I used to think that but with tournament play I can't even keep up with all the new books heh. I got tabled by crons not knowing what they could do since I didn't buy that dex. I can't even start a new army as I am trying to keep up with all the changes. Then of course there is that shiny new addiction I have heh. I have seen several long term gamers dropping out because they can't keep up with all the rules releases.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Doing another Eldar book and not re-doing the Avatar would just be criminal. It is one of the oldest models in the range. It needs to be redone.
While I don’t disagree, it’s not like the eldar range is short of horribly dated minis. They could update half the range, and still have work to do...
Combine that with the fact that credible rumour sources like Lords of Wargaming have only mentioned the jetbikes and autarch as new kits, its seems the Avatar is just the FW version being included on the GW site.
I don't comprehend people who buy every single Codex and complain about the costs draining their wallets. It's not like there are other ways to acquire the rules, particularly for those armies you don't actually collect, right? Right?
Anyway, I've got some Eldar allies to help spice up my DE army. The talk about the WK "gaining some weight" is intriguing, to say the least.
I think the wraithknight may actually become LOW and GMC. The other codecies that got a giant lord of war were ones that had big plastic kits. Eldar have one of those, he just needs more umpf. I can't wait to see what they do with it(though I already made my own superheavy version)
Also, the avatar of khaine may switch to that slot, he is already one per detachment...
Crazyterran wrote: Pretty much the only change is going to be Banshee Grenades, Serpent Shield Nerf, and Holoshield nerf, right?
I get the two first ones but why the holoshield nerf? It's already bad since you have to move to use it; it gives the same buff as IG/AM camo netting but doesn't work turn one, maybe I am missing something?
Because it sits on an on platform that can make an on-demand 4+ cover jink, which gives a 3+ cover even in the open. An IG vehicle in the open would have 6+ cover and 4+ if it pops its one-use smoke grenades. That's not even speaking of ignoring pens on 2+.
Giving the serpent the 5+ invuln instead would drop its survivability a decent amount. Especially since the player may decide to try and use it instead of jink, making them fail more saves.
Lythrandire Biehrellian wrote: Giving the serpent the 5+ invuln instead would drop its survivability a decent amount. Especially since the player may decide to try and use it instead of jink, making them fail more saves.
The real way to fix serps is fix scatter lasers - currently it's broken. Makes jinking easy.
<sarcasm>
Yeah!! They should treat Wave Serpents like they did Annihilation Barges. Nerf them and increase their point costs, so no one will want to play them. Teach those WAAC Xenos players"
</sarcasm>
Crazyterran wrote: Pretty much the only change is going to be Banshee Grenades, Serpent Shield Nerf, and Holoshield nerf, right?
I get the two first ones but why the holoshield nerf? It's already bad since you have to move to use it; it gives the same buff as IG/AM camo netting but doesn't work turn one, maybe I am missing something?
according to many peole the holofield rules in escalation take precedence - whenever a weapon scores a hit the eldar player rolls a d6; if the titan moved that turn the hit is disgarded on a 3+ if it remains stationary it is discarded on a 4+.
And then you can take cover saves against what didn't get negated.
Fishboy wrote: I used to think that but with tournament play I can't even keep up with all the new books heh. I got tabled by crons not knowing what they could do since I didn't buy that dex. I can't even start a new army as I am trying to keep up with all the changes. Then of course there is that shiny new addiction I have heh. I have seen several long term gamers dropping out because they can't keep up with all the rules releases.
Reading the articles on 1d4chan gives you 95% of the information in a codex. Reading the threads in news and rumours here on Dakka gives you 99% of the information in a codex. Talking to gamers who play the codex helps. The internet has 100% of the information in a codex if you know where to look.
Because you've got two rumours muddled, chap, that's why.
Several items have disappeared, the Avatar isn't one of them, and several URLs appear to redirect to valid, but as yet unused, pages in the GW site, the Avatar is one of those.
Hooo boy, the Windrider models seem to be gone. Too bad I've got a few of the old ones not that long ago but hey, I can always use some more jetbikes in my army. Particularly new shiny models...
H.B.M.C. wrote: Doing another Eldar book and not re-doing the Avatar would just be criminal. It is one of the oldest models in the range. It needs to be redone.
While I don’t disagree, it’s not like the eldar range is short of horribly dated minis. They could update half the range, and still have work to do...
yep
The eldar range needs a lot of love.
Seriously. We're talking about one of the oldest armies in the game, and 3/4 of its infantry model range is Finecast.
Since we're all basically wishlisting I'll go ahead and list what I hope happens.
1. Significantly buffed Phoenix Lords. Every single one with some sort of invulnerable save. Plus much improved guns, holy hell are their guns bad. Seriously, a 220 pt model that has an 18in range, strength 4, AP5, Assault 2, pseudo rending, twin-linked gun, is not worth it. That is basically the same as a 13 point dire avenger, just twin linked. Sure Asurmen's sword is cool but why the hell would he be in an assault as a dire avenger, it makes no sense.
2. If they really want a lord of war, make it the Avatar. You can only take one per detachment already, it would make sense that the Avatar would be the LOW and free up an HQ slot for something more useful. But he definitely needs a speed boost IMO.
3. Make Eldrad useful again. Ever since they nerfed Eldrad into the ground after everyone allied him in to be an anti-psyker, I haven't heard of anyone using him in 6th let alone 7th.
4. New Swooping Hawk models. I love the scourge models with their huge, cool looking wings and I would love if swooping hawks would get the same treatment since lets be honest, their wings are tiny as gak and don't look very impressive.
5. Some way of getting an aspect warrior across the board without having to resort to transport. Battle focus was supposed to help with that but now that there is so much ignore cover it is essentially impossible to run footdar and have any chance of winning.
Those are the top things I think need to happen IMO. What are your thoughts?
Lynchbread wrote: Since we're all basically wishlisting I'll go ahead and list what I hope happens.
1. Significantly buffed Phoenix Lords. Every single one with some sort of invulnerable save. Plus much improved guns, holy hell are their guns bad. Seriously, a 220 pt model that has an 18in range, strength 4, AP5, Assault 2, pseudo rending, twin-linked gun, is not worth it. That is basically the same as a 13 point dire avenger, just twin linked. Sure Asurmen's sword is cool but why the hell would he be in an assault as a dire avenger, it makes no sense.
2. If they really want a lord of war, make it the Avatar. You can only take one per detachment already, it would make sense that the Avatar would be the LOW and free up an HQ slot for something more useful. But he definitely needs a speed boost IMO.
3. Make Eldrad useful again. Ever since they nerfed Eldrad into the ground after everyone allied him in to be an anti-psyker, I haven't heard of anyone using him in 6th let alone 7th.
4. New Swooping Hawk models. I love the scourge models with their huge, cool looking wings and I would love if swooping hawks would get the same treatment since lets be honest, their wings are tiny as gak and don't look very impressive.
5. Some way of getting an aspect warrior across the board without having to resort to transport. Battle focus was supposed to help with that but now that there is so much ignore cover it is essentially impossible to run footdar and have any chance of winning.
Those are the top things I think need to happen IMO. What are your thoughts?
I completely agree, on top of the nerf to the serpent shield you should be able to expend it for a turn for it to be an assault vehicle for that turn.
Also make pathfinders/ranger weapons better like they used to be.
I honestly love most of the Aspect Warrior sculpts. Jes Goodwins stuff holds up better than anything else! The Warp Spiders, often complained about, are such exquisite sculpts, especially the Exarch. Their only problem is the monopose.
Mymearan wrote: I honestly love most of the Aspect Warrior sculpts. Jes Goodwins stuff holds up better than anything else! The Warp Spiders, often complained about, are such exquisite sculpts, especially the Exarch. Their only problem is the monopose.
I'd totally agree with that. The aspect sculpts are pretty ancient now and they still totally stand up. That's the skill of ol'Jes though eh?! They don't need to make many changes to the actual designs - just plasticate the wee buggers and put another nail in Finecast's rotten coffin
I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Oh boy, so Eldars now have to purchase actual tanks and use FOC slots to do the tank heavy role? Sounds good to me IMO.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Oh boy, so Eldars now have to purchase actual tanks and use FOC slots to do the tank heavy role? Sounds good to me IMO.
I'm all for reducing the power of the wave serpent. However if the shield is completely removed it's a 120 point scatter laser platform not including holo fields/ghost walk matrix.
That being said I'd rather the wave serpent be reduced in points than an increase to compensate for the shield.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Oh boy, so Eldars now have to purchase actual tanks and use FOC slots to do the tank heavy role? Sounds good to me IMO.
I'm all for reducing the power of the wave serpent. However if the shield is completely removed it's a 120 point scatter laser platform not including holo fields/ghost walk matrix.
That being said I'd rather the wave serpent be reduced in points than an increase to compensate for the shield.
You mean a 120 point 12/12/10 transport skimmer with jink and a scatter laser.
Harlequins have the Holofield changing to a straight up 5+ save. Just make the Serpent shield a replacement for the holofield, witha 5++ save, 4++ against attacks in the front arc, similar to the old energy shield iteration.
The only drop the shield needs is in range. I've run mine at 6" since the book dropped, and it is fine. All the shield does on the defensive is keep it from exploding. Huge yes, but our troops need that level of protection. Guardians die like conscripts, but are worth 3 of them in price.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
No model bit?? What do you think those 6 antennae on the hull are?
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
No model bit?? What do you think those 6 antennae on the hull are?
Indeed. Its a major part of what separate the serpent from the other skimmers and should be represented in the rules.
I would not mind a less expencive serpent with less effective shield though.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Oh boy, so Eldars now have to purchase actual tanks and use FOC slots to do the tank heavy role? Sounds good to me IMO.
I'm all for reducing the power of the wave serpent. However if the shield is completely removed it's a 120 point scatter laser platform not including holo fields/ghost walk matrix.
That being said I'd rather the wave serpent be reduced in points than an increase to compensate for the shield.
120 points for fast, skimmer, jink, 2+ to reduce pen to glance and scatter laser+shruiken (TL no less) and AV 12/12/10 3 HP with capacity of 12 models. A Hellhound costs 125 points bare bones. I honestly can't see how 120 points is expensive, even with nerfed shields (which my example above was.. I didn't even consider the Phil Kelly shields offensive capabilities).
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Oh boy, so Eldars now have to purchase actual tanks and use FOC slots to do the tank heavy role? Sounds good to me IMO.
You believe that the reason very few take Falcons or Fire Prisms is because of the wave serpent? They're also fairly terrible vehicles.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Oh boy, so Eldars now have to purchase actual tanks and use FOC slots to do the tank heavy role? Sounds good to me IMO.
You believe that the reason very few take Falcons or Fire Prisms is because of the wave serpent? They're also fairly terrible vehicles.
They're not THAT bad, they just compete with War Walkers and Wraithknights.
I would like to see Falcons become a Dedicated Transport option alongside the Wave Serpent.
Lots of numbers were ran a while back comparing the TriLas Pred to the Brightlance Falcon in 6th.
Pred wins - per model - on firepower.
Survivability was endlessly debated. AV13 front is huge for the Pred, but AV11 sides hurt it. Sure, Jink, but the Falcon has no TL, and low ROF, so jinking hurts it hard. Pred can stay back with all weapons being 48", but Falcon has more mobility.
Compared to a TriLas Pred, a BL Falcon is just a little worse per model, if properly kitted. But is a little more expensive. And the TriLas pred isn't generally considered all that great.
So the Falcon is an inch short of being OK. Not terrible, but not that scary.
If scatter lasers keep the laser lock rule, I would bet it only works on a 6 to hit,(no bonus when snap shooting) The serpent is the heaviest tank we have, in regards to defense, (besides superheavy vehicles). It has little in the way is offense for its cost (not including the current shield) the holofields with most certainly will become the same as what are in the Harlequin codex. So what you have is a dedicated transport able to keep itself from blowing up while getting its cargo downfield.
I mathed out the serpent when I updated the V.D.R. and the shield in their eyes was only worth 15 points. When they do the pricing for twin linked weapons, they price bs4 the same as bs3, so there is a slight cost savings there. At any rate, the way the 7th ed codecies are WORDED, not balanced, will bring the serpent in line.
Tldr: As an all around vehicle, the serpent is costed correctly(minus the shield) and the new codex should elimi ate the most ridiculous aspects of it simply because of the way they have been wording things with 7th ed codecies.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
Oh boy, so Eldars now have to purchase actual tanks and use FOC slots to do the tank heavy role? Sounds good to me IMO.
You believe that the reason very few take Falcons or Fire Prisms is because of the wave serpent? They're also fairly terrible vehicles.
They're not terrible. I run Fire Prisms fairly regularly, and I get good mileage out of them. I run a Night Spinner fairly frequently, and THAT vehicle definitely needs something.
Falcons aren't bad persay but they need to be dedicated transports for some Aspect Warriors, or they need to have better offensive power, or cheaper, or a combination of those three things.
Eldar heavy support slots are really crowded... Falcon has to be either a real gun boat or become a dedicated transport in order to see play.
On 4th edition where it was able to fire all weapons no eldar was leaving home without 3 of them.
Removing the weapon ability of the serpent's shield will be enough to remedy the problem I think.
adamsouza wrote: <sarcasm>
Yeah!! They should treat Wave Serpents like they did Annihilation Barges. Nerf them and increase their point costs, so no one will want to play them. Teach those WAAC Xenos players"
</sarcasm>
That would be great, then the rest of the models would be reduced by 40% and they would get a formation bonus for taking units that are already strong.
adamsouza wrote: <sarcasm>
Yeah!! They should treat Wave Serpents like they did Annihilation Barges. Nerf them and increase their point costs, so no one will want to play them. Teach those WAAC Xenos players"
</sarcasm>
That would be great, then the rest of the models would be reduced by 40% and they would get a formation bonus for taking units that are already strong.
If by "rest of the army" you meant the two units that were soo overpriced in the previous codex that no one played them.
Bharring wrote: Lots of numbers were ran a while back comparing the TriLas Pred to the Brightlance Falcon in 6th.
Pred wins - per model - on firepower.
Survivability was endlessly debated. AV13 front is huge for the Pred, but AV11 sides hurt it. Sure, Jink, but the Falcon has no TL, and low ROF, so jinking hurts it hard. Pred can stay back with all weapons being 48", but Falcon has more mobility.
Compared to a TriLas Pred, a BL Falcon is just a little worse per model, if properly kitted. But is a little more expensive. And the TriLas pred isn't generally considered all that great.
So the Falcon is an inch short of being OK. Not terrible, but not that scary.
Sure, if both were immobile, the tri-las pred wins out barely. But 7th is all about mobility now, and being able to move 12" and shoot two weapons is huge, and that's something a non-BA predator can't do. Also, it may not seem like much, but the transport capability should not be overlooked. It seems like a throw-away perk, but I've seen it be used to reposition dark reapers rather effectively.
I also think people sell jink short here. When that S10 AP1 pie plate clips your hull, you'll be thanking your stars for that save, while the poor Pred just dies. A Falcon that's snapfiring but still around turn 4 is far more effective than a Predator that is a smoking crater on turn 3.
The only thing wrong with the Falcon is its a heavy support and cuts into the Wraithknight budget, and to me, that's not a valid criticism of a unit's strength.
All good points, Classic, but there are a lot of points the other way, too.
(I'm not saying the Falcon is trash, I'm claiming its an inch short of the tri-las pred).
Three AT shots vs three AT shots sounds fair. Until we look at the details.
Lascannons are S9. So, outside AV13/14, they pen on one better per shot. 3 shots needing 3's to pen AV12 vs 3 needing 4's is actually quite a difference.
At AV13/14, one of the Falcon's shots has Lance. So, against AV14, Falcons are 1x4's + 2x6's to glance, versus 3x5's. Falcon is 5/6ths as likely to hurt AV14 as the Pred. And the difference is all in pens. Not huge, but a definite advantage to the Pred.
As AV goes down, Pred's advantage goes up, all the way to AV10 (glance on 1s vs glance on 2s).
That is assuming equal chance of hitting. But the Pred wins there, too, with a twin linked weapon.
Lascannons and the Pulse Laser are both likely to be in range at 48". Brightlnce is likely, too, at 36", but it is far less of a given.
So, Tri-Las Pred beats a Falcon against *all* targets, although against some its marginal (grots die just as easily to s9, but Pred hits more reliably).
As for survivability, AV13 front is a big deal. S6 is useless, and S7 can only glance. As those are the current golden boys of hull stripping, that's a big deal. Side AV11 sucks, so it needs to sit in the backfield.
Jinking in the open is a very useful defensive tool. But is it worth taking double damage from S7, and a higher rate of damage from stinger, and not ignoring S6? If they were both sitting back, certainly not. After all, how often do your preds not have at least 5+? Mine rarely gets caught like that.
More likely, both will hug terrain. Moving 12" makes the Pred snapshot, which is still better than the Falcon snapshotting (TL turret, bigger guns). Granted, the Falcon can do it reactively, whereas the Pred chooses to move preemptively.
I'd give that to the Falcon, sure, but not by as large a margin as you seem to believe.
Then we get to Transport. 6 models. So no Wraiths or Guardians. Or anything but min foot Aspect Warrior squads.
Reapers need to shoot. Can't from inside.
Scorpions need to Assault. Looking at T3 at the earliest if you need the falcon, and you should lose the Falcon in the process.
Banshees are like Scorpions, but worse in this case.
Spiders can't embark, even if enough of them die to fit.
Spectres can't embark
Hawks can't embark.
Avengers gets you 5-6 small-arms down field after 2 turns of moving in the Falcon. Not a lot for that kind of investment.
Fire Dragons could be useful. Get them in range to burn a tank. Probably suicide. Often probably costing the tank too. So why not take the cheaper transport, as you're unlikey to get more than one round of shooting out of it? (Yes, our cheapest transport is 115 stock. But the Falcon costs more)
The Transport is nice, sure. But it pays for it what its worth - a nice perk that's part of its definition, but not terribly game-changjng.
Throw this all together, and I still think the LasPred is probably about the same per model, making it a little better per point.
Question, does anyone else get the feeling that the Eldar codex "decurion" will have multiple core types? A Wraith guard one, a Guardian one, and an Aspect one.
Jayden63 wrote: I wouldn't be surprised if serpent shields disappear all together. Its just wargear that doesn't even have an actual model bit. With GW tendency to swing good for bad and bad for good I can see Wave Serpents going back to expensive transports with not much else going for them.
No model bit?? What do you think those 6 antennae on the hull are?
Is that what they are supposed to represent? LOL. I always thought they were just last minute add-ons to make the thing look just a little less like a Falcon.
Kirasu wrote: You believe that the reason very few take Falcons or Fire Prisms is because of the wave serpent? They're also fairly terrible vehicles.
The main reason I don't use Eldar transports is the '6"-move-then-disembark' rule.
Getting one of these huge skimmers over a wall and the hatch turned the right direction is difficult when you only have 6" to do it in.
I'm still hoping for a serpent shield's option to turn into a mini webway portal, and act as an escape hatch. Place the passengers up to 6" in the front arc to act as an assault vehicle, or something.
It didn't happen in the last codex, but I'm still holding my breath...
My bet is the wind riders drop to 4+ armor. I've been running them that way, and it makes sense. The fact that the Harlequin skyweavers have the same style cowling and they roll with a 4+ makes me believe it even more
Anyone else hope that they make the exarches actually useful again? And by that I mean exarch powers like the old bladestorm and defend that actually helped out the whole squad and not just the 1 wound exarch who is going to die really easily so you are just wasting points giving him a 4++ nearly doubling the models price.
The only way I can see the current powers being in anyway worth it is if the exarches get 2 wounds each, that will keep them alive slightly longer and will even match what they did with the harlequin troupe masters.
Lynchbread wrote: Anyone else hope that they make the exarches actually useful again? And by that I mean exarch powers like the old bladestorm and defend that actually helped out the whole squad and not just the 1 wound exarch who is going to die really easily so you are just wasting points giving him a 4++ nearly doubling the models price.
The only way I can see the current powers being in anyway worth it is if the exarches get 2 wounds each, that will keep them alive slightly longer and will even match what they did with the harlequin troupe masters.
Troupe Leaders and now Skitarii Primes are 2 wounds each. I could see Exarchs going to 2 wounds per
Mr.Church13 wrote: I just hope they make Banshees useable. It'll never happen, but hey, a guy can dream.
Hey you never know, look at what happened to Flayed Ones!
That is a good point! I'm more hoping for formations named (and obviously themed) on the different craft world's fighting styles. Sword wind for aspect warriors, black corsairs for guardians, that sort of thing. It would give us a way to mimic the "chapter tactics" style, without it having to apply to the whole army.
I hope they take away the same serpent shield's weapon profile so I don't have to listen to people cry like babies when I bring the only transport I have access to in my fricken codex lol.
Ellethorn wrote: I hope they take away the same serpent shield's weapon profile so I don't have to listen to people cry like babies when I bring the only transport I have access to in my fricken codex lol.
Cheese is cheese - perhaps don't use the cheese gun when you run them and people may not be so offended by your cheese.
Ellethorn wrote: I hope they take away the same serpent shield's weapon profile so I don't have to listen to people cry like babies when I bring the only transport I have access to in my fricken codex lol.
Aww, you hurt the Falcon's feelings. I never had any complains about the Wave Serpent when I field it, but then again I usually don't bring more than one; two at best. Now the Wraithknight on the other hand, I already get sighs when I pull out the model.
It is entirely possible that Aspect squads will get more expensive, but come stock with their Exarch. No more cheap Dire Avenger squads. This would also reinforce the "small elite force" style that Eldar are supposed to be.
If they make Windriders only have a 4+, I would be fine with that, but please don't make them more expensive too. Either drop them by a point or 2, or keep them the same cost.
So, "Faster Than The Eye Can See" means jetbikes most likely.
What does the dying line mean? I didn't think any Wraith constructs were rumored for release. Perhaps they are showcasing Iyanden in the issue? After all, almost everything Eldar since the codex last dropped has been Iyanden.
I'd rather hear from/see other craftworlds myself, but perhaps they are going to feature one per WD this week and next?
Automatically Appended Next Post: Unlikely but possible: Ynead is born!
Or, it just dawned on me, they are actually going to return to treating the Eldar the way they should be - the dying elder race, at the twilight of their existence. Strange, powerful, but failing.
Bharring wrote: Or, it just dawned on me, they are actually going to return to treating the Eldar the way they should be - the dying elder race, at the twilight of their existence. Strange, powerful, but failing.
I can hope.
Hope is the first step on the road to disappointment. (God I love this line)
I'd say I've got nothing against you, I just wish we'd see more than one craftworld.
But I'd be lying. You guys are thoughtless jerks. You trot your poor dead out at the drop of a pin, risking their souls because you feel like it. And you have no respect for the Materium, and use distort weapons freely, deploying them even in cases not worth risking the damage they cause to the physical universe itself!
If you jerks had listened to Eldred - like the rest of us -,when he first came to you to warn you, you'd be fine. But no. You had to think that you knew best.
Bharring wrote: So, "Faster Than The Eye Can See" means jetbikes most likely.
What does the dying line mean? I didn't think any Wraith constructs were rumored for release. Perhaps they are showcasing Iyanden in the issue? After all, almost everything Eldar since the codex last dropped has been Iyanden.
I'd rather hear from/see other craftworlds myself, but perhaps they are going to feature one per WD this week and next?
Wraiths are technically already dead, aren't they? The dying bit probably refers to the fact that the Eldar are considered a dying race.
Achaylus72 wrote: Did I read it right, plastic Rhubric Marines (T-Sons) and again no mention of Sisters.
I must be completely blind. Where did you read about the Rhubrics?
As to the wraiths, didn't a previous rumor say they were 'adding weight' to the wraithlord? Perhaps that line on the WD is simply about new rules coming out for it. I've never actually played against a Knight, are people generally happy with it? Overpowered? UnderpowereD?
The WK has it's place, but it's statline and unit type were an afterthought for GW.
i get that they wanted to make it tough, but putting it at T8 with 6 wounds was ham-fisted at best - it can't be hurt by normal infantry weapons but is still suceptible to 'instant death' weapons which would be fine for MC's, but this is a machine with a guy in it. (same feelings about nemesis dreadknight and riptide battlesuit)
Giving the WK a super-heavy walker profile would not only make me happy (eldar knight vs imperial knight fight!) i think it would be a better representation of how those constructs would be used - i don't think the eldar would send in the wraithknight with a scouting party, but they totally would use it if they knew there was the potential of a protracted battle which wouldn't suit their tactics.
I expect the shield to get hit with the nerf bat, but I hope that they are gentle with the rest of the codex. The Eldar right now have a few units that are competitive unfortunately it is the wave serpent and a few others. The problem is that Eldar have their weaknesses too. They do not have a lot of access to template or blast weapons, they have no assault vehicles or even open topped ones. I was hoping that they would make the Falcon an assault vehicle to make it more viable but alas they did not. We have good units besides the waveserpents, but that is all people see. But we have the Wraithknight - however instant death and anything AP2 or poison can deal with it, We have Spiders - which are wicked fast, but can be dealt with, an autarch in the right hands can be used very effectively. I would say I would like Eldar to lose the ability to summon daemons. It goes against everything core in the fluff and though it might be cool in game anyone that has played Eldar for longer than 6th edition knows that it is inherently wrong and any farseer doing this will find themselves on the short end of a Harlequins kiss. Cheers all.
Chad Warden wrote: Why Eldar revamped so quick? It cant be because they are overpowered, GW has let worse things go on for years.
Maybe because they aren't streamlined enough for 7th. Lots and lots of rules many of which are unnecessary.
It's probably because their model range is ancient and has more FineCost than any other. They'd want to consolidate/make dual kits and remove as much FineCost as possible (or all FineCost).
Chad Warden wrote: Why Eldar revamped so quick? It cant be because they are overpowered, GW has let worse things go on for years.
Maybe because they aren't streamlined enough for 7th. Lots and lots of rules many of which are unnecessary.
It's probably because their model range is ancient and has more FineCost than any other. They'd want to consolidate/make dual kits and remove as much FineCost as possible (or all FineCost).
If I was a betting man, I'd bet on this. IIRC, ALL the aspect warriors are FineCrap and considering FC is now "dead", sounds like an important army to revamp ASAP.
I hope they adjust all the contradicting rules in the Codex and the stuff that simply has no business on certain units.
Maugan Ra has Relentless but his weapon is Assault and Relentless does not spread to the squad. His cost should be brought down a couple of points.
Fire Dragons can have Crushing Blow...Really? A +1S to melee attack on a ranged unit with no CCW. NOBODY in their right mind would spend points on a +1S for a unit you hope never sees Assault.
Battle Focus on jetbikes? Come on.
Serpent shield can get nerfed or removed I do not care.
Would love to see Banshees being made useful again and possibly a rule or exarch power that would allow them to assault when they disembark.
Falcon being available as a dedicated transport.
Make Rangers worth taking.
Make the Avatar a LoW and actually scary. When half the Phoenix lords are scarier than the Living Incarnation of the God of War something is not right.
Chad Warden wrote: Why Eldar revamped so quick? It cant be because they are overpowered, GW has let worse things go on for years.
Maybe because they aren't streamlined enough for 7th. Lots and lots of rules many of which are unnecessary.
GW seem to be working towards two goals right now:
1) Eliminate outdated sculpts from the range, specifically multi-model Finecast sets and old single-purpose plastic sculpts. These are being replaced with kits that can be built with multiple options, reducing space needed for inventory.
2) Break up the product range into smaller chunks that are easier to keep updated with smaller releases. This makes it easier for people to overlap armies and lowering the
The likely end result of this is that instead of Eldar and Dark Eldar books that are updated every ~5 years we instead have:
Eldar > Craftworlds
Eldar > Dark Eldar
Eldar > Harlequins
Eldar > Exodites
Eldar > Biel-Tan (aspect warriors)
Eldar > Iyanden (wraith stuff)
etc...
and every year we can see at least some kind of Eldar release, keeping people interested.
By replacing the current Eldar codex they can remove the last Harlequin rules outside that book, push a couple of new kits (like Jetbikes) and generally begin to streamline an army that has decades of content to keep updated.
not gonna lie, Eldar was crazy OP for some units. I run 5 waveserpent with guardian/dire, wraithknight, and a lynx when I can. People always wanted ot play against it cuz they want to experience the ridculousness. I wonder what the new codex bring to exploit lol.
The plastic Jetbikes will replace two Finecast kits: Jetbike with Shuriken Cannon and Shining Spears. Maybe even the Autarch on Jetbike, if we're lucky.
Bharring wrote: So, what do you think the odds are of BattleFocus getting nerfed or removed? I'd put it at 25%, but you never know.
Could be a paid upgrade. I wouldn't mind paying it but not for all unit across the whole army.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Mr.Church13 wrote: Really hoping for a jetbike/shining spear combo kit. Always wanted to use spears just I hate the old style jetbikes.
QFT, that is really the only thing I want model wise... and the option to play with falcons without feeling like I am gimping myself volontarily by not takine a WS.
Erik_Morkai wrote: I hope they adjust all the contradicting rules in the Codex and the stuff that simply has no business on certain units.
Maugan Ra has Relentless but his weapon is Assault and Relentless does not spread to the squad. His cost should be brought down a couple of points.
Fire Dragons can have Crushing Blow...Really? A +1S to melee attack on a ranged unit with no CCW. NOBODY in their right mind would spend points on a +1S for a unit you hope never sees Assault.
Battle Focus on jetbikes? Come on.
Serpent shield can get nerfed or removed I do not care.
Would love to see Banshees being made useful again and possibly a rule or exarch power that would allow them to assault when they disembark.
Falcon being available as a dedicated transport.
Make Rangers worth taking.
Make the Avatar a LoW and actually scary. When half the Phoenix lords are scarier than the Living Incarnation of the God of War something is not right.
Just a note, Jetbikes don't have battle focus, the guardian riders do... The Jetbikes can't use it because they can't run.
Erik_Morkai wrote: I hope they adjust all the contradicting rules in the Codex and the stuff that simply has no business on certain units.
Maugan Ra has Relentless but his weapon is Assault and Relentless does not spread to the squad. His cost should be brought down a couple of points.
Fire Dragons can have Crushing Blow...Really? A +1S to melee attack on a ranged unit with no CCW. NOBODY in their right mind would spend points on a +1S for a unit you hope never sees Assault.
Battle Focus on jetbikes? Come on.
Serpent shield can get nerfed or removed I do not care.
Would love to see Banshees being made useful again and possibly a rule or exarch power that would allow them to assault when they disembark.
Falcon being available as a dedicated transport.
Make Rangers worth taking.
Make the Avatar a LoW and actually scary. When half the Phoenix lords are scarier than the Living Incarnation of the God of War something is not right.
Just a note, Jetbikes don't have battle focus, the guardian riders do... The Jetbikes can't use it because they can't run.
Even though, eldar jet bikes are already ULTRA mobile, if they wanted to reflect the battle focus on the bikes, they could add something like they added to the Skitari for the +3 movement just for the bikes.
Erik_Morkai wrote: I hope they adjust all the contradicting rules in the Codex and the stuff that simply has no business on certain units.
Maugan Ra has Relentless but his weapon is Assault and Relentless does not spread to the squad. His cost should be brought down a couple of points.
Fire Dragons can have Crushing Blow...Really? A +1S to melee attack on a ranged unit with no CCW. NOBODY in their right mind would spend points on a +1S for a unit you hope never sees Assault.
Battle Focus on jetbikes? Come on.
Serpent shield can get nerfed or removed I do not care.
Would love to see Banshees being made useful again and possibly a rule or exarch power that would allow them to assault when they disembark.
Falcon being available as a dedicated transport.
Make Rangers worth taking.
Make the Avatar a LoW and actually scary. When half the Phoenix lords are scarier than the Living Incarnation of the God of War something is not right.
Just a note, Jetbikes don't have battle focus, the guardian riders do... The Jetbikes can't use it because they can't run.
Even though, eldar jet bikes are already ULTRA mobile, if they wanted to reflect the battle focus on the bikes, they could add something like they added to the Skitari for the +3 movement just for the bikes.
That's the thing, Jetbikes can't battle focus. They literally cannot use that rule. It's their for completeness, since all guardians have it.
Make the Avatar a LoW and actually scary. When half the Phoenix lords are scarier than the Living Incarnation of the God of War something is not right.
\
To be fair the Phoenix Lords are literally one of a kind, they are kind of like the Primarchs of the Aspects, whereas each craftworld has an Avatar. It's kind of like comparing Abaddon to a Blood Thirster. The Avatar does need a buff though.
Bharring wrote: So, what do you think the odds are of BattleFocus getting nerfed or removed? I'd put it at 25%, but you never know.
I agree it's not likely. That was one of the cooler and thematic additions with the last codex. I hope it stays. It made guardians so much more viable (along with their considerable stat buffs of course ).
Bladestorm is here to stay as it is mentioned as such under the harlequin weapons
Serpent shield needs to go or change range or come with more of a downside or something. Somebody mentioned strike down or similar which I think would be cool. The str is too high and the laser lock benefit just make it silly. I feel guilty bringing more than one in a friendly list.
It will be interesting to see what the next few weeks brings us.
Isn't the shield a defensive weapon to ensure that the passagers can disembark safely? Would be cool if it was, say, a Nova power that caused Pinning or something.
Bharring wrote: So, what do you think the odds are of BattleFocus getting nerfed or removed? I'd put it at 25%, but you never know.
Bladestorm is here to stay as it is mentioned as such under the harlequin weapons
Dang, I was really hoping Bladestorm could get scaled back to AP3, but if if the rules are in the Harlequin book, no chance of that happening.
I'm still not really convinced that we are getting a new Codex: Eldar. Maybe some new models, and some new dataslates to go with them, but not a codex rewrite.
they probably thought you knew how to internet. this has been discussed in many recent threads and blogs.
Indeed. Faeit even posted an 'everything you need to know about redirects' post to try to silence people that rush to conclusions and call everyone else idiots just because they don't understand something.
they probably thought you knew how to internet. this has been discussed in many recent threads and blogs.
nope. the citation was incorrect, and completley lacking in the right information, what should have been said is the lowercase version is simply 301 redirecting to a case sensitive version, and since no-one could plausibly be trawling for these links anyway they have to have come from inside GW themselves. i.e. their web team, which is a point no-one seems to have been making, and is actually much more important.. it is an internal leak
they probably thought you knew how to internet. this has been discussed in many recent threads and blogs.
nope. the citation was incorrect, and completley lacking in the right information, what should have been said is the lowercase version is simply 301 redirecting to a case sensitive version, and since no-one could plausibly be trawling for these links anyway they have to have come from inside GW themselves. i.e. their web team, which is a point no-one seems to have been making, and is actually much more important.. it is an internal leak
I think it's entirely plausible that Atia on Bolter and Chainsword is trolling for these. I've considered rigging up a crawler with a dictionary to do the same automated, but that's effort. It's also possibly a leak from web developers within GW or within their e-commerce contractor or within Oracle.
Erik_Morkai wrote: I hope they adjust all the contradicting rules in the Codex and the stuff that simply has no business on certain units.
Maugan Ra has Relentless but his weapon is Assault and Relentless does not spread to the squad. His cost should be brought down a couple of points.
Fire Dragons can have Crushing Blow...Really? A +1S to melee attack on a ranged unit with no CCW. NOBODY in their right mind would spend points on a +1S for a unit you hope never sees Assault.
Battle Focus on jetbikes? Come on.
Serpent shield can get nerfed or removed I do not care.
Would love to see Banshees being made useful again and possibly a rule or exarch power that would allow them to assault when they disembark.
Falcon being available as a dedicated transport.
Make Rangers worth taking.
Make the Avatar a LoW and actually scary. When half the Phoenix lords are scarier than the Living Incarnation of the God of War something is not right.
Bharring wrote: So, "Faster Than The Eye Can See" means jetbikes most likely.
What does the dying line mean? I didn't think any Wraith constructs were rumored for release. Perhaps they are showcasing Iyanden in the issue? After all, almost everything Eldar since the codex last dropped has been Iyanden.
I'd rather hear from/see other craftworlds myself, but perhaps they are going to feature one per WD this week and next?
Wraiths are technically already dead, aren't they? The dying bit probably refers to the fact that the Eldar are considered a dying race.
Well, they WERE a dying race until Matt Ward got his filthy hands on the iyanden book. Suddenly even the smallest craftworld had billions and iyanden are the only craftworld that know how to make a craftworld. Smh
Erik_Morkai wrote: Maugan Ra has Relentless but his weapon is Assault and Relentless does not spread to the squad. His cost should be brought down a couple of points.
Nonsense! He has Relentless because it's fluffy and it helps you Forge a Narrative.
Bharring wrote: So, "Faster Than The Eye Can See" means jetbikes most likely.
What does the dying line mean? I didn't think any Wraith constructs were rumored for release. Perhaps they are showcasing Iyanden in the issue? After all, almost everything Eldar since the codex last dropped has been Iyanden.
I'd rather hear from/see other craftworlds myself, but perhaps they are going to feature one per WD this week and next?
Wraiths are technically already dead, aren't they? The dying bit probably refers to the fact that the Eldar are considered a dying race.
Well, they WERE a dying race until Matt Ward got his filthy hands on the iyanden book. Suddenly even the smallest craftworld had billions and iyanden are the only craftworld that know how to make a craftworld. Smh
I've never read the fluff in the Iyanden supplement so I'll have to take your word on the above. It sounds like good ol' Matt was just trying to mesh the fluff with the new rules and the eldar as a race are no longer limited by a single force org! They can take an infinity number of detachments and formations so naturally the population had to be expanded to match. Ain't progress grand?!
Or, the fact that without billions, they couldn't be a viable faction in the universe. Even with billions on each craft world, they are still pathetically sparse compared to the other races.
The entire eldar race, if every single planet, craft world, and sector of commoragh had 2 billion people, they would still be outnumbered at least 5 to 1 by just the imperial guard.
It is hard for humans to comprehend the excessive numbers they chose to use in 40k. Hell, the writers themselves fall prey to it when they use insignificant numbers whilst trying to show how impressive something is. But the fact remains that their are more humans in some hive cities than there are on the most densely populated craft world. The fluff in Iyanden is actually the most viable statistic I've seen in this nonsensical setting yet!
adamsouza wrote: I just marvel at how they have been a dying race for 10,000 years. Them space elves sure die slow.
They've been around for at least 65 million years, probably more like a hundred million. They were involved in a war that spanned multiple galaxies (although I'm not sure that scale is still canon after the Newcron Codex). It's implied that their population has been decreasing for millions of years as the Eldar became a decadent, urban society dependent on robot labor and defense, with an aging, shrinking population like modern Japan. Before the birth of Slaanesh, they had cities all over real space and through the webway. For all we know, their population has shrunk from quintillions down to hundreds of billions within living memory (for the oldest Eldar).
Billions of Eldar might be a tremendously low number compared to just 100,000 years ago. 10,000 years is almost nothing to them. Imagine if the population of Earth shrunk to just one million people in the next decade. Would that seem like it's taking forever for humans to die off?
BobtheInquisitor wrote: Billions of Eldar might be a tremendously low number compared to just 100,000 years ago. 10,000 years is almost nothing to them. Imagine if the population of Earth shrunk to just one million people in the next decade. Would that seem like it's taking forever for humans to die off?
That's a really good way of putting it. I hadn't thought of it that way.
It's also worth pointing out the relativity of numbers. Even if each craftworld had a hundred billion Eldar on them, and each Exodite world had a hundred billion Eldar on it, that would still pale in comparison to most of the other factions in the setting in terms of numbers- thus the "dying race" moniker.
edit- As far as my predictions for what would change in the codex: I foresee the Avatar remaining an HQ, and still crap due to being a walking MC. If anyone is going to become a LoW, it seems likely to me that Eldrad would be the frontman. Battle-focus will stay, pseudo-rending will stay, the Phoenix Lords will get token price drops but will otherwise fail to have any of their core issues addressed. I wouldn't be surprised if the serpent shield got nerfed, and the rest of the book will be a series of small point changes here and there with most of the units remaining the same in functionality.
Double-edit: I don't think WIndrider Jetbikes will get moved to FA. Though that would fit the trend, there'd be too much clash between them and Shining Spears.
Azreal13 wrote: In fairness, having a lifespan measured in centuries and millennia will take a while for them to peter out.
Humans live a long time too, though. Kinda like Mr. Emperor-San has been around for millennia (ok fine, he has a nice chair). But Dante is older than a thousand years, too, IIRC.
Azreal13 wrote: In fairness, having a lifespan measured in centuries and millennia will take a while for them to peter out.
Humans live a long time too, though. Kinda like Mr. Emperor-San has been around for millennia (ok fine, he has a nice chair). But Dante is older than a thousand years, too, IIRC.
Compared to the Eldar? No, we are but candles in a storm, our lives are snuffed out in an instant.
Besides those 2 anomalies like H.B.M.C puts it (Hell, Space marines don't live that much time because they die in action), we know humans have a greater life-span because of rejuvenating treatments, with officers living over 150 years or even more but compare that to an eldar, who's natural life-span is over 1000 years.
On-topic: When are we probably getting some leaks about the eldar? Next Monday?
Not even close. Some (not many) Eldar are still around from before the Fall.
Vect is the only one that comes to mind. The phoenix lords are all actually different guys possessed by their armor, so the only other one I can think of may be Eldrad, but I forget how old he is. Also he died lol.
Even with him alive now, he was already the premiere farseer for ulthwe during the emperor's crusade. That takes time, a lot of it.
With then last few codecies, they seemed to alternate army organization styles. Blood angels, force organization chart and some formations. Necrons, force org chart made of formations. Harlequin, forces org chart and formations. Daemonkin, force organization.made of formations. Admech, force organization chart and formations.
If the trend stays true, the Eldar will indeed get a decurian style detachment. That would make me happy
Not even close. Some (not many) Eldar are still around from before the Fall.
Vect is the only one that comes to mind. The phoenix lords are all actually different guys possessed by their armor, so the only other one I can think of may be Eldrad, but I forget how old he is. Also he died lol.
I'm sure that Vect isn't the only Dark Eldar to be that long lived maybe even Urien
Prediction: Guardians(both) go up to 10PPM and Dire Avengers go to 14PPM.
Still crunching numbers, but based off of the currant DE codex, and the way the numbers for infantry models, that seems to be what it will come out to. Though Wyches end up being 1PPM to much using the method I have found, but most seem to fall into the system. Would like to find out.
megatrons2nd wrote: Prediction: Guardians(both) go up to 10PPM and Dire Avengers go to 14PPM.
Still crunching numbers, but based off of the currant DE codex, and the way the numbers for infantry models, that seems to be what it will come out to. Though Wyches end up being 1PPM to much using the method I have found, but most seem to fall into the system. Would like to find out.
Hmm I sure hope not. I already almost never use Guardians since I consider them too costly myself. I mean they are going to die twice as fast as the dire avengers since a lot of stuff is going to punch through that 5+ armor, that the DA's 4+ armor would have otherwise stopped. Not to mention needing to get a very costly transport just to get the guardians in range, I don't see any reason in not paying the extra 40 points for the 10 Dire Avengers, that way when they pop out and attack they can at least take a hit for one turn. For me to take Guardians I either need to see a cheaper transportation option or the guardians are going to have to drop down to 7ppm to see some use.
Lythrandire Biehrellian wrote: Or, the fact that without billions, they couldn't be a viable faction in the universe. Even with billions on each craft world, they are still pathetically sparse compared to the other races.
The entire eldar race, if every single planet, craft world, and sector of commoragh had 2 billion people, they would still be outnumbered at least 5 to 1 by just the imperial guard.
It is hard for humans to comprehend the excessive numbers they chose to use in 40k. Hell, the writers themselves fall prey to it when they use insignificant numbers whilst trying to show how impressive something is. But the fact remains that their are more humans in some hive cities than there are on the most densely populated craft world. The fluff in Iyanden is actually the most viable statistic I've seen in this nonsensical setting yet!
But that could still work since the Eldar have infinite reach. They can be on (almost) any world in the galaxy instantly while the billions of IG are still climbing into their troop ships.
Also if their technology was sufficiently impressive and if each Eldar were a ninja-jedi-warrior prince.
If I were rebooting 40k from the ground up I'd want a game where 10 marines or Eldar were a match for a 100 or more IG, Orks or Nids.
Course that wouldn't be a great game for mini sales.
Kid_Kyoto wrote: They can be on (almost) any world in the galaxy instantly
The webway has never been instantaneous travel.
Its the combination of web way technology, scrying, careful planning and ruthless preemptive strikes that make up their seemingly uncanny speed across the galaxy, right?
Um... Eldar jet bikes are off the website? Seeing that they've already been reboxed does that mean we may be seeing new jetbike models coming out soon?
PuddlePirate wrote: Um... Eldar jet bikes are off the website? Seeing that they've already been reboxed does that mean we may be seeing new jetbike models coming out soon?
That's old news. Certainly seems so. There's been some talk about a speed-related hint in the upcoming WD.
Kid_Kyoto wrote: They can be on (almost) any world in the galaxy instantly
The webway has never been instantaneous travel.
Its the combination of web way technology, scrying, careful planning and ruthless preemptive strikes that make up their seemingly uncanny speed across the galaxy, right?
(By 'instantaneous' in regards to the Webway, they are referencing how travel time is independent of distance. Where almost all other races have travel times measured in years that generally scales about linearly with distance, taking an hour or so to cross the galaxy seems instantaneous.
So, even in a galaxy where everyone outpaces their cones of light, WWP travel still seems instantaneous.)
Kid_Kyoto wrote: They can be on (almost) any world in the galaxy instantly
The webway has never been instantaneous travel.
Its the combination of web way technology, scrying, careful planning and ruthless preemptive strikes that make up their seemingly uncanny speed across the galaxy, right?
And an almost fanatical devotion to the Pope .
It had been long enough since the Inquisition codex, thank you for the chuckle exalted!
If I were rebooting 40k from the ground up I'd want a game where 10 marines or Eldar were a match for a 100 or more IG, Orks or Nids.
Course that wouldn't be a great game for mini sales.
As somebody who can field a horde army, this is a terrible idea.
How long do you want to make set up time? Buy, paint and assemble 100 gaunts/orks/guardsmen and come back to me. Then do it again.
You would end up with really well painted armies on one side, and really badly/unpainted armies on the other, and with people leaving IG, Orks and Nids in droves.
If I were rebooting 40k from the ground up I'd want a game where 10 marines or Eldar were a match for a 100 or more IG, Orks or Nids.
Course that wouldn't be a great game for mini sales.
As somebody who can field a horde army, this is a terrible idea.
How long do you want to make set up time? Buy, paint and assemble 100 gaunts/orks/guardsmen and come back to me. Then do it again.
You would end up with really well painted armies on one side, and really badly/unpainted armies on the other, and with people leaving IG, Orks and Nids in droves.
That also assumes that each marine is equal to one "eldar" which I can't see being supported in the fluff either. Also, "eldar" can mean alot of different things (guardian, aspect warrior, which aspect warrior?) when talking about mooks where as "marine" is much more standard overall (with exceptions obviously like termies and scouts). I could see the justification for an aspect warrior possibly being "equal" to a marine (although I'd personally disagree overall) but not a guardian in any way in a reboot. I'd personally put it at 5 marines, 10 aspect warriors, and 100 IG. In any case, I suspect that if you want to play those types of numbers, it might be better instead to just play the RPG using the horde rules.
I'm not overly concerned with the tabletop adhering to the fluff. That hasn't been a thing for a long time. I could go off on a long tirade about how the game used to be 'grimdark' and now its just a tabletop version of Coll of Duty. Marines have lost virtually all of their appeal for me as a player, and the Eldar (while I like them a lot still) are probably the next to suffer that fate.
Regardless of what happens with the fluff (which is almost assuredly going to be rewritten) I think that the models are far overdue for an update.
With the recent release of the Dark Eldar (and how successful they were as a rage) and the even more recent release of the Harlequins, I think that all the basic elements are in place for some retooled Edlar plastic kits. The Windrider Jetbikes being gone from the store currently seems like a good indicator that we can expect some new models to replace them, which is likely to be very close in appearance to the new Harlequin bikes. I am fine with this.
I'd love for the Vyper to get a new kit as well since it's currently one of the most annoying kits I've ever assembled, but I've gone this long without one, I'd be shocked if they solved more than one problem in a calendar year.
I don't have any more items on my wishlist at this time... at least nothing unique to the Eldar. All they need to do to make me a happy camper is just remove flyers from the game entirely...
So I don't know if this has been posted yet, but the hint for next week's Paint Splatter in WD is "More red, but different" Possibly Saim Hann jetbikes do we think?
angelofvengeance wrote: So I don't know if this has been posted yet, but the hint for next week's Paint Splatter in WD is "More red, but different" Possibly Saim Hann jetbikes do we think?
angelofvengeance wrote: So I don't know if this has been posted yet, but the hint for next week's Paint Splatter in WD is "More red, but different" Possibly Saim Hann jetbikes do we think?
I'd not be surprised if it was a Saim Hann supplement.
I don't think a complete new Eldar codex makes sense. The book isn't the oldest of the current lot (Hi Dark Angels and Chaos) and a new codex could well make an existing supplement (Iyanden) invalid as some of the options might just not exist.
And considering we're due a codex rush of sorts a Saim Hann supplement makes sense as that seems to be what they've treated the current Ad Mech and Daemonkin books as.
Of course, 'More red, but different' could just be referring to a proper Ad Mech codex with the Skitari being their supplement equivalent (Like MT and AM).
angelofvengeance wrote: I'm not sure where all this redirect stuff is coming from, since you'd get that for adding pretty much anything that doesn't talk to GWs site surely?
No, you get a different error for random stuff. This is deliberate.
The error you get is the same, it's the redirect itself which is the giveaway something is coming there. Without going into the technical aspects of Oracle databases and 301 responses, you can easily check for yourself. If you pick this url, for example:
You'll notice that in your address bar it becomes capitalised, e.g. 'Codex-Craftworlds-ENG'. However if you just add something random to the url in lower case:
You'll notice that while you get the same 404 error page, the words in your address bar don't become capitalised. These urls are gained through simple datamining and guessing; trying different things until something returns a redirect. This means someone at GW added the item to their website's database already, but hasn't published the page yet, which in turn means they're most likely preparations for an upcoming release.
Redemption wrote: The error you get is the same, it's the redirect itself which is the giveaway something is coming there. Without going into the technical aspects of Oracle databases and 301 responses, you can easily check for yourself. If you pick this url, for example:
You'll notice that in your address bar it becomes capitalised, e.g. 'Codex-Craftworlds-ENG'. However if you just add something random to the url in lower case:
You'll notice that while you get the same 404 error page, the words in your address bar don't become capitalised. These urls are gained through simple datamining and guessing; trying different things until something returns a redirect. This means someone at GW added the item to their website's database already, but hasn't published the page yet, which in turn means they're most likely preparations for an upcoming release.
ceorron wrote: Will sisters ever get done. I was really, really hoping they would before another SM codex. Sigh
Eldar need some new models and some fixes to their codex............ whether they will get what is wanted and desired is much more debatable - GW is nothng but unpredictable...
Although mroe than agreed - a new Sisters Codex and figures range is much more needed than another Astartes: "Cosmetically different Marines" Codex.
ceorron wrote: Will sisters ever get done. I was really, really hoping they would before another SM codex. Sigh
Eldar need some new models and some fixes to their codex............ whether they will get what is wanted and desired is much more debatable - GW is nothng but unpredictable...
Although mroe than agreed - a new Sisters Codex and figures range is much more needed than another Astartes: "Cosmetically different Marines" Codex.
To be fair Chaos Space Marines would probably like a Codex that isn't wholly reliable either on supplements or alternative codexes altogether to be functional as more than one-trick ponies and I'm sure Dark Angels would love to actually be able to get something that's actually unique to them or at least shared access to some of the new SM vehicles and weapons like Graviton guns or, you know, Storm Ravens, Storm Eagles, Hunters, Stalkers....
Those two Codexes stand out to me as being pretty damn terrible as they were the two that came around before the big 'power spike' of Tau, Eldar and SM and all that followed.
Seriously. I honestly feel that my 'generic' CSM army is actually reliant on using Crimson Slaughter simply because the relics, free Fear and improved Possessed are far better than the tripe we currently get.
To be fair Chaos Space Marines would probably like a Codex that isn't wholly reliable either on supplements or alternative codexes altogether to be functional as more than one-trick ponies
Agreed Chaos have been hard done by.........
I'm sure Dark Angels would love to actually be able to get something that's actually unique to them or at least shared access to some of the new SM vehicles and weapons like Graviton guns or, you know, Storm Ravens, Storm Eagles, Hunters, Stalkers....
That's IMO the problem with some of the Space Marine releases ove the last couple of editions - increasingly depserate and often silly attempts to give a few "special" Chapters their own unique units - rather than just keeping the fluff 0 and now we are stuck with Blood Guns and Logans Sleigh. But equally ignoing actually more unusual Chapters or equal vintage and importance.
To be fair Chaos Space Marines would probably like a Codex that isn't wholly reliable either on supplements or alternative codexes altogether to be functional as more than one-trick ponies
Agreed Chaos have been hard done by.........
I'm sure Dark Angels would love to actually be able to get something that's actually unique to them or at least shared access to some of the new SM vehicles and weapons like Graviton guns or, you know, Storm Ravens, Storm Eagles, Hunters, Stalkers....
That's IMO the problem with some of the Space Marine releases ove the last couple of editions - increasingly depserate and often silly attempts to give a few "special" Chapters their own unique units - rather than just keeping the fluff 0 and now we are stuck with Blood Guns and Logans Sleigh. But equally ignoing actually more unusual Chapters or equal vintage and importance.
Except there actually weren't any "blood guns" aside from the hundreds of snarky comments on the internet.
To be fair Chaos Space Marines would probably like a Codex that isn't wholly reliable either on supplements or alternative codexes altogether to be functional as more than one-trick ponies
Agreed Chaos have been hard done by.........
I'm sure Dark Angels would love to actually be able to get something that's actually unique to them or at least shared access to some of the new SM vehicles and weapons like Graviton guns or, you know, Storm Ravens, Storm Eagles, Hunters, Stalkers....
That's IMO the problem with some of the Space Marine releases ove the last couple of editions - increasingly depserate and often silly attempts to give a few "special" Chapters their own unique units - rather than just keeping the fluff 0 and now we are stuck with Blood Guns and Logans Sleigh. But equally ignoing actually more unusual Chapters or equal vintage and importance.
Except there actually weren't any "blood guns" aside from the hundreds of snarky comments on the internet.
Symantics - My old Blood Angels Codex (when it was ruined by stupid "themed" addiitons) has Blood Fists, Blood Talons, Blood Strike Missiles
Meh just roll em all into one $200 400pg book and call it Adeptus Astartes: Robes, Swords, Blood, Wolves, and Smurf edition. Call it a day and go home.
Mr.Church13 wrote: Meh just roll em all into one $200 400pg book and call it Adeptus Astartes: Robes, Swords, Blood, Wolves, and Smurf edition. Call it a day and go home.
No!
It must be called Adeptus Astartes: Blue, Green, Red, Grey, Silver, Spiky and Generic.
To be fair Chaos Space Marines would probably like a Codex that isn't wholly reliable either on supplements or alternative codexes altogether to be functional as more than one-trick ponies
Agreed Chaos have been hard done by.........
I'm sure Dark Angels would love to actually be able to get something that's actually unique to them or at least shared access to some of the new SM vehicles and weapons like Graviton guns or, you know, Storm Ravens, Storm Eagles, Hunters, Stalkers....
That's IMO the problem with some of the Space Marine releases ove the last couple of editions - increasingly depserate and often silly attempts to give a few "special" Chapters their own unique units - rather than just keeping the fluff 0 and now we are stuck with Blood Guns and Logans Sleigh. But equally ignoing actually more unusual Chapters or equal vintage and importance.
Except there actually weren't any "blood guns" aside from the hundreds of snarky comments on the internet.
Symantics - My old Blood Angels Codex (when it was ruined by stupid "themed" addiitons) has Blood Fists, Blood Talons, Blood Strike Missiles
And the 5th edition Space Wolf book gave us Wolf Wolfborn, of the Space Wolves, riding a giant wolf with his wolf claws and his wolf tooth necklace.
And now, any new eldar rumors? I've heard nothing about whether or not there will be a kit for seers on jetbikes... I kind of wish they would drop them, I don't understand how everything is said to be moving at ludicrous speed on the bikes, requiring all of their attention, but there are psyckers casting powers (also requiring all their attention) while riding the same bikes. Just seems silly to me. I felt like a cheater the first time I moved 12" cast my powers at some poor chumps, then turbo boosted 3 feet away so they didn't retaliate.
Mr.Church13 wrote: Meh just roll em all into one $200 400pg book and call it Adeptus Astartes: Robes, Swords, Blood, Wolves, and Smurf edition. Call it a day and go home.
No!
It must be called Adeptus Astartes: Blue, Green, Red, Grey, Silver, Spiky and Generic.
To be fair Chaos Space Marines would probably like a Codex that isn't wholly reliable either on supplements or alternative codexes altogether to be functional as more than one-trick ponies
Agreed Chaos have been hard done by.........
I'm sure Dark Angels would love to actually be able to get something that's actually unique to them or at least shared access to some of the new SM vehicles and weapons like Graviton guns or, you know, Storm Ravens, Storm Eagles, Hunters, Stalkers....
That's IMO the problem with some of the Space Marine releases ove the last couple of editions - increasingly depserate and often silly attempts to give a few "special" Chapters their own unique units - rather than just keeping the fluff 0 and now we are stuck with Blood Guns and Logans Sleigh. But equally ignoing actually more unusual Chapters or equal vintage and importance.
Except there actually weren't any "blood guns" aside from the hundreds of snarky comments on the internet.
Symantics - My old Blood Angels Codex (when it was ruined by stupid "themed" addiitons) has Blood Fists, Blood Talons, Blood Strike Missiles
And the 5th edition Space Wolf book gave us Wolf Wolfborn, of the Space Wolves, riding a giant wolf with his wolf claws and his wolf tooth necklace.
Or wolf wolf, wolf, wolf, wolf wolf.
40k is an absurd game, man. Warhammer in general is absurd- it's part of the charm. There's a primarch named Iron Hands (who has iron hands) who leads the Iron Hands who give themselves iron hands in emulation of Iron Hands. The Grand Inquisitor of the Ordo Hereticus is named after the Grand Inquisitor in a dostoyevsky novel. Konrad Curze is full of Joseph Conrad references. I'm not even sure what's attempting to be argued here- that your blood angels were ruined by being pushed over the top? It wasn't enough that they were 8 foot tall genetically modified vampire super-soldiers, haunted eternally by the psychic echo of the death of their genetic angel-dad, "blood guy"?
Although mroe than agreed - a new Sisters Codex and figures range is much more needed than another Astartes: "Cosmetically different Marines" Codex.
Uh... Sisters ARE "cosmetically different marines."
Errr - no not really - stats are different, special units are different, vehicles are different, special powers are different, background is different, -the only thing that is the same is that the both wear Power Armour (and thats a different style so looks totally different), use Bolters and fight for the Imperium.
And the 5th edition Space Wolf book gave us Wolf Wolfborn, of the Space Wolves, riding a giant wolf with his wolf claws and his wolf tooth necklace.
Or wolf wolf, wolf, wolf, wolf wolf.
yep ad that was crap too. and of course the great sliegh of not awesomeness - loved that for my Space Wolves. Also Murder dreadnought from Murder world.
As noted the absurdity of the 40k universe is great - just keep using one world to somehow create a "theme" is lazy and weak.
back to Eldar - I am worried we will not see Wave Serpents or Howling Banshees fixed and somehow make the whole thing worse........ They make just make a super fast army formation and make WS better or screw over half the army like they did with Wyches and Dark Eldar.
Errr - no not really - stats are different, special units are different, vehicles are different, special powers are different, background is different, -the only thing that is the same is that the both wear Power Armour (and thats a different style so looks totally different), use Bolters and fight for the Imperium.
Grey Knights. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check.
Space Wolves. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check
Dark Angles. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background.. check
Etc..
By that benchmark, the problem of *cosmetically different* Marines doesn't exist anyhow.
Errr - no not really - stats are different, special units are different, vehicles are different, special powers are different, background is different, -the only thing that is the same is that the both wear Power Armour (and thats a different style so looks totally different), use Bolters and fight for the Imperium.
Grey Knights. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check.
Space Wolves. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check
Dark Angles. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background.. check
Etc..
By that benchmark, the problem of *cosmetically different* Marines doesn't exist anyhow.
Rubbish - what different stats for the Marines - the basic Marines are the same - WS4, BS4 S4, T4, I3 LD8 etc - by that standard the whole Imperial forces are the same.
Sisters are S3, T3, I3, - they are closer to Guard with Power Armour with special powers - as you well know.
Before the 5th edition rubbish - how different were the Chapters you list??? Dark Angels had some special formations and structure, same as the Space Wolves and Blood Angels. Now they have "unique units" just to try and justify a Codex. Their background and ay of fighting already differentiates them more than "themed" units.
You are seriously saying the backgroudn was improved with the various "blood" weapons, wolves riding wolves, Sleighs pulled by Wolves, Murder Dreadnought from Murder world, Super pure Grey Knights who are purere than the rest of the super Pure chapter ?? I know I hated them for all my Marine armies
By your reasoning - Each of the 1000 different Asartes Chapters should get their own Codex rather than the just the random ones they have chosen and keep trying to make different.
Errr - no not really - stats are different, special units are different, vehicles are different, special powers are different, background is different, -the only thing that is the same is that the both wear Power Armour (and thats a different style so looks totally different), use Bolters and fight for the Imperium.
Grey Knights. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check.
Space Wolves. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check
Dark Angles. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background.. check
Etc..
By that benchmark, the problem of *cosmetically different* Marines doesn't exist anyhow.
Rubbish - what different stats for the Marines - the basic Marines are the same - WS4, BS4 S4, T4, I3 LD8 etc - by that standard the whole Imperial forces are the same.
Sisters are S3, T3, I3, - they are closer to Guard with Power Armour with special powers - as you well know.
Space Wolves have a fair few units with WS/BS3, whereas both Wolves and DA have Scouts with WS/BS4. Grey Knights have better LD, are Psykers, some with 2 Wounds. All of them have actually far more units without Power Armour than Sisters have (Terminators, Scouts, Sanguinary Guard). Abilities vary widely (as noted, Psykers, Deathwing, Raven Wing, Thunderwolves, etc..).
A Space Wolf on a Thunderwolf, a Grey Knight Paladin or a Ravenwing Biker are far, far, far more different to a normal Marine than anything found in the Sisters book, not to mention things like Storm Wolves with Helfrost weapons, Dreadknights with Incinerators or Land Speeder Darkshroud. Arguably, they are more different from a normal Marine than even a Guardsman is different from a normal Marine.
Are you seriously arguing that a small difference in 3 random stats and a female haircut optic makes Sisters the big exception while thousands of other differences don't matter?
Although mroe than agreed - a new Sisters Codex and figures range is much more needed than another Astartes: "Cosmetically different Marines" Codex.
Uh... Sisters ARE "cosmetically different marines."
No there not. Let's look at why shall we?
Firstly sisters are T3 they have lower WS and are Primarily are Shooting / mid range army relying on Heavy flamers and melta weaponry to take mobs and out heavy armoured foes respectively.
Do Space Marines have Acts of Faith? Possibly if you count litanies of hate.
They have one CC unit one (unless you take priests which you get access to another that is fairly usless.) . That has literally no armour save. If your smart you'll shoot this first whichever they take
They have a CC walker that's mid range also again it's rare this gets into CC and compared to a dreadnaught it's rather weak.
They have the immolator a mid range tank, and the exorsist their only long range weapon. That has more in common with IG viechles except that it's mounted on a rhino body.
I'm not sure on the latest dex if they still have the Rosirus but if they do okay fine a 5+ inv( 3+/5+ inv ) that's better in my mind than a regular 3+
Fratis Militia / Redempionists a mob unit that is more in common with Chaos Cultists. Depending on the Version ones purely pistol, the other has autoguns.
So let's see what they have in common with Space Marines.
I'm going to wave the Inquisitors as in my mind felt tacked on
Their weaponry okay yes Boltguns ( including Storm and Heavy / pistols) , Heavy and regular flamer/ melta guns as well as hand flamers
They use rhinos as the basis for their two offensive tanks and use the basic as their transport.
You could argue that Dominions are just Devostators and Seraphim are just Jump pack troopers but the Seraphim are more like mobile mid range harassment troops and SM Jump Are more quick hitting CC, ill give you Dominions if you take all Heavy Bolters.
Sister Superiors can get Power weapons but cant all Seargent type character people? I think Tau are the only ones that cant.
And finally power armour oh my why would another Army use our special snowflake Armour and weapons.
SoB had an army before Black Templars, before Grey Knights. You could say that Grey Knights stole acts of Faith with their whole psychic powers stick but I'm willing to wave this as I'm sure they had psychic powers before. But not regular power Armour.
And don't they have a save against warp powers?( again not sure if each unit has them now or they are just fancy SM now). Sisters had this.
Errr - no not really - stats are different, special units are different, vehicles are different, special powers are different, background is different, -the only thing that is the same is that the both wear Power Armour (and thats a different style so looks totally different), use Bolters and fight for the Imperium.
Grey Knights. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check.
Space Wolves. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background... check
Dark Angles. Different stats, different special units, different vehicles, different special powers, different background.. check
Etc..
By that benchmark, the problem of *cosmetically different* Marines doesn't exist anyhow.
Rubbish - what different stats for the Marines - the basic Marines are the same - WS4, BS4 S4, T4, I3 LD8 etc - by that standard the whole Imperial forces are the same.
Sisters are S3, T3, I3, - they are closer to Guard with Power Armour with special powers - as you well know.
Space Wolves have a fair few units with WS/BS3, whereas both Wolves and DA have Scouts with WS/BS4. Grey Knights have better LD, are Psykers, some with 2 Wounds. All of them have actually far more units without Power Armour than Sisters have (Terminators, Scouts, Sanguinary Guard). Abilities vary widely (as noted, Psykers, Deathwing, Raven Wing, Thunderwolves, etc..).
A Space Wolf on a Thunderwolf, a Grey Knight Paladin or a Ravenwing Biker are far, far, far more different to a normal Marine than anything found in the Sisters book, not to mention things like Storm Wolves with Helfrost weapons, Dreadknights with Incinerators or Land Speeder Darkshroud. Arguably, they are more different from a normal Marine than even a Guardsman is different from a normal Marine.
Are you seriously arguing that a small difference in 3 random stats and a female haircut optic makes Sisters the big exception while thousands of other differences don't matter?
I know I'm wading into one of the silliest arguments you can have on the internet, BUT...
Grey Knights obviously require their own codex. Even though the basic structure of the army is the same ("5-10 marines in power armor in a Rhino, repeat"), the wargear options and mechanics of their special rules are drastically different. Most importantly, these differences are justified by how extremely different Grey Knights are from other marine chapters in the fluff.
Now look at Blood Angels and Dark Angels. Fluff-wise they are actually codex compliant chapters, and although they emphasize different tactics and organizational structures, they don't differ to a greater extent than Raven Guard or White Scars (who fit into the vanilla codex just fine) or especially Black Templars (who aren't remotely compliant, and I would argue don't fit in the vanilla codex well, but improvements to their characters and chapter tactics could make it work). So there isn't a great fluff justification for them to need drastically different rules in the first place (heck, in second edition they shared a codex, and it was virtually identical to the vanilla codex barring a few special rules, and they were still very popular).
In terms of mechanics of their unique rules units, I would argue that once you eliminate the various new additions that should be unborn and forgotten about (like the Land Speeder Incredibly Silly), units/rules that should be available to all codex chapters (jump pack honor guard, librarian dreadnoughts, the ability to field a terminator company or bike company, etc), and units that are superfluous duplicates (the Dark Angels fighter and Storm Guppy could both be supplanted by one kit with the Nephilim's superior looks and the Guppy's superior rules as probably the best example) you're left with unique units and chapter tactics that aren't any more drastic than the Black Templars' treatment.
While this would result in a huge codex, I think it would benefit all marine players. The only units lost by the BA/DA would be those whose fluff (and physical appearance) was the equivalent of a saturday morning cartoon - invented quickly and lazily out of wholecloth to sell chunky plastic toys. In turn they would gain access to various vanilla codex units, and more importantly, they would all share a common baseline set of rules - all chapters would be more or less equally functional and none would be left lagging behind for years (sorry about that, Dark Angels). In turn, the vanilla codex would benefit from units it's been missing to avoid stepping on toes ("Only the Blood Angels honor guard can ever go into battle with jump packs, Raven Guard would never do that!") and it would give another chance to rejigger the chapter tactics of some of the overlooked chapters in the vanilla dex. Everybody wins.
(I'm not going to touch Space Wolves in this conversation, I think their new fluff and new units are terrible, but I'd be fine if they and the Black Templars were the only separate marine codexes.)
Anyway, back to the main point, Sisters of Battle. Honestly compare them to marines. Is the comparison like BA/DA, where virtually every unit has an identical name, stats, weapon choices, and special rules (or if not identical, close enough they could be merged without violating any fluff), bar a few truly unique units and an army wide rule or two? Or is it like Grey Knights, where literally every unit has unique stats, weapons options, and special rules, with almost nothing in common except a few bits of wargear like armor and bolters, and even the fluff is so drastically different you couldn't merge the two without trashing it?
Now look at Blood Angels and Dark Angels. Fluff-wise they are actually codex compliant chapters, and although they emphasize different tactics and organizational structures, they don't differ to a greater extent than Raven Guard or White Scars (who fit into the vanilla codex just fine) or especially Black Templars (who aren't remotely compliant, and I would argue don't fit in the vanilla codex well, but improvements to their characters and chapter tactics could make it work). So there isn't a great fluff justification for them to need drastically different rules in the first place (heck, in second edition they shared a codex, and it was virtually identical to the vanilla codex barring a few special rules, and they were still very popular).
In terms of mechanics of their unique rules units, I would argue that once you eliminate the various new additions that should be unborn and forgotten about (like the Land Speeder Incredibly Silly), units/rules that should be available to all codex chapters (jump pack honor guard, librarian dreadnoughts, the ability to field a terminator company or bike company, etc), and units that are superfluous duplicates (the Dark Angels fighter and Storm Guppy could both be supplanted by one kit with the Nephilim's superior looks and the Guppy's superior rules as probably the best example) you're left with unique units and chapter tactics that aren't any more drastic than the Black Templars' treatment.
Well, change the fluff, if it bothers you so?
"Uncreating" the unique Dark Angels or Space Wolves flyers, units, etc... to roll them into the Space Marines codex is no more or less drastic than upping Sisters to T4, removing the Immolator and rolling them into Space Marines codex, once your all to evident personal bias (e.g. "Storm Guppy") is taken out of it.
SarisKhan wrote: Could you please move the SM discussion somewhere else? This is rumour thread for an Eldar release.
Indeed.
We understand and appreciate that threads will always divert somewhat, especially if there's been no real or substantial info recently, but the above discussion would be best served elsewhere.
It would be great if any/all of the aspect warrior boxes get plastic updates. They could do it with only 2-3 new multi-part plastic boxes. Scorps+Fire Dragons, Warp Spiders+Reapers, Banshees+Hawks. You would have to be clever in the head/sholder/backpack options but it would be a feat of real greatness that I'd love to see happen.
Also new plastic jetbike as that has been a long time coming.
I vote no on dual aspect kits. They'll lose the majority of their uniqueness if they do that they might as well make them one sculpt with weapon options and a painting guide for different aspects.
I love the Aspect sculpts, i really don't think they need new models. Even the most maligned ones, the Warp Spiders, are incredibly well done. Their Exarch especially is a real masterpiece.
Zippokovich wrote: Any guesses on what 'wraith knight gets some punch' could mean?
probably means it can fire more then 2 of its weapons, because currently there is nearly no reason to arm a wraithknight with more then its standard guns unless its sword toting (no one with a brain will use it) or the suncannons scatter laser buddy.
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Mymearan wrote: I love the Aspect sculpts, i really don't think they need new models. Even the most maligned ones, the Warp Spiders, are incredibly well done. Their Exarch especially is a real masterpiece.
Lies and slander the warp spiders need plastics asap, they are mono posed as hell.
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ergotoxin wrote: IMHO the current Swooping Hawks miniatures still look very good, it's just shame they are (as most of the Aspects) Direct Only.
Zippokovich wrote: Any guesses on what 'wraith knight gets some punch' could mean?
Strength D melee weapon, possibly with the same 'Colossus' rule that the Bloodthirster of Insensate Rage has on it's Greater Axe of Khorne. Of course, it will still remain T8 because Eldar.
"gains some weight" I will gladly take that to meaning becomes Super-Heavy or Gargantuan. Makes it much tougher and even deadlier. Down side is cost inevitably rises will probably get to use fewer of them. (upside to some, downside to others)
Mr.Church13 wrote: I vote no on dual aspect kits. They'll lose the majority of their uniqueness if they do that they might as well make them one sculpt with weapon options and a painting guide for different aspects.
Your alternative is the Aspects that don't get a new kit get cut from the Codex.
Mr.Church13 wrote: I vote no on dual aspect kits. They'll lose the majority of their uniqueness if they do that they might as well make them one sculpt with weapon options and a painting guide for different aspects.
Your alternative is the Aspects that don't get a new kit get cut from the Codex.
Your choice.
You either die a hero or you live long enough to see yourself become the villian
Mr.Church13 wrote: I vote no on dual aspect kits. They'll lose the majority of their uniqueness if they do that they might as well make them one sculpt with weapon options and a painting guide for different aspects.
Your alternative is the Aspects that don't get a new kit get cut from the Codex.
Your choice.
Honestly I'd rather them be cut than lose everything that make them special. They make them dual kits then they're no different than tactical marines from assault marines. Same suit different backpack.
Mr.Church13 wrote: I vote no on dual aspect kits. They'll lose the majority of their uniqueness if they do that they might as well make them one sculpt with weapon options and a painting guide for different aspects.
Your alternative is the Aspects that don't get a new kit get cut from the Codex.
Your choice.
Honestly I'd rather them be cut than lose everything that make them special. They make them dual kits then they're no different than tactical marines from assault marines. Same suit different backpack.
This is the problem right here:
People want new models when we should want new rules.
Lots of people here probably has squads of unused aspect models as it is.
Edit: I dont think they wil cut the aspects that lack plastic models. After all, they released codex: daemonkin with fleshhounds in it, and even a web bundle with fleshhounds despite the fact that finecast fleshhounds are out of stock.
Ok. So. That's a lot of Saim Hann art and the like. Now that could be just because they painted a studio Saim Hann army for the 5th edition codex and no longer bother doing new armies for updates (though hilariously they re-use the Aspect Warriors from their Biel Tann army - see the green sashes on the Swooping Hawks)...or it could be a hint as to something else.
I suppose that "Wraithknight gains some weight" means it will become a GC (or a SH Walker, less likely). This is yet another interpretation, though, time will tell. And pretty soon at that!
Just hope that they don't nerf it (too much). The Wraithknight has quickly grown to fulfil the role of the centrepiece of my DE / CWE army. I brought him to kick the Imperial Knights in the balls... which he did during the last tournament.
SarisKhan wrote: I suppose that "Wraithknight gains some weight" means it will become a GC (or a SH Walker, less likely). This is yet another interpretation, though, time will tell. And pretty soon at that!
Just hope that they don't nerf it (too much). The Wraithknight has quickly grown to fulfil the role of the centrepiece of my DE / CWE army. I brought him to kick the Imperial Knights in the balls... which he did during the last tournament.
9unit9 wrote: Am I the only one intrigued by the Ranger in the video....?
Would love a redo on them... 120 Rangers in a single army would be epic
I was thinking about that, plastic Rangers would be brilliant, but then I started thinking it may have just been a way of tying this video in with the first skitarii video, didn't that have a sniper feel to it?
Well heres hoping to rangers actually being useful wanted to do a ambush style list for ages, but snipers have just been so poor.
Hoping not for a nerf of the wraithknight, but maybe moving away from - dual wraithcannons or GTFO. Would be cool to see its stats potentially alter based upon loadout. Like HnR if it has the sword or something. But any variety is good imo! we shall see.
Although pleased if the codex has the necron feel. I like the way the necron dex lets you bring a CAD, a specific detachment or simply a collection of small formations with added bonuses. Really gives you the feel that its 'your list' and not 'a list you wanted to do constrained by the codexes boundaries'.
I'm curious as to whether they're going to change the name of Ranger/Pathfinder squads.
As it stands they've had their name stolen by two different factions(Skitarii for Rangers and Tau for Pathfinders).
I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
KurtAngle2 wrote: The codex has 160 pages and it's price is equal to the Space Marines one.
Eldar Craftworld Tactics incoming!
Is that a rumor? Not sure if I should add it to OP...
It would be a cool addition to the Eldar with tactics for the "generic Craftworld" and then for the big ones - however I would have thought they would done it in Necrons if they were extending the concept to other Codex.
Just as likely it will be random table of "advantages"...........same in the new SM Codex
Kanluwen wrote: I'm curious as to whether they're going to change the name of Ranger/Pathfinder squads.
As it stands they've had their name stolen by two different factions(Skitarii for Rangers and Tau for Pathfinders).
Yeah, that gets confusing fast. When 9unit9 was talking about Rangers in the teaser video, I was actually thinking he meant the Skitarii ones in the background at first.
I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
As he has a brand new model, I very much doubt he would get removed. Why would he need a nerf though? I wasn't under the impression he was overpowered in any way. I've never even seen anyone field him.
Kanluwen wrote: I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
As he has a brand new model, I very much doubt he would get removed. Why would he need a nerf though? I wasn't under the impression he was overpowered in any way. I've never even seen anyone field him.
I'm in agreement with Kan- Illic, like most other Finecast, is already Direct-only, and the rumors that all of Finecast is out the door soon seem to be matching up. He'll probably still be mentioned in the fluff as some sort of consolation prize, but I think Eldar might see a culling that leaves the Dark Eldar players saying "phew!" by comparison to their losses.
Actually, it is probably a huge selection of formations. The eldar have so many options it made my tyranid playing buddy stutter. We have 4 pages of HQ, then 2-3 PAGES of every other slot. That's without each unit getting a dedicated page.
I expect there to be a formation named (and themed) after each of the major craft worlds. Then one for the phoenix lords, one for the wraithknight, one for guardians, storm guardians, and Vaul's wrath support batteries, avatar of Khaine singled out.
I would like to see one for multiple Autarchs. I don't know what other units would be in the formation with them, but a command formation that didn't include psyckers would be nice. (Those would be in a seer council formation)
I really hope its Formations, not Craft world Tactics.
Craftworlders are only a couple generations removed from being a single People, whereas Marines are hundreds of generations removed from being 20 distinctly different Legions.
Iyanden might field a Spirit Host at the drop of a pin, but Samm-Hain will, when sufficiently boned. Biel-Tan might be known for Swordwind, and Uthwe for Guardians, but Uthwe can field a few Thousand Cuts strike forces, and Biel-Tan can field the militia where necessary. Just about the only thing I can think of that isn't much better fluffwise as a Formation than a Tactic are Black Guardians, but even then, not by much.
So I'm really hoping for Formations!
(Perhaps that's because I play Uthwe swordwind...)
Kanluwen wrote: I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
As he has a brand new model, I very much doubt he would get removed. Why would he need a nerf though? I wasn't under the impression he was overpowered in any way. I've never even seen anyone field him.
I'm in agreement with Kan- Illic, like most other Finecast, is already Direct-only, and the rumors that all of Finecast is out the door soon seem to be matching up. He'll probably still be mentioned in the fluff as some sort of consolation prize, but I think Eldar might see a culling that leaves the Dark Eldar players saying "phew!" by comparison to their losses.
I will say that if they really are releasing plastic Rangers/Pathfinders?
I could see him either getting a plastic clamshell OR being able to be built out of the box.
I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
As he has a brand new model, I very much doubt he would get removed. Why would he need a nerf though? I wasn't under the impression he was overpowered in any way. I've never even seen anyone field him.
I've fielded him a few times, and it always surprised people how little points he was for the possibility of Instant Death on something nasty thanks to Voidbringer, at a really nice range(48") and an absurdly high BS(9).
Couple that with Shrouded, the ability to Split Fire if you have him as your Warlord(which is hilariously fun to do against Tyranids; Illic split-fires at a big Synaptic gribbly and his Pathfinders start putting shots on other Synaptic critters), and the "Every shot made by this model is a Precision Shot" special rule(which his Pathfinders get, same with Shrouded).
The "Walker of the Hidden Path" special rule is one that I haven't ever really bothered to try though.
I doubt he'd be able to be built out of the box, as rangers don't have a captain per se, I'd hope the pathfinders are rather customisable, with plenty of pose options. Potentially, the autarch clam pack could contain a rifle? As there is therefore a way to make illic, or give an autarach the relic rifle.
I can see the argument for finecast being gone and as a by product the illic finecast also going. But I severely hope they don't cut down the special characters like in the DE dex, as lets be honest, DEHQs right now are basically just Pinpoint deepstrikers - one of the hackyslashy variety, one of the shooty variety and one of the coven variety. To me the DE dex is great - the worst part being the character loss.
If they do drop special characters, i'd still like there to be options. Perhaps not so much like SM tactics, but more like a generic cost to get an army wide upgrade? I dunno. But I like special characters, or atleast a way to play a HQ as something other than a generic 'blahhh' character who has a rifle.
Kanluwen wrote: I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
As he has a brand new model, I very much doubt he would get removed. Why would he need a nerf though? I wasn't under the impression he was overpowered in any way. I've never even seen anyone field him.
I'm in agreement with Kan- Illic, like most other Finecast, is already Direct-only, and the rumors that all of Finecast is out the door soon seem to be matching up. He'll probably still be mentioned in the fluff as some sort of consolation prize, but I think Eldar might see a culling that leaves the Dark Eldar players saying "phew!" by comparison to their losses.
Skulltaker and Flesh Hounds of Khorne and such are also web exclusive finecast models. They were still included in Codex: Khorne Daemonkin.
Hope this means eldae will get more plastic and less failcast ..and not some weird new unit
Also anyone can se if the ranger is new ?
Looks like its a sitning one with a helmet ..and that dont match the current failcast ones ..but its hard to tel..can be the one withe the helmet too..
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Mymearan wrote: Please no new rangers, they are already some of the most beautiful sculpts in the game!
and made in failcast ..sure the look grate on the GW site but this is hoe they look in reality
Claimh_Solais wrote: Hope this means eldae will get more plastic and less failcast ..and not some weird new unit
Also anyone can se if the ranger is new ?
Looks like its a sitning one with a helmet ..and that dont match the current failcast ones ..but its hard to tel..can be the one withe the helmet too..
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Mymearan wrote: Please no new rangers, they are already some of the most beautiful sculpts in the game!
and made in failcast ..sure the look grate on the GW site but this is hoe they look in reality
Co'tor Shas wrote: I guess it's a good thing I kept those old metal rangers. Only elder unit I own.
But wasn't GW supposed to be moving away from finecaste and towards plastic?
Yeah, but as of this point we don't know what will be happening.
There is so much Finecast for the Eldar model range that you could throw a dart at a board with every unit pictured and have a decent chance of 'predicting' it correctly.
I think the flame in the darkness could also be a reference to the fact that as Yariel leaves the shrine of asurman(I think) the flame that has been out since the tyranid attack burst back into light.
So by taking the good info from Darnok, Lords of Wargaming, Sad Panda, Atia and Redemption into account
Next Saturday - Products going preorder:
Codex Eldar: Craftworlds
Datacards
Jetbikes/Shining Spears
Autarch/Farseer/Warlock (on Jetbike/Chariot?)
Several webshop-only bundles
Assuming this is again a 1 week affair - which would be on par with Sad Panda's rumor about a Necron-like release (they had one week in January) - quite a few long-time wishes will come true this Saturday
Kanluwen wrote: I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
As he has a brand new model, I very much doubt he would get removed. Why would he need a nerf though? I wasn't under the impression he was overpowered in any way. I've never even seen anyone field him.
I'm in agreement with Kan- Illic, like most other Finecast, is already Direct-only, and the rumors that all of Finecast is out the door soon seem to be matching up. He'll probably still be mentioned in the fluff as some sort of consolation prize, but I think Eldar might see a culling that leaves the Dark Eldar players saying "phew!" by comparison to their losses.
I will say that if they really are releasing plastic Rangers/Pathfinders?
I could see him either getting a plastic clamshell OR being able to be built out of the box.
That's a good point. Have we have any Nork Deddog-esque kits since the most recent IG codex? I thought that was an effective way of integrating special characters into kits without being that expensive.
Kanluwen wrote: I could also see Illic Nightspear getting a nerf(sadly) or flat-out being removed from the Codex, and his Pathfinders simply becoming the basic Ranger option.
As he has a brand new model, I very much doubt he would get removed. Why would he need a nerf though? I wasn't under the impression he was overpowered in any way. I've never even seen anyone field him.
I'm in agreement with Kan- Illic, like most other Finecast, is already Direct-only, and the rumors that all of Finecast is out the door soon seem to be matching up. He'll probably still be mentioned in the fluff as some sort of consolation prize, but I think Eldar might see a culling that leaves the Dark Eldar players saying "phew!" by comparison to their losses.
Skulltaker and Flesh Hounds of Khorne and such are also web exclusive finecast models. They were still included in Codex: Khorne Daemonkin.
This is also true. Hmm, well I suppose if Finecast is going away, it's going to take some time. I wonder if certain Finecast kits are more reliably produced, and if that impacts what gets done sooner than later.
That's a good point. Have we have any Nork Deddog-esque kits since the most recent IG codex? I thought that was an effective way of integrating special characters into kits without being that expensive.
Unfortunately, no. I'm really surprised, Badrukk would have been a great inclusion in the otherwise empty Flash Gits box.
Windriders (€33) and the Farseer Skyrunner (€26) are definitely separate kits. There's also an Autarch (€21), cards and the codex (€46).
[...]
I'd guess, based on the price, that the Autarch is on foot, yes.
[...]
Just to clarify - the Farseer Skyrunner and the Autarch were two separate entries on the list I've seen.
That's a good point. Have we have any Nork Deddog-esque kits since the most recent IG codex? I thought that was an effective way of integrating special characters into kits without being that expensive.
Unfortunately, no. I'm really surprised, Badrukk would have been a great inclusion in the otherwise empty Flash Gits box.
Actually they did, just not really for 40k.
The Dark Elf Executioner/Black Guard kits effectively have the parts to build Tullaris Dreadbringer and Kouran Darkhand.
The Dark Elf Cauldron of Blood has Hellebron as an option instead of the standard Hag.
I really hope they aren't releasing another full codex already!
Has anyone confirmed that it's just a supplement yet?
When the Blood Angels release was a week or so away, the Sanguinary Guard kit was removed from the website. Only to reappear after the other products were released.
My point being; don't assume that all of the products that have gone walkabout will be replaced.
I'm hoping for:
New Jetbikes - Surely this is likely since they already have an eldar jetbike sculpt in the form of the skyweavers.
New Vyper / Light Transport - Also possible as the venom has been Craftworldified for the Harlequins. Although I doubt this will happen.
Source?
Prices are usually leaked as scans, aren't they?
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Hulksmash wrote: I just want the shield fixed. The rest of the book is super solid when you don't have serpent spam. Looking foward to seeing what they get
Me and my GF were having this discussion yesterday. I think the best ways to fix Serpent Shields would be to either reduce the range, OR take away Ignores Cover, OR make Serpent Shields a ~15 point upgrade. GW however will probably either do all three and nerf it to all hell, or let the Serpent go unchecked.
Bharring wrote: I wonder if GW will ever do fake redirects, just to fool the community? I was hoping for that on the first...
Do you really reckon GW know people use the redirects to find out what's coming?
The ones who read dakka or other news/rumor sites (probably quite a few) would know, but to get that info to the management and then down to tech is another matter. Also, I don't think they care, it builds hype and may even be beneficial.
What the heck!? Eldar Autarch Skyrunner in Finecast!? Also no Windrunner/Shining Spears dual box? Finecast Shining Spears... or does the red mean they are no longer available or something?
rollawaythestone wrote: What the heck!? Eldar Autarch Skyrunner in Finecast!? Also no Windrunner/Shining Spears dual box? Finecast Shining Spears... or does the red mean they are no longer available or something?
At $58, my hopes for this craftworld codex to NOT be a replacement for the current LESS THAN TWO fething YEARS SINCE FIRST RELEASE codex are pretty much dashed. I gave them a second chance by picking up the rehashed after 2 years 7th edition rulebook but I'm not going to support a two year lifecycle on rulebooks as a general rule.
I guess the new Eldar book will be similar to the Marine codex. Each Craftworld will get the equivalent to Chapter Tactics. Still, $70cdn is pretty ridiculous.... /sigh
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Orrus wrote: Surely 'Codex: Craftworlds' is not a replacement for Codex: Eldar
I still think it's a supplement for the remaining craftworlds, after Iyanden.
Am I just believing what I want to believe or is anyone else thinking the same?
The Eldar codex has been off the webstore for a few weeks now. It most certainly is a replacement.
Orrus wrote: Surely 'Codex: Craftworlds' is not a replacement for Codex: Eldar
I still think it's a supplement for the remaining craftworlds, after Iyanden.
Am I just believing what I want to believe or is anyone else thinking the same?
There is no way a $58, 160 page Codex is not a replacement for Codex Eldar. Also all the rumors say it's a replacement.
Automatically Appended Next Post: About the price, is this the first Codex at this price? Or is it because it has so many pages?
No, the Space Marine book is $58. I'm thinking GW is testing out how high they can price the books for their most popular armies (i.e. Space Marines, Eldar, and maybe Tau).
This book seems like a double whopper of pricing in that it has begun to firmly establish the two-year cycle for books (started with 6th-7th rulebooks) and perhaps higher costs for "premium" armies. I wonder how much longer it will be till we have $100 Space Marine codexes...
Orrus wrote: Surely 'Codex: Craftworlds' is not a replacement for Codex: Eldar
I still think it's a supplement for the remaining craftworlds, after Iyanden.
Am I just believing what I want to believe or is anyone else thinking the same?
There is no way a $58, 160 page Codex is not a replacement for Codex Eldar. Also all the rumors say it's a replacement.
Automatically Appended Next Post: About the price, is this the first Codex at this price? Or is it because it has so many pages?
No, the Space Marine book is $58. I'm thinking GW is testing out how high they can price the books for their most popular armies (i.e. Space Marines, Eldar, and maybe Tau).
This book seems like a double whopper of pricing in that it has begun to firmly establish the two-year cycle for books (started with 6th-7th rulebooks) and perhaps higher costs for "premium" armies. I wonder how much longer it will be till we have $100 Space Marine codexes...
Isn't the SM book also bigger than all other codices?
It is indeed, most of them are around 100-110 pages. The old Eldar codex from two years ago is in that same range, so either they've added 75+ pages of additional material or they're going for pricing popular books higher, I can't really say which it is they're doing.
I do however think this replacement of hardcover $50+ books every two years is atrocious.
heh. I have seen several long term gamers dropping out because they can't keep up with all the rules releases.
