I hate to say it, but I'll be very surprised to see a buggy kit. Especially a Meganobz/Buggy box. That seems a assortment. Seems very much like wish listing.
Red Corsair wrote: IDK I think people are being unfair with this guy. He is AV13 with 5HP, that is the equivalent to T9 in AV. If you give those grot rigger and a KFF that thing is not going to be dying and in 7th it scores. You can also hide a grot squad in its belly until last turn and grab another objective.
Due to the change to objective placement in 7th I think most games will favor the mid field more and this guy will be tough to move.
What is strangest to me though are the rules interactions. will its contents be stuck inside when it is in assault? How do stompas work in that regard?
That's one of the things I was discussing with my buddy yesterday. They're going to have to come up with a whole new set of rules for how a Walker acts as a transport. Some stuff is probably fairly obvious, such as not allowing troops to disembark if it runs. But other things such as what happens when it's in Assault are more up in the air. I don't know how that works with the Stompa right now.
I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
New Ork Clan: Kemikal Bromance. Led by Warboss Eeyore, Da Kemikal Bromance (or 'Dem Emo Boyz', as Warboss Eeyore is fond of saying) are a clan unlike any other. They use their mouth more than their Choppas, and have brought whole Star Systems to their knees through the power of Negative Warp Energy.
The clan is known for also wearing Black, but stick out from Goffs because of their tight fitting pants. Most of their scarring is also located running across their forearms.
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
I think its a lot of a general "my favourite army will get all the bad descisions for the next 10 years to come"-dread involved. But then again, lets look at the last dexes:
- IG lost characters and got a dumb APC they didn't need at all
- Nids lost characters and judging by the all-around tone, turned out pretty weak
- CSM divided between auto-include units and stuff you'd only take for sentimental reasons, as well as some stupid rules (duels, spawnhood)
- SoB lost I think some units and got.... nothing at all? correct me if I'm wrong.
So there's some precedence to base your scepticism on.
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
Tell that to tyranids.
AM got taurox we got gork n mork,
Am got ogryns we got manz AM got wyvern we get ?
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
Tell that to tyranids.
AM got taurox we got gork n mork,
Am got ogryns we got manz AM got wyvern we get ?
omg... we will get lootas with High explosive shells... D3 blast templates s7ap 3
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
I think the Doom and Gloom is coming from the fact that 6th Edition really hit Orks over the head hard. We got an awesome flier model, but crappy rules, and overcosted points for it.
I don't think Ork players are convinced that GW is going to address the serious shortcomings that Orks have in 7th Edition now, which is still an edition dedicated to shooting like 6th was. I think we're all afraid GW is just going to give us more of what we already have... big shootas, rokkits, etc... no weapons above S8 or below AP3 that have the volume of fire necessary to actually kill something when you're firing it at BS2.
And then on top of not giving us anything, they'll keep the prices on all our weapons high, as if they were being fired by models that have BS4 instead of BS2. A Kustom Mega Blasta, S8 AP2 shot with Gets Hot! might be a worthwhile upgrade at 15 points for a Space Marine who is firing it at BS4, and has a 3+ save to protect it from the Get's Hot! result. Orks have no such thing. Such a weapon isn't worth 15 points to us, but that's what GW will likely still cost them at.
It's that sort of philosophy that I'm just dreading will get applied to the entire Ork codex.
We need something to help us in Assault to get over the fact that 7th Edition still screws us with wound allocation. We're not even safe inside our Battlewagons any longer, although at least now a Lascannon won't have a 50% chance of blowing them up outright.
We need better shooting besides just "More Lootas". Lootas are really all we have anymore.
My Orks have been on the shelf for a year. I'm really sad about that. I really want to play with them. l'm excited for the new release, but I'm just not optimistic.
If the Gorkanaut / Morkanaut was in the 180-200 point range, I'd feel much better about where we were headed. But you're talking about almost 300 points for a Morkanaut with a KFF upgrade. It might be a fun unit to use, but I just think it's costed really high.
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
Tell that to tyranids.
AM got taurox we got gork n mork,
Am got ogryns we got manz AM got wyvern we get ?
omg... we will get lootas with High explosive shells... D3 blast templates s7ap 3
I.m hoping for quad gun on a half track. But not holding my breath.
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
Tell that to tyranids.
AM got taurox we got gork n mork,
Am got ogryns we got manz AM got wyvern we get ?
omg... we will get lootas with High explosive shells... D3 blast templates s7ap 3
I.m hoping for quad gun on a half track. But not holding my breath.
looks orky enough. the barrels even have the right length and size for GW's taste
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
Tell that to tyranids.
AM got taurox we got gork n mork,
Am got ogryns we got manz AM got wyvern we get ?
omg... we will get lootas with High explosive shells... D3 blast templates s7ap 3
I.m hoping for quad gun on a half track. But not holding my breath.
We have that allready. Forgeworld Dreadmob, flakka-trukk or whatever it's called. Orky AA trukk that can go flat out and still fire with full BS at fliers. It's on my scratchbuild-list, as soon as I get other stuff done.
Squidbot wrote: I hate to say it, but I'll be very surprised to see a buggy kit. Especially a Meganobz/Buggy box. That seems a assortment. Seems very much like wish listing.
Sadly, I don't think there'll be a Buggy kit either. I just hope their rules are good enough to kitbash a few more of them, though.
Is there a buggy cult that I am missing out on? I play orks and I have never fielded them due to the weaknesses of getting glanced to death. Should I be putting them on the table?
zammerak wrote: Is there a buggy cult that I am missing out on? I play orks and I have never fielded them due to the weaknesses of getting glanced to death. Should I be putting them on the table?
Honestly, I don't field them for their durability. I field them for the twin linked rokkits, the target saturation, LOS blocking, mobile cover, and mobility. They are under powered, but not over costed, and are a pain in the ass to my opponent who either needs to spend precious shooting to take em out, OR ignore them while they needle vehicles to death.
Buggies and their variants are great, I've had lots of fun with them and there are a lot of sneaky tactics to be employed.
As to where this will be true come the release of the new book we can only speculate.
However on the basis of that rubbish robot I am concerned about GW's model design team and its relationship to the games development team. both seem to be waaay off what people want.
shame.
again.
that said - I still hold some hope as i know the main man of 40k has a big soft spot for orks.
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
Tell that to tyranids.
AM got taurox we got gork n mork,
Am got ogryns we got manz AM got wyvern we get ?
omg... we will get lootas with High explosive shells... D3 blast templates s7ap 3
I.m hoping for quad gun on a half track. But not holding my breath.
We have that allready. Forgeworld Dreadmob, flakka-trukk or whatever it's called. Orky AA trukk that can go flat out and still fire with full BS at fliers. It's on my scratchbuild-list, as soon as I get other stuff done.
I meant something more like this With a bit of this mixed in Enclosed cab half track with quad gun
zammerak wrote: Is there a buggy cult that I am missing out on? I play orks and I have never fielded them due to the weaknesses of getting glanced to death. Should I be putting them on the table?
Hehe... I've had my buggies since 2nd when they packed a Multimelta, making them the orks' anti-tank weapon of choice. Up until 6th they were good enough at shielding trukks and wagons and taking rear/side shots at heavier vehicles, even though koptas had already begun to steal some of their thunder.
Now, 6th was the final nail in the buggies' coffin. Not only they competed with Dakkajets and the now great Koptas, but also hull points and widespread jink made them all but useless at their intended role.
I really hope 7th makes our beloved go-karts of DEATH (as Jidmah once put it ) viable again.
5 hull points.. nobody is talking about how good that is on a shooty dread with the capacity to carry meks for repairs, carry an invul save for backfield support and have it will not die. Its not open topped because they didnt want high strap - garbage accidentally detonating it.
All I hear is QQQQ I cant move two feet, disembark thirty MANz and assault with D weap CC attacks. We already have two assault transports yet 90% of this thread wanted another?
We didn't need a propietary battlewagon that would have been boring and probably not sell well.. Hard to say what morkynuts is good for until we have all the rules but its tough with capacity to be tougher and omg an invul save for an army that has been putting lots of lootas and kannon in the backfield in only some cover.
I can only inagine those Trukks Loki posted ported over to mainstream GW as a dual AA Truck - Katyusha rocket platform kit. Not that it's going to happen, but it would be swell...
None of us are complaining about the hull points, or the durability. Its the cost. Its so insanely expensive, its not worth it at all. Again, look at a soulgrinder for reference, which is a more effective shooting platform AND a more effective assault platform. Its only short one hull point, has the same invuln, but costs about half as much.
Thats the problem. The dumb thing may be worthwhile if it was a super heavy or cost only 175ish points, but at 250-300 its worthless.
Rismonite wrote: 5 hull points.. nobody is talking about how good that is on a shooty dread with the capacity to carry meks for repairs, carry an invul save for backfield support and have it will not die. Its not open topped because they didnt want high strap - garbage accidentally detonating it.
All I hear is QQQQ I cant move two feet, disembark thirty MANz and assault with D weap CC attacks. We already have two assault transports yet 90% of this thread wanted another?
We didn't need a propietary battlewagon that would have been boring and probably not sell well.. Hard to say what morkynuts is good for until we have all the rules but its tough with capacity to be tougher and omg an invul save for an army that has been putting lots of lootas and kannon in the backfield in only some cover.
I'm glad someone else put it together.
The 6 crew are for Meks to keep it repaired. 3x4+ repairs everyturn will make it virtually unkillable. Park it on the center contol point and just sit there. There is a good chance it will survive or eat a whole lot of shots.
I'm not sure how Killy it is, but it looks Dead Ard.
ORKS IS DA MEANEST AND GREENEST! KNIGHTS AND WHAT NOT ARE FOR KRUMPIN! NOT WANTIN!
Rismonite wrote: 5 hull points.. nobody is talking about how good that is on a shooty dread with the capacity to carry meks for repairs, carry an invul save for backfield support and have it will not die. Its not open topped because they didnt want high strap - garbage accidentally detonating it.
All I hear is QQQQ I cant move two feet, disembark thirty MANz and assault with D weap CC attacks. We already have two assault transports yet 90% of this thread wanted another?
We didn't need a propietary battlewagon that would have been boring and probably not sell well.. Hard to say what morkynuts is good for until we have all the rules but its tough with capacity to be tougher and omg an invul save for an army that has been putting lots of lootas and kannon in the backfield in only some cover.
Nope this thread wanted buggies and tracks to replace the ageing model line. I'm good with the Battlewagon as an assault transport.
What we didn't really want is a walker that doesn't add much tactically that couldn't be found else where but cheaper in points. It is good that it is really hard but thats all it is good at.
My question, if Zogwart is out what the hell do I do in the Psychic Phase? The Wyrdboyz don't have the power to counter anything by Smurfs, Eldar, or even IG. I just sit & take a beating for the Phase?!? MY pshychic phase is when I put 200+ models on the table & the guy on the other side has a "How do I kill all THAT!?!" look on his face. He's so worried about 120 Boyz, that the rest get a pass & kick his ass. Nobz, Kannonz, Stormboyz, and Kommandoz don't get as much attention. I'm not a fan of the Pshchic Phase. I hope Zogwart gets a boost!!
Rismonite wrote: 5 hull points.. nobody is talking about how good that is on a shooty dread with the capacity to carry meks for repairs, carry an invul save for backfield support and have it will not die. Its not open topped because they didnt want high strap - garbage accidentally detonating it.
All I hear is QQQQ I cant move two feet, disembark thirty MANz and assault with D weap CC attacks. We already have two assault transports yet 90% of this thread wanted another?
We didn't need a propietary battlewagon that would have been boring and probably not sell well.. Hard to say what morkynuts is good for until we have all the rules but its tough with capacity to be tougher and omg an invul save for an army that has been putting lots of lootas and kannon in the backfield in only some cover.
Yeah because exactly what Orks needed was more strength 6 shooting.
Gw is good at giving people what they want to make, not what people want to buy.
That's why sob have no new models.
Thousand sons have no data slate.
Chaos legions have no codex's.
7th ed rules are what they wanted to sell. 6th fixing was what people wanted.
It's sad when maxi mini and kromlech, have more idea what people want, than GW.
Goresaw wrote: None of us are complaining about the hull points, or the durability. Its the cost. Its so insanely expensive, its not worth it at all. Again, look at a soulgrinder for reference, which is a more effective shooting platform AND a more effective assault platform. Its only short one hull point, has the same invuln, but costs about half as much.
Thats the problem. The dumb thing may be worthwhile if it was a super heavy or cost only 175ish points, but at 250-300 its worthless.
Good thing it isn't in the daemon codex then, right?
@Rismonite: Exalted. We finally got a walker that can easily cross the battlefield without dying half way through, and one of the variants even has 36" S8 AP2 shooting plus 3 further S8 shots when it gets closer, something that doesn't exists in the current codex at all. Oh, and it can take an invulnerable save KFF as well. All you winy gits do is bitch and moan about it - and most of you are people who haven't been posting in any ork threads for the last year. So please take the negative attitude back to the tyranid and SoB threads, thank you very much. 'dis be ork turf.
Goresaw wrote: None of us are complaining about the hull points, or the durability. Its the cost. Its so insanely expensive, its not worth it at all. Again, look at a soulgrinder for reference, which is a more effective shooting platform AND a more effective assault platform. Its only short one hull point, has the same invuln, but costs about half as much.
Thats the problem. The dumb thing may be worthwhile if it was a super heavy or cost only 175ish points, but at 250-300 its worthless.
Good thing it isn't in the daemon codex then, right?
@Rismonite: Exalted. We finally got a walker that can easily cross the battlefield without dying half way through, and one of the variants even has 36" S8 AP2 shooting plus 3 further S8 shots when it gets closer, something that doesn't exists in the current codex at all. Oh, and it can take an invulnerable save KFF as well. All you winy gits do is bitch and moan about it - and most of you are people who haven't been posting in any ork threads for the last year. So please take the negative attitude back to the tyranid and SoB threads, thank you very much. 'dis be ork turf.
I love that I can always rely on Jid to put the smack down. =D
Goresaw wrote: None of us are complaining about the hull points, or the durability. Its the cost. Its so insanely expensive, its not worth it at all. Again, look at a soulgrinder for reference, which is a more effective shooting platform AND a more effective assault platform. Its only short one hull point, has the same invuln, but costs about half as much.
Thats the problem. The dumb thing may be worthwhile if it was a super heavy or cost only 175ish points, but at 250-300 its worthless.
Good thing it isn't in the daemon codex then, right?
@Rismonite: Exalted. We finally got a walker that can easily cross the battlefield without dying half way through, and one of the variants even has 36" S8 AP2 shooting plus 3 further S8 shots when it gets closer, something that doesn't exists in the current codex at all. Oh, and it can take an invulnerable save KFF as well. All you winy gits do is bitch and moan about it - and most of you are people who haven't been posting in any ork threads for the last year. So please take the negative attitude back to the tyranid and SoB threads, thank you very much. 'dis be ork turf.
This Boss speaks da Troof!
I for one, will see how the kit looks in person, see how it feilds in the battlefield and how it interacts with my army - before- I make any judgements.
matphat wrote: I know a lot of people are in a doom and gloom mood today, but really, if we look back on the last three or four new codex releases, haven't they all been pretty good over all? Am I missing something there? Do we have recent historic codex examples of why the sky is falling?
I think the Doom and Gloom is coming from the fact that 6th Edition really hit Orks over the head hard. We got an awesome flier model, but crappy rules, and overcosted points for it.
I don't think Ork players are convinced that GW is going to address the serious shortcomings that Orks have in 7th Edition now, which is still an edition dedicated to shooting like 6th was. I think we're all afraid GW is just going to give us more of what we already have... big shootas, rokkits, etc... no weapons above S8 or below AP3 that have the volume of fire necessary to actually kill something when you're firing it at BS2.
And then on top of not giving us anything, they'll keep the prices on all our weapons high, as if they were being fired by models that have BS4 instead of BS2. A Kustom Mega Blasta, S8 AP2 shot with Gets Hot! might be a worthwhile upgrade at 15 points for a Space Marine who is firing it at BS4, and has a 3+ save to protect it from the Get's Hot! result. Orks have no such thing. Such a weapon isn't worth 15 points to us, but that's what GW will likely still cost them at.
It's that sort of philosophy that I'm just dreading will get applied to the entire Ork codex.
We need something to help us in Assault to get over the fact that 7th Edition still screws us with wound allocation. We're not even safe inside our Battlewagons any longer, although at least now a Lascannon won't have a 50% chance of blowing them up outright.
We need better shooting besides just "More Lootas". Lootas are really all we have anymore.
Goresaw wrote: None of us are complaining about the hull points, or the durability. Its the cost. Its so insanely expensive, its not worth it at all. Again, look at a soulgrinder for reference, which is a more effective shooting platform AND a more effective assault platform. Its only short one hull point, has the same invuln, but costs about half as much.
Thats the problem. The dumb thing may be worthwhile if it was a super heavy or cost only 175ish points, but at 250-300 its worthless.
Good thing it isn't in the daemon codex then, right?
@Rismonite: Exalted. We finally got a walker that can easily cross the battlefield without dying half way through, and one of the variants even has 36" S8 AP2 shooting plus 3 further S8 shots when it gets closer, something that doesn't exists in the current codex at all. Oh, and it can take an invulnerable save KFF as well. All you winy gits do is bitch and moan about it - and most of you are people who haven't been posting in any ork threads for the last year. So please take the negative attitude back to the tyranid and SoB threads, thank you very much. 'dis be ork turf.
This must be the first time I've ever seen something that Jidmah has written that I don't agree with. I guess I have to be wrong.
I for one, will see how the kit looks in person, see how it feilds in the battlefield and how it interacts with my army - before- I make any judgements.
But initial impressions - I'm excited
Believe me, I'm definitely going to be waiting until I see battle reports before I put $105 on the table.
The 6 crew are for Meks to keep it repaired. 3x4+ repairs everyturn will make it virtually unkillable. Park it on the center contol point and just sit there. There is a good chance it will survive or eat a whole lot of shots.
Yeah it will just sit there, 300 pts of your army pretending it's a Bastion and doing jack all to contribute to the fight except blocking LOS. It's not going to eat any shots at all because it's not a threat to anything.
The 6 crew are for Meks to keep it repaired. 3x4+ repairs everyturn will make it virtually unkillable. Park it on the center contol point and just sit there. There is a good chance it will survive or eat a whole lot of shots.
Yeah it will just sit there, 300 pts of your army pretending it's a Bastion and doing jack all to contribute to the fight except blocking LOS. It's not going to eat any shots at all because it's not a threat to anything.
Wouldn't a bastion with lascannon. be better ?
icarus lascannon range 96 s9 ap2
NamelessBard wrote: This must be the first time I've ever seen something that Jidmah has written that I don't agree with. I guess I have to be wrong.
Hah, I'm far from unfailable. I'm just highly annoyed by all the people whining about an army they don't understand. Even if the Morkanaut would be completely overprice in other codices, it might still be a great asset in our codex, because we pay close to nothing for the backbone of our army. Even if all point costs stay the same, you can easily fit two of them in a green tide as heavy support choice, each one bringing along pretty decent shooting as well as highly deadly close combat ability. Keep in mind that the klaw is AP 1, so they have a better shot at cracking big vehicles than our warboss has. You basically get a warboss, a KFF mek and a kannon battery rolled into one model. Try doing the math of what's the point costs of those added together.
Guess who'd field lootaz in the daemon codex? No one.
NamelessBard wrote: This must be the first time I've ever seen something that Jidmah has written that I don't agree with. I guess I have to be wrong.
Hah, I'm far from unfailable. I'm just highly annoyed by all the people whining about an army they don't understand. Even if the Morkanaut would be completely overprice in other codices, it might still be a great asset in our codex, because we pay close to nothing for the backbone of our army. Even if all point costs stay the same, you can easily fit two of them in a green tide as heavy support choice, each one bringing along pretty decent shooting as well as highly deadly close combat ability. Keep in mind that the klaw is AP 1, so they have a better shot at cracking big vehicles than our warboss has. You basically get a warboss, a KFF mek and a kannon battery rolled into one model. Try doing the math of what's the point costs of those added together.
Guess who'd field lootaz in the daemon codex? No one.
That's exactly how I'd field the Morkanaught, with a green tide or lots of vehicles. That 5++ with a massive base, totally taking advantage of that!
Dread mob. If the kans dual wielding theory is true I'll have a wall of klanks, Deff Dreads behind the Morkanaut so it can soak up the fire (Mek inside, Grot riggers on it). Kans flanking within the range of the KFF. Sit that on an objective mid field, Dreads pop out from behind to chew up anything that gets too close.
Do we have a solid date the new Codex is going to drop? My locask Game shop JUST started carrying GW (last week), so I'd like to give him a date, if we have one.
None of us are complaining about the hull points, or the durability. Its the cost. Its so insanely expensive, its not worth it at all. Again, look at a soulgrinder for reference, which is a more effective shooting platform AND a more effective assault platform. Its only short one hull point, has the same invuln, but costs about half as much.
Thats the problem. The dumb thing may be worthwhile if it was a super heavy or cost only 175ish points, but at 250-300 its worthless.
Good thing it isn't in the daemon codex then, right?
@Rismonite: Exalted. We finally got a walker that can easily cross the battlefield without dying half way through, and one of the variants even has 36" S8 AP2 shooting plus 3 further S8 shots when it gets closer, something that doesn't exists in the current codex at all. Oh, and it can take an invulnerable save KFF as well. All you winy gits do is bitch and moan about it - and most of you are people who haven't been posting in any ork threads for the last year. So please take the negative attitude back to the tyranid and SoB threads, thank you very much. 'dis be ork turf
.
yup, far too much doom n gloom over what is actually a very VERY strong unit for orks...
mmmm almost indestructable av 13 walker that can reliably cross the feild, AND transport units, AND give out the 5++ save to my battle wagons, all wihtout wasting a HQ slot on a meq?
oh god, yes please... 300 pts isnt unfair for it kitted out like that.
my only comlaint is slightly on the model aesthetics, but the more angles I see it at the more it grows on me, I think the paint job is actually holding it back in the leaked pics.
Goresaw wrote: None of us are complaining about the hull points, or the durability. Its the cost. Its so insanely expensive, its not worth it at all. Again, look at a soulgrinder for reference, which is a more effective shooting platform AND a more effective assault platform. Its only short one hull point, has the same invuln, but costs about half as much.
Thats the problem. The dumb thing may be worthwhile if it was a super heavy or cost only 175ish points, but at 250-300 its worthless.
Good thing it isn't in the daemon codex then, right?
@Rismonite: Exalted. We finally got a walker that can easily cross the battlefield without dying half way through, and one of the variants even has 36" S8 AP2 shooting plus 3 further S8 shots when it gets closer, something that doesn't exists in the current codex at all. Oh, and it can take an invulnerable save KFF as well. All you winy gits do is bitch and moan about it - and most of you are people who haven't been posting in any ork threads for the last year. So please take the negative attitude back to the tyranid and SoB threads, thank you very much. 'dis be ork turf.
Exalted, people seem to be forgetting to have fun, and this looks Hella Orky and Hella fun!
Do people like and play grotsnik and zogwort because they are efficient or good? No, because they are fun!
NamelessBard wrote: This must be the first time I've ever seen something that Jidmah has written that I don't agree with. I guess I have to be wrong.
Hah, I'm far from unfailable. I'm just highly annoyed by all the people whining about an army they don't understand. Even if the Morkanaut would be completely overprice in other codices, it might still be a great asset in our codex, because we pay close to nothing for the backbone of our army. Even if all point costs stay the same, you can easily fit two of them in a green tide as heavy support choice, each one bringing along pretty decent shooting as well as highly deadly close combat ability. Keep in mind that the klaw is AP 1, so they have a better shot at cracking big vehicles than our warboss has. You basically get a warboss, a KFF mek and a kannon battery rolled into one model. Try doing the math of what's the point costs of those added together.
Guess who'd field lootaz in the daemon codex? No one.
Those are fair points, thanks.
I'm leaving for 3 week on June 6th, so I won't be around to get one until after the codex drops anyway, so I'll be able to fully assess before picking one up (although to be honest, I like the model, so I'll probably get one eventually anyway).
Jidmah wrote: You basically get a warboss, a KFF mek and a kannon battery rolled into one model. Try doing the math of what's the point costs of those added together.
About fifty points less than the morkanaut with a KFF (assuming a mega-armour boss to keep it mobile)? For a unit that packs similar firepower, has 24 wounds (half of them expendable) at T 7 against shooting, can play wound-allocation games with it's multiple characters and disposable extras and can take a SAG big mek for extra firepower. I'm failing to see how the waddling skip looks good in comparison?
Jidmah wrote: Guess who'd field lootaz in the daemon codex? No one.
The only reason that is the case is because no other army has battlewagons and lootas are only really good in combination with battlewagons. The g/morkanaut doesn't seem to have any synergy with any other unit in the codex and in fact seems to be a worse alternative to existing options which do combine well, like the big guns and characters or the lootas and battlewagon.
It's possible that there might be something we haven't seen yet which makes it a lot better than it looks. There could be some new piece of wargear which can provide buffs from inside a vehicle. KFFs could stack their effects somehow. Weirdboys or other things could give them powerful buffs to speed or shooting. Maybe the kit has amazing conversion potential. But based on what we've seen so far, it looks bad.
I don't think it looks that good.
For those points you could field 2 bastions with icarus lascannons, and void generators.
Range 96
str 9
ap 2
Thats one end of the board to the other.
I wouldn't necessarily say it has bad synergy. It is expensive in points but it will be a bullet magnet which should keep the heat off the boys if nothing else.
but apart from expensive point and cash wise, what do you guys like most? the gorka or morkanaut?
is i see it, the gorkanaut is about lots of dakka, while the morkanaut is about survivability and a pieplate
loki old fart wrote: I don't think it looks that good.
For those points you could field 2 bastions with icarus lascannons, and void generators.
Range 96
str 9
ap 2
Thats one end of the board to the other.
I might opt to scratch build one of those teen pregnant stompas to go with my dread mob list, ill wait to see some battle reports first before doing it though. It may be a good gun platform once it's in the center of the board.
If nothing else it's fluffy as hell.
Effigy of Mork, or possibly Gork, stomping across the battlefield with a mob of boys swarming out around it.
Dat's propa orky.
Perfect Organism wrote: The g/morkanaut doesn't seem to have any synergy with any other unit in the codex and in fact seems to be a worse alternative to existing options which do combine well, like the big guns and characters or the lootas and battlewagon.
Wow, you have a copy of then new codex? You should share if you do!
Seriously, we don't have the full rules, we don't know what else is in the codex. All I can say is that it's a nice model.
I'm really looking forward to the new codex as this think looks dead orky, and gives me high hopes for the rest of the codex.
...or maybe guys from GW prepared "looted wagon" table with the type of the vehicle (x axis: land raider, predator, etc...) and options for these vehicles (y axis: assault, transport size, weapons, etc...) with mandatory BS2 and Don't Press Dat...
Or I could invite you to taste my wine... It is lovely...
Perfect Organism wrote: The g/morkanaut doesn't seem to have any synergy with any other unit in the codex and in fact seems to be a worse alternative to existing options which do combine well, like the big guns and characters or the lootas and battlewagon.
Wow, you have a copy of then new codex? You should share if you do!
Seriously, we don't have the full rules, we don't know what else is in the codex.
Why did you cut out the bit of my post where I said exactly that?
Every time we get a preview of something, people insist on telling us that we haven't seen the whole picture and it's too early to judge. Most of the time, it turns out that the initial judgement was pretty accurate and there was nothing unexpected waiting to be discovered. When was the last time that an apparently weak unit actually turned out to be really strong thanks to unrevealed rules? I'm not even saying that it will be bad. All I said was that the information we have so far doesn't look promising.
What actually realistic unrevealed rules could possibly make this thing good anyway? A Pask-equivalent vehicle commander might do it, I guess. Or anything which let's you deep-strike or outflank with it.
As for being a good model, I'm going to have to disagree on that. I think it's the worst ork kit they have released for a decade. It's not as bad as some of the appalling rubbish that the Imperium ends up with, but it's clearly a big step down from the bomma, dreads and other recent kits. At a time when other companies are producing ork stuff which is really pushing the standard up, this thing doesn't compete for my money.
Just noticed that a couple more models are Temp. out of stock or No longer available on the US website:
Ork Boss Snikrot (Temp out of stock)
Big mek w/ Bosspole (No longer available)
These come in addition to the following, noted a few days ago:
Tankbustas (Temp out of stock)
Big Gun - Lobba (Temp out of stock)
Weirdboy (Temp out of stock)
Kaptin Badrukk (Temp out of stock)
Ork Kommando with Burna (Temp out of stock)
Grot Tekkies (Temp out of stock)
Big mek w/ Sh Att Gun (No longer available)
Nob with Klaw and Big Shoota (No longer available)
So, 2 out of 3 Big Mek models are no longer available.
nflagey wrote: Just noticed that a couple more models are Temp. out of stock or No longer available on the US website:
Ork Boss Snikrot (Temp out of stock)
Big mek w/ Bosspole (No longer available)
These come in addition to the following, noted a few days ago:
Tankbustas (Temp out of stock)
Big Gun - Lobba (Temp out of stock)
Weirdboy (Temp out of stock)
Kaptin Badrukk (Temp out of stock)
Ork Kommando with Burna (Temp out of stock)
Grot Tekkies (Temp out of stock)
Big mek w/ Sh Att Gun (No longer available)
Nob with Klaw and Big Shoota (No longer available)
So, 2 out of 3 Big Mek models are no longer available.
Glad I have Snikrot, & a Shokk attack Gunn...now I'll be PISSED if the characters are not int he new Codex. Boss Snikrot is the REASON I got Kommandoz, they Shred units. I hope he can (once again) assault when arriving from reserve, that was the biggest reason for spending the $ & pts on th unit. Maybe they're doing plastic models?!?
Every time we get a preview of something, people insist on telling us that we haven't seen the whole picture and it's too early to judge. Most of the time, it turns out that the initial judgement was pretty accurate and there was nothing unexpected waiting to be discovered. When was the last time that an apparently weak unit actually turned out to be really strong thanks to unrevealed rules? I'm not even saying that it will be bad. All I said was that the information we have so far doesn't look promising.
I reserve judgement in the same way Jidmah alluded to above. The unit SOUNDS very overcosted right now. But we'll see. If it's costed appropriately to combine with other units effectively to make a good Ork list, then it will be much more promising.
So far, the Morkanaut with the KFF and Grot Riggers is only about 70 points shy of being an Imperial Knight... a model that pretty much completely out-classes it. The Morkanaut has a lot more weapons to fire... but do all of its weapons add up to be anywhere close to effective as the Knight's S9 AP1 Melta Large Blast? Yes, it's very hard to do an Apples to Apples comparison here. But think about it this way. If you had both the Imperial Knight and the Morkanaut in your codex, would you take the Morkanaut, or would it be a poor choice when you could just spend 70 points more and get an Imperial Knight?
But like I said, I'm reserving judgement. I'm still a tad excited about the possibility of running a Gorkanaut with a KFF Mek w/ Mega Armour inside, accompanied by a couple of Deff Dreads, a Mega Dread, and a squad of Killa Kanz armed with two Rokkit launchers a piece. That would be DED STOMPY.
I love orks. Orks was my first army. But please, I hate facing opponents who play orks and pronounce Waaagh! as Wag. Listen, if youre going to pronounce every gh as a g, then im going to do like wise. This unit will figgott that unit. My character challenges your character to a figgot to the death. Oop, naggot figgoting rules are in effect...
I'm hopeful the WAAGH!! banner is still in there (a boost is probably a long-shot). I'm finally getting around to painting mine, I'd hate for it to be obsolete before I even use it.
nflagey wrote: Just noticed that a couple more models are Temp. out of stock or No longer available on the US website: SNIP
Just to compare:
Ork Boss Snikrot (Temp out of stock) Available in UK Big mek w/ Bosspole (No longer available) Available in UK
These come in addition to the following, noted a few days ago: Tankbustas (Temp out of stock) Available in UK Big Gun - Lobba (Temp out of stock) Available in UK (But new model coming) Weirdboy (Temp out of stock) Available in UK Kaptin Badrukk (Temp out of stock) Available in UK Ork Kommando with Burna (Temp out of stock) Available in UK Grot Tekkies (Temp out of stock) Available in UK
Big mek w/ Sh Att Gun (No longer available) No longer available in UK Nob with Klaw and Big Shoota (No longer available) No longer available in UK
Additional: Meganob with Kombi Shoota-Rokkit Launcha No longer available in UK Deffkopta No longer available in UK Flash Git with Targeting Squig No longer available in UK (Been gone a few weeks.
Basimpo wrote: I love orks. Orks was my first army. But please, I hate facing opponents who play orks and pronounce Waaagh! as Wag. Listen, if youre going to pronounce every gh as a g, then im going to do like wise. This unit will figgott that unit. My character challenges your character to a figgot to the death. Oop, naggot figgoting rules are in effect...
Getting a 5++ from KFF is such a huge game changer with Orks, I might not even mind much if the SAG is phased out this ed. I'm super psyched that change was made.
Multimoog wrote: Getting a 5++ from KFF is such a huge game changer with Orks, I might not even mind much if the SAG is phased out this ed. I'm super psyched that change was made.
Range is reduced to models within 6", not units. I'm still pleased though.
Nah, that's just bad translation. If it were 6" it wouldn't fully extend outside the base of the morkanaut. The English version is definitely going to make clear the "units within 6" distinction. Otherwise there'd be no point - you can't bunch a mob up to within 6" of a Mek and it was designed to give protection to whole mobs.
Multimoog wrote: Nah, that's just bad translation. If it were 6" it wouldn't fully extend outside the base of the morkanaut. The English version is definitely going to make clear the "units within 6" distinction. Otherwise there'd be no point - you can't bunch a mob up to within 6" of a Mek and it was designed to give protection to whole mobs.
It's an inv save now, and do you speak german to know that it was a bad translation? The main use will be to protect vehicles.
Also, it extends from the base of the model, not the centre point.
It's an inv save now, and do you speak german to know that it was a bad translation? The main use will be to protect vehicles.
Also, it extends from the base of the model, not the centre point.
It's a cover save in the current version of Codex: Orks, not an invul save. It would be pointless to improve the save to a ++ while removing its effectiveness by forcing players to bunch models around the base of the model it's equipped with. Its primary use is to provide cover to infantry. You don't need to be able to read German to be able to predict how it'll be presented in the final Codex rules.
Having it be within 6" per model goes against the way the Orks work as an army. I know most other players don't like the idea of an entire table of 5++ Orks (which is why everybody is steadfastly maintaining that's not how it'll work), but with every OTHER army having ample amounts of Ignores Cover weaponry, making the KFF provide 5++ will be the only way Ork builds are viable. As it is, you can't expect to play Orks against anything with access to template weapons and expect to have a fighting chance. 5++ is what will make boyz lists viable again, which means GW will sell a lot more of those models.
Squidbot wrote: Wonder if they'll give us some non HQ Weirdboys?
So long as we still have good troop choices, I don't think we need any special access to non-HQ characters. We effectively get one HQ per troops choice with 7th edition army composition. That should be enough.
It's an inv save now, and do you speak german to know that it was a bad translation? The main use will be to protect vehicles.
Also, it extends from the base of the model, not the centre point.
It's a cover save in the current version of Codex: Orks, not an invul save. It would be pointless to improve the save to a ++ while removing its effectiveness by forcing players to bunch models around the base of the model it's equipped with. Its primary use is to provide cover to infantry. You don't need to be able to read German to be able to predict how it'll be presented in the final Codex rules.
Having it be within 6" per model goes against the way the Orks work as an army. I know most other players don't like the idea of an entire table of 5++ Orks (which is why everybody is steadfastly maintaining that's not how it'll work), but with every OTHER army having ample amounts of Ignores Cover weaponry, making the KFF provide 5++ will be the only way Ork builds are viable. As it is, you can't expect to play Orks against anything with access to template weapons and expect to have a fighting chance. 5++ is what will make boyz lists viable again, which means GW will sell a lot more of those models.
This is why I'm so worried about the KFF. The new rules as they are shown in the WD are very close to gear the DA have, and their's only gives the invun to models within 6" not units, anddoes not work when embarked on a transport! It's very possible the morkanaut will be the only way to provide reasonable KFF coverage, with Big Meks not having a large enough base, and the KFF not working from inside a battlewagon.
GW could have decided that the Venomthropes shrouded buff was too powerful and are swinging the pendulum too far the other way to compensate.
ceorron wrote: I wouldn't necessarily say it has bad synergy. It is expensive in points but it will be a bullet magnet which should keep the heat off the boys if nothing else.
Why would anyone shoot at it?
I've seen people win games by simply ignoring models that are too tough to kill, models like the (old style) Monolith, Knight, Wraithknight... and all of those have a much higher damage output than the Gorkanaut. There's really no reason to shoot a Gorkanaut, it's not a threat to anything. Just stick a Land Speeder behind it on the last turn to contest the objective it's sitting on, done.
It's an inv save now, and do you speak german to know that it was a bad translation? The main use will be to protect vehicles.
Also, it extends from the base of the model, not the centre point.
It's a cover save in the current version of Codex: Orks, not an invul save. It would be pointless to improve the save to a ++ while removing its effectiveness by forcing players to bunch models around the base of the model it's equipped with. Its primary use is to provide cover to infantry. You don't need to be able to read German to be able to predict how it'll be presented in the final Codex rules.
Having it be within 6" per model goes against the way the Orks work as an army. I know most other players don't like the idea of an entire table of 5++ Orks (which is why everybody is steadfastly maintaining that's not how it'll work), but with every OTHER army having ample amounts of Ignores Cover weaponry, making the KFF provide 5++ will be the only way Ork builds are viable. As it is, you can't expect to play Orks against anything with access to template weapons and expect to have a fighting chance. 5++ is what will make boyz lists viable again, which means GW will sell a lot more of those models.
This is why I'm so worried about the KFF. The new rules as they are shown in the WD are very close to gear the DA have, and their's only gives the invun to models within 6" not units, anddoes not work when embarked on a transport! It's very possible the morkanaut will be the only way to provide reasonable KFF coverage, with Big Meks not having a large enough base, and the KFF not working from inside a battlewagon.
ceorron wrote: I wouldn't necessarily say it has bad synergy. It is expensive in points but it will be a bullet magnet which should keep the heat off the boys if nothing else.
Why would anyone shoot at it?
I've seen people win games by simply ignoring models that are too tough to kill, models like the (old style) Monolith, Knight, Wraithknight... and all of those have a much higher damage output than the Gorkanaut. There's really no reason to shoot a Gorkanaut, it's not a threat to anything. Just stick a Land Speeder behind it on the last turn to contest the objective it's sitting on, done.
that's what my opponent said he'll do. His view was that if I'm going to spend 300 points on that Morkanaut, it will mean only 1200 points on the units which CAN threaten him, so he'll keep mobile, and use his increased range to shoot the rest.
It's not even like the Morkaunt is particularly scary in CC either. There are a ton of things that will deal with it: meltas, multimeltas, dreadnaughts, dreadnaughts with multimeltas. A wraithknight would hunt them down and rip them apart. Hell, a tac squad with a meltabomb sarg could tie it up for a long while and have a reasonable chance at dropping it (about a 50% of getting an explodes result before the squad is wiped). The Morkanaut will only drop ~2 MEQ a turn while the sarg goes to work.
For the cost of a single Morkanaut with the upgrades and 5 burnaboys\meks inside, you could take 9 killa kans or 4 deffdreads and still have points to spare, and both of those choices would mop the floor with the morkanaut.
Heres a thought, might be a little out there. But what if the KFF carries the invun into the assault. Big nerf for getting shot at, huge buff for the assault. When you are piled in that's a hell of a lot of boyz in a 12" circle.
I don't see this happening but a mek can dream right?
Due to the gorkamorkanaut's stats and point costs, it seems unlikely that the deffdread and killa kans are going to get any notable changes to improve their viability, as that would only make the new walker that much more overcosted.
koolaid64 wrote: Heres a thought, might be a little out there. But what if the KFF carries the invun into the assault. Big nerf for getting shot at, huge buff for the assault. When you are piled in that's a hell of a lot of boyz in a 12" circle.
I don't see this happening but a mek can dream right?
I was thinking about that too, but id rather they make it work with units like in the current codex. Not that its one or the other of course 5++ in assault would be pretty neat though!
Part of me thinks they give us excessive ap3 to 6 because we are initiatve 2 and should be swinging about an unwieldy weapon for all our armored problems... an identity.. orkz have it.. why do we need to be firing melta at bs2?
Da umies get I4 let them blowup a landy at range.. we have to trim numbers before CC so ww can get lopsided ld checks in our favor.
MechanicusOmnisWrex wrote: Buggies and their variants are great, I've had lots of fun with them and there are a lot of sneaky tactics to be employed.
As to where this will be true come the release of the new book we can only speculate.
However on the basis of that rubbish robot I am concerned about GW's model design team and its relationship to the games development team. both seem to be waaay off what people want.
shame.
again.
that said - I still hold some hope as i know the main man of 40k has a big soft spot for orks.
"TWICE WRONG, INQUISITOR!" -Kairos Fateweaver
Games Workshop knows exactly what the people want. That's the only way they can make money. They're just off what you and I want. You see, the Dreadknight showed them that it doesn't matter how bad it looks, a monster unit sells better than anything else. And every faction gets one. Counting Knights for Imperial forces, the Dark Eldar and debatably Necrons are the only factions left without one, and once they get theirs it'll be interesting to see what the next gimmick is. A big unit for every release is still working so they're not going to fix it. People give their arms and legs just so they only have to paint 1 model instead of many, and they will continue to do so. Just you watch.
MechanicusOmnisWrex wrote: Buggies and their variants are great, I've had lots of fun with them and there are a lot of sneaky tactics to be employed.
As to where this will be true come the release of the new book we can only speculate.
However on the basis of that rubbish robot I am concerned about GW's model design team and its relationship to the games development team. both seem to be waaay off what people want.
shame.
again.
that said - I still hold some hope as i know the main man of 40k has a big soft spot for orks.
"TWICE WRONG, INQUISITOR!" -Kairos Fateweaver
Games Workshop knows exactly what the people want. That's the only way they can make money. They're just off what you and I want. You see, the Dreadknight showed them that it doesn't matter how bad it looks, a monster unit sells better than anything else. And every faction gets one. Counting Knights for Imperial forces, the Dark Eldar and debatably Necrons are the only factions left without one, and once they get theirs it'll be interesting to see what the next gimmick is. A big unit for every release is still working so they're not going to fix it. People give their arms and legs just so they only have to paint 1 model instead of many, and they will continue to do so. Just you watch.
True true
Although, I don't think I'll be buying the Gorkanaut... Personally I think It's really ugly ('dem legs... ) . I'd rather buy a 'Stompa
its also built out of far too few pieces.. where's the cobble together with random gubbins look gone - its too clean and manufactured for my liking.
I don't trust it.
I'll stick wiv my Stompa's, mega dreads n uver proper klanka's thanks.
This! I knew it was something. It looks too smoothly built. Too many curved, fitted pieces. It looks like orks are manufacturing it in a factory as opposed to... whatever they usually do.
I'm trying to put 2 and 2 together ... in WD, Andy Clark mentions the tellyporta as the first example of what OddBoyz can do
as far as I am concerned, this is the first time I heard about tellyporta (started to play in 5th edition)
also, on the side of the same WD page, they mention GT's Waaagh and the fact that something more dreadful is coming
on the other hand, we have a problem with our Boyz, not being able to send them fast enough to assault the ennemy
and the 'Orkanauts are not really solving that issue
on top of that, according to the rumors, we should see a couple of new Big Meks with something like a KFF or like a weapon on the shoulder or on the back (see first page of this thread)
sooooo, doesn't that sound like we could have some Big Mek with tellyporta coming our way?
maybe not the kind of tellyporta that would send the 'Orkanaut accross the table (though we can always dream), but at least one that could send our Boyz mobs right into assault distance
from what the Ork experts have said, there was that Nazdreg but from what I saw, he never had anything in his stats/rules that was related to tellyporta
the only reference that I found was in the Apocalypse book, with a tellyporta building
what do you think?
pure fantasy or plausible reality?
nflagey wrote: I'm trying to put 2 and 2 together ... in WD, Andy Clark mentions the tellyporta as the first example of what OddBoyz can do
as far as I am concerned, this is the first time I heard about tellyporta (started to play in 5th edition)
also, on the side of the same WD page, they mention GT's Waaagh and the fact that something more dreadful is coming
Read your codex. Page 23, teleportation mentioned there. It was referenced in the old Storm of Vengeance campaign pack too. Can't remember where else it may have been mentioned.
There is definitely some form of Mega armoured Ork ccoming, with some kind of shoulder mounted... thing. Who know what that could be. As the person that leaked it said; it could be a SAG, which might explain the SAG Mek model no longer being available. If it is some form of tellyporta tek I imagine it will just allow for deep strikes, though some form of a slightly more controlled version of 'Ere we go would be great.
nflagey wrote: I'm trying to put 2 and 2 together ... in WD, Andy Clark mentions the tellyporta as the first example of what OddBoyz can do
as far as I am concerned, this is the first time I heard about tellyporta (started to play in 5th edition)
also, on the side of the same WD page, they mention GT's Waaagh and the fact that something more dreadful is coming
Read your codex. Page 23, teleportation mentioned there. It was referenced in the old Storm of Vengeance campaign pack too. Can't remember where else it may have been mentioned.
There is definitely some form of Mega armoured Ork ccoming, with some kind of shoulder mounted... thing. Who know what that could be. As the person that leaked it said; it could be a SAG, which might explain the SAG Mek model no longer being available. If it is some form of tellyporta tek I imagine it will just allow for deep strikes, though some form of a slightly more controlled version of 'Ere we go would be great.
nflagey wrote: I'm trying to put 2 and 2 together ... in WD, Andy Clark mentions the tellyporta as the first example of what OddBoyz can do
as far as I am concerned, this is the first time I heard about tellyporta (started to play in 5th edition)
also, on the side of the same WD page, they mention GT's Waaagh and the fact that something more dreadful is coming
on the other hand, we have a problem with our Boyz, not being able to send them fast enough to assault the ennemy
and the 'Orkanauts are not really solving that issue
The thing is (and I know people are going to strongly deny this, not without justifiable cause) Orks, despite -a lot- of evidence to the contrary, are not an Assault army.
They might have been designed that way, they might've acted that way in previous editions, and hell you might be able to win with an assault list now, but that doesn't make them an Assault army in this edition of the game.
They're an army with a large amount of moderate-strength inaccurate firepower, with a decent counter-assault ability.
What this means is anyone who tries to get all his Ork units into close combat as fast as possible is gonna have a bad time. There's just not enough within the codex to make that approach workable. I highly doubt this will change with the new book, since they'd have to institute wide-ranging and rulebook-countering special rules. Stuff like negating overwatch, increasing charge distances to reliable levels, allowing assault from reserves/deep strike and after getting out of -any- vehicle. There's no way they'd put even half of that in there.
6th and 7th edition are Shooting editions, that by necessity make -all- codexes released within their reign Shooting codexes by default.
Viewing the Morka/Gorkanaut from that perspective, it starts to make more sense. It's not supposed to let CC units walk up relatively unharmed and jump out to start the krumpin', it's designed to be the rock-hard centrepiece of a battleline with a small unit within helping it to keep standing. The clincher will be how the KFF rules work, if it grants a 5+ invuln to UNITS within 6", I'll buy one or two. If it's just models? Maybe one, and that's a big maybe.
I guess what I'm trying to say here, if indeed I'm saying anything at all and not rambling ad nauseum, is this: none of us, as painful as it may be, should try to view the new codex as one which will make Assault viable again. It won't, I guarantee you. So what we need to do is moderate our expectations and predictions around that tenet. If GW have any sense, they'll give us more shooting options, particularly in the realms of dealing with armour and high-toughness at range. I don't even need it to be that reliable on a per-model basis, just make it cheap enough to bring a whole bunch. Lootas aren't that reliable really, but you cram 15 of them into a unit and suddenly they become pretty darn useful.
But, regardless of the outcome, I -will- buy the overpriced limited edition Ork codex, because these green fungoid soccer hooligans have always had a special place in the shard of flint I call a heart. They got me through high school, they got me through bad breakups, and nothing will ever stop me playing them.
Dr. Delorean wrote: The thing is (and I know people are going to strongly deny this, not without justifiable cause) Orks, despite -a lot- of evidence to the contrary, are not an Assault army.
They might have been designed that way, they might've acted that way in previous editions, and hell you might be able to win with an assault list now, but that doesn't make them an Assault army in this edition of the game.
I'll go a bit further and say orks were never an 'assault' army. Like Eldar and Space Marines, they could handle close combat, but all the way back to Rogue Trader shooting was an important element of their tactics and background. Their slogan has been 'more dakka!' for a long time. Take a look at 'ere we go or freebooterz and you can see they had a lot more rules and text devoted to guns than close combat.
My biggest fear for orks has always been that one day GW will actually start listening to people on the internet and decide that orks should only be good in close combat.
you both have a point there. i will buy the codex for shure, and then deceide what units i buy more. i'm thinking about one of the following: stompa, g/morkanaut, commandos, weirdboy. Is the codex in store the 31st or just ready for preorder?
I'm hoping that with the guns on the Morkanaut, the new Flashgitz models, and maybe the theory about dual wielding Kans, we may be getting more viable dakka.
And I'd be very happy with that.
wallygator wrote: you both have a point there. i will buy the codex for shure, and then deceide what units i buy more. i'm thinking about one of the following: stompa, g/morkanaut, commandos, weirdboy. Is the codex in store the 31st or just ready for preorder?
All we know for sure is the Gorkanaut will be available for preorder on the 31st, available 7th June. I reckon the codex will be up for preorder on the 7th?
No matter what the ork dex brings ork players have been known to find a way to make the boyz dead killy. Im not worried about the dex, we ork players will find a way to crush other armies. Our current dex is from 4th eddition and yet we still win games
Dr. Delorean wrote: The thing is (and I know people are going to strongly deny this, not without justifiable cause) Orks, despite -a lot- of evidence to the contrary, are not an Assault army.
They might have been designed that way, they might've acted that way in previous editions, and hell you might be able to win with an assault list now, but that doesn't make them an Assault army in this edition of the game.
I'll go a bit further and say orks were never an 'assault' army. Like Eldar and Space Marines, they could handle close combat, but all the way back to Rogue Trader shooting was an important element of their tactics and background. Their slogan has been 'more dakka!' for a long time. Take a look at 'ere we go or freebooterz and you can see they had a lot more rules and text devoted to guns than close combat.
My biggest fear for orks has always been that one day GW will actually start listening to people on the internet and decide that orks should only be good in close combat.
Orks really, really conflict with themselves though.
Rules wise yes, they have way more devoted towards shooting than they do towards close combat. They've spent the majority of existence being a "shooty army that can pound the snot out of you if given the opportunity". That said.. fluff has an entirely different view point. Fluff paints the Orks as -nothing- but close combat oriented. Sure, they've got a few guns that they fire off as they close the gap, and they might even use some big shells / bombs to take down really tough stuff; but they live and breath melee. It's where they want to be most of all.
It creates quite the large disconnect, and even the current codex describes the Orks as an assault army, merely stating that they have the -option- to shoot.
Furthermore, with regards to shooting.. If Orks shoot, they'll have an extremely hard time cracking tanks open. At least a warboss who charges a tank is going to get 5-6 swings in at strength ten; enough to dent even a land raider. Nobz will get 4 attacks on the charge with a klaw. Enough to blow up most light vehicles (with the boys plinking away too) and cause serious harm to medium. They'll even dent a land raider.
Orks just really need some of their issues smoothed out. Rules wise they favor shooting, but they can't reliably krump armor outside of melee. Fluff wise they're also all about CC.
But, regardless of the outcome, I -will- buy the overpriced limited edition Ork codex, because these green fungoid soccer hooligans have always had a special place in the shard of flint I call a heart. They got me through high school, they got me through bad breakups, and nothing will ever stop me playing them.
Exactly my feelings towards Orks. I have Space Marine, Eldar codex. But nothing gets me pumped and happy like Orks. There's something manic, psychotic, and just fantastic about them that makes me always smile.
Dr. Delorean wrote: The thing is (and I know people are going to strongly deny this, not without justifiable cause) Orks, despite -a lot- of evidence to the contrary, are not an Assault army.
They might have been designed that way, they might've acted that way in previous editions, and hell you might be able to win with an assault list now, but that doesn't make them an Assault army in this edition of the game.
I'll go a bit further and say orks were never an 'assault' army. Like Eldar and Space Marines, they could handle close combat, but all the way back to Rogue Trader shooting was an important element of their tactics and background. Their slogan has been 'more dakka!' for a long time. Take a look at 'ere we go or freebooterz and you can see they had a lot more rules and text devoted to guns than close combat.
My biggest fear for orks has always been that one day GW will actually start listening to people on the internet and decide that orks should only be good in close combat.
I had to exalt these two posts, because I never really thought about Orks this way. I originally started them in 5th because I wanted a fast assault army, but I never got to play them before 6th edition hit. I have been trying to get all my units into assault as fast as possible in almost every game, and the only reason why it sort of worked, was the very fluffy and unoptimized metagame my Orks fought in.
I have to admit that I had actually been hoping for a codex that made Orks viable as a true assault army again, but I am beginning so see that they just never really were made that way. Yes, there are some assault oriented units, and Boyz can do some damage if they get to assault. But it it's not to be relied upon at all.
They do have extreme problems with taking out vehicles at range, since you are going to loose most of a mob of Boyz if you send them after another transport in a trukk. I have to rethink how I build my army, there are still a lot of units that I do not own.
The only thing that makes orks (a BS2, mostly low ST shooting, mostly poor AP shooting) army a Shooting Army is the dearth of good options for assault over the last few editions.
I'm not saying orks are "all assault" at all. But the ridiculously low threat level of ork shooting (vs Marine, Eldar, Dark eldar, necron, IG, or Tau shooting) makes it clear they aren't a shooting army (or they are designed to be about the worst shooting army of all of them).
They should be shooting to thin the herd and deal with some threats, but orks should have multiple close combat options to deal with the tough nuts to crack. Right now, those are few and far between. But that doesn't mean that orks weren't meant for krumpin, but that they've been poorly served by the rules.
I seem to have done okay with a fairly assault-centred army over 5th and 6th!! Can't say I'm looking forward to my Boyz getting roasted in their Trukks, but I guess it makes sense!!
As for the Morkanaut, I doubt I'll bother!! Doesn't suit how I like to play - I'm more up for the "drive The Trukks as fast as I can, and if one ramshackles off the board, laugh it off and just keep driving!!"
Just need the new codex to drop though, feeling Orky
Some interesting points about orks being shooty really really never thought of it that way. I started playing orks in 6th last year, I chose orks not because they were FOTM or because I heard about insta-win combos, but because I wanted to build a junk army of scrappy robots with maniac drivers and random reapons with odd effects. I spent a year modelling and converting and only played a few games in 6th ed.
in terms of ork shooting, I would love to field an army of spray and pray nutters who pepper the enemy till nothing stands. Favourite moment in 6th ed was ramming an AV 14 building with my BW, dropping the armour massively with good rolls and then having the orks inside snap fire there sluggas till i reduced the armour to 0. Was fethin' hilarious id like more of that please!
Hoping for; more odd and interesting rules, like mass weirdboys teleporting blobs of shooty orks all over the place, teleporting burna boys would be sooo much fun small suicide squads popping bang smack in the centre of IG lines. Viability of walker lists/the ability to include walkers.
In total, im not worried about orks being crap in the new dex, im just looking forward to skyfire being somewhere and the ability to make some truely odd and interesting lists with the new FOC styles in 7th ed.
I'm pretty confident that Big Gunz at least are going to be really good. They are apparently getting new models, so I find it hard to imagine they will be made much weaker and the artillery rules in 7th edition are crazy good. Wouldn't be shocked at all if kannon batteries were the 'new lootas'.
The only things which really stopped me fielding massed big guns already were the lack of good models and the shortage of heavy support slots.
lord_blackfang wrote: Kannons are already the best unit for their points in the codex, the problem is you're not going to spend a Heavy slot on a 60 pt unit.
Well, with all the 7th edition FOC shenanigans, you totally could. So Kannons will be gold even if left as is.
I always did, 3 kannons and 3 lobbas, can't say there was ever a game that they were not feared.
Ork Rumors - May 2014
via an anonymous source on Faeit 212
Ork units over a certain large size generate a warp charge. Each separate combat Orks are in generate a warp charge.
Multiple units in the same combat are treated as a single group in regards to hit the size threshold for generating warp charges, so that several small units can mob up to generate a charge where they would not be able to otherwise.
pretre wrote: Ork Rumors - May 2014
via an anonymous source on Faeit 212
Ork units over a certain large size generate a warp charge. Each separate combat Orks are in generate a warp charge.
Multiple units in the same combat are treated as a single group in regards to hit the size threshold for generating warp charges, so that several small units can mob up to generate a charge where they would not be able to otherwise.
Morkanaut (Because Mork is ded sneeky, unlike Gork) painted all black, with some red details, film ninja style, with 6 ninja komandoz inside. They can sneak across the board and attack everything! Ded sneeky ork style!
Rubs wrote: I'm hoping its not that complicated. I don't want to have to count how many boyz I have in each unit every physic phase.
It won't be. This is a Natfka rumor.
These same kind of rumors about Orks generating "Waaggh! Tokens" or "Warp Charge" from being in close combat have been floating around for I think over a year now.
I'm highly skeptical of GW adding some kind of Dark-Eldar-esque-Pain-Token-mechanic to Orks. I'm not positive, but I don't think any of those rumors came from a source verified as very reliable.
Morkanaut (Because Mork is ded sneeky, unlike Gork) painted all black, with some red details, film ninja style, with 6 ninja komandoz inside. They can sneak across the board and attack everything! Ded sneeky ork style!
Exactly what I've been thinking. All that big dakka and 5 HP with IWND? No one will shoot it, but it can shoot tgem! And with some meks inside to capture objectives, any Ork player can win!
Rubs wrote: I'm hoping its not that complicated. I don't want to have to count how many boyz I have in each unit every physic phase.
It won't be. This is a Natfka rumor.
These same kind of rumors about Orks generating "Waaggh! Tokens" or "Warp Charge" from being in close combat have been floating around for I think over a year now.
I'm highly skeptical of GW adding some kind of Dark-Eldar-esque-Pain-Token-mechanic to Orks. I'm not positive, but I don't think any of those rumors came from a source verified as very reliable.
It wouldn't surprise me since basically the same mechanic applies to units of deamons (and other brotherhood of psykers?).
But as said. It's Naftka so it would be rather unwise to give the rumour too much credence.
Rubs wrote: I'm hoping its not that complicated. I don't want to have to count how many boyz I have in each unit every physic phase.
It won't be. This is a Natfka rumor.
These same kind of rumors about Orks generating "Waaggh! Tokens" or "Warp Charge" from being in close combat have been floating around for I think over a year now.
I'm highly skeptical of GW adding some kind of Dark-Eldar-esque-Pain-Token-mechanic to Orks. I'm not positive, but I don't think any of those rumors came from a source verified as very reliable.
It wouldn't surprise me since basically the same mechanic applies to units of deamons (and other brotherhood of psykers?).
But as said. It's Naftka so it would be rather unwise to give the rumour too much credence.
I can only say that it echoes what I was told. So it might hold up better than most people think
pretre wrote: Ork Rumors - May 2014
via an anonymous source on Faeit 212
Ork units over a certain large size generate a warp charge. Each separate combat Orks are in generate a warp charge.
Multiple units in the same combat are treated as a single group in regards to hit the size threshold for generating warp charges, so that several small units can mob up to generate a charge where they would not be able to otherwise.
This is pretty snazzy. Depending on the powers we get, it could be nasty as well. I could see Daemon-summoning spam coming to the fore though, which is not really the direction I'd like Orksn (or anyone save Daemons for that matter) to go in competitively.
Morkanaut (Because Mork is ded sneeky, unlike Gork) painted all black, with some red details, film ninja style, with 6 ninja komandoz inside. They can sneak across the board and attack everything! Ded sneeky ork style!
Just make sure not to tell your opponent what unit you put inside it. He'll have to guess based on the points value. That should be fun.
My biggest fear for orks has always been that one day GW will actually start listening to people on the internet and decide that orks should only be good in close combat.
Is that really a concern?
If anyone has decided that orks should only be good in close combat, it's GW, considering that they have made absolutely sure that our only form of high strength (and therefore reliable anti-tank) is in close combat.
Also worth noting that our two dedicated transports are open-topped (e.g. assault vehicles), and two of our USRs (Waaagh and Furious Charge) pertain specifically to close combat.
I always did, 3 kannons and 3 lobbas, can't say there was ever a game that they were not feared.
When I started buying Orkz (when the last Codex dropped), I got 9 Kannonz. I hate the idea of spending the small pts for that unit, but I think they're dead killy. Maybe the new 'Dex will let you put more than 3 in a Heavy slot. I'll be thrilled!!
I always did, 3 kannons and 3 lobbas, can't say there was ever a game that they were not feared.
When I started buying Orkz (when the last Codex dropped), I got 9 Kannonz. I hate the idea of spending the small pts for that unit, but I think they're dead killy. Maybe the new 'Dex will let you put more than 3 in a Heavy slot. I'll be thrilled!!
I thought it would be cool if you could take them like Heavy Weapons Teams in IG.
lol... seems like every single ork codex I ever bought was prefaced by GW with something along the lines of
"somehow, a CC army became a shooty one. This codex fixes that."
as it stands right now, orks are mediocre in CC due to low I, bad AP values, and the fact that your best CC units need to be sent after vehicles, and we have no solutions for MC's or characters with good I who just kill us in combat before we get to strike.
we need power weapons back, or somthing to get more AP in CC, and we need solutions for MC's, and ranged solutions for vehicles.
overall I am excited for the new dex though, here is hoping!
as it stands right now, orks are mediocre in CC due to low I, bad AP values, and the fact that your best CC units need to be sent after vehicles, and we have no solutions for MC's or characters with good I who just kill us in combat before we get to strike.
we need power weapons back, or somthing to get more AP in CC, and we need solutions for MC's, and ranged solutions for vehicles.
I always did, 3 kannons and 3 lobbas, can't say there was ever a game that they were not feared.
When I started buying Orkz (when the last Codex dropped), I got 9 Kannonz. I hate the idea of spending the small pts for that unit, but I think they're dead killy. Maybe the new 'Dex will let you put more than 3 in a Heavy slot. I'll be thrilled!!
I thought it would be cool if you could take them like Heavy Weapons Teams in IG.
THAT would do it too. I don't see us being able to add Kannonz to a Boyz squad though. BUT, I do like the idea.
Rubs wrote: I'm hoping its not that complicated. I don't want to have to count how many boyz I have in each unit every physic phase.
It won't be. This is a Natfka rumor.
These same kind of rumors about Orks generating "Waaggh! Tokens" or "Warp Charge" from being in close combat have been floating around for I think over a year now.
I'm highly skeptical of GW adding some kind of Dark-Eldar-esque-Pain-Token-mechanic to Orks. I'm not positive, but I don't think any of those rumors came from a source verified as very reliable.
It wouldn't surprise me since basically the same mechanic applies to units of deamons (and other brotherhood of psykers?).
But as said. It's Naftka so it would be rather unwise to give the rumour too much credence.
I can only say that it echoes what I was told. So it might hold up better than most people think
Now that we know how Warp Charge works in 7th Edition, I could envision the following:
Basically Orks would get a Warp Charge for every unit of Boyz over 10 or 20. There's our "Deny the Witch" dice for when we don't bring any Psykers to the field.
Then for Weirdboyz.... I could envision an Ork Psykic Powers list which might have powers that have different effects depending on how many Warp Charge you throw at them. For example...
Zzap!
Focused Witchfire
1 Warp Charge version - S6 AP2 Assault 1
2 Warp Charge version - S8 AP2 Blast
3 Warp Charge version - S10 AP1 Blast
This would basically let a Warp Head use more powerful psychic attacks the more Orks were on the field.
And then, just because it's Orks, we'll probably have some kind of mechanic where things go wrong... I'm betting that either we'll have our own Perils chart separate from the book, or we'll Perils on double 1's as well as double 6's.
The ISSUE that I have with this, is that it really seems to be shoe-horning Orks into more of a Psychic role than they really are. Sure, Orks have Weirdboyz, but you don't have full armies based around their mechanic.
Honestly, if the warp charge rumor is true, I probably wouldn't even take a Weirdboy and just generate charges for DtW. I have 120 boyz taken in units of 20+, so no worries there (which is why I've been so preoccupied with how the new KFF rules will work).
Multimoog wrote: Honestly, if the warp charge rumor is true, I probably wouldn't even take a Weirdboy and just generate charges for DtW. I have 120 boyz taken in units of 20+, so no worries there (which is why I've been so preoccupied with how the new KFF rules will work).
I'm with you there! I have 4 mobs of 30 (with another 2 on the way). So 1 Warp Charge for every 10 Boyz on the field would be cool. Save me having to buy a Psycher for defense (DtW).
In the unlikely event that every ork unit does generate a warp charge point at a certain size, it seems more likely that they will do so at 20 orks rather than 10. There's no way orks generate more psychic power than pink horrors.
If GW wanted to do that kind of mechanic, it seems to me that it would be more likely to generate warp charges based on the size of the weirdboy's unit. It used to be the case that you had to get power points from orks standing behind the weirdboy.
Perfect Organism wrote: In the unlikely event that every ork unit does generate a warp charge point at a certain size, it seems more likely that they will do so at 20 orks rather than 10. There's no way orks generate more psychic power than pink horrors.
If GW wanted to do that kind of mechanic, it seems to me that it would be more likely to generate warp charges based on the size of the weirdboy's unit. It used to be the case that you had to get power points from orks standing behind the weirdboy.
I agree with you. I don't think we would generate much Warp charges without a Weirdboy, at least in the whole army, but more likely in the unit.
Solar Shock wrote: Some interesting points about orks being shooty really really never thought of it that way. I started playing orks in 6th last year, I chose orks not because they were FOTM or because I heard about insta-win combos, but because I wanted to build a junk army of scrappy robots with maniac drivers and random reapons with odd effects. I spent a year modelling and converting and only played a few games in 6th ed.
in terms of ork shooting, I would love to field an army of spray and pray nutters who pepper the enemy till nothing stands. Favourite moment in 6th ed was ramming an AV 14 building with my BW, dropping the armour massively with good rolls and then having the orks inside snap fire there sluggas till i reduced the armour to 0. Was fethin' hilarious id like more of that please!
Hoping for; more odd and interesting rules, like mass weirdboys teleporting blobs of shooty orks all over the place, teleporting burna boys would be sooo much fun small suicide squads popping bang smack in the centre of IG lines. Viability of walker lists/the ability to include walkers.
In total, im not worried about orks being crap in the new dex, im just looking forward to skyfire being somewhere and the ability to make some truely odd and interesting lists with the new FOC styles in 7th ed.
LoL where orks ever FOTM? I have been playing since second edition and too this day I still get smirks when I pull out da green tide.
Solar Shock wrote: Some interesting points about orks being shooty really really never thought of it that way. I started playing orks in 6th last year, I chose orks not because they were FOTM or because I heard about insta-win combos, but because I wanted to build a junk army of scrappy robots with maniac drivers and random reapons with odd effects. I spent a year modelling and converting and only played a few games in 6th ed.
in terms of ork shooting, I would love to field an army of spray and pray nutters who pepper the enemy till nothing stands. Favourite moment in 6th ed was ramming an AV 14 building with my BW, dropping the armour massively with good rolls and then having the orks inside snap fire there sluggas till i reduced the armour to 0. Was fethin' hilarious id like more of that please!
Hoping for; more odd and interesting rules, like mass weirdboys teleporting blobs of shooty orks all over the place, teleporting burna boys would be sooo much fun small suicide squads popping bang smack in the centre of IG lines. Viability of walker lists/the ability to include walkers.
In total, im not worried about orks being crap in the new dex, im just looking forward to skyfire being somewhere and the ability to make some truely odd and interesting lists with the new FOC styles in 7th ed.
LoL where orks ever FOTM? I have been playing since second edition and too this day I still get smirks when I pull out da green tide.
I don't know about FOTM, but dash of pepper, had some success with them. Used to love reading his posts.
THAT would do it too. I don't see us being able to add Kannonz to a Boyz squad though. BUT, I do like the idea.
I was thinking more along the lines of being able to add one to standard grot unit. would definitely make them worth taking.
Grots are always worth taking as a cheap backfield objective holder or on a quad guns. It would great if grots had other uses use besides killing tau in CC or clearing minefields (the greatest special rule in 40k).
nflagey wrote: I've seen a few comments here about the cost (points) of the model, but I'm wondering if anyone actually did some math?
A Deff Dread is 75
+ 15 (for an extra CCW so it gets the same number of A)
[...]
So, looking at it this way, I'm not so sure it's such a bad deal, point wise...
and you are spot on. It is "correctly" priced.
When was the last time you build your ork list around the deffdread?
When was the last time you put a KMB on a deffdread?
The issue is not that it is overpriced, it is mostly that the Morkanaut does not know what it wants to be, and that it keeps stacking poorly effective solutions.
Slowest vehicles: Walker, check!
Worst weapon you can get if you have a low BS: a "Get hot" weapon, check!
Worst transport capacity for an army based on number: 6, check!
I'm going to give you an alternative version of stacking points which would use the same rules and make it effective:
A Deff Dread is 75
+ 15 (for an extra CCW so it gets the same number of A)
+ 25 for 5 big shoota
+ 20 (for 2 grot bomms as per IA8, Large blast TL AP3 rokkits - one use only)
+ 20 (for a supa skorcha as per IA8, an AP3 skorcha)
-------------
165 points
That's a Shooty dread with still a wide array of weapons, plenty of ork mix-bag of different guns, but it would really focus on the weapons with the biggest bang for buck.
in terms of point efficiency against MEQ (where orks are at the weakest) you can't really beat template AP3 and big shootas.
In complete fairness, I often build around the Deff Dread. I find them fun. So for me, the Morkanaut is awesome.
THAT would do it too. I don't see us being able to add Kannonz to a Boyz squad though. BUT, I do like the idea.
I was thinking more along the lines of being able to add one to standard grot unit. would definitely make them worth taking.
Grots are always worth taking as a cheap backfield objective holder or on a quad guns. It would great if grots had other uses use besides killing tau in CC or clearing minefields (the greatest special rule in 40k).
Well i know that, i generally take at least one unit of them as a sneaky objective snatcher. What i meat was, if they were to get a single big gun per unit (or one for every 10 in the unit) they would add a whole new dynamic to an otherwise boring single use entry. (in other words: I want more BS3 shooting )
Well i know that, i generally take at least one unit of them as a sneaky objective snatcher. What i meat was, if they were to get a single big gun per unit (or one for every 10 in the unit) they would add a whole new dynamic to an otherwise boring single use entry. (in other words: I want more BS3 shooting )
Grots should have outflank and infiltrate, or the ability to purchase it. they are the sneakiest in the whole Ork kingdom, and I wouldn't be surprised if they could sneak better than some silly blood axe kommandos
Billagio wrote: Do we have a firm date for the codex? I thought I remember seeing somewhere June 7th.
7th is for the Gork/Morkanaut (Pre order from the 31st). So I imagine the Codex will be announced on the 31st too? That was the date on the teaser video, I believe?
Fluffwise, the Weirdboyz should be immune to perils, immune to daemon possession and total sh*tkickin powerhouses in the psychic phase, no mukkin abawt, just mind-nukes to crack open tanks and smack opponent psykers right up.
The only real threat to a weirdboy (not a full warp'ead) should be being around too many boyz and overloading with power.
Orks just really need some of their issues smoothed out. Rules wise they favor shooting, but they can't reliably krump armor outside of melee. Fluff wise they're also all about CC.
I'd be perfectly ok with this if it weren't for sixth and onwards being "fix your army weaknesses with allies edition". The time for such things is past and Orks need an anti-tank gun.
Billagio wrote: Do we have a firm date for the codex? I thought I remember seeing somewhere June 7th.
7th is for the Gork/Morkanaut (Pre order from the 31st). So I imagine the Codex will be announced on the 31st too? That was the date on the teaser video, I believe?
Damn I was really hoping for the codex to come out next week :/
I have some predictions of my own based on context clues that we have received via the WD leaks. The WAAAAGH special rule is going to be completely revamped. No more crappy "Confers fleet of foot". However, WAAAAGH will have to be earned by doing orky things like driving fast in a trukk or on a bike, shooting a lot of dakka at stuff, or krumpin some boyz in cc. These were all hinted at in the WD. This is what people keep talking about as Weird Tokens. They are not Weird Tokens they are waaagh tokens. They will probably be spendable by alowing the ork mob with them to do some extra orky things like fire more dakka! Think about the Dakka Jet for example. It currently has the waaaaagh plane special rule. Well what if that rule was just one of three that could be used by orks with waaagh tokens. EX: your dakka jet shoots down an enemy flyer. It gains 1 waaaagh token. in it's next turn it may now spend that token and shoot twice as many shots! This would be great for things like lootas, shootas, dakka jets, tank bustas ect. Another one may be if a unit moves fast. Like if a group of boyz in a trukk moves flat out it gets a waaaagh token. In the next phase perhaps the boyz can move an extra 6in in the next turn with no penalty. lastly boyz krumpin in cc get a waaaagh token. in the next turn they can spend that token and gain +1 str.
I really don't know this is just a wild guess or wishlist if you will but it sure would make orks a lot more fun to play.
MeanGreenStompa wrote: Fluffwise, the Weirdboyz should be immune to perils, immune to daemon possession and total sh*tkickin powerhouses in the psychic phase, no mukkin abawt, just mind-nukes to crack open tanks and smack opponent psykers right up.
The only real threat to a weirdboy (not a full warp'ead) should be being around too many boyz and overloading with power.
rothrich wrote: I have some predictions of my own based on context clues that we have received via the WD leaks. The WAAAAGH special rule is going to be completely revamped. No more crappy "Confers fleet of foot". However, WAAAAGH will have to be earned by doing orky things like driving fast in a trukk or on a bike, shooting a lot of dakka at stuff, or krumpin some boyz in cc. These were all hinted at in the WD. This is what people keep talking about as Weird Tokens. They are not Weird Tokens they are waaagh tokens. They will probably be spendable by alowing the ork mob with them to do some extra orky things like fire more dakka! Think about the Dakka Jet for example. It currently has the waaaaagh plane special rule. Well what if that rule was just one of three that could be used by orks with waaagh tokens. EX: your dakka jet shoots down an enemy flyer. It gains 1 waaaagh token. in it's next turn it may now spend that token and shoot twice as many shots! This would be great for things like lootas, shootas, dakka jets, tank bustas ect. Another one may be if a unit moves fast. Like if a group of boyz in a trukk moves flat out it gets a waaaagh token. In the next phase perhaps the boyz can move an extra 6in in the next turn with no penalty. lastly boyz krumpin in cc get a waaaagh token. in the next turn they can spend that token and gain +1 str.
I really don't know this is just a wild guess or wishlist if you will but it sure would make orks a lot more fun to play.
I wouldn't be surprised either if the power of Weirdboyz was affected by the number of units you have on your table. Might be more fun to play actually, and would be pretty good for narrative games. You could start with a bunch of boyz, generate Waaagh!, and then use it to blast your opponents to bits through the power of Gork an' Mork! A little bit of story, perhaps...
"...Th' dakka thunderd 'round me an me boyz, wif 'umies gettin' blasted off der feet by da big shootaz we'ze was sportin', an' all ya could 'ear were dakka and da call o' Warboss Bogblitz, screamin' wif da 'eart uf Gork an' Mork demselves! We wuz all ry-eld up and yellin' ar 'eads off! Den da real show started, 'cuz all dem excited boyz iz wot make dem Weirdboyz all glowy-like. Den' dey star'ed blastin' all dem humies ta zog, better dan all th' dakka bafore! Ya coul' see fire in der eyez, loightnin' spewin' from der moufs, an' dey all had dem grotz yellin' and screamin'! O' course, we 'ad a few 'eadbooms 'ere an dere, but it wuz real pretty ter see dem firewurkz, hur hur!"
Rubs wrote: The banners above their head looked pretty fancy to me.
I'm pretty sure the "bosspoles", heads, and klaws, are all different. The torso of the one on the far left looks new as well. Furthermore, the one on the far right has a twin-linked shoota, and that model hasn't been available for years.
Automatically Appended Next Post: The middle one also has a new Kombi-rokkit and they seem to have chains hanging between their legs like the plastic killa kans.
Yeah I guess y'all are right they do look different than the current mega nobz. It would just be nice if they stared taking the old stuff down so new stuff could be hinted at... lets hope whoever has been posting wd pics on friday comes through tomorrow..
Goresaw wrote: Hope they loser the cost on the MANZ or give them T5. They cost a lot for a leadership 7 model.
Im hoping they are also cheap too. The way GW makes money is to release new models and to make the new rules for those models great. I personally don't think we've seen everything about the gorkanaught just yet.
60 bucks for 3 MANZ seems reasonable, and WAY better than 80 for 3 centurions. There's going to be tons of leftover bitz in that box, and I think it might be possible with some plasticard and some old Nobs to turn that 3 man box into 6. The amount of bitz in any Ork kit is phenomenal, and if you love to convert you can practically find a bit to save from every single character Ork kit there is.
I hope our manz are nothing like terminators and make them look tiny next to them.
I also would love to see T5 on the MAN primarily because the Warboss's extra Toughness has no one to join to share his high toughness.
I also look at all the T4 guys out there and a NOB with heavy plating sounds like he could do with an upgrade. They don't have the 5++ termies have, it would be a nice differentiation.
Also a boy's dream come true would be to be able to kit our boys' nobs with a mega armour. What an amazing bullet catcher at the front of a mob... talk about leading the boys to battle.
I really, really doubt that we're going to get mega-armoured boy's mob leaders, but it would be pretty fantastic if we did. Would make power klaws in boy's mobs actually practical again.
Goresaw wrote: Slow and purposeful isn't so great for foot slogging.
if you footslogg all the way yes, you are correct, but if you use battlewagons, or trukks, you can actually jump start your turn1:
Turn1: move 6", disembark 6", that puts you roughly just before the median line,
Turn2: move 6" (you are now somwhere ~ 7-10" from their deployment line) you should be able to start shooting.
With the extra resilience of a 2+ nob at the front and a BW which is still speeding nearby it becomes a viable tactic in my book
(do I shoot that deffrolla which is now empty or do i try do take down that 2+ nob to crack open the boys)
anyway i agree it is not likely but with the new rules you can easily have 2 HQ for 2 troops, so technically should be able to squeeze an Mega armour bullet proof front
Dakkafang Dreggrim wrote: So if rumor hold true and we get bomb squig units and we "fire" them in the shooting phase.....
I got this great image of them running out of a Morkanaught lol
The vision of the front plate dropping and six angry explosive covered squig running out. Oh the glory.
I imagine that like the scene from Return of the King when the armored trolls burst through the gates on Minas Tirith. Mighty spacemarines are expecting the worst for a warboss and a bunch of heavily armed MANz to come out but instead its 6 little squigs.
adamsouza wrote: So the White Dwarf with the new Orky goodness drops this Friday ?
I'm still trying to wrap my head around it being a weekly publication.
It was devoid of substance when it was a monthly publication.
Yes, but the 31 May edition only has the Gorka/morkanaut release, plus a few teasers like the apparent new meganobz in one pic. Nothing to confirm there even will be a new ork codex :(
Hmm, another thought re those meganobz - they _might_ just be the simplified meganobz from the rumoured new starter box, rather than the new meganobz kit. Or not...
adamsouza wrote: So the White Dwarf with the new Orky goodness drops this Friday ?
I'm still trying to wrap my head around it being a weekly publication.
It was devoid of substance when it was a monthly publication.
Yes, but the 31 May edition only has the Gorka/morkanaut release, plus a few teasers like the apparent new meganobz in one pic. Nothing to confirm there even will be a new ork codex :(
Hmm, another thought re those meganobz - they _might_ just be the simplified meganobz from the rumoured new starter box, rather than the new meganobz kit. Or not...
They are pretty blatant, I don't think they'd be so obvious without it being a kit coming soon...within a week.
Thats what I was thinking. GW is just trolling the ork players again. Another new model and rules in WD. Who said anything about a new 'dex right? Lol.
The ISSUE that I have with this, is that it really seems to be shoe-horning Orks into more of a Psychic role than they really are. Sure, Orks have Weirdboyz, but you don't have full armies based around their mechanic.
Sorry man... you seem to misunderstand the basic orkiness principle. Ork stuff works because they believe that they work. It is their belief that twists the warp around them.
It's interesting that only good models GW can design anymore are Orks, because Ork models are supposed to be oversized, clunky, and have tons of frivolous nonsense sticking out of it.
bigboss1o1 wrote: Anyone else besides me cut the meganobz in this picture I haven't been able to keep up so I don't know if anyone posted it
dude! what is that thing to the left with a helmet the style of a cheese grater! ?!?!?! looks larger than a Meganob... or is that just the camera angle ?
bigboss1o1 wrote: Anyone else besides me cut the meganobz in this picture I haven't been able to keep up so I don't know if anyone posted it
dude! what is that thing to the left with a helmet the style of a cheese grater! ?!?!?! looks larger than a Meganob... or is that just the camera angle ?
I think that's one of the MANz. Crosschecking at the MANz online on GWs site, I think these are new ones. Especially that "cheese grater" one. Plus they look bigger. Which is always BETTER.
New Dok looks to be nob sized. Quite likely a character. Cybork hand could be a PK but it has fingers. Well... scalpels and syringes.
Both look mono pose.
Those MANZ are the new ones for sure. Overall design is very similar to existing, but they're not the same models.
Edit: Can't spell for gak.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also; it amuses me that BoLs are just now posting what you guys spotted nearly a week ago.
Squidbot wrote: New Dok looks to be nob sized. Quite likely a character. Cybork hand could be a PK but it has fingers. Well... scalpels and syringes.
Both look mono pose.
Those MANZ are the new ones for sure. Overall design is very similar to existing, but they're not the same models.
Edit: Can't spell for gak.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also; it amuses me that BoLs are just now posting what you guys spotted nearly a week ago.
Squidbot wrote: New Dok looks to be nob sized. Quite likely a character. Cybork hand could be a PK but it has fingers. Well... scalpels and syringes.
Both look mono pose.
Where's this from? Did I miss something?
Squidbot wrote: Also; it amuses me that BoLs are just now posting what you guys spotted nearly a week ago.
Don't be surprised. That's standard operating procedure at Taco Bell.
rothrich wrote: I have some predictions of my own based on context clues that we have received via the WD leaks. The WAAAAGH special rule is going to be completely revamped. No more crappy "Confers fleet of foot". However, WAAAAGH will have to be earned by doing orky things like driving fast in a trukk or on a bike, shooting a lot of dakka at stuff, or krumpin some boyz in cc. These were all hinted at in the WD. This is what people keep talking about as Weird Tokens. They are not Weird Tokens they are waaagh tokens. They will probably be spendable by alowing the ork mob with them to do some extra orky things like fire more dakka! Think about the Dakka Jet for example. It currently has the waaaaagh plane special rule. Well what if that rule was just one of three that could be used by orks with waaagh tokens. EX: your dakka jet shoots down an enemy flyer. It gains 1 waaaagh token. in it's next turn it may now spend that token and shoot twice as many shots! This would be great for things like lootas, shootas, dakka jets, tank bustas ect. Another one may be if a unit moves fast. Like if a group of boyz in a trukk moves flat out it gets a waaaagh token. In the next phase perhaps the boyz can move an extra 6in in the next turn with no penalty. lastly boyz krumpin in cc get a waaaagh token. in the next turn they can spend that token and gain +1 str.
I really don't know this is just a wild guess or wishlist if you will but it sure would make orks a lot more fun to play.
i hope you're right ! getting rewards for doing as ork as possible? nice!
Did they look like they might be something other than kannons/lobbas/zzapp-guns or was the new design just giving them some more detail and suitably orky shields?
The ISSUE that I have with this, is that it really seems to be shoe-horning Orks into more of a Psychic role than they really are. Sure, Orks have Weirdboyz, but you don't have full armies based around their mechanic.
Sorry man... you seem to misunderstand the basic orkiness principle. Ork stuff works because they believe that they work. It is their belief that twists the warp around them.
Well, yes. Orks are actually a highly psychic race - they just don't know it!
However, the stuff working isn't because of 'Ork Belief' - although their psychic skills may assist it a bit - but rather because the Orks were created to be builders and soldiers, psychically guided by their masters. They were instilled with necessary skills and intelligence to put together complicated high-tech things, but not how to design them. Their masters were the ones who had all the designs and guided the process, so that the orks to put correct pieces in correct places. Now that the Orks are without guidance, those instilled skills manifest randomly - the things the Meks can improvise out of scrap are ingenious, but they are not able to make complete high-tech things, as those advanced designs died with their extinct masters.
Actually, fluff states that if enough orks gather, those high-tech designs come possible again (stompas, gargants, kruisas). Makes it more likely that their former master's collective knowledge is fully coded into the ork race, it's just too dispersed, so you need a lot of orks to regain access to it.
Huh. Maybe that's why Thrakka started the war on Armageddon?
I've always maintined that Orks are actually one of the strongest psychic races, if not the strongest. The call of the waaagh summons them across the galaxy.
Much like the fact that they could destroy the galaxy if they ever stopped fighting each other, if they ever learned to really fully control their weirdboys the universe would be theirs.
Aside from the fact that all the weirdboy's brains would pop.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Oh, and to build more excitement for the impending Orkiness, I read Engine of Mork again last night. It always gets me in the mood to paint something dead killy.
Jidmah wrote: Actually, fluff states that if enough orks gather, those high-tech designs come possible again (stompas, gargants, kruisas). Makes it more likely that their former master's collective knowledge is fully coded into the ork race, it's just too dispersed, so you need a lot of orks to regain access to it.
Huh. Maybe that's why Thrakka started the war on Armageddon?
HAHA! I had the funniest scene play through my head when reading this An ork design meeting where they couldn't seem to get the plans to work at all, scratchin' there noggin's till the tea boy ork arrives, raising the orkiness factor in the room +1, Bing goes the light bulb plan solved! I imagine ork building is like when I used to play lego with my brother, scrabble for the best bits and stick stuff together until you've got what you want!
Plus with all the talk of big guns, i think ima gona run some come the new dex no matter what especially considering ive just decided I want to use a whole load of grots lifting up a nice oldschool pirate cannon, using themselves as the alignment mechanism. Might even model a ogryn as just a fat ass ork holding a lobba Ahhhhh i can almost taste how close I am to moar conversions! the plasticard is calling me.
Jidmah wrote: Actually, fluff states that if enough orks gather, those high-tech designs come possible again (stompas, gargants, kruisas). Makes it more likely that their former master's collective knowledge is fully coded into the ork race, it's just too dispersed, so you need a lot of orks to regain access to it.
Huh. Maybe that's why Thrakka started the war on Armageddon?
Yes, probably the knowledge is 'genetic' and somewhat random, so only some gits become Meks, and within the Mek caste there are always those who are obsessed with things like flight, buggies, etc.. - I'd suppose that when the Orks were created, each ork did belong to a certain class, and the knowledge was appropriate for each. After the loss of the masters, the genetics became random and now each ork might exhibit one or more traits at various levels. This also goes for other classes, and explains why successful Warbosses are so rare - you need to be both highly cunning and highly brutal to make it to the top and stay there.
When it comes to building huge machines, in general I think you need plenty of resources to build big stuff anyways, and Meks tend to be scattered amongst the orks, each working for a small Warboss. An 'organized' Waaaagh is required, with a Boss with enuff vision as to what he needs, and enough sense to order the Meks to build stuff in groups. When it comes to psychics, it might be possible that if you gather enuff Meks to the vicinity of each other, the ideas start to psychically bleed to the others, and you start to get a bit more coherency out of the group. So yes, it makes sense, in orky kind of way
A Bubble Launcha or Squig Catapult would be great too! I'd heard somewhere that there were new Squigs in the pipeline, but if Squidbot didn't see them....
Squidbot wrote: Just because I didn't see it doesn't mean it doesn't exist.
I would love a reason to buy the FW Squig Gobba.
Once again thanks for all your insight. I think I asked a question 20 pages back that you answered immediately (something about the flashgit). I didn't get back to the thread till 10 pages later and I forgot to thank you for that. So anyways, thank you for all the information you have shared with us.
Squidbot wrote: They're actually much more similar to that in style now, but not quad.
Something like an ork version of the eldar support battery weapons?
I'm guessing they still have wheels.
Going by GW's recent design choices, I'm guessing that the weapons will be a horizontal shell-thrower (kannon), a vertical shell-thrower (lobba), a horizontal energy weapon (zzapp gun) and a vertical energy weapon (anti-aircraft option) with barrels looking very similar to the ones in the battlewagon kit.
Ratius wrote: Not overly impressed with the G(M)orkanaut. The front armor piece looks off angle-wise imo. The cannon/weapons are cool but for €85 I think I'll pass./quote]
As always I think we should wait for the 360. Every single time models look way better after official pics are released. Every single time.
I'm hoping the energy weapons look more interesting than lascannons with wires wrapped around. Can you comment on how "piratey" the flashgitz are and are thy nob sized or smaller?
Squidbot wrote: They're actually much more similar to that in style now, but not quad.
Something like an ork version of the eldar support battery weapons?
I'm guessing they still have wheels.
Going by GW's recent design choices, I'm guessing that the weapons will be a horizontal shell-thrower (kannon), a vertical shell-thrower (lobba), a horizontal energy weapon (zzapp gun) and a vertical energy weapon (anti-aircraft option) with barrels looking very similar to the ones in the battlewagon kit.
Squidbot, I just wanted to thank you for coming out of the woodwork and hooking us up with some information with a little meat on it's bones. It's nice to have something to chew on while we wait for pictures and rules.
matphat wrote: Squidbot, I just wanted to thank you for coming out of the woodwork and hooking us up with some information with a little meat on it's bones. It's nice to have something to chew on while we wait for pictures and rules.
what's happening to me? by browsing this ork rumors day and night, i'm thinking of sending my money (yes, all of it) to the guys from chromleg and GW. I desperately need to trade some hard earned cash for worthless plastic. I want to buy big gunz (alot), commandos , stompa, g/morkanaut and plundering the chromleg site for the ork walls, the juggernauts (erec...ion!! ), and the german helmet mg42 squads...
must have all of this.. at once..
voice in head: don't buy it now, wait for the codex to arrive, and select only the good units.
but mooooooom, i want it so badly! oh, and maybe the goliath remote mine from chromleg too.
what's happening to me? by browsing this ork rumors day and night, i'm thinking of sending my money (yes, all of it) to the guys from chromleg and GW. I desperately need to trade some hard earned cash for worthless plastic. I want to buy big gunz (alot), commandos , stompa, g/morkanaut and plundering the chromleg site for the ork walls, the juggernauts (erec...ion!! ), and the german helmet mg42 squads...
must have all of this.. at once..
voice in head: don't buy it now, wait for the codex to arrive, and select only the good units.
but mooooooom, i want it so badly! oh, and maybe the goliath remote mine from chromleg too.
Deunstephe wrote: All this talk is getting me excited - despite May having many family birthdays (including my own), I want it to fly by now for these updates to come.
Ouch... the price of this hobby just kicks my ass sometimes. I would love to buy a bunch of new Orky toys but $110-ish for one model which may or may not even be decent in its current iteration is tough...
Meanwhile, of all our armies that the wife and I own, the Orks are furthest away from feeling "done", as we lack staples more urgently than novelty items.
My heart says "Gorka/Morkanaut", but common sense says "Lootas, MANZ, Battlewagons first..." :-p
Shame this isn't Dust, etc... which is our main game, in part, because you can buy a super-heavy for $35 and have this giant, awesome model, ready-to-go right out of the box. If 40k was priced similarly, i'd own every army. :-p
I guess GW dont want people to magnetize them and force them to buy 2 models, perfect business sense, wont please many people though.
The price doesn't look too bad in £'s to me but I dont collect Ork's.
Either way, you would be best to keep your cash in your pocket until you can see what the codex says about them, if they suck then all everyone will hear is the same moaning as when people bought Harpys and Crones and started moaning that T5 sucks etc etc.
Keep your cash in your pocket and wait for the codex!
loki old fart wrote: It doesn't make sense, You should be able to mix and match, between the two spec's.
I like the load out on the morkanaut.
I like the kff on the gorkanaut.
Taurox tracks turned upside down instead of legs.
and a belly gun.
runt bot FTW
Do people not read? Obviously not.
You can make both, just like how they list the harpy and the crone separately.
Yeah we can read. Now you go read the rules, you can have either gork or mork.
Unless its different in the codex. you build one or the other, out of a dual model kit.
) . I'd rather buy a 'Stompa 
what's happening to me? by browsing this ork rumors day and night, i'm thinking of sending my money (yes, all of it) to the guys from chromleg and 
