrookM wrote: Does anybody have a link to that piece of art that has Freeguild soldiers fighting alongside Stormcast Eternals? I've been digging through this topic for some time now but I can't find it.
Huh... that piece of art has a Sacrosanct guy in it, with gloriously glowing hair. Could suggest that those free guild champs may end up as proper models, as wasn't this piece of art sited before the Sacrosanct were announced?
ph34r wrote: Am I blind, where are the freeguild in that picture? I see chaos dudes on the left, stormcast on the right, not seeing any regular human good guys
On the left, look at the Chaos Knight on horse with what looks to be a Chaos Standard. Then look at what he is stabbing below him.
And no, you aren't blind. Nobody really noticed it until someone blew up the picture, now you can't miss them if you had seen that exploded view.
ph34r wrote: Am I blind, where are the freeguild in that picture? I see chaos dudes on the left, stormcast on the right, not seeing any regular human good guys
Looks like they were doing a bit of a Last Stand against the Slaves of Darkness/Bloodbound when the Stormcast arrived.
Since GW doesn’t appear to be doing new models for them, I’ll mention this recent release as a nice proxy for Dragon Ogres, Chosen of Everblight from Warmachine.
AduroT wrote: Since GW doesn’t appear to be doing new models for them, I’ll mention this recent release as a nice proxy for Dragon Ogres, Chosen of Everblight from Warmachine.
"Nice".... But there is no need to proxy normal dragon ogers - it's really just the shaggoth that needs a new version, at least concerning the resin to plastic transition.
Sorry if it's of topic, but does anybody else remember GW previewing the double height Azurite ruins. The ones with the upper floor? I don't think they ever released them yet.
Marleymoo wrote: Sorry if it's of topic, but does anybody else remember GW previewing the double height Azurite ruins. The ones with the upper floor? I don't think they ever released them yet.
Wow are those everblight models expensive. And not really that big. I don't think they'd look right on 90x52mm ovals at all. The current GW plastic kit does.
TheWaspinator wrote:I asked Zealot about the minotaurs on Facebook and they said two months.
Excellent, thanks. Price will be a killer I guess, but serves me right for not knowing about their KS
AduroT wrote:I don’t think I knew GW had done a plastic Dragon Ogre kit, which was why I mentioned those Chosen.
I had a similiar realisation about Cygors and a ton of Tyranids when I replaced GW with PP and KS projects for a couple of years. "Wait, where did THAT huge kit come from?!" several times in a row upon seeing a Nid army posted I think I was around for the plastic Dragon Ogres and greatly disappointes about their IMO sub-par dragon bodies.
And I'd take a new Shaggoth in a heartbeat, but the current one is still a great sculpt. The Chimera and Manticore are straight trash in comparison and a huge waste of a release slot. Most good looking alterative models are gigantic and/or really expensive to boot! It sucks!
PS: During yesterday's sale I picked up a Maw Krusha for 22£ on a bits site. Now WHAT should I use it for in my Nurgle hordes?! I was thinking maybe Slaughter Brute, Chimera or Jabberslythe. I thought Chimera at first, but I didn't get a LoC head to stick it on.
Binabik15 wrote: PS: During yesterday's sale I picked up a Maw Krusha for 22£ on a bits site. Now WHAT should I use it for in my Nurgle hordes?! I was thinking maybe Slaughter Brute, Chimera or Jabberslythe. I thought Chimera at first, but I didn't get a LoC head to stick it on.
Marleymoo wrote: Sorry if it's of topic, but does anybody else remember GW previewing the double height Azurite ruins. The ones with the upper floor? I don't think they ever released them yet.
It wasn't just my imagination was it?
You didn't imagine them
Spoiler:
First shown in May so they should be within the 3 month release window but must have got bumped. Waiting to get a set or two myself. Ray implied there was more to come in the video he did for Warhammer TV about the Kill Team terrain.
Marleymoo wrote: Sorry if it's of topic, but does anybody else remember GW previewing the double height Azurite ruins. The ones with the upper floor? I don't think they ever released them yet.
It wasn't just my imagination was it?
You didn't imagine them
Spoiler:
First shown in May so they should be within the 3 month release window but must have got bumped. Waiting to get a set or two myself. Ray implied there was more to come in the video he did for Warhammer TV about the Kill Team terrain.
I wish this ruins are for for a new game as kill team, but in AoS.
Marleymoo wrote: Sorry if it's of topic, but does anybody else remember GW previewing the double height Azurite ruins. The ones with the upper floor? I don't think they ever released them yet.
It wasn't just my imagination was it?
You didn't imagine them
Spoiler:
First shown in May so they should be within the 3 month release window but must have got bumped. Waiting to get a set or two myself. Ray implied there was more to come in the video he did for Warhammer TV about the Kill Team terrain.
hotsauceman1 wrote: I hope they will include stuff like the FW Chaos beasts like the Bull centaurs, preyton, Skinwalkers and other things
GW doesn't usually put Forgeworld warscrolls in a GW publication. You'll have to wait for Forgeworld to update those warscrolls. Related question: is the Mournghul available for Legions of Nagash?
hotsauceman1 wrote: I hope they will include stuff like the FW Chaos beasts like the Bull centaurs, preyton, Skinwalkers and other things
GW doesn't usually put Forgeworld warscrolls in a GW publication. You'll have to wait for Forgeworld to update those warscrolls. Related question: is the Mournghul available for Legions of Nagash?
Thankfully it is not. LoN are overpowered enough as it is, they do not need a tool like that to stack with Neffy.
New models/sculpts for both sides?
Khorne needs plastic fleshhounds, herald on foot, and herald on jugger.
Slaanesh needs plastic herald on foot and steed, fiends. Plus Keeper of Secrets.
And any new units that get added.
Yes. New models for both sides. Still not 100% on the details, but it looks like it will be a system agnostic stand alone game set in the Realm of Chaos. Probably coming in 2018.
The branding doesn't seem right for that. This is Realm of Chaos: Wrath and Rapture, rather than Age of Sigmar: Realm of Chaos. I would expect another Realm of Chaos box, pitting Tzeentch against Nurgle. Get both boxes, play the Great Game.
streetsamurai wrote: Not sure it will be stand alone game. Might only be a bundle set a la Stormclaw
The report from an attendee is that it is "a standalone thing but not just standalone, with new models for Slaanesh and Khorne"
Here is the video.
https://youtu.be/VgRs7oe1K3U
Plastic Fiends and Flesh Hounds are two things I've been waiting for for ages now.
My Nurgle and Tzeentch Daemonic legions are complete, and whilst I have tons of metal Blood Letters, Diaz Daemonettes/Seekers, and a good number of plastic Bloodcrushers, I've always avoided the metal Flesh Hounds and Fiends 'cause I knew they'd get to 'em one day.
Huge slaanesh fan. Abit mixed on this. The biggest thing about slaanesh is that their mortal units are VERY limited compared to the other 3 of the big 4. A box set focusing on deamon v. deamon conflict is a bit disappointing in that regard.
But it is cool that this means we will prob get a plastic greater demon finally.
To be fair the big limit on Slaanesh models is mostly because the faction in 40K and Sigmar hasn't had much attention in ages. Nurgle has had LOADS and Khorn and Tzeentch have had quite a lot (indeed one would think that someone in GW is addicted to Nurgle!)
Slaanesh has thus been left in the dust by the others - having far fewer models and choices not so much by design but by just not being focused on for ages.
Look at that little cute maggot ridden pus oozing, belly spilling puppy of a nurgle monster! It just wants to run up and lick you all over and bounce around until you're as putrid and rotting as it is !
Of course, in a perfect world we'd have "Numerous Mortal" and "Elite Mortal" for each of the Chaos Gods, so:
Kairic Acolytes
Tzaangors
Bloodreavers
Blood Warriors
[Something Slaaneshi]
[Something more Slaaneshi]
[Something Nurglesque]
Blight Knights
Yeah, a little variety in the infantry department wouldn't go amiss. This box will hopefully add more than just the daemon kits we're missing, but being titled Realm of Chaos it's probably going to be just daemons. Which still leaves mortal Slaaneshis in big need of new models.
Still, Maybe we'll get some new Slaaneshi daemons out of this and not just redone metal/Finecast.
I mean this is a great way to get the daemons out and then the Emperors Children Codex / Cult Of Slaanesh Battletome or whatever, can focus on the non daemon elements,
And boom, whole range redone.
Look at the Orks codex, speed freaks is gonna get some of the vehicles out, then the book can release the rest/ characters / unit resculpts.
Danny76 wrote: For those saying they wish for Mortal Slaanesh.
I mean this is a great way to get the daemons out and then the Emperors Children Codex / Cult Of Slaanesh Battletome or whatever, can focus on the non daemon elements,
And boom, whole range redone.
That's what I'm hoping for. It worked for Tzeentch/1KSons and Nurgle/Death Guard (well, not the box of 7 marines for the price of 10, but that was one hiccup).
And all of the Nurgle stuff basically being mono-pose. That was a bigger hiccup.
And a weird amount of Ezy-2-Build stuff.
Which in turn limited lots of options 'cause no model/no rule.
The 7 thing sucked, great options in there though..
(Thinking of that I wonder how that stuff would work with spare marine bodies or something...)
Monopose, Definitely sucked. I hate having repeats in my armies, pox and cultists I can paint scheme to vary, with minor conversions.
But the non MP bits ere tricky.
E2B. Eh it’s fine, as it was good to get people into the game, and meant we got more kits than we might of (arguably at a better price).
I just only have one of each E2B, as with the monopose above..
The Beast Of Nurgle, just having his right arm posesble would have been something..
Danny76 wrote: The 7 thing sucked, great options in there though.. (Thinking of that I wonder how that stuff would work with spare marine bodies or something...)
Monopose, Definitely sucked. I hate having repeats in my armies, pox and cultists I can paint scheme to vary, with minor conversions. But the non MP bits ere tricky.
E2B. Eh it’s fine, as it was good to get people into the game, and meant we got more kits than we might of (arguably at a better price). I just only have one of each E2B, as with the monopose above..
The Beast Of Nurgle, just having his right arm posesble would have been something..
the deathguard bits are too large for standard marine bodies (I now have some primeris from Conquest I'll need to try), but with a bit of converting the spare torsos can be added to Calth bodies/legs to make extra Blightlord terminators with their of spare arms
AduroT wrote: Since GW doesn’t appear to be doing new models for them, I’ll mention this recent release as a nice proxy for Dragon Ogres, Chosen of Everblight from Warmachine.
Gawd, they look even worse than the GW versions, no mean feat.
And lol at those plastic Minotaurs still being a thing. If you dry brushed a particularly tough banana loaf turd, you’d still have something more attractive.
Manchu wrote: The branding doesn't seem right for that. This is Realm of Chaos: Wrath and Rapture, rather than Age of Sigmar: Realm of Chaos. I would expect another Realm of Chaos box, pitting Tzeentch against Nurgle. Get both boxes, play the Great Game.
Marleymoo wrote: The Warhammer underworlds stuff usually translates over to aos doesn't it?
Because I definitely need more troggoths and bat squigs in my life.
Kinda?
They usually get added in as some kind of unit(or in the case of the Fyreslayers: units) that aren't amazing outside of the models.
Speculation on my part for what we'll see, bolded are the ones we've already seen:
Sacrosanct Chamber Nighthaunt Moonclan Grots Some form of Aelf--I'm leaning personally towards Wanderers(there's been a Nomad Prince trapped in Shadespire for quite some time it seems ). Since I can't see a second Stormcast team this time around, I'm leaning towards Aelves taking their place.
Kharadron Overlords--We know they've looted Shadespire! They found a mirror containing an incredibly vain soul, and then the Overlords who pillaged it disappeared.
Tzeentch Arcanites--It's a city full of magical artifacts. If they're not trying to pillage it, they're doing it wrong. Seekers of Slaanesh--This is a bit off the cuff but it seems like an appropriate place for them to make an early appearance. Shadespire, like Slaanesh, is 'trapped' between two Realms. Maybe they went there to try to find Sigvald's soul trapped in that mirror and ended up trapped themselves--or maybe they think they found a backdoor into Slaanesh's prison?
The Briar Queen from Nightvault has already been mentioned in the Nighthaunt battletome (pg. 19):
THE BRIAR QUEEN
The Briar Queen – nemesis of the cursed city of Shadespire – is unleashed by Nagash to menace other lands. She is tasked with claiming certain souls that have cheated Nagash. With the aid of her spectral army – the Thorns of the Briar Queen – she visits each of the Mortal Realms, always bringing back her target’s soul. Between missions the Briar Queen returns to Shadespire, for her need for vengeance there remains unsatisfied.
Hopefully her rules for Age of Sigmar has her as a Hero and not just a unit.
Is it time we admitted to ourselves that all the buzz around Moonclan was based on Underworlds and there will be no grots or fungus-based airships between Beastmen and Slaanesh?
lord_blackfang wrote: Is it time we admitted to ourselves that all the buzz around Moonclan was based on Underworlds and there will be no grots or fungus-based airships between Beastmen and Slaanesh?
Well, it just might take another year. We had Idoneth rumours 1.5 years before release (as Cthulu Sea Elves).
lord_blackfang wrote: Is it time we admitted to ourselves that all the buzz around Moonclan was based on Underworlds and there will be no grots or fungus-based airships between Beastmen and Slaanesh?
I could live with that. The sooner Slaanesh comes, the better.
lord_blackfang wrote: Is it time we admitted to ourselves that all the buzz around Moonclan was based on Underworlds and there will be no grots or fungus-based airships between Beastmen and Slaanesh?
I could live with that. The sooner Slaanesh comes, the better.
lord_blackfang wrote: Is it time we admitted to ourselves that all the buzz around Moonclan was based on Underworlds and there will be no grots or fungus-based airships between Beastmen and Slaanesh?
This preview covers the next three months or so, so I doubt we're getting Moonclan before Christmas. I still have faith though.
Seekers of Slaanesh--This is a bit off the cuff but it seems like an appropriate place for them to make an early appearance. Shadespire, like Slaanesh, is 'trapped' between two Realms. Maybe they went there to try to find Sigvald's soul trapped in that mirror and ended up trapped themselves--or maybe they think they found a backdoor into Slaanesh's prison?
I see what you did there!
Maybe?
(Not sure if I want to know if you did that on purpose or not... )
Anyway, you're right, as this would be a great place to start the...slow build up to a Slaaneshi release.
I'd love to see something for Khorne that fit between Bloodletter and Bloodthirster. Flesh Hounds are going to be nice, but I'd love to see something Beast of Nurgle size that could function as an independent monster that isn't centerpiece model priced.
At this point for Slaanesh, I'm of the anything goes mindset. Much like Slaanesh itself.
Again, there is no "Dakka" in the sense that you mean it.
So, who actually said that then?
Unless a Mod locks it up and or deletes it, yes it's Dakka who says it. It's up to the mods what they let on this site. So if they leave it on the site, then it's Dakka who says it. Just like when people say "I read this on Bolter" or "Bolter said this" it's all the same. Dakka is a place to come for rumours so if anything is posted on Dakka and a Mod didn't delete it, then Dakka said it.
Again, there is no "Dakka" in the sense that you mean it.
So, who actually said that then?
Unless a Mod locks it up and or deletes it, yes it's Dakka who says it. It's up to the mods what they let on this site. So if they leave it on the site, then it's Dakka who says it. Just like when people say "I read this on Bolter" or "Bolter said this" it's all the same. Dakka is a place to come for rumours so if anything is posted on Dakka and a Mod didn't delete it, then Dakka said it.
I guess I look at it in a different way. I will say no more. We can alwasy make a new thread in Dakka Discussions if we need to.
*edit*
So no new minis for Beastherds? Just making sure just in case I missed a few posts.
There was no official stance made by Dakka, only opinions posted by forum users. BoLS and Spikey made official stances as sites. Those are not the same thing, basic definition.
"The sky is the same color as the ground."
"No, they are different colors."
"I guess I look at it a different way."
lord_blackfang wrote: Is it time we admitted to ourselves that all the buzz around Moonclan was based on Underworlds and there will be no grots or fungus-based airships between Beastmen and Slaanesh?
I don't think the airships will be fungus based. The way it seems is that Moonclan (the future night goblins) are going to be a more separate from the Sky faction of goblins (Future Forest Goblins? Smarter Snotlings? Who knows!)
lord_blackfang wrote: Is it time we admitted to ourselves that all the buzz around Moonclan was based on Underworlds and there will be no grots or fungus-based airships between Beastmen and Slaanesh?
I don't think the airships will be fungus based. The way it seems is that Moonclan (the future night goblins) are going to be a more separate from the Sky faction of goblins (Future Forest Goblins? Smarter Snotlings? Who knows!)
Would be hilarious if they pulled a concept thrown out in Warhammer Online. One of the proposals for transportation for the Orcs and Goblins was an airship where the ballon was an inflated squig with a rope tied around its bum-hole. They would loosen the rope for "propulsion". It sadly never made it into the game
highlord tamburlaine wrote: I'd love to see something for Khorne that fit between Bloodletter and Bloodthirster. Flesh Hounds are going to be nice, but I'd love to see something Beast of Nurgle size that could function as an independent monster that isn't centerpiece model priced.
Wouldn't that be the Bloodcrushers and/or Juggernauts? Demon princes, Heralds on chariots also sort of fill that role.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: While Princes and Heralds fill the role I'm thinking of, I'm just going to feel greedy and want more new Khrone stuff just because.
Hell, I probably have more proxy Bloodthirsters than I do official ones at this point...
As well as a new Fiend and of course Keeper Of Secrets, what I really want for Slaanesh
is some kind of additionnal sprue for the deamonettes with:
-Heads (the more "human" ones with) with smiling faces (to actually try to lure something...)
-A pair of bodies with "dancing" poses
-A arm with a short, curved sword
This will make them fare more interesting to build in my opinion, and the sprue
could be used for the seekers too!
Geifer wrote:Anyway, you're right, as this would be a great place to start the...slow build up to a Slaaneshi release.
Some teasing and toys shown before we get to play it would be great! It's coming, butt there is not need to rush it; I'm sure GW don't want to seem inexperienced by having it all be over too soon.
There's not enough crazyness in GW daemons. Too much thing that seems to be directly out of human civilizations (cavalry, chariot etc). Hopefully they get a bit more original with this release, and fiends are a perfect opportunity for that
I still think Raging Heroes' Death Dancers are the sort of direction I'd like to see the Daemonettes get taken- crazy poses and all sorts of ornamental extra limbs.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: While Princes and Heralds fill the role I'm thinking of, I'm just going to feel greedy and want more new Khrone stuff just because.
Hell, I probably have more proxy Bloodthirsters than I do official ones at this point...
Furies could use an update as well.
Furies should just be axed at this point. The models are just awful, and the undivided daemons-but-now-must-be-marked thing is just a thematic and fluff boondoggle.
Just add some more god-appropriate fast/flyer models to the non-Nurgle ranges.
highlord tamburlaine wrote: I still think Raging Heroes' Death Dancers are the sort of direction I'd like to see the Daemonettes get taken- crazy poses and all sorts of ornamental extra limbs.
Eh, while I am all for dynamic poses, the porn dancers thing RH has really doesn't work. They look like they were in the middle of extreme striptease show, not battle. If there is a good third party daemon of S that really looks the part and captures the artwork feel, I'd say it's Creature Caster stuff, especially with their alternate, even more eldritch-horror looking heads.
I really like say this model (obviously very NSFW) - GW really needs to make more daemons that look like this, really inhuman, and less like humans with horns and Star Trek latex makeup.
I wish GW just dropped current butt-ugly junk and went back to Diaznettes as a starting point. They really looked alien, both oddly attractive and repulsive, current ones are just ugly and have zero of their supposed allure. At this point, no amount of polishing that turd will work IMHO, they really need to try something, anything new and reboot the whole range.
Eh, while I am all for dynamic poses, the porn dancers thing RH has really doesn't work. They look like they were in the middle of extreme striptease show, not battle.
That's the point of Slaanesh followers - they look for high stimulations and extreme wrong yet strangely enticing aesthetics, even in the middle of battle. That's why RH's Death Dancers really catch that feeling. You're just not sensitive to it.
If there is a good third party daemon of S that really looks the part and captures the artwork feel, I'd say it's Creature Caster stuff, especially with their alternate, even more eldritch-horror looking heads.
They're nice, but Creature Caster focus on a very specific scale - that is, daemon princes /greater deamons. Their level of details isn't adapted to 28 mm lesser daemons. While serpentine bodies work well with Slaanesh (it's not a hazard Morathi's true form in AoS does look like this, after all), not sure it's really fitting for the whole range.
I wish GW just dropped current butt-ugly junk and went back to Diaznettes as a starting point. They really looked alien, both oddly attractive and repulsive, current ones are just ugly and have zero of their supposed allure. At this point, no amount of polishing that turd will work IMHO, they really need to try something, anything new and reboot the whole range.
Actually, the plastic daemonettes are in the line with the first design - both repulsive and attractive. Juan Diaz miniatures were more attractive than repulsive, having less of that balance. Also, it's funny you criticize RH Death Dancers while loving Juan Diaz's daemonettes, since they were doing quite the same "porn dancers" pose you specifically don't like with RH's miniatures.
Yea the 13 year old in me likes the Diazanettes but the older more cynical 28 year old prefers the current. They embody the horror of Slaanesh, and are very in line with his most early depictions of half female/half male-therefore his Daemonettes follow suit. They are the temptations of all humans after all.
Sarouan wrote: Also, it's funny you criticize RH Death Dancers while loving Juan Diaz's daemonettes, since they were doing quite the same "porn dancers" pose you specifically don't like with RH's miniatures.
Are we looking at the same models? Which Diaz 'monette did a standing split?
streetsamurai wrote: Yeah, also prefer the current daemonettes to the diaz ones. Seekers blows though. Much too rigid and static
To be fair you can say that of a lot of pre Sigmar era mounted troops. I think the more dynamic started with the old Wood Elves and their stag riders, before that most mounted units were pretty static in pose and design.
Cataphract wrote: They embody the horror of Slaanesh, and are very in line with his most early depictions of half female/half male-therefore his Daemonettes follow suit. They are the temptations of all humans after all.
What horror?
They are just butt ugly, zero appeal bad modelling job. Diaznettes did horror a lot better, big, black eyes and fanged maw conveys horror a lot better than 'I can't sculpt faces' look current ones have going on. Also, horror is only one half, the other is allure, and here current ones lose even to chaos spawn...
Sarouan wrote: That's the point of Slaanesh followers - they look for high stimulations and extreme wrong yet strangely enticing aesthetics, even in the middle of battle. That's why RH's Death Dancers really catch that feeling. You're just not sensitive to it.
Care to show even one whiff of these 'strangely enticing aesthetics'? Because Diaznettes had that look, current ones have zero of that. I tried to find really hard to find something to like about them, and I just can't, which is weird because I honestly prefer leg shape and silhouette of current ones but the execution is so terrible ancient sculpts beat them without even trying.
They're nice, but Creature Caster focus on a very specific scale - that is, daemon princes /greater deamons. Their level of details isn't adapted to 28 mm lesser daemons. While serpentine bodies work well with Slaanesh (it's not a hazard Morathi's true form in AoS does look like this, after all), not sure it's really fitting for the whole range.
Yes, they do only DP/GD, but that was more to demonstrate my point. You can combine allure with cosmic horror and unnatural look, the problem is current models have none of it and instead look like a drag parade done by someone who had to work with ugliest models around while doing makeup for the first time, ever. They aren't even scary, never mind attractive or alienness, they display none of their supposed traits.
Actually, the plastic daemonettes are in the line with the first design - both repulsive and attractive. Juan Diaz miniatures were more attractive than repulsive, having less of that balance. Also, it's funny you criticize RH Death Dancers while loving Juan Diaz's daemonettes, since they were doing quite the same "porn dancers" pose you specifically don't like with RH's miniatures.
They have no attractiveness whatsoever. That's why Diaznettes outsold everything else in their MtO combined, despite having modern plastic equivalent.
Also, can you provide the photo of that porn dancer pose? Because I have box of them freshly cast by GW right on my desk and they are all running, like they should, instead of shambling forward like nurgle zombies like current ones, with no energy whatsoever...
I personally prefer the new plastics, daemonettes should be a blend of a man and woman, a horror that causes people to wince away but their daemonic voices and musk entrances people anyway. The current one's are closer to that and the slaves to darkness designs.
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
I enjoy running a bunch of daemonettes, so I have units of all 4 versions. I’m partial to the Realm of Chaos ones myself, but they make for a ragtag looking army when you combine all eras. And I use the old RoC keepers of secrets for fiends, because the look awesome, are the right size, and have 6 different variants.
I’m very interested to see what they put in this new set.
shinros wrote: I personally prefer the new plastics, daemonettes should be a blend of a man and woman, a horror that causes people to wince away but their daemonic voices and musk entrances people anyway. The current one's are closer to that and the slaves to darkness designs.
Just my opinion.
Haha the ones on Seekers kind of have a pole dancer-sequence stance, but I will admit they seem more lively than the current range Seekers.
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
Much prefer the Bloodletters that came next (not the current wiry ones).
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
I enjoy running a bunch of daemonettes, so I have units of all 4 versions. I’m partial to the Realm of Chaos ones myself, but they make for a ragtag looking army when you combine all eras. And I use the old RoC keepers of secrets for fiends, because the look awesome, are the right size, and have 6 different variants.
I’m very interested to see what they put in this new set.
Granted.
Muscle and lobster claws should have remained an Eternia thing...
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
Much prefer the Bloodletters that came next (not the current wiry ones).
The fuzz-letters!? With their choppy axes. 3rd ed. (40k) lesser daemons really took some risks imo. The plague bearers were my least favorite,, but the horrors were the best.
While I'd be happy with just a Keeper of Secrets and Fiends. I really hope we get some awesome looking heralds. Although is their $30 a pop, I just keep using my conversions. Honestly, I'm kinda scared the Bloodthirster, Lord of Change, and Great Unclean were all excellent. Keepers unlike the other three are not supposed to have a set form, each is unique based on Slaanesh's mood at their moment of creations. So, hopefully we can build more than one with out having them be to similar looking; and maybe throw a named character build in as well. Just, please don't let it be ugly. I don't think I could take the disappointment. Fiends hopefully they make them more lean looking and 3-5 to a box.
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Well, the 1st gen models were not so pretty either, although their names were pretty "unique". But this is yet another reason I prefer the current plastics best, despite having collected all the generation. The current ones incorporate the traits of the previous three generations. You want your daemonettes 2nd gen style with bald heads, saucer eyes and large claws you can make them. Want the 1st gen style with punk Mohawks and big 80's hair, with small claws and chicken legs. You can't get to the 3 gen without some converting and GS boob job. But they are plastic, relatively cheap, and despite what some might say are the best sculpts of the four versions by far. Just look at that "actual" anatomy: the bones visible under the skin, the muscular definition of the legs and back, the skin folds and articulation. Then look at the texture details on the: feet, claws, and the transitions from scales to smooth flesh. Yes, the Diaz-nettes are objectively prettier, but they are less detailed, have less muscle definition, and lets be honest their "claws" are terrible. The plastics though are excellent sculpts given the design the were going for; witch was 1 generation, with elements of the others mixed in.
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
Much prefer the Bloodletters that came next (not the current wiry ones).
Yeah, if GW did a round of made to order on those dudes I’d probably get a full size unit or two. The Hounds of that era, I’m not so sure though.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
skullking wrote: 3rd ed. (40k) lesser daemons really took some risks imo. The plague bearers were my least favorite,, but the horrors were the best.
They took some risks and walked like 3/4th of them back, to be closer to their original art/theme it seems.
NinthMusketeer wrote: I seriously doubt a plastic Keeper in this new box set, they will save it for the main release. So it could still be quite a ways off.
What was the gap between Blightwar and Battletome Maggotkin?
Late August for Blight War and Early January for Maggotkin. Preorder dates at least.
The only reason I think you might get skin wolves, warpfire dragons, preytons in Beastherds is that chaos hounds, centigors and a few other monters of chaos are in there and they have the same monters keyword.
skullking wrote: The fuzz-letters!? With their choppy axes. 3rd ed. (40k) lesser daemons really took some risks imo. The plague bearers were my least favorite,, but the horrors were the best.
Big, brutal things. They look like Khorne Daemons to me. I've got a bunch of the Plague Bearers as well.
Could never be bothered with the 3rd Ed Horrors. Too fiddly.
Some releases won't have as many models in new kits as others; but they are welcome. When GW releases a Battletome and tidies up the listings it gives a safety net to that faction which is much needed as there are a lot of little factions all dotted around with few models and a big question mark on if GW will keep them or retire them.
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
I enjoy running a bunch of daemonettes, so I have units of all 4 versions. I’m partial to the Realm of Chaos ones myself, but they make for a ragtag looking army when you combine all eras. And I use the old RoC keepers of secrets for fiends, because the look awesome, are the right size, and have 6 different variants.
I’m very interested to see what they put in this new set.
I prefer those to the current ones myself. They have a sort of charm to them.
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
I enjoy running a bunch of daemonettes, so I have units of all 4 versions. I’m partial to the Realm of Chaos ones myself, but they make for a ragtag looking army when you combine all eras. And I use the old RoC keepers of secrets for fiends, because the look awesome, are the right size, and have 6 different variants.
I’m very interested to see what they put in this new set.
I prefer those to the current ones myself. They have a sort of charm to them.
Might just be nostalgia, but me too. The poses on the current plastics are so terrible.
It's why I'm hoping for an additional new infantry type for the Slaanesh release (since they're not going to redo Daemonettes and a similar kit to stand in for them is the best we can hope for). Something more along the lines of Witch Elves than the awkward is it dancing or not we got now.
There’s no point in arguing over whether the Diaz or plastic daemoettes are better. We just all need to agree that the batboy/lobster 2nd ed. (40k) one’s are the worst hands down.
Spoiler:
(Check out those muscle-beach bloodletters as well )
Much prefer the Bloodletters that came next (not the current wiry ones).
The fuzz-letters!? With their choppy axes. 3rd ed. (40k) lesser daemons really took some risks imo. The plague bearers were my least favorite,, but the horrors were the best.
Those horrors actually lived up to the name. I recall one which had another horror climbing out of it's mouth.
Uriels_Flame wrote: The more I have thought about the beastherds release, the more it seems "lazy" compared to the others.
Is there anything new here or am I overthinking this one?
Is it just chaff until RoC? Combo kits? Slaanesh Beasts?
We do not know much about it yet, so too early to tell. Three endless spells at the least, plus a fleshed out allegiance with several sub factions consolidated into something more coherent.
Honestly at this stage just seeing the faction restored with a Battletome and cleaned up is a big thing. There are a lot of subfactions in AoS and until GW gives them proper full attention we've no idea if they will become part of another faction; become ignored; be upgraded to a full faction or get removed from the game entirely.
So even a release without a lot of new models is still a good thing for AoS - esp when it cuts down on multiple sub-mini factions and provides a good steady solid faction to play as.
Plus they get 3 personal Endless Spells to play with!
sockwithaticket wrote: Isn't pretty/confusingly sexy daemonettes part of the reason Raging Heroes exist?
The thing is, they aren't 'confusingly' sexy. They miss the point just as much as GW ones, just in the other direction. GW are comically ugly, shambling zombies, RH are 12-year-old-wet-dream pinups with comical porn parade poses. There is nothing confusingly (rather, perfectly straightforward) alluring or alien about them, they aren't scary, you can pretty much sum them up as Baywatch: the army...
sockwithaticket wrote: Isn't pretty/confusingly sexy daemonettes part of the reason Raging Heroes exist?
The thing is, they aren't 'confusingly' sexy. They miss the point just as much as GW ones, just in the other direction. GW are comically ugly, shambling zombies, RH are 12-year-old-wet-dream pinups with comical porn parade poses. There is nothing confusingly (rather, perfectly straightforward) alluring or alien about them, they aren't scary, you can pretty much sum them up as Baywatch: the army...
That is the idea--to appeal to the opposite end of the GW models, not do Slaanesh as faithfully as possible
The point of the Raging Heroes minis I've seen seems to be to entice the owner to somehow figure out how to paint them one-handed while the other is . . . er . . . occupied.
I mean, while there are clearly elements in there of a 'conventionally attractive' female human. There's enough otherworldly elements like the claws and hooves to put any attraction into the 'not sure how to feel about this' category for me. Different strokes for different folks (possibly not the best turn of phrase given the topic...). They're not massively different to the Diaznettes imo, which were the contemporary ones when I came into the hobby, so have always been the lens through which I viewed what daemonettes are meant to look like.
Admittedly I've chosen an example where the tits are somewhat covered.
Spoiler:
They're obviously not going to replace the existing box, so all this is a bit moot I guess. There's a possibility, though, of getting something different via another kit. The Mortis Engine and Mortarch have female vampires who look quite different to other female vamps GW did in the past, the last one standing of which is Isabella von Carstein even if that's no longer what they call the model.
Problem is daemonettes are not meant to explicitly be female. They are a mix of male and female like slaanesh. In the newer kit some faces look more manish and others lean towards more female. Even in the trailer the daemonette's voice went oddly deep at a part of it.
Hell look at the iconic emperor's children artwork. He does not look attractive at all, slaanesh does mutations via someone's excess. Black Crusade notes if you like drinking wine slaanesh will give you multiple mouths, if a commissar enjoys executing people he will find his pistol has fused to his hand.
sockwithaticket wrote: Different strokes for different folks (possibly not the best turn of phrase given the topic...).
The most pleasurable turn of phrase though
Don't worry; any dark path starts with a single step, you'll get there.
Back to rumours.
From the art in the 8th codex and generals handbook, looks like the new KoS will be a big daemonette kind of idea. Not unlike how the new GUO is similar to the Forgeworld GUO.
Would be nice if the Masque got the Changeling treatment.
Creature Caster's take on the Keeper was pretty cool, so GW has a high bar for me to cross if they want me to pick up a plastic one.
On the other hand I've got plastic versions of all the Greater Daemons so far and I don't really even want to play Tzeentch or Khorne so I guess I'm just a sucker?
highlord tamburlaine wrote: Creature Caster's takes on the Keeper are pretty cool, so GW has a high bar for me to cross if they want me to pick up a plastic one.
Fixed that for you But yea, same here. Some day I'd like to own several of the CC Kippers, I can't really see GeeDub making something that can compete with that for me. Spoiler: CC does some great booties, and I'm pretty solidly in the boobs or GTFO camp of Slaanesh worshipers (though the ostensibly male keeper from CC is pretty sweet too).
Obviously I'm also a member of the Diaznettes FTW entourage, though I'll say they are distinctly unpleasant to work with as actual minis. Flat, static metals with awkward arms as the only poseable part sucks, as nice as the sculpts are. I hate the 'nettes that replaced them but at least they're in plastic? Who am I kidding, I'd just use the TGG2 mantis chicks at this point.
Fiends really are the place where the Dub could surprise us / me, the big girl/boys/girlbois are handled by other companies and the plastic lesser daemons ain't leaving or can be subbed out with French resin.
I wouldn't be opposed to sexy male Slaanesh demons. I know that the fantasy is for females to be the succubi, etc... but yeah.
At least the present daemonettes are very androginous.
The Black Coach being really expensive was to be expected, so no surprise there.
