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I like slice'n'dice's idea of the termie bein dropped on a "table" in front of Morgrim and he thinkin itd be a great shield. to add to it and take from the other posts... perhaps the "table" is a door off somethin. So strap a termie to a door and call it good.

Okay, so I had an idea for Morgrim (Da Warboss) to be holding a shield in front of him, and for that shield to utilise Terminator parts. That was as far as it went - I was waiting on actual Terminator models before I could refine the idea further - including whether it might work at all. I guess I should add I was thinking something custom built for him by Skarag (Da Big Mek) from one of his vanquished foes - not something hastily scavenged from the battlefield. Importantly, it would need to counter balance the hammer.

Terminator parts in hand, I started playing with the pieces. The height looked about right (perhaps a tiny bit too long). The width - I wasn't sure of yet - I hadn't decided whether I would try to incorporate weapons or not. The big issue at this stage was the depth - a full Terminator was just too deep! Even the head!

For my first attempt, I thought I would have the head facing down. I cut the head guard off the top of the chest piece and then hollowed the chest piece out and bent it flat. I nicked the inside of the head guard and bent that out too so that it would fit around the head (ie this is not a shoulder pad CommisarKhaine & monkeytroll). With the head facing down it was going to have to go under or over the chest piece or look too tall. I looked at cutting the head in half to reduce its depth, but that was just going to look odd. I ended up cutting it at an angle to keep all of the detail - but it still didn't sit well with the chest piece (which I didn't like flattened anyway...) I was also playing around with the legs - but couldn't see how they could be easily attached without leaving a large gap between them, or ending up too narrow - and they were going to add to the depth issue unless cut down too... I'd almost given up on incorporating weapons... I'd almost given up on a Termi shield...

I'm not sure now which occurred to me first - using the arm across the chest or the sword to plug the gap between the legs - but which ever it was lead me to the classic Dark Angels robed figure with sword icon look - and everything sort of flowed easily from there. The arm across provided enough room for the head without bulking the depth too much. I cut the sword to be used, and then the fingers from an outstretched Powerfist to make the hand resting on top (not a pad monkeytroll). Some halving of some Termi legs completed the look. At this point I had the pieces and the arrangement, just no way to attach them!

Given it was to be a shield, I made a shield back plate from a leftover Trukk reinforced ram and cut it in half to fit on either side of the left over Power Klaw gubbins. I then glued the arrangement on top - the sword connects the two halves - and hence it currently slides on and off (mostly off - blu-tack is currently holding it in place). I couldn't get a good feel for it straight away as I needed the glue to set - so it wasn't until the following morning I could try it on proper and take pics for Dakka.

Morning came, I tried it out. I think the shield by itself looks great. I envisage it more like an ornate coffin lid than a limp Terminator. Placing it on the model, well I wasn't sure. In some instances it looked great, in others, at odds - but I couldn't quite put my finger on it. Although I had originally planned to post without much accompanying information to get some raw feedback, time constraints ensure this was the case. Up it went, remained comment-less for quite sometime, and then the deluge began!

I think, if I can be so bold, that the major issue can be summed up as: too much detail, drawing attention/detracting from the rest of the model/over the top.

On reflection, I think I have to agree. In particular, I think I didn't quite realise how detailed the Terminator models are, and how lacking in detail the Ghazghkull model is (at least from the front...) - perhaps I should have picked that up in one of whalemusic360's earlier comments

However, I am not going to change it just yet. Importantly, it is not yet a permanent fixture of the model - so I am free to change my mind in the future. So far, only my time and one Terminator are casualties of this experiment But the main reason for not wanting to change it yet is that, on further thought, I think it may end up not being an issue - or even work out for the best. Why? Here are my thoughts:
1) There is still a lot more detail planned for the model - including, but not limited to, the scenic base, detailing of the hammer, cape/cloak/robe, possible lion skin, shoulder pads (I came to a revelation recently that Mega-armour is missing shoulder pads!), stikkbomb chukka etc. It may turn out that the level of detail on the shield is actually the correct amount, and won't draw attention away from the rest of the model.
2) Positioning - when doing the scenic base, I may tilt the model forward further. This will emphasise the body more and the shield less.
3) Weathering - this is only a first cut of the shield. Comments about it being too clean are completely well founded - and this should also help to de-emphasise it (and possibly reduce its depth too...) - though I may need to add some weld marks or bracing straps or chains or something...
4) As a final point - paint will have an impact on how much it stands out and draws the eye too - though that is a post modelling factor...

I think that about covers it. Your mission, should you choose to accept it, is to keep me informed as this project progresses, whether any of the above are having any impact on how you feel about the shield. I will do the same.

Thank you for all your suggestions of alternatives. I will keep them in mind if, when the time comes, the Termi shield is just not going to cut it. I think they are the easier option. I'm in this for the challenge - let's see if we can make the Termi shield work first!

I think that just leaves me with some minor housekeeping...

Artsoldier35: It's never way too early to have an opinion. The longer we leave commenting, the harder it is to fix! Appreciate your input as always.

CommissarKhaine: Great minds think alike - I had thought of this myself. I'm leaving removing it until later - easier to remove than add back on! Also considering putting some edging around the shield...

whalemusic360: Landraider door (at least without modification) was a bit big for the shield. Am thinking about for his base though....

slice'n'dice: More of a 2 & 3

prototype_X: Thanks! Glad you enjoyed!

schank23, Eckeon, moonshine, 1-i, Imperial Monkey, Vandez, monkeytroll, deadmeat85, Killmaimburnkillmaimburn, Heffling: I think I covered everything above... thanks for your input and keep it coming!

Thanks again everyone,
Arakasi

Guess I should have gone and looked at some termie bodies before assuming that was pads over his head I did realise that was a hand over the sword though, I was impressed with the posing there, just wasn't feeling it for the shield. I think your major challenge is going to be making it look like it's been constructed this way without obscuring things with too much chain/rope etc, maybe use rivets to show it's been bolted together?

Looking forward to seeing wherever this goes.

Quick idea, If the termie was painted very weathered/ monotone like a dusty or rusty effect that might obscure the details enough so they don't detract (look too busy etc) espcially when morgrim is painted in full colour.

Rivets would be good. I can probably also drill holes through the pieces and thread wire through it, rather than over it. Added benefit, it wouldn't add to the depth!

Muting the shield in paint is a definite option. My current dilemma is that the mega armour and shield *technically* are the same colour... Still, a dark green head should stand out, and the other paraphenalia still to come doesn't need to be the same colour... (and nothing to say the mega-armour can't be a different, more eye-catching tone - which was probably your original point )

You could make it look like some rebel grots got hold of his shield and slapped green paint or something all over it then Morgrim found out and smashed 'em on top of it with 'is bare hand!

I've seen some add ons for armor that are very detailed as far as iconic scenery. Maybe using a scrap piece of a LR with the scenery intact could be better. I'll see if I can find any examples.

Edit: OMG! Any of the resin add ons from forge world with a bit of weathering would be Awesome!




Or Chpaterhouse Studios

Guess I should have gone and looked at some termie bodies before assuming that was pads over his head

+1

CommissarKhaine: Great minds think alike - I had thought of this myself. I'm leaving removing it until later - easier to remove than add back on! Also considering putting some edging around the shield...

Good point, on both accounts . You could always add rope around the shield to make it look cobbled together in an orky way?

@Matt.Kingsley: I could...

@Artsoldier35: Doh! I'm surprised I didn't think of that! I will have to get those - they will be perfect for the scenic base, if not the shield as well (if I relinquish the Termi shield idea...)

@monkeytroll, CommissarKhaine: In all fairness - it *does* look like the base of a shoulder pad...

I totally agree you should continue to work on it. The idea is an interesting one at the least, and if it can be pulled off, I think you can do it. The LR (or rhino if better sized) doors would be an easy alternative, and the FW ones would look good.

I have the Angel rhino door yet unattached to anything, I could make you up a copy if you'd like.

this is probably un related but this thread has inspired me to create my own marine orks The krimzun klaws!

After readin your explanation up there I understand better what your tryin to do and it has the potential to be awesome.

Hell yea another Ork/marine army. Run with it prototye_X. But back to the subject matter. I think the termy shield idea is awesome. But I look at it this way. Orks have the mentality of Go big or go home. Orks dont care if some thing is to big or unproportioned. I can see a warboss in the heat of combat strike down a termy and pick up has body to use as a shield and bash the other umies with it. I feel its an original idea and if done correctly will look fantastic.

Hmmm...Too bad I just started an Eldar Army or I could jump on the Ork/Marine bandwagon with my own spin...

How about Black Ork Templar?

At first glance I was with the half that didn't think it worked, but the more I look at it, the more I can see where you're going with it, though it's not what I imagined when you first mentioned him using a terminator as a shield

There is something slightly off about it though. I think it's because the terminator bits look too clean and there's nothing apparently connecting the bits together. Little joining plates bolting everything together and adding dents/scratches/bullet holes into the bits might make it slightly more orky.

Belial will not stand for this insult which given my history of his surviving battles against anything but a brand new nid play more then likely means he will die early game to his orky counter part.

My apologies for this...anyone that saw a garbled message of nonsense. My moronic daemon of a brother posted it...

Deamon? Good thing the grey knights just got back from rebuilding.

I'm always in support of using fallen foes as decoration/shields. Your shield is no exception. I agree that presently it looks a bit off, but I also think you did a great job of making the termie the right size for the shield.

Some suggestions though - that you could try out, and see if they actually help or not - would be:
1) take off the headcover/scope - I really think it is just a little too high. Would be better IMO to make it look like Morgrim is glaring over the top of the shield as he charges forward, and I think that would be easier to pull off if there were a bit less things obscuring his face from that view. (Though of course I only have the two pictures to work off - maybe he can see just fine over it! )
2) My guess as to why is seems off, is that his shoulderpad is turned weird. It seems to me like it should be more to the side, seems like it's currently pulled too far onto his chest, makes the anatomy look a bit off. Another idea to maybe balance this out would be to see what it looks like if you have it with the other shoulderpad as well?

But yeah, I don't think it's over the top at all. Orks are all about that! With some weathering (and cutting off that damn sideways feather think on his shoulder pad) and some evident screws or ropes binding him to the shield, I think it will turn out great.

Also, awesome pose for Morgrim. Very powerful!

@whalemusic360: Thanks for the offer, but I already have a full set of FW winging its way to me...

@prototype_X: Cool - I look forward to seeing it!

@Eckeon: Thanks for the support!

@schank23: Orks may not care if something is too big or unproportioned - but I do. Orks *can* be well proportioned *and* Orky - in fact, I think they tend to look better that way... Hopefully I can do it correctly

@Artsoldier35: Black Templorks? A number of alternative Ork/Marine hybrids have turned up during the journey so far:

Molotov's "Black Templorks"

Llamahead's "Da Verminators"

endtransmission's short lived "Da' Elee-shun Waaaargh!"

@endtransmission: Seems a common theme that people were imagining something else... I think I'll have fun with itty bitty joining plates...

@White Ninja: No insult intended, but all heads accepted - with or without body...

@Imperial Monkey: I've told you before - stay out of the Painboyz hut!

Bad news for Morgrim and Da Deffwing - somehow work commitments have forced me to work from home this week - which means I'm not wiv da boyz dis week Da Boss is happy though...

I've signed up for Dakka's own Platinum Devil 3 - which means I have 5 weeks (At 3 nights a week, missing this week, that's only 12 nights! - and I think Easter and Royal Weddings might bring that down another 2...) to bring Da Dark Angelz up to 1500pts. Morgrim and Da Deffwing need to be finished. Artsoldier35's Trukk will get broken in. And I still need to do up Snikrot and a handful of Kommandos...

Stressful times ahead!

hmmm

Cool. I'll have to check them out.

And cool on the Trukk getting some fresh dings and dents! Hope it truly goes ramshackle for you.

hey hey! Thats the best thing about living in Britain. Some Royals shak up and we get a holiday

As to the shield. you could always scale it down and just use a company master...squishing mine twice would be reason enought to a llow you to include it.

and consider that comment to me sigged...it's a good 'un

*Morgrim charges I.G. bunker, shouldering the heavy metal door from its hinges. Door gets stuck on bulky metal arm. Morgrim has idea.*

Hey, if you give me another fething idea, Arakasi, I'll get people on you. My desk is full enough

The good news (for Da Dark Angelz anyway) is I'm headed back to Coventry this week - so we can expect some updates! As mentioned previously, I'm attending Platinum Devil 3 on the 7th and 8th of May - and with its current escalation rules going up to 1500pts - I need some more of Da Dark Angelz completed! As always, I will be planning my forces around what is most easily achievable for that date - so without further ado - da plan!

Skarag's Scoutin' Party
[HQ] Skarag Mekslag (Da Big Mek): Burna, Kustom Force Field, Mek's Tools (105pts)
[TR] Skarag's Taktikal Boyz - 11 Shoota Boyz including Rokkit Launcha and Nob: Power Klaw, Slugga, Bosspole in a Trukk: Big Shoota, Boarding Plank, Red Paint Job, Reinforced Ram (166pts)
[TR] Morgrim's Taktikal Boyz - 10 Shoota Boyz including Big Shoota and Nob: Power Klaw, Slugga, Bosspole in a Trukk: Big Shoota, Boarding Plank, Red Paint Job, Reinforced Ram (155pts)
[FA] Rav'nwing I - Deffkopta with Twin Linked Rocket Launchas and Buzzsaw (70pts)
TOTAL: 496pts

Morgrim Takes Charge!
[HQ] Morgrim "Da Lion" Grimork (Da Warboss): Mega Armour (Power Klaw, Twin Linked Shoota, Stikkbombs), Cybork Body (110pts)
[TR] Da Inna Circul - 6 Nobz including Grimskab Badwort (Da Painboy): 'Urty Syringe, Dok's Tools, Cybork Body, 2 Power Klaws, Big Choppa, 2 Choppas, 4 Sluggas, Twin Linked Shoota, 5 'Eavy Armour, Bosspole, Cybork Bodies in a Trukk: Big Shoota, Boarding Plank, Red Paint Job, Reinforced Ram (320pts)
[FA] Rav'nwing II - Deffkopta with Twin Linked Rocket Launchas and Buzzsaw (70pts)
TOTAL: 996pts

Hammerin' Time!
[EL] Da Deffwingz - 5 Meganobz in a Trukk: Big Shoota, Boarding Plank, Red Paint Job, Reinforced Ram (250pts)
TOTAL: 1246pts

Behind Enemy Linez...
[EL] Snikrot's Kommandoz - 13 Kommandoz, 2 Burnas, Boss Snikrot (245pts)
TOTAL: 1491pts

For those who are actually keeping up, the first 1000pts has all been modelled, undercoated and painting started (though not completed...) I need to finish modelling Morgrim, Da Deffwing and Artsoldier35's Trukk to get up to 1250pts - so no change to my plans there. The easiest I could see to get up to 1500pts was Snikrot and his Kommandos - especially as I will be able to use my currently completed Slugga and Choppa boyz for this, and I have two Burnas undercoated. Also, I'm hoping at 1500pts that I won't feel so crippled if they don't come in turn 2 or 3. I won't know until I get to Coventry exactly how many Kommandos I will still need to put together - I'm guessing 6 plus Snikrot - of which I have 3 or 4 of the metal Kommando models and Snikrot already - as well as the FW conversion parts. However, I have tools arriving in Edinburgh this week - so I will be transporting them up to Edinburgh at the end of the week so that I can assemble them up here

So - Morgrim an' da Deffwing the next three nights, Snikrot an' da Kommandoz the three after! No rest for da Big Meks!

Hmmmmm, so you're in Edinburgh at the end of the week? Fine chance for a game methinks!
Are you going to do any interesting conversion for Snikrot (in time if not necessarily now??

A pile of deliveries had stacked up at work while I was away working from home last week - which included my finally taking Gitsplitta's advice and getting a Jeweler's saw and bench pin - so work started on the "scenic base" concept - which seemed to be mostly dry fitting a landraider together to get a feel for it.... After all that, I *think* I have the basic layout I want - but no doubt Dakka can provide some fresh insight, even at this early stage (as always).

Pics or it didn't happen?

Front view:


Top down view:


The blank bases are for the entourage - 3 wound markers, boss pole, ammo runt and attack squig (mocked up with blu-tack). I'm looking to break the FW DA Landraider door and place it off angle across the doorway Morgrim is standing on, underneath his feet. His base will actually be at the bottom - so he will actually be this high when removed from the base - on his own small bit of Landraider that "plugs in" - or that's the plan!

I got the large oval base to house everything - but I'm not sure it's going to be big enough! I may need to make my own...

@HadoukenAvenger: I will not limit myself because of your lack of impulse control

@Imperial Monkey: PM me when you are available, points (up to 1250 I think.... 1000 if basecoated...) and I'll start negotiations wiv da Boss. When have I *not* done a conversion? I have some plans in my mind - but nothing as grandiose as da Big Mek or Morgrim...

Looks terrific Arakasi! Once you get used to that jeweler's saw, you'll wonder how you ever got along without it.

I haven't forgotten about the Bad Moon insignia I owe you, not that I'm free from my Adepticon burden, working on my orks is back on the docket. I'll get those done and ship them and your ork nob out in fairly short order.

Gits

Looks very fun

I've almost changed my mind now that I see Morgrim on the base. The shield doesn't seem to over power the mini as much. This is looking too sweet! Wonder if you'll get any complaints about size?