Accolade wrote: Maybe I should sell all of my 40k stuff and buy a Warlord. That way when people ask if I play 40k I can nod yes and when they ask the army, I canjust say "Warlord titan"
If you field a Warlord Titan, you don't play 40K; you win 40K.
Accolade wrote: Maybe I should sell all of my 40k stuff and buy a Warlord. That way when people ask if I play 40k I can nod yes and when they ask the army, I canjust say "Warlord titan"
If you field a Warlord Titan, you don't play 40K; you win 40K.
Alpharius wrote: A Warlord Titan is going to be moving much, if at all, ever, on a 40K table, is it?
Maybe if you're playing 4' x 8' the long ways?
In my opinion the only reason to move a Reaver or Warlord is to get in to CC In my Apoc game during Game Storm I could hit the entire table and the Apoc launcher has a 30 foot range.
Honestly, meh. Yeah yeah, oooh shiny it's a Warlord, but lets be honest here 99.99% of us are never even going to see one outside of pics online, let alone actually buy one. Wake me up when FW get back to their regular schedule of models most people can actually afford and the Solar Auxilia command squad goes up for sale.
Alpharius wrote: A Warlord Titan is going to be moving much, if at all, ever, on a 40K table, is it?
Maybe if you're playing 4' x 8' the long ways?
A 4 by 8 table lengthways is the smallest table I'd want to use any of my Titans on and I would prefer playing on 4 by 12. Playing widthways is just a bloodbath and removes any tactical manoeuvring and the point of some of the longer range weapons like the Volcano cannon as the Titan can see and shoot everything on the board. Tall LOS blocking scenery is a must as well, its no fun if the game is decided by who gets first turn.
If I get my Warlord I'd field it with at least a pair of Warhounds, the Warhounds would range ahead while the Warlord would command some of the fire lanes from back of the board.
Yodhrin wrote: Honestly, meh. Yeah yeah, oooh shiny it's a Warlord, but lets be honest here 99.99% of us are never even going to see one outside of pics online, let alone actually buy one. Wake me up when FW get back to their regular schedule of models most people can actually afford and the Solar Auxilia command squad goes up for sale.
This is how I feel. If I wanted to play games large enough to include a warlord, I'd rather play epic were I don't need 4x12 table! Lol
Personally I'm excited for the fact book 5 is coming out in the next month or so. I'm super excited to see what they do for the milita and warp cult armies planned for the book.
The solar auxilia are sort of the 30k storm troopers from what I understand. The milita will be more like the 30k ig i'm looking foreword to.
Yodhrin wrote: Honestly, meh. Yeah yeah, oooh shiny it's a Warlord, but lets be honest here 99.99% of us are never even going to see one outside of pics online, let alone actually buy one. Wake me up when FW get back to their regular schedule of models most people can actually afford and the Solar Auxilia command squad goes up for sale.
That's ironic, considering your current "rank" on Dakka!
Personally, I can't wait for the Warlord. I first saw MKI "Beetlebacks" in the flesh in the late 80's, and never dreamed I'd see a production model.
Sort of related, but I sent an email to FW yesterday asking about PDF updates to some of the now-outdated lists in print and PDF form and a general question regarding whether or not we'll see Iron Warriors and Alpha Legion unique units within the next year or so, as they're currently the most lacking alongside Raven Guard for their HH lineup.
Historically, you'd get some kind of response which while vague, will respond to your question - PDFs are planned timeline still uncertain, models were the same "they're in the pipeline" sort of thing, and if releases were imminent you'd sometimes get specifics - within X months, though not often.
On both fronts, I got the generic pre-made message of "Rules questions have been sent off to FAQ team" with various faux-latin and in-universe writing, the same response I've seen other people refer to as of late, and a faux-latin "no comment" (The Emperor has decreed "Queitus Maximus) on the other front.
Granted, I wasn't really expecting precise results, but the nature of the response feels like FW is changing its customer service approach from the less personal, immediate approach they've used in the past to a more "GW Prime" say nothing, offer nothing model. Maybe has something to do with being folded into the main site?
That kind of matches my experience of ringing up FW for at least the last twelve months if not longer. Since the death of the FW facebook page they have become much tighter on new releases, you have to go to an event like the Weekender or wait for information to leak from it to get the low down on what is planned for future release.
Yodhrin wrote: Honestly, meh. Yeah yeah, oooh shiny it's a Warlord, but lets be honest here 99.99% of us are never even going to see one outside of pics online, let alone actually buy one. Wake me up when FW get back to their regular schedule of models most people can actually afford and the Solar Auxilia command squad goes up for sale.
Probably about right. Whilst I am a huge Titan fan and it'll be nice to see this produced and updated to a modern look, those of us ambitious enough to own, build and paint one will very rarely get a chance to use it. As for me, I'll stick with Epic and Adeptus Titanicus games and plan, think and put off building my FW Warhound to some point in the distant future...
My Castigator sucks now compared to the new knight w/assault cannon and available carapace upgrades; they better do something if they want to sell any more.
I sent them an email about the possibility of releasing a generic marine brass etch set (no chapter specific stuff, but using the base iconography of many of the existing sheets) last month and got nothing but an acknowledgement of receipt auto-generated email.
agnosto wrote: My Castigator sucks now compared to the new knight w/assault cannon and available carapace upgrades; they better do something if they want to sell any more.
No the Castigator still has the ability to automatically hit an invisible unit in close combat which when combined with Deflagrate can really do a number on the enemy. The castigator will also clock in at about 50pts cheaper depending on upgrades.
I myself really like the new Laser Destroyer Vindicator tank. Not for the crowded loyalists heavy slots, but for the Chaos Space marine heavy slot. I think this new tank can be more valuable in the CSM list.
agnosto wrote: My Castigator sucks now compared to the new knight w/assault cannon and available carapace upgrades; they better do something if they want to sell any more.
No the Castigator still has the ability to automatically hit an invisible unit in close combat which when combined with Deflagrate can really do a number on the enemy. The castigator will also clock in at about 50pts cheaper depending on upgrades.
That's a good point, I just never thought of it because no one that I play runs invis units. The sword is great crowd control, I was mainly thinking of the shooting. The gun and optional missile launcher. If nothing else, it'd be nice if FW offers missile launcher upgrades for their kits.
Sigh. How I wish FW would stop making command squads with terrible weapon upgrades. Give me 4x melta or 4x plasma, not grenade launchers and worthless leadership banners. I might be tempted by them if I didn't have to choose between repeating the same pose (they don't look like they'd be very easy to convert) or crippling my army rules-wise. But as-is they're nice models but way too expensive for something that's never going to leave the display shelf.
The price certainly is quite odd - Elysian and DKoK Command Squads are in the high 20s, not 65.
Now, as the only thing I actually need for a SA force is a few infantry squads, I can justify it, as I'm relying heavily on a surplus of tanks currently sitting unused, but damn if that isn't crazy.
That price is certainly...interesting. Around £12 for a "boutique" resin character model isn't particularly unusual, but it's the fact you have to buy six models at that price at the same time and the comparison to existing IG command squads they make that results in the sticker-shock.
Damnit, I really wanted the leader and the Strategos bloke, but I'm not sure if I can find a use for the others and those two will probably end up costing £60-odd quid on the aftermarket anyway now. I suppose we should have seen this coming after the £40 Veletaris Storm Section and Flamer Section.
Really don't like the paint job or the pose for Samus, neither makes it look good to me and I think if both had been done better I'd have been more interested in it.
Looky Likey wrote: Really don't like the paint job or the pose for Samus, neither makes it look good to me and I think if both had been done better I'd have been more interested in it.
Looks like he's playing cricket and bowling for the wickets. "HOWZAT!?"
Looky Likey wrote: Really don't like the paint job or the pose for Samus, neither makes it look good to me and I think if both had been done better I'd have been more interested in it.
Looks like he's playing cricket and bowling for the wickets. "HOWZAT!?"
I like his rules more than the model. T7? Jees! Better than a BT but good that he can be taken in a Deamonkin force.
The SA models are lovely but I'm not collecting them so no pain re the price for me!!
Peregrine wrote: Sigh. How I wish FW would stop making command squads with terrible weapon upgrades. Give me 4x melta or 4x plasma, not grenade launchers and worthless leadership banners. I might be tempted by them if I didn't have to choose between repeating the same pose (they don't look like they'd be very easy to convert) or crippling my army rules-wise. But as-is they're nice models but way too expensive for something that's never going to leave the display shelf.
May want to read the unit entry then, as only two models may have a special weapon and the other upgrades, such as the cohort standard and nuncio vox come as standard kit for the unit.
I would have snapped that SA Leader/Colonel in an instant if he was a show only or separate character say £12-£16 rather than this years Space Marine ones. But i'll be dammed if I'm gonna spend £65 to get it!
I had imagined Samus as something creepy, not beastly. I didn't even know he had been established as a daemon of Khorne, with all the emphasis on betrayal and paranoia it had back when the character first appeared on Horus Rising.
Samus model is awesome. I never imagined him to look beastly (or be a Deamon of Khorne), though that fact is chaos in itself Also dat command squad... looks bloody amazing.
The Auxilia command squad is unbelievable, maybe a new best for Forge World. Unfortunately, the price is just as unbelievable. About twice what I'd pay for a kit I'm not going to game with.
Samus is far less armored and female and bounty hunter-y than I was hoping for (I know, I know ).
I feel that I should point out that not all Daemons of Khorne are slavering berserk psychopaths. Some of them can be pretty scheming douche bags (whose end game is mass bloodshed).
Samus is the first daemon low war choice that can be taken (in a normal-sized army) and is great at what he does. I'll probably try him out sometime or another, as even though his ability can screw you over (although you generally throw 2+ extra warp dice into invisibility/cursed earth/iron arm/any scary psychic power to prevent dtw) it hurts stuff like GK a lot more. For 375 points he is a steal.
Snrub wrote: I don't get all the hate for Samus. Why does everyone seem to have a hate boner for the model?
It's a pretty generic demon really, with some patches of hair that seem very out of place. The skin might be just a really bad paintjob but it seems to lack detail and, while more textured than a GW plastic kit, distinctly lacking in texture. The anatomy is off in places, particularly imo the neck which seems too long and, combined with the teeth and pose makes me think more of a skaven than a demon. In fact while typing this I pointed a couple of non-GW at the unpainted image and asked them if it where skaven or a demon, one said demon the other was unsure. The side abs where also pointed out by those friends and I agree it has clearly been doing its stomach crunches wrong. I'm also not sure what the back spikes are supposed to be for but it feels like the laziest possible way of adding 'chaosyness' to a model without any actual reason beyond it being chaos. There also appears to be a chaos star brand on its back, you can see one of the points on his left shoulder, it has the play doh level of detail that ruined the alpha legion shoulder pads and night lords helmets for me.
Snrub wrote: I don't get all the hate for Samus. Why does everyone seem to have a hate boner for the model?
For a demon that was in a few HH books, I was hoping for something less generic. He possessed space marines before it was cool!
I like big models like the bloodthirster posed like they're fething up ankle sized guys, this idiot looks like he woke up late and only had time to grab a knife and two pieces of armor before running out of the house.
Snrub wrote: I don't get all the hate for Samus. Why does everyone seem to have a hate boner for the model?
The Samus from the HH novels seemed creepy, terrifying, and unstoppable. This one looks like a big, red, angry, hairless ferret.
I never got anything like this from the 'appearance' or feeling of the Samus from the novels. I didn't see it as huge, buff, nearly naked, and packing a shiv. I saw it as malevolent, relentless, and paranoia-inducing. It could be inside your best friend's body, or inside the guy you just shot. If it had been a formless demon emerging from the corpse of a marine--cool. Skinny, wingless bloodthirster--no thank you.
It also screams Trish Cardiff. If you like her stuff, great. If you don't, you won't like this one either.
Snrub wrote: I don't get all the hate for Samus. Why does everyone seem to have a hate boner for the model?
I think it's mostly just disappointment that the model isn't very impressive. It's not a terrible model, it's just not a very exciting one either. And apparently it's a character that people had hoped to see get more than just a not-terrible model.
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BrookM wrote: May want to read the unit entry then, as only two models may have a special weapon and the other upgrades, such as the cohort standard and nuncio vox come as standard kit for the unit.
Yeah, I know rules-wise it's another of FW's idiotic "variant IG command squads always suck" units, but they could have at least given a second melta gun instead of the useless grenade launcher that nobody will ever take. And giving them 4x melta or 4x plasma would make the models useful in a 40kIG army. At that price a kit really needs to be useful on the tabletop without having to buy additional conversion parts/models just to make the squad even remotely useful rules-wise.
Samus doesn't look that bad, I don't think red is a great colour for it and it is a bit too top heavy, not as bad as the Tyranid "DIMACHAERON" but getting there.
Still It'd make a really sweet skaven, add clumps of matted fur, a ratty tail to help with balance and get rid of that marine.
That command squad surely is some of the most outstanding work FW has ever done, the detail on those models is insane.
Samus on the other hand is really 'MEH'. Not a bad sculpt but it's very... bland, and that pose, sheeesh! I kind of understand the idea behind it but its still a really, really bad pose.
Had expected more from Samus than "Big Scary Monster", the character had (have!) so much more potential to make something awsome of rather than a "monster smashes all mariines! duuuuh!"-CC Beatstick.
Bland model, bad execution of rules to represent the literary character.
Ashiraya wrote: They look like ideal Rogue Trader models, in my opinion.
I was thinking the same thing. The cutlasses, sashes, gold frogging, and holstered, las-lock pistols really invoke that swashbucklers-in-space vibe. Really beautiful sculpts.
Ashiraya wrote: They look like ideal Rogue Trader models, in my opinion.
Indeed! In fact, the whole Solar Auxilia looks like a good 40k Rogue trader army!
I think what really kills me about Samus is the dog nose. It looks very very humanoid in the torso with a dog head slapped on top. Each of the individual parts looks good in its sculpting, but overall it looks like a silly kitbash of FW components.
Doesn't beat the Daemon Prince of Khorne's rear, though.
Especially amusing after seeing its front, which is entirely armoured by what turns out to be a metal apron.
Samus in Horus Rising is described as being wolf like around the face, this is about the only bone I can throw to this model.
I'd like to see more of Jubal or the other space marine he possessed present in the model. Even after he turned Loken still recognised him as Jubal, even described him as the Jubal-thing.
This guy isn't a terrible model and makes an ok alternate demon prince but I don't think it cuts the mustard as a Samus.
Ugly Green Trog wrote: Samus in Horus Rising is described as being wolf like around the face, this is about the only bone I can throw to this model.
I'd like to see more of Jubal or the other space marine he possessed present in the model. Even after he turned Loken still recognised him as Jubal, even described him as the Jubal-thing.
This guy isn't a terrible model and makes an ok alternate demon prince but I don't think it cuts the mustard as a Samus.
He shows up in Know No Fear without possessing anyone. I'm guessing this is from then as its in the Calth/Shadow Crusade stuff from FW so he's not Samus possessing Jubal, he's just Samus.
Those guns are huge, and that is definitely a Laser Destroyer for the carapace mount. Can anyone with a Reaver and a Space Marine do a quick size comparison to see if the Laser Destroyer is roughly the same size as the Reaver version?
Judging from the new Eldar and Knight codex releases, that looks like a troops choice weapon upgrade for the new Admech codex coming Summer 2016. I'm sure it'll forge some balanced narratives in 1000pt unbound 8th edition games played at that time.
Thanks Looky Likey The Laser Destroyer looks to about the same size as the Reaver one then, but with more spacing between the barrels. The arm mount cannon is just massive. I'm not sure if a Volcano cannon that size is really represented well by simply increasing the blast radius over a Reaver Volcano cannon.
Hmm.. I'm thinking, why not make a gun that shoots tactically inserts Marines at high velocities? With all their modifications, they could sit days or weeks in the clip waiting to be fired. They could even have small gun ports on the gun, so they can shoot any nearby enemies while they are waiting for deployment.
It should really just remove the models under it, no rolling on the D table, and it would leave a permanent area affect.
That is what D weapons used to do. You know, the Reaver sized ones that are the same size as the ones pictured. You should have heard all the whining. So D got the nerf bat.
It should really just remove the models under it, no rolling on the D table, and it would leave a permanent area affect.
That is what D weapons used to do. You know, the Reaver sized ones that are the same size as the ones pictured. You should have heard all the whining. So D got the nerf bat.
Oh I remember that now; I think the biggest problem I had with the old D rules was how widespread D Weapons became, and this was before every other Eldar unit got given a D Weapon.
As long as they keep it only on the truly massive models (Warlord, Phantom, etc.) that only come out once in a blue moon it could work but I would expect that power creep would happen over time and it'd be on normal models in a handful of years.
Nah. The "new D" are known as "G" weapons (for "gone", "gw" or some other g starting word. ) - they have the "old" d rules, but come with MOAR skullz and are only on imperial (not chaos) models. Cause sphezz mehreenz! The new warlord has 6 of these guns. All with custom blast templates that can be made whatever size you want because they are marine guns and don't care about other lesser armies or main rule book rules. Pssshh!
As i said earlier, it is clear that GW is adopting the bra sizing scale for their weapons after str10. Therefore, the next step up would be double DD. You just put the range before the letters though so an apocalyptic eldar starcannon (likely the next guardian standard weapon for the 8th edition codex in 2016) would be 36DD.
On an off note I am very dissapointed that they put those two Consul models as event-exclusives, I really wanted those two (especially the Alpha Legion one with the axe) but going on the FW weekender just to buy two models is kind of silly.
yes, yes.. I know about Ebay but those things got expensive quick and I am not willing to part with twice the sale price (or more).
Why oh why FW? there's a distinct lack of generic HQs and you make 2 of them event models? *cries*
Those models are not just available at the FW weekender but at all shows they attend. So Salute, Comicon, Adepticon etc.
May not be any help in Sweden but if you have a chum attending any such shows (on the FW event diary) then they could pick one up for you or FW will post one to you if they don't have stock.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Good! They finally did the Ultra helmets from the artbooks, the ones with the mostly smooth face-plates that will likely be gold when painted.
Sweet.
My thoughts exactly. Not to mention that the iconography isn't too egregious on those torsos; with a very small amount of trimming they would make some nice generic variants.
Just got the newsletter myself. The reopening of Warhammer World is next weekend, so the Titan will be unveiled then. Hopefully Tempest will also go on sale!
I'm hoping that the Invictarii are the proto vanguard and the Praetorian are the proto sternguard, we'll know when book 5 launches a week on Saturday.
I'm not so keen on the Praetorian, that looks a little over done on some of them, but the Invictarii look great. I've already done all my 30k UM company with that style head from maximini.
I'm not actually that impressed with the UM parts, some of the sculpting, especially on the torsos looks a little sloppy. Also the fact that it is sold as an upgrade set means that to build a 10-man squad costs over 80 pounds!
Peregrine wrote: And for this week's "we can't show you the titan yet" release we get some ultrasmurfs stuff! *yawn*
Well, I was a little faster ;-)
And I find that stuff way more interesting than Titans ...
More usefull at any rate. Judging by their usual prices, that thing will probably cost around 1500 GBP, fully blinged out. Who in his right mind pays that much money for two kilograms of resin?
Commander Cain wrote: I'm not actually that impressed with the UM parts, some of the sculpting, especially on the torsos looks a little sloppy. Also the fact that it is sold as an upgrade set means that to build a 10-man squad costs over 80 pounds!
That's not new though. Terror Squads and the two IF special squads are the same. The IF one is the worst because you get everything in it except legs and one arm IIRC so you have to buy a whole set just for those parts.
Commander Cain wrote: I'm not actually that impressed with the UM parts, some of the sculpting, especially on the torsos looks a little sloppy. Also the fact that it is sold as an upgrade set means that to build a 10-man squad costs over 80 pounds!
I noticed the same thing about the price and I can't figure out how they arrived at it. These UM upgrade kits that include a head and torso are more (24) than the IF Phalanx upgrade that is head, torso, shield, etc (22)...
Commander Cain wrote: I'm not actually that impressed with the UM parts, some of the sculpting, especially on the torsos looks a little sloppy. Also the fact that it is sold as an upgrade set means that to build a 10-man squad costs over 80 pounds!
I noticed the same thing about the price and I can't figure out how they arrived at it. These UM upgrade kits that include a head and torso are more (24) than the IF Phalanx upgrade that is head, torso, shield, etc (22)...
It's about the same as a head and body set from they other legions, and you get double the bodies. And the IF set is just 5 people.
I plan to buy the Warlord as it comes out, but I am fine with this UM release. I need the extra paychecks between now and when it goes up for sale. So 16th is OK with me (or even the 30th, so I could squeak in a few Cult Mechanicus models to run at the feet of their God-Engine)
Feels good when your chosen legion is up to bat. I like seeing all the Horus Heresy stuff come out, but being able to participate now is pretty cool. I'm excited for everyone whose legions have yet to be done. Your time is coming!
Dark Angels and Blood Angels will probably have the best stuff in the entire range. Space Wolves and Thousand Sons will probably be incredible too. I'm excited to see white scars get some interesting, distinguishing details besides "white marines on bikes."
If they wanted to do the eagle faceplate thing (like in the HG kit) they need the full wings on the side. This might do it with the right paint job, but I’m not seeing it.
What about those Eagles on some of the INVICTARII chests? Weren't those reserved for the emperor's children? They only have one head i guess, so it doesen't count as imperial Eagles perhaps ?
Those are supposed to be eagles on their faces? Ugh. I thought maybe it was some sort of lamellar detail or had some obscure historical reference. Like I said, maybe paint will help.
BTW, for those of you with HH armies: do you prefer upgrade kits like this? Seems like a ridiculously expensive way to to build an army. £61 for 10 men in Mark armor with heresy bolters plus £24 for the torsos. Yikes.
Zywus wrote: What about those Eagles on some of the INVICTARII chests? Weren't those reserved for the emperor's children? They only have one head i guess, so it doesen't count as imperial Eagles perhaps ?
Basically, the Paletine Aquila, the Emperors personal symbol, was reserved for the EC, but the normal Aquila was still used for veterans and stuff.
BTW, for those of you with HH armies: do you prefer upgrade kits like this? Seems like a ridiculously expensive way to to build an army. £61 for 10 men in Mark armor with heresy bolters plus £24 for the torsos. Yikes.
I prefer the chapter specific stuff, yes. Expensive? Yes. Worth it? To me, yes. I want my HH army to look sweet, so I spent the money to do it.
BTW, for those of you with HH armies: do you prefer upgrade kits like this? Seems like a ridiculously expensive way to to build an army. £61 for 10 men in Mark armor with heresy bolters plus £24 for the torsos. Yikes.
I prefer the chapter specific stuff, yes. Expensive? Yes. Worth it? To me, yes. I want my HH army to look sweet, so I spent the money to do it.
Rar!
Aye, agreed. The FW kits and upgrade sets really finish off the resin. Although I'm waiting for more Alpha Legion upgrades and, when they do come, White Scars, I will be getting some when they do arrive:
BTW, for those of you with HH armies: do you prefer upgrade kits like this? Seems like a ridiculously expensive way to to build an army. £61 for 10 men in Mark armor with heresy bolters plus £24 for the torsos. Yikes.
I prefer the chapter specific stuff, yes. Expensive? Yes. Worth it? To me, yes. I want my HH army to look sweet, so I spent the money to do it.
Rar!
Aye, agreed. The FW kits and upgrade sets really finish off the resin. Although I'm waiting for more Alpha Legion upgrades and, when they do come, White Scars, I will be getting some when they do arrive:
The difference that the FW chapter specific stuff makes, especially the shoulder pads, IMO, is HUGE. Its expensive, but when painted, it just makes each marine looks absolutely fantastic. It's extra special eye candy for everyone when they get put on the table top.
FW space marine bits and LR parts are IMO the most cost effective stuff you can get from them.
HH Ultramarines are bad ass, i really liked how they are portrayed in the books, but eventually i wanted to start a World Eaters army.... but damn Ultramarines get looked after so well, the upgrade kits are amazing! Makes me want to start a HH Ultras army
Do a lot of you have spare pre-heresy legs and arms just laying around? It just seemed a little "gougey" on FW's part. Unless the names"Invictarii" and "Praetorian" are just armor types and not special units?
the_Armyman wrote: Maybe I was misunderstood: why would you want an UPGRADE kit rather than just a SQUAD that already includes the upgrades. For example:
Do a lot of you have spare pre-heresy legs and arms just laying around? It just seemed a little "gougey" on FW's part. Unless the names"Invictarii" and "Praetorian" are just armor types and not special units?
This is my frustration; the Imperial Fists are the most egregious case; all you're lacking are the legs and one arm. Having to buy a whole other set of 30k marines is obscene for so few additional parts, and the fact they weren't sold as a whole kit is insulting.
Especially as recasters offer them as a complete unit with the missing legs and arm.
Also, the complete units looks nicer; consider the Iron Hands tacticals, the Palatine Blades and such? The cohesive aesthetic spreads across the model with their relevant wargear is so much more attractive. from a cost, look and ease standpoint.
the_Armyman wrote: Maybe I was misunderstood: why would you want an UPGRADE kit rather than just a SQUAD that already includes the upgrades.
Oh that's absolutely annoying. There is no reason the legs and arms shouldn't have been included in the Imperial Fists Templar Brethren squad. Very annoying. However, I had some tactical squad bits and Black Templar bits to finish them off.
I'm just waiting for the Wolves and 1Ksons. I guess I have time to save up plenty for them.......if other nice stuff didn't keep coming out in the meantime! The only FW stuff I own atm are 3x Sisters Exorcists (because I really didn't like the GW Organ on a Rhino! :( ) and an Avenger Strike Fighter......
SargentWhiskey wrote: HH Ultramarines are bad ass, i really liked how they are portrayed in the books, but eventually i wanted to start a World Eaters army.... but damn Ultramarines get looked after so well, the upgrade kits are amazing! Makes me want to start a HH Ultras army
I'm slowly assembling what I need for a WE army. But if I was going to collect a second 30K army, it'd probably be UM. They'd be an instant adversary for some Calth/Shadow Crusade gaming. But more importantly, I somehow grew to really like those blue bastiches after reading Know No Fear.
I find it strange that the invictarii are on the old marine bases and the praetorians are on the new 32mm bases. Probably shouldn't read too much into it, though.
Bull0 wrote: I find it strange that the invictarii are on the old marine bases and the praetorians are on the new 32mm bases. Probably shouldn't read too much into it, though.
That's because it's 30K and Girlieman hasn't codified what base to walk on yet
If they insist on selling torso upgrade kits it'd be nice if you could purchase sets of legs only. Wouldn't presume to ask for any new ones to be made, just cast up some extras of the existing ones and sell them in 5s or 10s.
Praetorian heads get a big tick and the torsos look decent enough.
sockwithaticket wrote: If they insist on selling torso upgrade kits it'd be nice if you could purchase sets of legs only. Wouldn't presume to ask for any new ones to be made, just cast up some extras of the existing ones and sell them in 5s or 10s.
Praetorian heads get a big tick and the torsos look decent enough.
Might not be to your taste, but I've seen Kromlech do some very nice iron armour-looking legs. You can get 6 pairs on ebay for about 7 quid.
sockwithaticket wrote: If they insist on selling torso upgrade kits it'd be nice if you could purchase sets of legs only. Wouldn't presume to ask for any new ones to be made, just cast up some extras of the existing ones and sell them in 5s or 10s.
Praetorian heads get a big tick and the torsos look decent enough.
Might not be to your taste, but I've seen Kromlech do some very nice iron armour-looking legs. You can get 6 pairs on ebay for about 7 quid.
They are, in fact, to my taste; I have several of the sets! Love the bionic variants in particular. That said, it'd be nice if the 'official' patterns could be sold separately to compliment the various torso upgrades.
sockwithaticket wrote: They are, in fact, to my taste; I have several of the sets! Love the bionic variants in particular. That said, it'd be nice if the 'official' patterns could be sold separately to compliment the various torso upgrades.
Totally agree. Really, they should just do the torso upgrades as squad kits with the arms, legs, shoulders, etc. It seems designed to result in leftover torsos.
They really nailed the Praetor pattern. I like that the chestplates aren't one solid piece (which seemed like it would make it hard to rotate at the waist or bend over, lol). This is one of the better kits they have done for the Legions.
The Invictiarii I could take or leave. The facehugger look straight on I am sure will be mitigated by paint. But still fairly "Meh".
Agent_Tremolo wrote: I had imagined Samus as something creepy, not beastly. I didn't even know he had been established as a daemon of Khorne, with all the emphasis on betrayal and paranoia it had back when the character first appeared on Horus Rising.
It's been a while since I read the book, but when he possessed Jubal to fight Loken didn't he take out an entire squad and almost beat Loken? Seems like a physical daemon.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Zywus wrote: What about those Eagles on some of the INVICTARII chests? Weren't those reserved for the emperor's children? They only have one head i guess, so it doesen't count as imperial Eagles perhaps ?
The Emperor's Children were the only legion that was permitted in its entirety to display the Aquila. It is possible that this honor was also granted to elite units in each legion
Agent_Tremolo wrote: I had imagined Samus as something creepy, not beastly. I didn't even know he had been established as a daemon of Khorne, with all the emphasis on betrayal and paranoia it had back when the character first appeared on Horus Rising.
It's been a while since I read the book, but when he possessed Jubal to fight Loken didn't he take out an entire squad and almost beat Loken? Seems like a physical daemon.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Zywus wrote: What about those Eagles on some of the INVICTARII chests? Weren't those reserved for the emperor's children? They only have one head i guess, so it doesen't count as imperial Eagles perhaps ?
The Emperor's Children were the only legion that was permitted in its entirety to display the Aquila. It is possible that this honor was also granted to elite units in each legion
This is (I believe) the Paletine Aquila, which was the Emperors personal symbol and only worn by the EC. The normal Aquila was still used by everyone (just not as much as in 40k).
I can't wait to see what they do with the First Legion. They're gonna look sooo cool . Plus, they'll probably be getting Corswain, Luther and (I hope) Lord Cypher as well as the Lion himself
Bull0 wrote: I find it strange that the invictarii are on the old marine bases and the praetorians are on the new 32mm bases. Probably shouldn't read too much into it, though.
As has been mentioned multiple times, the reasons that GW/FW put forward are purely that it relates to how good the models look.
I don't care at all, but for the fans of the daemon in this thread, the Forge World product page calls him "A Daemon Prince of the Ruinstorm". Is he supposed to be a Daemon Prince? I don't know anything about the character, but judging by what people have said, he's just a daemon.
Bull0 wrote: I find it strange that the invictarii are on the old marine bases and the praetorians are on the new 32mm bases. Probably shouldn't read too much into it, though.
As has been mentioned multiple times, the reasons that GW/FW put forward are purely that it relates to how good the models look.
Oh well I guess in that case I don't find it strange after all and I... should... read too much into it?
Guildsman wrote: As big as that thing is supposed to be, wouldn't those rivets be the size of, like, basketballs at full scale?
I imagine rivets have to scale up a little bit. Rivets from smaller vehicles probably wouldn't hold this thing together.
Not sure if serious....
I apologise, my original post was a bit over the top. Just got some bad news and took it out on you. Yeah I was being serious, I'm guessing I was wrong but it was just a guess, it is a huge walking Titan, God knows how thick the metal plates are, I just assumed the rivets might need to be a bit bigger than normal.
Guildsman wrote: As big as that thing is supposed to be, wouldn't those rivets be the size of, like, basketballs at full scale?
I imagine rivets have to scale up a little bit. Rivets from smaller vehicles probably wouldn't hold this thing together.
Not sure if serious....
I apologise, my original post was a bit over the top. Just got some bad news and took it out on you. Yeah I was being serious, I'm guessing I was wrong but it was just a guess, it is a huge walking Titan, God knows how thick the metal plates are, I just assumed the rivets might need to be a bit bigger than normal.
I think that the bigger question is why one of the most advanced war machines that humanity has ever created, which uses a cybernetic brain link to connect to the pilot, would still be using rivets in its construction.
Guildsman wrote: As big as that thing is supposed to be, wouldn't those rivets be the size of, like, basketballs at full scale?
I imagine rivets have to scale up a little bit. Rivets from smaller vehicles probably wouldn't hold this thing together.
Not sure if serious....
I apologise, my original post was a bit over the top. Just got some bad news and took it out on you. Yeah I was being serious, I'm guessing I was wrong but it was just a guess, it is a huge walking Titan, God knows how thick the metal plates are, I just assumed the rivets might need to be a bit bigger than normal.
I think that the bigger question is why one of the most advanced war machines that humanity has ever created, which uses a cybernetic brain link to connect to the pilot, would still be using rivets in its construction.
Because rivets work? I dunno. What else would you use?
Yeah, it is very possible the Titan is actually of welded construction, and that the rivets are purely decorative too. The Titanicus does like it's bling.
Its an old fluff vs the new thing - when the models were first being made they put rivets on as a hark-back to early ironwork.
Rather than admitting a design mistake they got re-classified as 'molecular bonding studs' which is actually quite clever IMHO.
Rivets are actually quite detrimental to a structure because although it is pulling two parts together very tightly it introduces a structural weakness where the holes are drilled - the shape of the rivet and it's installation can create or compound these weaknesses too.
There is a formula for calculating the size and shape of a rivet given a known installation material but beyond a certain size the rivet is causing more problems than it is solving.
edit: and 'spalling' makes rivets on power armour a serious mistake!
Well, that would be assuming that adamantium responds to forces in the same way as steel, and also assuming that the rivets go all the way through the plate and that power armour has no kind of anti-spalling layer.
I really wish they hadn't put so much moulded on detail.
Really? I rather like the cross and stuff. Less free hand painting I have to do!
That's the exact reason I'd not want the fixed detail As I'm planning on having it covered in free hand, as it is such a big canvas to paint its perfect for it.
Haighus wrote: Well, that would be assuming that adamantium responds to forces in the same way as steel, and also assuming that the rivets go all the way through the plate and that power armour has no kind of anti-spalling layer.
>sigh<
If the base material is more resistant to compression, the rivets will pop thier heads much sooner and more care must be taken during installation.
Drilling a material always introduces structural weaknesses and can locally promote microvoid coalecance which propogates faults in the structure eminating from stress concentration point (usually an irregularity in the edge of the hole).
Even if you managed to create a perfect hole (due to atomic deposition for example) you have created a structural irregularity which can become a stress concentration point - this is without including weaknesses brought on by cyclical loading and the material fatigue and 'creep' which comes with cyclical loading.
Rivets always go through the material; it relies on the opposing forces to grip the base material sheets together.
Also - a note on 'spalling'; You can't get rid of spalling - if you glue the layer to the inside it peels off after the first strike due to the force of the 'spalled' pieces; if you use bolts then the bolt heads spall off inside. Thats why our army uses 'HESH' rounds
This is why i said i think that the change in name to 'molecular bonding studs' was clever - it introduces a 'miracle exception' where one was most definetly needed!!
Welding also introduces heat fatigue to materials, which is part of the reason aircraft are still riveted. The other reason is because some of the materials they are made of (like aluminum and titanium) are very difficult to weld. Maybe Adamantium just doesn't weld well.
greyknight12 wrote: Welding also introduces heat fatigue to materials, which is part of the reason aircraft are still riveted. The other reason is because some of the materials they are made of (like ALUMINIUM and titanium) are very difficult to weld. Maybe Adamantium just doesn't weld well.
The rivets make it grim-dark. Seriously mounting a plasma reactor, void shield generator and rack of turbo lasers on a structure that has 2 legs and the cockpit sticking out at the front isn't exactly optimal for effectiveness.
Maybe rack the rivets up to 'because it looks cool' rather than 'because it's practical'
wtnind wrote: The rivets make it grim-dark. Seriously mounting a plasma reactor, void shield generator and rack of turbo lasers on a structure that has 2 legs and the cockpit sticking out at the front isn't exactly optimal for effectiveness.
Maybe rack the rivets up to 'because it looks cool' rather than 'because it's practical'
My Space Marines have a layer of unobtanium underneath their ceremite, so the rivets work better than welding.
These other guys seemed to have been given shoddy ceremite.
The Emperor may protect, but a procurement officer worth his salt protects a little more!
Agree on molecular bonding studs being a great workaround, although it isn't true that you cannot get rid of spalling. Cannot get rid of it for rivets perhaps, but Dorchester armour is highly resistant to HESH rounds, and tanks usually have Kevlar liners to reduce the effects of spalling. Yes, the British army still uses HESH rounds, but most armies use solely kinetic penetration rounds for anti-tank purposes, and the British retain HESH rounds simply because they are also very effective against soft targets and structures in addition to their AT capabilities (as well as having a longer range than discarding sabot rounds).
When I said the rivets may not go all the way through, well, they may be used to bond outer layers together, with layers below that made of different materials (such as ceramite) that are bonded in different ways. If I remember correctly, it is the multiple layers of different materials that lends Dorchester armour its anti-spalling capabilities.
Anyway, the whole molecular bonding studs idea does wave it over with technobabble, so there is that.
Hooray for superfluous technobabble? Also - it IS a fictional futuristic universe. Something dosent have to have a reason to exist other then it looks cool. Or adds detail or something. Maybe rivets have a purpose. Maybe they don't. Same as skulls and random hanging pipes and cables. But if we are gonna debate said reality and focus on rivets without talking about pretty much every space marine aircraft .... Or the fact people don't wear helmets - in space..... Or that a SWORD is better in a fight then a gun.... Or that a cannon designed to reduce a city to powder is ineffective against a PERSONAL force field .... Yea.
Plus orkz. Seriously anyone demanding realism, coherence, sense and sensibility from 40k should look at orkz first.
Btw not sure about the Warlord head. The knightish head on knights is the one I like the least and it's all bit too knightly now for me. It was supposed to be like grey knights are knightish and Imperium is bare boned blocky WW I in spaaace. It won't exactly fit to Warhound or Reaver design but to IK instead, who were supposed to be something else entirely. Meh I'll pass. Well I'd pass anyway but Id prefer that it exist for that one special day on shrooms when I decide there's only now in space and natural conclusion, who needs a car.
Yeah, gotta' say, I'm a serious opponent of "it's a setting with magic so why are you questioning basic laws of nature, dummy?", but I can take dumb use of rivets. It's not very believable, but at least they tend towards places where rivets could go and do something (unlike gobs of steampunk where gears and rivets are more likely to be decoration or trim than interacting with things... could really rant on steampunk vs. its origins...).
Also, dark age of technology and all does give decent leeway for improper tech. Who knows what those silly ad mech boys are up to today?
I really wish they hadn't put so much moulded on detail.
Really? I rather like the cross and stuff. Less free hand painting I have to do!
That's the exact reason I'd not want the fixed detail As I'm planning on having it covered in free hand, as it is such a big canvas to paint its perfect for it.
Not trying to be dense here, and sorry if I am, but is there any reason why you couldn't sand off the fixed details you don't like?
Jaceevoke wrote: Not trying to be dense here, and sorry if I am, but is there any reason why you couldn't sand off the fixed details you don't like?
Resin at that thickness is both time-consuming to cut and toxic when doing so?
I think it's more accessible to a wider audience* that way since it allows people ambitious enough to do so to remove details (rather than necessitating those who want more to add them, which would be more difficult), but can still be a pain.
*of people willing to spend a huge amount of cash and time on a pretty but presumably rarely-used piece
At the risk of descending into another utterly pointless tangent, resin isn't toxic at any thickness. There's a mild to insignificant risk when breathing in fine particulates without protection (the dust) and that's it.
The detail is there because the guy making it thought it looked cool and that's really all that can be said.
Alpharius wrote: I think it might be time to take the Rivet Talk over to 40K General Discussions, maybe?
thanks!
Now, I must insist.
Thanks!
To be fair though, they are not talking about the rivets. They're debating the value of the plating details like the cross on its chin, which I think manages to be relevant enough, because it is specific to this model rather than debating rivets in general.
That said, I like that sculpted detail myself. As long as it's the design, I think sculpted looks better than freehand or transfers.
Anyway, I wonder just how large the Warlord's going to be. Something like a proportional increase from the Reaver compared to how much larger the Reaver is than the Warhound seems logical.
From the looks of the head, compared to the head of the Reaver, it looks way bigger, but it also seems like the Warlord has a proportionally bigger head compared to its body than the Reaver itself?
But to make a (hopefully) valid contribution, I do hope that they get the proportions right with the Warlord, the Warhound is great (the Chaos one is a firm fixture in y "one day" list) but I've always felt the Reaver looked a little too pinched in the waste, I think it needs to be broader and squatter, it looks a little too tall, slender and top heavy for my tastes, and while admirable qualities in a woman, are not what I look for in an Imperial Titan!
Azreal13 wrote: But to make a (hopefully) valid contribution, I do hope that they get the proportions right with the Warlord, the Warhound is great (the Chaos one is a firm fixture in y "one day" list) but I've always felt the Reaver looked a little too pinched in the waste, I think it needs to be broader and squatter, it looks a little too tall, slender and top heavy for my tastes, and while admirable qualities in a woman, are not what I look for in an Imperial Titan!
Just keep your eyes open for those Slaaneshi Titans...
Anyway, I wonder just how large the Warlord's going to be. Something like a proportional increase from the Reaver compared to how much larger the Reaver is than the Warhound seems logical.
From the looks of the head, compared to the head of the Reaver, it looks way bigger, but it also seems like the Warlord has a proportionally bigger head compared to its body than the Reaver itself?
I'm expecting the Warlord to look a lot like a 3 up Knight based on the leg and head we have seen before so it'll have the same "tiny" waist as the Reaver, skinny legs with big pauldrons, lots of moulded on baroque detail (rather than optional stuff provided on a sprue that you can glue on yourself), etc.
I thought we heard that the Warlord would be 24" tall? I can't remember where I heard or read that but I think it was officially confirmed as the target height?
The Reaver is around 16" tall depending on how you pose it, so the Warlord is 50% larger. The Warhound is around 10" tall, meaning that the Reaver is about 60% taller, although I'm expecting the Warhound to "feel" bigger compared to the Reaver than the Reaver to the Warhound as the Warhound will have bigger, broader shoulders to mount the above shoulder guns.
Due to renovations in my apartment I had to stash away all my models and painting stuff and I was too lazy to pull it out again ... but I guess Book V and the model of Roboute G. will bring me back to the hobby table ...
Yeah I've come around to the Warlord too. I was just put off a little because it's basically a bigger Knight and I was expecting something more like the Reaver, but the sheer scale of it has won me round.
Now that is a teaser. I was going to hold off getting the book. After that, no chance! Love the look of Word Bearers Diabolist. Gives me hopes for the Alpha Legion Saboteur appearing.
As for the Warlord... Love it. Cross between the Mk1 Mars and Mk2 Metalicus warlord. Nicely done
Edit. Nice shot of a Gothic class Cruiser. Come back BFG. Please. Pretty please
I know. The pics in the previous books, like the one of Perturabo's flagship make me weep for the lost potential. I think FW did say at one of their events that they would like to do 30K BFG, but that it is incredibly unlikely to happen.
Edit. Nice shot of a Gothic class Cruiser. Come back BFG. Please. Pretty please
I know. The pics in the previous books, like the one of Perturabo's flagship make me weep for the lost potential. I think FW did say at one of their events that they would like to do 30K BFG, but that it is incredibly unlikely to happen.
I reckon it's more likely a short-sighted GW main stopping any attempt - "I don't care how much money you'll get it in, no cannibalising of the core range!". Alan Bligh is a massive BFG fan and is rumoured to still play and run campaigns. I can see him busting to do something at the very least.
Looking forward to this book alright, kinda curious if there will be extra Knight goodness in there as well. I hope not, otherwise it'll be a must-buy for me.
I'm glad that they're coming out with the titan but that video makes it feel a bit like an upgraded version of the second vraks book that should have been subtitled "we've got a reaver!".
It might take a few dozen autocorrects given how varied the incorrect spellings are. It's not a simple case like the vaunted geometric warriors of the emperor, the Blood Angles and Dark Angles, or the gutteral stomach noise sounding forces of Choas that each have dozens to hundeds of tagged pics in the gallery.
Alph, in a world where the same gamers you're talking to are too lazy to type out 40,000 and abbreviate it to 40k despite just having to tap the same number their finger is already on a few more times, you really expect them to spell out (correctly) a nonsensical french sounding name?
Bull0 wrote: We know that's Guilliman? Could just as easily be one of the named marines from the Calth books, imo.
Well, those are the two main figures of the battle. Guilliman was present (and badass) and Kor Phaeron, I am guessing. Not sure why it would be anyone else.
Bull0 wrote: We know that's Guilliman? Could just as easily be one of the named marines from the Calth books, imo.
Well, those are the two main figures of the battle. Guilliman was present (and badass) and Kor Phaeron, I am guessing. Not sure why it would be anyone else.
From the novels pretty much an equal amount of time is spent following Guilliman as following one of the ultramarine captains (I want to say Ventanus?). The other figure in the trailer is definitely Phaeron.
I mean, it probably is Guilliman, I was just asking if it was confirmed - like we'd seen that portrait labelled at a HH weekender or something.
Even better if Daemon Prince Angron makes an appearance, although I'm guessing that's in the next book (they are spending two books on Calth and the Shadow Crusade, right?).
No, that was the Thramas Crusade. The Shadow Crusade was the Word Bearers and World Eaters keeping the Ultramarines occupied in their own pocket of the Imperium so they couldn't reinforce Terra.
I just hope FW dont go down the BL route and take the series around the houses into Stagnation. Book 4 was enjoyable but I felt it wasnt as juicy as the first 3. Hopefully this gets things back on track.
Bull0 wrote: We know that's Guilliman? Could just as easily be one of the named marines from the Calth books, imo.
Well he looks almost exactly like the Guilliman model WIP we saw a while ago and Guilliman and Kor Phaeron had a bit of a tiff in KNF. I'd put money on that drawing being him.
1 - Are the Ultramarines just getting upgrade kits? Seems a tad unfair considering the number of unique kits given to other legions such as the Emperors Children and Death Guard.
2 - They better not split the rules for the Ultramarines legion across Book V and book six which will cover the rest of the Shadow Crusade. Only a few months between each book. Only one legion getting new rules, I really don't see any justification to not have all the rules for fielding a legion Ultramarines army. I don't like the idea of having to fork out more money for a product tailored for the Word Bearers and World Eaters.
They've only got upgrades so far but I don't think either are for their specific units so they should still get full kits for them. Although the IF just got upgrades for their specific units.
2 - They better not split the rules for the Ultramarines legion across Book V and book six which will cover the rest of the Shadow Crusade. Only a few months between each book. Only one legion getting new rules, I really don't see any justification to not have all the rules for fielding a legion Ultramarines army. I don't like the idea of having to fork out more money for a product tailored for the Word Bearers and World Eaters.
If the others are any indication, you will have the core rules for UM in this book with additional special units in the next just like with the Istvaan series. Fw could always deviate from that though but that seems to be their pattern with the HH.
Bull0 wrote: We know that's Guilliman? Could just as easily be one of the named marines from the Calth books, imo.
Well he looks almost exactly like the Guilliman model WIP we saw a while ago and Guilliman and Kor Phaeron had a bit of a tiff in KNF. I'd put money on that drawing being him.
You're right, I must've missed that pic leak but I've just googled it and yeah, it's basically identical. It's definitely Guilliman in the trailer. Ignore Doubting Bull0, voice of unfounded skepticism, nothing to see here
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
For some completely non-lucid reason, i thought the sketch opposite RG was Perturabo rather than Kor Phaeron. Man i want him to get at least a leaked WIP sculpt :(
When I spoke to FW a couple of weeks ago to put in my order for the Open Day they said that this Friday's FW email would contain all of the new models that are available this weekend, so far we have:
The Warlord
Roboute Guilliman
Both UM Upgrade kits & transfers
HH Book V
what are the bets we get anything else? The trailer focused on the guy below, do we think we will also get these guys as well? They look different from the already shown upgrade kits?
Looky Likey wrote: When I spoke to FW a couple of weeks ago to put in my order for the Open Day they said that this Friday's FW email would contain all of the new models that are available this weekend, so far we have:
The Warlord
Roboute Guilliman
Both UM Upgrade kits & transfers
HH Book V
what are the bets we get anything else? The trailer focused on the guy below, do we think we will also get these guys as well? They look different from the already shown upgrade kits?
lets just wait until tomorrow ... FW indicated that the UM would get more than 2 special units and a type of Honor Guard would be amongst them. The upgrade kits released so far are nice, but a little more bling as shown in these pictures would be appreciated ...
Looky Likey wrote: When I spoke to FW a couple of weeks ago to put in my order for the Open Day they said that this Friday's FW email would contain all of the new models that are available this weekend, so far we have:
The Warlord
Roboute Guilliman
Both UM Upgrade kits & transfers
HH Book V
what are the bets we get anything else? The trailer focused on the guy below, do we think we will also get these guys as well? They look different from the already shown upgrade kits?
lets just wait until tomorrow ... FW indicated that the UM would get more than 2 special units and a type of Honor Guard would be amongst them. The upgrade kits released so far are nice, but a little more bling as shown in these pictures would be appreciated ...
Or a complete kit rather than an upgrade - the "upgrades" are pretty massively more expensive at the end of the day than any of FW's complete kits, I'm quite nonplussed about them.
Doesn't every legion so far also have a special terminator unit, or at least rules for one if not models yet? So we should see some nifty looking UM terminators sometime as well.
I reckon these upgrade kits are being done this way as a precursor to the rumoured new plastic marines with different armour marks. I have a suspicion that FW are rapidly burning through Space Marine moulds, hence the need for plastics. These upgrade kits make sense when they are meant to upgrade plastic kits...
BrookM wrote: Conquest was IMHO a much-needed diversion from the constant power armour masturbation going on in the previous three books.
I really liked the Knights list. It's what the Codex: Imperial Knights could have been.
The 30k IG list is IG light, though. Where are the heavy weapon squads? Also, their only transports are the 150 point tank that holds 20 and the Arvis Lighter (flier). I'd like to see a chimera variant.
Anyway, it's an interesting list, just missing some stuff.
1 - Are the Ultramarines just getting upgrade kits? Seems a tad unfair considering the number of unique kits given to other legions such as the Emperors Children and Death Guard.
Doubtful. In fact, they're the first Legion that got an upgrade kit BEFORE their HH book came out. I had to wait nearly a year for the Templar Brethren kits for my Imperial Fists.
Slow your roll. Ultramarines will get LOTS of love.
Tannhauser42 wrote: Doesn't every legion so far also have a special terminator unit, or at least rules for one if not models yet? So we should see some nifty looking UM terminators sometime as well.
No. Raven Guard, Imperial Fists, Night Lords, And Word Bearers don't have Terminator units (yet).
Tannhauser42 wrote: Doesn't every legion so far also have a special terminator unit, or at least rules for one if not models yet? So we should see some nifty looking UM terminators sometime as well.
I would hope so too. My assumption is that by the time FW is done with the heresy every legion will have at least one special terminator unit. I was hoping the IF would already have one, espically with the Battle of Phall, and they dont so I hope im not dissapointed again.
Tannhauser42 wrote: Doesn't every legion so far also have a special terminator unit, or at least rules for one if not models yet? So we should see some nifty looking UM terminators sometime as well.
Imperial Fists did not get a special terminator unit or terminator shoulder pads with the HH release. Nor did the Raven Guard, Alpha Legion, Word Bearers (Well, excluding Kor Pheron) or Night Lords.
Tannhauser42 wrote: Doesn't every legion so far also have a special terminator unit, or at least rules for one if not models yet? So we should see some nifty looking UM terminators sometime as well.
Imperial Fists did not get a special terminator unit or terminator shoulder pads with the HH release. Nor did the Raven Guard, Alpha Legion, Word Bearers (Well, excluding Kor Pheron) or Night Lords.
Were Guilliman's (sp?) honor guard terminators?
Edit: Double Ninja!
Well, the fists don't get special terminators, but they do get access to the Iliastus Pattern Assault Cannon...
Alpha's got the Lernaen Terminator Squad as well (Conversion Beamers and Volkite Chargers)
H.B.M.C. wrote: Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
I suspect you'll be able to scratch your ultramarine itch all joking aside. Given previous books, you'll get the UM rites of war, a few special characters, the primarch, tons of fluff, and one or two special UM only units. The second book would likely add another character or two plus another unit or two.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
I suspect you'll be able to scratch your ultramarine itch all joking aside. Given previous books, you'll get the UM rites of war, a few special characters, the primarch, tons of fluff, and one or two special UM only units. The second book would likely add another character or two plus another unit or two.
Well, don't forget fleshing out the other stuff. They seem like they do some overlap with previous books sometimes. I wouldn't be surprised to see some more Shattered Legion stuff (especially given their factoring into Ultramar in Unremembered Empire). Plus, maybe some extras for Word Bearers, Alpha Legion, and Dark Angels - all players involved.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
I suspect you'll be able to scratch your ultramarine itch all joking aside. Given previous books, you'll get the UM rites of war, a few special characters, the primarch, tons of fluff, and one or two special UM only units. The second book would likely add another character or two plus another unit or two.
Well, don't forget fleshing out the other stuff. They seem like they do some overlap with previous books sometimes. I wouldn't be surprised to see some more Shattered Legion stuff (especially given their factoring into Ultramar in Unremembered Empire). Plus, maybe some extras for Word Bearers, Alpha Legion, and Dark Angels - all players involved.
In book 6 you mean? I think this one is entirely Calth, and then 6 is the shadow crusade stuff.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
Please don't be a £70 advertisement for the Warlord!
I suspect you'll be able to scratch your ultramarine itch all joking aside. Given previous books, you'll get the UM rites of war, a few special characters, the primarch, tons of fluff, and one or two special UM only units. The second book would likely add another character or two plus another unit or two.
Well, don't forget fleshing out the other stuff. They seem like they do some overlap with previous books sometimes. I wouldn't be surprised to see some more Shattered Legion stuff (especially given their factoring into Ultramar in Unremembered Empire). Plus, maybe some extras for Word Bearers, Alpha Legion, and Dark Angels - all players involved.
In book 6 you mean? I think this one is entirely Calth, and then 6 is the shadow crusade stuff.
Hm. Good point. If this is exclusively Calth, I guess we will see stuff for just UM and WB and their rabble. Bummer if so, but I am still excited because I am ever-so-hopeful for a new Knight release. And with that, some decals for the existing 30k Knight Households too.
So is this Imperial Militia list an expansion for the Solar Auxilia army or is it something different? Personally I think the solar auxilia are a little meh compared to FW other guard ranges. IMO Krieg guardsman and Vostoryans and Elysians are much closer to how the Imperial army is described in the HH novels. Either really ornate and ceremonial like the Spireguard or functional and modern like the Calth Regiments. Not this weird steampunk scrap metal welder armor nonsense with the big trousers. They actually look more primitive than the 40k armies...
Ideally I would like to add some cheap militia to my burgeoning Ultramarines force.
Ashiraya wrote: I really wonder how they are going to represent Guilliman's masterful tactics in his rules.
Will he have the best battlefield buffs yet?
He'll have the doctrine: Master of the red tape. The ultramarines get 10% more points than the other army as guilliman is able to work through all the red tape of the administration and runs a tight ship. Also he can force his opponent to reroll any rerolls that are made each turn.
Seems like this particular thread suffers greatly from that, eh?
(No offense against anyone but the Guilliman memes are getting a bit old...)
Anyway, I would say something like Calgar's rules for Guilliman, but they seem way too strong with 30k's morale system, so I do not know.
GW and FW traditionally represents tactical and strategic skill by either
1. Manipulating reserves and deployment
2. Handing out USRs like candy
And it would not surprise me if big Mr. Codex Astartes himself would do both. The latter is already done by Alpha Legion, in a way, but the former is not something a Legion has really invested in yet.
Hmm, the other Primarchs have some pretty strong buffs though, I expect at least Guilliman and any unit he joins to have Calgar's ability to choose to pass or fail any Ld check instead of Fearless. Maybe for the rest of the army he will have a toned down version of this, such as giving a + or -1 modifier to any Ld check (players choice whether + or -). I still feel like the Ultramarine Legionnes Astartes are going to include either ATSKNF or Combat Squads in some way, as a kind of indication of the beginnings of the Codex Astartes, although if they get ATSKNF, then they probably will get no other buffs, and maybe some kind of nerf to counter how effective it is seeing as FW seem to be pretty good at balancing the Legion rules.
Haighus wrote: Hmm, the other Primarchs have some pretty strong buffs though, I expect at least Guilliman and any unit he joins to have Calgar's ability to choose to pass or fail any Ld check instead of Fearless. Maybe for the rest of the army he will have a toned down version of this, such as giving a + or -1 modifier to any Ld check (players choice whether + or -). I still feel like the Ultramarine Legionnes Astartes are going to include either ATSKNF or Combat Squads in some way, as a kind of indication of the beginnings of the Codex Astartes, although if they get ATSKNF, then they probably will get no other buffs, and maybe some kind of nerf to counter how effective it is seeing as FW seem to be pretty good at balancing the Legion rules.
Maybe giving the entire army a once-per game version of Calgar's rule?
If I were designing the UM I would give them ATSKNF or combat tactics as their standard legion tactic. For Guilliman in particular I'd give him reserve manipulation and either a bubble-buff (like 12'') bonus to overwatch BSor something like units that performed fury of the legion being able to shoot normally on the next turn.
Totalwar1402 wrote: So is this Imperial Militia list an expansion for the Solar Auxilia army or is it something different? Personally I think the solar auxilia are a little meh compared to FW other guard ranges. IMO Krieg guardsman and Vostoryans and Elysians are much closer to how the Imperial army is described in the HH novels. Either really ornate and ceremonial like the Spireguard or functional and modern like the Calth Regiments. Not this weird steampunk scrap metal welder armor nonsense with the big trousers. They actually look more primitive than the 40k armies...
Ideally I would like to add some cheap militia to my burgeoning Ultramarines force.
The Imperial Militia list is completely different to SA as far as I know. In terms of like training and equipment and proficiency it goes Imperial Militia < Imperial Army < Solar Auxilia, so they should be the cheap militia you're after
Although I can't say I agree about the SA. I think they look amazing.
Totalwar1402 wrote: So is this Imperial Militia list an expansion for the Solar Auxilia army or is it something different? Personally I think the solar auxilia are a little meh compared to FW other guard ranges. IMO Krieg guardsman and Vostoryans and Elysians are much closer to how the Imperial army is described in the HH novels. Either really ornate and ceremonial like the Spireguard or functional and modern like the Calth Regiments. Not this weird steampunk scrap metal welder armor nonsense with the big trousers. They actually look more primitive than the 40k armies...
Ideally I would like to add some cheap militia to my burgeoning Ultramarines force.
The Imperial Militia list is completely different to SA as far as I know. In terms of like training and equipment and proficiency it goes Imperial Militia < Imperial Army < Solar Auxilia, so they should be the cheap militia you're after
Although I can't say I agree about the SA. I think they look amazing.
Agreed, reading the screen in the teaser it looks like the Imperial Militia are the 30k version of the PDF, it'll be interesting to see if they use existing models or do new ones as looking at the screenshots for the Chaos Cult list they seem to be reusing the Vraks rebels.
For Guilliman I'm expecting him to be able to choose between a mix of power sword and a power fist attacks in CC. I'm not happy that so many Primarchs have I1 weapons, Primarchs are meant to be like super speed compared to a normal marine even when using an unwieldy weapon.
Imperial Fists have Bolter Drill so I can't see UM getting something too similar, a split fire option would be perfect.
Vintersorg wrote: Good that he is not in the tank, lie the warlord pattern described in Titanicus by Abnett.
If they spend enough time in there, then it's the fish tank treatment.
Nah, it's actually the titan pattern that decides if they use one system or the other. In the one with the tank you are sumberged from day one. The only thing that changes are how much of your body is mechanical. With time priceps will remove as much flesh as they can.
I'm mostly interested to see what Chaos Cultist/Imperial Militia kits come out of this release, I'm prone to looting most types of guard looking miniatures for my IA13 Renegades army and could do with more toys to convert.
Melcavuk wrote: I'm mostly interested to see what Chaos Cultist/Imperial Militia kits come out of this release, I'm prone to looting most types of guard looking miniatures for my IA13 Renegades army and could do with more toys to convert.
I suspect there won't be many, if any new models for them.
FW's range of guard miniatures, as well as GW's for that matter, provide a wide range of suitable models (to say nothing of artermarket producers). Earlier in the HH product lifetime, FW was recorded as saying they don't intend on doing full ranges of Imperial Army models, but rather a wide range of IA lists to represent how diverse and non-standard they were with the intention of using existing models. It means they don't end up making models with very limited applications, and can draw a large pool of IG players into the game for whom it would be fairly inexpensive, increasing the general player pool. Solar Auxilia are the exception, being a passion project by one of the sculptors FW decided to roll with, and provides that much more temptation for IG players (especially given the state of the Guard in 40k).
I believe their intention was produce specialists and variants, but no more whole ranges. Say, more models using Death Korps, Elysians, Cadians and Vostroyans, probably, as a base or with a shared aesthetic. HQs, Volkite toting guys, 30k specific stuff to complement existing ranges.
At least that's what the plan was; of course if the Solar Auxilia does well we'd probably get more Army types, and if not probably less so.
Just looked through the Warhammer World web page and there is mention in there that there will be a WW exclusive FW model in the shop. I wonder if it will be their normal event exclusive, or something else?
Jadenim wrote: Just looked through the Warhammer World web page and there is mention in there that there will be a WW exclusive FW model in the shop. I wonder if it will be their normal event exclusive, or something else?
edit for iPad typing fail...
Yes, it's in Forgeworld's announcement: a Princeps model.
Anyway, I think it would be appropriate for Guilliman to have the same ability as Zandrekh to choose a new warlord trait every turn.
Jadenim wrote: Just looked through the Warhammer World web page and there is mention in there that there will be a WW exclusive FW model in the shop. I wonder if it will be their normal event exclusive, or something else?
edit for iPad typing fail...
It appears that the model in question is the 2015 Event Only model, the just announced Princeps Majoris.
They have announced less than I was expecting, wish they had given a heads up on the Warlord's price as well, I'm guessing trying to avoid sticker shock with that one.
Planning on picking up the Princeps Majoris, he was a nice surprise, shall fit in nicely with the Mechanicum HQ I'm building: Navigator, TItan Princeps, Archmagos Draykavac,etc.
Looky Likey wrote: They have announced less than I was expecting, wish they had given a heads up on the Warlord's price as well, I'm guessing trying to avoid sticker shock with that one.
Planning on picking up the Princeps Majoris, he was a nice surprise, shall fit in nicely with the Mechanicum HQ I'm building: Navigator, TItan Princeps, Archmagos Draykavac,etc.
Me too, but then thinking about it, the Warlord model, the next book, and the next Primarch model are all pretty massive releases haha. The Titan is over £1000 with the weapons, they told Atia on bolter and chainsword when she asked on the phone.
I'd be curious to see how often those big marque models like the Manta and the Warlord are ordered. I don't doubt that they price them to cover their costs and then some as they're not going to take a financial hit on each but rather whether it is worth the design time put into it compared with expanding other (non-contemptor!) model lines.
The Manta and the Fortress Walls(previously the only two "really big" kits they had) were always 'cast to order' kits, so they don't just keep them sitting around in large quantities from my understanding.
Kanluwen wrote: The Manta and the Fortress Walls(previously the only two "really big" kits they had) were always 'cast to order' kits, so they don't just keep them sitting around in large quantities from my understanding.
Agreed but my point was rather in regards to them spending the design time and resources in catching up with models not yet done. For instance, coming out with ALL the models in the next HH book (if Warlord free) available for sale right away instead of staggering them over the next year just like they do with codex releases now.
Melcavuk wrote: I'm mostly interested to see what Chaos Cultist/Imperial Militia kits come out of this release, I'm prone to looting most types of guard looking miniatures for my IA13 Renegades army and could do with more toys to convert.
In the trailer I spotted a bunch of the existing chaos militia, and chaos Rouge psyker.
The idea I think will be just to use the existing ig ranges, the winged skull is OK, but no double headed egals. Shave them off.
Both the winged skull and any type of eagle are badges of honour and recognition amongst the forces of the Imperium.
The winged skull in particular, which is now the symbol of the Imperial Guard, was back then a badge of honour to denote that unit showed particular bravery or suffered a great loss but endured.
MajorStoffer wrote: I believe their intention was produce specialists and variants, but no more whole ranges. Say, more models using Death Korps, Elysians, Cadians and Vostroyans, probably, as a base or with a shared aesthetic. HQs, Volkite toting guys, 30k specific stuff to complement existing ranges.
FW YOU MUST DO THIS. If I don't get volkite DKoK I'm going to be really disappointed with 30k.
Yeah, but the general aesthetic has existed since ~1914... It wouldn't be actual DKoK, just IA troops with a similar aesthetic. May not even have similar battle doctrines. I don't think there would be no greatcoat clad troops using a (presumably) STC pattern of respirator and the basic stahlhelm design in the Great Crusade. The Lucius pattern lasrifle also looks similar to the Kalibrav pattern lasrifle (although probably still inferior in the GC, unless Lucius has lost the ability to make excellent lasguns since then).
I really wouldn't be surprised if FW did release DKoK troopers with Volkite weaponry under some new, GC name.
Argh that warlord is not what I imagined at all. It was always going to be way beynd my hobby budget but it's definitely a lazy offering from FW. Still though would have been nice to have some decent proper warlord style eye candy. The driver is pretty cool though.
