Switch Theme:

Adeptus Mechanicus Tactica 3.0: Riding the Dunes  [RSS] Share on facebook Share on Twitter Submit to Reddit
»
Author Message
Advert


Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you:
  • No adverts like this in the forums anymore.
  • Times and dates in your local timezone.
  • Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance.
  • Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely.
  • Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net.
If you are already a member then feel free to login now.




Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

The Canticles of the Omnissiah might not sound like music to flesh-ears, but the warriors of the machine god love ‘em, and they belt them out in the midst of battle to fan the flames of their fervour. These chants grant special boons to any units that include the Canticles of the Omnissiah ability, like Servitors and Tech-Priests.


The dulcet tones of the Canticles just don’t cut it for the Skitarii, however, so a judicious Tech-Priest or Skitarii Marshal has to take a firmer hand. That’s where the Doctrina Imperatives come in. Think of these override subroutines like orders handed down to the troops, except they can’t even think about saying no.


Sing-Along-Of-Death article on Canticles/Doctrina Imperatives.
   
Made in gb
Enginseer with a Wrench





They're chosen at the beginning of a battle round though, an awfully awkward time to issue orders imo. Especially if they are issued from an HQ model, what if they're in a vehicle? That's manipulus-levels of pain-in-the-ass all over again.

Though I guess when things affect your movement stat it has to be before movement.

The doctrina info could mean that the galvanic field on manipulus is gone, but they have special rules to either ignore deprecations or improve the range at which they can issue imperitives. Or the number of imperitives maybe.

Interesting indeed. I really hope the issuing of the imperitives isn't too awkward, we already have to deal with a negative modifier associated with receiving the buff without it being restrictive to issue them.

Wait...if the Skitarii keyword is all that's needed to receive an imperative...does that mean vehicles can have a 2+ save or 2+ BS? Before buffs!? And Mars ones can also re-roll one hit, wound and damage roll? So many questions now! Exciting.

Edited to correct my brain excitement.

This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2021/05/19 14:31:00


 
   
Made in us
Arch Magos w/ 4 Meg of RAM






Mira Mesa

Being chosen at the beginning of the battle round means you can reliably engage Bulwark against an enemy's first turn shooting. That's absolutely worth a trade-off for a little awkwardness with transports.

Mars definitely looks like one of the strongest factions now, and will certainly be the premier Skitarii faction. This also makes Metalica strong too as a split faction with Knights.

I have to assume Shroudpsalm got turned into Bulwark, which is why Kataphrons' base armour improved. I'll be interested to see what defensive canticle will exist. Anything that improves an invul will be exceptionally strong on Knights.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/19 15:17:48


   
Made in us
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Nebraska, USA

i wonder if that decision stemmed from how much necrons complain about if they go 2nd they have a full turn of missing a TON of defensive boosts, which can easily cost the game.
Battleround means that never happens, but it does make it wonky.

An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
Made in gb
Enginseer with a Wrench





 Vineheart01 wrote:
i wonder if that decision stemmed from how much necrons complain about if they go 2nd they have a full turn of missing a TON of defensive boosts, which can easily cost the game.
Battleround means that never happens, but it does make it wonky.


It kinda reflects the times you choose canticles, so not really a change in mentality. And in 7th you chose both at the beginning of the battle round as well.

I'm still curious what they have planned for the datasmith. They're a cult unit so no imperatives to issue, there are so many things they could do. I'm still kind of in shock at the scope of the changes we've seen so far, other armies got improvements here or there, but ours, it's like they just threw most of it out and started again!
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Mars is definitely looking like the meta forgeworld from just benediction alone. Much more of the codexes firepower is on the Skitarii side of things, and that's where you want something as potent as those rerolls. Not to mention - Mars already has an inherent hit reroll. So they get 2 hit rerolls, 1 wound reroll, and 1 damage reroll for each unit when benediction is up.
   
Made in gb
Enginseer with a Wrench





Ha, Lucius Infantry have a 2+ save against small arms fire when in cover and under the bulwark imperative. Thats gonna my arquebus very difficult to remove.

Hell, Balistarii have a 2+ save and ignore ap -1 as well while under this imperative.

Mars ones are even more powerful though...2+ save, re roll 2 hits, 1 wound and 1 dmg. Crap lol.

I wonder if shroudpsalm still exists as a canticle to add +1 to that 2+ save from Bullwark. Dragoons are hopefully still -1 to hit as well, makes them stupidly hard to take out.
   
Made in be
Mysterious Techpriest





Belgium

Ugh I just hope Mars won't be the no-brain go-to sub-faction again

40K: Adeptus Mechanicus
AoS: Nighthaunts 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




 Aaranis wrote:
Ugh I just hope Mars won't be the no-brain go-to sub-faction again


I think the other subfactions like Agripinaa and Ryza have shown enough to be viable, and we still don't know about the custom FWs. That being said Skitarii getting Canticles and the extra hit reroll to go along with Benediction of the Omnissiah is pretty significant. For me, Mars is top 2 in my mind alongside Ryza, but a lot of that will be dependent on your army composition, not to mention we don't have all the rules yet.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/19 18:11:21


 
   
Made in be
Mysterious Techpriest





Belgium

Yeah but I fear Cawl will still be locked to Mars and be bonkers again, I don't have much hope.

40K: Adeptus Mechanicus
AoS: Nighthaunts 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




Even if Cawl is unlocked from Mars (and we don't even know what he'll do in the new rules), I think Mars is a strong contender for #1. Ryza could be quite good too, it depends on what the other imperatives are like (Conqueror is obvious, but that leaves one other) and what our melee units look like once we see the full data sheets and points.
   
Made in us
Arch Magos w/ 4 Meg of RAM






Mira Mesa

From what we've seen so far, I don't think Mars can be the no-brainer choice just because the other factions bring meaningfully different angles for advantage. Ryza pushes a melee angle, and our Fulgerites have been some of the best melee units in the game previously. Agripinaa pushes the Breachers, already a meta staple, harder than Mars. Lucius can easily be souped in for insanely tough ObSec Skitarii and teleportation. Metalica's extra supplement rules might push it to be a strong spot, and are obviously the best way to run Knights now.

The only ones that seem to lag behind are maybe Stygies and definitely Graia.

   
Made in us
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus






 Vineheart01 wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/05/19/lets-join-the-adeptus-mechanicus-for-a-sing-along-of-death/

Holy crap, so skiitari are getting an Orders-type mechanic now?
Our rangers/vanguard can hit on 2s in shooting rofl....

Funny how I was talking about reasons why we would take full-sized Skitarii units earlier, and here we are.

Anyhow, Mars might just be the best Forge World again because of how ridiculous Benediction is for something like Dunecrawlers. Need to wait for more details though.
   
Made in us
Sure Space Wolves Land Raider Pilot




Somerdale, NJ, USA

i just pray that these Docrina don't turn out to be similar in implementation to the Necron Command Protocols....I refuse to use them and don't know a single Necron player that even uses Command Protocols.

"The only problem with your genepool is that there wasn't a lifeguard on duty to prevent you from swimming."

"You either die a Morty, or you live long enough to see yourself become a Rick."

- 8k /// - 5k /// - 5k /// - 6k /// - 6k /// - 4k /// - 4k 
   
Made in us
Owns Whole Set of Skullz Techpriests






Right behind you.

Joke's on you Suzuteo, I only take my Skitarii in full sized units!
   
Made in us
Arch Magos w/ 4 Meg of RAM






Mira Mesa

 Lord Clinto wrote:
i just pray that these Docrina don't turn out to be similar in implementation to the Necron Command Protocols....I refuse to use them and don't know a single Necron player that even uses Command Protocols.
Firstly, they won't because they're chosen in each command phase. Secondly, why on Earth wouldn't you use Command Protocols? They're a strong mechanic if you're willing to plan ahead.

   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




 Suzuteo wrote:
 Vineheart01 wrote:
https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/05/19/lets-join-the-adeptus-mechanicus-for-a-sing-along-of-death/

Holy crap, so skiitari are getting an Orders-type mechanic now?
Our rangers/vanguard can hit on 2s in shooting rofl....

Funny how I was talking about reasons why we would take full-sized Skitarii units earlier, and here we are.

Anyhow, Mars might just be the best Forge World again because of how ridiculous Benediction is for something like Dunecrawlers. Need to wait for more details though.


I think the other FWs have viability depending on army composition. Melee Ad Mech and Plasma Destroyer spam want Ryza, Kataphron blobs want Agrinpinaa, massed Skitarii infantry like Lucius, Stygies' dogma is still good, and Metalica still has a bunch of extra rules and good strats from Book of Rust to keep it viable. Mars feels like a great generalist FW that's jack of all trades, which feels right for them. Mars definitely makes the Neutron Laser more viable but I feel like the Icarus Array might still be the go to option for Dunecrawlers especially if they get rid of the -1 to hit vs ground targets. Still only d3 shots is pretty bad and right now I can't think of a reason to take it over twin cognis lascannons on Ironstriders. It needs more than just going to S12 and d3+3 damage, something like if it stays stationary it goes to flat 6 damage like the Valdor Tank Hunter (which also has a neutron laser!) or successful wounds deal MWs like with the heavy rail cannon.
   
Made in us
Quick-fingered Warlord Moderatus






Kanluwen wrote:Joke's on you Suzuteo, I only take my Skitarii in full sized units!

You are a braver man than I then. o7

Mr. Funktastic wrote:I think the other FWs have viability depending on army composition. Melee Ad Mech and Plasma Destroyer spam want Ryza, Kataphron blobs want Agrinpinaa, massed Skitarii infantry like Lucius, Stygies' dogma is still good, and Metalica still has a bunch of extra rules and good strats from Book of Rust to keep it viable. Mars feels like a great generalist FW that's jack of all trades, which feels right for them. Mars definitely makes the Neutron Laser more viable but I feel like the Icarus Array might still be the go to option for Dunecrawlers especially if they get rid of the -1 to hit vs ground targets. Still only d3 shots is pretty bad and right now I can't think of a reason to take it over twin cognis lascannons on Ironstriders. It needs more than just going to S12 and d3+3 damage, something like if it stays stationary it goes to flat 6 damage like the Valdor Tank Hunter (which also has a neutron laser!) or successful wounds deal MWs like with the heavy rail cannon.

Yeah. That's true. But if we're going to do the usual toolkit-style list, having the flexibility to focus Canticle picks on the most relevant part of your arsenal has historically been super good.

I personally hope I am wrong though. I want to play Ryza and field 9-10 Dragoons once more.
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




 Suzuteo wrote:

Mr. Funktastic wrote:I think the other FWs have viability depending on army composition. Melee Ad Mech and Plasma Destroyer spam want Ryza, Kataphron blobs want Agrinpinaa, massed Skitarii infantry like Lucius, Stygies' dogma is still good, and Metalica still has a bunch of extra rules and good strats from Book of Rust to keep it viable. Mars feels like a great generalist FW that's jack of all trades, which feels right for them. Mars definitely makes the Neutron Laser more viable but I feel like the Icarus Array might still be the go to option for Dunecrawlers especially if they get rid of the -1 to hit vs ground targets. Still only d3 shots is pretty bad and right now I can't think of a reason to take it over twin cognis lascannons on Ironstriders. It needs more than just going to S12 and d3+3 damage, something like if it stays stationary it goes to flat 6 damage like the Valdor Tank Hunter (which also has a neutron laser!) or successful wounds deal MWs like with the heavy rail cannon.

Yeah. That's true. But if we're going to do the usual toolkit-style list, having the flexibility to focus Canticle picks on the most relevant part of your arsenal has historically been super good.

I personally hope I am wrong though. I want to play Ryza and field 9-10 Dragoons once more.


Mars and Ryza are top 2 in my mind, we have a lot of good melee units and basically becoming Blood Angels and getting +1 to charge (+2 with a Manipulus) is pretty damn great. Dragoons getting an overall buff in their taser lances and statline is big, they'll basically wound anything T7 and below on 2+. Ruststalkers with AP on their weapons are also looking viable, I'm hoping there's more to the razor and chordclaw because blades look like the better pick straight up right now. And Plasma Destroyers are looking pretty good even if Plasma Specialists got nerfed, 3 damage plasma culverins are still no joke (and safer to overcharge now) and with the amount of -1 damage stuff out there these days 2 damage and d3 damage won't cut it.
   
Made in gb
Regular Dakkanaut




 Lord Clinto wrote:
i just pray that these Docrina don't turn out to be similar in implementation to the Necron Command Protocols....I refuse to use them and don't know a single Necron player that even uses Command Protocols.


Even if they are similar in that you need to be within range of a qualifying character to use them, they'll still be miles better than Command Protocols because the problem with CP (other than the whole 'choose the order before the battle ) is that they're very restrictive to implement and the buff is laughably minor even if you do bother to use it.
   
Made in it
Longtime Dakkanaut





Canticles could very well have the same limitations they have now. Can't be repeated. The blessing is nice for Mars, but it could be available for only one turn. Also, if you are going second, you will have to telegraph your intention to your opponent.
   
Made in de
Mysterious Techpriest






Mars is great, and it "needs" to be as its the the allrounder of all those forge worlds.
The intent seems to be to have Mars as a generalist that allows you to take whatever you want, mixing units as you see fit.
All the other FWs push a different angle.
Ryza, as mentioned. Agripinaa is Servitor. Lucius is durability. Metallica is mobility. Graia is fethed. Stygies is sneaky and anti-gunline.

The odd one out is Graia for me, as that one just appears weak. Every other FW has some unique traits that reward a certain army composition and playstyle.
I'll still run mostly Mars because its "comfortable", but its easy to branch out.
And noone said you cant mix detachments to get Canticles on Skitarii and your Fulgs ride in a Ryza detach....

Data author of DA/AdM on Battlescribe
Report bugs here:
https://github.com/BSData/wh40k/issues 
   
Made in gb
Enginseer with a Wrench





 Thairne wrote:
Mars is great, and it "needs" to be as its the the allrounder of all those forge worlds.
The intent seems to be to have Mars as a generalist that allows you to take whatever you want, mixing units as you see fit.
All the other FWs push a different angle.
Ryza, as mentioned. Agripinaa is Servitor. Lucius is durability. Metallica is mobility. Graia is fethed. Stygies is sneaky and anti-gunline.

The odd one out is Graia for me, as that one just appears weak. Every other FW has some unique traits that reward a certain army composition and playstyle.
I'll still run mostly Mars because its "comfortable", but its easy to branch out.
And noone said you cant mix detachments to get Canticles on Skitarii and your Fulgs ride in a Ryza detach....


I'm still expecting mixed detachments to be locked down like other codexes before us, but not every army has to play the same way. Even though it doesn't appeal to me; They've already shown that they're not afraid to shake things up. So far they've literally gone back to 7th and worked from there rather than building on the shakey foundations of 8th. Taken a few of the good things from 8th but generally just improved 7th like they should have done in the first place. Lessons learned I guess. But yeah, I wouldn't put all my eggs in one basket for mixed detachments, because the trend of 9th edition so far is moving away from min-maxing army benefits.

I support the Mars is the generalist approach, the problem is that the other forgeworlds so far dont double down on their niche enough for them to override Mars generalist position. I'm still hoping for a generic arch magos upgrade and for us to be able to specialise them in some way.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/20 21:25:54


 
   
Made in us
Stone Bonkers Fabricator General






A garden grove on Citadel Station

I'm glad Mars seems good be aude I spent too much time converting am Arch magos to feel good about moving to whatever else the new hotness would be.

ph34r's forgeworld Phobos blog
+From Iron Cometh Strength+ +From Strength Cometh Will+ +From Will Cometh Faith+ +From Faith Cometh Honor+ +From Honor Cometh Iron+
The Polito form is dead, insect. Are you afraid? What is it you fear? The end of your trivial existence?
When the history of my glory is written, your species shall only be a footnote to my magnificence.
 
   
Made in us
Lord Commander in a Plush Chair






A little something that I noticed in the Crusade Rules Preview: "Adeptus Mechanicus Infantry or Monsters..."

Either we are getting a new unit not yet revealed, or Robots are going back to being Monsters.

I, personally, Hope it is the latter; Robots as Monsters instead of Vehicles takes the sting out of Haywire, enemy Arc, and similar specialized anti-tank (but makes DEldar still a little scarier).

This is my Rulebook. There are many Like it, but this one is mine. Without me, my rulebook is useless. Without my rulebook, I am useless.
Stop looking for buzz words and start reading the whole sentences.



 
   
Made in gb
Fully-charged Electropriest






I noticed that too and thought it could perhaps be about Kastelan Robots but after considering the context I think that they’ll remain vehicles and perhaps Cawl will gain the Monster keyword. As the text is to do with interacting with a pseudo objective I think that makes the most sense.
   
Made in de
Mysterious Techpriest






Well those holy orders... mixed bag.

They're a hard nerf on the old ones, having exploding 6s only on one unit and then only from turn 2 on (if I interpret "action" correctly), but I can totally see Vanguards with a Manipulus going upfield, advancing, shooting 21" without penalty because metalica, explode on 6s, D2 on 6s...
The 1 CP saved reduces the pts cost in comparison. And metalica got an extra epic deed strat with charadon...
They really seem to love Metalica right now.

Artisan seems more underwhelming, although going back to ye olde times of S8 autocannons and S10 Lascannons without canticles and not running Mars and permanently at that is nice as well.

Data author of DA/AdM on Battlescribe
Report bugs here:
https://github.com/BSData/wh40k/issues 
   
Made in us
Regular Dakkanaut




https://www.warhammer-community.com/2021/05/21/make-your-tech-priest-as-flexible-as-his-mechadendrites-with-a-holy-orders-progressive-ability/

Looks like Holy Orders are chapter command style point upgrades now instead of WLTs. Some interesting stuff including a one time -1 CP to a specific category of stratagems depending on the Order (free/1 CP Wrath of Mars? 1 CP Plasma Specialists?) and 2 types of auras, one persistent that's effective at the start of the game or an advanced one that overrides the first one after you do an action to activate it. I'm gonna guess Enginseers are gonna get a bigger role now as cheap Holy Orders aura givers. Either way, there's a lot of things to keep track of while playing Ad Mech now.
   
Made in de
Mysterious Techpriest






Enginseers will be even more useless. The Traits are limited to your warlord.
They're also not really auras anymore since you pick ONE unit.

Edit: Correction - no idea where I picked up the warlord thing, its not in the article...

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/21 14:21:25


Data author of DA/AdM on Battlescribe
Report bugs here:
https://github.com/BSData/wh40k/issues 
   
Made in us
Big Mek in Kustom Dragster with Soopa-Gun





Nebraska, USA

The word "warlord" is not in that entire article. You must be thinking of the original Holy Order which for some randomass reason was limited to your actual warlord, despite the wording being identical to all warlord traits.
It does say "Tech-Priest" a lot though.

This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2021/05/21 14:22:58


An ork with an idea tends to end with a bang.

14000pts Big 'n Bad Orkz
6000pts Admech/Knights
7500pts Necron Goldboys 
   
 
Forum Index » 40K Tactics
Go to: