Fantastic to finally see an update to the guardians. Looks like they won't stand out much when side-by-side with the current ones. Kinda wish they weren't making so much use of the extra space from the larger bases. It's starting to look silly.
Edit: The vanes look like they're already in place, so they've probably gone for an easier assembly over the current models, but it also looks like there's less flexibility in terms of posing.
Edit: The vanes look like they're already in place, so they've probably gone for an easier assembly over the current models, but it also looks like there's less flexibility in terms of posing.
You aren't the first in this thread to make the observation about the vanes. Where are you seeing this? I don't see it in any of the pics so far.
Edit: The vanes look like they're already in place, so they've probably gone for an easier assembly over the current models, but it also looks like there's less flexibility in terms of posing.
You aren't the first in this thread to make the observation about the vanes. Where are you seeing this? I don't see it in any of the pics so far.
It's just a guess, but it does look like they're directly attached to the back in some of those previews. Makes sense since they're probably the most likely point to break on the current guardians.
Edit: The vanes look like they're already in place, so they've probably gone for an easier assembly over the current models, but it also looks like there's less flexibility in terms of posing.
You aren't the first in this thread to make the observation about the vanes. Where are you seeing this? I don't see it in any of the pics so far.
The current models have a lot of space between the vanes and the collar pieces, while the new ones seem to connected.
Saves up assembly time, though you lose interchangeability with the Dire Avengers kit or the option for a fancy back banner.
Edit: The vanes look like they're already in place, so they've probably gone for an easier assembly over the current models, but it also looks like there's less flexibility in terms of posing.
You aren't the first in this thread to make the observation about the vanes. Where are you seeing this? I don't see it in any of the pics so far.
The current models have a lot of space between the vanes and the collar pieces, while the new ones seem to connected.
Saves up assembly time, though you lose interchangeability with the Dire Avengers kit or the option for a fancy back banner.
It's a pill I'm willing to swallow though.
Eh. I doubt most people would even notice an issue with dire avengers. Their weird breakable shoulder scope (or whatever it is) isn't distinctive the way the head or loincloth is.
I doubt many people even catch the difference in the gun, to be honest.
chaos0xomega wrote: The only reason tactical marines got redone as often as they do is likely due to the fact that because they are such a high volume kit (if rumors are to be believed) GW has had to replace the molds for them several times over the years as a result of the molds wearing through, at which point it only makes sense that they would do a design update in the process.
More like they know people will buy them and they'll replace their older ones with the new, so they expect a better turnaround.
Unlikely. Production tooling is considered a capital asset (I believe the UK refers to it as a "fixed asset"), theres all sorts of tax implications involved with them and their depreciation/disposal, etc. There are back-end financial considerations/a bigger picture that have to be accounted for here beyond simple sales revenue/profit.
Yeah that's correct, although it depends on the original cost of the tool. Generally fixed assets need to have a minimum value before depreciation is used; £5000 is a common figure for this. So a 'cheap' aluminium mold for an event character like a store anniversary model might not require registration as an asset as the cost will be well under GW's threshold, but a set of steel molds for something like a Falcon could be a £10,000 asset, written off gradually over 5 or 10 years.
This is a big factor in the pricing for models. For example, we've seen equivalent kits (same number/size sprues) for space marines & xenos factions where the marine box was £5 cheaper. That's because even though the molds may cost GW almost the same, someone has carried out sales forecasting* for the lifetime of their use and determined that the xenos kit will sell far fewer and therefore need a higher price per unit to make the same profit as the marine kit.
*aka educated guessing
Maybe, just maybe putting like 90% of marketing effort to promote SM rainbow has something to do with how long does it take for a mould to make an acceptable return? And there is no reason of this sort to explain why GW has never updated Warp Spiders after their debut in '94 or why an anniversary SM models take precedence over a remake of Phoenix Lords or a mainstay character models like Warlocks. Those would make the same return in comparable time, just because of how short run anniversary models are designed for.
Fortunately GW seems to realise, that they overfocused on SM, so they do major overhauls of Xenos and non-SM imperial factions lately and reintroduce RT/2nd concepts.
Remember when I said that making production tooling is a lengthy and time consuming process. GW has been plugging away at "plasticization" of its product range for years. They have to strike a balance between resculpts and new releases, and we can argue all day about whether or not they got the balance right, but the point of the matter is that you're looking at probably 3-6 months of tooling time per kit, and GW probably can't run more than a literal handful of kits through tooling at once, if even that many. IIRCGW also only brought the toolmaking capability in house a few years ago, that was an outsourced process for some time, which comes with more delays as you have to wait in line while other customers in the queue go through the process ahead of you.
I really want a life-sized version of this mask to go grocery shopping in.
Nah. I think we all know deep down that if that was ever going to happen it would be a primaris tacticool grill. Geedubs missed an opportunity for merch
warpedpig wrote: I DEMAND Eldar Vypers get to "drive by" represented by moving 16" firing and moving 6 more inches. It is fitting for their speed and tactics.
That's impossible, they would need to be snipers riding shotgun on jetbikes to be able to do that :p
Given we are seeing these previews now, what's the turn around time before the codex and models drop? I should say we will probably see all this stuff in a month or two, no?
Togusa wrote: Given we are seeing these previews now, what's the turn around time before the codex and models drop? I should say we will probably see all this stuff in a month or two, no?
GW's rule of thumb is to show things 3 months before release. That's definitely not a hard rule though, sometimes it can come out within a few weeks while other times it's taken 4-5 months.
I reckon the most likely scenario is something along these lines:
New Kill Team box with Corsairs released soon. One rumour said preorders on Jan 29th
Chaos v Eldar box out around Feb
GW slots in another 40k release while Eldar folks are painting that lot, perhaps the new Chaos Knight
Eldar army box (if there is one) by Easter
Codex general sale follows about a month later with further waves of models
Togusa wrote: Given we are seeing these previews now, what's the turn around time before the codex and models drop? I should say we will probably see all this stuff in a month or two, no?
GW's rule of thumb is to show things 3 months before release. That's definitely not a hard rule though, sometimes it can come out within a few weeks while other times it's taken 4-5 months.
I reckon the most likely scenario is something along these lines:
New Kill Team box with Corsairs released soon. One rumour said preorders on Jan 29th
Chaos v Eldar box out around Feb
GW slots in another 40k release while Eldar folks are painting that lot, perhaps the new Chaos Knight
Eldar army box (if there is one) by Easter
Codex general sale follows about a month later with further waves of models
Why are people so stuck on the Corsair box. There is zero evidence that they exist, and there was just a KillTeam Box release a couple of months ago. I doubt there'd be another this soon.
Eldar getting to move-shoot-move makes sense to me. They’re meant to be hyper fast. And it’s kinda just swapping their advance and shoot around. I guess you could potentially game it, but being a d6 makes it harder to
What do you guys think about the rumoured (some confirmed) shake up of our Heavy weapons?
Scatter lasers- Heavy 6, S5 D1 Ap0
Shuricannons- Assault 3, S6 D2 Ap1 (Ap3 on a 6 to wound)
Star cannon- Heavy 2, S7 D2 Ap3
I like the change to the Scatter, although S5 makes it 1pt harder to wound T3/5/6 compared to the current S6, but the 2 extra shots should make that up.
I love that Shuricannons get the Heavy Bolter treatment.
Not sure about the Star cannons though. I was hoping for straight Damage 3. If it has the same D as Shuricannons now, I'd rather just use Shuricannons if they still cost less.
Galef wrote: What do you guys think about the rumoured (some confirmed) shake up of our Heavy weapons?
Scatter lasers- Heavy 6, S5 D1 Ap0
Shuricannons- Assault 3, S6 D2 Ap1 (Ap3 on a 6 to wound)
Star cannon- Heavy 2, S7 D2 Ap3
I like the change to the Scatter, although S5 makes it 1pt harder to wound T3/5/6 compared to the current S6, but the 2 extra shots should make that up.
I love that Shuricannons get the Heavy Bolter treatment.
Not sure about the Star cannons though. I was hoping for straight Damage 3. If it has the same D as Shuricannons now, I'd rather just use Shuricannons if they still cost less.
Let's hope all 3 weapons cost the same.
-
I like all of the changes, but I am also not sure about the Star cannon. I am not sure what role it should play. If it's cheap then as cheap source of marine killer, but from other rumours eldar will have plenty of choices for marine killer that are more versatile
I could see the Star cannon filling an "all comers" role. It's decent enough to strip wounds off vehicles/monsters, even though it's more ideal against mid-level Infantry with multiple wounds.
You could build a list with plenty of anti-infantry like Shurikens, Shuricannons Scatter lasers, etc and plenty of anti-tank (BLs almost assuredly being D:d3+3 now)
Then put Star cannons on a few units as a versatile "clean up" option.
I'll probably still bring them on my WWs, especially if the cost the same as Shuricannons now
Move shoot move is terrible in the way 40k does movement.
If you had to pick a direction, and you could then float along that trajectory after firing, maybe there could be some interest there. But this would require a complete re-write of movement rules.
Any system which encourages popping out an inch from behind a brick, shooting, then moving back an inch so you are out of LOS, is inevitably toxic as hell.
Tyel wrote: Move shoot move is terrible in the way 40k does movement.
If you had to pick a direction, and you could then float along that trajectory after firing, maybe there could be some interest there. But this would require a complete re-write of movement rules.
Any system which encourages popping out an inch from behind a brick, shooting, then moving back an inch so you are out of LOS, is inevitably toxic as hell.
What are you on about?
I've played since 4th ed and both Tau suits and Eldar jetbikes had move-shoot-move since at least then. It only became "toxic" in 7th because you now had TROOPs with heavy weapons that could do it and both Eldar and Tau could be in the same armylist.
8th/9th is a very different game now. Things are way more "killy" than before. And enemies can be in your deployment zone turn 1 quite reliably.
Giving an extra D6 move to squishy T3 Eldar is hardly going to break the game.
Especially since this only applies to units with BATTLE FOCUS, which means just Infantry & Bikes. And it's possible they might remove it from Bikes.
Shuricannons- Assault 3, S6 D2 Ap1 (Ap3 on a 6 to wound)
Star cannon- Heavy 2, S7 D2 Ap3
-
All rumour say the scatter laser is staying at str 6. I think only Auspex Tactics had it at str 5, and he acknowledged the mistake.
I feel the starcannon does not have an identity at this point. The shuriken cannon is just a better alround weapon, and will fill the anti elite slot as well through weight of fire (and fishing for sixes).
Shuricannons- Assault 3, S6 D2 Ap1 (Ap3 on a 6 to wound)
Star cannon- Heavy 2, S7 D2 Ap3
-
All rumour say the scatter laser is staying at str 6. I think only Auspex Tactics had it at str 5, and he acknowledged the mistake.
I feel the starcannon does not have an identity at this point. The shuriken cannon is just a better alround weapon, and will fill the anti elite slot as well through weight of fire (and fishing for sixes).
That's good to know. S6 Heavy6 Scatters would be great.
I feel Star cannons won't be a BAD choice for guaranteed Ap3 (won't have to fish for 6s) and the S7 makes it better against T6/7 targets.
If it cost the same as Shuricannons, I could see it as a viable choice for WKs to match the Suncannnon at least.
But as a fan of Shuricannons since 4th, I'll probably still spam them where possible
Tyel wrote: Move shoot move is terrible in the way 40k does movement.
If you had to pick a direction, and you could then float along that trajectory after firing, maybe there could be some interest there. But this would require a complete re-write of movement rules.
Any system which encourages popping out an inch from behind a brick, shooting, then moving back an inch so you are out of LOS, is inevitably toxic as hell.
You mean like real life combat? Someone tell the marines they need to stand in the open and take it like a man!
Tyel wrote: Move shoot move is terrible in the way 40k does movement.
If you had to pick a direction, and you could then float along that trajectory after firing, maybe there could be some interest there. But this would require a complete re-write of movement rules.
Any system which encourages popping out an inch from behind a brick, shooting, then moving back an inch so you are out of LOS, is inevitably toxic as hell.
You mean like real life combat? Someone tell the marines they need to stand in the open and take it like a man!
Show me in real life combat where people stand in the open shooting whilst the enemy stand there not shooting, then run back into cover before the enemy open fire.
Exactly. Doesn’t happen. Because the game is a bunch of abstractions. So “you mean like real life combat” holds no water here as real life combat does not happen as you describe, and because the rules cover mind bullets and everyone having a disc glued to their feet.
Looks like Shuricannons are confirmed D2. Also they are Heavy now instead of Assault
Lord Perversor wrote: So fot he look of it seems we can pair the Heavy Wraithcannon with a Scatter shield in the Wraithknight.
Indeed. Looks like the WK comes stock with Ghostglaive/Shield and you can:
Swap Glaive for either 1 Suncannon or 1 HWC
Swap Shield for 1 HWC
So we can now have the following 3 builds we couldn't before:
-Glaive/HWC
-HWC/Suncannon
-HWC/Shield
Although I am not seeing the point in the Shield, since the WK now has a 5++ standard.
Shield is 4++. Not sure that is worth giving up a powerful weapon just for a ~16% better ++
Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! Then, manipulate dice rolls with these dice, but if you haven't used them, and the ones you kept from this turn's allotment match the numbers on this chart, then for specific types of Tests you can make them natural 6's and...
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! Then, manipulate dice rolls with these dice, but if you haven't used them, and the ones you kept from this turn's allotment match the numbers on this chart, then for specific types of Tests you can make them natural 6's and...
Oh my God GW... why do you do this???
Alongside the way they wrote Katah's for Custodes, I think they've mistook "ancient and elite" to somehow mean they have to write unnecessarily verbose and complicated ways of writing army doctrines for them. Boy am I glad I play Orks lol.
Tyel wrote: Move shoot move is terrible in the way 40k does movement.
If you had to pick a direction, and you could then float along that trajectory after firing, maybe there could be some interest there. But this would require a complete re-write of movement rules.
Any system which encourages popping out an inch from behind a brick, shooting, then moving back an inch so you are out of LOS, is inevitably toxic as hell.
You mean like real life combat? Someone tell the marines they need to stand in the open and take it like a man!
Show me in real life combat where people stand in the open shooting whilst the enemy stand there not shooting, then run back into cover before the enemy open fire.
Exactly. Doesn’t happen. Because the game is a bunch of abstractions. So “you mean like real life combat” holds no water here as real life combat does not happen as you describe, and because the rules cover mind bullets and everyone having a disc glued to their feet.
That's IGUGO. Not much that can be done about it outside of having alternate activations.
I like what I see for the Wraith Knight so far! Can't see it all through the blurriness, and I play more casual and not competitive at all, so it looks interesting! I might cave in and buy one in the end!
Well, at least they had the common sense not to make the ynncarne untargetable given its sheer screw you melee power.
Can't see it on those pics but here's the text pulled out via B&C:
Yncarne
Wounds M WSBS S T W A LdSv 7+ wounds 12" 2 2 7 7 12 6 10 3+
4-6 9 2 2 6 7 NA 5 10 3+
1-3 6 2 2 5 7 NA 4 10 3+
Swirling void energy | 6", Assault D6, S7, -2AP, D1 | Each time an attach is made with this weapon, the attack automatically hits its target
Sword of Souls (two profiles)
| Piercing Strikes | S+4, -4AP, Dd3+3 | No invun saves can be made against this profile
| Sweeping Blow | S User, -4AP, D1 | Make 2 attacks instead of 1
Abilities
4++ and Halves Damage
Ynnari within 12" ignore modifiers for combat attrition
During deployment, you can set up this model in waiting instead of setting it up on the battlefield. If you do this, then when another unit is destroyed, before removing the last model in that unit, you can set this model up within 1" of that model. If this model is on the battlefield when another unit is destroyed, before removing the last model in that unit, you can remove this model from the battlefield and set it up again within 1" of that model. When this/that model is set up in either of theses ways, it cannot be set up within Engagement range of any enemy models and until the end of the turn, it is not eligible to declare a charge or perform a heroic intervention. (Thanks Garishtech for the transcribe)
Are Banshees finally worth using? S4 and +1 or wound on the charge with 3(?) attacks seems pretty decent.
EDIT: Also, are Warlocks getting new models at all? There’s the rumour they’re getting a unit entry for up to, like, 9 dudes. Seems weird when there’s only a set of like 3 metal models, though I guess that does add up.
The opposite, they were on the money. It's worth noting the owner of the images calls the book out as "in the realm of Drukhari at release" so expect some teeth gnashing. Especially since a lot of the people telling us the rumour smust be fake because they were too good will be upset!
I thought the advent leak was fake as hell for many different reasons. And I was WRONG.
But I have learned some things: GW leakage control is not as tight as it used to be. Playtesters do have images of new units and codex art.
And I still think that Battle Focus is a very bad idea that makes games tedious and very uncinematic.
--------
In other news: The first post is now a full-blown summary of all current rumours/news regarding Aeldari.
Vovin wrote: I thought the advent leak was fake as hell for many different reasons. And I was WRONG.
But I have learned some things: GW leakage control is not as tight as it used to be. Playtesters do have images of new units and codex art.
And I still think that Battle Focus is a very bad idea that makes games tedious and very uncinematic.
--------
In other news: The first post is now a full-blown summary of all current rumours/news regarding Aeldari.
Or the leaker didn't have playtest version and wasn't playtester to begin with and it was THAT part that was lie. Guess to protect his identity or source?
Tiberius501 wrote: Are Banshees finally worth using? S4 and +1 or wound on the charge with 3(?) attacks seems pretty decent.
EDIT: Also, are Warlocks getting new models at all? There’s the rumour they’re getting a unit entry for up to, like, 9 dudes. Seems weird when there’s only a set of like 3 metal models, though I guess that does add up.
The Seer Council has always been a thing since 3rd (?), it's just given the points cost and losing character rules they mostly got taken as MSU(ish) of 2 or 3 to power the double range psyker strat
Tiberius501 wrote: Are Banshees finally worth using? S4 and +1 or wound on the charge with 3(?) attacks seems pretty decent.
EDIT: Also, are Warlocks getting new models at all? There’s the rumour they’re getting a unit entry for up to, like, 9 dudes. Seems weird when there’s only a set of like 3 metal models, though I guess that does add up.
Seer Council is mainly made up of Warlocks from what I remember.
Count me amongst those tucking into a well deserved slice of humble pie, to go with the egg on my face!
Thank you for your attitude ! It goes a long way into making healthy online spaces and god knows it's hard to admit when you were wrong, especially online !
As for the rumours. Wow, some things do look strong. And maybe in quite a frustrating way ? Don't know what to think about it...
tneva82 wrote: Or the leaker didn't have playtest version and wasn't playtester to begin with and it was THAT part that was lie. Guess to protect his identity or source?
I'm starting to think Battle Focus might retain the "except Heavy weapons" part of its current rule.
Like the rule might be: "Models with this rule that have not Advanced this turn may move d6" after firing their weapons (except Heavy weapons)."
If so, that would go a long way toward reducing 7th ed style Bikers spamming Scatter lasers or Shuricannon fire. Could be why Shuricannons are now Heavy instead of Assault (as confirmed by the WK datasheet)
I kinda hope that's the case. It would also prevent Dark Reaper from abusing BF.
So, let's see. Eldari have super advanced holofields backed by psychic powers that allow them to dodge any incoming fire. Or are a literal god disintegrating anything that dares to touch them. Unless it's a chunk of iron thrown in a straight line, then none of this works. Broken gak, meet even more broken gak
Heavy wraithcannon, titan scale gun that literally sends half of the target into the warp, somehow deals less damage than a first sized piece of scrap. Oh, and less AP to boot (and no ignoring ++) because FRAK YOU, having a cybernetic finger or first aid kit now means you're warp- (but not thrown stone-) proof. Anyone willing to tell me how this idiocy makes any sense whatsoever?
Meanwhile, heavy AT guns of SM and Necron vehicles cry in corner because neither book managed to catch the wave of broken cheese change of design direction. Especially Necron doom X guns that used to be better than both of the above. Bravo
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
Gert wrote: So Craftworlds, Harlequins and Ynarri are all in the same book. Good. Makes way more sense than a 5 unit Codex and a WD supplement.
Just wondering how that's going to happen with the Harlequins, as they seem to be their own faction as much as Drukhari with their own detachments and lore.
Not opposed to it though if it means two codices in one plus the Ynnari rules.
Gert wrote: So Craftworlds, Harlequins and Ynarri are all in the same book. Good. Makes way more sense than a 5 unit Codex and a WD supplement.
Just wondering how that's going to happen with the Harlequins, as they seem to be their own faction as much as Drukhari with their own detachments and lore.
Not opposed to it though if it means two codices in one plus the Ynnari rules.
To be fair, harlis have been dancing in and out of the main eldar codex all their lives.
Stand alone RT list
Part of the 2nd ed codex.
Dropped in the 3rd book.
Added back as a unit at some point
Spun out into their own book
Wrapped back in.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
I'm not competent in the details to be able to comment specifically on these instances, but in general making a game mechanic really complicated does not necessarily equal "fixing it"
Dudeface wrote: Well, at least they had the common sense not to make the ynncarne untargetable given its sheer screw you melee power.
Can't see it on those pics but here's the text pulled out via B&C:
Yncarne
Wounds M WSBS S T W A LdSv 7+ wounds 12" 2 2 7 7 12 6 10 3+
4-6 9 2 2 6 7 NA 5 10 3+
1-3 6 2 2 5 7 NA 4 10 3+
Swirling void energy | 6", Assault D6, S7, -2AP, D1 | Each time an attach is made with this weapon, the attack automatically hits its target
Sword of Souls (two profiles)
| Piercing Strikes | S+4, -4AP, Dd3+3 | No invun saves can be made against this profile
| Sweeping Blow | S User, -4AP, D1 | Make 2 attacks instead of 1
Abilities
4++ and Halves Damage
Ynnari within 12" ignore modifiers for combat attrition
During deployment, you can set up this model in waiting instead of setting it up on the battlefield. If you do this, then when another unit is destroyed, before removing the last model in that unit, you can set this model up within 1" of that model. If this model is on the battlefield when another unit is destroyed, before removing the last model in that unit, you can remove this model from the battlefield and set it up again within 1" of that model. When this/that model is set up in either of theses ways, it cannot be set up within Engagement range of any enemy models and until the end of the turn, it is not eligible to declare a charge or perform a heroic intervention. (Thanks Garishtech for the transcribe)
Explodes
Takes two whole Hammerhead Railguns to kill. So broken!
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! Then, manipulate dice rolls with these dice, but if you haven't used them, and the ones you kept from this turn's allotment match the numbers on this chart, then for specific types of Tests you can make them natural 6's and...
Oh my God GW... why do you do this???
But HBMC, how else can GW ensure that Eldar's mechanic is super special and unique and completely different from Miracle Dice?
I mean, where would we be if factions started sharing comparable rules? That way lies madness and, worse still, USRs!
I am liking what I see right now. Not sure if I'm thrilled with my non magnetized suncannon/scattershield wraithknight, but I may just buy a second anyway and magnetize it. In friendly games i can probably just count the suncannon as heavy wraithcannon sometimes anyway, it's not like my buddies know what either looks like...it's just a long bloody gun!
The heavy wraithcannon damage is really good, it's the railgun that is super dumb. Ignoring invulns with that kind of damage is just plain stupidity, but Tau do need help in 9th so will reserve judgement until I see overall strength of codex.
Strands of fate dice seems fine to me, kinda like the way it works.
had no idea what the keyword anhrathe was, so had to look it up. Pretty much confirms Corsairs too then, which is sweet.
Since I also play harlequins, I really hope the excellent changes they put in with the WD article (which was better than many codex supplements in 8th) aren't removed, leaving harlies as a sideshow army.
man, I really need to finish painting my sisters project because I know when this hits, I'm going to be all in with rejuvenating my Eldar army.
Argive wrote: How do people still have potato cameras..
Its intentionally blurred. These are screenshots from playtest pdfs rather than photographs, the pages have hidden watermarks and code markings, etc. to identify the source of the document if its leaked.
tneva82 wrote: # of codexes is irrelevant for when edition changes since gw isn't obligated to update codexes before next ed and rarely does
I think the point is the opposite. If GW updates all the Codices swiftly, the next logical step is to update the edition. They can't keep the same rules around for too long, otherwise people won't keep buying models.
Count me amongst those tucking into a well deserved slice of humble pie, to go with the egg on my face!
It's pretty easy to tell when rumours/leaks are legit nowadays because the intermediaries who bring them are much better at verifying them. The Advent Calendar leaks were only released because the discord server owner had received other information from the leaker that turned out to be true beforehand. Valrak too has ways to verify who he is getting his information from. There's a leaker on the r/Eldar subreddit who is now being taken seriously because he posted about ALL of this stuff like 5 months ago, including naming the Shroud Runners. The Advent Leaks were also verified by several other youtubers who essentially said the majority of it was true, or matched up with stuff they'd seen/been able to verify.
If it's just some random dude or Faeit or obvious photoshop filters to make it look like a phone cam pic then yeah, take it with a huge grain of salt. But for the past 2-3 years we've had consistent leaks and rumours from very reliable sources and everything about the Advent leak pointed to it being completely legit.
Nazrak wrote: If they'e folded Harlequins back in, I'll be delighted.
I'm just confused about it.
I mean... I like fewer books and fewer teeny-tiny subfactions.
But not too long ago, Harlies were in both Craftworlds and Dark Eldar.
Then they got their own book and weren't in either (despite working with both, fluffwise and on the table)
Now they're... not in Dark Eldar, but will be in Craftworlds. That's just... gakky.
Its like they didn't plan out the edition and what they were going to do with the, for lack of better word, stray subfactions. (See the guard datasheets being removed from GSC, which is more like Dark Eldar without Harlies rather than Craftworlds with Harlies). Makes me wonder about Chaos Cultists, to be honest (since there are rumors about range expansion there).
Anyway, mid edition paradigm shift screws over an earlier release again. Nothing new, I guess. But no guard in GSC makes me wonder if DE will ever get harlies back directly.
Bosskelot wrote: It's pretty easy to tell when rumours/leaks are legit nowadays because the intermediaries who bring them are much better at verifying them. The Advent Calendar leaks were only released because the discord server owner had received other information from the leaker that turned out to be true beforehand. Valrak too has ways to verify who he is getting his information from. There's a leaker on the r/Eldar subreddit who is now being taken seriously because he posted about ALL of this stuff like 5 months ago, including naming the Shroud Runners. The Advent Leaks were also verified by several other youtubers who essentially said the majority of it was true, or matched up with stuff they'd seen/been able to verify.
If it's just some random dude or Faeit or obvious photoshop filters to make it look like a phone cam pic then yeah, take it with a huge grain of salt. But for the past 2-3 years we've had consistent leaks and rumours from very reliable sources and everything about the Advent leak pointed to it being completely legit.
Yeah, in hindsight it is pretty obvious that the stuff is correct.
But given the information the general public (and not some insider group of playtesters and people with connection to them) had, it wasn't obvious.
1) Sure, Valrak has at least one reliable source. But he also makes videos about fabricated gak rumours like the ones that started this thread. So he clearly doesn't use his reliable sources to confirm other rumours.
2) How do you know that some random Discord admin diligently checks his sources, except taking his word for it?
3) We only know that OK_Entrepeneur's Reddit posts are legit since the Eldritch Omen teaser confirmed it.
So there is no direct way to judge the veracity of a rumour except you have connections yourself to someone who can verify it.
Nazrak wrote: If they'e folded Harlequins back in, I'll be delighted.
I'm just confused about it.
I mean... I like fewer books and fewer teeny-tiny subfactions.
But not too long ago, Harlies were in both Craftworlds and Dark Eldar.
Then they got their own book and weren't in either (despite working with both, fluffwise and on the table)
Now they're... not in Dark Eldar, but will be in Craftworlds. That's just... gakky.
Its like they didn't plan out the edition and what they were going to do with the, for lack of better word, stray subfactions. (See the guard datasheets being removed from GSC, which is more like Dark Eldar without Harlies rather than Craftworlds with Harlies). Makes me wonder about Chaos Cultists, to be honest (since there are rumors about range expansion there).
Anyway, mid edition paradigm shift screws over an earlier release again. Nothing new, I guess. But no guard in GSC makes me wonder if DE will ever get harlies back directly.
With the way keywords work, it no longer matters if a faction has it's own book or shares one with others.
You still have to take separate detachments to get the most out of a faction anyway.
Dark Eldar can still take Harlies, but just like before, they'll be in a separate detachment.
Bosskelot wrote: It's pretty easy to tell when rumours/leaks are legit nowadays because the intermediaries who bring them are much better at verifying them. The Advent Calendar leaks were only released because the discord server owner had received other information from the leaker that turned out to be true beforehand. Valrak too has ways to verify who he is getting his information from. There's a leaker on the r/Eldar subreddit who is now being taken seriously because he posted about ALL of this stuff like 5 months ago, including naming the Shroud Runners. The Advent Leaks were also verified by several other youtubers who essentially said the majority of it was true, or matched up with stuff they'd seen/been able to verify.
If it's just some random dude or Faeit or obvious photoshop filters to make it look like a phone cam pic then yeah, take it with a huge grain of salt. But for the past 2-3 years we've had consistent leaks and rumours from very reliable sources and everything about the Advent leak pointed to it being completely legit.
Yeah, in hindsight it is pretty obvious that the stuff is correct.
But given the information the general public (and not some insider group of playtesters and people with connection to them) had, it wasn't obvious.
1) Sure, Valrak has at least one reliable source. But he also makes videos about fabricated gak rumours like the ones that started this thread. So he clearly doesn't use his reliable sources to confirm other rumours.
2) How do you know that some random Discord admin diligently checks his sources, except taking his word for it?
3) We only know that OK_Entrepeneur's Reddit posts are legit since the Eldritch Omen teaser confirmed it.
So there is no direct way to judge the veracity of a rumour except you have connections yourself to someone who can verify it.
There were comments on a podcast I believe from Peter from 40kstats confirming the rumours very early on. But unless you listened to it by chance or went looking you wouldn't know.
It's more that too often on dakka people demand iron clad proven rumour sources, I.e. facts, when discussion of the what ifs and the possibility is still worthwhile even if the veracity cannot be confirmed.
Nazrak wrote: If they'e folded Harlequins back in, I'll be delighted.
I'm just confused about it.
I mean... I like fewer books and fewer teeny-tiny subfactions.
But not too long ago, Harlies were in both Craftworlds and Dark Eldar.
Then they got their own book and weren't in either (despite working with both, fluffwise and on the table)
Now they're... not in Dark Eldar, but will be in Craftworlds. That's just... gakky.
Its like they didn't plan out the edition and what they were going to do with the, for lack of better word, stray subfactions. (See the guard datasheets being removed from GSC, which is more like Dark Eldar without Harlies rather than Craftworlds with Harlies). Makes me wonder about Chaos Cultists, to be honest (since there are rumors about range expansion there).
Anyway, mid edition paradigm shift screws over an earlier release again. Nothing new, I guess. But no guard in GSC makes me wonder if DE will ever get harlies back directly.
With the way keywords work, it no longer matters if a faction has it's own book or shares one with others.
You still have to take separate detachments to get the most out of a faction anyway.
Dark Eldar can still take Harlies, but just like before, they'll be in a separate detachment.
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Yeah, but for DE to use them, they need to buy 2 books, and for Eldar to use them, they just need the 1. I’m with Voss on this, it’s weird and definitely feels like they made the choice too late to add them to the DE codex or something.
It’s not ideal for DE players who want to splash some harlis into their list, but I’d rather have things wrapped into fewer codexes. Now DE can also add CWE units as well, without more books.
And duplicating entries in multiple books often ends up with different versions as they get updated. So just having it here is fine.
Nazrak wrote: If they'e folded Harlequins back in, I'll be delighted.
I'm just confused about it.
I mean... I like fewer books and fewer teeny-tiny subfactions.
But not too long ago, Harlies were in both Craftworlds and Dark Eldar.
Then they got their own book and weren't in either (despite working with both, fluffwise and on the table)
Now they're... not in Dark Eldar, but will be in Craftworlds. That's just... gakky.
Its like they didn't plan out the edition and what they were going to do with the, for lack of better word, stray subfactions. (See the guard datasheets being removed from GSC, which is more like Dark Eldar without Harlies rather than Craftworlds with Harlies). Makes me wonder about Chaos Cultists, to be honest (since there are rumors about range expansion there).
Anyway, mid edition paradigm shift screws over an earlier release again. Nothing new, I guess. But no guard in GSC makes me wonder if DE will ever get harlies back directly.
Agreed, bit of a kick in the teeth of Drukhari players IMO, now they will need to buy a second codex to use them, assuming that its still a soupable option for them in the first place. Also a bit startling that they would reintroduce the concept of codex supplements only to seemingly not utilize them for factions other than space marines.
Agreed, bit of a kick in the teeth of Drukhari players IMO, now they will need to buy a second codex to use them, assuming that its still a soupable option for them in the first place. Also a bit startling that they would reintroduce the concept of codex supplements only to seemingly not utilize them for factions other than space marines.
Can someone tell me what Edition Harlequins were present in the Dark Eldar Codex and when they were removed because AFAIK they were in the 6th Ed Craftworlds Codex then got their own release in 7th Ed. Was it 5th or 4th? Because if not then DE having to buy multiple Codexes to use Harlequins is not a new thing and people should stop acting like it's a betrayal on GW's part.
Also, Drukhari can't be taken in the same Detachment as non-Drukhari Aeldari without them also being Ynarri (say that 10 times fast).
tneva82 wrote: # of codexes is irrelevant for when edition changes since gw isn't obligated to update codexes before next ed and rarely does
I think the point is the opposite. If GW updates all the Codices swiftly, the next logical step is to update the edition. They can't keep the same rules around for too long, otherwise people won't keep buying models.
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They can and will release new edition whenever it suits them. 40k 10th will be out 2023 whether or not all have got 9e codex.
They can and will release new edition whenever it suits them. 40k 10th will be out 2023 whether or not all have got 9e codex.
You and I are not in disagreement. I am not implying that GW will wait to update all armies before releasing 10th, I'm saying that if GW pushes out all the army updates THIS FAST, it's inevitable that 10th is coming.
If GW hypothetically updates every army in 9th, it will only be a matter of weeks before 10th drops, as there is no way GW is going to let the game "stagnate" and damage their sales (despite how wonderful it would be to have time to get used to a change of edition or army before immediately getting hit with the newest power creep)
Agreed, bit of a kick in the teeth of Drukhari players IMO, now they will need to buy a second codex to use them, assuming that its still a soupable option for them in the first place. Also a bit startling that they would reintroduce the concept of codex supplements only to seemingly not utilize them for factions other than space marines.
Can someone tell me what Edition Harlequins were present in the Dark Eldar Codex and when they were removed because AFAIK they were in the 6th Ed Craftworlds Codex then got their own release in 7th Ed. Was it 5th or 4th? Because if not then DE having to buy multiple Codexes to use Harlequins is not a new thing and people should stop acting like it's a betrayal on GW's part.
Also, Drukhari can't be taken in the same Detachment as non-Drukhari Aeldari without them also being Ynarri (say that 10 times fast).
Harlequins were present in the 5th edition codex for Drukhari. Removed for 7th.
Gert wrote: Can someone tell me what Edition Harlequins were present in the Dark Eldar Codex and when they were removed because AFAIK they were in the 6th Ed Craftworlds Codex then got their own release in 7th Ed. Was it 5th or 4th?
Nazrak wrote: If they'e folded Harlequins back in, I'll be delighted.
I'm just confused about it.
I mean... I like fewer books and fewer teeny-tiny subfactions.
But not too long ago, Harlies were in both Craftworlds and Dark Eldar.
Then they got their own book and weren't in either (despite working with both, fluffwise and on the table)
Now they're... not in Dark Eldar, but will be in Craftworlds. That's just... gakky.
Its like they didn't plan out the edition and what they were going to do with the, for lack of better word, stray subfactions. (See the guard datasheets being removed from GSC, which is more like Dark Eldar without Harlies rather than Craftworlds with Harlies). Makes me wonder about Chaos Cultists, to be honest (since there are rumors about range expansion there).
Anyway, mid edition paradigm shift screws over an earlier release again. Nothing new, I guess. But no guard in GSC makes me wonder if DE will ever get harlies back directly.
As a DE player, it's doubly frustrating because taking Harlequins now makes us lose PfP. Meanwhile, even if Eldar count them as allies, they still get to keep Battle Focus on all their units (losing out only on the extra rule this new book is giving them).
They can and will release new edition whenever it suits them. 40k 10th will be out 2023 whether or not all have got 9e codex.
You and I are not in disagreement. I am not implying that GW will wait to update all armies before releasing 10th, I'm saying that if GW pushes out all the army updates THIS FAST, it's inevitable that 10th is coming.
If GW hypothetically updates every army in 9th, it will only be a matter of weeks before 10th drops, as there is no way GW is going to let the game "stagnate" and damage their sales (despite how wonderful it would be to have time to get used to a change of edition or army before immediately getting hit with the newest power creep)
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May I introduce you to psychic awakenings? They fill the void after the books are done, don't worry.
Rihgu wrote: Harlequins were present in the 5th edition codex for Drukhari. Removed for 7th.
Ok, so they were no longer able to be taken as units from the Dark Eldar Codex 7 years ago. So very much not a recent thing that Harlequins aren't in the newer Drukhari books and not a big deal as people are making it out to be.
Rihgu wrote: Harlequins were present in the 5th edition codex for Drukhari. Removed for 7th.
Ok, so they were no longer able to be taken as units from the Dark Eldar Codex 7 years ago. So very much not a recent thing that Harlequins aren't in the newer Drukhari books and not a big deal as people are making it out to be.
Spoiler:
They were also taken out of the Craftworld book at about the same time they were removed from the DE book though, because they were spun out into their own codex. So they were in both for roughly the same amount of time. Like, by that logic it’s been 7 years since they were in a Craftworld Eldar book either. I really don’t get your point.
I’ve just looked and Dark Eldar didn’t get a 6th edition codex. So Harlequins were removed from both books in the same edition, 7th.
They were also taken out of the Craftworld book at about the same time they were removed from the DE book though, because they were spun out into their own codex. So they were in both for roughly the same amount of time. Like, by that logic it’s been 7 years since they were in a Craftworld Eldar book either. I really don’t get your point.
Agreed, bit of a kick in the teeth of Drukhari players IMO, now they will need to buy a second codex to use them, assuming that its still a soupable option for them in the first place. Also a bit startling that they would reintroduce the concept of codex supplements only to seemingly not utilize them for factions other than space marines.
So I asked how long it had been since Harlequins had been in the DE Codex. It's my opinion that framing the inclusion of Harlequins in CWE and not in DE as some kind of gross injustice is just flat-out silly when for the past 7 years you've needed to buy 2 Codexes to use them together anyway.
At least now you have one Codex with CWE, Harlequins, and Ynarri so if you do want to run a mixed/Ynarri army you need to get just 2 Codexes instead of 3 + a White Dwarf that you might get a hold of. Honestly, if I were a betting gentlemen, I wouldn't be surprised to see all the Aeldari in the one Codex with all the rules to use them as individual armies or as mixed Ynarri forces.
I wish they had not merged Harlequins back in. When they spun them out into their own Codex, it led to the creation of the most background for Harlequins since Rogue Trader days. For the same reason, that is why I think Corsairs and Ynnari should have their own Codex, because that would allow for their fleshing out in terms of background.
Bosskelot wrote: It's pretty easy to tell when rumours/leaks are legit nowadays because the intermediaries who bring them are much better at verifying them. The Advent Calendar leaks were only released because the discord server owner had received other information from the leaker that turned out to be true beforehand. Valrak too has ways to verify who he is getting his information from. There's a leaker on the r/Eldar subreddit who is now being taken seriously because he posted about ALL of this stuff like 5 months ago, including naming the Shroud Runners. The Advent Leaks were also verified by several other youtubers who essentially said the majority of it was true, or matched up with stuff they'd seen/been able to verify.
If it's just some random dude or Faeit or obvious photoshop filters to make it look like a phone cam pic then yeah, take it with a huge grain of salt. But for the past 2-3 years we've had consistent leaks and rumours from very reliable sources and everything about the Advent leak pointed to it being completely legit.
Yeah, in hindsight it is pretty obvious that the stuff is correct.
But given the information the general public (and not some insider group of playtesters and people with connection to them) had, it wasn't obvious.
1) Sure, Valrak has at least one reliable source. But he also makes videos about fabricated gak rumours like the ones that started this thread. So he clearly doesn't use his reliable sources to confirm other rumours.
2) How do you know that some random Discord admin diligently checks his sources, except taking his word for it?
3) We only know that OK_Entrepeneur's Reddit posts are legit since the Eldritch Omen teaser confirmed it.
So there is no direct way to judge the veracity of a rumour except you have connections yourself to someone who can verify it.
Because the Discord admin posted how and why he was able to verify the leaks; namely the leaker told him a bunch of stuff about Custodes and GSC which turned out to be true. He had been sitting on the leaks for about a week beforehand and then when those Custodes details turned out to be completely accurate he went ahead and started the Advent leaks. As for Valrak, he made a rumour video about new Chaos Knights and an Autarch with a Fusion Gun like, 7 months ago, with the same source being the one who leaked Krieg vs Kommandos KT box over a year ago.
And those original Reddit leaks are actually, technically, true. They're from a Test Print version of the Codex (which is mainly how GW legal came down on the guy who posted them) which again is something that has been independently confirmed by other trustworthy people.
They were also taken out of the Craftworld book at about the same time they were removed from the DE book though, because they were spun out into their own codex. So they were in both for roughly the same amount of time. Like, by that logic it’s been 7 years since they were in a Craftworld Eldar book either. I really don’t get your point.
Agreed, bit of a kick in the teeth of Drukhari players IMO, now they will need to buy a second codex to use them, assuming that its still a soupable option for them in the first place. Also a bit startling that they would reintroduce the concept of codex supplements only to seemingly not utilize them for factions other than space marines.
So I asked how long it had been since Harlequins had been in the DE Codex. It's my opinion that framing the inclusion of Harlequins in CWE and not in DE as some kind of gross injustice is just flat-out silly when for the past 7 years you've needed to buy 2 Codexes to use them together anyway.
At least now you have one Codex with CWE, Harlequins, and Ynarri so if you do want to run a mixed/Ynarri army you need to get just 2 Codexes instead of 3 + a White Dwarf that you might get a hold of. Honestly, if I were a betting gentlemen, I wouldn't be surprised to see all the Aeldari in the one Codex with all the rules to use them as individual armies or as mixed Ynarri forces.
Probably missed the edit I made after this, but the Dark Eldar didn’t get a 6th edition codex, so the Harlequins were removed from both Eldar and Dark Eldar codexes in the same edition, 7th. So it’s weird that they’ve then added them back to just one of the books. For the past 7 years you’ve had to buy 2 books to run harlequins no matter which flavour of Eldar you play. Now you only need to if you play Dark Eldar. That’s the ‘gross injustice’.
Probably missed the edit I made after this, but the Dark Eldar didn’t get a 6th edition codex, so the Harlequins were removed from both Eldar and Dark Eldar codexes in the same edition, 7th. So it’s weird that they’ve then added them back to just one of the books. For the past 7 years you’ve had to buy 2 books to run harlequins no matter which flavour of Eldar you play. Now you only need to if you play Dark Eldar. That’s the ‘gross injustice’.
I would disagree, especially considering the rule that prevents mixed non-Ynarri detachments in the Drukhari Codex where it specifically notes that the Drukhari don't play well with any of their kind, Craftworld or Harlequin. Why would the subsect of Aeldari that consider all outsiders to be lesser work with them in such a way that mixed forces wouldn't be a concern? It's a balancing mechanic (probably) that fits properly with the background of the Drukhari and (IMO) emphasises the importance of the Ynarri.
But you do you, I just think some of the reactions are a bit OTT.
Nazrak wrote: If they'e folded Harlequins back in, I'll be delighted.
I'm just confused about it.
I mean... I like fewer books and fewer teeny-tiny subfactions.
But not too long ago, Harlies were in both Craftworlds and Dark Eldar.
Then they got their own book and weren't in either (despite working with both, fluffwise and on the table)
Now they're... not in Dark Eldar, but will be in Craftworlds. That's just... gakky.
Its like they didn't plan out the edition and what they were going to do with the, for lack of better word, stray subfactions. (See the guard datasheets being removed from GSC, which is more like Dark Eldar without Harlies rather than Craftworlds with Harlies). Makes me wonder about Chaos Cultists, to be honest (since there are rumors about range expansion there).
Anyway, mid edition paradigm shift screws over an earlier release again. Nothing new, I guess. But no guard in GSC makes me wonder if DE will ever get harlies back directly.
Seems to me that GW is being rather consistent with a paradigm shift that just wasn't noticed. They are avoiding duplicating datasheets in different codexes because they don't want to have contradictory datasheets for the same unit. Look at what they have done:
Codex Space Marine & Supplements: All the shared units are in the Codex with only unique units in the Supplements instead of having multiple codexes all with the same Intercessor datasheet in them.
Codex Death Guard: All the non-vehicle units shared with normal CSM are now Death Guard Unit rather than just Unit.
Codex Genestealer Cults: All the Astra Militarum units are out in favor of rules allowing you to field an Brood Brother AM detachment, unifying the rules for the GCS versions with those for the AM version.
Now in typical GW fashion, they managed to half-ass the process by not doing Chaos Vehicles or most units in Codex Thousand Sons in a consistent manner, but GW has got to GW
Irbis wrote: So, let's see. Eldari have super advanced holofields backed by psychic powers that allow them to dodge any incoming fire. Or are a literal god disintegrating anything that dares to touch them. Unless it's a chunk of iron thrown in a straight line, then none of this works. Broken gak, meet even more broken gak
Heavy wraithcannon, titan scale gun that literally sends half of the target into the warp, somehow deals less damage than a first sized piece of scrap. Oh, and less AP to boot (and no ignoring ++) because FRAK YOU, having a cybernetic finger or first aid kit now means you're warp- (but not thrown stone-) proof. Anyone willing to tell me how this idiocy makes any sense whatsoever?
Meanwhile, heavy AT guns of SM and Necron vehicles cry in corner because neither book managed to catch the wave of broken cheese change of design direction. Especially Necron doom X guns that used to be better than both of the above. Bravo
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
Sisters players must be feeling great here "we took your mechanic, fixed it, made it better and gave it to eldar. Sucks to be you"
Irbis wrote: So, let's see. Eldari have super advanced holofields backed by psychic powers that allow them to dodge any incoming fire. Or are a literal god disintegrating anything that dares to touch them. Unless it's a chunk of iron thrown in a straight line, then none of this works. Broken gak, meet even more broken gak
Heavy wraithcannon, titan scale gun that literally sends half of the target into the warp, somehow deals less damage than a first sized piece of scrap. Oh, and less AP to boot (and no ignoring ++) because FRAK YOU, having a cybernetic finger or first aid kit now means you're warp- (but not thrown stone-) proof. Anyone willing to tell me how this idiocy makes any sense whatsoever?
Meanwhile, heavy AT guns of SM and Necron vehicles cry in corner because neither book managed to catch the wave of broken cheese change of design direction. Especially Necron doom X guns that used to be better than both of the above. Bravo
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
Sisters players must be feeling great here "we took your mechanic, fixed it, made it better and gave it to eldar. Sucks to be you"
I'm not seeing it. They might get multiple dice a turn and guaranteed 6's, but they are highly restricted on when they can use them. A guaranteed 6 on a Wound Roll isn't great if the weapon you want to use it on misses. That's one of the things I love about Faith and Fury (yes, my meltagun rolled a 4 to hit and to wound your tank. Say good night.).
Irbis wrote: So, let's see. Eldari have super advanced holofields backed by psychic powers that allow them to dodge any incoming fire. Or are a literal god disintegrating anything that dares to touch them. Unless it's a chunk of iron thrown in a straight line, then none of this works. Broken gak, meet even more broken gak
Heavy wraithcannon, titan scale gun that literally sends half of the target into the warp, somehow deals less damage than a first sized piece of scrap. Oh, and less AP to boot (and no ignoring ++) because FRAK YOU, having a cybernetic finger or first aid kit now means you're warp- (but not thrown stone-) proof. Anyone willing to tell me how this idiocy makes any sense whatsoever?
Meanwhile, heavy AT guns of SM and Necron vehicles cry in corner because neither book managed to catch the wave of broken cheese change of design direction. Especially Necron doom X guns that used to be better than both of the above. Bravo
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
Sisters players must be feeling great here "we took your mechanic, fixed it, made it better and gave it to eldar. Sucks to be you"
I'm not seeing it. They might get multiple dice a turn and guaranteed 6's, but they are highly restricted on when they can use them. A guaranteed 6 on a Wound Roll isn't great if the weapon you want to use it on misses. That's one of the things I love about Faith and Fury (yes, my meltagun rolled a 4 to hit and to wound your tank. Say good night.).
Agreed. Plus, I don't have to worry about crazy mental gymnastics just to figure out the rule. I roll a dice, I add it to pool, I use it where I want. Straightforward and yet effective.
Irbis wrote: So, let's see. Eldari have super advanced holofields backed by psychic powers that allow them to dodge any incoming fire. Or are a literal god disintegrating anything that dares to touch them. Unless it's a chunk of iron thrown in a straight line, then none of this works. Broken gak, meet even more broken gak
Heavy wraithcannon, titan scale gun that literally sends half of the target into the warp, somehow deals less damage than a first sized piece of scrap. Oh, and less AP to boot (and no ignoring ++) because FRAK YOU, having a cybernetic finger or first aid kit now means you're warp- (but not thrown stone-) proof. Anyone willing to tell me how this idiocy makes any sense whatsoever?
Meanwhile, heavy AT guns of SM and Necron vehicles cry in corner because neither book managed to catch the wave of broken cheese change of design direction. Especially Necron doom X guns that used to be better than both of the above. Bravo
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
Sisters players must be feeling great here "we took your mechanic, fixed it, made it better and gave it to eldar. Sucks to be you"
I'm not seeing it. They might get multiple dice a turn and guaranteed 6's, but they are highly restricted on when they can use them. A guaranteed 6 on a Wound Roll isn't great if the weapon you want to use it on misses. That's one of the things I love about Faith and Fury (yes, my meltagun rolled a 4 to hit and to wound your tank. Say good night.).
SoB get freedom of choice on what rolls, though of varying effect. Eldar mechanic gives them guaranteed 6's but random choice of rolls they can apply the 6's to.
I actually think from a background perspective, it is backwards. If the SoB miracles are meant to be Emperor sent miracles, then should they not be overpowering (6's) but without player choice? Whereas the Eldar Farseers are trying to consciously manipulate fate, so should they not instead get freedom of choice of rolls (i.e. what they choose to manipulate) but be of varying success in their manipulations?
Irbis wrote: So, let's see. Eldari have super advanced holofields backed by psychic powers that allow them to dodge any incoming fire. Or are a literal god disintegrating anything that dares to touch them. Unless it's a chunk of iron thrown in a straight line, then none of this works. Broken gak, meet even more broken gak
Heavy wraithcannon, titan scale gun that literally sends half of the target into the warp, somehow deals less damage than a first sized piece of scrap. Oh, and less AP to boot (and no ignoring ++) because FRAK YOU, having a cybernetic finger or first aid kit now means you're warp- (but not thrown stone-) proof. Anyone willing to tell me how this idiocy makes any sense whatsoever?
Meanwhile, heavy AT guns of SM and Necron vehicles cry in corner because neither book managed to catch the wave of broken cheese change of design direction. Especially Necron doom X guns that used to be better than both of the above. Bravo
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
Sisters players must be feeling great here "we took your mechanic, fixed it, made it better and gave it to eldar. Sucks to be you"
I'm not seeing it. They might get multiple dice a turn and guaranteed 6's, but they are highly restricted on when they can use them. A guaranteed 6 on a Wound Roll isn't great if the weapon you want to use it on misses. That's one of the things I love about Faith and Fury (yes, my meltagun rolled a 4 to hit and to wound your tank. Say good night.).
We will have to see actual games played with this new mechanic to have an idea on how powerful it is. But I feel that it is more powerful than miracle dice. Maybe you can't rely on it 100% of the time, but it is no less reliable than Sister's miracle dice. Because you could also roll low 1 to 3 for all your miracle dice as well. Strike force 2000 points gives you 4 dice each round. That's pretty good odds of getting the phase you want to use those 6s in. That's 20 sixes through 5 rounds. That... sounds pretty OP to me.
6s on a save is a successful save if your unit has an invul. 6s on a charge (as we have seen in sisters) is really good when you need that unit to make its charge. I think 6s to hit are probably the least useful. 6s to wound is good too. and 6s on a psychic almost gaurantees any psychic will definitely go off.
The thing is, in a typical game, maybe I see a sisters army get three to four 5/6 on their miracle dice, and those are used in key moments by the player, and it already feels so good. Eldar getting 20 sixes in the course of a game sounds absolutely bonkers.
Irbis wrote: So, let's see. Eldari have super advanced holofields backed by psychic powers that allow them to dodge any incoming fire. Or are a literal god disintegrating anything that dares to touch them. Unless it's a chunk of iron thrown in a straight line, then none of this works. Broken gak, meet even more broken gak
Heavy wraithcannon, titan scale gun that literally sends half of the target into the warp, somehow deals less damage than a first sized piece of scrap. Oh, and less AP to boot (and no ignoring ++) because FRAK YOU, having a cybernetic finger or first aid kit now means you're warp- (but not thrown stone-) proof. Anyone willing to tell me how this idiocy makes any sense whatsoever?
Meanwhile, heavy AT guns of SM and Necron vehicles cry in corner because neither book managed to catch the wave of broken cheese change of design direction. Especially Necron doom X guns that used to be better than both of the above. Bravo
H.B.M.C. wrote: Sisters: When you get a Miracle Dice, roll a D6 and keep it to one side. Then, when you wish to use them, simply substitute a dice with the miracle dice result.
Eldar: At the start of each battle round, roll six D6! Then, you get to keep some, depending on the size of the battle! (...)
I like how the badly scaling mechanic of miracle dice was #1 complaint of Sister players for years, then, as soon as GW fixes it and introduces similar mechanic that attempts to take it into account, they get bashed for it being somehow 'too complicated'. It would be funny if it wasn't so sad...
Sisters players must be feeling great here "we took your mechanic, fixed it, made it better and gave it to eldar. Sucks to be you"
I'm not seeing it. They might get multiple dice a turn and guaranteed 6's, but they are highly restricted on when they can use them. A guaranteed 6 on a Wound Roll isn't great if the weapon you want to use it on misses. That's one of the things I love about Faith and Fury (yes, my meltagun rolled a 4 to hit and to wound your tank. Say good night.).
We will have to see actual games played with this new mechanic to have an idea on how powerful it is. But I feel that it is more powerful than miracle dice. Maybe you can't rely on it 100% of the time, but it is no less reliable than Sister's miracle dice. Because you could also roll low 1 to 3 for all your miracle dice as well. Strike force 2000 points gives you 4 dice each round. That's pretty good odds of getting the phase you want to use those 6s in. That's 20 sixes through 5 rounds. That... sounds pretty OP to me.
6s on a save is a successful save if your unit has an invul. 6s on a charge (as we have seen in sisters) is really good when you need that unit to make its charge. I think 6s to hit are probably the least useful. 6s to wound is good too. and 6s on a psychic almost gaurantees any psychic will definitely go off.
The thing is, in a typical game, maybe I see a sisters army get three to four 5/6 on their miracle dice, and those are used in key moments by the player, and it already feels so good. Eldar getting 20 sixes in the course of a game sounds absolutely bonkers.
I mean the playtesters are all going "Eldar are fething nuts guys. Like, burn all your armies now and buy out the craftworlds line, nothing else matters for however long it takes to nerf them"
I might be a bit hyperbolic there, but the rumors are churning that this book is going to be excessive and oppressive. So, just returning eldar back to the way the GW writers are comfortable with.
I mean the playtesters are all going "Eldar are fething nuts guys. Like, burn all your armies now and buy out the craftworlds line, nothing else matters for however long it takes to nerf them"
I might be a bit hyperbolic there, but the rumors are churning that this book is going to be excessive and oppressive. So, just returning eldar back to the way the GW writers are comfortable with.
I started playing Eldar in 4th/5th and didn't ever feel they were that great. Fun, but not OP.
Then 7th happened and MAN that was some interesting times.
I was glad 8th toned them down, but I still think they over nerfed the WK and Bikes.
I'll enjoy the Eldar supremacy for the hot minute it lasts, but with Chapter Approved coming every 6 months now, I guarantee it won't last long.
Heck, it's possible GW already has points increases drafted and ready to go. Once the initial band-wagoners buy thier lot and sales dip, BOOM, points increases across the Codex
The opposite, they were on the money. It's worth noting the owner of the images calls the book out as "in the realm of Drukhari at release" so expect some teeth gnashing. Especially since a lot of the people telling us the rumour smust be fake because they were too good will be upset!
If GW frigs this up we'll probably wind up with a general riot in the competitive scene. I
I mean the playtesters are all going "Eldar are fething nuts guys. Like, burn all your armies now and buy out the craftworlds line, nothing else matters for however long it takes to nerf them"
I might be a bit hyperbolic there, but the rumors are churning that this book is going to be excessive and oppressive. So, just returning eldar back to the way the GW writers are comfortable with.
So basically pre drukhari release or even more concerned?
Bosskelot wrote: Because the Discord admin posted how and why he was able to verify the leaks; namely the leaker told him a bunch of stuff about Custodes and GSC which turned out to be true. He had been sitting on the leaks for about a week beforehand and then when those Custodes details turned out to be completely accurate he went ahead and started the Advent leaks.
This is incorrect. I made a post about the exact timeline in this post: https://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/90/802147.page#11265638.(Please ignore my misguided overly cocky intro.)
It goes like this: Admin is excited about vyper-diorama/mini-avatar reddit fakes, so clearly isn't convinced that they are fake -> gets message with 4 pages of leaks and the custodes stuff -> decides to make a advent calendar out of it and posts his intention on the Discord -> Custodes stuff gets verified -> posts his first advent entry.
The decision to post the stuff was clearly made before he could verify it.
As for Valrak, he made a rumour video about new Chaos Knights and an Autarch with a Fusion Gun like, 7 months ago, with the same source being the one who leaked Krieg vs Kommandos KT box over a year ago. And those original Reddit leaks are actually, technically, true. They're from a Test Print version of the Codex (which is mainly how GW legal came down on the guy who posted them) which again is something that has been independently confirmed by other trustworthy people.
He made a video about the latest reddit rumours with the vyper diorama, embers of khaine, morai-heg avatar, etc. These are completely contradictory with the official GW previews, so fake. Valrak made a video about them nonetheless.
So no, these people do not verify their information. They had the luck that some of their sources were actually sincere. If someone fed them fake news, they would spread the misinformation as surely as Faeit or SpikyBits.
The point I agree with you is, that there are more people in the community than ever before that can verify such rumours. And some of them do so publicly, like the podcast you mentioned or Pete from HonestWargamer on the 40k Adjacent Show. This is something I will keep in mind.
I mean the playtesters are all going "Eldar are fething nuts guys. Like, burn all your armies now and buy out the craftworlds line, nothing else matters for however long it takes to nerf them"
I might be a bit hyperbolic there, but the rumors are churning that this book is going to be excessive and oppressive. So, just returning eldar back to the way the GW writers are comfortable with.
I started playing Eldar in 4th/5th and didn't ever feel they were that great. Fun, but not OP.
Then 7th happened and MAN that was some interesting times.
I was glad 8th toned them down, but I still think they over nerfed the WK and Bikes.
I'll enjoy the Eldar supremacy for the hot minute it lasts, but with Chapter Approved coming every 6 months now, I guarantee it won't last long.
Heck, it's possible GW already has points increases drafted and ready to go. Once the initial band-wagoners buy thier lot and sales dip, BOOM, points increases across the Codex
Similar for me, I started with Eldar in 3rd and 7th was by far the worst. Problem is myself and a lot of Eldar like players like to play the models that aren't broken, mainly the infantry like Aspects or Phoenix Lords, and those haven't been that great in a longtime. There's been some broken Eldar stuff every edition (7th Scatbikes and WK, 8th Flyers) but I would love to have a codex where most of the units are viable instead of just a few broken units or overly relying psychic combos.
Likewise I won't be surprised if they nerf the points after the initial sales rush. The WK was intentionally under costed on release to move models then got nerfed into the ground in 8th. With CA so frequent I doubt Eldar supremacy will last long. We'll see what happens.
warpedpig wrote: Bout time. Eldar deserve a turn to spank space marines hard. And you know they’re not changing the rules until the sales of Craftworld slow down.
If you have played this game for more then 2 years, you saying about time is hilaaaaaarious considering Eldar are the overpowered faction most of the time.
You strike me as someone who netlists top table lists to stomp 12 year olds in the local club.
I mean the playtesters are all going "Eldar are fething nuts guys. Like, burn all your armies now and buy out the craftworlds line, nothing else matters for however long it takes to nerf them"
I might be a bit hyperbolic there, but the rumors are churning that this book is going to be excessive and oppressive. So, just returning eldar back to the way the GW writers are comfortable with.
I started playing Eldar in 4th/5th and didn't ever feel they were that great. Fun, but not OP.
Then 7th happened and MAN that was some interesting times.
I was glad 8th toned them down, but I still think they over nerfed the WK and Bikes.
I'll enjoy the Eldar supremacy for the hot minute it lasts, but with Chapter Approved coming every 6 months now, I guarantee it won't last long.
Heck, it's possible GW already has points increases drafted and ready to go. Once the initial band-wagoners buy thier lot and sales dip, BOOM, points increases across the Codex
-
Eldar were the best army in 4th for a chunk of it. And 5th. And 8th. And, of course, 7th. And 3rd for that matter.
Like, vector engine nonsense was THE top level gak in 4th.
I mean the playtesters are all going "Eldar are fething nuts guys. Like, burn all your armies now and buy out the craftworlds line, nothing else matters for however long it takes to nerf them"
I might be a bit hyperbolic there, but the rumors are churning that this book is going to be excessive and oppressive. So, just returning eldar back to the way the GW writers are comfortable with.
I started playing Eldar in 4th/5th and didn't ever feel they were that great. Fun, but not OP.
Then 7th happened and MAN that was some interesting times.
I was glad 8th toned them down, but I still think they over nerfed the WK and Bikes.
I'll enjoy the Eldar supremacy for the hot minute it lasts, but with Chapter Approved coming every 6 months now, I guarantee it won't last long.
Heck, it's possible GW already has points increases drafted and ready to go. Once the initial band-wagoners buy thier lot and sales dip, BOOM, points increases across the Codex
Similar for me, I started with Eldar in 3rd and 7th was by far the worst. Problem is myself and a lot of Eldar like players like to play the models that aren't broken, mainly the infantry like Aspects or Phoenix Lords, and those haven't been that great in a longtime. There's been some broken Eldar stuff every edition (7th Scatbikes and WK, 8th Flyers) but I would love to have a codex where most of the units are viable instead of just a few broken units or overly relying psychic combos.
Likewise I won't be surprised if they nerf the points after the initial sales rush. The WK was intentionally under costed on release to move models then got nerfed into the ground in 8th. With CA so frequent I doubt Eldar supremacy will last long. We'll see what happens.
Like, yea, 7th is the WORST, but Eldar have been meta defining or ruining for more of this game's history then they haven't been.
What other company would people just accept releasing a product that is broken (and I suppose there is still the chance it will be just fine), and moreover that the customers assume will only be fixed once sales have run their course?
That is a bait and switch. Plain and simple. And apparently it is just ok? So strange.
What other company would people just accept releasing a product that is broken (and I suppose there is still the chance it will be just fine), and moreover that the customers assume will only be fixed once sales have run their course?
That is a bait and switch. Plain and simple. And apparently it is just ok? So strange.
If customers acknowledge it will be too good and subsequently toned down its not a bait because people are knowingly involved. Nobody says it is OK, simply that its how these things go. Likewise it's a real situation of not knowing whether incompetence or malice is the cause.
What other company would people just accept releasing a product that is broken (and I suppose there is still the chance it will be just fine), and moreover that the customers assume will only be fixed once sales have run their course?
That is a bait and switch. Plain and simple. And apparently it is just ok? So strange.
If customers acknowledge it will be too good and subsequently toned down its not a bait because people are knowingly involved. Nobody says it is OK, simply that its how these things go. Likewise it's a real situation of not knowing whether incompetence or malice is the cause.
"Simply that its how these things go." That is exactly the problem. It isn't some uncontrollable mystical process. The company is making choices, and remarkably, those choices are just accepted as "how these things go".
40K players always wanted "optimal builds" to exist, because "solving" list building is huge part of the total time spent on 40K. And "optimal builds" cannot, by definition, exist in a balanced system. This is also the drive behind jumping on a "new shiny" OP codex - people want to be the first, who come up with a top tier builds/combos, and each new codex is a new challenge.
The discussion about Eldar being OP throughout editions is pretty much a proof of that optics. Even in 7th ed it was entirely possible to build a thrash tier Eldar army, because not everything in the codex was Pale Courts WK+Scatbike+Warp Spiders+Farseer&superfriends combo. And many casual players remember editions by how their carefully painted and beloved models fared on the tabletop, not by what broken combo dominated top tournament tables.
tneva82 wrote: And players as a rule of thumb don't want balannce. Just ther faction be the op
I don’t think that’s particularly fair or probably accurate in any way.
Yeah. SOME players just want to be able to smash noobs and crush everything.
Most players want to have a good time and a reasonably fair match. They might prefer OP to UP, but well-balanced is the ideal.
Couldn't agree more !
I just don't want to be stomped before we can both have fun. And if it means I won't ever stomp anyone, it's a sacrifice I am more then willing to make !
Regarding the "Buhu, we poor Drukhari players have to buy another codex to use Harlequins and get the Craftworld stuff for free instead of having to buy another codex and get nothing extra like in the past" whining:
From the Discord server, answered by OK_Entrepeneur.
Man… when people talk about how the game is so unbalanced and a big part of it is about list building, it makes me want to quit again. I hate the fact that that’s 40K.
Such a broken, uninteresting thing to build a game around.
I want the game to be about the actual gameplay, not about winning in the pre-game.
I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
Automatically Appended Next Post: In all seriousness, noone who follows the wargaming scene, and certainly not people who read dakka can be unaware of the long standing boom bust cycle of faction power levels and power creep in 40k. If the list building game turns you off or you aren’t enjoying the swingy nature of the meta, then the logical response is to try other stuff. I feel like GWs model of perceived exclusivity really exists to build up players perception of armies as a sunk cost from which moving on would be too costly, too difficult, too emotional, take your pick. Just try using your models in some other games or paint up a different project, and see how you like it. Come back to 40k when it seems like it may have come to its senses.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
If this was for me, I totally agree. I play Infinity, Legion, Bolt Action and ASOIAF. But I also love the 40K setting and would love to play in the universe with a fun set of rules with the really cool figures.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
90% don’t see playing in my area. Everyone scoffed at Legion and even MESBG’s relaunch, which is objectively GW’s best game.
Probably didn’t help that our only store was trying to sell some of the Legion character packs at $35 each when they retailed for $13 and were easy to find for that price online. They’re dirty like that
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
90% don’t see playing in my area. Everyone scoffed at Legion and even MESBG’s relaunch, which is objectively GW’s best game.
Probably didn’t help that our only store was trying to sell some of the Legion character packs at $35 each when they retailed for $13 and were easy to find for that price online. They’re dirty like that
It’s a real shame they didn’t want to get into Legion. Honestly one of the best systems I’ve ever played. I kinda wish it wasn’t Star Wars tho lol.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
Automatically Appended Next Post: In all seriousness, noone who follows the wargaming scene, and certainly not people who read dakka can be unaware of the long standing boom bust cycle of faction power levels and power creep in 40k. If the list building game turns you off or you aren’t enjoying the swingy nature of the meta, then the logical response is to try other stuff. I feel like GWs model of perceived exclusivity really exists to build up players perception of armies as a sunk cost from which moving on would be too costly, too difficult, too emotional, take your pick. Just try using your models in some other games or paint up a different project, and see how you like it. Come back to 40k when it seems like it may have come to its senses.
What if I told you...
...there are three ways to play Warhammer, and not everything has to be a competitive matched play game? Crusade is pretty darn fun, people, and you can absolutely use whatever you want.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
90% don’t see playing in my area. Everyone scoffed at Legion and even MESBG’s relaunch, which is objectively GW’s best game.
Probably didn’t help that our only store was trying to sell some of the Legion character packs at $35 each when they retailed for $13 and were easy to find for that price online. They’re dirty like that
It’s a real shame they didn’t want to get into Legion. Honestly one of the best systems I’ve ever played. I kinda wish it wasn’t Star Wars tho lol.
Way way off topic but, I was recently thinking where Legion went wrong was trying to have the game centered on the inherently binary faction pair offs from Star Wars. They need a version that caters to a crime lord + retinue and toys vs similar. Lean into what we are getting from the Book of Boba Fett.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
Automatically Appended Next Post: In all seriousness, noone who follows the wargaming scene, and certainly not people who read dakka can be unaware of the long standing boom bust cycle of faction power levels and power creep in 40k. If the list building game turns you off or you aren’t enjoying the swingy nature of the meta, then the logical response is to try other stuff. I feel like GWs model of perceived exclusivity really exists to build up players perception of armies as a sunk cost from which moving on would be too costly, too difficult, too emotional, take your pick. Just try using your models in some other games or paint up a different project, and see how you like it. Come back to 40k when it seems like it may have come to its senses.
What if I told you...
...there are three ways to play Warhammer, and not everything has to be a competitive matched play game? Crusade is pretty darn fun, people, and you can absolutely use whatever you want.
While I agree that doesnt work for pick ups. The generally accepted rules are what is generally played. Arranging to play with a custom set of rules that both parties agree upon takes time and only really works if you have a close knit group.
Arguably if there ewren't 3 DIFFERENT ways to play but one thats modular that would be much easier to tailor a game to the bits we dont like.#
Having said that my local group is of the same opinion, we love the 40k setting, lore, characters etc, we just dont think the direction GW is taking the game is A) a good one, even from a tournament perspective and B) Supportive of the game actually staying dynamic. More elements should happen IN the game instead of deciding the majority of the tactics before you even start.
Some people just want to play games in the setting they love with the models they love and the army they have built a story round. The games easy to balance if no one is a dick.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, whining about how broken the codex is when it isn’t even released is a bit premature.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
Automatically Appended Next Post: In all seriousness, noone who follows the wargaming scene, and certainly not people who read dakka can be unaware of the long standing boom bust cycle of faction power levels and power creep in 40k. If the list building game turns you off or you aren’t enjoying the swingy nature of the meta, then the logical response is to try other stuff. I feel like GWs model of perceived exclusivity really exists to build up players perception of armies as a sunk cost from which moving on would be too costly, too difficult, too emotional, take your pick. Just try using your models in some other games or paint up a different project, and see how you like it. Come back to 40k when it seems like it may have come to its senses.
What if I told you...
...there are three ways to play Warhammer, and not everything has to be a competitive matched play game? Crusade is pretty darn fun, people, and you can absolutely use whatever you want.
While I agree that doesnt work for pick ups. The generally accepted rules are what is generally played. Arranging to play with a custom set of rules that both parties agree upon takes time and only really works if you have a close knit group.
It's supposed to. Crusade is intended to be a permanent, on-going system. You and I may never have met, but there should be ZERO stopping us from using existing Crusade forces to play a pickup Crusade game. Hell, Age of Sigmar actually does it better because you can work on your Path to Glory even in a Matched Play setting.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
90% don’t see playing in my area. Everyone scoffed at Legion and even MESBG’s relaunch, which is objectively GW’s best game.
Probably didn’t help that our only store was trying to sell some of the Legion character packs at $35 each when they retailed for $13 and were easy to find for that price online. They’re dirty like that
It’s a real shame they didn’t want to get into Legion. Honestly one of the best systems I’ve ever played. I kinda wish it wasn’t Star Wars tho lol.
Way way off topic but, I was recently thinking where Legion went wrong was trying to have the game centered on the inherently binary faction pair offs from Star Wars. They need a version that caters to a crime lord + retinue and toys vs similar. Lean into what we are getting from the Book of Boba Fett.
To some degree you’re in luck haha. Scum and Villainy is the next faction to be released. It’s not the focus of the game, but still xD
Tiberius501 wrote: Man… when people talk about how the game is so unbalanced and a big part of it is about list building, it makes me want to quit again. I hate the fact that that’s 40K.
Such a broken, uninteresting thing to build a game around.
I want the game to be about the actual gameplay, not about winning in the pre-game.
It largely isn't. Caveats - terrain needs to be competent and a couple armies are a bit ahead of the curve.
However, there has NEVER been a time where I didn't feel like I was having an impossible game against Drukhari. The actual problem is that if I make mistakes - it hurts. If they make mistakes it's no big deal. And that's why they win more games.
GW DOES do a poor job at being consistent. And I can see them screwing this up. I bet we're seeing leaks, because the playtesters feel like this is a big issue.
That said, people are spazzing out a little too much right now. I am exhausted with the break-fix cycle as much as anyone, but it's absurd for others ( not you ) to assert that this is a sales strategy. We KNOW GW will address issues quarterly. We KNOW people already love the Eldar models and will buy them regardless. The rules have jack gak to do with how much people are excited for new releases for hugely neglected models.
Tiberius501 wrote: Man… when people talk about how the game is so unbalanced and a big part of it is about list building, it makes me want to quit again. I hate the fact that that’s 40K.
Such a broken, uninteresting thing to build a game around.
I want the game to be about the actual gameplay, not about winning in the pre-game.
It largely isn't. Caveats - terrain needs to be competent and a couple armies are a bit ahead of the curve.
However, there has NEVER been a time where I didn't feel like I was having an impossible game against Drukhari. The actual problem is that if I make mistakes - it hurts. If they make mistakes it's no big deal. And that's why they win more games.
GW DOES do a poor job at being consistent. And I can see them screwing this up. I bet we're seeing leaks, because the playtesters feel like this is a big issue.
That said, people are spazzing out a little too much right now. I am exhausted with the break-fix cycle as much as anyone, but it's absurd for others ( not you ) to assert that this is a sales strategy. We KNOW GW will address issues quarterly. We KNOW people already love the Eldar models and will buy them regardless. The rules have jack gak to do with how much people are excited for new releases for hugely neglected models.
A good thing to realise in this context is that for people who don't hang out in LFGS all the time, quaterly means just after a couple of games played with their new toys - you have to assemble and paint new models and if you are not a tournament focused guy you often don't race with painting your stuff. There is a parallel thread "how to start a new army" and there are some people who plan their armies as a 2-3 years long endeavour. Main Dakka threads have always been dominated by meta-chasers while in reality many if not the most players do not have time/money/interest in the tournament meta and the game is and always has been about an occasional game with their carefully collected and painted army.
Dominated by 'meta-chasers'... or people just talking about releases (and thus by extension the 'meta')?
Some have strong opinions (both positive and negative), but I really doubt that most people here (from the way they talk) are the rabid WAAC players that get villainized so much.
nou wrote: 40K players always wanted "optimal builds" to exist, because "solving" list building is huge part of the total time spent on 40K. And "optimal builds" cannot, by definition, exist in a balanced system. This is also the drive behind jumping on a "new shiny" OP codex - people want to be the first, who come up with a top tier builds/combos, and each new codex is a new challenge.
The discussion about Eldar being OP throughout editions is pretty much a proof of that optics. Even in 7th ed it was entirely possible to build a thrash tier Eldar army, because not everything in the codex was Pale Courts WK+Scatbike+Warp Spiders+Farseer&superfriends combo. And many casual players remember editions by how their carefully painted and beloved models fared on the tabletop, not by what broken combo dominated top tournament tables.
The issue is that casual players play other casual players, so the overall tone of the codexes still matter. Sometimes there are codexes that have just a couple of excessive options and everything else is weak, in which case casual players suffer. But usually the best tournament codexes also make the easiest to build strong casual lists too, meaning casual vs casual, the better codex still wins pretty hard.
Like, right now, for Drukhari, you have to take tournament level listbuilding skills to make a bad list.
nou wrote: 40K players always wanted "optimal builds" to exist, because "solving" list building is huge part of the total time spent on 40K. And "optimal builds" cannot, by definition, exist in a balanced system. This is also the drive behind jumping on a "new shiny" OP codex - people want to be the first, who come up with a top tier builds/combos, and each new codex is a new challenge.
The discussion about Eldar being OP throughout editions is pretty much a proof of that optics. Even in 7th ed it was entirely possible to build a thrash tier Eldar army, because not everything in the codex was Pale Courts WK+Scatbike+Warp Spiders+Farseer&superfriends combo. And many casual players remember editions by how their carefully painted and beloved models fared on the tabletop, not by what broken combo dominated top tournament tables.
The issue is that casual players play other casual players, so the overall tone of the codexes still matter. Sometimes there are codexes that have just a couple of excessive options and everything else is weak, in which case casual players suffer. But usually the best tournament codexes also make the easiest to build strong casual lists too, meaning casual vs casual, the better codex still wins pretty hard.
Like, right now, for Drukhari, you have to take tournament level listbuilding skills to make a bad list.
The example of 7th ed Eldar codex stays in direct contradiction to what you just wrote - they were meta busting in many different ways but still required a skill (or a netlist) to not build a trash tier lists, especially including Pale Courts - the most fluffy and interesting, and at the same time the most abusable part of the 7th ed Eldar, which gave birth to Warp Spider spam. The simple restraint from scatbikes solved like 50% of the power disparities problem but in the dakka discussions that never changed the myth of the grossly overpowered codex. In my experience casual and tournament are so heavily disconnected worlds, that any argument that healthy tournament meta automatically means a better play experience for the casual player has no ground in the real world. Unless we talk solely about pick-up culture, where it's probably true, but outside of US it is not as fundamental part of 40k experience as many folks believe. In every period I stayed active a close group of no more than 5 players formed, that was perfectly capable of honoring "not being a dick" rule and cross tailoring lists for mutual fun. Some of the best and closest games I had during 7th was Eldar vs Tyranids, a matchup deemed impossible to have fun with by many posters on Dakka.
There is some gross misconception perpetuating on dakka for years now - that somehow casuals are less knowledgeable about the game they play than meta focussed players. They are not, they simply use that knowledge towards a different goal.
Rivetbull wrote: I know this could be seen as trolling, but I feel genuinely like a couple of you need to see this.
Automatically Appended Next Post: In all seriousness, noone who follows the wargaming scene, and certainly not people who read dakka can be unaware of the long standing boom bust cycle of faction power levels and power creep in 40k. If the list building game turns you off or you aren’t enjoying the swingy nature of the meta, then the logical response is to try other stuff. I feel like GWs model of perceived exclusivity really exists to build up players perception of armies as a sunk cost from which moving on would be too costly, too difficult, too emotional, take your pick. Just try using your models in some other games or paint up a different project, and see how you like it. Come back to 40k when it seems like it may have come to its senses.
What if I told you...
...there are three ways to play Warhammer, and not everything has to be a competitive matched play game? Crusade is pretty darn fun, people, and you can absolutely use whatever you want.
While I agree that doesnt work for pick ups. The generally accepted rules are what is generally played. Arranging to play with a custom set of rules that both parties agree upon takes time and only really works if you have a close knit group.
It's supposed to. Crusade is intended to be a permanent, on-going system. You and I may never have met, but there should be ZERO stopping us from using existing Crusade forces to play a pickup Crusade game. Hell, Age of Sigmar actually does it better because you can work on your Path to Glory even in a Matched Play setting.
Some new info snippets from the Discord. The poster verified the post with a partly image from Maugan Ra:
So. For new models. We have : Maug. Corsairs. Warlock. Shining Spears. Dark reapers.
Night spinner AP-2 dmg 2
D canon d6+2 not d3+3 I was wrong last time
Shuriken canon for harlies now S6 ap1 dmg 2 But 3 shot
Now can't reroll hit rolls against Starweavers and skyweavers
Are relics any good? A lot
Shining Spears pictures? I do. Models are good. Unit is not. Can't show.
Do they lose the 4++? Nope
Also, no more double move and charge. Both in harlies and craftworlds.
And no more -1 to invuls.
So jinx doesn’t work on invuls anymore? Nope
think jinx is now removes invulns - No. -1 to armor save.
Thats’s sad - Don't worry. You have a gak ton of ignore invul and mobility. This codex is busted.
Are corsairs troop and elite? And do they look cool
Very cool. But they are not good.
Yeah, I'm curious about what information is being delivered in the comment section of a GW instagram post. No rumours indicate Dark Mechanicum right now. If Chaos is in the KT box, based on what we've seen, you'd expect Cultists/Renegade Guard/Possessed/one of the other gribbly mortal units coming with the CSM release.
Starfarer wrote: Looks like Corsairs vs. Dark Mechanicum in the new Kill Team set according to the GW Instagram comments...
This is going to be amazing if so.
The art in question is from the KT Core Book on page 20. It's accompanying a fluff blurb about a warzone.
When tech-hungry magi of the Adeptus Mechanicus seized a number of webway portals and ancient shrines on the Aeldari maiden world of Vyaneth, they swiftly built-up enormous fortifications and bastions to hold their takings, churning the pristine ground, pulling down glorious forests and pumping heavy pollution into the atmosphere. Knowing a full-scale assault would be ruinously costly, as well as highly likely to fail, the Asuryani of Alaitoc Craftworld formed a number of kill teams, drawing together Aspect Warriors and Rangers. With precise long rifle fire, the Rangers picked off Skitarii sentries and drew defenders out, giving room for Dire Avengers to rapidly storm the weakened Imperial defences. After weeks of this kind of fighting, Alaitoc deployed a vast host alongside a number of Revenant Titans, who utterly destroyed the hollowed Mechanicus bastions and ground them to dust.
Starfarer wrote: Looks like Corsairs vs. Dark Mechanicum in the new Kill Team set according to the GW Instagram comments...
This is going to be amazing if so.
Hmm. Does the Dark Mechanicum stuff have substance beyond the picture? Those could easily be cultists BSF style, like the current chaos marine rumors are saying.
H.B.M.C. wrote: I thought the next KT box was Nachmund or however you spell it? The Return to Vigilis thing.
This, yes, but they've also said that Nachmund is in the grip of war between pretty much every faction.
Most rumors say "Corsairs vs. Chaos Kill Team Box" apparently due for preorder on the 29th of Jan. but the chaos side has been oddly quiet.
The major chaos rumor listed out Warpsmith, Chosen, Possessed, Bikers, Traitor Guard, Cultists, Cultist standard bearer, and Cultist Leader w/Bodyguard all as part of the big wave of Chaos Marines.
The Eldritch Omens box confirmed two of those at least, but we've gotten nothing out of the rest.
On top of that, GW is giving the focus to the Eldar, which hints that Eldar will get their big release first, then Chaos shortly after, but some are saying it'll be a big dual-release due to schedule changes.
Vigilus started with the battle boxes "Tooth and Claw" and "Wake the Dead". The events of the latter were addressed when Calgar brokered an alliance with Saim Hann to use their very rare and ancient stealth ship as a car bomb against the Vengeful Spirit. Saim Hann has been on Vigilys from the very beginning because "Chaos Bad".
zamerion wrote: yeah, also the drawing and the description do not fit with the rumor of corsairs, right?
Gw trolling us.
I'm afraid until LVO we won't know what the next box will be
Nah I think they might just be setting up the Corsairs reveal with a piece of Eldar Killteam art. Hoping to see something for KT sooner rather than later, they've already announced the new box is coming.
Starfarer wrote: Looks like Corsairs vs. Dark Mechanicum in the new Kill Team set according to the GW Instagram comments...
This is going to be amazing if so.
The art in question is from the KT Core Book on page 20. It's accompanying a fluff blurb about a warzone.
When tech-hungry magi of the Adeptus Mechanicus seized a number of webway portals and ancient shrines on the Aeldari maiden world of Vyaneth, they swiftly built-up enormous fortifications and bastions to hold their takings, churning the pristine ground, pulling down glorious forests and pumping heavy pollution into the atmosphere. Knowing a full-scale assault would be ruinously costly, as well as highly likely to fail, the Asuryani of Alaitoc Craftworld formed a number of kill teams, drawing together Aspect Warriors and Rangers. With precise long rifle fire, the Rangers picked off Skitarii sentries and drew defenders out, giving room for Dire Avengers to rapidly storm the weakened Imperial defences. After weeks of this kind of fighting, Alaitoc deployed a vast host alongside a number of Revenant Titans, who utterly destroyed the hollowed Mechanicus bastions and ground them to dust.
That is an Eldar Phantom Titan wrecked in the background. It seems that victory Alaitoc got still came at a heavy cost.
I don't really get how all that suggests "Corsair VS Dark Mechanicus" rather than Eldar VS Adeptus Mechanicus.
Sure, that art doesn't look exactly like the usual Mechanicus style, but it's not unusual for there to be some variety with how things are presented in the artwork.
Don't the Space Marine eradicators have a gun that is d6+2 as well? I was expecting the D Cannon to be a bit more impressive than that, especially if they're keeping the 12" range on Wraithguard.
That Instagram image popped up a few weeks back as well. Weren't the corsair kill team rumored to have the option to have one as a ranger, one as a warlock, etc? Fits the image, though maybe the rumor only came about AFTER the image first appeared.
Also, since we have a slight Ra leak, maybe they'll show him off tmrw to beat the leakers. Hopefully he doesn't have a hood on. (It looks like he will from the new year video, though that's really rubbing in the grim reaper aspect a bit too much)
Like I said, that image is from the Kill-Team Core book. It's on page 20.
They even gave away a promo art card with KT: Octarius' release.
Something I hadn't considered is this might be the intro of a reworked "Elites" and "Commanders" setup. The Warlock would make sense in that context...and there's a Technoarchaeologist model still needing release for AdMech.
Kanluwen wrote: Like I said, that image is from the Kill-Team Core book. It's on page 20.
They even gave away a promo art card with KT: Octarius' release.
Something I hadn't considered is this might be the intro of a reworked "Elites" and "Commanders" setup. The Warlock would make sense in that context...and there's a Technoarchaeologist model still needing release for AdMech.
Is there? I thought the technoarchaeologist model was part of a Barnes n Nobles box "Combat Arena":
Spoiler:
Still available as far as I can see.
But yeah, we know that Kill Team is going to get elites and commanders and such. There are lots of images in the Core Book that are pretty much 'future proofing', like showcasing lychguard and custodes terminators as units you can take, when they're not in the compendium.
We also know that the balance of Kill Team is very different, and if they can fit in an aspiring sorcerer in a Thousand Sons kill team, they can very likely fit a Warlock in an Eldar kill team without dipping into elites just yet.
Vovin wrote: Some new info snippets from the Discord. The poster verified the post with a partly image from Maugan Ra:
So. For new models. We have : Maug. Corsairs. Warlock. Shining Spears. Dark reapers.
Night spinner AP-2 dmg 2
D canon d6+2 not d3+3 I was wrong last time
Shuriken canon for harlies now S6 ap1 dmg 2 But 3 shot
Now can't reroll hit rolls against Starweavers and skyweavers
Are relics any good? A lot
Shining Spears pictures? I do. Models are good. Unit is not. Can't show.
Do they lose the 4++? Nope
Also, no more double move and charge. Both in harlies and craftworlds.
And no more -1 to invuls.
So jinx doesn’t work on invuls anymore? Nope
think jinx is now removes invulns - No. -1 to armor save.
Thats’s sad - Don't worry. You have a gak ton of ignore invul and mobility. This codex is busted.
Are corsairs troop and elite? And do they look cool
Very cool. But they are not good.
Exarch traits are very busted at the moment.
Jain zar solid option
The change to Jinx will definitely change up my playstyle a bit (not a bad thing, mind you). I finished a tourney this weekend using it against a Kill Rig, Ork Warboss in one game an a massive Harridan in another. It is super useful lowering invulnerable saves.
The damage output for the current Nightspinner isn't so much an AP issue, but a random numbe of shots issue. I'll take AP2, but if it's still 2d6 shots, I will likely still be on the fence whether to use it or not.
Dark Reapers? Interesting.
Fire Dragons being good? We shall see. Still in Finecast and those models take such a long time to remove the flashing. If folks really want Fire Dragons and we don't get new models, find the older metal scultps.
The Warlock really appears like it will be in the KT boxset (based on artwork).
I don't really get how all that suggests "Corsair VS Dark Mechanicus" rather than Eldar VS Adeptus Mechanicus.
Sure, that art doesn't look exactly like the usual Mechanicus style, but it's not unusual for there to be some variety with how things are presented in the artwork.
It certainly could be regular Admech based on the snippet, but the image does not resemble any of the current aesthetic for Admech, so if it is, I expect, or at least hope, for something very different in looks from what we have for the current AdMech range.
That said, all the rumors have said Eldar vs Chaos for the next KT box without specifying what type of Chaos. There's also the issue that Admech already got new KT Rules in White Dwarf very recently. Would be extremely odd for a game that's in the early stages of new content releases to double down on multiple rules for a single faction within a couple months.
Then there's the GW 2022 teaser which showed a model that people were saying either Admech or chaos cultists. Weird those were the assumptions for the same model. Very possible it is Dark Mechanicus.
I guess we'll see soon enough! Either way super excited for the Corsairs as well.
Kanluwen wrote: Like I said, that image is from the Kill-Team Core book. It's on page 20.
They even gave away a promo art card with KT: Octarius' release.
Something I hadn't considered is this might be the intro of a reworked "Elites" and "Commanders" setup. The Warlock would make sense in that context...and there's a Technoarchaeologist model still needing release for AdMech.
Is there? I thought the technoarchaeologist model was part of a Barnes n Nobles box "Combat Arena"
As mentioned, also part of Blackstone Fortress: Escalation. Buuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuut...the model is on a shared sprue that can't be released individually.
Spoiler:
Still available as far as I can see.
Not according to B&N employees. It says temporarily unavailable on the website, but when I had 'em check the stock said discontinued in their system.
... next week’s Path of the Preview, where we’ll be showing off an updated Aspect Warrior.
Can we talk about why this is casually just the best character kit GW has released in fething eons?
Are we gonna get this mini and find "2015" printed on the sprue or something? This thing seems like they made it from a lost fething STC labeled "Kits with Options" that was paid for with the blood of 10,000 skitarii. WTF?
What a great looking model. Like the canoness, it's absolutely loaded with options and even with the tactical ruin, you can make two or three that looks almost entirely different.
Shame that they used an already revealed model for the weekly preview, but it's cool to see all the options now. (except the banshee helmet)
Can we talk about why this is casually just the best character kit GW has released in fething eons?
Are we gonna get this mini and find "2015" printed on the sprue or something? This thing seems like they made it from a lost fething STC labeled "Kits with Options" that was paid for with the blood of 10,000 skitarii. WTF?
Right?!
Like, I'm happy to have gotten a Skitarii HQ finally...but man does this make me feel like they missed a beat with how restricted the Marshall is. Dude doesn't even get to take the power sword he's got strapped to his hip while Aeldari are like frigging Doomguy over here lol.
GaroRobe wrote: What a great looking model. Like the canoness, it's absolutely loaded with options and even with the tactical ruin, you can make two or three that looks almost entirely different.
Honestly, the ruin is the only bad part about the model. It feels like someone sculpted it to be flat on the ground but they had to add a ruin so they just basically copypasted the Autarch onto the ruin.
Can we talk about why this is casually just the best character kit GW has released in fething eons?
Are we gonna get this mini and find "2015" printed on the sprue or something? This thing seems like they made it from a lost fething STC labeled "Kits with Options" that was paid for with the blood of 10,000 skitarii. WTF?
Right?!
Like, I'm happy to have gotten a Skitarii HQ finally...but man does this make me feel like they missed a beat with how restricted the Marshall is. Dude doesn't even get to take the power sword he's got strapped to his hip while Aeldari are like frigging Doomguy over here lol.
I'd be so sad if it was revealed to be an older kit. I've been looking over the sprue prices of the 2012-2014 eldar on the GW site, and the plastic looks pretty iffy. It could be just poor picture quality, but the models look like they're covered in splotches.
GaroRobe wrote: What a great looking model. Like the canoness, it's absolutely loaded with options and even with the tactical ruin, you can make two or three that looks almost entirely different.
Honestly, the ruin is the only bad part about the model. It feels like someone sculpted it to be flat on the ground but they had to add a ruin so they just basically copypasted the Autarch onto the ruin.
Tactical see-saw!
I've seen Marvel films... I know they are a thing!
GaroRobe wrote: What a great looking model. Like the canoness, it's absolutely loaded with options and even with the tactical ruin, you can make two or three that looks almost entirely different.
Honestly, the ruin is the only bad part about the model. It feels like someone sculpted it to be flat on the ground but they had to add a ruin so they just basically copypasted the Autarch onto the ruin.
I mean he is standing flat just at like a 10 degree angle. You can just cut him off the thing.
Can we talk about why this is casually just the best character kit GW has released in fething eons?
Are we gonna get this mini and find "2015" printed on the sprue or something? This thing seems like they made it from a lost fething STC labeled "Kits with Options" that was paid for with the blood of 10,000 skitarii. WTF?
Right?!
Like, I'm happy to have gotten a Skitarii HQ finally...but man does this make me feel like they missed a beat with how restricted the Marshall is. Dude doesn't even get to take the power sword he's got strapped to his hip while Aeldari are like frigging Doomguy over here lol.
I'd be so sad if it was revealed to be an older kit. I've been looking over the sprue prices of the 2012-2014 eldar on the GW site, and the plastic looks pretty iffy. It could be just poor picture quality, but the models look like they're covered in splotches.
it is the same plastic - theyre just running it thru older molds. Don't worry, GW plastic from 2012-2016 is going to be infinitely better quality than GW plastic now....because GW plastic from that time period just used simple ball joins and stuff like shoulderpads to hide seams instead of now, where they purposefully key it together so it only goes one way and you end up with super long stupid gigantic seams on the model that you have to fill in with greenstuff.
Like this Gloomspite Gitz model I just painted, which has a big, long, giant, crooked series of seams running the entire length of the entire fething model, from cape to helmet to down the middle of his fething face.
It's so endlessly hilarious to me that people will see kits like this and make BS claims like "ohhh the new monoposes are so cunningly put together to make the seams hidden! LOL no dawg the purpose is to reduce compatibility with third party bits, don't be an idiot.
Pictured below: "Boutique Luxury Quality, Such Glorious Attention To Detail That It Costs 3x As Much As Every Other Model Company And 100x As Much As 3d Printing"
is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
I'd be so sad if it was revealed to be an older kit. I've been looking over the sprue prices of the 2012-2014 eldar on the GW site, and the plastic looks pretty iffy. It could be just poor picture quality, but the models look like they're covered in splotches.
Just a bad pic - I am working on the plastic Autarch currently and it is just fine - smooth and perfect. Comparing it to an older Finecast Autarch I was marveling just how much better the plastic was - its night and day....
The left foot looks like it's separate, but the right foot looks like it was sculpted onto the base. It won't be impossible to remove, but it's annoying.
Still better than the underworld models with half a foot already sculpted onto the base itself...
clodax66 wrote: is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
Next week will be full preview of Shroud Runners. Then Reapers, then Maugan, and lastly the Avatar and that will be all we get this decade
But jokes aside, GW drip feeds those previews at such a rate, that I gave up hope for a Necron scale update, as such would take half a year of weekly Paths of the Previews.
And this Autarch looks like it was designed at the same time as the previous one, they just saved it for later, just as they did with Jetbikes.
GaroRobe wrote: What a great looking model. Like the canoness, it's absolutely loaded with options and even with the tactical ruin, you can make two or three that looks almost entirely different.
Honestly, the ruin is the only bad part about the model. It feels like someone sculpted it to be flat on the ground but they had to add a ruin so they just basically copypasted the Autarch onto the ruin.
Honestly I think it’d look better if the stone was turned 180° - that way the various cloth bits would be hanging down. Or yeah just remove it.
Stupid thing is that it’s probably got one boot moulded onto it or something else like that.
This looks really nice, and the backwards compatibility is a nice touch. For whatever reason, I wasn't expecting the Warp Spider Jump-pack upgrade.
The interesting bit of the video is at the end. While the box is 'Aeldari Autarch,' the ending text is 'Asuryani War Leaders' which, at least to me, implies more to come.
clodax66 wrote: is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
Next week will be full preview of Shroud Runners. Then Reapers, then Maugan, and lastly the Avatar and that will be all we get this decade
But jokes aside, GW drip feeds those previews at such a rate, that I gave up hope for a Necron scale update, as such would take half a year of weekly Paths of the Previews.
And this Autarch looks like it was designed at the same time as the previous one, they just saved it for later, just as they did with Jetbikes.
They gave a more in depth preview of the autarch which they had no need to do and yes they will drag it out. If they show all the centrepieces and most requested units now, people will probably just get bored while the book comes out, which I dare say is likely 3 months away.
the_scotsman wrote: Are we gonna get this mini and find "2015" printed on the sprue or something? This thing seems like they made it from a lost fething STC labeled "Kits with Options" that was paid for with the blood of 10,000 skitarii. WTF?
clodax66 wrote: is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
"next week’s Path of the Preview, where we’ll be showing off an updated Aspect Warrior."
vipoid wrote: A Xeno HQ with a range of options *and* backwards compatibility.
GW, are you... feeling okay?
Not that I'm complaining it's just so weird to see them actually doing this, given their prior policies and recent track record.
It feels really alien. When they releaesed the ork megaboss separately I looked at that sprue and just.... Both the big choppa and the grot shoota are non-optional, which seems ridiculous.
I'm trying to figure out who's getting a character model next (beyond the warpsmith hammer/axe and the primaris whatevers with swords). But we're at the point that even space marine characters with options is an upcoming novelty.
Albino Squirrel wrote: I like that there's options, but that autach looks pretty terrible just standing there at an angle on a slab with legs spread. What a terrible pose.
Yeah I am happy with the kit - nice options and extra bits for the win - but the pose could be better. Maybe will swap in legs from the new guardian kit or aspects....
Both feet seem have a tiny gap between them and the rock at the tip of the foot which makes me think none of them are moulded on the rock and you can just leave it off
Albino Squirrel wrote: I like that there's options, but that autach looks pretty terrible just standing there at an angle on a slab with legs spread. What a terrible pose.
As otherwise mentioned, take them off the slab and put them flat?
Matrindur wrote: Both feet seem have a tiny gap between them and the rock at the tip of the foot which makes me think none of them are moulded on the rock and you can just leave it off
I hope that is the case. It would still be a boring pose, but I think it at least wouldn't look bad standing on flat ground.
Ha, looks like we've been doing the same thing. It looks loads better standing flat, as the pose doesn't seem to compensate for the angle at all. Strong whiff of the base scenery being an afterthought/last-minute addition, I'd say.
Anyone heard any rumors about the Skyrunner Autarch?
With GW revamping the Eldar range, I could easily see them ditch any units that they don't want to update in plastic.
They removed the Archons bike option years ago and recently did the same for several SM & Chaos Characters. They apparently don't like generals on bikes.
I really hope I am wrong (maybe the plastic Shining Spears kit is compatible with the INFANTRY Autarch)
I've use a bike Autarch as my primary HQ since 4th and would really hate to see him go (or have to continue using the Legends entry just for all the options)
Inquisitor Gideon wrote: It's nice it has the options, but does anyone else find the pose/stance kinda, dull?
It's a nice refresh from everyone constantly dynamically leaping off a piece of tactical masonry half their size, with one foot being connected to it by their big toe and nothing else.
it is the same plastic - theyre just running it thru older molds. Don't worry, GW plastic from 2012-2016 is going to be infinitely better quality than GW plastic now....because GW plastic from that time period just used simple ball joins and stuff like shoulderpads to hide seams instead of now, where they purposefully key it together so it only goes one way and you end up with super long stupid gigantic seams on the model that you have to fill in with greenstuff.
Like this Gloomspite Gitz model I just painted, which has a big, long, giant, crooked series of seams running the entire length of the entire fething model, from cape to helmet to down the middle of his fething face.
It's so endlessly hilarious to me that people will see kits like this and make BS claims like "ohhh the new monoposes are so cunningly put together to make the seams hidden! LOL no dawg the purpose is to reduce compatibility with third party bits, don't be an idiot.
Pictured below: "Boutique Luxury Quality, Such Glorious Attention To Detail That It Costs 3x As Much As Every Other Model Company And 100x As Much As 3d Printing"
This is merely photographic evidence of you lacking/choosing not to utilize advanced modelling skills.
Next time (if you care enough about the seams):
- dry fit the pieces
- shave down any pegs or other interior obstacles that prevent a tight fit
- dry fit again and remember the location of the problem seams
- deliberately "overglue" those seams (while using plastic cement) so that a small bead of glue overflows them
- after it has cured for a few hours, shave off the bead and enjoy your completely seamless mini
It would be totally reasonable for you to take the (somewhat more nuanced) position that more recent models do not provide you with a seamless finish in the same amount of assembly time that older models required -- which would still be an elision, because "they used to fix this with shoulderpads" is obviously a bunk statement when there are dozens (hundreds?) of minis that didn't have shouldpads, and did have broad, unfixable seams -- but acting like you had no control over how that model turned out is stupid. I guarantee you that if I had built it, it would not have had those seams, because I am compulsive about taking the extra ~10 minutes to complete the steps I outlined above.
Yeah, but they could have made it look like they were swinging the combat weapon, or even just pointing it at something. Instead of just standing there looking at it. I mean, it looks okay once it's flat, but nothing all that exciting.
I'm amazed that they added the warp jump generator back in.
It seems that the waist sash is integrated with the torso and is different for the male and female torsos. We know this kit is compatible with the other plastic autarch at least for the weapons, but I'm wondering if it will have any compatibility with the new guardians.
clodax66 wrote: is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
Next week will be full preview of Shroud Runners. Then Reapers, then Maugan, and lastly the Avatar and that will be all we get this decade
But jokes aside, GW drip feeds those previews at such a rate, that I gave up hope for a Necron scale update, as such would take half a year of weekly Paths of the Previews.
And this Autarch looks like it was designed at the same time as the previous one, they just saved it for later, just as they did with Jetbikes.
They gave a more in depth preview of the autarch which they had no need to do and yes they will drag it out. If they show all the centrepieces and most requested units now, people will probably just get bored while the book comes out, which I dare say is likely 3 months away.
If we assume for a moment that this is a complete update (which we know is not the case), without any new units besides the Shroud Runners, it would take another three to four months of weekly, single unit/hero previews to just cover everything dating 2nd to 4th ed.
What is more worrying is that the entire Eldar side of Advent Engine was about Eldritch Omens only and both "hanging" old rumours are already revealed - Guardian platform operator and Bloody Hand. Only Maugan was unexpected in the new year's sneak peek, so the "large but incomplete" may not be that large after all...
clodax66 wrote: is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
Next week will be full preview of Shroud Runners. Then Reapers, then Maugan, and lastly the Avatar and that will be all we get this decade
But jokes aside, GW drip feeds those previews at such a rate, that I gave up hope for a Necron scale update, as such would take half a year of weekly Paths of the Previews.
And this Autarch looks like it was designed at the same time as the previous one, they just saved it for later, just as they did with Jetbikes.
They gave a more in depth preview of the autarch which they had no need to do and yes they will drag it out. If they show all the centrepieces and most requested units now, people will probably just get bored while the book comes out, which I dare say is likely 3 months away.
If we assume for a moment that this is a complete update (which we know is not the case), without any new units besides the Shroud Runners, it would take another three to four months of weekly, single unit/hero previews to just cover everything dating 2nd to 4th ed.
What is more worrying is that the entire Eldar side of Advent Engine was about Eldritch Omens only and both "hanging" old rumours are already revealed - Guardian platform operator and Bloody Hand. Only Maugan was unexpected in the new year's sneak peek, so the "large but incomplete" may not be that large after all...
Next week they're showing an aspect warrior. It says at the bottom of the article.
Galef wrote: Anyone heard any rumors about the Skyrunner Autarch?
With GW revamping the Eldar range, I could easily see them ditch any units that they don't want to update in plastic.
They removed the Archons bike option years ago and recently did the same for several SM & Chaos Characters. They apparently don't like generals on bikes.
I really hope I am wrong (maybe the plastic Shining Spears kit is compatible with the INFANTRY Autarch)
I've use a bike Autarch as my primary HQ since 4th and would really hate to see him go (or have to continue using the Legends entry just for all the options)
-
Isn't the old destroyer lord still being sold? Same with the white scar captain on bike? I think the autarch skyrunner is safe
clodax66 wrote: is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
Next week will be full preview of Shroud Runners. Then Reapers, then Maugan, and lastly the Avatar and that will be all we get this decade
But jokes aside, GW drip feeds those previews at such a rate, that I gave up hope for a Necron scale update, as such would take half a year of weekly Paths of the Previews.
And this Autarch looks like it was designed at the same time as the previous one, they just saved it for later, just as they did with Jetbikes.
They gave a more in depth preview of the autarch which they had no need to do and yes they will drag it out. If they show all the centrepieces and most requested units now, people will probably just get bored while the book comes out, which I dare say is likely 3 months away.
If we assume for a moment that this is a complete update (which we know is not the case), without any new units besides the Shroud Runners, it would take another three to four months of weekly, single unit/hero previews to just cover everything dating 2nd to 4th ed.
What is more worrying is that the entire Eldar side of Advent Engine was about Eldritch Omens only and both "hanging" old rumours are already revealed - Guardian platform operator and Bloody Hand. Only Maugan was unexpected in the new year's sneak peek, so the "large but incomplete" may not be that large after all...
According to rumours we have:
Baharroth
Maugan Ra
Avatar
Swooping Hawks
Warp Spiders
Rangers
Ranger Bikes
Shining Spears
Guardians
Dark Reapers
Corsairs
Autarch
12 weeks is just shy of 3 months, 12 units is also a "large update" by any measure.
Galef wrote: Anyone heard any rumors about the Skyrunner Autarch?
With GW revamping the Eldar range, I could easily see them ditch any units that they don't want to update in plastic.
They removed the Archons bike option years ago and recently did the same for several SM & Chaos Characters. They apparently don't like generals on bikes.
I really hope I am wrong (maybe the plastic Shining Spears kit is compatible with the INFANTRY Autarch)
I've use a bike Autarch as my primary HQ since 4th and would really hate to see him go (or have to continue using the Legends entry just for all the options)
-
Isn't the old destroyer lord still being sold? Same with the white scar captain on bike? I think the autarch skyrunner is safe
He’s on the old bike though. Kinda embarrassing. I could see him getting swept under the rug. I could also see building one of of the shining spears box if they get updated.
Or just slapping all those spare arms/helms from the new autach onto one of the new bikes.
Galef wrote: Anyone heard any rumors about the Skyrunner Autarch?
With GW revamping the Eldar range, I could easily see them ditch any units that they don't want to update in plastic.
They removed the Archons bike option years ago and recently did the same for several SM & Chaos Characters. They apparently don't like generals on bikes.
I really hope I am wrong (maybe the plastic Shining Spears kit is compatible with the INFANTRY Autarch)
I've use a bike Autarch as my primary HQ since 4th and would really hate to see him go (or have to continue using the Legends entry just for all the options)
-
Isn't the old destroyer lord still being sold? Same with the white scar captain on bike? I think the autarch skyrunner is safe
He’s on the old bike though. Kinda embarrassing. I could see him getting swept under the rug. I could also see building one of of the shining spears box if they get updated.
Or just slapping all those spare arms/helms from the new autach onto one of the new bikes.
We’ll see what the skien of fate has in store.
Aye, if there is a Shining Spear redo, and if it puts them on the new Jetbike sculpt, this would leave the Autarch Skyrunner (silly name) as the only model using the original plastic Jetbike. You would think GW would want to do something so they could eliminate that mold from being used, wouldn't you?
If we assume for a moment that this is a complete update (which we know is not the case), without any new units besides the Shroud Runners, it would take another three to four months of weekly, single unit/hero previews to just cover everything dating 2nd to 4th ed.
What is more worrying is that the entire Eldar side of Advent Engine was about Eldritch Omens only and both "hanging" old rumours are already revealed - Guardian platform operator and Bloody Hand. Only Maugan was unexpected in the new year's sneak peek, so the "large but incomplete" may not be that large after all...
Absence from the rumour engine isn't a great way to make predictions. IIRC a couple of years ago, the only Necron rumour engine pic was the new Szaras model that came with Psychic Awakening. The entire rest of their range update at the start of 9th wasn't covered in the rumour engine at all. Space marines only had 1-2 pics.
GW also love to throw in multiple shots of single-models & characters, so you get a disproportionate amount of rumour content over much smaller releases.
Autarch is great. Love that the Warp Spider options are there.
vipoid wrote: A Xeno HQ with a range of options *and* backwards compatibility.
GW, are you... feeling okay?
I think it's a shift.
Look at the new Gravis Captain and Primaris Ancient. They've got new hats weapon options. This has weapon options. Maybe GW have finally wised up and realised that this gak just isn't what people want when it comes to characters. They want actual options, and not weird combo restrictions.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Autarch is great. Love that the Warp Spider options are there.
vipoid wrote: A Xeno HQ with a range of options *and* backwards compatibility.
GW, are you... feeling okay?
I think it's a shift.
Look at the new Gravis Captain and Primaris Ancient. They've got new hats weapon options. This has weapon options. Maybe GW have finally wised up and realised that this gak just isn't what people want when it comes to characters. They want actual options, and not weird combo restrictions.
We can only hope.
Watch them follow this up with a Chaos Lord that can only ever be equipped with a power axe, but OH WAIT you can choose between a PLASMA PISTOL or a BOLT PISTOL!!!
This Autarch and the Cannoness they gave to the Sisters are the better examples of what we all know that GW can do. Now we just need that treatment in other factions.
drbored wrote: Watch them follow this up with a Chaos Lord that can only ever be equipped with a power axe, but OH WAIT you can choose between a PLASMA PISTOL or a BOLT PISTOL!!!
Wouldn't shock me. I mean, they are about to do this to Chosen, so we shouldn't get our hopes up too high.
The new Autarch is really a statement from GW:
"OK, you want options, we give you the most bland, tired pose model ever so you can just tack on your weapons without context or purpose"
I guess you win some, lose some. At least he/she is not in the middle of a jump, suspended in air by swirly gak.
All in all a decent model, now gimme some Maugan Ra already!
Fayric wrote: The new Autarch is really a statement from GW:
"OK, you want options, we give you the most bland, tired pose model ever so you can just tack on your weapons without context or purpose"
I guess you win some, lose some. At least he/she is not in the middle of a jump, suspended in air by swirly gak.
All in all a decent model, now gimme some Maugan Ra already!
Exactly. This model recreates the classic Autarchs to the point, where they managed to recreate the 2.5D nature of pewter sculpts. But combining the two models it should be possible to get some interesting poses with limited conversions. Sadly, the fusion gun is an unsalvageable disaster pose of "psst, wanna buy a perfectly good, second hand Dragon Fusion Gun?"
Very impressive stuff. Im not one to praise GW but on this account they seem to be giving us the Eldar people what we want
GW will certainly be getting some of my money this year haha. Im happy my winged tarch conversion can come out the legends banishment zone and join the fray once again.
The only thing im not interested in is guardians. Im up to about 45 guardians and stormies and had I known Id have not bothered with fail cast... Alas.. I dont want to paint another guardian ever again at this point.
Not really sure why people are bashing the poses... Not only is it compatible with the winged autarch im sure you will be able to kit bash it with things like bansshees/Dire evengers and other stuff we have inbound. Also just take it off the tacticool rock...
Its a great time to be a craft order. Im stoked
It looks like us the Eldar players will soon have as money autarch as we have farseers
Im most curious what they do with warlock conclaves and seer council. Would be great for a seer council unit again.
clodax66 wrote: is me or are they really milking these previews. I was hoping for more previews not preview of more options of miniature they already previewed. What next week we are going to get previews of rest of the options for this miniatures.
Next week will be full preview of Shroud Runners. Then Reapers, then Maugan, and lastly the Avatar and that will be all we get this decade
But jokes aside, GW drip feeds those previews at such a rate, that I gave up hope for a Necron scale update, as such would take half a year of weekly Paths of the Previews.
And this Autarch looks like it was designed at the same time as the previous one, they just saved it for later, just as they did with Jetbikes.
They gave a more in depth preview of the autarch which they had no need to do and yes they will drag it out. If they show all the centrepieces and most requested units now, people will probably just get bored while the book comes out, which I dare say is likely 3 months away.
If we assume for a moment that this is a complete update (which we know is not the case), without any new units besides the Shroud Runners, it would take another three to four months of weekly, single unit/hero previews to just cover everything dating 2nd to 4th ed.
What is more worrying is that the entire Eldar side of Advent Engine was about Eldritch Omens only and both "hanging" old rumours are already revealed - Guardian platform operator and Bloody Hand. Only Maugan was unexpected in the new year's sneak peek, so the "large but incomplete" may not be that large after all...
According to rumours we have:
Baharroth
Maugan Ra
Avatar
Swooping Hawks
Warp Spiders
Rangers
Ranger Bikes
Shining Spears
Guardians
Dark Reapers
Corsairs
Autarch
12 weeks is just shy of 3 months, 12 units is also a "large update" by any measure.
Corsairs don't count if they're in a kill team box, it'll be a separate release later.
In my mind the most important thing about this model is its ability to be kitbashed with other eldar models, that and the extra weapons it has.
This means the eldar will actually have the ability to have interesting and unique conversions for characters in the same way marines have had for 20+ years.
I'm looking forward to people using the new plastic eldar kit components to create new and interesting looking models.
The pose of this one while boring will make it very flexible in this regard.
The Red Hobbit wrote: I'm very pleasantly surprised the Autarch is coming with so many options, and backwards compatible too!
Makes me want to get two of the new box.
Man I hope it doesn't come out this month/next month...
Hellebore wrote: In my mind the most important thing about this model is its ability to be kitbashed with other eldar models, that and the extra weapons it has.
One other Eldar model. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.
Hellebore wrote: This means the eldar will actually have the ability to have interesting and unique conversions for characters in the same way marines have had for 20+ years.
I'm looking forward to people using the new plastic eldar kit components to create new and interesting looking models.
Nothing of the sort has been mentioned in the Autarch article. It's compatible with the other plastic Autarch. That's it. We're not at the level of Pre-8th Ed Maries, where you could mix'n'match anything with anything.
Fayric wrote: The new Autarch is really a statement from GW:
"OK, you want options, we give you the most bland, tired pose model ever so you can just tack on your weapons without context or purpose"
As a DE player, I'd say that options and a bland model are vastly better to a "dynamic" model with no options.
Reason being, it's a hell of a lot easier (and more rewarding) to convert a model to your liking than it is to get your opponent to accept rules for wargear/weapons that no longer exist.
The Red Hobbit wrote: I'm very pleasantly surprised the Autarch is coming with so many options, and backwards compatible too!
Makes me want to get two of the new box.
Man I hope it doesn't come out this month/next month...
Hellebore wrote: In my mind the most important thing about this model is its ability to be kitbashed with other eldar models, that and the extra weapons it has.
One other Eldar model. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.
Hellebore wrote: This means the eldar will actually have the ability to have interesting and unique conversions for characters in the same way marines have had for 20+ years.
I'm looking forward to people using the new plastic eldar kit components to create new and interesting looking models.
Nothing of the sort has been mentioned in the Autarch article. It's compatible with the other plastic Autarch. That's it. We're not at the level of Pre-8th Ed Maries, where you could mix'n'match anything with anything.
I'm talking kitbashing not compatibility. With an actual range of plastic kits, there will be real options for kitbashing models. Autarch bits on exarchs, exarch bits on autarchs.
Even if they stopped right now, with the banshees and autarchs that's a lot of options to build interesting models. But as we're also getting at least on new aspect confirmed by WARCOM, I expect there will be even more options.
That's better than old gurdians, dire avengers and one autarch to work with.
The Red Hobbit wrote: I'm very pleasantly surprised the Autarch is coming with so many options, and backwards compatible too!
Makes me want to get two of the new box.
Man I hope it doesn't come out this month/next month...
Hellebore wrote: In my mind the most important thing about this model is its ability to be kitbashed with other eldar models, that and the extra weapons it has.
One other Eldar model. Let's not get ahead of ourselves.
Hellebore wrote: This means the eldar will actually have the ability to have interesting and unique conversions for characters in the same way marines have had for 20+ years.
I'm looking forward to people using the new plastic eldar kit components to create new and interesting looking models.
Nothing of the sort has been mentioned in the Autarch article. It's compatible with the other plastic Autarch. That's it. We're not at the level of Pre-8th Ed Maries, where you could mix'n'match anything with anything.
I'm talking kitbashing not compatibility. With an actual range of plastic kits, there will be real options for kitbashing models. Autarch bits on exarchs, exarch bits on autarchs.
Even if they stopped right now, with the banshees and autarchs that's a lot of options to build interesting models. But as we're also getting at least on new aspect confirmed by WARCOM, I expect there will be even more options.
That's better than old gurdians, dire avengers and one autarch to work with.
Have an exalt!
Ive managed to kit bash 2 decentish autarchs by using visarch and ol failcast kit. That was pre plastic banshees even.. In comparison to these incoming plastic kits wil be an absolute treasure trove of bits!
Agreed with the more options for kitbashing - that new female autarch torso and helm might work well with a set of Banshee legs to do a very dynamic pose for a start.
So anxious to see what Aspects we really will get in plastic - I think the rumors have mentioned several but still seems hard to believe for some reason. Obviously they have mentioned one being previewed next week, but with the Ra tease they almost have to be Dark Reapers but I guess we shall see soon enough....
I'm hoping for Shining Spears. They have received one model kit for their entire existence, and even that kit is just a conversion kit of the previous version of the Jetbike.
The Red Hobbit wrote: I'm very pleasantly surprised the Autarch is coming with so many options, and backwards compatible too!
Makes me want to get two of the new box.
Man I hope it doesn't come out this month/next month...
I know exactly what you mean, I'm very excited for the new Eldar releases since about half of my army is metal. That said we've got a newborn in our family now so I've finally started to accrue a backlog, I've managed to prime my Kill Team 21 terrain but still haven't had a chance to paint it, heck I haven't even had time to assemble the Kommandos. Hopefully I'll find some time to catch up since I think we'll be seeing some great Eldar releases in 2022!
Okay, I was sorta meh about the new Autarch (I'd rather a female Farseer for my OC do not steal Farseer Faleaseen) But now it can be a male Autarch not just female it'll allow me to make my other OC do not steal High-Autarch Raloth Arlyandor. I hope there are rules to equip the Autarch with a shuriken catapult like it was in the old codexes, even though it doesn't seem you get that option in this. But can convert one pretty easily from my old Dire Avenger bitz. Right now I'm using my Skyrunner Autarch for him. This also makes me more excited for if there's a Commander expansion for Killteam 2: Electric Boogaloo. Might use one of the awesome looking bare heads in the new Guardian box.
Glad to see T4 and 5++ Invul. Those Exarch powers are solid, really make Fire Dragon's fulfill their role. Tough choice between auto-wound and damage boost.
T3 Eldar has been a pretty solid universal constant for many'a decade.
A couple of theories:
1: it's a mistake
2: all aspects are now Sv 3+ and T4 is what 'heavy' aspect armour now is (so scorpions, spiders, reapers and dragons would be T4 with this rule).
3: its a purely dragon feature of the aspect. if this is true then scorpions may be S4 standard
Personally I am hoping they've pushed all aspects to Sv3+ and heavy armour is T4, because 4+ saves on expensive elite units with T3 and W1 is not very survivable.
drbored wrote: Watch them follow this up with a Chaos Lord that can only ever be equipped with a power axe, but OH WAIT you can choose between a PLASMA PISTOL or a BOLT PISTOL!!!
Wouldn't shock me. I mean, they are about to do this to Chosen, so we shouldn't get our hopes up too high.
Honestly not too worried about that. The major thing with the Sword Brethren kit is that you can kit them out real straightforward and simple just by giving everyone a bolt pistol and power sword. Maybe give the squad leader one of the special weapons to mark him out as different or whatever.
If they do the same with Chosen, I won't be too upset. Give them a 'base' loadout that's real easy, like all power axes or all power mauls or something, and then sprinkle in the other options so you can pick one or two to be different or pack that extra punch.
Yeah it's a lot of weird rules gak that you gotta read through, but I'd rather have options that represent the box, rather than have to buy 4 boxes to get the right loadout that I need to play them 'optimally' or some crud.
drbored wrote: If they do the same with Chosen, I won't be too upset. Give them a 'base' loadout that's real easy, like all power axes or all power mauls or something, and then sprinkle in the other options so you can pick one or two to be different or pack that extra punch.
Except when you end up in the weird situation where you can take only take 3 Combi-Weapons per 5 because the kit only comes with 3, and they have to be one of each type (melta, flamer, plasma) unless you take 10 Chosen, where suddenly you can have 6, but again, only 2 of each type.
Meanwhile, in Sternguard land, they can have whatever the feth they want...
T3 Eldar has been a pretty solid universal constant for many'a decade.
A couple of theories:
1: it's a mistake
2: all aspects are now Sv 3+ and T4 is what 'heavy' aspect armour now is (so scorpions, spiders, reapers and dragons would be T4 with this rule).
3: its a purely dragon feature of the aspect. if this is true then scorpions may be S4 standard
Personally I am hoping they've pushed all aspects to Sv3+ and heavy armour is T4, because 4+ saves on expensive elite units with T3 and W1 is not very survivable.
I'm hoping it's #2 as well. GW has been raising toughness this edition and we've already got a precedent with Gravis Armor giving +1T. T4 and 5++ will go a long way towards making Aspects survivable, I'm looking forward to running mine again!
I have this guy waiting with magnetised warp spider jump pack and wings … what are the chances I can use him and what could I make the gun (also magged so I could build something lighter, maybe a fire pike)
dan2026 wrote: Sucks as there is no way I'm going to use Fire Dragons unless they get new models.
Im very happy with my metals tbh.
They could always do a MTO run of metals
Fire Dragons are what caused me to swear off finecast.
In this brave new world of plastic, I think there will be plenty of kitbashing opportunities.
But GW could make bank with metal MTO of the aspects not getting updated. Doing so would be an admission of fault, so will never happen. Unless they went back to the old metals that pre-date the conversion of the modern sculpts.
dan2026 wrote:Sucks as there is no way I'm going to use Fire Dragons unless they get new models.
The current models are still good if you can find them in metal. I just ordered some off of Ebay. There are also some very good alternatives from Artel W.
Wha-Mu-077 wrote:
Well they did say there's a new Aspect Warrior being shown next week.
Everything points to it being Dark Reapers, not Fire Dragons.
dan2026 wrote: Sucks as there is no way I'm going to use Fire Dragons unless they get new models.
No chance of converting some?
That's an idea. Getting the right helmets would be a trick, but fusion guns from the new guardians, and bodies from the Banshees or other new aspect could work.
Regarding the Toughness 4 on Dragons:
I could see this make sense for Dragons as they deal with fire and thus may be a bit more inured to pain.
It's the same reason DE Wracks are T4, because they are used to torture.
It may also be that the Fire Dragon armour has built in fire-proofing that makes them a bit tougher.
But with all Aspects getting a 5++, I kinda hope not all Aspects are getting T4, although you could certainly justify it for some. Reapers could be T4 just like Havocs are T5, Spears are on Bikes, Spiders have the big jump generator, etc.
But Hawks & Banshees need to stay T3 to represent their light and nimble nature.
Scorpions too, probably. Heavy things don't make the best for stealth.
T3 Eldar has been a pretty solid universal constant for many'a decade.
A couple of theories:
1: it's a mistake
2: all aspects are now Sv 3+ and T4 is what 'heavy' aspect armour now is (so scorpions, spiders, reapers and dragons would be T4 with this rule).
3: its a purely dragon feature of the aspect. if this is true then scorpions may be S4 standard
Personally I am hoping they've pushed all aspects to Sv3+ and heavy armour is T4, because 4+ saves on expensive elite units with T3 and W1 is not very survivable.
I'm hoping it's #2 as well. GW has been raising toughness this edition and we've already got a precedent with Gravis Armor giving +1T. T4 and 5++ will go a long way towards making Aspects survivable, I'm looking forward to running mine again!
All the guns in codexes before, like, orks are getting mega devalued though.
All the guns in codexes before, like, orks are getting mega devalued though.
Pretty sure the Ork Codex giving a ton of Ork guns non-synergistic "Rapid Fire But Worse" and swapping most of the rest from Assault to Heavy did way more to devalue Ork guns than this would.
jeff white wrote: I have this guy waiting with magnetised warp spider jump pack and wings … what are the chances I can use him and what could I make the gun (also magged so I could build something lighter, maybe a fire pike)
Spoiler:
--Gallery:2020/5/2/1058261_sm.jpg--
While he looks great with those wings as decor I can only imagine him flying with them like a drunken bumblebee. So better give him the WS jump pack if you want him moving fast. Or let him stay slow but looking good.
It's kind of funny how badly GW wants to keep the random element in damage. They are adding the +d3 or +3 or even +6 damage to the d6 because they know just a flat d6 or d3 just isn't going to cut it these days. They started doing the d6 with a minimum of 3 thing as well, because, let's face it, nothing sucks more than shooting a 50 point cannon at something and doing 1 piddly damage that doesn't even kill a space marine now.
But then, with how GW seems to be bending over backwards to appease the tournament scene, and with tournament players advocating against random rolls like charges and damage, it's just a matter of time until we see weapons doing flat damage of 6 or 8 or 10, and charges of 3" auto-passing, then some units will get auto-charge of 4", or 5" to represent their 'fleetness'.
It's just the normal development of the rules they've written for themselves with this edition. Armor and wounds trump small arms, and heavy weapons trump armor and wounds, and invul saves trump heavy weapons, and HEAVIER weapons trump invul saves and then damage reduction trumps HEAVIER weapons and then AMAZING weapons trump damage reduction.
I look forward to whatever they come up with to trump AMAZING weapons.
jeff white wrote: I have this guy waiting with magnetised warp spider jump pack and wings … what are the chances I can use him and what could I make the gun (also magged so I could build something lighter, maybe a fire pike)
Spoiler:
--Gallery:2020/5/2/1058261_sm.jpg--
While he looks great with those wings as decor I can only imagine him flying with them like a drunken bumblebee. So better give him the WS jump pack if you want him moving fast. Or let him stay slow but looking good.
Yeah, I had the wings and figured why not, as I can also magnetise other models for use of the wings with this dude getting the jump pack, for sure. Good point.
So, the latest Eldritch Omens article on WARCOM mentions Exodites a couple of times. Could it be, that we'll get not only Corsairs (rebranded 2nd ed Pirates), but also a unit of Dragon Knights?
WarCom wrote:Eldritch Omens is due to hit pre-order in February, and our pre-order weekend promise will ensure that anyone who orders a copy that weekend is guaranteed to get one.
Why couldn't it be March...
Also potential first bit of artwork for new Possessed?
Interesting tidbits there (for those that want to save their eyes)-
witch weapons lose random damage (huzzah), witchblades get a point of AP, but do less damage (2 instead of the spear's 3).
only one datasheet- 1 model is a character, 2-6 is a conclave. (Max unit sized dropped from 10 to 6). Presumably skyrunner warlocks will have their own, however.
2 powers (and manifestations) at 4-6 models.
Seer Council lets you take slotless warlock unit for each farseer, which... eh. Seems more like a discouragement from taking Autarchs or an Avatar. Again.
To protect the leakers, apparently. But I think it's probably about as effective as people posting statements on FB about how they own their own content.
Anyway, it's mostly legible to me.
1-6 models. PL depends on unit size. Stat line unchanged.
It says temporarily unavailable on the website, but when I had 'em check the stock said discontinued in their system.
