Collector's is already sold out in Oz. Wow.

 Peregrine wrote:

 Valkyrie wrote:
Correct me if I'm wrong, Baneblades weren't £85 before today were they?

Nope. Now you get to pay 50% more so you can get both the Shadowsword and Baneblade gun sprues. Of course since you can't build both variants at once this just means you pay 50% more for a bunch of scrap plastic you're never going to use.

I'm glad they bundled both the baneblade and the shadowsword together, as magnetising is coming more mainstream, it's nice to have all tank variants in a single box (unless it's something like a Rhino which has lots of variants of varying usage).

I'm not happy about the price rise, but am definitely happy they bundled it all together.

maciek wrote:
Yes. why not. Depending on price of course. But I think, ability to kill that overpowwered, underpricced Helldrake is act of restoring balance to game, not breaking it ;-)

Great, so you have a powerful counter to Helldrakes. Now you've effectively removed any flyer that isn't a Vendetta/Helldrake or Scythe spam. Why bring a Tau flyer or two when it will just get auto-killed as soon as it arrives? Interceptor quad guns are already bad enough for the "true" 6th edition flyers, quad interceptor lascannons is going to put them permanently on the display shelf.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

AllSeeingSkink wrote:
I'm glad they bundled both the baneblade and the shadowsword together, as magnetising is coming more mainstream, it's nice to have all tank variants in a single box (unless it's something like a Rhino which has lots of variants of varying usage).

But can you really magnetize it? It's not just a simple gun swap, you'll have to replace the entire center hull and that's a pretty important part structurally.

Well the old imperial strongpoint is gone. It was actually a pretty good deal. 2 bastions and 3 ADLs for $135. New I should have got one through the FLGS before this release came out... damn.

just downloaded the new White Dwarf, and i have to say that the inside of the Vault has some really cool details...
the little Scarabs crawling around are a nice touch...
the C'Tan looks much cooler painted in blue...
might just be the coolest big kit GW has made so far, and i don't even collect Necrons...

i would have put at least the Lord Executioner on my "to buy" list, but he's Finecast:(...
nothing for me this month...
they'll get me when the new Marine Codex comes out, for sure...

cheers
jah

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Collector's is already sold out in Oz. Wow.

Perhaps people got excited that a collectors edition featured more than just a fancy cover. Only explanation I can come up with.

You think the quad lasgun is scary.. Double punishers. Lol

Okay maybe that's just me.

I'll be grabbing a bombardment cube dice, simply because it's 125 dice for $32au. And it comes with a turn counter.

varag wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Collector's is already sold out in Oz. Wow.

Perhaps people got excited that a collectors edition featured more than just a fancy cover. Only explanation I can come up with.

Nah... it's probably because you guys can buy anything GW cheaper than the rest of the non-Commonwealth world. *runs for the hills*

Looks awesome, cant wait to see the rules for some of the terrain. I am really lacking in anti armor punch in my lists so this might be a good way to shore it up.

Holy feth, that set with 2 RoBBs and a bunch of terrain is $2100au.

$2100au.

£1000 for a game board. Fething insane. The blurb even states 'time to put your money where your mouth is...'

No thanks. For that price, I'd rather buy a HD projector and a huge white sheet, and project a changeable map onto a table...

Looool, $74 for a fething rulebook. Not sure what these people at GW are on.

 Eggs wrote:
£1000 for a game board. Fething insane. The blurb even states 'time to put your money where your mouth is...'

No thanks. For that price, I'd rather buy a HD projector and a huge white sheet, and project a changeable map onto a table...

Well now we know what GW will replace the realm of battle game board for.along with some citadel finewood (£50) to place the white sheet on, and all maps are available for purchase from the digital store for only £20 each.

Does anyone know if the new Vortex template is just the old one reskinned or the larger 5" one similar to the Storm of Magic templates?

 pretre wrote:
You think the quad lasgun is scary.. Double punishers. Lol

Okay maybe that's just me.

Yes, but it's only got 1/4 of the range, and isn't Int & Skyfire (that we know of)

And, and I apologise for bringing an (un)related arguement into the equation, are these rules 'codex' or 'optional' ala Forgeworld?

Cheers

Andrew

 AndrewC wrote:
And, and I apologise for bringing an (un)related arguement into the equation, are these rules 'codex' or 'optional' ala Forgeworld?

Cheers

Andrew

It's 40k, but a different gametype. Like Planetstrike or Cities of Death. It just makes changes to the FoC (ie there is none in the old Apocalypse) that lets you bring things like superheavies.

 AndrewC wrote:
And, and I apologise for bringing an (un)related arguement into the equation, are these rules 'codex' or 'optional' ala Forgeworld?

Well, FW isn't optional, so the question to ask would be whether they're "standard" 40k units (codex, FW, etc) or explicitly listed as an optional expansion (like the DFTS dogfighting rules, which clearly said "optional" in the introduction). And the answer is we don't know. The product description just says "for 40k".

 pretre wrote:
You think the quad lasgun is scary.. Double punishers. Lol

Okay maybe that's just me.

At least the double punisher cannons are something you can already get from a codex unit that is generally considered to be far from overpowered. Multiple interceptor lascannons is something completely game-changing that is only available on this new terrain piece.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 -Loki- wrote:
It's 40k, but a different gametype. Like Planetstrike or Cities of Death. It just makes changes to the FoC (ie there is none in the old Apocalypse) that lets you bring things like superheavies.

Not necessarily. The description for the new terrain pieces says they include 40k rules (with the Apocalypse rules in the Apocalypse book), so at least some of this stuff could be part of normal games.

 Eggs wrote:
£1000 for a game board. Fething insane. The blurb even states 'time to put your money where your mouth is...'

No thanks. For that price, I'd rather buy a HD projector and a huge white sheet, and project a changeable map onto a table...

Hell, for that price you can buy a plasma screen television, mount it as a table, and put a sheet of plexiglass over the screen.

(Although you'd probably want an LCD instead because of burnin)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AndrewC wrote:

 pretre wrote:
You think the quad lasgun is scary.. Double punishers. Lol

Okay maybe that's just me.

Yes, but it's only got 1/4 of the range, and isn't Int & Skyfire (that we know of)

And, and I apologise for bringing an (un)related arguement into the equation, are these rules 'codex' or 'optional' ala Forgeworld?

Cheers

Andrew

GW doesn't run official tournaments anymore. Codex is what you and your friends decide it is. (I still have to roshambo my brother until he lets me take my Razorshark.)

 -Loki- wrote:

 AndrewC wrote:
And, and I apologise for bringing an (un)related arguement into the equation, are these rules 'codex' or 'optional' ala Forgeworld?

Cheers

Andrew

It's 40k, but a different gametype. Like Planetstrike or Cities of Death. It just makes changes to the FoC (ie there is none in the old Apocalypse) that lets you bring things like superheavies.

He was asking about the terrain which is normal 40k.

@peregrine: punishers aren't scary until you make them rending with faith.

Actually, googling around the projector idea, for half the price of the apocalypse board, you can pick up an hd projector that can handle chucking out an 8 foot image. You'd sacrifice the third dimension, but gain a changing battlefield - fields of crops blowing in the wind, burning fires, the ability to mark on objectives, wrecks, etc etc.

At least 3 of the CE went to preorders through my local GW store, and one of the guys ordered that AND the GE.

Ok, the collector's wasn't that big a deal. I thought it came with templates and other stuff, but really it's the book divided up into smaller things, the cards, and an extra warzone. Not a huge loss.

And it says that there are 100 formations, all available as easy 1-click bundles, confirming our fears that everything in this book is a readily available model purchase rather than something a bit more creative (like the last version of Apoc, that included things like Warlord Titans). This also makes me believe that further formations will not be released via PDF on their website but as overpriced iOS bs.

 Eggs wrote:
Actually, googling around the projector idea, for half the price of the apocalypse board, you can pick up an hd projector that can handle chucking out an 8 foot image. You'd sacrifice the third dimension, but gain a changing battlefield - fields of crops blowing in the wind, burning fires, the ability to mark on objectives, wrecks, etc etc.

You also gain odd coloured light shining brightly on top of yours nicely painted miniatures, changing how they look.

No thanks.

The answer to GW's insane $2100au board isn't 'I'll spend that $2100au on other terrain', it should be 'haha I can make a full table of good looking terrain for under 1/10th of that. Which includes the table'.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Does anyone know if the new Vortex template is just the old one reskinned or the larger 5" one similar to the Storm of Magic templates?

I thought it looked like the old web way portal they used to sell

shade1313 wrote:
At least 3 of the CE went to preorders through my local GW store, and one of the guys ordered that AND the GE.

or so you hope. There were issues with stores over promising preorders and GW under delivering.

Well it looks like the baneblade lets you build every variant now. Granted it costs a ton more and you can still only use 1 at a time....

 Billagio wrote:
Well it looks like the baneblade lets you build every variant now. Granted it costs a ton more and you can still only use 1 at a time....

they shutdown bits sales so consumers could sell their bits...

 Peregrine wrote:

 AndrewC wrote:
And, and I apologise for bringing an (un)related arguement into the equation, are these rules 'codex' or 'optional' ala Forgeworld?

Well, FW isn't optional, so the question to ask would be whether they're "standard" 40k units (codex, FW, etc) or explicitly listed as an optional expansion (like the DFTS dogfighting rules, which clearly said "optional" in the introduction). And the answer is we don't know. The product description just says "for 40k".

Peregrine, you and I are of a like mind, in that FW is designed for 40K and as such should be an integral part of the game. However not everyone is of that mind, and picking up on the 'make sure your opponent is happy to play before using these units'they insist that FW requires opponents consent.

Now, these pieces contain rules for integration into normal 40K games, so I'm just wondering how GW are going to word those rules.....

Cheers

Andrew

 brassangel wrote:

Hulksmash wrote:That's the thing. I own a bunch of stuff already. I'll only play Apoc once or twice a year. Meaning I'd be down to buy some crazy stuff but not at those prices. I only need so many sentinels, leman russes, basic space marines, and so on.

They even took the transports out of the company box set. Probably didn't want the cost to clear 1k for it.....

Not everybody owns a bunch of stuff already. And if you do, GREAT! That means you don't have to buy anything. As to the once or twice a year comment: that will likely change if this format receives continued support. It'll be worth playing more often. Much like Commander/EDH for Magic: the Gathering, it started as a cute side option, and is now a mainstay of the game. Despite being a larger, more expensive format, it's become wildly popular, and people are buying new cards even if they already have a bunch of stuff.

What did you want them to do? Release a pamphlet and no bundles? You'd be in the slim minority there.

Show me where I said I only wanted a pamphlet or even implied it. Seems I said I'm buying the templates, book, and possibly the cards. Long way from wanting just a pamphlet.

What I was hoping for was a relative deal. I didn't expect the deals of the first Apoc release. But I held out hope for at least a decent discount.

And they aren't targeting normal players on this. It's a limited format currently (and is likely to remain so). They are targeting people with the time and money to build and play Apoc sized formations. People generally able to find online discounters. Let alone deals that might be made with a local shop to profit off just placing an enormous order.

Either way they'll make a solid amount of cash of the book, LE stuff, and the terrain. I'm cool either way. Should be happy as now I don't have to throw money at them.

I do hope there's some flexibility in these formations. The most obvious one is the Baleful Necropalis. One Tesseract Vault and 8 Monoliths. Mother fething eight Monoliths.

I hope that when we read page 170 of the new Apoc Rulebook it says that this formation consists of 1 Tesseract Vault and between 2 and 8 Monoliths, not just flat out 8. That would be totally insane.


[EDIT]: Tide of Spawn is now just 10 Spawn. It used to be an actual box w/Spawn and CSMs.

At least monoliths are super cheap on the secondary market.

Yeah, but 8 of the damned things? I have 4 and that's more than enough.

I must admit, this one is pretty funny.

I've just realised from looking at the pictures on GW that the quad cannon arn't even mounted on the fortification. So we'll have the ADL quad gun placement arguement twice over now.

Cheers

Andrew

Are we starting to become in the range of 3d printers now? I mean, over $2000 for plastic, 3d printers don't seem so expensive now. Is GW actually making 3d printers seem cheap now?

Seriously though, I looked at the Tyranid formations and my heart just sank. With all the price increases, I am scared to see what Tyranids will cost when they come out.

I guess, GW at least for me, has hit the c now price limit. Maybe, I should just get as many gaunts, and MC now before they are re-released and re-packaged, otherwise, that is it for me.

I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

My guess, is the Grey Knights purified themselves for the upcoming war.

And now, and update on Skullwatch 2013:

Vengeance Weapon Battery (Battlecannon): 35 skulls!
Vengeance Weapon Battery (Punisher Cannon): 33 skulls!
Aquila Strongpoint: 85 skulls (approx).
Firestorm Redoubt: 74 skulls!
Lord of Skulls: *brain melts*

 AndrewC wrote:
I've just realised from looking at the pictures on GW that the quad cannon arn't even mounted on the fortification. So we'll have the ADL quad gun placement arguement twice over now.

And I just noticed that the Firestorm Redoubt has slots for three turrets! AHAHAHAHAH!

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Yeah, but 8 of the damned things? I have 4 and that's more than enough.

I must admit, this one is pretty funny.

Ok, now THAT is cool. Im excited to read this book and see all the lore and stuff they add in.

Meh. I am just going to [continue to oppose piracy] and buy the templates. It's all I need.

The rest of the stuff is way overpriced. Only suckers would buy the 1 click deals.

Kindly do not advocate piracy - Kid Kyoto

Based on the formations I saw for sell, I only had to pick up a few items to complete a few formations. I am glad I stocked up on the formation sets from the first release. Problem was with APOC-1st Ed, was by the time I finished painting all of my stuff no one in my area played Apoc anymore. At least this time around I will have fully painted formations ready to go as soon as my rule book arrives.

Also:
Who knows what will happen in tournament play, but we use the new terrain pieces as objectives in our fun games in my area. (if you need to control something, it might as well be useful.) You control the objective you get to use its weapons. It keeps people from bringing heavy hitting table wiping forces and makes them actually bring more than the minimum FOC of troops or suffer. We have even used super heavies in regular 40K games with our own house rule which works similar to reserves. The vehicle starts with one functioning minor* weapon (*something found in the regular BRB or Codex) Then at the end of each turn you roll a d6 on a 6 another weapon is revived and is considered a one use weapon. This is done in order of weakest to strongest weapon order and the vehicle starts the game with 3 HP. This makes for some very exciting games. The game was originally designed to play and have fun. I can see not using some of the FW stuff in competitive play, but just for fun games should be anything goes as long as it is equal for each side.

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

I was hoping they would be in the book. Black Templar aren't either. Would be cool to have a formation for sisters.

And still not one piece of Xenos Fortification. Shame, shame, shame GW.

Cant have a formation of sisters. GW doesn't have that many metal sisters figures left in their warehouse.

I despise the Realm of Battle Board with every fibre of my being, but I have to repost this picture because it is a lovely board set up:



Would you pay over 2k for it? Of course not, but it looks amazing.

Don't know if this has already been brought up. Skimmed back several pages before posting but didn't see it. So apologies if it has already been posted.

I got my White Dwarf today and pulled out my reading glasses and magnifying glass in order to read the very small snippets of rules they had for Superheavy walkers and gargantuan creatures. Here is what I was able to decipher.

Looks like Superheavies lose structure points and get Hull Points instead, as it has HPs in some of the superheavy profiles. There is also a super heavy damage chart to roll on so it will probably be similar to the last edition's, so superheavies won't get destroyed in one shot. The chart was not in the WD.

Gargantuan creatures didn't change much. They still have most of the immunities they did before, such as not being able to be insta-killed. They also gain a bunch of special rules, such as Feel no Pain, Hammer of Wrath, and Vector strike (flying Gargantuans) to name a few.

Stomp attack has changed considerably. Instead of all models in base contact with the superheavy walker or gargantuan creature taking a hit, from what I can decipher, it looks like it generates D3 stomp attacks at initiative step 1. For each attack, you place a blast marker over the unit/vehicle being stomped, roll a D6, and then consult a chart. 1=nothing happens, 2-5 =non-vehicle models under the marker take a S6 AP4 hit, vehicles suffer a penetrating hit, 6=non-vehicle models under the template are removed from play, vehicles scatter D6 inches and then suffer an Explodes! result on the damage chart. Some things, like superheavies, gargantuan creatures, buildings, etc., can't be stomped.

The only thing that sucks, is the Tesseract Vault is so cool, I wish I could use it in regular games!

I really hope that's not all the formations, because that sure as hell isn't very much for Necrons, and there is no way I'm going to buy 15 more Lychguard, and 6 more Monoliths.

I can field all the Tyranid formations though....

Too true, looks amazing, way too expensive and totally unnecessary.

And anyone who buys it must either be insane or has WAY too much money

 Lord_Mortis wrote:
Stomp attack has changed considerably. Instead of all models in base contact with the superheavy walker or gargantuan creature taking a hit, from what I can decipher, it looks like it generates D3 stomp attacks at initiative step 1. For each attack, you place a blast marker over the unit/vehicle being stomped, roll a D6, and then consult a chart. 1=nothing happens, 2-5 =non-vehicle models under the marker take a S6 AP4 hit, vehicles suffer a penetrating hit, 6=non-vehicle models under the template are removed from play, vehicles scatter D6 inches and then suffer an Explodes! result on the damage chart. Some things, like superheavies, gargantuan creatures, buildings, etc., can't be stomped.

Cool. More randomness cinematicness.

 Sasori wrote:
I really hope that's not all the formations, because that sure as hell isn't very much for Necrons, and there is no way I'm going to buy 15 more Lychguard, and 6 more Monoliths.

The blurb for the rulebook says "over 100 formations", and the website has 1-click bundles for 94 of them. Make of that what you will, but it seems that Necrons didn't get all that many.

Meanwhile, who wants to field a full Scout Company?

 Sasori wrote:
I can field all the Tyranid formations though....

Hmm... that's a good question... what can I field of everything that's there?

Daemons: 3 of the Chaos Daemons ones, assuming the Khorne one doesn't require exactly 70 Bloodletters.

CSM: 5 of the Chaos Marine ones. Almost 6, but I don't have that many Spawn.

Eldar: I don't have enough Eldar to do any of those formations, although combined with two of my friends we could do the Wraithknight one. Kinda shocked there's no Wraithguard formation.

Imperial Guard: There is not a single Guard formation there that I cannot do. Some I can do more than once. I can do the Emperor's Fist Tank Company 3 times over.

Necrons: I have to assume that the big Warrior one doesn't require 100 Warriors, and if so I can do it. I decided against buying the Money Vault, so I can't do the Necropolis. I do hope there's a formation for multiple Monoliths (like the last version of Apoc) and that they don't all require a Money Vault.

Marines: Battle Company? Easily. Tactical Reserve? Probably. First Company? No problem. I could even do a Scout Company if I dip into my ancient single-pose plastic Scouts supplies. So 6 of what's there.

Tau: I don't own any Tau vehicles. Don't have enough Tau to do any of those.

Tyranids: All the Tyranid ones, although I don't have any Hive Guard.

Armageddon Imperium: I can do three of them, and that includes the Stronghold and the Mechanised Company.

 conker249 wrote:

I was hoping they would be in the book. Black Templar aren't either.

I guess you missed the Sons of Grimaldus formation, then?

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1090032a&prodId=prod2090141a

 Lord_Mortis wrote:

Stomp attack has changed considerably. Instead of all models in base contact with the superheavy walker or gargantuan creature taking a hit, from what I can decipher, it looks like it generates D3 stomp attacks at initiative step 1. For each attack, you place a blast marker over the unit/vehicle being stomped, roll a D6, and then consult a chart. 1=nothing happens, 2-5 =non-vehicle models under the marker take a S6 AP4 hit, vehicles suffer a penetrating hit, 6=non-vehicle models under the template are removed from play, vehicles scatter D6 inches and then suffer an Explodes! result on the damage chart. Some things, like superheavies, gargantuan creatures, buildings, etc., can't be stomped

Hmmm, how big are the blasts? You roll the D6 for each blast or all at once?


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I despise the Realm of Battle Board with every fibre of my being, but I have to repost this picture because it is a lovely board set up:



Would you pay over 2k for it? Of course not, but it looks amazing.

It does look great, but bear in mind it wont be painted :( Agreed it costs way too much

 conker249 wrote:

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

I was hoping they would be in the book. Black Templar aren't either. Would be cool to have a formation for sisters.

Black Templars actually got a bunch of formations under the Armaggedon tab. Sons of Grimaldus, Crusader Hailstorm, and a Heroes of the Imperium set. Lame part is all the IG offerings are Cadians rather than Steel Legion. But the Sisters did get screwed yet again. Boooooooo.

 Peregrine wrote:
But can you really magnetize it? It's not just a simple gun swap, you'll have to replace the entire center hull and that's a pretty important part structurally.

I don't have one in hand yet, but looking at the pictures, it doesn't look like it's going to be all that hard. More difficult than an arm or barrel swap, yeah, but it doesn't look super hard either.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Cool. More randomness cinematicness.

Even better, it's in a game that's already full of tedious dice rolling. Someone should tell GW that as your game gets bigger you need to simplify things, not make the more time consuming.

 Billagio wrote:

 Lord_Mortis wrote:

Stomp attack has changed considerably. Instead of all models in base contact with the superheavy walker or gargantuan creature taking a hit, from what I can decipher, it looks like it generates D3 stomp attacks at initiative step 1. For each attack, you place a blast marker over the unit/vehicle being stomped, roll a D6, and then consult a chart. 1=nothing happens, 2-5 =non-vehicle models under the marker take a S6 AP4 hit, vehicles suffer a penetrating hit, 6=non-vehicle models under the template are removed from play, vehicles scatter D6 inches and then suffer an Explodes! result on the damage chart. Some things, like superheavies, gargantuan creatures, buildings, etc., can't be stomped

Hmmm, how big are the blasts? You roll the D6 for each blast or all at once?

From what I can tell, you roll a D6 for each marker, and it looks like it is the small blast marker. The diagram shows a Stompa in assault with a unit of marines, and 3 blast markers being placed over the unit. I would imagine if the Stompa was in base contact with 2+ different units, it could make a seperate stomp attack on each one, depending on the roll of the D3.

OK, let's take a look see through the zero-savings bundles...

Legion Ascendant, I can do that several times over.
Crusader Hailstorm, I can do that.
Stompa Hunters, yep. Several times over.
Thousand Sons Warcoven, easily.
Lost and the Damned, check.
Deathwing Redemption, uh huh.
Carnival of Pain, covered.
Kabalite Web Strike,
Sickle Squadron...need one more Razorwing.
Cloudstrike, Farseer Council, and Sunstorm Squadron, yeppers. I can probably do the Farseers 3 times over, for that matter, unless Eldrad is mandatory for it.
Emperor's Talons, Emperor's Shield, and the Steel Fury BB squadron, check.
SM Battle Company, piece of cake, same with the Tactical Reserve Company.
Predator Assassin Squadron, yep, for a couple of different armies.
I'd need a third Razorshark for the Air Superiority Wing, Similarly with needing another Riptide for the Riptide Wing.
Got the Counterstrike Cadre, Rapid Insertion Force, and Skysweep Missile Defense covered, though.
I can do any of the Tyrannid one-click datasheets, some of them multiple times over. Kind of surprised they don't have one for the Tervi and/or Terrorfex. Not surprised that they don't have a flying swarm sheet, I'll expect that one when they put out a Shrike kit.


Yep, no need whatsoever to get any of the one-click deals, even if they had a modest savings.

There is also a pic of some of the strategic assets. Flank March looks to be the same as before....

Edit: Nope, looks like it may apply to just a single Apocalypse Formation. Can still come in from any table edge though.

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

The speculation is that since GW is no longer making metal models they'll either take them OOP or relaunch.

Not a good time to expect SoB materials.

Davor wrote:

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

My guess, is the Grey Knights purified themselves for the upcoming war.

Which reminds me of the game that was going on in the GW when I was ordering. GK vs. Sisters, and the GKs got WIPED for nearly zero losses by the Sisters.

 Lord_Mortis wrote:

 Billagio wrote:

 Lord_Mortis wrote:

Stomp attack has changed considerably. Instead of all models in base contact with the superheavy walker or gargantuan creature taking a hit, from what I can decipher, it looks like it generates D3 stomp attacks at initiative step 1. For each attack, you place a blast marker over the unit/vehicle being stomped, roll a D6, and then consult a chart. 1=nothing happens, 2-5 =non-vehicle models under the marker take a S6 AP4 hit, vehicles suffer a penetrating hit, 6=non-vehicle models under the template are removed from play, vehicles scatter D6 inches and then suffer an Explodes! result on the damage chart. Some things, like superheavies, gargantuan creatures, buildings, etc., can't be stomped

Hmmm, how big are the blasts? You roll the D6 for each blast or all at once?

From what I can tell, you roll a D6 for each marker, and it looks like it is the small blast marker. The diagram shows a Stompa in assault with a unit of marines, and 3 blast markers being placed over the unit. I would imagine if the Stompa was in base contact with 2+ different units, it could make a seperate stomp attack on each one, depending on the roll of the D3.

Alright, not too bad then. But as others have said it adds alot more tediousness to the game which isnt really needed.

 pretre wrote:

shade1313 wrote:
At least 3 of the CE went to preorders through my local GW store, and one of the guys ordered that AND the GE.

or so you hope. There were issues with stores over promising preorders and GW under delivering.

Considering I got my order in within two minutes of them being posted on the pre-orders page, I'll be royally PO'd if I don't get mine.

 Lord_Mortis wrote:
Edit: Nope, looks like it may apply to just a single Apocalypse Formation. Can still come in from any table edge though.

Good. That's the way it always should have been.

 Lord_Mortis wrote:
There is also a pic of some of the strategic assets. Flank March looks to be the same as before....

Edit: Nope, looks like it may apply to just a single Apocalypse Formation. Can still come in from any table edge though.

In other words, expect TFG to default to that one.

Edit: I started my comment before the clarification. Still, I'll likely keep Ambush tucked away for when I know someone's fielding The Green Tide. Although, if they can't assault on the turn of arrival as Outflanking units, that'd mitigate it somewhat.

I tend to avoid playing with formations or some the crazy assets, I call it big 40k or apoc light.

Rather suprised that Forgefiends/maulerfiends didnt get a formation, but the helldrakes did.....

might be time for a banablade formation then..

 H.B.M.C. wrote:


Hmm... that's a good question... what can I field of everything that's there?

Daemons: 3 of the Chaos Daemons ones, assuming the Khorne one doesn't require exactly 70 Bloodletters.

CSM: 5 of the Chaos Marine ones. Almost 6, but I don't have that many Spawn.

Eldar: I don't have enough Eldar to do any of those formations, although combined with two of my friends we could do the Wraithknight one. Kinda shocked there's no Wraithguard formation.

Imperial Guard: There is not a single Guard formation there that I cannot do. Some I can do more than once. I can do the Emperor's Fist Tank Company 3 times over.

Necrons: I have to assume that the big Warrior one doesn't require 100 Warriors, and if so I can do it. I decided against buying the Money Vault, so I can't do the Necropolis. I do hope there's a formation for multiple Monoliths (like the last version of Apoc) and that they don't all require a Money Vault.

Marines: Battle Company? Easily. Tactical Reserve? Probably. First Company? No problem. I could even do a Scout Company if I dip into my ancient single-pose plastic Scouts supplies. So 6 of what's there.

Tau: I don't own any Tau vehicles. Don't have enough Tau to do any of those.

Tyranids: All the Tyranid ones, although I don't have any Hive Guard.

Armageddon Imperium: I can do three of them, and that includes the Stronghold and the Mechanised Company.

You.....have a lot of tanks.

 Billagio wrote:
You.....have a lot of tanks.

Yeah. 30 Russes (technically 31 if you count the Bombard). 10-tank Artillery Company (including that Bombard). 12 Chimeras. 3 Hellhounds. 1 Stormblade. 1 Hellhammer. 2 Shadowswords. 3 Baneblades. 3 Macharii (one of each flavour). Then lots of other things like 6 Valks, 20 Sentinels, 400+ Infantry, and so on.

Someday, when I have finished building and painting them all, I will find an Apoc game to play in wherein I'll field 2 full SM Battle Companies, comprised entirely of the old Legion of the Damned.

Edit: Maybe 1 Battle Company. The other may be a Reserve Company of Tacticals, I'm not sure if I'll make enough of them into Assault Marines to do two Battle Companies.

... $300 for a case and a book. Who the feth can justify buying this junk?

If sisters of battle retributors can man vengeance platforms with punisher guns... there won't be a need for formations.

This will be the formation...

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 Billagio wrote:
You.....have a lot of tanks.

Yeah. 30 Russes (technically 31 if you count the Bombard). 10-tank Artillery Company (including that Bombard). 12 Chimeras. 3 Hellhounds. 1 Stormblade. 1 Hellhammer. 2 Shadowswords. 3 Baneblades. 3 Macharii (one of each flavour). Then lots of other things like 6 Valks, 20 Sentinels, 400+ Infantry, and so on.

My word...

Looking over these formations, they just seem to be a hodgepodge of whatever expensive Models GW could come up with and rarely have any strategic benefit to them.

And my Guard are only 4 tanks, basilisk, manticore, hydra, baneblade, 5 chimeras, 3 sentinels, 1 valkyrie, and ~90 infantry. I am a poor mans Regiment.

 Ravenous D wrote:
... $300 for a case and a book. Who the feth can justify buying this junk?

The same people who buy other prestige products (its a marketing term, look it up).

Like:
* Collectors editions of comics that sold for 25 cents and pay $500
* Sports cars that are $160,000
* People with no kids who never go camping/off road and buy an $50,000 suv
* A rolex watch.
* A 55" tv (or a 70" for that matter).
* An autograph
* a "signed" anything
* a "was used by ...(insert famous person name here)" item
* an big engagement ring
* old chairs from a stadium...
* a Tshirt from a concert for $50.

Get the idea?

While I won't buy most of those things...there are people who will.

The new cases are cool....but I will spend my money on other toys.

Anyone notice this on the digital releases page in WD?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Does anyone know if the new Vortex template is just the old one reskinned or the larger 5" one similar to the Storm of Magic templates?

It's the small template.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I despise the Realm of Battle Board with every fibre of my being, but I have to repost this picture because it is a lovely board set up:



Would you pay over 2k for it? Of course not, but it looks amazing.

Kinda, but there isn't much room left for models.

Apoc works best with a minimal amount of terrain on the table. There are so many models in a big game, you don't want half the board fitted with terrain.

The board would need to be 2x as big as the one pictured for a proper, balanced game. In this setup, you would be deploying your forces right next to enemy
emplacements.

Isn't much room left? Most of that table is empty space.

And minimal terrain is best? So it just becomes a "who brought the most long ranged guns" slugfest? No thanks. Never tell me that less terrain is better. Never.

That is a super bad ass looking army case. I kind of want one, although I don't know what for...

Is the Tesseract Vault the only new Necron release? It's cool and all, but might be too large for me to get much use out of, except as maybe terrain... Was hoping for some more new kits I could get cool bitz out of for my Cryx.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Isn't much room left? Most of that table is empty space.

And minimal terrain is best? So it just becomes a "who brought the most long ranged guns" slugfest? No thanks. Never tell me that less terrain is better. Never.

No, minimal terrain is best on that size table. It is way too cramped. Unless everyone is fighting with pure super heavies. That table needs to be WAY bigger for that terrain setup.

 dementedwombat wrote:
That flying "super monolith" looks pretty awesome. Can't wait to see someone buy it and paint it up with some awesome object source lighting from that star god thing in the middle.

It just looks so unbalanced and top heavy. I'd be afraid of it toppling over and breaking!

dlight wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Isn't much room left? Most of that table is empty space.

And minimal terrain is best? So it just becomes a "who brought the most long ranged guns" slugfest? No thanks. Never tell me that less terrain is better. Never.

No, minimal terrain is best on that size table. It is way too cramped. Unless everyone is fighting with pure super heavies. That table needs to be WAY bigger for that terrain setup.

hate to say it on a 6x8 table the biggest game I d play on it would be at max 5k and that would be a very large game on that size table. A good game on that table would be 3500-4k. At that size there is plenty of room for movement. with that terrain set up

 AndrewC wrote:
I think thats optomistic.

Two quad icarus lascannon? 96" range, presumably H2 TL w Int & Skyfire. (Based off of BrB P114)

Do you honestly think they will be accepted?

Cheers

Andrew

Well, they are on a building, not an artillery piece, so can be shaken, and I expect the bunker to be in the 250-300 point range with the pair of quad lascannons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 SickSix wrote:
I like how they are selling the 'Fortress of Arrogance' that was a converted Baneblade from last Apoc Ed. and now it's just a more expensive box with a $20 comissar yarrick figure.

Oh and confirms that discounted bundles are 100% DEAD. No more Christmas megaforces :(

If they took away battleforces, then maybe I'd agree that Megaforces were gone. But I still expect to see 4-5 of them come December, 2 for Fantasy, Space Marines +1 for 40K and maybe daemons.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Ok, the collector's wasn't that big a deal. I thought it came with templates and other stuff, but really it's the book divided up into smaller things, the cards, and an extra warzone. Not a huge loss.

And it says that there are 100 formations, all available as easy 1-click bundles, confirming our fears that everything in this book is a readily available model purchase rather than something a bit more creative (like the last version of Apoc, that included things like Warlord Titans). This also makes me believe that further formations will not be released via PDF on their website but as overpriced iOS bs.

I'm guessing 100 formations plus superheavy units and such. The Lord of Skulls, Megalith, and Reaver Titan all are new additions to the book, and it is 296 pages vs the 200 pages of Apoc 1 and 88 pages of Reload.

As for Apoc formations in iOS stuff, my prediction is that they will show up in various Codex Supplements, which already have Planetstrike and Cities of Death. Apoc seems too logical not to add to them.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 AndrewC wrote:
I've just realised from looking at the pictures on GW that the quad cannon arn't even mounted on the fortification. So we'll have the ADL quad gun placement arguement twice over now.

Cheers

Andrew

The quad las, punisher cannon, and battle cannon turrets all fit into the little turret rings, so they can only go on the vengeance turret mount, or one of three places on the redoubt. They don't sit on top wherever.

I was looking at the templates and kinda laughed at the product description.

"These are an essential purchase for anyone who wants to play games of Apocalypse."

...which is of course why they're in extremely limited supply. Make sure you buy this "essential" now, or it's gone forever!

Same thing with the rest of this junk, honestly. The vortex template is kinda cool, I actually think it looks better than the webway portal and could probably be used as one for all those DE players that missed out on that the first time, but like everything GW sells now it's extremely limited so BUY IT NOOOOW if you really want it! The cards are a neat idea, but again, if you don't BUY IT NOOOOW you'll never get them. This stuff really shouldn't be limited, yet it is. Hell, why not make all the codices, rulebooks, and maybe even the models "while stocks last" from now on, why keep anything around for longer than a month?

It's just little things like that which really bother me.

So these are all up for pre-order... But does anyone know the release date?

Think it's the 14th of next month.

Two weeks I believe.

Even though I could tell that's what they would be from the White Dwarf its really sad to see the one click bundles... do they really think folks are that stupid.

That terrain set-up looks nice, but can you imagine what a modelling/painting studio could come up with for that much money?

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

I know I shouldn't laugh... but this comment is just so pitiful... (sorry The nameless! )

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1090030a&prodId=prod2090131a&rootCatGameStyle=

Did they just kill Yarrick?

The siege of Tempestora Hive saw a gathering of three of the greatest heroes of the Armageddon War - Commissar Yarrick, High Marshal Helbrecht, and Captain Tycho. Tempestora may have been lost, but thanks to the actions of these three men, Armageddon Prime still held on.

Did they just kill off one the most Iconic characters in 40K?

 Ravenous D wrote:
... $300 for a case and a book. Who the feth can justify buying this junk?

Would not buy any of these.

 dreamakuma wrote:

Did they just kill off one the most Iconic characters in 40K?

Na'h, they are just referencing stuff we already know with a more in depth look, only Tycho actually died in that fight, Yarrick is still in pursuit of Ghaz somewhere. Tbh those two fluff books are part of the reason I'm considering a CE.

If you break down the £150 into GW mentality pricing it ain't that bad.

Leather cover Apocalypse book - easy £50 on its own
100 Card stock formation cards - I'd say £30
Five door reference screen - £15
Strategic Cards - £8
The hard book background book £30 - based on Iyanden
The two soft back ones £15 each.

So separately its be over £160 and that's not counting the case, which is pretty funky.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:


Yeah. 30 Russes (technically 31 if you count the Bombard). 10-tank Artillery Company (including that Bombard). 12 Chimeras. 3 Hellhounds. 1 Stormblade. 1 Hellhammer. 2 Shadowswords. 3 Baneblades. 3 Macharii (one of each flavour). Then lots of other things like 6 Valks, 20 Sentinels, 400+ Infantry, and so on.

Wow HMBC. Where do you get the time/money/space to get all of that? You must be very comfortable financially!!

And.. I just convinced myself to pre order a Collectors with that breakdown.

 ceorron wrote:

 H.B.M.C. wrote:


Yeah. 30 Russes (technically 31 if you count the Bombard). 10-tank Artillery Company (including that Bombard). 12 Chimeras. 3 Hellhounds. 1 Stormblade. 1 Hellhammer. 2 Shadowswords. 3 Baneblades. 3 Macharii (one of each flavour). Then lots of other things like 6 Valks, 20 Sentinels, 400+ Infantry, and so on.

Wow HMBC. Where do you get the time/money/space to get all of that? You must be very comfortable financially!!

Either that or he's good at robbing stores!

Anyway, 95 quid for the Khorne mower. 95 quid. 95 quid...

95... you get the gist of what I'm saying. I'm so glad I bailed out of GW a while back.

This is the first release ive never even thought about buying anything, well, apart from the WD.
Edit: I predict many more to come. Thanks GW.

H.B.M.C. wrote:Collector's is already sold out in Oz. Wow.

Wait, they sold BOTH boxes?

Kid_Kyoto wrote:

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

The speculation is that since GW is no longer making metal models they'll either take them OOP or relaunch.
Not a good time to expect SoB materials.

... nor do they have a Codex in print. Maybe GW could offer a 100€ Sororitas Apocalypse box, consisting of 2 standard units
BTW has there ever been a good time to expect SoB material in the last 10 years?

Sidstyler wrote:I was looking at the templates and kinda laughed at the product description.
"These are an essential purchase for anyone who wants to play games of Apocalypse."
...which is of course why they're in extremely limited supply. Make sure you buy this "essential" now, or it's gone forever!

Yeah, that is quite revealing

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

Templars weren't invited either, I call religious discrimination!

EDIT: Wow, looks like we were invited after all, but not under the "all formations" tab, but the Armageddon tab. Why make things clear when you can make them confusing, eh?

Well i'll be buying at least 2 of the Vaults and maybe 1 Obelisk depending on what it does as to me it just doesn't float my boat like the Vault does, naturally with the rulebook and probably the templates.

Turns out i'll already have the -
Infinite Phalanx a couple times over.
The War Council of Mandragora (when they are all painted otherwise i have stand ins i can use for now).
The Baleful Necropolis when i get a Vault as i somehow managed to gather around 10 Monoliths over the years.

Should be fun to see what these do whenever i can get a game.

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

Templars weren't invited either, I call religious discrimination!

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1090032a&prodId=prod2090141a

Dam I wanted to get 1 Baneblade and another Shadowsword but not a 170 Canadian. Any word at whether the previous separate boxes that are still in circulation will go up to the new kit's price?

 gianlucafiorentini123 wrote:

AlmightyWalrus wrote:

The nameless wrote:
I'm not sure if this has been brought up, but why weren't the Sisters invited to this fight?

Templars weren't invited either, I call religious discrimination!

http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat1090032a&prodId=prod2090141a

Yup, realized when I checked through the Armageddon tab. Rather silly that the Sisters weren't included there TBH, they were there as well after all.

Those formations, just holy fething gak. Damn, so awesome.

 ceorron wrote:
Wow HMBC. Where do you get the time/money/space to get all of that? You must be very comfortable financially!!

It took me years to build it up to that level.

All I want to really know is if the old rule of Chaos being able to use Imperial formations as 'traitor' formations is still there.

Else I have a whole damn Traitor Battle Company for nothing.

anyone saying that sisters got screwed by not being included in the formation set up is missing a big point. If they actually put up a formation for sisters then the £1000 price tag for that battle board+forts will look reasonable!
When a standard SoB squad costs roughly £50 (for ten models), and a minimum heavy weapon squad costs £42.5 (for 5 models). Any type of formation near to any of the others would be ridiculously priced. For instance if you were to do an equivalent of the C:SM reserve company in SoB then it would run at £620ish.....compared to £360ish......

Im glad there arent any SoB formations because it would mean some poor fool would probably buy it at some point, and its just not worth it. Get on eBay and buy your SoB there like everyone else does.

Their latest video is a laugh-and-a-half. Goes to prove how every surface at GW is now a Realm of Battle. Can't even show off the new case on a fething table. Its gotto be a RoBB! I wonder if all the desks at GWHQ have been forcibly removed and replaced with RoBB's?

[EDIT]: Actually, everything about this [ulr=http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/wnt/blog.jsp?pid=9700060]new article[/url] is kinda hilarious. I mean the first line of the article shamelessly links to two big kits (Stompa and Wraithknight). Then there are gems like this:

GW wrote:In smaller games of Warhammer 40,000 you often find yourself torn between what units to include in your army. One of the great things about Apocalypse is that that dilemma will rarely come up as you can use anything you like. You could, for example field a Chaos Space Marine army backed up by Chaos Daemons, allied to a regiment of rebellious Imperial Guard and supported by a Khorne Lord of Skulls and a squadron of Baneblades. Or maybe a horde of Orks teamed up with Dark Eldar. The great thing is that there are no restrictions in Apocalypse.

They realise that the herp-a-derp allies chart from 6th basically removed a lot of those restrictions anyway? The main difference here is that Tyranid players can finally ally with things. And Sisters and Templar players can ally without the rulebook scolding them for it. That's about it.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
All I want to really know is if the old rule of Chaos being able to use Imperial formations as 'traitor' formations is still there.

NO! You're only allowed to use things that they explicitly sell as model kits. There is no Chaos Battle Company, therefore such a thing does not exist! Any attempt to use such a formation will result in a summary execution.

Gotta admit though the formations look delicious. Always wanted a death company group, just a shame ill prob never be able to get one.

Havent counted but is that all the formations then including heavies that are in the book?

They will do new formations every WD for a while so no need to panic regarding SOB's as sure they will get one.
Wonder if it has the blank sheets like the old one to create new formations or not.

So we are seeing a downside to the CHS case. But, it's fething apocalypse! You can make your own units and you're own data sheets. I don't think people are going to stop bringing their Warlords to apocalypse games if they aren't in this book.

I'm normally quite quick to cut GW some slack, but this is the first that I'm actually insulted at how stupid GW thinks I am.

"Here, buy a 'Stompa Mob'! You get no discount, and its exactly the same as increasing the quantity by one before you click 'add to cart' on a Stompa, but we need to set it as a separate entry in case you're too dumb to add something to your cart twice"

That moment when the GW design team had a BRILLANT idea for a model just after a full-drunk Power Rangers marathon.

I mean, really, WHAT THE FORK!

 SickSix wrote:
So we are seeing a downside to the CHS case. But, it's fething apocalypse! You can make your own units and you're own data sheets. I don't think people are going to stop bringing their Warlords to apocalypse games if they aren't in this book.

I know I intend to keep using my plague tower, too much time and money has gone into that for it to become scenery.

 Goliath wrote:
I'm normally quite quick to cut GW some slack, but this is the first that I'm actually insulted at how stupid GW thinks I am.

That was the thing about Apocalypse: There was a point to the bundles. The original Battle Company? Captain + Command Squad + 6 Tactical Squads + 2 Assault Squads + 2 Devastator Squads + 9 fething Rhinos (and a Razorback for fun!) for about AUD$800 (and about US$400-500). Now it's over AUD$1k, and there are no Rhinos, but a few Dreads thrown in. The Land Raider formation (that had 4 Land Raiders IIRC), basically came with a free Land Raider. The Dread Mob had 3 Deff Dreadz.

And so on.

Apocalypse was a runaway success for GW last time because there was an actual point to buying the formations. Now they're just the same price as always.

 Sigvatr wrote:


That moment when the GW design team had a BRILLANT idea for a model just after a full-drunk Power Rangers marathon.

I mean, really, WHAT THE FORK!

This is not a new idea...



They should have kept the bull head. In fact, I miss the bull headed Khornate demons. The 3rd ed bloodletters were gnarly.

HBMC - The best one for me was the old carnifex brood.
carnifex x3 for £50.

Nearly doubled in price now.



Also, this really does piss me off
They release a daemon engine for chaos, and daemons dont get it. (i know, allies and all that, but still)
I would have assumed that daemons got the daemon engines.




Edit:

They should have kept the bull head. In fact, I miss the bull headed Khornate demons. The 3rd ed bloodletters were gnarly.

You mean the large built, impressive looking beasts with the maines?
The ones that also carried the signature weapon of khorne?
You know, the ones that looked like a war daemon, as opposed to a pissed off, red skinned naomi campbell lookalike?

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Apocalypse was a runaway success for GW last time because there was an actual point to buying the formations. Now they're just the same price as always.

And that's even more depressing, because it highlights just how utterly stupid the pricing has actually gotten. The old rapid insertion force with all the battlesuits was about $125 if I'm not mistaken...the battlesuits are pretty ugly models but being able to get literally an army's worth for that price, you can't really complain. The same fething models, years later, but with a riptide thrown in: over $300(!).

If there were any discounted Tau bundles I'd think about buying them, but I'm not going to bother if they're full price. I was holding out hope that the armored interdiction force would be back so I could grab two more hammerheads/sky rays and a devilfish at a good price, but at full retail I'd rather not. I'd rather do without or just buy one now and then, on the off chance I feel like pissing away $60 at the local store and there aren't any X-Wing models in stock. GW apparently doesn't realize that actual deals are what get us to spend our money...we all have big enough collections of unpainted models already sitting at home and budgets that are stretched too thin as it is, so you're not going to entice very many people with "We'll save you literally a whole minute of your time by just adding all this gak to your cart for you!"

 Jackal wrote:
I would have assumed that daemons got the daemon engines.

I'd have just assumed daemons were a part of the CSM army, since...they kinda always were. There was no reason to ever split them.

Well, I bought the Khornemower and the Dice of Dice. Dunno why. I guess I like dice.

I also bought a lot of plasticard. Chaos Knight, here I come. Might as well do a proper tower demon engine out of the leftovers too.

 scrunty wrote:
anyone saying that sisters got screwed by not being included in the formation set up is missing a big point. If they actually put up a formation for sisters then the £1000 price tag for that battle board+forts will look reasonable!
When a standard SoB squad costs roughly £50 (for ten models), and a minimum heavy weapon squad costs £42.5 (for 5 models). Any type of formation near to any of the others would be ridiculously priced. For instance if you were to do an equivalent of the C:SM reserve company in SoB then it would run at £620ish.....compared to £360ish......

A Black Templars 10-man troops choice with CCWs is £63 (!!) if you don't buy Assault Marines and convert them to foot marines by adding backpacks, in which case they're £49 without special or heavy weapons. Having a Sisters formation wouldn't be too outrageous IMO.

I also bought a lot of plasticard. Chaos Knight, here I come. Might as well do a proper tower demon engine out of the leftovers too.

Yeah, the legs shouldn't be hard to build and then the model is actually pretty cool. The thing holding me back isn't actually the prices, it's that the Apocalypse game is so incredibly bad I just can't see the point.

It's not a war game. It's something I played around 22 years ago when it was cool to just play with toys and make your own rules as you go. I'm just too old for a miniature purchasing competition where the gaming part is about deploying hundreds of non-uniform badly painted guys on the table, playing a couple random cards, throwing 200 dice and the other guy putting his little toys back into the bitz box.

This would have been the perfect chance to re-release the wulfen for space wolves.
Instead we get useless bundles and still no flyers. And i dont care about allies.

And why is it so hard to finally release SoB plastic miniatures?

Why releas more "sidegames" instead of all the miniatures we still need?

HamHamLunchbox wrote:
Why releas more "sidegames" instead of all the miniatures we still need?

Because the way GW sees it, there's 100 guys in the world who are interested in Sisters models, while there's potentially thousands of guys who'll buy some new edition of Space Crusade or HeroQuest.

 Therion wrote:

HamHamLunchbox wrote:
Why releas more "sidegames" instead of all the miniatures we still need?

Because the way GW sees it, there's 100 guys in the world who are interested in Sisters models, while there's potentially thousands of guys who'll buy some new edition of Space Crusade or HeroQuest.

I was actually referring to apocalypse as side game and not specialist games like space hulk,necromunda...

And of course people are buying things like spacehulk and space crusade because they usually are limited edition and have some cool minis in it.

Releasing SoB would be so easy. One box with all the heavy weapons and the option to built sisters or seraphim. ONE freaking box.

GW: the reason why we cant have nice things

 HamHamLunchbox wrote:
Why releas more "sidegames" instead of all the miniatures we still need?

Apoc is also the perfect time to release a few "gap filler" models, so things like the Hydra or the Harpy or whatever. But no. 1-click-bundles ahoy!

How much was the Baneblade before it went up to £85?

And the Khornemower and others are £95.

I laughed. Sad. I thought the big monolith would be £50-60, silly me!

It's particularly bad that with some of the one click bundles, the money saved if bought from an independent with a discount would buy you a whole new army as well.

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
How much was the Baneblade before it went up to £85?

Something like that; But it was a baneblade only kit. they combined the baneblade & stormlord kits into a dual kit.
still too much of a price increase; but not as bad as it looks at first.

So new Baneblade is all 8 variants combined. At +15€.
Who doesn't need every piece of those 295 should get some of the old boxes.

The bundles have always been odd marketing. One would imagine the giving bundles a small discount (even 5%) would be worth it. Then they could at least market them as moneysavers, even if the actual discount wouldn't be terribly large. I'd imagine the increased sales would cover the discount.

So the new terrain pieces will have rules for 40K games in the box, but there is no mention of those rules being elsewhere? Hopefully they're a free PDF on the website or in a White Dwarf or something. Like others, I would be interested in seeing how powerful the anti-flier fortifications will be in standard 40K, but I shouldn't have to buy the model in order to see the rules.

I doubt Gw will publish the terrain rules outside the boxes, they don't want customers freeloading by scratch building their own.

Be thankful they're even doing that, the alternative is making you buy the $80 Apocalypse book or some kind of $50 "Terrain in the 41st Millenium" supplement or some crap like that.

 Sidstyler wrote:
Be thankful they're even doing that, the alternative is making you buy the $80 Apocalypse book or some kind of $50 "Terrain in the 41st Millenium" supplement or some crap like that.

Stop giving them ideas!

 Sidstyler wrote:
Be thankful they're even doing that, the alternative is making you buy the $80 Apocalypse book or some kind of $50 "Terrain in the 41st Millenium" supplement or some crap like that.

No, no, no. Three separate $9.99 "Terrain of the 41st Millennium" iOS only documents.

davethepak wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
... $300 for a case and a book. Who the feth can justify buying this junk?

The same people who buy other prestige products (its a marketing term, look it up).

Like:
* Collectors editions of comics that sold for 25 cents and pay $500
* Sports cars that are $160,000
* People with no kids who never go camping/off road and buy an $50,000 suv
* A rolex watch.
* A 55" tv (or a 70" for that matter).
* An autograph
* a "signed" anything
* a "was used by ...(insert famous person name here)" item
* an big engagement ring
* old chairs from a stadium...
* a Tshirt from a concert for $50.

Get the idea?

While I won't buy most of those things...there are people who will.

The new cases are cool....but I will spend my money on other toys.

See most of those things are resellable, increase in value, functional, or have an affordable price point. Warhammer does not increase in value, nor will it ever, those "limited editions" aren't worth jack, and wont be worth jack in 10 years.This is a box, with a book, for a game you wont play more then a few times for $300. At least last time they were doing cheap bundles, but this is just dumb.

The only thing that is actually fair is the 125 dice for $30

UNCLEBADTOUCH wrote:

 Sidstyler wrote:
Be thankful they're even doing that, the alternative is making you buy the $80 Apocalypse book or some kind of $50 "Terrain in the 41st Millenium" supplement or some crap like that.

Stop giving them ideas!

 SwampRats45MK wrote:
Dam I wanted to get 1 Baneblade and another Shadowsword but not a 170 Canadian. Any word at whether the previous separate boxes that are still in circulation will go up to the new kit's price?

I am pretty sure that would be illegal. At least very dishonest.

Previous boxes go to land fill.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
Previous boxes go to land fill.

Or to the managers collection/friends, only landfill trip I saw was when the head trainer showed up and took all the dreadfleet and left the store in his rental car.

Wow, they put a broken model up for display: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=&prodId=prod2130074a

Take a look at her in 360 degree view.

Also, the Baneblade only went up €15 in price for us. Used to be €95, is €110 now,

 BrookM wrote:
Wow, they put a broken model up for display: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=&prodId=prod2130074a

Take a look at her in 360 degree view.

Also, the Baneblade only went up €15 in price for us. Used to be €95, is €110 now,

wow broken rear track.....

and yeah i want the rules for those new quad LC batteries

and another thing on the iBook WD ( dont know if its in print) but apparently the strategic asset cards are the eldar psycic power cards... very handy for us chaos players

 BrookM wrote:
Wow, they put a broken model up for display: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=&prodId=prod2130074a

Take a look at her in 360 degree view.

Also, the Baneblade only went up €15 in price for us. Used to be €95, is €110 now,

Well, this is the same Baneblade they've had up since it first came out. After sitting in storage for so long, the piece must have fallen out and got lost. The photography team noticed it and suggested that they get a replacement piece for the tread, but procurement told them that spending $140 on a new kit just for one piece was ridiculous. Photography suggested going to a bits seller, but legal reminded them that they no longer existed. So, they decided to just photograph the dang thing as-is and not worry about it too much.

 Lansirill wrote:


Well, this is the same Baneblade they've had up since it first came out. After sitting in storage for so long, the piece must have fallen out and got lost. The photography team noticed it and suggested that they get a replacement piece for the tread, but procurement told them that spending $140 on a new kit just for one piece was ridiculous. Photography suggested going to a bits seller, but legal reminded them that they no longer existed. So, they decided to just photograph the dang thing as-is and not worry about it too much.

Great story, someone is paying attention.

It is not the first, there is a broken/incorrect built wraithguard on the front of that box too. Photo team shouldn't be QA but they are getting sloppy.

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
How much was the Baneblade before it went up to £85?

And the Khornemower and others are £95.

I laughed. Sad. I thought the big monolith would be £50-60, silly me!

It was £60 when it was released back with the original Apocalypse, then went up to £70 at some point between now and then, and now they've bundled the extra stuff that came with the shadowsword/stormlord kit into it and bumped the price up to £85. Whilst the price at £70 was possibly a tad unreasonable, the amount of extra stuff you get for the extra £15 is well worth it I'd say (though that is coming from an Ork player who is planning on covering the entire thing in plasticard and cannibalising the extra gunz.)

So yeah, current price increase taken on its own is quite reasonable for the extras that you get, but the price it came from is slightly unreasonable.

 BrookM wrote:
Wow, they put a broken model up for display: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=&prodId=prod2130074a

Take a look at her in 360 degree view.

Also, the Baneblade only went up €15 in price for us. Used to be €95, is €110 now,

piss. poor.

Very piss poor indeed.

 Goliath wrote:

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
How much was the Baneblade before it went up to £85?

And the Khornemower and others are £95.

I laughed. Sad. I thought the big monolith would be £50-60, silly me!

It was £60 when it was released back with the original Apocalypse, then went up to £70 at some point between now and then, and now they've bundled the extra stuff that came with the shadowsword/stormlord kit into it and bumped the price up to £85. Whilst the price at £70 was possibly a tad unreasonable, the amount of extra stuff you get for the extra £15 is well worth it I'd say (though that is coming from an Ork player who is planning on covering the entire thing in plasticard and cannibalising the extra gunz.)

So yeah, current price increase taken on its own is quite reasonable for the extras that you get, but the price it came from is slightly unreasonable.

Ah right, I remember paying £60 so it having increased by more than half that raises an eyebrow.

 BrookM wrote:
Wow, they put a broken model up for display: http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=&prodId=prod2130074a

Take a look at her in 360 degree view.

Also, the Baneblade only went up €15 in price for us. Used to be €95, is €110 now,

The jetbike autarch 360 is the same, there is a massive metal chip on the lance arm, he isn't even attached to the bike and the banner is busted.

At least they avoided a Sony PS3 $599! moment and didn't put the prices of various articles in the youtub videos.

I see GW have changed their logo on their website from red/yellow to a greeny gunmetal colour and a skull (obviously).

Is that a limited think for Apoc or is it a permanent change?

 Howard A Treesong wrote:

 Goliath wrote:

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
How much was the Baneblade before it went up to £85?

And the Khornemower and others are £95.

I laughed. Sad. I thought the big monolith would be £50-60, silly me!

It was £60 when it was released back with the original Apocalypse, then went up to £70 at some point between now and then, and now they've bundled the extra stuff that came with the shadowsword/stormlord kit into it and bumped the price up to £85. Whilst the price at £70 was possibly a tad unreasonable, the amount of extra stuff you get for the extra £15 is well worth it I'd say (though that is coming from an Ork player who is planning on covering the entire thing in plasticard and cannibalising the extra gunz.)

So yeah, current price increase taken on its own is quite reasonable for the extras that you get, but the price it came from is slightly unreasonable.

Ah right, I remember paying £60 so it having increased by more than half that raises an eyebrow.

I think your maths is slightly dodgy there half of £60 is £30, so it would have to be more than £90 to have increased by more than half that

Is it just me or does it look like they just did a black wash over plastic for the Tesseract Vault's inside parts? It looks unpainted. Whatever it is the grey nearly unpainted look is really bad.

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
I see GW have changed their logo on their website from red/yellow to a greeny gunmetal colour and a skull (obviously).

Is that a limited think for Apoc or is it a permanent change?

They did the same thing when they released the 6th ed rulebook.

Almost as great as the new WD
Hate the bloody fold out pages to start with, more so when there are 2 together.
And its just filled with pure gak.
Nothing of interest atall unless you like the flying box or khornemower.

Just wait, we'll get word soon that the box and book set is sold out, Great News!

Well if nothing else the vortex grenade template is already gone, at least on the UK site, didn't expect it to go that quickly.

 Ignatius-Grulgor wrote:
Well if nothing else the vortex grenade template is already gone, at least on the UK site, didn't expect it to go that quickly.

People wanted to participate in the Apoc release and it's the only thing most people can afford anymore!

People complain that GW doesn't copy WM and release rules for stuff in the boxes of said stuff. Games Workshop releases new stuff with rules in box. People complain that it isn't free.


Dakka's operating at normal capacity, I see.

On the topic of broken models being used for display, for a while now you've been able to spot blue tack holding on various parts on models being used in 360's and promotional pics. The Finecast Tau commander is one of them, and I remember being able to see the stuff on the back of the flying hive tyrant kit.

I kinda want the template, but now that I think about it $15 is a lot for that. I can't remember, wasn't the DE WWP $10 when it came out years ago?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
People complain that GW doesn't copy WM and release rules for stuff in the boxes of said stuff. Games Workshop releases new stuff with rules in box. People complain that it isn't free.


Dakka's operating at normal capacity, I see.

It's most likely not the same people doing the complaining, but feth, why let that get in the way of taking a good jab at people?

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
People complain that GW doesn't copy WM and release rules for stuff in the boxes of said stuff. Games Workshop releases new stuff with rules in box. People complain that it isn't free.

Way to generalise bro.

 Goliath wrote:

 Howard A Treesong wrote:

 Goliath wrote:

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
How much was the Baneblade before it went up to £85?

And the Khornemower and others are £95.

I laughed. Sad. I thought the big monolith would be £50-60, silly me!

It was £60 when it was released back with the original Apocalypse, then went up to £70 at some point between now and then, and now they've bundled the extra stuff that came with the shadowsword/stormlord kit into it and bumped the price up to £85. Whilst the price at £70 was possibly a tad unreasonable, the amount of extra stuff you get for the extra £15 is well worth it I'd say (though that is coming from an Ork player who is planning on covering the entire thing in plasticard and cannibalising the extra gunz.)

So yeah, current price increase taken on its own is quite reasonable for the extras that you get, but the price it came from is slightly unreasonable.

Ah right, I remember paying £60 so it having increased by more than half that raises an eyebrow.

I think your maths is slightly dodgy there half of £60 is £30, so it would have to be more than £90 to have increased by more than half that

Of course, I think I was still reeling from the £95 on the other kits.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
People complain that GW doesn't copy WM and release rules for stuff in the boxes of said stuff. Games Workshop releases new stuff with rules in box. People complain that it isn't free.

Way to generalise bro.

The odd part about that statement is that it could be said that WM actually copied GW. GW used to release rules in datafaxes with the boxed sets you buy.

I count about 80 "1 click" formations on GW website + 15 for Armageddon formations. So, depending on whether the Armageddon ones are included or separate from the "more than 100" the blurb talks about, there is still room for some Forgeworld formations. And from WDD:

There are other formations in the Apocalypse Rulebook, such as Titans, that can be found on the Forge World website. I'll be taking a closer look at the Apocalypse rulebook on Monday, where I'll explain more of the rules that make Apocalypse such a unique experience, including the Finest Hour, Unnatural Disasters and Divine Intervention.

Guys.

I have done a bad thing. Or a good thing. I just placed an order for the Gamers' Edition.

Oh, and the Dice of Dice, too.

 DarkStarSabre wrote:
All I want to really know is if the old rule of Chaos being able to use Imperial formations as 'traitor' formations is still there.

Else I have a whole damn Traitor Battle Company for nothing.

Nowhere near a Battle Company, but this, as I play CSM and now have 2 Baneblades (and would consider a 3rd if I could use the Steel Fury formation).

Apocalypse means you can take anything, doesn't it? It certainly used to, and some of the wording on the GW site implided you could.

FOC is out the window, but formations are still by army. The old book specifically allowed chaos to use any imperial formations.

At least this is how I understood it, although I must admit to very limited experience with Apoc.


edited to add clarification


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Guess it will also depend on how the allies system works in the new book.

 Goliath wrote:

 Howard A Treesong wrote:
How much was the Baneblade before it went up to £85?

And the Khornemower and others are £95.

I laughed. Sad. I thought the big monolith would be £50-60, silly me!

It was £60 when it was released back with the original Apocalypse, then went up to £70 at some point between now and then, and now they've bundled the extra stuff that came with the shadowsword/stormlord kit into it and bumped the price up to £85. Whilst the price at £70 was possibly a tad unreasonable, the amount of extra stuff you get for the extra £15 is well worth it I'd say (though that is coming from an Ork player who is planning on covering the entire thing in plasticard and cannibalising the extra gunz.)

So yeah, current price increase taken on its own is quite reasonable for the extras that you get, but the price it came from is slightly unreasonable.

Yes ... but you can still make only the one vehicle from it? I'm sure most people would rather you just had a choice of 3 different boxes at the £70 (which was already ridiculous), and you can choose the tank you would like?

I'm happy.
Just bought the WD mag ordered the normal book and a set of templates.
Went to my flgs got a standard discount and it cost me £50 and i'll be getting on the day of release..
If it doesn't get revised for as long as the old version did then i'm very happy.
That book must've clocked up well over 300hrs of gaming.
If this is the same, and I see no reason why it shouldn't be, i'll get 17p per hour out of it.
Gonna be painting extra stuff up like a mad thing over the next two weeks.

I'm fine.

 Alex Kolodotschko wrote:
I'm happy.
Just bought the WD mag ordered the normal book and a set of templates.
Went to my flgs got a standard discount and it cost me £50 and i'll be getting on the day of release..
If it doesn't get revised for as long as the old version did then i'm very happy.
That book must've clocked up well over 300hrs of gaming.
If this is the same, and I see no reason why it shouldn't be, i'll get 17p per hour out of it.
Gonna be painting extra stuff up like a mad thing over the next two weeks.

I'm fine.

OT: Which FLGS is that?

UltraPrime wrote:

 Alex Kolodotschko wrote:
I'm happy.
Just bought the WD mag ordered the normal book and a set of templates.
Went to my flgs got a standard discount and it cost me £50 and i'll be getting on the day of release..
If it doesn't get revised for as long as the old version did then i'm very happy.
That book must've clocked up well over 300hrs of gaming.
If this is the same, and I see no reason why it shouldn't be, i'll get 17p per hour out of it.
Gonna be painting extra stuff up like a mad thing over the next two weeks.

I'm fine.

OT: Which FLGS is that?

I too am interested... Taunton's not too far from Bristol after all...
Back OT; Was incredulous when I found out they're sticking with this inane 'One Click Collection' nonsense. The old release did so well for them it makes me wonder who the gak they've hired this time round... As for making it easier for non-gamers (Parents and the like) to order without the risk of getting the wrong thing, I'm sure GW used to have 'gift lists' or somesuch. I know they have wish lists now that the hobbiest/gamer can add to, guessing that's replaced it?

am I correct in assuming the one click apoc collections offer no cost savings?

 ironicsilence wrote:
am I correct in assuming the one click apoc collections offer no cost savings?

Yup. If I'm not wrong they're also Pre-Orders, which is a little silly considering that you can just buy them separately for the same cost and earlier delivery. Not that you'd want to do that, of course, when you can get 20% off it from elsewhere...

You would be correct, unfortunately. So there is literally no difference between ordering a One Click Collection of a Karnage Swadron (3 Ork Bommers) and simply going to the Bomma's original page and entering '3' into the quantity box. Except maybe, maybe, a few seconds. That's it. No discount at all, unlike the original Apoc release where you could get 3 Carnifexes for £50, effectively getting a whole Carnifex free (They were £25 each at the time).

@ Sandyman/Ultraprime-
'Vanguard Wargaming' in Hotwells Bristol.
It's the best place to go now that 'Cut and Thrust' has gone.

I like how there are Rough Riders on the cover, could that be a hint maybe?

 ironicsilence wrote:
am I correct in assuming the one click apoc collections offer no cost savings?

Always assume the worst

http://pinsofwar.com/sneaky-apocalypse-pricing/

 Zweischneid wrote:

 ironicsilence wrote:
am I correct in assuming the one click apoc collections offer no cost savings?

Always assume the worst

http://pinsofwar.com/sneaky-apocalypse-pricing/

This is great news!!

Right.

 Zweischneid wrote:

 ironicsilence wrote:
am I correct in assuming the one click apoc collections offer no cost savings?

Always assume the worst

http://pinsofwar.com/sneaky-apocalypse-pricing/

Epic.

Glad I bought a Baneblade before they hiked up the price. After taxes it works out at a nice fat $195.50 and the Tesseract Arc which I really wanted is $218. Also the fact that there are no nice discounted bundles really does it for me, where is the incentive to buy heaps of plastic now?

And $30 characters, that's just not cool...

It's strange actually. I checked the US and AU prices to compare prices and all the larger kits are hugely more expensive than both other countries yet you poor aussies have to pay almost $40 for those bland SM characters, horrific!

I do love the new scenery though, it's just a shame that the actual terrain sections are littered with Cadians which really puts me off.

All in all a pretty sucky "release"! All it does for me is ensure I finish painting what GW stuff I have left before even considering buying anything else.

218 Canadian is 55 pounds?

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/NECRON_TESSERACT_ARK.html

 Commander Cain wrote:
Also the fact that there are no nice discounted bundles really does it for me, where is the incentive to buy heaps of plastic now?

What do you mean? GW is allowing you to participate in your favorite hobby: buying their products. What more incentive could one want?!

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
218 Canadian is 55 pounds?

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/NECRON_TESSERACT_ARK.html

'Scuse me, whatever the new GW necron thingy is called then.

 Commander Cain wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:
218 Canadian is 55 pounds?

http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/New_Stuff/NECRON_TESSERACT_ARK.html

'Scuse me, whatever the new GW necron thingy is called then.

Oh that. That makes a lot more sense

 Enigwolf wrote:
Guys.

I have done a bad thing. Or a good thing. I just placed an order for the Gamers' Edition.

Oh, and the Dice of Dice, too.

Great looking case for a bit of a ridiculous price. In the end, if you're happy with your purchase, that's the most important thing.

Just saw a post on reddit showing some of the one click bundles like the windrider host is more expensive than buying individually (oops checked myself, more than 4 quid difference) so GW are now charging for the saving of time?

This is a new low GW, a new low indeed.

Would it hurt them to knock a few bucks/quid off the price of the bundles? I really don't see the point of them...

This little trick they have pulled is disgusting.

i would have guess they would have built in a future price increase with the one click pricing, but just being a few dollars more expensive likely wouldnt account for that. Whole price difference of 1 click vs buying together is odd

No shokk attack gun formation just as I started buying snots and old school shokk attack guns to build one.

A lot of Ork formations are missing from the 1 click bundles, I hope there is more in the book than there is on the site.

 scrunty wrote:
anyone saying that sisters got screwed by not being included in the formation set up is missing a big point. If they actually put up a formation for sisters then the £1000 price tag for that battle board+forts will look reasonable!
When a standard SoB squad costs roughly £50 (for ten models), and a minimum heavy weapon squad costs £42.5 (for 5 models). Any type of formation near to any of the others would be ridiculously priced. For instance if you were to do an equivalent of the C:SM reserve company in SoB then it would run at £620ish.....compared to £360ish......

Im glad there arent any SoB formations because it would mean some poor fool would probably buy it at some point, and its just not worth it. Get on eBay and buy your SoB there like everyone else does.

This is probably the same reason there aren't any aspect warrior formations for Eldar.

 unmercifulconker wrote:
Just saw a post on reddit showing some of the one click bundles like the windrider host is more expensive than buying individually (oops checked myself, more than 4 quid difference) so GW are now charging for the saving of time?

This is a new low GW, a new low indeed.

Actually that is kind of amusing..

Possibly for the parent who just wants to buy something but hasn't got a clue what they are actually buying? The old adage of a 'fool and his money' comes to mind, although it is rather cruel in any case..

In all seriousness, quite possibly an admin error?

All of those formations are not feasible for me.



I hope there are more in the book than that.

The iBooks version if the Apocalypse book is MORE expensive than the hardback version.... Kinda weird, especially after some books (most of the fantasy and Iyanden books) have been cheaper.

Oh, just noticed it includes the how to paint book. I guess that's a deal....

Agreed. I mean, wheres the Armoured Interdiction Cadre?

 Pacific wrote:


Yes ... but you can still make only the one vehicle from it? I'm sure most people would rather you just had a choice of 3 different boxes at the £70 (which was already ridiculous), and you can choose the tank you would like?

Looks like the drill is to buy up the older BB kits and then buy one of the new ones to get parts for all of the conversions.

T

Re the Windrider Host - remember they have to pay a guy to break open a jetbike squad box to get the spare jetbike & then throw the rest away - with minimum wage in the UK at about £6 per hour, GW have obviously worked out that it takes 40 minutes to break into one of their boxes, sort the parts & find a non-recycling bin to put the other 2 bikes in. I call 'no foul'!

 bubber wrote:
Re the Windrider Host - remember they have to pay a guy to break open a jetbike squad box to get the spare jetbike & then throw the rest away - with minimum wage in the UK at about £6 per hour, GW have obviously worked out that it takes 40 minutes to break into one of their boxes, sort the parts & find a non-recycling bin to put the other 2 bikes in. I call 'no foul'!

Hey, in parts of the UK it really can take 40 minutes to find a non-recycling bin...

I bought the collector's edition today, I'm sure I'll be happy with it when it arrives.

It's only money and you don't have to buy it.

unmercifulconker wrote:Just saw a post on reddit showing some of the one click bundles like the windrider host is more expensive than buying individually (oops checked myself, more than 4 quid difference) so GW are now charging for the saving of time?

This is a new low GW, a new low indeed.

unmercifulconker wrote:This little trick they have pulled is disgusting.

This really is a new low. If they did it on one bundle they probably have done it on others.

I am rooting for them to get bought out now.

I think its only a matter of time now, they have driven the vast majority of the customers to independent retailers, so they are getting less and less RoI.

Eventually, they will either see reason and lower prices to normality, and get their entire stock removed at once and have a massive amount of profit, or they will get bought by someone who will...

You know... It is possible when creating 100 bundles someone made a math error. Just saying...

 pretre wrote:
You know... It is possible when creating 100 bundles someone made a math error. Just saying...

Knowing GW, replace that "a," with "several dozen" and you're on the right track

I'm disappointed there's no proper bundle deals from totalwargamer or Wayland. If there was a "just buy the stuff whats needed with an extra saving" I'd be happy.

I'm curious whether third-party vendors will see any increase in sales if they did a proper discounted bundle.

Well collectors and gamers still up for sale in UK.

Wonder how much longer they will be available? At least one person in the thread has purchased one

If you are aware of online discounters and therefore aware of the rate of discount, it means you'll go to the extra effort to order the kits there and save the money, so take the extra 3-5 mins it'll take to fill your order/shopping cart and save around 20%, or, if you can't rationale that even if you have money to throw away, that still means extra minis... spend it with GW.

 AlmightyWalrus wrote:
People complain that GW doesn't copy WM and release rules for stuff in the boxes of said stuff. Games Workshop releases new stuff with rules in box. People complain that it isn't free.


Dakka's operating at normal capacity, I see.

In today's shock news: Different people... have different opinions!

More at 5.

Lovepug13 wrote:
Well collectors and gamers still up for sale in UK.

Wonder how much longer they will be available? At least one person in the thread has purchased one

They're still up in the US, too.

Edit: I also wish they numbered the cases.

 Bangbangboom wrote:
No shokk attack gun formation .

Jervis does give shout out to the SAG in his Standard Bearer article, perhaps all hope is not lost?

When exactly are the going to be released?

Also, will the new rule book completely change the rules for apoc?

The wind rider box isnt mispriced.
They have just priced each vyper as a single model, rather than the squad of 3 that is cheaper.

Dirty trick, and really deserves to be dropped in price, but its GW is it not?

IS anyone concerned about the impact of 4 twin linked las cannons with skyfire/inceptor in normal games/tournaments? I feel like that really changes the flyer meta.

Um...yay?


Edit: No wait...that's definitely a YAY.

 MikeFox wrote:
IS anyone concerned about the impact of 4 twin linked las cannons with skyfire/inceptor in normal games/tournaments? I feel like that really changes the flyer meta.

I hope it does, the fact that everyone and their dog always has flyers makes things a bit repetitive.

On the other hand you also have to take into account whats its points price will be - If GW screw up its pricing then people will be more reluctant to use it.

To be perfectly honest I'm more excited about having BS4/5 Punisher Cannon turrets.

 MikeFox wrote:
IS anyone concerned about the impact of 4 twin linked las cannons with skyfire/inceptor in normal games/tournaments? I feel like that really changes the flyer meta.

I don't actually think that it's going to be 4 twin-linked Skyfire Lascannons... It's probably just going to be 2 Twinlinked Icarus Lascannons. Am I concerned? Maybe, not really. Quad guns are still scarier.

 Mr.Omega wrote:
Is there actually any discussion of the releases going on in this thread or is it just 'GW is the antichrist' V.232?

There's been some discussion of the releases, although it's veered towards the pricing in recent pages. Personally, I find the terrain particularly interesting, and already have my pre-orders in - it'd be worth getting just for the aesthetic, but the fact it can be used in 40k makes it even more interesting to me (I don't tend to play Apocalypse - Sisters don't scale well with the new Faith mechanic). I'm hoping they function like current Gun Emplacements - Retributors giving a Punisher Gatling Cannon, or two, rending certainly appeals.

I'm slightly disappointed by the lack of Sisters Formations - went into my local hobby centre today and made that point. At the same time, any Formation for SoB would have been about twice as expensive, per model, as the SM ones - still, I'd probably have gone for it if they had one up. And it would have been a nice confirmation that Apocalypse hasn't completely overlooked the poor stepchild army.

Overall, I don't find the super-heavy prices that bad - but my perspective is that of "Oh, so a Baneblade now costs as much as a full Seraphim Squad; my heart bleedeth". I can see why folks who're used to slightly lower per-unit prices might complain, though - particularly those who were in the process of saving up for a super-heavy only to find they need to save 50% more.

All in all, though, I'm rather pleased with the release as a whole, and I think GW have done a better job with it than they have done with several recent products.

I'm just thinking what happens if you put a Vindicare Assassin on one of those Punishers. 20 shots, all at 2+ rerollable, that lets you allocate the wounds... lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mythal wrote:

All in all, though, I'm rather pleased with the release as a whole, and I think GW have done a better job with it than they have done with several recent products.

I find myself in agreement that GW's stepping up the quality of their releases.

 Enigwolf wrote:
I'm just thinking what happens if you put a Vindicare Assassin on one of those Punishers. 20 shots, all at 2+ rerollable, that lets you allocate the wounds... lol.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Mythal wrote:

All in all, though, I'm rather pleased with the release as a whole, and I think GW have done a better job with it than they have done with several recent products.

I find myself in agreement that GW's stepping up the quality of their releases.

Actually that sounds like a ridiculously nasty tactic- odds are you are going to get about 15+ hits, then about 10+ wounds you can allocate onto a single model in a unit... you could easily snipe out IC's even in terminator armour. And then if a tank or MC appears you can just use the Exitus Rifle's ridiculous 4D6 pen round.

Gun emplacement punishers are going to be hilarious.

Guys from what I have heard the new baneblade kit builds ALL of the the variants, but any in stock still at stores will be sold at the old price until sold out. But anyway, they save themselves money with 8 kits in 1 box instead of two boxes.

Left Hand of the Pheonix wrote:
But anyway, they save themselves money with 8 kits in 1 box instead of two boxes.

Which explains the price rise...since as we know, in GW-land, switching to a less expensive production method requires an increase in price to compensate.

Left Hand of the Pheonix wrote:
Guys from what I have heard the new baneblade kit builds ALL of the the variants

When you say 'from what I have heard', you mean 'I have read the description on website'.

UltraPrime wrote:

Left Hand of the Pheonix wrote:
Guys from what I have heard the new baneblade kit builds ALL of the the variants

When you say 'from what I have heard', you mean 'I have read the description on website'.

You missed his point about the old boxes and their price haven't you?

 MikeFox wrote:
IS anyone concerned about the impact of 4 twin linked las cannons with skyfire/inceptor in normal games/tournaments? I feel like that really changes the flyer meta.

I suspect that, since it's apparently got different rules for 40k vs. Apoc, it'll get toned down.

I sure hope so, at any rate.

It'll probably cost a lot points-wise

Quad-Auto is 50pts, so maybe Quad-Las will be 70pts?

*2 + cost of the buildng (assuming it's AV 14 small building, probably 50pts), I'd say it would cost about 190pts more or less.

not game-breaking, really.
Quad-Las will most likely just be 2 twin-linked shots, same range, str and AP of icarus las (seeming the description says 'Quad-Linked Icarus pattern Lascannons)

 insaniak wrote:

Left Hand of the Pheonix wrote:
But anyway, they save themselves money with 8 kits in 1 box instead of two boxes.

Which explains the price rise...since as we know, in GW-land, switching to a less expensive production method requires an increase in price to compensate.

I understand your need to make a pithy response to any comment regarding GW, but the price increase in this one specific case seems justified with the amount of extra plastic you're getting in the box.

Absolutely. Adding an extra dollar's worth of plastic to the box, with the end result being a box that still only builds one complete vehicle, certainly justifies the price rise in this instance.

 Goliath wrote:

 insaniak wrote:

Left Hand of the Pheonix wrote:
But anyway, they save themselves money with 8 kits in 1 box instead of two boxes.

Which explains the price rise...since as we know, in GW-land, switching to a less expensive production method requires an increase in price to compensate.

I understand your need to make a pithy response to any comment regarding GW, but the price increase in this one specific case seems justified with the amount of extra plastic you're getting in the box.

Sure $25 (in US-land) for an extra top and a bunch of extra guns isn't a terrible deal. But GW isn't offering to sell you that for $25. They're offering to sell you a single super heavy plastic tank for $140 instead of $115. If you happen to want the super heavy, plus all the extra bits, the new kit probably isn't so bad. If you just wanted to build an extra Baneblade though, well, it's a $25 price increase. What can I say? It's complicated.

 insaniak wrote:
Absolutely. Adding an extra dollar's worth of plastic to the box, with the end result being a box that still only builds one complete vehicle, certainly justifies the price rise in this instance.

I'm not sure where you're getting "an extra dollar's worth" from; the stormsword kit contains an entirely different top panel, as well as the base for the troops transport section (and lid if that isn't used) as well as all of the different guns for the different tanks. There's actually quite a lot of plastic being added to the box, far more than "an extra dollar's worth"

Never mind. I'm coming at this from a completely different angle to most people due to scratch-building Ork vehicles. Anyone else would look to buy it for the tank to assemble as a baneblade/shadowsword/stormhammer/hammerstorm/whaterver, whereas I'm looking at it to buy, then whack plasticard on it and orkify it, then re-use the spare gun barrels and such as spare parts for other stuff.

You know, for once Australia isn't being screwed and I can't help but laugh at the rest of you.

Our baneblades are $165 and have been that way for quite a while now. It's sad that it's that high to begin with but no price rise for us

 jonolikespie wrote:
You know, for once Australia isn't being screwed and I can't help but laugh at the rest of you.

Our baneblades are $165 and have been that way for quite a while now. It's sad that it's that high to begin with but no price rise for us

You're a malicious little one, aren't you?

I thought that was the case, just couldn't be sure as I don't really look at superheavy stuff

 jonolikespie wrote:
You know, for once Australia isn't being screwed and I can't help but laugh at the rest of you.

Our baneblades are $165 and have been that way for quite a while now. It's sad that it's that high to begin with but no price rise for us

A while back, people were joking that when GW finally realised that equalising prices would be a good idea for keeping customers happier, they would do it the GW way, and lift everyone else's prices to match ours, rather than going the other way.

Sadly, going by the last few releases, this does indeed appear to be the way they choose to go.

 insaniak wrote:
A while back, people were joking that when GW finally realised that equalising prices would be a good idea for keeping customers happier, they would do it the GW way, and lift everyone else's prices to match ours, rather than going the other way.
Sadly, going by the last few releases, this does indeed appear to be the way they choose to go.

We also joked about the 'one-click deals' being more expensive than doing it the "slower" way.
Maybe we should start joking about them lowering the prices?

 insaniak wrote:

 jonolikespie wrote:
You know, for once Australia isn't being screwed and I can't help but laugh at the rest of you.

Our baneblades are $165 and have been that way for quite a while now. It's sad that it's that high to begin with but no price rise for us

A while back, people were joking that when GW finally realised that equalising prices would be a good idea for keeping customers happier, they would do it the GW way, and lift everyone else's prices to match ours, rather than going the other way.

Sadly, going by the last few releases, this does indeed appear to be the way they choose to go.

As sad as it is at least the cries of 'holy this is way too expensive' should now be loud enough to be heard.

 pretre wrote:
You know... It is possible when creating 100 bundles someone made a math error. Just saying...

Yeah, the whole "Never attribute to malice that which can be..." etc. thing.

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
It'll probably cost a lot points-wise

Quad-Auto is 50pts, so maybe Quad-Las will be 70pts?

*2 + cost of the buildng (assuming it's AV 14 small building, probably 50pts), I'd say it would cost about 190pts more or less.

not game-breaking, really.
Quad-Las will most likely just be 2 twin-linked shots, same range, str and AP of icarus las (seeming the description says 'Quad-Linked Icarus pattern Lascannons)

Still thats a whole lot of nasty. 200ish points to completely counter on coming aircraft, Ill take that any day of the week(now mind you I said counter not blow out of the air, Ill take a jink as a moral victory). Orks can cash in one squad of lootas for those Lascannons and it wouldnt really shift the list that much.

It opens the door for orks to get long range AT and a place to hide lootas. And it gives higher BS models punisher cannons, which could also skew the foot heavy lists meta. This is of course based on the notion that it has the option to take a punisher cannons in normal 40k.

 MikeFox wrote:
IS anyone concerned about the impact of 4 twin linked las cannons with skyfire/inceptor in normal games/tournaments? I feel like that really changes the flyer meta.

So is that terrain piece going to be usable in regular games then? I haven't seen anything that says it is.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:

 pretre wrote:
You know... It is possible when creating 100 bundles someone made a math error. Just saying...

Yeah, the whole "Never attribute to malice that which can be..." etc. thing.

Exactly. Someone already figured out they did the math for separate vypers instead of the 3 box or someauch.

Historically GW has always added half the cost for a twin link weapon. An Icarus was 35 pts so a twinlink, if GW followed previous criteria, should have worked out at 50pts And it's a pair so each battery should be 100pts.

2 batteries for a total of 200pts + the building.

So GW will probably make the entire thing cost 100pts.

I think this is a bad idea for 'normal' 40K.

Cheers

Andrew

TechMarine1 wrote:


So is that terrain piece going to be usable in regular games then? I haven't seen anything that says it is.

Go and read the descriptions on the GW website. It says there will be rules for it in normal 40k games as well as APOC

Unsure if this has been posted, But over on Faeit 212 http://natfka.blogspot.com/2013/06/pricing-on-bundles-costing-more-than.html apparently some bundles are more then buying the models separate. again if it's been posted already i apologize, not digging through all the pages lol. Just trying to keep fellow gamers informed.

Yep we know, believe it was on the last page, lol.

And yet again I say: GW based the prices on the individual jetbike and viper boxes, not the squadron sets.

Using the prices for the individual sets it adds up to the bundle's cost.

How is it the templates are limited edition?

You are going to need them to play the game......

Yeah I know, I don't really get that. Like I said, if you're going to make an essential item like that limited stock you might as well do it with everything: models, rulebooks, etc.

I mean imagine if Codex: Eldar was just a limited release and once it was gone it was gone. They'd make so much money, right? Because they only have to print what they know they can sell and it's guaranteed to make a profit, just like Space Hulk did years ago. And think of the PR! You know how people often whine and complain about "bandwagoners" taking up "their" army every time an update gets put out? GW could spin it as if they were listening to fan feedback, lol. Now everyone who wants to be the Eldar player in their local scene will finally get their wish! And they could do it with every army!

GW's all about "premium", "prestige", "exclusivity", etc. Might as well go full fething hog and do it all, make it literally impossible to get into 40k at all for everyone.

Anyway, in all seriousness I think that just goes to show their confidence in this product, if they can't even be bothered to keep the templates around for Apocalypse then clearly they don't expect many people to be interested in playing it. Maybe that's why the superheavies this time around are insanely priced and we didn't get any discounted bundles, they aren't interested in making this an "event", it's just another quick cash grab and will be quickly forgotten about in just a few short months. They'll make a little money off the few suckers willing to blow $200 on single models and nearly $300 on worthless "collector's editions" that have no value unlike a real collectable, and then it's on to Space Marines! Who, just you watch, will end up getting the best-written and most horribly overpowered book out of all the 6th edition codices thus far.

dlight wrote:
How is it the templates are limited edition?

You are going to need them to play the game......

I'm guessing they will release clear grey ones or ones that are single pieces instead of clip together or something once these ones are gone.
That way people can still get them but GW get to use that 'limited edition' sticker they love so much these days.

Hmmm, GW has finally produced a Necron model I have no desire to buy....not because of the price, which is ridiculous IMO, but because I've never been a fan of Apocalypse sized games. They take too long for each turn and are not fun for me to just sit there for 30+ minutes while my opponent(s) take their turn.

 Zathras wrote:
Hmmm, GW has finally produced a Necron model I have no desire to buy....not because of the price, which is ridiculous IMO, but because I've never been a fan of Apocalypse sized games. They take too long for each turn and are not fun for me to just sit there for 30+ minutes while my opponent(s) take their turn.

I got a game of dystopian wars in the other night that was the largest I'd ever played by a wide margin but with the 'I move my squad, you move yours' back and forth mechanic it wasn't at any point boring. If I were playing a 10,000 apoc game I'd finish my turn and then head off to get lunch while my opponents did their turn, watching your opponent's turns in 2k is boring enough.

 jonolikespie wrote:

dlight wrote:
How is it the templates are limited edition?

You are going to need them to play the game......

I'm guessing they will release clear grey ones or ones that are single pieces instead of clip together or something once these ones are gone.
That way people can still get them but GW get to use that 'limited edition' sticker they love so much these days.

My thoughts exactly.

If you go over to white dwarf daily, they've said a bunch of stuff regarding the new rules, over 100 formations, chance to "field your entire collection at once", no restrictions, multiple allies, etc...

 Sidstyler wrote:
I mean imagine if Codex: Eldar was just a limited release and once it was gone it was gone.

Now imagine making the Sororitas Codex a limited release ... wait!

This guy looks like he has a blanket. All he needs is a teddy modelled in the other hand and he'll be ready for the cinematic power-nap.

The more I think about the Corn Dozer, the more I think that it's a modified Ork warmachine over anything else...

Only just seen all this...


This might very well be the most horrendous looking thing GW has put out...and not in a good way. It looks like something a child would play with. I am not f**kin impressed
The necron on the other hand

Actually the Lord of Skulls is growing on me. I never liked the Epic versions, but I think that they've made a pretty decent job of updating and upscaling them.

pgmason wrote:
Actually the Lord of Skulls is growing on me. I never liked the Epic versions, but I think that they've made a pretty decent job of updating and upscaling them.

I'd have to agree. Reading the WD, the Lord of Skulls look fun on the battlefield. Big skull-tracked warmachine chopping away at the scenery, etc.. . It's still ridiculous, but in a charming way IMO.

 Black Lantern wrote:

200$ Tonka truck !

 Matt.Kingsley wrote:
It'll probably cost a lot points-wise

Quad-Auto is 50pts, so maybe Quad-Las will be 70pts?

*2 + cost of the buildng (assuming it's AV 14 small building, probably 50pts), I'd say it would cost about 190pts more or less.

not game-breaking, really.
Quad-Las will most likely just be 2 twin-linked shots, same range, str and AP of icarus las (seeming the description says 'Quad-Linked Icarus pattern Lascannons)

My guess is Land raider price range, so 240-260 points. Maybe depending on weapons, as you can swap the QLLC with the battle cannon and punisher cannons.

I think it's fine once you get rid of the awful possessed head.

On the subject of Lord of Skulls Bashing, anyone remeber Robot Wars?

Lots of people remembered it, and posted the same image on several previous pages of this thread.

I personally have warmed to the model since seeing the alternative head for it. I still think it's a bit daft, but no more daft than most of Khorne's stuff and a marked improvement on the epic scale stuff, which, whilst many remember with nostalgia, was produced whilst I was drifting away from the game during the Red Age and I thought was fairly rubbish at the time, along with that rubbish robot khorne thing with the flails on cartwheels.

Consider market research guys. The Lord of Skulls is obviously aimed at the 14 years and younger audience. Grumpy old wargamers like us aren´t the majority of customers and Apocalypse models are tailormade for the impulse buyers. Most sensible players would stay clear of these as you aren´t likely to get many games with them.

 tarnish wrote:
Consider market research guys. The Lord of Skulls is obviously aimed at the 14 years and younger audience. Grumpy old wargamers like us aren´t the majority of customers and Apocalypse models are tailormade for the impulse buyers. Most sensible players would stay clear of these as you aren´t likely to get many games with them.

14 year olds don't have 160$ to spend on a single model, nor do they tend to play apoc. Seems like market research destined to fail.

 Kirasu wrote:

 tarnish wrote:
Consider market research guys. The Lord of Skulls is obviously aimed at the 14 years and younger audience. Grumpy old wargamers like us aren´t the majority of customers and Apocalypse models are tailormade for the impulse buyers. Most sensible players would stay clear of these as you aren´t likely to get many games with them.

14 year olds don't have 160$ to spend on a single model, nor do they tend to play apoc. Seems like market research destined to fail.

You would be surprised how much money teenagers can manipulate out of their grown-ups....

I don't think there's a way to make a tank-centaur that wouldn't look daft. That being said, I still think the upper body is too humanoid. it would be better if it had sunken head like terminators and Contemptors, and the axe directly attached to the arm instead of there being a hand holding it.

And looking at the rules for the Khornemower, it appears that Strength D is still a thing. The Great Cleaver has it.

You say it like its a bad thing.

The book is out already?