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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/11 11:55:27
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Devastating Dark Reaper
QLD, Australia
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I can't really think of anything that we need to add to the base wargear, but if we're having the number of runes and greater variety/level of powers, maybe have the witchblade and ghosthelm as optional. My thought is we can get the points up very quickly at current, so even if it's only reduces it by a few points it may be appreciated.
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Craftworld Squishy: ~1500pts of Eldar |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/11 12:50:31
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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I think the general consensus would to get rid of spirit stones and just incorporate their effect into the basic cost, So you get 2 powers a turn as standard (3 for the ancient). That would leave you with something like: Wargear: Rune Armour (4++) Ghost Helm Shuriken Pistol Witchblade Options: May replace their Witchblade with a Singing Spear for free. Each Farseer can take up to 2 of he following runes (ancients may take 3): Runes of Warding - XX points Runes of Witnessing - XX points Runes of Ful - XX points Runes of ......... Runes of ......... Each Farseer may take up to 4 psychic powers: Doom - XX points Fortune - XX points Guide - XX points Eldritch Storm - XX points .............. - XX points
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/11 12:53:49
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/11 13:37:41
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Swift Swooping Hawk
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Gorechild wrote:[hint] I'm waiting to see if dayve will throw a Seer Council/Farseer suggestion out there if he's lurking  [/hint]
I'm feeling really ill... my head is too clogged up to compose a unit entry that could potentially be very complicated...
Plus i've been playing Fallout Online, and i love Fallout... so its distracting.
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/11 13:38:17
WLD: 221 / 6 / 5
5 Dragons 2011: 2nd Overall
DT:80+S++G++M+B+I+Pw40k96++D++A++/mR+++T(T)DM+
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/11 14:37:13
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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dayve110 wrote:Gorechild wrote:[hint] I'm waiting to see if dayve will throw a Seer Council/Farseer suggestion out there if he's lurking  [/hint]
I'm feeling really ill... my head is too clogged up to compose a unit entry that could potentially be very complicated...
Plus i've been playing Fallout Online, and i love Fallout... so its distracting.
Fair enough dude, I'll carry on my rambling by myself then
Gorechild wrote:
Wargear:
Rune Armour (4++)
Ghost Helm
Shuriken Pistol
Witchblade
Options:
May replace their Witchblade with a Singing Spear for free.
Each Farseer can take up to 2 of he following runes (ancients may take 3):
Runes of Warding - XX points
Runes of Witnessing - XX points
Runes of Ful - XX points
Runes of Dispersing - XX points
Runes of Channeling - XX points
Each Farseer may take up to 4 psychic powers:
Doom - XX points
Fortune - XX points
Guide - XX points
Eldritch Storm - XX points
Curse - XX points
A few more ideas came to me during an very dull lunch break
Curse - A vehicle version of doom, was my initial thought (trying to find a way to hep counter the meta game and mix things up a bit). All glancing hits against a cursed vehicle count as penetrating. I can't really tell if this is horribly OP, but it could be changed about, I like the general idea though.
Runes of Channeling - Thinking about re hashing the old idea of being able to use LOS/measure range from a friendly warlock instead of the farseer. dont know if its needed, but it could be a great way to include the idea if we decided to stick with the idea.
Runes of Dispersing - don't know what to do about it or even what to suggest  just as a thought as another way to nullify enemy psychic powers, any suggestions would be good
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/11 23:12:04
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Devastating Dark Reaper
QLD, Australia
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Runes of Dispersing: Any non-template enemy psychic power that effects the farseer or his unit may instead effect a valid target within 6".
Does that work? Maybe only on a Ld test.
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Craftworld Squishy: ~1500pts of Eldar |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/11 23:38:20
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Guarding Guardian
NWI
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I really like this, I think this would make the Eldar a legit team again. I probably have to agree most with the increase range on the guardian weapons. 12"? Terrible... Maybe whenever they redo the codex it will look something like this.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/12 09:18:13
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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@Pyro- I like it, but it seems a little more direct that the effects of the other runes. I'll have another think of another approach, but your idea would certainly work. If they were named RoDeflection it would fit though
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/12 20:46:59
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Longtime Dakkanaut
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Hmm. Any chance you guys could compile the best stuff so far into an article, i would love to see your ideas. My input: shuriken Cataplults R18" Strength 4 AP 6 Assault 2.
I can't think of anything else as i don't play eldar.
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Mary Sue wrote: Perkustin is even more awesome than me!
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/12 22:36:34
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Wicked Warp Spider
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Perkustin wrote:Hmm. Any chance you guys could compile the best stuff so far into an article, i would love to see your ideas. My input: shuriken Cataplults R18" Strength 4 AP 6 Assault 2.
I can't think of anything else as i don't play eldar.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Ideas_for_5th_edition_Eldar_codex,_a_compilation
It's very high level, no specific numbers. Feel free to contribute the stuff I've missed, but try to keep exact numbers out of it and try to keep ideas that have been shot down horribly out of it (such as increased T or some silliness like that)
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I really need to stay away from the 40K forums. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/13 09:58:32
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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Mahtamori wrote:Perkustin wrote:Hmm. Any chance you guys could compile the best stuff so far into an article, i would love to see your ideas. My input: shuriken Cataplults R18" Strength 4 AP 6 Assault 2. I can't think of anything else as i don't play eldar. http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Ideas_for_5th_edition_Eldar_codex,_a_compilation It's very high level, no specific numbers. Feel free to contribute the stuff I've missed, but try to keep exact numbers out of it and try to keep ideas that have been shot down horribly out of it (such as increased T or some silliness like that) I'm slowly, very slowly, putting it all into a fandex, once we've covered all the units and ironed out the stumbling blocks I'll post it. Its taken me a couple weeks to do just a few pages, so its not going to be any time soon @Mahtamori - Whats your view on the Runes and other Farseer power?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/13 09:59:56
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/13 17:15:32
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Furious Fire Dragon
Earth
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Mahtamori wrote:Perkustin wrote:Hmm. Any chance you guys could compile the best stuff so far into an article, i would love to see your ideas. My input: shuriken Cataplults R18" Strength 4 AP 6 Assault 2.
I can't think of anything else as i don't play eldar.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Ideas_for_5th_edition_Eldar_codex,_a_compilation
It's very high level, no specific numbers. Feel free to contribute the stuff I've missed, but try to keep exact numbers out of it and try to keep ideas that have been shot down horribly out of it (such as increased T or some silliness like that)
I like this a lot
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/13 18:31:20
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Wicked Warp Spider
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Gorechild wrote:Mahtamori wrote:Perkustin wrote:Hmm. Any chance you guys could compile the best stuff so far into an article, i would love to see your ideas. My input: shuriken Cataplults R18" Strength 4 AP 6 Assault 2.
I can't think of anything else as i don't play eldar.
http://www.dakkadakka.com/wiki/en/Ideas_for_5th_edition_Eldar_codex,_a_compilation
It's very high level, no specific numbers. Feel free to contribute the stuff I've missed, but try to keep exact numbers out of it and try to keep ideas that have been shot down horribly out of it (such as increased T or some silliness like that)
I'm slowly, very slowly, putting it all into a fandex, once we've covered all the units and ironed out the stumbling blocks I'll post it. Its taken me a couple weeks to do just a few pages, so its not going to be any time soon
@Mahtamori - Whats your view on the Runes and other Farseer power?
Alright, let's see...
Gorechild wrote:A few more ideas came to me during an very dull lunch break
Curse - A vehicle version of doom, was my initial thought (trying to find a way to hep counter the meta game and mix things up a bit). All glancing hits against a cursed vehicle count as penetrating. I can't really tell if this is horribly OP, but it could be changed about, I like the general idea though.
Runes of Channeling - Thinking about re hashing the old idea of being able to use LOS/measure range from a friendly warlock instead of the farseer. dont know if its needed, but it could be a great way to include the idea if we decided to stick with the idea.
Runes of Dispersing - don't know what to do about it or even what to suggest  just as a thought as another way to nullify enemy psychic powers, any suggestions would be good
Curse - Well, could do with a different name more appropriate. Weakened Integrity or something to the effect. It's not horribly overpowered at all, until you take into account the plethora of weapons Eldar have that simply causes glancing blows: Eldritch Storm, Vibro Cannon, D-Cannon, D-Gun, Haywire Grenades (several units), and of course the multitude of high-attack S6 weapons against the rather common AV11/12.
It's good. Worthy of being a psychic test and worthy of replacing Eldritch Storm (in favour of making Farseers more ( de)buff oriented).
Runes of Channeling - depending entirely on what happens to the council. For solitary Farseer design, I think this should be a baseline ability, while for council design the council itself should be self-sufficient.
Runes of Dispersing - Might be good for a psychic power or a lucky charm. I'm not certain whether it should be permanent (against the appropriate army it'll be over powered to the extreme, more so than RoWard). Could be something like a one-use "my psychic power just succeeded and you can't do bugger all about it, and I don't care what special character you are".
Other than this, I must admit I've been phased out of the specifics about Farseers. Something like "why fix what is working bloody awesome?". For me it's the offensive psychic powers that are pitiful little things. I mean, Eldritch Storm (current version) would be an alright Warlock power, but not a Farseer power.
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I really need to stay away from the 40K forums. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/14 09:51:36
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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Mahtamori wrote:Other than this, I must admit I've been phased out of the specifics about Farseers. Something like "why fix what is working bloody awesome?". For me it's the offensive psychic powers that are pitiful little things. I mean, Eldritch Storm (current version) would be an alright Warlock power, but not a Farseer power. I'm not saying Seer's aren't awesome, I'm just trying to give remove their direct killing power and sort out the Seer council. I'll keep working on an suggestion by myself for a while, but due to the underwhelming response and debate the farseers seem to be causing I think it might be a good idea to move along to something else. Special characters? At the moment we have Eldrad, Yriel and the Lords. I (shock horror) think its time Eldrad is removed. He's been presumed dead for ages and (if we incude Farseer Ancient) they will be very similar. Yriel could have an additional Iyanden themed autarch stratagem; improved wraith sight or something? Other than that I think he's a deacent HQ. The main issue is the Pheonix Lords. Would they be best kept as a single entry (to allow for a few more SC's) or to seperate them all to allow them to be more individual. I think introducing craftworld specific SC's would make for a more interesting army llist, whilst keeping the lords as a more generic HQ. Maybe identical stats, a unit of their aspect is scoring but each has a fancy weapon? Thoughts?
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/14 10:01:56
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/14 11:01:46
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Devastating Dark Reaper
QLD, Australia
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Agreed, we seem to be going round in circles with the farseers at current, we've more or less have them sorted out. We just need to choose one path or the other and add points cost and they would be done. So, on to Pheonix Lords? I guess I'll rattle off some thoughts.
The PLs should keep the same base statline, so long as each aspect keeps the same as well. If we change the stats for each aspect then we should have that reflected on the PLs. As for overcrowding the SC options, I'dd be more worried about overcrowding the HQ slot in general.
A PL should be able to take a retinue of their aspect as the one HQ choice.
PLs should be limited to joining only joining units of their aspect. I honestly didn't realise that wasn't the case until someone on dakka wrote up having one and a farseer with a full unit of harlequins. But that thought could simply me being picky.
All units of their aspect should gain something while the PL is alive, not just the unit it has joined. Gorechild's idea of being scoring is a good one, maybe not limited to "while alive" for that. Though the thought of having 3 scoring units in place only to have their PL taken out with a lucky shot on the last turn, thereby no longer being considered scoring, entertains me greatly and would fit well with the "one mistake can cost you" play style we currently have, so honestly I'd prefer even that to be "while alive". Alternatives: fearless to the aspect, all of the aspect count as having both exarch powers, aspect's type changes to troop or "may be taken as troops", +1 WS/BS, aspect may always use PL's LD, a 3rd all encompassing Exarch power... umm, that's all of the top of my head.
They should have one for each aspect. I won't budge from this. The only problem with that now is that if each has some unique equipment or rule they may take up too much space, yet at the same time I wouldn't want to make them generic.
Over all I feel have a PL of a particular aspect should make you want to take a good showing of that aspect. To that I would personally prefer the scoring unit, troop choice and 3rd power options on all.
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Craftworld Squishy: ~1500pts of Eldar |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/14 13:19:07
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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"A Pheonix Lord may only join a unit of their aspect, If a pheonix lord is taken as a HQ then their aspect can be purchased as Troops instead of Elite/Fast attack/Heavy support. Pheonix Lords know all the exarch powers of their respective aspect."
They could have a 4+ inv accross the board, 3+ for the DA dude (or 5++/4++?)
If they become troops instead of remaining in their FOC slot but being able to score you could have very themed armys. What do you think would be best?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/14 18:29:47
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Sneaky Striking Scorpion
Oregon
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Purchased as troops is very risky.
Feugan and 6 dragon wagons? Thats a hell of a lot of firepower, and the elite and HS slots haven't even been touched.
Maugan freeing up the HS slots by moving 2 or 3 (improved) reaper squads to troops? Reapers camping on home objectives and decimating enemies from long range?
Scoring is good.... taking them as troops is really freaking amazing.
Part of the balance of the current codex is that several good units (really, just banshees and dragons) are in the elite slot, and everyone and their brother takes two squads of dragons.
A conceptual decision should be made regarding the HQ SCs - do we want to stay with the PLs, or do we want to go with other characters. Do we want these characters to have an effect on the FOC, ala codex: SM characters?
All PLs should have a 4++ ... anything less is insulting, really. A lowly autarch gets a 4++ invuln and they don't? The prospect of a fortuned PL comes at the expense of having upwards of 350pts invested in the HQ slot alone (PL + farseer)
Requiring a PL to be attached to their aspect (or, put another way, banning them from attaching to anything not of their aspect) is fine, but they need to really add something to their aspect. A common criticism of the PLs in their current incarnation is that they do nothing for their aspect more than an exarch does, at 10x the price. Another criticism is that for the price of a PL, you can get an entire 2nd squad of the aspect, with all the fixings. In other words, the PLs need to bring something special to the table - a honest-to-god reason to take them.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/14 18:30:18
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Wicked Warp Spider
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I don't see why Dire Avenger lord would be better at defense that way than the others, unless Dire Avengers themselves are changed to be more of a hold-the-line aspect and less a kill-them-with-liberal-fire.
I'm all for allowing troop Banshees and Scorpions, but I dread troop choice Fire Dragons...
There's really two ways of dealing with Phoenix Lords: Keep Fuegan et al or simply have each and every one of them be named Phoenix Lord (of this aspect here).
The first option will have the HQ section remain crowded, while the second option will be a bit more difficult to make neat and to the point.
I mean, a special character that's Squad Leader X with +2 BS/WS/I/W - how fun is that?
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I really need to stay away from the 40K forums. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/15 03:21:42
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Devastating Dark Reaper
QLD, Australia
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The best way to go about it is probably how they currently have it. One stat line, list of wargear for each one, and 3-4 pages of rules. We can't fully have a generic PL as the the pts for each one would have to be different, even with the current Exarch powers there's as much as a 25pt difference between two Exarches taking both.
Just to see if we're all on the same page, does anyone have any objections/reasons against PLs effecting the entire aspect in some way?
Gorechild wrote:"A Pheonix Lord may only join a unit of their aspect, If a pheonix lord is taken as a HQ then their aspect can be purchased as Troops instead of Elite/Fast attack/Heavy support. Pheonix Lords know all the exarch powers of their respective aspect."
Instead or in addition to? Either way I very much Like this idea. Though I do also have the concern that we'll see 6-9 units of Fire Dragons as a standard,  then again this threat could significantly cut back on the number of mech lists. Seriously though, if we bring Fire Dragon's points cost in line with their value would that fix how broken that would be?
If it's "in addition to" we should probably also have all the aspect count as scoring, that way we don't have any confusion of "Was it this unit of Banshees that are scoring, while this unit of identically painted/equipped Banshees?".
Additionally, if we do have the troop bit, would adjusting the PLs' point value to reflect the effect of an average of 3 units being taken as troops be help.
Possible Aspect wide powers:
Scorpions: Stealth (fair simple that one)
Banshees: Hit & Run (honestly I think that it should be an exarch power. Why would a highly nimble first strike aspect not teach its warriors to break off for a second assault?)
Dragons:
Dire Avengers: Defend reduced attacks by 2
Shining Spears: may re-roll LD to use hit & run
Hawks: roll 2d6 for fleet, choosing the better
Spiders: may re-roll their assault move
Reapers: Roll 3 dice for scatter taking the lowest 2
Random off topic thought: For anti-deep strike, Dire avengers (or a different squad) add one to the number of shots/attacks made against a unit that deep striked the previous turn. The possibility of a 10 man squad firing off 40+ shots (bladestorm included) should give pause to anyone deep striking too close... if not, doom/guide and chuck a second squad into the mix. It would definitely define their roll as hold the line however.
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Craftworld Squishy: ~1500pts of Eldar |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/15 09:32:00
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Wicked Warp Spider
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The troop choice thing is a bit generic and leads to a risk of spamming. Ideally an Eldar player wouldn't want more than one or two squads of any given aspect in the first place, since filling an entire troop section with the same aspect hints that that aspect isn't specialized.
What you do need is some way to ease the congestion in elite section for more melee oriented armies and the congestion in heavy support for ranged oriented.
My preferred method is simply remove Independent Character from Phoenix Lords and let their Disciples say "Up to X of their aspect may be added to the Phoenix Lord's squad for Y points per model".
This way you give a "free" slot (let's not forget that Dire Avengers are troop) but without giving up more kill points and sticks a middle finger at scenarios which have a single HQ unit from each side alone on the board.
If Eldar are missing a more sturdy unit which can claim objectives, then Dire Avengers is an obvious target since they are troops and already suffer from similarity-syndrome. Altering them to more heavily rely on Shimmer Shield (say it's a straight up 5++) and Defend and then change Blade Storm (heresy!) into a ranged defensive power so that you can stick them down on objectives.
Pyro-Druid: in my own experience Eldar aren't in very dire need of being able to react decently to deep strikers which drop down and then wait for next turn to assault, it's more the deep strikers which drop down and then run up to you and smash your face on the same turn.
If Blade Storm was changed to be anti-infantry deep strike, I'd more rather see it as "Any unit deep striking within weapons range of the Dire Avengers will immediately suffer a barrage from the Dire Avengers after landing".
This could lead to a situation where a single Dire Avenger sqaud shoots 100+ shots in the opponent's movement phase, but the more common situation would be 20+20 shots (enemy movement then your own shooting) or 20->assaulted.
SOME sort of deep strike deterrent is necessary, or we'll keep seeing Mechdar forever since their foot armies can't really defend against deep strikers that may assault after deep striking. (Or against deep strikers with strong fire power)
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I really need to stay away from the 40K forums. |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/16 07:19:34
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Sneaky Striking Scorpion
Oregon
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One option would be to alter the way in which deepstrike occurs.
We could, for instance, add deepstrike disruption to the fluff that surrounds eldar (since they are all psychic, to some degree) and make it so that any unit deepstriking within X" (12) have an effect, such as always scattering 2d6" - with no modification of the distance for any reason whatsoever - so decent of angels and drop pods both scatter normally. Or, deepstrikers within X" roll a d6 and suffer a mishap-misplaced (or whatever it is called) on a 4+, a delayed on a 6+.
The enemy could always avoid this rule by simply not deepstriking close - essentially removing the benefit that deepstriking provides, which is an alpha-strike capability.
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/16 16:47:00
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Swift Swooping Hawk
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OK, I'm still a bit ill, but feel alot better... if i don't explain anything clearly then just say so and i can edit this...
I know you want to move on, but i missed out on the Seer Council discussion so i'm posting it anyway (And this will make Gorechild happy at any rate)
So... on with the show!!!
Farseer 5 5 3 3 3 5 2 10 -
Unit Type: Infantry (or Jetbike if mounted on a jetbike)
Wargear: Ghosthelm, shuriken pistol, witchblade and rune armour
Special Rules: independent Character, Fleet of Foot, Farseer Psychic powers (and any other racial special rules we come up with)
Options: A Farseer may be given any of the following:
Upgrade witchblade to singing spear – X points
Eldar Jetbike – X points
A Farseer may choose upto 2 of the following runes:
Runes of warding – X points
Runes of witnessing – X points
Runes of Guidance – X points
Runes of Dispersing – X points
Runes of Fortitude – X points
A Farseer must take between 1 and 4 psychic powers:
Doom – X points
Fortune – X points
Guide – X points
Curse – X points
Isha's blessing – X points
Eldritch Storm – X points
Seer Council
Ancient 4 4 2 4 3 4 1 10 -
Farseer 5 5 3 3 3 5 2 10 -
Verdant 4 4 3 3 1 4 1 8 -
Unit Type: Infantry
Unit Size: The Seer council must consist of at least one Ancient and 3 Verdants. Upto 2 Farseers may be purchased and upto 6 additional Verdants.
Wargear: Witchblade, Rune armour, shuriken pistol. Farseers and Ancients also have ghosthelms.
Special Rules: Fleet of Foot (and any other racial special rules we come up with). Farseers and Ancients have Farseer psychic powers, Verdants have Verdant Psychic powers.
Options: A Farseer has all the same options as in the Farseer entry, however s/he may not take a Jetbike.
An Ancient has all the same options as in the Farseer entry, however s/he may not take a Jetbike. In addition, an Ancient may take upto 3 sets of Runes and must purchase at least 1 Farseer psychic power, with no upper limit. (So could take them all)
Any verdant may replace their witchblade with a singing spear – X points
For Every 3 Verdants you may select one verdant power:
Distort – X points
Augment – X points
Endure – X points
Channel – X points
Warlock 4 4 3 3 2 5 2 9 -
Unit Type: Infantry (Or jetbike if mounted on a jetbike)
Wargear: Shuriken pistol, witchblade, rune armour
Special Rules: Fleet of Foot, Warlock Psychic powers (and any other racial special rules we come up with)
Options: A Warlock may be given any of the following:
Upgrade witchblade to singing spear – X points
Eldar Jetbike – X points
A Warlock may choose 1 of the following runes:
Runes of warding – X points
Runes of witnessing – X points
Runes of Guidance – X points
Runes of Dispersing – X points
Runes of Fortitude – X points
A Warlock must take between 1 and 2 psychic powers:
Conceal - X points
Embolden - X points
Enhance - X points
Regrowth - X points
Unnatural Speed - X points
Destructor - X points
Spear of Khaine - X points
Sunder - X points
Mind War - X points
Spiritseers and Shadowseers will have a differnt statline to any of the above, with access to different powers/options. As a spirit seer with Regrowth and Runes of Fortitude would be rather sickening with some Wraithguard.
And now... for the describy bits!
Farseer – A Farseer may cast upto 2 Powers per turn.
Ancient Farseer – An Ancient may cast upto 3 powers per turn, you may cast the same power twice.
Warlock – A Warlocks first power is passive, and is “always on” and does not require a psychic test. If a second power is also chosen, then this power required a psychic to use as normal.
Verdant – A Verdants powers do not require tests to use and are considered to be passive.
Rune Armour – Rune armour provides the wearer with an Invulnerable save. In most cases this is a save of 4++, however, the Ancient receives a 3++.
Witchblade – A witch blade always wounds on a 2+, Against a vehicle is counts the users strength as 9. In the hands of a Warlock, a witchblade will also count as a power weapon. In the hand of a Farseer or an Ancient, the witchblade will also count as a force weapon.
Singing spear – 2-handed, follows all the rules of a witchblade. It may be thrown in the shooting phase with the following profile:
Range: 12” Strength: X AP: N/A Type: Assault 1
Runes of warding – Any enemy attempting to cast a psychic power must roll and additoinal D6 and add it to their total to cast. Any roll exceeding their Ld value will trigger a Perils attack.
Runes of witnessing – Any model with these runes must roll an additional D6 to cast powers, discarding the highest result.
Runes of Guidance – Any Friendly unit attempting to Deepstrike within 12” of a model with these runes will only scatter D6”, if the deepstriking unit would land within 6” of the model with these runes, the unit may for forgo its shooting in order to charge this turn.
Runes of Dispersing – Any enemy Psychic power that targets a unit within 6” or originates within 6” of a model with these runes is cancelled on a 5+.
Runes of Fortitude – Any unit that a model with these runes joins gains a 5++ invulnerable save.
Doom - Either, All 'to wound' rolls against this unit can be re-rolled until the start of the next Eldar turn or, the target unit must re-roll all successful saves until the start of the next Eldar turn.
Fortune – As is now
Guide – As is now
Curse – May be cast on any enemy vehicle or vehicle squadron within 24”, all rolls to penetrate the vehicle can be re-rolled until the start of the next Eldar turn. (doom for vehicles)
Isha's blessing - Nominate one unit with a model within 24” of the Farseer. Either all 'to wound' rolls this units makes have a -1 modifier until the start of the next Eldar turn or the target unit reduces its WS by 1 until the start of the next Eldar turn.
Eldritch Storm - Any time an enemy unit attempts to deep strike on scatters within 4D6 inches of the Farseer (roll each time a unit deep strikes) then that unit will count as being delayed on a roll of 5+. If the unit succeeds in coming through they must take a dangerous terrain test. (If the unit lands in difficult terrain then they will be forced to take a second dangerous terrain test) The only exception to this rule is if the unit mishaps and the Eldar player places the unit, in that case Eldritch Storm has no effect.
Conceal - The psyker and his unit receive the USR: Stealth and gains a 6+ cover save when in the open. (which stacks to a 5+ with stealth)
Embolden - The psyker and any member of his unit may re-roll any Ld tests they are required to make.
Enhance - The psyker and every member of the unit he has joined gain +(1) to any of the following: WS, BS, S, T, I, A. The increases must be chosen before the game starts, and cannot change during its course. Each stat may only be enhanced once.
Regrowth – The psyker and his unit receive the USR: FNP.
Unnatural Speed – The psyker and his unit receive the USR's: Move through cover and skilled rider. In addition, the psyker and his unit may run 2D6, but may not assault in the same turn as doing so.
Destructor – Psychic shooting attack with the following profile:
Range: Template S: 5 AP: 4 Assault 1
Spear of Khaine - Psychic shooting attack with the following profile:
Range: 18” line S: 8 AP: 2 Assault 1, Lance
Sunder - Psychic shooting attack with the following profile:
Range: 12” S: 8 AP: 1 Assault 1, Melta
Mind War - This psychic power is a psychic shooting attack. Nominate one unengaged model in line of sight within 18” of the psyker. Both players roll a D6 and add the Ld of their respective models; the Eldar player adds one to this roll. For each point the psyker wins by, the target loses a wound, with no armour or cover saves allowed.
Distort – All ranged weapons fired at the seer council, or any unit within X, has its range reduced by X (Where X is the current number of Verdants alive within the unit)
Augment – Any Farseer psychic power has its range increased by 3X (Where X is the current number of Verdants alive within the unit)
Endure – Any friendly unit within X” will count as stubborn (Where X is the current number of Verdants alive within the unit)
Channel – X/3 (rounding down) Farseer powers may be channelled each turn, when channelling a power, you may measure the origin from any other friendly psyker, that psyker may not use any power this turn that requires a psychic test. (Where X is the current number of Verdants alive within the unit)
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This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2011/01/17 02:22:30
WLD: 221 / 6 / 5
5 Dragons 2011: 2nd Overall
DT:80+S++G++M+B+I+Pw40k96++D++A++/mR+++T(T)DM+
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 02:07:07
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Devastating Dark Reaper
QLD, Australia
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just picking on a couple of things:
Conceal: if provided USR:Stealth, it should only provide 6+ cover (but this will stack to 5+)
Regrowth: Still don't agree with eldar getting access to FNP... but that may just be me.
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Craftworld Squishy: ~1500pts of Eldar |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 02:19:51
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Sneaky Striking Scorpion
New Iberia, Louisiana, USA
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Pyro-Druid wrote:just picking on a couple of things:
Conceal: if provided USR:Stealth, it should only provide 6+ cover (but this will stack to 5+)
Regrowth: Still don't agree with eldar getting access to FNP... but that may just be me.
Agreed on conceal, but as for Regrowth, remember that their Toughness is still only 3. It's not hard to ID them. It's a great power, but definitely situational. Against mech guard, there's too many ML or ML shots coming your way to want to use it over, say, fortune.
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DS:80+S+G++M---B--IPw40k10#+D++A/eWD-R+T(D)DM+
Current Race - Eldar
Record with Eldar 1-0-2 (W-L-D)
Last game was a DRAW against DARK ELDAR.
I shake your hand and say "Good Game". How are you a good sport? |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 02:19:57
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Swift Swooping Hawk
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Pyro-Druid wrote:just picking on a couple of things:
Conceal: if provided USR:Stealth, it should only provide 6+ cover (but this will stack to 5+)
Regrowth: Still don't agree with eldar getting access to FNP... but that may just be me.
O yea.... Will edit it to 6+
As for Regrowth, i think most people dislike of FNP would be getting WG units and council deathstars with it. Which will be avoided. And with a name like Regrowth... its not really feeling no pain... just has a similar effect.
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WLD: 221 / 6 / 5
5 Dragons 2011: 2nd Overall
DT:80+S++G++M+B+I+Pw40k96++D++A++/mR+++T(T)DM+
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 07:40:52
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Fireknife Shas'el
All over the U.S.
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Hey guys,
I've been following the thread and feel it is time for me to interject with an observation or two. I started the first thread in order to open a discourse of ideas on how to bring the Eldar into 5th ed while remaining true to the Eldar back story and philosophy. I also was looking for ideas on how to have a balanced codex that allowed for a reasonable variety of builds. I never expected the thread to go into multiples or to spawn articles. The fact that it has is a testament to the creativity and passion of those participating in these threads.
Having said such, I would like to express the concern that we may have focused on the ideas to the point of loosing site of the Eldar. In essence, we have been looking so hard on watching where we step that we wandered off the path without noticing.
I bring this up because of the proposed farseer/warlock revisions and the numerous new units that are now being considered. One of the problems with the Eldar is that they have so many(some would say to many) units that care has to be taken when contemplating any new units because at some point some of the established units will be forced out of the coded by the newer ones.
[list
Don't get me wrong, I am in favour of new units as much as anyone(if not more so), but I also recognize the limitations of how many units can be in a single codex before a strict balancing mechanism has to be implemented. Also, the greater the number of units, the more heavy handed the balancing mechanism will have to be in order to help prevent exploitive builds. Such exploitive builds actually end up limiting the number of playable ones unless there ends up being several such builds. What I am getting at is that we should take care to not create auto win units/builds.
Next, I would like to point out that GW has taken steps to make the DE and Craftworld Eldar much more closely related and that we might want to look at the new DE for guidance on what we suggest for the next codex.
I bring this up because of the suggestion that was made to do away with spirit stones. In the DE codex,
soul stones are mentioned in the Incubi fluff as being used to build tormentors. While not exactly the same as spirit stones they are connected and the stones are an integral part of the CE backstory that I would hate to see completly removed.
Again, I think you guys are coming up with some amazing ideas and only wanted to suggest that we take a moment to remember what the CE are. A fast but fragile army of highly specialized units.
Oh yeah, one more thing before I go back to lurking. Wraithlords and guard will have to be revised for inv saves. This is because any Iyanden themed army is currently an automatic loss. To the DE's splinter weapons.
Will catch you guys later. Keep up the good work
, later
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Officially elevated by St. God of Yams to the rank of Scholar of the Church of the Children of the Eternal Turtle Pie at 11:42:36 PM 05/01/09
If they are too stupid to live, why make them?
In the immortal words of Socrates, I drank what??!
Tau-*****points(You really don't want to know) |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 08:03:13
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Devastating Dark Reaper
QLD, Australia
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I agree and disagree with you post. Yes we do need to keep the fluff in mind, occasionally we have needed to step back a bit and acknowledge that we've strayed from from the fluff to much and need to pull it back in. But for the most part I feel we have kept to the fluff, the major points where we've strayed the furthest are when we've come across point that's left us asking "Why isn't this the case?" (most notably Aspect Lords).
As for adding new units, I don't feel we actually have as much as we've simply refined what was already there. The current seer council more or less exists, but if we leave it as is it will break as we revise Warlocks and Farseers, so we've simply addressed that problem.
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Craftworld Squishy: ~1500pts of Eldar |
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 10:31:31
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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@Focused - Re the spirit stones: I see were the issue is coming from, I phrased my ideas a little badly. I didn't mean to just remove them completely from fuff. The way I see it they are pretty much a "must have" so their effect and cost should just be built into the basic farseer. They'd still be there for fuff and everything, they'd just be 20 (?) points more expensive and able to cast 2 powers instead of 1 as standard. The fluff behind the spirit stones is key to alot of Eldar fuff and I really like it so I'm not wanting to just wipe them out of the codex.
@Dayve - I like it  theres a few things to sort though.
Enhance should not boost T at all ever, being able to make T4 guardians would make DA's redundant and make Wraithguard even tougher. T5 JSJ jetbikes is also insane.
Were you intending Warlocks to be a unit in their own right then giving them power weapons will ake banshees useless, just as unit leaders it could be okay though, if not, then would rending be better?
Back to the PL's....I wasn't 100% about the aspect being troops, just thought I'd throw it out there. I like the retinue idea, it frees up a hotly contested Elite slot. I also agree that having some elite and some troops for the aspect would cause alot of confusion. If you're allowed to take them as a retinue then it would make sense to just add "all units of their aspect are scoring".
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 15:29:03
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Swift Swooping Hawk
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Gorechild wrote:@Focused - Re the spirit stones: I see were the issue is coming from, I phrased my ideas a little badly. I didn't mean to just remove them completely from fuff. The way I see it they are pretty much a "must have" so their effect and cost should just be built into the basic farseer. They'd still be there for fuff and everything, they'd just be 20 (?) points more expensive and able to cast 2 powers instead of 1 as standard. The fluff behind the spirit stones is key to alot of Eldar fuff and I really like it so I'm not wanting to just wipe them out of the codex.
Plus spirit stones are still a vehicle upgrade, and every model has a bajillion of them on their armour. Also there will most likely be a few paragraphs on their use and implimentation regarding direswords and exarch armour etc.
Gorechild wrote:@Dayve - I like it  theres a few things to sort though.
Enhance should not boost T at all ever, being able to make T4 guardians would make DA's redundant and make Wraithguard even tougher. T5 JSJ jetbikes is also insane.
Were you intending Warlocks to be a unit in their own right then giving them power weapons will ake banshees useless, just as unit leaders it could be okay though, if not, then would rending be better?
I can take out the T, and i do not intend warlocks to be an upgrade for wraithguard anyway, spiritseers could be a seperate entry with a seperate list of powers to stop WG becoming uber (although if your paying £8.70 per model, i have no problem with WG being uber, you are giving up eating for a fortnight after all to build an army of them)
As war warlocks forming a unit... i really dislike deathstars, so i'd prefer not to have a unit of warlocks, if we did, i'd expect a cap of 5 and the cost to be astronomical considering all the powers involved. But for unit leaders the wraithsword PW could add much needed punch and threat to many a guardian unit.
Gorechild wrote:Back to the PL's....I wasn't 100% about the aspect being troops, just thought I'd throw it out there. I like the retinue idea, it frees up a hotly contested Elite slot. I also agree that having some elite and some troops for the aspect would cause alot of confusion. If you're allowed to take them as a retinue then it would make sense to just add "all units of their aspect are scoring".
Scoring sounds good.
But what about Mr Asurman?
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WLD: 221 / 6 / 5
5 Dragons 2011: 2nd Overall
DT:80+S++G++M+B+I+Pw40k96++D++A++/mR+++T(T)DM+
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 16:04:48
Subject: Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Mighty Brass Scorpion of Khorne
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dayve110 wrote:As war warlocks forming a unit... I really dislike deathstars, so i'd prefer not to have a unit of warlocks, if we did, i'd expect a cap of 5 and the cost to be astronomical considering all the powers involved
I agree, I'm not a fan of them becoming a unit in their own right either, I was just asking as many posters seem adament to give up their deathstar.
dayve110 wrote:Gorechild wrote:Back to the PL's....I wasn't 100% about the aspect being troops, just thought I'd throw it out there. I like the retinue idea, it frees up a hotly contested Elite slot. I also agree that having some elite and some troops for the aspect would cause alot of confusion. If you're allowed to take them as a retinue then it would make sense to just add "all units of their aspect are scoring".
Scoring sounds good.
But what about Mr Asurman?
In answer to your question.....I completely forgot about him
Off the top of my head, a couple of options are:
Do nothing, the other lords could just have thier points cost slightly higher to reflect the advantages of their aspect being made scoring.
Give him another power (on top of the suggested other PL exarch power).
Make his abilities more powerful to ballance the cost with the other PL's
Give him special wargear that gives a bonus to all DA's (Shimmershields provide Inv even at range?)
Thoughts?
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![[Post New]](/s/i/i.gif) 2011/01/17 16:45:35
Subject: Re:Ideas for the next Eldar Codices - MkII
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Hacking Interventor
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Some great ideas, thanks all.
Subscribed.
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Dennis
Damnant quod non intelegunt
"Sometimes at the most basic level, to be alive you must stop other people being alive. This is what we do. We are extremely good at it"
"It takes a vast amount of self control to be this dangerous."
-from Prospero Burns
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