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Gitzbitah wrote: Invader Zim. Alone, unsupported, unasked for, yet he waged a one Irken war on Humanity which at the very least resulted in the destruction of Mercury and Mars. He is so unabashedly over the top, and gleefully destructive. If he only had an ounce of common sense he would have conquered galaxies.
One of the plots of an unaired episode was a sort of trial that would allowe the Tallest to execute Zim, but the trial instead concludes that Zim is the greatest invader in Irken history he doesn't even have to try to destroy, it just happens by his mere presence
Man I miss this show. I think I'm gonna go track down the episodes and start watching again.
My vote for my favorite sci-fi villain goes to the terminator T800
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2014/09/20 20:27:55
I expected something involving Ming the Merciless.
You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was
Roy was a good one. Didn't even think of blade runner which was a huge mistake on my part haha. I love the nostalgia from threads like these as I haven't seen a lot of this stuff in what is probably years at this point.
Wishing I was back at the South Atlantic, closer to ice than the sun
MeanGreenStompa wrote: Also I don't really get people nominating Londo Molari, he was always far more a trapped Faust-like character to me. Not a villain.
Basically its because that's almost exactly what he is, but he wasn't trapped, he stepped right into that cage of his own free will. Just looking at the episode where everyone is approached by Morden and asked what they wanted, in his heart, Londo never wanted power for himself, he put the Centauri Empire above all else and so began a slow and tragic path to achieving that no matter what the cost. Most villains have some sort of self aggrandisement as the eventuality, wealth, power or revenge against some other party. Londo did none of that, he didn't care who/what he hurt just so that the Centauris were the primary race in the Galaxy. He was an unwitting villain who did evil to achieve good for his race.
Cheers
Andrew
I don't care what the flag says, I'm SCOTTISH!!!
Best definition of the word Battleship?
Mr Nobody wrote:
Does a canoe with a machine gun count?
Carter Burke from "Aliens" - ok, the xenomorphs are nasty, but as Ripley says, you didn't see them screwing each other over a percentage - and I always find the scheming villains to be the most unlikeable.
You damn kids! It's Vader. It's always been Vader.
We were once so close to heaven, St. Peter came out and gave us medals; declaring us "The nicest of the damned".
“Anti-intellectualism has been a constant thread winding its way through our political and cultural life, nurtured by the false notion that democracy means that 'my ignorance is just as good as your knowledge.'”
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
Q is a Q. An omnipotent and transcendent species from a parallel universe where all individuals refer to themselves as Q. But only one of them really shows any interest in the world of mortals, and humans in particular interest him.
He shows up in Next Generation, Voyager, and DS9. Don't believe he appears in any of the others.
He's kinda sorta an antagonist and protagonist at the same time. Really the best description of him is that he's one big troll that's just bored out of his skull with existence in the Q-verse.
His notable achievements include tormenting all the protagonists, materializing on the Enterprise bridge buck naked, attempting to seduce Captain Janeway, and regularly making large numbers of ship crew cease to exist for periods of time.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
Grey Templar wrote: He shows up in Next Generation, Voyager, and DS9. Don't believe he appears in any of the others.
There's fan-theories(and I believed it's explored in one of the EU books) that "God" from The Final Frontier is an exiled Q.
You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was
Then there was the novel where Trelane from the original series episode 'The Squire of Gothos' was retconned as a juvenile Q.
On Dukat: (SPOILERS!) the episode 'Waltz' was featured recently on Tor.com's DS9 rewatch. I thought it was kind of interesting that in the article and the many comments, there's a kind of horror that trekkies back then were starting to see him as admirable, but that the writers' response in this episode, turning him into a full-blown moustache-twirling villain, was a misstep.
Personally, I have mixed feelings. Sure, I wouldn't agree with some mid-90's trekkies in justifying his old actions as prefect of Bajor, but the problem is an old writers' mistake: we weren't shown Dukat as prefect of Bajor, and all the nastiness he carried out, except in a couple of flashback episodes. We were just kinda told 'trust us, he's a baddy, okay?', all the while being shown that for every unlikable act shown on screen (more often than not, not a lot more than hitting on Kira in a creepy way) we were also shown one or two cooperative, sensitive, friendly, even heroic and yeah, admirable acts.
Maybe that's why he was such a magnificent bar-steward, 'cos he (or Marc Alaimo) managed to charm even the viewers' attention away from his misdeeds.
I don't know if Waltz was such a mistake, either. The complaints are that it was too obvious, and retconned Dukat as hating Bajorans the whole time even as he was trying to be accepted and loved as their benefactor. (scaly man's burden) Personally, I think he went for the moustache-twirling bit earlier, when it turned out he orchestrated Cardassia's entry to the Dominion with him as it's governor, of sorts. He became a bit less interesting to me then, fixated on DS9 but hobbled by Weyoun, but regained it in Sacrifice of Angels and Waltz. I thought of it less as a desperate retcon, than as a man completely broken down and spat on by life and all the people he tried (in a screwed-up way) to reach out to and work with. His prize of DS9, gone; his image as heroic saviour of Cardassia, gone; his beloved daughter, his only remaining family, shot by his second in command and closest friend. Nothing left but ashes, and the hatred and contempt of him from Bajor and Sisko, so his recently tilted psyche gives in and latches onto that. They want him to be the bad guy? Well no more mister nice gul.
What follows after that maybe could've been handled a bit better, especially some of the pagh-wraith stuff, but I don't mind it so much as others in that Tor comments thread. I see it as an interesting shift from smarmy but ineffectual 'statesman' to more of a... Hannibal Lecter type. Then his schemes and aims become a bit more morbidly interesting and successful too. Alaimo could always do sinister along with the charm, and with the latter arc I think he did well in cranking it up several notches.
On Dukat: (SPOILERS!) the episode 'Waltz' was featured recently on Tor.com's DS9 rewatch. I thought it was kind of interesting that in the article and the many comments, there's a kind of horror that trekkies back then were starting to see him as admirable, but that the writers' response in this episode, turning him into a full-blown moustache-twirling villain, was a misstep.
Yeah, fans were taking to him as an anti-villain, which he most certainly wasn't (genocidal occupation is genocidal occupation) and they decided to take the plunge with him to ensure this didn't become a thing in the fandom. Personally, I think it worked just fine, highlighting the original ideal behind Dukat.
I don't know if Waltz was such a mistake, either. The complaints are that it was too obvious, and retconned Dukat as hating Bajorans the whole time even as he was trying to be accepted and loved as their benefactor. (scaly man's burden)
Personally, my view of Dukat is that his greatest flaw, and the thing that always stopped him from achieving his goals, was his narcissism. Dukat would 'reinterpret' events to suit his version of reality, and it blinded him consistently to his mistakes and overshadowed the part of him that could have become a great man. While being 'less genocidal' than other Cardassians on Bajor is a rather token thing, I think it suggests Dukat knew what was happening on Bajor was wrong. That inside himself he knew it had to stop.
But he wanted to be the hero, not just to Bajor but Cardassia. He tried to give both sides what they wanted, missing that killing fewer Bajorans than the other guys, just wasn't going to improve his image for them. And of course, his 'softer touch' was viewed by the resistance as capitulation, The Bajorans fought harder (how dare they!) and Cardassia was forced to give up Bajor. It ended his career, ruined his already damaged image, and to make matters worse, the wormhole was found and his old post became the most important strategic location in the Quadrant for nearly a decade. More than that, another outsider came to Bajor (Sisko) and rather than being rejected was embraced as a Messianic figure.
Thus follows the story of a man who wanted to be the hero of the story but because of his own twisted character couldn't take that role and this happened;
His prize of DS9, gone; his image as heroic saviour of Cardassia, gone; his beloved daughter, his only remaining family, shot by his second in command and closest friend. Nothing left but ashes, and the hatred and contempt of him from Bajor and Sisko, so his recently tilted psyche gives in and latches onto that. They want him to be the bad guy? Well no more mister nice gul.
That's how I always saw it. He wanted to be the hero but couldn't so he embraced becoming the villain.
That's a very human story to me. How many of us want to be heroes, but fail for one reason or another? How many of us want to be more than we are but can't? The world keeps beating down on us in that way. Things rarely work out the way we want them too. It's scary how easily a person, starting with a desire to do good but with very human flaws, can be broken down into something monstrous, and that's Dukat's story.
Ahtman wrote: Surprised this character didn't pop up:
That's cause he wasn't so much a character as a device to drive the plot forward.
You know you're really doing something when you can make strangers hate you over the Internet. - Mauleed
Just remember folks. Panic. Panic all the time. It's the only way to survive, other than just being mindful, of course-but geez, that's so friggin' boring. - Aegis Grimm
Hallowed is the All Pie The Before Times: A Place That Celebrates The World That Was
Yeah. Maybe if he'd actually been in the TV series, he'd have been more exciting but really when I think of Serenity, I don't think of the Agent that much. He's cool sure, even intriguing, but he just didn't seem all that engaging.
Does Slade from Teen Titans count? Because holy feth, corrupting and brainwashing and mind-raping teenage children.
If Slade's too super-hero-y, then yeah, gotta stick with Vader, Palpatine (the one good thing about the prequel trilogy), and Ian McKellan's Magneto (and his Richard III).
Roy Batty isn't the villain in Blade Runner. Arguably, Deckard is the villain! We just happen to see the movie from Deckard's point of view, so the (sympathetic) bad guy is the protagonist and the hero's the antagonist....
BURN IT DOWN BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN
Psienesis wrote: Well, if you check out Sister Sydney's homebrew/expansion rules, you'll find all kinds of units the Sisters could have, that fit with the theme of the Sisters (as a tabletop army) perfectly well, and are damn-near-perfectly balanced.
I've read, on more than one occasion, that Q was bound by certain rules regarding his conduct, by the Continuum.
He introduced humans to the borg because the cube he showed them was on course to the alpha quadrant, due to the circular timeline of events in first contact and enterprise. The borg had already begun attacking colonies on the very fringes of human/romulan territory and Q directly showed the crew the nature of the Borg, under the guise of demonstrating that they were out of their depth, but for the real reason of alerting the humans and co to a species moving into their territory that otherwise would have wiped them out.
Don't know if it really counts as SciFi or if he really counts as a villain, but here is a good one IMO:
Textbook case of terrorist vs revolutionary vs freedom fighter vs bad guy vs good guy. But I think Hugo Weaving did a great job portraying V as a complex character. Ruthless, efficient, calculating, and very theatrical throughout it all.
Of course if we are talking about Hugo Weaving SciFi villains:
Waiting for my shill money from Spiral Arm Studios
MeanGreenStompa wrote: I've read, on more than one occasion, that Q was bound by certain rules regarding his conduct, by the Continuum.
He introduced humans to the borg because the cube he showed them was on course to the alpha quadrant, due to the circular timeline of events in first contact and enterprise. The borg had already begun attacking colonies on the very fringes of human/romulan territory and Q directly showed the crew the nature of the Borg, under the guise of demonstrating that they were out of their depth, but for the real reason of alerting the humans and co to a species moving into their territory that otherwise would have wiped them out.
So, Q saved the federation from the borg.
I doubt it was a selfless act. Q would have been bored without humans to talk to.
Self-proclaimed evil Cat-person. Dues Ex Felines
Cato Sicarius, after force feeding Captain Ventris a copy of the Codex Astartes for having the audacity to play Deathwatch, chokes to death on his own D-baggery after finding Calgar assembling his new Eldar army.
In terms of Villains I love to overcome, as a player... Slavers always make my heart soar when ground into the Dust. Fallout New Vegas is my favourite videogame of all time [Edges past Bioshock 1 by a hair] and I think part of what makes me love it is conquering the conqueror... the ultimate slaver Caesar.
Speaking of Bioshock, both Andrew Ryan and Atlas were fascinating villains. Ryan for his inability to see reasonable limits and for being an uncaring bastard. Atlas for the corruption that ultimately must be guarded against.
While it isn't Sci-fi, the villain from Apocalypse Now is an incredible archetype. A fallen "Hero" that determines that the only way to win is to discard his humanity, and I very loosely paraphrase... "They would always win, because they were willing to do what we would not. We vaccinated the children in a village, and 3 days later they cut off the vaccinated arm from each child. We didn't have the WILL to defeat them..."
Agent Smith, from the Matrix series always made me smile. "Mr... Anderson..."
I think the best villains don't necessarily have super powers, though that helps in gaming terms. The best villains have rational reasons for what they do. The Joker is entertaining, and makes the perfect foil for Batman's super seriousness... but he's a terrible villain. "I'm bat-gak crazy, so I kill people in silly ways! Tee-Hee!" It hurts for me to say that.
Great villains have power in a form that is relatable, well established, but that still leaves them vulnerable to the efforts of the heroes. Politicians, and other persons of power are capable of enacting genocide, or other more "individual" horrors from positions of seemingly infinite power. But they're still vulnerable to being shot in the face, which is something the heroes can do. Or destabilize their power base... or expose their sadism, or whatever. You know, they have a weak point.
he doesn't even have to try to destroy, it just happens by his mere presence 
The Undying Spawn of Shub-Niggurath 
Legion: Dark Angels 
