If anybody who has the origional 15mm has a link to some of their models all put together I think it would help to sell them here on dakkadakka. I think the videos have been great, but some more wip pics wouldn't hurt. Especially if they are next to models that are proxy for future dreamforge releases .
I have pics of four 15mm ones in a gallery, from WIP to finished
Here's a few for the thread
Keep in mind that these are 5.5" tall, though, and the ones from this campagin will be 4.5". Personally, I think that's a smart change, although I won't mind mine looking over the shoulders of anyone else's
I'm also going to swap mine out to have the capacitor coolers, as I was finally able to locate some. I don't think the new 4.5" bits are going to be compatiable with these resin ones.
So yeah, I absolutely love these kits! The only reason I'm not pledging for Leviathans is that I already have a lot (even more than pictured). Which is why I'm here for the infantry
Hah, don't worry, it's worth saying that twice! 4.5" tall is going to be a perfect size, imo, for use as a Dreadknight... or in the case of the Mortis, some infernal chaos contraption. They'll also be more posable in plastic, which is the only drawback to the resin kit, imo. For the full-size ones, Mark keeps mentioning "working" hydraulics- I'm betting that the poses that will be able to be achieved with that will be insane!
And just so this doesn't get lost on the last page:
catharsix wrote:Good point about the Mortis - Chaos connection. That's why I want it too! Sounds like a way to sell this to many other curent and future Chaos players
If the Mortis is possible in the 4.5" size, it definitely has support, Mark!
Haha, I think he's decided to focus on Leviathan weapons for this one though, Sikil. I love the heavy troopers, and think those and some of the Shadokesh (particularly a Shadokesh Leviathan) could make another great Kickstarter.
I do hold out hope for some Eisenkern command in this one, though
He posted in the comments section on the KS page that he's having a conference call with the manufacturer today about the weapon arm options. Hope to see an update soon!
Also, this (in a separate comment):
Mark Mondragon wrote:I still have to put up the Command Squad and a VERY cool APC.... Will post some pics and drop them in the queue ASAP.
Seems like a command squad should be a very achievable thing... and that most people who bought infantry might want it (and even others who don't want all-new infantry, for a cool looking command). Hopefully that one makes it
So, there's something for both Leviathan and infantry lovers to look forward to!
I was more than willing to get in on this KS right when it started, I've been eying the resin leviathans for quite some time. The partnership with Wargames Factory is a pretty interesting development. Their kits have really increased in quality and I think they're in position to do this project right. Looking forward to seeing the results!
The Shadokesh is my favorite IronCore faction by far, and I do hope that there will be a kickstarter for them in the future. But for now I'd stay with Eisenkern in this (except for the promo Shadokesh, that I hope I can pledge to get additionals of!! )
Weapons are nice and all, but HEAVY TROOPERS ffs! More than 6 months I've drooled over the renders of them...
I agree about a lot of money coming in at the end. I am going to pledge for at LEAST a titan and a 20 box of troopers, I am just going to wait until a few days are left to see what goals are unlocked and if I want to pledge for anything else.
If you KNOWyou want some stuff, pledge for that now
It means stretch goals come faster, other folk are more likely to pledge and everybody can get more stuff....
You can easily increase or change you pledge if you decide you want somthing else.
by waiting to the last minute you also risk missing out if the servers crash (like for sedition wars and reaper bones), or you are unable to access the net for whatever reason
People tend to wait to pledge until the last minute, but there's really no reason to. You can always change your pledge later on at any time before the kickstarter ends. So there's absolutely no benefit to pledging later, if you already know you are going to.
I just upped my pledge for what i would expect to pay should the 15mm version becomes available.
The earlier we all pledge the money, even if its for later stretch goals that havent been unlocked, the better, as it generates momentum, and gets unlocks earlier for more people to become exposed to.
Vitruvian XVII wrote:Yeah you have to go via amazon unfortunately.
I just upped my pledge for what i would expect to pay should the 15mm version becomes available.
The earlier we all pledge the money, even if its for later stretch goals that havent been unlocked, the better, as it generates momentum, and gets unlocks earlier for more people to become exposed to.
Igloo wrote:OK, I will do it today.
These are not the droids you're looking for.
But this IS the Kickstarter you're looking to pledge!
Been a bit of a slow day. Though it does tend to pick up in the evenings. We need 26k to get to my baby titans! Which honestly shouldn't be an issue but I want them now
If we knew what they were armed with, their options, and their prices people might start throwing in early to get us there. I know I would
I don't think putting the Mortis at 90k was smart (unless that's the absolute cheapest it could be) - there are a lot of people holding back on pledging until it becomes available, and at this rate I don't think that will happen.
on the plus side, if it does manage to hit 90K in the next couple of weeks, pledges are going to soar
Im pretty sure we'll make the Mortis, even if its only in the last few days.
On another note, there seems an annoying amount of people in the comments section trying to push back the 15mm, or at least phrasing their comments so as to suggest this.
Still, im pretty sure Mark knows how popular a plastic 15mm would be so we should be alright.
Oh you guys made me feel guilty so I guess I will pledge as soon as I can also.
Settled on a 20-man set and one box of support weapons, I figure that then I will have 32 guys, mixing the support weapons into the normal troopers to give me 3 squads and then a commander and bodyguard!
I sure am envious of you Americans getting free shipping with all these kickstarters, especially as I am just out of reach. It is the only thing stopping me from picking up a leviathan, ah well, knew I should have moved to the states instead of Canada!
Not that I want to sound greedy, but I was thinking of something. Hypothetically, if the $100,000 goal is reached, would purchasers of the Mortis also recieve Advanced capacitor coolers, a Sword, and a left handed Vulcan cannon? Or are those just for Crusader owners?
RiTides wrote: I think it's usually because on-the-fence folks give in last second
Yes, that's probably it. The willpower holds out until the very end, when you can see the opportunity disappearing. I keep telling myself that since I never play 40K Apocalypse, I have no use for a mini titan. But I still keep trying to think of a use for it.
I don't think getting to the 90k goal will be a problem. I think it will take a while to get to 80k, since there is nothing extra to buy between 50k and 80k, and I doubt that slightly different sword that is unlocked at 60k is going to convince anyone on the fence to jump in. But ones the mini crusaders are unlocked, I think new people will jump in and it will break 90k in no time.
Ah, being a brit who is used to countries with normal distances between them, this bit threw me Just out of reach to me would mean a couple of miles from the US border
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cuda1179 wrote: Not that I want to sound greedy, but I was thinking of something. Hypothetically, if the $100,000 goal is reached, would purchasers of the Mortis also recieve Advanced capacitor coolers, a Sword, and a left handed Vulcan cannon? Or are those just for Crusader owners?
You know im not sure, thats definitely a question for mark. One would think thats how it would work, given that almost all the cost is in the moulds which would have already been made.
Ah, being a brit who is used to countries with normal distances between them, this bit threw me Just out of reach to me would mean a couple of miles from the US border
Well I am a Brit too, moved here a couple of years ago! I got used to long distances after the first week and I live on the smallest province in the country!
Back OT, I was under the impression that the mortis had a completely different torso so wouldn't the backpack not fit anyway?
Well, with the resin ones I believe the back pieces (smokestacks or capacitor coolers) fit on either model.
I don't know if the "free" sword and gatling cannon would come with the Mortis or not- I guess it depends on whether they're attached to the Crusader's sprue or separate.
However, I would think at the very least you would get the capacitor coolers for free with the Mortis... a great question for Mark
Commander Cain wrote: Oh you guys made me feel guilty so I guess I will pledge as soon as I can also.
Settled on a 20-man set and one box of support weapons, I figure that then I will have 32 guys, mixing the support weapons into the normal troopers to give me 3 squads and then a commander and bodyguard!
I sure am envious of you Americans getting free shipping with all these kickstarters, especially as I am just out of reach. It is the only thing stopping me from picking up a leviathan, ah well, knew I should have moved to the states instead of Canada!
I probably doesn't help that you also chose an island in the middle of the gulf. Was our mainland too crowded for you?
Yes, that HEL cannon looks amazing, as well as the longer, thinner one (don't remember the name) that looks just like a big artillery piece. This screams knight, along with the B-A chainsaw attachment.
Mathieu Raymond wrote: Yes, that HEL cannon looks amazing, as well as the longer, thinner one (don't remember the name) that looks just like a big artillery piece. This screams knight, along with the B-A chainsaw attachment.
I'm itching for the HEL cannon and the nova myself. The brilliance of Mark's design though is even if he doesn't put them out until next year, the arms are swappable. I absolutely love this model!
I don't think it will be much of a savings getting the arms now. They are going to be going up as options that will NOT be available for some time, if ever again if the line doesn't do well and no variants are produced.
The price is a premium to get them NOW (when they ship) and have variants for your Crusader for other games.
Look at it as getting weapons you would not be able to any other way.
I would have rather seen a price of $15-$20 for the arms, especially as they will add another $7.50 to the formerly "Free" shipping. I know that at that rate I would certainly pass on the Ripper saw, for it's just another type of melee weapon, however it fits a 40K "look".
I am, however interested in a Grendel Siege gun to be a stereotypical Knight battle cannon, or especially a Nova cannon to be a Knight-scale Plasma Blastgun, which would cause just as much wholesale damage on a battlefield.
Awesome weapon variants for the arms, but I have one question: At 100k, what is the point of buying an extra vulkan cannon when one already comes with the model and the other is a free stretch goal? Leviathans only have 2 arms (though I wish I could top/shoulder mount a cannon...or two).
Unless of course, your planning on letting us pick and choose our Leviathan's armaments as we hit each goal...now that would be quite an incentive! I really want a right vulkan and a left mauler claw! An incentive like that might make me pledge 2-3 more of them
MUCH BETTER! This is great I think, with the new arm options. There wasn't much else to motivate new and existing pledgers to put forth extra money to hit those goals up toward 100K. This is a great incentive though.
kaiohx wrote: Awesome weapon variants for the arms, but I have one question: At 100k, what is the point of buying an extra vulkan cannon when one already comes with the model and the other is a free stretch goal? Leviathans only have 2 arms (though I wish I could top/shoulder mount a cannon...or two).
Unless of course, your planning on letting us pick and choose our Leviathan's armaments as we hit each goal...now that would be quite an incentive! I really want a right vulkan and a left mauler claw! An incentive like that might make me pledge 2-3 more of them
Makaleth wrote:Ouch, $25 per arm... for the plastic.
I really like these arms, but was hoping to get a couple. At that price I can only really get 1.
Yea they are really pricey for plastic alternate arms. $15 would be been a bit more reasonable since the idea is to entice people to pledge more and more. Looking back at it, those who want this stuff at a sort of reasonable price better pledge this kickstarter now, because its been stated these prices are only for this promotion. They will go up, which kind of scares me since if you look at it by the numbers, its upwards on GW kind of prices. I hope I'm wrong and that we could possibly see an 'affordable' mass-model tabletop game with excellent plastic minatures.
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NoseGoblin wrote:Your Mortis may need some love
Ohhhh, good call! Though for me personally, the mortis isn't quite as neat as the crusader, unless there will be a way to get extra armor to bulk him out. I'm curious what the Gabriel will look like in time. Sounds more advanced than the crusader or mortis.
Makaleth wrote:Ouch, $25 per arm... for the plastic.
I really like these arms, but was hoping to get a couple. At that price I can only really get 1.
Yea they are really pricey for plastic alternate arms. $15 would be been a bit more reasonable since the idea is to entice people to pledge more and more. Looking back at it, those who want this stuff at a sort of reasonable price better pledge this kickstarter now, because its been stated these prices are only for this promotion. They will go up, which kind of scares me since if you look at it by the numbers, its upwards on GW kind of prices. I hope I'm wrong and that we could possibly see an 'affordable' mass-model tabletop game with excellent plastic minatures.
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NoseGoblin wrote:Your Mortis may need some love
Ohhhh, good call! Though for me personally, the mortis isn't quite as neat as the crusader, unless there will be a way to get extra armor to bulk him out. I'm curious what the Gabriel will look like in time. Sounds more advanced than the crusader or mortis.
I posted this into the comments, but I should state it here as well, as I am sure there are others that would love to see a lower price.
I would hope that you can understand that everything costs more money than you think when dealing with hard tooling. The average cost for one of these molds will be $12-16K I will need to sell 640 units of each one before I see a penny, and that’s at retail. When these hit the supply chain I will need to sell double that amount.
I have done the best that I can and stretched as far as I can. It works for you or it does not. I cannot go any lower. You are getting a great kit with loads of accessories for a quarter the price of the resin kits. And 1/5 to 1/6 the price of Forgeworld. If you cannot find value in that then I'm not sure what I can do?
I look at the bottom line and how many units will move at what margin. The main chassis is used with all five variants; therefore I can amortize the costs over a larger range of product. If I was trying to amortize 100k in a single kit release then the retail would be closer to $200+ per kit.
The weapon arms, being more of an accessory until the main variant kits is released… IF…. they are released need to be amortized with a much more limited view. If I had all five variants already in production I could see offering them at a lower price, but there are no assurances as of today that this will happen anytime soon. If the Kickstarter were to end today at its current funding level then my available capital for the next releases would be ZERO and likely in the negative.
I am not a gambling man and do not wish to gamble my company on what ifs, and It should haves. I have to price according to the risks and costs to produce an item. Long story short, there are a lot of mitigating factors that determine cost. I don’t pretend to know the magic formula for determining costs, but I do have several factors that I weigh against each time I need to visit this subject.
I agree they seem pricey. But having looked at getting items put into production with injection molding in the past, what NoseGoblin is saying is 100 percent true. Generally to break even on an injection mold you need to sell 1000 sprues or more. He currently has 461 crusaders 'sold' on his kickstarter.
Being options, the arms will not sell to everyone. They will probably each sell to around 5 to 10 percent of the folks who purchase a Leviathan. This may be even smaller given that he has already included a third arm to everyone if the kickstarter hits 100k.
If suddenly he gets 1000s more backers, then things might change. But as I see it now, he's streching the money from the backing as far as he reasonably can, which yes means higher prices on options that only a few will choose.
BTW if I can I'll be backing you for at least a crusader, sadly I threw too much money at the reaper kickstarter to guarantee that.
I am not a gambling man and do not wish to gamble my company on what ifs, and It should haves.
And nor should you have to.
Thanks for explaining that, and hope people read your words and understand where you are coming from.
Seems completely reasonable to me - I'm still just thrilled to be able to throw in for a Leviathan at 1/4 of the price , and far from worried about the price of some optional extras!
I might get a pair of Novas and a pair of HELs. Thats another 100+p&p pledge. But that's stretching what I can manage, given that there might be HEAVY TROOPERS in there somewhere, and that I realy realy realy like to pledge to get additional Shadokesh promo-pairs (to make a unit).
Already pledged 330 USD, and that's more than I usually spend a "normal month" on pewter/residic/plastic -crack...
I think 25 an arm is a steal. Compare to the 45+ dollars an arm you pay for a Warhound arm (which for all intents and purposes, appears to be less mass than these add ons). They are plastic with a hard mount/unmount option already built in too--I'm sold.
He added a "Buy 3, get the 4th free!" option. So, if you want 4 arms, it's $75.
For the resin 15mm scale Leviathan, extra arms were $20 with no free 4th. Meaning 4 arms were $80, more than these. And I bought tons and it was worth every penny.
And these look freaking fantastic! As a limited Kickstarter reward... Imo it's perfect. 4 extra arms for less than a Leviathan, 5 for about the same price.
GW and every company has to do similarly. Contemptor weapons are I believe the same percentage of the kit cost.
That combo cannon Grendel arm... Just Wow
The only thing I wonder is, I guess each arm is it's own mold? Wondering if the mold will need to be remade when the other variants hit.
AgeOfEgos wrote: I think 25 an arm is a steal. Compare to the 45+ dollars an arm you pay for a reaver arm (which for all intents and purposes, appears to be less mass than these add ons). They are plastic with a hard mount/unmount option already built in too--I'm sold.
$45 for a Reaver arm? Maybe if you got lucky on ebay. Currently that's about how much a Warhound weapon costs. I have to say that the quick-change arms are the on thing that sets this project ahead of the rest. It's also one of the reasons I prefer my armorcast titans over my Forgeworld ones.
AgeOfEgos wrote: I think 25 an arm is a steal. Compare to the 45+ dollars an arm you pay for a reaver arm (which for all intents and purposes, appears to be less mass than these add ons). They are plastic with a hard mount/unmount option already built in too--I'm sold.
$45 for a Reaver arm? Maybe if you got lucky on ebay. Currently that's about how much a Warhound weapon costs. I have to say that the quick-change arms are the on thing that sets this project ahead of the rest. It's also one of the reasons I prefer my armorcast titans over my Forgeworld ones.
Finally got my monies together and I'm in for a leviathan.
Also, point your Ork friends towards this kickstarter - $25 for a new weapon system for their stompas is a decent deal - maybe they'll piggyback on your pledge if they don't want to start their own...
Ooh I do like those arms, will have to get some now for sure! And this change in shipping costs has me more confused than ever, we pay a $15 flat rate and then add 50% of the already listed shipping price for each item we want am I correct? Well he mentioned something about a calculator at the end of the campaign so I will let that do all the thinking for me I guess.
Unless you mean resin pictures of them then I have no idea
ah hell
Thats what I get for posting before breakfast...
Automatically Appended Next Post: Alright after looking over the pics, it looks like there are a solid 6 options...I like the buy 3 get the 4th free deal...I'd like a buy them all deal even more. This kick starter is loaded with shut up and take my money!
Holy crap i missed out on a lot while i was asleep!
Those weapons are awesome and i would be all over them were i not holding out for the 15mm crusader.
Im right in thinking these arms are just for the 28mm version yeah?
Automatically Appended Next Post: Crap, having looked at all the weapons im thinking that i'll buy them anyway and use them as weapons for my AdMech tanks.
Does anyone have any inkling as to what the 15mm is gonna cost?
Yes those are for the 28mm version. The 15mm version will have it's own tooling and molds to do.
I've been holding out to see if we reach a Mortis to up my pledge as I'd love to have one of those also.
If we had a ball park figure for the cost of a Mortis in this Kickstarter, I could budget accordingly.
I have very limited amounts of spending money due to medical bills unfortunately, but I want to give what I can for this Kickstarter.
Anyone complaining about the price point of $25 needs to seriously rethink their position. Have you looked at comparable "giant robot" arm prices? A certain British company charges £36.00 (appx $57 USD) plus shipping for a less modular, less posable version. Still think $25 is unreasonable? $15 is wishful thinking and ignores the money and effort poured into these.
I will definitely be pledging for these alternate weapons and a Mortis if it becomes available! Probably left and right sets- 2 Hel cannons anyone? RAWR!
Question on the Beowulf/Grendel- It looks like the longer bore is just an additional barrel insert, so would it be possible to simply not glue it in and have it able to act as either?
Hmmmm...keep my pledge at 2 Crusaders, or change it to 1 Crusader, a Nova cannon, mauler claw, and box of troops...guess the future pledges and stretches reached will have to determine that for me.
Not only is 25$ affordable compared to another company, the platform these will go on is also a lot more affordable. I think someone earlier mentioned awesome sauce?
jmurph wrote: Anyone complaining about the price point of $25 needs to seriously rethink their position. Have you looked at comparable "giant robot" arm prices? A certain British company charges £36.00 (appx $57 USD) plus shipping for a less modular, less posable version. Still think $25 is unreasonable? $15 is wishful thinking and ignores the money and effort poured into these.
Quoted for truth....25 bucks for a giant robot arm is a steal in my book. 15 bucks would only be likely for the 15mm version
Man, I am jealous of you Leviathan pledgers. Mark pulled out all the stops with your stretches! And rightfully so. Hoping it picks up and we get Eisenmern command or APC after eclipsing 100K. Certainly got a nice bump this morning after the weapon announcement!
I doubt he can due to logistics, but if the 100k free Vulcan became 100k free Any arm... Wow. But like I said, I really don't see that being feasible. 4 for the price of 3 is already sweet.
RiTides wrote: Man, I am jealous of you Leviathan pledgers. Mark pulled out all the stops with your stretches! And rightfully so. Hoping it picks up and we get Eisenmern command or APC after eclipsing 100K. Certainly got a nice bump this morning after the weapon announcement!
I doubt he can due to logistics, but if the 100k free Vulcan became 100k free Any arm... Wow. But like I said, I really don't see that being feasible. 4 for the price of 3 is already sweet.
So, yeah... Totally jealous!
All it takes is a simple pledge increase and you can come to the dark side....we have titans with cookies
I'm grabbing a Leviathan Crusader. At least one but my entire body is calling out for two. I figure one running a Vulkan/CCW and one running a pair of Nova Cannons. Then calling them a pair of Warhounds for apocalypse gaming. Turbolaser destroyer (nova cannons) in the backfield, Megabolter/CCW up front and nasty.
So minimum I'm in for Crusader and two arms. It's looking like I'm gonna be getting two if I can squeeze a little extra cash out.
Congrats on an already very successful kickstarter!
I made some changes to the shipping fees so that it is a bit more international friendly on the pocket book.
Free or gift items are no longer added to the shipping totals! and the per box price has been lowered!
The international shipping has already been discounted from its true cost (we removed roughly the cost to ship within the USA, so you are getting the same value as the domestic backers)
I hope and plan on adding more goodies to the mix as the project progresses; this begs the question of how to deal with shipping fees… Not easy answers to a rather simple question as international shipment are based on package volume and weight. Without a shopping cart, it becomes difficult to properly estimate these fees.
When combining orders, use the base shipping cost of $15,00 and add the shipping cost of each box.
Large boxes for the Leviathans and the (yet to be released APC) are +$6.00 per box.
Medium sized boxes such as the (yet to be released 15mm scale Leviathans) are +$3.00 per box
Small box items such as the Stormtroopers, and their accessories as well as any weapon upgrades for your Leviathan are +2.00 per box.
There is no charge (addition) to the shipping costs for items that are offered as gifts in the stretch goals!
Example: You want a Leviathan Crusader (Ready for Serious Stompin!) and a 20 man box of Stormtroopers (Boots on the ground). There are two possible stretch goals that you may unlock as well. The Crusader is +$6.00 shipping, the Stormtroopers are +$2.00 shipping ($15,00 base cost +$6,00 for the Leviathan + $2.00 for the Stormtroopers = $23.00 total shipping. The stretch goals for the stormtrooper and Leviathan that have free gift items are NOT added to you shipping fees.
man having to deal with shipping charges on a website like kick starter is a bit of a pain, hope there wont be too many people out there that pledge a certain amount and miss out on something because they did do the math right
RiTides wrote: Excalibur stretch hit, moments away from Grendel/Beowulf gun at $61K!
so exited, Need to change my pledge amount tonight as I need a second Lev. Also need to include additional funds in my pledge to account for the weapons I want / am sure will unlock
At first, I balked at the arm prices too, but Mark's explanation makes sense.
I think that all of us hope that this is more than just a one-shot chance to get a cheap titan and some cool sci-fi infantry. I think we all would love to see a truly viable company rise out of the efforts and MONEY that this Kickstarter campaign is generating. If that means that Mark's gotta sell arms at $25, then so be it. It is justified if it means that, three years down the road, I can go down to my FLGS, or to the Warstore.com, and purchase some Iron-Core miniatures, not worrying if the line will disappear in 6 months. Or, even better, that I can purchase an Iron-Core army set, and so can my buddy, and we can sit down and play an Iron-Core game (and not just use the awesome and reasonably priced models as proxies for GW figures).
All that said, I would like to pose a question that I am not sure has been fully addressed. Usually with Kickstarters, part of the premium that early supporters get is that the merchandise received at different pledge levels is more expensive post-kickstarter, that is to say, your pledge is a kind of discounted pre-order of something that will be available later from the company at regular, which is to say somewhat higher, prices.
This brings me to my question. Mark/NoseGoblin:
Can you give us an idea of what the prices on some of these products will be POST-Kickstarter? Or, put another way, can you give us an idea of what kind of premium supporters are receiving by supporting now.
I know this might be a bit much to ask. I do so for several reasons:
1.-To try to drive home the benefit of throwing in your support NOW. If you're offering, say 30% off what will be the retail price, then people who wouldn't buy now, but might do so later will see the benefit of pledging during the Kickstarter.
2.-To re-assure those pledgers who are already offering support that they are genuinely getting a premium for their support. If you can get a Leviathan for $89 next year, then why are all these people working so hard to promote your project (with their money AND evangelizing efforts).
3.-To give an idea of what the prices might be like in the future, so that people can better judge if they really want to get into the Iron-Core line as a game in its own right. If we have an idea of what prices might be like a year from now, two years from now, we can better decide if we want to go that extra mile to ensure that there IS a year from now, two years from now for Dream-Forge Games.
I'm sure there might be a variety of reasons that you might not want or be able to provide the kind of pricing info that I'm requesting here, but I really think it would be beneficial. So please let us know what you think of the above (I'm speaking only on my own behalf, but I suspect other supporters have similar questions).
Thanks for all your hard work and engagement with the Wargaming Community. Keep up the good fight, and hopefully we'll all make your dream of a great company and our dreams of a great new gaming alternative into reality!
Grendel/Beowulf gun unlocked!! It's going to be an exciting run to $100K, with stretches so close together . We're $3.75K from the next one now!
cartharsix, Mark has mentioned that he doesn't know exactly what he'll be charging for these yet, but it may be more than $89. And that's without at least the free extra Vulcan when we hit 100K (not sure if Excalibur comes on the sprue or not).
The higher pledge levels are getting this beast for $75 with a free Vulcan. It's a pretty fantastic deal, I think.
Pasting the gun images here for folks to see without clicking
And, of course, in the middle of that is the 4.5" tall Crusader, and the full-size Mortis. Wow
Im personally not to concerned with what the price will be done the road, just as long as they dont sell these to the masses for less then what I'm paying for them. I'd be more then happy to hand over my monies and call it a pre order
I believe the estimated MSRP I saw was $90. So no 'discount', but you are getting:
a)it now (well october)
b)free shipping
c)extra CCW d)Better looking power plant (or just a spare for those of you who like the smoke stacks)
e)free second assault cannon arm (because do you really think this isn't going to hit 100k)
Possibly more that hasn't been seen yet.
I was happy to see the Crusader at $90. Its a great kit, and thats a great price for it. Not sure why people are so demanding of getting more for less from a very small company like this.
the HEL cannon just drips sexy, cant put my finger on what I like so much about it...but i NEED it
I quite like the artillery cannon. But I'd like to see it shoulder mounted with an assault cannon and a fist, or even two fists. I cant afford to make that happen soon sadly (damn you again reaper). But someday, that will be my Crusader.
Justyn wrote: I believe the estimated MSRP I saw was $90. So no 'discount', but you are getting:
I was happy to see the Crusader at $90. Its a great kit, and thats a great price for it. Not sure why people are so demanding of getting more for less from a very small company like this.
Reaper is in a different position entirely. They are a very well known mini company. They have the capability to take their 3.4 million make some molds, take a minor hit on producing a ton of models for the backers, and make their money back over the few months afterward. Small companies like dreamforge, they can't take hits so well. And with a much smaller customer base, it takes longer to recoup them. I suspect he won't see profit on those extra arms for a year or two.
I doubt MSRP is going to be $90. My guess would be in the $100-$120 range. That's still dirt cheap for what you're getting but since most people aren't going to be buying these in bulk you don't want your MSRP to low. We'll see. Either way I'm cool with the price of the models so it doesn't bother me much.
Justyn wrote: Reaper is in a different position entirely. They are a very well known mini company. They have the capability to take their 3.4 million make some molds, take a minor hit on producing a ton of models for the backers, and make their money back over the few months afterward. Small companies like dreamforge, they can't take hits so well. And with a much smaller customer base, it takes longer to recoup them. I suspect he won't see profit on those extra arms for a year or two.
All im suggesting is the average person doesnt see it this way...the just see MOAR FREE STUFF
I'm not clamoring for MOAR FREE STUFF or an unrealistically cheap price now. I think for the reasons I outlined in my earlier post, that more transparency *IF POSSIBLE* might help encourage more people to jump on the bandwagon, or if already there, up their support.
I'm trying hard to save some pennies for 1 titan, 2 arms, 20 troopers, and a shortie if all become available. But that's a large chunk of change (especially with 6th ed. coming out right now). I hope I can get those funds in to Mark now, to help this along, but it can be tough to put together that amount of money for a single purchase.
catharsix wrote: At first, I balked at the arm prices too, but Mark's explanation makes sense.
I think that all of us hope that this is more than just a one-shot chance to get a cheap titan and some cool sci-fi infantry. I think we all would love to see a truly viable company rise out of the efforts and MONEY that this Kickstarter campaign is generating. If that means that Mark's gotta sell arms at $25, then so be it. It is justified if it means that, three years down the road, I can go down to my FLGS, or to the Warstore.com, and purchase some Iron-Core miniatures, not worrying if the line will disappear in 6 months. Or, even better, that I can purchase an Iron-Core army set, and so can my buddy, and we can sit down and play an Iron-Core game (and not just use the awesome and reasonably priced models as proxies for GW figures).
All that said, I would like to pose a question that I am not sure has been fully addressed. Usually with Kickstarters, part of the premium that early supporters get is that the merchandise received at different pledge levels is more expensive post-kickstarter, that is to say, your pledge is a kind of discounted pre-order of something that will be available later from the company at regular, which is to say somewhat higher, prices.
This brings me to my question. Mark/NoseGoblin:
Can you give us an idea of what the prices on some of these products will be POST-Kickstarter? Or, put another way, can you give us an idea of what kind of premium supporters are receiving by supporting now.
I know this might be a bit much to ask. I do so for several reasons:
1.-To try to drive home the benefit of throwing in your support NOW. If you're offering, say 30% off what will be the retail price, then people who wouldn't buy now, but might do so later will see the benefit of pledging during the Kickstarter.
2.-To re-assure those pledgers who are already offering support that they are genuinely getting a premium for their support. If you can get a Leviathan for $89 next year, then why are all these people working so hard to promote your project (with their money AND evangelizing efforts).
3.-To give an idea of what the prices might be like in the future, so that people can better judge if they really want to get into the Iron-Core line as a game in its own right. If we have an idea of what prices might be like a year from now, two years from now, we can better decide if we want to go that extra mile to ensure that there IS a year from now, two years from now for Dream-Forge Games.
I'm sure there might be a variety of reasons that you might not want or be able to provide the kind of pricing info that I'm requesting here, but I really think it would be beneficial. So please let us know what you think of the above (I'm speaking only on my own behalf, but I suspect other supporters have similar questions).
Thanks for all your hard work and engagement with the Wargaming Community. Keep up the good fight, and hopefully we'll all make your dream of a great company and our dreams of a great new gaming alternative into reality!
I am pretty transparent when it comes to such things. The truth of the matter is, I don’t have the retail established. I know the MSRP will be higher than the Kickstarte, but I do not have a % number for you.
It really depends on how much debt I am carrying at the time this project closes, and what the market will bear. If you are wondering, if you will be able to find these for less six months after the Kickstarter is shipped… sure it is possible. When they enter the supply chain and hit the retailers, they will likely have a 25% margin to play with. How deep will they discount it? I have no clue… Are you getting your monies worth here? Well that’s a judgment call. Do you want these to be made or not? Is free shipping within the US and the free items enough for you? I cannot answer that.
I understand where you are coming from but unfortunately, I do not have the answers you’re looking for.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
catharsix wrote: I'm not clamoring for MOAR FREE STUFF or an unrealistically cheap price now. I think for the reasons I outlined in my earlier post, that more transparency *IF POSSIBLE* might help encourage more people to jump on the bandwagon, or if already there, up their support.
I'm trying hard to save some pennies for 1 titan, 2 arms, 20 troopers, and a shortie if all become available. But that's a large chunk of change (especially with 6th ed. coming out right now). I hope I can get those funds in to Mark now, to help this along, but it can be tough to put together that amount of money for a single purchase.
-C6
If you approach this from a purely strategic purchase, then grabbing up the weapon arms will yield you something that will likely not be available for some time.
I'm not even looking at the troops yet. My money is all going to the Crusader on this one. I'm a terrible photoshoper but this will not be a cheap conversion lol.
yeah and a second crusader to use the 4th arm..... thats where it starts getting expensive lol.
On another note. NoseGoblin just out of curiosity why did the plastic kits end up being smaller than the resin versions? Not complaining or anything like that, just curious about the logic of it. Frankly they will fit in better with my other large scale 'Mechs at 8.5" anyway.
Damn you, Mondragon! I said a Mortis MAYBE and that was it! Now you go and pull this uber-sexy weapon arms stunt... *sigh and starts shopping*
I see what catharsix is saying; it's a common trait that people like to realize a "value" on their purchases and get leery when they can't see where they're getting ahead of the pack. Places like the WarStore base their business model around this tendency after all.
While Mark can't predict the future while delivering the awesome to us I decided to whip up some comparisons to the well-known purveyor of plastic goodies, GW. Doing this mainly from memory so apologies for any oversights. Please let me know where I screwed up and I'll correct it. For reference this is using base prices and in USD.
Infantry:
Spoiler:
Imperial Guard: Cost: $29 for 10 Number of weapon options: 4 (CCW/Pistol, Lasgun, Flamer, Grenade Launcher) Number of specialized kit: 1 (Voxcaster) Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes Number of heads: 12 - most helmeted
Space Marines: Cost: $37.25 for 10 Number of weapon options: 4 (CCW/Pistol, Bolters, Missile Launcher, Flamer...based on images, not sure if GW added more special ones later) Number of specialized kit: 1 (Auspex) Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes Number of Heads: 12 - most helmeted
DreamForge Kickstarter: Cost: $39 for 23 (20 troopers + 3 MULEs) - Maximum Number of weapon options: 5 (Rifle, SMG, AT rocket, Pistol, SMG with Grenade Launcher...I didn't count the rifle-to-LMG option) Number of specialed kit: 2 (Field computer, binoculars) Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes Number of heads: 34 (!!) - Majority helmeted, but options for field hats and officer's caps included
So the kits are clearly comparable in terms of modelling potential. Apples-to-apples price comparison on model count yields:
$39 (DFKS) < $58 (GW-IG) < $74.50 (GW-SM)
Even ordering from the War Store yields:
$39 (DFKS) < $46.4 (GW-IG) < $59.60 (GW-SM)
Summary: The accessories that make the kit fantastic will likely be sold separately based on some of Mark's comments, so if you want to get a great-looking and highly-customizable army, the Eisenkern Stormtroopers in the Kickstarter are *very* compelling. Quality of look is in the eye of the beholder, but on the objectively measured features they stand up quite well to the major player in this market. Pledging more boxes lowers your price tilting this even MORE in DFG's favor.
Heavy Weapons:
Spoiler:
Imperial Guard: Cost: $39.50 for 9 models (counting guns), $31.60 from WarStore Number of weapon options: 5 (Missile Launcher, Mortar, Autocannon, Lascannon, Heavy Bolter) Multiple weapons of the same type from one box: Yes Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes
DreamForge KickStarter Cost: $33 for 12 models (counting guns) Number of weapon options: 3 (Light cannon, AA quad, Mortar) Multiple weapons of the same type form one box: No (well, can't have everything I suppose...) Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes
Summary: On their own, this one is not as much of a slam-dunk. However, I think if you like the look of the Stormtroopers these are still a solid buy. If you want to field them as IG, you can pull the spotters off the bases and put them with an AT trooper from the "base" box and viola! A missile launcher team. This will also pull out a few troopers to make command sections, so if that's the route you're looking to go with them as a stand-in it will help make that happen naturally.
Big Frikkin' Walkers:
Spoiler:
GW - Ork Stompa Cost: $115, 92 from WarStore Height: ~9" Weapon swaps: If you're a clever modeller Additional Cost per Arm: N/A
FW - Warhound Titan Cost: $502 (at present exchange rates) Height: 10.5" Weapon Swaps: If you're a somewhat good modeller. Additional Cost per Arm: $57
DFKS - Crusader Cost: $89 Height: 8.5" Weapon Swaps: Built into the design Additional Cost per Arm: $25 (assuming you don't want one of the freebies)
Summary: Yes, they're a bit shorter than the two competitors but GREAT GOOGLY MOOGLY! You can buy 6 Crusaders and 2 extra arms for the cost of a Warhound on this KickStarter! Not sure WHY you would do this, but it does illustrate the disparity. The Ork Stompa compares much more favorably, unless you don't like the Ork design aesthetic (which would likely be the case for Chaos and Imperial players). The Stompa is still technically more expensive even from a discount retailer. Again another win for Dreamforge.
Building a full army:
Spoiler:
For the sake of argument, the build is 115 soldiers (2 full platoons of 50 + 3 command sections) with 12 heavy weapons teams and one walker. We will pretend the DreadKnight can be used with the IG directly to add a walker and also pretend it's on the same scale as a Crusader.
GW: 11 boxes of IG troopers, 1 command squad, 4 heavy weapons boxes, dreadknight = (29x11) + (25x1) + (39.5x4) + 53.75 = $555.75 or $440.60 online. 11 boxes of troopers to use 1 box to make 2 5-man command sections (fair play given the heavy weapons "hack" used for DFG below).
DFKS: 6 boxes of troopers ($29.33 ea. at that pledge level), 3 heavy weapons teams (refer to earlier section about missile launcher teams...120 troopers - 3 for missile teams = 117 still), 1 crusader = (6x29.33) + (3x33) + 89 = $363
Summary: Obviously GW is a very high price point, which skews this comparison somewhat. However, given that the kits are on-par with GW product, this Kickstarter looks to be an excellent value. The only loss in the equation is you can't spam a particular heavy weapon, which IMO is not worth an extra $90 over discounted price. If we unlock the smaller crusader and it has a lower price point, again the comparison only goes into DFG's favor more.
Do I advise people throwing tons and tons of money at Mark? Well it'd be awesome if you could, but this was mainly to show where this product sits both quality and price-wise in comparison to "the big boys".
Necros wrote: Which reminds me, will there be left and right handed versions of the guns? Or do they work either way?
I think it's only the chaingun and the claw that are arm-specific. You might need to choose which side as you're assembling the arm, but all the others can be built as either a left arm or a right arm.
Justyn wrote: yeah and a second crusader to use the 4th arm..... thats where it starts getting expensive lol.
On another note. NoseGoblin just out of curiosity why did the plastic kits end up being smaller than the resin versions? Not complaining or anything like that, just curious about the logic of it. Frankly they will fit in better with my other large scale 'Mechs at 8.5" anyway.
Well, a 15mm version should be about 4.5" tall I made the other resin kits 5.5 because of the material I was working with. Some of the parts lit the stack tops were too thin when I reduced it to 4.5" for I had to make them larger or the damn thinks would break The platic at this scale should be fine as long as your not thewing them around...
Krinsath wrote: Damn you, Mondragon! I said a Mortis MAYBE and that was it! Now you go and pull this uber-sexy weapon arms stunt... *sigh and starts shopping*
I see what catharsix is saying; it's a common trait that people like to realize a "value" on their purchases and get leery when they can't see where they're getting ahead of the pack. Places like the WarStore base their business model around this tendency after all.
While Mark can't predict the future while delivering the awesome to us I decided to whip up some comparisons to the well-known purveyor of plastic goodies, GW. Doing this mainly from memory so apologies for any oversights. Please let me know where I screwed up and I'll correct it.
Infantry:
Spoiler:
Imperial Guard:
Cost: $29 for 10
Number of weapon options: 4 (CCW/Pistol, Lasgun, Flamer, Grenade Launcher)
Number of specialized kit: 1 (Voxcaster)
Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes
Number of heads: 12 - most helmeted
Space Marines:
Cost: $37.25 for 10
Number of weapon options: 4 (CCW/Pistol, Bolters, Missile Launcher, Flamer...based on images, not sure if GW added more special ones later)
Number of specialized kit: 1 (Auspex)
Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes
Number of Heads: 12 - most helmeted
DreamForge Kickstarter:
Cost: $39 for 23 (20 troopers + 3 MULEs) - Maximum
Number of weapon options: 5 (Rifle, SMG, AT rocket, Pistol, SMG with Grenade Launcher...I didn't count the rifle-to-LMG option)
Number of specialed kit: 2 (Field computer, binoculars)
Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes
Number of heads: 34 (!!) - Majority helmeted, but options for field hats and officer's caps included
So the kits are clearly comparable in terms of modelling potential. Apples-to-apples price comparison on model count yields:
$39 (DFKS) < $58 (GW-IG) < $74.50 (GW-SM)
Even ordering from the War Store yields:
$39 (DFKS) < $46.4 (GW-IG) < $59.60 (GW-SM)
Summary:
The accessories that make the kit fantastic will likely be sold separately based on some of Mark's comments, so if you want to get a great-looking and highly-customizable army, the Eisenkern Stormtroopers in the Kickstarter are *very* compelling. Quality of look is in the eye of the beholder, but on the objectively measured features they stand up quite well to the major player in this market. Pledging more boxes lowers your price tilting this even MORE in DFG's favor.
Heavy Weapons:
Spoiler:
Imperial Guard:
Cost: $39.50 for 9 models (counting guns), $31.60 from WarStore
Number of weapon options: 5 (Missile Launcher, Mortar, Autocannon, Lascannon, Heavy Bolter)
Multiple weapons of the same type from one box: Yes
Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes
DreamForge KickStarter
Cost: $33 for 12 models (counting guns)
Number of weapon options: 3 (Light cannon, AA quad, Mortar)
Multiple weapons of the same type form one box: No ( :( )
Ammo and Misc. Bitz: Yes
Summary:
On their own, this one is not as much of a slam-dunk. However, I think if you like the look of the Stormtroopers these are still a solid buy. If you want to field them as IG, you can pull the spotters off the bases and put them with an AT trooper from the "base" box and viola! A missile launcher team. This will also pull out a few troopers to make command sections, so if that's the route you're looking to go with them as a stand-in it will help make that happen naturally.
Big Frikkin' Walkers:
Spoiler:
GW - Ork Stompa
Cost: $115, 92 from WarStore
Height: ~9"
Weapon swaps: If you're a clever modeller
Additional Cost per Arm: N/A
FW - Warhound Titan
Cost: $502 (at present exchange rates)
Height: 10.5"
Weapon Swaps: If you're a somewhat good modeller.
Additional Cost per Arm: $57
DFKS - Crusader
Cost: $89
Height: 8.5"
Weapon Swaps: Built into the design
Additional Cost per Arm: $25 (assuming you don't want one of the freebies)
Summary:
Yes, they're a bit shorter than the two competitors but GREAT GOOGLY MOOGLY! You can buy 6 Crusaders and 2 extra arms for the cost of a Warhound on this KickStarter! Not sure WHY you would do this, but it does illustrate the disparity. The Ork Stompa compares much more favorably, unless you don't like the Ork design aesthetic (which would likely be the case for Chaos and Imperial players). It is still technically more expensive even from a discount retailer. Again another win for Dreamforge.
Building a full army:
Spoiler:
For the sake of argument, the build is 115 soldiers (2 full platoons of 50 + 3 command sections) with 12 heavy weapons teams and one walker. We will pretend the DreadKnight can be used with the IG directly to add a walker and also pretend it's on the same scale as a Crusader.
GW:
10 boxes of IG troopers, 1 command squad, 4 heavy weapons boxes, dreadknight = (29x11) + (25x1) + (39.5x4) + 53.75 = $555.75 or $440.60 online.
DFKS:
6 boxes of troopers ($29.33 ea. at that pledge level), 3 heavy weapons teams (refer to earlier section about missile launcher teams...120 troopers - 3 for missile teams = 117 still), 1 crusader = (6x29.33) + (3x33) + 89 = $363
Summary:
Obviously GW is a very high price point, which skews this comparison somewhat. However, given that the kits are on-par with GW product, this Kickstarter looks to be an excellent value. The only loss in the equation is you can't spam a particular heavy weapon, which IMO is not worth an extra $90 over discounted price. If we unlock the smaller crusader and it has a lower price point, again the comparison only goes into DFG's favor more.
Do I advise people throwing tons and tons of money at Mark? Well it'd be awesome if you could, but this was mainly to show where this product sits both quality and price-wise in comparison to "the big boys".
Been watching this for awhile and tempted to get in on it, but really want to get an idea on the scale, I know you say 8.5 inch or 15mm but I just cannot visualize that. Any chance you can take a picture of one of these beside a gw dreadnaught or stompa or something else I can use to get scale.
I think he might be locking in via manufacturing for that extra Vulkan arm.
I was thinking though, if we do reach above 100K, couldn't some of these extra stretch goals be free extra arms, or a free extra arm for those who bought one already? It would limit the amount of CAD Mark has to do to keep the gibbering hordes at bay. (Myself included, mind you)
I suspect this will not happen. He made more options like many asked for. However to make more molds takes more money. I doubt reaching the 100k level will mean he has recouped enough of them to allow that.
Krinsath- And all those comparisons are done using the base price. If you get 3 infantry boxes, for example, the price drops to under $30 per box!
Makaleth- I think Mark confirmed in the comments section of the KS that it's just going to be the left-hand Vulcan for free at $100K. However, he is going to try to have it shipped along with the stage 1 items- so folks can field a dual-wielding Crusader right away if he can work it out.
Mathieu- If we pass $100K, I had better well see an infantry stretch! (I.e. Command or APC) I'm being patient here... really
Also, I forgot to respond to this:
Commander Cain wrote: Well now we know where all those limited edition crusaders went too. I was about to get one but they must have already been sent to RiTides house!
Sorry to anyone who read the original post. Trying really hard not to be the devil's advocate, I'm just a concerned backer and I want Dreamforge to do well.
Just one note: Be very careful when comparing these model's prices to GWs. We already know they absolutely insane so they are not a good yardstick, they just happen to be the big dogs in the yard and can get away with it.
Hey guys: I'm considering making a $20 pledge (money is tight), and I have a quick question: What all will I get with a $20 pledge? I know that I will get a 10-man rifle squad + a free feral Shadokesh, but is there anything I missed?
Tim, that's it for $20... but if you can swing the $39 level, you'd get the accessory pack (which costs $10 to purchase separately on the kickstarter) as well.
So, $20 = 10 infantry, free Shadokesh handler and monster thing
And, $39 = 20 infantry, free Shadokesh handler and monster thing, free accessory pack for infantry
Either one are pretty good choices, I think, just wanted to show you the level where the next "freebie" comes in
Today was the second biggest day of pledges, but with a relatively low number of new backers. Update #19 has me thinking hard and coming up blank. Might be my final exam too.
Did everyone in here just suddenly want those gorgeous, beautiful extra weapons?
Seriously. I have tried gouging more friends, but some of them have those... kids they keep talking about, and apparently you can't not feed those for a few days or they spoil... or something.
If it weren't the huge annual sale on our avenue (the literally close off the street so people can wander around) I'd be tempted to print a few sheets and post them at the local gaming stores.
I know I have talked to people at the store and posted on our facebook group, but it seems that even though its plastic not titans for cheap and how much they say they need them for apoc, no one will bite. Few looked at the models but didn't like the look well enough to snatch em up for cheap allies.
I think it will take a few days for news of the new weapons to bring in new backers. Also, I think the 4.5" tall Crusader and the full-size Mortis will be levels that will bring in a lot of new backers. Today's news really got current backers upping their pledges, though!
I will share this with my local gaming group and see if anyone else might be interested
I agree the 15mm Crusader will get some extra pledges in. I disagree on the Mortis. Everyone I have talked to agree the Crusader is the much better looking model. I'm sure there are a few who will order it. And some who will order both. I am just not expecting a large jump from it.
Oh, the Knight is 100% the full sized one. Have you seen the 5.5" one at my house? The new one is smaller than that.
@RiTides: Hasn't confirmed nor denied, just commented that the Vulcan will be free postage. And to the comment of not recouping... he has to give a FREE arm from any kit, so the cost is marginal for another arm (as he will already have had to kit them up).
Right now the extra weapons are only for the full-size. Isn't it almost "true titan" sized, though? Not sure how tall Knights are... but I call my 5.5" resin ones knights
I love the fullsize, it's definitely my warhound... still waffling on whether to get one or two. Gonna grab the 4 for 3 arms. Especially if we get the HEL cannon. Not sure which to get though. Pair of Novas... HEL, maybe a Ripper?
I'm definitely using mine as either a Chaos warhound or some sort of daemon-engine roughly on par with that. It's maybe an inch shorter than a FW warhound (probably a dead-ringer on the height compared to an armourcast), so I figure with the obligatory spiky bits on the shoulders, a nice banner of some sort between the smoke stacks, it'll look beefy enough.
*edit* Went and fudged with my overall kickstarter pledges, so that I could justify a single crusader, and 4 weapon arms, to take advantage of the 4 for 3 deal. to be honest, I think that ripper saw if we get to it will be going on a stompa in the future.
Just put in for six arms (and hoping on grabbing two free ones with em). One question though. Does anyone with some manner of graphic design skills feel like kicking out a poster that people could put up in their FLGS? I'm utterly terrible at that sort of thing. Thoughts?
Lanithion wrote: Just put in for six arms (and hoping on grabbing two free ones with em). One question though. Does anyone with some manner of graphic design skills feel like kicking out a poster that people could put up in their FLGS? I'm utterly terrible at that sort of thing. Thoughts?
You are welcome to uuse my renders if you need them. I do not have time to do new hi-rez because it ties up my system for 8-10 hours while it renders They are large files when full size and the one I used for the cover on the box art can make a decent 17X24" poster
Anyone here involved in the fine scale modelling community? How about the mecha/gundam modelling community? Post links to the kickstarter on related boards/sites (esp. If you know of Japanese sites for the latter) as there is some crossover and we may be able tk get pledges from military modelers for this.
H.B.M.C. wrote: In all’a y’all’s opinions, what would make a better Knight: The full-sized one, or the 15mm scale one?
And will the additional weapons be available in 15mm?
Im personally springing for the 15mm as a Knight. I dont like the large Knights that are almost the same as a Warhound, but thats just personal opinion. I do think the 15mm is slightly too small for that, with a bit of leg extension and fixing that bare torso that i dont particularly like, i should be able to bring it up to 6", which is the same size as my scratch built Warden.
Plus, you know, getting the smaller one means i get more for my money
Dang I was one of the guys lucky enough to get one of the resin big boys. But I'm hooked pledged for another one with arm options and more foot soldiers. Wife is going to kill me.lol
You know, I've been looking around for this, but being a slow, old man I can't seem to find the answer. When the Mortis is unlocked, will we be able to swap the crusader that we pledged for for one? Don't get me wrong, I love both levis but the Mortis fits my traitor guard's look much better. If not, hey no problem - I'll end up getting a mort later anyhow
I don't think he's explicitly laid that out yet. I believe the answer is going to be YES, and that it will be the exact same cost as the Crusader. All of the weapon add-ons will be made to fit either (with the extra armor Crusaders have included as an extra piece that you can just leave off the Mortis).
Although it is mostly the same bitz for the kit, there is no telling how they were laid out on the sprue, though. If the armour was interspersed with the chassis, then it would make little sense to sell us so many "useless" bitz.
If it was laid out that the chassis was a sprue, the armour was another one, the arms were on separate sprues, then really all he has to spring for are the new arm sprues and a toes/death's head sprue. Otherwise, its another massive investment for Mark.
It'll take some converting, but I think these things would make fantastic Warmachine Colossals. Anyone know about the footprint? Would it fit on a base the size of a CD?
I like the idea of a Mortis with two long melee weapons and a big shoulder mounted cannon as a Cryx Kraken. My only worry is that the thing is too big to fit on the base and the 15mm version is too small.
H.B.M.C. wrote: In all’a y’all’s opinions, what would make a better Knight: The full-sized one, or the 15mm scale one?
And will the additional weapons be available in 15mm?
Im personally springing for the 15mm as a Knight. I dont like the large Knights that are almost the same as a Warhound, but thats just personal opinion. I do think the 15mm is slightly too small for that, with a bit of leg extension and fixing that bare torso that i dont particularly like, i should be able to bring it up to 6", which is the same size as my scratch built Warden.
Plus, you know, getting the smaller one means i get more for my money
I'm with you on this one - the smaller one will make a better Knight.
I've see RiTides' resin versions in person, and they are BIG - I think one that is 1" short will be plenty big enough to represent a Knight, while at the same time being a bit smaller will make it a better proxy for that chassis in 40K.
I've spread the word to my gaming group on these, the break down a page or two back on what you get for the money is pretty awesome and really sells the deal
It might work. But it might be just a bit too big. Too colossal to be a colossal.
Unless the plastic kit can be built with it's legs closer together. Are the legs very posable?
How tall are the colossals?
The Cygnar & Khador ones appear to be about 6 inches tall, give or take a bit. So the 28mm Leviathan is way too big. The 15mm scale might be a bit on the short side, but with some clever basing they could pull it off.
While Im pulling for maximum income on this, Ill be all set after $95k. Im currently in for 2 Crusaders, but thats going to change. If we clear the 95k mark Im going to change it to a Crusader, Nova cannon, HEL cannon, and both claws.
Im also super excited about the freebie Shadokesh. That and if we get high enough seeing the APC concept.
I would personally use the full-size Crusader as a 40K scale Knight. Knights are much bigger than Dreadknights. Remember that when they were available for Epic scale, Knights were on normal 25mm slotta-bases and most were the same size as 28mm Space marines.
The old 5.5 inch resin might work, but the 4.5 inch version is on the side of too small, IMHO. Especially when you take into account that one of the knights (Errant, I think?) had an arm that was a battle cannon with (I think) coaxial twin-linked heavy bolters.
As far as I know, Knights are the Imperial match for Stompas.
AegisGrimm wrote: I would personally use the full-size Crusader as a 40K scale Knight. Knights are much bigger than Dreadknights. Remember that when they were available for Epic scale, Knights were on normal 25mm slotta-bases and most were the same size as 28mm Space marines.
The old 5.5 inch resin might work, but the 4.5 inch version is on the side of too small, IMHO. Especially when you take into account that one of the knights (Errant, I think?) had an arm that was a battle cannon with (I think) coaxial twin-linked heavy bolters.
As far as I know, Knights are the Imperial match for Stompas.
Can someone give me more info on these knights? rules? I've never even heard of them.
This is why I'm still pretty stoked I got the 5.5" ones
Muwahahaha!
But you lads get all the sweet weapons, though, so... I'd say it's a toss-up (plus the full-size ones are about the same price as the old 5.5" resin ones which is incredible)
Warhounds weren't much bigger than Knights in Epic... from what I remember a Knight Baron was as tall as a Warhound (but ganglier)
I think so. I was always under the assumption that the scale of a Knight to a Warhound was like a Power Armor is to Terminator armor. The difference being more about the armor than the weapons (though a Warhound can still carry more than a Knight). Even the actual Epic models aren't that big a difference, being mainly 25mm-based to 40mm-based, just like PA versus TA.
The big difference between the two is I don't think that Knights have any kind of Void Shields, just armor plating. It's one of the reasons that they aren't regarded as "proper titans".
@RiTides- Umm, did Mark switch the goals? The Kickstarter site is saying the 15mm Crusader is the next stretch... unless, of course, my eyes are alot worse off than I thought...
I think as with many of the older models and their fluff, it really depends on personal opinion.
Automatically Appended Next Post: @DeChevalier: What! It appears he did switch the goals, epic! Id say thats some smart thinking tbh, get all the new backers interested earlier.
Yeah, he switched it! Smart move, I think, to get in more alternate backers
For the resin 15mm one, I believe he had to fuse some parts together. However, for the plastic 15mm he is saying it will just be the 28mm scaled down, and will remain fully poseable!
That's awesome because the one drawback to the resin kits is that it is hard to pose them dynamically.
I'd bet he may release arms (perhaps in resin) to fit the new 15mm one in the future, but for the Kickstarter it is from all indications just going to be the base kit. Usable for a perfect Dreadknight as-is, though and those things are still (or even more) scary in 6th ed.
Seems like the 15mm would be the perfect size then! Also the Ork Mega-Dread which has pretty much identical rules to the Knight, comes in at about 5-6"
I will say that I agree with the decision to swap the stretch goals of the ripper arm and the 4.5 inch Leviathan. It is what is best for the project. However, I will be a little disappointed if the 80,000 goal isn't met as I was looking forward to the Ripper.
So I did some screen calipers type measurements on the Mortis pictures and believe that as it is posed with the miniature beneath it, it is 6.24 inches from the outside of one foot to the outside of another. Which means the position of the hips needs to allow each foot to be brought in roughly .77 inches each.
This picture leads me to believe it to be possible:
Spoiler:
I think that exact pose would fit on a 4.7" base with the forward leg on the exact front of the base and the rear leg having it's toes just stepping onto the base, with the heal sticking out behind.
Ok, I am currently put in for the $89 pledge for one Crusader and I'm trying to wrap my head around the total cost for this including shipping (international since it has to come up to Canada). I tried using the cost calculator listed at the bottom of the kickstarter page but was unable to fill anything in. Is anyone able to assist me in determining just what my total cost will be after all the shipping changes have happened? Also I fully intend on getting a Nova Cannon, so that will need to be factored in as well.
CrashCanuck wrote: Ok, I am currently put in for the $89 pledge for one Crusader and I'm trying to wrap my head around the total cost for this including shipping (international since it has to come up to Canada). I tried using the cost calculator listed at the bottom of the kickstarter page but was unable to fill anything in. Is anyone able to assist me in determining just what my total cost will be after all the shipping changes have happened? Also I fully intend on getting a Nova Cannon, so that will need to be factored in as well.
Are you just getting the nova cannon or other stuff as well?
Im sure someone can check my math or ninja me here but I think your total would be 89 (pledge) + 15 (shipping) + 25 (nova) + 2 (nova shipping) = $131
Though I could be wrong as I dont really understand this message:
"International shipping: Please add $2.00 per box to the $15.00 base charge."
Dont fully understand how the international shipping or this stage 1, 2, 3 stuff works so I might be way off
Holy crAap thats cheap. Im down for 3, until he tells us how to buy more
Automatically Appended Next Post: If theres a way to buy more than 3, ill be down for 7, plus 20 or 40 troopers i havent decided. Thatll be all i need to make my Knight Company (using these crusaders as the baron and the paladins, with scratch built wardens and dreadknights as lancers)
so Since I've already pledged for the 165 2 crusader option, if I want to add on 2 of the little guys, I just increase my pledge total by 79 right? I'd still leave my reward option as the 165 one? Doesnt seem to be an easy way to select multiple reward options
Yep, basically choose any reward level, and total the right amount of cash, theyll be a survey at the funding of the kickstarter to find out exactly what you wanted.
Making history! The world’s first 15mm - 1/100 scale, Injected plastic, science fiction model kit for tabletop gaming!
This kit has all the features and details of its big brother, fully poseable, featuring quick swap weapon arms for future releases.
This kit comes complete with advanced capacitor coolers and the Excalibur sword option!
Marines are not 10 feet tall. Most of them aren’t even 8 feet tall...
cuda1179 wrote: Here is a picture of the 5.5 inch resin leviathan between an Armorcast Warhound and an Epicast Knight (the only official 40k-scale knight ever made).
Well that settles that then. Thank you cuda; you are a legend for posting this!
hmm.. so hows about a full size mortis with big cannons, as a counts as warhound. Then a squad of 15mm crusaders as not-dreadknights. I'm so glad god invented credit cards.
After this is over, how about a new campaign for a reaver-sized not-titan of some sort?
1. Although they are unlikely to be part of this Kickstarter, is the current plan to duplicate all the full-sized Crusader weapon options for the 15mm Crusader?
2. Is there a plan to make a 15mm Mortis?
3. Even if you don't make a 15mm Mortis... could you make a 15mm scythe arm?
4. The 15mm Crusaders come with the capacitor backpack (which is great, BTW!). Will it also come with the big smoke stacks as well (as I want to use them on some terrain)?
5. Is the Mortis' scythe arm compatible with the Crusader?
6. How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
I'm sure I'll think of others (I've still got more than 2 weeks to decide!).
Wait! One more: Are those guns on either side of the Crusader's head... attached to either side of his upper torso? I never noticed those before. Can the barrels be replaced with other weapons, if one was so inclined?
Wait! One more: Are those guns on either side of the Crusader's head... attached to either side of his upper torso? I never noticed those before. Can the barrels be replaced with other weapons, if one was so inclined?
How in gods name have i never seen that before!! Just perfect for a HB....
Wait! One more: Are those guns on either side of the Crusader's head... attached to either side of his upper torso? I never noticed those before. Can the barrels be replaced with other weapons, if one was so inclined?
if its the same as the resin one, they are guns and it would be pretty simple to convert any weapon to fit
I'd have to look at my resin version, but I think they are separate pieces. I do not think there are any alternatives for the chest guns at this point though.
All weapon arms will be interchangeable per Mark. You may have to wait a while for other 15mm variant chassis and weapons though.
Smokestacks should come standard, with the Capacitors as an option.
1. Although they are unlikely to be part of this Kickstarter, is the current plan to duplicate all the full-sized Crusader weapon options for the 15mm Crusader?
2. Is there a plan to make a 15mm Mortis?
3. Even if you don't make a 15mm Mortis... could you make a 15mm scythe arm?
4. The 15mm Crusaders come with the capacitor backpack (which is great, BTW!). Will it also come with the big smoke stacks as well (as I want to use them on some terrain)?
5. Is the Mortis' scythe arm compatible with the Crusader?
6. How much wood could a woodchuck chuck if a woodchuck could chuck wood?
I'm sure I'll think of others (I've still got more than 2 weeks to decide!).
Wait! One more: Are those guns on either side of the Crusader's head... attached to either side of his upper torso? I never noticed those before. Can the barrels be replaced with other weapons, if one was so inclined?
If these gain a lot of new backers.... Everything you see for the 28mm will be made for the 15! sooooo its up to you and others as to what gets slotted after 100k!
They are their own parts, they aren't build into the torso on the big or small version. a heavy bolter would be too big on the small version, maybe if you chopped it down a little.
Vitruvian XVII wrote: Seems like the 15mm would be the perfect size then! Also the Ork Mega-Dread which has pretty much identical rules to the Knight, comes in at about 5-6"
Yes, it certainly seems as if the 15mm version is just about perfect, doesn't it?!?
Vitruvian XVII wrote: Seems like the 15mm would be the perfect size then! Also the Ork Mega-Dread which has pretty much identical rules to the Knight, comes in at about 5-6"
Yes, it certainly seems as if the 15mm version is just about perfect, doesn't it?!?
CrashCanuck wrote: Ok, I am currently put in for the $89 pledge for one Crusader and I'm trying to wrap my head around the total cost for this including shipping (international since it has to come up to Canada). I tried using the cost calculator listed at the bottom of the kickstarter page but was unable to fill anything in. Is anyone able to assist me in determining just what my total cost will be after all the shipping changes have happened? Also I fully intend on getting a Nova Cannon, so that will need to be factored in as well.
Are you just getting the nova cannon or other stuff as well?
Im sure someone can check my math or ninja me here but I think your total would be 89 (pledge) + 15 (shipping) + 25 (nova) + 2 (nova shipping) = $131
Though I could be wrong as I dont really understand this message:
"International shipping: Please add $2.00 per box to the $15.00 base charge."
Dont fully understand how the international shipping or this stage 1, 2, 3 stuff works so I might be way off
I'm planning on also getting the HEL Cannon when it becomes available.
HMBC, didn't you read the fluff posted a few pages ago?
Sheesh. =P
They are 20mm autocannons, for close defense. As for questions regarding the mortis' scythe arm, Mark has said that all Leviathans' arms will be interchangeable AND hot swappable. That alone makes these 1000 times cooler that FW titans.
Mark, you are truly a drug dealer. I thought GW cornered the market on plastic crack, but boy are you giving them a run for their money. I fudged with my other pledges to make room for a crusader and 4 arms. I have a strict "no more than $200 in any 3 month running period for kickstarter, otherwise I'd just have to change my direct deposit info to go to amazon.
They are definately being used as flamers of some sort when I corrupt mine into the service of Chaos. I'm in the process of coming up with some rules for mine, to make it more of a walking firebase of death as opposed to a fast hunter like the warhound. Mark's leviathans have a positive gun size to chassis size ratio, which means I'm going for slightly stronger than warhound weapons on a slighty weaker and slower frame. something along the lines of 4 SP to the warhounds 3 and 2 voids. Perhaps a 5+ or 6+ "big effing daemon inside" save when it's stationary. Gonna need to do some play testing with my stompa to work out points costs and feasability, then I'll post them up here for you lot to shred to pieces. =D
Mark, you are truly a drug dealer. I thought GW cornered the market on plastic crack, but boy are you giving them a run for their money.
Agree with this, I started off just wanted a big guy for my custodes army...then it turned into a big guy for my custodes and my flesh tearers....now each army needs a matching little guy...and I find myself wondering if my dark angel army needs a big guy and how difficult would it be to make robes for him to wear....
Once the mortis is unlocked I'm not sure how I'll avoid getting one for my khorne
With the additional weapon arms that are available, will we simply indicate which ones we want with the survey that will be sent out at the end? Or will there be another way to indicate which ones we want before that happens?
I don't play GK- perhaps someone meant IG as allies?
Edit: Quoting onto the new page:
Dreamforge wrote:Making history! The world’s first 15mm - 1/100 scale, Injected plastic, science fiction model kit for tabletop gaming!
This kit has all the features and details of its big brother, fully poseable, featuring quick swap weapon arms for future releases.
This kit comes complete with advanced capacitor coolers and the Excalibur sword option!
1 for $44
2 for $79
3 for $105
Dreamforge wrote:If these gain a lot of new backers.... Everything you see for the 28mm will be made for the 15! sooooo its up to you and others as to what gets slotted after 100k!
Will be interesting to see if a bunch of new backers jump on now. At that price point... it's pretty insane! If you're ordering 3 or more, it's almost 60% less than the price these were going for in resin!
Mathieu Raymond wrote: Yes, Mark, we'd like to have a talk with you. See, you keep pushing our buttons in just the right way, and we'd like to know how you do this.
Although I wasn't planning on it, I will not most probably pledge on two of the 15mm ones, at that price.
Can anyone point me to the relevant page of Codex: GK, that says we can use Inquisitorial Stormtroopers? I swore those were out of the codex.
I wonder if I can talk one of the mods into changing my tag from "Regular Dakkanaut" to "Plastic Crack Dealer"
Glad to see this. Gonna be even more excited if it gets enough backers to have different weapons and a mortis head. I'll likely be down for 2. I'll post it up on my game group page and see if anyone is interesed.
RiTides wrote: Yeah, I felt bad saying that as I can see that every penny of yours is going into this Kickstarter!
Just emailed my gaming group about the 4.5" tall ones, hoping some more folks will bite as that is an insane deal.
I did the same, I know I'm in for 2 of the 4.5's, my group is just plain dumb if they dont want to jump on board with me from a cost savings stand point alone. Not to mention the sweet sweet model for 35 bucks
Why does a (presumably higher-selling over the long term) model requiring 1/4 the tooling cost 1/2 as much?
Necros wrote:Can you make a 3D mockup pic of a mortis with 2 nova cannons? or a mortis with any of those weapons really..
I accidentally two HEL cannons instead, but here's a quick and dirty shop:
NoseGoblin wrote:I made some changes to the shipping fees so that it is a bit more international friendly on the pocket book.
Only if you're buying at least one Leviathan.
Makaleth wrote:DAMN IT!! Why are all of these arms better than the one that comes standard
They are better, aren't they? The assault cannon has a too-small ammo box and too-thick barrels, belt and support structure, and uses the silly GW "let's shoot through a tiny secondary barrel for the giggles" gimmick. The sword has a clumsy design, particularly the puffy hilt, and a fragile attachment that prevents it from having the range of motion necessary to believably hit an opposing mech. The other weapons are much better designed and proportioned (if perhaps a little oversize overall) and the scythe is actually capable of reaching out and touching someone.
RiTides wrote:It's just one of each weapon, although maybe you can trade with others if you're after certain ones. I figure I may want the options
What kind of gonzo sprue layout makes this sensible? Put multiple copies of the one with the weapons and weapon-specific arms on it in the box already. Mark, given this and way you needed your arm twisted to provide the Stormtruppen the rifles they were missing I'm concerned you can't tell the difference between not distorting your product to accomodate their use as proxies for other games and actively sabotaging such efforts.
I'm still interested in an Eisenkern force but I feel I'd be better to wait until the next, non-Leviathan-centric, kickstarter when you'll hopefully be...better organised. All success with this one, man.
Why does a (presumably higher-selling over the long term) model requiring 1/4 the tooling cost 1/2 as much?
Large flat areas don't cost as much to machine as details. The 1/100 scale on retains all the details of its big brother, but a whole lot less large flat area. While yes, there may be 1/4 as much plastic in the mold when it is done, that does not equate to the mold costing 1/4 to make.
You can presume it will sell better over the long term, this does not mean it will sell significantly faster in the immediate future, which is what might bring the price down. More important, your presumption is an opinion. We all know how opinions work.
I wonder if the 15mm is the right size for a Dreadknight. It would be soooooo much better than the "Baby-on-board" version.
Well its 4.5" tall. If memory serves the DK is around 4 to 4.5" tall... any one got a hard figure on that?
Construct wrote: Why does a (presumably higher-selling over the long term) model requiring 1/4 the tooling cost 1/2 as much?
Because that's how much the creator of the item has decided that it costs. While that sounds snarky that is the honest answer. Mark has created something, if you want a copy of it here's the cost. If you don't want a copy, for whatever reason under the sun, that's your business and your right as a consumer. Asking "well why is it this much?" is a bit crass though.
RiTides wrote:It's just one of each weapon, although maybe you can trade with others if you're after certain ones. I figure I may want the options
What kind of gonzo sprue layout makes this sensible? Put multiple copies of the one with the weapons and weapon-specific arms on it in the box already.
Evidently the layout for the Heavy Weapons Teams that Mark and his manufacturer agreed on? Not saying that I wasn't slightly disappointed by the fixed loadout in the box, but it's far from the end of the world. If that design is a deal-breaker for you that's fine, but there's no need to descend into "well *I* could do it better" name-calling. If you could do it better, by all means do so. If you got the same quality results as Mark did in the designs (and you seem to have good insights on this at least), I'd be quite interested in your KickStarter and/or product launch.
Construct wrote: Mark, given this and way you needed your arm twisted to provide the Stormtruppen the rifles they were missing I'm concerned you can't tell the difference between not distorting your product to accomodate their use as proxies for other games and actively sabotaging such efforts.
To characterize Mark as "needing his arm twisted" to put in the accessories sprue comes across as incredibly insulting. As near as I can tell from the thread someone says "I wish they had enough rifles to outfit them all that way" and Mark replies *less than two hours later* (and five posts later in the thread) that there will be an accessory pack as a goal that includes more rifles. It took Mark 3 days to put up the poster of the accessory pack that will be added for free. While he could have created it in that time I somehow doubt that was the case looking at the number of options included and the fact that it will be delivered alongside the Crusader and Stormtrooper boxes, unlike the later items like alternate weapon arms and the 15mm version.
Even if Mark somehow whipped this up in that timeframe (at which point he is a logistical wizard), how does someone saying "Boy, I'd really like more rifles" and the designer saying "there will be options to have more rifles!" translate into arm-twisting? That sounds like how it's supposed to work. Arm-twisting is him replying "NO! I will not cater to you people who don't want to play in MY sandbox!", or at least remaining silent for a long period, and then grudgingly changing his mind by being asked by multiple people to do it. That's not at all what happened.
While I might be naive about the world of model design, I don't think any of these items were cobbled together at the last minute. It looks much more like the entire range was planned out and ready to roll once there was feedback about what items customers really wanted and would recoup their expense quicker. That's not arm-twisting or being unorganized, that's reacting to the market and good business when you're starting out. There's a big difference between being unorganized and being flexible, and what I've seen from this Kickstarter shows much more of the latter.
Just as a heads up I just measured my Dreadknight. From foot to the top of his carapace he's just over 4". But from his feat to the top of his shoulder pistons he's 4.5". And that does not include the base. Bascially, these will be excellent stand-in Dreadknights.
Any one with the IA book have the ability to confirm or deny Warhound scout titan's ability to take CCWs?
And Mark if you have a second to clarify the exact contents of a 10 model sturmtrupen squad? I read it as 10x riflemen.
The Warhound currently doesnt have an option to take a titan CCW, however i dont think a single person who is playing apoc with you would begrudge you simply using it. Particularly when you would be losing out on one of the warhound's deadly weapons
As to the 10man box, i believe it is exactly that, 10 riflemen. Its just supposed to be either a little reward for those who cant pledge any more, or its an easy way to add riflemen cheaper, without 20 more guys.
True. The only other change is that adding a TCCW grants you and extra 3 attacks, if I recall correctly. I always thought it was silly, though, that you pay the same points for a Warhound with two of the giant flamers as you do one with two twin turbos.
So with the Iron Core range of models being offered in 15mm and 28mm scale, what will determine the order for releases?
Obviously the proxy-dreadknight status of the 15mm Crusader puts that out in front of other 15mm and 28mm releases, but when would we see storm troopers in 15mm?
Mark, how many models do you have ready to go in terms of plastic tooling? Will you plan on doing another Kickstarter next year for another Iron Core faction?
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, one of the things I love about Kickstarter is that with almost 400 people willing to chip in so far, they are helping to make some awesome hobby items availabe to the world and many more people will have the chance to enjoy them in the future.
Just a note to say for those that are confused with shipping etc, the new shipping calculator works a treat, just download to your computer and calculate away.
Warhounds weren't much bigger than Knights in Epic... from what I remember a Knight Baron was as tall as a Warhound (but ganglier)
I think so. I was always under the assumption that the scale of a Knight to a Warhound was like a Power Armor is to Terminator armor. The difference being more about the armor than the weapons (though a Warhound can still carry more than a Knight). Even the actual Epic models aren't that big a difference, being mainly 25mm-based to 40mm-based, just like PA versus TA.
The big difference between the two is I don't think that Knights have any kind of Void Shields, just armor plating. It's one of the reasons that they aren't regarded as "proper titans".
Knights had one power shield, but it only provided a 3+ invulnerable from the front 90 degree arc (remember, the bases that Knights came with had a little quarter-circle marked on the 25mm slotta base).
Some Knight weapons were Titan-class (like the one Knight that had a Quake cannon, which was one of the only non-Barrage weapons that could destroy a building)
awesome to see the little brother getting the go. I wont be picking one up during the kickstarter, but surely will once it hits general sale. Actually thats probably true for several things. My budget at this time is quite limited, but knowing all the cool things that will be released during 2013...time to prepare for them.
Still havent decided if Im going 2 stock Crusaders or 1 and a bunch of arms with what I have pledged...
Or, you could just use a TCCW on the warhound. Balance wise, you wouldnt even have to pay any extra points.
Well since TCCW are easily the worst weapons you can mount on a titan this makes a lot of sense. 3 Extra D CC attacks, or you can take a multi-shot D template weapon that is guaranteed to hit titan sized opponents from 96" away.
Anyway I'm glad the mini ones make a good stand in for the baby on board DK. I wont be getting one because imo it would look silly to use it next to its big brother. But I suspect that 15mm sci fi wargamers everywhere will like it once they hear about it. Has this been posted on ambush alley forums?
Argh. I'm also reaching close to my own limit. I'd really like to get my hands on the Mortis, and the 15mm guys, but can't afford it... I might actually reshuffle my pledge and forget about the stormtroopers. Which is sad, cuz they rock.
And, for the record, Kinsrath actually pretty much summed up the best possible way to respond to naysayers. Post Exalted.
Or, you could just use a TCCW on the warhound. Balance wise, you wouldnt even have to pay any extra points.
Well since TCCW are easily the worst weapons you can mount on a titan this makes a lot of sense. 3 Extra D CC attacks, or you can take a multi-shot D template weapon that is guaranteed to hit titan sized opponents from 96" away.
Anyway I'm glad the mini ones make a good stand in for the baby on board DK. I wont be getting one because imo it would look silly to use it next to its big brother. But I suspect that 15mm sci fi wargamers everywhere will like it once they hear about it. Has this been posted on ambush alley forums?
Trust me, 28mm wargamers everywhere are excited about the "15mm" version too!
For those claw arms.. are they articulated at all? Like I assume the elbow can bend for positioning, but what about the wrist or fingertallonclaws? Would be great if we could make it look like one hand is slashing while the other is punching, something like that. And any plans for other different kinds of arms, like siege weapons? Like a ginormous wrecking ball flail or mega drillfist? maybe not part of the kickstarer, but just eventually?
Necros wrote: For those claw arms.. are they articulated at all? Like I assume the elbow can bend for positioning, but what about the wrist or fingertallonclaws? Would be great if we could make it look like one hand is slashing while the other is punching, something like that. And any plans for other different kinds of arms, like siege weapons? Like a ginormous wrecking ball flail or mega drillfist? maybe not part of the kickstarer, but just eventually?
I only have the mini resin hand but it is palm and each finger plus some misc bits.
Im assuming because these arent resin casts alot more will be posable for the minis
Necros wrote: For those claw arms.. are they articulated at all? Like I assume the elbow can bend for positioning, but what about the wrist or fingertallonclaws? Would be great if we could make it look like one hand is slashing while the other is punching, something like that. And any plans for other different kinds of arms, like siege weapons? Like a ginormous wrecking ball flail or mega drillfist? maybe not part of the kickstarer, but just eventually?
On the resin 15mm version the fingers/thumb were all separate pieces. I guess you could position them on the hand to make them into a fist.
Other weapons... probably gonna have to wait and see what kind of market there is for them, and how well the current weapons sell.
I know I'll be picking up 15mm weapons to go with my resin kit as soon as they are available after the kickstarter. I'm focusing on the 28mm stuff this time around. Rare earth magnets are cheap
hear that Mark? People love your plastic crack so much we're BLEEDING for it! XD
Glad you like it and I am excited to have the support. Please don't bleed plenty more plastic crack to come in the next year so don't overextend yourself. slow and steady wins the race...
Necros wrote: For those claw arms.. are they articulated at all? Like I assume the elbow can bend for positioning, but what about the wrist or fingertallonclaws? Would be great if we could make it look like one hand is slashing while the other is punching, something like that. And any plans for other different kinds of arms, like siege weapons? Like a ginormous wrecking ball flail or mega drillfist? maybe not part of the kickstarer, but just eventually?
On the resin 15mm version the fingers/thumb were all separate pieces. I guess you could position them on the hand to make them into a fist.
Other weapons... probably gonna have to wait and see what kind of market there is for them, and how well the current weapons sell.
I know I'll be picking up 15mm weapons to go with my resin kit as soon as they are available after the kickstarter. I'm focusing on the 28mm stuff this time around. Rare earth magnets are cheap
Elbow and finger can move ! twist at the shoulder and the arm raises their as well.
Now, my math skills aren't the best (hey, my major was history and ethics, so that should tell you something), but I'm trying to look at the trends and money so far.
The trend has been around 450 to 475% throughout the kickstarter (well, apart from that first day I would guess) and as we are mid-way through, we've stayed within those numbers.
So getting some more backers for the next week, we should hit the Mortis well before the last few days.
And can you believe school started this week and I am already getting calls to sub? Moar money for leviathans!!!
Looks like the guys who were wanting the 15mm Leviathan have gotten their wish. I could've sworn this kickstarter was only at 60k a couple of days ago. I'm really glad to see that this line is getting the attention it deserves. I hope WGF casts the stuff well for you, their models were crap last time I bought them, but I've heard they've gotten better since then.
Also, do you have a rough idea of what the stormtroopers will cost down the road. Money is tight right now and I doubt I'll get to fund the kickstarter, but I'd like to know how much I need to save up for a squad when they hit retail...
And can you believe school started this week and I am already getting calls to sub? Moar money for leviathans!!!
I really hope school starts earlier in Quebec than it does out here in the Maritimes otherwise I have missed out on my first week!
Added a 15mm leviathan to my pledge, couldn't resist!
Unless you're in high school, I don't think so. McGill would tentatively start before Labour Day, but teachers rarely agreed to actually teach before it. Most high schools have some wiggle room for the exact day they start, but teachers have a set number of sick days, project days and family days. Dipping into that bank so early means that teacher is going to have to pace himself big time in order to reach June on something else than life-support. But hey, personally, that means rent for October is already paid, I need 3 more days and I can afford more Dreamforge stuff. Since I don't have to pay for it until October 16th, I'll get my Mortis without feeling the squeeze. I might even pledge for those 15mm ones too.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Question for Mark: Have you considered how you are going to sell these at a later date? I know we've talked about FLGS (I know I will definitely be pushing for them to contact Mark) but have you thought about web sales?
I was just looking at the wargames factory webstore and felt a bit unimpressed with it. I just hope that if your products are integrated through their store, your section will look a bit snazier.
MrMoustaffa wrote: Looks like the guys who were wanting the 15mm Leviathan have gotten their wish. I could've sworn this kickstarter was only at 60k a couple of days ago. I'm really glad to see that this line is getting the attention it deserves. I hope WGF casts the stuff well for you, their models were crap last time I bought them, but I've heard they've gotten better since then.
Also, do you have a rough idea of what the stormtroopers will cost down the road. Money is tight right now and I doubt I'll get to fund the kickstarter, but I'd like to know how much I need to save up for a squad when they hit retail...
Hi Moustaffa, gawd that a hard question to nail down, it depends on how successful or not the Kickstarte is... If am left carrying a lot of debt then I need to price them a bit higher into the supply chain (as they get 50% off) but I also need to be mindful of my customers. Soooo I just don’t know exactly where they will land. Will they be more expensive than the kickstarter? Yes, by a lot? I don’t know yet ...I understand the whole cash issue. I have been watching my pannies for months now.
Here is what you get. 20 Stormtroopers 12 leg poses, 4 weapon options (5 if you count the SAW drum mag) 3 poses for each of those weapons arms. A FREE accessory pack that has 15 heads, enough arms to give them all rifles or make them all SAW gunners, enough arms to trick out tons of poses, enough packs and detail parts to add plenty of "bling" and three Mechanical mules for hauling gear.... All for $39 for 1 or $69 for 2
A pretty good deal with the free shipping and free accessory packs. but still pricy if your counting pennies...
Mark-
I need to get some sleep... my spelling is gak right now
Still watching this with great interest. Dreadbowl doesn't seem to be adding anything that makes me want to up my pledge, I'm over RK, and it's confusing as hell as well now.
After I get paid, I'll sort out bills, finish paying Sedition Wars, may pay for Reaper stuff if their pledge manager is out yet, then decide how much if any I can afford here. I like the infantry, but they're far from needed and shouldn't be much more down the line. That accessory sprue is going to have to go into the box at some stage as well, or it may as well ave not been tooled. I like the heavy weapons, but the odd choice of "one of each" stops me buying them at all here. Again, down the road from a discounter with free shipping.
I've got 2 15mm unassembled resin Leviathans still from the final batch. I'd like to get 2 of the latest batch, and 2 each of the 28mm Leviathan and Mortis, but I'm fairly sure my wallet won't stretch anywhere near that far. I'll see what's left after the above bills and such. I wanted to buy a few other gaming things (WFRP3 and Talisman with all expansions, but we'll see what happens, I can decide during the week. Pouring all my money into this may be "good value", but I'm kinda tired of paying now for things that will ship in March. Nothing personal to Mark, of course.
RiTides wrote: Infantry and 28mm Crusader will ship in November, though
Yeah, I didn't say I'm not interested. I already have a small, non-specific pledge in there that I'll change once I can check my money and (hopefully) the Mortis becomes available. International shipping is also a confusing nightmare that I can't be bothered with dealing with right now, and one I'm only likely to be bothered doing once - at the end of the campaign, so that'll be when I decide what to do.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
CrashCanuck wrote: The shipping dates are all ok by me, so long as it's all here for next august for the next Apocalypticon
I'm not specifically bitching about this one, but between this, Sedition Wars, Mantic, Reaper and Avatars of War, it's a lot of cash paid upfront for stuff that's a long way away. This (and DreadBowl) will likely be my last "long-term" Kickstarters until all of the above have made good on their side.
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(I.e. Command or APC) I'm being patient here... really 
