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NinthMusketeer wrote: Which makes sense, because humans are largely the same. If anything, expecting a different response goes against what should be the basic assumption.
The big difference between now and 2,500 years ago is science. But the people have had enough of experts.
I dunno, those greeks were pretty smart when it came to physics and math. Archimedes, Pythagoras, the list goes on.
NinthMusketeer wrote: Which makes sense, because humans are largely the same. If anything, expecting a different response goes against what should be the basic assumption.
The big difference between now and 2,500 years ago is science. But the people have had enough of experts.
I dunno, those greeks were pretty smart when it came to physics and math. Archimedes, Pythagoras, the list goes on.
With maths you don't solve sickness.
And enlightenment basically allowed us to break the chains of censorship atleast in some parts of the world.
Not to say they were stupid or lesser but ultimately we have hindsight and 2000 years + of acumulated knowledge, it is fair to assume that we could've reacted better.
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/04/15 05:30:00
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
Ok, you're probably wondering how this could possibly be good news. Fair question.
IF scientists find a corona type virus that is closely related to COVID 19 but does not produce the serious symptoms it does, it might be possible to use it to inoculate people with it to produce antibodies effective against covid 19.
In a good case scenario we could find a corona strain that is related to COVID19 in the same way cowpox was related to smallpox. The first successful immunization in recorded history was when a scientist/physician named Edward Jenner deliberately infected children with a relatively harmless disease names coxpox after noting milkmaids who has had cowpox never seemed to get smallpox.https://www.vbivaccines.com/wire/edward-jenner-and-the-first-modern-vaccine/
If a non symptom producing strain of corona can be found it might lead to a leap ahead in vaccinations. (I wish we had an orkmnoticon of an ork crossing his fingers.) Keep watching this space....
This message was edited 4 times. Last update was at 2020/04/14 23:16:38
"But the universe is a big place, and whatever happens, you will not be missed..."
I'd see it as poetic justice if this judge ended up in this doctor's ER.
Yes its a terrible situation for the doctor, but after reading the full article I'm actually quite sympathetic to the fathers position(assuming he's not using the virus as an excuse). Also the judge seemed fairly explicit about the temporary nature of this ruling. I have a friend who is in a similar situation with shared custody and an ex who works in the health service. He started self isolating last week, as his ex developed symptoms but didn't tell him until after his daughter had stayed over for a couple of days.
At least it doesn't sound like they'll have an audience.
Klawz-Ramming is a subset of citrus fruit?
Gwar- "And everyone wants a bigger Spleen!"
Mercurial wrote:
I admire your aplomb and instate you as Baron of the Seas and Lord Marshall of Privateers.
Orkeosaurus wrote:Star Trek also said we'd have X-Wings by now. We all see how that prediction turned out.
Orkeosaurus, on homophobia, the nature of homosexuality, and the greatness of George Takei.
English doesn't borrow from other languages. It follows them down dark alleyways and mugs them for loose grammar.
At least it doesn't sound like they'll have an audience.
Been following this. There's gonna be some of their talent who I imagine will refuse. Roman Reigns I hope will refuse as he quite recently recovered from Leukemia so his immune system is going to still be compromised from the treatment. He already dropped out of the pre-taped wrestlemania so I hope he stays at home as it is just not worth the risk. Well, I hope all of them stay at home as it just isn't worth it.
Hell, they've had pushback from ex-WWE wrestlers on this, such as Ryback who tweeted:
Now is the time for ALL wrestling talent to stand together and refuse to perform. Nothing changes without courage and right now the world has your back like never before. Wrestling will become so much better once @vincemcmahon is out completely. So do it for your kids. @wwe Thumbs down
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/04/15 00:25:22
The Laws of Thermodynamics:
1) You cannot win. 2) You cannot break even. 3) You cannot stop playing the game.
Colonel Flagg wrote:You think you're real smart. But you're not smart; you're dumb. Very dumb. But you've met your match in me.
ced1106 wrote: Interesting comment on a Yahoo comments section. Obviously, I'm gonna keep an eye out for more info. But you should already know that a fever is how your body combats viruses, and preventing your body from raising its temperature would be advantageous to the virus. Time for a good long soak in the hot tub, I suppose.
Possible adjunctive therapyrobably more than SARS 1, SARS 2/ COVID 19 seems to supress fevers more than usual. A lot of people have the virus, don't know they have it and have no fever at all. This may be the reason the virus is able to replicate and spread. (calm before the storm) So if we can increase the core body temperature using whatever techniques are available like contrast showers, hydro thermal therapy, hot bath then cold, this might actually help speed up recovery and not spread the virus.
Patients coming in with COVID-19 have elevated liver function tests. Non steroidal medications inhibit the production of prostaglandins, which are directly responsible for antibody production. That is the adaptive immune response but no the innate immune system. The impact of COVID-19 isn't just on lungs. It attacks the entire body including the heart, kidneys, liver, the collagulation system, neuroligical system.
Thermal stress produces heat shock proteins which are immune modulators. They essentially jumstarts the immune response whereas this virus tries to downregulate the innate immune system. This treatment has to be complimented with current medical care. If you are relatively fit the same can be accomplished with exercise to increase core temperature then cooling off with a cold shower.
In terms of anyone who might be immunocompromised, many companies are looking at the natural killer cells to help with immunity in other diseases and repurposed to look at COVID-19. They are taking it and infusing it on people coming in to the hospital. Imagine that you can do this in much less invasive ways much earlier in the process with hydro thermal therapy.
Warning to anyone with asthma as steam hot showers can precipitate an astma attacks. Hot/Cold therapy treatment can potentially boost immunity with coronavirus. He cites 4 studies below indicate affects the part of the SARS COV2 natural cells and monocytes. Keep in mind there is no studies on this with COVID-19 but he is using the next best scenario studies if you follow. Hot and cold temperature regulation affects part of the innate immune system that helps with targeting viral infections. Hyperthermia and then cooling off actually improved surrogates for the immune system monocytes and their stimulation/ response to foreign invaders.
Consider taking contrast showers 4-6 minutes warm/hot water, clean yourself, then rinse with 1-3 minutes cold water. Every day. Takes 1-2 weeks to get used to it, but it's well worth it. Or hot bath/then cold shower. Consult with your doctor first but here is a instructional video on contrast showers https://vimeo.com/165013134/346f3ef87a
I agree that a natural fever is often a beneficial part of the bodies response to infection, and it is becoming increasingly common practice to not treat pyrexias unless they become very high because of this. However, I would be very cautious about interpreting those studies as meaning artificially heating the body externally will help. The studies above are very theoretical- they are measuring biomarkers in a lab setting and not actual infections rates. The exception is the study about saunas, but that has a tiny sample size of 50 people. All of the studies looking at artificially heating the body are therefore not generalisable to the population level. They also don't look at any potential downsides for doing this. Having said that, the results are interesting and provide avenues for further study with more validity for generalisation.
Regarding prescriptions if they run out another doctor, Dr. Nicole Apelian has recently come up with alternative herbal remedies along with natural plants to use. She has some great coronavirus tips but please don't discount her as she has a PHD and is a herbalist because an unexpected diagnosis of multiple sclerosis in 2000 led Nicole to apply her research skills towards her own personal wellness.She was selected on history channel back in 2015 on a survival show called Alone. Her guide is on http://lostremedies.pg-blog.com/
Ok I watched the video in good faith, thinking it may have some interesting options for replacing medicines in a pinch. After all, many herbal remedies have been refined into pharmaceuticals.
But to be frank, that video contains dangerous misinformation. The way it uses HIV as an example is disingenuous, when the agenda of the video is to tell you to stop taking pills. Antiretrovirals for HIV are the only known treatment that allows those infected with HIV to have a normal life-expectancy. In addition, much of the earlier part of the video focuses exclusively on immune-modulated disease, which is largely infectious and autoimmune disease. Most of the medications people take are not immunomodulators, and have nothing to do with the immune system in their therapeutic mechanism of action. The video flat-out states that only your immune system can cure a disease, which is simply false for, say, HIV, or liver cirrhosis, or major trauma.
The video goes on to talk about some specific examples. It states that insulin does not cure the cause of diabetes. This is true. However, if a person's diabetes is insulin dependent, then nothing is going to cure their diabetes because their natural insulin production is destroyed. Insulin is a hormone produced by the body that is vital for life! Telling people to stop taking their insulin will kill people, especially type 1 diabetics, but also a large number of people with type 2 diabetes. There are people with pre-diabetes and early type 2 diabetes who can manage their condition without medication and can even reverse the progression and go into remission, but those people are not the ones who have a damaged pancreas that can't produce insulin. Insulin also isn't a pill... which somewhat stretches the credibility of the video as a whole.
Stating painkillers don't treat the cause of the pain is also unhelpful. Being is pain is detrimental to healing and general wellbeing, and there are also specific examples like morphine improving mortality in heart attacks. That isn't as flat out dangerous as telling people to stop taking their insulin though. I've had entire teaching modules on the correct use of insulin because it is such a vital medication that can be very dangerous if it is underdosed or overdosed.
"We can now pinpoint the substances in nature that act like an antibiotic, an antiviral..." Quote from the video. I don't know why this is revolutionary, when penicillin was derived from a fungus and is literally a substance in nature; cephalosporins- from a fungus; aminoglycosides like streptomycin- from a bacterium; macrolides like erythromycin- from a bacteria. All antibiotic classes derived from nature, hardly an exhaustive list. Nature is still a commonly used source for medicines.
Natural remedies also still suffer from all the same problems with side effects and interactions that prescription medications do. St John's wort is a well-example of a herbal remedy that has actual, scientifically proven pharmaceutical effects in treating depression... but also has a very well documented interaction with warfarin, a common and useful medication. In this case, taking the St John's wort can cause the warfarin to work less effectively and lead to life-threatening blood clots like strokes or pulmonary emboli (depending on the reason for taking the warfarin).
I think natural remedies can have a place, but they have risks. I also think that video is dangerous because it spreads harmful disinformation about medicines.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/04/15 02:50:54
ChargerIIC wrote: If algae farm paste with a little bit of your grandfather in it isn't Grimdark I don't know what is.
Azreal13 wrote: I'd also be surprised if an apparently fit and healthy chap who's been fighting the disease for over a week, has been posting videos from the hospital earlier today and has still been staying in relative touch with the cabinet could take such a turn in such a short period of time.
I wouldn't.
It is one of the characteristic features of coronavirus pneumonia- rapid progression in those developing severe disease. People can have a more-or-less normal chest xray one day, and have a white-out the day afterwards.
It is quite unusual- bacterial pneumonias usually only display this in unusually virulent, aggressive infections. COVID-19 typically causes weird xray findings in general to be honest.
Overread wrote: 1K ontop of 9K is a big increase in volume. And if that 9K is for the whole of the USA then consider that the whole of the UK is VASTLY smaller. So suddenly that 1K is a vastly larger percentage of daily deaths on the system.
I mean of all the things in life that can potentially kill you, commuting by car is about the most likely thing to kill most people - being far more dangerous than even some dangerous sports/events/activities.
And this is 1K deaths a day when most of the country has shut down to reduce infection spread. Imagine the numbers if people were moving around normally
And in US about 1.7k dies per day to heart attack. That's the biggest killer. So 1k vs 1.7k of US's(lot bigger country)'s biggest killer.
It's not that insignificant number. And likely lot lower than truth(they don't include those who died to corona outside hospital for example. Died in old people's care house? Don't count)
This depends heavily on the country. The way death certification works in the UK, at least, allows for the cause of death to be registered on the balance of probability- it doesn't have to have been proved by pathology. I was speaking to one of the medical examiners in my hospital a week ago, and he said the current convention is to list the 1a cause of death* as coronavirus (confirmed) or coronavirus (probable) if the patient hadn't tested positive but the characteristics of the patient's illness fitted coronavirus well enough that it was the most likely cause for the pneumonia. The chest xray findings mentioned above are a good example- some patients are displaying very typical coronavirus xray findings but testing negative for whatever reason.
This is especially true when considering the sensitivity issues of the tests.
Because of this, the UK statistics can include patients who are not confirmed to die of coronavirus. I do not know if they are currently publishing those deaths in the statistics, but they are being collected.
*UK deaths are registered using a 1a 1b 1c 2 system, where 1 is the cause of death, and 2 is contributing factors.
AegisGrimm wrote: That would pretty much be a first in medical history. The entire reason viruses are called Novel is because no one is out there with antibodies in their system. The only way people won't produce antibodies for this is if their immune system is compromised.
Even Dr. Fauci says that it's likely people will develop antibodies that probably will last about a year or two. With Coronaviruses, historically the worse the virus the longer the body produces antibodies for, and other than the transmission rates, Covid19 is (relatively) weak compared to things like SARs, or Swine Flu.
A first? We know 'flu changes regularly enough that the population loses immunity between years sufficiently greatly to require a new vaccine to protect the vulnerable. There are also a number of viruses that are cleared just fine in weeks in some people, but become lifelong infections in others for reasons that are not clear in a lot of cases (the HPV family is a major example). Both of these phenomena are caused by the viruses in question evolving to hide themselves from the immune system in some way. Viruses like some HPV subtypes can even lead to cancer due to the way they hide from the immune system.
Viruses can be really tricky customers when it comes to immune responses.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: No, that is the advice /guidance, not the law. The law is a lot less restrictive than what the government would like us to do as laid out in their guidelines, but they are somewhat wary of breaching parts of the ECHR, and rightly so. For example, you can leave your house for whatever reason you like, as many times as you like, despite the police setting up snitch websites for curtain twitchers to grass up their neighbours. This is why we've had problems. Certain parts of the law are unclear, and some police have mistaken some of the guidance for things they can enforce, (despite it really being in their professional remit to ensure they are aware of what can and can not be enforced.)
GoatboyBeta wrote: My sisters neighbours had a visit from the constabulary today. They had people over for a barbecue a few days ago and today they had visitors for a Sunday meal I honestly don't know what its going to take for the message to get through to some people. TBH at this stage if it wasn't for the extra danger they are putting others in I'd say screw em and let natural selection do its thing.
Oh and seven hundred and thirty seven hospital deaths today in the UK.
The law only prohibits gatherings in public places, so I have no idea why the police feel they have any right to visit them.
Aren't you only 'allowed' to go outside to shop for essentials, exercise once, work or care for someone/medical care?
Exactly, organising parties and having people visit is totally non-essential travel.
But not illegal.
I don't see why it needs to be illegal for the police to visit? So long as they weren't nicking anyone or handing out fines, just providing advice on the guidelines and telling people to stop being muppets is fine and part of the remit of the police (I would argue part of the remit of any public servant within their expertise and trianing). For example, a large part of the highway code is only best practice, not law, and the police advise on that.
queen_annes_revenge wrote: What do you mean competitive market? do you mean private healthcare? I think there should be an opt out option for those willing and able to buy private health insurance. I'd happily buy private for my family if it meant a slightly lower tax rate for myself.
What would be the advantage of buying private health insurance in exchange for a lower tax rate? You might get lower taxes, sure, but you'd almost assuredly pay more for your premiums than you would save from reducing your tax rate, let alone your additional out-of-pocket costs..
Quicker service, choice of medical care, better quality care etc.
How? Insurance doesn't determine the speed or quality of care, thats determined purely by the medical staff/healthcare provider and has nothing to do with your insurance carrier. Nobody has ever once in my life said "oh you have Cigna/Kaiser Permanente/Metlife/etc? Here, cut to the front of the line, would you like a single malt and a cigar while we take your blood pressure?" In fact, its repeatedly slowed down my speed of service, particularly in the last year. I ended up having to push back a surgery to correct a deviated septum not once but on 3 separate occasions, from Feb 2019 to September 2019, precisely because my insurance carrier would not approve the surgery even though I got 3 separate ENTs and a cardiologist to all say that I was more or less at extreme risk of dropping dead in my sleep due to a blocked nasal passageway which was somehow triggering a cardiac arrhythmia. Oh, and when that surgery was finally cleared, I was given the excellent "choice" of not getting it at all or paying $3k out of pocket because my insurer didn't consider it medically necessary. While probably a more egregious example of things, I can't tell you how many times I've had to go without prescription meds for several days (in a few cases several weeks) because insurance carriers needed doctors to prove medical necessity or decided that the prescription was too expensive and that it would be more cost effective for them to proscribe an alternative set of meds instead - in some cases to the obvious detriment of my quality of care as instead of taking a single medication as originally proscribed, I was taking 2 or 3 different ones to achieve similar results.
As for choice - I don't know how the NHS works (i.e. are you restricted to using only certain providers or going to certain hospitals, etc?), but as far as the American healthcare system, I have very little choice - my choice is dictated entirely by my insurance carrier, which is in turn dictated by my employer. For the current year my employer decided to switch carriers for cost savings, in turn I can no longer see the family doctor I've been seeing for the past 10+ years, nor can I continue seeing the ENT specialist I've been working with for the past 2 years to get my sleep apnea issue under control unless I want to pay ~$700 out of pocket per visit. How is that "choice"?
As someone who has private health insurance, you seem to not really understand what it is you're asking for.
I think the UK system is different to that in the US, because it is optional rather than required if you want to be able to access treatment. I don't have much experience with it, but those I know who have it say its much better than potentially having long waits with the NHS
This is because the private providers here have to compete with a free-at-the-point-of-use service (the NHS) and so have to maintain a minimum standard that seems worth it in comparison to sticking with the NHS. In addition, private healthcare here doesn't touch emergency/acute medicine- it just isn't profitable. Therefore, they only take the predictable, profitable, elective work, which is much easier to provide a good service for. NHS trusts which operate "cold" elective hospitals often operate services that feel much more akin to private services, because the hospital has fully predicatable workflow that is not disrupted by the vagaries of acute medicine. Well, outside of a global pandemic anyway. A private or cold hospital doesn't have to worry about a routine endoscopy being postponed because a patient just got admitted in A&E with a serious upper gastrointestinal bleed who needs a gastroscopy now to survive, and therefore takes their slot.
It is also one of the disadvantages of private hospitals in the UK- all surgery and procedures carry risks, and if one of those complications does occur, a private hospital has only limited facilities to deal with an emergency because it is not designed to handle acute cases. Being transfered to an acute hospital is usually smooth, but it is less ideal than being in the same building.
Also with what I’ve been hearing about amazon, I’ve cancelled Prime and I’m endeavouring to never buy from them again.
What did Amazon do now?
Amazon fired the guy who led the walkout protest. On the other hand, he was also supposed to be staying at home, with pay, on quarantine for possible exposure to the virus.
That seems pretty reasonable to me. But then, today has been a litany of workers making demands for more money and threatening strikes, which seems shaking moral ground and dangerous employment grounds when there's a glut of newly unemployed people who'll line up to replace them.
Yeah, as long as we can just keep feeding serfs into the grinder who cares right?
Sure, you could take it that way.
Personally, since delivery services are becoming more essential for large segments of the population, I find leveraging the pandemic for a pay raise by threatening to leave people without access to essential food and medicine deliveries to be fairly disgusting. Sorry, Granny Jill, we need more cash money before you get your meds this week. Hopefully you won't die, but honestly, we don't care as long as we get ours, right?
Times are tough all over. Prioritizing selfishness over helping others strikes me as the wrong road.
This is very frustrating for me. I work in healthcare. I, and my collegues in the same role, literally cannot engage in many forms of industrial action (particularly strikes) without at least some service disruption that could harm patients under normal operation (i.e. not a pandemic)
Does that mean I can never fight for my working conditions to be improved? I can only let myself and the value of my work be ground-down by my employer?
This message was edited 2 times. Last update was at 2020/04/15 02:54:07
ChargerIIC wrote: If algae farm paste with a little bit of your grandfather in it isn't Grimdark I don't know what is.
No, because I work 10 hour shifts, 4 days a week. So really, I would be holding it for about 12 hours.
I wouldn't say I never poop at work, but it's certainly rare - I imagine in the 5 years at my current job, I've gone twice, when I was really sick. I prefer never ever to poop at my work, and my body is well adapter to not really needing to poop until I get home around midnight.
One of the interesting things about working for home now is that I am free to eat things that could potentially upset my stomach without worrying. I would never eat Popeye's greasy-ass fried chicken on a night before I work, normally. Now, the bathroom is just 15 feet from my "office"!.
I'm going to miss that when I rotate back to in-person next week.
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
No, because I work 10 hour shifts, 4 days a week. So really, I would be holding it for about 12 hours.
I wouldn't say I never poop at work, but it's certainly rare - I imagine in the 5 years at my current job, I've gone twice, when I was really sick. I prefer never ever to poop at my work, and my body is well adapter to not really needing to poop until I get home around midnight.
One of the interesting things about working for home now is that I am free to eat things that could potentially upset my stomach without worrying. I would never eat Popeye's greasy-ass fried chicken on a night before I work, normally. Now, the bathroom is just 15 feet from my "office"!.
I'm going to miss that when I rotate back to in-person next week.
I mean, pretty much.
But i dont even go every other day, let alone once a day. So this "Pooping at work" thing has me confused. People really poop at work? Like, what if a co worker is there or something?
@Ouze: Fine, but why such a strong reaction (never ever) to taking a dump at work? Do you feel uncomfortable? Vulnerable? Are the facilities dirty/third world? Is it a germ thing (seems more relevant these days)?
I mean, I don’t want to spend a lot of time in a public john, but I don’t think twice about pinching a loaf if I have to. I’m not going to hold it fer crissakes, not with a 45-60 minute commute. I guess I have nice office building bathrooms at my disposal, and an office job I can step away from for a couple minutes if I need to. Still, I’m kinda fascinated by the OH HELL NO reactions.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/04/15 04:19:32
No, because I work 10 hour shifts, 4 days a week. So really, I would be holding it for about 12 hours.
I wouldn't say I never poop at work, but it's certainly rare - I imagine in the 5 years at my current job, I've gone twice, when I was really sick. I prefer never ever to poop at my work, and my body is well adapter to not really needing to poop until I get home around midnight.
One of the interesting things about working for home now is that I am free to eat things that could potentially upset my stomach without worrying. I would never eat Popeye's greasy-ass fried chicken on a night before I work, normally. Now, the bathroom is just 15 feet from my "office"!.
I'm going to miss that when I rotate back to in-person next week.
I mean, pretty much.
But i dont even go every other day, let alone once a day. So this "Pooping at work" thing has me confused. People really poop at work? Like, what if a co worker is there or something?
Well as the title of the book says everybody poops. I don't really judge since it's something everybody's gotta do at some point.
I think natural remedies can have a place, but they have risks. I also think that video is dangerous because it spreads harmful disinformation about medicines.
Yeah, I reported the post, it's literal disinformation that's going to get somebody killed.
I prefer to buy from miniature manufacturers that *don't* support the overthrow of democracy.
Matt Swain wrote: x. The first successful immunization in recorded history was when a scientist/physician named Edward Jenner deliberately infected children with a relatively harmless disease names coxpox after noting milkmaids who has had cowpox never seemed to get smallpox.https://www.vbivaccines.com/wire/edward-jenner-and-the-first-modern-vaccine/
This is... not particularly accurate, in an 'erasing non-Westerners from history' kind of way.
The roots of inoculation came to Britain by way of the Ottoman Empire, largely because Lady Mary Wortley Montagu (wife of the British Ambassador) came across it and had it done to her children.
Its not particularly clear when the Ottomans adopted it, but limited attempts at inoculation were made in China in the 16th century.
In the Americas, the practice came to people's attention about the same time in the Americas, because several Africans had been innoculated before being enslaved and sent over.
Vulcan wrote: The more I see the phrase 'essential worker' thrown around, the more I'm starting to think what they really mean is 'expendable worker'.
They are only essential so far as they sacrifice to keep everyone else comfortable while many remain the lowest paid sectionnof the populace. So yes, expendable.
"By this point I'm convinced 100% that every single race in the 40k universe have somehow tapped into the ork ability to just have their tech work because they think it should."
Vulcan wrote: The more I see the phrase 'essential worker' thrown around, the more I'm starting to think what they really mean is 'expendable worker'.
They are only essential so far as they sacrifice to keep everyone else comfortable while many remain the lowest paid sectionnof the populace. So yes, expendable.
Yeah I’d agree with that, after a few wks of being in lock down but having to go to work everyday while a major part of the uk stay home I’m now feeling like an expendable asset.
You are expected to go in everyday and bust your ass to get gear out the door while working and mixing with others there by putting yourself at greater risk of picking something up , hell then if you do get the virus you are told to stay at home on live on statutory sick pay of 96 quid a wk.
But hey the uk are clapping and banging pots and pans for NHS workers and the rest of us key workers!! That’s great when I’m literally hanging and collapsing on the sofa each night after coming home from work.
Sorry if this sounds bitter people but yeah I’m feeling expendable and wondering why .
Bran Dawri wrote: I dunno, those greeks were pretty smart when it came to physics and math. Archimedes, Pythagoras, the list goes on.
With maths you don't solve sickness
Those ancient Greek dudes may have had a thing or two to say about society, governing, and ethics as well...
Unless you were a male citizen, little of it was good.
Good to have you back! How's that insignificant virus vs WHO terrorism going?
You should not apply Standards of today to the past though.
I am curious aswell on the later Part.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
Bran Dawri wrote: I dunno, those greeks were pretty smart when it came to physics and math. Archimedes, Pythagoras, the list goes on.
With maths you don't solve sickness
Those ancient Greek dudes may have had a thing or two to say about society, governing, and ethics as well...
Unless you were a male citizen, little of it was good.
Good to have you back! How's that insignificant virus vs WHO terrorism going?
You should not apply Standards of today to the past though.
I am curious aswell on the later Part.
Ironically, Plato would think you could. Broadly I agree, but appeals to ancient history as relevant to modernity because they contain the germ of ideas that still matter are silly. Hellenistic thought does ground some modern philosophy regarding how we can justify or explain ethical, moral, and political positions, for example, but the ethics, morals, and politics themselves are useful only as bad examples! But we digress.
To drag it back towards coronavirus, aside from Pericles, Johnson's political hero is the mayor in Jaws who insisted on keeping the beaches open to protect the economy during a crisis...
I deleted it because it was petty
On topic, I see Trump has ended US funding to the WHO, or is considering it, depending on the source consulted, both of which seem to be him?
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/04/15 06:27:25
gorgon wrote: @Ouze: Fine, but why such a strong reaction (never ever) to taking a dump at work? Do you feel uncomfortable? Vulnerable? Are the facilities dirty/third world? Is it a germ thing (seems more relevant these days)?
I mean, I don’t want to spend a lot of time in a public john, but I don’t think twice about pinching a loaf if I have to. I’m not going to hold it fer crissakes, not with a 45-60 minute commute. I guess I have nice office building bathrooms at my disposal, and an office job I can step away from for a couple minutes if I need to. Still, I’m kinda fascinated by the OH HELL NO reactions.
It's a little hard to explain, I think it's a few things. For one, I don't like it when I am going and someone goes into the room, I don't feel like I can leave. This actually is not a problem now, I basically have the whole building to myself, but at my old job, it was a high-volume bathroom so it could be tricky leaving when no one else is in there. I have a strong aversion to being caught red-handed at the scene of the crime.
I also take a fairly long time, and I don't really want my coworkers to know how long it takes. There's this one guy that works there that is basically remembered largely for taking 40 minute dumps, and while I'm nowhere near that excess, I fear something like that could be my legacy.
I have to say, this becoming a poop thread is a welcome break in Coronavirus news, which was mostly incessantly dire. Speaking of;
nfe wrote: On topic, I see Trump has ended US funding to the WHO, or is considering it, depending on the source consulted, both of which seem to be him?
I know he was thinking of it for a few days now, but by my reading of the reporting, he did indeed order it cut off.
I mean, even if you agree with the rationale, this might not the the exact best time with the global pandemic and all, but what do I know. I guess we fell back to "terrorists".
This message was edited 3 times. Last update was at 2020/04/15 06:43:06
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
The stated rationale is that they are heavily biased to the Chinese government to the point they are complicit in the early coverup.
This isn't my rationale, I don't know enough about the WHO to really have an opinion - but I think the timing is terrible even if you buy into the above.
lord_blackfang wrote: Respect to the guy who subscribed just to post a massive ASCII dong in the chat and immediately get banned.
Flinty wrote: The benefit of slate is that its.actually a.rock with rock like properties. The downside is that it's a rock
Ouze wrote: The stated rationale is that they are heavily biased to the Chinese government to the point they are complicit in the early coverup.
This isn't my rationale, I don't know enough about the WHO to really have an opinion - but I think the timing is terrible even if you buy into the above.
I mean yeah, but lest we forget who let them gain this much influence in the first place....
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
Ouze wrote: The stated rationale is that they are heavily biased to the Chinese government to the point they are complicit in the early coverup.
This isn't my rationale, I don't know enough about the WHO to really have an opinion - but I think the timing is terrible even if you buy into the above.
Funnily enough trump himself was downplaying the whole thing and not doing anything to prepare US while complimenting china and who warning of the danger.
But trump is just looking for external target to shift blame from his own mistakes.
Ouze wrote: The stated rationale is that they are heavily biased to the Chinese government to the point they are complicit in the early coverup.
This isn't my rationale, I don't know enough about the WHO to really have an opinion - but I think the timing is terrible even if you buy into the above.
I mean yeah, but lest we forget who let them gain this much influence in the first place....
China is the second biggest funder of the WHO (or biggest now). Meanwhile the Trump admin is terrible in paying its UN bills (including the WHO) on time. When you have two bosses, you hardly flip of the one that pays your salary properly to please the one who pays you whenever they might feel like it. What do they expect? Its cynical, but very few of us would work for free.
This message was edited 1 time. Last update was at 2020/04/15 07:39:48
Sorry for my spelling. I'm not a native speaker and a dyslexic.
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Ouze wrote: The stated rationale is that they are heavily biased to the Chinese government to the point they are complicit in the early coverup.
This isn't my rationale, I don't know enough about the WHO to really have an opinion - but I think the timing is terrible even if you buy into the above.
I mean yeah, but lest we forget who let them gain this much influence in the first place....
China is the second biggest funder of the WHO. Meanwhile the Trump admin is terrible in paying its UN bills (including the WHO) on time. When you have two bosses, you hardly flip of the one that pays your salary properly to please the one who pays you whenever they might feel like it.
Aye, that said, the ethics of the WHO helping the Chinese covering up at first is also an issue in and off itself.
https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/0/766717.page A Mostly Renegades and Heretics blog.
GW:"Space marines got too many options to balance, therefore we decided to legends HH units." Players: "why?!? Now we finally got decent plastic kits and you cut them?" Chaos marines players: "Since when are Daemonengines 30k models and why do i have NO droppods now?" GW" MONEY.... erm i meant TOO MANY OPTIONS (to resell your army to you again by disalowing former units)! Do you want specific tyranid fighiting Primaris? Even a new sabotage lieutnant!" Chaos players: Guess i stop playing or go to HH.
Ouze wrote: The stated rationale is that they are heavily biased to the Chinese government to the point they are complicit in the early coverup.
This isn't my rationale, I don't know enough about the WHO to really have an opinion - but I think the timing is terrible even if you buy into the above.
I mean yeah, but lest we forget who let them gain this much influence in the first place....
China is the second biggest funder of the WHO. Meanwhile the Trump admin is terrible in paying its UN bills (including the WHO) on time. When you have two bosses, you hardly flip of the one that pays your salary properly to please the one who pays you whenever they might feel like it.
Aye, that said, the ethics of the WHO helping the Chinese covering up at first is also an issue in and off itself.
Yep, but deference to the Chinese comes more easily if a good chunk of your employees jobs (and your own) depended on it. Cynical, but understandable, without China they would be unable to do part of their job and access to China, however much it might lie, is still important.
Sorry for my spelling. I'm not a native speaker and a dyslexic.
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NinthMusketeer wrote: Which makes sense, because humans are largely the same. If anything, expecting a different response goes against what should be the basic assumption.
The big difference between now and 2,500 years ago is science. But the people have had enough of experts.
I feel that point would be valid, IF people were prone to listen to science. They are not. They are prone to disregard it. Thus the assumption that they will act in the same way people did in absence of modern science because, well, that is what they are doing.
(I wish we had an orkmnoticon of an ork crossing his fingers.) Keep watching this space....
robably more than SARS 1, SARS 2/ COVID 19 seems to supress fevers more than usual. A lot of people have the virus, don't know they have it and have no fever at all. This may be the reason the virus is able to replicate and spread. (calm before the storm) So if we can increase the core body temperature using whatever techniques are available like contrast showers, hydro thermal therapy, hot bath then cold, this might actually help speed up recovery and not spread the virus.
I honestly don't know what its going to take for the message to get through to some people. 
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