A new Warhammer® 40,000® MMORPG revealed.

Montreal, 10th June, 2013 – Behaviour Interactive and Games Workshop® proudly announce a new online game in the Warhammer® 40,000® universe: Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade. Behaviour Interactive has obtained the rights to create a wholly new MMORPG persistent war experience for PC, PS4 and Xbox One set in Games Workshop’s universe of the 41st Millennium. In the game, players choose a Warhammer 40,000® race and fight directly as one of their warriors in massive conflicts for territory. It will be up to each faction’s community to determine their own destiny as they vie for control of an entire planet.

http://bhvr.com/eternalcrusade/#

Main features of the game include:

Experience the gameworld with 3rd-person, behind the shoulder action featuring precision gunplay and brutal melee combat with excruciating finishers;

Participate in a persistent online war to conquer the planet, its fate completely in the hands of the players;

Become a warrior from one of four initial factions, each unique and opposed to one another: Space Marines, Chaos Space Marines, Orks and Eldar.

Participate in truly massive conflicts that simultaneously bring thousands of players to bear over territories and other strategic resources.

Get behind the controls of Space Marine Rhinos, Predators, Ork Battlewagons and other iconic vehicles of the 41st millennium;

Hack through genuinely challenging procedural content alongside your battle-brothers and never have the same experience twice;

Earn the right to customize your builds in a deep progression system drawing on the rich Warhammer 40,000 universe.

Found a Battle Squad with friends and prepare for conflict from your customized shared space in orbit - then drop down to the planet together and seek out glory!

http://www.marketwire.com/press-release/join-the-eternal-crusade-starting-in-2015-1800713.htm

Could you post a little less information? Geeze.

A new Warhammer® 40,000® MMORPG revealed.

Montreal, 10th June, 2013 – Behaviour Interactive and Games Workshop® proudly announce a new online game in the Warhammer® 40,000® universe: Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade. Behaviour Interactive has obtained the rights to create a wholly new MMORPG persistent war experience for PC, PS4 and Xbox One set in Games Workshop’s universe of the 41st Millennium. In the game, players choose a Warhammer 40,000® race and fight directly as one of their warriors in massive conflicts for territory. It will be up to each faction’s community to determine their own destiny as they vie for control of an entire planet.

sorry new to forums.

This sounds like a really nice idea, I just hope they pull it off.

However, I'm not confident looking at Behaviour Interactive's list of past games: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behaviour_Interactive
Mostly just movie tie in stuff, no real big games as far as I can see.

well, we'll see...I've stopped getting my hopes up for a 40k MMO a long time ago...

Just so people don't think this is spam...

A new Warhammer® 40,000® MMORPG revealed.

Montreal, 10th June, 2013 – Behaviour Interactive and Games Workshop® proudly announce a new online game in the Warhammer® 40,000® universe: Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade. Behaviour Interactive has obtained the rights to create a wholly new MMORPG persistent war experience for PC, PS4 and Xbox One set in Games Workshop’s universe of the 41st Millennium. In the game, players choose a Warhammer 40,000® race and fight directly as one of their warriors in massive conflicts for territory. It will be up to each faction’s community to determine their own destiny as they vie for control of an entire planet.

There's not a lot else on the site at the moment, other than a galaxy map of potential new pieces of information in the future. The developer, Behaviour Interactive seems to do lots of Disney and film/cartoon tie in games

Erebus83 wrote:
sorry new to forums.

It was meant to be gentle sarcastic ribbing. Don't take it too hard.

More from the site:

Warning

By the command of Inquisition the following content has been classified as HERESY!
Access Override all
An empty mind is a loyal mind

From the look of the quotes, there are orks, imperial, chaos, Necrons and others...

A MMO FPS where your avatar is a persistant character has been a good idea for a long time... I would be interested to see if they can pull it off.

The one thing that the fantasy warhammer MMO had going for it was the graphics were amazing and like walking around GW minis.

OH BOY OH BOY OH BOY
edit: I'll say it again, next gen is best gen.

edit 2: sorry hype has just shot through the roof listening to the webiste quotes, TIME FOR ETERNAL WAR ON THE PS4!!!

 pretre wrote:
From the look of the quotes, there are orks, imperial, chaos, Necrons and others...

The last quote is definitely Eldar.

"once was ours and will come back to us" is an Eldar phrase.

Plus, that's an Eldar Sword with an Eldar rune on it.

It's your classic Blue Marines, Spiky Marines, Orks, and Eldar

So another MMO that isn't really an MMO but an arena combat game that happens to be on the same server?

That said I hope they pull it off and it is great, an FPS multiplayer 40k would be good.

Damn says huge battles which decide the fate of planets, I can picture it now, rows of marines unleashing bolter fire upon a mass horde of orks, all players, all glorious.

edit: end of 2015

Behavior is also responsible for Halo: Waypoint, which is very interesting.

It's not gonna be an FPS though. It says third person persistent online action ...
We'll see

Well I enrolled, interesting to see where this goes.

Strange that it hasn't been featured on any news site, even a Google search turns up nothing on this game.

(Also click on the option; "An empty mind is a loyal mind" when you first go on the website )

Is it not a single planet?

It's an absolutely awesome concept, I hope it turns out well.

 Ctan_Overlord wrote:
Strange that it hasn't been featured on any news site, even a Google search turns up nothing on this game.

Sounds like a GW campaign

 Absolutionis wrote:

 pretre wrote:
From the look of the quotes, there are orks, imperial, chaos, Necrons and others...

The last quote is definitely Eldar.

"once was ours and will come back to us" is an Eldar phrase.

Plus, that's an Eldar Sword with an Eldar rune on it.

It's your classic Blue Marines, Spiky Marines, Orks, and Eldar

Bah, you got me. I was thinking 'crons.

We will see where this goes.
But if I end up not being able to be a noise marine I'm going to throw a bottle in the street out of anger

Plus, ever since Pariahs stopped being canon and only the highest-level Necrons have individuality and free will, it'd be odd to put a playable Necron into a game.

 Absolutionis wrote:
Plus, ever since Pariahs stopped being canon and only the highest-level Necrons have individuality and free will, it'd be odd to put a playable Necron into a game.

Why? There have been plenty of 'limited individuality and free will' characters in big games. Plus it wouldn't be too difficult for any PC necrons to be low-level crypteks or nobility.

 Ctan_Overlord wrote:
Strange that it hasn't been featured on any news site, even a Google search turns up nothing on this game.

Yeah, I've looked and I can't find anything. What's the source for this information?

A new Warhammer® 40,000® MMORPG revealed.

Montreal, 10th June, 2013 – Behaviour Interactive and Games Workshop® proudly announce a new online game in the Warhammer® 40,000® universe: Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade. Behaviour Interactive has obtained the rights to create a wholly new MMORPG persistent war experience for PC, PS4 and Xbox One set in Games Workshop’s universe of the 41st Millennium. In the game, players choose a Warhammer 40,000® race and fight directly as one of their warriors in massive conflicts for territory. It will be up to each faction’s community to determine their own destiny as they vie for control of an entire planet.

 Ctan_Overlord wrote:


(Also click on the option; "An empty mind is a loyal mind" when you first go on the website )

Already did that.
Kittehs!


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 RaptorsTallon wrote:

 Ctan_Overlord wrote:
Strange that it hasn't been featured on any news site, even a Google search turns up nothing on this game.

Yeah, I've looked and I can't find anything. What's the source for this information?

A new Warhammer® 40,000® MMORPG revealed.

Montreal, 10th June, 2013 – Behaviour Interactive and Games Workshop® proudly announce a new online game in the Warhammer® 40,000® universe: Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade. Behaviour Interactive has obtained the rights to create a wholly new MMORPG persistent war experience for PC, PS4 and Xbox One set in Games Workshop’s universe of the 41st Millennium. In the game, players choose a Warhammer 40,000® race and fight directly as one of their warriors in massive conflicts for territory. It will be up to each faction’s community to determine their own destiny as they vie for control of an entire planet.

The site, after all the quotes.

The website linked above is the source. They may not have posted an actual press release yet. It just posted yesterday.

I will hold my excitement until we are in the year 2015 and see if it still exists. Im still dissapointed how the last 40k mmo dissapeared into the void, it looked like a good game

I just need to see one gameplay video and thats it.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Should be some more news during e3.

Well, after the previous attempt at a 40K MMO ended in the midst of THQ's bankruptcy... I'm not terribly surprised to see GW licensing it out again.

Though I'm kinda shocked that they did it before the fate of Vigil was entirely settled.

Not too confident about the studio they went with this time around, to be honest. I thought Vigil had promise, though it was clear they were trying to go too big with it, but these new guys... I dunno.

Curious if they got their hands on the old Vigil/THQ code or are starting from scratch.

Isnt this the 4th time now that someone has tried a 40K MMO? Its been sad to get my hopes up only to see them dashed a year later heheh.

Oh man, I hope they do a good job on this... the 40k universe lends itself so fething well to the idea, it will piss all over WoW.

The only thing I can see being an issue is.. if the community have to get together and sort their lives out in order to attack and take planets and systems, surely Space Marines will just consume the galaxy, I mean, they are far and away the most popular faction, so it stands to reason they will outnumber the other races massively.

And how many young lads (main gamers) are going to want to be puny Eldar!?

updated first post.

 mattyrm wrote:
Oh man, I hope they do a good job on this... the 40k universe lends itself so fething well to the idea, it will piss all over WoW.

The only thing I can see being an issue is.. if the community have to get together and sort their lives out in order to attack and take planets and systems, surely Space Marines will just consume the galaxy, I mean, they are far and away the most popular faction, so it stands to reason they will outnumber the other races massively.

And how many young lads (main gamers) are going to want to be puny Eldar!?

If thats the problem, just nerf the hell out of Space Marines, and make the Eldar as OP as possible, then turn the tides to level up the thing around again. Then you should have a more or less stable community around the factions, since people has tendence to stay where they have their strongest character Wich in this case, would be an Eldar.

Also, the puny Eldar are Space efls, so we can expect a similar tendence as when Blood Elfs came to WoW with the Burning Crusade.

List of previous games by this company concerns me....

I just hope they look at what some of the more popular features are in modern mmo's and use them all.

Player Created Content: One of the main features behind Neverwinter Online is player created dungeons. It's not a very big stretch to consider this same mechanic so players can create space hulk style maps that need to be cleared.

Rich, 3 way PvP: While I think racial divisions between servers could be a mistake (eldar vs marines vs orks), a real realm vs realm 3way large scale pvp system is pretty much mandatory for any new game coming out.

Diverse Classes: How a low budget game like Shadowbane managed to offer one of the richest and most diverse class systems any MMO has ever had is beyond me. But the stale trait system many MMO's use is just laziness. We need to return to RPG roots in MMORPGs.

Viable small to moderate scale content that is equally viable to any large scale content offered. One of the largest mistakes WoW made was its 40 man raids. It took 5+ years for them to scale back to the 10 mans they have today, and even those I would like to see more rare where 5 mans are the 'go to' content players complete.

Get rid of the holy trinity! Several games still offer classes that could still fall into the holy trinity (healer, tank, dps) but even those work without strict tanks or healers being invited to groups. There's no reason PvE content needs to be boring and shallow without tanks and healers.

Now if a new MMO comes out in any genre and can't cover these few basic elements that I would consider mandatory for any MMO at a minimum, it's going to be a complete failure of a game.

Best of luck.

ps. Please let me play as a striking scorpion or incubi...

BrotherVord wrote:
List of previous games by this company concerns me....

We have a winner! http://www.bhvr.com/en/games/

So these guys are a licensed shovelware company, is that it?

I can't get too excited about this after being left at the altar by the last one.

Linkdead wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:
List of previous games by this company concerns me....

We have a winner! http://www.bhvr.com/en/games/

Hahaha I saw the doritos crash course thing and thought, oh dear.

Their main games however are the likes of Dantes Inferno which had pretty solid mechanics and gameplay so I think it should be ok.

I have little worry for the story and background because the setting is already there and GW will not want their video game showcasing their product to show space marines falling in love with imperial citizens or eldar warriors becoming uber god like psykers in the game.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Holy crap just read those new details.

Vehicles like rhinos and battlewagons, mother of god.

Drop pod assaults, this is the game, it has to be.

Who wants to join me for Black Templars drop pod vanguard crusade squads?

 unmercifulconker wrote:

Linkdead wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:
List of previous games by this company concerns me....

We have a winner! http://www.bhvr.com/en/games/

Hahaha I saw the doritos crash course thing and thought, oh dear.

Their main games however are the likes of Dantes Inferno which had pretty solid mechanics and gameplay so I think it should be ok.

I have little worry for the story and background because the setting is already there and GW will not want their video game showcasing their product to show space marines falling in love with imperial citizens or eldar warriors becoming uber god like psykers in the game.

Yeah, about that... They didn't do the original, just the PSP port.

Oh....... ooohhhhhhhh.

Still I shall have faith. They are doing a reddit AMA soon.

 KaiserEddie wrote:


If thats the problem, just nerf the hell out of Space Marines, and make the Eldar as OP as possible, then turn the tides to level up the thing around again. Then you should have a more or less stable community around the factions, since people has tendence to stay where they have their strongest character Wich in this case, would be an Eldar.

Also, the puny Eldar are Space efls, so we can expect a similar tendence as when Blood Elfs came to WoW with the Burning Crusade.

Actually if this is more of an action game they could simply have team size caps. Will have to see if this one takes off. I could see something sort of like Planetside working. Certainly nothing like WoW though, not WH40Kish anyway.

I reckon they could just balance it out a bit with racial perks, so space marines have more health and eldar have more powerful psychic abilities or orks have better strength, rather than making all races the same to balance the game.

I thought Maxis made the sims, I have not played a sims game since the first one came out like 12-13 years ago so i might be wrong.

You know what would be an amazing 40k MMO? A Rogue Trader plying his warrant of trade on the fringes of the Imperium.

You know what would make a poor 40k MMO? A generic 3rd person game with big promises which will almost certainly fall flat on their face.

I hope its more then just running around and shooting other players in the 40k universe , I already get that fix from space marine

I wanna be able to engage in massive conflicts in the warhammer universe, drop pod landing upon the field of battle, close combat spec and predators and land raiders rolling up behind me. I think this game might just be that.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
I wanna be able to engage in massive conflicts in the warhammer universe, drop pod landing upon the field of battle, close combat spec and predators and land raiders rolling up behind me. I think this game might just be that.

It already exists its called planetside 2. Its not the 40k universe but one wartorn city looks like any other. I hope theres a PVE aspect to it ,if it does not its just COD with spesh muhreens

 unmercifulconker wrote:
I wanna be able to engage in massive conflicts in the warhammer universe, drop pod landing upon the field of battle, close combat spec and predators and land raiders rolling up behind me. I think this game might just be that.

You won't be able to, I bet my left testicle that it will be standard sized multiplayer maps (at the very most 64 players but likely a lot less) with some kind of meta map. Development for consoles also doesn't fill me with confidence.

A friend of mine is working on this. He worked for long months on Wet as well, I saw his girlfriend playtest a Kim Possible.

From what he's told me, the movie tie-ins pay the bill, more than anything.

Skipping all the replies for a moment, so I can savor my reaction to the OP...


WEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE!!!!!

So, what's his verdict? Should we get excited?

Become a warrior from one of four initial factions, each unique and opposed to one another: Space Marines, Chaos Space Marines, Orks and Eldar.

That's... sad.

Looks like Ultramarines / Word Bearers / Orkz / Eldar.

Should be fun. Assuming it actually gets released.

It's slating the end of 2015 as a release...That is 2.5 years away. The horrifically early announcement frankly does nothing to help my confidence, it's not worth announcing at concept phase which is where it is.

 Minx wrote:
So, what's his verdict? Should we get excited?

If you really want to. Their previous games don;t look too impressive though http://www.bhvr.com/en/games/

Tbh as long as I can play Orks or Eldar I can dig this. If it does well, they can always add other factions later.

Also at this point I don't really mind MMORPG or semi MMOFPS, this could be the game that gets me back into pvp.

 Palindrome wrote:

 Minx wrote:
So, what's his verdict? Should we get excited?

If you really want to. Their previous games don;t look too impressive though http://www.bhvr.com/en/games/

Doesn't look too promising. I like your rogue trader idea though.

 Ouze wrote:
So these guys are a licensed shovelware company, is that it?

I can't get too excited about this after being left at the altar by the last one.

Unfortunately, I fear the same. Considering the company hasn't been going *that* long and has a ridiculously long list of mediocre games, it's clear that not that long is spent on each one.
Looking down that list, the only game I can say I like is Naughty Bear... and that's for humour value. The actual gameplay in that got formulaic pretty damn fast.

I can only suspect that after Dark Millennium went down the drain, GW are none too willing to put a similar amount of time and effort into this again. Pity - I'd argue it's better off not bothering at all than cheapening the IP with a rubbish version.

Yeah, don't expect anything from this at all. That way we can only be pleasantly suprised.

I've enjoyed a few of the games these guys have done before, so I'm fairly optimistic abou this.

I get some are downplaying this based on the publishers previous history. But, hasn't a lot of developement already been done on this game? I mean, aren't they basically finishing off someone elses project?

On the contrary, I'm downplaying it based off of the fact that only a single faction allows you to play as a female character. If you could at least play as a human (guardsman? inquisitorial acolyte? psyker? commissar? sergeant with his squad? techpriest? anything?) it'd be okay, but nope, only Imperial representation amongst players is spehss mureenz, so meh, I'll probably skip it unless it turns out to be amazing and groundbreakingly new (which it won't).

 SickSix wrote:
I get some are downplaying this based on the publishers previous history. But, hasn't a lot of developement already been done on this game? I mean, aren't they basically finishing off someone elses project?

Nope, Dark Millennium still exists as a separate entity, and it's been cut back in light of THQ's bankruptcy. From wikipedia:

Originally planned to be a massively multiplayer online role-playing game, Vigil Games announced that they would be dropping the MMO components of the game in order to focus on a single-player and more traditional multiplayer experience.

There are no imperial male characters either. Just space marines :(

 Minx wrote:
There are no imperial male characters either. Just space marines :(

Space Marines are male in effect, as are Orks (even if they are not male in the most literal sense of the term)-- for the same reasons that Asari are female.

Their body types are based off of male body types; their voice actors will be male voice actors; they will walk in a manly manner, they will talk in a manly manner, they will posture in a manly manner. And that's cool and all, but that doesn't mean that I want to roleplay as one of them for several hours at a time over hundreds of hours.

I'm only intrested in Eldar.

Well, from what my friend has told me, and I don't work in computer gaming, not everyone gets big customers knocking on their doors with AAA money. Disney is especially thrifty.

Apparently, their reputation is more along the lines of "on time, on budget", which must be part of the appeal for GW.

 Melissia wrote:

 Minx wrote:
There are no imperial male characters either. Just space marines :(

Space Marines are male in effect, as are Orks (even if they are not male in the most literal sense of the term)-- for the same reasons that Asari are female.

Their body types are based off of male body types; their voice actors will be male voice actors; they will walk in a manly manner, they will talk in a manly manner, they will posture in a manly manner. And that's cool and all, but that doesn't mean that I want to roleplay as one of them for several hours at a time over hundreds of hours.

You are right, they are not really androgynous visually or aurally. But fear not, i suspect there won't be any need for roleplaying as it will just end in a hack'n'slay console game style perhaps with added chatbox to flame your teammates.

Hack and slash? So it's not only going to be a sausage festival, but it's going to be a WoW ripoff?

I mean the least they could do is make it a shooter instead of a traditional MMO.

Getting the urge to go back to playing BF4......and the wife hates that game...she fears I might have a flashback or something

 Melissia wrote:
Hack and slash? So it's not only going to be a sausage festival, but it's going to be a WoW ripoff?

I mean the least they could do is make it a shooter instead of a traditional MMO.

Every single MMORPG i've ever tried has been a WoW clone. I simply don't like that style of combat, it's too...technical. It's all about the numbers. That and the fact that there's no narrative whatsoever means the combat feels essentially pointless (rather than in a single player RPG where the existance of an actual world, rather than a load of people called 'Th0xor12' running around and squatting everywhere).

I fully expect a crappy WoW/COD crossover.

 BryllCream wrote:
Every single MMORPG i've ever tried has been a WoW clone. I simply don't like that style of combat, it's too...technical. It's all about the numbers. That and the fact that there's no narrative whatsoever means the combat feels essentially pointless (rather than in a single player RPG where the existance of an actual world, rather than a load of people called 'Th0xor12' running around and squatting everywhere).

I fully expect a crappy WoW/COD crossover.

Did you play TOR at all? Because while it was an MMO it did an excellent job at immersing the player in their character's story.

Anyway as far as this announcement goes, I'll remain cautiously optimistic. Do we know whether it's true that Bioware got the rights to the Space Marine franchise?

 morgendonner wrote:

 BryllCream wrote:
Every single MMORPG i've ever tried has been a WoW clone. I simply don't like that style of combat, it's too...technical. It's all about the numbers. That and the fact that there's no narrative whatsoever means the combat feels essentially pointless (rather than in a single player RPG where the existance of an actual world, rather than a load of people called 'Th0xor12' running around and squatting everywhere).

I fully expect a crappy WoW/COD crossover.

Did you play TOR at all? Because while it was an MMO it did an excellent job at immersing the player in their character's story.

Anyway as far as this announcement goes, I'll remain cautiously optimistic. Do we know whether it's true that Bioware got the rights to the Space Marine franchise?

The story was good, but gameplay was still crappy WoW ripoff. Then you have stuff like TERA which did a great job with gameplay, but there was zilch in the way of story, and quests were grindy as hell. Either way, there's been a rather large dearth in actual good MMORPGs out there to threaten WoW's dominance, even with their slipping numbers.

Mind you, this doesn't look like it'll really be an RPG. I'm expecting something similar to Planetside, which means it's going to have to either be REALLY good or FTP as well to pull me out of Planetside, especially after the Lattice system has been fully implemented.

I want to believe this is good, but man...been burned before and the developer is not a name that inspires confidence. Believe me, I want them to succeed, but I just can't say that until I see solid gameplay.

It was an decent WoW ripoff, actually, as far as implementing the mechanics and interface. Of course WoW is just a rip off of DAoC and EQ.

Of course I never understood the complaint of having conventions to a genre. Almost every FPS uses ASWD yet you never hear "CoD is just a crappy Doom ripoff", or "Mario and Sonic are the same game because they both have a run and jump button". Seems an odd complaint. The question on the others, and should be for MMO's is how well are they implemented, not dismissing them because they fall into genre convention.

 Super Ready wrote:

Nope, Dark Millennium still exists as a separate entity, and it's been cut back in light of THQ's bankruptcy. From wikipedia:

Originally planned to be a massively multiplayer online role-playing game, Vigil Games announced that they would be dropping the MMO components of the game in order to focus on a single-player and more traditional multiplayer experience.

That happened before THQ was broken up and Dark Millenium was rumoured to have been cancelled not long after it went single player. Vigil Games no longer exists with most of its staff now working for Crytek. Dark Millenium will never see the light of day.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Melissia wrote:
On the contrary, I'm downplaying it based off of the fact that only a single faction allows you to play as a female character.

Orks are asexual and Marines of all stripes can only be male. What did you think was going to happen? Plus that has to be one of the worst reasons for disliking a game that I have ever heard.

 Ahtman wrote:
It was an decent WoW ripoff, actually, as far as implementing the mechanics and interface. Of course WoW is just a rip off of DAoC and EQ.

Of course I never understood the complaint of having conventions to a genre.

Conventions can be good, or they can be utter crap.

For example, the "let's all be starcraft clones" conventions of the RTS genre basically doomed the genre to mediocrity and lameness for a decade after that game was released, because they were pretty crap conventions and only when games started to buck those conventions did the genre start getting good again.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Palindrome wrote:
Orks are asexual and Marines of all stripes can only be male. What did you think was going to happen?

Orks are male in all but the most literal sense, as I explained earlier.

As for what I thought was going to happen? I expected there to be an Imperial faction-- a sergeant with guardsmen minions, a techpriest, a psyker, and so on and so forth. Instead we got screaming old bald white guys that I don't give a damn about. I'm not going to play an MMO where I have to create a character I feel zero empathy for.

 Melissia wrote:
On the contrary, I'm downplaying it based off of the fact that only a single faction allows you to play as a female character. If you could at least play as a human (guardsman? inquisitorial acolyte? psyker? commissar? sergeant with his squad? techpriest? anything?) it'd be okay, but nope, only Imperial representation amongst players is spehss mureenz, so meh, I'll probably skip it unless it turns out to be amazing and groundbreakingly new (which it won't).

THIS

Seriously, I'm sick and tired of this SPHESS MEHREENS ARE THE IMPERIUM, where the hell is the Imperial Guard? Where the hell is the force that does 99% of the work for the Imperiu

Its almost like in the Star Wars where it seems like Jedi's are the only thing, but at least the Star Wars universe was nice enough to give non Jedi's a shot at glory; I mean look at the human classes in Old Republic and such

 Melissia wrote:
On the contrary, I'm downplaying it based off of the fact that only a single faction allows you to play as a female character. If you could at least play as a human (guardsman? inquisitorial acolyte? psyker? commissar? sergeant with his squad? techpriest? anything?) it'd be okay, but nope, only Imperial representation amongst players is spehss mureenz, so meh, I'll probably skip it unless it turns out to be amazing and groundbreakingly new (which it won't).

I don't know if you could realistically create an imperial that is as dangerous as an ork, space marine or eldar balance wise.

 Cheesecat wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
On the contrary, I'm downplaying it based off of the fact that only a single faction allows you to play as a female character. If you could at least play as a human (guardsman? inquisitorial acolyte? psyker? commissar? sergeant with his squad? techpriest? anything?) it'd be okay, but nope, only Imperial representation amongst players is spehss mureenz, so meh, I'll probably skip it unless it turns out to be amazing and groundbreakingly new (which it won't).

I don't know if you could realistically create an imperial that is as dangerous as an ork, space marine or eldar balance wise.

Sure you could.

A techpriest with hi-tech weaponry, combat mechadendrites, and dragonskin (their power armor) could easily do it.

A psyker, some of whom in the lore can be powerful enough to rip Space Marines apart like their armor is made of cheap aluminum and who it's possible to implement in a variety of ways.

A sister of battle, who are in-lore considered the equals of the Astartes in combat, and who wield nasty short ranged weaponry and can be given unique gameplay features through Acts of Faith.

A sergeant, whose squad reduces the damage they take and increases their firepower as well as providing more tactical options by ordering them around, with the sergeant themselves wielding a special or heavy weapon. This one is the only one that might be hard to implement in an FPS genre.

Various high-ranking Inquisitorial acolytes, whom are exceptional human beings that are very well equipped, and many of which are capable of accomplishing things which might impress an Astartes (Amberley Vail's squad was raiding genestealer nests in one of the Cain books, for example).

It's not exactly hard to implement a human character who is capable of keeping up with an Astartes character. Astartes aren't some kind of unbeatable god on the battlefield.

 Melissia wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:
It was an decent WoW ripoff, actually, as far as implementing the mechanics and interface. Of course WoW is just a rip off of DAoC and EQ.

Of course I never understood the complaint of having conventions to a genre.

Conventions can be good, or they can be utter crap.

For example, the "let's all be starcraft clones" conventions of the RTS genre basically doomed the genre to mediocrity and lameness for a decade after that game was released, because they were pretty crap conventions and only when games started to buck those conventions did the genre start getting good again.

That still seems to be an argument for how well implemented the conventions are, or innovative they are, rather than an argument that their appearance alone is enough to complain about. When the conventions become stagnant that is a problem, but as in the RTS example, most RTS's didn't throw off the conventions so much as evolve and refine them.

 Ahtman wrote:
most RTS's didn't throw off the conventions so much as evolve and refine them.

On the contrary-- to give an example, DoW1 threw off the RTS convention of having units harvest resources and was better for it.

 Melissia wrote:

 Ahtman wrote:
most RTS's didn't throw off the conventions so much as evolve and refine them.

On the contrary-- to give an example, DoW1 threw off the RTS convention of having units harvest resources and was better for it.

That is missing the forest for the trees. You still drag and drop units, point on the map where they go, produce units, and you still gathered resources, albeit in a different way. It refined the core mechanics of an RTS, it did not throw them off. Upgrading within a unit instead of creating a new unit follows this evolution as well.

 Ahtman wrote:
That is missing the forest for the trees.

No it's not.

Not all conventions are good conventions, and you can try to claim that doing something entirely different is "refining", but I won't agree with that.

Gentlemen, the bottom line is that we all know this game will not innovate much. They are saying "An over the shoulder" Action MMORPG. So the first thing I think about is Spacemarine the video game and a similar combat system.

When we take a look at the developer we see they have no experience in this type of game that we can all agree sounds like Planetside:40k
SOE has quite a few years of experience compared to them and in no way will the game be as smooth as planetside.

Further more we ALL know what GW policies are like, they're a corporation that likes to play it safe. They know fans will buy the game if there is enough hype so why bother "innovating" an entire genre.

To put this in perspective if this game was going to be "HOly gak so innovative so new so cool its like crack Im so high!" We would see different developers behind it and there would be a lot more hype than there is right now. Do they even have a teaser out? Last time i checked they didn't. So they release a website about the game before a teaser or announcement? This just seems cheap to me.

The only developers to actually make a game that takes different and risky strides to innovate video games are those that are funded via kickstarter. Don't get your hopes up for this game

@Melissa: about you not being able to play the character you want to, I feel your pain. I understand you want to play Adeptus Soroitas in an immersive setting to give you that fantasy high that we all crave. You have to understand and accept that GW will only apply to the General Audience of people who like Loyalist Chapters and the cartoony CSM who talk about spikes and eating babies. You know as well as I do not all CSM are a bunch of retards with spikes on their armor, and that Sisters of Battle would make an awesome (not to mention unique and original) additon to the game. But like i said before.. enjoy the game for what it is and you won't be AS upset.



-

I'd say that more people would prefer playing as badass immortal terminators, eh? eh? *hints at dev*

Listening to the quotes again, it sounds like the guy who does some of the voices for the videos I have seen for Rome Total War 2.

 Ifepy wrote:
enjoy the game for what it is

That's like if a person asks for a slice of turkey meat on Thanksgiving, and you instead give them a bowl of watered down turkey broth, then complain "enjoy your thanksgiving dinner for what it is" when they say they'll just eat some of the slices of ham instead.

To explain it without an analogy: I'd rather just keep playing Blacklight: Retribution or Tribes: Ascend than pay money to play this MMO if it ends up having such a facepalm-inducingly limited selection of character customization at release.

then say goodbye to playing 40k video games

 Ifepy wrote:
lol then say goodbye to playing 40k video games

Why? DoW2 already does better than this game apparently will.

You gotta get used to not being listened to. Ask core RPG or flight simulator gamers what it feels like to be a gamer nowadays. MMOs are mainstream, 40k is mostly about the BIG DOODZ WITH GUNZ and they will thus focus on these guys. I won't see Necrons either.

Being used to being ignored isn't a reason to stay quiet you know.

 Melissia wrote:
Being used to being ignored isn't a reason to stay quiet you know.

Never said so, I won't shut up about Necrons either. E-Mailed them.

 Melissia wrote:
I'd rather just keep playing Blacklight: Retribution

Thanks for bringing that game to my attention. Doesn't look too bad.

Well I will watch this to see how it goes but I am not holding my hopes up.
It sounds to me by the description that it will go the planetside 2 route (huge battles with tanks and aircraft involved as well as infantry) rather than the wow clone one, I hope I am right, if it is anything like Ps2 I will be well up for it.
If its the usual, do quests to gain xp and level up, il pass.

i really enjoyed Dante's Inferno, it was really creepy and they did some pretty cool things to make parts of the game as real a possible. (they motion capped a toddler to get realistic movement for their baby demons)

TBH anyone with half a brain who wants to make a good 400k FPSMMO just needs to ask Planetside 2 to borrow their game to reskin the whole thing to 40k.

God yes, if its basically planetside 2 in a 3rd person warhammer form, mother of god.....

Finally, VIGILIA MORTIS SHALL RISE AGAIN!


New Interview:


Hot on the heels of Behaviour Interactive's announcement that they are in fact making an MMO based on the Warhammer 40k franchise. I got the chance to sit down with studio head Miguel Caron to talk about Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade.

I had a nice set of safe questions ready. I'd stayed up so late preparing, checking, refining; nothing could have prepared me to face the incredible passion of Miguel Caron for the Warhammer 40K universe. “There is only war!” He exclaimed numerous times before I realized that was my answer. To Caron, that phrase is not a gimmick or sales tactic; it embodies the essence of his team's ultimate universe.

He asked me to call him Miguel as his smartphone crackled in and out. “I'm hiding under an escalator to get enough signal to talk with you!” I offered to get on Skype, but he informed me the internet availability was worse than the cell signal. We made some awkward small talk, then I asked that fateful question: “Can you describe this MMO to me in a nutshell?”

There is only war.

Within the game universe there will be multiple planets, each utilizing a single-server technology Behaviour Interactive's team is currently testing to create a truly massive multiplayer experience. “Think of the largest MMO you know,” Miguel said. “Now double it!” Thriving landscapes become battlefields in a world where humanity is facing its last hour. “It's not if they will be wiped out, it's when. Humanity is minus one from extinction. Every jump they make to save themselves punches another hole to allow Chaos through.” The resulting culture is desperate and brutal.

The four player factions—Chaos Marine, Space Marine, Orks, and Eldar—begin their battle from a personal attack cruiser in orbit. The cruiser is capable of merging with your friends' ships, forming a social guild structure by creating massive warships where in-guild production, storage, and trade can exist. Endgame guilds will be able to actually fire on the planet's surface from their ship, a power they must be careful not to exploit.

“We have taken inspiration from Eve Online in shaping our economic system. We've dumbed it down a bit—no one should need spreadsheets to manage their virtual trade.” There is one currency: requisition points. In the military model the game embodies, a player will have to requisition weapons and armor at supply points. To use the items, the character will have to prove their worth through experience, rank, and training.

Eternal Crusade will follow a free-to-play model, but non-paying players are restricted in faction and progression. “They can only be Orkboyz! It takes five Orkboyz in the tabletop game to take down one Space Marine!” Miguel's excitement grew with every breath. Free players cannot progress in military rank beyond officer.

Much of the game relies on social checks. Officers, squad leaders, commanders: each rank commands the players beneath them, and all are ultimately ruled over by a Council populated by the best of the best. Missions are handed down through rank by the players themselves. Miguel is counting on the lowest ranks to obey their officers a third of the time at best. The catch? You don't progress in-game unless you learn to take orders—then eventually give them. The social balance alone in this game is motivation enough to entice players to purchase premium content.

Obviously this is a PVP heavy game, and I was worried how a PVE/RP player such as myself might contribute to such a strict army structure. Miguel reassured me that there is a hefty need for diplomats, gatherers, crafters, and other non-combat roles. He estimates 60-70% of the players will choose active battle, with the others filling support roles and giving the offensive line something to defend. A player may make their way by saying, “Hey, if you take out that enemy, I'll give you 100 requisition points.” Or a group of miners might remind a squad of Marines that the resources are necessary to their faction, gaining some protection while they mine. Commanders may need to retire to a diplomatic position if they want to reach a position on the Council, and that position gives the greatest wartime powers of all.

While requisition points will be currency, campaigns will be won by the resources gathered and directed by the faction Council. If the Council finds a player strong and trustworthy enough, they can choose to funnel resources into establishing him as a Hero. This special class is granted abilities that can erase enemies en masse from the battlefield, changing the outcome in a few clicks. The abilities decay quickly, expiring at the end of a battle, so the Council must choose the Hero carefully.

The struggles where factions rise and fall and boundaries are shifted daily sound exciting enough, but the team is planning dynamic world events in three-month campaigns. Sweeping through planets one by one, each campaign will give players an epic struggle with clear winners. Miguel shared that he doesn't care for MMOs where the same things happen daily and everyone just moves forward. “There needs to be a victor,” he pointed out, “just as there needs to be a loser.” Players will earn badges and medals, marking them as campaign veterans seasoned on the field of battle.

I didn't get many details on the class system, but there may not be much need: The details have been written in Codex after Codex for the fifteen 40K armies and their chapters. Miguel plans to copy tabletop units stat for stat to make up the classes, complete with chapter variations. "I don't care about game balance at launch" he said. "War is not balanced. Why should a game about war be balanced?" Nevertheless, a system will exist to prevent a faction's monopoly of resources and overwhelming strength. Tyranids, the monstrous beasties that make up the ultimate enemy, will level the playing field, as will an intricate weather system capable of wiping out terrain and fortresses. These random mechanics will be wielded by the developers as needed to keep the factions on equal footing.

Miguel promised more factions would be playable in the future. I brought up my personal favourite, the Necron army, and he assured me Necrons were the most popular army amongst his developers as well. The first four player factions are a great place to start, since they will provide straightforward classes that will be easy for players to understand. Playing members of the other factions, especially Necrons, would involve a more complex knowledge of the game and battle system before the player found them effective rather than frustrating. Miguel doesn't plan to deviate from established lore, regardless. “I'm not worried about content. The 40K universe has enough content already for a hundred years of updates!”

I didn't even need to ask questions about the team's familiarity with Warhammer 40K; Miguel made it clear that every on the project developer is foremost a fan. I expressed my excitement and delight over everything he'd shared—this may be the first Warhammer game (Fantasy or 40K) which has truly grabbed my interest. Still, the gutsy designs are risky from a business standpoint. Miguel did scoff there—rightfully, because at that point I should have known better. "We are not making a game for publishers or marketing, we are making a game for the Warhammer fans." If Miguel and his team stay true to the bold strategy he's outlined, this MMO may wholly embody the spirit of the tabletop version.

For in the grim darkness of the future, there is only war. Source:
http://gamegeex.blogomancer.com/post/1290/interview-with-warhammer-40k-mmo-studio-head-miguel-caron/

Okay...that actually sounds pretty cool.

Yeah, whilst I don't tend to trust much of what is said in these interviews, he does make it sound pretty awesome.

We'll see. If they pull this off and make this a good game. I'll climb Mt Rainier
If they fail I'll buy 3 pizza's say feth my diet, play Rome 2 total war for 5, 20 hour interations and Just throw my bag of feths out my window

Tyranid NPC's and fighting them with your chapter?

Drop in from orbit with 50 of your battlebrothers to kill some termigaunts and gene stealers? hmmm

Can't wait to join the nightlord guild, i'm sure they'll be one

Eternal Crusade will follow a free-to-play model, but non-paying players are restricted in faction and progression. “They can only be Orkboyz! It takes five Orkboyz in the tabletop game to take down one Space Marine!” Miguel's excitement grew with every breath. Free players cannot progress in military rank beyond officer.

Have they not learned from good free-to-play examples like League of Legends, etc? There are no game related restrictions for the free players and still they make enough money, grow their player-base and keep interest.

I cannot imagine any free players staying long playing as an orkboy just being cannon fodder for the paying customers. It all sounds way too much like a demo version attached to a pay-to-play game. And from the sound of it they need a huge player-base to create interesting battles and struggles for planetary control.
They should really try to get more (initially) non paying players to play the whole game and entice them here and there to spend some money on non game play related perks instead of these hard restrictions.

"I don't care about game balance at launch" he said. "War is not balanced. Why should a game about war be balanced?"

It's supposed to be a game and a game should be all about having fun, so why would they not care about some semblance of balance?
I assume there will be a huge imbalance in player numbers for the different factions with Space Marines being the go to faction. So to have fun and not end up as cannon fodder (even as a paying orkboy commander) one should play as a Space Marine :(
So, why even bother with four factions?

It's all shaping up to be a wonderful game. The popular franchise probably will even make up for the horrid game design money wise for the devs...

Not being balanced also doesn't mean total ROFLstomp either. I took it to mean they were going to try and avoid WoW's monthly class tweaking.

What's wrong with frequent tweaks to keep the game interesting?

This sounds incredibly ambitious, if they manage to pull off even half of this I'll be excited! It almost sounds like an RTS where your units are other actual players, at least for the Commanders. It's weird that as you progress, the fundamental gameplay can possibly change shape by being promoted.

I think the biggest and best thing to take away from that, is how passionate this guy is about 40k. So at least if they fail, we'll know it's because they bit off more than they can chew, and not because they just didn't care enough.

Promises of new races to come is good, and implies they're planning on giving this plenty of support after release (if it gets there, that is). Also I like the idea of the developers balancing things in-universe with weather and Tyranid attacks, it lets them go more the tabletop route where one Boy can't and shouldn't be able to take a Marine one-on-one. Glad to hear they'll be trying to stay true to the stats, my Eldar will be fast enough to pull off plenty of Eldar Trickery! I hope you can be a Harlequin, that would kick ass.

 Minx wrote:
What's wrong with frequent tweaks to keep the game interesting?

Doing it on occasion to fix serious imbalance isn't an issue, but it seemed like in WoW they were making changes on a monthly basis and every change just imbalanced something else. Your class would change constantly, which is annoying, but I also think a lot of the time there really wasn't much issue, just trying to quiet the voices on the forums, which of course never stopped complaining.

To be fair, if they really want to to stay true to the game, they HAVE to release an unbalanced MMO

Well that looks quite ambitious to say the least, It should be good if it works out to be as he is explaining it. Its definitely a better more original concept that I had previously envisioned.
I also think people make too much of a big deal regarding the balance too, I think this is down the Wow influence, in my experienced it is entirely possible to have a fun, unbalanced game.

If they're basing the classes on the codices, they might be working in the points/per/model, too. With a basic class available for all players, and the option of upgrading at the next spawn when enough kills/points are gathered would balance the sides.
The bit about trade between ships is intriguing. Wargear, probably.
No mention of vehicles?

 Sigvatr wrote:
To be fair, if they really want to to stay true to the game, they HAVE to release an unbalanced MMO

The character creation screen will be 10 variants of loyalist marines, and then one of each other faction.

Good Lord have mercy!

Ranks will be an awesome addition to games. Who knows if the council of the best of the best will have their soldiers interests in mind or do what ever it takes to get the job done, i.e. send an orbital strike in to stop the enemy from claiming the base even though our marines are still on the planet.

Oh yes we are getting chapters. Black Templars 'hero' will no doubt be the Emperors Champion, amazing!

This really does sound ambitious and the fact that this guy is a fan, I have little worries. This could be it Ladies and Gentlemen, prepare for eternal war.


Edit: hmmmm I wonder what diplomats entail. You reckon we will have players acting as messengers on behalf of the Ultrmarines or Inquisition requesting aid on planets, I dont see much luck in a Dark Angel diplomat requesting aid from a Space Wolf guild.

There are many things they will have to get correct.

And to get there, ill be surprised.

#1 Smooth Gameplay
#2 Content
#3 Graphics
#4 Balance, doesn't have to be perfect, but it can't be where you play this class or your screwed.

Well see if they get that right.

Ill hold any Judgements until I see gameplay video's

Yeah final judgement shall be given on the gameplay I see.

I wonder if we get to see something soon, I wonder what stage of development they are at, hopefully they have managed to create something for us, even just a teaser trailer.

Another interview:

It’s been awhile since Warhammer 40K: Dark Millennium dropped off the face of the earth. Who knew that just a year after the closure of the THQ studio, we’d be here at E3 2013 talking about a brand new take on the 40K license as an MMO once more. Only this time? Well, this time Chaos Marines, Space Marines, Eldar, and Orks will all be duking it out on a massive scale while fending off the AI-controlled Tyranids in a universal struggle for power. We spent time with Behaviour Studios Head Miguel Caron (formerly of Funcom Montreal and Anarchy Online as well as Age of Conan) talking about the studio’s ambitions and philosophy for their take on Games Workshop’s epic space fantasy. Today, we have so much to tell you about what Behaviour has in store for all fans of the Waaagh.
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Starting right off the bat, fans should note that four races will be playable from the start, with the fifth being the AI-controlled Tyranids (who are there to keep everyone balanced throughout the battle). The four races available at launch (24 months from now, 18 months for Open Beta) will be the Space Marines (Dark Angels), Chaos Marines (Iron Warriors), The Eldar, and the Orks. Miguel told us straight away that the game will be available on PC, Xbox One, and PS4 as a premium Free-to-Play MMORPG. The free race available to everyone will be the Orks. But free players will only be able to progress through the game’s content Ork Boyz: five of which are needed to take down one Space Marine. Behaviour expects that F2P members will always outnumber paid players and the Ork Boyz are their way of balancing F2P with paid members. Once someone becomes invested in the game, they can purchase the other races and open up the full progression paths for each (including the Orks). But perhaps, I’m getting ahead of myself. Let’s talk a bit about how the game’s ongoing planetary war will actually work.

We will start with the example of the Space Marines that Miguel gave us. You will login, select your character and be ported to your personal Orbital Striker (spaceship, which you can deck out and customize like a form of housing). You can also take your Striker and join it up with your Squad (up to 10 people) and create one shared mobile living space. Your Squad is part of the larger Chapter which is run by an electorate that the players will choose in the game itself. Are you following me so far? Good.

So your squad (or you as a solo player) then chooses a continent on the current campaign planet to land on. Each campaign will last three months, and then a winner will be declared. The game’s focus will reset to a new planet in the universe that Games Workshop has given Behaviour to make their own (it will not immediately be a part of the “canonical” Black Library). Once you land, you will be presented with an overworld map interface that displays where friendly and enemy squads are headed and shows you where action and locales to be explored are available. From this map display, you’ll be able to select a place to take your squad (or go it solo if you choose). Some locations may be rife with PVP while others may be more intimate PVE Tyranid encounters. One example Miguel gave us was a mine that is infested with Tyranids. If your squad is able to clear it out, you’ll gain those resources for your Chapter.

But that’s about the extent of the PVE content in Eternal Crusade. The crux of the game will be focused on the persistent struggle between the four player factions and of course the AI-controlled Tyranids. The PVP is Eternal Crusade’s big sell. As Miguel put it: “There is only WAR.” Combat is a mix between THQ’s single-player cult hit Space Marine and Epic Games’ Gears of War. You will seamlessly go between ranged bolter combat and then hacking apart a bunch of Nobz with your chainsword. It’s all handled via the familiar third-person over the shoulder vantage point. You can build your squad, and change your specs on the fly, between ranged and melee combat with vast array skills and abilities specific to each race and class.

Progression will handled via traditional experience points, but the way in which you earn those valuable XP will be a bit foreign. Sure, you can go off into the world and do your own thing, but if you decide to listen to your Order’s leadership (again, elected by the players) you will get bonus XP and rewards. Say your order sends out the call to sack a particular fortress and you help out? Then you’ll be justly rewarded with XP and Requisition tokens. If you decide to go your own way, you’ll get XP from playing the game as you want, but it’s always in your best interest to contribute to the war effort. Not only will you unlock more classes in each faction, but each class has its own deep skill tree to progress through. So you might start as a base Space Marine, but work your way up to a Chaplain and gain its armor and skillset.

Speaking of Requisition tokens: this is Eternal Crusade’s own form of currency. Like any military, you don’t really care about gold or copper... you just want some sort of allowance from your commanding officers to get bigger and better weaponry to do your job (and armor as well). As such, as you contribute to the War Effort, you’ll get Requisition from capturing objectives, following orders, and killing enemy players and Tyranids. These tokens can be spent with the Requisition vendors in order to fully deck out your character.

So, back to the Campaign. You will drop down into this overworld map, and you’ll see a fortress of the enemy lit on fire. Your squad will vote and all agree to go see what’s happening there. From the overworld map, the camera pans in in real-time to an over the shoulder view of your character. Your squad joins the battle in progress, and let’s say you successfully overtake the Eldar’s fortress. Now you’ve changed the border and territory control of the map, and any resources that were under the purveyance of the Eldar are yours to hold onto. Miguel said it’s a lot like EVE’s economy, but on a much simpler-to-grasp level. Resources are all necessary to make the armor, weapons, ships, and fortress armaments needed to defend your faction’s stake in the world. Once you take the fortress, though you may have ruined a lot of it in the process (because EC comes complete with destructible environments and plenty of cover mechanics) you will rebuild it and hold it to keep the battle-lines drawn in your favor.

All of this: the fight between the four player controlled factions and the fifth wild-card known as the Tyranids rages on for three months. At the end, a winner is decided by overall territorial control and dominance, and the battle shifts from that planet to a brand new one (fresh and ripe for the picking). The new world may have a completely different ecosystem, new resources, new layout, and all of that to fight over. Think of it like competitive “seasons” in any sport. What’s the point of a war if no one wins? And that’s the philosophy behind having a campaign system in Eternal Crusade.

There’s so much more to tell you about Warhammer 40K: Eternal Crusade, but all we can say is that Behaviour’s vision sounds exactly like what we’ve hoped for out of a 40K MMO. They have full reign to go into all the other races and faction in Warhammer’s lore. Dungeons and other content will be procedurally generated so that there’s always an element of surprise when you go to clear out a Tyranid infestation. Progression is set up to reward those to help their fellow warriors, while not limiting the ability for the lone wolf to play his part. The payment model is designed from the ground up to let anyone play while still making sure that those who feel invested have something to invest in. Ships, artillery, fortresses, airships... it’s all customizable and usable in the field of battle. Said “field of battle” will consist of a lot of people on any given map though Miguel was not ready to let us share the number of persistent on-screen players you can expect. Let’s just say it will be a lot.

Behaviour hopes to have Warhammer 40K: Eternal Crusade ready for its open beta in 18 months, and launch in just 24 months. Can they pull it off while targeting PC and consoles simultaneously? We shall see. But we are all very keen to find out just how much of their ambitious plans come to fruition, as it’s more than a little refreshing to see 40K treated not only seriously as a game for the fans by fans, but also as an MMO that’s seeking to become something unique in an industry that’s been clouded with also-rans for far too long. If Miguel and his team of MMO veterans can pull off half of what they are planning, we’ll all be in for a treat. Be sure to check back soon for more info on Eternal Crusade as we march ever on and on and pester Behaviour for as much information as they can muster. If you have questions, ask them here and we’ll answer them after we’re all back from the convention.

http://www.mmorpg.com/gamelist.cfm/game/954/feature/7493/Warhammer-40000-Eternal-Crusade-There-Is-Only-WAR.html




Fight for the Emperor, slay the Heretic! www.battle-brothers.net

These interviews sound waaaaay too good to be true for a licensed shovelware company that has never produced a mega successful game. I am intrigued, but extremely cautiously so.

 mattyrm wrote:
Oh man, I hope they do a good job on this... the 40k universe lends itself so fething well to the idea, it will piss all over WoW.

The only thing I can see being an issue is.. if the community have to get together and sort their lives out in order to attack and take planets and systems, surely Space Marines will just consume the galaxy, I mean, they are far and away the most popular faction, so it stands to reason they will outnumber the other races massively.

And how many young lads (main gamers) are going to want to be puny Eldar!?

to be blunt mate.. ill just answer one of your first parts there, the ole "this'll piss all over WOW" mate, im sorry that is a VERY tired old phrase, look at all the MMO's that come and go, and ohh lets see whos still the king? is anything even competing with WOW atm? GW2? no Rift? no SWTOR? no... who was it this year gonna take the title? .. sorry bud, but unless these chumps hire in with extreme expense this will not ever be a wow killer, might be fun but ahh no.. sadly not :( .. hell we all want to see the king overturned but, well... ahaha the only company in 5 years or more to do that right is Blizzard :( ...

Haha an interesting idea to use money as a means of balancing the race numbers.

Oh wow ok as Dakka and The Emperor as my witness, I shall become the greatest chaplain ever to walk the fields of the eternal crusade, all enemies shall fear my presence and all brothers shall love it. I shall commit my time in eternal crusade to verbally strike fear into the hearts of my enemies. This is my dream class.

Oh my, player housing? I will actually be able to have my own personal prayer altar or gretchin maids. Lawdy lawd.


edit: I fall more in love with this ranking system, it will in time create special characters which people will rally to in battle. Imagine you are on the verge of defeat from a chaos and tyranid massacre and all of a sudden, a drop pod falls down, containing a famous space marine captain and their honour guard to turn the tide of battle.

so i cant be a night lord?

They said chapters will be in and most things are decided by the players themselves so what I am guessing is that people will be able to pay to make a seperate chapter/guild?
So I could pay to start a Black Templars Crusade and the people who join would all get new cosmetics, ships etc to match the Templars and we would all decide who would be Marshal, diplomat etc.

Palindrome wrote:Plus that has to be one of the worst reasons for disliking a game that I have ever heard.

Depends. When you've got a preference you may be able to dismiss it for some time - but when the opposite keeps being shoved in your face all the time, it starts to piss you off. I'm sure it has nothing to with this game alone, but is a reflection of the individual player's past experience with other games, or indeed the entirety of 40k.

Cheesecat wrote:I don't know if you could realistically create an imperial that is as dangerous as an ork, space marine or eldar balance wise.

Well, the Imperial Guard has access to weaponry such as plasma guns or meltas, and considering that this game apparently tries to have vehicles as well, ...
Really, the issue would be an IG character's ability to resist damage, not so much dishing it out. But there are ways around it, from granting them faster respawns to team boosts to NPC companions. Or simply having the players suck it and make the IG another F2P faction, when it's apparently fine for Ork Boyz.

And I have to add, Mehreens on Mehreens is a bit stale. Where's the hordes of cannonfodder? This isn't some sort of medieval jousting tournament where only the knights show up. Or at least it should not be.

That said, supposedly they plan on bringing in more factions later on, so the current set-up makes sense. I'm still a bit surprised as I would have thought that the IG would be 40k's second most-popular race and thus a sure bet to have as a playable character.

Morathi's Darkest Sin wrote:Tbh as long as I can play Orks or Eldar I can dig this. If it does well, they can always add other factions later.

curran wrote:I want to believe this is good, but man...been burned before and the developer is not a name that inspires confidence. Believe me, I want them to succeed, but I just can't say that until I see solid gameplay.

These two statements sum up my own feelings perfectly. And at least Orks will be F2P, too. No need to throw money at them until they feature something more interesting than "the next best thing" to me, but this way I can at least try out if they're capable of delivering what they are apparently aiming for.

The interview sounds a bit wacky, though. A studio I'm sure most of us never heard of before with a track record of Disney-funded movie tie-ins suddenly announces a 40k game and enthusiastically declares: "We've got this huge crate of ideas, it's gonna be so awesome! Just trust us, we'll manage to actually implement all of this. Somehow. It's gonna be the best thing you ever played!"

Guess we'll see about that. I'll remain cautious for now.

Also, lol'd @ Miner Marines & Strike Cruiser housing

lol what if this is all a big prank?

E3 is the last place you want to pull a coorporate prank.

Deathklaat wrote:
E3 is the last place you want to pull a coorporate prank.

Or the first.

"I trolled a forum!"
"Cool, I trolled E3."

What a wonderful tidbit of News and Rumors this is.

"Not caring about balance" huh lol?

gg Black Templars

I dont think he literally meant forget balance all together but he is right, no game can ever be balanced so why worry about it the most. Doesnt mean they wont worry about it.

If it is not F2P they are dooming themselves to failure.

Assuming it doesnt fail anyways like Dark Millennium which im still annoyed I lost that Single Player game

 unmercifulconker wrote:
I dont think he literally meant forget balance all together but he is right, no game can ever be balanced so why worry about it the most. Doesnt mean they wont worry about it.

Only his words imply it is an explicit design choice.

I can't wait to play as an Ork Boy that is outnumbered ten to one by the Marine players, with each Marine being worth five of me.

I can't wait to hear the endless whining of players who WANT to play marines but can't because they're trying to enforce the 5:1 ratio of Orks:Marines.

Just remembered the combat is going to be like space marine and gears of war, HOT DAYUM!

Meh they do have plans to try and even out the numbers by making space marine players pay for that race, while the orks are free so in theory there should be more orks than marine players and I think it is a great idea, I dont mind paying what even £10 for my race, the game itself is free.
However it will be interesting to see how this tactic plays out and I do have doubts.

Edit: They arent going to enforce number ratios, just ways which will try to convince people to pick a certain race. Ultimately its not their fault for the number issues.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Ultimately its not their fault for the number issues.

Actually... yes, it is. If they refuse to balance the game and make it so that one faction is always both more numerous AND stronger than all the others, it is entirely the developers' fault. It's THEIR game, how it's implemented is THEIR decision.

It will admittedly be hilarious to see the Tyranids attack the overwhelming Space Marine horde every battle, to allow the few Eldar and Ork Boy players a chance of victory.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
the game itself is free.

Unfortunately only a tiny slice of the game seems to be free. And that part, being cannon fodder for the paying space marines, will get old pretty fast. I doubt they'll manage to get enough ork boyz to die play for them.

 Melissia wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Ultimately its not their fault for the number issues.

Actually... yes, it is. If they refuse to balance the game and make it so that one faction is always both more numerous AND stronger than all the others, it is entirely the developers' fault. It's THEIR game, how it's implemented is THEIR decision.

I liked how LotR handled this. They gave humans superior stats to make them more numerous and it worked, but to a very sensible degree.

This sounds bad and will be bad. Too much "DLC" in it for me. Of course a GW game would be the one to do what the game "DLC quest feared" EA could take notes on this.

Also,

Earn the right by giving us your money, to customize your builds in a deep progression system drawing on the rich Warhammer 40,000 universe.

Thought I'd correct this for what it obviously will be.

I never thought pay to play could be worth it, however this, this i could get down on. Seriously this has all the potential to be exactly what ive imagined for a game like this for a long time.

Give me an eldar long rifle and some form of stealth tech and let me wreak havoc with headshots all day long! At least, untill they come out with Tau, and i can jump around in a stealthsuit or tell a bunch of sniper drones where to shoot.

I dont wanna be more excited than skeptical...but its hard lol

I kind of like the ork boy idea. I don't think it will end up working, but I like the idea of having really divergent power levels where you need to get a gang of boys in order to take on a SM. I don't think you should use that as your montization plan.

Hoping for more MMO (Planetstrike) and less MMORPG (World of Warcraft)

Otherwise that epic battle for the planet they mention is gonna be 90% Warbosses and Librarians and gak, and no actual soldiers...

Edit: Just read that pay2spacemarine gak above. Thats really awful. Like, I wanna be Orks, but theres no way I'm going to willingly play ten year olds with uber-powerful space marines that they just bought.

If they're going to have paid content, why not just make Imperial Guardsmen the level one of the Imperial faction, and let everyone purchase upgraded characters?

Or better yet, feth free to play and earn your money selling the damn game. As the first real decision I've seen from the questionable developer of this game, I gotta say I'm not impressed at all.

Just remember there's at least 2 years before the game can even think about being ready for play. Lots will change before then.

I'm looking for 2 things as of right now :

1) Free to play, but NOT pay to win type system. (cash shop for trinkets/skins/things that don't affect how the game is played are ok to me)
2) Vehicle combat (bikes/tanks/walkers - but no fliers)

To be honest, I'm not going to give this game any real consideration until it hits beta tests. That'll help lessen the blow if this game never sees the light of day.

I am, on the one hand, foaming at the mouth for this, as I've been an avid MMO player since UO, and obviously love the 40K universe.
On the other hand Behaviour Interactive have no history that impresses me, and the MMOs Miguel Caron has previously worked on have never been really great (Well, AO was pretty good but that was a looong time ago).
I'll likely be all over this though.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also; I can see this becoming pay to win if GW get too involved. Fortunately Warhammer online never went that route.

True. Warhammer Online failed for it's own reasons. So at least they're shooting themselves in the foot originally here.

Warhammer Online should have gotten F2P a LONG time ago. It would have meant a considerable financial success and would have had good synergy effects with the brand overall.

In the end, EA failed it. Surprise, EA Sucks.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Warhammer Online should have gotten F2P a LONG time ago. It would have meant a considerable financial success and would have had good synergy effects with the brand overall.

In the end, EA failed it. Surprise, EA Sucks.

What, you mean the company that has 400+ dollars worth of DLC for the Sims 3 (half of which is just copy-pasted from the previous Sims games) sucks?

 Melissia wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
Warhammer Online should have gotten F2P a LONG time ago. It would have meant a considerable financial success and would have had good synergy effects with the brand overall.

In the end, EA failed it. Surprise, EA Sucks.

What, you mean the company that has 400+ dollars worth of DLC for the Sims 3 (half of which is just copy-pasted from the previous Sims games) sucks?

Surprising, eh?

Fun fact for you, though you most likely know it already: did you know that in Sims 3, women were forced to stay home if your family got a child? My fiancee stumbled upon that when she played it back then. Can't even work if you got a "Work at home" job.

I am down for this, even as an Ork, though I suspect the vent servers for Ork forces are going to be the most annoying things in the history of transmitted human conversation that doesn't involve Dane Cook or the White House.

Eldar would be cool. Chaos would be cool too.

Marines can eat it.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
I am down for this, even as an Ork, though I suspect the vent servers for Ork forces are going to be the most annoying things in the history of transmitted human conversation that doesn't involve Dane Cook or the White House.

Eldar would be cool. Chaos would be cool too.

Marines can eat it.

The only forces you'll ahve for Chaos are marines, so.... you're stuck with Eldar and Orks, then.

Ork boys are, by design, a demo into the game for new players...people who want to pay but also want to keep being orks can upgrade into the nob and war boss categories. This is stated in one of the interviews posted.

People need to read.

 Melissia wrote:
I can't wait to hear the endless whining of players who WANT to play marines but can't because they're trying to enforce the 5:1 ratio of Orks:Marines.

Why not allow the players to play as nobz instead of boyz aren't nobz supposed to be similar in power level to a space marine?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Melissia wrote:

 Cheesecat wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
On the contrary, I'm downplaying it based off of the fact that only a single faction allows you to play as a female character. If you could at least play as a human (guardsman? inquisitorial acolyte? psyker? commissar? sergeant with his squad? techpriest? anything?) it'd be okay, but nope, only Imperial representation amongst players is spehss mureenz, so meh, I'll probably skip it unless it turns out to be amazing and groundbreakingly new (which it won't).

I don't know if you could realistically create an imperial that is as dangerous as an ork, space marine or eldar balance wise.

Sure you could.

A techpriest with hi-tech weaponry, combat mechadendrites, and dragonskin (their power armor) could easily do it.

A psyker, some of whom in the lore can be powerful enough to rip Space Marines apart like their armor is made of cheap aluminum and who it's possible to implement in a variety of ways.

A sister of battle, who are in-lore considered the equals of the Astartes in combat, and who wield nasty short ranged weaponry and can be given unique gameplay features through Acts of Faith.

A sergeant, whose squad reduces the damage they take and increases their firepower as well as providing more tactical options by ordering them around, with the sergeant themselves wielding a special or heavy weapon. This one is the only one that might be hard to implement in an FPS genre.

Various high-ranking Inquisitorial acolytes, whom are exceptional human beings that are very well equipped, and many of which are capable of accomplishing things which might impress an Astartes (Amberley Vail's squad was raiding genestealer nests in one of the Cain books, for example).

It's not exactly hard to implement a human character who is capable of keeping up with an Astartes character. Astartes aren't some kind of unbeatable god on the battlefield.

Alright, alright you're right.

 Melissia wrote:

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
I am down for this, even as an Ork, though I suspect the vent servers for Ork forces are going to be the most annoying things in the history of transmitted human conversation that doesn't involve Dane Cook or the White House.

Eldar would be cool. Chaos would be cool too.

Marines can eat it.

The only forces you'll ahve for Chaos are marines, so.... you're stuck with Eldar and Orks, then.

I'm fine with Marines: Spiky Edition

but I think if I buy an upgrade it'll be Eldar unless they release Sisters or some other Imperial faction I like. DA is okay, but kinda "meh" you know?

 Cheesecat wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
I can't wait to hear the endless whining of players who WANT to play marines but can't because they're trying to enforce the 5:1 ratio of Orks:Marines.

Why not allow the players to play as nobz instead of boyz aren't nobz supposed to be similar in power level to a space marine?

Only players who pay will be able to play nobz. F2P players will be stuck as Boyz.

 Melissia wrote:

 Cheesecat wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
I can't wait to hear the endless whining of players who WANT to play marines but can't because they're trying to enforce the 5:1 ratio of Orks:Marines.

Why not allow the players to play as nobz instead of boyz aren't nobz supposed to be similar in power level to a space marine?

Only players who pay will be able to play nobz. F2P players will be stuck as Boyz.

Are you saying you have a problem with that?

I'm personally of the opinion that it's a smart way to get people into the game and then subsequently paying for the game, which is kind of the point is it not?

 Melissia wrote:

 Cheesecat wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
I can't wait to hear the endless whining of players who WANT to play marines but can't because they're trying to enforce the 5:1 ratio of Orks:Marines.

Why not allow the players to play as nobz instead of boyz aren't nobz supposed to be similar in power level to a space marine?

Only players who pay will be able to play nobz. F2P players will be stuck as Boyz.

It's neat, but like the most horrid way one can do a F2P model. Like literally the worst way.

BrotherVord wrote:

Are you saying you have a problem with that?

I'm personally of the opinion that it's a smart way to get people into the game and then subsequently paying for the game, which is kind of the point is it not?

Free to play , not pay to win. If you don't buy the "superior" classes (Nobz, Spess Murheens) don't expect to make any progress against those who do. They will be stronger than you, faster than you and have more powerful weapons than you.

Doesn't matter how skilled you are if you can be one shot by any one of a thousand armor clad genetic freaks running around.

Does that sound fun?

It sounds fine to me, to be honest. I don't mind players having to put something into a game financially in order to get the full experience. We have come to this place where we as gamers feel like we are entitled to a free experience somehow. The developers and publishers need to make money, they can't do that if every free ork toon is just as good as every space marine...if that were the case then nobody would have incentive to pay to be anything more than one of the boyz. This system gives incentive to try the game, see the systems in place, and choose to buy in if you want. I like that system.

If you have to pay to buy extra stuff in order to have a chance to compete then the game is not free.

They should just put all the factions in then sell the game to make money that way.

why not just make the game like planetside 2 (in terms of how the F2P is set up)

But at the same time have NPC's that play as Guard, Orkz, Cultists, Guardians, etc.

I think they could make a tidy sum of money just from selling skins and that is the model they should look into.

AWesker1976 wrote:
If you have to pay to buy extra stuff in order to have a chance to compete then the game is not free.

They should just put all the factions in then sell the game to make money that way.

Guild Wars 2 has proven the viability of a one purchase model as a money-maker.

Also, people are reading what it says wrong, from what I can see.

It is not that an Ork pays money and becomes a Nob, they have to pay money to even potentially become a Nob (The classes above officer, apparently). So, even the p2p players who start as Orks' first experience in-game will be getting slaughtered at a 5:1 ratio by the Marine players. Which isn't actually fun.

I've played as an underpowered class before balance tweaks at the start of an MMO's life, and it eventually makes even bothering to play a drag. I eventually said feth it and stopped. The difference is that the imbalance, rather than being the result of an open beta without finalized balancing, is an explicit feature in this game, apparently.

I think their are ways to make playing as an boy fun and viable even if it takes 5 of you to down one SM.

 Void__Dragon wrote:

AWesker1976 wrote:
If you have to pay to buy extra stuff in order to have a chance to compete then the game is not free.

They should just put all the factions in then sell the game to make money that way.

Guild Wars 2 has proven the viability of a one purchase model as a money-maker.

Indeed. They're also still making money because people can purchase various items with real-game money, mostly cosmetics, character slots, etc.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

nomotog wrote:
I think their are ways to make playing as an boy fun and viable even if it takes 5 of you to down one SM.

Not when you're invariably going to be outnumbered by the Space Marines you have to outnumber to win against.

 Melissia wrote:

nomotog wrote:
I think their are ways to make playing as an boy fun and viable even if it takes 5 of you to down one SM.

Not when you're invariably going to be outnumbered by the Space Marines you have to outnumber to win against.

It depend on exactly how things work out. If you give every class a spawn cost then you can balance things out better. If it takes you 5 times the money to spawn a SM then a boy, then that makes things more even form a point perspective. You can also give boys powers bases around the fact that they die a lot. Like give them the ability to re spawn anywhere their are 5 or more orks and do it instantly. Meanwhile a SM might need to re spawn all the way back at a base or in an APC.

Basically I say balance it all by points. You can boy, nob, or warboss depending on how many points you spend. Same with the SM scout MS or captain. all depending on how much you spend.

Spawn costs?

You might have lost me.

Like, your character is set in stone depending on how far you have progressed, you don't spend points every battle to afford better and kewler units.

This is not PlanetSide 2, which is the impression I think you might have. It is similar in that it is PVP based and focused on big battlefields, but that is where the comparison ends, from what I've seen.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Melissia wrote:
Indeed. They're also still making money because people can purchase various items with real-game money, mostly cosmetics, character slots, etc.

Yeah, skins alone are pretty cheap to render and can net a good profit.

I could see people paying to customize their special snowflake some more. Like, your base Ork is a fairly generic Ork in aesthetic, but you can buy totems and icons that belong to a certain clan, or whatever. Maybe you could have the appearance of a manly freeboota with a manly pirate hat.

Space Marines, random bling of war, customizing your armour's mark, stuff like that.

Not sure how that would work on Eldar since I am less knowledgeable of their fluff, but I am sure something could work.

Well if your going to make everything persistent, then start SMs as scouts and that will make things more balanced with orks starting as boys. Though I was hoping for a more dust like system myself because of reasons.

Also Everyone in 40k has the bling of war. Everyone! It's part of why it makes such a good mini game. Every one has a reason to bling out their models and if they didn't then the fans made one up.

nomotog wrote:
Well if your going to make everything persistent, then start SMs as scouts and that will make things more balanced with orks starting as boys. Though I was hoping for a more dust like system myself because of reasons.

Also Everyone in 40k has the bling of war. Everyone! It's part of why it makes such a good mini game. Every one has a reason to bling out their models and if they didn't then the fans made one up.

According to the Imperial Munitorium Manual, Atricle 5633/64b:

Any soldier (ie - guardsman) who displays about his person or uniform, unauthorized decals, tattoos, trophies taken from the field of battle or other spoils of war without prior permission in writing of his superior officer, will have the offending items stripped from him and then be flogged.

nomotog wrote:
If it takes you 5 times the money to spawn a SM then a boy

That won't matter if there's ten times as many people playing them.

This is sounding pretty dumb. I guess they could do something slightly less dumb and just have marines as npcs. But it's far easier to just realise how stupid trying to enforce population ratios like this is.

Cause honestly it's sounding like WH40k Online: Marine Fanwank Edition.

BrotherVord wrote:
It sounds fine to me, to be honest. I don't mind players having to put something into a game financially in order to get the full experience.

Like buying the game?

BrotherVord wrote:
We have come to this place where we as gamers feel like we are entitled to a free experience somehow.

I've already bought the game, why should I pay more?

BrotherVord wrote:
The developers and publishers need to make money

Just buying the game isn't enough anymore?

BrotherVord wrote:
they can't do that if every free ork toon is just as good as every space marine...if that were the case then nobody would have incentive to pay to be anything more than one of the boyz. This system gives incentive to try the game, see the systems in place, and choose to buy in if you want. I like that system.

But I've already bought the game!

---

I find a bit of a problem with your argument, I've outlined my issues with it above.
I do have a closing question though;

What's wrong with the only costs involved being the purchase of the Game itself?

Idky everyone is so scared of SM overpopulation, this game isn't just meant to sell to just our community... it's for everyone, meaning that those who are unfamiliar to the franchise may or may not add to the ranks of raging fanbois....

The simplest solution to balancing the game would be to just have it be a big game of rock paper scissors.. SMs can usually beat Orks, are equal to CSM, but struggle against the Eldar, CSMs can usually beat the Eldar, are equal to the SMs but struggle against the Orks. The Orks are equal to the Eldar, beat the CSMs, but struggle against the SMs. Finally the Eldar beat the SM's, struggle against CSM, and are about equal to the Orks.

This isn't exactly new: Warlocks in Wow seemed incredibly powerful, but warriors could crush their faces in, who were in turn obliterated by Mages, who were in turn backstabbed by Rogues, who were pummeled by Shamans, Paladins, and Druids, who were then gunned down by Hunters, out-survived by Priests, who in turn were melted by Warlocks....

Being an excellent player or bringing an excellent game that day can change your odds, as does coordination of your team.. the better coordinated you are with your faction, the higher percentage you have of winning. Much like the Horde was when I initially played WoW, I suspect that the majority of the greatest populated faction will be lousy players who are disorganized and simply horde up against pocketed resistance. Though strongest when simply driving forward, our flanks and rear were very vulnerable and astute alliance commanders knew when to hit us hard and kill the majority of a disorganized guild. It wasn't until we shaped up could we dish out some serious punishment, but by then the alliance already had a serious item or positional advantage.

I find it funny that you are all that bitter, you are complaining about the game before its even out lol.
None of us know anything about it apart from those interviews, no one said you cannot pay to be a "better ork" maybe a nob or something, and half of the things you are all moaning about have not even been done yet.
I dont think it will be as good as they are making it sound but you lot are embarrasing, cheer up !!

You're right, all comments should be positive, nothing negative should ever be said.

I said I'd wait until more is revealed to see if my initial impression is changed, but until then, I can have whatever opinion on the information we have I please.

BrotherVord wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
Only players who pay will be able to play nobz. F2P players will be stuck as Boyz.

Are you saying you have a problem with that?

I'm personally of the opinion that it's a smart way to get people into the game and then subsequently paying for the game, which is kind of the point is it not?

It's not smart to entice people to pay for your game if all you can show them is the absolute worst part of it, i.e. being cannon fodder, no advancement possible and therefore no incentive to follow orders from the paying customers above you (it won't be fun being an ork nob either for that reason alone; unless there is friendly fire) and being stuck with all the new players who have no clue but need to work together to down one of the mighty space marine gods. Yeah, that sounds like real fun.

BrotherVord wrote:
It sounds fine to me, to be honest. I don't mind players having to put something into a game financially in order to get the full experience. We have come to this place where we as gamers feel like we are entitled to a free experience somehow. The developers and publishers need to make money, they can't do that if every free ork toon is just as good as every space marine...if that were the case then nobody would have incentive to pay to be anything more than one of the boyz. This system gives incentive to try the game, see the systems in place, and choose to buy in if you want. I like that system.

How about selling them a complete product for a change or follow the successful free-to-play-model, that really deserves that name, of League of Legends. Everything game related can be unlocked and tested just by playing. If you want to customize your character visually or show the devs your support you can pay for skins. There are also ways to pay for a shortcut to unlocking stuff.
And if they don't follow one of those routes why are they using the misleading term free-to-play if it's really pay-to-play or at the very least pay-to-win.

Providing they stick with what they are doing, this is how it will work.
Everyone starts as an ork boy if no one bought anything from the start. As you kill and complete objectives you will become a better ork boy. However to progress further up the rank system you have to pay AND obey orders through their social system. You can just get a group of friends (ork boys) and go on a rampage across the field but you will all stay as an ork boy because you didnt capture the base like the player who is a warboss told you all to.

If you wanted you pay a fee to become a space marine and again you can only progress if you follow orders and it turn give them. Hopefully because many people will not pay a lot or follow orders all the time, we will not be seeing 100 warbosses or captains fighting 2 ork boys and 3 assault marines. I imagine the amount of exp needed to become even a nob will be quite high.

Free to play models are never truly free, it just means the base game itself is accesible, but if you want to make money after spending your own to make the game, of course you are going to have charge for something.

I seriously doubt it will be pay to win, you only pay to switch races as far as I know and I seriously doubt they will let every player just buy a warboss or eldar autarch class. My guess is you will have to earn it, THEN unlock it with money.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Free to play models are never truly free, it just means the base game itself is accesible, but if you want to make money after spending your own to make the game, of course you are going to have charge for something.

League of Legends is free to play and not just some demo version or base game. Everything is free. All they sell are unlock shortcuts (and those are not needed, if you are having fun playing the game) and visual customization. It seems to work for them since they've managed to produce a fun game (although not very innovative) with a large player base.
They should just release a quick demo version and otherwise sell the 40k MMO as a full price game. That would be transparent and honest.

LoL is the biggest and most successful online game so far. Take a look at their financial report - it's ridiculous!

 Void__Dragon wrote:
You're right, all comments should be positive, nothing negative should ever be said.

I said I'd wait until more is revealed to see if my initial impression is changed, but until then, I can have whatever opinion on the information we have I please.

That is not what I said though was it, You failed to comprehend me.
I was basically pointing out that some of the negativity expressed by posters in this thread amuses me, and I said cheer up, which is commonly said to miserable people, no malice meant.
I have no problem with your opinions, I fully support freedom of speech.

Yes but in LOL you have to pay if you want to play a certain costume or unlock a character , which many many people buy so its not truly free 2 play.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Yes but in LOL you have to pay if you want to play a certain costume or unlock a character , which many many people buy so its not truly free 2 play.

No, that's partially wrong. You can unlock any character you want to play just by playing. There's also a changing selection of free characters to start the game. You only pay for costumes and shortcuts in the unlocking process. Those shortcuts are not needed; it's not a terrible and overly long grind.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Yes but in LOL you have to pay if you want to play a certain costume or unlock a character , which many many people buy so its not truly free 2 play.

No, it's F2P. What you mean is a completely free game, freeware, which is certainly isn't. You gotta pay for people and for servers etc. F2P means having free access to all basic gameplay features without being at a disadvantage to paying people...which perfectly fits LoL.

Plus: in ARAM, you can play all heroes without even having them bought.

 Sigvatr wrote:
Plus: in ARAM, you can play all heroes without even having them bought.

Unless they've changed it recently this is incorrect.

Ah I see, apologies.

Still I think the method they are trying to implement is fair tbh.

What other ways could people be 'persuaded' to join a certain race to adjust realistic numbers? A lot of AI bots for say orks and some for eldar?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Oh yeah forgot they will be using Tyranids to balance the games.

However I have one worry for this and this is what the behaviour of the tyranids is, I doubt this but using them as a balance mechanic does this mean they will just attack the winning side?

Should still be amazing, imagine duking it out with your squad against some dire avengers and all of a sudden a carnifex and warriors spring out of no where.

Also It seems like the ambition is brought partly from Planetside which is amazing imo and thus we will be seeing huge 4 way battles, of course more when more races are released.

 n0t_u wrote:

 Sigvatr wrote:
Plus: in ARAM, you can play all heroes without even having them bought.

Unless they've changed it recently this is incorrect.

It's correct. It's fully AR, you can get any hero in the game. If you already have the hero bought you randomed, you get additional "reroll points" after the game.

Oh, that's much much better.

If this thing is going to succeed longterm they are going to have to put in more PVE than hinted at in the interview.

Another major wild card is the idea that players will essentially be getting "quests" from other players rather than NPC's. I can forsee some real problems with that model of business.

I hope they are successful and have no problem with a subscription fee if it means a stable and continuos development of the game. If you dont like the fee idea, then just dont sign up. The "free" aspect is just to get people hooked.

The Ork nerd rage is kind of funny, please continue to contribute more.

I would rather see this be like Planetside 2 then some sort of gimmicky theme-park MMO. I don't care about the payment structure at this point. If the game sucks, then the game sucks.

There is only war.

Hopefully the developers realize that.

Haha all they say in the interviews is 'there is only war' I think we're good.

The studio head also comments on everyones Facebook post and seems like a really nice guy.

I wish them all the best with making our beloved universe into an mmo shooter.

JWhex wrote:
If this thing is going to succeed longterm they are going to have to put in more PVE than hinted at in the interview.

Another major wild card is the idea that players will essentially be getting "quests" from other players rather than NPC's. I can forsee some real problems with that model of business.

I hope they are successful and have no problem with a subscription fee if it means a stable and continuos development of the game. If you dont like the fee idea, then just dont sign up. The "free" aspect is just to get people hooked.

The Ork nerd rage is kind of funny, please continue to contribute more.

At it's core it's going to be a PVP game, "There is only war" should be enough of a hint.

Their current design decisions don't really seem suited to getting people hooked.

The only draw is the franchise (like in most other games of this publisher).

It says its an MMORPG. Good luck with that. I would rather it be an MMOFPS. It already looks like its third-person. That doesn't rule out FPS shooter elements, as there are a few cool TPS out right now. I just hope it isn't a point and click to activate abilities theme-park. Those seem easy to make and commercially "popular."

Should be interesting to watch for the next year and a half.

It seems to be an MMO in the same way Planetside is an MMO and it is an RPG because it has a talent/class building system.

If its going to play how they want it to i.e. like Space Marine, I cant wait.

AWesker1976 wrote:

nomotog wrote:Well if your going to make everything persistent, then start SMs as scouts and that will make things more balanced with orks starting as boys. Though I was hoping for a more dust like system myself because of reasons.
Also Everyone in 40k has the bling of war. Everyone! It's part of why it makes such a good mini game. Every one has a reason to bling out their models and if they didn't then the fans made one up.

According to the Imperial Munitorium Manual, Atricle 5633/64b:
Any soldier (ie - guardsman) who displays about his person or uniform, unauthorized decals, tattoos, trophies taken from the field of battle or other spoils of war without prior permission in writing of his superior officer, will have the offending items stripped from him and then be flogged.

Technically, the developers in this game wouldn't have to care at all for the inventions of some random Black Library product.
The Primer is a fun thing to read and I certainly don't regret the purchase, but the information you quoted doesn't hold up to the Imperial Guard as described in GW's original fluff - where it's a cultural thing that differs between every single planet raising a regiment. Hell, from the looks of it, half of the regiments don't even have a uniform.

Granted, it'd probably look odd on the posterboy regiment Cadians. Then again, even the 3E Guard Codex had a full page devoted to Cadians wearing looted autopistols as trophy weapons and stuff.

Wonder how soon a daemon champion, warboss or captain will turn up. Hopefully the beta-testers will get a start bonus, like becoming a sergeant. Also will the skins allow us to be other chapters, or do we have to stick with iron warriors

I reckon in the beta it will just be the devs and that being the leaders to start off with. They did say other chapters would be in so I assume the other chapters would be available through guilds.

 Minx wrote:

JWhex wrote:
If this thing is going to succeed longterm they are going to have to put in more PVE than hinted at in the interview.

Another major wild card is the idea that players will essentially be getting "quests" from other players rather than NPC's. I can forsee some real problems with that model of business.

I hope they are successful and have no problem with a subscription fee if it means a stable and continuos development of the game. If you dont like the fee idea, then just dont sign up. The "free" aspect is just to get people hooked.

The Ork nerd rage is kind of funny, please continue to contribute more.

At it's core it's going to be a PVP game, "There is only war" should be enough of a hint.

Their current design decisions don't really seem suited to getting people hooked.

The only draw is the franchise (like in most other games of this publisher).

Yeah but, they also said there was going to be crafting and resource gathering activities like mining which are more along mmorpg elements. I am not opposed to it being heavy PVP but I just dont see it holding up long term with a large player base without substantial solo and PVE elements. People burn out on activities and need to change up every once in awhile.

Guilds? So unofficial? Or just joinable? If there unofficial guilds then it'll probably be run by friendsand therefore only the guy who knows the leader will rank up....

Another interview, posted it on the front of my site - Here

http://www.rockpapershotgun.com/2013/06/13/interview-behaviour-on-warhammer-40k-eternal-crusade/

"The game is an MMORPG, but not in the sense that it’s a content- and quest-heavy theme park – ours is more a system-driven virtual world in the vein of Planetside 2 or EvE Online. “There Is Only War” is our mantra..."

That's what I was talking about. Looks like good news.

No, it still looks like gak.

 The Dark Apostle wrote:
Guilds? So unofficial? Or just joinable? If there unofficial guilds then it'll probably be run by friendsand therefore only the guy who knows the leader will rank up....

Unofficial it seems, they want most decisions to be up to players which is a good idea imo but like you said there will be problems with this. Luckily I think when your guild picks leaders, heroes, diplomats etc, the vote is from the whole guild; well it should be because that way the choosing is fair. For example if we wanted to pick our Templar Marshal, we could pull everyones kill records together along with looking at how well they co-operate within the guild and how they take/give orders, rather than the vote being up to a say 5 guys who all know each other. I hope so anyway.

Besides if anyone notices a clear bias choosing, I am sure the GM's would be happy to sort it out.

Planetside 2 and EVE? Just the games I was hoping to hear.

That's just namedropping, not an indication of them actually doing a good job.

Nice read aswell thanks for posting the interview. Haha so psychic powers will have dangers with them? Guess we can expect some hilarious outcomes fighting wierdboys.

More likely than not it'll just be "you take damage from using some abilities" or "you get debuffs from using some abilities".

Oh stop being such a Negative Nancy. Give it a chance Mel.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Oh stop being such a Negative Nancy. Give it a chance Mel.

Maybe when I hear something about it that's actually good.

 unmercifulconker wrote:

 The Dark Apostle wrote:
Guilds? So unofficial? Or just joinable? If there unofficial guilds then it'll probably be run by friendsand therefore only the guy who knows the leader will rank up....

Unofficial it seems, they want most decisions to be up to players which is a good idea imo but like you said there will be problems with this. Luckily I think when your guild picks leaders, heroes, diplomats etc, the vote is from the whole guild; well it should be because that way the choosing is fair. For example if we wanted to pick our Templar Marshal, we could pull everyones kill records together along with looking at how well they co-operate within the guild and how they take/give orders, rather than the vote being up to a say 5 guys who all know each other. I hope so anyway.

Besides if anyone notices a clear bias choosing, I am sure the GM's would be happy to sort it out.

Planetside 2 and EVE? Just the games I was hoping to hear.

Honestly I cant think of a worse possible way to origanize ranking up or whatever than to put it into the hands of players. Freaking linkshell drama queens and favortism will cause a huge amount of grief and people rage quiting, you can rely on it.

Sounds good, but way, way too ambitious. It'll be a TPS arena shooter by the time it's in beta.

The more I hear about this the better it sounds...I'm really looking forward to a first proper look at gameplay and the like. With any luck the developers have the skill to match their apparent ambition.

 Melissia wrote:
That's just namedropping, not an indication of them actually doing a good job.

I agree. While they mention Planetside 2, most of what they have said about the game seems not Planetside 2. At least they are aware of what they are up against. Planetside 2 is only getting better with each game update. With the lattice system in place, large battles are easy to find, as well as a number of other improvements and new options.

If they want a piece of the Planetside 2 crowd to stick around for any length of time, they have to bring the large scale battles with combined arms in a balanced and competitive way. Still, I think its to vague to tell just what type of gamer they are after. RPG or FPS/TPS.

JWhex wrote:
Honestly I cant think of a worse possible way to origanize ranking up or whatever than to put it into the hands of players. Freaking linkshell drama queens and favortism will cause a huge amount of grief and people rage quiting, you can rely on it.

Seems like a bad idea to make platoons anything more than optional systems in the game. The factions are already defined. The problem is 40k isn't a free and open social order. Is it even possible to translate that into a videogame with massive amounts of people and still make something successful. Planetside handles it by keeping the backstory as backstory, because the real intent of the game is to simulate large scale combined arms battles, not to role-play.

 Melissia wrote:

nomotog wrote:
If it takes you 5 times the money to spawn a SM then a boy

That won't matter if there's ten times as many people playing them.

I don't think everyone will play SMs. They are rather dull and boring so I expect more people to move to the fractions with actual personality.

 Kettu wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:
It sounds fine to me, to be honest. I don't mind players having to put something into a game financially in order to get the full experience.

Like buying the game?

BrotherVord wrote:
We have come to this place where we as gamers feel like we are entitled to a free experience somehow.

I've already bought the game, why should I pay more?

BrotherVord wrote:
The developers and publishers need to make money

Just buying the game isn't enough anymore?

BrotherVord wrote:
they can't do that if every free ork toon is just as good as every space marine...if that were the case then nobody would have incentive to pay to be anything more than one of the boyz. This system gives incentive to try the game, see the systems in place, and choose to buy in if you want. I like that system.

But I've already bought the game!

---

I find a bit of a problem with your argument, I've outlined my issues with it above.
I do have a closing question though;

What's wrong with the only costs involved being the purchase of the Game itself?

I'm not sure why you think you're saying something different from what I am. It feels like you're extrapolating intent from the developers about a pricing model that we know very little about. I am going strictly off of what the developer has already said, and not filling in the gaps for myself like some of the others here.

It's annoying, however, to see so many people demanding that the game be totally free except for cosmetic changes to a toon...do you guys realize how expensive it is to make an mmo? Do you really think it's possible to recoup that cost by having people pay only for little trophies, dyes, and doodads for their toons? I don't.

BrotherVord wrote:

 Kettu wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:
It sounds fine to me, to be honest. I don't mind players having to put something into a game financially in order to get the full experience.

Like buying the game?

BrotherVord wrote:
We have come to this place where we as gamers feel like we are entitled to a free experience somehow.

I've already bought the game, why should I pay more?

BrotherVord wrote:
The developers and publishers need to make money

Just buying the game isn't enough anymore?

BrotherVord wrote:
they can't do that if every free ork toon is just as good as every space marine...if that were the case then nobody would have incentive to pay to be anything more than one of the boyz. This system gives incentive to try the game, see the systems in place, and choose to buy in if you want. I like that system.

But I've already bought the game!

---

I find a bit of a problem with your argument, I've outlined my issues with it above.
I do have a closing question though;

What's wrong with the only costs involved being the purchase of the Game itself?

I'm not sure why you think you're saying something different from what I am. It feels like you're extrapolating intent from the developers about a pricing model that we know very little about. I am going strictly off of what the developer has already said, and not filling in the gaps for myself like some of the others here.

It's annoying, however, to see so many people demanding that the game be totally free except for cosmetic changes to a toon...do you guys realize how expensive it is to make an mmo? Do you really think it's possible to recoup that cost by having people pay only for little trophies, dyes, and doodads for their toons? I don't.

Yeah, it doesnt annoy me but it seems like people are acting childish, petulant and unrealistic.

nomotog wrote:

 Melissia wrote:

nomotog wrote:
If it takes you 5 times the money to spawn a SM then a boy

That won't matter if there's ten times as many people playing them.

I don't think everyone will play SMs. They are rather dull and boring so I expect more people to move to the fractions with actual charter.

People LOVE dull characters. Incredibly bland, muscled "badass" protagonists with a lack of any profound character or, dare I say, complexity, but huge guns? People LOVE that. Cue Call of Doody.

 Melissia wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Oh stop being such a Negative Nancy. Give it a chance Mel.

Maybe when I hear something about it that's actually good.

Like.... what? It actually being released?

To be fair, at this point, we don't even know if this will be released. I mean the other ones weren't...

 DemetriDominov wrote:

 Melissia wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Oh stop being such a Negative Nancy. Give it a chance Mel.

Maybe when I hear something about it that's actually good.

Like.... what? It actually being released?

If you actually read her posts, you would see the things that concern her.

Whats better than a warhammer 40k game where thousands of people fight in a 4 way battle for control of the planet, which plays like Space Marine?

Edit: Wasnt the reason that DM went down was because THQ died?

BrotherVord wrote:
It's annoying, however, to see so many people demanding that the game be totally free except for cosmetic changes to a toon...do you guys realize how expensive it is to make an mmo? Do you really think it's possible to recoup that cost by having people pay only for little trophies, dyes, and doodads for their toons? I don't.

So perhaps the free-to-play-model is the wrong one for a game like this then? Full price game or subscriptions might work better. Otherwise they won't make enough money to keep this game going with their hidden pay-to-play scheme.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Whats better than a warhammer 40k game where thousands of people fight in a 4 way battle for control of the planet, which plays like Space Marine?

Edit: Wasnt the reason that DM went down was because THQ died?

It was a money pit and they had to keep cutting the funding until it eventually was turned into a single player game that was canned when THQ offed itself

 Minx wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:
It's annoying, however, to see so many people demanding that the game be totally free except for cosmetic changes to a toon...do you guys realize how expensive it is to make an mmo? Do you really think it's possible to recoup that cost by having people pay only for little trophies, dyes, and doodads for their toons? I don't.

So perhaps the free-to-play-model is the wrong one for a game like this then? Full price game or subscriptions might work better. Otherwise they won't make enough money to keep this game going with their hidden pay-to-play scheme.

If you want to go to that extreme. I think that a game like this can succeed on a free to play model, but gamers need to stop being so entitled and arrogant to think that unless a game does X it will fail miserably. The armchair executives in the gaming community are just agonizing to me.

It's terribly damaging too, because gamers will hear something about a game that they don't like and they go on negative PR rampages that possibly sour others on the game. It's one thing to speak one's mind, it's another to hear about a feature that one doesn't like and go on a forum rampage preaching on the doom that will surely befall a game that doesn't have, or does have, a particular feature.

Not sure if this has been posted already, but more information on this from E3:

New Warhammer 40k MMORPG Revealed at E3 2013

All hope is not lost, and we’ll finally be able to see a Warhammer 40k MMORPG! Behavior Interactive teamed up with Games Workshop and will bring us Warhammer 40k: Eternal Crusade sometime by the end of 2015.

Behavior Interactive describes Warhammer 40k MMORPG as a “3rd Person Persistent Online Action MMORPG of the 41st Millenium”

Warhammer 40k MMORPG will come PC, PS4 and Xbox One. In the game, players choose a Warhammer 40,000 race and fight directly as one of their warriors in massive conflicts for territory. It will be up to each faction’s community to determine their own destiny as they vie for control of an entire planet.

New Warhammer 40k MMORPG Revealed at E3 2013“I am thrilled to announce what will finally be the first MMORPG based on the Warhammer 40,000 license,” said Miguel Caron, Head of Studio, Online at Behaviour Interactive. “Eternal Crusade’s team are all MMO development veterans and with the support of Behaviour’s 20+ years of experience this is going to be the online Warhammer 40,000 universe game that fans have been dreaming of for years!”

“Warhammer 40,000: Eternal Crusade is the second milestone in Behaviours new online strategic positioning after last year’s Star Citizen Announcement.” said Rémi Racine, President and Executive Producer of Behaviour. “We are very happy with the progress of the online studio and you should expect more similar announcements to come.”

“The depth, breadth and sheer level of detail that the Warhammer 40,000 universe has after 26 years of continuous development makes it one of the great fantasy settings of our times.” said Jon Gillard, Head of Licensing at Games Workshop. “Experiencing the thrill of first hand combat in this world of eternal conflict, with thousands of other players beside you, will be fantastic.”

Main features of the game include:
◾Experience the gameworld with 3rd-person, behind the shoulder action featuring precision gunplay and brutal melee combat with excruciating finishers;
◾Participate in a persistent online war to conquer the planet, its fate completely in the hands of the players;
◾Become a warrior from one of four initial factions, each unique and opposed to one another: Space Marines, Chaos Space Marines, Orks and Eldar.
◾Participate in truly massive conflicts that simultaneously bring thousands of players to bear over territories and other strategic resources.
◾Get behind the controls of Space Marine Rhinos, Predators, Ork Battlewagons and other iconic vehicles of the 41st millennium;
◾Hack through genuinely challenging procedural content alongside your battle-brothers and never have the same experience twice;
◾Earn the right to customize your builds in a deep progression system drawing on the rich Warhammer 40,000 universe.
◾Found a Battle Squad with friends and prepare for conflict from your customized shared space in orbit – then drop down to the planet together and seek out glory!

http://mmopage.com/news/new-warhammer-40k-mmorpg-revealed-at-e3-2013

If what they have said about new devs who are 'MMO Veterans' is true, then this might actually be good, even though their track record is awful to say the least.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Whats better than a warhammer 40k game where thousands of people fight in a 4 way battle for control of the planet, which plays like Space Marine?

A warhammer 40,000 game that isn't designed by a complete dumbass?

For example: "Durr, I know, let's make all free to play players exist for no reason other than to be slaughtered by the paying players who automatically, and with no extra effort, get to be five times s strong as the non-paying players! That'll convince them that this game is going to be fun and worth buying!" is bad game design. Nevermind the horrendous faction choices-- where two factions are practically identical and are stated by a developer to be overpowered, one faction is stated to be gimped, and the other one will probably be the least populated and also the only faction which can have female characters in it-- the other ones being male-only.

Everything I've heard about this game makes it sound like a rotting turd. I'm not going to willingly spend my time and money on a gakky game, and no amount of complaining from you will change that. If that makes me "entitled" then feth yeah I'm "entitled", and rightfully so. Seriously, what kind of person are you to try to claim that I should spend money on a game I don't want?

 Melissia wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Whats better than a warhammer 40k game where thousands of people fight in a 4 way battle for control of the planet, which plays like Space Marine?

A warhammer 40,000 game that isn't designed by a complete dumbass?

For example: "Durr, I know, let's make all free to play players exist for no reason other than to be slaughtered by the paying players who automatically, and with no extra effort, get to be five times s strong as the non-paying players! That'll convince them that this game is going to be fun and worth buying!" is bad game design. Nevermind the horrendous faction choices-- where two factions are practically identical and are stated by a developer to be overpowered, one faction is stated to be gimped, and the other one will probably be the least populated and also the only faction which can have female characters in it-- the other ones being male-only.

I'm not going to willingly spend my time and money on a gakky game, and no amount of complaining from you will change that. If that makes me "entitled" then feth yeah I'm "entitled", and rightfully so. Seriously, what kind of person are you to try to claim that I should spend money on a game I don't want?

I'm not sure if this has been said but modern aged game design when it comes to MMO's is $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ at all costs.


If going Free 2 play, nerfing everyone but premium members makes them millions than they damn sure are going to do it.


I'm not looking forward to this game but time will tell.

Source: Game Designer Me.

If they wanted to make millions they could do the GW2 method of selling the game in a box and then selling cosmetics, character slots, etc to continuously make money after release... instead of specifically saying they are making the game an unbalanced wreck.

What's worse: I have this kind of feeling that they will sell Eldar as "good" or even "friends" with Space Marines...

 Melissia wrote:
If they wanted to make millions they could do the GW2 method of selling the game in a box and then selling cosmetics, character slots, etc to continuously make money after release... instead of specifically saying they are making the game an unbalanced wreck.

I (when I used to play wow) was continually stunned at just how many people spend their money on that gak.. mounts and stuff for ten bucks a pop werent even remotely rare.

I was going to go on a tirade about it, but I changed my mind after I realised I spend about $100 a week on beer.

Each to their own I suppose eh?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Sigvatr wrote:
What's worse: I have this kind of feeling that they will sell Eldar as "good" or even "friends" with Space Marines...

 Melissia wrote:
If they wanted to make millions they could do the GW2 method of selling the game in a box and then selling cosmetics, character slots, etc to continuously make money after release... instead of specifically saying they are making the game an unbalanced wreck.

Warhammer isn't as big a name as Guild Wars, so free to play would get more people to start playing right out of the gates.

 Melissia wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Whats better than a warhammer 40k game where thousands of people fight in a 4 way battle for control of the planet, which plays like Space Marine?

A warhammer 40,000 game that isn't designed by a complete dumbass?

For example: "Durr, I know, let's make all free to play players exist for no reason other than to be slaughtered by the paying players who automatically, and with no extra effort, get to be five times s strong as the non-paying players! That'll convince them that this game is going to be fun and worth buying!" is bad game design. Nevermind the horrendous faction choices-- where two factions are practically identical and are stated by a developer to be overpowered, one faction is stated to be gimped, and the other one will probably be the least populated and also the only faction which can have female characters in it-- the other ones being male-only.

Everything I've heard about this game makes it sound like a rotting turd. I'm not going to willingly spend my time and money on a gakky game, and no amount of complaining from you will change that. If that makes me "entitled" then feth yeah I'm "entitled", and rightfully so. Seriously, what kind of person are you to try to claim that I should spend money on a game I don't want?

And thats like, your opinion bro and thats cool.

 pities2004 wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
If they wanted to make millions they could do the GW2 method of selling the game in a box and then selling cosmetics, character slots, etc to continuously make money after release... instead of specifically saying they are making the game an unbalanced wreck.

Warhammer isn't as big as Guild Wars, so free to play would all more people to start playing right out of the gates.

There are better ways to do free to play than the way they plan on doing it. For example, look at the way Champions Online does it-- free players have access to specific builds, which allow them to experience a wide range of gameplay, but paying players have access to massive amounts of customization that lets them make their characters truly their own and have their own unique builds. Each of the free to play default builds are fairly competitive, but the incentive is that people who pay to play want to make their own character, free from limitations, rather than because they want an outright stronger character.

Profitable or not, "pay to win" is bad game design.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
And thats like, your opinion bro and thats cool.

Keep in mind that that post wasn't JUST responding to yours, which is why the last paragraph was added.

 Melissia wrote:

 pities2004 wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
If they wanted to make millions they could do the GW2 method of selling the game in a box and then selling cosmetics, character slots, etc to continuously make money after release... instead of specifically saying they are making the game an unbalanced wreck.

Warhammer isn't as big as Guild Wars, so free to play would all more people to start playing right out of the gates.

There are better ways to do free to play than the way they plan on doing it. For example, look at the way Champions Online does it-- free players have access to specific builds, which allow them to experience a wide range of gameplay, but paying players have access to massive amounts of customization that lets them make their characters truly their own and have their own unique builds. Each of the free to play default builds are fairly competitive, but the incentive is that people who pay to play want to make their own character, free from limitations, rather than because they want an outright stronger character.

Profitable or not, "pay to win" is bad game design.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 unmercifulconker wrote:
And thats like, your opinion bro and thats cool.

Keep in mind that that post wasn't JUST responding to yours, which is why the last paragraph was added.

Champions started out as a full paid subscription based game. they had to switch in order to prevent shutting down the game.

Wonder when phase 2 will be unlocked, hopefully well get to hear some more news before or at GC.

JWhex wrote:

 unmercifulconker wrote:

 The Dark Apostle wrote:
Guilds? So unofficial? Or just joinable? If there unofficial guilds then it'll probably be run by friendsand therefore only the guy who knows the leader will rank up....

Unofficial it seems, they want most decisions to be up to players which is a good idea imo but like you said there will be problems with this. Luckily I think when your guild picks leaders, heroes, diplomats etc, the vote is from the whole guild; well it should be because that way the choosing is fair. For example if we wanted to pick our Templar Marshal, we could pull everyones kill records together along with looking at how well they co-operate within the guild and how they take/give orders, rather than the vote being up to a say 5 guys who all know each other. I hope so anyway.

Besides if anyone notices a clear bias choosing, I am sure the GM's would be happy to sort it out.

Planetside 2 and EVE? Just the games I was hoping to hear.

Honestly I cant think of a worse possible way to origanize ranking up or whatever than to put it into the hands of players. Freaking linkshell drama queens and favortism will cause a huge amount of grief and people rage quiting, you can rely on it.

oh go, the reason I left space marine after a month was because of lack of becoming a good cool looking guy, I was hoping the daemona rmour would add some nice wings or talons but no, it looks like you need to be high ranking to look cool, and I will not play aminute of this game if I cant look badass because a kid wants his bestest friend to be his 2nd in command. I want official chapters an dpeople to be able to request a chapter providing its official. me and my friends at gothic wars will most certainly have our chapters in this and hopefully well be the first so we can get high ranks.

All they need this to be is a rebalanced, third person planetside 2 with melee kickassery, dreadnaughts and titans

That latest posted blurb about the game does not make the game seem all that intriguing but it is many months to launch, if it actually is completed.

 Grundz wrote:
All they need this to be is a rebalanced, third person planetside 2 with melee kickassery, dreadnaughts and titans

...and Necrons!

 Grundz wrote:
All they need this to be is a rebalanced, third person planetside 2 with melee kickassery, dreadnaughts and titans

Dont play with my heart now, lawd hab mercy!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just to clarify what I wrote was not what is actually going to happen, it is just my take on what it may be like based on the games details.

BrotherVord wrote:

It's annoying, however, to see so many people demanding that the game be totally free except for cosmetic changes to a toon...do you guys realize how expensive it is to make an mmo? Do you really think it's possible to recoup that cost by having people pay only for little trophies, dyes, and doodads for their toons? I don't.

I realize that Guild Wars has made one of the most critically acclaimed and commercially successful MMOs there is with the business model of "Pay once, then buy this kewl extra gak if you want".

 Void__Dragon wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:

It's annoying, however, to see so many people demanding that the game be totally free except for cosmetic changes to a toon...do you guys realize how expensive it is to make an mmo? Do you really think it's possible to recoup that cost by having people pay only for little trophies, dyes, and doodads for their toons? I don't.

I realize that Guild Wars has made one of the most critically acclaimed and commercially successful MMOs there is with the business model of "Pay once, then buy this kewl extra gak if you want".

And that's a different price model, since this game will be free to play with no retail cost...

Melissa...using champions online is a terrible template...that game released years ago to a different gaming environment (mmorpg's are one of the fastest changing gaming markets) and was pay to play out of the box, $50.00 retail plus $15 a mon sub fee. It went f2p because it was tanking...and it still isn't all that popular of a game.

Of course it is a different price model, if it was the same, I wouldn't be saying Eternal Crusade's model sucks, would I?

Ohai guise, Im here to bitch and moan about a game I know little to nothing about, that features the most popular factions of 40k,simply because of the previously mentioned fact that I know next to nothing about it. Furthermore I would like to add that I put no thought into the possibility I could be an overpowered Nob or screaming winged eldar man lady if I paid, and will continue dumping money into something equally pointless that I will also complain about.

I see that my comments have rendered you so furious that you are physically incapable of making anything resembling a valid point or non-flame addled post.

I'm so sorry.

People please...... this is a happy place.

Games make the most money by attracting the most players. Players are attracted to games with fair pricing models that don't punish player for being free. It's the you will get m ore flys with honey thing. The more free players you get the better. Even if a free player doesn't pay a dime, they still add value to a game like a mmo. Times that by 10 if it's a game focused all around PvP.

Just noticed this about half an hour ago on TBs Youtube channel.

Originally though awesome, about friggin tme!

Then I saw the games Behavior Interactive have put out.(http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Behaviour_Interactive)
Only two games on the list were good(imo) Bugs Bunny: Lost in Time and Bugs Bunny and Taz Time Busters. (both released years ago, 1999 and 2000 respectively) So they were good because I loved Bugs and Taz lol.

My hopes for a good 40K MMO have just crashed to the earth again...

I really hope they prove me wrong.

 Void__Dragon wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:

It's annoying, however, to see so many people demanding that the game be totally free except for cosmetic changes to a toon...do you guys realize how expensive it is to make an mmo? Do you really think it's possible to recoup that cost by having people pay only for little trophies, dyes, and doodads for their toons? I don't.

I realize that Guild Wars has made one of the most critically acclaimed and commercially successful MMOs there is with the business model of "Pay once, then buy this kewl extra gak if you want".

How does Guild Wars compare to WoW, I thought WoW blew everyone else out of the water for raking in cash. I never played either so dont have any idea about Guild Wars. WoW is too cartoony for my tastes.

JWhex wrote:
How does Guild Wars compare to WoW, I thought WoW blew everyone else out of the water for raking in cash. I never played either so dont have any idea about Guild Wars. WoW is too cartoony for my tastes.

It doesn't.

Sheer force of inertia has kept WoW king of the MMO, and it is IMHO unrealistic to expect this game to supplant it.

nomotog wrote:
Games make the most money by attracting the most players. Players are attracted to games with fair pricing models that don't punish player for being free. It's the you will get m ore flys with honey thing. The more free players you get the better. Even if a free player doesn't pay a dime, they still add value to a game like a mmo. Times that by 10 if it's a game focused all around PvP.

This is worth repeating. And someone tell the devs.

Edited by AgeOfEgos

If anyone posts anything hateful and distasteful like that again in this thread-you will be receiving a long break from Dakka.

Oh my.

Well anyway.

i don't see the hostility against the FTP model, as we have no idea how it will be balanced after release. I'll definitely give it a shot, anyone who doesn't secretly yearn to be a space marine isn't a true 40k fan

What do you mean by "balanced"?

And not everyone plays 40k for the Space Marines (Though I'd personally like to play as a Black Templar).

I want to play an ork myself, or a pathfinder, or an ork pathfinder.

 BryllCream wrote:
anyone who doesn't secretly yearn to be a space marine isn't a true 40k fan

So what, if I don't want to be a castrated emotionally insecure screaming old bald guy with severe scarring and an obnoxious gravely voice, I'm not a real 40k fan?

Screw that. I'm a huge 40k fan but I have no interest in "being" a Space Marine,

 Melissia wrote:

 BryllCream wrote:
anyone who doesn't secretly yearn to be a space marine isn't a true 40k fan

So what, if I don't want to be a castrated emotionally insecure screaming old bald guy with severe scarring and an obnoxious gravely voice, I'm not a real 40k fan?

Screw that. I'm a huge 40k fan but I have no interest in "being" a Space Marine,

How about a Sister of Silence? It may suite us all

The game is two years away, I'm guessing withing that two years it may change a bit.

 Melissia wrote:
So what, if I don't want to be a castrated emotionally insecure screaming old bald guy with severe scarring and an obnoxious gravely voice, I'm not a real 40k fan?

Screw that. I'm a huge 40k fan but I have no interest in "being" a Space Marine,

How do you know Space Marines are castrated?

Void__Dragon wrote:

 Melissia wrote:
So what, if I don't want to be a castrated emotionally insecure screaming old bald guy with severe scarring and an obnoxious gravely voice, I'm not a real 40k fan?

Screw that. I'm a huge 40k fan but I have no interest in "being" a Space Marine,

How do you know Space Marines are castrated?

She's being ontollogically inflamatory, insulting space marines by saying "hur hur der penis been chopped off". They're probably chemically infertile or something.

Melissia wrote:

 BryllCream wrote:
anyone who doesn't secretly yearn to be a space marine isn't a true 40k fan

So what, if I don't want to be a castrated emotionally insecure screaming old bald guy with severe scarring and an obnoxious gravely voice, I'm not a real 40k fan?

Screw that. I'm a huge 40k fan but I have no interest in "being" a Space Marine,

Yes we've gathered that. No idea how you're still trolling this thread but I hope a mod comes along soon.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Void__Dragon wrote:
What do you mean by "balanced"?

One race will not simply swarm over the others on day 1 and remain completely dominant. I doubt the actual gameplay experience will be anywhere near balance though, so I won't be rushing to buy this.

And not everyone plays 40k for the Space Marines (Though I'd personally like to play as a Black Templar).

Space Marines are awesome. Nothing quite like smashing up some xeno scum

orks are awesomer . Orks are the pinnacle of creation. Naturally they are equal if not superior to marines who need augumentation and technology to even be on the same footing as orks , but humans need to learn things whereas orks just know. Orks psychologically are stronger as they don't lose they just get ready to have another go. Orks do not fall prey to the lures of chaos as much as humans or marines for that matter.

Orks are better in every respect.

Bullockist wrote:
Orks are better in every respect.

Well yes, that goes without saying.

I wonder what the power level of Eldar will be?

MadMuzza wrote:
How about a Sister of Silence?

Hell yes! Come on FW!

Oh wait, this is a thread about a MMO? Nevermind.

I've been burned time after time with MMOs. I'm a big MMO fan, but I'll reserve judgment until release this time around.

No seamless experience = me quitting. Period. Load screens fail. I don't care that we may end up planet-hopping, disguise the load screen with a shuttle transition, just don't let me lose control of my avatar for even a moment.

I'm okay with load screens if they're not excessive (I don't mind how GW2 does it), but it would certainly be nice.

I can't wait for this game to come out so I can install it and not play it ever because I don't have the motivation to play anything anymore. YAY MOAR MEDICINES!

Good god, I hope that this doesn't turn out to be another flop like Dark Millennium or a disaster like Fire Warrior.....

Damn I hate loading screens more than anything in any game, I just cant EVER get the motivation to play Shogun 2 as much as I want because most time is spent staring at a loading screen.

Hopefully with this being an mmo there will be few.

Also this space marine hate is heresy.

Why the sudden hate on Fire Warrior??

Its not going to be a free game, I only base that on the fact that its going to be released for the next gen systems as well as PCs.

As far as thier pay scheme? I dont see a big deal with it really, So you can only make it to a Lvl10 ork boy? You'll probably get to feth around with sluggas, shootas, big shootas, rokkit launchas, and hard boy armor, thats quite a bit of possibilty for 'just an orkboy'.

Then if you wanna get the other races or progress farther as an ork you have to pay for it, now i bet its a paid for subscription (like WoW) that just unlocks your ability to change races, and progress up the chain of command should you choose to. Why is that such a bad idea i dont see.

I know he said 5 boys to 1 but i bet it drops to 3 to 1 pretty quick when the beta hits.

And @ mel, now, i know this isnt exactly what you want, because im sure you'd rather they get their own faction completely, but did you ever stop and think that maybe when you make your SM character that there might just be an option for girls to create a Sister? And have them just put a blurb saying that they are easily the equivalent of an SM? And whos to say they dont make demonic sisters as well(all fluff aside,also i dont know gak about the sisters). Im guess im hoping for a little more optimism, and im not trying to be rude but its just something that i wouldnt be too surprised to see, especially if they really want A LOT of people to really invest in this

I guess im maybe a lil too giddy over this concept, Im a huge fan of what they are so far trying to accomplish so far, even though there is no Tau lol I just really hope they can pull it off!!!

Fire Warrior was an ass-terrible game in story, game design, production quality, and canon-ity to the 40k universe. As a 40k fanboy I loved it when it came out, but I still think it was horrid.

I think Dark Millennium had a better-looking future than this though. Given the developers' track record I'm slightly worried.

They made Iron Man (the game).
I've not forgiven or forgotten that game.

We should be worried.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Iron_Man_(video_game)

To be honest. They haven't even developed any note-worthy games. Who decided that it would be a good idea to give A2M the IP to make a 40k MMO? >.<

Considering they are huge fans of warhammer and the fact that they put space marines rather than the Imperium makes me think sisters wont be in. Perhaps however one of the expansions will make the whole Imperium playable from gaurd to sisters?

As long as I can play a Mekboy I'm happy.

I wonder how dreads, kans, hell brutes, and wraith lords will come into it, maybe as support abilities.

I'd prefer to have the Imperium as a factions and have SM, SoB, Techpriest and Guard (Maybe Inquisitor as well) as classes and then you can spec into a certain type of SM via skills...

 Grundz wrote:
All they need this to be is a rebalanced, third person planetside 2 with melee kickassery, dreadnaughts and titans

This. If they made a game like that, I would be very happy indeed.

Wolfnid420 wrote:And @ mel, now, i know this isnt exactly what you want, because im sure you'd rather they get their own faction completely, but did you ever stop and think that maybe when you make your SM character that there might just be an option for girls to create a Sister? And have them just put a blurb saying that they are easily the equivalent of an SM?

Ah come on now, they would have at least hinted at this and sold it as another faction if that were the case.
They are trying to drum up support and enthusiasm for their project now, after all, hence the use of so many buzzwords and their comparison to other particularly popular games.

Correct. I have no hope that they will expand the initial offering beyond Marines, Marines, Orks, and Eldar

Mel they've already said that they really want to do necrons and they're planned for one if the first releases after the initial launch, I think they want to eventually have every faction in there.

This is all assuming that the game is a success and actually, you know, releases.

BrotherVord wrote:
Mel they've already said that they really want to do necrons and they're planned for one if the first releases after the initial launch, I think they want to eventually have every faction in there.

This is all assuming that the game is a success and actually, you know, releases.

There's your FTP model right there- sell new factions as a bundle, new classes individually, make classes faction specific and start up a release schedule that pumps them out for each group regularly. If you make them available with some sort of in-game currency as well, you'll sidestep the PTW label, while still hauling in cash hand over fist.

BrotherVord wrote:Mel they've already said that they really want to do necrons and they're planned for one if the first releases after the initial launch, I think they want to eventually have every faction in there.

This is also true, at least the first part. If the game is a success, for which I have yet to see anything more than fancy ideas and statements (which I could come up with all day long myself).

Of course, I'm under no illusion that Sisters of Battle would be high on their list, though. On the other hand, the Imperial Guard would have a fairly good chance of being a close follower, and I would think they put in female troops after already having girls in the Eldar faction (otherwise I would sadly be sceptical). They're gonna have female Eldar, right? Right?!

Anyways, my suggestion would be to just lean back and not get hyped Aliens-style. Read up on things when real news get out. Don't expect anything, but don't be bitter about it either - at least not before the facts are actually there. Yes, one could complain that the first 4 factions are what they are, but imho this is (a) totally subjective and (b) more a fault of GW's marketing than this small studio here. With 40k being what it is, I have to say the selection makes sense, and you gotta start with something.

Gitzbitah wrote:

BrotherVord wrote:
Mel they've already said that they really want to do necrons and they're planned for one if the first releases after the initial launch, I think they want to eventually have every faction in there.

This is all assuming that the game is a success and actually, you know, releases.

There's your FTP model right there- sell new factions as a bundle, new classes individually, make classes faction specific and start up a release schedule that pumps them out for each group regularly. If you make them available with some sort of in-game currency as well, you'll sidestep the PTW label, while still hauling in cash hand over fist.

Hope not, they'd do better selling character slots.

Say there's 4 factions, you have room for 2 characters to start with. Easy money, though some will still just make new accounts. However that's also fine as they won't obviously share account specific cash items. You have to give them a small taste of it overall, just enough to get them in the door then you impress with the shiny stuff. Selling races and such, people will always see as PTW. Cash is for aesthetics and about 80-90% of account services like name changes, server transfer, new character slots, item slots, bank slots, etc.