Forum adverts like this one are shown to any user who is not logged in. Join us by filling out a tiny 3 field form and you will get your own, free, dakka user account which gives a good range of benefits to you: No adverts like this in the forums anymore. Times and dates in your local timezone. Full tracking of what you have read so you can skip to your first unread post, easily see what has changed since you last logged in, and easily see what is new at a glance. Email notifications for threads you want to watch closely. Being a part of the oldest wargaming community on the net. If you are already a member then feel free to login now.

tiber55 wrote:
can anyone please explain exactly what the wording is on the new anti psyker gun.

How does it allocate the perils if it hits.

We don't know.. the unit takes a perils of warp.. units don't have wounds or anything in themselves.. only the models in them do. We don't have any rules on how to allocate perils, which is why similar mechanics (Mindstrike missiles) are careful to specify that specific models take the perils (i.e. the models under the blast of the mindstrike missile).

 Shandara wrote:

tiber55 wrote:
can anyone please explain exactly what the wording is on the new anti psyker gun.

How does it allocate the perils if it hits.

We don't know.. the unit takes a perils of warp.. units don't have wounds or anything in themselves.. only the models in them do. We don't have any rules on how to allocate perils, which is why similar mechanics (Mindstrike missiles) are careful to specify that specific models take the perils (i.e. the models under the blast of the mindstrike missile).

Indeed, however, if one were to replace "unit" in that sentence for "model" it would actually work and make sense. Sadly it does not say model.

just noted one error/inconsistency between the iBook and the ePub file: Seraphim superior in iBook can take power weapon, and in ePub can only take Power sword. Minor difference but vaguely important

 scrunty wrote:
just noted one error/inconsistency between the iBook and the ePub file: Seraphim superior in iBook can take power weapon, and in ePub can only take Power sword. Minor difference but vaguely important

Very important... My power lance Seraphim Superior is looking at me fearfully!

My take on AS+IG foot list:

HQ:
Canoness (Cloak of St. Aspira)
Uriah Jacobus - Warlord

5 Sororitas Command Squad (Hospitalier, Sacred Baner of the Order Militant, Power Axe, Power Axe, Power Axe)
Ministorum Priest

FA:
5 Dominions (4 meltaguns), TL-MM Immolator
5 Dominions (4 meltaguns), TL-MM Immolator

HS:
Exorcist
Exorcist

Troops:
5 Battle Sisters (flamer, heavyflamer)
5 Battle Sisters (flamer, heavyflamer)
5 Battle Sisters (meltagun, meltagun)
5 Battle Sisters (meltagun, meltagun)

HQ:
primaris psyker

Troops:
5 platoon command squad
10 infantry squad (power axe)
10 infantry squad (power axe)
10 infantry squad (power axe)
10 infantry squad (power axe)
10 infantry squad (power axe)

FA:
Vendetta


- 10 Seraphim (2x twin hand flamers)
+ Ministorum Priest
+ Vendetta

1755 pts, beta version. I guess I will swap seraphim for a Vendetta or Avenger Strike Fighter. Others changes will probably follow regarding wargear options. Also, I may add one naked Priest to use both War Hymns. SCS Celestians may opt to take Condemnor boltguns.

My fire warriors approve of the fact flamer dominos are no longer valuable, and that HB rets will likely see a drop, or at least wont be dirt cheap.

My hammerheads do not approve of the fact they got so good with meltas

My fire warriors regret their temporary relief when they see that rets now pack heavy flamers and ride flame tanks like bosses.

Looks like a nerf at a glance, but deeper look reveals that except the fact they still go no proper AA, most things got pretty damn good, with the exception of saint and HB rets who got much needed nerf, and repentia turned quite a bit more squishy.

New faith also looks like a nerf at first, until you realize that you dont need them all too often, and when you need them you NEED them.

Free army-wide AW is also a nice hidden boost. "oh, you planned to psyker me? NOT TODAY"


This version is healthy for the army. no longer punishing you for MSU on one hand, yet a few things that make you want to take huge squads, some units work very will with quite a few useful gun options (rets actually make proper use of all 3 guns nowdays, too bad dominos turned into melta-only useful)

There are alot of possible setups now, and I think it will be more varied then old WD "codex", plus the traits and relics are quite diverse and pretty good (and actually balanced to each other, unlike farsights "1 insane, 1 decent, 4 trash" traits)

Just give them some damn AA unit GW, comon. you dropped the ball hard there.

And dont bother giving your dominos the extra act of faith, there is no way in hell people will let them live to fire again XD
(BTW, if you fail the test, does it waste your AoF, or can you try again next time?)
(and does anyone get fixed trait?)

If you fail the AoF test you can't try again.

Very happy overall. Some models (HBs) will be shelved for a while, and it's looking like a triple exorcists edition, but overall I'm very please.

I can't decided how how to run Doms, at a glance it clearly should be 4 meltas in a mm imoo and a simulacrum imp, but wait. Immos have no fire points so you're gonna have to jump out to shoot the 4 meltas, and as we all know once you get out you can be pasted qucikly, so do you need a Simulacrum is you're just gonna die?

I reckon there's a place for a simulacrum in a squad in a rhino as you can fire out the fire points once, and then hopefully again later on (probably once your rhino has gone pop?)...

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

D

Question - how badly have Retributors really been nerfed?

They still have rending, and they can use it 1-2 times.

But how often did they actually get their Act of Faith anyway?
With the random 1-6pts, and the often 50/50 odds of it working - how many times a game did it actually work?

 Ovion wrote:
Question - how badly have Retributors really been nerfed?

They still have rending, and they can use it 1-2 times.

But how often did they actually get their Act of Faith anyway?
With the random 1-6pts, and the often 50/50 odds of it working - how many times a game did it actually work?

It's also the points increase though. A 10 sister unit with 4 hb was running 145 before. Now with a sim you're looking at 170 or 180 (180 if you want a Vet SS to make those AoF easier to pass).

Funnily enough my Rets rarely died so I would usually get atleast 3 rounds where I passed my act, but even when you pass the act you're still only rending on a 6...so now you only get it twice at the most and from that you'll get how many rending shots? And it's costing you more?

Nah.

D

I prefer 3 Exorcists now.

 Ovion wrote:
Question - how badly have Retributors really been nerfed?

They still have rending, and they can use it 1-2 times.

But how often did they actually get their Act of Faith anyway?
With the random 1-6pts, and the often 50/50 odds of it working - how many times a game did it actually work?

To be quite honest I never used AoF myself, I follow the nicety of rolling for faith points but never really used them.

If they worked they worked, but usually they didn't. I didn't bother with it, which seems like a waste of a potential benefit but it was so unreliable I personally felt like it wasn't worth my time, but I know it probably would have been better to have at least tried sometimes.(at least on the dom's anyway)

I just downloaded my copy, I have not read it yet but it sounds like at least we'll get a guaranteed chance of actually using our AoF when we actually need it instead of it being a crapshoot every turn.

I had to go in an inventory my sisters to make sure I had enough for my lists. Plenty of sisters, but need more immolators.

 pretre wrote:
Plenty of sisters, but need more immolators.

This seems to be theme of the new codex. I thought I had plenty, but you really want every single of your squads in one.

 evildrcheese wrote:


I can't decided how how to run Doms, at a glance it clearly should be 4 meltas in a mm imoo and a simulacrum imp, but wait. Immos have no fire points so you're gonna have to jump out to shoot the 4 meltas, and as we all know once you get out you can be pasted qucikly, so do you need a Simulacrum is you're just gonna die?

I reckon there's a place for a simulacrum in a squad in a rhino as you can fire out the fire points once, and then hopefully again later on (probably once your rhino has gone pop?)...

Anyone got any thoughts on this?

I am thinking a Laud Hailer on their Immolator - it gives the re-roll for AOF rather than the Simularcums extra one as we all know you likely won't get a second round of shotting ?

I think that Doms in a rhino will be pretty decent as well.
6 Doms, 4 Melta, Simulacrum and VSS in a rhino with Priest would be nice.

Keeps you from getting pasted and makes you fearless for when your vehicle gets popped so you don't get pinned.

Hm. So, 6 squads of 6 (or 5, just put hte last sister in as an ablative wound ), all in immolators for troops slots-- think it can work?

Then add in celestians, dominions/seraphim, and a heavily equipped canoness with command squad (or two command squads if it's possible), all in immolators, plus three exorcists...

 Melissia wrote:
Hm. So, 6 squads of 6 (or 5, just put hte last sister in as an ablative wound ), all in immolators for troops slots-- think it can work?

Sounds like fun for one player How many poiints is that?

 Melissia wrote:
Hm. So, 6 squads of 6 (or 5, just put hte last sister in as an ablative wound ), all in immolators for troops slots-- think it can work?

Definitely, if that's how you want to do it.

I think that's the briliance of this new list. Viable builds:
Immo spam? Check.
Big squads with priests? Check
Mixed Mech? Check
Allied guard shenanigans? Check
AV13 spam with Forgeworld? Check

Plenty of variety.

Heck, you even get more options for HQs, no more auto-include...
Celestine? Still good as an area buffer and challenge soaker.
Jacobus? Crazy buffer
Canoness? Great buffer, great tank. Even better than celestine for tanking and has great buffs.
Command Squad? Great buffer and good utility. Awesome with big blob army.
Priests? Holy crap.

People wanted variety and I think they got it. Even the easy bake oven is back.

I don't have a copy of the codex on me (I'm saving up for my next payment on college debt), so someone else will have to calculate it.

Here's the rough idea:

HQ:
Canoness w/Blade of Admonition, loaded with other equipment.
Celestian Command Squad w/Power Weapons, Immolator (TLHB)

Elites:
Celestians w/Flamers, Combimelta VSS Immolator (TLHF)
Celestians w/Flamers, Combimelta VSS Immolator (TLHF)
Celestians w/Flamers, Combimelta VSS Immolator (TLHF)

Troops:
BSS W/Meltaguns, Combiflamer VSS Immolator (TLHB)
BSS W/Meltaguns, Combiflamer VSS Immolator (TLHB)
BSS W/Meltaguns, Combiflamer VSS Immolator (TLHB)
BSS W/Meltaguns, Combiflamer VSS Immolator (TLHB)
BSS W/Meltaguns, Combiflamer VSS Immolator (TLHB)
BSS W/Meltaguns, Combiflamer VSS Immolator (TLHB)

Fast Attack:
Dominions w/Meltaguns, Combimelta VSS, Immolator (TLMM)
Dominions w/Meltaguns, Combimelta VSS, Immolator (TLMM)
Dominions w/Meltaguns, Combimelta VSS, Immolator (TLMM)

Heavy Support:
Exorcist
Exorcist
Exorcist


Add priests as necessary (probably to the Celestians and a couple of the BSS, or celestians and dominions if you are facing lots of vehicles with Jink).

That's a lot of points. Each of those doms is 180-200 The BSS is about 150-170.

That's a fair point. Could probably drop a few of the BSS and a celestian squad to save points (maybe even dropping an exorcist, with this many dominion squads), for a 2k sized game...


Automatically Appended Next Post:
I hope the Army Builder guys are going to do an update for htis in a month or so, will help me play around with it more easily

Unlike the White Dwarf codex, this one is making me like it a little more every time I read about it.

This sucks to be honest. This book was short, sweet, and to the point and now I would need a small fortune to build it. GW really could have made solid money on this book with plastics. Lots of flavor and even bad things look fun... Rage Dreads with a 6++ yes please. Repentia are still bad but I like rage and FnP AoF.

I could see solid AS ally lists. Good update.

Are the Celestians worth taking?

I think they are, especially with a priest and flamers.

BURN IT DOWN BABY BURN IT DOWN.

More calmly: nice to have a niche for Celestian Squads.

Or a command squad with one Imagifer and the other four Celestians toting Heavy Flamers....

tiber55 wrote:
can anyone please explain exactly what the wording is on the new anti psyker gun.

How does it allocate the perils if it hits.

Units with the Psyker, Brotherhood of Psykers, or Psychic Pilot special rules hit by [the Condemnor] suffers the Perils of the Warp in addition to any other damage.

So, at least for now, the entire unit suffers Perils.

Celestians make good heavy weapons squads when spamming Exorcists.

Units aren't affected by it though, individual models are. Well that's more for YMDC I guess.