Johnson101 wrote: I don't think any model bigger than the Reaver Titan would be profitable to produce, they would also cost so much they would barley sell any, plus it would be too large to practically use in any game of 30k or 40k, you'd need like a 8"x4" board to play on
Do not underestimate the desire that players have for large resin 40K models. GW underestimated that desire when it gave resin model licenses to Mike Biasi Studios and Armorcast. Armorcast sold 30,000 40K resin kits in three years, only in North America, so GW no longer had any doubt about the market for larger resin models. Hence the birth of Forge World a couple of years later.
Warlords will sell...
I reckon he looks on course to be the best-looking Primarch yet. His face is amazing.
Most handsome? Probably. It's not like the traitor primarchs have much going for them in the male fashion model department. I do expect Sanguinius to be the best male fashion model of the bunch though when he comes out.
I reckon he looks on course to be the best-looking Primarch yet. His face is amazing.
Most handsome? Probably.
He is handsome, in a plain way. He is handsome the way a regent on an old coin is handsome, like a good sword is handsome. He is not handsome like a ritual weapon, the way Fulgrim is. He is not angelic, like Sanguinius. There is a dutiful line to his jaw, like his good brother Dorn. They share a nobility. There is the great strength of Ferrus and the vitality of Mortarion. There is, sometimes, the rogue glint of the Khan in his eyes, or the solemnity of the Lion. In the architecture of his nose and brow there is, many claim, the energy and triumph of Horus Lupercal. There is none of the bitterness that shadows Corax, or the persecuted despair that haunts poor Konrad. There is never any of the deliberate mystery that obscures Alpharius or Magnus and he is more open than that buried soul Vulkan... He never displays the pitch of fury found in Angron, nor do his eyes ever ignite with the psychotic gleam of Russ...
I reckon he looks on course to be the best-looking Primarch yet. His face is amazing.
Most handsome? Probably.
He is handsome, in a plain way. He is handsome the way a regent on an old coin is handsome, like a good sword is handsome. He is not handsome like a ritual weapon, the way Fulgrim is. He is not angelic, like Sanguinius. There is a dutiful line to his jaw, like his good brother Dorn. They share a nobility. There is the great strength of Ferrus and the vitality of Mortarion. There is, sometimes, the rogue glint of the Khan in his eyes, or the solemnity of the Lion. In the architecture of his nose and brow there is, many claim, the energy and triumph of Horus Lupercal. There is none of the bitterness that shadows Corax, or the persecuted despair that haunts poor Konrad. There is never any of the deliberate mystery that obscures Alpharius or Magnus and he is more open than that buried soul Vulkan... He never displays the pitch of fury found in Angron, nor do his eyes ever ignite with the psychotic gleam of Russ...
Darth Bob and Roboute sitting in a tree.
K. I. S. S. I. N. G.
As a 40k UM player, my willingness to dip a toe in the FW 30k was going to be dependant on the Guilliman model.
Guess I'd better tell the Long Haired Admiral that she's not getting a foreign holiday this year.
Grand-daddy Smurf seems to be modelled on Caesar, going by the face; seems quite similar to this:
Makes a certain amount of sense, given the oft-overt Roman theme the Ultramarines have had going on. His armour also seems quite similar in style to that of Roman officers.
A few pages back there was a Gal Vorbak with wings; does that look like just a cool conversion or possible Argal Tal? It looked like he may be on a scenic base.
I don't think he has rules yet, and it wouldn't make sense for him to be in Book 5 since he's not at Calth.
I reckon he looks on course to be the best-looking Primarch yet. His face is amazing.
Most handsome? Probably.
He is handsome, in a plain way. He is handsome the way a regent on an old coin is handsome, like a good sword is handsome. He is not handsome like a ritual weapon, the way Fulgrim is. He is not angelic, like Sanguinius. There is a dutiful line to his jaw, like his good brother Dorn. They share a nobility. There is the great strength of Ferrus and the vitality of Mortarion. There is, sometimes, the rogue glint of the Khan in his eyes, or the solemnity of the Lion. In the architecture of his nose and brow there is, many claim, the energy and triumph of Horus Lupercal. There is none of the bitterness that shadows Corax, or the persecuted despair that haunts poor Konrad. There is never any of the deliberate mystery that obscures Alpharius or Magnus and he is more open than that buried soul Vulkan... He never displays the pitch of fury found in Angron, nor do his eyes ever ignite with the psychotic gleam of Russ...
Jpogfreak886 wrote: A few pages back there was a Gal Vorbak with wings; does that look like just a cool conversion or possible Argal Tal? It looked like he may be on a scenic base.
I don't think he has rules yet, and it wouldn't make sense for him to be in Book 5 since he's not at Calth.
Just a conversion. The body of the one with wings is identical to one of the five Gal Vorbak. I hope we get Argal Tal in book 6.
Still not even a hint of any Thousand Sons stuff makes me quite sad. All those models are gorgeous though, Guilliman is looking mighty fine!
Automatically Appended Next Post:
MajorStoffer wrote: Grand-daddy Smurf seems to be modelled on Caesar, going by the face; seems quite similar to this:
Spoiler:
Makes a certain amount of sense, given the oft-overt Roman theme the Ultramarines have had going on. His armour also seems quite similar in style to that of Roman officers.
Ah not just me who thought they looked alike then!
I suppose that if we're getting rules and a model for that Samus thing, then there's a good change that Ka'bandha will get rules eventually. That should be cool.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I suppose that if we're getting rules and a model for that Samus thing, then there's a good change that Ka'bandha will get rules eventually. That should be cool.
Probably with the Blood Angels in whatever book they first appear in.
Love those ultramarine upgrade kit, those 30K helmets i need!
Not sold on the stormbird from the stories i got that the stormbird was smaller more agile than the Thunderhawk.
That WIP version just looks like a Thunderhawk with more engines on.
With the popularity of 30K stuff GW should do a 30K tactical plastic marines squad, i would buy that!
Not really. I'm not a huge fan of the chain fist, but that's my personal preference. I'm not saying it's bad/poorly designed/lazily made/causing the downfall of civillisation as we know it.
Medium of Death wrote: If they're happy realising crap and people are willing to buy crap then that's fine.
Please try to learn that there is a difference between something being bad, and something that you dislike.
Pot? Kettle?
That non argument aside. The teeth are far too small to be functional. While the setting isn't know for its realism this just looks ridiculous.
What armour is this going to be cutting through?
I would guess titan armor and other super heavies they also have the field that the Titan Powerfists have so yea that is my guess on that
I want the Volcano Cannon an apoc blast D-weapon
I guess you've never looked at the size of the teeth on a real chainsaw relative to the size of the blade? If anything smaller chainswords/chainfists have teeth that are too big, due to a combination of GW's cartoonish size exaggeration and the difficulty in making distinct teeth at 28mm scale.
Looking at it, I think a biger problem may be the elbow joint. It doesn't look like it can even rotate far enough to bring the blade up as high as it's waist joint, and it isn't long enough to hit vehicle smaller than a land raider without crouching.
Actually, the titan powerfist has a similar problem, but it looks like it has a slightly better range of motion.
Titan CCWs could probably use another joint so they can raise them higher. Or at least a ball and socket joint at the shoulder rather than a perpendicular joint.
Personally, I agree with Medium of Death - the detail just seemed lack-luster. Maybe it's because its for a big model so they didn't want to bog it down with small details, but it looked like something I'd see coming out of a mediocre Kickstarter, especially the Volcano Cannon. Edit: The back end of it looks better though; I hadn't seen the other pics on FW yet
I think seeing that in the midst of all the teasers for HHW may be a factor too
I guess you've never looked at the size of the teeth on a real chainsaw relative to the size of the blade? If anything smaller chainswords/chainfists have teeth that are too big, due to a combination of GW's cartoonish size exaggeration and the difficulty in making distinct teeth at 28mm scale.
I guess you've never looked at a chainsaw because the chain isn't typically constrained by the sides which negates the need for the teeth to be massive. The teeth on the Reaver arm barely clear the sides.
Jpogfreak886 wrote: Personally, I agree with Medium of Death - the detail just seemed lack-luster. Maybe it's because its for a big model so they didn't want to bog it down with small details, but it looked like something I'd see coming out of a mediocre Kickstarter, especially the Volcano Cannon.
The reason the Volcano cannon probably looks off is that while all the other reaver ranged weapons have a rather bulky breech area, the Volcano cannon breech is rather less bulky. It makes sense though, as it is a single barreled weapon, and all the other ones are multiple barrels. The Volcano cannon is long and slender
Medium of Death wrote: I guess you've never looked at a chainsaw because the chain isn't typically constrained by the sides which negates the need for the teeth to be massive. The teeth on the Reaver arm barely clear the sides.
The cutting surface being too narrow (just like the tracks on most of GW's tank designs) has nothing to do with the size of the teeth. If you're going to criticize a design as "unrealistic" then you should at least be clear about what you're criticizing.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Jpogfreak886 wrote: Personally, I agree with Medium of Death - the detail just seemed lack-luster. Maybe it's because its for a big model so they didn't want to bog it down with small details, but it looked like something I'd see coming out of a mediocre Kickstarter, especially the Volcano Cannon. Edit: The back end of it looks better though; I hadn't seen the other pics on FW yet
Compare it to the detail on the other Reaver weapons (especially the laser blaster, which is the closest equivalent) and it's about the same. If you like the other guns I can't see why you'd have any problem with the volcano cannon.
I agree that it isn't 100% realistic. The two concepts are not the same.
The crap design should have bigger teeth for it to work as a cutting weapon as otherwise they'd not have enough reach.
Making bigger teeth doesn't solve the problem, it just lets it cut a bit deeper before the side of the blade blocks it. Chainsaws don't cut by having the teeth rip apart the material by brute force, they make a rapid sequence of shallow cuts as each tooth passes over the surface. Making the teeth bigger just makes the chainsaw heavier and more complex. The actual solution (like the solution to the tank track problem) is to make the teeth wider than the blade so that the blade can go all the way into and through the material.
It's not believable. Which doesn't mean realistic.
Titans aren't realistic at all. If you can accept that a Reaver titan can exist without having paper-thin armor and fatal ground pressure issues then I don't really see why a small detail of a chainsaw blade is such a big deal.
Though I'm still not sold on them. They're wearing greatcoats over their space suits..
It is bloody perfect, FW has read my mind! I really hoped Solar Auxilia officers would get great coats. These will make an absolutely perfect Rogue Trader's landing party.
Sorry, I called psychic-dibs on using the SA commander model as a Rogue Trader when I saw it, get your own ideas
Though I'm still not sold on them. They're wearing greatcoats over their space suits..
It is bloody perfect, FW has read my mind! I really hoped Solar Auxilia officers would get great coats. These will make an absolutely perfect Rogue Trader's landing party.
Sorry, I called psychic-dibs on using the SA commander model as a Rogue Trader when I saw it, get your own ideas
I've been using the Solar Auxilia as a Rogue Trader and attached elements since its release now, even had a battle in a proper Zone Mortalis last week. Yoink!
I was really surprised to see the Gulliman preview yesterday, but I guess I should have seen it coming as FW always "promotes" a new book with a model that is also related to that book. But I am really sad that Dorn will not be out in the near future. Also read elsewhere that the IF Command model was originally to be intended to resemble Sigismund, but they were not happy with it (and I agree there). But that explains some of the discussions we had here. But I guess that Sigismund also will not be available in the near future.
Overall I was disappointed with the Weekender. As a guy interested in SM characters and special units there was not much exciting stuff. The Alpha Legion character was the only highlight. Gulliman will be awesome as everything by Eagan, but that's about it ...
After seeing the Guilliman preview I'm kinda glad they didn't go for the all power fist look. May as well just field Calgar as Guilliman if they did that.
angelofvengeance wrote: After seeing the Guilliman preview I'm kinda glad they didn't gp for the all power fist look. May as well just field Calgar as Guilliman if they did that.
Well, apart from the massive size difference and almost certainly vastly better model
Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks gathers together and presents afresh the story of this monumental conflict, previously published in Imperial Armour Volumes Five, Six and Seven. As well as extensive background information on the siege and the forces engaged in it, such as the Red Scorpions Space Marines Chapter, the Grey Knights and the World Eaters Chaos Space Marines, this 288-page, full colour hardback book contains updated rules and army lists for the Death Korps of Krieg and the Renegades of Vraks. Also included are the heraldry and iconography of the forces deployed to Vraks and rules for the lords and heroes of each faction, including Inquisitor-Lord Hector Rex and the vile Mamon, Daemon Prince of Nurgle.
Red Corsair wrote: I'm honestly not a fan of any of the night lord HH stuff. I think they are trying way to hard to make them look gory and spooky, sometimes less is more.
I don't think "less is more" has ever been applied to the Night Lords. Definitely not in models. I pity the person who has to attempt to make a decent design with the limitation of "they have to have bat wings on their heads".
Actually they don't. The wings were largely ceremonial and not worn in combat. Wearing people was a lot more common then actually mounting bat wings on their helmets.
And what's wrong with wearing people? The human leather gloves on the Raptors just looks downright devious. Hell the Night Lords are more like the Dark Eldar then the Emperor's Children are.
Man, the HH stuff just gets me more amped to start working on my XIIth Legion project (soon, soon...). And I'm excited for the World Eaters to get more goodies in book 6. Seems like they hinted a new Angron sculpt is on the way. I haven't even started painting the current, non-daemonic version. But I'm ready to get some Ruinstorm on!
Guilliman looks great and I'm sure all the UM stuff will. I was never a fan of the UM, but Abnett really made them shine in Know No Fear, probably my 2nd favorite book in the whole series. Those guys are heroes...and it's too bad my XIIth is going to chew them up with chainaxes.
So the speculation on Battle Bunnies is that after Guilliman, Corax is next (apparently the jump pack wings may have been giving them some trouble?), then Perturabo, who will be the 1st primarch done in CAD. At least those seem to be the primarchs that sculptors are talking about.
Well he loses the one he had then while he led the traitors on a merry chase round Istvaan (and there's rules for that too, you can pay less points and he loses his jump pack and has a heavy bolter) but I'm sure he gets a new one afterwards. I'm almost certain his model with have the Jump Pack because it's in his rules. There may be an option to not use it for the cheaper version of him though.
ImAGeek wrote: Well he loses the one he had then while he led the traitors on a merry chase round Istvaan (and there's rules for that too, you can pay less points and he loses his jump pack and has a heavy bolter) but I'm sure he gets a new one afterwards. I'm almost certain his model with have the Jump Pack because it's in his rules. There may be an option to not use it for the cheaper version of him though.
Well if the cover of Ravenlord (set after the Dropsite Massacre) is anything to go by, he begins using a standard jump pack.
Well, the designers apparently commented that they solved the issue they had with a certain piece of gear for a certain primarch. So yeah, if it's Corax, it sounds like he'll get the Pinions. Although the problem piece could also be the whip.
Yeah, he can be fielded as he was in the aftermath of the Dropsite Massacre (wounded, no Pinions, no archeotech pistols), but the regular profile has the wings and I think we can assume the model will too.
ImAGeek wrote: Yeah so he still has a jump pack, is that not what I said?
Yes...I was agreeing with you. I recalled that Ravenlord (set after Istvaan) has Corax on the cover.
I thought he was no longer using jump packs becausehe has a combi melta on the cover, which you don't typically see with jump packs so I double checked and found that he does have a jump pack after all.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Anyone know if he lost the Korvadine Pinions for good at the Dropsite Massacre, or were they recovered and repaired?
Oooh vraks book wonder what new goodies come in that all pointing to the upcoming csm book.
Oh and iirc yes he left the pinoins at isstvan somthing like without them can fit one more marine on the t.hawk.
According to what I read in the HH books his Pinions were shattered but the remaining legion techmarine had scavenged many of the parts and brought them back to deliverance. He is trying to figure out how to recraft them, but they are lost technology and he was only an apprentice at the time of the massacre.
Yeah that list looks exactly like the one in IA:13, rather disappointed with that fact, unless there's a hell of a lot crammed into the wargear options, even then not sure I can justify another book at that price for a few small options.
ImAGeek wrote: Yeah so he still has a jump pack, is that not what I said?
Yes...I was agreeing with you. I recalled that Ravenlord (set after Istvaan) has Corax on the cover.
I thought he was no longer using jump packs becausehe has a combi melta on the cover, which you don't typically see with jump packs so I double checked and found that he does have a jump pack after all.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Anyone know if he lost the Korvadine Pinions for good at the Dropsite Massacre, or were they recovered and repaired?
Looks like he still has the Korvadine Pinions on that cover. If you look at the image without the title box in the way he still has them. Check the YouTube video for it.
ImAGeek wrote: Yeah so he still has a jump pack, is that not what I said?
Yes...I was agreeing with you. I recalled that Ravenlord (set after Istvaan) has Corax on the cover.
I thought he was no longer using jump packs becausehe has a combi melta on the cover, which you don't typically see with jump packs so I double checked and found that he does have a jump pack after all.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Anyone know if he lost the Korvadine Pinions for good at the Dropsite Massacre, or were they recovered and repaired?
Looks like he still has the Korvadine Pinions on that cover. If you look at the image without the title box in the way he still has them. Check the YouTube video for it.
In Deliverance lost they describe a marine salvaging Corax's jump pack from Istvaan and presenting it to him at the end of the book repaired I thought.... or was that one of his Lightning Claws. it, now I have to go reread that book.
There's a fault in your reasoning though, as were it to become a new, standalone campaign supplement, then they could call it something else which didn't require the volume X naming convention.
its like they downloaded the Ordo Reductor wishlist and ran with it! Mechanicum Ordinatus Super-Heavy LOW Tank FTW! looks like the mother of all photon thruster weapons!
Imperial Armour – The Siege of Vraks gathers together and presents afresh the story of this monumental conflict, previously published in Imperial Armour Volumes Five, Six and Seven. As well as extensive background information on the siege and the forces engaged in it, such as the Red Scorpions Space Marines Chapter, the Grey Knights and the World Eaters Chaos Space Marines, this 288-page, full colour hardback book contains updated rules and army lists for the Death Korps of Krieg and the Renegades of Vraks. Also included are the heraldry and iconography of the forces deployed to Vraks and rules for the lords and heroes of each faction, including Inquisitor-Lord Hector Rex and the vile Mamon, Daemon Prince of Nurgle.
Guess I need to get this book now, unless the Siege list is the same as the free pdf on FW site.
Yup, that's the free official update I was talking about. Thanks for checking, Looky. If you can peek at Zufor as well, I would be even happier as he is another cool model (albeit one I don't own yet unlike Rex).
Rex is same points and stats, Arias (his sword) upgraded from wounding demons on 4+ to 2+, gains adamntium will, loses psybolts & warlord, psychic powers swapped for latest GK ones.
The big Zhuf is 20 points cheaper, same stats, gains champ of chaos, mark of khorne bonus attack no longer stated as included in stats, otherwise the same. He was a reasonable choice before, now hes that bit better with a point cut. I've never regretted using him, eats most things in his path.
ImAGeek wrote: Yeah so he still has a jump pack, is that not what I said?
Yes...I was agreeing with you. I recalled that Ravenlord (set after Istvaan) has Corax on the cover.
I thought he was no longer using jump packs becausehe has a combi melta on the cover, which you don't typically see with jump packs so I double checked and found that he does have a jump pack after all.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Anyone know if he lost the Korvadine Pinions for good at the Dropsite Massacre, or were they recovered and repaired?
Looks like he still has the Korvadine Pinions on that cover. If you look at the image without the title box in the way he still has them. Check the YouTube video for it.
In Deliverance lost they describe a marine salvaging Corax's jump pack from Istvaan and presenting it to him at the end of the book repaired I thought.... or was that one of his Lightning Claws. it, now I have to go reread that book.
This ^ at the end of the book the techmarine finishes repairing the pinions and presents them to him before they take the perfect fortress. He uses them in soulforge and raven lord
Personall I hope they make the version of Corax where he was bloodied and broken, running around fighting anything he saw with a heavy bolter. They bothered to make rules for that version of him, so a mini would be good.
Looky Likey wrote: Rex is same points and stats, Arias (his sword) upgraded from wounding demons on 4+ to 2+, gains adamntium will, loses psybolts & warlord, psychic powers swapped for latest GK ones.
The big Zhuf is 20 points cheaper, same stats, gains champ of chaos, mark of khorne bonus attack no longer stated as included in stats, otherwise the same. He was a reasonable choice before, now hes that bit better with a point cut. I've never regretted using him, eats most things in his path.
Thanks for the update rundown. I had been hoping they'd either drop his price, give him t4, or addd eternal warrior due to his "massive physique" but no luck I guess. He's still a darn good looking fig though so there is that. I just wish you could easily convert him into the pose he is in for his pic in the book.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Personall I hope they make the version of Corax where he was bloodied and broken, running around fighting anything he saw with a heavy bolter. They bothered to make rules for that version of him, so a mini would be good.
This would be awesome! From what FW have been saying about making multiple versions of the Primarchs, I can't see them missing this opportunity personally, especially seeing as he has rules already, and it would only require modifying the original model rather than making a new sculpt like the more Daemonic Primarchs may need.
The Krieg list looks like a good update / consolidation, but I wonder how different the RoV list will be to the standard R&H list in IA13. From this contents image it seems almost identical, with the addition of a couple of detachments. If so, that's a big chunk of the book to spend on reprinted rules...
Bobthehero wrote: Oh wait, special orders, warlord traits? Oooooooooooooh my.
The question is are they different enough, as well as the army-wide special rules, to justify this in place of the Assault Brigade? I mean, aside from havings points adjusted to match the 6th ed IG book and working in a few more orders to be more equitable to the main book, I don't see much based on the contents alone to justify the investment on my part.
Forge World have taken on somebody whose job is the creation of Decal Sheets and etched brass sprues so we should see a big increase in these products.
They started yesterday (Mon 9th feb) so it'll be a while.
Koppo wrote: Oh, I don't think this was mentioned.
Forge World have taken on somebody whose job is the creation of Decal Sheets and etched brass sprues so we should see a big increase in these products.
They started yesterday (Mon 9th feb) so it'll be a while.
Koppo wrote: Oh, I don't think this was mentioned.
Forge World have taken on somebody whose job is the creation of Decal Sheets and etched brass sprues so we should see a big increase in these products.
They started yesterday (Mon 9th feb) so it'll be a while.
Oh, and that person is Jes Goodwin's daughter.
You're kidding. That is too awesome to be true.
I believe she studied illustration at Uni and is very good, but I thought Tammy was doing all the new design work? Didn't Tammy do all the decal sheets and heraldry for the Knights?
Bobthehero wrote: Oh wait, special orders, warlord traits? Oooooooooooooh my.
The question is are they different enough, as well as the army-wide special rules, to justify this in place of the Assault Brigade?
These are two different lists. The current Siege list can be found on FW site for free, but it was made for 6th Ed and has no orders or warlord traits.
I believe she studied illustration at Uni and is very good, but I thought Tammy was doing all the new design work? Didn't Tammy do all the decal sheets and heraldry for the Knights?
I don't know about that so cannot comment, but the gist was that she'd be doing only the decals and brass so they'd see a marked upsurge in product with some being shorter runs than others (probably based on sales).
So hopefully we'll see some mechanicum decals soon.
I didn't actually check the delivery date on the Vraks pre-order (it's from this Friday....the 13th ), so it was a pleasant surprise to get my despatch notice already
Bobthehero wrote: Oh wait, special orders, warlord traits? Oooooooooooooh my.
The question is are they different enough, as well as the army-wide special rules, to justify this in place of the Assault Brigade?
These are two different lists. The current Siege list can be found on FW site for free, but it was made for 6th Ed and has no orders or warlord traits.
I think he was aware they are 2 different lists, more that he was asking if the lists are unique enough from each other to justify purchasing the new Vraks for the Siege regiment list when he already has the Assault brigade list.
The Krieg list looks like a good update / consolidation, but I wonder how different the RoV list will be to the standard R&H list in IA13. From this contents image it seems almost identical, with the addition of a couple of detachments. If so, that's a big chunk of the book to spend on reprinted rules...
I read through the new Vraks renegade list last night, I still need to sit down tonight and compare unit by unit to understand the exact differences but my initial findings are:
1) Khorne and Nurgle only, as you'd expect the other two chaos gods do not feature in this book at all in the list as options or upgrades
2) States that this list is an extention of the IA13 list and should be treated as such
3) More units start with the higher BS and don't have the milita upgrade option
4) No Avus as transports, in fact no real options for flyers that I can remember
5) Loses the built in options for marked chaos troops, but the IA13 doesn't have these options and Chaos Marines are full battle brothers so its not a massive loss
6) Some of the warlord options are different
7) Some of the devotions are different
8) Some of the options are different, a big *I think* on this one, but renegade troop squads in IA13 can take very few special weapons, in Vraks v2 its one special weapon per 5 members, with very large (50 ish) max unit size.
9) Basic units available are broadly the same
10) Removes the old limits on heavy armour
So its not a completely different list, its not a 100% faithful update on Vraks, but if you have a large Vraks themed army (mine is around 9k) then you have something that is a better fit to how we used to play.
Koppo wrote: Oh, I don't think this was mentioned.
Forge World have taken on somebody whose job is the creation of Decal Sheets and etched brass sprues so we should see a big increase in these products.
They started yesterday (Mon 9th feb) so it'll be a while.
Oh, and that person is Jes Goodwin's daughter.
Oo, goody! I was gutted when they removed the Tau decals, as they were so much better than the standard in box ones, hopefully they'll make a comeback now.
The Krieg list looks like a good update / consolidation, but I wonder how different the RoV list will be to the standard R&H list in IA13. From this contents image it seems almost identical, with the addition of a couple of detachments. If so, that's a big chunk of the book to spend on reprinted rules...
Looky Likey wrote: I read through the new Vraks renegade list last night, I still need to sit down tonight and compare unit by unit to understand the exact differences but my initial findings are:
1) Khorne and Nurgle only, as you'd expect the other two chaos gods do not feature in this book at all in the list as options or upgrades
2) States that this list is an extention of the IA13 list and should be treated as such
3) More units start with the higher BS and don't have the milita upgrade option
4) No Avus as transports, in fact no real options for flyers that I can remember
5) Loses the built in options for marked chaos troops, but the IA13 doesn't have these options and Chaos Marines are full battle brothers so its not a massive loss
6) Some of the warlord options are different
7) Some of the devotions are different
8) Some of the options are different, a big *I think* on this one, but renegade troop squads in IA13 can take very few special weapons, in Vraks v2 its one special weapon per 5 members, with very large (50 ish) max unit size.
9) Basic units available are broadly the same
10) Removes the old limits on heavy armour
So its not a completely different list, its not a 100% faithful update on Vraks, but if you have a large Vraks themed army (mine is around 9k) then you have something that is a better fit to how we used to play.
Thanks so much for this, couple of questions:
3. Does the higher BS mean the unit is more expensive than it is in IA13?
8. How sure are you that the unit size is 50, as for example a platoon in IA13 is 50 men base if you take all five squads but they're seperate units. Side note it is one special per 5 in the IA13 list too, only reason I'm asking for a double check on this point!
Oh and the Arkos update, is there anything that removes his apocalypse finest hour in the update, I'm rather a big fan of using him as my warlord to deepstrike a legionnaire warband that can assault the turn they land...
Koppo wrote: Oh, I don't think this was mentioned.
Forge World have taken on somebody whose job is the creation of Decal Sheets and etched brass sprues so we should see a big increase in these products.
They started yesterday (Mon 9th feb) so it'll be a while.
Oh, and that person is Jes Goodwin's daughter.
You're kidding. That is too awesome to be true.
I believe she studied illustration at Uni and is very good, but I thought Tammy was doing all the new design work? Didn't Tammy do all the decal sheets and heraldry for the Knights?
Tammy is doing design for GW, not FW. She did the incredible decal sheets for the Knights though.
Tamereth wrote: I've always hoped that they would do squad marking in etched brass, i.e. arrows for tactical marines etc.
You mean like this? £5 for 10 (bit of a rip off but they're pretty good)
My experience has been that a lot of the go shoulder pads have been kinda smallish on modern plastic Sm. also are throws still metal or were they switched into fine cast?
I have to agree etched brass arrows would be better.
but I also want brass chaos stars sized more for infantry and shoulder pads to compliment the more tank sized renegade stars they do now.
e.earnshaw wrote: Oooh vraks book wonder what new goodies come in that all pointing to the upcoming csm book.
Don't think anything new jumps out?
Just a fiddle to bring the rules up to date I expect (and a condensation.)
I wish I could say I was more excited about this new book. As far as I'm able to tell though, they've left out the Storm Chimeras they introduced as part of the Assault Brigade, and they've also left out the planes.
I suppose the planes aren't a huge loss, after all they're described in IA AERONAUTICA and I don't think the rules and costs are any different from those listed in IA12. In principle you're allowed to include such units in any Imperial Guard armies.
I hope they plan to revise and update the Assault Brigade list, now that they're releasing a new Siege list.
Also, I don't know how to interpret the "Hydra Flak Platform" seeing how it's hopelessly out of production now. How exactly am I expected to ward off enemy fliers if I can't have planes or flak?
The third Vraks book was one IA I never got. I wish I had now.
The Storm Chimera appears in IA-12 as a dedicated transport for Grenadiers, which are also a troop choice. The Storm Chimera has an autocannon turret and some other compulsory upgrades. It's pretty good in combination with the Grenadiers.
It goes without saying that I won't be able to use the Chimeras in a future DKoK Siege army, but I'll be able to reuse almost everything else that I've collected.
The third Vraks book was one IA I never got. I wish I had now.
The Storm Chimera appears in IA-12 as a dedicated transport for Grenadiers, which are also a troop choice. The Storm Chimera has an autocannon turret and some other compulsory upgrades. It's pretty good in combination with the Grenadiers.
It goes without saying that I won't be able to use the Chimeras in a future DKoK Siege army, but I'll be able to reuse almost everything else that I've collected.
You could never use the Storm Chimera in a Siege list in the first place.
Personally I've allied Siege stuff and Assault Brigade stuff to make my army.
Thanks so much for this, couple of questions:
3. Does the higher BS mean the unit is more expensive than it is in IA13?
8. How sure are you that the unit size is 50, as for example a platoon in IA13 is 50 men base if you take all five squads but they're seperate units. Side note it is one special per 5 in the IA13 list too, only reason I'm asking for a double check on this point!
Oh and the Arkos update, is there anything that removes his apocalypse finest hour in the update, I'm rather a big fan of using him as my warlord to deepstrike a legionnaire warband that can assault the turn they land...
Finally got round to sitting down with both books side by side rather than going from my inpefect memory so:
1) Warlord Traits are identical
2) Devotions, we lose Mutant Overlord, Heretek Magus, but gain Shock Legion Taskmaster - must take ogryns as troops but they don't count as scoring or objective secured, which is WTF, any ogryns within 12" of the Demagogue can inflict D3 unsavable wounds on that unit to give them fleet and furious charge for a game turn.
3) HQ units are identical bar the loss of Slanesh and Tzeech marks
4) Elites - we gain we lose marauder squad, otherwise the same
5) Troops - identical
6) Fast Attack - lose the Arvus, Valkyrie
7) Heavy - identical
8) LoW - lose the titans, slanesh/Tzeech greater demons, the 25% of points total for LoW and any devtion can take any LoW unlike IA13.
9) Gain two detachments - The Purge, Nurgle formation that has barrage weapons acting like 30K grav weapons in that you leave the template in place to create new dangerous terrarin, and chem weapon upgrades that adds in gets hot and shred. The other formation, Unending Host any unit that can reenter after being destroyed does so on a 2+ rather than the normal 5+ gaining outflank, 2d6 for run when reentering, cover from intervening friendily units is 3+ not 5+
10) The demons in the heros section in Vraks v2 state that they are not the same demon as IA13, so you could field two of them, one from each book, which seems crazy. Obviously we gain the Vraks heros/villians over IA13 and lose the rules for the greater demons, although the khorne and nurgle ones are valid choices still.
Overall not enough has changed in this new version bar the heroes and they cut out of the campaign meaning I have to keep this and the old books.
Thanks so much for this, couple of questions:
3. Does the higher BS mean the unit is more expensive than it is in IA13?
8. How sure are you that the unit size is 50, as for example a platoon in IA13 is 50 men base if you take all five squads but they're seperate units. Side note it is one special per 5 in the IA13 list too, only reason I'm asking for a double check on this point!
Oh and the Arkos update, is there anything that removes his apocalypse finest hour in the update, I'm rather a big fan of using him as my warlord to deepstrike a legionnaire warband that can assault the turn they land...
Finally got round to sitting down with both books side by side rather than going from my inpefect memory so:
1) Warlord Traits are identical
2) Devotions, we lose Mutant Overlord, Heretek Magus, but gain Shock Legion Taskmaster - must take ogryns as troops but they don't count as scoring or objective secured, which is WTF, any ogryns within 12" of the Demagogue can inflict D3 unsavable wounds on that unit to give them fleet and furious charge for a game turn.
3) HQ units are identical bar the loss of Slanesh and Tzeech marks
4) Elites - we gain we lose marauder squad, otherwise the same
5) Troops - identical
6) Fast Attack - lose the Arvus, Valkyrie
7) Heavy - identical
8) LoW - lose the titans, slanesh/Tzeech greater demons, the 25% of points total for LoW and any devtion can take any LoW unlike IA13.
9) Gain two detachments - The Purge, Nurgle formation that has barrage weapons acting like 30K grav weapons in that you leave the template in place to create new dangerous terrarin, and chem weapon upgrades that adds in gets hot and shred. The other formation, Unending Host any unit that can reenter after being destroyed does so on a 2+ rather than the normal 5+ gaining outflank, 2d6 for run when reentering, cover from intervening friendily units is 3+ not 5+
10) The demons in the heros section in Vraks v2 state that they are not the same demon as IA13, so you could field two of them, one from each book, which seems crazy. Obviously we gain the Vraks heros/villians over IA13 and lose the rules for the greater demons, although the khorne and nurgle ones are valid choices still.
Overall not enough has changed in this new version bar the heroes and they cut out of the campaign meaning I have to keep this and the old books.
Thanks so much. I do have one big question - can you give us more info about the details of the Unending Host formation? I ask because I recently built a Master of the Horde R&H army of 90 guys in 6 squads (using Krieg models, no less!).
I wanted to know if 1) you can take the formation with any army/book, just like other formations, 2) what units you must/can take in the formation (do you need a demagogue? Is it just platoons? what are min/max number of squads?), 3) whether the platoons in this formation (assuming it is just normal platoons) are more expensive than a Master of the Horde IA13 army due to being forced to take them at the pricier BS3/WS3, 4) whether these have objective secured (if not, OS would be an advantage for the Master of the Horde list), 5) whether there is any cost to the formation like old-school apoc formations, or is it "free" like modern 40k formations, 5) whether it is just "reserves" or "ongoing reserves" (people wonder whether that's a typo in IA13....), and 6) whether these come back every time they are destroyed like Master of the Horde, or just the first time (2+ comes back infinitely seems really strong....).
Edit: and I totally missed that part about outflank....wow. Does that mean that an Unending Horde unit that is destroyed can choose to come in from its own board edge or to outflank?
That formation is locked to the Vraks units and only for the devotion I mention. Is scoring. Those units always come back every time with that devotion anyway, your odds just improve with that formation.
Thanks for the clarification....sounds like it's a detachment not a formation? From your description it seems like you lose Objective Secured from a CAD, but you buff the Master of the Hordes ability (assuming that's what you took). Still wondering whether they changed the wording of the Master of the Horde to say "Ongoing Reserves? instead of "Reserves" but I guess if they copy-pasted it, then sadly probably not...
How much more expensive are platoons per model, since they come with BS3/WS3 base? In IA13 it's a little different since it's a flat squad upgrade...
With 'Tempest' on the horizon I have been re-listening to Mark of Calth.
I am keen to grab an Arkurian Pattern Shadowsword from Forgeworld for my Krieg but are there any thoughts in regard to a new (or old 30k) Shadowsword model?
I imagine we might see a Ventanus model in the near future considering he is the Saviour of Calth. With the Solar Auxilia Stormhammer teased I imagine a 30k version Shadowsword may have the same aesthetic.
The book mentions an Imperialis Auxilia Shadowsword that Ventanus rides- i'm presuming this is Solar Auxilia in the ForgeWorld books? I haven't read 'Conquest' so not sure how the Solar Auxilia fit into the Imperial Army and the battle of Calth.
DominusLimum wrote: I am keen to grab an Arkurian Pattern Shadowsword from Forgeworld for my Krieg but are there any thoughts in regard to a new (or old 30k) Shadowsword model?
I wouldn't bet on it. There aren't even any rumors about one, and the book pictures use the existing Arkurian-pattern model. Plus, it doesn't make much sense given that the Stormhammer is pretty much another Arkurian-pattern tank already. I don't think there's enough room to make major changes that would get people to buy another Shadowsword variant, especially when they could make an entirely new tank instead.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Seems like an awful lot of money to get something that's already in plastic.
It's only "already in plastic" if you don't mind having the uglier version of the model. That's fine if you just want a game piece that is WYSIWYG and may or may not even bother painting it, but the Arkurian pattern is a much better design IMO.
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DominusLimum wrote: Cheers Peregrine. Makes sense, so 'Conquest' has a Solar Auxilia Shadowsword in it?
It does, but it's just the standard one you can find everywhere else.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Seems like an awful lot of money to get something that's already in plastic.
It's only "already in plastic" if you don't mind having the uglier version of the model. That's fine if you just want a game piece that is WYSIWYG and may or may not even bother painting it, but the Arkurian pattern is a much better design IMO.
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DominusLimum wrote: Cheers Peregrine. Makes sense, so 'Conquest' has a Solar Auxilia Shadowsword in it?
It does, but it's just the standard one you can find everywhere else.
The plastic version doesn't fit the Death Korps super heavy filters either. Not a huge deal, but if you want everything to look nice and OCD, it can be a problem. I didn't catch that until i had already bought the plastic version. Since the Solar Auxilla is using Death Korps equipment, I would recommend to anyone potentially wanting to play Auxilla in 30K to pick up the forge world version in case you want it to match the mars pattern armor. All this aside from its much more pleasing appearance.
The frontal mud guards, the cannon... "girth," cannon travel lock, elements of the gun casemate, and the entire rear deck (almost the entire back 1/4 of the tank) are different on the forge world version. If hobby equals gameplay to anyone considering either tank, the forge world super heavies, to me, are preferential.
The Auxilla shadowswords featured in conquest are the current forge world models with the death korps super heavy filter set added. The baneblades are the plastic versions.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Thanks Mr. Subjective-is-a-word-alien-to-me.
Thanks Mr. Hypocritically-whine-about-subjectiveness-after-complaining-that-a-model-is-a-waste-of-money. Now that we've both made our non-constructive posts for the day can we get back on topic?
Virules wrote: Thanks for the clarification....sounds like it's a detachment not a formation? From your description it seems like you lose Objective Secured from a CAD, but you buff the Master of the Hordes ability (assuming that's what you took). Still wondering whether they changed the wording of the Master of the Horde to say "Ongoing Reserves? instead of "Reserves" but I guess if they copy-pasted it, then sadly probably not...
How much more expensive are platoons per model, since they come with BS3/WS3 base? In IA13 it's a little different since it's a flat squad upgrade...
Its a detachment, poor phrasing on my part. The rule is clearly written to cover anything going back into reserves for the recycling special rule, very clearly doesn't give that rule to anything that doesn't already have it.
As mentioned in my side by side comparision of the two books, troops are exactly the same in everyway. My initial thoughts were based on what I (mis)remembered from IA13.
The book mentions an Imperialis Auxilia Shadowsword that Ventanus rides- i'm presuming this is Solar Auxilia in the ForgeWorld books? I haven't read 'Conquest' so not sure how the Solar Auxilia fit into the Imperial Army and the battle of Calth.
Imperialis Auxilia and Solar Auxilia could happily be two different things. The Solar Auxilia is essentially a pattern of regimental organisation that was popular during the Great Crusade - so while the pattern was developed in the Solar system, the regiments could be raised anywhere, with standardised doctrines and equipment.
There were tons of other regiments, regimental patterns, and probably things that might be called 'Auxilia' units too. Having said that, I'm sure some Solar Auxilia units will turn up in the Calth books, just because FW are producing them now...!
I have no doubt FW is repeating what they did with the Mechanicum by producing for the Imperial army a number of lists that build upon each other, each representing a broader and broader force. First we had the Ordo Reductor list, the Legio Cybernetica, and then finally the Tagmatta Omnissiah. Now we have Solar Aulia, then Imperalis Auxilia... And we'll probably get a third.
If I recall correctly, the "Imperial Auxilia" is just the name for the Imperial Army in the Great Crusade, a catch-all phrase for their otherwise enormous variety and non-standardized forces, the Solar Auxilia being the elite and most-standardized element of them, akin to a larger version of the Storm Troopers of the 41st millenium.
Now, the rumours were that the Imperial Army would heavily draw upon existing 40k ranges rather than having FW invest in a bunch new Guard-equivalent lines (different regiments requiring a lot more work, and models, than the Legions) with specific models to expand upon them or otherwise add the 30k flair. I'm interested to see what comes of that, especially as the idea is very non-GW as it basically is "use your favourite guard-equivalent models," which from a hobby aspect is awesome, and will certainly add some visual diversity to 30k if true, and makes sense from a production side of thing, but is anathema to GW corporate thought.
Colour me interested, at any rate. Maybe my Death Korps can fight in the better Warhammer ruleset....
aka_mythos wrote: I have no doubt FW is repeating what they did with the Mechanicum by producing for the Imperial army a number of lists that build upon each other, each representing a broader and broader force. First we had the Ordo Reductor list, the Legio Cybernetica, and then finally the Tagmatta Omnissiah. Now we have Solar Aulia, then Imperalis Auxilia... And we'll probably get a third.
Solar Auxilia are their own force, like Stormtroopers in 40k. The force coming in Book V is more like PDF forces, less elite than the SA. So I think it's different to the way they did the Mechanicum.
You'll notice that Krieg has two detachments, "Krieg Death Rider Squadron - Battle-Forged Detachment" and "Krieg Gorgon Assault Squadron - Battle-Forged Detachment".
I believe the list on the table of contents reveal all the units they intend to be used with a DKoK Siege army. As I mentioned the other day, I find it a little odd that they've left out aircraft.
FW were asked about the imperial army lists that they have in production. Apparently only the Solar Aux. use a standard template and became imperial guard by 41st century. The other armies are localised to their region and follow their own pattern with very different look and feel. Tallaran was discussed in the weekender with FW picking up the middle bit of the campaign covered by John French's books at some point in the future.
With Book V having a proper PDF I couldn't be more chuffed as my 40k Imperial Guard force is built and painted as a UM PDF already.
aka_mythos wrote: ...First we had the Ordo Reductor list, the Legio Cybernetica, and then finally the Tagmatta Omnissiah. Now we have Solar Aulia, then Imperalis Auxilia... And we'll probably get a third.
sorry to be technical here (I'm an engineer, I can't help it) but the Ordo Reductor wasn't a list until book two came out and allowed its units to be used as one; the 'Ordo Reductor list' was included as an allied detachment (never intended to be fielded on it's own) for a loyalist player.
honestly, I'm just bitter that the whole Ordo Reductor has to be the shattered remnants of the Isstvan atrocity.
Must point out, I love Girlyman. I know will still be any wip however believe he or she appears great. Be intriguing to determine exactly how this individual turns out.
Looky Likey wrote: FW were asked about the imperial army lists that they have in production. Apparently only the Solar Aux. use a standard template and became imperial guard by 41st century. The other armies are localised to their region and follow their own pattern with very different look and feel. Tallaran was discussed in the weekender with FW picking up the middle bit of the campaign covered by John French's books at some point in the future.
With Book V having a proper PDF I couldn't be more chuffed as my 40k Imperial Guard force is built and painted as a UM PDF already.
Honestly while I like both the look and fiction for the Solar Auxilia, I won't be particularly invested in the Army/Guard aspect of FW's Heresy series until/if they start doing the interesting forces like the Geno-52 Chiliad and the Lucifer Blacks.
I know this may be a little late but I recently bought IA13 (the renegades one) & I can't find the stats for all but 1 of the titan weapons. I found a couple in the main rule book but not all.
Anyone know if this has been discussed, if FW know & if so, is there a PDF flying around somewhere with this info?
I also have this problem with the HH book 'THE HORUS HERESY LEGIONES ASTARTES: CRUSADE ARMY LIST' (here) which doesn't have the weapon stats for the 2 Mechanicum units.
I know I have the 1st 2 big HH books so I can dig out the stats but that's not the point.
The books should contain all the rules you need to run the units in them - not rely on the customer maybe having other FW books with this info in it. & re the titan weapons, with all the rules changes recently, how do I know if my other books contain up-to-date stats anyway??
If I can find 5 minutes I will be complaining to FW's editor as this is ridiculous.
gasdg wrote: Must point out, I love Girlyman. I know will still be any wip however believe he or she appears great. Be intriguing to determine exactly how this individual turns out.
I have trust that the Primarch of the Ultramarines will be a great model ... but I am still sad that Dorn is not one of the next primarchs to be released ...
Virules wrote: Thanks for the clarification....sounds like it's a detachment not a formation? From your description it seems like you lose Objective Secured from a CAD, but you buff the Master of the Hordes ability (assuming that's what you took). Still wondering whether they changed the wording of the Master of the Horde to say "Ongoing Reserves? instead of "Reserves" but I guess if they copy-pasted it, then sadly probably not...
How much more expensive are platoons per model, since they come with BS3/WS3 base? In IA13 it's a little different since it's a flat squad upgrade...
Its a detachment, poor phrasing on my part. The rule is clearly written to cover anything going back into reserves for the recycling special rule, very clearly doesn't give that rule to anything that doesn't already have it.
As mentioned in my side by side comparision of the two books, troops are exactly the same in everyway. My initial thoughts were based on what I (mis)remembered from IA13.
Thanks a bunch. That sounds incredibly strong, even with the loss of Objective Secured. So excited. 90 guys coming back on 2+ sounds so strong.
aka_mythos wrote: I have no doubt FW is repeating what they did with the Mechanicum by producing for the Imperial army a number of lists that build upon each other, each representing a broader and broader force. First we had the Ordo Reductor list, the Legio Cybernetica, and then finally the Tagmatta Omnissiah. Now we have Solar Aulia, then Imperalis Auxilia... And we'll probably get a third.
Solar Auxilia are their own force, like Stormtroopers in 40k. The force coming in Book V is more like PDF forces, less elite than the SA. So I think it's different to the way they did the Mechanicum.
Those three Mechanicum armylists represent 3 entirely seperate branches of the Mechanicum's military forces, each it's own force. In this era they are all very seperate arms of the Mechanicum. FW has used their similarities to cascade and build up into a larger list. You draw the stormtrooper parallel... Stormtroopers are in both their own list and the Imperial Guard lists... And I'd bet Solar Auxilia will be likewise their own list and elites in the Imperialis Auxilia.
aka_mythos wrote: ...First we had the Ordo Reductor list, the Legio Cybernetica, and then finally the Tagmatta Omnissiah. Now we have Solar Aulia, then Imperalis Auxilia... And we'll probably get a third.
sorry to be technical here (I'm an engineer, I can't help it) but the Ordo Reductor wasn't a list until book two came out and allowed its units to be used as one; the 'Ordo Reductor list' was included as an allied detachment (never intended to be fielded on it's own) for a loyalist player.
honestly, I'm just bitter that the whole Ordo Reductor has to be the shattered remnants of the Isstvan atrocity.
Technically (I'm an engineer too) they're included in the appendix where there is nothing saying they can't be taken as their own Armylist. The Legion Armylist is the only mention of them as allies and just says that a Legion can take them as an ally. There is no restriction on them being taken standalone.
There's too much in the SA list to be elites in the Imperial Army list, whenever it comes out. And the next list is the PDF type force, which they've already said is different to SA, not elite, more numbers. So already it's different to how they did the Mechanicum.
gasdg wrote: Must point out, I love Girlyman. I know will still be any wip however believe he or she appears great. Be intriguing to determine exactly how this individual turns out.
He or she..? Guilliman is definitely a he.
No kidding, right?
That "funny" spelling has to be one of the least funny misspellings, ever.
I HOPE it is just because "Roboute Guilliman" is, I guess, kind of hard to remember how to spell correctly?
aka_mythos wrote: ...First we had the Ordo Reductor list, the Legio Cybernetica, and then finally the Tagmatta Omnissiah. Now we have Solar Aulia, then Imperalis Auxilia... And we'll probably get a third.
sorry to be technical here (I'm an engineer, I can't help it) but the Ordo Reductor wasn't a list until book two came out and allowed its units to be used as one; the 'Ordo Reductor list' was included as an allied detachment (never intended to be fielded on it's own) for a loyalist player.
honestly, I'm just bitter that the whole Ordo Reductor has to be the shattered remnants of the Isstvan atrocity.
Technically (I'm an engineer too) they're included in the appendix where there is nothing saying they can't be taken as their own Armylist. The Legion Armylist is the only mention of them as allies and just says that a Legion can take them as an ally. There is no restriction on them being taken standalone.
yeah, the appendix was intended for people to use their titans as LOW choices and we were given a single troop choice and a single unique character which couldnt join other squads! at that point it was in NO WAY intended as a standalone list i emailed them about it when i got betrayal and thats what they said - they also admitted to me at the time that the mechanicum models were much more popular than they were expecting and a full list may be around the corner (shame i didnt save that e-mail, i honestly didnt think i would ever need it!).
go get your copy of betrayal: look at caleb's entry in the bottom right on the right-hand side; theres a bit titled 'Castellan Reductor' - first line states:
"Calleb Decima is a HQ choice for an Ordo Reductor Allied Detachment, and if you are using the isstvan 3 campain, this detachment may only be chosen by the Loyalist side"
it was a massive deal for me and i went ahead and made a primary detachment from it anyway! i just made sure that if they renaged on their e-mail that i could have a sizeable reductor allied detachment with only enough marines to technically count as my primary.
You'll notice that Krieg has two detachments, "Krieg Death Rider Squadron - Battle-Forged Detachment" and "Krieg Gorgon Assault Squadron - Battle-Forged Detachment".
I believe the list on the table of contents reveal all the units they intend to be used with a DKoK Siege army. As I mentioned the other day, I find it a little odd that they've left out aircraft.
Yes, I saw the table of contents, I was asking what the rules for the DKoK detachments are.
And leaving out the aircraft makes sense, if this is supposed to be a Vraks-focused list. There weren't any aircraft involved with the trench warfare, and they kind of contradict the theme of a static gunline with a horde of meatshields. Plus, it's all part of the same IG faction so you can just include a few Vendettas in your DKoK detachment even if they aren't in the DKoK army list.
Yes, I saw the table of contents, I was asking what the rules for the DKoK [Battle-forged] detachments are.
This. Can someone provide us a general idea what the composition/rules are for these two, new DKK detachments? My imagination tells me they're awesome!
BrookM wrote: Probably some sort of honour guard with boarding / combat shields.
I think I heard that too ... Honor Guard. I do not know about the shields though. Ultramarines may even get more than just two elite units if I remember correctly ...
Snrub wrote: Anyone know what sort of special Ultramarine units we might see along side their Primarch?
A few pages back there are the shots of the WIP sculpts of the UM command squad and pictures of the proto van/sternguard unit we are getting. Even further back there are pictures from warhammerfest of the UM boarding marines with the shields. Only one I am expecting that we haven't see yet is the fancy UM terminators, there are pictures of them in the Battle for Macragge comic book, see bottom right here:
As every other legion has had them so far, no reason for UM not to be getting them as well.
I didn't get chance to look at the model properly over the weekend, do we know if this model is much taller than a normal marine as he is meant to be much taller according to the books or am I misremembering?
Looky Likey wrote: I didn't get chance to look at the model properly over the weekend, do we know if this model is much taller than a normal marine as he is meant to be much taller according to the books or am I misremembering?
Does not look much taller to me ...
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BrookM wrote: Gorgeous model, though a pity a helmet isn't included.
Yeah, but I like the face (as I do from Sevatar - still unsure which version to use) so its ok ... but I think I will take the banner from the Phalanx Warder set and give it to Pollux.
Snrub wrote: Anyone know what sort of special Ultramarine units we might see along side their Primarch?
A few pages back there are the shots of the WIP sculpts of the UM command squad and pictures of the proto van/sternguard unit we are getting. Even further back there are pictures from warhammerfest of the UM boarding marines with the shields. Only one I am expecting that we haven't see yet is the fancy UM terminators, there are pictures of them in the Battle for Macragge comic book, see bottom right here:
As every other legion has had them so far, no reason for UM not to be getting them as well.
The only UM stuff we've seen is the upgrade kits and WIP of Guilliman, we haven't seen anything from their specific squads yet. Apparantly there's going to be an Honour Guard squad, and some kind of Breacher squad armed with axes and Gladius slots on their shields. And not every legion gets Terminators, RG don't, IF dont, NL and WB dont.
The only UM stuff we've seen is the upgrade kits and WIP of Guilliman, we haven't seen anything from their specific squads yet. Apparantly there's going to be an Honour Guard squad, and some kind of Breacher squad armed with axes and Gladius slots on their shields. And not every legion gets Terminators, RG don't, IF dont, NL and WB dont.
I mixed up the WIP upgrade kit with the command squad, but here are the photos from earlier in the thread for the rest of it:
Alan Bligh stated that he did about 8 unquie units per legion with some of them cut. When an army features in a later book, and all will at some point, we'll see the rest of that Legion's units. UM are getting back to back books and don't really feature again right until the end so I would expect most of their units to hit in the next two books, particularly as they are such a popular 40k army. IF I expect to get covered in the Terra books, I'm also expecting a decent Dorn in that one was well. NL in the Dark Angels book. RG and WB I'm not sure on but they get other unquie units that other armies shouldn't get meaning their total unquie units will be around the same.
If aren't new units in a subsequent book for an army then just reprinting the earlier rules would be a bit cheeky and FW would be unlikely to sell many books to people running that army.
Yup you are right, for some reason I didn't see the brush on the sarge's head for the painted ones. Not a fan of the blue they have used for the painted ones, bit to Alpha Legion for my taste. Upgrade set looks good though, I may have to do some vets at some point.
I really like the blue, I think I prefer it to the deeper blue. I dunno, I like both. I think I'm gonna do UM as my loyalist legion. And yeah I really like the upgrade set.
I love the UM helmets, but the torsi are a little disappointing (considering what they have done for the IF e.g.). I expect much more bling bling for the Honor Guard though (as indicated on the photos)
DAMN YOU EMPTY WALLET! FORGEWORLD WHY DO YOU TORMENT ME SO!!!!
I have to admit both Polux & Sevatar are 2 of my favourite characters from the 30k..... seriously considering buying both... but then again the new Alpha Legionnaire looks pretty special also!
I have to agree with the previous comment though.... for some reason I always pictured Polux with a helmet!? Perhaps a modified MkII with a centurion crest might work!?
Snrub wrote: Anyone know what sort of special Ultramarine units we might see along side their Primarch?
A few pages back there are the shots of the WIP sculpts of the UM command squad and pictures of the proto van/sternguard unit we are getting. Even further back there are pictures from warhammerfest of the UM boarding marines with the shields. Only one I am expecting that we haven't see yet is the fancy UM terminators, there are pictures of them in the Battle for Macragge comic book, see bottom right here:
As every other legion has had them so far, no reason for UM not to be getting them as well.
The only UM stuff we've seen is the upgrade kits and WIP of Guilliman, we haven't seen anything from their specific squads yet. Apparantly there's going to be an Honour Guard squad, and some kind of Breacher squad armed with axes and Gladius slots on their shields. And not every legion gets Terminators, RG don't, IF dont, NL and WB dont.
Don't forget the obligatory Contemptor , wait the HH black library books have a named Contemptor, so they'll probably get 2....at least
Nng. If only Polux's shield didn't have that zogging great fist on it ;(. Wonderful model and I love the idea of a Fist with a built in combi-melta. Powerfists with a built in armament should be far more common.
I almost love his base more than the model, The spent and half spent bolter magazines are an outstanding touch.
Don't forget the obligatory Contemptor , wait the HH black library books have a named Contemptor, so they'll probably get 2....at least
Oh, the dreadnought that fell to earth (well, Calth) got mentioned on the weekender at one of the seminars as a character in the next book, so yeah, that'll happen.
Koppo wrote: Oh, the dreadnought that fell to earth (well, Calth)
This legit happened? How high? Like from orbit high or fell out of a thunderhawk while deepstriking high?
Yes - he was on an orbital platform that was destroyed. He _might_ have already been in his drop pod - I'll check.
Automatically Appended Next Post: It is Know No Fear, and his name's Telemechrus. He's in a transport casket rather than a drop pod.
"His casket has been violently disturbed, thrown, dropped. His implant clock tells him that he has been dormant for a little over nine hours and ten minutes. External sensors are down. He can’t see. He can’t open the casket. There is no noosphere. There is no data inload. His own sensors, the cyberorganic sensors of his combat chassis mount, tell him the external temperature of the casket is over five thousand degrees Celsius. His inertial locators tell him that he is upside down and falling. At terminal velocity."
Snrub wrote: Anyone know what sort of special Ultramarine units we might see along side their Primarch?
A few pages back there are the shots of the WIP sculpts of the UM command squad and pictures of the proto van/sternguard unit we are getting. Even further back there are pictures from warhammerfest of the UM boarding marines with the shields. Only one I am expecting that we haven't see yet is the fancy UM terminators, there are pictures of them in the Battle for Macragge comic book, see bottom right here:
As every other legion has had them so far, no reason for UM not to be getting them as well.
The only UM stuff we've seen is the upgrade kits and WIP of Guilliman, we haven't seen anything from their specific squads yet. Apparantly there's going to be an Honour Guard squad, and some kind of Breacher squad armed with axes and Gladius slots on their shields. And not every legion gets Terminators, RG don't, IF dont, NL and WB dont.
Don't forget the obligatory Contemptor , wait the HH black library books have a named Contemptor, so they'll probably get 2....at least
We'll only get one, the Salamanders and EC both had named dreads that use the existing models.
SirDonlad wrote: honestly, I'm just bitter that the whole Ordo Reductor has to be the shattered remnants of the Isstvan atrocity.
I don't see why this is the case? The Tagmata list is easily capable of producing an Ordo Reductor list, and has more options for one than the Allied detachment in Book 1. It has the option for a Reductor Magos, as well as Reductor Techpriest covenants, Thallax for Troops, the Ursarax for Fast Attack, and the big siege-automata and the tank would make good Heavy Support. Myrmidons attach themselves to any Mechanicus forces they feel like for the most part, so they make sense to include too. The Land Raider is also included, but annoyingly requires you to own Book 1 for the rules.
This year’s Forge World and Black Library Horus Heresy Weekender, two days packed full of seminars and activities dedicated to the Horus Heresy, is now over and it was another fantastic event with hundreds of hobbyists in attendance. I’ve only just recovered and can’t wait for next year’s!
The Forge World Sales Hall was stocked up with Event Exclusive merchandise and fantastic pre-release models.
One of the best things about the Horus Heresy Weekender has got to be meeting and chatting to all the designers and writers from the Forge World Studio. All weekend they were showing off what they’ve been working on and answering questions about their creations.
The Forge World Studio designers were out in force to meet hobbyists from all over the world.
The Demo Pods running throughout the weekend were incredibly popular, with painters and designers from the Forge World Studio sharing their skills. One of the most popular was Phil Stutcinskas’ Airbrushing Demo Pod, with queues out of the door to join in. Thankfully, Phil ran his Demo Pod four times over the weekend so no one missed out.
Phil shares some of his airbrushing expertise.
Some of the seminars this year were crammed to capacity with people eager to find out what Forge World is releasing over the next few months. The most popular were those seminars looking ahead at forthcoming models from the Forge World Studio and The Horus Heresy Book Five – Tempest.
So much happens at the Weekender, there’s no way to fit it all in to one bulletin. Next week I’ll be taking a look at some of the awesome models entered into the Horus Heresy Weekender 2015 painting competition.
That’s all from me for now. Make sure you check back soon for more from the Forge World Studio.
Some of this stuff is really great, but a lot of it is more of the same to me. I don't like/play SMs, so I'm clearly biased, plusI wasn't exactly critical of all the love they used to shower on Guard, but still, so very many marine releases. I'm no longer excited when I get a FW email anymore
AkhilleusK42 wrote: Some of this stuff is really great, but a lot of it is more of the same to me. I don't like/play SMs, so I'm clearly biased, plusI wasn't exactly critical of all the love they used to shower on Guard, but still, so very many marine releases. I'm no longer excited when I get a FW email anymore
Well, I only like to paint Space Marines and therefore love the Horus Heresy stuff - this bulletin just had no real news whatsoever. But I feel for you guys who are not interested in SM stuff ...
If they were going to cover the weekender they should have at least put in high quality shots of the cool new stuff, the best of the painting comp cabinet, and the best of the armies that were gaming that weekend. I know they took pictures of all of that cause I watched them do it, but they never seem to use them for anything. Wasted opportunity, again.
Looky Likey wrote: If they were going to cover the weekender they should have at least put in high quality shots of the cool new stuff, the best of the painting comp cabinet, and the best of the armies that were gaming that weekend. I know they took pictures of all of that cause I watched them do it, but they never seem to use them for anything. Wasted opportunity, again.
Ahem. Though it's unsurprising as no-one will ever see them if they appear in there...
It's pretty bad when these prices are great, compared to going down to your local game store and picking up a box of tac space marines, or base troopers, or a tank or two.
Great looking stuff though, they have really come a long way.
ImAGeek wrote:This was part one of the weekender too so there'll be more stuff on it next week, probably some model photos.
Looky Likey wrote:If they were going to cover the weekender they should have at least put in high quality shots of the cool new stuff, the best of the painting comp cabinet, and the best of the armies that were gaming that weekend. I know they took pictures of all of that cause I watched them do it, but they never seem to use them for anything. Wasted opportunity, again.
They said themselves the Bulletin themselves there will be pictures of the painting competition
Forge World wrote:So much happens at the Weekender, there’s no way to fit it all in to one bulletin. Next week I’ll be taking a look at some of the awesome models entered into the Horus Heresy Weekender 2015 painting competition.
They do apparently: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Events/HH_Weekender_2014.html This is last years, I expect next years to appear soon. Wasn't easy to find though, there is a page somewhere with past FW painting competition winners, can't seem to find it. They may have removed it though.
EDIT: Found it: http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Events/prevbos0309.html There are quite a few galleries of old Games days and things on the FW sitemap, took me awhile to find this in them, so I don't doubt they will put up a new gallery for this event at some point.
SirDonlad wrote: honestly, I'm just bitter that the whole Ordo Reductor has to be the shattered remnants of the Isstvan atrocity.
I don't see why this is the case? The Tagmata list is easily capable of producing an Ordo Reductor list, and has more options for one than the Allied detachment in Book 1. It has the option for a Reductor Magos, as well as Reductor Techpriest covenants, Thallax for Troops, the Ursarax for Fast Attack, and the big siege-automata and the tank would make good Heavy Support. Myrmidons attach themselves to any Mechanicus forces they feel like for the most part, so they make sense to include too. The Land Raider is also included, but annoyingly requires you to own Book 1 for the rules.
it's ALL about the thallax man! if i use the taghmata list i can't have the 'ferrox' upgrade. i like the ferrox upgrade with heavy chain blades.
book two promised my list more units but i'm still waiting to see that fulfilled.
Looky Likey wrote: I didn't get chance to look at the model properly over the weekend, do we know if this model is much taller than a normal marine as he is meant to be much taller according to the books or am I misremembering?
Does not look much taller to me ...
It's a trick of perspective. The models aren't all on the same plane. The banner bearer is further back and looks smaller.
I really like the way Forge World poses their models. I get sick and tired of GW squatting marines, and when they're standing upright, the models don't actually look that half bad.
angryboy2k wrote: Does anyone know the pricing for the Mhara Gal Dreadnought? And a release date?
I've not bought anything 40k-related in ages, but this thing is very appealing for some reason.
It was available at the weekender so should be out within a few weeks. I dunno the price but if I had to guess around £40, maybe £45, cos you get the arms with it.
It's listed as £126 for three quad launchers and three crew sets, that's 3x£23 and 3x£12 which is £105, only noticed because it's one I actually want the bundle, looks like it's email time.
It's listed as £126 for three quad launchers and three crew sets, that's 3x£23 and 3x£12 which is £105, only noticed because it's one I actually want the bundle, looks like it's email time.
No, you're not being crazy. E-mail forgeworld. They'll either drop the bundle price or raise the price of the individual pieces...
Dropped them an email, shame there aren't more renegade bundles when they have pretty much the same options as the krieg bundles available to them. Though their automated reply is still banging on about the free shipping vouchers that expired two and a half weeks ago so not expecting a speedy response.
Well they responded rather quickly by increasing the bundle to four launchers and crew, not quite what I was expecting but it's certainly one solution.
The Rapier Laser Destroyer bundle is interesting, seeing how the crew models are ordinary Krieg guardsmen and not Engineers.
In IA-12, the crew are listed as Engineers (which gives the Rapier BS 4).
I've tried assembling rapiers with Engineer crewmen, the only useable miniature being one of the two mole launcher crewmen and it didn't look that great.
On my second attempt, I created crewmembers from the "Heavy Artillery Crew" kit. In this set, you have 3 upright miniatures, ideal for standing on the platform behind the console, and a selection of empty arms.
In my experience the "Heavy Artillery Crew" set is much better suited for creating the Rapier shooters, than the "Thudd Gun crew".
Zingraff wrote: The Rapier Laser Destroyer bundle is interesting, seeing how the crew models are ordinary Krieg guardsmen and not Engineers.
In IA-12, the crew are listed as Engineers (which gives the Rapier BS 4).
I've tried assembling rapiers with Engineer crewmen, the only useable miniature being one of the two mole launcher crewmen and it didn't look that great.
On my second attempt, I created crewmembers from the "Heavy Artillery Crew" kit. In this set, you have 3 upright miniatures, ideal for standing on the platform behind the console, and a selection of empty arms.
In my experience the "Heavy Artillery Crew" set is much better suited for creating the Rapier shooters, than the "Thudd Gun crew".
Ahh, but these aren't for the IA12 Assault Brigade, these are for Siege list in the new Vraks book
Ahh, but these aren't for the IA12 Assault Brigade, these are for Siege list in the new Vraks book
Yes precisely, that's what I was trying to get across.
The Rapier bundle seems to suggest that the Rapier Crew in Vraks book aren't Engineers, but Guardsmen with BS 3. Which does affect the functionality of the Rapier to a certain extent.
I'm primarily interested in the newest and most up to date Krieg list/"codex" and it doesn't matter much whether that means I'll be playing Siege or Assault Brigade, but it does incline me to compare the two, to see which parts of my current army I'm allowed to carry over, and which may no longer work, unless as allies.
a) They didn't want to make an Engineer Squad + 5 Rapier Bundle, or
b) The Siege Regiment Rapiers are now crewed by ordinary korpsmen, which means that they should have BS3 and 5+ armour. Probably cheaper (30 points compared to IA13?).
sockwithaticket wrote: Not sure that 750 is a number you need to start sounding the alarm for; 500 perhaps.
Agreed. Though the price is now £25. Not bad and it is a nice book. I suspect that we'll be see the remaining Imperial Armour books re-done as 2nd Editions and then... what I don't know?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
warboss wrote: How much time was there between when they did the big sale of Vraks and the redone version they just started selling at the weekender?
A quick look at this thread shows IA5 sold out in November last year.
Ah, thanks for the updates. So in about 6 months or so we should expect a new version of the book now on super sale in all likelihood (no guarantees though).
warboss wrote: Ah, thanks for the updates. So in about 6 months or so we should expect a new version of the book now on super sale in all likelihood (no guarantees though).
I doublechecked my mailbox and I ordered the Vraks book bundle in late August, a few weeks after the bundle was announced.
Bobthehero wrote: Its strange, considering the current Krieg pdf Rapier has Engineers as crewmen
Just wanted to address this: the Rapier in the new Vraks book still has engineers as crew. So the bundle isn't strictly WYSIWYG, but someone probably thought that the artillery crew models work better than the engineers.
zedmeister wrote: Interesting. Imperial Armour 11 is being sold off:
Not really surprising. All of the rules in it are obsolete so it doesn't make much sense to print new ones, and sales have probably slowed down enough that the extra stock is going to be around forever at full price. They might as well cut the price and see if people are willing to pay a reduced price for the fluff alone.
warboss wrote: How much time was there between when they did the big sale of Vraks and the redone version they just started selling at the weekender?
The Imperial Armour Vraks book deal was announced late last summer, if I remember correctly. I think I received my books in september/october.
Fun story about the Vraks bundle. Ordered it, but only book 1 arrived along with a note saying that they were out of books 2 and 3 and a credit for the missing books.
Couple of weeks later along comes a new package with all three books... but no new credit card charge. Whoo hoo!
Lobukia wrote: Getting the full badab set for 30 was nice, rules be darned.
Quite, the rules change every so often anyways, the fluff part stays the same throughout editions . I picked those up aswell, might even pick this up for the background. Don't play Sw or Eldar but these books usually are pretty good reads just in and of themselves and for 25 it's not a bad deal at all.
So they are selling of IA8, IA9/10 and IA11. I'd guess we'll see IA8 at the Warhmmer World reopening, IA9 & 10 later and then IA11 for Christmas? That only leaves IA12 needing a second edition?
I still don't like the Stormhammer, that flap over the front gun looks just as silly in real life.
Does IA12 even need a second edition? The DKoK stuff is 95% current with the new Vraks book, and most of the "obsolete" rules are all minor things like small changes in LRBT point costs. That's hardly worth reprinting a book for, unless the Necron stuff really needs it. A third edition of IA1 would do more to update obsolete IG rules than a second edition of IA12.
True, most of the Necron rules from IA12 that overlap with the codex refer you to the codex for the rules. Some of the Lords and the like could do with a minor tweak but nothig major.
That DEATH KORPS OF KRIEG SUBTERRANEAN ASSAULT SQUAD bundle is tempting me, saves 20 pounds for models I've always wanted yet have no real obvious use for, but dam I like the Engineer models and Hardes drill, look perfectly industrial and grim, Hope they have rules for them in an Imperial Army list in HH
True, most of the Necron rules from IA12 that overlap with the codex refer you to the codex for the rules. Some of the Lords and the like could do with a minor tweak but nothig major.
SirDonlad wrote: Did anyone else think that the price seemed reasonable or has my interpretation of money become flawed?
In my mind I still see the Baneblade as a ~£60 kit so when I saw it was £150 I quickly closed the web page (and ya know, I own a Brass Scorpion, and plenty of other FW items so I'm not that easily put off)
Johnson101 wrote: That DEATH KORPS OF KRIEG SUBTERRANEAN ASSAULT SQUAD bundle is tempting me, saves 20 pounds for models I've always wanted yet have no real obvious use for, but dam I like the Engineer models and Hardes drill, look perfectly industrial and grim, Hope they have rules for them in an Imperial Army list in HH
er, not sure your maths adds up there mate:
1 x drill @ £30
1 x mole launcher @ £12
2 x engineers squad @ £23
total=£88
Johnson101 wrote: That DEATH KORPS OF KRIEG SUBTERRANEAN ASSAULT SQUAD bundle is tempting me, saves 20 pounds for models I've always wanted yet have no real obvious use for, but dam I like the Engineer models and Hardes drill, look perfectly industrial and grim, Hope they have rules for them in an Imperial Army list in HH
Pretty sure the DKoK are supposed to be a relatively recent thing in the 40k timeline and before 1-2 thousand years ago, they were the "Some Guys from Krieg".
Yes, weren't the Death Korps created following the irradiation of Krieg in a nuclear Civil War? Prior to the nuclear war (i.e. Horus Heresy), regiments from Krieg would have lacked the distinctive hazardous environment themes, they would resemble Cadian regiments more than the Death Korps.
It's not like the traitor primarchs have much going for them in the male fashion model department. I do expect Sanguinius to be the best male fashion model of the bunch though when he comes out. 
What if we call the dropper "Alpharius" and the pot "Omegon"? If we say which side we are on would that be more appropriate
