So some of the designs they've shown look like the MWO redesigns. Are they using a number of those or no? Cause a number of the Clan Mechs look like they are using that redesign, but then on the Inner Sphere side, we have the Marauder which looks like a cross between an older design and the MWO design.
I've backed, cant resist me some mechs, tempted to back for much more.
VictorVonTzeentch wrote: So some of the designs they've shown look like the MWO redesigns. Are they using a number of those or no? Cause a number of the Clan Mechs look like they are using that redesign, but then on the Inner Sphere side, we have the Marauder which looks like a cross between an older design and the MWO design.
I've backed, cant resist me some mechs, tempted to back for much more.
No. MechWarrior Online is by Piranha Games and is not affiliated with Catalyst Game Labs. They look similar because they both started with the original FASA designs, although CGL is trying to stay closer to those original designs (when they can) compared to Piranha.
VictorVonTzeentch wrote: So some of the designs they've shown look like the MWO redesigns. Are they using a number of those or no? Cause a number of the Clan Mechs look like they are using that redesign, but then on the Inner Sphere side, we have the Marauder which looks like a cross between an older design and the MWO design.
I've backed, cant resist me some mechs, tempted to back for much more.
No. MechWarrior Online is by Piranha Games and is not affiliated with Catalyst Game Labs. They look similar because they both started with the original FASA designs, although CGL is trying to stay closer to those original designs (when they can) compared to Piranha.
With a couple caveats:
* Piranha Games and Catalyst have an agreement to share 3d models. It's no coincidence that most of the IS Mechs in MWO showed up as Battletech miniatures. They just posed the MWO model.
* They've shared a surprising number of concept artists
I don’t think that first part is true. Piranha Games allows individuals to access their 3D models for personal use, but the folks selling resin casts of MWO models are technically not supposed to (probably why they’re all in Eastern Europe). It may have provided a bit of impetus for CGL to hurry up and update those old sculpts already, because you’d be crazy to buy them when bootleg MWO minis look so much better.
Microsoft owns the MWO designs; Piranha uses them under license.
CGL owns the tabletop game’s designs. IronWind Metals has the primary right to sell models based on those designs, but CGL can sell models too, as long as they’re in packs of more than one mini and they include rules (Alpha Strike cards count). CGL can’t copy Microsoft’s art, but recent court cases like GW vs. Chapterhouse Studios tightened the definition of copying. For example, the Lu Wei Bing (a later-era Capellan mech based on the Victor) is basically a copy of the MWO Victor with a different right arm. It’s the closest thing I’ve seen to a direct copy.
At least one of CGL’s artists has said he isn’t a fan of all the boxy weapons on the MWO mechs, so that, at least, will be different in the new sculpts. They’re less polygonal in general – the Catapult’s torso is a good example.
The Reaper/CAV OGRE model is pretty much a perfect stand-in, although it's just slightly too large. It barely fits on a hex base but it still works great for a 100 ton mech called a Behemoth. Most of the CAV stuff is very mediocre, but that's been my favorite stand-ins since they discontinued the original for looking very ever so roughly like a macross MAC II Monster (even though they only bear the barest resemblance to each other).
Dissapointed in the urban mech and stalker not being redone yet, those 2 are pretty much classics and some of the best original FASA designs. Well, Urbie is an awful awful awful mech, but it's exactly all the right kinds of awful
The Kickstarter has just passed ONE MILLION DOLLARS!
New stretch goals have already been posted for the next $500K. News from the BattleTech forum on the composition of the $850K and $950K lances/stars is “… we've already tallied the votes and the comments, and have started discussion.” so hopefully we'll know soon.
welp finally put my backing downl, just went with blood named level for now, might adjust up towards the end of the kickstart if I begin to look like I have the money. the big appeal of the star colonel or higher, getting your name in canon holds less appeal when it's already happened.
If that 1.5m gets unlocked I may have to reconsider my pledge.
I'm in this all the way - every single Lance/Star/Level II - as I want it all, but if the $300 double forces becomes "Just pick 10 packs!" then that could change things.
H.B.M.C. wrote: If that 1.5m gets unlocked I may have to reconsider my pledge.
I'm in this all the way - every single Lance/Star/Level II - as I want it all, but if the $300 double forces becomes "Just pick 10 packs!" then that could change things.
Remember, at Star Colonel, you already got a bonus 'Orbital Drop' choice as a pack which Catalyst said would be doubled, too. So you would be getting 12 individual packs, 5 mechs in the game, and 2 salvage boxes, for 67 in all. That was the $500,001 stretch goal.
Star Captain adding every 'Mech pack vs Star Colonel. The Colonel pledge is 25-35 more, give or take. You get the faction pack, but I don't care about that.
So I'd rather save the money. Plus I'll get the map pack for free, which means I might get the Strana Mechty one.
NewTruthNeomaxim wrote: So I take it its literally impossible for new players to get started, considering both starter boxes don't seem to exist? Where does one even start as the volume of books is incomprehensible?
Yep. Out of stock. If that's what you mean by having 19 of them available. And that's just this site.
That's pretty unfair to quote a month+ old post, the starter set WAS completely out of stock and going for crazy amounts on eBay when that post was made. The starter was only VERY recently restocked (I'd imagine to coincide with the KS), which makes me happy AF because I FINALLY was able to pick up a starter off of Miniature Market that just arrived yesterday. Spent a few hours tonight cleaning and modifying them and watching Tex/BlackPantsLegion Battletech videogame playthroughs.
Well curiosity got the better of me and I bought a copy of AGOAC which arrived this morning. Believe it or not? I am a fan of Battletech, it’s just the minis have been so disappointing for so long it’s been a complete turn off. Also I had to know their current quality first hand and if they reflected the ones I saw in the vid posted by Ghaz.
So what were my thoughts on them?
Spoiler:
Well they were better than I expected.
They were quite faithful to the originals although I would warn CGL against using too much MWO influence, which seems mainly on the arms and legs.
The scaling is better than any of the reincarnations prior.
The models were generally pleasant on the eye and the ones in my box certainly seemed to have a lot less imperfections than the ones in that video Ghaz posted. Some of the detailing does seem to be lost here and there and some of the mould/spruce joins could be cleaner.
So what would I change? The plastic does seem a tad too soft and I would lay money if they upped the quality and applied a bit more QC in the production these minis would come out a lot sharper and go up a grade in quality instantly. I am sure the detail and finish of the minis would improve making them much more collectible and nicer to look at and paint.
What else would I change in the set? Can’t help but feel the maps should be thicker, the dice a bit more interesting and maybe a bit more BT lore in there but I suppose this would push the price up again and the box does maybe feel a little light on contents but not overly so.
So with the above said, I am in on this KS. Looks like posts on quality and plastic are already being raised so will be interesting to see how CGL reacts. If they were going to make slight adjustment to the minis production? Now is definitely the time to do it as it will be a lot easier to change the process for 9 minis than 101 post the KS. CGL has an opportunity now to put the minis in the next bracket up in quality, they shouldn’t waste it IMO and backers should be holding CGL’s feet to fire on it.
Also great to see that the double forces issue will likely go away so long as the KS hits 1.5mil, which it should do. Just waiting shipping costs before deciding how I go.
Lastly does anyone know when the beginners box will be restocked in the UK, there doesn’t seem to be one B&M or online shop stocking them in the land.
they're probably waiting for another batch to come in from the US
(or waiting for another batch from china to come in to the US and then get sent to the UK if there are any spares after all the US distribution orders are sent out)
I know Wayland games has them when they can get them and will send you an email when they re-stock if you sign up for it, so try that (and as many other places as you can find that will do the same)
They have said that the Beginner Box will be something that can be added in the pledge manager at the end, so if you don't find it between then and now you can add it to this.
Sort of annoying they only put the Griffin in the beginners box, especially when the only retailers who seem to have them in stock are in the USA and after shipping and taxes you could almost buy the AGOAC set so not worth it at all.
If Catalyst want a wider audience they will need to make their product more readily available outside the USA.
Chimaera wrote: Sort of annoying they only put the Griffin in the beginners box, especially when the only retailers who seem to have them in stock are in the USA and after shipping and taxes you could almost buy the AGOAC set so not worth it at all.
If Catalyst want a wider audience they will need to make their product more readily available outside the USA.
I still don't get why the Wolverine was repeated in the Beginner's Box and the AGOAC set. They couldn't have picked another mech to put in either box? Maybe drop the Wolverine from AGOAC and put a Dervish or something?
Chimaera wrote: Sort of annoying they only put the Griffin in the beginners box, especially when the only retailers who seem to have them in stock are in the USA and after shipping and taxes you could almost buy the AGOAC set so not worth it at all.
If Catalyst want a wider audience they will need to make their product more readily available outside the USA.
I still don't get why the Wolverine was repeated in the Beginner's Box and the AGOAC set. They couldn't have picked another mech to put in either box? Maybe drop the Wolverine from AGOAC and put a Dervish or something?
well you see sir, that second Wolverine is actually the rare Minnasotta battlemech!
You'll only get this if you're a true fan
that are the contents of the boxes where decided by a marvel comics executive.
Sterling191 wrote: Gonna be interesting to see what the funding numbers do over the next few days in light of PGI and their MW5 debacle.
you mean their decision to release on the epic games store? yeah I'm a bit annoyed as I'd rather it be on steam.
Its worse than that. They funded it by promising it would be on Steam, and quietly removed all reference to that on their KS just days ago, saying they never made such a claim. Problem is, they're idiots and once something is on the internet its their forever, and they got busted being scumbags.
Sterling191 wrote: Gonna be interesting to see what the funding numbers do over the next few days in light of PGI and their MW5 debacle.
you mean their decision to release on the epic games store? yeah I'm a bit annoyed as I'd rather it be on steam.
Its worse than that. They funded it by promising it would be on Steam, and quietly removed all reference to that on their KS just days ago, saying they never made such a claim. Problem is, they're idiots and once something is on the internet its their forever, and they got busted being scumbags.
jesus, that was bad. that said it shou;dn't imapct things tooo much. CGL isn't Piranaha.
jesus, that was bad. that said it shou;dn't imapct things tooo much. CGL isn't Piranaha.
You misunderstand. More than a few irate folks are going to be refunding MW5 pre-orders. That creates additional funding that may or may not be put into the CGL column.
Though I imagine having a PGI stretch goal on the table now may put a damper on some of that.
I was looking forward to MW5. 'Was' being the active word in that sentence.
Good thing this KS can't go Epic exclusive.
Chimaera wrote: If Catalyst want a wider audience they will need to make their product more readily available outside the USA.
Just bought the beginner box, A Game of Armoured Combat, and the new map pack from a local Australian retailer. *shrugs*
infinite_array wrote: I still don't get why the Wolverine was repeated in the Beginner's Box and the AGOAC set. They couldn't have picked another mech to put in either box? Maybe drop the Wolverine from AGOAC and put a Dervish or something?
That annoys me greatly. If they wanted something around that range, a Centurion or Hunchback would'a done. Not that I need more of either, but at least it wouldn't be a duplicate.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I was looking forward to MW5. 'Was' being the active word in that sentence.
Good thing this KS can't go Epic exclusive.
Chimaera wrote: If Catalyst want a wider audience they will need to make their product more readily available outside the USA.
Just bought the beginner box, A Game of Armoured Combat, and the new map pack from a local Australian retailer. *shrugs*
infinite_array wrote: I still don't get why the Wolverine was repeated in the Beginner's Box and the AGOAC set. They couldn't have picked another mech to put in either box? Maybe drop the Wolverine from AGOAC and put a Dervish or something?
That annoys me greatly. If they wanted something around that range, a Centurion or Hunchback would'a done. Not that I need more of either, but at least it wouldn't be a duplicate.
yeah, epic seems to be scooping a lotta excusive deals but I just got a hunch it's going to be mostly forgotten about, used begrudgingly for the handful of exclsuvie games and mostly serving as a deterrant to those games sucuess..
I wonder if they intended to do an alternative to the wolverine for one of the two packs, but it just didn't work out either in sculpting or tooling,
so the alternatives was to double one of their other mechs up, or spend a bunch more money redoing thing (or at best wait an age for another tooling slot even if they got the work done for free),
Catalyst seems short enough on ready capital to have gone for the former option rather than the latter
It’s all very exciting! BUT please guys keep in mind this is CGL. Some of this stuff won’t be delivered for years, most likely, if at all. I am in for Star Cpt but I’m probably not shelling out for anything not promised for the minimum first wave.
What's the big deal about MW5 being an Epic Studios exclusive? Is it just a matter of people wanting all their games on one launcher platform or is Epic a problem company? Genuinely curious why it's such a problem since I don't do a lot of PC gaming beyond MMOs
Kalamadea wrote: What's the big deal about MW5 being an Epic Studios exclusive? Is it just a matter of people wanting all their games on one launcher platform or is Epic a problem company? Genuinely curious why it's such a problem since I don't do a lot of PC gaming beyond MMOs
Theres several concerns, some general to the Epic store, others specific to this game. The general ones are the incredibly shady way that Epic is trying to build their cartel, by bribing their suppliers not to sell on other platforms, running a frankly terrible platform (from both a user experience and user safety angle), and being all around donkey-caves when it comes to well, anything.
The specific issues are that PGI have been taking pre-orders for months while advertising that it would launch on Steam, while knowing that they would be going Epic exclusive (the exclusivity deal was apparently signed back in April, and only revealed yesterday), subsequently trying to erase all mention of said non-Epic games exclusivity from their Kickstarter, and painting the whole picture as "The bag of cash Epic handed us didnt matter, and we totally didnt get our release window fethed because of Borderlands 3". Oh and delaying an already chronically delayed game. PGI is not an organization with a good rep for community relations. This situation is pouring gasoline on flames that have been burning for years.
For those going heavily into this kickstarter, are the designs significantly better than the already updated versions of mechs in Mechwarrior Online? I recently found probably a hundred free mech designs from that game for free download on thingiverse and was curious as to the opinions on a comparison. Some of them have been there for a while but I only bothered to search for them on a lark because of this kickstarter. I don't actually have a 3d printer (yet... fingers crossed!) but it seems like a free goldmine with zero risk unlike kickstarters.
Your's sincerely, a kickstarter backer whose first and only real crowdfunding experience was unfortunately Robotech Tactics.
warboss wrote: For those going heavily into this kickstarter, are the designs significantly better than the already updated versions of mechs in Mechwarrior Online? I recently found probably a hundred free mech designs from that game for free download on thingiverse and was curious as to the opinions on a comparison. Some of them have been there for a while but I only bothered to search for them on a lark because of this kickstarter. I don't actually have a 3d printer (yet... fingers crossed!) but it seems like a free goldmine with zero risk unlike kickstarters.
Your's sincerely, a kickstarter backer whose first and only real crowdfunding experience was unfortunately Robotech Tactics.
I think that CGL's designs are nicer than the MWO ones. Definitely a subjective opinion, there, but there you go.
I've got a fair few of the MWO minis and whilst they're a big improvement on the old ones, they seem to share a similar design ethic - not a bad one, mind you, but having stared at them in mini form and in the BT computer game form, sometimes I have to concentrate to work out what's what. No such problem with the CGL minis; I remember looking at the previews for the AGOAC box and thinking "that's a Battlemaster! That's a Shadowhawk! That's a... a... Thunderbolt... I think..."
If we'd been provided with MWO designs, I'd still have been happy, but I like the newer designs even more.
The STL’s May be “free”, but you need to factor in the cost and time of the 3D printer - personally, I’ve been underwhelmed with the results and frustration of getting quality 3D prints that I’ve handled.
warboss wrote: For those going heavily into this kickstarter, are the designs significantly better than the already updated versions of mechs in Mechwarrior Online? I recently found probably a hundred free mech designs from that game for free download on thingiverse and was curious as to the opinions on a comparison. Some of them have been there for a while but I only bothered to search for them on a lark because of this kickstarter. I don't actually have a 3d printer (yet... fingers crossed!) but it seems like a free goldmine with zero risk unlike kickstarters.
Your's sincerely, a kickstarter backer whose first and only real crowdfunding experience was unfortunately Robotech Tactics.
Spoiler:
ORIGINAL WOLVERINE
UPDATED WOLVERINE
MECHWARRIOR ONLINE WOLVERINE
As you can see, the updated art that CGL is using is closer to the original art than what MWO is using.
Chillreaper wrote:I think that CGL's designs are nicer than the MWO ones. Definitely a subjective opinion, there, but there you go.
I've got a fair few of the MWO minis and whilst they're a big improvement on the old ones, they seem to share a similar design ethic - not a bad one, mind you, but having stared at them in mini form and in the BT computer game form, sometimes I have to concentrate to work out what's what. No such problem with the CGL minis; I remember looking at the previews for the AGOAC box and thinking "that's a Battlemaster! That's a Shadowhawk! That's a... a... Thunderbolt... I think..."
If we'd been provided with MWO designs, I'd still have been happy, but I like the newer designs even more.
I asked for opinions so it would be foolish for me to think they're not subjective unless you're doing a strict accuracy comparison of the translation of one medium to another (like going from 2d drawings to 3d models in this case). I do like the new designs as well but I'm not particuarly partial to them over the MWO ones hence my initial question.
Stormonu wrote:The STL’s May be “free”, but you need to factor in the cost and time of the 3D printer - personally, I’ve been underwhelmed with the results and frustration of getting quality 3D prints that I’ve handled.
But that is, like, just my opinion, man.
Most definitely the printer isn't free.. nor is the resin, fep film, etc. Perhaps I didn't phrase the original post as well as I could to indicate that. I was more referring to the designs. What do you think of the new Catalyst versions compared with the MWO variants of ostensibly the same mechs?
Ghaz wrote: As you can see, the updated art that CGL is using is closer to the original art than what MWO is using.
I'd agree it's closer. In my case, though, I'm not a fan of the unfinished Drafting 101 1980's style of Battletech art with the only mechs from that original era that I liked back in the day being the Robotech designs. In my case, being closer to the art isn't a strong selling point but obviously YMMV. That doesn't stop me from judging the new 3d designs based on their own merits though; I do actually like the new designs/models but not much more that the MWO designs personally. For me at least, they're equivalent. Do you have a preference?
Stormonu wrote: The STL’s May be “free”, but you need to factor in the cost and time of the 3D printer - personally, I’ve been underwhelmed with the results and frustration of getting quality 3D prints that I’ve handled.
They have added a 'Backer and Social Media' stretch goal. If the Kickstarter reaches 6,000 backers, 1,000 Facebook Announcement shares and 500 Twitter Announcement retweets you'll be able to get the 'mechs from the Clan Invasion box for $25. There are currently 5,167 backers, 802 Facebook Announcement shares and 426 Twitter Announcement retweets.
Personally I prefer the older and newer designs/artwork over the MWO stuff. The MWO stuff looks to blocky and you lose the character over the various IS mechs especially.
Personally I like the way CGL are going with the mechs, little bit of an update but yet still remind you of the originals, I hope they keep going that way.and would say even go a little bit more classic especially on the legs and arms of the IS stuff which seems to be where the main influence from MWO is.
For logistical reasons, adding 3 more points of Elementals would be more efficient...grab a box post Q/C instead of cherry-picking two of each. May only be a few pennies in a large enough print run, so definitely a good idea past the 1.5.
As GenCon is upon us the latest update mentions how updates will be sparse during this period (and talks a lot about 'Why Kickstarter?').
It also means they've added some new Stretch Goals to cover us 'til the end of Gen-Con:
$1,625,000 - New poster maps of 2025 and 3052 Inner Sphere to be included in the Clan Invasion box. Plus a 'Mech recognition poster that will be free for Ristar and above (so that's every $30 pledge and above). This poster will feature all 92 'Mechs once the redesign is complete.
$1,750,000 - A new painting guide free to everyone that has House Kurita and Clan Smoke Jaguar to start with. Stated as a living document, adding new factions each month.
$1,875,000 - A rematch of the game between the HBS crew and the BTech crew, except rather than taking place in the BattleTech PC game, it'll be played with BTech proper. Losers have to shave their beards off.
$2,000,000 - ???
It's another mystery Stretch Goal!
Also, the 3D Warhammer:
The Warhammer is one of my fav 'Mechs, and it looks great here!
A rematch of the game between the HBS crew and the BTech crew, except rather than taking place in the BattleTech PC game, it'll be played with BTech proper. Losers have to shave their beards off.
I don't normally watch other games but that might be worth watching a lotta the HBS crew are folks who where involved with Battletech in the beginning
The fluff explanation about originally carrying infantry cargo pods makes it tolerable, but yeah... silly arms.
I've wanted a Gargoyle for years and this is a nice design, just a pity that it's basically a Clan Charger - no where nearly as scary as it looks. I've also wanted a nice (ugly) Orion, too - the SRM4 looks better in the torso, but it's going to mess with my head not having it in the arm.
That Orion is sexy. It's always been one of my favorites on paper but the miniature was kind of meh. Let's see if this time it transitions to 3d better.
I always liked the custom version we made for Solaris matches. Ran very hot, but when you're fighting in The Factory nothing says "Go away!" quite like a point-blank MRM40.
I always liked the custom version we made for Solaris matches. Ran very hot, but when you're fighting in The Factory nothing says "Go away!" quite like a point-blank MRM40.
I dunno, twin UAC 20s work pretty well for that too!
So, in the latest update they've shared the process and the results of the 'Voting off the Dropship" poll.
I'm sad that I tried to vote in the Grizzly, but instead the Kodiak got voted off lol
edit: I do think that overall the new line-up is more representative of fan favorites and 'popular' mechs, so its all good. Just feel bad no bear mechs haha.
The revised packs are awful. Adding in boring 'Mechs everyone already has (Centurion, Hunchback, Zeus, Dragon, Spiders... uhh), and removing some great ones (Hellion, the entire bloody Berserker Lance and the Kodiak - who in their right mind thought that was a good idea?).
Worse, the two "choose your own adventure" packs are IS! I wasn't expecting both to be Clan, but I was expecting one of them to be Clan.
This is a major downer for this KS, as these new choices are either nonsensical or boring. And I say that as someone who wanted a Night Gyr.
Seems odd to change that much stuff on more or less a whim.
I have to agree that the line up is a lot more boring sorry classic now.
So thanks to the polls is there less clan mechs available now and if so is that just the anti clan faction of “fans” trying to hijack the KS?
H.B.M.C. wrote:The revised packs are awful. Adding in boring 'Mechs everyone already has (Centurion, Hunchback, Zeus, Dragon, Spiders... uhh), and removing some great ones (Hellion, the entire bloody Berserker Lance and the Kodiak - who in their right mind thought that was a good idea?).
Worse, the two "choose your own adventure" packs are IS! I wasn't expecting both to be Clan, but I was expecting one of them to be Clan.
This is a major downer for this KS, as these new choices are either nonsensical or boring. And I say that as someone who wanted a Night Gyr.
Yeah, like for the most part they aint great, but I doubt they are gonna listen now.
SeanDrake wrote:Seems odd to change that much stuff on more or less a whim.
I have to agree that the line up is a lot more boring sorry classic now.
So thanks to the polls is there less clan mechs available now and if so is that just the anti clan faction of “fans” trying to hijack the KS?
Based on backer voting, some mech got kicked off the dropship and replaced with (what are presumably) fan favorites.
For someone like me who is just starting out, its fine because I don't have much of anything anyway. But for long-time mechheads like HBMC I can understand its less appealing.
What I don't get is HOW the Urbanmech was not added in, based on the comments and the votes it seemed a shoo-in. At this point I'm half-sure CGL is trolling, and the 2M stretch goal will be a 6 inch gold plated urbie statue or somesuch (But still not available in lance packs)
I thought that the vote thing they put up was to remove one 'Mech. I didn't realise that by submitting my Community Lance ideas that that would also contribute to removing 'Mechs (like the Kodiak, still a major WTF?).
Anyway, I've reduced my pledge as there's no Berserker lance any more, and the two Community Lances are just IntroTech grog gak to make the 4th Succession War 4eva people happy.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I thought that the vote thing they put up was to remove one 'Mech. I didn't realise that by submitting my Community Lance ideas that that would also contribute to removing 'Mechs (like the Kodiak, still a major WTF?).
Anyway, I've reduced my pledge as there's no Berserker lance any more, and the two Community Lances are just IntroTech grog gak to make the 4th Succession War 4eva people happy.
in fairness the "4th war 4evah" people proably aren't the main drive here (they are as I've said befoire a small minority) but classic designs that have been around for ever and are used by everyone are proably going to be more popular then a design associated strongly with one faction. I know one of the former line developers once commented at how faction focused the community is. to the point where people will only buy handbooks for their factions etc. I'm not sure TBH how 100% I belive that but it is what it is.
Anyway, I've reduced my pledge as there's no Berserker lance any more, and the two Community Lances are just IntroTech grog gak to make the 4th Succession War 4eva people happy.
Wait, no more Beserker? Where is this at? How do we undo this travesty.
Dunno yet. They said they were listening, now they're going to have to listen to the backlash of changing a bunch of 'Mechs when a lot of us figured they'd be dumping the most called for one rather than entire Lances (that was what was implied with the poll), as well as the backlash for adding two more IS Lances to the Clan Invasion Kickstarter, and also for removing the Kodiak.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Dunno yet. They said they were listening, now they're going to have to listen to the backlash of changing a bunch of 'Mechs when a lot of us figured they'd be dumping the most called for one rather than entire Lances (that was what was implied with the poll), as well as the backlash for adding two more IS Lances to the Clan Invasion Kickstarter, and also for removing the Kodiak.
#JusticeforGhostBear
Maybe the fact that the two new lances are IS design is indicative that, at this point, people are requesting classic IS designs more than obscure Clan ones ?
I mean, how many classic Clan mechs aren't in there already ? Before I get DFAed, I say that as someone whose pledge is all-Clan so far.
If they want to make the two user-packs into boring IntroTech Lances, then fine. But then they went and fethed with half a dozen of the other lances, removing things that were fun (like the Kodiak) or outright destroying the entire purpose of other packs (the Berserker Lance).
The revisions have good and bad in them. The best part for me are the Goshawk, Peregrine, and Vixen all in one pack now!
Like HBMC said, the Inner Sphere designs are mostly more perplexing. I love the inclusion of the plastic Thug and Sentinel, but find it odd that the Raven, Cataphract, and Victor all got involved- they're only a generation of plastic behind from the Alpha Strike Lance packs.I'd have rather continued to see ones that haven't appeared in plastic at all, or much longer.
I'll predict the Urban lance as their least ordered from this kickstarter- it's a solid lance, but it's just boring.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Dunno yet. They said they were listening, now they're going to have to listen to the backlash of changing a bunch of 'Mechs when a lot of us figured they'd be dumping the most called for one rather than entire Lances (that was what was implied with the poll), as well as the backlash for adding two more IS Lances to the Clan Invasion Kickstarter, and also for removing the Kodiak.
#JusticeforGhostBear
Maybe the fact that the two new lances are IS design is indicative that, at this point, people are requesting classic IS designs more than obscure Clan ones ?
I mean, how many classic Clan mechs aren't in there already ? Before I get DFAed, I say that as someone whose pledge is all-Clan so far.
I have to agree. A clan totem mech has limited appeal compared to a standard design. Even for another Clan player who just wants more standard OpFor IS mechs for their toys to fight.
The 4th war only crowd are a very tiny minority of the fan base. Like 2nd edition only players in 40k. Anyway the real old school BTers view anything past the original setting as too far a bridge to cross. The 4th war originally got a lot of the flak the Clans and Jihad eventually got.
"What do you mean there's functioning mech factories?" A living universe has its refugees at every major story arc change.
playing devil's advocate the Kodak is a second line assault mech mostly associated with the ghost bears, I mean it's not super obscure but it's not exactly a common machine eaither.
HudsonD wrote: Eh, I agree with the Kodiak, even though I like the Stone Rhino.
On the other hand, what's wrong with "Introtech Lances", and having solid, classic designs for people that might interested in getting into the game ?
if they're all in the basic boxed set game it is a tad odd you'd think people would have those already. of course it might be this is why they're doing it. people have complained about an inability to get the core set so by making the emchs in it avalaible outside it it should, in theory, ease some of the pressure on the stock of the core sets.
niall78 wrote: I have to agree. A clan totem mech has limited appeal compared to a standard design. Even for another Clan player who just wants more standard OpFor IS mechs for their toys to fight.
But the Kodiak was part of a 2nd Line Star. It was a good fit. Have all the new IS packs you want, however boring, but why mess with the ones that are already there?
HudsonD wrote: On the other hand, what's wrong with "Introtech Lances", and having solid, classic designs for people that might interested in getting into the game ?
There's enough IntroTech stuff in all the lances we have and the 10 'Mechs in the starter boxes.
Including the redesigned unseen, we'd have a long list of some of the most basic and iconic IS 'Mechs around:
Did they really have to go and add another Hunchback? Dragon? Enforcer? Cyclops? Another fething Spider? These are 'Mechs that have been part of the starterbox since the 4th Ed box came out, and that wasn't exactly new when I bought it nineteen years ago!
No longer being produced-
Fire Falcon
Hellion
Kodiak
Whitworth
Bombardier
Howler (Baboon)
Solitaire
Pack Hunter
Scarybus
Firestarter Omni
Berserker
Hermes
Will be produced-
Night Gyr
Linebacker
Behemoth (Stone Rhino)
Zeus
Stalker
Hellhound
Goshawk
Piranha
Cataphract
Bushwhacker
Axman
Nightstar
New lance-
Raven
Enforcer
Hunchback
Victor
New Lance-
Dragon
Thug
Cyclops
Spider
And Sentinel.
Sorry the formatting stinks, but it might be easier to figure out than their google doc.
Gitzbitah wrote: No longer being produced-
Fire Falcon
Hellion
Kodiak
Whitworth
Bombardier
Howler (Baboon)
Solitaire
Pack Hunter
Scarybus
Firestarter Omni
Berserker
Hermes
Will be produced-
Night Gyr
Linebacker
Behemoth (Stone Rhino)
Zeus
Stalker
Hellhound
Goshawk
Piranha
Cataphract
Bushwhacker
Axman
Nightstar
New lance-
Raven
Enforcer
Hunchback
Victor
New Lance-
Dragon
Thug
Cyclops
Spider
And Sentinel.
Sorry the formatting stinks, but it might be easier to figure out than their google doc.
Good changes in my view. Only two I'd miss would be the Firestarter Omni and the Berserker.
There will always be mechs that I want that won't be on the list. CGL could run a dozen kickstarter filling out my preferences for mechs/tanks/vees/battle armour/infantry. Let alone rolling out a comprehensive range for all the hotness in the BT universe over its different eras.
One thing worth noting is that with very few exceptions the mechs on the no longer produced list are mechs that post date the clan invasion.
really once you remove the Bombadier and Hermes, SLDF machines. almost all of those mechs appered post clan invasion. so over all I think I understand the logic here.
I think changing the offerings this sign ificantly is a really dumb move,
loads of backers pay little or no attention to a KS once the back, and will be expecting those now vanished mechs and be very annoyed when they hit the PM and find they're gone
BrianDavion wrote:
if they're all in the basic boxed set game it is a tad odd you'd think people would have those already. of course it might be this is why they're doing it. people have complained about an inability to get the core set so by making the emchs in it avalaible outside it it should, in theory, ease some of the pressure on the stock of the core sets.
... Except they're not in the base box.
H.B.M.C. wrote:
Did they really have to go and add another Hunchback? Dragon? Enforcer? Cyclops? Another fething Spider? These are 'Mechs that have been part of the starterbox since the 4th Ed box came out, and that wasn't exactly new when I bought it nineteen years ago!
Yes, yes they do, and I have that box around. There weren't any minis in it.
So unless you mean "20 years ago, those classic designs existed as cardboard cuts in the base box, and also as very crummy bits of pewter, so, really, why should they be re-released today as (reasonnably) modern, decent plastic new sculpts ?!", I don't think I can agree with your premise.
This KS isn't made so that you, or me, can get another Hunchback, it's made so that new blood can look at boxes on a store shelf and go "Oh, I want this", and get to playing afterward. It's a goal I'm happy to support.
I remember playing a game of Battle Tech when I first got into gaming all those years ago. I'll check this out and get a feel fo or what I need. Is there a place I can have a good read if the background?
To a new player the 'Mechs mean nothing. They don't their Awesomes from the Atlases.
To the people who have been playing suddenly changing a 1/3rd of them is a somewhat bigger deal, especially when we were given no indication that so much would change. The poll was for the 'Mech we wanted to remove, we got one choice of every 'Mech so far, and figured there'd be one winner (or loser, depending on your point of view), not twelve.
I think that making the two user-created packs IntroTech is boring, but it just means they're ones I won't buy. Cutting out so many 'Mechs is a different story altogether.
And the main sticking point is that it was never explained in this manner.
H.B.M.C. wrote: To a new player the 'Mechs mean nothing. They don't their Awesomes from the Atlases.
To the people who have been playing suddenly changing a 1/3rd of them is a somewhat bigger deal, especially when we were given no indication that so much would change. The poll was for the 'Mech we wanted to remove, we got one choice of every 'Mech so far, and figured there'd be one winner (or loser, depending on your point of view), not twelve.
I think that making the two user-created packs IntroTech is boring, but it just means they're ones I won't buy. Cutting out so many 'Mechs is a different story altogether.
And the main sticking point is that it was never explained in this manner.
IMHO the user creator packs should have been 1 IS pack and 1 clan pack, but *shrugs* my pledge isn't high eneugh to get a vote*
loads of backers pay little or no attention to a KS once the back, and will be expecting those now vanished mechs and be very annoyed when they hit the PM and find they're gone
Now that I think about it. What's even dumber is that they went made a big change and (IMHO) are not communicating it correctly to the backers. From the backer update:
"I’d originally thought of placing it into a graphic, but then realized it would be much easier for everyone to review the spreadsheet, determine which designs are being moved off the DropShip, and what the new Lance and Star Packs will entail."
I can't agree, the changes should be in a graphic, on the front page, replacing the old offer. Not on a google doc link in a backer only update. At least take down the old and incorrect info.
I personally am fine with the changes, its a w/e for me (though they should have left in the Kodiak lol). But this seems to be a sure fire way to court backer anger, for no apparent gain.
The apparent gain is not paying for a graphic. Those are expensive. Also, moving towards stuff that is cheaper/further along in development. They have lots of stuff 'in development' including Elementals. Anything they do to shorten that funnel of stuff they don't have production-ready is a benefit to them. Also a benefit to getting the KS fulfilled...
H.B.M.C. wrote: To a new player the 'Mechs mean nothing. They don't their Awesomes from the Atlases.
Can confirm. It took me about a minute to realize that the Awesome is the name of a mech.
When it comes time to choose add ons. I'm going to be the perfect representation of that meme where the guy is looking at two red buttons and not knowing which to pick.
H.B.M.C. wrote: To a new player the 'Mechs mean nothing. They don't their Awesomes from the Atlases.
Can confirm. It took me about a minute to realize that the Awesome is the name of a mech.
When it comes time to choose add ons. I'm going to be the perfect representation of that meme where the guy is looking at two red buttons and not knowing which to pick.
Isn't that meme about how one choice is obvious, but the dude is still sweating it anyways?
Nurglitch wrote: The apparent gain is not paying for a graphic. Those are expensive. Also, moving towards stuff that is cheaper/further along in development. They have lots of stuff 'in development' including Elementals. Anything they do to shorten that funnel of stuff they don't have production-ready is a benefit to them. Also a benefit to getting the KS fulfilled...
But they haven't shortened anything. They've added to what they had to design.
I’m really happy with the changes and the contents of the “mystery” lances. Getting cool updated sculpts for iconic and beloved ‘mechs is fantastic imho.
I can see why some people don’t like the changes, and I’m a bit baffled by the Kodiak change myself. I’m not trying to say anyone else’s opinion is wrong but I’m glad to be getting better minis for some of my favorite ‘mechs like the Hunchback and Cyclops.
Nurglitch wrote: The apparent gain is not paying for a graphic. Those are expensive. Also, moving towards stuff that is cheaper/further along in development. They have lots of stuff 'in development' including Elementals. Anything they do to shorten that funnel of stuff they don't have production-ready is a benefit to them. Also a benefit to getting the KS fulfilled...
But the changes are the result of a fan vote. Are you suggesting that CGL's original production funnel was suboptimal, but the fan vote results actually managed to tighten and focus them? I feel that is implausible.
Regardless, my point was that that CGL should communicate this change better, to avoid future drama down the road. Starting with yes updating their graphic or at least taking it down. Is that really so weird to expect? Again, I am FINE with the changes, its just that I 100% guarantee some guy is saying ooooh I like this Berserker Lance, plops down 20 and then gets surprised and butthurt when he receives something else. Is CGL liable? Probably not. But we know people will whine anyway. Proper updating just seems like a logical way to settle any drama before it begins. My 2 c-bills.
No longer being produced-
Fire Falcon
Hellion
Kodiak
Whitworth
Bombardier
Howler (Baboon)
Solitaire
Pack Hunter
Scarybus
Firestarter Omni
Berserker
Hermes
I'll miss the Whitworth and Hermes. I would have liked to see the Fire Falcon, but as primarily a Jade Falcon 'mech I can understand it being cut for something that would be in more widespread use.
Will be produced-
Night Gyr
Linebacker
Behemoth (Stone Rhino)
Zeus
Stalker
Hellhound
Goshawk
Piranha
Cataphract
Bushwhacker
Axman
Nightstar
Scratching my head on the inclusion of the Night Gyr, Linebacker and Nightstar. Still no Ostroc or Ostsol
New lance-
Raven
Enforcer
Hunchback
Victor
The Raven seems a little too specialized to be included IMHO
Nurglitch wrote: The apparent gain is not paying for a graphic. Those are expensive. Also, moving towards stuff that is cheaper/further along in development. They have lots of stuff 'in development' including Elementals. Anything they do to shorten that funnel of stuff they don't have production-ready is a benefit to them. Also a benefit to getting the KS fulfilled...
But the changes are the result of a fan vote. Are you suggesting that CGL's original production funnel was suboptimal, but the fan vote results actually managed to tighten and focus them? I feel that is implausible.
Regardless, my point was that that CGL should communicate this change better, to avoid future drama down the road. Starting with yes updating their graphic or at least taking it down. Is that really so weird to expect? Again, I am FINE with the changes, its just that I 100% guarantee some guy is saying ooooh I like this Berserker Lance, plops down 20 and then gets surprised and butthurt when he receives something else. Is CGL liable? Probably not. But we know people will whine anyway. Proper updating just seems like a logical way to settle any drama before it begins. My 2 c-bills.
Maybe they weren't anticipating quite this level of funding and they're pivoting to make sure that their production structure lines up with their KS structure. For all the savings they make on being able to make a bigger order, they'll incur more costs (paid off over the long run) in bringing 'mechs to plastic. It looks like they're going to make a lot of money, but in terms of what's left over after everyone is paid? I'm making the assumption that any changes they make are to their benefit, as well as the perceived benefit of the people they consulted about the change. The benefit that strikes me is moving stuff that was planned for a regular release following AGOAC being shuffled into the KS order. Of course, I could be completely wrong. I've noticed that happening with increasing frequency of late.
That said, I'm excited to see what they'll do with a plastic Stalker.
So now the grogs have won what's the bet you get a lot of dropout's from the higher tier pledges as the have all ready voted.
The other option is catalyst have gak the bed and realised they have no chance of.producing that many techs and have swapped out stuff to make production easier.
SeanDrake wrote: So now the grogs have won what's the bet you get a lot of dropout's from the higher tier pledges as the have all ready voted.
The other option is catalyst have gak the bed and realised they have no chance of.producing that many techs and have swapped out stuff to make production easier.
I don't see how Catalyst can be worry about production problems seeing how they probably haven't begun production on any plastic miniatures beyond the five in the boxset and the first couple packs (which haven't changed). I'll be watching the Kicktraq data, but I'd bet any potential losses from this dustup are offset by Gencon excitement.
Well, this was always going to be the Khan and upwards decisions, and they talked about it at length about the web chats planned for those levels. While I hope the Kodiak makes a reappearance, I am very happy with the Stone Rhino.
I too am curious about the Linebacker and the Night Gyr, but it was not my decision.
Sacredroach wrote: I too am curious about the Linebacker and the Night Gyr, but it was not my decision.
I suggested a Linebacker as a potential addition to a new Clan Star (rather than replacing anything). It's a goofy looking overly fast heavy in dire need of a redesign, so I'm glad it's getting one. Just wish it wasn't at the expense of the Hellion, which is an incredible machine.
Sacredroach wrote: Well, this was always going to be the Khan and upwards decisions, and they talked about it at length about the web chats planned for those levels. While I hope the Kodiak makes a reappearance, I am very happy with the Stone Rhino.
I too am curious about the Linebacker and the Night Gyr, but it was not my decision.
Showing my limited experience with alot of the Mechs but I had never even heard of the Stone Rhino.
Sacredroach wrote: Well, this was always going to be the Khan and upwards decisions, and they talked about it at length about the web chats planned for those levels. While I hope the Kodiak makes a reappearance, I am very happy with the Stone Rhino.
I too am curious about the Linebacker and the Night Gyr, but it was not my decision.
Showing my limited experience with alot of the Mechs but I had never even heard of the Stone Rhino.
#JusticeForGhostBear
The Stone Rhino is the Clan name for the Behemoth.
Sacredroach wrote: Well, this was always going to be the Khan and upwards decisions, and they talked about it at length about the web chats planned for those levels. While I hope the Kodiak makes a reappearance, I am very happy with the Stone Rhino.
I too am curious about the Linebacker and the Night Gyr, but it was not my decision.
Showing my limited experience with alot of the Mechs but I had never even heard of the Stone Rhino.
#JusticeForGhostBear
AKA Behemoth. It was a Smoke Jaguar favorite and also featured in the Wolf's Dragoons I think.
Sacredroach wrote: Well, this was always going to be the Khan and upwards decisions, and they talked about it at length about the web chats planned for those levels. While I hope the Kodiak makes a reappearance, I am very happy with the Stone Rhino.
I too am curious about the Linebacker and the Night Gyr, but it was not my decision.
Showing my limited experience with alot of the Mechs but I had never even heard of the Stone Rhino.
#JusticeForGhostBear
The Stone Rhino is the Clan name for the Behemoth.
Sacredroach wrote: Well, this was always going to be the Khan and upwards decisions, and they talked about it at length about the web chats planned for those levels. While I hope the Kodiak makes a reappearance, I am very happy with the Stone Rhino.
I too am curious about the Linebacker and the Night Gyr, but it was not my decision.
Showing my limited experience with alot of the Mechs but I had never even heard of the Stone Rhino.
#JusticeForGhostBear
AKA Behemoth. It was a Smoke Jaguar favorite and also featured in the Wolf's Dragoons I think.
It looks more familiar, but its not as quickly identifiable for me.
Yeah, no way in hell the artist intended that huge cannon on the back to be just a small pulse laser, and hidden torso Gauss weapons? Makes no sense. Awesome model though, always one of my favorites design-wise
As far as omnimechs, was there ever rules for them outside campaigns? Fluffwise they're just an easy way to swap out different weapons loadouts onto the same chassis
The Stone Rhino artwork was one of the Unseen, produced out-of-house by Victor Musical Industries, Inc. so the art preceded FASA's decision to use it as the Stone Rhino.
The Kodiak thing is messing with my Ghost Bears plan...
I can understand getting rid of a 2nd line mech that's exclusively associated with a single Clan, but replacing it with another 2nd line mech that's pretty much associated with a single Clan kind of ruins that line of thinking.
Maybe I'm just not fussed about the Stone Rhino because I've got one of the originals, it's a lovely mech and I'd want three of them if it wasn't for that.
Chillreaper wrote: The Kodiak thing is messing with my Ghost Bears plan...
I can understand getting rid of a 2nd line mech that's exclusively associated with a single Clan, but replacing it with another 2nd line mech that's pretty much associated with a single Clan kind of ruins that line of thinking.
Maybe I'm just not fussed about the Stone Rhino because I've got one of the originals, it's a lovely mech and I'd want three of them if it wasn't for that.
well in fairness the stone rhino is proably in a lot of inner sphere armies after 3058
Chillreaper wrote: The Kodiak thing is messing with my Ghost Bears plan...
I can understand getting rid of a 2nd line mech that's exclusively associated with a single Clan, but replacing it with another 2nd line mech that's pretty much associated with a single Clan kind of ruins that line of thinking.
Maybe I'm just not fussed about the Stone Rhino because I've got one of the originals, it's a lovely mech and I'd want three of them if it wasn't for that.
well in fairness the stone rhino is proably in a lot of inner sphere armies after 3058
Put my pledge down again, ditching another two IS Lances.
Someone on the official forums is saying that the changes, despite saying "proposed" in the spreadsheet, are set in stone.
Guess we'll have to wait for their next update to see if that's true.
[EDIT]: And we've reached the point on the official BTech forums where people are posting dictionary definitions of the word 'some' to justify how when Catalyst said that 'some' 'Mechs may change they of course meant 1/3rd of the ones on offer.
Have to say I was hesitant before the start of this Kickstarter, since I was worried about how it was going to be run, but now that I know the full list of mechs and I know the price points I’m in for a double Galaxy Commander, which is about 4x more than I’ve ever spent on a Kickstarter. Looks like it’s not slowing down either. More new backers today than in any of the last nine and third biggest increase in funds over the last eight, and the days not over yet. Looking forward to see if GenCon brings another boost.
Justyn wrote: My bet is wave one will get fulfilled, and Loren Coleman will steal the rest to buy a new mansion.
Loren apologized for that, it was apparently an accounting error. I'm willing to forgive and move on as it's not unknown to happen to busniesses in the stage CGL was at the time.
In addition to not really trusting CGL with this much money, I’m also anxious about the stuff that CGL will be outsourcing. Totally expecting that these vendors will make for trouble and delays down the line, not because they are bad or especially unreliable; it’s just that such additional wrinkles tend to end up more of a burden as all the pieces need to move in unison to get the product moving to backers.
Manchu wrote: In addition to not really trusting CGL with this much money, I’m also anxious about the stuff that CGL will be outsourcing. Totally expecting that these vendors will make for trouble and delays down the line, not because they are bad or especially unreliable; it’s just that such additional wrinkles tend to end up more of a burden as all the pieces need to move in unison to get the product moving to backers.
obviously with any kickstarter you need to accept that it might not pan out, so yeah don't go silly.
I'm very interested to see their wave shipping schedule. Delays are a given, but I don't want to spend on shipping per delivery wave as my country can be very delivery-unfriendly. Right now my plan is to try and keep everything to whatever wave 1 turns out to be, and just get the rest on retail.
I personally apply a few rules to Kickstarters to inform whether I’ll back and by how much. If it helps anyone these were my considerations for the Battletech Kickstarter.
1. Value: This is my primary question. At the end of the day as a backer I’m taking on a decent amount of risk so I have to receive a decent amount of value in return. For me that means either a lot of exclusive stuff or receiving about 50% off MSRP. In terms of this Kickstarter I think the value is there. Based upon the material used and the quality that I’ve seen in the starter boxes, my cutoff was $5 a mech (since the mechs are what I’m most interested in), which they reached and the inclusion of maps, scenarios, etc. just sweetens the pot for me.
2. Preparation: I need to see that the stuff that’s being done for the Kickstarter is at a certain point. If all they have are a couple of sketches I’m out. Too many risks involved. In this case they already have the first few boxes basically in production (they stated everything below the $300,000 level is too far along to change the contents). They have recently produced starter boxes, with a resupply coming and they have at least the 3D designs drawn for future mechs, so I think they a decent handle on things up to and including production. They’ve also already started supplying the digital content and have cut off producing more physical content, which for me is actually a good thing. Overall I think they’ve set out realistic goals, and are prepared to get things done, although I always expect a 6 month delay. They’ve also already stated that they expect there to be at least two waves of content.
3. Kickstarter history: I’m wary of companies that do a failed Kickstarter and then try to run out another. This is where things get shaky for Catalyst. I don’t know the full details on their Shadowrun Kickstarter, but from what I gather there was a shipping issue that primarily affected Europe. I don’t know if this has been addressed (I know a few companies that switched certain partners between Kickstarters due to these types of issues), but I also live in the US where there weren’t any problems as far as I can tell, so I’m not as worried about this. If you live in Europe though I would read up on it and take it into account.
sure except given the nature of the introduction to the sucession wars TRO and the date included we're proably looking at another god damned time jump.
edit: just got a look at TRO clan invasion (utterly skippable if you have all the old TROs already) and yeah, the intro is written by a "star league loremaster Stephen Roshak oct 24 3250"
Roshak's a jade falcon blood name, for what it's worth
BrianDavion wrote: mechwarrior destiny BTW is apparently intended to be to the RPG what alphastrike is to battletech. a faster play version.
Given that character creation in ATOW requires a doctorate in economics, that's probably a good thing.
BrianDavion wrote: ... utterly skippable if you have all the old TROs already...
Wish I'd know that before I purchased it...
BrianDavion wrote: the intro is written by a "star league loremaster Stephen Roshak oct 24 3250"
Roshak's a jade falcon blood name, for what it's worth
So was the intro of TRO: Succession Wars. Same guy, slightly earlier date. It includes the line:
"The Word of Blake—a blighted and corrupt organization with foundations in invented mysticism and worship of technology—further delayed our ascension with their vile machinations and wastefulness. The ultimate defeat of that cult caused a malaise and stagnation within our ranks. It took another seven decades for us to complete Kerensky’s quest: To reclaim Terra and re-establish the Star League."
So... the Clans win. I guess that's set in stone now.
Given that character creation in ATOW requires a doctorate in economics, that's probably a good thing.
character creation isn't HARD, it is however tedious. It was actually going to be worse. originally it was going to be 100% XP buy. at least with the life modules system there's a bit of structure.
Wish I'd know that before I purchased it...
yeah so does the guy who told me that.
So was the intro of TRO: Succession Wars. Same guy, slightly earlier date. It includes the line:
"The Word of Blake—a blighted and corrupt organization with foundations in invented mysticism and worship of technology—further delayed our ascension with their vile machinations and wastefulness. The ultimate defeat of that cult caused a malaise and stagnation within our ranks. It took another seven decades for us to complete Kerensky’s quest: To reclaim Terra and re-establish the Star League."
So... the Clans win. I guess that's set in stone now.
yeah, which raises the obvious ".. ok where do we go from here?"
On the bright side, the foreword made me look into other forewords, and made me realise I didn't have the 2nd Succession War book, within which is a very interesting opening bit of fiction that changes my view of ComStar completely.
BrianDavion wrote: yeah, which raises the obvious ".. ok where do we go from here?"
I have a theory, a crazy theory that you'll probably laugh at:
Thank you for posting the video. We definitely need an Urbanmech plushie in the campaign given the love the Mech has consistently garnered.
While there was not a direct discussion of improving quality in this campaign the Q and A did include some talk about lessons learned in manufacturing and a desire to continue pushing model quality higher.
Camospaces - Making paint schemes new player friendly
Core Books are are in print, TRO: Succession Wars & TRO: Clan Invasion
Leviathans is being put out again - Kickstarter Summer 2020, all factions coming out at once for Great War and ships. Fiction is planned
Fiction News - Physical copies of Forever Faithful (sold out at con), Iron Dawn, Kill Zone (anthology), Kell Hounds (Anthology & Sold out at con), ShadowRun novels & anthologies, Shadowrun individual profiles.Randall talks about the Kickstarters, Dragon Fire, and small games news
Questions - Will Bonfire of Worlds come back out? (Yes)
Questions - IlClan question - KickStarter delayed IlClan book till 2020 & Layout guys are tied up and issues with China production issues, CGL's efforts to of tying IlClan fiction other novel authors into IClan fiction stories in the making connect to one another.
Question - How the Kickstarter's names being included in future fiction
Question - UrbanMech Plushy Toy possibility (Yes)
Question - Why there so many plushy toys?
Question - Will the Classic designs be made by IronWinds (Yes)
Question - Are there any plans for Quads (Yes) - Goliath and Scorpions need be redesign because they're too big in plastic. Likely going need to be redesigned so they fit on hexes, possibly metal.
Question - Is House Davion going have resurgence? (yes)
Question - Is DropShip on the Kickstarter going be made? (Yes) Ironwinds will be making special run for CGL
Question - MechWarrior Destiny (RPG) status - Work in progress, its using Valiant RPG rules. Art and writing together. Book will include aids for Tabletop players include special features to enhance their game.
Question - Will MechWarrior Design (RPG) have a quickstarter version by year's end? (no) However, Beta Version of the system is going to be sent to Kickstart backers by end of August.
Question - Will the Pilot Cards have game effects or fluff? (Stats) Two type pilot cards will be coming out, with basic one with stats, another one premium card with pictures on the back.
Question - is Shadowrun Spawl gangers minis coming out? (yes) For 2021. Kickstarts been helping figure out plastics works and how handle it. The Kickstart helps educate them handle Leviathans and Battletech
Questoin - When will the redesign Classics appears in TRO? (yes) when we have art, then it will be put out.
Question - When all the minis promised from the Kickstarter be done. (by Gencon 2020 prox) Will not rush for sake quality
Question - TRO Reorganization continue? (yes) No names given, but the TRO by era theme will be continue on beyond Clan Invasion and Succession Wars.
BrianDavion wrote: yeah, which raises the obvious ".. ok where do we go from here?"
The intro to TRO: Succession Wars makes it sound like the new Star League allows Inner Sphere freebirths to use old mechs with old tech in “the arena system,” which keeps the people entertained and mollified as the clans reshape society. They mention a Marik becoming a popular hero due to his exploits in a Thunderbolt.
It’s easy to piece it together. One of the clans will conquer Terra and the Inner Sphere around 3150 (there’s some mention of it happening 70 years after the Word of Blake adventures). There’ll be peace for a while - a full hundred years, I guess. Then the gladiators - a lot of them members of former noble houses - rise up and we get war all over again.
Personally, I’d give the gladiators 3250 mechs and weapons - still great for learning the game - and the Star League would use clan mechs with a shortened list of more advanced weapons. To avoid invalidating models you’d have to give every mech a variant that only included those standard weapons (I’d be comfortable adding gauss rifles to the gladiatorial weapon list - it’s too visually distinctive to eliminate, and it isn’t complicated to use). The variants we’re familiar with could be rediscovered later during the war.
It’d allow new players to start with introtech while still playing in the present, and those new players would have an easy time understanding a setting with two factions, each with a different set of mechs.
If the writers are unimaginative or the fanbase demands it, then before long we’ll get the same old houses creating the same old nations as they claw back territory from the Star League, which will, in turn, crumble into the same old clans.
If the writers are unimaginative or the fanbase demands it, then before long we’ll get the same old houses creating the same old nations as they claw back territory from the Star League, which will, in turn, crumble into the same old clans.
eradicating the old factions to introduce new ones would be a mistake. to put it bluntly the great houses have some intreating subtlty and fluff that frankly the new writers aren't quite as capable of matching.
If the writers are unimaginative or the fanbase demands it, then before long we’ll get the same old houses creating the same old nations as they claw back territory from the Star League, which will, in turn, crumble into the same old clans.
eradicating the old factions to introduce new ones would be a mistake. to put it bluntly the great houses have some intreating subtlty and fluff that frankly the new writers aren't quite as capable of matching.
I'm fine with reviving the old nations, but not so much the old houses. It's already unrealistic for the five big dynasties to all stay in power for so many centuries.
If the writers are unimaginative or the fanbase demands it, then before long we’ll get the same old houses creating the same old nations as they claw back territory from the Star League, which will, in turn, crumble into the same old clans.
eradicating the old factions to introduce new ones would be a mistake. to put it bluntly the great houses have some intreating subtlty and fluff that frankly the new writers aren't quite as capable of matching.
I'm fine with reviving the old nations, but not so much the old houses. It's already unrealistic for the five big dynasties to all stay in power for so many centuries.
It is if they tend to carry a history of keeping their family name even after marraige so many of the cadet branches of the house don;t have a differant name.
as of 3150 the Federated Suns ruler, for example, is from the Victoria Davions. the line of the New Avalon Davions having been broken. Julien Davion has to go back to Alexander Davion to find a common ancestor with Hanse Davion.
I've really enjoyed the smaller periphery states popping up in later fiction. Sure, some are moustache twirling villains like the Tortuga Dominions, but starting up with the major houses again, thoroughly intermingled with Clans, would leave the door open for the interesting stories to happen with minor players, interacting with not ilClan malcontents, the descendants of deposed rulers, those pretending to be descendants of Great Houses, and generally give you a way to show the nibbling at the edges of civilization, rather than any dramatic fall. Heck, you could even see some Periphery Clans- folks who run their kingdoms like a Clan, and are big into single combat not out of any real conviction, but because it allows them to continue to exist, just losing a champion every few years when a new Clan sweeps through to take over. They're far less likely to destroy the Bandit Kingdom if they issue a formal batchall and bid a single warrior in defense of the world- and once the Clan jumps out, everything goes back to normal.
I want to see more periphery stories, especially with mixed Clan influences.
edit- BTW, I'm far out of date with my battletech reading, I made it up to the Twilight of the Clans saga- anything I should look out for that matches this style?
Problem with this is bandits AREN'T clan. I mean that literally, bandits are, literally not clan. the clan system formally places bandits outside of clan society. which means they are not protected by a batrchal, zellbrigen etc. so a clan force would ignore a batchal issued from a force of bandits. they would not offer Zelbrigen to bandits etc. in the clan system, Bandits aren't really people.
No. I decided against getting them as part of the KS, as the shipping to Oz will be murderous. Found a place that still had all three items in stock and jumped on them.
H.B.M.C. wrote: No. I decided against getting them as part of the KS, as the shipping to Oz will be murderous. Found a place that still had all three items in stock and jumped on them.
I love the minis in this new box. They are much smaller than I expected them to be, which is great I was expecting more scalecreep nonsense.
Very good detail compared to the last boxed set minis (and I quite liked them - miles above the starterbox before that). Even more jazzed about the KS minis if they're going to look like this.
Still unhappy that they duplicated the Wolverine between boxes. They couldn't've given us a Hunchie, Centurion or Enforcer as the other 'Mech?
H.B.M.C. wrote: I love the minis in this new box. They are much smaller than I expected them to be, which is great I was expecting more scalecreep nonsense.
Very good detail compared to the last boxed set minis (and I quite liked them - miles above the starterbox before that). Even more jazzed about the KS minis if they're going to look like this.
Still unhappy that they duplicated the Wolverine between boxes. They couldn't've given us a Hunchie, Centurion or Enforcer as the other 'Mech?
just hold your wolverines, smile..... and give a good middle finger to Harmony Gold
And the 90-odd new 'Mechs from this KS appear to be of the same design standard, meaning that they'll all be in scale and won't suffer from Iron Wind Metals constant scale creep!
Really wish they had taken the sculpt from the original Warhammer design, not in love with that one at all. Such an iconic Mech they need to have a rethink.
Also hoping the finishing on the final models will be a lot sharper than the ones that exist already. Still think them moving to a better quality plastic would make a big difference.
Seems like the game is up for Harmony Gold either way and they should just give it up now for the fans of Battletech sake as it looks like Catalyst have a pretty robust workaround.
Still wish they could adjust that Warhammer, bigger cockpit, more pronounced shoulder boxes and lose the shoulder pads/pauldrons for something nearer to the original (similar to the MWO shoulder pauldrons) but guess that can’t happen :(
Harmony gold tried to go after MWO and HBS's battletech game awhile back, (claiming among other things that the Atlas battlemech was a copy of the armored Valkyrie *eyeroll*) that court case was fairly quick. it was found out that HG's ownership of Macross was questionable as it was, and it was clear they where at this time just trying to bully other companies, the judge dismissed the case with prejudice. and I've heard that the judge was openly pissed off at HG
Better positioning and more on point layer curing time for that resin, I'd say. Detail quality looks more than good enough for what it is.
And yes, more cleanup than "eh, yank the supports".
According to FB, they were done by Mack The Maker to a very tight deadline:
Stay up to 11 pm finishing the last batch of 3D printing? Check. Wake up at 02:30 to drive to GenCon? Check Deliver a 3D printed prototypes of BattleTech Kickstarter mech for Catalyst Game Labs? Check.
You'd expect more design consistency in that case. The Shadowhawk, Wolverine, Griffin, and Battlemaster are basically all the same thing while the Warhammer, Rifleman, and Longbow all shared the same legs in their Macross originals.
The FAQ seems to have been updated with shipping guesstimates:
How much will shipping cost?
We are working to estimate that with different pledge managers and fulfillment companies. Here is what we've gathered so far:
Depending on the country, a STAR CAPTAIN pledge with a couple of small add-ons is looking to run about $20-ish. CGL pays the freight and VAT (when needed) to get it into the country. If the Mech Packs chosen necessitate a second wave, that would be $12-14 as well. So, worst case, around $30-34. but perhaps much better.
For larger pledges, and especially those who require a larger second-wave... Let's say STAR COLONEL with 8 Mech Pack add-ons (full set) 2 BattleMats and a half dozen faction packs to keep it interesting. This varies a lot more, but the average looks to be coming in at $27.50 (+/-$5) for the first wave, and $18.50-ish on the second wave.
Our goal is to get this locked down with hard costs very soon. but we wanted you to see what we are seeing. Please note: these are current estimates on average pledge. A lot of places charge per-piece handling fees so adding 24 sets of dice can skew the handling fees, but they are so light they hardly bump the weight costs.
While you can't buy those STL files, I believe the designs from the Mechwarrior Online game were put out for free more or less. They're extremely similar.
Elbows wrote: While you can't buy those STL files, I believe the designs from the Mechwarrior Online game were put out for free more or less. They're extremely similar.
Oh, I know, and some are similar. Others, not so much.
Still, I like 3d printing and I'd like to show CGL that I like the new direction by being able to buy some more of their stuff.
I'd consider bumping up to the $300 level but I frankly doubt CGL's ability to meet these goals that they've set within any reasonable amount of time. I wouldn't be at all surprised if it took them 2+ years to deliver on all of the kickstarter components.
So, $150 is pretty much the sweet spot, is that fair to say?
$300 pledge is best I think, more mechs and more swag.
I meant to make them myself (thought it was clear enough from the context). I am already backing, but 3d printing is also a hobby, and a pretty fun one at that.
BTech Kickstarter Update #16 wrote:Ad Hoc Clan Star Pack
The Formation Building and Formation Building (Redux) updates have generated a combined 1,600 comments! That’s in addition to other discussions in our official forums at bg.battletech.com, Facebook groups, and more. As I mentioned in those previous posts, that level of enthusiasm and focused interaction is fantastic.
We’ve heard you regarding the ’Mechs which were ultimately voted off the DropShip. With that in mind, the following Ad Hoc Clan Star Pack will be added to the miniatures we’ll produce in plastic. As usual, this Star Pack may be selected with any Star/Lance Pack reward, and is also available as an add-on.
Kodiak
Fire Falcon
Hellion
Pack Hunter
Howler
If your favorite didn’t make the cut, never fear: ’Mechs that did not make this Kickstarter will still be fair game for redesign down the line.
Bumped my pledge up to Star Colonel as if the double forces goal is met, then it becomes cheaper to get the Star/Lance packs that way and I get the Strana Mechty map thrown in for free.
I don't care much for the Howler or Pack Hunter either, but man, that Hellion. That's one of those Clan machines that just proves how superior they are. Something that small shouldn't be able to carry that level of firepower.
BTech Kickstarter Update #16 wrote:Ad Hoc Clan Star Pack
The Formation Building and Formation Building (Redux) updates have generated a combined 1,600 comments! That’s in addition to other discussions in our official forums at bg.battletech.com, Facebook groups, and more. As I mentioned in those previous posts, that level of enthusiasm and focused interaction is fantastic.
We’ve heard you regarding the ’Mechs which were ultimately voted off the DropShip. With that in mind, the following Ad Hoc Clan Star Pack will be added to the miniatures we’ll produce in plastic. As usual, this Star Pack may be selected with any Star/Lance Pack reward, and is also available as an add-on.
Kodiak
Fire Falcon
Hellion
Pack Hunter
Howler
If your favorite didn’t make the cut, never fear: ’Mechs that did not make this Kickstarter will still be fair game for redesign down the line.
infinite_array wrote: Backers also get access to the Mechwarrior RPG beta! I'm looking forward to seeing their streamlined RPG rules.
Well, I hope they really ARE streamlined. Just got the Shadowrun 6th World book from the same company and with the same claims... And well, it didn't exactly fill me with confidence. Not only the rules seem to be an unholy mess, maybe even messier than 5th, all the while claiming it did get a streamline... It also followed tradition, with 10 whole pages of day one errata, with anything from typos to full blown missing tables (yes, multiple).
That's a "wait at least for a third printing even if you liked the reviews" game if I ever saw one...
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TalonZahn wrote: So who's dropping @$500 for all the dice and coins?
Coins are cool, but to me the dice are Must Haves.
Also, no T-Shirt Add On? Weird.
You can already get faction dice from Q-Workshop. Just saying...
I just spent way too long considering if I wanted to upgrade to the $300 pledge only to remember that I still haven't played battletech yet and have no reason to buy 12 lance/star packs at this time.
balmong7 wrote: I just spent way too long considering if I wanted to upgrade to the $300 pledge only to remember that I still haven't played battletech yet and have no reason to buy 12 lance/star packs at this time.
balmong7 wrote: I just spent way too long considering if I wanted to upgrade to the $300 pledge only to remember that I still haven't played battletech yet and have no reason to buy 12 lance/star packs at this time.
So you upped to $300, right?
I decided I prefer being married to owning all the mechs. haha
infinite_array wrote: Backers also get access to the Mechwarrior RPG beta! I'm looking forward to seeing their streamlined RPG rules.
Well, I hope they really ARE streamlined. Just got the Shadowrun 6th World book from the same company and with the same claims... And well, it didn't exactly fill me with confidence. Not only the rules seem to be an unholy mess, maybe even messier than 5th, all the while claiming it did get a streamline... It also followed tradition, with 10 whole pages of day one errata, with anything from typos to full blown missing tables (yes, multiple).
Adrian Gideon wrote:Destiny has no relation to ATOW. It’s a completely different system, it uses a variation of the Cue system, like Cosmic Patrol, Valiant, and Anarchy.
I'm not an RPG'er so I have no opinion on the Cue System.
infinite_array wrote: Backers also get access to the Mechwarrior RPG beta! I'm looking forward to seeing their streamlined RPG rules.
Well, I hope they really ARE streamlined. Just got the Shadowrun 6th World book from the same company and with the same claims... And well, it didn't exactly fill me with confidence. Not only the rules seem to be an unholy mess, maybe even messier than 5th, all the while claiming it did get a streamline... It also followed tradition, with 10 whole pages of day one errata, with anything from typos to full blown missing tables (yes, multiple).
Adrian Gideon wrote:Destiny has no relation to ATOW. It’s a completely different system, it uses a variation of the Cue system, like Cosmic Patrol, Valiant, and Anarchy.
I'm not an RPG'er so I have no opinion on the Cue System.
...I do. It can be summed up as such: "not even with a 10-foot pole". Shadowrun: Anarchy, a game for which they used the very same system, is a dumpster fire.
One for which, years after the fact, they have not even fixed the pregenerated characters, of which there are like 30 of them, and not many even work as designed.
...I do. It can be summed up as such: "not even with a 10-foot pole". Shadowrun: Anarchy, a game for which they used the very same system, is a dumpster fire.
One for which, years after the fact, they have not even fixed the pregenerated characters, of which there are like 30 of them, and not many even work as designed.
Yeah, nope.
I can confirm that Shadowrun Anarchy is a mess. Problems/typos/errors were brought up before release and not ever to my knowledge corrected. I tried getting into it long after the (gencon?) preview/beta/whatever release and the same issues people complained about months earlier in various reviews and forum threads persisted a year later. Shadowrun 5e was similarly put together and never fixed given that they're releasing the follow up 6e now. I wouldn't consider Catalyst to be a reliable company with regards to correcting any problems after they're released given my experiences with them for multiple editions of Shadowrun though I can't comment on Battletech specifically.
...I do. It can be summed up as such: "not even with a 10-foot pole". Shadowrun: Anarchy, a game for which they used the very same system, is a dumpster fire.
One for which, years after the fact, they have not even fixed the pregenerated characters, of which there are like 30 of them, and not many even work as designed.
Yeah, nope.
I can confirm that Shadowrun Anarchy is a mess. Problems/typos/errors were brought up before release and not ever to my knowledge corrected. I tried getting into it long after the (gencon?) preview/beta/whatever release and the same issues people complained about months earlier in various reviews and forum threads persisted a year later. Shadowrun 5e was similarly put together and never fixed given that they're releasing the follow up 6e now. I wouldn't consider Catalyst to be a reliable company with regards to correcting any problems after they're released given my experiences with them for multiple editions of Shadowrun though I can't comment on Battletech specifically.
they're a bit better with battletech but battletech has a stable ruleset thats like 30 years old and the folks running CGL are, bluntly, more battletech guys so likely pay closer attention
I wound up sticking with the $150 level. I know the $300 level seems like the best buy but honestly the chances of me actually sitting down and playing Battletech are... slim.
At this point I think the only time I am actually gonna push a mech around is in a PC. Still, I do love the sculpts and the challenge coins and the swag.
About 2"/50mm in diameter, heavy. They're given out as tokens, originally in the military, for perfoming some action or belonging to a unit. The US President gives them out to military types who he meets. They're not always military in origin, some professional orgs give them out too.
Since the nice ones are relatively expensive to produce I suspect the BT ones will be a lot smaller and thinner, more like pins. Might look nice as a display though.
within the battletech universe they're used among clanners to detirmine the venue of a blood named trial. each contestant has a challange coin, with the clan symbol on one side, and their name on the other. the coins re then placed in one of those spiral gravity well wishing well things, I forget the exact order, but depending on whose coin reaches the bottem first one of the contenders gets to choose the weapons, and the other gets to choose the venue.
So if I won I could declare "we'll fight augmented" (IE mechs, battle armor whatever your specialty is) and my opponent would get to choose where we fight.
useally the augmented or not bit can give a huuuge advantage (m,echs have a advantage augmented vs an elemental, but an elemental would flatten a mechwarrior unaugmented)
H.B.M.C. wrote: "How will you fight?"
"We will fight unaugmented!"
"Very well. And you, where will this fight take place?"
"Underwater!"
"Wait... what?"
actually thats not too far off something that actually happened. During his Bloodname trial Phelan Kell had to fight an elemental unaugmented. he choose to fight on a ship in the cargo bay of a ship in space so as to engage the element in a zero gravity enviroment. the choice of location won him the match
It seems apropos, considering how much the Clans obsess with the number 5, that with five days left to go, we unveil the 2m Stretch Goal!
While the Pledge Level graphics have been updated on the site, due to how long it has all gotten with so many great graphics--pledge levels, stretch goals, and so on--I thought I'd make it easy and simply post it here as well.
$2,000,000 –NO GUTS, NO GALAXY! BattleTech is filled with endless stories and tabletop fun. This campaign has unlocked a huge swath of such action, and we’ve got even more to enhance your enjoyment of this game we all love:
· Magazine. A new, digital-only magazine envisioned as a blend of MechForce Quarterly-meets-BattleTechnology. New fiction, scenarios, and more, and all officially in canon! This community will specifically be asked for content submissions. We will commit to four issues, with timing of release to be determined. WARRIOR and above will receive the first issue for free, while STAR COLONEL and above will receive the first two issues for free.
· Reinforcements! While all players will have access to the free PDF of the record sheets for the miniatures from this campaign, all STAR COMMANDER and above will receive physical record sheets for free. Additionally, we’ll create a Reinforcements package that will include a cardboard standee for each design—exactly along the lines of those found in theBattleTech Beginner Boxand A Game of Armored Combat—corresponding to those record sheets. STAR COLONEL and above will receive this package for free.
· Camospecs: A Unit Art Manual PDF. The BattleTech community is fantastic, filled with great energy and passion that can lead to fantastic projects. One of those is the Unit Art Compendium, created by the community for MechWarrior Online. Our Camospecs: A Unit Art Manual PDF will be patterned after that amazing project. It will include a variety of paint schemes for various combat commands from the various factions, appropriate to each design, along with text discussing those details. This PDF will dove-tail into the Camospecs: A Guide to Faction Paint Schemes from the $1,750,000 Stretch Goal; each time a new How To Paint guideline is added to that PDF, it will correspond directly to a camo schemes from this Camospecs: A Unit Art Manual. WARRIOR and above will receive all PDF updates for free.
But that's not all! Oh no, the best part is the last part:
All Hail The UrbanMech!
First, the UrbanMech as its own box! All backers will be given one free UrbanMech. Additionally, this ’Mech will be provided as an add-on for any players who wish to purchase additional copies.
Second, we will commission a plushy UrbanMech! All backers will be given first access to purchase this plushy.
Urbanmech is famously ugly, the MWO one actually looks pretty cool but the original looked downright awful, the "trash can with legs" joke was well deserved. It's REDICULOUSLY slow for such a light mech, but it has 3 things going for it: it packs a heck of a wallop for it's size with the AC10, it's really cheap to produce/buy, and background-wise they made bajillions of em.
it's been one of those underdog designs that you grew to love despite it being kinda awful, because they usually die horribly but once in a while can punch WAY above it's weight class, and the design and the name naturally suit it to a lot of jokes
Late 90's, early 2000's. We're experimenting with cable internet at college (so we have the fastest internet in the country basically). I'm playing whatever the current Mechwarrior game is, and I'm playing online, a new experience.
I find a lobby which is interested in lopsided and weird games, so we select the City map...night time....no radars...and then we choose Assaults vs. Light mechs. I think we had 20 people in the room, and 5-6 went Assaults and everyone else went light mechs. Now it's early internet days, we don't have voice chat, etc., so it's all text.
We're zipping around in the city at night, trying to locate the Assault mechs. I stop in a street and look down the way to an intersection. I see a Locust (or similar tiny mech) running full speed from right to left. If we'd had voice chat I think it would have been screaming "oh gak, oh gak, oh gak!" A split second after he zips across the intersection a wall of laser fire and missiles follows it. I assume he died an instant later, but it was just one of those brilliant Mechwarrior moments that stuck out to me and I still remember it vividly to this day.
Being an old school game, it made it even more sinister without radar because draw-distance was only maybe 500 meters? So you'd be stomping down a street and suddenly see the shape of a huge assault mech. You'd pop off a shot or two and zip into a side street. One of the best Mechwarrior/Battletech experiences I've had. Great fun.
SeanDrake wrote: I keep meaning to ask but what’s with the urbie love?
I mean I have read the memes and there is some funny fan fiction but where did it start?
For a confluence of a few reasons:
1) It was a meme before the Internet as the largely acknowledged worst designed (and looking) mech of the entire 3025 lineup. It was a recon class mech that could do none of the things that recon class mechs do
2) It was a kind of poster child for min-maxing. There was a rash of 2/3 movement assault mechs slathered with every gun known to man amongst small play groups since the orignal rules favored armor over speed. The urbanmech would inevitably show up in light-mech only matches in the hope that the massive (for the weight class) autocannon would deliver some kind of hail mary shot.
3) There is no greater underdog. Even the Chameleon and Charger have roles they can fufill, but the urbanmech is a turret with aspirations. (not even a good one, since it lacked true 360 degree swiveling)
4) it was a very distinctive silhouette in the 3025 era lineup. Most mechs were based of other IPs and could be confused for their respective derivative properties, but no one else was really attaching a giant cannon to R2D2 and asking to be taken successfully.
5) Even parody products of the series included the Urbanmech. Up to an including the infamous BattleCows game.
SeanDrake wrote: I keep meaning to ask but what’s with the urbie love?
I mean I have read the memes and there is some funny fan fiction but where did it start?
It's a jumping turret, and for what it's supposed to be doing it actually works pretty well, as it's relatively cheap and the jumping makes it surprisingly mobile inside their preferred terrain. The AC/10 gives it a mean punch with decent range, and it's very well armored for its weight.
It's also fun to try and make it work for anything else, as it's kind of famously bad at anything but defending built up terrain ^^.
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Nurglitch wrote: What changed to make speed valuable? Or at least more valuable than armour and weapons?
The clans. A slow mech against the clans doesn't usually fare too well (particularly if the rest of the lance is also made up of slow mechs), because the amount of dakka they put out was about twice what you could reliably expect from any mech of any size, while being able to stay out of range of most of their weapons.
SeanDrake wrote: I keep meaning to ask but what’s with the urbie love?
I mean I have read the memes and there is some funny fan fiction but where did it start?
It's a jumping turret, and for what it's supposed to be doing it actually works pretty well, as it's relatively cheap and the jumping makes it surprisingly mobile inside their preferred terrain. The AC/10 gives it a mean punch with decent range, and it's very well armored for its weight.
It's also fun to try and make it work for anything else, as it's kind of famously bad at anything but defending built up terrain ^^.
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Nurglitch wrote: What changed to make speed valuable? Or at least more valuable than armour and weapons?
The clans. A slow mech against the clans doesn't usually fare too well (particularly if the rest of the lance is also made up of slow mechs), because the amount of dakka they put out was about twice what you could reliably expect from any mech of any size, while being able to stay out of range of most of their weapons.
no the clans have changed. they're talking the pre-clan days. the clans also are about when the game introduced XL engines, Endosteel internals etc that made faster mechs a little more viable. prior to those various weight saving techs getting a fast mech was pretty hard. 6/9/6 (the speed of a Phawk) was aboiut the normal speed of a light mech and a few notable mediums. most mediums moved at 5/8 or 4/6.
by 3050 you had a number of mediums maintaining the same armor and weapons levels, and boosting their speed. the centrion went from 4/6 to 6/9. and you even had a 55 ton mech capable of moving an insane 7/11/7 in the form of the wraith
I love the Wraith. It's my favorite mech from TRO 3055. Takes some skill to use it but it's a beast.
About the Urbie, my first encounter with one was in the old game the Crescent Hawks revenge where you got to use 2 in a city defense scenario. It was quite a shock to see how much of a punch it packed compared to other lights even if it was ugly as a sin.
BrianDavion wrote: no the clans have changed. they're talking the pre-clan days. the clans also are about when the game introduced XL engines, Endosteel internals etc that made faster mechs a little more viable. prior to those various weight saving techs getting a fast mech was pretty hard. 6/9/6 (the speed of a Phawk) was aboiut the normal speed of a light mech and a few notable mediums. most mediums moved at 5/8 or 4/6.
by 3050 you had a number of mediums maintaining the same armor and weapons levels, and boosting their speed. the centrion went from 4/6 to 6/9. and you even had a 55 ton mech capable of moving an insane 7/11/7 in the form of the wraith
I started in 1989. The rule don't seem to have changed much. What's changed, back slightly after I started, is that some new options and trade-offs were introduced pretty much at the same time. Nothing in the rules improves the defensive utility of speed, 'mechs can just be made faster since TO:3050 was released in 1990.
That would just be the start. Basically the walking boombox needs a complete overhaul from the ground up.
Spoiler:
There are very mechs I absolutely despise the look of. The Yeoman tops that list.
I wish I had the money to get in on this Kickstarter, I have been lusting after a plastic Marauder for years, and throwing in the II and IIC (my all-time favourite mech since I first got into the universe with Mechwarrior 2) is just icing, but unfortunately I can't swing it right now.
BrianDavion wrote: no the clans have changed. they're talking the pre-clan days. the clans also are about when the game introduced XL engines, Endosteel internals etc that made faster mechs a little more viable. prior to those various weight saving techs getting a fast mech was pretty hard. 6/9/6 (the speed of a Phawk) was aboiut the normal speed of a light mech and a few notable mediums. most mediums moved at 5/8 or 4/6.
by 3050 you had a number of mediums maintaining the same armor and weapons levels, and boosting their speed. the centrion went from 4/6 to 6/9. and you even had a 55 ton mech capable of moving an insane 7/11/7 in the form of the wraith
I started in 1989. The rule don't seem to have changed much. What's changed, back slightly after I started, is that some new options and trade-offs were introduced pretty much at the same time. Nothing in the rules improves the defensive utility of speed, 'mechs can just be made faster since TO:3050 was released in 1990.
Well, no, you're right, the movement rules haven't changed. But the fact that those rules didn't change but that the mech creation system allowed for faster, better armed and longer ranged mechs impacted comparatively more on the slower mechs, as it made them more vulnerable and less capable of returning fire effectively.
H.B.M.C. wrote: There are some 'Mechs that use speed as their main defence. There are some that use armour. There are some (cheating Clanners, mostly) that use both.
And there are some that somehow manage to fail at both, despite being Clan Omnimechs, like the Hellbringer.
Here's a question for those current with the game:
I keep hearing that the rules have barely changed since the beginning. If I have the old Battletech Compendium (dug out of a storage closet Back Home over the weekend), why do I need Total Warfare? Do I need Total Warfare?
Psychopomp wrote: Here's a question for those current with the game:
I keep hearing that the rules have barely changed since the beginning. If I have the old Battletech Compendium (dug out of a storage closet Back Home over the weekend), why do I need Total Warfare? Do I need Total Warfare?
Because 'barely changed' does not mean 'have not changed at all'. What rulebook you need depends on what rules your group (if you're playing with a group) uses.
Psychopomp wrote: Here's a question for those current with the game:
I keep hearing that the rules have barely changed since the beginning. If I have the old Battletech Compendium (dug out of a storage closet Back Home over the weekend), why do I need Total Warfare? Do I need Total Warfare?
I don't have a clue. I would say go to catalyst web site and download the free edition and see what has changed. I believe but I can be wrong, you can still play with the original book, only a few things changed from what I read. So as long as you are not going to play against strangers in a pick up game you should be fine. I bought the PDF version since it was only $10 or so. Thing to remember is to build mechs you need a separate book.
Just to clarify, Depth 2+ water is still the OmniShield, correct? No fire in or out, mech cannot sustain damage, be targeted, etc...or has that changed?
H.B.M.C. wrote: The Hellbringer was created so that the IS would have something they could defeat.
there's been a persistant rumor floating around about the "mark one omnimechs" that where tricked out with all the bells and whistles, and whatw e got was what resulted after playtesting revealed that a loki with full ES and FFA would be disgustingly OP.
Psychopomp wrote: Here's a question for those current with the game:
I keep hearing that the rules have barely changed since the beginning. If I have the old Battletech Compendium (dug out of a storage closet Back Home over the weekend), why do I need Total Warfare? Do I need Total Warfare?
If you use the Battletech Compendium to play and don't care much about the tech released after it, then no, you don't need it at all.
So I went out and did some research on my own, since no one was able to give me the quick answer. For other returning players, here's what I came up with for rules advanced from the Compendium to Total Warfare:
Major changes to how Infantry work.
Significant changes to how vehicles work, especially the hit location charts and how motive system damage happens.
Partial cover works a bitt differently - only a +1 cover save, but you use the full hit location chart and discount hits to the legs. Less protective, but reduces the weird syndrome of almost every hit while in partial cover being straight to the face.
I also got the impression there's minor tweaks and changes to some rules, and lots of incorporated errata across the printings.
New Social Media Challenge. On the Clan Invasion Kickstarter page, go down to the 'Social Media Challenges' near the bottom of the page. Click on the Norse Foundry graphic (it will take you to the Adventurers & Adversaries 28mm D&D Resin Miniatures & Dice Kickstarter). If it receives 1,000 clicks, the size of the Challenge Coins will be increased from 1.25" to 1.5" (3.175 cm to 3.81 cm).
mumsnarf wrote: 2 days left and ~$70k to go. Think we will get that urbie? I'm not willing to up my pledge to get there that's for sure.
One thing that counts to push the total up and that you will have to do anyways is to calculate the postage you will have to pay and add it to your pledge.
Elbows wrote: Knowing Catalyst...if you like Battletech, you'd more or less have to get in on this. It'll be out of stock for 18 months following release or some silly nonsense.
This. And for yet another "historical" product at that.
I wonder what the hell happened? Things were hot back in the FanPro days, and were still jumping when Catalyst took over. Glad I dropped the game before things started slowing down and becoming niche.
In any case, if I ever decided to start playing again, and wanted to jump into the Operation:Revival era, I can just use the tons of stuff from the FASA era I bought back in the 80's and 90's.
Will characters be clan era only?
No. All realms and eras of BattleTech. No guarantee where. Make a note on your affiliation about the era you prefer.
Will the 3025/3052 maps be purchased as addons?
Currently no, but contemplating offering it. Loren says “yes”, and they’ll look into it.
Will we get concept art, even sketches, before the pledge manager comes out?
No. We will reveal it when it is worth revealing it. 60-90 days of pledge manager, we will see a good quantity, maybe ½ to ¾, we will do our best.
Will the storyline move beyond IlClan?
Yes. It is the launch pad for the future. They want to keep focus on all eras, and all products on the shelf.
Why no Star League options for faction packs and others?
Needed to cut it off somewhere. “If” we go over 2Mil, we might talk about it. Maybe it will sneak in there.
Any more Blaine Pardoe fiction?
Lol. Yes.
Will there be dice bundles and the likes?
Adding more Sku’s will be difficult, but they will ad at least one collector set for every faction. 20% discount.
Lady shirts?
Yes, there will be lady and mens shirts.
Are the elementals going to get more love than their initial model?
Goal is 10 elemental poses, but it is difficult to get all 5 on a hex (size). There is too much they do not know yet.
Strana mechty circle of equals, one giant circle if two are combines?
They are considering this. Will update this and the maps.
Novels in print instead of epub?
Printing is difficult, but print on demand will be available. Subscription (book club style) is being considered, where we would print based on the demand of subscribers, and deliver it to you.
Will the rules for elementals be included in the box set?
Yes
More kickstarters for other eras in the future?
Yes. But not until this was is done. A lot of lessons learned. If it goes well, we will do this again.
Is the 3145 the starting era for canon?
No, 3025 is the “starting point” for the IP. We plan to continue with all eras. You will see forward movement of the timeline, but we do plan to support other eras.
Which ‘Mech packs do you expect to be in the first wave?
High confidence = clan command star, IS command lance, clan heavy star. Maybe IS battle lance, and Clan fire star. Updates to come.
Aidan Pryde as a pilot card?
Hasn’t been discussed, to have current are and characters in the packs. Will consider it.
Can I delay wave 1 until wave 2 is ready?
Fulfillment company and pledge manager recommend against it heavily. Logistics and customer service point of view. Will continue to discuss.
How are euro continent countries (but not EU) categorizes for shipping?
No definite answer yet. Maybe Like EU, or like ROW. Will update.
HI and Alaska shipping?
Fast and expensive, or slow and cheaper. Loren says unless the fans want other, he suggest half cost extra weak, traceable.
TV Series?
Beyond what we can decide per Topps. Would be awesome.
Neoprene maps available ?
5th map = convention exclusive (maybe we will add it to the website, conventions. not retail).
What happens to IWM if you go plastic for the ‘Mechs.
IWM will have access to all our redesigns. Mike @ IWM considering a 5 for 4 pack of putter ‘Mechs. New plastic sculpts have proven to increase sales for IWM.
Magazine.
Plan is to go thru the older magazines, and see what we loved about them, and put that into a new magazine. We will also talk to you to see what you want.
Expectations of the kickstarter
Crack a million was the expectation.
Any time frame for Mechwarrior destiny?
Hopefully end of month (August-september 2019).
Bill leaves to Everett.
How will the Clan codex dog tag and plush urbie?
Heavy metal medallion for the dagger star, no beer bottle opener though…
Urbie plushie looks really cool, trust us, we will work on it.
Natasha Kerensky body pillow NO!
How do you plan to continue fiction, if you know where the story is going (such as the smoke jaguars being annihilated?)
We can still tell good smoke jaguar stories, and what you know may not be the entire truth. Look at the latest Blaine Pardoe story for example.
I want to get nuked.
If you are okay with your character dyeing, tell us. We can make it happen as far as your fictional character.
If I have a group of players who all pledged canon characters, can we unit into a Merc unit?
Yes. Fill-out form and affiliation, and say something like 1 of X entries. They will then bulk you all together. This might move you up the list.
How much for urbie plushie?
No idea, most expensive high end one I have prices is $42. Too much we do not know, might not be that company.
Where are the quads and OST’s?
Quads ---- John enters abruptly… ---- Quads will be worked on and redesigned, we intend to bring them on, but they didn’t fit for this kickstarter. Quads do not fit on a hex and work with the packaging. Those ‘Mechs are coming and are getting a facelift.
What about vehicles?
No. We will get to another box in the future bringing the vehicle rules and vehicles. IWM produces all those vehicles right now, so there is no immediate need. We are focusing more on retail store products.
What has been your favorite part of this kickstarter?
Loren = Reconnecting with a lot of the fan-base. Brent = Speed this kick’ed off at. Having access to die-hard fans to bounce ideas off of. John = To see that many people wanting to embrace BattleTech, and the growth.
What about LAM and aerospace?
Outside of the spoke of this core expansion. If we do this again, there will be LAMS (jokingly from Loren). Brent prefers IWM doing it.
Will we see more t-shirts?
Yes
Are the $4.99 books in the store digital?
Digital. But we are working on print on demand.
Will people be told where their characters are used?
Will try, tracking via spreadsheet, viewable publicly.
Will the alien worlds map pack be available in the pledge manager.
Yes. What wave, we are unsure
What about plastic kits with the ‘mechs on sprues (non-assembled)
Focus is miniatures for people to play. IWM is the place for assembly ‘Mechs.
And since it's close enough and I'm gong to bed...
