Really? Is GW back to handing out free benefits again?
Oh boy.
Scenery pieces are limited to, depending on the size/type, 2 or 3 per army max.
To use the Idoneth example, you can place 0 to 2 Shipwrecks.
Either 2 whole shipwrecks(and it has to be the whole shipwreck, with both parts locked together and no room between the components) or 2 halves.
The radius of the bonuses is usually limited to something like 3-4 inches tops as well.
Endless Spells cost points to add to your army though.
Thanks for the info. It's just not something I wish to see return. It was tragic to watch 7th ed 40k disintegrate because of it and seeing formations in Age of Sigmar cost points (after they added points in the first place...) seemed like such a good sign. Baby steps to be sure, but still steps in the right direction
I had hoped GW would learn from past mistakes, but this kind of thing is giving me the impression that all those fixes they do in FAQs and annuals will only last as long as people protest and when things quiet down the design team can go back to merrily fething things up again.
NinthMusketeer wrote: I wish it was like 40k where you pay points for them, rather than them mandatory.
I don't think any are mandatory; and several of them do cost points. It's just the Skaven and FEC and maybe some others, that are free. So it varies army to army. It might well be that the Khorne one you will have to pay points for.
Really? Is GW back to handing out free benefits again?
Oh boy.
Scenery pieces are limited to, depending on the size/type, 2 or 3 per army max.
To use the Idoneth example, you can place 0 to 2 Shipwrecks.
Either 2 whole shipwrecks(and it has to be the whole shipwreck, with both parts locked together and no room between the components) or 2 halves.
The radius of the bonuses is usually limited to something like 3-4 inches tops as well.
Endless Spells cost points to add to your army though.
Thanks for the info. It's just not something I wish to see return. It was tragic to watch 7th ed 40k disintegrate because of it and seeing formations in Age of Sigmar cost points (after they added points in the first place...) seemed like such a good sign. Baby steps to be sure, but still steps in the right direction
I had hoped GW would learn from past mistakes, but this kind of thing is giving me the impression that all those fixes they do in FAQs and annuals will only last as long as people protest and when things quiet down the design team can go back to merrily fething things up again.
Strictly speaking, the terrain they've added hasn't exactly been gamebreaking. Between the limitations as to how many can be taken, the short range on effects, and in many instances the just general "bleh" of the effects?
I don't see an issue. The new Flesh-Eater piece might change my tune though.
Are there any army specific terrain that has been released that cost points?
Herdstone, Gloomtide shipwreck, charnel throne, gnawholes, gnarlmaws, and that gloomspite gitz ones are all points free I believe.
Hopefully armies that don't get access to endless spells will at least get some nice terrain (I'm looking at you KO, Dispossed, and Fyreslayers) Though, with the Khorne Not-Endless Spells coming, maybe even Duardin will get both
NinthMusketeer wrote: I wish it was like 40k where you pay points for them, rather than them mandatory.
I don't think any are mandatory; and several of them do cost points. It's just the Skaven and FEC and maybe some others, that are free. So it varies army to army. It might well be that the Khorne one you will have to pay points for.
They are all free and as such effectively mandatory because why not use a "free" bonus? It would be as silly as not using your Iron Hands FNP.
Faction terrain should be viewed as just part of an army's special rules (and lo behold, that's exactly where they put terrain in the book). It's no different to the fishmen Tides, Nurgle Cycle, the Power From Pain thing that Dark Eldar do, Orks re-rolling charges, etc. In theory these things are baked into the broader power level of the army and points values of its units. Of course it looks iffy when an army suddenly receives a new ability without points going up anywhere, but that's not really a problem with the concept of faction terrain or army wide abilities as a whole.
Nova_Impero wrote: At this point, the problem is that the Free People is now synonymous with Free Guilds or the idea of the Free People both name and idea is flawed because of the baggage of the Empire range.
I think the Renaissance core aesthetic should be retained. I think it is actually far more interesting than most more medieval inspired generic fantasy looks. They can build on the old Empire range and add more AOS specific elements.
Yes, but EACH Gnarlmaw gives you that D3. Which adds up. And I’m pretty positive you can get more Gnarlmaws aside from summoning. So they’re free and grant summoning boosts. I think Nurgle is considered “really good” as far as summoning goes this edition because of them.
In response to the setting, I think they should move away from the Renaissance background. I don't like tech with my Fantasy, that is what 40K is for. There is a theory developed by fantasy writers that if Magic were real, technological breakthroughs would not be happening. Why invent a cannon when a mage can just drop a meteor swarm. There is no incentive to develop tech when a readily available power source like magic exists. Maybe in a world where magic users were rare and hard to find, but that is NOT the mortal realms.
Smellingsalts wrote: In response to the setting, I think they should move away from the Renaissance background. I don't like tech with my Fantasy, that is what 40K is for. There is a theory developed by fantasy writers that if Magic were real, technological breakthroughs would not be happening. Why invent a cannon when a mage can just drop a meteor swarm. There is no incentive to develop tech when a readily available power source like magic exists. Maybe in a world where magic users were rare and hard to find, but that is NOT the mortal realms.
That is a perfectly valid perspective. But then again, I think they could meld magic and technology. Instead of non-magical engineers, have magical artificers. These produce magotech items that non-magical people can use. And nothing says these magotech items can't look like DaVincian renaissance contraptions (possibly with some added magic crystals!) Cog-forts, some sort of walking castles have been mentioned in the background; I'd absolutely love to have a model for a small cog-fort! And of course no of this prevents anyone from sporting magnificent landsknecht fashion!
That makes sense really. They’d never really even think of it, we only do as it was historical progress.
But back to model reasons itself, I don’t think they’ll use the free people empire as we know them, and it’ll be new units and models, perhaps a big full release.
Not sure why, just get the feeling it’s the old style and isn’t coming back.
But I didn’t really want to rebase my 6k empire anyway so I don’t mind too much
Danny76 wrote: That makes sense really. They’d never really even think of it, we only do as it was historical progress.
But back to model reasons itself, I don’t think they’ll use the free people empire as we know them, and it’ll be new units and models, perhaps a big full release.
Not sure why, just get the feeling it’s the old style and isn’t coming back.
But I didn’t really want to rebase my 6k empire anyway so I don’t mind too much
I already rebased my Empire, so I really hope the new models won't be completely stylistically incompatible!
Nova_Impero wrote: At this point, the problem is that the Free People is now synonymous with Free Guilds or the idea of the Free People both name and idea is flawed because of the baggage of the Empire range.
I think the Renaissance core aesthetic should be retained. I think it is actually far more interesting than most more medieval inspired generic fantasy looks. They can build on the old Empire range and add more AOS specific elements.
The only thing I think it would work if it from Azyr and not from the other realms.
reds8n wrote: little bit of info about the AoSRPG :
timetowaste85 wrote: Yes, but EACH Gnarlmaw gives you that D3. Which adds up. And I’m pretty positive you can get more Gnarlmaws aside from summoning. So they’re free and grant summoning boosts. I think Nurgle is considered “really good” as far as summoning goes this edition because of them.
Not really. It costs 7 to summon a Gnarlmaw, so you need 3 turns to break even. Slimux drops a "free" one but obviously that's baked into his own cost, and also misses at least 1 turn. Finally there's a ridiculously bad battalion based around free trees that is sure to lose you the game.
What is good about the tree is that it has a Run&Charge aura that you can drop anywhere as needed and it extends your summoning range, allowing you to drop tiny units of chaff onto distant objectives on the final turn - that's the real power of Nurgle summoning, not the quality or quantity of it.
The extra d3 contagion points turn is a big deal, it often means the difference between summoning the unit you want a round earlier. Also the extra tree battalion isn't bad; you just need at least 5 trees to do it right and that's a pain.
That RPG cover would look great on my wall. Hopefully they will do prints. I'd also not be averse to a model of the Knight Questor. Especially as everyone else in the picture has a mini.
Overread wrote: Also don't forget a Battletome confirms a faction is sticking around - it wasn't that long ago that we lost Greenskins as an army. So people are still cautious of investing in any forces that don't have a Battletome and we've no idea what GW is going to do with the glut of Aelven forces in Order.
So right now getting a Battletome is more than just models, its security of a future with AoS and a chance at more stuff in the future. Plus a good reason to start collecting them now - right now!
Long time WFB player just re-entereing AoS, I knew that GH2018 basically killed my biggest/best painted army, bretonnians, now grreenskins are gone to? O&G was my next best army (more models than Brettonians, but not as well painted). I saw and picked up Gloomsprite Gitz, but that only acounts for about 35% of my old O&G modle range. the rest are as useless and my Bretonnians now?
Overread wrote: Also don't forget a Battletome confirms a faction is sticking around - it wasn't that long ago that we lost Greenskins as an army. So people are still cautious of investing in any forces that don't have a Battletome and we've no idea what GW is going to do with the glut of Aelven forces in Order.
So right now getting a Battletome is more than just models, its security of a future with AoS and a chance at more stuff in the future. Plus a good reason to start collecting them now - right now!
Long time WFB player just re-entereing AoS, I knew that GH2018 basically killed my biggest/best painted army, bretonnians, now grreenskins are gone to? O&G was my next best army (more models than Brettonians, but not as well painted). I saw and picked up Gloomsprite Gitz, but that only acounts for about 35% of my old O&G modle range. the rest are as useless and my Bretonnians now?
There's still Ironjawz and BoneSplitterz as ork based factions just like Gloomspite collected a lot of the troll and goblin forces (though again not all of them). GW might re-unite the two ork factions into one force like they've done with Skaven and Goblins or they could keep them separate - no one really knows save for GW. Hopefully as they are really pushing out Battletomes fast this year they might well update the other ork factions!
Don't worry; Greenskinz still have point costs and can be used in the game. The models are not currently for sale but neither are Gitmob (old regular goblins, warachines, & wolf stuff) and we know for sure they are an army since they are clearly described as such in the Gloomspite battletome. Further, both Gotmobs and Greenskinz are listed as ally options in Gloomspite. They could easily have left those out but went out of their way to put them there. My bet? Those models are going to be replaced and were simply pulled early because they weren't selling at all.
Hmm, not sure I like the idea of only 3 attributes. You can’t quite set the difference between an agile character and a strong character with only Body as the physical one. I like that it’s a d6 system though, much better than d20’s. Just really hope it doesn’t go the way Wrath and Glory did.
Tiberius501 wrote: Hmm, not sure I like the idea of only 3 attributes. You can’t quite set the difference between an agile character and a strong character with only Body as the physical one. I like that it’s a d6 system though, much better than d20’s. Just really hope it doesn’t go the way Wrath and Glory did.
Yes you can. You just do not need to make it stat-line wise but shift it to talents and skills. Like having a positive talent like lithe to increase speed (go first or more times) accompanied by a negative talent like frail, so to speak. While a strong bruiser may be intimidating and, say, mighty. (Note I am making most of the names up bar intimidating).
GaroRobe wrote: Not the skaven I was hoping for. Tretch Craventail had a great model, but he didn't make the cut :/
Aye that would have been a great one to see. That said how GW chooses is unknown, but it might be that the Tretch mould is older and more worn. I know when they did the Dark Elves a year or so back they had to withdraw Morathi on a Pegasus because the mould broke on use. The Cast on Demand I wager don't make enough actual sales to make producing a new mould commercially viable (plus there's timescales and production slots to consider). Though one hopes that GW retains the masters and ability to produce more in the future "possibly"
Reforging is an interesting one because in theory it means the SC character is immortal in the setting. For RPG games where the DM and gamers want and allow perma-death it will be curious to see a character who can persist through death without having to roll up a new character if yours dies.
That said most of reforgings loss appears to be memories and a degree of sanity whilst not really affecting skills as such.
So in an RPG taht kind of puts all the onus on the player rather than on the mechanics of the system (since the system would be all the skills and modifiers).
I can see them, for the purposes of the game, adjusting it so that perhaps the stormcast loses peripheral skills outside of combat. Meaning it might become a powerhouse of combat skills but a lot of others (including charismatic and social skills) might diminish continually. Another angle might be that level/ability caps on skills come into play. A reforged stormcast might have no limit on their current warrior skills but gets a penalty to learning new ones; or a cap on their non-combat skills.
Overread wrote: So in an RPG taht kind of puts all the onus on the player rather than on the mechanics of the system (since the system would be all the skills and modifiers).
Technically you could have insanity and compulsion rules that could potentially have mechanics affect playing the character more than player choices, if the rules are set up that way and the designers find it's a good idea.
Worth considering, too. It's not Warhammer without insanity.
I'm a fan of just putting in a label saying "warning; xyz mechanic is difficult to perform as a player because it requires role-playing a disadvantage rather than it existing as a strict number, accordingly xyz can only be used when the GM permits" buuut there are problems with that when trying to make a product for a wide audience.
The Shrike wrote: Is there any validity or corroboration to the rumor that KO were getting a new battletome in April? I would love that but it’s counterintuitve.
There was someone spreading a load of rumours about things like that and was found to be just making it up over on the TGA forums (The Grand Alliance).
Honestly no one really knows, the only AoS news we have is the hints at new games like Warcry; the upcoming Khorne Battletome; the very likely Slaanesh Battletome and Demon model release; plus the fact that we know all four Grand Alliances will see at least one new Tome this year. Considering we've already got 3 Chaos done and confirmed (Skaven done; Khorne confirmed; Slaanesh all but certain) and had Destruction (Gloomspite) and head a Death (Flesh Eaters) that does leave Order due for at least one or more new tomes. KO might get one; its possible but there's nothing to suggest its soon .
Yeah I mean aren’t there other Duardin or free peoples yet to get books? Seraphon? Those all seem more likely to me; though I am just returning after a baby-induced hiatus.
The Shrike wrote: Yeah I mean aren’t there other Duardin or free peoples yet to get books? Seraphon? Those all seem more likely to me; though I am just returning after a baby-induced hiatus.
There are rumors about Fyreslayers but nothing on the "Free People" or whatever that is going to be called.
GW seems to be in a phase of bringing what exists in AoS up to date. Pete Foley said as much in the recent podcast.
In terms of how they are doing competitively the three existing books that most need an update are Ironjawz, Beastclaw raiders and Kharadron Overlords.
At lvoGW said battletomes were still to come for each grand alliance. The Skaven and FEC books were already announced.
So it seems pretty clear that we will get at least one more book for each grand alliance this year.
They just announced khorne and at the start of the year they said there will be more Slaanesh models this year. There are also strong rumours of a Darkoath/slaves to Darkness book this year so that's 3 books for chaos alone.
The rumours about a slyvaneth and KO book alongside their underworlds warbands came from a different person than the debunked stuff.
It was apparently hinted at the lvo event that Sylvaneth are getting a book soon so this rumour could well be true but ultimately nobody knows for sure.
GW are attending Gama again this year from 11th to 15th of March. They usually show off some stuff there so we may hear more then.
Nova_Impero wrote: I wonder if we will see a new unit or hero if that Sylvaneth rumor is true. We know that each new battletome is getting Endless Spells at least.
New terrain? I know Sylvaneth have the old Citadel wood... but that is a bit uninspiring alongside the newer offerings.
They all but said there would be a Sylvaneth battletome at LVO, before which we had no hints of one aside from that rumor which said Sylvaneth and Kharadron. Given the state of KO and how many people WANT to play them I think those two are solid bets.
GaroRobe wrote: Not the skaven I was hoping for. Tretch Craventail had a great model, but he didn't make the cut :/
Aye that would have been a great one to see. That said how GW chooses is unknown, but it might be that the Tretch mould is older and more worn. I know when they did the Dark Elves a year or so back they had to withdraw Morathi on a Pegasus because the mould broke on use. The Cast on Demand I wager don't make enough actual sales to make producing a new mould commercially viable (plus there's timescales and production slots to consider). Though one hopes that GW retains the masters and ability to produce more in the future "possibly"
It's interesting. Most of these are the early nineties sculpts of some of the more famous Skaven characters. There's a newer Deathmaster, Ikit, Queek, (all in the store, but sold out) and Thaquol (I think? aside from the big plastic kit), but strangely that's the second iteration of Boneripper. The first model had flesh, and a giant horn on his head. But this version has the gun arm, so maybe that's why? The original 90s Lord Skrolk is up in the store now though (and not sold out) as the Plague Priest.
The Greyseer is the newest model there I believe, I think it came out in the late 90s at the earliest, perhaps this century?
Tretch came out with the resculpts of many of these heroes, so I'm surprised that he was held back. His model would be a great Clawlord, or second in command.
And why no Throt the Unclean (the newer one,or the Rogue Trader one) or the old Vermin Lord (one of my favorite models)? The old (original) metal screaming bell Greyseer, and some of the nicer metal rat ogres (the plastic ones look like 90's action figures), would have been nice too.
That is the most recent Thanquol aside from his plastic version afaik. The newer heroes were still on sale going into AoS while some of those have been oop for quite a while, having been replaced with the 7th ed book.
I'm surprised one of the very old Warplocks hasn't been returned - though I think its from way back in the pewter era as I've managed to get two and they are distinctly different in material colour (a few shades darker which actually shows up the details on it really well compared to bright clean white metal)
LolFEC and Skaven FAQs dropped. They stated that Gristlegore behemoths *DO NOT* count as Behemoths, directly changing how they ruled for Beastclaw Raiders.
SnotlingPimpWagon wrote: Sadly, no Nurglitch... My favorite skaven mini from the pre-8th ed era.
Nurglitch was in a previous Skaven MTO only six months ago (approx). Hence it was highly unlikely they would do this model again unless demand had been overwhelming.
Have GW started to base their single figure made to order prices on ebay buy it now prices or what? Even the good ones like eldar bonesinger used to be cheaper then this. And others less desirable half of this price!
DanceOfSlaanesh wrote: Have GW started to base their single figure made to order prices on ebay buy it now prices or what? Even the good ones like eldar bonesinger used to be cheaper then this. And others less desirable half of this price!
Thats what i thought when i see those prices this morning!
Makes an old guy like me (at least in the realm of what's "old" for a GW player) hurt a little, right there in the corner of my soul, when I remember what they used to cost when they came out originally.
Makes an old guy like me (at least in the realm of what's "old" for a GW player) hurt a little, right there in the corner of my soul, when I remember what they used to cost when they came out originally.
You should look at ebay - prices there for anything in metal are nuts. Jezzails are around £16 per rat/team on average at present; whilst many leaders are pushing into the £20 bracket. Of course there are a lot of "rare unique exclusive" models kicking around that are priced way above what GW charges new for them. Meanwhile surprisingly the Engineer Gamesday Exclusive model is still in the £15 or so region.
but yeah prices are two to three times what they were when the models first came out. On ebay at least one has limited supply as a mechanic for driving the prices up; esp if the model is clean and not assembled (or at least paint stripped). I assume GW is adding abit more because they are cast on demand - though at least for Skaven they already have to cast metals anyway.
I'm tempted to get the Grey Seer - I already grabbed the assassin model before he was put up.
Jezzails are $55 for 3 from GW... When they came out they were $7 for one to my knowledge. Not sure what inflation has been but pretty sure it isn't that much.
Yeah, I have been pondering a 15 dollar metal Jezzail (see them go for that many times), but it's only acceptable as I just need the one for skirmish purposes.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Jezzails are $55 for 3 from GW... When they came out they were $7 for one to my knowledge. Not sure what inflation has been but pretty sure it isn't that much.
How long ago was that? I can't think of any living necessity that didn't increase far more than that in my lifetime.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Converting them is a pain, too. Same with globadiers except with those the numbers you need relatively are so crazy it is barely worth trying.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Converting them is a pain, too. Same with globadiers except with those the numbers you need relatively are so crazy it is barely worth trying.
Just use the Skitarii Arquebuses.
Just made my globadiers from stormvermin bodies, engineer heads moulded from the doomwheel kit, backpacks from maxmini, zombie open hands and 6mm airsoft BBs.
Costs around £40 for 20 globadiers so not all bad.
I got 15 jezzails but I've slowly been picking them up from eBay.
Never paid over £8 for one though, just a case of being patient and waiting on auctions.
Is there a decent/easy conversion option for Ratling Guns or Jezzails online? I tried looking to see if Mantic had any weapon teams for their Veer-Myn Warpath army, but no luck. Honestly, everything I’ve seen, I’d LOVE to run a Skryre/Pestilens joint army (with obligatory clanrats as battleline in a mixed force)...but those two are necessities to pull me from Pestilens/Moulder.
If I’m remembering correctly, I think I heard of a conversion involving Kroot gun arms and and clanrat or stormvermin bodies.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Converting them is a pain, too. Same with globadiers except with those the numbers you need relatively are so crazy it is barely worth trying.
Just use the Skitarii Arquebuses.
I do, still a pain and requires additional work to skaven-ify it.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Converting them is a pain, too. Same with globadiers except with those the numbers you need relatively are so crazy it is barely worth trying.
Just use the Skitarii Arquebuses.
Just made my globadiers from stormvermin bodies, engineer heads moulded from the doomwheel kit, backpacks from maxmini, zombie open hands and 6mm airsoft BBs.
Costs around £40 for 20 globadiers so not all bad.
I got 15 jezzails but I've slowly been picking them up from eBay.
Never paid over £8 for one though, just a case of being patient and waiting on auctions.
Nice work! Also highlighting the point of how much work it is... Only 10 more to get one full unit!
NinthMusketeer wrote: Converting them is a pain, too. Same with globadiers except with those the numbers you need relatively are so crazy it is barely worth trying.
Just use the Skitarii Arquebuses.
I do, still a pain and requires additional work to skaven-ify it.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Converting them is a pain, too. Same with globadiers except with those the numbers you need relatively are so crazy it is barely worth trying.
Just use the Skitarii Arquebuses.
Just made my globadiers from stormvermin bodies, engineer heads moulded from the doomwheel kit, backpacks from maxmini, zombie open hands and 6mm airsoft BBs.
Costs around £40 for 20 globadiers so not all bad.
I got 15 jezzails but I've slowly been picking them up from eBay.
Never paid over £8 for one though, just a case of being patient and waiting on auctions.
Nice work! Also highlighting the point of how much work it is... Only 10 more to get one full unit!
That's only 5 lol, I'll get a group shot later.
I have got 60 converted (only 20 painted)
The heads I have 5 moulds so I can churn out 20 a day or so.
Assembly wise, they take maybe an hour to put together, not all that time consuming.
Jezzails - kroot guns or the long rifle from mechanicus rangers works fine.
Ratling gun - rotor cannons from 30k are the perfect size.
The main thing with skaven is that they don't have to be neat and tidy.
You can literally go wild with conversions until your heart is content as nothing is off limits.
Does bug me that we didn't get a kit though.
Would have liked to see acolyte or weapon teams kit.
Either way, I enjoy converting though so it doesn't bother me too much.
Just goes to show; the amount of effort to convert globadiers properly is crazy. Molds, multiple kits, 3rd party bits, and extra supplies to make guys that are 12 points each! Fortunately for me I only use 5-man units as support if at all. At least jezzails are pretty elite so one does not need many, though even with mechanicus/kroot guns there is a good amount of work to be done.
@ratling guns, the ratling cannons from the stormfiend kit work great and the back end can easily be completed using one of the doomflayer halves from the same kit. Though speaking in tabletop terms just taking the stormfiend is a vastly superior option to the weapon team...
NinthMusketeer wrote: Just goes to show; the amount of effort to convert globadiers properly is crazy. Molds, multiple kits, 3rd party bits, and extra supplies to make guys that are 12 points each! Fortunately for me I only use 5-man units as support if at all. At least jezzails are pretty elite so one does not need many, though even with mechanicus/kroot guns there is a good amount of work to be done.
@ratling guns, the ratling cannons from the stormfiend kit work great and the back end can easily be completed using one of the doomflayer halves from the same kit. Though speaking in tabletop terms just taking the stormfiend is a vastly superior option to the weapon team...
But it's not really "effort" atall.
Moulding takes 10 mins, 5 mins either side of setting time.
The rest is chopping and gluing, as you would with any set.
Man, as much as I have been interested in and bought into the. Vigilus stuff for 40k, I am really hoping there is some attention on AoS after this. Let’s get cracking on the Warcry shall we?
I just bought my first AoS army (Maggotkin) and am looking forward to seeing how it fairs in a skirmish setting.
Kendo wrote: Man, as much as I have been interested in and bought into the. Vigilus stuff for 40k, I am really hoping there is some attention on AoS after this. Let’s get cracking on the Warcry shall we?
I just bought my first AoS army (Maggotkin) and am looking forward to seeing how it fairs in a skirmish setting.
I think the next thing for AoS will be the Khorne Battletome that they've told us is coming. After that I think we need another reveal event because we'll have caught up with all the "its coming" news that GW has given us thus far. The rest are possible things such as Slaanesh Tome and Warcry; whilst anything else is purely guesswork.
So another release event to top up the upcoming list; Khorne Battletome for certain (along with terrain and Endless spell trio).
Personally I'd hope we see the Slaanesh big release sometime soon. They've dragged their heels with Slaanesh for years and its high time the Dark Prince got a new Demon model and a Tome and generally got up to the standard of the other 3 chaos gods (4 if you include the Great Horned One).
NinthMusketeer wrote: Converting them is a pain, too. Same with globadiers except with those the numbers you need relatively are so crazy it is barely worth trying.
Just use the Skitarii Arquebuses.
Just made my globadiers from stormvermin bodies, engineer heads moulded from the doomwheel kit, backpacks from maxmini, zombie open hands and 6mm airsoft BBs.
Costs around £40 for 20 globadiers so not all bad..
timetowaste85 wrote: Is there a decent/easy conversion option for Ratling Guns or Jezzails online? I tried looking to see if Mantic had any weapon teams for their Veer-Myn Warpath army, but no luck. Honestly, everything I’ve seen, I’d LOVE to run a Skryre/Pestilens joint army (with obligatory clanrats as battleline in a mixed force)...but those two are necessities to pull me from Pestilens/Moulder.
If I’m remembering correctly, I think I heard of a conversion involving Kroot gun arms and and clanrat or stormvermin bodies.
A Lot of the easy conversions use the flamethrower dudes
Which goes to show a weapon team kit can be really simple!
That said those flamers in plastic are not going to be cheap/easy to get hold of right now. Probably going to cost more than the £8 or so that the weapon team costs from GW direct.
Hm, are we certain that there will be a new Khorne terrain ? Sure, we saw the "not endless spells" new miniatures in the previous reveal, but since Khorne is quite straightforward, I'm thinking litterally everything GW made as terrain before can be used - you know, the thing GW has with adding skulls anywhere on their terrains. Maybe an opportunity to sell the weird Crucible Khorne Tower from that AoS Dreadhold "Skull is the New Material" Fortress.
You know, that thing :
Or maybe a part of it, like the cauldron on top, who knows. Wouldn't be that surprising.
GW has wanted to encourage terrain sales direct for years, however mostly gamers didn't rush for them even when GW put some rules for them in the book. There were cheaper options or home made or they just gamed at their local GW store or hobby club which already had terrain. So GW wasn't seeing huge sales.
Now once they realised that things like the nurgle plague trees were selling they've latched onto the idea that faction specific terrain sells. Thus all releases going forward are getting at least one unique faction terrain feature. It's another reason why some are also free to take (Eg Skaven Gnawholes) so there's even less reason not to get them. It drives sales of terrain; gets people buying and using GW terrain which might make them pick up more and it also makes the boards even more unique compared to the competition with high quality terrain features.
It's basically a win win for all parties involved and I believe GW confirmed that all new tomes would now come with unique terrain. So yep I figure we will see unique Khorne terrain to go along with three endless spells. A pattern I tihnk we'll see repeating over and over from now on at least with AoS and likely with 40K armies as well (Eldar and Genestealers both got terrain features - heck GSC terrain is a huge mole that inter-connects with several other terrain features alreayd release by GW)
I just want to see them do it like 40k where the terrain costs points to put on the table. Let people bring all that cool dreadhold stuff. I remember back in fan comp days when that was a thing and it was great. The move to make terrain a free part of every allegiance ensures sales of that piece, but only one set of it and only to players of that allegiance. Some generic kits that anyone could bring, and/or the ability to bring multiples by paying extra points, that could drive sales just as well while expanding what's available in the game. I know I'd shell out for some more Nurgle trees and expand my dreadhold collection.
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Overread wrote: Which goes to show a weapon team kit can be really simple!
That said those flamers in plastic are not going to be cheap/easy to get hold of right now. Probably going to cost more than the £8 or so that the weapon team costs from GW direct.
Doesn't help that the wft is the only team worth it's points, and all the teams pale in comparison to a stormfiend unit. Seriously... 3 weapon teams costs only slight less than 3 stormfiends.
I sort of get the feeling that GW got itself confused about weapon teams and stormfiends. I sort of tihnk someone had the idea to replace one with the other as a design (which makes sense) and then someone said "hey wait why not as they all look the same, field them as a single unit!"
And they've gone with that and we've wound up with two groups of models that "sort of" do very similar things but don't.
NinthMusketeer wrote: I just want to see them do it like 40k where the terrain costs points to put on the table. Let people bring all that cool dreadhold stuff. I remember back in fan comp days when that was a thing and it was great. The move to make terrain a free part of every allegiance ensures sales of that piece, but only one set of it and only to players of that allegiance. Some generic kits that anyone could bring, and/or the ability to bring multiples by paying extra points, that could drive sales just as well while expanding what's available in the game. I know I'd shell out for some more Nurgle trees and expand my dreadhold collection.
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Overread wrote: Which goes to show a weapon team kit can be really simple!
That said those flamers in plastic are not going to be cheap/easy to get hold of right now. Probably going to cost more than the £8 or so that the weapon team costs from GW direct.
Doesn't help that the wft is the only team worth it's points, and all the teams pale in comparison to a stormfiend unit. Seriously... 3 weapon teams costs only slight less than 3 stormfiends.
That's the biggest issue.
3 teams for around fiend cost, yet nowhere near the survivability of them and fiends are battle line in a skryre army to boot.
Even with the nerf (weapon selection) fiends are still pretty damn good.
Weapon teams sadly lack alot.
Would have liked a LoS type rule for them to atleast help a bit, or have them hidden in the way fanatics are even.
I wouldn't mind a WFT hiding in a clanrat unit ready to jump out and ignite a unit.
I just think for their cost, they really offer very little, which is sad because jezzails are now a good option, yet weapon teams got left behind.
Jackal90 wrote: Weapon teams sadly lack alot. Would have liked a LoS type rule for them to atleast help a bit, or have them hidden in the way fanatics are even. I wouldn't mind a WFT hiding in a clanrat unit ready to jump out and ignite a unit.
I just think for their cost, they really offer very little, which is sad because jezzails are now a good option, yet weapon teams got left behind.
Let us turn back the sands of time, to March 2002. Skaven are released for WHFB 6E, and become fairly reviled in short time, thanks in no small part to weapon teams being both extremely powerful and untargetable when near friendly units, of which Skaven have plenty of. There is much lamentation and nashing of teeth among the armies of the upper world, with Alessio Cavatore's name taken in vain hither and yon (for he, a known Skaven player, had clearly been allowed to write himself an armybook of murderous proportions).
Meanwhile, somewhere at Games Workshop a note is made: 'weapon taems too stronk, please nerf'
This note is never taken down, and indeed every edition that followed diminished their majesty further
Jackal90 wrote: Weapon teams sadly lack alot.
Would have liked a LoS type rule for them to atleast help a bit, or have them hidden in the way fanatics are even.
I wouldn't mind a WFT hiding in a clanrat unit ready to jump out and ignite a unit.
I just think for their cost, they really offer very little, which is sad because jezzails are now a good option, yet weapon teams got left behind.
Let us turn back the sands of time, to March 2002. Skaven are released for WHFB 6E, and become fairly reviled in short time, thanks in no small part to weapon teams being both extremely powerful and untargetable when near friendly units, of which Skaven have plenty of. There is much lamentation and nashing of teeth among the armies of the upper world, with Alessio Cavatore's name taken in vain hither and yon (for he, a known Skaven player, had clearly been allowed to write himself an armybook of murderous proportions).
Meanwhile, somewhere at Games Workshop a note is made: 'weapon taems too stronk, please nerf'
This note is never taken down, and indeed every edition that followed diminished their majesty further
Just to clarify before someone stabs me, I wasn't talking about alessio levels of ninja BSlol.
Maybe a 4+ if they are within 6" of 10+ vermintide models.
They just need something, even if it's niche.
Otherwise, if you want weapon teams just take fiends instead.
£25 for 3 on eBay currently, £10 below retail.
I'd say any skryre players need to jump on eBay now. Doomwheels and WL cannons are only £14 too.
Always good to stock up!
Carrion Empire sold out and its not getting a reprint. Personally I think its reflects GW making these duel army boxes cycle faster rather than slower. Having the Tomes released on the same day meant a big surging increase in attention because you got new models and to use them in an updated army - as opposed to many previous boxes where there were months beteween the boxed set and the Battletomes which stunts interest (people are interested to buy but wind up holding off till the Tome comes out).
I think that's why Carrion Empire sold out so fast, and GW might have produced less we don't know. Though there are still boxes lurking around - 3rd party shops a local GW store and ebay full and split are still about so there's still stuff out there if you can do a bit of hunting for it. But yeah it will dry up fast - FEC players bsically get their whole army in a single box barring their dragon model; whilst Skaven get a very solid core of all popular models.
I'd say the article ties the Fyreslayers into that rumor engine from the other day. I bet we are getting some kind of spell or scenery piece for Fyreslayers where they horde the gold whether it be urgold or non urgold.
Man I really hope they do not carry on with every faction getting a mandatory terrain piece. Make them optional rather than something just shoved on us! It is cool when some factions have it, it is lame when a standard part of deployment in AoS is putting down your terrain piece because every faction has one for free. At least they are pretty cool kits.
I do remain happy to see every faction getting endless spells or equivalents. The recent endless spells are well designed too; fun, thematic, and while most deal MWs in some manner only a handful of the newer ones can really be called simple damage-dealers. I am really enjoying the Skaven ones for their tactical use.
What do we think Fyreslayer 'endless runes' will be called? We already know that Khorne's are called "Judgements of Khorne".
NinthMusketeer wrote: Man I really hope they do not carry on with every faction getting a mandatory terrain piece. Make them optional rather than something just shoved on us! It is cool when some factions have it, it is lame when a standard part of deployment in AoS is putting down your terrain piece because every faction has one for free. At least they are pretty cool kits.
I would expect they become mandatory with every new battletome, because it's obvious they sell way more that way. Sure, that means you have to take your terrains with you to play and have to free more space in your bag/boxes when you carry that army with you.
On the other hand, it has an unexpected upside for tournaments - since more and more armies come with their "free" terrains, organizers will naturally tend to take that into account and make sure the tables are less crowded with terrain, so that each player can place their own.
It also means that players are encouraged to take terrains with them and populate the tables, meaning the organizers will need less terrains than before. That's quite interesting for tournament logistics, IMHO.
What do we think Fyreslayer 'endless runes' will be called? We already know that Khorne's are called "Judgements of Khorne".
Grimnir's Runes, or something like that I guess. Maybe instead of the equivalent of endless spells, it would be used as a replacement for the current runes you can use once per game as their core rules - maybe a bit different.
GW is going to power ahead with faciton terrain for 40K and AoS because it sells terrain better than anything else GW has tried. The best they can hope for is that it also sparks more sales of other support terrain by gamers and that in turn results in increased overall terrain use and sales direct from GW.
That in turn might make them ease back (eg terrain starts to get points); but it might be something they keep. Along with Endless spells its another tool in the box that improves the visual experience of the game which many of the competing games on the market don't do.
This is GW giving AoS a unique identity for itself in a very visual sense and it also helps improve tables - better tales means more chance of luring in more gamers.
It's a fair bit better than including battalions for armies based on very specific terrain pieces being on a board, but still a pain to have to bring all the terrain along with all the models.
I think faction terrain is awesome! GW needs to make more fantasy terrain other than castles/towers. If you don't like the army terrain, don't use it. Nobody says you have to take one, but if you do they are free.
If Warcry ends up being what most people hope it is I'd expect some more terrain pieces. WHFB was close to Warmachine level terrain from my experience so it's not a surprise that AoS initially struggled to get people to fill up their boards a bit more.
I like the kits, I just do not like them being mandatory. 40k style where they cost points and you can bring however much you like? I'd be all over that. Doubly so if they add dreadhold to that.
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Smellingsalts wrote: I think faction terrain is awesome! GW needs to make more fantasy terrain other than castles/towers. If you don't like the army terrain, don't use it. Nobody says you have to take one, but if you do they are free.
Similarly, one can bring a shooting unit and not use its missile weapons. Or bring a wizard and not cast his spells.
Whilst the terrain is free its hard to not use it. Sure you can have gnawholes or the new throne and not use them, but you're sort of leaving really powerful and useful features on the table without much reason to do so. As Ninth says its a bit like bringing ranged units and not using their ranged attacks - you can do that but its not really very sensible.
Putting a cost on to the terrain makes you have to pick and choose it around your army intentionally; so its not there for just casual use.
Most of the terrain is pretty easy to kitbash or scratch build though. So long as you make things the correct size it shouldn’t be a problem. It is also not true that every army gets them. Of the 7 battletomes released last year only 3 got terrain.
NinthMusketeer wrote: I like the kits, I just do not like them being mandatory. 40k style where they cost points and you can bring however much you like? I'd be all over that. Doubly so if they add dreadhold to that.
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Smellingsalts wrote: I think faction terrain is awesome! GW needs to make more fantasy terrain other than castles/towers. If you don't like the army terrain, don't use it. Nobody says you have to take one, but if you do they are free.
Similarly, one can bring a shooting unit and not use its missile weapons. Or bring a wizard and not cast his spells.
Agreed. I never liked "free mandatory rules" that come in the form of additional kits that you have to buy. If Terrain will be free and mandatory then sell me it with the Battletome. Or add a point price to it, then I can choose to use it or not.
Chikout wrote: Most of the terrain is pretty easy to kitbash or scratch build though. So long as you make things the correct size it shouldn’t be a problem. It is also not true that every army gets them. Of the 7 battletomes released last year only 3 got terrain.
Yes but of all the battletomes released this year (and announced to be released) all have gotten a unique bit of terrain. The only ones that have not (thus far that we are aware of) are the two mini-codex in the new 40K boxed set. And there is still a chance GW has more for them to come. The terrain is a new thing that they are clearly focusing on this year as part of a rollout. The same way that all the new and udpated battletomes for AoS are getting Endless Spells.
Terrain can be made at home and its for this reason that GW is trying to shift terrain from a home made feature into an army feature - they want you to buy terrain from them not just make it at home or use the store/club terrain.
plastictrees wrote: If Warcry ends up being what most people hope it is I'd expect some more terrain pieces. WHFB was close to Warmachine level terrain from my experience so it's not a surprise that AoS initially struggled to get people to fill up their boards a bit more.
Terrain was always considered a unecesary hinderence in the WFB games I watched / played in, especially with competative and torunament gamers I encountered. I like terrain - when the rules matter.
They could have done much more with it and made it part of the game but apart from Wood Elves they never seemed to be that interested.
Overread wrote: Terrain can be made at home and its for this reason that GW is trying to shift terrain from a home made feature into an army feature - they want you to buy terrain from them not just make it at home or use the store/club terrain.
Well, I mean they do, but I also think they've realized that terrain is the last big part of the Warhammer experience that they aren't selling to players. Part of what sells Warhammer is seeing a game table with all the little painted miniatures on it, and GW goes out of its way to make their miniatures as great as possible and make painting as mindless and easy as possible, but then they get stuck on a table with a bunch of foamcore buildings that look like a 7th grader's art project and it really brings the whole impression down. Meanwhile, you've got other games like Infinity with giant tables of MDF buildings with glorious catwalks and building interiors and it looks great. GW had to be looking at that stuff going, there's a market for this stuff and we aren't in it, and it will make our games look more appealing on the table.
They've been trying to push terrain for a while. Sector Mechanicus was a big selling point for Shadow War and they appear to have designed Necromunda around it, and they made terrain a huge part of Kill Team (you get terrain is pretty much every KT product). But cracking the 40k (and AoS) tables, where terrain is usually an afterthought and where people already have a building or two, wasn't working so well. Remember Moonbase Klaisus and Blasted Hallowheart? They never expanded that line, even though the Killzones are basically the same thing and sell out in minutes (I expect themed killzones to be a feature of the next version of 40k)
I think it was with the Sylvaneth that they realized how effective army-based terrain could be. I bet they weren't selling more than a handful of Citadel Woods sets a month before Sylvaneth, and couldn't keep them in stock afterwards. Then with the Idoneth, they did the shipwreck and I think a little lightbulb went off in their heads, and now it is a standard feature going forward.
I seem to recall it was actually the Gnalwood that made them take notice. Wood Elves have been summoning forests for years even back in the Old World era so it was nothing new. I think that the Gnalwood started to show GW that the WE/Sylvanath element wasn't just a one-off - it could be repeated!
I bought a ton of terrain with Killteam. I’ve never had better looking tables than I do now. I really hope that not only do they continue to offer army specific terrain, I hope that Warcry follows the same model as Killteam and makes terrain as important to the game as the actual warbands people fight with.
And I much prefer the AoS way to deal with terrain. I don’t know anyone who uses the faction specific 40k terrain in their army. It always seems horribly over costed. Horribly. The Ork kit was a nice model, but a terrible rule/ points cost. And I didn’t get it. Funny, I would rather buy terrain that just makes the table better looking and has nonfaction specific rules than buy
A piece of faction specific terrain that is tainted by bad rules design.
I really feel that locally at least 40k and AoS have been hurt by the constant desire of more competitive players to abstract away terrain until anything with any character is considered an annoyance and people won’t use it. The ITC magic box being the ultimate expression of generic terrain being distilled down to an idea for the sake of competitive play versus something really grand and thematic on the table. The last three games at the local store I took part in were played on a mishmash of left over bits, ugly resin stuff from some other terrain maker. The table sucked to look at and stole a lot from my experience I have recently
Been playing tons of Killteam on the beautiful tables I have now and apparently become spoiled.
So, in summary, continue with the Killteam model for that game and for Warcry. Keep rolling with 0 point faction specific terrain for AoS.
Kendo wrote: I bought a ton of terrain with Killteam. I’ve never had better looking tables than I do now. I really hope that not only do they continue to offer army specific terrain, I hope that Warcry follows the same model as Killteam and makes terrain as important to the game as the actual warbands people fight with.
I'm really hoping for this too, but AoS doesn't have enough terrain to pull it off. We do know that they have something more substantial in the Azyrite Ruins set, and Dreadhold can be broken up in various ways to produce new sets, so who knows? I'm really pinning my future with AoS on Warcry, so fingers crossed!
But what GW really needs is some freaking stairs. None of the KT kits have it, Sector Imperialis doesn't have it. They've got stairs built into the Baleful Realmgates and (I think) Dragonfate Dais that they've been cutting out and reusing in all their battle report tables. But only the Dreadhold had an actual separate staircase. When I saw the Charnel Throne, I didn't even notice the bone chair on it because I was too busy drooling over the staircase.
Funny, I would rather buy terrain that just makes the table better looking and has nonfaction specific rules than buy A piece of faction specific terrain that is tainted by bad rules design.
You can just ignore the rules and use it as regular terrain. I was thinking of getting the Ork Mekboy Workshop for Kill Team and just ignoring the rules.
I agree AoS is lacking in the terrain department. I think the Killzone format could fix that though. Half a dozen box sets, each with its own theme. One for each Realm perhaps? Some interesting hills/ caver enterance, more Forrests, and a couple smaller garrison pieces are just some things I would like to see.
War fields. That’s what I am betting the Warcry terrain kits will be called.
The problem with AoS scenery is most kits are army specific obstacles. So unlike 40k kits you cant combine them and can only play AROUND them, not ON, because no bridges, stairs, roads. etc. LotR goblintown and laketown were better in those aspects.
I love army specific terrain. That's why I bought a 3d printer. The dwarves and elves versions of terrain from printable scenery are freaking awesome quality. It is crazy how much I've made on just one roll of 15 dollars. When ever they drop the new light elves I hope it comes with terrain.
Sqorgar wrote: I'm really hoping for this too, but AoS doesn't have enough terrain to pull it off. We do know that they have something more substantial in the Azyrite Ruins set, and Dreadhold can be broken up in various ways to produce new sets, so who knows? I'm really pinning my future with AoS on Warcry, so fingers crossed!
You do realize that the only thing you can purchase currently for the Chaos Dreadhold are the rules?
EDIT: Blades of Khorne goes on pre-order next week:
Grab some skulls, hide your wizards and stock up on Blood For The Blood God – Khorne is coming back. Next week sees a gory tidal wave of Khornate new releases for both Warhammer Age of Sigmar and Warhammer 40,000, including stunning new models, new rules and more…
Spoiler:
Bloodmaster
The Bloodmaster is an invaluable addition to any collection of Khorne Daemons, making already-deadly Bloodletters even more murderous with nifty (and ultra-violent) aura abilities! The return of Khorne to the Mortal Realms was the ideal opportunity to bring this dark champion to life in plastic.
Skull Altar
As every Khorne fan knows, taking skulls is only part of worshipping the Blood God. The Skull Altar is a new terrain piece that allows you to get the most out of your Khorne Priests, a brazen dais from which they roar grisly invectives. In-game, it’ll allow them to re-roll their Prayer and Judgement rolls, as well as disrupting the abilities of nearby Wizards.
Spoiler:
Previously seen
Skulltaker, Karanak, Flesh hounds, Judgements of Khorne (Endless Spells)
Skull Altar is surprisingly subdued for GW, in a good way. It doesn't suffer from the 'busy' look that many of their models tend towards. Assuming it is free with allegiance I remain irked about that but the piece itself, and its use as a source for prayer re-rolls, is great. Will really help towards not needing gore pilgrims as a crutch.
Bloodmaster I like as well. That armor is cool and really fits the bloodletter aesthetic. Skulltaker looks cool but... Off, like misproportioned somehow. I think it is just the angle they took the picture though.
You do realize that the only thing you can purchase currently for the Chaos Dreadhold are the rules?
Believe me, I'm aware (I was hoping to get another Overlord Bastion when they disappeared without warning). But I presume they still have the CAD files and/or the moulds and can bring it back easily enough. As a kit though, it's AoS' most modular kit and can do a lot more than the triangle towers it was sold as:
Do Khorne Daemons have any resin left at all now? Alongside Nurgle Daemons, they may be one of the most complete ranges for an older faction. Makes the idea of collecting them much more appealing!
So, I’m not gonna lie, that preview actually makes me think they’re gonna surprise unveil Angron this week at GAMA. Hear me out; the article focuses on Khorne in AoS, but at the end it talks about using them in your 40k army, throws them alongside World Eaters in artwork, then tells us they’ll be previewing Khorne all next week; Khorne in general, not “Blades of Khorne”. We’ve heard from multiple sources (reputable ones) that Angron is ready to go; when best than for a big-deal trade show at the same time as a big Khorne release?
I’d rather get Fulgrim first, but I’ll take Angron happily.
timetowaste85 wrote: So, I’m not gonna lie, that preview actually makes me think they’re gonna surprise unveil Angron this week at GAMA. Hear me out; the article focuses on Khorne in AoS, but at the end it talks about using them in your 40k army, throws them alongside World Eaters in artwork, then tells us they’ll be previewing Khorne all next week; Khorne in general, not “Blades of Khorne”. We’ve heard from multiple sources (reputable ones) that Angron is ready to go; when best than for a big-deal trade show at the same time as a big Khorne release?
I’d rather get Fulgrim first, but I’ll take Angron happily.
I agree, I'd prefer Fulgrim. However, I will be a bit sad if they release another daemon primarch when we only have Roboute while Chaos already has 2 and then get a third, along with baby Horus.
Angron was supposed to go all Bloodthirster-ed out, right? I hope so. Wouldn't mind if he does, not a fan of the one- legged pose the current one is in. My Skulltaker has been demoted to regular Bloodthirster on a few occasions when the points need trimming.
That said I'll get both of those new Khorne daemons. Khorne's always had my favorite daemons.
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: i'd say it would be unlikely to have another major character reveal so soon, especislly another chaos one, before they've sold enough Abadons
I reckon its possible though. After all, Abbadon was teased a couple of months before he was fully revealed, and isn't released yet.
I really hate the look of the skulls on the base of the terrain. They're so flat looking. Its the same problem the Carnal Throne had, though that one was worse, since the skulls on the throne had faces on the front and the back somehow. It just looks bad, in my humble opinion. The same with the ones on the chain. This is the same reason I don't buy the scenic bases, because they just look off.
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: i'd say it would be unlikely to have another major character reveal so soon, especislly another chaos one, before they've sold enough Abadons
I also feel it would be unlikely to have a Primarch revealed at GAMA, especially when Adepticon is just over two weeks away.
You do realize that the only thing you can purchase currently for the Chaos Dreadhold are the rules?
Believe me, I'm aware (I was hoping to get another Overlord Bastion when they disappeared without warning). But I presume they still have the CAD files and/or the moulds and can bring it back easily enough. As a kit though, it's AoS' most modular kit and can do a lot more than the triangle towers it was sold as:
Very impressive use of the kit for sure. I got a Helfort still sitting in it's box to build. I don't see them ever making them again. Once GW makes the larger kits vanish they are goners.
Haighus wrote: Glad they finally replaced the resin Herald.
Do Khorne Daemons have any resin left at all now? Alongside Nurgle Daemons, they may be one of the most complete ranges for an older faction. Makes the idea of collecting them much more appealing!
Daemons as a whole are one of the most complete lines in the entire range (in terms of models produced. I'd argue that each god still needs a bit more diversity, and especially in 40k, combat roles).
A few things are direct only because reasons, but at this point (including these new models) the resin models for daemons are:
1- Keeper of Seekers (obviously)
2- The Masque
3- The Bluescribes
4- Khorne Herald on Bloodcrusher
5- Furies, the sad forgotten remnants of Chaos Undivided.
and
6- Slaanesh Herald (though it can be made from a chariot kit, though it doesn't look all that striking without extra bits from somewhere else, or some basing work
7- technically, the Tzeentch Herald on disc (though that can easily be done by cutting up the chariot kit into an exalted flamer, two screams and a herald (on or off disc)
a new prince kit with god specific bits would be nice as well.
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Its funny, my reaction to the WarCom post title was, 'Boring, yet more Blood Blooders,' but I'm perfectly happy filling the holes in the daemon range.
I'm curious about that 'what the future holds for Khorne' combined with that last piece of art. Sure it could just be for the Battletome, but...
bersekers?
I would be all over a new DP kit. The current one still looks good but is really showing its age in how rough the details are. Would be doubly happy if it came with a new warscroll that made him a rightful badass instead of the piddly 160 point hero he currently is.
NinthMusketeer wrote: I would be all over a new DP kit. The current one still looks good but is really showing its age in how rough the details are. Would be doubly happy if it came with a new warscroll that made him a rightful badass instead of the piddly 160 point hero he currently is.
Agreed. The demon prince right now has no place in the game. He's very under par. Hell even most of the mortal heroes are under par, you go dual or trifecta of blood thiirsters or not at all, which is a shame.
I actually LIKE the Daemon Prince. Appearance wise, it’s very versatile. I have on that is “basic” without conversions. A second has both hands holding Minotaur axes w/a Bloodcrusher head. All fits on easily w/no greenstuffing and minimum cutting. A third has been converted to Be’Lakor (more work, but not bad at all), and a 4th (and 5th) are a two prince combo that became a Keeper of Secrets.
Haighus wrote: Glad they finally replaced the resin Herald.
Do Khorne Daemons have any resin left at all now? Alongside Nurgle Daemons, they may be one of the most complete ranges for an older faction. Makes the idea of collecting them much more appealing!
Daemons as a whole are one of the most complete lines in the entire range (in terms of models produced. I'd argue that each god still needs a bit more diversity, and especially in 40k, combat roles).
A few things are direct only because reasons, but at this point (including these new models) the resin models for daemons are:
1- Keeper of Seekers (obviously)
2- The Masque
3- The Bluescribes
4- Khorne Herald on Bloodcrusher
5- Furies, the sad forgotten remnants of Chaos Undivided.
and
6- Slaanesh Herald (though it can be made from a chariot kit, though it doesn't look all that striking without extra bits from somewhere else, or some basing work
7- technically, the Tzeentch Herald on disc (though that can easily be done by cutting up the chariot kit into an exalted flamer, two screams and a herald (on or off disc)
a new prince kit with god specific bits would be nice as well.
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Its funny, my reaction to the WarCom post title was, 'Boring, yet more Blood Blooders,' but I'm perfectly happy filling the holes in the daemon range.
I'm curious about that 'what the future holds for Khorne' combined with that last piece of art. Sure it could just be for the Battletome, but...
bersekers?
Nice Herald. I'm not sure about the Khorne throne, though. Something about the bunny ears looks off, even if Khorne is all about bunny ears. And as has been mentioned, those flat skulls...
He could definitely decapitate them with a warhammer, he just does it inversely by crushing the body off of the head instead of cutting the head off of the body.
Skull altar, judgement, battletome...that’s it for me (and frankly, plenty). Got a metal Skulltaker, two Skullmasters from the Throne kit and 15 classic flesh-hounds. I’m good.
I liked how Skarbrand had the ability to instant death models, MWs are avoidable by some so the change is dissapointing to me.
If Khorne still has the ability to farm blood tithe without losing/killing units that 8 power could very well push the army into overpowered territory. If those abilities are no longer present I like it.
Well, the Skarbrand change is actually a hidden nerf. Before, you could stack attacks for Total Carnage (Wrathmongers, Bloodsecrator, etc). Now, you get one attack no matter what, that can either be 8 or 16 MW. Before, you could get up to something like 24 mortal wounds. Now...1/6 times it's gonna be 8MW with no chance of going up. Hope his points went down to make up for this.
I guess one could argue that now he can stand on his own...but Skarbrand has always been a force multiplier himself, making everyone super-pissed-off when they get close. So it makes him autonomous, which he hasn't ever been supposed to be; both by rules and by fluff. So yeah, unhappy with that change for multiple reasons.
timetowaste85 wrote: Well, the Skarbrand change is actually a hidden nerf. Before, you could stack attacks for Total Carnage (Wrathmongers, Bloodsecrator, etc). Now, you get one attack no matter what, that can either be 8 or 16 MW. Before, you could get up to something like 24 mortal wounds. Now...1/6 times it's gonna be 8MW with no chance of going up. Hope his points went down to make up for this.
I guess one could argue that now he can stand on his own...but Skarbrand has always been a force multiplier himself, making everyone super-pissed-off when they get close. So it makes him autonomous, which he hasn't ever been supposed to be; both by rules and by fluff. So yeah, unhappy with that change for multiple reasons.
Thats why I actually like him more now. I hate the wombo combo nature of AoS and specially when is something as... urgh as Skarbrand. "This model has this mega attack... but he can do it 3 times because a Bloodthirster known for being mad is made even more furious by having a couple of little dudes alongside him!" Naaa.
I'm sure he'll still make everyone around him super pissed, but he won't need all of that baby sitting to actually be viable. And yes, it is actually a nerf but I believe is better for the state of the game. I hope they change Bloodsecrators and their hability. I just hate how VITAL they are to the army. Is nice to have sinergies, and options, and heroes, etc... but when you have one heroe that is "Everyone gains +1 attack" in a full meele army is like... "You should put this model with the battletome"
Reach 8 Blood Tithe, gain exploding hits across the army.
That's... terrifying. Granted, you're using a whole bunch of your unique resource to do so, but it's not inconceivable to get to 8 on Turn 2 or 3 with specific builds, especially against some armies that are heavier on MSU.
Yup; hello 8 units of 10 Bloodreavers rushing into combat. That's 560 points of chaff that looks like crap...gets buffed like crazy, and either gives points or hits with a flurry of attacks. Enjoy the humble reavers!
This is Warcry – a new skirmish game from the makers of Kill Team and Warhammer Underworlds that allows you to experience the visceral carnage of battle in the Mortal Realms in a whole new way.
This is more than just a skirmish version of Warhammer Age of Sigmar – it’s hyper-kinetic, it’s tactical and it’s very, very bloody, featuring bold new game mechanics.
Warcry is perfect for narrative players looking to forge character-driven campaigns where warbands grow and develop through their own journey. Meanwhile, gamers looking for a close-matched, fast and exciting experience will find a game that fits both their coffee table and coffee break.
In the game, you’ll follow the myriad tribes of Chaos – reavers and despoilers from every corner of the realms – as they make their dark pilgrimage to the Varanspire. Warcry explores a never-before-seen side of life (and death!) in the Age of Sigmar. Every model for this game is brand new, reflecting on the dizzying diversity of Chaos on a scale never attempted before and rooted in rich lore that realises the servants of the Dark Gods as deep and varied cultures.
We’ll have more Warcry news for you (and some closer looks at those stunning models!) in the coming weeks – make sure to subscribe to our email newsletter and follow our Facebook page to make sure you don’t miss any announcements.
I'm sad about the mortal wound saturation in Sigmar these days. It's a really fun system in theory, but when everyone is just chucking autowounds everywhere, it sort of throws a lot out the window. Looks like they want to keep pouring them into armies, rather than pull it back, which is a real shame.
I still suspect Warcry is a stealth preview of a new chaos battletome and all the factions will eventually be rolled into an AoS book, albeit it looks to have a slightly bigger scope than just Darkoath.
lord_blackfang wrote: I still suspect Warcry is a stealth preview of a new chaos battletome and all the factions will eventually be rolled into an AoS book, albeit it looks to have a slightly bigger scope than just Darkoath.
Which, I think, is excellent. And if not, maybe it's a preview of some of the mortal warriors to come for Slaanesh?
Kill Team, Kill Team Arena, Kill Team Elite, Necromunda. Armageddon is now gone so that doesn't make me feel good about stability.
Things get muddled together.
While the minis look great, it's diluting the field.
But looking for something good: hopefully we'll get some good fantasy terrain out of it.
Kill Team, Kill Team Arena, Kill Team Elite are all the same game.
While shadespire is a skirmish game it plays alot different then AoS and I suspect warcry
Warcry looks amazing model and terrain wise but the disappointment I am feeling that it's just Chaos vs Chaos is immesurable. I was hoping for a real AoS skrimish game.
Warcry is disappointing in that its chaos only. Thats a huge wasted opportunity and for my area wont' see much traction. Even the people that love chaos like myself aren't going to want to invest in somethiing few others are interested in because they lack a faction they care about.
Well yes there is room for expansion. But I would think if initial release is so limited that that would liimit who wants to buy it, which would limit their desire to expand it.
I feel like it may be included. But that'll mean it'll be more expensive that it already will be. The introduction kill team set had terrain, a unit of skitari, and a GSC unit. But this has a lot more units and they're all original, so who knows.
The new models are nice and look very faithful to some of John Blanche's work. Hopefully this gets expanded beyond Chaos Warbands in the near future. I'll be very disappointed if I don't see some new Orruks and a standalone rulebook.
As for the model everyone is calling a Harpy I'm going to say it's a Chaos Fury. Harpies in WHFB were always a Dark Elf unit and I believe they've already been re-imagined as the Daughters of Khaine Kinerai.
Not-not-kenny wrote: Warcry looks amazing model and terrain wise but the disappointment I am feeling that it's just Chaos vs Chaos is immesurable. I was hoping for a real AoS skrimish game.
Real AoS skirmish was in the February and March 2019 issues of White Dwarf. this, like Mordheim, Gorkamorka and Necromunda looks like it focusses ona specific setting, to bring out the flavour of that particular part of the Mortal Realms. It's not for everyone, but it should make for a better game for those people who are interested.
Not-not-kenny wrote: Warcry looks amazing model and terrain wise but the disappointment I am feeling that it's just Chaos vs Chaos is immesurable. I was hoping for a real AoS skrimish game.
Real AoS skirmish was in the February and March 2019 issues of White Dwarf. this, like Mordheim, Gorkamorka and Necromunda looks like it focusses ona specific setting, to bring out the flavour of that particular part of the Mortal Realms. It's not for everyone, but it should make for a better game for those people who are interested.
I'm pretty sure know what I mean with "real skirmish", the campaign system in the WDAoS Skirmish isn't even substantial enough to be called a joke. Now iff Warcry atually has solid rules and customisation enough to allow for some counts-as like necromunda then I'll definitely jump right in, but GW seems to be determined to not give AoS the full skirmish experience it deserves.
Not-not-kenny wrote: Warcry looks amazing model and terrain wise but the disappointment I am feeling that it's just Chaos vs Chaos is immesurable. I was hoping for a real AoS skrimish game.
Real AoS skirmish was in the February and March 2019 issues of White Dwarf. this, like Mordheim, Gorkamorka and Necromunda looks like it focusses ona specific setting, to bring out the flavour of that particular part of the Mortal Realms. It's not for everyone, but it should make for a better game for those people who are interested.
I'm pretty sure know what I mean with "real skirmish", the campaign system in the WDAoS Skirmish isn't even substantial enough to be called a joke. Now iff Warcry atually has solid rules and customisation enough to allow for some counts-as like necromunda then I'll definitely jump right in, but GW seems to be determined to not give AoS the full skirmish experience it deserves.
Based on the description of Warcry and that it looks to be played on a 22"x30", and who designed it, I can imagine the campaign rules will be similar to Kill Team (maybe a bit more involved as they mention Warbands "growing and developing"), I'm also hoping the game has a bit of customization to the units.
Not too impressed with the judgements of khorne. The skulls are cool but the other two are just MW delivery with a side benefit. The skull altar on the other hand I like, it gives the army prayer re rolls without gore pilgrims.
Ghaz wrote: The new models are nice and look very faithful to some of John Blanche's work. Hopefully this gets expanded beyond Chaos Warbands in the near future. I'll be very disappointed if I don't see some new Orruks and a standalone rulebook.
As for the model everyone is calling a Harpy I'm going to say it's a Chaos Fury. Harpies in WHFB were always a Dark Elf unit and I believe they've already been re-imagined as the Daughters of Khaine Kinerai.
Spoiler:
At least when I played back in 4th, Chaos Harpies were a thing and they looked more or less like this, that is flying humanoids with fangs and claws. I don’t think Furies existed.
Ghaz wrote: The new models are nice and look very faithful to some of John Blanche's work. Hopefully this gets expanded beyond Chaos Warbands in the near future. I'll be very disappointed if I don't see some new Orruks and a standalone rulebook.
As for the model everyone is calling a Harpy I'm going to say it's a Chaos Fury. Harpies in WHFB were always a Dark Elf unit and I believe they've already been re-imagined as the Daughters of Khaine Kinerai.
Spoiler:
At least when I played back in 4th, Chaos Harpies were a thing and they looked more or less like this, that is flying humanoids with fangs and claws. I don’t think Furies existed.
Beastmen could take harpies as well, if memory serves. I still feel like they may be some Ulgu daemons, or something to do with Maelerion(?). Though, unaffiliated daemons against unaffiliated chaos warbands would be a welcome change.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Not too impressed with the judgements of khorne. The skulls are cool but the other two are just MW delivery with a side benefit. The skull altar on the other hand I like, it gives the army prayer re rolls without gore pilgrims.
Seems that most Endless Spells of late just deliver MW's in varying ways.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Not too impressed with the judgements of khorne. The skulls are cool but the other two are just MW delivery with a side benefit. The skull altar on the other hand I like, it gives the army prayer re rolls without gore pilgrims.
Seems that most Endless Spells of late just deliver MW's in varying ways.
Actually the last several releases (Skaven, FEC, Gloomspite) were quite good about the spells doing other things, while they generally deal mortal wounds they are poor sources of them next to other endless spells or even just regular ones. It is the other effects they do that they are taken for. Warp Lightning Vortex is probably the biggest output of MWs from all of them and I still wouldn't take it if that is all it did.
Warcry looks good - the terrain looks great and I like the idea. But I'm not a chaos fan- hopefully they will add other factions to this. I was hoping it would be layer above shadespire towards the full AoS game.
Carlovonsexron wrote: I dont think those guys are actually Darkoath- not enough metal. I do think they are from Ghur though.
I was just going to say the same thing. Dark oath are just undivided marauder types. These 6 tribes could probably all be broadly considered “dark oath”, in that they are sworn to the gods of chaos. I could be wrong as it is very early. I think that it’s pretty apparent that these first 6 tribes/factions will be themed according to 6 of the realms.
Segersgia wrote: Could these marauders be Realm themed perhaps? Like the Red dudes give me a very Chamon vibe, while the normal Darkoath might be Ghur?
I get more of an Ulgu sense with the masks and grey skin, agree the others are very Ghurish though.
silverstu wrote: Warcry looks good - the terrain looks great and I like the idea. But I'm not a chaos fan- hopefully they will add other factions to this. I was hoping it would be layer above shadespire towards the full AoS game.
It looks very much like a Necromunda equivalent. 2 of 6 gangs in the box with more to follow.
Plus beasties, some of which look like they're attached to a warband, others like 'map hazards'
But I really hope the release and rules model isn't as awful as Necromunda.
No interest in Necromunda, and Mordheim seemed too convoluted (when I was starting out), but this looks just right. And being able to play on a small table? I’ll be getting it on release. Feels like a no-brainer purchase.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Not too impressed with the judgements of khorne. The skulls are cool but the other two are just MW delivery with a side benefit. The skull altar on the other hand I like, it gives the army prayer re rolls without gore pilgrims.
Seems that most Endless Spells of late just deliver MW's in varying ways.
I do kind of like AoS, but it really is the +1/-1/Re-roll/MW game.
Maybe that's an inherent limitation of a d6 system, or maybe it is down to the limitations of whoever is in charge or writing the rules?
There's only two models (both mortal) that actually enable the Judgements, Slaughterpriests and the Warshrine. The Warshrine doesn't really work sitting stationary in the back of the army as it is a support piece for mortals that needs to move up with the army.
Then there's the opportunity cost. A slaughterpriest (the cheapest priest) is 100 points plus the cost of the judgement spells. You could just be adding another unit of bloodletters to your army which also do mortal wounds, capture objectives, and put more bodies on the field for blood tithe purposes.
So the only thing that really is gained if you don't invest in the priests and judgements, is just the free terrain piece for the 16" bubble of difficult spellcasting. Which isn't bad, but easily played around/avoided by your opponent.
I'm really hoping there is an artifact or warlord trait that turns a model (especially for daemons) into a priest.
I like the miniatures. Even the scuba-diver warband.
I am currently more interested in this product than I am anything else Games Workshop has previewed or released so far this year.
There's only two models (both mortal) that actually enable the Judgements, Slaughterpriests and the Warshrine. The Warshrine doesn't really work sitting stationary in the back of the army as it is a support piece for mortals that needs to move up with the army.
Then there's the opportunity cost. A slaughterpriest (the cheapest priest) is 100 points plus the cost of the judgement spells. You could just be adding another unit of bloodletters to your army which also do mortal wounds, capture objectives, and put more bodies on the field for blood tithe purposes.
So the only thing that really is gained if you don't invest in the priests and judgements, is just the free terrain piece for the 16" bubble of difficult spellcasting. Which isn't bad, but easily played around/avoided by your opponent.
I'm really hoping there is an artifact or warlord trait that turns a model (especially for daemons) into a priest.
I play Tzeentch, which really does only one thing well. Khorne has about 8,000 ways to mess that up, and rocks face in combat while doing it.
So, I'm boned. Seems like there's little point in playing against Khorne anymore.
Basically if you are playing an army / factiion that doesn't have up to date rules (the vast majority of factions) you are likely boned if your opponent is going alpha list.
*cough* and we don't always do that all that well *cough*
So I own a Khorne Daemon army (100% metal) that I've used in AOS a few times, pre-battletome era. It was a thing. Then I started building a new Khorne Daemon army (100% plastic), got sick of AOS and ported the project to 40k, had no interest in 7E so ported back to AOS when Blades dropped and played a game or two, soured of AOS and ported back to 40k for 8E, where it's gained some traction. Could possibly pop back over to see how this new book works?
I'll give AOS credit, the new battletomes do add significant flavor to daemons in particular, who are pretty one note in 40k. While I enjoy playing 40k the game with my Tizz Daemons due to the system being more developed, I enjoy playing my Tizz Daemons the army in AOS due to the subfaction actually having rules that do Tzeentchian things #destinydiceforever
Would be nice if Tzeentch could just roll a 3+ to shut down the Khorne combat phase since apparently it's fine to just remove phases you're not good at.
The only thing I dislike is the terrain piece because don't bypass the language filter like this. free terrain pieces with free bonuses.
Eveyrthing else I don't see a problem with. At the end of the day they receive those bonuses instead of others and agaisnt many factions they aren't even gonna work. I'm actually angsty, because if they become too much anti-psyker army they could end up going the GK route.
lord_blackfang wrote: Would be nice if Tzeentch could just roll a 3+ to shut down the Khorne combat phase since apparently it's fine to just remove phases you're not good at.
That’s just a tiny bit of an exaggeration don’t you think? The endless spell effect can be mitigated by the lord of change, and you can roll exactly 8 nine times before you need to worry about losing any spells. I’m not saying Tzeentch is the greatest army going right now but you maight actually do better against Khorne than some other magic heavy armies thanks to the destiny dice.
There's only two models (both mortal) that actually enable the Judgements, Slaughterpriests and the Warshrine. The Warshrine doesn't really work sitting stationary in the back of the army as it is a support piece for mortals that needs to move up with the army.
Then there's the opportunity cost. A slaughterpriest (the cheapest priest) is 100 points plus the cost of the judgement spells. You could just be adding another unit of bloodletters to your army which also do mortal wounds, capture objectives, and put more bodies on the field for blood tithe purposes.
So the only thing that really is gained if you don't invest in the priests and judgements, is just the free terrain piece for the 16" bubble of difficult spellcasting. Which isn't bad, but easily played around/avoided by your opponent.
I'm really hoping there is an artifact or warlord trait that turns a model (especially for daemons) into a priest.
I play Tzeentch, which really does only one thing well. Khorne has about 8,000 ways to mess that up, and rocks face in combat while doing it.
So, I'm boned. Seems like there's little point in playing against Khorne anymore.
Aren’t you worried more about Slaanesh? That Infernal Enrapturess makes doubles peril...and LoCs of all varieties ONLY roll doubles. Tzeentch GW Slaanesh is basically an automatic loss if you play with any LoCs. You won’t out-CC a Slaanesh army, they’ll be hitting you turn 1 with half the army, turn 2 with the second half, and they shut down tzeentch magic more than Khorne does. Trust me, this Khorne matchup is WAY more favorable for you.
lord_blackfang wrote: Would be nice if Tzeentch could just roll a 3+ to shut down the Khorne combat phase since apparently it's fine to just remove phases you're not good at.
That’s just a tiny bit of an exaggeration don’t you think? The endless spell effect can be mitigated by the lord of change, and you can roll exactly 8 nine times before you need to worry about losing any spells. I’m not saying Tzeentch is the greatest army going right now but you maight actually do better against Khorne than some other magic heavy armies thanks to the destiny dice.
Khorne pays points for the ability to summon a model that applies a penalty to magic in a large but still limited-range bubble that has a chance to vanish on its own at the end of turn without the Tzeentch player doing anything.
With all due respect, if what we have seen so far means auto-lose for a Tzeentch player then that player needs to learn and apply better counter-strategies. Now if it turns out to be like 20 points for the skulls and the altar can be deployed anywhere on the Khorne's player's table half than that is a different matter.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Not too impressed with the judgements of khorne. The skulls are cool but the other two are just MW delivery with a side benefit. The skull altar on the other hand I like, it gives the army prayer re rolls without gore pilgrims.
Seems that most Endless Spells of late just deliver MW's in varying ways.
I do kind of like AoS, but it really is the +1/-1/Re-roll/MW game.
Maybe that's an inherent limitation of a d6 system, or maybe it is down to the limitations of whoever is in charge or writing the rules?
It is the rules writing. There are a number of routes they could take (including just having sources of MWs not deal as many of them) that are not taken. That said, the statement that most endless spells of late are MW delivery mechanisms is inaccurate.
lord_blackfang wrote: Would be nice if Tzeentch could just roll a 3+ to shut down the Khorne combat phase since apparently it's fine to just remove phases you're not good at.
That’s just a tiny bit of an exaggeration don’t you think? The endless spell effect can be mitigated by the lord of change, and you can roll exactly 8 nine times before you need to worry about losing any spells. I’m not saying Tzeentch is the greatest army going right now but you maight actually do better against Khorne than some other magic heavy armies thanks to the destiny dice.
Khorne pays points for the ability to summon a model that applies a penalty to magic in a large but still limited-range bubble that has a chance to vanish on its own at the end of turn without the Tzeentch player doing anything.
With all due respect, if what we have seen so far means auto-lose for a Tzeentch player then that player needs to learn and apply better counter-strategies. Now if it turns out to be like 20 points for the skulls and the altar can be deployed anywhere on the Khorne's player's table half than that is a different matter.
When so much of an army is dedicated to screwing up the ONE thing you're good at and you can't counter the thing they're good at, "get better, newb' isn't the most helpful piece of advice.
And how many of the new faction terrain pieces can't be placed anywhere in your own deployment zone? Skaven Gnawholes, of which you get three and can set up in the opponent's zone?
silverstu wrote: Warcry looks good - the terrain looks great and I like the idea. But I'm not a chaos fan- hopefully they will add other factions to this. I was hoping it would be layer above shadespire towards the full AoS game.
It looks very much like a Necromunda equivalent. 2 of 6 gangs in the box with more to follow.
Plus beasties, some of which look like they're attached to a warband, others like 'map hazards'
But I really hope the release and rules model isn't as awful as Necromunda.
As it’s GW not FW led, I’d assume it to be more like Underworlds/Kill Team/BSF or anything in that vein..
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, unrelated;
You know what puzzles/annoys me.
AoS gets this one thread for anything in the Mortal Realms setting. (All main game,Warcry,Underworlds, everything..)
But 40k gets threads for every game (Necro/BSF), faction release (Orks,GSC,Sisters etc), expansion (Vigilus/Shadowspear) And any tiny thing they release pretty much.
You know what puzzles/annoys me.
AoS gets this one thread for anything in the Mortal Realms setting. (All main game,Warcry,Underworlds, everything..)
But 40k gets threads for every game (Necro/BSF), faction release (Orks,GSC,Sisters etc), expansion (Vigilus/Shadowspear) And any tiny thing they release pretty much.
Anyone can start a new thread if they so wish (and Underworlds already has thread) so you can be annoyed about it or you could start a new thread
lord_blackfang wrote: Would be nice if Tzeentch could just roll a 3+ to shut down the Khorne combat phase since apparently it's fine to just remove phases you're not good at.
When so much of an army is dedicated to screwing up the ONE thing you're good at and you can't counter the thing they're good at, "get better, newb' isn't the most helpful piece of advice.
OK, how about this. Put the blue scribes in your list. Once a turn they can cast a spell on 2+ that is unaffected by modifiers, as it is not a typical casting roll. You can then cast the spell that lets everyone else reroll failed casting roles. You also have on the the best combat units in the game with the Tzaangor enlightened.
You know what puzzles/annoys me.
AoS gets this one thread for anything in the Mortal Realms setting. (All main game,Warcry,Underworlds, everything..)
But 40k gets threads for every game (Necro/BSF), faction release (Orks,GSC,Sisters etc), expansion (Vigilus/Shadowspear) And any tiny thing they release pretty much.
Anyone can start a new thread if they so wish (and Underworlds already has thread) so you can be annoyed about it or you could start a new thread
I guess, though in the last year I’m sure I’ve seen several closed with ‘already discussed here’ cited. Which is fair enough.
But the new chaos crawler for instance, gets discussed in the Rumour Mill, Gama, Shadowspear etc.
It shouldn’t bother me, as I don’t play any kind of AoS (nothing since Fabatsy RIP) games.
Though Warcry could be the one, it looks awesome, great models, I love Kill Team.
(And of course I need more models to paint and have loads of free time to invest in a new game.. )
lord_blackfang wrote: Would be nice if Tzeentch could just roll a 3+ to shut down the Khorne combat phase since apparently it's fine to just remove phases you're not good at.
That’s just a tiny bit of an exaggeration don’t you think? The endless spell effect can be mitigated by the lord of change, and you can roll exactly 8 nine times before you need to worry about losing any spells. I’m not saying Tzeentch is the greatest army going right now but you maight actually do better against Khorne than some other magic heavy armies thanks to the destiny dice.
Khorne pays points for the ability to summon a model that applies a penalty to magic in a large but still limited-range bubble that has a chance to vanish on its own at the end of turn without the Tzeentch player doing anything.
With all due respect, if what we have seen so far means auto-lose for a Tzeentch player then that player needs to learn and apply better counter-strategies. Now if it turns out to be like 20 points for the skulls and the altar can be deployed anywhere on the Khorne's player's table half than that is a different matter.
When so much of an army is dedicated to screwing up the ONE thing you're good at and you can't counter the thing they're good at, "get better, newb' isn't the most helpful piece of advice.
And how many of the new faction terrain pieces can't be placed anywhere in your own deployment zone? Skaven Gnawholes, of which you get three and can set up in the opponent's zone?
Territory =/= deployement zone. Anywhere in territory can mean anywhere on the whole board half, as in basically the middle of the board. Anywhere in deployment zone would mean only 12" in on a standard setup. The difference is huge.
Also, 'so much of an army' as in:
-A terrain piece
-A judgement they pay points for
-A 5 wound buff-bubble character that also debuffs casting in the same range
Again, it may be that Khorne anti-magic is so strong and so cheap that it screws Tzeentch over hard. But from what we have seen that call is premature because the resources currently available can be countered with proper play. Tzeentch deals MWs which Stormcast have no defense against, but to say that automatically decides the matchup is silly because there are so many other factors involved.
Warscrolls have been updated on the GW site. Seems like a lot of changes from what people are saying on the facebook group.
Mighty skullcrushers went up to 3+ save but lost the spells save but gained another attack on all their weapons and the demon bloodcrushers charge ability.
NinthMusketeer wrote: That said, the statement that most endless spells of late are MW delivery mechanisms is inaccurate.
I feel I should clarify, or, rather, should have been more clear in the use of my word 'deliver'. I should have said 'causing' MW, not delivering. I don't think that all the recent spells are MW delivery systems. I think that they cause MW's in various ways. Even the Goblin one that doesn't hurt the enemy still causes MWs to the user. They're like the C'Tan abilities - all just slightly different ways of causing MWs - different paths to end up at largely the same result.
That's why they're lazy. That's why MW bloat (and aura re-rolls/1+'s or -1's) permeating the game is so bad. And this affects 40k as well.
NinthMusketeer wrote: That said, the statement that most endless spells of late are MW delivery mechanisms is inaccurate.
I feel I should clarify, or, rather, should have been more clear in the use of my word 'deliver'. I should have said 'causing' MW, not delivering. I don't think that all the recent spells are MW delivery systems. I think that they cause MW's in various ways. Even the Goblin one that doesn't hurt the enemy still causes MWs to the user. They're like the C'Tan abilities - all just slightly different ways of causing MWs - different paths to end up at largely the same result.
That's why they're lazy. That's why MW bloat (and aura re-rolls/1+'s or -1's) permeating the game is so bad. And this affects 40k as well.
I don't know enough to agree or disagree for other army specific Endless Spells, but I'm glad my FEC got 2 other endless spells that did more than just cause wounds. Its gotta be tough to try and come up with 3-4 unique ideas for spells for each tome, especially if they also have to be comparable to the Malign Sorcery spells.
NinthMusketeer wrote: That said, the statement that most endless spells of late are MW delivery mechanisms is inaccurate.
I feel I should clarify, or, rather, should have been more clear in the use of my word 'deliver'. I should have said 'causing' MW, not delivering. I don't think that all the recent spells are MW delivery systems. I think that they cause MW's in various ways. Even the Goblin one that doesn't hurt the enemy still causes MWs to the user. They're like the C'Tan abilities - all just slightly different ways of causing MWs - different paths to end up at largely the same result.
That's why they're lazy. That's why MW bloat (and aura re-rolls/1+'s or -1's) permeating the game is so bad. And this affects 40k as well.
Got the BoK book today. Few things that annoy me, otherwise it looks solid. You can go heavy attack, heavy anti-magic, heavy prayers, or even heavy charging mortal wounds. It doesn’t look like a one trick pony, and I think the Dark Feast battalion is way better than Gore Pilgrims in this book (+1A for each model, instead of +8” range for the ‘Secrator, plus cheaper).
When GW have released those 6 main Factions (which are maybe all Undivided?) - do you think it would be possible they Release 4 Factions for the Chaos Gods and some other "feral" Factions like... Seraphon or Bonesplitaz for the other Alliances?
I think there is a good chance it'll expand out into other factions based on popularity, but I'm hopeful it will be a test bed of awesome new designs and mini factions to see what takes and can get slotted up for a bigger release in AoS.
Seaphon would be cool, and i do adore Lizardmen- but I'd much rather see different human nations and armies from order represented. And from Chaos why bother with other orcs when we could have a re-invented and more lore palatable Fimir...
I don't know that there's much point in speculating on Warcry just yet. We just don't know. I expect to hear more about it from Adepticon, though. Excited to see what it's all about!
Maybe that'll be their excuse to fully squat Slaanesh. "w-w-well s-ee! You did affect the narrative!"
Boy do you guys seem obssessed with the squatting of Slaanesh. At this point it almost seems you want GW to do it.
Squatting of Slaanesh has already been confirmed. When he/she has his/her comeback in AoS, he/she will have a beard and stubby legs. His/her portfolio will also not include lust anymore but avarice and greed. And to cement this retcon the Stormcast statue in Nottingham will be replaced by a hunchbacked old squat with a glass eye and a bag full of gold.
Lord Kragan wrote: http://cubicle7.co.uk/age-of-sigmar-doomseeker-reveal/
Meet the doomseeker.
My GM instincts tell me that's a character concept for someone who wants to create a new character every session. At least as soon as the rest of the party gets tired of saving the nutter from himself.
I hope there is more to this than a new Battle Tome. The return of an active Slannesh to the realms should IMO be a proper event on par with the Necro quake.
GoatboyBeta wrote: I hope there is more to this than a new Battle Tome. The return of an active Slannesh to the realms should IMO be a proper event on par with the Necro quake.
Genuinely? I can see Slaanesh’s return upsetting the Big Three most of all, which in turn could allow the forces of Order to further dig in?
GoatboyBeta wrote: I hope there is more to this than a new Battle Tome. The return of an active Slannesh to the realms should IMO be a proper event on par with the Necro quake.
Genuinely? I can see Slaanesh’s return upsetting the Big Three most of all, which in turn could allow the forces of Order to further dig in?
It's fit into Tzeentch's plan, rub Khorne and Nurgle the wrong way and probably piss of that upstart the Horned Rat.
The Slaanesh teaser has me so excited. I don't have the money right now for new models but I can still look and drool, right? Seems right somehow to covet a Slaanesh release
I had to blink and refocus to make sure that KoS was a miniature and not an art piece. No words for how perfect that is.
Other stuff looks cool, but need a full look to be sure. Still, that named daemon prince certainly peaks my interest, terrain feature seems uninspired, spells look just the right amount of excessive silliness.
The lack of mortal previews arouses my interest in how releases will stack up between them, the daemons, and chaos space marines.
I like the demon prince who actually managed to keep his human look and got a little spider-monkey pal who's going to swing around on all those metal things coming out of his back whipping people.
I think I would try to paint his skin like marble or porcelain (I would fail but would be neat to try)
nagash42 wrote: I like the demon prince who actually managed to keep his human look and got a little spider-monkey pal who's going to swing around on all those metal things coming out of his back whipping people.
I think I would try to paint his skin like marble or porcelain (I would fail but would be neat to try)
That 'little' pal is a herald. The guy is a 15-foot roman emperor crossed with platinum golem.
1) A shame that Fyreslayers didn't get all new models for their line, but they are getting udpated and are getting some very cool looking spells and a big bit of terrain! I think that they will certainly join Flesh Eater Courts in being a smaller line of models, a shame for fans of the line, but at the same time a new Tome on their own cements them as a secure faction for the future which is good!
2) Warcry getting 9 additional launch factions sounds a lot like they won't get unique models for those lines. It's a LOT of models if GW were to do that. My money is on them either just having rules for regular models or even porting over the Shadspire warteams. The Chaos "Pets" look great!
3) 50 Shades of Grey - well a brand new thing in the GW paint line up? Well if its not the can of Peachy and Duncan I could see GW launching their own air-gun. They did have (might still have one) head of their own but this might be them doing their own formal machine complete with compressor. GW has supported them in the past, but never in a big way, so this could be a turning point (note how in all their tutorials they stuck to brushes, if they added airsprayers that would change things up a lot).
4) Slaanesh - I'm not sure how I feel about the new Keeper. Mostly because of the head being more human and less beastial compared to the old. I'm also curious what other optional parts will appear in the box. The other big chaos lords have quite the variety of heads/weapons/parts so it will be interesting to see what else it comes with. Its looking fantastic and has a great "power" pose coming right at you! The new spells look suitably great.
My one real complaint is the new lord+herald model because my GODS that thing looks fragile as heck in plastic! A multi-headed whip held by a character hanging from spikes on the back of another - that that is going to be one model you wrap in the dark gods own velvet to transport and offer up sacrifices before any trip that it makes it to the end of the trip in one part!
Seeing the new stuff make me wish they'd re-done the deamonettes, but still a fantastic looking update for Slaanesh!
5) Forbidden power was what I expected - its Malign Sorcery 2.0! What I am interested to see is the sheer amount of Tomb King Style teasing going on with it - a boat of the dead; a freaking head of a Pharaoh etc.... It's got a very strong "this is shyesh - this is egyptian" theme going on. Which is curious because every major culture has its own ways to represent the dead worlds so that GW has latched onto that might be them just giving a nod to the past; or maybe its a hint....
Eh, the Keeper of Secrets is salvageable but the head needs to go. Master Blaster is at least unique, but not really my thing. There's no saving the Masque, not in metal, not in plastic. The mirror thing looks reasonable. I hope it's a giant laser cannon. Probably does mortal wounds because why not?
Biggest deal for me is that they showed no mortals. I'm not saying there won't be any, who knows but GW, but that's the one thing I wanted from a Slaanesh release: mortal followers on the fantasy side.
So yeah, I'm bored by this preview. GW doesn't share my idea of hedonism.
Overread wrote: 1) A shame that Fyreslayers didn't get all new models for their line, but they are getting udpated and are getting some very cool looking spells and a big bit of terrain!
Note that in the video they also show what I assume to be a terrian feature for Slaanesh that they've not photographed and put in the article - the large portal with a head coming through it.
I really like the new Slaanesh things, but I'm still hoping fore MORE! Call it excess, but Slaangors and/or marked marauders would see me getting some, more demons won't. The new demon characters are a vast improvement and the KoS is gorgeous, but tons of regular non-Diaz-Nettes, nah, no need. A fat Doombull, a few shredded strongman/male model-types with mumified or masked faces as 40mm base elite infantry, a sorceror made from liquid gold, insanse things of excess is what Slaanesh needs.
Warcry is still awesome looking and "I told you so" to all the people doubting that we'd see non-Chaos bands (mainly on TGA). I did not expect so many, though, and most probably won't be new models with a crusader/witch hunter/anti-Chaos theme it seems :/ That's what kitbashing is for, though, unless at least the Sigmar-ish glyph is a witch hunter band.
Fyrslyrs, ehh, if only the standard dwarfs were not such bad sculpts outisde of the helmets and weapons. The hideously expensive *and* hideous lumps of plastic vaguely resembling muscles are not very tempting to start. The magma spell will be mine if it's part of a endless spell-like box at the same price, a big fire gribbly is always useful.
First greater daemon that I've really been impressed with. But I'll echo 'where are the units?' Be they mortal or daemon, a book needs more than characters to fill it out.
Binabik15 wrote: Warcry is still awesome looking and "I told you so" to all the people doubting that we'd see non-Chaos bands (mainly on TGA). I did not expect so many, though, and most probably won't be new models with a crusader/witch hunter/anti-Chaos theme it seems :/ That's what kitbashing is for, though, unless at least the Sigmar-ish glyph is a witch hunter band.
It was kind of foreseeable, at least if your outlook is a little gloomy. A focused game like Necromunda or Mordheim is for Specialist Games. GW proper wants to sell as many models to as many people as possible. Too narrow a theme gets in the way of that.
Which I approve of in this case. It's plenty good to get a wider range of Chaos models alone. The focus of the game doesn't specifically have to be about that. There are obviously advantages to a game about Chaos followers vying for the attention of the Chaos Gods, but with Age of Sigmar being such a massive punchfest, I think having other faction meddle in their little competition is just fine.
Voss wrote: First greater daemon that I've really been impressed with. But I'll echo 'where are the units?' Be they mortal or daemon, a book needs more than characters to fill it out.
While I agree, I think I lost hope of GW seeing it like that with the massive cavalcade of characters Death Guard got. I might have let it slide for Age of Sigmar releases since the game and setting were new at the time, but the direction they took 40k at the same time kind of carved it in stone for me. Narrative wise it's all about a set of heroes doing everything everywhere, too. Sign of the times, I guess.
As a Gloomspite player this is what I'm looking forward to. I'm hoping we see a new plastic Madcap Shaman and a plastic Loonboss on a Giant Cave Squig with this release.
As a Gloomspite player this is what I'm looking forward to. I'm hoping we see a new plastic Madcap Shaman and a plastic Loonboss on a Giant Cave Squig with this release.
That'd be quite nice, as the old boss on squig is fairly...poor
Not a chaos fan( bit tired of the recent deluge of pre-orders and little else ) but the Keeper of Secrets looks a great model to paint. Just wondering how much it might cost...
Nice to see more stuff for the Fyreslayers, but, I feel like they need more units more than anything. I still think it's silly that the old school slayers can't be in their army list. That, and that the Khadorans can't take the old Gyrocopters. Still, this Forge is pretty amazing.
Spoiler:
I'm not sure what to think of Forbidden Power. Some more endless spells, but most don't look that cool compared to what we've seen so far (I like the boat, and that's about it). There's talk of opening sigmar's chamber, or a Stormvault or something, but I have no clue what that means? I'm not super well versed in the lore of AoS, but I knew Warhammer Fantasy, and 40k pretty well, so I feel like this info should be more obvious to even less committed fans. But, I may have just missed where that became a thing?
Great to see Slaanesh finally coming to the table (and the Keeper in plastic). I really like the look of the endless spells for them. That said... As a long time (we're talking close to 30 years since I bought my first Realm of Chaos Keeper of secrets (it was the Yak head with the eye patch )) collector/player of Slaaneshi Demons, Warriors, and EC space marines, I have to say, I'm not really excited about any of these figures. The Keeper looks nice, but not really very interesting to me. I much prefer Zara, and the Creature Caster Queen of Ecstasy and Pincer Demon. I don't feel like they did it wrong, but, I guess I just don't enjoy the current Slaanesh aesthetic that they use. The Demon Prince is underwhelming, and the new Masque is just... The rest looks fine though, and I like their Terrain piece, but, I doubt I'll get any of it, unless the Keeper has an alt build, or special character build that's just crazy awesome (totally possible!). I'm hoping Sigvaald (sp?) will make it into this edition, since it seems like some of the 'mortal' heroes from each god had made it out of the end times, but we'll see. They could do a pretty wild model of him engorged in his own reflection, which would be fun.
The terrain piece irks me in that it is a static structure; so they hauled it out and built it reallyreally fast before the battle? Most structures are 'summoned' but there are an increasing number that are just inexplicably there and it breaks immersion for me.
I'm hoping Warcry is a bit more than Kill Team + Shadespire, and more like N17. Well, N17 without the release schedule that took 2 years to make 6 factions.
Because those kits look way too modular and look like they have a lot of options.
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The rest looks fine though, and I like their Terrain piece, but, I doubt I'll get any of it, unless the Keeper has an alt build, or special character build that's just crazy awesome (totally possible!). I'm hoping Sigvaald (sp?) will make it into this edition, since it seems like some of the 'mortal' heroes from each god had made it out of the end times, but we'll see. They could do a pretty wild model of him engorged in his own reflection, which would be fun.
