Good DW models, Dealer, I like the Librarian conversion ideas

Seeing the closeup photos of the new Patriarch I recognized they gave him a head similiar to the 2nd Ed Zoanthrope design. Also very different to the last Broodlord and the 1st Ed Patriarch models.





The Space Hulk one

The models all look pretty sweet. Im a little disapointed that there is not an Apothecary, but I'll live.

I know its a GW battle report and the marines were destined to win but holy hell does this game look one sided. Still as long as I get my GS cult models I don't really mind.

 dragqueeninspace wrote:
I know it's a GW battle report and the marines were destined to win but holy hell does this game look one sided. Still as long as I get my GS cult models I don't really mind.

To be honest, it's pretty much how you'd expect a fight between poorly equipped, poorly trained cultists and Astartes to go. That and the dice gods can be truly cruel.

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
The models all look pretty sweet. Im a little disapointed that there is not an Apothecary, but I'll live.

Agreed, could have done without the bike if we had gotten an apothecary tbh, but that might be just me, don't like the white scars that much to begin with.

Hoping if we get a full deathwatch codex later this year that we can take apothecaries..

I'm still cracking up that the name scroll on the Blood Ravens Librarian's shin says "VIDYA"

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
The models all look pretty sweet. Im a little disapointed that there is not an Apothecary, but I'll live.

Ah! Good point. It would have been nice if the Blood Angel had been an Apothecary.

 lancebenchpress wrote:
I'm still cracking up that the name scroll on the Blood Ravens Librarian's shin says "VIDYA"

Been that way for a while.

M0ff3l wrote:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
The models all look pretty sweet. Im a little disapointed that there is not an Apothecary, but I'll live.

Agreed, could have done without the bike if we had gotten an apothecary tbh, but that might be just me, don't like the white scars that much to begin with.

Hoping if we get a full deathwatch codex later this year that we can take apothecaries..

I just could have done with out the bike (or the Single Terminator) cause it doesnt mesh well over all with how the teams seem to work. White Scars I am indifferent towards. I agree that hopefully they get rules at somepoint.

H.B.M.C. wrote:

 VictorVonTzeentch wrote:
The models all look pretty sweet. Im a little disapointed that there is not an Apothecary, but I'll live.

Ah! Good point. It would have been nice if the Blood Angel had been an Apothecary.

Yeah, the Blood Angel would probably have been the best choice for that out of the group.

The BA marine should have been a Jump Pack Apothecary. Best of both worlds.

Or mainstreamed FW and replaced the UM Sternguard with a Red Scorpion Apothecary.

Warhams-77 wrote:

Spoiler:

Such a beautiful mini. The subtle OSL while he manifests a psychic power, and the composition as a whole is superb. The pose is menacing, and I love the subtle homage to the GS cult symbol. I can't imagine that any Tyranid player wouldn't want this model in their army. It'll be interesting to see what some of these models command on eBay after boxes get broken down and parted out.

 H.B.M.C. wrote:
I'm still cracking up that the name scroll on the Blood Ravens Librarian's shin says "VIDYA"

Been that way for a while.

Interesting. Cheers for the link HBMC

 MajorWesJanson wrote:
Or mainstreamed FW and replaced the UM Sternguard with a Red Scorpion Apothecary.

Also acceptable. I would have preferred the Imperial Fist was the Sternguard, to be honest.

These two bozos are really draining the fun out of this video

 streetsamurai wrote:
These two bozos are really draining the fun out of this video

Harsh much?

 streetsamurai wrote:
These two bozos are really draining the fun out of this video

Really? I liked their play through for BaC----one of the reasons I wound up getting that set, for the game as they had demonstrated in that vid.
I like their back and forth but can see that it might annoy some folks. I know there's a certain scriptedness but they are good, to me, at making it look like they're having fun.

 privateer4hire wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
These two bozos are really draining the fun out of this video

Really? I liked their play through for BaC----one of the reasons I wound up getting that set, for the game as they had demonstrated in that vid.
I like their back and forth but can see that it might annoy some folks. I know there's a certain scriptedness but they are good, to me, at making it look like they're having fun.

Weirdly enough, I liked the BAC video, I think that the third guy in that video was making it sound more professionnal.

 streetsamurai wrote:

 privateer4hire wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:
These two bozos are really draining the fun out of this video

Really? I liked their play through for BaC----one of the reasons I wound up getting that set, for the game as they had demonstrated in that vid.
I like their back and forth but can see that it might annoy some folks. I know there's a certain scriptedness but they are good, to me, at making it look like they're having fun.

Weirdly enough, I liked the BAC video, I think that the third guy in that video was making it sound more professional.

Well, the mechanics of the BaC are different to DWO, so perhaps needed a little more explaining?

 the_Armyman wrote:

Warhams-77 wrote:

Spoiler:

Such a beautiful mini. The subtle OSL while he manifests a psychic power, and the composition as a whole is superb. The pose is menacing, and I love the subtle homage to the GS cult symbol. I can't imagine that any Tyranid player wouldn't want this model in their army. It'll be interesting to see what some of these models command on eBay after boxes get broken down and parted out.

Lovely model, well worth buying the game for this model and some of the other sculpts...really interested to see some of the conversions in the next few weeks. Can see the pipe being added to a larger industrial scenery base

 dragqueeninspace wrote:
I know its a GW battle report and the marines were destined to win but holy hell does this game look one sided. Still as long as I get my GS cult models I don't really mind.

Aye, seems as if as long as the Deathwatch player picks the right models for the scenario and grasps basic target priority there's not much the Cult player can do except put models down and immediately pick them back up again. I mean sure, they're poorly equipped and dice gods etc etc, but most of the Cult guys never even got to make more than one attack(and many never even got that). Good thing I give zero gaks about the game aspect of the box.

Dem models though... Proper sprue pics would have been good, but even with the GW studio paintjobs they look incredible.

I didn't like that there seems to be no LoS, but I'll probably only play a few times before moving the cult over to join the Space Hulk horde anyway.

The pieces all really do like look great. The nostalgia value paired with new-tech models is a real winner.

Pity that in NZ we can only get Deathwatch Overpriced.

Am I the only one that is going to cut the heads off helmetless marines and replace them with helmeted heads? At least the majority of them. The WS, BR, and Cassius are about the only ones that get to be without helmets.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 dragqueeninspace wrote:
I know its a GW battle report and the marines were destined to win but holy hell does this game look one sided. Still as long as I get my GS cult models I don't really mind.

Aye, seems as if as long as the Deathwatch player picks the right models for the scenario and grasps basic target priority there's not much the Cult player can do except put models down and immediately pick them back up again. I mean sure, they're poorly equipped and dice gods etc etc, but most of the Cult guys never even got to make more than one attack(and many never even got that). Good thing I give zero gaks about the game aspect of the box.

Dem models though... Proper sprue pics would have been good, but even with the GW studio paintjobs they look incredible.

They also mentioned a few times that the GSC player had a finite amount of cult members for this mission, which makes me think there will be other missions where the board gets flooded with GSC and evens the odds.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Am I the only one that is going to cut the heads off helmetless marines and replace them with helmeted heads? At least the majority of them. The WS, BR, and Cassius are about the only ones that get to be without helmets.

Space Wolves almost never wear helmets, so that guy is fine for my tastes. The Iron Hand dude would probably look better with a teched-out helmet, like one of the new devastator's.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Am I the only one that is going to cut the heads off helmetless marines and replace them with helmeted heads? At least the majority of them. The WS, BR, and Cassius are about the only ones that get to be without helmets.

I HATE Marines that don't wear helmets.

You're completely reasonable.

BaronVonSnakPak wrote:
Space Wolves almost never wear helmets, so that guy is fine for my tastes. The Iron Hand dude would probably look better with a teched-out helmet, like one of the new devastator's.

Yeah, the Wolf is keeping his regular head. I have just the right helmet for the Iron Hand. Lots of good Sternguard helmets to choose from.

With the Deathwatch marines so specifically being "Kill Team: Cassius"... anyone else imagining a series of expansions presenting other kill teams? I just picture other Kill Teams when combined with these miniatures might present something that translates better to 40k. Things like a Blood Angel Apothecary, a Iron Hands Techmarine, a Dark Angels Ravenwing Biker, a Dark Angel Deathwing terminator... seem like absent characterizations. You take something like the Ravenwing biker, and then some other biker... alongside the Whitescar you've got a squad.

I would love to see expansions that consist of of different kill teams and different xenos adversaries. That way someone could play Kill Team Cassius against Orks or Eldar, or someone could play the Ghosar Brood against Kill Team Kantor. Each expansion would include more tiles and game scenarios.

 aka_mythos wrote:
With the Deathwatch marines so specifically being "Kill Team: Cassius"... anyone else imagining a series of expansions presenting other kill teams? I just picture other Kill Teams when combined with these miniatures might present something that translates better to 40k. Things like a Blood Angel Apothecary, a Iron Hands Techmarine, a Dark Angels Ravenwing Biker, a Dark Angel Deathwing terminator... seem like absent characterizations. You take something like the Ravenwing biker, and then some other biker... alongside the Whitescar you've got a squad.

That'd be pretty cool. I know DW are suppose to be small elite squads, but it'd be cool to see a full-on faction for them.

Would like to see their Inquistion masters brought into play

 the_Armyman wrote:

Such a beautiful mini. The subtle OSL while he manifests a psychic power, and the composition as a whole is superb. The pose is menacing, and I love the subtle homage to the GS cult symbol. I can't imagine that any Tyranid player wouldn't want this model in their army. It'll be interesting to see what some of these models command on eBay after boxes get broken down and parted out.

The lighting on his brain is really amazing. No idea how one would approach that technique.

T

timd wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:

Such a beautiful mini. The subtle OSL while he manifests a psychic power, and the composition as a whole is superb. The pose is menacing, and I love the subtle homage to the GS cult symbol. I can't imagine that any Tyranid player wouldn't want this model in their army. It'll be interesting to see what some of these models command on eBay after boxes get broken down and parted out.

The lighting on his brain is really amazing. No idea how one would approach that technique.

T

Quick blast with an airbrush.

Sprues Pics+ Gameplay have convinced me. I'm in. Even if I have to do a little song and dance to appease trade restrictions or whatever nonsense. Still found a decent price so that helps.

Any one have any examples of gene-stealer cult colour schemes outside of the main purple and blue? Do they just follow Tyranid colour schemes traditionally?

They tend to follow Tyranid color schemes.

 Imateria wrote:

timd wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:

Such a beautiful mini. The subtle OSL while he manifests a psychic power, and the composition as a whole is superb. The pose is menacing, and I love the subtle homage to the GS cult symbol. I can't imagine that any Tyranid player wouldn't want this model in their army. It'll be interesting to see what some of these models command on eBay after boxes get broken down and parted out.

The lighting on his brain is really amazing. No idea how one would approach that technique.

T

Quick blast with an airbrush.

Model in the picture is definitely not painted like that though.

 NobodyXY wrote:
Sprues Pics+ Gameplay have convinced me. I'm in. Even if I have to do a little song and dance to appease trade restrictions or whatever nonsense. Still found a decent price so that helps.

Has anyone any examples of gene-stealer cult colour schemes outside of the main purple and blue? Do they just follow Tyranid colour schemes traditionally?

Genestealer broods that are already planetside when the invasion begins can be different in appearance to those of a hive fleet. The Genestealers planetside will generally fall under the control of that fleet when they're close enough.
Lictors and Genestealers both act as beacons to the Hive Mind


Automatically Appended Next Post:

timd wrote:

The lighting on his brain is really amazing. No idea how one would approach that technique.

T

I'm guessing either a dry brush or they used an xs artificer brush for highlighting.

timd wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:

Such a beautiful mini. The subtle OSL while he manifests a psychic power, and the composition as a whole is superb. The pose is menacing, and I love the subtle homage to the GS cult symbol. I can't imagine that any Tyranid player wouldn't want this model in their army. It'll be interesting to see what some of these models command on eBay after boxes get broken down and parted out.

The lighting on his brain is really amazing. No idea how one would approach that technique.

T

If would try highlighting from the purple through to flesh (Cadian fleshtone and Kislev Flesh), then through to bone (Ushabti Bone and Screaming Skull) - probably with corner spots of an off-white like Pallid Wytch Flesh and then adding a soft yellow glaze probably thinned further with lahmian medium. At least, that's how I am planning to attempt it right now.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
The game play looks fun! I think the Genestealer player used his gambits very badly and didn't play aggressively enough.

Should be a fun tactical challenge to try and win with the Genestealer cult. I wonder if there are any campaign rules, like playing through all the missions but the marines that died in one mission not being available in later missions...

Anyone else notice the special edition with a book? Is that a compilation of the existing BL stuff or something new?

PRORDERED

NobodyXY wrote:Any one have any examples of gene-stealer cult colour schemes outside of the main purple and blue? Do they just follow Tyranid colour schemes traditionally?

IIRC when I stumbled on 40K in third ed, genestealer cults had already gone the way of the squats (or were little more than a Chapter Approved list), but genestealers were still the old purple 'n' blue scheme; alongside the studio nids that were purple 'n' red at the time.

Genestealers were one of the hooks that got me into 40K ("Oh, that's where those things in the Space Hulk console game come from"), but it was this pic in the 3rd ed book that really sold me on nids. Hits me right on the nostalgia. (IIRC the GW shop had already moved onto the grinner fexes. It was ages before I got a proper look at the original screamer-killers from that spread.)

Preordered from Element games for £79.99, added a pot of paint to go past the £80 free delivery threshold.

More minis to add to the painting backlog.

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:
Preordered from Element games for £79.99, added a pot of paint to go past the £80 free delivery threshold.

Genestealer Purple? :p


Automatically Appended Next Post:

ecurtz wrote:
I didn't like that there seems to be no LoS, but I'll probably only play a few times before moving the cult over to join the Space Hulk horde anyway.

It looks like the mine workings are gantries in an open cavern (also explaining how they can use jump packs), rather than tunnels.

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:
Preordered from Element games for £79.99, added a pot of paint to go past the £80 free delivery threshold.

More minis to add to the painting backlog.

Yep, I did exactly the same

EG link is here: http://elementgames.co.uk/wargames-and-miniatures-by-manufacturer/games-workshop/warhammer-40k/deathwatch-overkill

I ordered Kantor Blue as it's the first colour needed for Genestealers following this guide:

http://taleofpainters.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/tutorial-how-to-paint-space-hulk.html

As I aim to get this AND all the Space Hulk figures done in one glorious mission later in the year

So it seems that Darren Latham (@darrenlatham) designed the Genestealer cult minis. He did Ulrik too. His career at GW is looking more and more promising.

I'm seriously considering painting these in the traditional purple and blue. I'm not sure my homemade yellow and green colour scheme will work well unless I want hybrids to look like the old racist yellow Chinese.

 Slinky wrote:
As I aim to get this AND all the Space Hulk figures done in one glorious mission later in the year

I tried to do that in 2009 when Space Hulk came out. :I painted Squad Lorenzo, then did all 23 Genestealers - and was so put off by the whole thing that I didn't touch the rest until the next edition came out in 2014.

 durecellrabbit wrote:
I'm seriously considering painting these in the traditional purple and blue. I'm not sure my homemade yellow and green colour scheme will work well unless I want hybrids to look like the old racist yellow Chinese.

I can understand your concern! If I go with my old hive fleet colour plan, my hybrids will be black. Very black.
But in the way the studio-painted hybrids here aren't bright, saturated purple (the third and fourth generations seem more pale, starved of sunlight) I think you might get away with it if you don't go straight yellow, or the sickly greenish yellow used in old propaganda. Paint ranges have more subtle shades, suitable for yellowish skin tones of any ethnicity. Ungor flesh vs. Kislev flesh, for one example

If the 1st-2nd gen hybrids are made a bit more yellow, I think it'd be fairly easy to tell that's coming from the space-alien part of them, rather than any human.

Maybe paint all your existing Tyranids in the traditional scheme? That's what I'm going to do with my old 5th edition army that's in the loft -starting with my Genestealers, I'm going to drop them in dettol and repaint them blues and purples. If I start to add Tyranids I'll do them in the 2nd edition colours (red flesh and bone carapace). - but that's a long way off as I have 50 cultists to paint first!

Gyaah so excited >.<!! Gotta finish off my projects this week like a madman. Want to jump head first into this the moment I have it in my hand!>

Well I ordered 1 box. We'll see if another one is warranted when the first one arrives.

 Slinky wrote:

 Undead_Love-Machine wrote:
Preordered from Element games for £79.99, added a pot of paint to go past the £80 free delivery threshold.

More minis to add to the painting backlog.

Yep, I did exactly the same

EG link is here: http://elementgames.co.uk/wargames-and-miniatures-by-manufacturer/games-workshop/warhammer-40k/deathwatch-overkill

I ordered Kantor Blue as it's the first colour needed for Genestealers following this guide:

http://taleofpainters.blogspot.co.uk/2014/09/tutorial-how-to-paint-space-hulk.html

As I aim to get this AND all the Space Hulk figures done in one glorious mission later in the year

Another way to do it is to paint the fleshy areas Ulthuan Grey, then wash with Druchi Violet, then drybrush with Lucius Lilac. Quick and effective, especially if you do a production line.

 NobodyXY wrote:
Sprues Pics+ Gameplay have convinced me. I'm in. Even if I have to do a little song and dance to appease trade restrictions or whatever nonsense. Still found a decent price so that helps.

Any one have any examples of gene-stealer cult colour schemes outside of the main purple and blue? Do they just follow Tyranid colour schemes traditionally?

I would say a good way to go on the color of the GSC would be a blend between the colors of the hive fleet and "natural" human skin tones.

 AndrewGPaul wrote:

ecurtz wrote:
I didn't like that there seems to be no LoS, but I'll probably only play a few times before moving the cult over to join the Space Hulk horde anyway.

It looks like the mine workings are gantries in an open cavern (also explaining how they can use jump packs), rather than tunnels.

Ah!, Good theory. Of course that makes the bike even more ridiculous, but that was already silly.

Finished watching the full playthrough last night.
Really interested in the game and the GSC but was thinking I might be able to get away with using my BaC and Space Hulk marines for everything except for the bike and jump pack gus.

Don't know if buying GSC and the board game bits and a bike and a jump packer separately winds up saving me anything other than painting time.

The SMs look super but, to me, they're just another 11 models I have to paint before the game looks nice on the table.

Not sure if the Deathwatch formation is worth it, since its 535 pts for just 11 Marines.

FYI North American Pre-orders are up, also FYI, GWs site is being slammed so if you need to recover your password you are SOL lol...

Chikout wrote:
So it seems that Darren Latham (@darrenlatham) designed the Genestealer cult minis. He did Ulrik too. His career at GW is looking more and more promising.

Seems like he's a tremendous addtion

Got to see the models first hand in store today as the staff were working on them, they look amazing, pre ordered a box and can't wait to get my hands on them next week.

 wuestenfux wrote:
Not sure if the Deathwatch formation is worth it, since its 535 pts for just 11 Marines.

That is a lot of points, but most of the models have Special Ammunition and everything rerolls 1s to-wound/ to-pen. Overall, the formation is a little disappointing, but it's definitely fluffy.

I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

I'll be doing the 'stealers black and white to match the Tyranid scheme I'm working on.

For the 'Cult I'll be trying to do human tones (different races) and then tone down to the white. Maybe have blotches that look like sun spots for early generations.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

Just Heroic Intervention. It is the better version of it though.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

Just Heroic Intervention. It is the better version of it though.

Lame. Everyone else has ways to show what Chapter they came from.

 durecellrabbit wrote:
I'm seriously considering painting these in the traditional purple and blue. I'm not sure my homemade yellow and green colour scheme will work well unless I want hybrids to look like the old racist yellow Chinese.

One thing you can do with a purple and blue scheme is add a neutral to tone down the overall effect. In my case I used khaki, which also warmed up the scheme a little. I used purple as a spot color.








I chuckled a little to see the studio painted some of their hybrids with tan carapaces, blue clothes and brown bases.

Really looking forward to gtting this later on - summerish maybe. Hoping hte fethig thing is still about!!! Gonna make the hybrids of the same kin as my Space Hulk 'stealers. Never was a fan of the classic/original purple & blue



Reckon the pale skin tones should fit the denizns of a mining colony pretty well

That black and white scheme looks pretty boss!

For mine, I went with three separate palettes of slight variation on the classic stealer scheme. Nothing drastic, just pulling towards indigo a little on one end and aqua/green a little on the other. The key for me was making sure that there was a generational transition towards human skin tone, and also a transition in the carapace from dark blue to a bone'ish color with the mildest tint to blue in 3rd gens. This way each generation had it's own scheme, but it was in context of everything around it. It makes each gen stand out from one another which is something I liked a lot.

My notes for anyone interested -





Uniforms similarly, 3 schemes in a similar pallete, mix and match clothes and leathers over white ceramic armor -

That Stealer priest thing would make a great Primaris Psyker. Just replace all them xenos iconography with Aquilas, add more purity seals, transplant a new, non derpy looking head and ta-daa

Does anyone remember how brother Artemis was designed? 'cause I thought that thought process was brilliant (or at least nicely aspirational) how they divided his armor and equipment into archaic and futuristic halves, and seeing the mishmash of stuff they've done with it is... just a bit painful. It's just a fancy shoulder pad now.

Sooooo basically you have a 3 discipline psyker, a less than decent hq, a pointless jump pack unit and one troop choice, forcing the formation on you.



m'kay

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

Just Heroic Intervention. It is the better version of it though.

Lame. Everyone else has ways to show what Chapter they came from.

He's got a hand flamer, they're pretty Blood Angel.

 Vermis wrote:

 durecellrabbit wrote:
I'm seriously considering painting these in the traditional purple and blue. I'm not sure my homemade yellow and green colour scheme will work well unless I want hybrids to look like the old racist yellow Chinese.

I can understand your concern! If I go with my old hive fleet colour plan, my hybrids will be black. Very black.
But in the way the studio-painted hybrids here aren't bright, saturated purple (the third and fourth generations seem more pale, starved of sunlight) I think you might get away with it if you don't go straight yellow, or the sickly greenish yellow used in old propaganda. Paint ranges have more subtle shades, suitable for yellowish skin tones of any ethnicity. Ungor flesh vs. Kislev flesh, for one example

If the 1st-2nd gen hybrids are made a bit more yellow, I think it'd be fairly easy to tell that's coming from the space-alien part of them, rather than any human.

Originally I did think of trying to mix between my yellow and ordinary flesh paint but wasn't really sure it would work well with my painting skill. I never consider using looking for naturally yellow skin paints though. I've got most of the VGC range so I'll have a look and see what I can find. Thanks for the idea.

CragHack wrote:
That Stealer priest thing would make a great Primaris Psyker. Just replace all them xenos iconography with Aquilas, add more purity seals, transplant a new, non derpy looking head and ta-daa

Exactly what I'm planning to do with him!

currently trying to work out if the aquila from top of this will be too big for the top of his staff or not...

The Blood Angel has furious charge IIRC.

Not sure if it was mentioned, but it does appear I was right about picking your Deathwatch team members each mission. Got this screen grab from the pre-order trailer.

 Bull0 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

Just Heroic Intervention. It is the better version of it though.

Lame. Everyone else has ways to show what Chapter they came from.

He's got a hand flamer, they're pretty Blood Angel.

Huh. My phone autocorrected "Raven" to "Angel". My bad.

Hmm, well unless there are missions that are literally only one or two tiles or the other KT members have some insane abilities, I don't see why you'd ever leave home without Cassius, the IF, and the Salamander; Cassius' buff looks really useful and he gives you a CC-fighter with a 2+ save, the IF gives you the choice of blast or multi-shot at longer range and the Sally gives you blast and a single ignore-armour shot at shorter range. And a powerfist. Seems like the only real choice involved is which of the 3 fast Marines do you want to give the teleport homer to, and pick that as your fourth.

I mean, why would you ever choose a guy with a Bolter, special ammo or not, over that Frag Cannon?

 Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, well unless there are missions that are literally only one or two tiles or the other KT members have some insane abilities, I don't see why you'd ever leave home without Cassius, the IF, and the Salamander; Cassius' buff looks really useful and he gives you a CC-fighter with a 2+ save, the IF gives you the choice of blast or multi-shot at longer range and the Sally gives you blast and a single ignore-armour shot at shorter range. And a powerfist. Seems like the only real choice involved is which of the 3 fast Marines do you want to give the teleport homer to, and pick that as your fourth.

I mean, why would you ever choose a guy with a Bolter, special ammo or not, over that Frag Cannon?

Forging the narrative?

The formation makes me concerned, cuz forcing them all into one unit negates the bike and jump packs (or at least severely hampering them).

Is this game "limited edition" ?

 Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, well unless there are missions that are literally only one or two tiles or the other KT members have some insane abilities, I don't see why you'd ever leave home without Cassius, the IF, and the Salamander; Cassius' buff looks really useful and he gives you a CC-fighter with a 2+ save, the IF gives you the choice of blast or multi-shot at longer range and the Sally gives you blast and a single ignore-armour shot at shorter range. And a powerfist. Seems like the only real choice involved is which of the 3 fast Marines do you want to give the teleport homer to, and pick that as your fourth.

I mean, why would you ever choose a guy with a Bolter, special ammo or not, over that Frag Cannon?

If you had limited time and needed to have the faster team members race across the board to do something as objectives in the game?
Also, it looks like the GSC player needs to be smart about use of their cards AND would have a little different challenge in missions (unlike the playthrough) where they have unlimited troop recycling.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 Bull0 wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

Just Heroic Intervention. It is the better version of it though.

Lame. Everyone else has ways to show what Chapter they came from.

He's got a hand flamer, they're pretty Blood Angel.

Huh. My phone autocorrected "Raven" to "Angel". My bad.

He does have Furious Charge as well. Which is the only thing differentiating a BA from a regular Marine.

 Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, well unless there are missions that are literally only one or two tiles or the other KT members have some insane abilities, I don't see why you'd ever leave home without Cassius, the IF, and the Salamander; Cassius' buff looks really useful and he gives you a CC-fighter with a 2+ save, the IF gives you the choice of blast or multi-shot at longer range and the Sally gives you blast and a single ignore-armour shot at shorter range. And a powerfist. Seems like the only real choice involved is which of the 3 fast Marines do you want to give the teleport homer to, and pick that as your fourth.

I mean, why would you ever choose a guy with a Bolter, special ammo or not, over that Frag Cannon?

Well, we haven't seen the missions, for one thing, so there may be ones where you need to move quickly, or where you can't shoot because of dangerous gasses, or whatever.

Then, to me, the fact that there is a card for each Marine, with a Hale and Wounded side, suggests that you could do the missions in order. You might get someone wounded in mission one, and killed in mission five, and not available for use after that! Using your best guys in each mission would just get them worn down and killed if that's the case!

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
The formation makes me concerned, cuz forcing them all into one unit negates the bike and jump packs (or at least severely hampering them).

Then don't run them as the formation.
The Jump Pack models, Terminator and Biker are all their own options. Both Jump Packers and the Terminator are Elite choices and the Biker is Fast Attack.

The Imperial Fist, Dark Angel, Space Wolf, Iron Hand, and Ultramarine Sternguard are all a single Troops choice.
Cassius and the Librarian are HQs.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
The formation makes me concerned, cuz forcing them all into one unit negates the bike and jump packs (or at least severely hampering them).

Then don't run them as the formation.
The Jump Pack models, Terminator and Biker are all their own options. Both Jump Packers and the Terminator are Elite choices and the Biker is Fast Attack.

The Imperial Fist, Dark Angel, Space Wolf, Iron Hand, and Ultramarine Sternguard are all a single Troops choice.
Cassius and the Librarian are HQs.

The problem with running most of these guys solo is that only the Libby and Cassius are ICs, so the other would just be one model running around the board dodging fire.

Which is AWESOME since they are deathwatch and they don't normally have huge units of dudes running around.

I so want to play against them with my Harlequins

 Imateria wrote:

timd wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:

Such a beautiful mini. The subtle OSL while he manifests a psychic power, and the composition as a whole is superb. The pose is menacing, and I love the subtle homage to the GS cult symbol. I can't imagine that any Tyranid player wouldn't want this model in their army. It'll be interesting to see what some of these models command on eBay after boxes get broken down and parted out.

The lighting on his brain is really amazing. No idea how one would approach that technique.

T

Quick blast with an airbrush.

Take another close look. Its far more complex than a simple airbrush blast.

T


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MajorTom11 wrote:
That black and white scheme looks pretty boss!

For mine, I went with three separate palettes of slight variation on the classic stealer scheme. Nothing drastic, just pulling towards indigo a little on one end and aqua/green a little on the other. The key for me was making sure that there was a generational transition towards human skin tone, and also a transition in the carapace from dark blue to a bone'ish color with the mildest tint to blue in 3rd gens. This way each generation had it's own scheme, but it was in context of everything around it. It makes each gen stand out from one another which is something I liked a lot.

My notes for anyone interested -

Very impressive! Is there a basic paint colors list to go along with the palettes?

T


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Tyran wrote:
They tend to follow Tyranid color schemes.

At the time of the GSC, there was really only one Tyranid cannon color scheme and since the GSC was all birthed from the original blue/purple genestealers the GSC was based on those colors. Now? who knows...?

T

 Kanluwen wrote:

 MechaEmperor7000 wrote:
The formation makes me concerned, cuz forcing them all into one unit negates the bike and jump packs (or at least severely hampering them).

Then don't run them as the formation.
The Jump Pack models, Terminator and Biker are all their own options. Both Jump Packers and the Terminator are Elite choices and the Biker is Fast Attack.

The Imperial Fist, Dark Angel, Space Wolf, Iron Hand, and Ultramarine Sternguard are all a single Troops choice.
Cassius and the Librarian are HQs.

You eithe run the formation or have to run them as an allied detachment, meaning you still need to take Squad Donatus and one of the HQs.

Can't just pay 60 points to get a deep striking melta and heavy flamer!

timd wrote:

At the time of the GSC, there was really only one Tyranid cannon color scheme and since the GSC was all birthed from the original blue/purple genestealers the GSC was based on those colors. Now? who knows...?

Other Tyranid Hive Fleets also have seeded the galaxy with their own Genestealers, in the "current" Warhammer galaxy, a GSC could have been birthed a large varieties of possible Hive Fleets, even ones that had yet to enter the galaxy.

Da Butcha wrote:

Then, to me, the fact that there is a card for each Marine, with a Hale and Wounded side, suggests that you could do the missions in order. You might get someone wounded in mission one, and killed in mission five, and not available for use after that! Using your best guys in each mission would just get them worn down and killed if that's the case!

Yes! This is how I think it would be most fun to play too :-)

 EnTyme wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Not sure if the Deathwatch formation is worth it, since its 535 pts for just 11 Marines.

That is a lot of points, but most of the models have Special Ammunition and everything rerolls 1s to-wound/ to-pen. Overall, the formation is a little disappointing, but it's definitely fluffy.

I think the only way to play the Deathwatch models in a 40k game is to make use of the formation.

 wuestenfux wrote:

 EnTyme wrote:

 wuestenfux wrote:
Not sure if the Deathwatch formation is worth it, since its 535 pts for just 11 Marines.

That is a lot of points, but most of the models have Special Ammunition and everything rerolls 1s to-wound/ to-pen. Overall, the formation is a little disappointing, but it's definitely fluffy.

I think the only way to play the Deathwatch models in a 40k game is to make use of the formation.

No, they have their own dateslates too.

 Yodhrin wrote:
Hmm, well unless there are missions that are literally only one or two tiles or the other KT members have some insane abilities, I don't see why you'd ever leave home without Cassius, the IF, and the Salamander; Cassius' buff looks really useful and he gives you a CC-fighter with a 2+ save, the IF gives you the choice of blast or multi-shot at longer range and the Sally gives you blast and a single ignore-armour shot at shorter range. And a powerfist. Seems like the only real choice involved is which of the 3 fast Marines do you want to give the teleport homer to, and pick that as your fourth.

I mean, why would you ever choose a guy with a Bolter, special ammo or not, over that Frag Cannon?

Cassius has only combat range though, which is prob about 6 inches at a guess, the Salamander is slow,speed 1, the IF has rubbish assault value.... I don't doubt there are going to be better teams than others, but the couple of games I saw yesterday in GW largely went "IF guy fires killing 2-3 guys, dies subsequently as cultist player looked at his card and targeted him mercilessly" . Stuff like gambits can reduce ranges or shut down firing altogether.

Am I the only one wondering how to combine the cultists and the Assassinorum assassins into a game to recreate the old Black Library novel ?


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Yeah the DW characters are a unit of 5, a fast attack choice, elites and 2 HQ, so no need to use formation. All in White Dwarf, it's well worth £2.40 for a printed copy in decent quality!

This is not confirmed by photos yet but I trust the person posting this on the german GW-Fanworld forum. WD 110 has arrived in some places. Scans could pop up here and there soonish. So I post a translation of what Otis has seen, just to give an idea what the GC formation will be about. There may be mistakes and/or things missing. This is a loose translation containing the info he had shared.

~600 points. Combined GC models from the box. All have Infiltrate, Stealth, Shrouded (the latter until the beginning of their 2nd turn). Everyone may charge after infiltrating. Patriarch and Purestrain Genestealers may infiltrate up to 1" next to enemy models.

http://www.gw-fanworld.net/showthread.php/211707-Diskussion-Symbiontenkulte-vs-Deathwatch-Brettspiel?p=3528371&viewfull=1#post3528371

This is a lot like they could be played in 1st Edition. Infiltrating close to enemy units and being allowed to charge afterwards could fix the issues with the current Genestealers. As the Patriarch is an IC he can join the Purestrains.

There is no such thing as "other hive fleets". That classification is strictly a invention of the imperium used to give name and form to the devourer.

All hive fleets are a part of the single Hive Mind. Within a hive fleet, planet to planet (each invasion), hive ship to hive ship coloration can vary greatly.

There is no such thing as what any tyranid bioform should look like or be colored. They adapt and change, or not, in each environment. Anything goes.

Lance845 wrote:
There is no such thing as "other hive fleets". That classification is strictly a invention of the imperium used to give name and form to the devourer.

All hive fleets are a part of the single Hive Mind. Within a hive fleet, planet to planet (each invasion), hive ship to hive ship coloration can vary greatly.

There is no such thing as what any tyranid bioform should look like or be colored. They adapt and change, or not, in each environment. Anything goes.

Yes there is, while you are right that all Hive Fleets are part of a greater whole, the Hive Mind, each Hive Fleet is genetically different from the others thanks to the millennium or more time apart spent traveling the universe and eating stuff. And part of this genetic difference is the colors that characterize and differentiate Hive Fleets.

Warhams-77 wrote:
This is not confirmed by photos yet but I trust the person posting this on the german GW-Fanworld forum. WD 110 has arrived in some places. Scans could pop up here and there soonish. So I post a translation of what Otis has seen, just to give an idea what the GC formation will be about. There may be mistakes and/or things missing. This is a loose translation containing the info he had shared.

~600 points. Combined GC models from the box. All have Infiltrate, Stealth, Shrouded (the latter until the beginning of their 2nd turn). Everyone may charge after infiltrating. Patriarch and Purestrain Genestealers may infiltrate up to 1" next to enemy models.

http://www.gw-fanworld.net/showthread.php/211707-Diskussion-Symbiontenkulte-vs-Deathwatch-Brettspiel?p=3528371&viewfull=1#post3528371

This is a lot like they could be played in 1st Edition. Infiltrating close to enemy units and being allowed to charge afterwards could fix the issues with the current Genestealers. As the Patriarch is an IC he can join the Purestrains.

That sounds....over the top. Hey, we finally have a competitive assault army that isn't a death-star! Woo!

 MajorTom11 wrote:
That black and white scheme looks pretty boss!

For mine, I went with three separate palettes of slight variation on the classic stealer scheme. Nothing drastic, just pulling towards indigo a little on one end and aqua/green a little on the other. The key for me was making sure that there was a generational transition towards human skin tone, and also a transition in the carapace from dark blue to a bone'ish color with the mildest tint to blue in 3rd gens. This way each generation had it's own scheme, but it was in context of everything around it. It makes each gen stand out from one another which is something I liked a lot.

My notes for anyone interested -





Uniforms similarly, 3 schemes in a similar pallete, mix and match clothes and leathers over white ceramic armor -

Wow! That is some awesome design concept work. I thought ai put loads of thought in to models!!!!

Do you mind if I try and use it? I was about to go hunting for paint schemes because I'll need to buy some paints prior to being able to pull more traditional GS schemes off and could do with making up my element games order to above the £80

Can I query something though? Are there three palettes to introduce a little variability through the force or is it meant to be a "pick which one you like of the 3" situation?

They're still just cultists, though. I'm not convinced that it's all that scary just yet, but it doesn't sound terrible at least.

Dont take this as gospel for now, it is early info. And the Genestealers in that formation are only two models (as far as we know - it could be they are a unit of 2+ models but I doubt that), even by adding a Patriarch they arent that impressive. Better wait until we have photo leaks for proper evaluation.

Well the Acolytes are pretty ridiculous in close combat for their points and the Patriarch more than likely has base AP3-AP2 attacks given that he has unique Rending Claws. If the Purestrains are the same as regular Genestealers but are minimum two with optional added models they will still be pretty powerful too with guaranteed first turn charges and +3 to cover saves. Problem is that we have no idea what most of the units do at this point other than the Patriarch (somewhat) and the Acolytes. If the rest of the units follow the trend set by the Acolytes then it will be very nasty, but I agree we should probably wait until we have all the details to judge. Still, very exciting for Tyranid and Genestealer Cult players!

Warhams-77, any hints about new releases for next week?

Whats exactly coming next week is not known yet but Orcs & Goblins are getting a large, several week long AoS release soon. I posted the info from Darnok about it in the AoS thread. The last WD page teaser has not been leaked.

 Tyran wrote:

Lance845 wrote:
There is no such thing as "other hive fleets". That classification is strictly a invention of the imperium used to give name and form to the devourer.

All hive fleets are a part of the single Hive Mind. Within a hive fleet, planet to planet (each invasion), hive ship to hive ship coloration can vary greatly.

There is no such thing as what any tyranid bioform should look like or be colored. They adapt and change, or not, in each environment. Anything goes.

Yes there is, while you are right that all Hive Fleets are part of a greater whole, the Hive Mind, each Hive Fleet is genetically different from the others thanks to the millennium or more time apart spent traveling the universe and eating stuff. And part of this genetic difference is the colors that characterize and differentiate Hive Fleets.

Nope. The fluff specifically talks about how a hive fleet might change coloring on a specific planet. Or how a splinter fleet might break off and change. The genetic changes happen constantly with every organism bred. One hive fleet is no different from any other besides superficially. The hive mind might direct a fleet to act a certain way or evolve a certain way while another does something different. None of that is geneticly different. If one hive fleet encounters a toxin they all will be imune tobit with their next wave of organisms. It used to be the norm Queens who directed these evolutions. But they are not in the current codex and supplements fluff. So as it stands from colors to tactics, everything is based on biomass and direction from the hive mind. They can all be any color at any time.

Basically they handbwave coloring so you can pick what you want.

Lance845 wrote:

 Tyran wrote:

Lance845 wrote:
There is no such thing as "other hive fleets". That classification is strictly a invention of the imperium used to give name and form to the devourer.

All hive fleets are a part of the single Hive Mind. Within a hive fleet, planet to planet (each invasion), hive ship to hive ship coloration can vary greatly.

There is no such thing as what any tyranid bioform should look like or be colored. They adapt and change, or not, in each environment. Anything goes.

Yes there is, while you are right that all Hive Fleets are part of a greater whole, the Hive Mind, each Hive Fleet is genetically different from the others thanks to the millennium or more time apart spent traveling the universe and eating stuff. And part of this genetic difference is the colors that characterize and differentiate Hive Fleets.

Nope. The fluff specifically talks about how a hive fleet might change coloring on a specific planet. Or how a splinter fleet might break off and change. The genetic changes happen constantly with every organism bred. One hive fleet is no different from any other besides superficially. The hive mind might direct a fleet to act a certain way or evolve a certain way while another does something different. None of that is genetic. It used to be the norm Queens who directed these evolutions. But they are not in the current codex and supplements fluff. So as it stands from colors to tactics, everything is based on biomass and direction from the hive mind. They can all be any color at any time.

All this is true, but it's also true that Hive fleets that encounter each other will fight to the death for the biomass involved - which is not the behaviour of a race under the direction of a single mind. Imo it seems like each hive fleet has its own manifestation of the hive mind - it is possible that the HM wants hive fleets to fight as survival of the fittest, but that would still require it ceding control to things like Norn Queens, tyrants, etc, as otherwise the whole exercise would be akin to playing chess against yourself.

I'm fairly certain the hive fleets fighting each other is also no longer in the fluff. There is zero mention of it at all since the 6th Ed codex. In fact they specifically mention how talking about them as separate entities is a mistake made by people who don't grasp the full macroorganism of the hive mind.

Lance845 wrote:
I'm fairly certain the hive fleets fighting each other is also no longer in the fluff. There is zero mention of it at all since the 6th Ed codex. In fact they specifically mention how talking about them as separate entities is a mistake made by people who don't grasp the full macroorganism of the hive mind.

Mummy and daddy tyranid were just wrestling?

Or they're just trialling variant designs out against each other because theoretical modelling never quite gets every glitch build-and-blow-it-up testing does?
It's not like space marines don't do live fire training which, to someone who has no concept of human psychology, might well look like a group fighting itself for no reason.

Lance845 wrote:


Nope. The fluff specifically talks about how a hive fleet might change coloring on a specific planet. Or how a splinter fleet might break off and change. The genetic changes happen constantly with every organism bred. One hive fleet is no different from any other besides superficially. The hive mind might direct a fleet to act a certain way or evolve a certain way while another does something different. None of that is geneticly different. If one hive fleet encounters a toxin they all will be imune tobit with their next wave of organisms. It used to be the norm Queens who directed these evolutions. But they are not in the current codex and supplements fluff. So as it stands from colors to tactics, everything is based on biomass and direction from the hive mind. They can all be any color at any time.

Basically they handbwave coloring so you can pick what you want.

They can be, but why the need to change the color? Tyranid Hive Fleets have specific colors, they can change, but there is no need to waste energy and time on that.
And Genestealers aren't even connected to the Hive Mind while in their "infestation missions", so they don't even have the possibility to change their colors.

And while Norn Queens hadn't been mentioned in a while, Norn Ships are present in the Valedor novel.

Lance845 wrote:
I'm fairly certain the hive fleets fighting each other is also no longer in the fluff. There is zero mention of it at all since the 6th Ed codex. In fact they specifically mention how talking about them as separate entities is a mistake made by people who don't grasp the full macroorganism of the hive mind.

There is a little of infighting in the Valedor novela. The book shows that while all Hive Fleets are part of the Hive Mind, the time evolving apart means that there are some "hardware" and "software" incompatibilities, which means the Hive Mind wouldn't immediately recognize itself in the other Hive Fleet, but rather it would take some time to evolve a compatibility between the two different Synaptic webs and merge the Hive Fleets.

Lance845 wrote:
I'm fairly certain the hive fleets fighting each other is also no longer in the fluff. There is zero mention of it at all since the 6th Ed codex. In fact they specifically mention how talking about them as separate entities is a mistake made by people who don't grasp the full macroorganism of the hive mind.

Should I point out that the 6th ed Codex is the current codex and that most of the fluff since has concerned the invasion of the Cryptus system which is far too specific to go into how different Hive Fleets interact given that it only represents one tendril of Hive Fleet Leviathan. At this point I think it might be fair to say that nobody fully grasps what the Hive Mind is.

Warhams-77 wrote:
This is not confirmed by photos yet but I trust the person posting this on the german GW-Fanworld forum. WD 110 has arrived in some places. Scans could pop up here and there soonish. So I post a translation of what Otis has seen, just to give an idea what the GC formation will be about. There may be mistakes and/or things missing. This is a loose translation containing the info he had shared.

~600 points. Combined GC models from the box. All have Infiltrate, Stealth, Shrouded (the latter until the beginning of their 2nd turn). Everyone may charge after infiltrating. Patriarch and Purestrain Genestealers may infiltrate up to 1" next to enemy models.

http://www.gw-fanworld.net/showthread.php/211707-Diskussion-Symbiontenkulte-vs-Deathwatch-Brettspiel?p=3528371&viewfull=1#post3528371

This is a lot like they could be played in 1st Edition. Infiltrating close to enemy units and being allowed to charge afterwards could fix the issues with the current Genestealers. As the Patriarch is an IC he can join the Purestrains.

That sounds really good. I really hope that this means we get 2 units of 8 3rd & 4th generation, each unit with 1 grenade launcher and 1 mining laser.

Whew only 200 cad more reasonable than I expected. Hmmmm.... okay I can chip in for that. I thought we would have a higher price on the boxed set.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

Just Heroic Intervention. It is the better version of it though.

Lame. Everyone else has ways to show what Chapter they came from.

The imperial fist gets no special rules.

Que Michael Stripe "everybody hurts...sometimes."

 kronk wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:

 casvalremdeikun wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
I cannot quite remember, but did the Blood Angels dude get any special rules?

Just Heroic Intervention. It is the better version of it though.

Lame. Everyone else has ways to show what Chapter they came from.

The imperial fist gets no special rules.

Que Michael Stripe "everybody hurts...sometimes."

Well, he does get the bolter-y-est bolter¹ that ever bolted, so there's that….



¹ I know it says "frag cannon" on the side, but it's a belt-fed machine RPG. The only thing that makes it not a bolter is the option to load canister shot.

The difference is a frag cannon doesn't fire rocket propelled ammo. It uses a traditional primer system.

I picture it as an auto cannon that fires fragmentation shells. At least in my head. Which uses a traditional primer method and expends ammunition which looks cool. Bolters don't do that they are miniature rocket-shells. It would be able to have more mass to its shots since less is taken up by the rocket propellant in the bolter shell. So more fun stuff to shoot. In real life it is strictly superior to the bolter. We never adopted bolters in IRL and stuck with traditional ammo because its better. Many modern vehicles and weapons positions use auto cannons and there are many varieties of fragmentation rounds.

But this is Warhammer 40k where real life has no business being in a game about the rule of cool.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyrojet

The marines are amazing. But I'm on a strict no new model deal with the wife.

I'm dying inside.

 SickSix wrote:
The marines are amazing. But I'm on a strict no new model deal with the wife.

I'm dying inside.

Buy from a friend. That way they're not 'new', they're 'second hand'.

I wouldn't be brave enough to try it.....

 Gamgee wrote:
The difference is a frag cannon doesn't fire rocket propelled ammo. It uses a traditional primer system.

I picture it as an auto cannon that fires fragmentation shells. At least in my head. Which uses a traditional primer method and expends ammunition which looks cool. Bolters don't do that they are miniature rocket-shells. It would be able to have more mass to its shots since less is taken up by the rocket propellant in the bolter shell. So more fun stuff to shoot. In real life it is strictly superior to the bolter. We never adopted bolters in IRL and stuck with traditional ammo because its better. Many modern vehicles and weapons positions use auto cannons and there are many varieties of fragmentation rounds.

But this is Warhammer 40k where real life has no business being in a game about the rule of cool.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gyrojet

Thing is, gyro jets are not boltguns. No-one has made a boltgun yet. Yes Boltguns have a rocket, like a gyro, but they also have a case with primer and whatnot. They use gas pressure to achieve peak acceleration in the barrel like any other gun then, uniquely, continue accelerating after leaving the muzzle.
If they were straight gyrojets they wouldn't have (or need, or even really be able to use) rifling, nor would the launchers be particularly heavy.
Indeed, if you examine the older blueprints you will see that stalker ammo (the long range 'sniper' variant) actually is a pure gyrojet, unlike the others, so there's no bang or significant muzzle flash.

Gorgon, MajorTom: nice! That's getting the juices flowing.

 durecellrabbit wrote:

Originally I did think of trying to mix between my yellow and ordinary flesh paint but wasn't really sure it would work well with my painting skill. I never consider using looking for naturally yellow skin paints though. I've got most of the VGC range so I'll have a look and see what I can find. Thanks for the idea.

You can find a few more in the Vallejo Model Color range, too. Looking at the Vallejo swatch here, sunny skintone* might be a place to start, with some shade provided by beige red (!?!) or one of the sand/ochre colours, depending on what they look like in the flesh. No pun intended.

Then there's the Reaper swatch below that. Been meaning to get my hands on some of those for ages. I think something like the warm light brown triad or the ochre gold triad could suit your purposes.

*At least it's a bit less on the nose than Coat D'arms 'oriental flesh'. Nevertheless, another range with plenty of subtle colours in their historical lines. And in my experience CDA oriental flesh is a close match for Ral Partha Miniature Paints apricot, etc. etc.

In general, to stay subtle and realistic, I say keep some hint of brown in there. This CMoN article in a nutshell: we're all of us brown, just with a couple of sliding scales of dark-to-light brown and reddish-to-yellowish brown. (With extra tints from how many capillaries show up and the type of light we're photographed under...)

For meself, I think it could be interesting to try and make a transition from bluish-black to those human shades of brown. And since my hive fleet colours are based on this guy, I'm thinking of the more human cult members tattooing white patches or outlines around their eyes. Something along these lines.

The Deathwatch models look great, real shame about that price though 165$.
Id rather GW skip making a board game, and just make a kit or upgrade spur, id buy that.

165$ to add 10 models to my Deathwatch colletion.... Thats a big pass in my opinion.

 GraywarTS wrote:
The Deathwatch models look great, real shame about that price though 165$.
Id rather GW skip making a board game, and just make a kit or upgrade spur, id buy that.

11 singlepose models that only get built one way and all have the Infantry(Character) type.

And yes, that does include the squad. They're all listed as "Deathwatch Veteran" with "Infantry(Character)".

165$ to add 10 models to my Deathwatch colletion.... Thats a big pass in my opinion.

Do you know how much individual plastic blisters are right now?
$30-$33 for a Space Marine character.

Rumour has it that there may be a later separate release (although whether it's this sprue or more multipose version) probably towards the end of the year,

so if you only want the deathwatch and can't split a box best wait for that or try a bitz seller

140 €.

;(

I thought 130. Right after a week of Paris. Le urgh.

 durecellrabbit wrote:

Originally I did think of trying to mix between my yellow and ordinary flesh paint but wasn't really sure it would work well with my painting skill. I never consider using looking for naturally yellow skin paints though. I've got most of the VGC range so I'll have a look and see what I can find. Thanks for the idea.

If you want Asian "yellow" colored flesh, try Tamiya "Flesh". Was using it to paint some German WWII troops. When the paint dried I did a double take because they all looked Asian...

T

 Kanluwen wrote:

165$ to add 10 models to my Deathwatch colletion.... Thats a big pass in my opinion.

Do you know how much individual plastic blisters are right now?
$30-$33 for a Space Marine character.

I've seen that mentioned a few times and I have to admit - it sounds just as ridiculous now as the first time I read it.

Just because GW sees fit to charge $30 for individual plastic miniatures these days doesn't really make it a bargain to 'only' pay "165$ for 10" of them!

 Alpharius wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

165$ to add 10 models to my Deathwatch colletion.... Thats a big pass in my opinion.

Do you know how much individual plastic blisters are right now?
$30-$33 for a Space Marine character.

I've seen that mentioned a few times and I have to admit - it sounds just as ridiculous now as the first time I read it.

Just because GW sees fit to charge $30 for individual plastic miniatures these days doesn't really make it a bargain to 'only' pay "165$ for 10" of them!

except you get a 600 point genestealer cult army to go with that. And if the rules are indeed as good as early rumors state, I think selling the genestealer cult half will be very, very easy.

timd wrote:

If you want Asian "yellow" colored flesh, try Tamiya "Flesh". Was using it to paint some German WWII troops. When the paint dried I did a double take because they all looked Asian...

T

Completely OT, but that totally makes sense to me. Tamiya is a Japanese company, so why shouldn't their default 'flesh tone' be, as you say, 'Asian'? Technically, GW, being in the oh-so-sunny British Isles, should have a default flesh tone of pasty flesh, right?

 M0ff3l wrote:

 Alpharius wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

165$ to add 10 models to my Deathwatch colletion.... Thats a big pass in my opinion.

Do you know how much individual plastic blisters are right now?
$30-$33 for a Space Marine character.

I've seen that mentioned a few times and I have to admit - it sounds just as ridiculous now as the first time I read it.

Just because GW sees fit to charge $30 for individual plastic miniatures these days doesn't really make it a bargain to 'only' pay "165$ for 10" of them!

except you get a 600 point genestealer cult army to go with that. And if the rules are indeed as good as early rumors state, I think selling the genestealer cult half will be very, very easy.

There are a lot of ifs and suppositions in there - and I'm still not seeing anything that has single plastic miniatures at $30+ making much sense!

To help with any mobility issues, you can take those Drop Pod blobs that the Tyranids have.

It isn't any limo, but you can't always get what you want.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
To help with any mobility issues, you can take those Drop Pod blobs that the Tyranids have.

It isn't any limo, but you can't always get what you want.

You can only do that if the genestealer cult is battle brothers with tyranids. Something I have not seen as confirmed yet? If you have I would love the source tho!

I noticed that they're selling foreign language editions on the UK webstore. Didn't they shut down their regional European offices and stop doing foreign language translations a few years back?

So this is a welcome change of policy.

good. GOOD. GOOOOOD.....

aberrants seem really good. The purestrain princelings are just 15 point genestealers with stealth and hit & run (pretty good, but youre always gonna put the patriarch here). Magus has another 2 powers from telepathy (with BS this time) so optimal chance for invis! Familiars are only 2 extra S4 AP- attacks (with rending) in close combat, kind of expected more from these. Formation also gives all units fearless and adamantium will while the patriarch lives... very good 600 point formation imo. Really want to see the last unit (3rd & 4th gen guys, they should be 130 points) and if they can ally with nids.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
To help with any mobility issues, you can take those Drop Pod blobs that the Tyranids have.

Tyranocytes only transport things with the Tyranid faction. No level of allying can take advantage of that.

Those are some damn good rules IMO. I can see potential for fun with Patriarch Ghosar, he's everything I wanted, and the Trysst family seem to be pretty good too. There's not one page of rules there that have disappointed me, and I think I now need these models.

Those rules are actually really, really fun! I think they're perfect for a Genestealer cult army and I will have a lot of fun making a casual list out of these guys, a few Lictors, Deathleaper and some Raveners.

The Deathwatch rules are kinda lame. Genestealers are good though thankfully the nids finally get something.

Note the symbol at the top. It's the tyranid faction symbol, so no issues there!

 DarknessEternal wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
To help with any mobility issues, you can take those Drop Pod blobs that the Tyranids have.

Tyranocytes only transport things with the Tyranid faction. No level of allying can take advantage of that.

wowww, You can put 2!!!!!!!! genestealers anywhere on the table!!!!...

The formation have very good rules, but are very small units.. :( and characters are uniques, so only one formation its possible...

waiting for the codex.

 Fxeni wrote:
Note the symbol at the top. It's the tyranid faction symbol, so no issues there!

 DarknessEternal wrote:

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
To help with any mobility issues, you can take those Drop Pod blobs that the Tyranids have.

Tyranocytes only transport things with the Tyranid faction. No level of allying can take advantage of that.

Its not the tyranid faction symbol, it's a new symbol. Check the allies matrix, the tyranids symbol is 2 of those symbols combined together back to back!

Btw do you have a source for the pics? I really want to see the last unit!!

People can moan about GW pricing, but those models are fantastic and I think £100 is a fantastic deal (£75) with discount.

You cant complain really.

Welp, that's an almost guaranteed t1 charge for the stealers.

 Swampmist wrote:
Welp, that's an almost guaranteed t1 charge for the stealers.

AND the patriarch...

Other formation

I can imagine that being amazing against shooting Deathstars; charge the shootiest thing, hope it takes two turns for you to win, charge something else.

Final formation:

Well thats a nice upgrade for the stock Genestealers. Hit and Run and Stealth have been something they always should have had - hopefully the Tyranids get these changes too. Not that it would make them playable...

Ouch, mining lasers sting.

Fxeni, what's your source? Do they know if they can ally with regular tyranids?

rollawaythestone wrote:
Well thats a nice upgrade for the stock Genestealers. Hit and Run and Stealth have been something they always should have had - hopefully the Tyranids get these changes too. Not that it would make them playable...

if they get a formation similar to the GS ... they are getting played

Those Hybrids are hell'a cheap! 110 points for 16 models kitted out with 2 Grenade Launchers and 2 24'' Las-cannons? That's gotta be like 5 points a pop including the average price for those kinda weapons!

Thanks for posting the rules :-) looks like You get a nice little 600 point army with the GS Cult. I wonder if we can add any tanks to the force, or if we can only ally with Tyranids.

Yup, missing some Limousine.

 SJM wrote:
Yup, missing some Limousine.

Who the hell is going to drive a Limousine though a mineshaft?

I'm just waiting for the main army book to let those purestrain genestealers being able to be taken in squads of 10...screw those wulfen t1 charges - genestealers are where it's AT!

 dan2026 wrote:

 SJM wrote:
Yup, missing some Limousine.

Who the hell is going to drive a Limousine though a mineshaft?

John McClane.

The rules for these guys are really stellar. It seems like they packed a lot of power into these simple GS cultists. Reminds me of the rules for the Mechanicus...

Gee, if only the rules for, like, actual genestealers were this good…
Seriously though, I'm comparing cultists and termagants, hybrids and hormagaunts, and the hyper-evolved space bugs are coming up waaaay short.

So as of now there is no way to add more units to the cult.

As all the characters are unique.

Guess we wait for the codex.

 dan2026 wrote:
So as of now there is no way to add more units to the cult.

As all the characters are unique.

Guess we wait for the codex.

You can run multiple regular combined arms detachments with more troops or elites as you desire. Up to 3, really. They have regular force org icons on the top left and are their own faction.

for example:

CAD 1:
HQ: Magus
Troops: 6x 3rd & 4th gen unit
Elites: 2x aberrant brothers

CAD 2:
HQ: Primus & Patriarch
Troops: 6x 1st & 2nd gen units
Elites: 3x pureseed genestealers

Except you dont get the sweet formation, which is really, really worth it.

 Mr_Rose wrote:

 dan2026 wrote:

 SJM wrote:
Yup, missing some Limousine.

Who the hell is going to drive a Limousine though a mineshaft?

John McClane.

bwhahahahahaha - exalted!!!

 SickSix wrote:
The marines are amazing. But I'm on a strict no new model deal with the wife.

I'm dying inside.

40k. It costs your time, it costs your money, it costs your life (wife).

I'm going to bypass this box set, since I'm not playing Nids and my Marine army is rather focused.

I haven't spent any money on GW for the past 7-months (?) now. This box-set is quite tempting though. I would have appreciated a lower price-point, though. Here's hoping that I can score some of those GS cultists on ebay.

 SJM wrote:
Yup, missing some Limousine.

Am I the only one who doesn't care about getting some special snowflake model that only exists because someone had had a couple of toy cars lying around.

Seriously, I'll be more than happy with Chimeras, Russes, even Tauroxes.

 xttz wrote:

 SJM wrote:
Yup, missing some Limousine.

Am I the only one who doesn't care about getting some special snowflake model that only exists because someone had had a couple of toy cars lying around.

Seriously, I'll be more than happy with Chimeras, Russes, even Tauroxes.

No. I like the GC, but hope as hell that the limo doesn't makes a comeback.

Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

It's a Heavy weapon on a BS3 T35+ sv model. It may be stronger than expected, but let's not pretend it has "no drawbacks".

Yeah, it's like a guardsman shouldering a lascannon.

I wonder what the cultists will go for on Ebay. Because I would gladly pay similar to the price of a get-started bundle for them, as that's basically what they would be.

Or wait awhile if thwy will ne non-limited. Because after the hype dies down, you can find some really good deals. The Chosen for Dark Vengeance are amazing models, and you can regularly get the six of them, the Lord, and the Champion for less than 20 bucks.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Yeah, it's like a guardsman shouldering a lascannon.

To be fair, it's a weaponised mining laser.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Yeah, it's like a guardsman shouldering a lascannon.

But that's super-duper amazin!!!1 Which is why all Guard armies include tons of Lascannon heavy weapon squa....oh.

Seriously Armyman, seriously

 xttz wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

It's a Heavy weapon on a BS3 T35+ sv model. It may be stronger than expected, but let's not pretend it has "no drawbacks".

My point was that it's ridiculous to think a mining laser is superior to most of the weapons in the game. A tool purpose-built for mining makes a pretty devastating weapon? Why do termies bother with storm bolters when they could carry a mining laser?

 angelofvengeance wrote:

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Yeah, it's like a guardsman shouldering a lascannon.

To be fair, it's a weaponised mining laser.

Well, yeah. But that part's obvious semantics. My comparison was about the survivability of the guy toting the gun. I'm not arguing againt the capability of a guy to carry a lascannon!

I find it amusing to think the technophobic Imperium has an STC for a mining laser that would make a great weapon but no-one has ever realized it, or maybe they have and the report was filed on a random server by an Adeptus Mechanicus scribe and forgotten about.

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Yeah, it's like a guardsman shouldering a lascannon.

 Yodhrin wrote:

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Yeah, it's like a guardsman shouldering a lascannon.

But that's super-duper amazin!!!1 Which is why all Guard armies include tons of Lascannon heavy weapon squa....oh.

Seriously Armyman, seriously

yeah at this point, it seems that this guy is looking for any reason to complain. This thing is an inferior version of a lascannon. Nothing to write home about.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 xttz wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

It's a Heavy weapon on a BS3 T35+ sv model. It may be stronger than expected, but let's not pretend it has "no drawbacks".

My point was that it's ridiculous to think a mining laser is superior to most of the weapons in the game. A tool purpose-built for mining makes a pretty devastating weapon? Why do termies bother with storm bolters when they could carry a mining laser?

To be truthful, you might as well be making the argument as to why Terminators aren't all carrying one-handed heavy bolters as standard, with a lascannon being a choise as a heavy weapon.

I'm kinda surprised about the stats, though. My gut would have expected something like a multi-laser, or it being essentially either a multi-melta, or a slightly longer range meltagun, rather than a lascannon-type.



Automatically Appended Next Post:

 MeanGreenStompa wrote:

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Yeah, it's like a guardsman shouldering a lascannon.

Hold on. You guys are taking the wrong opportunity to stick it to me for some reason. I literally own Rogue Trader Guards(Imperial Army)men with shoulder mounted lascannons. That's not what I was making a statement about. I am agreeing with xttz's statement.......sheesh.

Ordered one for $85 equivalent, seems to be a nice and cheap little game.

 streetsamurai wrote:


yeah at this point, it seems that this guy is looking for any reason to complain. This thing is an inferior version of a lascannon. Nothing to write home about.

That's funny, I seem to recall writing a couple posts that praised the models and painting. But don't let facts get in the way of whatever point you were trying to make, right? Next we'll be told GS carpenters carry rending, S5 nailguns and AP3 carpenter squares coz reasons but they're inferior because the model carrying them is only BS3.

 casvalremdeikun wrote:
Am I the only one that is going to cut the heads off helmetless marines and replace them with helmeted heads? At least the majority of them. The WS, BR, and Cassius are about the only ones that get to be without helmets.

For me, the only one that is guaranteed to stay helmetless is the Iron Hand guy.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:


yeah at this point, it seems that this guy is looking for any reason to complain. This thing is an inferior version of a lascannon. Nothing to write home about.

That's funny, I seem to recall writing a couple posts that praised the models and painting. But don't let facts get in the way of whatever point you were trying to make, right? Next we'll be told GS carpenters carry rending, S5 nailguns and AP3 carpenter squares coz reasons but they're inferior because the model carrying them is only BS3.

I might have been one of those putting the boot in earlier nut you're obviously being positive here. It might be a BS, T3 model but Tyranids are drastically short of any kind of high strength, low AP weaponry and we now have a 110pt unit with 2 of them, not to mention grenade launchers! That is awesome, and since we now have 2 ML2 psychers rolling on Telepathy we have a very good chance of getting Shrouded or Invisibility to up their servivability.

I love the fact that the formation gives the entire army Fearless and Adamantium Will.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 streetsamurai wrote:


yeah at this point, it seems that this guy is looking for any reason to complain. This thing is an inferior version of a lascannon. Nothing to write home about.

That's funny, I seem to recall writing a couple posts that praised the models and painting. But don't let facts get in the way of whatever point you were trying to make, right? Next we'll be told GS carpenters carry rending, S5 nailguns and AP3 carpenter squares coz reasons but they're inferior because the model carrying them is only BS3.

Salty

 Imateria wrote:

I might have been one of those putting the boot in earlier nut you're obviously being positive here. It might be a BS, T3 model but Tyranids are drastically short of any kind of high strength, low AP weaponry and we now have a 110pt unit with 2 of them, not to mention grenade launchers! That is awesome, and since we now have 2 ML2 psychers rolling on Telepathy we have a very good chance of getting Shrouded or Invisibility to up their servivability.

I love the fact that the formation gives the entire army Fearless and Adamantium Will.

I don't see my comment as being positive or negative, tbh. It's only viewed negatively because people choose to see pretty minis and stick their fingers in their ears going "lalala" about anything else. I'm obviously not here to make friends, and I'm not going away

It's about trying to make sense of the mechanics of the game. We mine today without the benefit of space lazorz, so why would miners of tomorrow need a space lazor that can punch a hole in a fething land raider? Wouldn't a S6 AP- weapon make more sense: something powerful enough to wound a SM very easily, but still not able to completely render TDA into molten slag 2/3 of the time with a single shot?

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

The Deathwatch booklet actually has something interesting about that.

It's noted by the Iron Hand member of the Kill-Team when he examines one of the mining lasers that all the safety protocols have been overridden and that it was modified to "require a third hand to hold"--with the "normal" miners requiring a servo-arm to operate it.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

The Deathwatch booklet actually has something interesting about that.

It's noted by the Iron Hand member of the Kill-Team when he examines one of the mining lasers that all the safety protocols have been overridden and that it was modified to "require a third hand to hold"--with the "normal" miners requiring a servo-arm to operate it.

Bad fluff doesn't make it right. If it's a jury-rigged piece of equipment made by an uneducated xenos hybrid, should't it have Gets Hot! or variable strength or 6" range or a malfunction mechanic? I hope the IH guy picked it up, hid it in his underwear, and took it home to a DW techmarine and told him to start mass production!

You might also consider that while a mining laser might be a sweet, sweet zappy gun for a one off firefight over in a few hours at most,

but perhaps it's fragile, requires frequent maintenance, special machine spirit oil, burns out the crystals when overcharged etc

so it's pretty much useless as a long term military weapon for the purposes of the imperium, sort of like the various squeeze bore adaptors developed for tank guns in the 20s-30s which did provide a better punch, but tended to fail after only a few shots leaving you with a wrecked gun. professional soldiers didn't like them and tended not to fit them preferring a reliable weapon over a more powerful one

Edit: eg https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Littlejohn_adaptor

 Kanluwen wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

The Deathwatch booklet actually has something interesting about that.

It's noted by the Iron Hand member of the Kill-Team when he examines one of the mining lasers that all the safety protocols have been overridden and that it was modified to "require a third hand to hold"--with the "normal" miners requiring a servo-arm to operate it.

Well there's the explanation. They tampered with their equipment to make it efficient for fighting.

Do remember that The_Armyman complained about this being a game in the first place, so there's going to be no pleasing him.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Do remember that The_Armyman complained about this being a game in the first place, so there's going to be no pleasing him.

Tragedy

 the_Armyman wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

The Deathwatch booklet actually has something interesting about that.

It's noted by the Iron Hand member of the Kill-Team when he examines one of the mining lasers that all the safety protocols have been overridden and that it was modified to "require a third hand to hold"--with the "normal" miners requiring a servo-arm to operate it.

Bad fluff doesn't make it right. If it's a jury-rigged piece of equipment made by an uneducated xenos hybrid, should't it have Gets Hot! or variable strength or 6" range or a malfunction mechanic? I hope the IH guy picked it up, hid it in his underwear, and took it home to a DW techmarine and told him to start mass production!

It's not "made by an uneducated xenos hybrid".

It's a STC produced tool that had its safety regulators tampered with.

Additionally? The mining laser has a militarized brother. It's called the "lascutter" that the Elysians used to have rules for.

Something tells me a lascutter isn't nearly as good as this weapon.

A lascutter is a S9 AP3 ccw that strikes at I1. I like it. Seems much more sensible than a mini-lascannon.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Something tells me a lascutter isn't nearly as good as this weapon.

It's basically a lazcannon that you use in combat. S9, AP2, Melee, Unwieldy

the_Armyman wrote:It's about trying to make sense of the mechanics of the game.

You can't.

It's 40K.

Whether you're squeeing or scratching your head over the amount of power put into these lowly mutants - or rather, into the 'but-but-but GW said so' rules for them - it's aaaall the same old thing. Business as usual. Imbalance, power creep, use of a dartboard to assign points costs... Wait 'til the next thing comes out that nobbles them.

Is that positive enough, Imateria?

I'm just weirded out that a portable mining laser has a 24" range.

I don't mind the game implications, but it seems weird that the miner is excavating a rock face WAAAAY OVER THERE, especially when other people have 'power picks' to bash the crap out of a difficult rock more effectively.

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Do remember that The_Armyman complained about this being a game in the first place, so there's going to be no pleasing him.

Jings, I don't expect anyone to agree with Armyman - I don't agree with all he says myself - but could we at least do the courtesy of dispensing with the fingers-in-your-ears ad hominems?

Da Butcha wrote:
I'm just weirded out that a portable mining laser has a 24" range.

I don't mind the game implications, but it seems weird that the miner is excavating a rock face WAAAAY OVER THERE, especially when other people have 'power picks' to bash the crap out of a difficult rock more effectively.

Just assume it has been tampered with or modified somehow to be used as a weapon.
Or possibly they were mining something super, super, hard.

It's interesting that all of the units have no options other than bog-standard size/equipment. I wonder if these rules will just be temporary until a legit codex comes out.

 Accolade wrote:
It's interesting that all of the units have no options other than bog-standard size/equipment. I wonder if these rules will just be temporary until a legit codex comes out.

They're named formations/characters.

Very rarely do those have options.

I know nothing about current 40k rules, but doesn't the fluff explicitly mention that the mining laser normally requires an exoskeleton to provide the user with a 3rd arm? Seems like that would lesson its appeal as a weapon.

ecurtz wrote:
I know nothing about current 40k rules, but doesn't the fluff explicitly mention that the mining laser normally requires an exoskeleton to provide the user with a 3rd arm? Seems like that would lesson its appeal as a weapon.

Requires a servo-arm to make the most efficient usage of it and to stabilize it.

You can operate it two-handed but it's not going to be accurate. It mentions that the miners commonly have servo-arm equipped harnesses that 'clamp' on to the upper handle.

It's what I like to call a unique occurance. It's not exactly your standard Mars-pattern bolter.

Plumbumbarum wrote:
Ordered one for $85 equivalent, seems to be a nice and cheap little game.

Where did you order from?

 Kanluwen wrote:

ecurtz wrote:
I know nothing about current 40k rules, but doesn't the fluff explicitly mention that the mining laser normally requires an exoskeleton to provide the user with a 3rd arm? Seems like that would lesson its appeal as a weapon.

Requires a servo-arm to make the most efficient usage of it and to stabilize it.

You can operate it two-handed but it's not going to be accurate. It mentions that the miners commonly have servo-arm equipped harnesses that 'clamp' on to the upper handle.

I'm not sure how any of that information would preclude it from being used by a SM in power armor. Also, are you then saying that a standard human miner with an exo-skeleton is now wielding a weapon than can kill an Astartes Land Raider from a couple hundred meters away? Forget the Imperial Guard, get me some West Virginia coal miners from the future on the horn!

There's definitely not enough new info to talk about right now if this is what we have come to.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

ecurtz wrote:
I know nothing about current 40k rules, but doesn't the fluff explicitly mention that the mining laser normally requires an exoskeleton to provide the user with a 3rd arm? Seems like that would lesson its appeal as a weapon.

Requires a servo-arm to make the most efficient usage of it and to stabilize it.

You can operate it two-handed but it's not going to be accurate. It mentions that the miners commonly have servo-arm equipped harnesses that 'clamp' on to the upper handle.

I'm not sure how any of that information would preclude it from being used by a SM in power armor. Also, are you then saying that a standard human miner with an exo-skeleton is now wielding a weapon than can kill an Astartes Land Raider from a couple hundred meters away? Forget the Imperial Guard, get me some West Virginia coal miners from the future on the horn!

What exactly are you upset about now? Tyranids finally got something good? Is that too much for you? Jezus christ man, do you have so little imagination that you can't even think of 1 reason space marines don't walk around with mining lasers?

OT: does anyone have a pic of the first page of that new WD with the genestealer cult in it? In the deathwatch WD it stated there how it could ally etc. Really want to see if the genestealer cult can ally with nids or not.

Your contention is meaningless. You may as well ask why Marines aren't all carrying lascannons instead of just one out of 10 of them.

Or why in-game they aren't three times harder to kill.

If the model had a lascannon or a multi-melta to fill the same in-game function, would there then be a big issue of, "how did a mining colony have such military heavy weapons lying around for cultists to pick up"?

Exactly. That's just how things are. The future sucks as much as the_Armyman's attitude.

They should be mining the salt from him instead of that asteroid.

I would assume the cult has its fingers in local government and shipping. I don't know 40k but couldn't they use a more unstable/powerful power source and modify the equipment for that? I should really read up on GSC more but I assume technical know how and smuggling would be useful skills for them to have as an organization.

What kinds of material are used in SM armour construction? Or for that matter what material keeps a plasma pistol's plasma from exploding? Maybe its whatever that is. In any case aren't Las weapons like a blaster? Couldn't this be the Phaser equivalent? Basically an uninterrupted beam weapon is how I see it.

So, the only thing coming next week is stealer cult rules? No physical release?

Anything in the game that makes marine players and their fleet of free Razorbacks salty is a good thing in my book.

I'm sure this new god weapon is going to totally shake up and unbalance the tourney scene...

Slayer-Fan123 wrote:
Exactly. That's just how things are. The future sucks as much as the_Armyman's attitude.

They should be mining the salt from him instead of that asteroid.

I don't care if you don't agree with me. But do you lack the small modicum of self control to keep yourself from typing insults and personal attacks? Again, this isn't a popularity contest. There are no cool kids here.

When GSC get updated to a full army, if their limos had an equally inexplicable AV14 would everyone be expected to accept it because "Tyranids finally got something good"?

if you're going to fluff it as civilian equipment with all SAFETY protocols turned off, you should at the very least give it Gets Hot.

This civilian equipment is currently as good (or better) than military grade plasma rifles AND safer.

MORE ON TOPIC (RULE #2) and LESS BREAKING OF RULE #1 - RIGHT NOW.

LAST WARNING BEFORE SUSPENSIONS.

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Accolade wrote:
It's interesting that all of the units have no options other than bog-standard size/equipment. I wonder if these rules will just be temporary until a legit codex comes out.

They're named formations/characters.

Very rarely do those have options.

Ah, gotcha. I wasn't sure since I saw the usual Elite/Troop/Fast Attack symbols next to them. Thanks Kan

Rihgu wrote:
When GSC get updated to a full army, if their limos had an equally inexplicable AV14 would everyone be expected to accept it because "Tyranids finally got something good"?

if you're going to fluff it as civilian equipment with all SAFETY protocols turned off, you should at the very least give it Gets Hot.

This civilian equipment is currently as good (or better) than military grade plasma rifles AND safer.

Plasma rifles are rapid fire and not heavy, this is not better.
People really will complain and pick fights about anything won't they?

 Accolade wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

 Accolade wrote:
It's interesting that all of the units have no options other than bog-standard size/equipment. I wonder if these rules will just be temporary until a legit codex comes out.

They're named formations/characters.

Very rarely do those have options.

Ah, gotcha. I wasn't sure since I saw the usual Elite/Troop/Fast Attack symbols next to them. Thanks Kan

You're quite welcome.

If I had to make a semi-educated guess? I would say whenever we see the final products, it would be like so on GSC:

HQ
Magus
Patriarch
Primus

Elite
Aberrants
Purestrains

Troops
First & Second Generation Hybrids(AP/CCWs with a Rending Claw and Assault Grenades; smaller unit size but heavier hitting unit)
Third & Fourth Generation Hybrids(Autoguns with options for scavenged heavy/special weapons mixed in; larger unit size and basically bullet shields)

Maybe Aberrants getting the ability to be doled out into units of Hybrids?

Deathwatch:
HQ
Chaplain
Watch-Captain
Librarian

Elite
Kill-Marines done similar to Lone Wolves; options for Jump Packs or Terminator Armor. Infantry(Character)
Deathwatch Terminator Squad OR a Deathwatch Dreadnought

Troops
Deathwatch Squad--each model is Infantry(Character) as we saw with Squad Donatus; models take individual upgrades but otherwise are one unit

Fast Attack
Deathwatch Scout--Bike or on Foot. Infantry(Character)

 BloodGrin wrote:

Rihgu wrote:
When GSC get updated to a full army, if their limos had an equally inexplicable AV14 would everyone be expected to accept it because "Tyranids finally got something good"?

if you're going to fluff it as civilian equipment with all SAFETY protocols turned off, you should at the very least give it Gets Hot.

This civilian equipment is currently as good (or better) than military grade plasma rifles AND safer.

Plasma rifles are rapid fire and not heavy, this is not better.
People really will complain and pick fights about anything won't they?

But Plasma rifles do Gets Hot! and aren't S9.

edit: so this is strictly better at ranges between 12 and 24".
edit2: not strictly, since you can move and shoot Plasma Rifles. Confused Rapid Fire with Salvo for a second

 CT GAMER wrote:
Anything in the game that makes marine players and their fleet of free Razorbacks salty is a good thing in my book.

I'm sure this new god weapon is going to totally shake up and unbalance the tourney scene...

I'm not a tourney player, but it wouldn't scare me. Correct me if my math is off: 2 shots at the front of a razorback, needing 4+/6+ to hit, and 5+ to wound... not much to be afraid of.

The lascannon on a razorback is twin-linked, has double the range, hits the GSC on 3+/6+ and wounds/kills on a 2+.

 Kanluwen wrote:
Deathwatch:
HQ
Chaplain
Watch-Captain
Librarian

Elite
Kill-Marines done similar to Lone Wolves; options for Jump Packs or Terminator Armor. Infantry(Character)
Deathwatch Terminator Squad OR a Deathwatch Dreadnought

Troops
Deathwatch Squad--each model is Infantry(Character) as we saw with Squad Donatus; models take individual upgrades but otherwise are one unit

Fast Attack
Deathwatch Scout--Bike or on Foot. Infantry(Character)

I wish they'd allow for Deathwatch Assault and Tactical Squads. And Terminators!

BaronVonSnakPak wrote:

 CT GAMER wrote:
Anything in the game that makes marine players and their fleet of free Razorbacks salty is a good thing in my book.

I'm sure this new god weapon is going to totally shake up and unbalance the tourney scene...

I'm not a tourney player, but it wouldn't scare me. Correct me if my math is off: 2 shots at the front of a razorback, needing 4+/6+ to hit, and 5+ to wound... not much to be afraid of.

The lascannon on a razorback is twin-linked, has double the range, hits the GSC on 3+/6+ and wounds/kills on a 2+.

The big GSC formation grants you Stealth and Infiltrate.
Additionally, if you Infiltrate? You get Shrouded until the start of turn 2.

BaronVonSnakPak wrote:

 CT GAMER wrote:
Anything in the game that makes marine players and their fleet of free Razorbacks salty is a good thing in my book.

I'm sure this new god weapon is going to totally shake up and unbalance the tourney scene...

I'm not a tourney player, but it wouldn't scare me. Correct me if my math is off: 2 shots at the front of a razorback, needing 4+/6+ to hit, and 5+ to wound... not much to be afraid of.

The lascannon on a razorback is twin-linked, has double the range, hits the GSC on 3+/6+ and wounds/kills on a 2+.

It's a 2+, just fyi

Rihgu wrote:

 BloodGrin wrote:

Rihgu wrote:
When GSC get updated to a full army, if their limos had an equally inexplicable AV14 would everyone be expected to accept it because "Tyranids finally got something good"?

if you're going to fluff it as civilian equipment with all SAFETY protocols turned off, you should at the very least give it Gets Hot.

This civilian equipment is currently as good (or better) than military grade plasma rifles AND safer.

Plasma rifles are rapid fire and not heavy, this is not better.
People really will complain and pick fights about anything won't they?

But Plasma rifles do Gets Hot! and aren't S9.

edit: so this is strictly better at ranges between 12 and 24".
edit2: not strictly, since you can move and shoot Plasma Rifles. Confused Rapid Fire with Salvo for a second

I don't think it matters if it is better or worse. GW decided GSC needed a short range lascannon and so they got one and then gave an explanation. Accept or don't accept. The "whole" safety protocol thing... what if they exist not to protect the user but specifically to keep it from being used as a weapon and yet is still somehow disabled?

 Kanluwen wrote:

BaronVonSnakPak wrote:

 CT GAMER wrote:
Anything in the game that makes marine players and their fleet of free Razorbacks salty is a good thing in my book.

I'm sure this new god weapon is going to totally shake up and unbalance the tourney scene...

I'm not a tourney player, but it wouldn't scare me. Correct me if my math is off: 2 shots at the front of a razorback, needing 4+/6+ to hit, and 5+ to wound... not much to be afraid of.

The lascannon on a razorback is twin-linked, has double the range, hits the GSC on 3+/6+ and wounds/kills on a 2+.

The big GSC formation grants you Stealth and Infiltrate.
Additionally, if you Infiltrate? You get Shrouded until the start of turn 2.

Alright, they're within firing range turn 1 and gives them a 4+ open ground save for the first turn, but it doesn't change their to hit and wound roll numbers. 2 heavy 1 shots at BS3 still isn't scary.

BaronVonSnakPak wrote:

 CT GAMER wrote:
Anything in the game that makes marine players and their fleet of free Razorbacks salty is a good thing in my book.

I'm sure this new god weapon is going to totally shake up and unbalance the tourney scene...

I'm not a tourney player, but it wouldn't scare me. Correct me if my math is off: 2 shots at the front of a razorback, needing 4+/6+ to hit, and 5+ to wound... not much to be afraid of.

The lascannon on a razorback is twin-linked, has double the range, hits the GSC on 3+/6+ and wounds/kills on a 2+.

I was being sarcastic. Marine players complaining that what will probably amount to a poorly supported niche sub-faction getting a nice toy is beyond facepalm inducing. In a world dominated by uber-cheese, alliance abuse, 100s of free points and of course Eldar; cultists getting a nifty laser cannon is a moot point...

 CT GAMER wrote:

I was being sarcastic. Marine players complaining that what will probably amount to a poorly supported niche sub-faction getting a nice toy is beyond facepalm inducing. In a world dominated by uber-cheese, alliance abuse, 100s of free points and of course Eldar cultists getting a laser cannon is a moot point...

Gotcha. It's hard to differentiate between sarcasm and salt on 40k forums these days.

 the_Armyman wrote:

 xttz wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Apparently, the Imperium has REALLY advanced mining equipment. How many armies would like a R24" S9 AP2 weapon with no drawbacks? My Deathwing and GK should take temp jobs on the nearest mining colony...

It's a Heavy weapon on a BS3 T35+ sv model. It may be stronger than expected, but let's not pretend it has "no drawbacks".

My point was that it's ridiculous to think a mining laser is superior to most of the weapons in the game. A tool purpose-built for mining makes a pretty devastating weapon? Why do termies bother with storm bolters when they could carry a mining laser?

Why are termies just as fast as other units when they should be slower?

Answer: Just because. Funny I didn't see you champion this that Terminators are too fast.

BaronVonSnakPak wrote:

 Kanluwen wrote:

BaronVonSnakPak wrote:

 CT GAMER wrote:
Anything in the game that makes marine players and their fleet of free Razorbacks salty is a good thing in my book.

I'm sure this new god weapon is going to totally shake up and unbalance the tourney scene...

I'm not a tourney player, but it wouldn't scare me. Correct me if my math is off: 2 shots at the front of a razorback, needing 4+/6+ to hit, and 5+ to wound... not much to be afraid of.

The lascannon on a razorback is twin-linked, has double the range, hits the GSC on 3+/6+ and wounds/kills on a 2+.

The big GSC formation grants you Stealth and Infiltrate.
Additionally, if you Infiltrate? You get Shrouded until the start of turn 2.

Alright, they're within firing range turn 1 and gives them a 4+ open ground save for the first turn, but it doesn't change their to hit and wound roll numbers. 2 heavy 1 shots at BS3 still isn't scary.

S9 glances a Razorbacks' AV11 on a 2+ FYI.

Here i thought this was the news & rumors page, could you take the rules discussion to, say the rules discussion page?

Any figs spotted yet on ebay or is it still to early?

 Jehan-reznor wrote:
Here i thought this was the news & rumors page, could you take the rules discussion to, say the rules discussion page?

Any figs spotted yet on ebay or is it still to early?

Plenty of preorder sales of figs on there.

Other than just for fairness' sake (and to sell more models for 40k, which has it's place in business) the fluff guy in me thinks than neither force in this game should have a rules-supported place among the types of battles that 40k portrays. It would be like giving rules to take Escher gangs alongside your Imperial forces (although that basically did happen in a limited fashion in the Armageddon codex, oddly enough).

These are the types of forces where I always felt having the mechanical capability to deal with things on a battlefield-scale combat feels a bit shoehorned in sometimes, because they are better suited for intense skirmish-level wargaming like Kill Team (in this case, it's where the name came from, lol!).

To me, a Genestealer cult doesn't need any sort of heavy AP ranged weapons. They are either fighting against PDF forces, or in the drastic circumstances involved in facing something like the Deathwatch, they either have to drown them in autogun-fire and pray for the best, or get help from their Purestrain brethren (or hybrids' claws).

If I were playing a special non-board game of these two forces against each other, I think I would find that if GSC only had a melee option to crack armor, it would be what made them unique, rather than hybrid "squads" being set up in the traditional tactical setup of "x number of guys, including one special weapon and one heavy weapon", because that's what everyone else has.

I always found the fun in those situations being that I don't have the extreme options of a 40k battlefield-ready force.

Really, in the fluff, if a cult gets powerful enough to start taking over large areas by force, it seems they would need and have large amounts of the wargear that the Guard has to gain the upper hand, whereupon mechanically on the tabletop they would be more like an Imperial guard force with some Hybrids and purestrains scattered about.

 DarknessEternal wrote:
Your contention is meaningless. You may as well ask why Marines aren't all carrying lascannons instead of just one out of 10 of them.

Exactly. Also, their is no reasons for the Imperium to use these lasers for war (not to mention that in the IOM, STC desing are sacred, so modifying them and using them for something else than their intended purpose is forbidden), since the lascannon is actually a much better weapon.

But then, the guy obviously get a thrill out of being a contrarian.

 Jehan-reznor wrote:
Here i thought this was the news & rumors page, could you take the rules discussion to, say the rules discussion page?

Any figs spotted yet on ebay or is it still to early?

At this point, less than a week from release, I think it's safe to assume we pretty much have all the info about this box. Without any more rumors, talking about unit stats and TT applications is a pretty natural evolution of the discussion. I didn't see people asking for the thread to be moved to P&M when color palettes and methods were being discussed.

As to your question:
http://www.ebay.com/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2050601.m570.l1313.TR0.TRC0.H0.Xdeathwatch+overkill.TRS0&_nkw=deathwatch+overkill&_sacat=0

 AegisGrimm wrote:
Other than just for fairness' sake (and to sell more models for 40k, which has it's place in business) the fluff guy in me thinks than neither force in this game should have a rules-supported place among the types of battles that 40k portrays. It would be like giving rules to take Escher gangs alongside your Imperial forces (although that basically did happen in a limited fashion in the Armageddon codex, oddly enough).

These are the types of forces where I always felt having the mechanical capability to deal with things on a battlefield-scale combat feels a bit shoehorned in sometimes, because they are better suited for intense skirmish-level wargaming like Kill Team (in this case, it's where the name came from, lol!).

To me, a Genestealer cult doesn't need any sort of heavy AP ranged weapons. They are either fighting against PDF forces, or in the drastic circumstances involved in facing something like the Deathwatch, they either have to drown them in autogun-fire and pray for the best, or get help from their Purestrain brethren (or hybrids' claws).

If I were playing a special non-board game of these two forces against each other, I think I would find that if GSC only had a melee option to crack armor, it would be what made them unique, rather than hybrid "squads" being set up in the traditional tactical setup of "x number of guys, including one special weapon and one heavy weapon", because that's what everyone else has.

I always found the fun in those situations being that I don't have the extreme options of a 40k battlefield-ready force.

Really, in the fluff, if a cult gets powerful enough to start taking over large areas by force, it seems they would need and have large amounts of the wargear that the Guard has to gain the upper hand, whereupon mechanically on the tabletop they would be more like an Imperial guard force with some Hybrids and purestrains scattered about.

Many armies currently bend/brake/rewrite and abuse fluff these days. The alliance rules are a hot mess in this regard as well, daemon summoning, etc. etc. most players ignore fluff as they see fit, so this new GSC aren't prime offenders tbh.


Personally I prefer the kind of battles you describe for GSC and will
Mostly be using them in a narrative Zone Mortalis/ kill-team campign, but GW also wants standard 40k players to use them as well so you get a bit of the " shoe horning" you describe for sure.

SO!!!!!!!!! Correct me if Im wrong, but All these are Formations and not units? Right?

So if that is the case you could do something like this.

Ghosar Quintus Broodkin
The Faithfull Throng x5
Fovoured Disciples x5
Purestrain Princelings x9

Total 1845pts

This wouldnt be a good list at all, Im just asking if this would be a Legal "Bound" list.

With that Said Im thinking of Running 3 Dakka Flyrants, Ghosar Quintus Broodkin, 3 Mucolid Spore's and trying it out later this week or next week.

Guys, why not just think of it that this box represents an isolated colony, specialized in a commodity. Not large. Hadley's hope type thing. That is why this cult is armed the way they are.

If this release proves popular enough, you can surely imagine that future, 40k dedicated releases would include PDF weaponry and more, representing larger cults on larger worlds. You can also imagine tiered Patriarchs... ones like the broodlord esque one we have here, fed by hundreds or thousands, and then larger, more powerful versions fed by millions of cultists.

There is so much room to grow the concept, and ways to approach the fluff as well that allow for the core concept and then splinter variants.

In any case, I guess the point I am making is that if viewed as a very specific cult, not a generalized one, then one can easily 'forgive' (if it even needs forgiving) the limitations of the options.

As to the mining laser issue... it's a laser, powerful enough to blast rock or metals in huge amounts. One would think power was already implied, and range was the only issue needing a jury rigged adjustment. I don't find it a massive stretch of the imagination to think they would figure out a way to rig the mining laser given how ubiquitous and understood laser tech is in the modern imperium. If that is your only gripe, should probably get over it imho.

Also, one would assume a mining colony would be quite well armed to protect from pirates and xenos as well. The amount and type of weapons makes sense for local militia.

Legitimate question: if this is a boardgame with 40K rules added on as an afterthought, why couldn't the uber mining lasers stay in the boardgame version of Deathwatch: Overkill and not bleed into the 40K rules?

 Amishprn86 wrote:
SO!!!!!!!!! Correct me if Im wrong, but All these are Formations and not units? Right?

So if that is the case you could do something like this.

Ghosar Quintus Broodkin
The Faithfull Throng x5
Fovoured Disciples x5
Purestrain Princelings x9

Total 1845pts

This wouldnt be a good list at all, Im just asking if this would be a Legal "Bound" list.

With that Said Im thinking of Running 3 Dakka Flyrants, Ghosar Quintus Broodkin, 3 Mucolid Spore's and trying it out later this week or next week.

And servo skulls ruin your day. Or going second.

 Ravenous D wrote:

 Amishprn86 wrote:
SO!!!!!!!!! Correct me if Im wrong, but All these are Formations and not units? Right?

So if that is the case you could do something like this.

Ghosar Quintus Broodkin
The Faithfull Throng x5
Fovoured Disciples x5
Purestrain Princelings x9

Total 1845pts

This wouldnt be a good list at all, Im just asking if this would be a Legal "Bound" list.

With that Said Im thinking of Running 3 Dakka Flyrants, Ghosar Quintus Broodkin, 3 Mucolid Spore's and trying it out later this week or next week.

And servo skulls ruin your day. Or going second.

The point was... this could be legal.

Every paper has its scissors and every scissors has its rock. Also it depends if your local/meta plays with them.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Legitimate question: if this is a boardgame with 40K rules added on as an afterthought, why couldn't the uber mining lasers stay in the boardgame version of Deathwatch: Overkill and not bleed into the 40K rules?

Counter Question: Why is it a problem? So far, everything else in all the boardgames has been able to transition to 40k/30k, without much of a problem. Including rules for a new weapon (albeit one that functions similarly to another type) seems fine.

Yeah... I don't see the big deal.

 the_Armyman wrote:
Legitimate question: if this is a boardgame with 40K rules added on as an afterthought, why couldn't the uber mining lasers stay in the boardgame version of Deathwatch: Overkill and not bleed into the 40K rules?

Likely because people would get annoyed when they can't use all their brand new miniatures.
Also it's probably likely that people would complain if their GSC had no realistic way to deal with PA level saves and armored vehicles.

 Carnikang wrote:

 the_Armyman wrote:
Legitimate question: if this is a boardgame with 40K rules added on as an afterthought, why couldn't the uber mining lasers stay in the boardgame version of Deathwatch: Overkill and not bleed into the 40K rules?

Counter Question: Why is it a problem? So far, everything else in all the boardgames has been able to transition to 40k/30k, without much of a problem. Including rules for a new weapon (albeit one that functions similarly to another type) seems fine.

Answer: You have failed to establish why this is a problem beyond your single subjective opinion. It is no fictional stretch to modify a man portable, high powered short range laser into a longer range one (which is less effective than the true, dedicated laser cannon). As mentioned, the power supply and all aspects necessary to create a heavy weapon are logically already present but for that one thing. Then, again understanding lasers are common tech in 40k, it is also no stretch to imagine the knowledge necessary to fit a ranged focusing array on it is feasible.

So -
Being reasonable unto the rules of 40k fiction - is it possible to turn the mining laser into a cannon? Yes.
Being reasonable is this gun completely alien and broken in terms of rules of the game and other weapons? No, it fits the rules and range of available guns.
Being reasonable, if the above is true, then have you presented any legitimate reason this gun is a problem other than you are upset it was jury-rigged in fiction and didn't come off of a weapon manufactorum line? No, you haven't.

Honestly man you have been griping on this for a few pages. You just don't like it, no particular reason other than you don't. That is fine, you absolutely don't have to. But stop trying to force others to agree with you when you literally have no compelling argument other than the equivalent of 'I don't like blue on a car, so you can't either'.

Would love to move on now, hopefully the Mods will encourage exactly that, as the topic is stalemated.

 Amishprn86 wrote:
SO!!!!!!!!! Correct me if Im wrong, but All these are Formations and not units? Right?

So if that is the case you could do something like this.

Ghosar Quintus Broodkin
The Faithfull Throng x5
Fovoured Disciples x5
Purestrain Princelings x9

Total 1845pts

This wouldnt be a good list at all, Im just asking if this would be a Legal "Bound" list.

With that Said Im thinking of Running 3 Dakka Flyrants, Ghosar Quintus Broodkin, 3 Mucolid Spore's and trying it out later this week or next week.

They are unit data-slates, formations don't exclusively feature a unit profile and have Troops/Elites/HQ symbols denoting their position in a Force Organization Chart the last time I checked. Them having specific titles rather than generic descriptors doesn't make them Unique or anything different to a regular unit rules-wise. Just so it is clear-cut, formations have their own symbol (look at the Ghosar Quintis Broodkin) distinct from units, check the top left part of each data-slate.

 Amishprn86 wrote:
SO!!!!!!!!! Correct me if Im wrong, but All these are Formations and not units? Right?

I believe you are wrong actually. The various units and characters all have Battlefield Roles (Troops, Elites, HQ) and so are just Unit Entries. The only Formation here is the Ghosar Quintus Broodkin.

You could still legally field them as Combined Arms or Allied Detachments though - up to three of them in fact, with the various HQ's taking a slot in each and the other units filling Troops and Elites slots. (The three HQ's are Unique, so you can only have one of each of them, but the other units are not, so you can have as many as your Formation or Detachment allows - so a max of 18 Troops and 9 Elites choices going with Combined Arms Detachments. Of course, then you lose out on the lovely Broodkin Special Rules.

I'm not sure what the most competitive way to use the GSC will be. The easy one seems to be using the formation and allying it in to a Tyranid force as assumed Battle Brothers means you can hand out Invisibility to Tyranid units that direly need it, but alternatively you could run 3 Combined Arms Detachments each led by 1 of the Unique characters, then spam the Acolyte Hybrids to use up all of your Troops slots and go from there. The Acolytes may as well be horde Orks turned up to 100, so spamming them in units of 12 might not be a bad idea at all.

If Unbound was widely allowed and it actually let you take more than 1 of a Unique character, taking three of the formations and an Aegis Defence Line with no upgrades would slot exactly into 1850 points, but alas...

Caederes wrote:
I'm not sure what the most competitive way to use the GSC will be. The easy one seems to be using the formation and allying it in to a Tyranid force as assumed Battle Brothers means you can hand out Invisibility to Tyranid units that direly need it, but alternatively you could run 3 Combined Arms Detachments each led by 1 of the Unique characters, then spam the Acolyte Hybrids to use up all of your Troops slots and go from there. The Acolytes may as well be horde Orks turned up to 100, so spamming them in units of 12 might not be a bad idea at all.

If Unbound was widely allowed and it actually let you take more than 1 of a Unique character, taking three of the formations and an Aegis Defence Line with no upgrades would slot exactly into 1850 points, but alas...

Ally them with Tyranids, use the GSC formation to assault on turn 1, which gives the rest of your Tyranid forces a little breathing room for moving up the board. Considering they have Fearless and Adamantium Will as long as the Patriarch is alive, they could be a pretty effective "first wave" assault force for roughly 600 points.

Only the two Genestealers and the Patriarch can get close enough to assault turn 1. So, they die horribly in one round, then the rest are meat shields?

As someone who last played 40k in 5th edition (and I'm looking seriously at picking this up for board game if nothing else) can you play GSC with the info in the WD plus a 7th ed core rulebook?

Or do you need other info?

 Crazyterran wrote:
Only the two Genestealers and the Patriarch can get close enough to assault turn 1. So, they die horribly in one round, then the rest are meat shields?

The rest have infiltrate, so best case scenario they can be within 12" and charge on turn 1. If they can't get close enough to assault, then yeah, use them as a shooting meat shield.

http://cdn.bols.netdna-cdn.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/02/ghosar-broodkin-bw.jpg

The video they have demonstrating the game play seemed a bit incoherent to me, and I ended up shutting it off. The miniatures are beautiful, though.

 privateer4hire wrote:
As someone who last played 40k in 5th edition (and I'm looking seriously at picking this up for board game if nothing else) can you play GSC with the info in the WD plus a 7th ed core rulebook?

Or do you need other info?

You can play them as the formations described in White Dwarf, or add them as allies to an existing army. But there are no current rules for Deathwatch or Genestealer Cult armies in 40K until the rumored, forthcoming codexes later this year.

Yes, they are a playable force. You can build an army based on the rulebook CAD (standard force organisation chart like in 5th) with at least one HQ and two Troops choices chosen from the unit rules in White Dwarf 110. These are rumored to be available on the GW website for free soon as well, source: GW email to retailers.

Genestealer Cult is its own faction. See the unique Genestealer Cult faction symbol (center top of a datasheet).

And you can ally them. We do not know how they treat other factions because not all pages of the new rules have been leaked yet.

Thanks to both of you.
Great news---other than my pre-buying a WD issue 110

You are welcome. You can also ally Astra Militarum (IG) units if you want to play the Cult like in earlier editions. In 7th an army can have as many detachments as you want. So you could play 1 GC detachment (the formation counts as one detachment) and 1 Astra Militarum detachment in your army for example. Worst case the Cult forces and the IG will have to be deployed with 12" distance to each other (called Come the Apocalypse on the ally matrix), and psychic powers and other buffs do not affect the other faction's models. Using IG as cannon fodder and tank support is already possible. I'm currently checking the AM book for what I want to add to my 1500 points Cult Uprising force for a first game.

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Btw thanks a lot, rules leaker