Sweet update here:

http://www.kickstarter.com/projects/dreamforge-games/something-wicked-this-way-comes-crusader-plastic-m/posts

He really is listening to feedback, which is awesome! And will be gearing the final stretch goals based on them. Command for troopers is a shoe-in for a stretch soon after 100k, apparently... but then it is up in the air. APC will cost more to tool so would have to come later.

Personally, I think other than trooper command he should do 15mm weapon arms... and possibly a 15mm Mortis, to round out both of those offerings (28mm, 15mm, and troopers).

 NoseGoblin wrote:

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Mark, I have been having ideas to expand the Shadokesh fluff like crazy. Please let me in on it!!!

Absolutely!

I had an idea for the Shadokesh as well, if you don't mind me bringing it up here. By their fluff they seem rather advanced, although uncaring to the world around them.. Another thing I noticed in the general background is the energy that is released when the "veil" is damaged too much. What if Shadokesh Leviathans could tap into that energy and release it in small-scale bursts? Basically a self-centered blast that would damage anything within a certain radius. Of course their own Leviathans would be sheilded (unless that sheilding is damaged). Although, something tells me a sheild-damaged Shadowkesh Leviathan would not be opposed to possibly hurting themselves to unleash an attack on enemies surrounding it.

I'm waiting to see where the heavy infantry get slotted in. Those guys would make an awesome terminator-style unit.

Less than 1K from sweet HEL cannon goodness!

Mark has to give significant thanks to the fact that I didn't keep up to date on the Reaper and Sedition Wars KS, otherwise I'd have pledged to get that "Calamity" crew in a heartbeat... and for that beautiful Cthulhu fig from Reaper.

Speaking of which, how geeky is a forum that the auto-correct doesn't even flinch at words like Cthulhu?

If I had known... some of my monies would be there and not available for this one, which would be a crying shame.

So far I am the only one interested in the extra arms in my gaming group, so I hope that the dust settles, everyone gets their leviathan, we paint'em up, get used to playing with them and then BOOM! something new gets thrown in. HEL cannon baby!

Mark: I'll get finished up with my exam real quick, and then I can start giving you fluff... in October, say, to let all this craziness go by.

You can get Cthulu from reaper....

just email them with the address you want to use

http://www.reapermini.com/ks/

you'll get a link to the pledge manager when it goes live (it will cost more, $150 for Vampire level, and the options are 20% more, but if you want him........ tempt......

Glad to see others interested in the Shadokesh. Im quite excited about the feral and handler mini. Really Im very interested in the whole universe. Im loving the models and concepts, the fluff has lots of potential. Whether I get into the game itself is still far to early to say, but hes definitely got a customer here for the models and books.

Im also going to be altering my pledge. I may go for some 15mm action. The 28mm guys are doing good, and Ill be able to buy one (or more) outright later in the year, so Id say its time to boost the love for the little guys.

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
You can get Cthulu from reaper....

just email them with the address you want to use

http://www.reapermini.com/ks/

you'll get a link to the pledge manager when it goes live (it will cost more, $150 for Vampire level, and the options are 20% more, but if you want him........ tempt......

Tempt me not! If I can get Cthulhu at a later date, then I would rather pledge what I have available on this endeavour instead. The Dark God waited for aeons, he can wait a few more months. Plus I already have a little statuette on my desk... whispering... paint more minis... faster... wet palette... stop drybrushing...

Hey is the fluff/whatever dev forums only available after the KS is done?

Also when this order calculator is on, are we being held to what we put in? because my theoretical needs keep shifting around with these new rewards

Yeah, I think he should keep the forums until after the KS, because he needs to sleep, from time to time.

I also think you're going to have to keep on top of your money yourself. The calculator is on, by the way. It seems to work fine, it's really just an excel spreadsheet that you download, so it doesn't "hold you" to anything. Unless you have a weird relationship with your computer.

Whatever else.... 75.000!!!!!

Since there are not sooo many painted Eisenkern Troopers around, I thought it might be appreciated to see one more:

Its from the nice metal multipart troopers set. I will use them as weird war Germans.

Size comparison below:

Stunning paintwork Agis. I plan on using mine as Weird War 2 German droptroopers also. Although they will be in a modified ambush pattern camo

Looking at the shadow on the two figs on the left, I assume there is a kind of spacer under their bases, so they would be a tad shorter than the GK?

I think they have spacers to bring their bases up to a uniform height. That way each is measured from the same bottom level.

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Looking at the shadow on the two figs on the left, I assume there is a kind of spacer under their bases, so they would be a tad shorter than the GK?

The new ones will be


This is the most upright leg set that creates the highest profile... Most legs will make them slightly shorter.

The change for the metal minis:
Thicker legs
1mm shorter miniature height
Thinner base to get the total height = to 28mm on the table
Every arm re-done
Arm position and neck re worked to get rid of hyperextension in the neck design.
Backpack removed as a separate item
Improvement of the helmet details to make them more visible and easily painted.
The plastic won’t look out of place with the metal, but I have tried to refining the overall proportions and balance to improve the design.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

AAN wrote:
Since there are not sooo many painted Eisenkern Troopers around, I thought it might be appreciated to see one more:

Its from the nice metal multipart troopers set. I will use them as weird war Germans.

Size comparison below:

Those look great! I love to see the painted minis!

Whoo hoo - HEL cannon unlocked! 15K more to the Mortis!

Yes, and for such a small amount, it should have the same effect as blood in the water. Come on sharks... bite.

Thanks again, Mark, for the graphic. It was good, indeed, to see a painted one, but if you say the proportions are a bit better, it'll be even greater.

I might, just might, have found somewhere to get female heads. If I can sort that out in the next few weeks, I might be upping my pledge to get my male/female force from DFG instead of DG...

AAN- Wow, that trooper looks really good!

Bring on the Mortis!

Really thrilled to see how well this is going for Mark, and thinking about expanding my own pledge now...

Padre^.

Just made a pledge for the $300 option for Leviathans! So excited about this kickstarter!

@Nuwisha: tsk, tsk, tsk. I think you forgot to add the banner!

Welcome aboard, glad to see Mark still generates excitement!

Mark,

I know you are tapped out in funds, so I'm not going to ask that you make them, but I do have a question about future releases. I know you stated you want to focus on the Shadokesh next, and they look cool. However, about a year ago you mentioned that you purchased the rights to a line of light mechs for use with the Republic. Has anything ever come of that? Did that end up falling through, or do you eventually plan on making those models (obviously not for years to come). On the same note, any plans on re-releasing the old Black Widow walking tank?

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Looking at the shadow on the two figs on the left, I assume there is a kind of spacer under their bases, so they would be a tad shorter than the GK?

Exactly I evend out the different base height for better comparison.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

ski2060 wrote:
Stunning paintwork Agis. I plan on using mine as Weird War 2 German droptroopers also. Although they will be in a modified ambush pattern camo

LOL, I am planning to use the Kriegsmarine minis (have 20+ in metal around here somewhere) as Fallschirmjaeger in Splintercamo.
The backpacks look kinda "Vrill-powered gravchutes" to me.

Excellent work AAN.

I appreciate any wip of marks models as I think they help other people to see what they are going to get. And that is some really awesome models with great design and a little thing GW has never heard of....proportions.

ski2060 wrote:
Stunning paintwork Agis. I plan on using mine as Weird War 2 German droptroopers also. Although they will be in a modified ambush pattern camo

LOL, I am planning to use the Kriegsmarine minis (have 20+ in metal around here somewhere) as Fallschirmjaeger in Splintercamo.
The backpacks look kinda "Vrill-powered gravchutes" to me.

Hah! I'm doing the same thing almost. I have 25 Kriegsmarine to use as my Droptroopers for SotR49. They will make up the base of my platoon with some Bolt action Fallshirmjager as my scout/sniper elements
I borrowed the idea of using the 1/35 Ma.k models for light mecha after seeing yours, and to bring this back on topic my resin 15mm Crusader is going to be the Large Mecha for that force. I think it will look damn cool in an ambush pattern camo.

Slow day due to Labor Day in US. Hopefully international pledgers can keep it moving!

If APCs get added, I'll re-up for 7 or so plus command squad if offered as he said he intends to.

I think 15mm weapons could give a boost, too.

Only German themed SciFi troopers tempting me to buy.
And nice paintjob as usual, Agis!

 RiTides wrote:


I think 15mm weapons could give a boost, too.

Id also like to put in a vote for doing the 15mm weapons sooner than later. People are going to be clamoring for options pretty quick. Speaking as someone who works in injection molding, Im very sure that all the gun options could fit on one mold, same for the CC options. Id consider doing that before the APC...and thats saying something since Ive been quite excited for the APC.

Maybe there will be a way to get the 15mm weapon options all added to the sprue? then it shouldn't cost anything extra to make em

I think they'd have to be their own sprue...

Sadly that would still entail substantial extra machining costs

but I'm sure mark will do what he can

Almost halfway to the ripper!

Sadly that would still entail substantial extra machining costs

but I'm sure mark will do what he can

I'm waffling so hard...

 Vitruvian XVII wrote:
Almost halfway to the ripper!

Over halfway now

Lots of see sawing in this one. Wish people would just stay in.

I know! But the cost on shipping has thrown people around (and the lack of answers about the $100k level arms is not helping me).

I don't want 4 to 8 vulcans!!!

 Makaleth wrote:
I know! But the cost on shipping has thrown people around (and the lack of answers about the $100k level arms is not helping me).

I don't want 4 to 8 vulcans!!!

Can I have yours?

On a serious note, I'm sure Mark is working things out right now - he's been remarkably organised for a "one-man-band" to date.

Padre^.

Remember the extra arm moulds need to be paid for too,

If everybody just swaps the 'free' vulcan for an arm of thier choice without pledging more they don't get paid for

so my suspicion is Mark won't be able to aford to allow swaping. Remember the titan alone will cost 100K to pay for, all the other cool stuff he's adding he's having to borrow to pay for, the amount he has to borrow will fall as the KS goes up, but still...

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Remember the titan alone will cost 100K to pay for, all the other cool stuff he's adding he's having to borrow to pay for, the amount he has to borrow will fall as the KS goes up, but still...

QFT. This is something that people really should remember. This is not CMON or Reaper who are essentially running preorders, this is a true case of "no funding no product".

If we hit 80K by the end of today, I'll be happy as then we'll only be 10K from the Mortis and another boost. C'mon 2K on Labor Day!!

I think his sending out the survey will also give a boost.

He posted this in the comments yesterday:

Mark Mondragon wrote:Plugging away on some renders and modeling over the next week. I will be checking in, but not as often :(
One man band makes it difficult to handle everything... and adding all of those weapon arms introduced a task that was not anticipated.

So, that does explain his lack of presence... now we just need a few more backers to put this over the top!

To me, this is such a fantastic Kickstarter to support, much moreso than Relic Knights... I have a feeling that this will rock it's final week when that one is over. Help the little guys, folks!! But even if you don't feel that way, these models are SO much bigger than Relic Knights, which are tiny in-person... I feel like folks don't realize what a fantastic value this KS is due to how huge these models are.

I had to reduce my pledge slightly, but my birthday is later this week and depending on if/how much the parents send my way I may be able to put it back up, maybe even higher than before.

What I would really like is a 28mm Crusader with Nova Cannon and Mauler claw, and a 15mm Crusader...

I'm a little put off by the constant changes. I realize Mark wants this to be a success and wants everyone involved but I'm a bit confused now with all that's gone on and now having to download and fill out a shipping estimator....

I know he's a one-man operation but I just can't help the feeling that a bit more thought should have gone into the planning of this kickstarter. It could be my perception because the only other kickstarter I backed was Mantic's Kings of War and they did a really good job of exciting the backers into spending more money and drawing in more backers.

Don't get me wrong, I think Mark's got a great idea and some mad skills with the 3d modelling software but the campaign could have been better planned and much clearer. It might be something as simple as cleaning up the page to make things clearer. I'm looking forward to receiving my leviathan but won't be chipping in any more than I've already put up.

agnosto- You don't need to download the shipping calculator. It's just +$7.00 for US folks if you want your Wave 1 and Wave 2 models shipped separately.

He's definitely made a lot of changes, but personally I think it's great that he's listening to feedback and adjusting accordingly.

Looking forward to the post 100K stretch goals when we get there just have to push a bit further!

First off, good on you for supporting the project at all. You're taking a risk on someone else's dream and that's praiseworthy regardless. The following is just a presenting another viewpoint, not a belittling of your position.

 agnosto wrote:
I'm a little put off by the constant changes. I realize Mark wants this to be a success and wants everyone involved but I'm a bit confused now with all that's gone on and now having to download and fill out a shipping estimator....

As said, you're US so it's $7 if you want anything from the stretch goals past 60k. Or, you can hold it for those other goals to come in and pay nothing for shipping but have to wait until March-ish. The shipping calculator is really for those people who have to navigate the hell of international shipping, which is complicated by A) these kits being big, B) international shipping being expensive and C) Dreamforge not being a company that can just absorb those costs.

 agnosto wrote:
I know he's a one-man operation but I just can't help the feeling that a bit more thought should have gone into the planning of this kickstarter. It could be my perception because the only other kickstarter I backed was Mantic's Kings of War and they did a really good job of exciting the backers into spending more money and drawing in more backers.

Therein lies the rub. Mantic is an established company with a known customers base and a known amount of demand since the game was first launched in 2009. Their KickStarter was essentially marketing hype and so they could plan around that fact and they did it well. It'd be no different than GW launching a KickStarter for the 6th Edition of Warhammer 40k (except we know that GW would never do something so radical and untested as to let their customers know what product is coming). Most of the other big KickStarters with scads of rewards are coming from similarly established names in their industries and that's good, but remember that they already have some brand-identity to cash in on (see also outside of miniatures: DoubleFine Adventure, Wasteland, OGRE, Penny Arcade).

In contrast, this is a true "off the ground" effort. There is no data about what people want, because they've never had the opportunity to buy this product line before. That leaves Mark in the unenviable position of trying to figure out what his customers want now, and what they would prefer to see later. This adjustment to reality from what he might have wanted to do results in the changes to the line-up and shipping. However, it is important to note that save the staged shipping possibly adding $7 to your cost, every other change has been to the benefit of the customer (someone please correct that if I missed something).

As I said earlier in the thread, there's a key difference between being unorganized and having flexibility. Dealing with something that truly is brand-new calls for more flexibility than something like Mantic or Reaper or CMON. Mark had his plan laid out, but knew that he needed to adjust to what customers wanted. Hence why we have more arm options for the Crusaders (a customer request) instead of the planned entry for Assault and Heavy Troopers.

EDIT: Almost forgot...I agree whole-heartedly that the information presented on the KickStarter page could use some cleanup. Way too much to scroll through to get to some of the important information (like the calculator which is nearly at the bottom). While I'm sure some of that is KickStarter's site and format, it'd be nice if it was re-organized a bit.

@RiTides,
Thanks for pointing that out; I went back through the page and got the gist of what you stated.

@Krinsath,
Oh, I understand completely the difference here between Dream Forge and Mantic. I saw Mark doing this and have seen him around Dakka for some time now; he seems a stand up guy so I doubt there's any risk on my part other than my wife getting mad at me for dropping more money on "nerd stuff" after just dropping some serious coin on Mantic's kickstarter.

There are some small things that I could recommend to Mike as he pursues this dream (hopefully it kicks off so well that he can turn it into a full-time gig if it isn't already).

1) Don't listen to the customers too much. There's probably a fine line beyond which you've compromised yourself to the point of becoming a doorstep for the customers; I've seen first-hand how the idiom "The customer is always right." can go horribly wrong. Don't let us become petty tyrants. :-)

2) For the love of all that is holy, please run a spellchecker and proofread what you write before posting updates. Yeah, that's picky but I've been in education for too long I guess...sorry.

3) Look at the layout of your kickstarter page and compare it to the slick pages run by other organizations; you might be able to take something away, organizationally speaking, that will make it easier to navigate/read which may result in more backers.

I think Mark partnering up with Wargames Factory was brilliant as, barring any shipping/manufacturing snafus like they dealt with a year or so ago, he has instant access to industry affordable manufacturing capabilities.

I'm excited for Mark and I'll be excited to get my leviathon.

Cheers.

Yeah, Mark's spelling and grammar rankle with me too at times so I think you're right about the education business making us sensitive. Being the son of an English teacher (which sounds quite a bit like an insult) doesn't help either.

However, if we want to compare my written English to Mark's and then throw in our ability to create and design models then I'm pretty sure I get my ass kicked and quite badly. We each have our strengths and I can overlook a few typos for such quality models. Your point is a good one though; presentation counts a great deal for customers dealing with the unknown.

My current issue with the kickstarter is that I have too many expensive as hell hobbies. I'll know where exactly I can donate by the end of this week.

 KalashnikovMarine wrote:
My current issue with the kickstarter is that I have too many expensive as hell hobbies. I'll know where exactly I can donate by the end of this week.

Mine is too much going at the same time, as well as limited finances. Relic Knights kickstarter (wife insists, no complaints, cool minis and loading on the freebies), the Dreamforge kickstarter, which I want to support as much as possible, then the need for something that will be sent to me now, I need a fix in the short term. Im still waiting on the Blackwater Gulch kickstarter stuff to get shipped, Relic Knights wont be until at least May, and Dreamforge will be Oct/Nov if I can swing a 28mm, arch if I have to stay with the 15mm guys. So Im trying to squeeze in a Stormwall too...

He said he'll try to post command squad renders by day's end.

Pledge calculator spreadsheet turned out to be more useful then I expected. Think I finally have my pledge sorted out...till I end more..

Yeah; Mark has a nasty habit of making me want to spend more money. These rumors of a command set are disturbing...

Cue "just when I think I'm out..." impressions.

 Mad4Minis wrote:

 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:
Remember the titan alone will cost 100K to pay for, all the other cool stuff he's adding he's having to borrow to pay for, the amount he has to borrow will fall as the KS goes up, but still...

QFT. This is something that people really should remember. This is not CMON or Reaper who are essentially running preorders, this is a true case of "no funding no product".

Sorry, but this just isn't true.
At this point ($100k) all of the arm designs are already in. They are already being paid for. This means the extra cost is not that of the extra moulds, but that of the extra arms to produce.
The question is whether he can produce different arms (which can be done as he has to produce all of them now as they would all be unlocked). He should be able to produce extra arms.

The reason that I mention this is that a free arm of any type would get more people in on this Kickstarter.
Which in the long term is better for the amortisation of the rest of the kits.

Remember, a free arm will be had regardless... different arms shouldn't increase cost at all (as there will be a survey to figure this out anyway).

 Makaleth wrote:
At this point ($100k) all of the arm designs are already in. They are already being paid for. This means the extra cost is not that of the extra moulds, but that of the extra arms to produce.
The question is whether he can produce different arms (which can be done as he has to produce all of them now as they would all be unlocked). He should be able to produce extra arms.

The reason that I mention this is that a free arm of any type would get more people in on this Kickstarter.
Which in the long term is better for the amortisation of the rest of the kits.

Remember, a free arm will be had regardless... different arms shouldn't increase cost at all (as there will be a survey to figure this out anyway).

While hopefully Mark will provide the definitive answer, it's worth mentioning that the free arm might be a deal that's already been worked out with WGF in advance. It's been heavily implied throughout that a lot of this is done via their support. If that is the case, then all costs may not be equal, and it might not be an option (similar to how you can't change the default options).

I'm hoping that we'd get a choice of arm, because while I wouldn't use that option I think you're right about it being a good enticement. However, I can also see circumstances where they just can't do it. Time will tell I suppose.

Video someone posted of metal troopers painted up:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Or2XiXrSKKs

Hi Guys,
The extra left Vulkan , will have to stay a left Vulkan. I went over this with WGF and Wai Kee and we cannot change this option.

The mold draft angles for the other weapons added later have not been done yet as all of these were unanticipated adds. Messing with the 100K free arm is not possible because it causes major issues with the shipping date and additional delivery fees. We had scheduled the Vulkan to go out at the same time as the Crusader, they have already preformed the pre-production steps needed for the mold cuts and we have used all the available production slots.

Well, I say sweet. Because that means that we won't have to wait for our leviathans, not titans, until the holidays.

I think agnosto said it best that it is a very fine line between the customer always being right and DFG doing business as it wants to.

I think Mark mentioned ADHD, which is a learning disability, and, from my limited experience with kids having it, does lead to some typos, grammar and syntax errors. I think we can all be understanding in this, and he focuses on bringing us models covered in awesome sauce, rather than poifect engrish.

Thanks for the confirmation Mark.
Will work out which arms I need now

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
I think Mark mentioned ADHD, which is a learning disability, and, from my limited experience with kids having it, does lead to some typos, grammar and syntax errors. I think we can all be understanding in this, and he focuses on bringing us models covered in awesome sauce, rather than poifect engrish.

I agree with the sentiment completely; it's just when trying to drum up business first impressions count. Those of us who are already on the hook, as it were, are important, but if he's trying to snag those next backers then every little bit helps. Is it really important in the grand scheme? Of course not, but smaller things have turned away customers.

Thanks for the information on the arms! Even if it's what I thought, it's good to have that final confirmation and reasoning.

True, but he did mention a technical writer, for the rulebook. Someone much better than me, at any rate.

I hate to say it but I pulled my pledge.

I'm not looking to collect an imperial guard army right now and the game seems way focused on Giant Titans. I don't like titans in 40k and that seems to be 90% maybe if Mark does a new kickstarter for more troop types and stuff I'll bite but right now I'll bank my pledge.

Not helping I know, I just don't see enough love for player who use troops only.

blah, i want to toss in on this, but.....i have to get new tires first

He's going to post the render of the command squad today. That's love for us troopers-only pledgers

Under $700 to go until we hit the next stretch!

To be honest, there is about as much trooper as titan in this.

the regular troopers and then the heavy weapons are a lot.
And then the accessory pack as well.

Now the command squad.

Still think the titan is the money maker... but happy to be proven VERY wrong and this to go gang busters

C'mon heavy infantry!!!!!!!

I agree, even I would get some of the heavy infantry (and I really only want the titans )

Rest of the goals are up now.

Oh gak, 15mm mortis and weapons. Ima be so broke.

Interesting.

$105 - Command Squad
$110 - 15mm Mortis (SWEET!!)
$115 - 15mm weapons.

No idea how he is going to do all the 15mm weapons. Also appears that they cannot be left and right for all of them... but that could just be a speed typo

 Makaleth wrote:
Interesting.

$105 - Command Squad
$110 - 15mm Mortis (SWEET!!)
$115 - 15mm weapons.

No idea how he is going to do all the 15mm weapons. Also appears that they cannot be left and right for all of them... but that could just be a speed typo

It does seem like a lot of new kits for such small stretches, i hope hes not over extending.

Depending on the price points for these will determine 2 big and 1 small or 1 big and 2 small.

And arms

I'm thinking he had to put all 28mm arm sprues onto the same mould, and then could only afford it if enough money was raised, and thus was ported rather easily to 15mm.

I could be completely wrong (ah! There's a thought!)

A 15mm Mortis. A 15MM MORTIS!!!! How could I not know I needed that all my life. These would make wonderful daemon engines for... other games.

Just noticed that on the 15mm weapons it shows that only the bottom 2 need notification of L or R. Which would mean the others make both, though he hasnt said that outright.

Uggh just totaled up what i would want in my head, its depressing to say the least

Need to know what that extra 15mm stuff will cost! :S

Yes, indeed. I think I will need to sub a lot more. Hopefully I will get a contract soon.

How could I make sure female teachers get pregnant? Oh wait...

15mm Mortis?

I'm in.

Pair of Crusaders, one Mortis. That's my Knight Squadron.

[EDIT]: Heavy Troopers are up! I’m totally in now! But... weren’t there some close combat weapon options for the heavy troopers?

Anyway, just put up the prices for those Heavy Troopers (and any 15mm arms) and we’re in business!

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
How could I make sure female teachers get pregnant? Oh wait...

If you ever figure this out I'm sure you'll have a number of volunteers to help...

In other news, this just in from my credit card:

Yes, I have to become creative as well with my credit card statement. I hope I can pay off most of it before the end of the month, otherwise... intense discussion, which I would deserve.

Trying to buy any kind of property, so keeping our debt down is a must for the next few years.

Speaking of volunteers, I think that happened in Louisiana or something, many years ago? Inspired an Adam Sandler movie.

Oh. My. God.........

Those stretches are fantastic. I am definitely in for command and the heavy troopers with support weapons.

If he makes the close combat heavy troopers... I will have to seriously, seriously consider them as well (wondering if they might be a $125K stretch? He may still be updating the page as he hasn't actually made an official "update" yet).

Yowsah!!! Will wait for him to officially update the page this evening and then likely pre-emptively up my pledge tonight or tomorrow morning.

HEAVY TROOPERS @$120K

Totally in for 10 of them,
sweet!!!

$130k Heavy Assault troops!

I have no use for them, but I know a ton of you guys do. Gahhh... so many nice new things. I'll be upping my pledge as soon as I can nail down more funds.

I won't be able to get near as much stuff as I want to, but I'll definitely be getting one of each 28mm Leviathan and some extra weapons.

I'm hoping for some sort of electro-hammer, or electro-whip or power-hammer sort of arrangement for the close combat ones. Those'd be perfect.

Just power swords I believe. No other power weapons :(

I like the heavy assault troopers, interesting...

Ooh, those look good. I did put down for a box of eisenkern and a set of support weapons, mainly to learn the game. The faction just isn't quite my bag. If the Commonwealth as a Tommy look, though, that KS would bleed me dry.

Let's assume this is successful enough for Mark to stay alive and eventually get a check in the mail, maybe even make this a full-time gig.

Would successive Kickstarter campaigns for the other factions be a model that you think could be sustainable in the long run? If this one is relatively successful, it could allow the company to come up with a good offering for a diverse gaming experience (and sticking it up to the man in the process... I guess?)

Hes mentioned in the past (on DFG forums IIRC) that he needs to hire a proofreader when the game rules start to get finalized. Guy cant do everything himself. I think for a one man show he does pretty good.

 Mad4Minis wrote:
I think for a one man show he does pretty good.

That's what she said.

But seriously, the stuff I send him will probably be just as awful. Since I am on the fence in both languages, I tend to use French forms in English and vice versa. Now that I'm learning Japanese... it's not too bad but the simplicity of the form is very seductive. Just incredibly blunt when used in French.

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:

 Mad4Minis wrote:
I think for a one man show he does pretty good.

That's what she said.

But seriously, the stuff I send him will probably be just as awful. Since I am on the fence in both languages, I tend to use French forms in English and vice versa. Now that I'm learning Japanese... it's not too bad but the simplicity of the form is very seductive. Just incredibly blunt when used in French.

I don't mind proofreading. I'm not a professional technical writer, but I do work for free.

My major concern with this KS now is "what's Mark going to do next?" His previews make my wallet whimper.

Wow

Just upped my pledge pre-emptively as I'm going to sell some items to add these new stretches when they get hit. And I put us over $80K so that stretch goal is gone! Only $10K to go till full-scale Mortis


Mark, do you think you could edit the title of this thread to something like this (I checked and it fits):

DreamForge-Games: We are going plastic! Kickstarter w/ Weapon Option and Heavy Trooper stretch goals

I don't think folks who aren't clicking on the thread have any idea of the amazing additions you've done here!

 Krinsath wrote:


My major concern with this KS now is "what's Mark going to do next?" His previews make my wallet whimper.

Its a very good thing I dont have any credit cards, or he would have me in deep. Id end up being in the "one of everything please" category.

I have found my Inquisitorial Warrior Acolytes and my Grey Knight Space Marine count-as models for my Adeptus Mechanicus army.

Praise be to the Omnissiah

10k till Mortis!

This is interesting. I just downloaded the excel spreadhseet and "All your base" shipping with nothing else added at all comes to $39 rather than the original $30 listed in the kickstarter. I know that Mark is trying to sort out the shipping with 4 million stretch goals, but it annoys me that the shipping has gone up by 25% on one of the simple initial pledge levels with nothing else added.

From the spreadsheet it also looks like you have to pledge for the Mortis variant separately, and can't split an "All your base" between the two variations.

I'll probably give the whole thing a miss at this rate and just buy a couple discounted at retail when I get the urge.

I would assume that the 'All your base" would allow you to chop and change between the 2... but that's not confirmed.

Will be VERY annoyed if that is not the case.

 scipio.au wrote:
This is interesting. I just downloaded the excel spreadhseet and "All your base" shipping with nothing else added at all comes to $39 rather than the original $30 listed in the kickstarter. I know that Mark is trying to sort out the shipping with 4 million stretch goals, but it annoys me that the shipping has gone up by 25% on one of the simple initial pledge levels with nothing else added.

From the spreadsheet it also looks like you have to pledge for the Mortis variant separately, and can't split an "All your base" between the two variations.

I'll probably give the whole thing a miss at this rate and just buy a couple discounted at retail when I get the urge.

That is true. Some of the multi-box deals have gone up in shipping (All Your Base was up at $55,- at one point, before Mark put it back down again).

Then again, there's some errors to be expected along the way I think. In the end, that is what Kickstarter is... a crowd-funding place for start-ups and entrepreneurs, not a pre-order platform for businesses running smooth as can be.

It's part of the charm I believe and that alone is (to me) well worth an extra 9 or 10 US$ shipping.

It's ultimately no huge deal. I'm very tight on cash right now, and I'll lose nothing by being more conservative with my spending on this sort of thing, and simply buying the final product when it's eventually available from a retailer if I'm still interested by that stage. - Or I can wait and see what happens with the 15mm kits and Mortis.

Ultimately, as cool as these kits are, they aren't something I need, (I have 2 unassembled 15mm kits in the shelf a foot away from me right now) and so I'm just going to cool my jets and remove the Fry.jpg mentality. Things like the nightmare of shipping (and multi-stage shipping) just make it easier to do so.

With the exception of truly small scale Kickstarters like the Stonehaven Dwarfs, Bruno's Goblins, etc ($30-50 price range kinda thing). I think I'm done with Kickstarters for awhile after I decide what to do with this one, RK and DeathBowl. I don't need to be continually sending off hundreds of dollars for the promise of something cool sometime next year, and it's probably not too smart to continue to do so. Lots of stuff actually available now, after all...

 Zweischneid wrote:
It's part of the charm...

It's really not. Even done unintentionally, if someone pledged for the All Your Base in the opening days, they shouldn't have to worry about coming back a month later to find their money's gone but the starter wants more to fulfil their promise. CMON reneging on their twice confirmed price for a particular addon option rubbed people the wrong way, and anyone less clueless than them about customer service should want to avoid a similar problem.

 AlexHolker wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:
It's part of the charm...

It's really not. Even done unintentionally, if someone pledged for the All Your Base in the opening days, they shouldn't have to worry about coming back a month later to find their money's gone but the starter wants more to fulfil their promise. CMON reneging on their twice confirmed price for a particular addon option rubbed people the wrong way, and anyone less clueless than them about customer service should want to avoid a similar problem.

What did CMON do? PM me if it'll take this thread too far off-topic. Or post in the appropriate thread and point me there.

You also have a good point about the All Your Base above. I didn't think of that.

 AlexHolker wrote:

 Zweischneid wrote:
It's part of the charm...

It's really not. Even done unintentionally, if someone pledged for the All Your Base in the opening days, they shouldn't have to worry about coming back a month later to find their money's gone but the starter wants more to fulfil their promise. CMON reneging on their twice confirmed price for a particular addon option rubbed people the wrong way, and anyone less clueless than them about customer service should want to avoid a similar problem.

There is no "price". Any and all Kickstarters are funding. You throw money in it to support a project you like.

Whether or not an organizer includes "treats" and "giveaways" to their backers is entirely optional and ultimately contingent on their good-will. There is no sales-contract.

There is no pre-order. If you throw 1000 dollars on Kickstarter at Reaper Bones or CMON and they ultimately decide to just take the money and go on vacation, than that is your tough luck. They wont do that, because it'll hurt their reputation, sure, but if you are on Kickstarter "expecting" a certain customer right to your "purchases", you better read the Kickstarter-terms again carefully.

Again, it's not a sales contract. There is no guarantee in any Kickstarter project that they deliver or that they deliver what was promised. It's funding, not purchase.

Well, except that you know as well as I do that pretty much everything that comes along here is more of a pre-order than anything else, Dreamforge included. You're technically correct on the T&C aspect, but that's not how it's being used, so we're better off dropping the pretense of "supporting a project" when we know that the context is in fact pre-orders.

All the more reason to wait until retail on projects that we find borderline for any reason, when you think about it.

 Zweischneid wrote:
There is no "price". Any and all Kickstarters are funding. You throw money in it to support a project you like.

Whether or not an organizer includes "treats" and "giveaways" to their backers is entirely optional and ultimately contingent on their good-will. There is no sales-contract.

There is no pre-order. If you throw 1000 dollars on Kickstarter at Reaper Bones or CMON and they ultimately decide to just take the money and go on vacation, than that is your tough luck. They wont do that, because it'll hurt their reputation, sure, but if you are on Kickstarter "expecting" a certain customer right to your "purchases", you better read the Kickstarter-terms again carefully.

Again, it's not a sales contract. There is no guarantee in any Kickstarter project that they deliver or that they deliver what was promised. It's funding, not purchase.

While we won't know for sure until it comes up, this is not an argument that I would expect to stand up in a court of law. Like EULAs and C&D's, its power lies in convincing plebes that they have no rights and not actually removing their rights.

@Scipio: Cliffs notes version is that two items were reduced in price by $5 for the preliminary survey, and when asked CMON said that one was a mistake. When they put the CKPM up, both were back to full price.

On DFG: I'd still like to see pictures to decide how well the APC would fit in outside of the Eisenkern.

The $140k stretch looks really interesting!

A heavy armoured trooper box set much like the stormtrooper one? Sweet.

 AlexHolker wrote:

@Scipio: Cliffs notes version is that two items were reduced in price by $5 for the preliminary survey, and when asked CMON said that one was a mistake. When they put the CKPM up, both were back to full price.

Oh, the THX suits or whatever they're called. Gotcha.

Ripper saw goal achieved.

I like the look of the core heavy troopers much more than the support weapon ones, hopefully we reach that stretch!

 Vitruvian XVII wrote:
The $140k stretch looks really interesting!

A heavy armoured trooper box set much like the stormtrooper one? Sweet.

Definitely!

scipio- Mark confirmed in the comments on the Kickstarter page that when the Mortis unlocks you be able to mix and match Mortis and Crusaers in the multi-Leviathan pledges. It will ship later, though (or you can have everything held to ship in March to pay only one shipping charge). It's going to be the exact same price as the Crusader.

Those heavy troopers are sexy

I really hope that Mark succeeds in this one because Im very interested to see the other factions come to light. I really do like those heavy troopers just found my new storm troopers. Those small crusaders will be count as pre her-dreads for me will be increasing my pledge my wife is going to kill me.

what I can't figure out is what the 15mm weapons will cost. what am I missing here?

Mark hasn't posted prices yet for those.

Ah, okay then. guess I'll have to wait a little longer before upping my pledge

I'm kind of torn on posting prices for stretch goals in advance. On one hand its nice to know what those things are going to cost...but what happens if you increase your pledge to include stretch goals...but they dont get unlocked. It would then fall to you to ensure you reduce your pledge before its all over. Could make for some messy customer service issues

So when mortis is unlocked, will we be able to just say we want that instead of the crusader? or will we have to switch to a different pledge level?

 ironicsilence wrote:
I'm kind of torn on posting prices for stretch goals in advance. On one hand its nice to know what those things are going to cost...but what happens if you increase your pledge to include stretch goals...but they dont get unlocked. It would then fall to you to ensure you reduce your pledge before its all over. Could make for some messy customer service issues

...which would be your fault for pledging early but not checking in ~12H before the project ends. as long as that much is clear... if he'd just throw out an indication in the comments, or on some forum or whatnot only the more, let's say active, backers would get that info anyway so no harm done.

Bolognesus wrote:

 ironicsilence wrote:
I'm kind of torn on posting prices for stretch goals in advance. On one hand its nice to know what those things are going to cost...but what happens if you increase your pledge to include stretch goals...but they dont get unlocked. It would then fall to you to ensure you reduce your pledge before its all over. Could make for some messy customer service issues

...which would be your fault for pledging early but not checking in ~12H before the project ends. as long as that much is clear... if he'd just throw out an indication in the comments, or on some forum or whatnot only the more, let's say active, backers would get that info anyway so no harm done.

Well based on my past experience in retail and customer service....even when its 100% the customers fault....the customer will ALWAYS lose there mind and blame the provider. Granted in this instance the customer wouldnt have a leg to stand on but in the court of public opinion in would only take 1 or 2 loud users to smear dream forge

Someone once said A lie can travel halfway around the world while the truth is still putting on its shoes

 scipio.au wrote:
I'll probably give the whole thing a miss at this rate and just buy a couple discounted at retail when I get the urge.

That's the spirit.

Kids, the next time something doesn't go 100% to plan, especially when it's something that might not be in the total control of the guy running the event, just abandon everything and don't purchase it. Also make sure to tell everyone that you're not buying anything - as everyone is just dying to know how much you're not going to buy something over a minor detail like shipping - and give those toys a hefty big throw out of your pram while you're at it!

 scipio.au wrote:
This is interesting. I just downloaded the excel spreadhseet and "All your base" shipping with nothing else added at all comes to $39 rather than the original $30 listed in the kickstarter. I know that Mark is trying to sort out the shipping with 4 million stretch goals, but it annoys me that the shipping has gone up by 25% on one of the simple initial pledge levels with nothing else added.

From the spreadsheet it also looks like you have to pledge for the Mortis variant separately, and can't split an "All your base" between the two variations.

I'll probably give the whole thing a miss at this rate and just buy a couple discounted at retail when I get the urge.

Actual shipping cost USPS priority mail $51.97 you are being charged $39.00 (you save about $12.00 off actual costs). I dont know what ells to say about that....

Mixing and matching Mortis and Crusader is allowed. Pledge for two to four Leviathans and mix to year hearts content.

Arg...it's becoming insupportable...I'm really fighting to not considerably up my pledge... These troops are sooo nice...but I aready have a truckload of unnassembled models and 5 times as much models waiting for a paintjob...I'm really struggling to justify buying these awesome models.
Gotta hold on a couple more days...I don't think it will be possible...

 Von Skyfury wrote:
Arg...it's becoming insupportable...I'm really fighting to not considerably up my pledge... These troops are sooo nice...but I aready have a truckload of unnassembled models and 5 times as much models waiting for a paintjob...I'm really struggling to justify buying these awesome models.
Gotta hold on a couple more days...I don't think it will be possible...

best way to deal with your problem is to replace them with sexy models that will be a joy to paint! Also consider pledging for some sexy stuff that will ship to you in a few months (depending on what you get) you can use that as motivation to get stuff done since you will have more stuff on the way

 ironicsilence wrote:

 Von Skyfury wrote:
Arg...it's becoming insupportable...I'm really fighting to not considerably up my pledge... These troops are sooo nice...but I aready have a truckload of unnassembled models and 5 times as much models waiting for a paintjob...I'm really struggling to justify buying these awesome models.
Gotta hold on a couple more days...I don't think it will be possible...

best way to deal with your problem is to replace them with sexy models that will be a joy to paint! Also consider pledging for some sexy stuff that will ship to you in a few months (depending on what you get) you can use that as motivation to get stuff done since you will have more stuff on the way

I currently have enough models to last a couple years =P
And I've already got models from 2-3 other kickstarters coming in soon or not so soon =P

That's not helping me !

 Von Skyfury wrote:

 ironicsilence wrote:

 Von Skyfury wrote:
Arg...it's becoming insupportable...I'm really fighting to not considerably up my pledge... These troops are sooo nice...but I aready have a truckload of unnassembled models and 5 times as much models waiting for a paintjob...I'm really struggling to justify buying these awesome models.
Gotta hold on a couple more days...I don't think it will be possible...

best way to deal with your problem is to replace them with sexy models that will be a joy to paint! Also consider pledging for some sexy stuff that will ship to you in a few months (depending on what you get) you can use that as motivation to get stuff done since you will have more stuff on the way

I currently have enough models to last a couple years =P
And I've already got models from 2-3 other kickstarters coming in soon or not so soon =P

That's not helping me !

Get them now...save a few bucks...get them before all your friends can get them...be the envy of your entire gaming group....DO IT!

 ironicsilence wrote:

 Von Skyfury wrote:

 ironicsilence wrote:

 Von Skyfury wrote:
Arg...it's becoming insupportable...I'm really fighting to not considerably up my pledge... These troops are sooo nice...but I aready have a truckload of unnassembled models and 5 times as much models waiting for a paintjob...I'm really struggling to justify buying these awesome models.
Gotta hold on a couple more days...I don't think it will be possible...

best way to deal with your problem is to replace them with sexy models that will be a joy to paint! Also consider pledging for some sexy stuff that will ship to you in a few months (depending on what you get) you can use that as motivation to get stuff done since you will have more stuff on the way

I currently have enough models to last a couple years =P
And I've already got models from 2-3 other kickstarters coming in soon or not so soon =P

That's not helping me !

Get them now...save a few bucks...get them before all your friends can get them...be the envy of your entire gaming group....DO IT!

Yeah that's a bit of a problem... I'm the only one around that actively wants to play =P I played a couple times with some friends but they are not that interested =(

But yeah...ok...you got me =P

@Von Skyfury: PM me if you want a game. I don't have massive availability, being on call and all, but I can definitely try to provide you with a fix.

As long as you don't ask me to get into the West Island. I don't have a car.

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
@Von Skyfury: PM me if you want a game. I don't have massive availability, being on call and all, but I can definitely try to provide you with a fix.

As long as you don't ask me to get into the West Island. I don't have a car.

Sounds good to me !

From what you wrote earlier, I think you are around Mont Royal right ? Let's continue this conversation to PM =)

Now now...Any size comparaison Heavy Infantry vs Standard floating around ?

I think the Heavy guys have never seen the light of day so far, so this would be a first ever.

Looking at it, if he were to add an APC and a MBT, the Eisenkern faction would be well-rounded starter. We could get cracking on other factions, then...

 Von Skyfury wrote:

I currently have enough models to last a couple years =P

Ive never let a backlog of unassembled/unpainted minis stop me from getting more.

 Mad4Minis wrote:

 Von Skyfury wrote:

I currently have enough models to last a couple years =P

Ive never let a backlog of unassembled/unpainted minis stop me from getting more.

Neither do I, otherwise I wouldn't have such a truckload =P
And it would have stopped me from upping my pledge

Go go awesome minis ! Hopefully they will blend with my Infinity stuff =)

Warning picture heavy

Here are the new stretch goals www.dreamforge-games.com/kickstart/

I'm very interested in those heavies. Hopefully they will be priced well less than say, a box of GW Terminators.

The heavies should be size equivalent to normal power armored Marines, not termies, though.

Alright, I've decided. If my bid doesn't go through on this Kar 98 package I'm trying to pick up for WW2 Reenacting then I'll be grabbing a pair of these bad boys, and a deuce of HEL and Nova Cannons.

You don't need guns for reenacting. Just get an eye patch and a briefcase and you can be Tom Cruise.

woot, tire replacement was less expensive then i'd expected, might be able to jump in on this for a crusader after all

That's the spirit boys!

It looks like we will hit the Mortis by the end of the week, so I will be adding one of these to my pledge tonight.

March is going to be pretty sweet. Spring break, just in time to receive awesome goodies from DFG. I actually feel totally at ease waiting for these.

Mark, if you have the time, am I right in assuming that the March date is somewhat soft, but that potential stocks for retailers for those kits would be available around the same time?

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
That's the spirit boys!

It looks like we will hit the Mortis by the end of the week, so I will be adding one of these to my pledge tonight.

March is going to be pretty sweet. Spring break, just in time to receive awesome goodies from DFG. I actually feel totally at ease waiting for these.

Mark, if you have the time, am I right in assuming that the March date is somewhat soft, but that potential stocks for retailers for those kits would be available around the same time?

Hey Mathieu, I imagine it will be April or May before they hit the supply chain? Although WGF is quite used to shipping direct, we are creating a bit of a mess with all these orders hitting at the same time. They will need some time to let the dust settle, but that's just a guess.

Good to know. In time for summer and all that spare time students have.

So are these Heavy Troopers coming in a box of 20... or boxes of 5 sparated by weapon type (heavy weapon, close combat weapons, etc.)? Or is it both (boxes of 5 now, 20 later)?

Getting really hard to resist those stormtroopers. Good thing I literally have no money at the moment

Which really sucks, because I want to make some sisters of battle, and I think these stormtroopers would be perfect. They're sculpted really well for more "normal" proportions, which means they'll look "feminine" compared to GW minis. What's really killing me is that $40 would be enough for me to buy all the scrubs I would need for the sisters squads, and all I would need to buy later would be some APC's and the HQ's.

If only I had $40...

Also, what time would we expect to see the stormtroopers roughly after the kickstarter is over? Both the ones mailed to us and later on when they hit retail?

EDIT: Nevermind it says estimated delivery november. Not too bad, that's only a couple of months away.

MrMoustaffa: check your PMs.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
So are these Heavy Troopers coming in a box of 20... or boxes of 5 sparated by weapon type (heavy weapon, close combat weapons, etc.)? Or is it both (boxes of 5 now, 20 later)?

That's a good question. Right now it looks like the earlier stretches are for the 5-man boxes (support weapons, close combat), and then the 20-man box with lots of options is the higher stretch, presumably because it will take more tooling for the extra pose options, etc.

A 20-man box of "not marines" would be pretty darn sweet! 10 would make it cheaper, but perhaps he'll be able to re-use some things from the 20-man stormtrooper accessory sprue or the like, making 20 a natural choice.

Either way, I Really hope we get there

Von Skyfury wrote:Now now...Any size comparaison Heavy Infantry vs Standard floating around ?

Unless Mark has changed the size from earlier in the year, they'll be the same height as the Stormtroopers, just bulkier (which makes sense from a realism standpoint). So if you're wanting them for 40K they're about right for artificer power armour but too small for termies unless you going to do as I plan to and run Kreigsmarines-Stormtroopers-Heavy Troopers as Scouts-Marines-Terminators. (With the appropriate magnetisations and such to convert between Space Marines and Eisenkern as much as possible. Should be do-able since if I, say, model a pile hammer on a Heavy's arm to better represent a power fist when it's a termie, it's easily ignored when it's a heavy since there's no such weapon option in the latter case. Similarly, with the Stormtroopers I only need to model the power weapons, not the chainswords, on assault marines and when they're stormtroopers it's just a bit of faction-appropriate ceremonial bling.)

NoseGoblin wrote:Actual shipping cost USPS priority mail $51.97 you are being charged $39.00 (you save about $12.00 off actual costs). I dont know what ells to say about that....

Regardless of you heavily subsidising the 28mm Leviathan and its shipping because it's your baby, people still respond badly to bait-and-switch, however reasonable.

H.B.M.C. wrote:That's the spirit.

Kids, the next time something doesn't go 100% to plan, especially when it's something that might not be in the total control of the guy running the event, just abandon everything and don't purchase it. Also make sure to tell everyone that you're not buying anything - as everyone is just dying to know how much you're not going to buy something over a minor detail like shipping - and give those toys a hefty big throw out of your pram while you're at it!

That's the spirit! I'm sure Mark isn't the least bit interesting in why someone would be choosing not to support this kickstarter!

Zweischneid wrote:Again, it's not a sales contract. There is no guarantee in any Kickstarter project that they deliver or that they deliver what was promised. It's funding, not purchase.

It damn well is a sales contract and is protected as such. Now, you may be confused by some kickstarters qualifying as donations, by clarifications that no kickstarter is an *investment* (and thus not subject to the extra protections granted investment contracts), or by the terms of service specifying that the contract is between the creator and the backer and not Kickstarter, but even if for argument's sake we throw existing law out the window and only go by what the binding Terms of Use say then, and I quote, "Project Creators are required to fulfill all rewards of their successful fundraising campaigns or refund any Backer whose reward they do not or cannot fulfill."

Krinsath wrote:I don't mind proofreading. I'm not a professional technical writer, but I do work for free.

As would I. I like pointing out flaws.

Vitruvian XVII wrote:Just noticed that on the 15mm weapons it shows that only the bottom 2 need notification of L or R. Which would mean the others make both, though he hasnt said that outright.

All the other weapons are ambidextrous. I can't understand why he didn't make the minor changes to the assault cannon necessary for it to be built with either a left or right feed belt so it could be ambidextrous as well. Or why the mauler claw doesn't come with both left and right hands - or at least palms - given that it's so much smaller than the other options.

Mathieu Raymond wrote:I'm thinking he had to put all 28mm arm sprues onto the same mould, and then could only afford it if enough money was raised, and thus was ported rather easily to 15mm.

The 28mm weapons would almost certainly be on individual sprues. If I had to guess based on the contents of the infantry sprues then the 15mm weapons would be sprued together with only a single pair of upper arms for the set.

Vitruvian XVII wrote:It does seem like a lot of new kits for such small stretches, i hope hes not over extending.

Unfortunately Mark's had to introduce stuff he'd been planning on holding back for a proper Iron Core kickstarter in the future in order to boost flagging support. Originally he said Kriegsmarines and Heavy Troopers were off the table, then they were added...but we wouldn't see them until $125k at the earliest, and now they've been adjusted down even further .

5deadly wrote:I'm not looking to collect an imperial guard army right now and the game seems way focused on Giant Titans.

Don't worry. The game itself won't be focused on the titans - indeed, you may never see one in any game you play - despite the impression this kickstarter is giving.

agnosto wrote:3) Look at the layout of your kickstarter page and compare it to the slick pages run by other organizations; you might be able to take something away, organizationally speaking, that will make it easier to navigate/read which may result in more backers.

Putting smaller pictures on the main page and linking to the updates wherein you post them in all their glory, for example.

I think Mark partnering up with Wargames Factory was brilliant as, barring any shipping/manufacturing snafus like they dealt with a year or so ago, he has instant access to industry affordable manufacturing capabilities.

Meanwhile, at WGF, Wai Kee Hui is quietly sitting back with a glass of cognac, a cigar, the latest Defiance images and a smug look on his face.



Good lord, and I haven't even replied to the earlier attacks yet. Imma need sum coffee.

Nice pic, Construct!

Just a note, I have a bunch of the claws for the 15mm resin ones, and while they are smaller than the vulcan cannon for instance, they're a lot more intricate. Every finger came as a separate piece, and I imagine that there would be even more separate parts for the full-size 28mm ones. From what I have, I think the cheapest part would actually be the sword arm, so it's cool that he's giving a 2nd sword option for free

Whelp F it. I was looking at getting a new firearm or TV in the next month or so but I suppose that gets to be postponed.

Now I stand up to
1 Leviathan Crusader
1 20 man stormtrooper box
1-4 15mm Leviathan Crusaders
1 Nova Cannon

and when (or god forbid "if") they make their stretchgoals
1-3 15mm Ripper Saws
1 15mm Nova cannon
1 5 man Heavy armor assault troopers squad
1 20 man Valkir squad

Days like this make me wish I hadn't left the army.

by the way not sure if it's been addressed yet but what kind of delay are we expecting between the soft dates when the items get to WGF warehouses and when they'll be available for retail online. Kinda wanna know if I just wanna wait and pay retail for my 15mm stuff.

Also what kind of price hike are we estimating between kickstarter and retail sales.

Mark has said he won't know what the retail pricing on stuff will be until after the KS when he can see how much debt his company is carrying

remember distributors will want a 40%+ discount when buying to sell on so I wouldn't be suprised to see a $150+ for the basic leviathans

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 scipio.au wrote:
I'll probably give the whole thing a miss at this rate and just buy a couple discounted at retail when I get the urge.

That's the spirit.
Kids, the next time something doesn't go 100% to plan, especially when it's something that might not be in the total control of the guy running the event, just abandon everything and don't purchase it. Also make sure to tell everyone that you're not buying anything - as everyone is just dying to know how much you're not going to buy something over a minor detail like shipping - and give those toys a hefty big throw out of your pram while you're at it!

You're right. Only positive cheerleading comments are allowed. Disappointment is not allowed, only the pledging and payment of large amounts of money. It's completely unreasonable for someone to decide not to pledge hundreds of their dollars based on something like a change in shipping, and even more unreasonable to express that disappointment or intent to not purchase something. if you change your mind about buying something, just do it quietly because if you don't, fanbois might try to bully or belittle you over the internet. Always be positive and happy. Just like HBMC in every thread involving Games Workshop and Citadel miniatures. Always positive, never snide, always constructive. A force to emulate!




Automatically Appended Next Post:

 NoseGoblin wrote:

Actual shipping cost USPS priority mail $51.97 you are being charged $39.00 (you save about $12.00 off actual costs). I dont know what ells to say about that....
Mixing and matching Mortis and Crusader is allowed. Pledge for two to four Leviathans and mix to year hearts content.

Thanks for the confirmation and explanation Mark. Much appreciated.

kind of put off by the "Lump everything in one campaign" approach, the fact he saw the need to put up a spreadsheet so people could calculate exactly how much they'd end up paying with all the stretch goals and multi-deals and different shipping costs kind of says it all about the oppressive complexity of the scheme. there's a reason most projects are for a single game or a single model, not an entire business.

That said, we're almost at 90k, and £60 for a Mortis, shipped is still a good deal...

Charax wrote:
kind of put off by the "Lump everything in one campaign" approach, the fact he saw the need to put up a spreadsheet so people could calculate exactly how much they'd end up paying with all the stretch goals and multi-deals and different shipping costs kind of says it all about the oppressive complexity of the scheme. there's a reason most projects are for a single game or a single model, not an entire business.

I won't say it's not complex, but it is only one faction for one game.

 AlexHolker wrote:

I won't say it's not complex, but it is only one faction for one game.

True...and how much of Dreamforge's output is not this one faction for one game?

That's why they need a Kickstarter

Halfway to the claw (ideal to replace the Crusader sword with, imo). And then 28mm Mauler

Someone just backed in the few minutes it took me to turn off my phone and turn on my PC

Charax wrote:
kind of put off by the "Lump everything in one campaign" approach, the fact he saw the need to put up a spreadsheet so people could calculate exactly how much they'd end up paying with all the stretch goals and multi-deals and different shipping costs kind of says it all about the oppressive complexity of the scheme. there's a reason most projects are for a single game or a single model, not an entire business.

That said, we're almost at 90k, and £60 for a Mortis, shipped is still a good deal...

Pretty sure at first this kickstarter was just for the crusaders, Mark didnt start throwing in the kitchen sink till people asked for it. I dont know the first thing about running a business or a kickstarter so cant really comment on if I think things would have turned out better if Mark did something like a kickstarter for the walkers and a seperate kickstarter for the infantry but what I do know is you really cant go wrong if your listening to the people that want to buy your stuff. I personally think its pretty awesome the way Mark has given us a peak behind the curtain so to speak on his game

Yeah, as an infantry-only pledger I'm glad he included them

Yes, had he only done the crusaders I'd be in for probably a third of what he's getting at the moment. The bulk of my pledge at the moment is for infantry, though that might change at the 90k mark.

 Krinsath wrote:
Yes, had he only done the crusaders I'd be in for probably a third of what he's getting at the moment. The bulk of my pledge at the moment is for infantry, though that might change at the 90k mark.

Well, that rather presupposes that there wouldn't be a second, Infantry-only kickstarter. That way you'd be able to get your Command Squad option at $20k of infantry-specific donations rather than 105k of infantry-and-everything-else donations. I know a lot of people are only interested in/buying Infantry, that's why different projects make sense - infantry get funded faster, have stretch goals at lower price points and you don't have to wait for the "big stuff" to get funded before the "little stuff" gets a shot.

There's no chance the structure will change now, just pointing out there's a lot of logic and advantages behind multiple, focused kickstarters Vs one big "Fund our whole range of stuff" project

Alright I'm going ahead and pledging for the $39 20 man deal. I don't know if I can fund it 100% yet, but I'm pretty sure i can pinch pennies and make it happen. At the very least, it bumps it up and gets more people interested in pledging. I'll only withdraw if it's an emergency.

I'd really like to see this succeed. This looks like it's going to be a great company down the line and if he can get some momentum going, I hope we'll see more great things from him. I may not be using his minis for his game at the moment, but I'll always have the option to down the road if it ever gets popular around here! :thumbsup!:

Best of luck man, thanks for the awesome minis!

The new page is much better. But still lacks the picture of a certain apc we are all looking forward to.

And he opened up all arm options!

I'm extremely pleased with this kickstarter. Really looking forward to getting my hands on this stuff

Quick thoughts on new layout

1) He should be plugging the free delivery in the USA at the top of the page.

2) He should put the scale/painted videos/pictures back up.

Anyone care to inform him?

 Lurker wrote:
Quick thoughts on new layout

1) He should be plugging the free delivery in the USA at the top of the page.

2) He should put the scale/painted videos/pictures back up.

Anyone care to inform him?

He checks this thread regularly, he'll probably see this by tomorrow.

I do think the new layout is easier to navigate/understand.

Did anyone notice that you will now be able to buy additional Shadokesh Handler + Feral at $4 a set, up to 5 total with the free set?

Gonna get me some of those to paint up and ready for an eventual Shadokesh faction.

ski2060 wrote:
Did anyone notice that you will now be able to buy additional Shadokesh Handler + Feral at $4 a set, up to 5 total with the free set?

Gonna get me some of those to paint up and ready for an eventual Shadokesh faction.

Whoa, I did Not notice that. Sweet!

Comments on the KS mentioned the 15mm arms will be $10 bucks...me likely me likely alot

$10? That sounds good.

Now we need the final price on the Heavy Trooper boxes.

Broke 85K. Upped my pledge to get that sweet sweet Mauler arm.

Come on 90K! I need a Mortis too!

Hi everyone!

Just a summary of some changes today.

The front page was becoming a scroll fest.
I have begun consolidating items by group, the only true change to the project was getting rid of the stretch goals for the rest of the 28mm weapons, and they can all be added now! No more waiting for these to open up as we reach toward $100k!

I have also transferred the information to a separate page on my blog; you can now click the image for a more detailed look (I still need to clean a few of the images up to reflect the new availability of all the 28mm Leviathan weapons).

I folded the 15mm Mortis and all 15mm scale weapons into the $110k stretch goal.

Shadokesh Feral and Handler may now be added (to a maximum of 5 per backer) for $4.00 per set.


Let me know if you see anything that needs tweaking.

All the best!
Mark-

Wish we could get just the Mortis head as an upgrade part. I love the death's head look but I like the heavily armored crusader.

pledged this evening. send in the mechs, baby!

 NoseGoblin wrote:

[...]
Shadokesh Feral and Handler may now be added (to a maximum of 5 per backer) for $4.00 per set.
[...]

Thus my pledge had 20 USD added! THANKS Mark!

 ironicsilence wrote:
I'm extremely pleased with this kickstarter. Really looking forward to getting my hands on this stuff

Definitely!!!

URGENT! Could someone who has pledged and can thus comment on the kickstarter page please tell Mark that he's messed up the graphic for the 15mm arms and the Heavy Support Troopers. He's put the $11 etc pricing for the arms under the troopers by mistake.

I really want to buy into this, but have never done a kickstarter before, so I'll definately have to take another peak at the KS page again, the extra ferals and handlers have increased the money I will spend, but I need to know when the money will be taken?

I get paid the day before it ends, but I only have internet access through work, and therefore I cannot wait until the very last moment, but I do need to wait until after I have been paid to ensure I have the money to cover it.

 Conrad Turner wrote:
I really want to buy into this, but have never done a kickstarter before, so I'll definately have to take another peak at the KS page again, the extra ferals and handlers have increased the money I will spend, but I need to know when the money will be taken?

I get paid the day before it ends, but I only have internet access through work, and therefore I cannot wait until the very last moment, but I do need to wait until after I have been paid to ensure I have the money to cover it.

Money is taken the day it ends.

Good. Thanks KM. That means I can pledge early and not have the money taken out until I have enough to cover it.

By the way, can anyone contact the guy running this and let him know that the calculator is not adding the extra Shadokesh he says you can now get. I presume that will be stage 1 stuff, as they were supposed to be free with and pledge of $20 or more.

 Sikil wrote:

 NoseGoblin wrote:

[...]
Shadokesh Feral and Handler may now be added (to a maximum of 5 per backer) for $4.00 per set.
[...]

Thus my pledge had 20 USD added! THANKS Mark!

For some reason, I had thought it was "maximum 5 total" (counting the free one), but the wording does make it sound like you can add 5. Anyway, I added 4 last night and can always adjust it later

Wow, prices on the heavy troopers seem really good!

For the boxes of 5 (assault and support heavy troopers):
$11 for 1, $19 for 2, $25 for 3 boxes
+$8 for each box after 3

For the box of 20 (main line heavy troopers):
$42 for 1, $75 for 2, $99 for 3 boxes
+$32 for each box after 3

Also, for the command squad:
$30 for 1, $57 for 2, $75 for 3
+$25 for each box after 3

And 15mm arms are $10, or if you buy 4 you get the 4th free (so 4 for $30).

I hope those prices are good. The graphic is missing for the Heavy Troopers now.
I could see those being the KS prices. Very steep discount for helping get the line going, then going up a good deal for retail.

I mean, it is only $2.20 or so per figure with weapons.

As for the Shadokesh, I think it's 4 extras sets, 5 total. So only an additionaly $16 US for them.

The graphic shows up for me?

Mark posted pretty late last night that he was going to sleep and would check in the morning to answer any questions, but he is west coast time so... we might have a little bit of a wait

I am really stoked for those prices, though! The command squad is a little high, and I asked him if it would have any extra options or just what is pictured. But the prices on everything else- Wow!!

Compared to gee-dub, the price is still incredibly interesting. Especially with the quality of models offered. If it were great coats, I'd probably pass, but this is beautiful.

I am so torn right now, between replacing my UAMC guardsmen with Eisenkern all the way. I figured if I can get some meow meow minis female heads, these could be interesting. And available sooner... I was planning on using missile launchers as my main heavy weapon as well... so these boxes would have me covered.

We're in the single digits, boys and gals, this whirlwind will be over soon!

 RiTides wrote:
The graphic shows up for me?

Mark posted pretty late last night that he was going to sleep and would check in the morning to answer any questions, but he is west coast time so... we might have a little bit of a wait

I am really stoked for those prices, though! The command squad is a little high, and I asked him if it would have any extra options or just what is pictured. But the prices on everything else- Wow!!

I've always had problems with images on kickstarter, seems like some images only load when they want to, need to pound F5 to see everything.

 Construct wrote:
URGENT! Could someone who has pledged and can thus comment on the kickstarter page please tell Mark that he's messed up the graphic for the 15mm arms and the Heavy Support Troopers. He's put the $11 etc pricing for the arms under the troopers by mistake.

Hi Construct, that is not a mistake... Just good pricing for the Kickstarter crowd. Keep in mind that the heavy weapons and assault troopers are a box of 5.

Just for clarity on the Shadokesh 1 free 4 purchased=5 total. Not to worry the Shadokesh will be the next faction developed....

$2500 to go until Mortismageddon

I think the problem with images is because you have to have them hosted on another server and just put in the URL to the image, so the other server could be messing up or there's too much traffic between at the second you load the page or whatever.

 Necros wrote:
I think the problem with images is because you have to have them hosted on another server and just put in the URL to the image, so the other server could be messing up or there's too much traffic between at the second you load the page or whatever.

Kickstarter hosts the images... I think they need a server upgrade

Oh .. hmm.. for me I thought I had to link my own before.

But I guess that's why reaper crashed their servers

Mark is starting to get me in trouble with boss lady at this rate stop releasing so many goodies. i have to up my pledge again because I want those heavy troopers.

 NoseGoblin wrote:

the Shadokesh will be the next faction developed....

I will be really looking forward to this. Theres some serious potential for awesome stuff for the Shadokesh. They might be my "shut up and take my money" faction.

And I still want to see the APC, that and having the extra shadokesh in the calculator could well push up my pledge too. I really want them to hit the $100K mark, the twin Vulkan stretch goal looks awesome, and I would rather not have to decide between getting that as my free 4th arm and getting the mauler claw.

I plan on getting 20 troops, a 28mm leviathan, two Beowolf arms, a HEL cannon, plus whichever I go for on the free one. (Which could include another HEL cannon. Or I could get a pair and pair the mauler claws too. I'll end up getting paired arms of all of them, I just know it!)

It looks to me like the Beowolf/Grendel arms are interchangable, so a single pair means I get paired Beowolfs and paired Grendels too, so paired Vulkans would be an amazing range of smackdown! (If this is the case, maybe make sure people know about it?)

The models are so awesome, I don't care for the rules. I need those models! (I hope the rules are as good, so I have a chance at starting a gaming group around here.)

 Conrad Turner wrote:
I really want them to hit the $100K mark...

I think that won't be any problem at all.

The 120K+ stretch goals might be a challenge, but hopefully not, as the heavy troopers are tempting indeed!

Too much good stuff on this kick starter. I want it all, but can't afford it all now. I think I'll have to stick with 4 leviathans and a mess of weapon arms. Infantry will have to come later. Any chance of the next kick starter bringing back some of these deals mark?

I really want it to hit the $110k mark. I'd be in for 3 of the mini-mortis and about 8 weapons....here's hoping!

Well, turns out my laptop isn't broken!

So now the debate is more models... or a new bed.... ehh I can keep sleeping on an air mattress. Just gotta make sure my card has some wiggle room on it...

Theophony wrote:
Too much good stuff on this kick starter. I want it all, but can't afford it all now. I think I'll have to stick with 4 leviathans and a mess of weapon arms. Infantry will have to come later. Any chance of the next kick starter bringing back some of these deals mark?

I dont need infantry, and I still feel the same. I could drop a ton on just the Leviathans.

Mortis on it's way Sadly, it looks like we'll have to wait until ~March to get them, but hey - I probably won't have a hole in my painting schedule to do it until then, anyway.

Hey, wanna jump in on this but I'm a little confused.

The accessory sprue, does that come free with every box of 20 troopers, or do I buy them separately?

Thanks!


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Also, does anyone know the head sizing? I love the infantry but I'd like to use a different helmet/head, possibly from Pig Iron. Want to make sure there won't be meatball-heads (ala GW skeletons)

They are a non-heroic 28mm size. I "think" pig-iron heads would work, but I'd test fit in case.

Accessory sprues come with every $39 box of 20 troops, and you can buy extras at $10 a pop after one box of troopers.

I think they're kind of "semi-heroic" now... Enough not to look out of place in GW armies, at least.

About 2k till Mortis. When that hits... BOOM, we'll blow away the next stretch goal with that alone.

 Moopy wrote:
About 2k till Mortis. When that hits... BOOM, we'll blow away the next stretch goal with that alone.

Thats what I'm hoping but I also wonder how many people adjusted there pledge to account for getting a mortis once the pricing was posted.

Also unrelated to the above, I've completely avoided the comments section on the kickstarter, lots of nonsense and negative comments in there. So many people are "arm chair game companies" and have all the answers on how to make everything under the sun a success. Its just utter nonsense. I'm not sure how you can even compare what Mark is doing to what other companies have done. Comparing a start up company to someone like CMON or Relic or Mantic doesnt make ANY sense to me. Mark has been very upfront about just about everything through this process and has IMO more then listened to the suggestions people have made. Its crazy to me that people can view this kick starter as anything other then a success...Mark set his goal at 30k in cash raised...the kick starter is currently at a hair under 89k...my math isnt the greatest but 89k seems like slightly more then 30k

But I clearly dont know what a successful kickstarter is. Seems to me like Mark wouldnt be able to do anything right...at the start people wanted more visability into all the stretch goals and wants to see what else was possible, now people complain about seeing too much. If at the very least Mark gets to see the best part of running a for profit company...the customers are NEVER happy

Wow, that's a pretty awesome Kickstarter you've got going there, NoseGoblin! I'll have to see what spare change I can find down the back of the sofa...

Not a criticism of Mark. But there is way too much good stuff here in this ks. I would have loved to have seen leviathan only goals for this, but glad that he is making the full line cone to life. I just hope the infantry stuff will be around on the next ks with the same discounts or similar freebies. I am going the all 28mm leviathan route. I want to light them up and do a good jod on them before the infantry come out. Hopefully some big dogs on the table in friendly apocalypse games will help push the line for mark.

Glad the 15mm guys are coming out as well, I know they will look awesome in 40k as dread knights, or chaos daemon engines.

Keep up the great work mark, and stop trying to be a one man show.

If I buy the normal troops and then some heavies, is shipping still free in the US?

@bobtheinquisitor I believe you get free shipping if you have all the items held until the stage three heavies are ready to ship. If you want the troops right away and the heavies later when they are complete then you pay $7.00 for shipping.

Also just read the fine prin and noticed that the mortis will also be getting the free capacitors and left hand Vulcan when we hit the $100k goal.

Right- 28mm Crusaders and the troops and their support weapons are stage 1 deliveries, so you wouldn't have to pay any extra shipping.

However, if you want alternate weapons, a Mortis, heavy infantry, etc... these are stage 2 or 3 deliveries. It's $7.00 more for each stage if you want things shipped separately.

Personally, as an all-infantry pledger, the items I'm interested in are Stage 1 (November) and Stage 3 (May) with nothing from Stage 2 (March).

The Kickstarter-only Shadokesh handler and monster model are a Stage 1 delivery, right?

I think you guys are banking too much this reaching the stretch goal to include the Heavies. I for one would love to see this get that high since the heavies are primarily what I want, but with a little over 9 days to go and the last few days have been very slow, I wouldn't count on it.

Sorry to be a downer, but someone needed to point out the reality of it.

Who knows, someone prove me wrong.

$7 is pretty steep for one $11 box... Any idea what the heavies will retail for?

I don't think Mark has set retail prices yet, but imo the heavy troopers are the best deals of the bunch. If you only want one box of 5, maybe you can go together with someone else on it?

kaiohx- Good point, but if you pledged for heavy infantry, you could always reduce it later if the goal wasn't hit- it isn't taken until the campaign ends. Although, I am pledged for all light infantry

@kiaohx if you check the kicktraq on the ks page its still guestimating $127,945 even with these last few days.I am holding upping my pledge a lot......so I know morty is definitely unlocked, and easily more. I just can't up it yet as I am waiting on final contract approval on our house sale. Got an offer with it being up for only one day. As soon as that goes through then I'm in like Flynn.

As for the heavy troopers I think the last few days will be the tell all. Once we get to mini morty and the 15mm arms I think things will be off the hook.

Man I sound old.

I'm betting it'll top 120k in the end. The last couple days are always the biggest.

This is not your grandfathers Hanomag

This model is a WIP, read a bit about my design processes on my blog (link below)

http://dreamforge-games.blogspot.com/2012/09/this-is-not-your-grandfathers-hanomag.html

That's no moon!

Big and very nice - I love it!

Wow...
How much will they cost ?
Just tell me and I'm taking a couple of these right now
Take my money !!!

Is that a fire extinguisher in the troop compartment? If so that's the type of detail that makes this wicked cool.

Will be buying one just to paint up as rodimus prime.

Any chance of getting a scale shot of that next to a leviathan? I can now see a mortis holding a wrecked one of those as a shield as it advances to use its sickle. Heck, my mortis pilot would probably pick up a perfectly fine apc just for fun while advancing.

and suddenly my wallet feels lighter

this is likely very interesting for you APC crazy folks..
http://dreamforge-games.blogspot.com/2012/09/this-is-not-your-grandfathers-hanomag.html

Holy crap thats amazingly cool.

For those genestealer cultists out there it would make an epic limo too.

From the extra pics I was wondering how many troopers fit inside, it looks small, but not gw small like a certain apc that should hold ten models the same size as these troopers.

Is there some sort of consolidated price chart for all the various options? Something like:

Crusade Leviathan – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Weapon Arms – $X each.
Trooper Boxes – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Command Squad – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
15mm Crusader – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
15mm Crusader Arms - $X each.
Heavy Troopers – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Heavy Assault Troopers – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Shipping Costs – $X/$Y/$Z.

‘Cause that’d make life much easier, and I’d be able to tell my friend exactly how much to add to his pledge for my stuff.

The APC is awesome!

I want to built a 1:1 version...

Theophony wrote:
From the extra pics I was wondering how many troopers fit inside, it looks small, ...

Are we looking at the same APC here?!!!

It actually looks like it could carry 10 in spades, and to my eyes at least, looks very large in scale...

I've attached a side view of a M113 APC, which carries 2 crew and 11 passengers, for comparison against the side shot of Mark's APC...




Automatically Appended Next Post:

timd wrote:
The APC is awesome!

I want to built a 1:1 version...

Well, if anyone could....it'd be you! Might just have to start pestering you for those metal tank tracks again!

28mm Leviathan Crusader/Mortis:

1 = $89
2 = $165
3 = $240
4 = $300

+ $75 per extra Leviathan after 4

28mm Leviathan Weapon arms:

$25 each

Buy 3 get 1 free

20 man Stormtrooper box:

1 = $39
2 = $69
3 = $88

+ $29.33 per box after 3

(10 man box equipped with rifles = $20)

Support Weapons

1 = $33
2 = $60
3 = $79

+ $26.33 per box after 3

Command Squad:

1 = $30
2 = $57
3 = $75

+ $25 per box after 3

15mm Leviathan/Mortis:

1 = $44
2 = $79
3 = $105

+ $35 per Leviathan after 3

15mm Leviathan Weapon Arms:

$10 each

Buy 3 get 1 free

Heavy Trooper Support

1 = $11
2 = $19
3 = $25

+$8 per box after 3

Heavy Trooper Assault

1 = $11
2 = $19
3 = $25

+$8 per box after 3

Heavy Trooper Core (20 man box)

1 = $42
2 = $75
3 = $99

+$32 per box after 3


Red text are stretch goals not unlocked yet

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Is there some sort of consolidated price chart for all the various options? Something like:

Crusade Leviathan – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Weapon Arms – $X each.
Trooper Boxes – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Command Squad – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
15mm Crusader – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
15mm Crusader Arms - $X each.
Heavy Troopers – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Heavy Assault Troopers – x1 = $X, x2 = $Y, and so on.
Shipping Costs – $X/$Y/$Z.

‘Cause that’d make life much easier, and I’d be able to tell my friend exactly how much to add to his pledge for my stuff.

theres an excel spreadsheet you can download from the home page on the kickstarter that should handle what your looking for, though not sure if its been updated with ALL the prices

I did a quick breakdown just above, all the prices are from the KS page.

But yeah the spreadsheet is a helluva lot easier to use as it calculates shipping and shows you freebies. Not sure if its fully up to date though.

@padre. If you go to the link by ironic silence then you'll see some more wip pics. One shows a top down of the crew compartment, but the angle only let's you see some seats, and it looks like possibly 4 to a side.

I see what your saying with the comparison pic, but the soldiers arent wearing fully enclosed armor and the passenger compartment probably doesn't have gravity restraint harness for the troops. Overall size looks immense, but I think Marc has more reinforcements and design features incorporated into his plan than our military ho went to the lowest bidder.

HBMC, here's a cheat sheet based on one from the Kickstarter comments although you probably will need to download the calculator to figure out shipping.

Pledge Cheat Sheet

Full-size Leviathan Crusader/Mortis
Leviathan - $89 per or - $165 (2) - $240 (3)- $300 for 4
Weapons - $25 per or - $75 for 4

4.5" Size Leviathan Crusader/Mortis
Leviathan - $44 per or - $79 (2) - $105 (3)
Weapons - $10 per or - $30 for 4

Troopers
Troopers (box of 20) - $39 per or - $69 for 2 - $88 for 3
Trooper Support Weapons (box of 9 with 3 heavy guns) - $33 per or - $60 for 2 - $79 for 3
Trooper Command (box of 10) - $30 per or - $57 for 2 - $75 for 3
Accessory Pack - $10 (1 comes free with each box of 20 Troopers)

Heavy Troopers
Heavy Assault Troopers (box of 5) - $11 per or - $19 for 2 - $25 for 3
Heavy Support Troopers (box of 5) - $11 per or - $19 for 2 - $25 for 3
Heavy Core Troopers (box of 20) - $42 per or - $75 for 2 - $99 for 3

Shadokesh
Feral with handler (2 figures) - $4 per, maximum of 5 (one comes free with any pledge of $20 or more)

Vehicles
APC - Unknown

Quantity Discount Note: Further models on top of the highest quantity discount cost the same unit price (i.e. a 5th full-size Leviathan would be $75)
Shipping Note: Stage 1 items ship free in the US. However, to have Stage 2 and Stage 3 items shipped separately, there is a $7.00 fee for each stage.

International shipping should be calculated by entering everything you want in the online calculator:
https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0AmVlbic3iCLQdERrcC10UTJQQXk4UVB2X0d2NkdjZ1E#gid=0

That is also linked to on the Kickstarter page, I'm not actually sure how to save it. I believe you're supposed to save it to your Desktop first... someone who is international and has used it help me out here

 Vitruvian XVII wrote:
I did a quick breakdown just above, all the prices are from the KS page.

But yeah the spreadsheet is a helluva lot easier to use as it calculates shipping and shows you freebies. Not sure if its fully up to date though.

yep, I win the lazy award while you get the helpful award!

 Padre wrote:

Theophony wrote:
From the extra pics I was wondering how many troopers fit inside, it looks small, ...

Are we looking at the same APC here?!!!

It actually looks like it could carry 10 in spades, and to my eyes at least, looks very large in scale...

I've attached a side view of a M113 APC, which carries 2 crew and 11 passengers, for comparison against the side shot of Mark's APC...




Automatically Appended Next Post:

timd wrote:
The APC is awesome!

I want to built a 1:1 version...

Well, if anyone could....it'd be you! Might just have to start pestering you for those metal tank tracks again!

It fits ten eight in the back and two near the side doors.... I place troops in the seats for a scale check. It's about the size of a Stryker.

do you know how to make a model that isnt awesome? I've got hands fulls of money with your name on them...please take

@theophony: we all do. Welcome to your thirties and beyond.

Mini mortis will indeed be my tipping point for an extra 100$, as well as a command squad box or two.

 ironicsilence wrote:

Also unrelated to the above, I've completely avoided the comments section on the kickstarter, lots of nonsense and negative comments in there.

Never read the comments. Never.

Man, I got ninja'ed by like 10 minutes on the cheat sheet . Hopefully it's helpful, though!

Thanks for the artwork, Mark, you tease

The APC looks good, but I think I'd want to convert mine to have a smaller reactor, like this:

Alex, wow, I Totally agree!

I like the renders, but with the long nose it makes me think too much of the car "Cruella de Vil" in 101 Dalmations... just can't get it out of my mind.

If it looked like the sketch you just showed, I would be 100% for it, though.

I hope others feel this way, too, or maybe Mark just decides the nose is a bit too long and shortens it up a tad

Thanks for the breakdown guys. That helps.

Two last questions:

1. We are 100% sure the buy 3/get 1 free offer for the arms applies to the 15mm models and not just the full scale ones?
2. The 20-man Heavy Trooper ‘Core’ box. Is that completely different to the Heavy Trooper/Heavy Assault Troopers?

First time poster here (although I've been a Dakka reader for a long time now).

I love that APC model. I would buy at least six upon release. After all, the 120+ Eisenkern stormtroopers I've pledged for need to ride in style!

Tannhauser42 wrote:
First time poster here (although I've been a Dakka reader for a long time now).

I love that APC model. I would buy at least six upon release. After all, the 120+ Eisenkern stormtroopers I've pledged for need to ride in style!

welcome aboard! Glad this kickstarter has pushed you towards registration!

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Thanks for the breakdown guys. That helps.

Two last questions:

1. We are 100% sure the buy 3/get 1 free offer for the arms applies to the 15mm models and not just the full scale ones?
2. The 20-man Heavy Trooper ‘Core’ box. Is that completely different to the Heavy Trooper/Heavy Assault Troopers?

1. Yes, it's on the graphic and is confirmed so the 15mm weapons are a really great deal at 4 for $30, imo
2. Yes, the Assault Heavy box is just 5 models and they have a pistol and huge sword. The Support Heavy box is also just 5 models and they each have a different, really large gun.

The core Heavy Troopers box of 20 are going to have a mid-sized gun, and hopefully as many options at the lighter troopers box comes with. I.e, lots of extra parts, and the skirting possibly as a removable piece (it won't be removable on the assault or support models, and I don't think they'll come with any extra bits other than the alternate heads, and spare pistol for the assault models).

Well that just seals it. That APC is cats socks or some such silly saying.

I will be pledging closer to the end of the deadline.

What do you guys think? Do I take a chance that at least a third of the heads in the "Zombie Vixens" box are undamaged enough to pass for human once painted, and use eisenkern as troops... or do I wait for Defiance to finally put out their female UAMC?

It would allow me to have zombies too... which is kinda cool.

Mathieu, I'm not really sure what you're asking!

Theophony wrote:
@padre. If you go to the link by ironic silence then you'll see some more wip pics. One shows a top down of the crew compartment, but the angle only let's you see some seats, and it looks like possibly 4 to a side.

I see what your saying with the comparison pic, but the soldiers arent wearing fully enclosed armor and the passenger compartment probably doesn't have gravity restraint harness for the troops. Overall size looks immense, but I think Marc has more reinforcements and design features incorporated into his plan than our military ho went to the lowest bidder.

Fair point! And thanks to Mark for the clarification.

Padre^.

 RiTides wrote:
Mathieu, I'm not really sure what you're asking!

The shoot-from-the-hip guy that I usually am is in a quandary:

I want a modern, equally representative fighting force of both men and women. I like the UAMC from Defiance, and they were slated to get female marines... in June.

Since I thought this was the case, I kinda sold my old catachan to a friend of mine, as well as my Shock Troops to someone else, so I am sans guardsmen right

now So I feel a bit silly, but I have my nine count-as chimera, my manticore, my two hydras, all my fliers... but only 25 UAMC marines. And I really love painting minis for some reason. I've just always been in love with the IG. So not having a case full of grunts makes me feel... naked.

So I can wait for Defiance, which will have exactly what I want (albeit I am throwing a dice on quality) Or pledge for a few more boxes of eisenkern, get a hold of some female heads (which is why I was thinking WGF zombie vixens) and make it work like that. I'd just hate to wait for Defiance until well into 2013.

If Mark is a paragon of communication and feedback response, some are not as disciplined, let's say. Or tend to be very cryptic.

Get the DFG stormtroopers.
Buy some very small rare earth magnets.

Put heads on with magnets, and then swap heads out for female versions when you find some good female heads that fit your vision.

...profit?

I thought that was genius.

I turned around and talked about it with my significant other, the real artist in the house, and it got shot down in about 10 seconds.

Her quote: "It's gonna look like men who are pretty like girls."

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
I thought that was genius.

I turned around and talked about it with my significant other, the real artist in the house, and it got shot down in about 10 seconds.

Her quote: "It's gonna look like men who are pretty like girls."

If it's any consolation, that's still an improvement over the wife who disapproves of the hobby and expenditure altogether.

I'm lucky enough to have a wife who's only complaint about my army is it isn't stompy enough and needs more boyz.

Gaaaaah I really friggin want some of this infantry. I wish we could get a comparison on the heavy troopers vs. Terminators. If the scale was right enough just one box would fill out the rest of my Death Wing in a second with only some minor additions.

Or maybe use some of the assault troops as counts as GK for an allies detachment...

Dammnit Mark! This is clearly wallet abuse! XD

So the heavy guys aren't unlocked till 120,000, but they're only $11 something for 5 guys...

How are people not funding the crap out of these guys? GW would try and charge you $40 for that box

If it hits the stretch for those guys, I may well go ahead an pledge another 11 bucks. Those are too cool to not to to be honest.

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
What do you guys think? Do I take a chance that at least a third of the heads in the "Zombie Vixens" box are undamaged enough to pass for human once painted, and use eisenkern as troops... or do I wait for Defiance to finally put out their female UAMC?

It would allow me to have zombies too... which is kinda cool.

You can always paint the damaged parts as metal for that cyborg look.

 NoseGoblin wrote:

[...]
Just for clarity on the Shadokesh 1 free 4 purchased=5 total. Not to worry the Shadokesh will be the next faction developed...
[...]

4 dollars more or less...

Shadokesh being next =





Automatically Appended Next Post:
The APC is stunning!! I don't think it will make it into this kickstarter; but why not gice it its very own one?

Stretches whould be variants of the base chassis;
- Command & Control
- Supply
- Anti-Air (quad 40mm autocannon? )
- Anti-Armour (guided missiles? )
- Artillery (MLRS? / 200mm fast-fire howitzer on a TOW? )


I'd pledge for that!!

Wow, if the smaller Mortis gets unlocked, I'm pretty much doomed to purchase some...

How much more AWESOME can one put on wheels?!

This is actually cooler than Atenicitis' vehicles IMO! And THAT'S like... PURE AWESOME!

I don't want that APC to get its own kickstarter. I want (to pledge for) one NOW, dangit!

That is seriously the best, there has been an obvously high amount of thought on scale and requirement gone into that. It knocks efforst from some other companies into the trash where they belong, and if it was released how much it would cost my planned pledge (Ah hell, I'm gonna pledge at lunchtime. This just so deserves to succeed, and I would be pledging for "I want my shinys as soon as possible" postage anyway, so adding a stage 3 pledge for that APC is just going to have be done considering I am after a set of troops and crusader from stage 1, multiple arms from stage 2, an APC in stage 3 would be icing on the cake!) may mean a restriction on the number of arms I get, but will be getting at least 4 anyway. My troops MUST have that ride!

I shiver at the thought of how many APCs I need for transport...

And a C&C one...

And a couple of supply ones...

And a AA one...

Maybe a CS or Arty one or three as well!

 RiTides wrote:
Alex, wow, I Totally agree!

I like the renders, but with the long nose it makes me think too much of the car "Cruella de Vil" in 101 Dalmations... just can't get it out of my mind.

If it looked like the sketch you just showed, I would be 100% for it, though.

I hope others feel this way, too, or maybe Mark just decides the nose is a bit too long and shortens it up a tad

Glad you like it, but unfortunately that's out of the question:

Mark on Kickstarter wrote:Honestly, no.... To make changes to the basic shape at this point, it would be faster to scrap the model and start again. The long nose is one of the trademarks of the Hanomag. A short nose makes it much more like a British vehicle. IMO

May have missed it since I just got up, but mortis is unlocked, now onto some dual smack down assault cannons.

90K is done. Plastic Mortis is in!!!

Epic!

Damn, now i need to change my banner

Seriously, if my tax isn't back by the time this is around I will scream...and you yanks will hear it from where you live.

Only 20k to go for the baby mortis and extra weapons. We might make it!

Im sure we will, hopefully, as in every other kickstarter, we'll get a big boost in the last couple of days.

Just tried to locate an old dakka thread where someone made a conversion of the mortis with the sickle mounted on the back of the fist like a can opener. He also used the brass etchings all over it for the traitor legion titans. If anybody can locate it I think it would be a great image here to help boost the totals. Sadly my search fu is weak.

Also, probably asked and answered, but if I buy more than 4 of the 28mm arms then does the price drop to the per piece price or do I need to order in groups of four?

I couldnt find it on dakka, but its here:

http://www.heresy-online.net/forums/showthread.php?t=96460&page=2

and here:

http://www.dreamforge-games.com/forum/index.php?topic=55.0

Thanks vitruvian xvii

That is exactly the beast I was thinking of. With the recent release of that other game company's cultists this could be an excellent centerpiece.

Wow it looks great with the blade mounted onto the claw! Thanks for showing the pics!

Alex- I saw, but that's OK, I can totally see the reasoning

Congrats on hitting the full-size Mortis!

I like the comment on Heresy-Online right after the pictures saying "It needs more spikes, it's too smooth."

mini-mortis... come to me baby. You know you want to.

Since this is my first KS, I was wondering, if I up my pledge, and we don't reach a stretch, what do I do with the extra money? Is it still sent to the backee and the backer just bites it?

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Since this is my first KS, I was wondering, if I up my pledge, and we don't reach a stretch, what do I do with the extra money? Is it still sent to the backee and the backer just bites it?

I believe if you pledge the money, it goes to Mark regardless. If it was for a stretch goal that's not met and Mark can't get it made through other methods, then your options are to reallocate it to something else (e.g. - more stormtroopers/weapon arms) or eat it. That's why I'm leery about pledging for the farther out stretches.

Might be wrong, but I'm reasonably confident that's the case.

 Mathieu Raymond wrote:
Since this is my first KS, I was wondering, if I up my pledge, and we don't reach a stretch, what do I do with the extra money? Is it still sent to the backee and the backer just bites it?

Pretty much, you have pledge a certain amount of money, cool for you! But if the item/reward you want isnt available/unlocked at the end of the kickstarter you obviously can't get it.

Considering you are here a lot it shouldn't be too hard to pledge for what you want and keep an eye out for when the pledge item you really want unlocks and then pledge more then.

Yep, about to pull out all my stops and add a Mortis to my pledge. I wish I could add more, but the past couple years have not been kind and medical bills suck.

At least I am in a position to pick up this much, and help out a great company with this Kickstarter.

I can't wait to get them in and put some paint on them.

ok lets get to the 15mm weapons. I can't wait to make killer mini crusaders.

You can also pledge for it now, and reduce later if we didn't hit a stretch. Works as long as you do it before campaign ends

I already pledge for the command squad. We'll make 105 easy with the end surge, and 110, too for the mini Mortis and 15mm weapons. Personally I think we'll go well beyond that, but those should be easy.

NNNOOOOOOOOO!!! They unlocked the Mortis...time to sell more blood

If we can unlock that APC, I could see me doing a whole new IG mechanized army instead of just a titan. Anyone want to buy my extra kidney? (Or should I put that in the swap shop?)

How much for the Kidney ?

And yeah, is the APC just a teaser or can it hit the kickstarter ? I'm really looking forward to these APCs !

 Sikil wrote:


How much more AWESOME can one put on wheels?!

This is actually cooler than Atenicitis' vehicles IMO! And THAT'S like... PURE AWESOME!

Agreed. Glad we finally got a look at some armor. Cant wait for some actual tanks.

I am not sure a Liver might sell better I do like the APCs defiantly a great counts as Tauros for Elysians.

Way way way too big for a counts as tauros!!

Mark has it listed on the stage 3 sheet on the spread sheet so I guess it can be obtained with enough pledges. I hope it makes it there too I have the idea an entire army of heavy troopers and apcs has transports.

And the Mortis can now be ordered. This should give it a nice push. Another 20k to the 15 mm weapons. Yes please. :-)

 Ghiest1 wrote:
I am not sure a Liver might sell better I do like the APCs defiantly a great counts as Tauros for Elysians.

I'm going to guess you're joking here and that you were paying attention in science/biology/anatomy class when they mentioned 2 kidneys and 1 liver per human...

Yeah, but you can actually re-grow part of your liver. Donate half and it will come back

 Alpharius wrote:

 Ghiest1 wrote:
I am not sure a Liver might sell better I do like the APCs defiantly a great counts as Tauros for Elysians.

I'm going to guess you're joking here and that you were paying attention in science/biology/anatomy class when they mentioned 2 kidneys and 1 liver per human...

Well, he didn't say he had to sell HIS liver ...

Please note the above post

It's been a long month, I guess people are getting a bit... extreme to pledge in more money.

Ok, bit the bullet and pledged for my max. 28mm Crusader, Mortis, 4 arms, and 4 extra sets of Shadokesh.

Wish I could do more, but will have to wait for retail or next KS.

ski2060 wrote:
Ok, bit the bullet and pledged for my max. 28mm Crusader, Mortis, 4 arms, and 4 extra sets of Shadokesh.

Wish I could do more, but will have to wait for retail or next KS.

welcome aboard!

Sweet online calculator is up. Way better than the one you had to download, even works on my windows phone

Check it out:

http://www.dreamforge-games.com/kickstartshipping/DFCalc.htm

I like the online calc too .. I totally plan to steal that idea for my next Kickstarter

 ironicsilence wrote:

ski2060 wrote:
Ok, bit the bullet and pledged for my max. 28mm Crusader, Mortis, 4 arms, and 4 extra sets of Shadokesh.

Wish I could do more, but will have to wait for retail or next KS.

welcome aboard!

Oh I've been in since day 1. I just had to make sure I had the funding and we made it to the point I wanted items from. I was waiting for that Mortis to unlock to get an extra Leviathan, and the extra Shadowkesh were too good to pass up.

I'll just have to hide the boxes from my wife when they come in.
Or get her something nice in the meantime

Sounds like a good plan, ski . And imo that's a perfect pledge

Calculator looks great, but it says I want over a $1000 worth of titans, that can't be right....oh wait....

Will 5 man heavy troopers be available for retail ?
I want some but don't wan't to wait until May to get my stuff and don't want to spend that additionnal 20$ for a couple troops.

You sure there is no way to put stage 2 and 3 together ? =P

Theophony wrote:
Calculator looks great, but it says I want over a $1000 worth of titans, that can't be right....oh wait....

im glad im not the only one having that "error"

So...how come the Mortis doesn't get the Excaliber stretch goal. Its a Leviathan isn't it?

It doesn't come with a left sword arm? No where to put the blade?

Yeah, I think the blade is on the Crusader sprue. Just like you can't buy the reaper/sickle arm separate from the Mortis.

ski2060 wrote:
It doesn't come with a left sword arm? No where to put the blade?

Yep, that is correct, the attachment points wont work for the blade and the item will likely be added to the Crusader sprue set.