Rayvon wrote: Those buildings are growing on me actually the more I look at them, I just wish they were a little taller. I hate to think how much a full board of those tiles would set me back if I lived down under.
I bought one of the big boxes, then instead of buying the other five I'd need to make a full table with decent terrain density I spent a third that much on a vacuum chamber. Will be a lot easier to make large structures once I combine multiple plastic components into large "tiles" and cast them. If it's good enough for GW...
Would you mind linking to the vacuum chamber you bought? Or any links to help someone learn more of this dark magic you speak of?
Vorian wrote: For further comparison old warlord is about waist of new warlord. Old Imperator is about size of new warlord(some use the old imperators to convert new warlords and doesn't look oddly small)
Actually... the old Imperator is much closer in size (and particularly bulk) to a Reaver than a Warlord. It mostly looks like a smallish Reaver with a house on top
Yes, the top of the highest spire of the Imperator is at the same height that the Warlord... but it's nowhere as big anyways.
I don't really care how viable the imperator is for the game, I just want the model. Also, just have it be played in specific scenarios or larger games.
puzzledust wrote: I don't really care how viable the imperator is for the game, I just want the model. Also, just have it be played in specific scenarios or larger games.
Shouldn't be too difficult to kitbash one.
Buy a 28MM Knight kit, replace the top carapace with some foamcore and stack Civitas Imperialis Administratum Sector buildings onto the top.
Was checking my Reaver Weapons Cards last night, and realised that with the previews, we’re soon to have a full suite of dakka for them.
And it got me wondering what we’re awaiting for the Warlord. Gatling Blasters are on the way, as are the Macro Cannon and Heavy Gatling Blasters. What are we yet to see to complete their existing suite?
After the previews and existing releases the Warlord just needs carapace megabolters & turbolasers. Luckily are those are the easiest to substitute from the Reaver/Warhound. The megabolter in particular isn't the biggest loss as it's short range can normally only be used on other Walords.
xttz wrote: After the previews and existing releases the Warlord just needs carapace megabolters & turbolasers. Luckily are those are the easiest to substitute from the Reaver/Warhound. The megabolter in particular isn't the biggest loss as it's short range can normally only be used on other Walords.
The Turbo-lasers are already out, on the Sunfury weapon sprue, so think it's just the mega-bolters left (after the previewed Gatling blasters)
xttz wrote: After the previews and existing releases the Warlord just needs carapace megabolters & turbolasers. Luckily are those are the easiest to substitute from the Reaver/Warhound. The megabolter in particular isn't the biggest loss as it's short range can normally only be used on other Walords.
The Turbo-lasers are already out, on the Sunfury weapon sprue, so think it's just the mega-bolters left (after the previewed Gatling blasters)
Doesn't the rulebook have at least a couple of weapon rules not used by any current cards? Will be interesting to see if they have something already planned for those.
I'm sure we'll see a 'Wave 2' of weapons. Vortex missiles and Warlord Chainfists spring to mind. Fire control Towers, landing pads and Corvus Assault Pods? Not so sure.
xttz wrote: Doesn't the rulebook have at least a couple of weapon rules not used by any current cards? Will be interesting to see if they have something already planned for those.
Vortex at least. And then there was one that made target take more shield saves than was expected.
And its more fun than putting a counter by it to say its fired; plus it works well if you've got more than one in the game and want to keep easy track on what has and hasn't fired. If its got no missile you know its the one that's already fired.
If this evolves into epic, then it's over for me. I would drop up to a thousand bucks on it on an instant. Epic was my first mini wargame, my first GW game and the game that hooked me on metal, plastic and resin for, I assume, life.
Panzerkanzler wrote: If this evolves into epic, then it's over for me. I would drop up to a thousand bucks on it on an instant. Epic was my first mini wargame, my first GW game and the game that hooked me on metal, plastic and resin for, I assume, life.
As it is likened to a sea-warfare game, and set in the Horus Heresy era, its hard to see Titanicus being evolved into an epic-style game. The team behind it have also said they have no plans for xenos in Titanicus.
That said, I certainly wouldn't dismiss the possibility of a second 8mm game. With Knight and terrain/scenery kits already available they just need tanks and aircraft to go with them to make a combined-arms game and just move it into the modern 40K era.
Even then 6 Knights( using different colour plastic ) and a few buildings would be enough for a small, limited availability game such like Gangs of Gormmrah or Gorechosen. It would be a great opportunity to place an AT advert sheet inside the box.
For now, though, there is AT and it seems to be popular enough with the giant-robot lovers of the Warhammer community. That alone suggests good things are to follow...
Rayvon wrote: I cannot believe that they are not considering an Epic scale reboot after the way AT has been selling.
They might be but:
1) GW is still under producing for demand and still has a very full roster fixing AoS and its armies up. So there's likely no room for adding another big game
2) GW doesn't need to add it - as noted in point 1 GW is doing so well they can only just keep up.
3) AT is doing well but we don't know the investment to profit ratio. So we can't easily say how well or badly its doing save that its selling very strongly based on GW running out of stock and adding more support to it.
4) AT works really well because its very low investment (no this doesn't conflict point 3). They've only got 1 army to support at present so that really cuts down on variety of sculpts and number of moulds needed. Epic would require alternate races and that means significantly more moulds and such at launch.
5) Even if GW was working on it now they wouldn't say. GW is very strict about not leaking info too far ahead, Sisters of Battle is about one of the rare situations where we know something is coming more than a few months in advance. If GW has epic on the cards then they are playing it close to their chest until such time as they are 100% certain on the release date and already gearing up to launch.
6) Don't forget one strength AT has is that whilst it is expensive its very low model count and appeals to a different market. Epic isn't low model count, its high model count and the rules are very different by nature. So there's always a risk that it can end up appealing to a market that perhaps is alerady bought into 40K
Personally I don't expect to see Epic until well after AT has added Chaos titans - and I mean more than just alternate weapon/armour packs I mean proper fully demonic unique titans. If anything I'd expect them to trial Xenos like orks and eldar before going for Epic. Also if GW were to bring back a game in Epic scale I'd honestly prefer to see Warmaster return (Either old world or, more likely, AoS style). Rank and file fits ideally into that scale and could give GW a chance to capture that market again and ease the "AoS hasn't got rank and file"
xttz wrote: If we can have 40k and Killteam with overlapping miniature ranges there's no reason we can't have some combination of AT / AI / Epic co-existing.
Agreed. It seems 40K was stretched into a one-size-fits-all at one point, and strange compared to earlier days when a common army would be two squads, a leader chap and a Dreadnought. Oh, I had a Falcon grav-tank once. Yep. A prince amongst table-toppers...
But now for a modern Space Marine army we have Mike setting up his army...
"Okay, thanks for coming round tonight Jeff...now lets see...I have two Knights, sixteen squads of marines, three Land raiders, five dreadnoughts as bodyguard to Robute Guilleman and his private Thunder hawk gunship. Oh, we musn't forget the Warlord Titan thats upstairs in my wife's wardrobe. Hold my beer, Jeff, I'll be right back!"
Poor old Jeff, who has popped round for a quick game, has yet to deploy the contents of his "start collecting" boxset of orcs, which he thought was pretty cool as it came with that rather nifty Deff Dread... . Of course, he wasn't expecting to play a game of Space Marine 2nd Edition using 40K rules...
KT and 40K are good companion games while some of it is still best left to the Titanicus-scale game systems.
xttz wrote: If we can have 40k and Killteam with overlapping miniature ranges there's no reason we can't have some combination of AT / AI / Epic co-existing.
Agreed. It seems 40K was stretched into a one-size-fits-all at one point, and strange compared to earlier days when a common army would be two squads, a leader chap and a Dreadnought. Oh, I had a Falcon grav-tank once. Yep. A prince amongst table-toppers...
But now for a modern Space Marine army we have Mike setting up his army...
"Okay, thanks for coming round tonight Jeff...now lets see...I have two Knights, sixteen squads of marines, three Land raiders, five dreadnoughts as bodyguard to Robute Guilleman and his private Thunder hawk gunship. Oh, we musn't forget the Warlord Titan thats upstairs in my wife's wardrobe. Hold my beer, Jeff, I'll be right back!"
Poor old Jeff, who has popped round for a quick game, has yet to deploy the contents of his "start collecting" boxset of orcs, which he thought was pretty cool as it came with that rather nifty Deff Dread... . Of course, he wasn't expecting to play a game of Space Marine 2nd Edition using 40K rules...
KT and 40K are good companion games while some of it is still best left to the Titanicus-scale game systems.
So much agree on the 40k scale. I remember a WD where they had an epic 'tank battle' which had an unheard of amount of tanks... 7 or 8 Rhino variants vs less leman Russ than most current guard armies put in a single detachment
Im not bought into Titanicus yet because I cant afford the table to play on. Titans easy, £100 gets enough. To make a good looking table (I dont play unpainted and dislike playing on bad tables) with appropriately scaled and detailed scenery, £400? probably more really. In the future id like to see them bring in flyers, thats something that i dislike being in 40k, they are just too big and destroy the 'immersion' for me.
I really don’t want to see an Imperator in Adeptus Titanicus, just too big, and too unwieldy.
Yes it would be nice to have an updated and upscaled model, of course it would. But I just don’t think it fits the scope of the game. It’s be so big and plodding, an opponent just has to keep out of its arc of fire. One way or the other, as the game stands, it’d be a very repetitive experience.
So much agree on the 40k scale. I remember a WD where they had an epic 'tank battle' which had an unheard of amount of tanks... 7 or 8 Rhino variants vs less leman Russ than most current guard armies put in a single detachment
Im not bought into Titanicus yet because I cant afford the table to play on. Titans easy, £100 gets enough. To make a good looking table (I dont play unpainted and dislike playing on bad tables) with appropriately scaled and detailed scenery, £400? probably more really. In the future id like to see them bring in flyers, thats something that i dislike being in 40k, they are just too big and destroy the 'immersion' for me.
In the same boat regarding boards to play on. With different games on the go I'm using large black foam boards and whatever I can scramble together for scenery. Already up to £90 for AT models and still not ready for the ruleset for a 2 player game, so the scenery is going to have to be DIY. I did think about purchasing the small Civitas Imperialis set and making mulliput copies with bluestuff, but I need to try that with some 40K crates to see if that will work. In the meantime its plasticard boxes!
Ah, there was one battle report that offered an interesting table; rocks formations with the entire table covered in sand...
As long as your not wedded to the idea of a city table, terrain is not really any more expensive than other wargames. Hills and large rock formations are usually compatible across scales. Statues and alien looking fauna(like GW's death world stuff) can also work on a AT table without breaking the immersion.
...
Personally I don't expect to see Epic until well after AT has added Chaos titans - and I mean more than just alternate weapon/armour packs I mean proper fully demonic unique titans. If anything I'd expect them to trial Xenos like orks and eldar before going for Epic. Also if GW were to bring back a game in Epic scale I'd honestly prefer to see Warmaster return (Either old world or, more likely, AoS style). Rank and file fits ideally into that scale and could give GW a chance to capture that market again and ease the "AoS hasn't got rank and file"
Not kidding. I would be all over a Warmaster re-release, even if it was set in the AoS timeline.
stato wrote: I remember a WD where they had an epic 'tank battle' which had an unheard of amount of tanks... 7 or 8 Rhino variants vs less leman Russ than most current guard armies put in a single detachment
...
Personally I don't expect to see Epic until well after AT has added Chaos titans - and I mean more than just alternate weapon/armour packs I mean proper fully demonic unique titans. If anything I'd expect them to trial Xenos like orks and eldar before going for Epic. Also if GW were to bring back a game in Epic scale I'd honestly prefer to see Warmaster return (Either old world or, more likely, AoS style). Rank and file fits ideally into that scale and could give GW a chance to capture that market again and ease the "AoS hasn't got rank and file"
Not kidding. I would be all over a Warmaster re-release, even if it was set in the AoS timeline.
Aye AoS is good but the scale of warmaster just lets you do things that 35mm is not suited to in practical and economic terms. Of course GW could do a race with CA and see who gets it out first because I'm betting that CA will likely do Age of Sigmar. Warhammer has done really well for them and they've done a stella job on it. It would make full sense to follow through and give them the AoS licence.
tneva82 wrote: Drop zone commander buildings. 30£, at least 1.5 tables worth of buildings if not 2. With thick layout
That does seem the best option as you don't have to do any painting...
If you don't mind painting, TTCombat (which are linked to Troll Trader who own DZC) have a range of pretty decent laser cut MDF buildings that are pretty reasonably priced. It's what I've got my beady eye on if I decide to spring for some terrain beyond the DZC starter I've already got.
GoatboyBeta wrote: As long as your not wedded to the idea of a city table, terrain is not really any more expensive than other wargames. Hills and large rock formations are usually compatible across scales. Statues and alien looking fauna(like GW's death world stuff) can also work on a AT table without breaking the immersion.
100% agree... but it just seems like over the last, oh, 10 years,,,, GW/Forgeworld have gone urban heavy regardless of the game system, even the AoS stuff seems to be more or less period urban. Not that the kits have not been beautiful... but please push some more alien/non-urban terrain again. You can get just as cluttered or non-cluttered (depending on your style) with woods or rocks as you can with buildings...
Trees also run issue that it's hard to block los. Buildings are mucg better at that. Rocks are good alternative though but look less interestrng imo than dzc buildings
Need to be at least 15cm long and quite thick trees needed. In several rows as top is generally wider than bottom so there\s going to be gaps at bottom.
Adeptus Titanicus is the perfect game for introducing an official scale model of the Imperator Titan. It is a model many of us have wanted for a long time and, as such, would sell quite well. It is also the only scale GW produce in which it is feasible, so if we're every going to see one, this is the only game in which it is possible. I'd rather see one (and have the opportunity to own one) than not.
I realize some are concerned that this model would overwhelm the game, or that it would only be used in specific scenarios. I don't believe either criticism is valid. An Imperator Titan in Adeptus Titanic would function in much the same way as do 28 mm scale titans in 40K. That is to say, its presence would be felt in those games in which it took part but, by and large, it would not be present in the majority of games played. Further, while in those games in which an Imperator took part it would in fact become a focal point to the game, that is the point of such a grandiose model! I clearly remember the first time I ever saw a 28mm scale titan on the battlefield in a game of 40K. It was controlled by my opponent and it was glorious!!!! I loved seeing it in action and have enjoyed the presence of a titan every time I've crossed paths with one on the table.
Adeptus Titanicus is the perfect game for introducing an official scale model of the Imperator Titan. It is a model many of us have wanted for a long time and, as such, would sell quite well. It is also the only scale GW produce in which it is feasible, so if we're every going to see one, this is the only game in which it is possible. I'd rather see one (and have the opportunity to own one) than not.
I realize some are concerned that this model would overwhelm the game, or that it would only be used in specific scenarios. I don't believe either criticism is valid. An Imperator Titan in Adeptus Titanic would function in much the same way as do 28 mm scale titans in 40K. That is to say, its presence would be felt in those games in which it took part but, by and large, it would not be present in the majority of games played. Further, while in those games in which an Imperator took part it would in fact become a focal point to the game, that is the point of such a grandiose model! I clearly remember the first time I ever saw a 28mm scale titan on the battlefield in a game of 40K. It was controlled by my opponent and it was glorious!!!! I loved seeing it in action and have enjoyed the presence of a titan every time I've crossed paths with one on the table.
Exalted! I’d love to be able to have an officially-scaled Imperator in my collection, and I agree that it would, by default, only be seen in large games or specific scenarios just like 40K scale titans are now. My friend loves to run his Warhound up against 2000 point armies, and it’s always fun for both sides, and of course Apocalypse games look even more epic with a Titan or two on each side! I’d like to think that the same would apply to an imperator.
tneva82 wrote: Need to be at least 15cm long and quite thick trees needed. In several rows as top is generally wider than bottom so there\s going to be gaps at bottom.
I dunno. I'd rather put trees half that size on my table and have things look more to scale. Your average tree isn't 120 feet tall. And from a gameplay standpoint, I don't think Warlords should be able to hide easily, but should have firing lanes. *shrug*
Adeptus Titanicus is the perfect game for introducing an official scale model of the Imperator Titan. It is a model many of us have wanted for a long time and, as such, would sell quite well. It is also the only scale GW produce in which it is feasible, so if we're every going to see one, this is the only game in which it is possible. I'd rather see one (and have the opportunity to own one) than not.
I realize some are concerned that this model would overwhelm the game, or that it would only be used in specific scenarios. I don't believe either criticism is valid. An Imperator Titan in Adeptus Titanic would function in much the same way as do 28 mm scale titans in 40K. That is to say, its presence would be felt in those games in which it took part but, by and large, it would not be present in the majority of games played. Further, while in those games in which an Imperator took part it would in fact become a focal point to the game, that is the point of such a grandiose model! I clearly remember the first time I ever saw a 28mm scale titan on the battlefield in a game of 40K. It was controlled by my opponent and it was glorious!!!! I loved seeing it in action and have enjoyed the presence of a titan every time I've crossed paths with one on the table.
I hope you realize that the titans in 40k are total, uber, compelete junk that are pretty much automatic loss. Because they break the system. And that there's no practical difference in value of each titan. You could have the 3 of them cost say 1500 pts(yes same price for warhound and warlord...) and it would STILL be lose by default...
Imperator in AT has high chance of either being that or just being slightly beefier warlord completely against fluff.
tneva82 wrote: Need to be at least 15cm long and quite thick trees needed. In several rows as top is generally wider than bottom so there\s going to be gaps at bottom.
I dunno. I'd rather put trees half that size on my table and have things look more to scale. Your average tree isn't 120 feet tall. And from a gameplay standpoint, I don't think Warlords should be able to hide easily, but should have firing lanes. *shrug*
If they are that tiny then they aren't blocking LOS and doesn't prevent game from devolving into shooting gallery. Failure at the primary function of terrain.
Adeptus Titanicus is the perfect game for introducing an official scale model of the Imperator Titan. It is a model many of us have wanted for a long time and, as such, would sell quite well. It is also the only scale GW produce in which it is feasible, so if we're every going to see one, this is the only game in which it is possible. I'd rather see one (and have the opportunity to own one) than not.
I realize some are concerned that this model would overwhelm the game, or that it would only be used in specific scenarios. I don't believe either criticism is valid. An Imperator Titan in Adeptus Titanic would function in much the same way as do 28 mm scale titans in 40K. That is to say, its presence would be felt in those games in which it took part but, by and large, it would not be present in the majority of games played. Further, while in those games in which an Imperator took part it would in fact become a focal point to the game, that is the point of such a grandiose model! I clearly remember the first time I ever saw a 28mm scale titan on the battlefield in a game of 40K. It was controlled by my opponent and it was glorious!!!! I loved seeing it in action and have enjoyed the presence of a titan every time I've crossed paths with one on the table.
I hope you realize that the titans in 40k are total, uber, compelete junk that are pretty much automatic loss. Because they break the system. And that there's no practical difference in value of each titan. You could have the 3 of them cost say 1500 pts(yes same price for warhound and warlord...) and it would STILL be lose by default...
Imperator in AT has high chance of either being that or just being slightly beefier warlord completely against fluff.
You're not wrong, but the argument you make isn't an argument against producing an Imperator model; it's an argument for better rules writing on the part of GW. And, if anything, GW has already proven that they are better at writing rules for Adeptus Titanicus than they are for 40K. That being the case, it is far more likely than not that rules for an Imperator Titan in Adeptus Titanicus would be superior to rules for 28mm scale titans in 40K. But let's assume you're correct and the rules would in fact be poorly written; I'd still rather have an official Adeptus Titanicus scale Imperator Titan than not.
Adeptus Titanicus is the perfect game for introducing an official scale model of the Imperator Titan. It is a model many of us have wanted for a long time and, as such, would sell quite well. It is also the only scale GW produce in which it is feasible, so if we're every going to see one, this is the only game in which it is possible. I'd rather see one (and have the opportunity to own one) than not.
I realize some are concerned that this model would overwhelm the game, or that it would only be used in specific scenarios. I don't believe either criticism is valid. An Imperator Titan in Adeptus Titanic would function in much the same way as do 28 mm scale titans in 40K. That is to say, its presence would be felt in those games in which it took part but, by and large, it would not be present in the majority of games played. Further, while in those games in which an Imperator took part it would in fact become a focal point to the game, that is the point of such a grandiose model! I clearly remember the first time I ever saw a 28mm scale titan on the battlefield in a game of 40K. It was controlled by my opponent and it was glorious!!!! I loved seeing it in action and have enjoyed the presence of a titan every time I've crossed paths with one on the table.
...well, seeing as I already think that Warlords are kind of too big for this (or any other, really, the idea of playing wit Epic units in regular 40k is ludicrous to me and it looks quite bad at the table IMHO), I'd say bring it on. I wouldn't like to play with an Imperator, but it would certainly be fun to look at
Adeptus Titanicus is the perfect game for introducing an official scale model of the Imperator Titan. It is a model many of us have wanted for a long time and, as such, would sell quite well. It is also the only scale GW produce in which it is feasible, so if we're every going to see one, this is the only game in which it is possible. I'd rather see one (and have the opportunity to own one) than not.
I realize some are concerned that this model would overwhelm the game, or that it would only be used in specific scenarios. I don't believe either criticism is valid. An Imperator Titan in Adeptus Titanic would function in much the same way as do 28 mm scale titans in 40K. That is to say, its presence would be felt in those games in which it took part but, by and large, it would not be present in the majority of games played. Further, while in those games in which an Imperator took part it would in fact become a focal point to the game, that is the point of such a grandiose model! I clearly remember the first time I ever saw a 28mm scale titan on the battlefield in a game of 40K. It was controlled by my opponent and it was glorious!!!! I loved seeing it in action and have enjoyed the presence of a titan every time I've crossed paths with one on the table.
Exalted! I’d love to be able to have an officially-scaled Imperator in my collection, and I agree that it would, by default, only be seen in large games or specific scenarios just like 40K scale titans are now. My friend loves to run his Warhound up against 2000 point armies, and it’s always fun for both sides, and of course Apocalypse games look even more epic with a Titan or two on each side! I’d like to think that the same would apply to an imperator.
100% This. I think they would sell quite well considering it would be the first and only official scale model.
tneva82 wrote: Need to be at least 15cm long and quite thick trees needed. In several rows as top is generally wider than bottom so there\s going to be gaps at bottom.
I dunno. I'd rather put trees half that size on my table and have things look more to scale. Your average tree isn't 120 feet tall. And from a gameplay standpoint, I don't think Warlords should be able to hide easily, but should have firing lanes. *shrug*
If they are that tiny then they aren't blocking LOS and doesn't prevent game from devolving into shooting gallery. Failure at the primary function of terrain.
Everything on the table doesn't have to completely hide a Warlord titan. I think this mentality evolved from people playing Warlord battles with their GME sets.
I play all Warhounds. So if you want to completely choke the table with oversized buildings, be my guest. LOL.
Lets face it, we can all envision that future issue of White Dwarf with a headline of "WRATH OF THE IMPERATOR!" and the awesome cover art alone will be enough to liberate £150 from our wallets...
Adeptus Titanicus is the perfect game for introducing an official scale model of the Imperator Titan. It is a model many of us have wanted for a long time and, as such, would sell quite well. It is also the only scale GW produce in which it is feasible, so if we're every going to see one, this is the only game in which it is possible. I'd rather see one (and have the opportunity to own one) than not.
I get that you want an Imperator.
I understand that. Really, I do.
But you're talking about adding an Imperator to a game that already has a laundry list of things that people want added to it. And quite frankly, I'd much rather see Phantoms and Gargants before I see Imperators. We know that Forge World is short-handed. That's been mentioned many times. It's been discussed here repeatedly that FW putting time into one project (or game) means that they're not putting time into another project (or game). So, to put it bluntly, what you're basically asking is that Forge World *not* work on introducing other races that could be used in the same scenarios as the Imperial forces we have now so that you can get an Imperator that will only be usable in specialized games.
When the game has been properly built up and out, then by all means add an Imperator. But again, I want to see Phantoms and Gargants first. And I'll be extremely irritated if I see an Imperator released before I see other races added to the game. Yes, I realize that FW has not promised that we'll see other races. But if we don't see other races, then I don't want to see an Imperator. It's that simple.
Forge World is going to produce what Forge World is going to produce.
I don't kid myself into thinking that my Dakka post is going to change their course one iota. They've already mentioned that Titanicus is planned two years out.
Might an Imperator be difficult on the table top; might it break the carefully crafted balance of Titanicus? Possibly yes; possibly no. We're not going to be the ones writing those rules.
Would I like to have one in my collection regardless? You bet.
Err, that's exactly what we're talking about. Have you seen the more recent art of Imperators? Have you seen the Acastus, which is probably the closest model in terms of height & bulk to what an AT Imperator would end up as?
We're talking a 200mm+ base, compared to the Warlord's already pretty chonk 120mm.
Albertorius wrote: I would expect it to be about... Cerastus Knight height, I think? Probably quite bulkier, though.
Yeah, but were not talking about a model that's impractical for game use. The footprint isn't that much bigger than a AT Warlord
As I stated, I think that a Warlord is already pushing it... so YMMV. For me, it would be too big, and that's one of the reasons I don't usually play current 40K: it feels too bloated for me, as the big units that they are currently so fond of are actively anti-fun for me.
tneva82 wrote: Need to be at least 15cm long and quite thick trees needed. In several rows as top is generally wider than bottom so there\s going to be gaps at bottom.
Yes? So? I've got plenty of model trees the same height or taller than a Warlord; you write as if these are unusual things that are hard to find. And most of them are conical or mostly cylindrical. On a big enough area they'll block LOS between titans. Some of them will allow Knights to gain LOS while being obscured in return, but that's a feature, not a bug.
tneva82 wrote: Need to be at least 15cm long and quite thick trees needed. In several rows as top is generally wider than bottom so there\s going to be gaps at bottom.
I dunno. I'd rather put trees half that size on my table and have things look more to scale. Your average tree isn't 120 feet tall.
"The map shows that the temperate forests of the U.S. Pacific Northwest have among the tallest canopies at 40 meters — perhaps no big surprise for the home of the sequoia and those redwood forests of song. Most tropical rainforests and temperate forests proved to be about the same height at 25 meters, whereas the northern boreal and primarily evergreen forests tended to be about 20 meters in height."
English Oaks and various varieties of pine trees will get to 30 metres. Giant redwoods are over 100 metres.
Even if you model your forests at a scale 20 metres, that's plenty to block LOS for Warhounds, Reavers and the arm weapons on Warlords.
Albertorius wrote: I would expect it to be about... Cerastus Knight height, I think? Probably quite bulkier, though.
Yeah, but were not talking about a model that's impractical for game use. The footprint isn't that much bigger than a AT Warlord
If it's true scale to fluff it's 40k warhound size. Which towers above 40k knights. That is larger than at warlord. And it's not like imperator is thin...
Also it's not just model size but rules. Imperator is supposed to be powerfull. It's hard to make them make sense without being so powerfull that they cost so much they lose by being too powerfull like 40k titans. Warlord titan could be like 1500 pts and still autolose...
At some point when you up the power system just breaks sooner or later
tneva82 wrote: Need to be at least 15cm long and quite thick trees needed. In several rows as top is generally wider than bottom so there\s going to be gaps at bottom.
I dunno. I'd rather put trees half that size on my table and have things look more to scale. Your average tree isn't 120 feet tall.
"The map shows that the temperate forests of the U.S. Pacific Northwest have among the tallest canopies at 40 meters — perhaps no big surprise for the home of the sequoia and those redwood forests of song. Most tropical rainforests and temperate forests proved to be about the same height at 25 meters, whereas the northern boreal and primarily evergreen forests tended to be about 20 meters in height."
English Oaks and various varieties of pine trees will get to 30 metres. Giant redwoods are over 100 metres.
Even if you model your forests at a scale 20 metres, that's plenty to block LOS for Warhounds, Reavers and the arm weapons on Warlords.
Trees of that height will look better for urban forests and parklands, IMO. And -1 and -2 mods are still impactful in the game. If someone wants their AT table to be a redwood (or alien equivalent) forest, that's cool. It's just that sometimes the tree models used for that purpose end up looking like 28mm trees being used for a 6mm game, if that makes sense.
It's more that the trees we use in 28mm games are usually thickets of shrubs rather than decent-sized woods.
Personally, I agree to an extent; demanding that all terrain must block LOS or it's useless is too extreme, but having woodlands big enough to do so isn't unrealistic. Even areas granting only a -1 to hit penalty and slowing movement will be useful.
GW/Forgeworld are placing priority on cityscape terrain for Adeptus Titanicus because it accentuates the scale of a titan and allows them to utilize a design aesthetic that is specific to their IP.
Is it really hard for people to imagine counting an area of Forest with trees of Warlord height as blocking line of sight from being drawn across it, the same as if it were a big solid building, but with the added bonus of letting models move through it.
Its simple abstraction.
Make it even more fun and have forests be in the normal modular fashion where each tree is on a seperate base. But in the case of AT, instead of moving the trees around to accomodate models which are inside the area terrain, when titans move into and across areas of forest, the trees that their bases would 'touch' are removed from the game to reflect them toppling the trees with their bulk. Which then would open up spaces for clear lines of sight to be drawn.
I fething despise the Imperator, a god aweful concept and the specialist games team would be much better off putting their resources into something useful, like Xenos titans.
AegisGrimm wrote: Is it really hard for people to imagine counting an area of Forest with trees of Warlord height as blocking line of sight from being drawn across it, the same as if it were a big solid building, but with the added bonus of letting models move through it.
Its simple abstraction.
Make it even more fun and have forests be in the normal modular fashion where each tree is on a seperate base. But in the case of AT, instead of moving the trees around to accomodate models which are inside the area terrain, when titans move into and across areas of forest, the trees that their bases would 'touch' are removed from the game to reflect them toppling the trees with their bulk. Which then would open up spaces for clear lines of sight to be drawn.
I love that idea! Crushing trunks under your tread sounds like an awesome visual. I need 50 stands of trees and bushes right now.
I fething despise the Imperator, a god aweful concept and the specialist games team would be much better off putting their resources into something useful, like Xenos titans.
Are you sure? Positive? He does carry a Cathedral on his shoulders and has guns coming out of his legs...we must not forget that!
Being serious though, I would buy a set of Wrath Knights in a heart beat. And this fella should definitely be a thing in Titanicus...
schoon wrote: Yeah. Gargants will always have a special place in my Titanicus heart.
I'm liking the idea of making their Boilerz something that has to be kept in a middle ground - not too hot and not too cold...
Gargants aren't all that steam thing though. That would be specifically the steam gargant's ground for feral orks.
For normal gargants they used to have one time shields and lots of them. Maybe no option for voids to full either. However once shields would be down they would take quite a pummeling so lots of tracks and maybe require two locations be critted out before out of action? The defining gargant thing is them keep coming closer despite in flames spitting death and mayhem while doing that.
Plus of course tons of dices but low chance to hit though please no BS5+ gargants. We don't want their shooting to be as inefficient as in 40k where they need strategems and specific units to shoot scarily.
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AegisGrimm wrote: Is it really hard for people to imagine counting an area of Forest with trees of Warlord height as blocking line of sight from being drawn across it, the same as if it were a big solid building, but with the added bonus of letting models move through it.
Its simple abstraction.
Make it even more fun and have forests be in the normal modular fashion where each tree is on a seperate base. But in the case of AT, instead of moving the trees around to accomodate models which are inside the area terrain, when titans move into and across areas of forest, the trees that their bases would 'touch' are removed from the game to reflect them toppling the trees with their bulk. Which then would open up spaces for clear lines of sight to be drawn.
Check the rulebook. Rules should work without people having to house rule things around. The AT works with idea of TLOS. Not abstracted LOS.
The Great Gargant command terminal is ready for beta-testing, so if you have the time, please let me know. Weapons are still WIP, so for the moment, you can substitute Warlord weapons.
I feel Orks should have a fairly flat 4+ to hit. After all, they're not relying on fancyshmancy gubbins like sensoriums. There's probably a Grot up a stikk shoutin' left a bit, right a bit, and that's yer lot. Or they're just peeping out the firing hatch, sticking their tongue out the corner of their gob, and getting the gun lined up about nice. Either way, hard to reduce their accuracy.
We're also talking about targeting Titans. Even Warhounds are relatively plodding, and aren't going to be doing the old dip, dodge, duck and dive that infantry would - so they're much easier targets, even for a Gargant.
There's also a background argument that dakkaboyz aboard a Gargant are more disciplined, in so far as they know to actually point the gun, then pull the trigger. And those on gunz with loadsa dakka probably have so much dakka, it does improve their accuracy (little point in giving tons of shots with a rubbish to hit, when you can reduce the shots and up the to hit).
Nah if you are mostly hidden by building you shouldn't be as easy to hit as if you are in open. No 40k laser guided missiles that fire from 1mm tiny holes unimpeded to AT please.
BS4+ is fine. You have worse accuracy than imperials(checks), cover helps against it(check) but you aren't totally screwed by just -1(which halves vs BS5+) and depending on did AT have automatic hit on 6(memory escapes as don't recall that ever having been case for me I would go to 7+) make immune.
And there is point having tons of shot with worse BS. Terrain. Cover. If you want orks to ignore it only fair(and more sensible) for imperial titans to ignore as well. But we don't want 40kbs where you hit without issues as long as you see enemy through even 1mm hole(and in 40k from tip of finger to tip of enemy finger resulting in land raiders unable to block LOS to behind them etc)
Which is why 4+ fits just fine. No need to copy 40k stat lines. Orks can be 5+ there and 4+ here. Different game systems. 40k also doesn't have -1 to hit quite as easy as AT where any terrain can provide that to all and even other titans can be used to provide -1 to hit to others(luckily AT doesn't have -1 to hit trait legion...Even thought of that needs to burn in hell! That would become the most powerful legion by far). Seeing modifiers hurt the more the lower BS is having 5+ when -1 to hit is fairly trivial to get...Yeah not good idea.
d6 limits but if we want orks to hit less than imperials then 4+ is pretty much perfect.
Happy to discuss beta rules further elsewhere, but I don't want to take this off-topic. Feel free to PM me with any playtest results.
(On the specific BS5+ for orks, note that this is set against the Krew rules, which the ork weapons are being designed around. This sometimes takes the part of additional shots; sometimes +1 or +2 to hit, depending on the weapon. It's explained in more depth through the designer's notes, which I encourage you to read for playtesting.)
I think you could give Orks the 40k rule where they always hit on a 6+. But prevent them from ever making targeted shots because they just like to blaze away.
Realistically, a good sized copse of trees may as well be a building when finding line of sight to and from all but Knights. Just put them with the foliage of all the trees touching to be really dense. Especially with Warlords and Reavers, titans all have weapons mounted too high to thread LoS through the trunks below, it's not like they have guns on their knees.
This obviously requires the use of model trees that are not the ones GW sells, where the foliage does about as much as if they were giant mushrooms.
Apologist wrote: Happy to discuss beta rules further elsewhere, but I don't want to take this off-topic. Feel free to PM me with any playtest results.
(On the specific BS5+ for orks, note that this is set against the Krew rules, which the ork weapons are being designed around. This sometimes takes the part of additional shots; sometimes +1 or +2 to hit, depending on the weapon. It's explained in more depth through the designer's notes, which I encourage you to read for playtesting.)
SamusDrake wrote: But yeah, it would be nice if the Knights got upgrades. Poor little fellas must be feeling left out!
I couldn't disagree more. The Knights are the one part of Adeptus Titanicus I have zero interest in. I play Titanicus for the the TITANS; I couldn't care less about their mini-me minions.
The last of the two realm of battle boards coming out (for now) gamma and delta. They’re deliberately designed to limit Titan movement in places to make the game as tactical as it should be.
Reaver upgrade sprue. Sold separately due to popular demand ?? *extensive feedback* ??
New buildings. 2 sets, designed to fit existing buildings. First set is just spires. Second set includes base set. Strong likelihood of more terrain.
Legio Fureans transfers. Fureans has Madaxia knights on theirs. On decal sheets - mortis and gryphons were the most popular legios at 28mm scale so went first. Got what they thought was a year of stock and we bought it out in a month. Good work all!
Next expansion! Doom of Moloch. Follows the events of Vengeful Spirit. Narrative scenarios and 4 more Legios. Rules for fielding a knight household - no Titans!
Legios in DoM - Crucius (Warmongers), Fortidus (Dauntless), Vulcanum (Dark Fire/Lords I’d Ruin), Interfector (Murder Lords)
Vulcanum are weird, two Legios on one FW. Weird things with their princeps.
Possibility, no promise, of a large A4 sheet of transfers to cover a number of the more minor Titan Legios. *speculation in Seminar, do not assume will be coming*
7 Knight houses covered including Devine. Will have special rules for each Household. Each Knight world (like Moloch) could have a number of households on it. Allows you to build the household along the lines of the predefined ones or you can pick a couple rules to define your Baron or high Seneshal.
Knight Strategems. And can be played against knights or titans. Plus Strategems!
Knight carapace weapons were meant to be on the plastic sprue but couldn’t fit! Will be coming soon.
Re-release of the Grand Master edition. Huge logistical operation to put together. Won’t be a permanent thing, if you want it get it while it’s there.
Resin weapons, being done by Blake. You get the whole arm so you can magnitise them. Individually available, not in sets as per the Contemptor etc. All weapon options will be available. Quake Cannon and Macro Blaster first up.
CARAPACE GATLING BLASTERS!!! REAVER VULCANS! WARP MISSILES! Missile is removable to track once it’s been fired. 2-3 months time. Designed 5-6 missiles, will likely get new rules for other missile types.
What’s next?
More campaign books. Pick something iconic and go with that as a jump off point. Calth would be a good one, Mars would be a likely choice too. Terra... obviously but will be a build up.
Legio/Household heraldry and special rules. Massive spreadsheet of STUFF!
Continued releases of plastic kits for knights, titans and terrain.
Entire spectrum of titans from Rapier upwards which might get covered. Light battle Titan between hound and reaver, maybe a heavy battle Titan.... Warbringer mentioned. Both plastic and resin potential due to expanded specialist games team.
Designs of knights and titans deliberately future proofed for different panelling; mechanicum, traitor, mutated... all that good stuff.
Themed dice - just beyond the 3 month window to be shown. Not Legio specific but loyalist/traitor
Other accessories. Terminals etc. The terminals out of stock is purely down to selling too well *shakes fist* but will be coming soon.
New weapons.... existing and brand new. Knight stuff too!
Resin weapons <£20 at a guess, not gospel. Not finalised yet.
App for terminals etc - one of Andy’s first thoughts for the game. Ultimately not enough resource on the App Team. Comes down to demand so get emails in to GW if you want it.
New:
Ordo Sinister likely in the book after Moloch. Will likely get expanded out to cover reaver and the like, not just the 25 Warlords they had in Prospero times.
Special Character titans (rather than just princeps and crews) and alternative princeps.
If they did an Imperator it would be about the size of the 40k scale Reaver.... don’t hold your breath.
Audax and Ursus Claws are basically a shoe in. Just need to get final sign off past Tony...
On the Epic discussion. The Titanicus rules as they stand is designed for titans only but doesn’t mean the game can’t evolve in the future to include a broader scope. The intent of the game at the moment is very much to give players the sense of piloting a Titan. There *may* be expansions later on to deal with this.
Definitely some more modular bunkers similar to the Strategems currently available.
Organic terrain - mountains etc and well... ultimately comes down to cost. A mountain is a large chunk of resin you can make out of foam or rocks in the garden. If they do anything it would be themed terrain that you could then integrate into natural structures etc. Demo pods and seminars or a masterclass book to cover these things is a possibility.
More Realm of Battle boards are a possibility. Just need a Phil 2.0 to design them!
Titan Legio specific equipment conversion packs - gryphons motor reactive etc. Likely to come after the generic weapon upgrades. Along side unique panelling and heads etc. Likely going to come alongside the thematic books with the Legios.
Design your own Legio ruleset - definitely a possibility... something like the old Heresy rules for time before your Legion had rules. A Titan Crusade option. Possibly a WD article.
40k scale knights and new stuff being carried across is a very real possibility. Just down to resource, time and priority. Armigers etc.
Cerastus pattern knights - plans to do the other patterns in the future. Not in the next few months but not too far. Possibly plastics.
PLEASE DO NOT QUOTE MASSIVE SLABS OF TEXT LIKE THIS, THANKS!
I. Dont. Buy. This.
There is no reason an imperator would need to be the size of a full scale reaver, that sounds like rubbish to me. An Imperator is just a warlord with a fortress on it, make it the size of a Castellan knight and be done with it.
Norchack wrote: I couldn't disagree more. The Knights are the one part of Adeptus Titanicus I have zero interest in. I play Titanicus for the the TITANS; I couldn't care less about their mini-me minions.
You should give them a try.
While it's possible your objections are from an aesthetic standpoint, they really add quite a lot of tactical variety to the game.
I was originally on the fence about them, and now I rather like them. Not as much as the Titans, but they'll do.
There is no reason an imperator would need to be the size of a full scale reaver, that sounds like rubbish to me. An Imperator is just a warlord with a fortress on it, make it the size of a Castellan knight and be done with it.
More than that. They are said to be 55m long. Scaled that to warlord fluff size and model we get Imperator to be 24cm or tad(1cm) short of warhound titan in 40k which btw towers over castellan knight. Castellan knight isn't that much taller than regular knight which is only bit taller than warlord titan(AT).
Jimmy Zimms wrote: Thank you. I was going to say, Emperor class Titans are absolutely immense and in no fluff, rules, nor art just an 'oversized Warlord'.
Well immense as in 55m which is the current size in fluff.
Jimmy Zimms wrote: Thank you. I was going to say, Emperor class Titans are absolutely immense and in no fluff, rules, nor art just an 'oversized Warlord'.
Well immense as in 55m which is the current size in fluff.
From Lexicanum:
Discrepancies
A number of different sources list different heights for Emperor-class titans. Imperators are said to be at least 50meters in height,[5] although in at least one novel Dies Irae is said to be only 43 meters tall[1] (with an earlier novel pegging the same Titan as being 140 meters tall[6]). Imperator Titans have also been listed as being 60 meters tall,[7] 70 meters tall,[8] at least 90 meters tall,[9] and 100 meters tall.[10]
Note that none of the sources are Titandeath, the most recent novel to feature an Imperator which implies they're pretty damned big without giving an explicit number.
Great pic! Thank you, this actually even more proves my point.
First, yes, it is larger I can now see that. But it's not THAT much larger. I'm even more convinced making it the size of a regular 40K knight to maybe Castellan size would be perfectly fine for the game.
Umm warlord is about reqular knight and castellan is only slightly taller than reqular...were imperator that size head would be lower than in warlord.
24cm. That's what imperator should be
tneva82 wrote: Umm warlord is about reqular knight and castellan is only slightly taller than reqular...were imperator that size head would be lower than in warlord.
24cm. That's what imperator should be
I have trouble with dimensions, so forgive me brother for being obtuse,
But are you saying somewhere between a Castellan and a Warhound in size?
Couldn't they just curb the size of the model, does the scale actually really matter?
I mean, look at the old Rhinos and Marines, definitely scale didn't matter there.
Looking at that picture, the Warlord's head is level with the Imperator's hips - and that's with the Warlord an unspecified amount closer to the "camera"; the Imperator being twice the height of the Warlord looks like a lower limit.
The other Warlord being higher than the one in the foreground confuses things; it appears that the Imperator is in a slpoe-sided trench, with both Warlords walking along a higher ground level; the background one higher than the foreground. I can't see any details on the Imperator itself that I could try to compare to a human.
tneva82 wrote: Umm warlord is about reqular knight and castellan is only slightly taller than reqular...were imperator that size head would be lower than in warlord.
24cm. That's what imperator should be
I have trouble with dimensions, so forgive me brother for being obtuse,
But are you saying somewhere between a Castellan and a Warhound in size?
Couldn't they just curb the size of the model, does the scale actually really matter?
I mean, look at the old Rhinos and Marines, definitely scale didn't matter there.
Tneva struggles with the difference between size and height.
A Titanicus scale Imperator should be roughly the same height as a 40k scale acastus knight porphyrion, but substantially smaller due to effectively being a Dominus knight plus the spires.
I see no reason that GW/Forgeworld couldn't/shouldn't produce a Titanicus scale Imperator slightly smaller in overall dimensions than the 28mm scale Warhound. It would bring an iconic representation of imperial might in the 40K universe into miniature form. It would make for fun engagements on the tabletop. Most importantly for GW, it would sell.
tneva82 wrote: Umm warlord is about reqular knight and castellan is only slightly taller than reqular...were imperator that size head would be lower than in warlord.
24cm. That's what imperator should be
An AT Warlord isn't almost 40K Knight size, it's much smaller
A Castellan Knight isn't only slightly taller than a regular Knight, it's much taller
I'm sticking with my initial estimate - if they make one, it will be almost Cerastus height, with ~Acastus bulk. If it's resin(which, is still my instinct, but we're getting a multipack of plastic Ambots so who knows wtfGW's thinking is these days as to what merits a plastic kit) it will cost 250-300 pounds.
RazorEdge wrote: Some Time has now past since someone mention that GW needs to Release Epic...
Should have left it that way.
RESET THE CLOCK!!!
Just to throw in some content while we wait, here’s some work I did for various Vehicles (personally, I have zero interest in infantry at this scale).
When (that's right - WHEN!!!) GW decides to restart EPIC I will be buying everything that they put out for it - be it Eldar, Ork Imperial Guard or even, yes, Tyranids.
And multiples of many things at that!
Until then, I'll keep having fun with all this AT stuff, of course.
SamusDrake wrote: But yeah, it would be nice if the Knights got upgrades. Poor little fellas must be feeling left out!
I couldn't disagree more. The Knights are the one part of Adeptus Titanicus I have zero interest in. I play Titanicus for the the TITANS; I couldn't care less about their mini-me minions.
They've never said they would never do one - just that it's not in their plans at the moment, and those plans seem to stretch out for a couple of years at least.
Even if we could accurately scale the size of the Imperator from the artwork or old miniatures, that's irrelevant. It'll get reinterpreted, the size, proportions and details will change. The current plastic Warhound, Reaver and Warlord don't look like they have the same relative sizes as the old 80s models did.
That Fire Wasps one from the previous page is just an artist's interpretation anyway - basically the old Epic miniature with a new-style plasma cannon from Forge World's Warlord design grafted on instead of the original weapon.
Same artist (Neil Roberts I believe), but fairly consistent with the other image in scale. Also shows variant cathedrals on the backs, with all three different Imperators having a different style, which would be nice to see in a kit- a degree of modularity in the acropoliz.
Those pictures, especially that last one, look incredibly off scale, like an order of magnitude at least... pretty sure an Imperstr isn’t supposed to be a kilometre tall.
and Imperators are taller. it appears that there were different designs/sizes for titans but the most common ones may be the currently scaled ones?
Even the warhammer world diorama of the seige of terra is closer in line to that artwork scale with titans being like a smaller person in height. (which i kinda prefer).
Let's be honest with ourselves, the scale of GW/Forgeworld's eventual Adeptus Titanicus Imperator model will be whatever they deem to be the best compromise between cost of production, profit per unit, and overall visual appeal. Established lore (which itself is inconsistent) will take a backseat to the aforementioned considerations.
Oh of course it will. the same for any background. but that doenst change the fact that if it was real, the sizes very. thats all.
like the second death star was 160km diameter. models/toys are obviously never in scale with anything since they would still need to be the size of the house.
that doesnt change the fact of what the size of the official death star 2 was.
however, that does assume the books etc are canon.
StarFyre wrote: Oh of course it will. the same for any background. but that doenst change the fact that if it was real, the sizes very. thats all.
like the second death star was 160km diameter. models/toys are obviously never in scale with anything since they would still need to be the size of the house.
that doesnt change the fact of what the size of the official death star 2 was.
however, that does assume the books etc are canon.
They're canon, but not necessarily true. As it has been noted, the stated size of Imperator Titan varies wildly in the books, even the size of one specific titan! BL authors make up details as they need and they often contradict each other (or even themselves), so one should take any such numbers with a grain of salt.
Alpharius wrote: Using the marines in that picture, some enterprising soul should be able to now tell us the height of an Imperator - excellent!
Gav Thorpe repeatedly states 45 metres in the book. Which seems really small when he's simultaneously writing about people walking down corridors in the leg decks.
Ye the text written height for titans is silly vs what the art shows
The titan on terra art with the custodes running around is ludicrous if a custodes stands just over 2 meters at 7-8 feet tall, imperators should only be around 20-30 space marines high, based on the distance of the imperator from the platform it looks like just the head of it is 10+ custodes tall, I still think the 100 meters+ is more "realistic" for the art and power descriptions of imperators
Consider that the big church on top is based somewhat on Japanese Pagoda mast on their battleships, those were around 30-40 meters high on their own above the waterline makes imperators seem somewhat goofy at 45 meters and considered huge warmachines really
Consider that a warlord titan is listed as 33 meters they are actually 5 meters shorter than the Rio jesus statue below
Any chance we can go back to posting news & rumours, rather than repeatedly bumping the thread to point out GW art isn't consistently scaled? Pretty sure that's been true for a while now, and definitely isn't news.
tneva82 wrote: Umm warlord is about reqular knight and castellan is only slightly taller than reqular...were imperator that size head would be lower than in warlord.
24cm. That's what imperator should be
I have trouble with dimensions, so forgive me brother for being obtuse,
But are you saying somewhere between a Castellan and a Warhound in size?
Couldn't they just curb the size of the model, does the scale actually really matter?
I mean, look at the old Rhinos and Marines, definitely scale didn't matter there.
We just got true 6mm warlord, reaver and warhound. LEt's not go off scale right away. There's no reason not to make the imperator true scale
tneva82 wrote: Umm warlord is about reqular knight and castellan is only slightly taller than reqular...were imperator that size head would be lower than in warlord.
24cm. That's what imperator should be
An AT Warlord isn't almost 40K Knight size, it's much smaller
A Castellan Knight isn't only slightly taller than a regular Knight, it's much taller
I have knight and warlord in my room. It's about 1cm.
And second picture point is? It doesn't even SHOW castellan knight. For the record I also have castellan knight. It's bulkier but not significantly taller. Here it would be only slightly taller than the questor left but notably shorter than the cerastus in the middle.
You showed questor, cerastus and poryphion(Whatever spelling) knights. No castellan in sight.
Incidentally the rightmost knight in 28mm is about same height as warhound so that would be the height you would be looking at.
Let's be honest with ourselves, the scale of GW/Forgeworld's eventual Adeptus Titanicus Imperator model will be whatever they deem to be the best compromise between cost of production, profit per unit, and overall visual appeal. Established lore (which itself is inconsistent) will take a backseat to the aforementioned considerations.
Well they made warlord, reaver and warhound 6mm scale to the spot...
tneva82 wrote: Umm warlord is about reqular knight and castellan is only slightly taller than reqular...were imperator that size head would be lower than in warlord.
24cm. That's what imperator should be
An AT Warlord isn't almost 40K Knight size, it's much smaller
I have knight and warlord in my room. It's about 1cm.
And second picture point is? It doesn't even SHOW castellan knight. For the record I also have castellan knight. It's bulkier but not significantly taller. Here it would be only slightly taller than the questor left but notably shorter than the cerastus in the middle.
You showed questor, cerastus and poryphion(Whatever spelling) knights. No castellan in sight.
Incidentally the rightmost knight in 28mm is about same height as warhound so that would be the height you would be looking at.
I mixed up the Castellan and the Cerastus. If I make an Imperator I'll be using the Castellan. You're completely delusional about the Warlord being slightly smaller than a regular Knight. I've provided a picture for you to see the scale. Do you think it's doctored? Maybe you should take a picture of the Knight and Warlord that you have in your room to show the true comparison.
That Xiphon looks like mine...I need to see about getting a replacement wing from FW
Boards are OK, but I'm more excited about the next plastic terrain set.FW ought to make more scatter terrain for AT, like Titan wrecks, and less of the full size fixed boards. They look really good, but seem more suited for display than play with titans on bases.
schoon wrote: Not quite a rumor, but in addition to Warriors and Rapiers for new Titan classes, the Titandeath novel references the Nightgaunt class fairly heavily.
I would guess we'll see that eventually...
Were they not covered in the Titandeath expansion?
schoon wrote: Not quite a rumor, but in addition to Warriors and Rapiers for new Titan classes, the Titandeath novel references the Nightgaunt class fairly heavily.
I would guess we'll see that eventually...
Were they not covered in the Titandeath expansion?
Titandeath expansion doesn’t have any new units in it. When GW releases a new unit you’ll get the rules in a terminal/weapon pack.
Malika2 wrote: This was back in the day when GW's artwork also included stuff that wasn't a direct product placement. ;-)
I mean, most of the art over the last page or 2 is very recent and of Imperators, which aren’t a product they make.
But about 99.99999% of the artwork GW makes nowadays of units is pretty much the way they will look like in their model form. I doubt the Imperator would be such a big exception here.
schoon wrote: Not quite a rumor, but in addition to Warriors and Rapiers for new Titan classes, the Titandeath novel references the Nightgaunt class fairly heavily.
I would guess we'll see that eventually...
Were they not covered in the Titandeath expansion?
Titandeath expansion doesn’t have any new units in it. When GW releases a new unit you’ll get the rules in a terminal/weapon pack.
Before someone gets the wrong idea; neither book of rules for AT18 has any unit stats in it, except incidentally as an example to show you how to read a terminal, and I wouldn’t expect that to change with any future books.
Nostromodamus is quite correct that any new unit types will be sold alongside new terminals to allow them to be fielded and I don’t expect that to change any time soon.
Titandeath expansion doesn’t have any new units in it. When GW releases a new unit you’ll get the rules in a terminal/weapon pack.
Of course. But nothing in the expansion's "fluff"?
Not in the sense of a novel following individual Titans and describing what they face in direct combat, no. It describes the region of the Titandeath campaign, it’s various worlds and their collective strategic value, as well as some of the individual battles, but never gets as granular as individual Titans, nor even as close as describing the types of Maniple that fought the ‘historical’ scenarios they’ve created – which would at least have given a few hints.
Titandeath expansion doesn’t have any new units in it. When GW releases a new unit you’ll get the rules in a terminal/weapon pack.
Of course. But nothing in the expansion's "fluff"?
Not in the sense of a novel following individual Titans and describing what they face in direct combat, no. It describes the region of the Titandeath campaign, it’s various worlds and their collective strategic value, as well as some of the individual battles, but never gets as granular as individual Titans, nor even as close as describing the types of Maniple that fought the ‘historical’ scenarios they’ve created – which would at least have given a few hints.
Curses! I saw the title of the preorder thing calling out titanic weapons. Thought we were finally getting the quake and Gatling guns. Just the weapon sprues though, sadly.
It looks like the guns from the warlord and reaver mki will be on sale separately as well as the alternates, which is nice.
Well, at least the Titans are up to date with their weapons now. Was hoping for a second they would do something on the Knight front as well, but oh well.
SamusDrake wrote: Well, at least the Titans are up to date with their weapons now. Was hoping for a second they would do something on the Knight front as well, but oh well.
Still no announcement of a few options, so they’re far from having the full suite available.
Mandragola wrote: Curses! I saw the title of the preorder thing calling out titanic weapons. Thought we were finally getting the quake and Gatling guns. Just the weapon sprues though, sadly.
It looks like the guns from the warlord and reaver mki will be on sale separately as well as the alternates, which is nice.
We may yet get both. Resin ones looked to be the finished product when shown off at the Weekender. And given they’re a FW release, quite possible the GW pre-order wouldn’t mention them?
Mandragola wrote: Curses! I saw the title of the preorder thing calling out titanic weapons. Thought we were finally getting the quake and Gatling guns. Just the weapon sprues though, sadly.
Honestly, even the restock of the Warlord sprues is very welcome news.
Mandragola wrote: Curses! I saw the title of the preorder thing calling out titanic weapons. Thought we were finally getting the quake and Gatling guns. Just the weapon sprues though, sadly.
It looks like the guns from the warlord and reaver mki will be on sale separately as well as the alternates, which is nice.
We may yet get both. Resin ones looked to be the finished product when shown off at the Weekender. And given they’re a FW release, quite possible the GW pre-order wouldn’t mention them?
The resin weapons will almost certainly not be announced on a Sunday preview like this, but rather show up as part of new FW pre-orders on a Friday morning.
Mandragola wrote: Curses! I saw the title of the preorder thing calling out titanic weapons. Thought we were finally getting the quake and Gatling guns. Just the weapon sprues though, sadly.
It looks like the guns from the warlord and reaver mki will be on sale separately as well as the alternates, which is nice.
We may yet get both. Resin ones looked to be the finished product when shown off at the Weekender. And given they’re a FW release, quite possible the GW pre-order wouldn’t mention them?
The resin weapons will almost certainly not be announced on a Sunday preview like this, but rather show up as part of new FW pre-orders on a Friday morning.
Yeah I agree, they'll probably be on the FW site and preorders on a Friday. That's logical, but doesn't change the fact that my illogical reaction was hope at the title, and disappointment at the reveal. It's still a good thing to release these weapon sprues of course.
It's weird seeing the old and new warlord sprues next to each other. There's so much more stuff on the new one! The old sprue has quite small shoulder weapons (the missiles), two volcano cannons and two (basically Identical) heads. The new one has much more elaborate shoulder weapons, to different heads and three arm weapons - one of which has loads of alternate fingers and stuff, yet still finds room for some alternate armour plates and shields. It feels like there are double the number of components on the new sprue.
Then its not really canon. That sounds like the same issue Lucasfilm has gotten into. When disney bought lucasfilm (and thus star wars, indy, etc), they said all the old star wars books, were now legends. not official. They did this to forge their own path and to clear up a huge issue for major star wars fans. before, there was G canon (ie. the films/tv shows that George Lucas had a part of), then like A canon, B canon, C canon, etc. I dont know the exact letters but you get the idea. it was a clusterF.
So all that is gone. the book/comics/video games all start fresh, however, the force awakens novel version. In the novel, Poe and Daisy meet and talk. That doesnt happen in the films. they meet for first time in last jedi. So right there, they have messed up their own canon. So the head of the lucasfilm story group, Pablo Hidalgo i believe is the name, ended up saying in an interview, if anything like that happens, the films are always considered official canon and ignore the books.
So its right back to where it was before and with like less than 5 books released up to that point.
the easiest way, and what i understood, was that there are multiple titan designs (like the ones at warhammer world in the seige of terra diorama, that match alot of the artwork and are person sized), but the ones you can buy from forgeworld are the crappier smaller versions that they still build in large quantities.
doesnt matter from a gamplay POV. i just find the lore in stuff like D&D, WH, SW, GOT, Marvel/DC, ST, etc interesting
StarFyre wrote: Oh of course it will. the same for any background. but that doenst change the fact that if it was real, the sizes very. thats all.
like the second death star was 160km diameter. models/toys are obviously never in scale with anything since they would still need to be the size of the house.
that doesnt change the fact of what the size of the official death star 2 was.
however, that does assume the books etc are canon.
They're canon, but not necessarily true. As it has been noted, the stated size of Imperator Titan varies wildly in the books, even the size of one specific titan! BL authors make up details as they need and they often contradict each other (or even themselves), so one should take any such numbers with a grain of salt.
Fun little article, though not much new information in it.
Heaven forbid that the question about Titan Legios and Space Marine Legions might be generated by old Epic players as opposed to W30K players...
This is a telling development in GW's interaction/communication with its customer base. They know there's a contingent of players who want Titanicus to evolve to include armor and infantry units, yet every time fans of Epic have asked for this GW has intentionally thrown cold water on their hopes. Now, they act as if they have a NEW idea! That's disrespectful.
Nurglitch wrote: Yeah, Laser Blasters have three barrels. I want dual-barrelled Laser Destructors like on the Reaver and Warhound. I want my Imperius Dictatio dangit!
May need to shapeways then, since Dictio is a Lucius pattern, not a Mars.
Nurglitch wrote: Yeah, Laser Blasters have three barrels. I want dual-barrelled Laser Destructors like on the Reaver and Warhound. I want my Imperius Dictatio dangit!
May need to shapeways then, since Dictio is a Lucius pattern, not a Mars.
There’s a weapon card for warlord carapace turbo lasers so I’m sure GW will make them eventually for the Mars pattern.
Nurglitch wrote: Yeah, Laser Blasters have three barrels. I want dual-barrelled Laser Destructors like on the Reaver and Warhound. I want my Imperius Dictatio dangit!
May need to shapeways then, since Dictio is a Lucius pattern, not a Mars.
There’s a weapon card for warlord carapace turbo lasers so I’m sure GW will make them eventually for the Mars pattern.
They're going to be a resin release - so we'll need to keep an eye on the FW website rather than the GW one.
I’ve glued a Powerfist and Chainfist in place, as Reavers seem the chassis for punchy-Fight-Fight. But I do want to be able to double up on the other arm Weapons if I so fancy.
A little lower would have been nice but £15 is cool beans. Next purchase is the Rules set though, so I'm going to hold off a bit...or maybe a second reaver instead down the line?
Logistics...Full kit has more expensive logistics and is more useful. Weapon sprue isn\t 1/3 of use. Top of that it's mould that has already paid itself and is essentially print free now for GW
tneva82 wrote: If you have only 1 reaver it's easy. 2nd reaver over weapon sprue. So it's full reaver kit or rules box.
I think you're right on this one. I would get the 2nd Reaver from Wayland so he'd be £28 against the £15 for the weapon sprue from GW. For the extra £13 that covers the other two sprues. Yup, makes sense. Also, I would really like to add that second "tusk" head to my collection which a 2nd reaver body would allow...
I really hope for Xenos first - now don't get me wrong I love Epic it was my gateway into wargaming (well ok Titan Legions was). So I've a lot of love for that scale of game and GW made great models for it.
But I'd rather see Xenos titans with varied weapons and alternate bodies and all kinds of fancy stuff before we see Epic return. Eldar and Orks had quite a few neat options but I'd love to see Tyranids fleshed out with a range of new titans and titan models; whilst seeing what Tau and Necron could get to bring to the table .
Reckon we’ll see Epic before Xenos Titans. And I’d like to try to explain my reasoning.
All starts with the reason Adeptus Titanicus is set during the Heresy. From a production point of view, it’s cheaper, and therefore more efficient.
The start up costs for GW are relatively minimal. So far we’ve seen three Titan kits, and two Knight kits. Both are shared across the (admittedly binary) choice of factions. The real variety comes from the Maniple you choose, the Legio specific perks, and of course the weapon loadout. Whichever way you butter it, that’s an appealing prospect.
Now, it all seems to be selling quite nicely. Especially now the Battle Group boxed set offers a decent way in, price wise. It’s also pretty close to rounding out the existing choices. Certainly by the time 2019 is turning to 2020, I do expect the full, initial range to be out there for our gaming delectation.
Xenos Titans? Well, they just don’t have the same wide appeal as the common Imperial marks, because they’re very much a solo affair. If you buy say, an Eldar Maniple? It’s always going to be an Eldar Maniple. And not everyone is all that into Eldar. Same for Orks, and whatever else they conjure up for the remaining species.
Unless.....you keep on following throuch on the ‘Heresy first’ approach, and expanded that to Epic Scale. Same initial benefit. Two for one on your design investment. Keeps it cost effective. And on the off chance gaming tastes have changed, or the Epic rules set don’t tickle people’s fancies (oh HAI Epic 40,000!), that’s a wiser investment, as you likewise keep your losses to an absolute minimum.
But should Epic succeed? That’s when your Xenos armies can start coming into it. Both game systems are well established. And it’s entirely possible your Faithful will be ready for further variety, and therefore primed to try the very different play styles, perks and drawbacks of Xenos forces.
Me? I reckon we’ll get there, in time. Epic and Xenos remain a safer bet than trying an entirely new Specialist Game. They are, if you like, the second lowest of the low hanging fruit of SG’s glorious and well received resurrection.
Yay, another rehash of the when / if / I really hope they do Epic and this is how I want it that we've seen 26 times in this thread already. Mod sanctioned and encouraged too, what could be better? Some nice ideas of what they'll add to Epic Chaos, that might be good.
JWBS wrote: Yay, another rehash of the when / if / I really hope they do Epic and this is how I want it that we've seen 26 times in this thread already. Mod sanctioned and encouraged too, what could be better? Some nice ideas of what they'll add to Epic Chaos, that might be good.
Two things there: for one, yes, news and rumor threads often include discussion of what else people would like to see. That's just the nature of the beast. And just FYI, DCMs are not MODs.
However, those spotted on the Titans are likely out fairly soon (possibly even tomorrow!), as they very much seem like the finished product.
So that’s, erm, the Quake Cannon, and Warlord Gatling Cannon? I think?
Reaver Carapace Weapons (Vulcan Megabolter and Support Missile) were shown off as resin components, but not, if memory serves, as painted examples. So it strikes me they’ll be out after the Warlord ones?
Automatically Appended Next Post: My mistake. Reaver Carapace Weapons are digital versions at the moment (or at least, that’s all they showed off!)
We’ve got Adepticon coming up in a week or three though, then Warhammerfest beginning of May.
I have a gut feeling that a new Knight class will be released at the same time as Doom of Molech.
Apparently DOM will have an all-knight battleforce but its hard to see it comprising of just Questoris(Infantry) and Cerastus(fast-melee) classes. The Knight range currently lacks a heavy-fire power option and I'm wondering if the Acastus will be the next knight class to be released, possibly a threat to at least the Warhounds...
Or maybe they will make us super happy and release the Armigers? We could then come up with a "The 3 Worlds of the Reaver battle titan" scenario, where our titular hero is chained to the ground by pixie-like Armigers screaming "we got the bastard!" in their sqeaky voices...
Mad Doc Grotsnik wrote: I suspect we won’t see Armiger class until tanks and/or infantry are introduced. That’s their forte, and indeed their purpose.
Against Titans, they’d likely only be a threat to Knights, and be very easily swatted in return.
Meltagun have S8 in AT and Helverin are potentially the cheapest shield stripper unit out there.
Armigers could be 2 to a base.
I wish the Cerastus had a few more options, not just the lancer though.
I think the Acastus would be the most likely of the current 28mm kits, as they would fill a role of warhound scale firepower on a knight durable chassis. Maybe add a few weapon options as well- the new conversion beamer loadout, maybe a plasma and/or rocket variant.
Or they could add the chassis that became the Slaaneshi Hell-knights.
Armigers could be 2 to a base.
I wish the Cerastus had a few more options, not just the lancer though.
I think the Acastus would be the most likely of the current 28mm kits, as they would fill a role of warhound scale firepower on a knight durable chassis. Maybe add a few weapon options as well- the new conversion beamer loadout, maybe a plasma and/or rocket variant.
Or they could add the chassis that became the Slaaneshi Hell-knights.
Perhaps the 2 armigers could be called an "Armiger pack"?
With DoM approaching, I'm wondering if GW will have a value knight box set containing Questoris & Cerastus and a third type...just for those who want House Devine in-a-box.
I think a Epic Legio Astartes Range can be made easy with only 2 Sprues for the Start.
Mk4 Space Marine Sprue
-3 Sergeants with different Weapons
-10 Marines with Bolter
-3 Marines with different Special Weapon (for Support Squads)
-3 Marines with different Heavy Weapon (for Devastator Squads)
-2 Rhino Based Tanks (options for Rhino, Predator, Vindicator)
Enough Parts for one Tactical Squad. For Support Squads or Devastator Squads, you need multiple Sprues.
Mk4 Command Sprue
-Multiple Command Models (Captains/Centurions, Librarian, Chaplain, Standard Bearers ect.)
-2 Tartaros Terminator Sergeants with DIfferent Weapons
-8 Tartaros Terminator with Combi-Bolters
-2 Tartaros Terminator with Heavy Weapon
-1 Rhino Based Tank (options for Rhino, Razorback, Command Tank)
-1 Spartan Tank
-1 Fighter
...people knows that the old SM Epic sprue had half a company crammed inside, complete with tacticals, devs, assaults, scouts, termies, bikes, characters and all, right? In a half sized sprue?
Right? Because posts like the above make me wonder.
RazorEdge, everything you have stated would fit inside a single, regular sized sprue. And then some. It's Epic we're talking here, FFS. Unless they make the stuff mroe like 15mm than 6-8, that is. And even then, seeing FoW sprues I'd say eveything you mentioned above except tanks would fit in a single sprue.
I mean... translate this:
Into a modern, current density GW sprue. Those two combined are about the size of a single Blood Bowl or Necromunda sprue.
With the original Epic the armies had one or two plastic sets in a small box. Infantry and vehicles was the normal divide for a major army. Infantry had pretty much all the infantry for the army in one box, whilst the vehicles had the most numerous core. Everything else was sold in metal pretty much save for one or two of the biggest titans (Imperator and Mega Gargant).
There was a huge wealth of tanks and monsters in metal for many of the races; Imperials and Orks had quite a big selection, Imperial Guard a massive number of tank types.
So yeah the core of every army was really cheap to buy into and really easy to get; but the variety that built up around it was where the profit was.
Now things have changed and GW could do most armies on very few sprues with most of the army being in plastic. GW are unlikely to return to metals and likely wouldn't want to do a bulk of the army in resin. Now if they went plastic its unlikely that they are going to be able to sell it the same was as the metals - 3 lemon russ in a set in plastic isn't all that interesting for Epic. Now 30 LemonRuss in a pack at £20 now that's interesting and being in plastic very possible to do.
Epic would be different to how it was released in the past; unless they went for all metal.
Overread wrote: With the original Epic the armies had one or two plastic sets in a small box. Infantry and vehicles was the normal divide for a major army. Infantry had pretty much all the infantry for the army in one box, whilst the vehicles had the most numerous core. Everything else was sold in metal pretty much save for one or two of the biggest titans (Imperator and Mega Gargant).
There was a huge wealth of tanks and monsters in metal for many of the races; Imperials and Orks had quite a big selection, Imperial Guard a massive number of tank types.
So yeah the core of every army was really cheap to buy into and really easy to get; but the variety that built up around it was where the profit was.
Now things have changed and GW could do most armies on very few sprues with most of the army being in plastic. GW are unlikely to return to metals and likely wouldn't want to do a bulk of the army in resin. Now if they went plastic its unlikely that they are going to be able to sell it the same was as the metals - 3 lemon russ in a set in plastic isn't all that interesting for Epic. Now 30 LemonRuss in a pack at £20 now that's interesting and being in plastic very possible to do.
Epic would be different to how it was released in the past; unless they went for all metal.
I think 30 leman russes for £20 Is a bit optimistic sadly.
I'd imagine 5 with kit options at that price.
Look at the knights kit.
3 terminator sized models, barely any options - £20
Cerastus knights are a bit bigger but no options for the same £20.
Don't get me wrong, I'd love 30 russes for that price, but I just don't see it.
The biggest issue with GW doing epic again is their prices.
There are a ton of 3rd party companies that have been going for ages that would be priced better than GW.
I'd love for GW to prove me wrong as a cheaper source of epic models would be amazing (rather than cruising eBay daily to find stuff)
Why should the release a Single Sprue when they can make different ones to Expand the Range and release them from Time to Time to make Money.
See the Weapon Sprues on TItans.
See the sprue size of the titans. What you're stating would have trouble to fill a character's sprue. I don't think they would go for that size of sprue.
I could see it for an all-resin FW rleease, though. But if they go that way, IMHO it would be DOA, at least for me.
If they do it, they'll probably do "themed" plastic boxes like, say, a "Legion Tactical Company" with say 60 bolter guys including a character with 6 Rhinos, or else do a "Legion Infantry Company" with loads of bolter guys, some support squad guys etc and do a separate box of Rhinos that can also be assembled as Predators, maybe a clampack-size sprue or two with character models.
Either way, it won't have the value proposition Epic used to have, they'll aim it firmly at the "playing 50,000 point games of Age of Darkness is really inconvenient" crowd who'll happily stump up 500+ quid for an army.
Yea I think that the larger vehicles could fit in with AT rules but I don't see how anything much smaller would fit in as seamlessly unless its done as groups of bikes / speeders or whatever.
Either way as long as it eventually comes I will be a happy chap as will many others by the looks of this thread repeating itself over and over again ( not that I care, its not like there is anything else to discuss just yet )
Albertorius wrote: Well, even if they don't have rules, little marines make for very cool basing materials
Spoiler:
That, at least, would be welcome. They already included a tank on one of the FW boards so some base decorations for the Titans could be a possibility. It would help to reinforce the scale of the game with a marine or two underneath the Knights and Titans...
I think Adeptus Titanicus might keep to just large mechs and the Heresy-era for a three year stretch and then release a 2nd edition of the game that brings it into the 40K era and will include xenos. Lets face it, with 3 years feedback from gamers it will be time to update the core rules and we'll likely see pretty much all there is to see from Imperial-traitor forces, and adding Orks and Eldar would probably keep things managable. The Orks would be numerous, clumsy & brutal, the Eldar few but technologically advanced & graceful. Imperials would be the middle ground...
Adding smaller units such as infantry, artiliary and tanks would risk Titanicus becoming a combined-arms game rather than the mech-sim it started off as. GW made Titanicus for those who have an obsession with Titans and Knights( generally Forgeworld customers ) - some of their collections of entire 40K Banners and Maniples are gobsmacking, and it leaves little wonder as to who is keeping this game afloat. One has to ask - why risk upsetting that audience by turning the game into a different product? Other races would merely bring in new players who don't have much love for Imperials, while a separate game for mass armies( which could re-use models from Titanicus ) would be a safer option.
Although thats looking ahead years, there could - in the meantime - be a small limited-release game in the 8mm scale. Given the popularity of X-Wing, could there not be a game with fliers? GW have already done a flier-based game(stormcloud attack) in the 28mm scale, so a smaller scale version - with the intention to reuse the models for later games - could be feasable.
MajorWesJanson wrote: IIRC Aeronautica Imperialis predated X-Wing, and was inspired by Wings of Glory.
Ah-haaaaaa! Said Alan Partridge.
I didn't know about Aeronautica( released during my long abscence from table-top gaming ) but it was - apparently - a companion to the Epic 40K gaming system reusing models an'all. Not sure what the reception was like for that one but its interesting to know that such a game was released previously....
How big would Armigers be in AT scale? GSC human size or grots?
Seeing all the very expressive tiny trolls (sorry, "Troggoths"), snotlings, snails, shroom squigs on the Gloomspite sprues, Nurglings, familiars and stuff nowadays and the comments about the sculptors loving to do those tiny models gives me hope for plastic Epic minis soon-ish.
Binabik15 wrote: How big would Armigers be in AT scale? GSC human size or grots?
Seeing all the very expressive tiny trolls (sorry, "Troggoths"), snotlings, snails, shroom squigs on the Gloomspite sprues, Nurglings, familiars and stuff nowadays and the comments about the sculptors loving to do those tiny models gives me hope for plastic Epic minis soon-ish.
I'd day grot sized at best.
The knights are only around marine height to begin with.
Like be either 25mm - 32mm bases at a push.
I dont see any Xenos getting added until the SOT series is over as they may well be pushing that hard, I also wonder what the chances are of the battlefleet reboot accompanying the SOT series as well with the solar war ?
Afterall the new version of the video game did include the phalanx this time around, maybe im just getting my hopes up .
gilljoy wrote: So has there been any news on when the GME is back? I'm looking to get into the game
No, though I think the better way to get into the game is to buy the rules box and battleforce. Gives you variety and enough titans to make an Axiom Maniple.
gilljoy wrote: So has there been any news on when the GME is back? I'm looking to get into the game
Its on its way, but I wonder if it will be in August to celebrate its first year. Could be sooner but who knows...
Considering most retailers offered little-or-no discount on the GME last August( it was £175 ), you could shop around and get a battlegroup for about £80 and the ruleset for £35. Unlike the GME you'll be able to try out all three titans and still have change left over for some Knights or even another Reaver or pair of Warhounds.
Having now played Titanicus for myself, GW definitely should release another set that swaps out the Warlords for Warhounds( and double their weapon cards ). They could make a further saving by swapping out the plastic buildings for cardboard terrain...and boom - more players willing to give the game a shot.
Whilst this is nice and all, we really need new Knight models. It is pretty weird that there are more different types of Knights available for 40K than AT.
Crimson wrote: Whilst this is nice and all, we really need new Knight models. It is pretty weird that there are more different types of Knights available for 40K than AT.
Why is that weird? AT has been a game available for less than 10 months. 40K knights have been a thing since 6th edition, undergoing a major update last summer.
AT is also a risk game for them, they can't just shotgun the market with AT products at the current time without a large base of buyers. I'm wondering what the next release will end up being, but somehow, I'm not sure it will be knights.
Keep in mind they might not reveal those yet. Gw dripple feeds info. Why not sg as well? Leave something for big bang later
I'm wondering what they'll release. Knight upgrades are long overdue, but we may get something completely left field such as a Porphyrion sprue or a brand new Knight Chassis.
Knights are actually expensive for points. Cheap models, cheap price. For at on budget reaver and wargound are your frienes. Then warlord, knights worst
tneva82 wrote: Knights are actually expensive for points. Cheap models, cheap price. For at on budget reaver and wargound are your frienes. Then warlord, knights worst
I would probably say Knights are quite expensive price-wise, especially when compared with a box of Warhounds. Two sprues( two boxes of knights ) against three, and the hounds have so much in variety of armour and weapons.
That said, the Knights do not require the additional cost of weapon cards...urgh. Went to order some WH cards from the local GW this morning but its closed on Mondays...
" There’s also a new matched play mission that pits your forces against the mighty beasts that roam the world, for a very different kind of challenge. "
...and from Warhammer40K.Fandom...
"Their officers became lethargic, interested only in their sports, using their mighty Knight suits to hunt the towering reptilian beasts that stalked Molech's lush jungles."
...does this mean we're getting monster lizards for Titanicus???
tneva82 wrote: Knights are actually expensive for points. Cheap models, cheap price. For at on budget reaver and wargound are your frienes. Then warlord, knights worst
I would probably say Knights are quite expensive price-wise, especially when compared with a box of Warhounds. Two sprues( two boxes of knights ) against three, and the hounds have so much in variety of armour and weapons.
That said, the Knights do not require the additional cost of weapon cards...urgh. Went to order some WH cards from the local GW this morning but its closed on Mondays...
They’re also friendlier on the smaller pocket that belongs to peeps that struggle to save. £20 now is easier than saving it for a week or month to get a Titan.
They’re also friendlier on the smaller pocket that belongs to peeps that struggle to save. £20 now is easier than saving it for a week or month to get a Titan.
Ah, yet you do get two Warhounds in a box, not just the one. With the knights you don't a full banner in a box, nor all its options. In the case of the Warhounds...I'd have to back them in this case. If lacking in titans then the hounds are worth saving up for and putting the knights on hold for a bit.
With that said, you speak wisely about how much one has to budget for wargaming, on a regular basis. On a monthly basis I can afford about £30 - £40 at a push. The Reaver is as far as I can go for this game( a single miniature ), and thats using discount with Wayland. Even then, theres other gaming stuff I'd like to get( Dice, Cards & game magazines ), so yes the Knights can fit snuggly into that budget.
" There’s also a new matched play mission that pits your forces against the mighty beasts that roam the world, for a very different kind of challenge. "
...and from Warhammer40K.Fandom...
"Their officers became lethargic, interested only in their sports, using their mighty Knight suits to hunt the towering reptilian beasts that stalked Molech's lush jungles."
...does this mean we're getting monster lizards for Titanicus???
Can you build any of the Seraphon monsters without tack or riders? Those would work for dinosaurs in AT scale (even the smaller ones like Salamanders and the like).
Being old and sad and grognard, perhaps even a little bit crusty, Adeptus Titanicus is about the Titans, like wot is wos wen I wos yung. So that's what I've focussed on.
The option to field more variety with maybe, £60-£80 worth (after discount) is mighty tempting. And the Questoris are a really, really nice kit to work with.
Binabik15 wrote: How big would Armigers be in AT scale? GSC human size or grots?
Seeing all the very expressive tiny trolls (sorry, "Troggoths"), snotlings, snails, shroom squigs on the Gloomspite sprues, Nurglings, familiars and stuff nowadays and the comments about the sculptors loving to do those tiny models gives me hope for plastic Epic minis soon-ish.
I'd day grot sized at best.
The knights are only around marine height to begin with.
Like be either 25mm - 32mm bases at a push.
That sounds awefully cute. I'd get some just to have one fight the squirrel from the new BB Halflings.
The local store was out of AT Knights again, so I got a box of 40 sized Armigers for my brother instead. He'll have to build his Knight Warden and its new squires now, instead of of an army of shrink-rayed ones
I would much rather see just some round out additions for the current knights (weapon options/variant types) and additional weapon option sprues for the Titans. While I like having the knights in the game, I would prefer the focus to stay on the Titans, maybe other variant titans, some specific chaos type upgrade sprues to represent late in the heresy period...More terrain sprue options.. (actually having the weapon cards available for purchase or heaven forbid, just include them in with the actual model for all weapon options included on the sprues....)
Continue with rules and legion specific benefits for other titan legions...
I would still love to start seeing xenos war machines, super heavies,,, etc... but can wait on them and hope that may be a spin off for inclusion later, perhaps even a post-heresy game add on (can just see a GM edition with a great gargant and two stompas against a phantom and two revenants....oh and yes, at least for the visual and center piece an imperator....
" There’s also a new matched play mission that pits your forces against the mighty beasts that roam the world, for a very different kind of challenge. "
...and from Warhammer40K.Fandom...
"Their officers became lethargic, interested only in their sports, using their mighty Knight suits to hunt the towering reptilian beasts that stalked Molech's lush jungles."
...does this mean we're getting monster lizards for Titanicus???
Can you build any of the Seraphon monsters without tack or riders? Those would work for dinosaurs in AT scale (even the smaller ones like Salamanders and the like).
You can, but if you want them to look right they require a fair bit of cutting & sculpting work to remove all the harnesses and saddle details etc.
ah64pilot5 wrote: I would much rather see just some round out additions for the current knights (weapon options/variant types) and additional weapon option sprues for the Titans. While I like having the knights in the game, I would prefer the focus to stay on the Titans, maybe other variant titans, some specific chaos type upgrade sprues to represent late in the heresy period...More terrain sprue options.. (actually having the weapon cards available for purchase or heaven forbid, just include them in with the actual model for all weapon options included on the sprues....)
Continue with rules and legion specific benefits for other titan legions...
I agree with you regarding a focus on titans. Seems like all-Knight forces are an extreme concept compared to the controlled, conservative approach AT takes to titan maniples. As a result, there'd seem to be a high probability of them being broken in either direction. But we'll see. *shrug*
ah64pilot5 wrote: I would much rather see just some round out additions for the current knights (weapon options/variant types) and additional weapon option sprues for the Titans. While I like having the knights in the game, I would prefer the focus to stay on the Titans, maybe other variant titans, some specific chaos type upgrade sprues to represent late in the heresy period...More terrain sprue options.. (actually having the weapon cards available for purchase or heaven forbid, just include them in with the actual model for all weapon options included on the sprues....)
Continue with rules and legion specific benefits for other titan legions...
I agree with you regarding a focus on titans. Seems like all-Knight forces are an extreme concept compared to the controlled, conservative approach AT takes to titan maniples. As a result, there'd seem to be a high probability of them being broken in either direction. But we'll see. *shrug*
I am trying to remember if the Mechanicus have other Super Heavy Units that Titans and Ordinatus?
ah64pilot5 wrote: I would much rather see just some round out additions for the current knights (weapon options/variant types) and additional weapon option sprues for the Titans. While I like having the knights in the game, I would prefer the focus to stay on the Titans, maybe other variant titans, some specific chaos type upgrade sprues to represent late in the heresy period...More terrain sprue options.. (actually having the weapon cards available for purchase or heaven forbid, just include them in with the actual model for all weapon options included on the sprues....)
Continue with rules and legion specific benefits for other titan legions...
I agree with you regarding a focus on titans. Seems like all-Knight forces are an extreme concept compared to the controlled, conservative approach AT takes to titan maniples. As a result, there'd seem to be a high probability of them being broken in either direction. But we'll see. *shrug*
I am trying to remember if the Mechanicus have other Super Heavy Units that Titans and Ordinatus?
Well, yeah - all of them. GW can try to chuck out the old fluff and basic common sense to try and flog new kits if they like("Err, naw, Skitarii just walk everywhere, and if they need to get somewhere quick, they just start walking sooner!"), but the idea that the Mechanicus doesn't operate forces of "normal" tanks and flyers, including superheavies, beggars belief.
And the solution for people who only want to play Titans vs Titans is, err, only play Titans vs Titans? There are folk out there still who, for some reason I can't fathom, insist on playing *only* core-rulebook content for Mordheim, Necromunda etc, and hey, you do you. I'd rather we have the *option* of more than just that.
ah64pilot5 wrote: I would much rather see just some round out additions for the current knights (weapon options/variant types) and additional weapon option sprues for the Titans. While I like having the knights in the game, I would prefer the focus to stay on the Titans, maybe other variant titans, some specific chaos type upgrade sprues to represent late in the heresy period...More terrain sprue options.. (actually having the weapon cards available for purchase or heaven forbid, just include them in with the actual model for all weapon options included on the sprues....)
Continue with rules and legion specific benefits for other titan legions...
I agree with you regarding a focus on titans. Seems like all-Knight forces are an extreme concept compared to the controlled, conservative approach AT takes to titan maniples. As a result, there'd seem to be a high probability of them being broken in either direction. But we'll see. *shrug*
I am trying to remember if the Mechanicus have other Super Heavy Units that Titans and Ordinatus?
Well, yeah - all of them. GW can try to chuck out the old fluff and basic common sense to try and flog new kits if they like("Err, naw, Skitarii just walk everywhere, and if they need to get somewhere quick, they just start walking sooner!"), but the idea that the Mechanicus doesn't operate forces of "normal" tanks and flyers, including superheavies, beggars belief.
And the solution for people who only want to play Titans vs Titans is, err, only play Titans vs Titans? There are folk out there still who, for some reason I can't fathom, insist on playing *only* core-rulebook content for Mordheim, Necromunda etc, and hey, you do you. I'd rather we have the *option* of more than just that.
Oh I know that they have lots of conventional vehicles (in the fluff if not the game for no reason) and one-offs but if they had other large scale walkers like the Titans or just them and the Oridinatus, they have the really big robots that FW do and the Knights so maybe thats more than enough?
Ah ok I see what you mean, superheavies that are exclusive to them. I think not, not yet anyway, I wouldn't put it past FW to come up with some superheavy Robot eventually.
They have bonded Knights, the Centurio Ordinatus, and the Collegia Titanica.
Ordinatus Majoris should be the size of Warlord Titans or bigger. The dinky Epic sculpts are way too small.
So, as much as I want them to return, I’d rather see the resin weapon packs and some additional Knights and Titans first.
Edit: more importantly, did anyone suggest when the new building kit was going to be released?
Just in case folks missed it, the article on Molech mentions new Battlefield Assets, which require models...
So it's basically guaranteed there'll be something new inbound, whether that'll be drop forts, Evangelion style underground deployment shuttles, new Knights or something else entirely remains to be seen.
Mr_Rose wrote: Edit: more importantly, did anyone suggest when the new building kit was going to be released?
I've not seen anything official - though they could talk about it in the live feed tomorrow - but since they had boxes already done during the preview, I'd guess very soon.
ah64pilot5 wrote: I would much rather see just some round out additions for the current knights (weapon options/variant types) and additional weapon option sprues for the Titans. While I like having the knights in the game, I would prefer the focus to stay on the Titans, maybe other variant titans, some specific chaos type upgrade sprues to represent late in the heresy period...More terrain sprue options.. (actually having the weapon cards available for purchase or heaven forbid, just include them in with the actual model for all weapon options included on the sprues....)
Continue with rules and legion specific benefits for other titan legions...
I agree with you regarding a focus on titans. Seems like all-Knight forces are an extreme concept compared to the controlled, conservative approach AT takes to titan maniples. As a result, there'd seem to be a high probability of them being broken in either direction. But we'll see. *shrug*
All titan, all knight. So what? Either way one thing gets spammed
On the other hand we don't know what Knights to expect( well, perhaps educated guesses ) nor if their rules will differ from normal Knights.
The Acastus, for example, might be drawing from both Titans and Knights due to its almost-equal footing with a Warhound. Maybe it will lack servitor clades but need the use of a fire-arc, and have limits on its movement. Not sure how they are used in 40K, nor care for their fluff, but while they might not need weapon management, they might use warp-shields instead of ions if they work as independent units.
I'm not trying to predict the workings of the Acastus but merely illustrating a possibility - a unit with Titan-Knight Hybrid rules...or something else altogether.
Hopefully more will be revealled this evening...
Automatically Appended Next Post: Sadly, I was constantly distracted during the preview so others might be able to fill in the blanks, but here goes...
DOM is set for April, possibly early April at that.
Giant lizards were recommeded as proxy models from 40K and AOS ranges, with a resin release being a possibility down the line.
Big pictures of all three Cerastus Knights, so it shouldn't be long until the other two variants are available.
A Household seems to be - as I understand it - in layers, Field commander and guards, then lancers and others.
Oh, they did say they would cover other legios and houses with each expansion and continually introduce new maniples.
Strategms for Knights would also be an ongoing thing too.
Overall it seems GW/FW are going with the flow and not trying to restrict players by giving them the choice of how they want to play their games and how they create their collections. The expansions are there to inspire players, not restrict them.
-Molech is an early battle of the HH where House Devine betrays the Loyalists
-They have a copy of the book, it's coming next month
-Focus will be on Knights and Knight Houses
-Contents:
----Talks about the Warmaster's invasion
----History of Molech
----Legios - Crucius (Warmongers), Fortidus (Dauntless), Vulcanum (Dark Fire/Lords of Ruin), Interfector (Murder Lords)
----New Maniples - Fortis Battle (Warlord and Reavers), Ferrox Light (Reaver and Warhounds)
----Knight Houses - All knight forces now possible - House Devine, House Donar, House Indra, House Casker, House Cowshik, House Mamaragon, House Tazkhar
----Scenarios - recreates some of the key battles
----Battlefields - steam, ruins, cities - less lethal than those in Titandeath
-They have a spreadsheet of all Legios ever mentioned, and will keep knocking them off from "top tier" down
-They'll do the same thing with Knight Houses
-Legio Interfector has an Insanity Table
-Legio Audax ONLY uses scout Titans, but more than Warhounds
-All Knight Army uses another level of structure
-Groups Banners into Lances, which has an HQ, and then Lances have a Commander and Retinue
-FAQ comes out next month - and this book provides some clarifications
-Knights charge in a straight line - helps balance
-Knightly Qualities, Battle Standards, and Knight Strategems (with card pack, but rules are in the book as well)
-Some Strategems are unique to Knight Houses
-Playing all-Knight forces is very different and takes different tactics - expect casualties
-Beast Hunts as Matched Play, with three kinds of "monsters"
-They will do a combined Loyalist House decal sheet and Traitor one
-They will continue to do Imperial forces for the near future - Xenos might be done "someday"
-Civitas Imperialis Spires are on the way
-More Titan classes are on the way
-Grand Master Set is coming back, but no set date
-Mechanicum-style terrain is something for the future
ah64pilot5 wrote: I would much rather see just some round out additions for the current knights (weapon options/variant types) and additional weapon option sprues for the Titans. While I like having the knights in the game, I would prefer the focus to stay on the Titans, maybe other variant titans, some specific chaos type upgrade sprues to represent late in the heresy period...More terrain sprue options.. (actually having the weapon cards available for purchase or heaven forbid, just include them in with the actual model for all weapon options included on the sprues....)
Continue with rules and legion specific benefits for other titan legions...
I agree with you regarding a focus on titans. Seems like all-Knight forces are an extreme concept compared to the controlled, conservative approach AT takes to titan maniples. As a result, there'd seem to be a high probability of them being broken in either direction. But we'll see. *shrug*
All titan, all knight. So what? Either way one thing gets spammed
Oh I know it will get spammed, at least to an extent,,, but this is Adeptus Titanicus...not Adeptus Knightcus.... lets have more titans first,,, more options for them first,,, then expand out the knights. I know they are the big thing GW has going for 40k and all,,,, but how about maybe Lucius patterns of Warhounds first... or sprues with other options...more knights later... or for that matter,,,lets bring in the super heavies.....just my two cents worth....
Annoying that there's still no word on the resin weapon upgrades. It's literally an afternoon's work to turn a completed 3D model into a set of production-ready molds, but we still don't even have a vague idea of a date for stuff that was previewed weeks ago.
What's the point in them doing stuff in resin if it doesn't allow them to cut the lead times compared to doing them in plastic.
EDIT: And don't hold your breath for Lucius pattern, the current design team are on record from one of the event days IIRC as thinking they're just flat out ugly. As for why people want more Knights at the moment - well, they want to play Knight lists, and now that's going to be an option, they want them to be varied and effective. Without at least the addition of the Porphyrion playing Knights as-is will be pretty samey and spammy.
Grand master set coming back might actually spell me getting into the game. Ever since the knight bundles were undone, I dread looking at the sum underneath the cart, once I add everything I want. :(
SnotlingPimpWagon wrote: Grand master set coming back might actually spell me getting into the game. Ever since the knight bundles were undone, I dread looking at the sum underneath the cart, once I add everything I want. :(
Keep in mind it's only good deal if you want everything in it. 2 warlords(so not if you plan to play maniples without 2 warlords...), knights, terrain. Of course if all is good then it's good saving and better than the maniple box but if you aren't sure you need all the battlebox maniple with ruleset adds decent saving but not as much as the GME. But the maniple box has more all around force with 1 warlord, reaver and 2 warhounds.
SnotlingPimpWagon wrote: Grand master set coming back might actually spell me getting into the game. Ever since the knight bundles were undone, I dread looking at the sum underneath the cart, once I add everything I want. :(
Keep in mind it's only good deal if you want everything in it. 2 warlords(so not if you plan to play maniples without 2 warlords...), knights, terrain. Of course if all is good then it's good saving and better than the maniple box but if you aren't sure you need all the battlebox maniple with ruleset adds decent saving but not as much as the GME. But the maniple box has more all around force with 1 warlord, reaver and 2 warhounds.
This. I got the GME, the battle box and a plasma warlord. Now I have four warlords, which is possibly more than I need!
The battle box, plasma warlord and reaver 2 would be my recommended purchases, along with the rules set. You get 2 of each titan, a great mix of weapons and coincidentally you'll have all the right terminals.
The trouble with the GME is that it makes the batle box bad value, and otherwise that would be the most efficient way to buy titans. Dual-Bellicosa warlords are really not very good, and you definitely don't want three of them! If it came with one sprue of volcano cannons and one of plasma annihilators it'd be a totally different thing.
Hmmm, thanks for the tips!
My plan was to get GME + 1 Titan battlegroup and sell the third warlord off, next step was to buy Ceratus knights/alternative weapons.
-They have a spreadsheet of all Legios ever mentioned, and will keep knocking them off from "top tier" down
I wonder how long it will take them to get to Legio Praetor...
On the other hand... giant lizards, you say? To the dinosaur aisle of the toy shop! Finally I have an excuse to name my Reaver Striker Eureka.
Weirdly, I'm most excited about those building spires. Not quite sure why.
I just hope Molech kicks the fluff up a notch. Neither the AT rulebook nor Titandeath managed to catch my interest with any of its background. No human element, no energy or life in the prose, nothing to make me care. It's basically just "Goodies! Baddies! Robots! Fight!" Whereas even BFG managed to be evocative and entrancing with its Jane's Warships descriptions of cruisers. Maybe that's just how GW/FW fluff is these days? Oh well. I keep thinking of that Monty Python skit with the accountant. "Dull, dull, dull! God it's dull!"
I probably sound like a broken record on this subject. But I was thinking about it while reminiscing about old computer RTS games the other day. Total Annihilation? Great game, but you didn't play it because you cared about either side. But Dark Reign on the other hand... the manual had this ridiculously in-depth backstory that was totally irrelevant to most of the game itself. (Apparently due to its organic development process, in which world-building for an early version of the game became ancient history for the finished one.) Yet thanks to it, I hated those Imperium sons of canines with a passion and barracked for the plucky Freedom Guard to avenge all those monstrous historical injustices. I only wish I could say the same for Adeptus Titanicus. I suppose I'm just meant to go buy some BL books...
And would it kill them to have a single portrait of a Princeps somewhere? I get they're on a tight budget, but I don't know how many more full-frontal technical shots of Warlords I can take...
OK, enough whinging about stuff I actually like
Incidentally, since I've asked elsewhere but had no reply... is a Reaver with twin volcano cannons a good idea? Bad idea? Crazy idea? I *think* the reactor can cope as long as it doesn't run around too much, but I haven't played enough to be sure...
I tend to agree with you on the fluff in the first couple of books. It’s all “here’s how many people live on this imaginary planet” and very little about how titan war feels. I want to know what these things sound and smell like.
Personally I don’t much like the idea of a double-volcano cannon reaver, but opinions do differ. The argument in favour that I’ve heard is that you can park it somewhere with good LoS on repair orders, or even just next to a plasma asset thing, and it’ll just sit there zapping away all game. It’s certainly useful to have a unit like that which you can activate first and can’t really be dodged. Unlike a warlord, whose carapace weapons are easily avoided if it stands still, a reaver can hit anywhere.
Another argument in favour is that, if you’re giving a reaver one volcano cannon, what else are you going to give it? No other arm weapons really have the range to work with it.
To me though, standing still far away isn’t playing to a reaver’s strength, which is its relative agility compared to a warlord. I’d much rather have mine running around with a melta and gatling gun. Then you can use your repair rolls to fix your shields and/or to cool down your reactor after moving fast.
One scenario in which double volcanos could work well is a Corsair maniple. If you’ve got that many reavers it’s be fine to have one chilling out at the back.
. Of course, he wasn't expecting to play a game of Space Marine 2nd Edition using 
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