Crisis suits only have a 3 BS, but it wouldnt be too hard to bump it with markerlight support

 Savageconvoy wrote:

am I the only one hoping that the new canon shows that Earth Caste is full of jerks that purposefully make confusing control systems, like inverting the y-stick, just to make Suits have terrible BS stats?

Actually, this is already quasi-canon. The Earth Caste (a bunch of civvies) has complete monopoly over developing stuff for the Fire Caste (the soldiers). So the create something completely on their own, without any external help, then they give it to the Fire Caste to "experiment". Ultimately, they will refine the design through the good old try'n'fix method what is notoriously long and unforgiving (this case was already confirmed with the XV-22 and Hazard suits).

 Gyrtop wrote:

Bobug wrote:
Did anyone else notice shas'vre are now ld9 and have 3 attacks? seems they really are "heroes" now, rather than just glorified sergeants, nice!

This bodes well for Deathrain. Very well. automatic BSF, MT isn't needed, but then we can stick TAs on EVERYBODY. Along with the rumor of XV8s BS4, we can get BS5 Missile Pods, TL on three attacks. Thats about 6 autocannon-level shots per crisis suit, per turn.

But XV8s don't have BS4. however, the rumors are appearing to be true about automatic BSF and MTs, so a TA just became much easier to invest in. Almost an auto-include in my book now, since you don't have to balance it against other hardware anymore.

 YotsubaSnake wrote:

 Gyrtop wrote:

Bobug wrote:
Did anyone else notice shas'vre are now ld9 and have 3 attacks? seems they really are "heroes" now, rather than just glorified sergeants, nice!

This bodes well for Deathrain. Very well. automatic BSF, MT isn't needed, but then we can stick TAs on EVERYBODY. Along with the rumor of XV8s BS4, we can get BS5 Missile Pods, TL on three attacks. Thats about 6 autocannon-level shots per crisis suit, per turn.

But XV8s don't have BS4. however, the rumors are appearing to be true about automatic BSF and MTs, so a TA just became much easier to invest in. Almost an auto-include in my book now, since you don't have to balance it against other hardware anymore.

Do we know for sure that TAs are still in and work the same?

Some what I've seen on the Spanish page shots:
- Farsight 165 points, 4 Wounds and 4 Attacks
- Nova Reactor on the XV105, on the roll of 1 or 2 takes a wound, other wise can choose from loads of other abilities including have a 3+ Invulnerable.

Does anybody know about the 0-1 restrictions on Farsight? Like if they're still around?

 Lobukia wrote:

 YotsubaSnake wrote:

 Gyrtop wrote:

Bobug wrote:
Did anyone else notice shas'vre are now ld9 and have 3 attacks? seems they really are "heroes" now, rather than just glorified sergeants, nice!

This bodes well for Deathrain. Very well. automatic BSF, MT isn't needed, but then we can stick TAs on EVERYBODY. Along with the rumor of XV8s BS4, we can get BS5 Missile Pods, TL on three attacks. Thats about 6 autocannon-level shots per crisis suit, per turn.

But XV8s don't have BS4. however, the rumors are appearing to be true about automatic BSF and MTs, so a TA just became much easier to invest in. Almost an auto-include in my book now, since you don't have to balance it against other hardware anymore.

Do we know for sure that TAs are still in and work the same?

Didn't find any mention of TA in the new dex, nor new gears with the same effect. Also note that units who used to have one (so used to have a bonus in BS in their stat line) don't anymore
Food for thoughts


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Gyrtop wrote:
Does anybody know about the 0-1 restrictions on Farsight? Like if they're still around?

No more restrictions, but he doesn't grant PE: Orks to his whole army anymore

Eh, the PE won't be missed by me. I wanted to field the guy so badly, until I read all my favorite units were restricted.

 lord_blackfang wrote:

 CthuluIsSpy wrote:

 Dogface 76 wrote:
St 5 on a Blast weapon is just silly. I would rather shoot the enemy with the many other St5 AP5 weapons in the Tau list, and have no scatter issues.

Guess im building a Fighter!

Its large blast, and its the only bomber in the game that can make its bombs. I would say that its a fair option.

I'm not sure how a Str 5 AP 5 bomb, on an 11/10/10 platform with all the movement restrictions of a flyer, can be a fair option when you get a 13/12/10 Ionhead for 35 pts less and it fires Str 8 AP 3 large blast.

Your forgetting that it also spits out Interceptor Drones.

So while its main attack is not that great killing MEQ but it still kills most GEQ.

 KhornateCake wrote:
Some what I've seen on the Spanish page shots:
- Farsight 165 points, 4 Wounds and 4 Attacks
- Nova Reactor on the XV105, on the roll of 1 or 2 takes a wound, other wise can choose from loads of other abilities including have a 3+ Invulnerable.

How easy do you think it will be to get cover saves with the Riptide? Taking an unsaveable wound 1/3 of the time in order to get a saving throw seems a bit counter productive, considering the enemy can simply opt to shoot at something else with their AP2 weapons if the Riptide succesfully generates an invulnerable save.

-Aun'Va can produce 2 Etheral powers a turn.
-Another of the XV105's Nova Reactor powers is that is can move 4D6
-Hammerhead is 125 base with Longstrike an additional 45

If those bombs are true, im sad.
Please, JUST MAKE IT AP3!!!!!!

So no targetting arrays? That's great. It's not like that would make Pathfinders an even bigger target if an opponent was looking to cause an army wide crippling affect.

Am I reading that you have to roll for the Nova reactor each activation?

 MechaBeast wrote:
Am I reading that you have to roll for the Nova reactor each activation?

No, there are 4 options to choose from.

Am I reading that you have to roll for the Nova reactor each activation?

It's the finest technology in the universe. Once you activate the Riptide battlesuit, you got about 15 'turns' before your mech's power core goes nuclear all by itself

No, there is 4 options to choose from.

Pretty sure he is asking if you can't opt out of using the Reactor and risking killing yourself.

Curious, if my translation is correct (and I'm just using Google translate) then the Crisis battlesuits can take up to 3 weapon or systems. If we already start with a multi-tracker, which do you think is more efficient, taking one TL weapon and one non-TL weapon, or if it exists, a TA to give +1 BS to both weapons?

Also Battle Suits are strength 5!

 MechaBeast wrote:
Am I reading that you have to roll for the Nova reactor each activation?

I have a shiny codex here with me so allow me . Riptides are made of rainbow, spice and everything nice, but at the start of each of his Movement phases you must declare it's going to use the reactor. If it chooses to do so, roll a D6. On a roll of 1 or 2, something has gone wrong. Takes a single Wound (it has 5) with no saves. It it's a success it can choose one of the following until the start of the next Movement Phase :

Nova SHield : 3+ Invul Save

Boost: Rolls 4D6 for it's Thrust Move in the Assault Phase

Ripple Fire: Can fire it's TL fusion blaster, TL Plasma rifle or it's TL smart missile system twice this turn

(My favorite) Nova-charge: The ion accelerator or heavy burst cannon can fire using it's nova-charge profile.

EDIT: Ion Accelerator Nova-charged: 72'' STR 9 AP2 Ordnance 1, Gets Hot, Large Blast, Nova-charge

 KhornateCake wrote:
Also Battle Suits are strength 5!

They were S5 before.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
So no targetting arrays? That's great. It's not like that would make Pathfinders an even bigger target if an opponent was looking to cause an army wide crippling affect.

So far from the looks of things, everyone can get Markerlights but the +1BS does not stack.

 TheDraconicLord wrote:

 MechaBeast wrote:
Am I reading that you have to roll for the Nova reactor each activation?

I have a shiny codex here with me so allow me . Riptides are made of rainbow, spice and everything nice, but at the start of each of his Movement phases you must declare it's going to use the reactor. If it chooses to do so, roll a D6. On a roll of 1 or 2, something has gone wrong. Takes a single Wound (it has 5) with no saves. It it's a success it can choose one of the following until the start of the next Movement Phase :

Nova SHield : 3+ Invul Save

Boost: Rolls 4D6 for it's Thrust Move in the Assault Phase

Ripple Fire: Can fire it's TL fusion blaster, TL Plasma rifle or it's TL smart missile system twice this turn

(My favorite) Nova-charge: The ion accelerator or heavy burst cannon can fire using it's nova-charge profile.

EDIT: Ion Accelerator Nova-charged: 72'' STR 9 AP2 Ordnance 1, Gets Hot, Large Blast, Nova-charge

I...I...Can we be best friends?

 YotsubaSnake wrote:

 Gyrtop wrote:

Bobug wrote:
Did anyone else notice shas'vre are now ld9 and have 3 attacks? seems they really are "heroes" now, rather than just glorified sergeants, nice!

This bodes well for Deathrain. Very well. automatic BSF, MT isn't needed, but then we can stick TAs on EVERYBODY. Along with the rumor of XV8s BS4, we can get BS5 Missile Pods, TL on three attacks. Thats about 6 autocannon-level shots per crisis suit, per turn.

But XV8s don't have BS4. however, the rumors are appearing to be true about automatic BSF and MTs, so a TA just became much easier to invest in. Almost an auto-include in my book now, since you don't have to balance it against other hardware anymore.

Also one thing I would like to point out, the number of attacks on the suit do not affect the amount of shots it puts out. So the Missile Pod TL would still only be 2 TL shots, not 6.

Didn't they say that markerlights are 15 points now? As in more expensive than before when nobody used them. I take it they are making them affect their own unit as well.

I think i will go with the Heavy burst cannon and the Misslepods.
That will be fun.

 Lysenis wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
So no targetting arrays? That's great. It's not like that would make Pathfinders an even bigger target if an opponent was looking to cause an army wide crippling affect.

So far from the looks of things, everyone can get Markerlights but the +1BS does not stack.

Umm...yes it does, actually. The scans say that for each ML expended by the unit it gets +1 BS. Nowhere does it say you are limited to just one.

 TheDraconicLord wrote:

 MechaBeast wrote:
Am I reading that you have to roll for the Nova reactor each activation?

I have a shiny codex here with me so allow me . Riptides are made of rainbow, spice and everything nice, but at the start of each of his Movement phases you must declare it's going to use the reactor. If it chooses to do so, roll a D6. On a roll of 1 or 2, something has gone wrong. Takes a single Wound (it has 5) with no saves. It it's a success it can choose one of the following until the start of the next Movement Phase :

Nova SHield : 3+ Invul Save

Boost: Rolls 4D6 for it's Thrust Move in the Assault Phase

Ripple Fire: Can fire it's TL fusion blaster, TL Plasma rifle or it's TL smart missile system twice this turn

(My favorite) Nova-charge: The ion accelerator or heavy burst cannon can fire using it's nova-charge profile.

EDIT: Ion Accelerator Nova-charged: 72'' STR 9 AP2 Ordnance 1, Gets Hot, Large Blast, Nova-charge

If you don't mind.... crisis suits: can they take a TA and does it work the same?

Can either of the flyers take Dpods? and what are Dpods now?

Thanks

-Ion Rifles, Strength 7 AP 4 Rapid fire, or Strength 8 AP 4 (Heavy 1 Pinning)

 KhornateCake wrote:
-Ion Rifles, Strength 7 AP 4 Rapid fire, or Strength 8 AP 4 (Heavy 1 Pinning)

Is that what the bomber drones carry?

I...I...Can we be best friends?

If that thing can buy FNP too like someone said it seems to be pretty strong for 200 ish points. Due to the 2+ save and FNP it won't be easy to take out with no AP high rate of fire/high strength weapons, and due to possible cover saves and the reactor invulnerable it isn't an attractive target for low AP weapons either.

 Lobukia wrote:

 KhornateCake wrote:
-Ion Rifles, Strength 7 AP 4 Rapid fire, or Strength 8 AP 4 (Heavy 1 Pinning)

Is that what the bomber drones carry?

I'm assuming the Patherfinders, at the moment not sure.

Samurai_Eduh wrote:

 Lysenis wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:
So no targetting arrays? That's great. It's not like that would make Pathfinders an even bigger target if an opponent was looking to cause an army wide crippling affect.

So far from the looks of things, everyone can get Markerlights but the +1BS does not stack.

Umm...yes it does, actually. The scans say that for each ML expended by the unit it gets +1 BS. Nowhere does it say you are limited to just one.

I am going off the discussion a few pages back concerning this. If we can get the English RAW then we shall see. I dont care if I am wrong in this it just means that those ML drones are going to be even better in situations when you overwatch with them.

Any sign of Stealthsuits or Gun Drone Squadrons for Troops?

It's something that'll make or break my interest in Tau.

 KhornateCake wrote:

 Lobukia wrote:

 KhornateCake wrote:
-Ion Rifles, Strength 7 AP 4 Rapid fire, or Strength 8 AP 4 (Heavy 1 Pinning)

Is that what the bomber drones carry?

I'm assuming the Patherfinders, at the moment not sure.

Yes, from what I saw in the Spanish scans, pathfinders and the bomber drones.


Automatically Appended Next Post:

Rustgob wrote:
Any sign of Stealthsuits or Gun Drone Squadrons for Troops?

It's something that'll make or break my interest in Tau.

So far, looks like no for both. Only troops I saw were kroot and firewarriors.

 Therion wrote:

I...I...Can we be best friends?

If that thing can buy FNP too like someone said it seems to be pretty strong for 200 ish points. Due to the 2+ save and FNP it won't be easy to take out with no AP high rate of fire/high strength weapons, and due to possible cover saves and the reactor invulnerable it isn't an attractive target for low AP weapons either.

Confirmed. They may take up to 2 "Support Systems". One of them gives FNP rule

Ap 4? on flying drones?
Hmm, goodby warrior squads behind aegis.

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 Prodigalson wrote:

The only thing I am not liking is that there appears to be no way (so far) to get the Ripdie a BS of 4. It may have great guns, and be defensive, but if it can't shoot straight, who cares. The Tyranofex is awesome as well, but misses 1/2 the time. You are going to have to use markerlights to guide the shots in to make it work it appears.

Earth Caste Engineer: This is the new suit, our most perfect creation. It's loaded with the most advanced systems and weaponry available to the empire.
Fire Caste Commander: How accurate is it?
Earth Caste Engineer: Like a newly hatched Gaunt!
Fire Caste Commander: *sheds a single tear of admiration* Then it truly is our most powerful weapon.

am I the only one hoping that the new canon shows that Earth Caste is full of jerks that purposefully make confusing control systems, like inverting the y-stick, just to make Suits have terrible BS stats?

What can be confusing about a giant robot's control systems? You stomp on the pedal, push the lever on the right forward, and yell.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
Ap 4? on flying drones?
Hmm, goodby warrior squads behind aegis.

So is the bomber STILL pointless? The Fighter does not get these drones from what we have heard.

The bomber may or may not be pointless.
Although, I might take a Fighter. especially if i can fire behind.

RogueRegault wrote:

 Savageconvoy wrote:

 Prodigalson wrote:

The only thing I am not liking is that there appears to be no way (so far) to get the Ripdie a BS of 4. It may have great guns, and be defensive, but if it can't shoot straight, who cares. The Tyranofex is awesome as well, but misses 1/2 the time. You are going to have to use markerlights to guide the shots in to make it work it appears.

Earth Caste Engineer: This is the new suit, our most perfect creation. It's loaded with the most advanced systems and weaponry available to the empire.
Fire Caste Commander: How accurate is it?
Earth Caste Engineer: Like a newly hatched Gaunt!
Fire Caste Commander: *sheds a single tear of admiration* Then it truly is our most powerful weapon.

am I the only one hoping that the new canon shows that Earth Caste is full of jerks that purposefully make confusing control systems, like inverting the y-stick, just to make Suits have terrible BS stats?

What can be confusing about a giant robot's control systems? You stomp on the pedal, push the lever on the right forward, and yell.

You forgot the whole reticile thing. The metal on that suposedly is where the gun will shoot. . . we hope. . .

If the drones really have interceptor then there is a nice chance at being able shoot down enemy flyers when they come on. It'll also be the first non-fortification interceptor model in standard 40k.

Overall pretty pleased with what's been thrown out. I'm looking foward to spending saturday with my nose in a book.

 hotsauceman1 wrote:
The bomber may or may not be pointless.
Although, I might take a Fighter. especially if i can fire behind.

The Ion turret it gets is 360. So yeah, you can fire backwards, or sideways , or whatever... so it's totally feasible to get into the rear arc of Vendettas and pump 6 S7 shots into their rear armor 10.

Oh, and since it carries a pair of Seekers, there's other off-angle Seeker Shenanigans you can pull. Run one into the rear arc of a couple Necron barges, for instance, then use markerlights to toss seekers into rear armor 10, getting the pen you need to drop their Quantum Shielding. You can even do that while popping a flyer with your regular guns.

Speaking of seekers, i don't think i saw information on the skyray in the Spanish page. Can some one confirm? (probably should note i cant read Spanish lol)

Grammar edit

GW webstore wrote:Warhammer 40,000 Pre-orders

For European customers:

Due to exceptional demand for Tau Empire miniatures, any orders that contain the following products will not be fulfilled until Monday 8th April at the earliest:

Tau Empire One-Click Launch Collection
Tau Battlesuit Collection
Farsight Enclave
Tau Recon Team
Shadowsun Firestrike Hunter Cadre
XV104 Riptide Battlesuit
XV88 Broadside Battlesuit
Cadre Fireblade
Commander Farsight
XV8 Battlesuit Commander
Darkstrider
Longstrike

Note that if your order contains other products, they will be delayed until these Tau Empire miniatures are back in stock and your items can be sent together. Orders that were placed before 4pm on Tuesday 2nd April are not affected.

For those of you who urgently desire to join the cause for the Greater Good, head to your local Hobby Centre this Saturday - they will have limited numbers of these Tau Empire miniatures in stock.

Syradin wrote:

 YotsubaSnake wrote:

 Gyrtop wrote:

Bobug wrote:
Did anyone else notice shas'vre are now ld9 and have 3 attacks? seems they really are "heroes" now, rather than just glorified sergeants, nice!

This bodes well for Deathrain. Very well. automatic BSF, MT isn't needed, but then we can stick TAs on EVERYBODY. Along with the rumor of XV8s BS4, we can get BS5 Missile Pods, TL on three attacks. Thats about 6 autocannon-level shots per crisis suit, per turn.

But XV8s don't have BS4. however, the rumors are appearing to be true about automatic BSF and MTs, so a TA just became much easier to invest in. Almost an auto-include in my book now, since you don't have to balance it against other hardware anymore.

Also one thing I would like to point out, the number of attacks on the suit do not affect the amount of shots it puts out. So the Missile Pod TL would still only be 2 TL shots, not 6.

How does the number of attacks not affect the weapon? Last I checked, 1 attack allows one weapon, and MP fires 2 shots per attack.

 Savageconvoy wrote:
So no targetting arrays? That's great. It's not like that would make Pathfinders an even bigger target if an opponent was looking to cause an army wide crippling affect.

There's still Armoury with all Wargear options, I'd think that Targeting Array can still be bought from there.

Got to love it when they cant fill pre-orders, GW should look up what pre-order means. Back in the day a pre-order meant you got the dex and models two weeks before launch.

 Gyrtop wrote:

Syradin wrote:

 YotsubaSnake wrote:

 Gyrtop wrote:

Bobug wrote:
Did anyone else notice shas'vre are now ld9 and have 3 attacks? seems they really are "heroes" now, rather than just glorified sergeants, nice!

This bodes well for Deathrain. Very well. automatic BSF, MT isn't needed, but then we can stick TAs on EVERYBODY. Along with the rumor of XV8s BS4, we can get BS5 Missile Pods, TL on three attacks. Thats about 6 autocannon-level shots per crisis suit, per turn.

But XV8s don't have BS4. however, the rumors are appearing to be true about automatic BSF and MTs, so a TA just became much easier to invest in. Almost an auto-include in my book now, since you don't have to balance it against other hardware anymore.

Also one thing I would like to point out, the number of attacks on the suit do not affect the amount of shots it puts out. So the Missile Pod TL would still only be 2 TL shots, not 6.

How does the number of attacks not affect the weapon? Last I checked, 1 attack allows one weapon, and MP fires 2 shots per attack.

It May just be the way you wrote it BUT, if most of the rules for multi tracker and equip limits stay relatively the same. First you can take 2 of the same weapons without twin linking it. and second you wouldn't be able to fire all 3 anyway as you could only ever fire 2 weapon systems. max shots would be 4

 Ravenous D wrote:
Got to love it when they cant fill pre-orders, GW should look up what pre-order means. Back in the day a pre-order meant you got the dex and models two weeks before launch.

Umm. Pre-order generally means that you order it before it goes on sale. It doesn't magically make material show up in warehouses. You preorder two weeks before it goes live and if their stock is sold out, you get first dibs when more show up. Not rocket science.

What you are talking about is not pre-order, it is pre-sale. I.e. sold before launch or ordered and delivered before launch.

Hmm. The entry for markerlights in the Firewarrior and Stealth Suit section translate as "Markerlight and a target selector". So I guess a target lock is included as standard when you buy a markerlight.

TIL; All the new Tau stuff is 'Limited Edition' xD

Rustgob wrote:
TIL; All the new Tau stuff is 'Limited Edition' xD

Get yours before it runs out!!!



So if I'm reading it right, Kroot rifle is now 2-handed melee weapon with AP5. Wow, not only they lost point of strength, but also attack. They totally suck in close combat now. One WOULD think that 2 metres tall bloodthirsty giant with two-handed weapon hits harder than average human soldier with a bayonet or rifle butt, but no...

Even Krootox sucks in combat now. Unless they have some juicy stuff which we haven't seen yet, Kroot were hit real hard with Nerf Bat, and I'm really struggling why to include them.

Pleased I ordered mine at gw about 2 seconds after they went up for sale. I imagine that all the independents such as wayland will receive orders after direct customers have the stuff in hand......perhaps?

 pretre wrote:

 Ravenous D wrote:
Got to love it when they cant fill pre-orders, GW should look up what pre-order means. Back in the day a pre-order meant you got the dex and models two weeks before launch.

Umm. Pre-order generally means that you order it before it goes on sale. It doesn't magically make material show up in warehouses. You preorder two weeks before it goes live and if their stock is sold out, you get first dibs when more show up. Not rocket science.

What you are talking about is not pre-order, it is pre-sale. I.e. sold before launch or ordered and delivered before launch.

The old longer pre order period however did allow them to fit in additional casting runs to make sure all orders where fulfilled. These days they just have to pull numbers out the air and hope for the best. In this instance they failed.

On the flip side it shows how popular updating the very old xenos codexes have been, who would have thought it.

UNCLEBADTOUCH wrote:


On the flip side it shows how popular updating the very old xenos codexes have been, who would have thought it.

Actually can't wait to get the book.........I am away for my MBA for a week and this book will be coming with me. I shall perfect my lists during this time lol

A lot of good news from this list, such as the hammerhead remaining BS4, Ion weapons do seem very versatile, and the drone selection is enough to have me positively intrigued.

I'll have to find some good conversions.

 Gyrtop wrote:

Syradin wrote:

 YotsubaSnake wrote:

 Gyrtop wrote:

Bobug wrote:
Did anyone else notice shas'vre are now ld9 and have 3 attacks? seems they really are "heroes" now, rather than just glorified sergeants, nice!

This bodes well for Deathrain. Very well. automatic BSF, MT isn't needed, but then we can stick TAs on EVERYBODY. Along with the rumor of XV8s BS4, we can get BS5 Missile Pods, TL on three attacks. Thats about 6 autocannon-level shots per crisis suit, per turn.

But XV8s don't have BS4. however, the rumors are appearing to be true about automatic BSF and MTs, so a TA just became much easier to invest in. Almost an auto-include in my book now, since you don't have to balance it against other hardware anymore.

Also one thing I would like to point out, the number of attacks on the suit do not affect the amount of shots it puts out. So the Missile Pod TL would still only be 2 TL shots, not 6.

How does the number of attacks not affect the weapon? Last I checked, 1 attack allows one weapon, and MP fires 2 shots per attack.

The number of attacks in the models stat line in the noumber of attacks it get during assault. The number of shots a weapon get is listed in its weapon profile, ie. Assualt 1, Heavy 4. What Bodug was talking about was the number of attacks the Shas'vre get in the assault phase.

Backfire wrote:

Rustgob wrote:
TIL; All the new Tau stuff is 'Limited Edition' xD

Get yours before it runs out!!!

Spoiler:

So if I'm reading it right, Kroot rifle is now 2-handed melee weapon with AP5. Wow, not only they lost point of strength, but also attack. They totally suck in close combat now. One WOULD think that 2 metres tall bloodthirsty giant with two-handed weapon hits harder than average human soldier with a bayonet or rifle butt, but no...

Even Krootox sucks in combat now. Unless they have some juicy stuff which we haven't seen yet, Kroot were hit real hard with Nerf Bat, and I'm really struggling why to include them.

Because you can give them Sniper ammo - 20 Infiltrating Snipers :-D

Can a native Spanish speaker whose read the Spanish site confirm whether the Ethereal's powers affect Kroots and Vespids? Google translate says, "The ethereal and all friends of the Tau Empire miniatures." I wonder if this means models from codex Tau Empire.

Kroot gain the special rule "corpulent" when accompanied by a Krootox: Nomnomnom

'sup guys! Always lurked around here, and seeing some calling for spanish speakers, i decided to make myself known.

From what the spanish codex says, all friendly units in the tau empire army get the benefits...i'm thinking allies as well?

Any other thing you want me to translate i will be happy to help!

Sa'Cea Janus wrote:
'sup guys! Always lurked around here, and seeing some calling for spanish speakers, i decided to make myself known.

From what the spanish codex says, all friendly units in the tau empire army get the benefits...i'm thinking allies as well?

Any other thing you want me to translate i will be happy to help!

No request, but welcome to Dakka!

Backfire wrote:

Rustgob wrote:
TIL; All the new Tau stuff is 'Limited Edition' xD

Get yours before it runs out!!!

Spoiler:

So if I'm reading it right, Kroot rifle is now 2-handed melee weapon with AP5. Wow, not only they lost point of strength, but also attack. They totally suck in close combat now. One WOULD think that 2 metres tall bloodthirsty giant with two-handed weapon hits harder than average human soldier with a bayonet or rifle butt, but no...

Even Krootox sucks in combat now. Unless they have some juicy stuff which we haven't seen yet, Kroot were hit real hard with Nerf Bat, and I'm really struggling why to include them.

I think you missed the part where they can buy Sniper Rifles for one point each. 20 shots at 4+ to wound where 6s can be piled onto characters.

Interestingly, the drones no longer appear to match the controlling unit's toughness and save. Here's hoping they no longer count towards morale etc. or they could prove a vulnerability.

Also those 20 shots cost the grand total of 140 points.
If some use sniper scouts, why not those?
I'm still dissappointed though... Gotta think differently now!

RogueRegault wrote:

I think you missed the part where they can buy Sniper Rifles for one point each. 20 shots at 4+ to wound where 6s can be piled onto characters.

Don't forget that sniper shots have rending and pinning too.

So 6's to hit are precise, and 6's to wound are AP2. Not bad for a 7 pt model.

Sa'Cea Janus wrote:
'sup guys! Always lurked around here, and seeing some calling for spanish speakers, i decided to make myself known.

From what the spanish codex says, all friendly units in the tau empire army get the benefits...i'm thinking allies as well?

Any other thing you want me to translate i will be happy to help!

Sweet! My horde Kroot army gets stubborn!

Thank you kind sir.

New leaked pictures have been leaked. Now it seems that the Ethereal grants a bonus rule for the whole army ("Summon the Elements"). This grants a benefit for the whole army depending on what element you have chosen this turn.
Interesting is "Summon fire" that grants all tau equiped with induction weapon +1 shot. Charging against a unit that can shoot 36 f5 shoots seems a bad idea for our oponents.
We also have 2 new "characteristic systems?" that allows the unit with the character that carries these to reroll all rolls to hit the enemy and the other one ignores the cover save of the enemy unit you are firing at. The character can not fire his weapons during the shooting phase to use both systems. Both systems can be combined.

What are is the squad size of the Stealth Suits?

I see their burst cannon gets an extra shot, but if they're the same price, I'm having a hard time figuring out why I'd choose them over Crisis suits...

Can anyone perhaps enlighten me why I shouldn't just take Crisis suits equipped with burst cannons? THey have a better toughness, and have two wounds each, and I'm guessing the price really wouldn't be too far off.

I guess that's a problem I've always had with stealth suits, they compete against Crisis Suits for the Elite slot, and Crisis Suits tend to do the same thing, but better, has this changed?

Don't forget the "power fist" on characteristic systems as well, the suit that has it can sustitute all of its attacks that turn, and instead make one str 10 ap 1 attack

Stealth suits have the shrouded and Stealth USRs and infiltration. Different placement? Honestly I can't say what else they'd have going for them

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Stealth suits have the shrouded and Stealth USRs and infiltration. Different placement? Honestly I can't say what else they'd have going for them

It's rumored that they will have a homer beacon on their armor, meaning that you can forward deploy them with infiltrate and then accurately deep strike crisis suits.

I dunno what that was but I ignored it.

Materia_Master wrote:
What are is the squad size of the Stealth Suits?

I see their burst cannon gets an extra shot, but if they're the same price, I'm having a hard time figuring out why I'd choose them over Crisis suits...

Can anyone perhaps enlighten me why I shouldn't just take Crisis suits equipped with burst cannons? THey have a better toughness, and have two wounds each, and I'm guessing the price really wouldn't be too far off.

I guess that's a problem I've always had with stealth suits, they compete against Crisis Suits for the Elite slot, and Crisis Suits tend to do the same thing, but better, has this changed?

Depending on the book it self, and depending on the price and if they are available to them, double missile drone squads with stealth and shroud that can infiltrate could be VERY useful. but that's just based on speculation. (so many possibilities i cant fraking wait 4 more days)

it looks like the riptides 2 drones are toughness 4... does this make the riptide toughness 4 due to majority toughness?

 MajinMalak wrote:

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Stealth suits have the shrouded and Stealth USRs and infiltration. Different placement? Honestly I can't say what else they'd have going for them

It's rumored that they will have a homer beacon on their armor, meaning that you can forward deploy them with infiltrate and then accurately deep strike crisis suits.

Assuming that's Rastreador Guiado, it costs 10 points plus a 10 point Shas'vre upgrade.

But yes, a homing beacon on a squad that can infiltrate would be nice. Too bad it's competing with Crisis Suits and Riptides.

Stealth suit squads have a maximum of 6 members, drones not included.

Riptide's drones are Toughness 6

Aaaand...stealth suits get to pick 2 drones from the drone list, which contains the drone with the missiles, at toughness 4 though.

Desubot, I doubt stealth squads get to take the missile drones,
As far as I remember only the riptide gets them

 boy wonder wrote:
it looks like the riptides 2 drones are toughness 4... does this make the riptide toughness 4 due to majority toughness?

I believe the Riptide's drones are the ones with toughness 6, not 4.

I guess what I was asking is how many can be in a single squad.

In squads of 3-6, I can't see stealth suits firepower really maximized, but allow up to squads of 9... now THATS a lot of dakka.

IMO, they gain more relavance if I can take them in a larger group.

Also, hooray for fusion blasters becoming 18", now my stealthsuit with his FB will be able to hit what the rest of the squad is shooting at!

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Desubot, I doubt stealth squads get to take the missile drones,
As far as I remember only the riptide gets them

What about the missile drones from the broadside kits?

Double markerlight drones with stealth squads could be nice too

Are markerlights useable by any unit now, or are they still limited to everything that is not kroot or leaderless vespid?

Materia_Master wrote:
What are is the squad size of the Stealth Suits?

I see their burst cannon gets an extra shot, but if they're the same price, I'm having a hard time figuring out why I'd choose them over Crisis suits...

Can anyone perhaps enlighten me why I shouldn't just take Crisis suits equipped with burst cannons? THey have a better toughness, and have two wounds each, and I'm guessing the price really wouldn't be too far off.

I guess that's a problem I've always had with stealth suits, they compete against Crisis Suits for the Elite slot, and Crisis Suits tend to do the same thing, but better, has this changed?

According to leaks, they start out with 3 models and can expand to 6.

The only real benefit to fielding Stealth Suits is ease of getting a 2+ cover save when they are inside terrain. Burst Cannon is now 4 shots, so now a maxed out squad can dish out 24x 18" Str5 AP5 shooting. It's interesting to note that for 8 points more, you could get the same amount of damage from fielding 12 Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines with a Devilfish. I really see no point in taking Stealth Suits.

A tidbit I haven't seen reported yet:
The crisis bodyguards suite thingy you can get for your commander have a special rule allowing their character's LoS! to always succeed .
Shadowsun's shield drones have it too, and stealth units gain it when joined by shadowsun
Shadowsun now starts without her drones, but you can buy them at 20 pts each, her shield drones have a 3++ and her command drone allow nearby unit(s?) (within 12 I think) to reroll 1s to hit. To run her with her 3 drones costs 195pts

 SabrX wrote:
The only real benefit to fielding Stealth Suits is ease of getting a 2+ cover save when they are inside terrain. Burst Cannon is now 4 shots, so now a maxed out squad can dish out 24x 18" Str5 AP5 shooting. It's interesting to note that for 8 points more, you could get the same amount of damage from fielding 12 Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines with a Devilfish. I really see no point in taking Stealth Suits.

Stealth Suits can outflank (potentially with Acute Senses-- they have it in the old book and might in the new one too), get a Jet Pack move in the Assault phase, and carry fusion blasters.

 SabrX wrote:

Materia_Master wrote:
What are is the squad size of the Stealth Suits?

I see their burst cannon gets an extra shot, but if they're the same price, I'm having a hard time figuring out why I'd choose them over Crisis suits...

Can anyone perhaps enlighten me why I shouldn't just take Crisis suits equipped with burst cannons? THey have a better toughness, and have two wounds each, and I'm guessing the price really wouldn't be too far off.

I guess that's a problem I've always had with stealth suits, they compete against Crisis Suits for the Elite slot, and Crisis Suits tend to do the same thing, but better, has this changed?

According to leaks, they start out with 3 models and can expand to 6.

The only real benefit to fielding Stealth Suits is ease of getting a 2+ cover save when they are inside terrain. Burst Cannon is now 4 shots, so now a maxed out squad can dish out 24x 18" Str5 AP5 shooting. It's interesting to note that for 8 points more, you could get the same amount of damage from fielding 12 Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines with a Devilfish. I really see no point in taking Stealth Suits.

*sigh*
So it's the same problem they had last codex too. Sure, they have space marine armor, but with only 3T, sure they have really good cover saves, but at 30 points a model?
If I want that much firepower, I'll spend 108 points on 12 pulse-carbine FWs, compared to the 180 I'd spend on stealth suits.
OR, I could just take crisis suits and hook them up with burst cannons (maybe even twin-linked) for almost the same price (i'm guessing, using old codex gun prices) and get 4T and 2 wounds...

All I wanted was their price to be reduced by 5 or so points, make them viable, you know?

 Kingsley wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
it looks like the riptides 2 drones are toughness 4... does this make the riptide toughness 4 due to majority toughness?

I believe the Riptide's drones are the ones with toughness 6, not 4.

looks like I got str and t mixed up..im awesome!

im now really psyched for this codex... I think I like most everything.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
can firewarriors take missile drones? (nit the shielded riptide variant) because that would be awesome..

 Kingsley wrote:

 SabrX wrote:
The only real benefit to fielding Stealth Suits is ease of getting a 2+ cover save when they are inside terrain. Burst Cannon is now 4 shots, so now a maxed out squad can dish out 24x 18" Str5 AP5 shooting. It's interesting to note that for 8 points more, you could get the same amount of damage from fielding 12 Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines with a Devilfish. I really see no point in taking Stealth Suits.

Stealth Suits can outflank (potentially with Acute Senses-- they have it in the old book and might in the new one too), get a Jet Pack move in the Assault phase, and carry fusion blasters.

Sorry, double post?

Besides the outflank with acute senses, so can crisis suits. EACH can carry a burst cannon AND a fusion blaster.

I guess your right though, given the right situation, stealth suits may have a slight advantage over crisis suits... maybe.

Materia_Master wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

 SabrX wrote:
The only real benefit to fielding Stealth Suits is ease of getting a 2+ cover save when they are inside terrain. Burst Cannon is now 4 shots, so now a maxed out squad can dish out 24x 18" Str5 AP5 shooting. It's interesting to note that for 8 points more, you could get the same amount of damage from fielding 12 Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines with a Devilfish. I really see no point in taking Stealth Suits.

Stealth Suits can outflank (potentially with Acute Senses-- they have it in the old book and might in the new one too), get a Jet Pack move in the Assault phase, and carry fusion blasters.

Sorry, double post?

Besides the outflank with acute senses, so can crisis suits. EACH can carry a burst cannon AND a fusion blaster.

I guess your right though, given the right situation, stealth suits may have a slight advantage over crisis suits... maybe.

I think it's going to be a min/max situation. There is a part of me that wants to have a full squad of 6 suits and 12 drones and 48 dice

Am I reading it right that pathfinders are now save +5? For an army that seems to have to rely on them even more now that's pretty terrible to say the least... Any change to their point cost or equipment to balance?

Yeah D: Pathfinders have +5 save... i somehow feel we got excellent new toys...that costed us a little bit of survivavility...

Here's a comparison shot for the riptide

(Yeah I like to show off, I'm a jerk)

Which units in the Tau army get access to skyfire?

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Here's a comparison shot for the riptide

(Yeah I like to show off, I'm a jerk)

Sweet googly man......im so jelly right now.


Anyone got any rules confirmation for dark strider? seems to be the only one i haven't seen yet

Wow. That's quite a suit. I love it, do you think it will be difficult to magnetize the main gun?

madmax011 wrote:
Am I reading it right that pathfinders are now save +5? For an army that seems to have to rely on them even more now that's pretty terrible to say the least... Any change to their point cost or equipment to balance?

They can take Ion Rifles, and Rail Rifles are now Rapid Fire while Pulse Carbines are Assault 2. They also have some new drone options that we don't seem to have a full picture of yet.

madmax011 wrote:
Am I reading it right that pathfinders are now save +5? For an army that seems to have to rely on them even more now that's pretty terrible to say the least... Any change to their point cost or equipment to balance?

Not sure about point cost, but one of the things I'm really digging is no more 80 point Dfish as a manditory purchase (Sure, I'll still probably get a Dfish for my FW, but I don't HAVE to).

So if they stay the same price, and we don't have to take a Dfish, what was a 128pt unit minimum is now a 48 point minimum unit.

So for the cost of the old Pathfinder minimum unit (4 pathfinders and a transport), we can now field 10 pathfinders. That's 60% more markerlights for roughly the same price! (conceeding, of course, that you don't take any of their sweet new weapon choices)

Personally, I think I'm going to field around 2 units (8 per models per unit) of pathfinders, that's only going to cost me less than 200 points, and I have 16 markerlights to guide my troop's fire! In a 2000pt game, that's only around 10% of my total point cost! Markerlights just got WAY more numerous on the battlefield.

@ Therion : All suits have acces to a "velocity tracker" as a support system, which gives them the option tu use the skyfire USR.
@Desubot Darkstrider's got that bigger makerlight thingy, allows his unit to consider targetted units -1T than they really are (even for instant deaths!) and allows his squad to consolidate 1d6 after the countercharging shots, before the enemy rolls his charge distance.
@tetrisphreak the main gun should be overall quite easy to magnetize, but you might have to let out a little cable dodats you need for the ion gun (not visible on my pic)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kingsley wrote:

madmax011 wrote:
Am I reading it right that pathfinders are now save +5? For an army that seems to have to rely on them even more now that's pretty terrible to say the least... Any change to their point cost or equipment to balance?

They can take Ion Rifles, and Rail Rifles are now Rapid Fire while Pulse Carbines are Assault 2. They also have some new drone options that we don't seem to have a full picture of yet.

The new drones are the recon drone (the one with the burst cannon) which acts as a beacon and gives some control concerning flank attacks. You also have an "inhibitor dron" which allows you to substract 1D3 to a specific unit charge distance charging you. Then the fabled +6 range on pulse carbines/rifles (pulse drone?). Cheers!

@B0B MaRlEy -

1. If one suit in a unit takes the Skyfire support system, do they all get the Skyfire USR? Or does it only apply to the suit that bought it?
2. Do you have any idea how much the various Crisis weapons cost points-wise? Especially Fusion Blasters, Plasma Rifles, and Missile Pods?
3. Can any units other than Pathfinders take the Rail Rifle?
4. Do Pathfinders get any sort of Stealth / Shrouded special rule? Or is there an upgrade they can take to get it?

 MechaBeast wrote:

Materia_Master wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

 SabrX wrote:
The only real benefit to fielding Stealth Suits is ease of getting a 2+ cover save when they are inside terrain. Burst Cannon is now 4 shots, so now a maxed out squad can dish out 24x 18" Str5 AP5 shooting. It's interesting to note that for 8 points more, you could get the same amount of damage from fielding 12 Fire Warriors with Pulse Carbines with a Devilfish. I really see no point in taking Stealth Suits.

Stealth Suits can outflank (potentially with Acute Senses-- they have it in the old book and might in the new one too), get a Jet Pack move in the Assault phase, and carry fusion blasters.

Sorry, double post?

Besides the outflank with acute senses, so can crisis suits. EACH can carry a burst cannon AND a fusion blaster.

I guess your right though, given the right situation, stealth suits may have a slight advantage over crisis suits... maybe.

I think it's going to be a min/max situation. There is a part of me that wants to have a full squad of 6 suits and 12 drones and 48 dice

Stealth Suits is an elite choice. One more Stealth Suit unit is one less Crisis Suit or Riptide. There's plenty of troop choices. Fire Warriors inside Devilfish is just as mobile and still deals the same amount of damage in terms of Str5 shots.

@bob marley -- thanks. Can you confirm the targeting array is no longer in the suit support system armory? Also are missile pods/plasma cheaper now? What % is the cost to twin link weapons? Thanks again.

 boy wonder wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
it looks like the riptides 2 drones are toughness 4... does this make the riptide toughness 4 due to majority toughness?

I believe the Riptide's drones are the ones with toughness 6, not 4.

looks like I got str and t mixed up..im awesome!

im now really psyched for this codex... I think I like most everything.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
can firewarriors take missile drones? (nit the shielded riptide variant) because that would be awesome..

Codex: "A Fire Warrior Shas'ui may take up to two drones from the Drones list" These drones are:
Gun Drones - TL Pulse Carbine
Marker Drone - Markerlight
Missile Drone - Missile Pod
Shield Drone - Shield Generator

huzzah!! Thanks for that!

now my FW will be all like.. PEW PEW!! FWOOSH! KA BLAM!

 TheDraconicLord wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
it looks like the riptides 2 drones are toughness 4... does this make the riptide toughness 4 due to majority toughness?

I believe the Riptide's drones are the ones with toughness 6, not 4.

looks like I got str and t mixed up..im awesome!

im now really psyched for this codex... I think I like most everything.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
can firewarriors take missile drones? (nit the shielded riptide variant) because that would be awesome..

Codex: "A Fire Warrior Shas'ui may take up to two drones from the Drones list" These drones are:
Gun Drones - TL Pulse Carbine
Marker Drone - Markerlight
Missile Drone - Missile Pod
Shield Drone - Shield Generator

Oh god.... Oh... oh my gooooooood!

Looks like that frees up my suits to take something other than missle pods.

lets hold hands and jump around!

Materia_Master wrote:

 TheDraconicLord wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
it looks like the riptides 2 drones are toughness 4... does this make the riptide toughness 4 due to majority toughness?

I believe the Riptide's drones are the ones with toughness 6, not 4.

looks like I got str and t mixed up..im awesome!

im now really psyched for this codex... I think I like most everything.


Automatically Appended Next Post:
can firewarriors take missile drones? (nit the shielded riptide variant) because that would be awesome..

Codex: "A Fire Warrior Shas'ui may take up to two drones from the Drones list" These drones are:
Gun Drones - TL Pulse Carbine
Marker Drone - Markerlight
Missile Drone - Missile Pod
Shield Drone - Shield Generator

Oh god.... Oh... oh my gooooooood!

Looks like that frees up my suits to take something other than missle pods.

Reign of the Deathrain Loadout comes to an end. What will the new staple crisis suit loadout be? Flamer TL Burstcannon? Plasma Rifle Fusiongun? (Especially with the increased range? My mind in boggled. Time to experiment.

Oh ,yet another bit I remember, you get to take drone squadrons like in the old codex, except you get to turn them attack drones into shield drones or marker drones for free!
Crowding even more the fast attack section

im going plasma,fusion... I used to run fireknifes exclusively.. but I think the helios is the way forward. need some tankbusters

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Oh ,yet another bit I remember, you get to take drone squadrons like in the old codex, except you get to turn them attack drones into shield drones or marker drones for free!
Crowding even more the fast attack section

I'm not sure how this would work, but if it's true, that's awesometastic.

But seriously, FREE shield or (more importantly) marker drones? That doesn't seem right.

It seems... too good.

Therion : All suits have acces to a "velocity tracker" as a support system, which gives them the option tu use the skyfire USR.

A Tau army based on Crisis suits, Broadsides and Riptides + support might be a tough opponent for flying Necrons then. No vehicles that are deployed only to get blown up by Tesla Destructors and Voltaic Staffs, and instead nice reasonably mobile firepower, great armour saves / high toughness / fnp, and nearly across the board skyfire. Seems like close combat is the best the Necrons have for taking down the new Tau stuff like the Riptide, and although 12-18 Wraiths are quite points effective for the price, the Tau guns with their high strength and high rate of fire don't seem to be bad at taking out Wraiths in return either. Three FNP Riptides, especially with cover saves, can't realistically be killed with shooting.

It'll be interesting to see some more accurate points values to see what kind of 1850 / 2000p armies can be made.

Oh god, My riptide with skyfire fusion blasters. I shall rule the skies.
I finally get my revenge on the flying croissants.
Of give the velocity tracker to my suits

 TheDraconicLord wrote:
Codex: "A Fire Warrior Shas'ui may take up to two drones from the Drones list" These drones are:
Gun Drones - TL Pulse Carbine
Marker Drone - Markerlight
Missile Drone - Missile Pod
Shield Drone - Shield Generator

What about Stealth suits and crisis suits? what are listed for them?

edit quote fail

Translated Special-issue support systems from Warseer:

Their are characteristic systems, so i guess prototypes.

- Iridium armor. +1T, 2+ Armor save.
- Repulse shock field. Assault, I10, 1d6 S4AP- hit to any enemy unit who succesfully charged.
- Jun'nami (neural chip or something like that). Movement phase choose between tankhunter, counterattack, monster hunter, stubborn, furious charge.
- Failsafe detonator. If model dies, large blast on top of him, S5 AP-. Deaths count for combat resolution.
- Fist something. Assault, change all of his attack for a single S10 AP1 attack.
- Neurored. Enemy unit gets hot rule on their shooting phase.
- Command and control module. If he doesn't shoot, all his unit re-roll to hit.
- Multispecter sensor system. If he doesn't shoot, all his unit ignore cover.

The 2 last ones stack.

Keep in mind that IIRC the skyfire upgrades are around 20 points. It'll throw a wrench in a mostly-flyer army's plan though

 Desubot wrote:

 TheDraconicLord wrote:
Codex: "A Fire Warrior Shas'ui may take up to two drones from the Drones list" These drones are:
Gun Drones - TL Pulse Carbine
Marker Drone - Markerlight
Missile Drone - Missile Pod
Shield Drone - Shield Generator

What about Stealth suits and crisis suits? what are listed for them?

edit quote fail

Same list as the FWs. Any Crisis suit may take up to 2 drones from the Drones List. A Stealth Shas'vre may take up to 2 drones from the Drones list.

When you have special drones, they usually have a special rule like the Pathfinders. "May include a Pulse Accelerator Drone"

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
double post and useless too for I've been NINJA-ed!

Its k i saw it before ninja snatch.

but yeah kinda sad that it is only for the character. is drone controllers still in? and what does it do?

@desubot Actually all I remember is for FW and stealths, crisis probably get a set of drones each. Might apply for broadsides too

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
@ Therion : All suits have acces to a "velocity tracker" as a support system, which gives them the option tu use the skyfire USR.
@Desubot Darkstrider's got that bigger makerlight thingy, allows his unit to consider targetted units -1T than they really are (even for instant deaths!) and allows his squad to consolidate 1d6 after the countercharging shots, before the enemy rolls his charge distance.
@tetrisphreak the main gun should be overall quite easy to magnetize, but you might have to let out a little cable dodats you need for the ion gun (not visible on my pic)


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kingsley wrote:

madmax011 wrote:
Am I reading it right that pathfinders are now save +5? For an army that seems to have to rely on them even more now that's pretty terrible to say the least... Any change to their point cost or equipment to balance?

They can take Ion Rifles, and Rail Rifles are now Rapid Fire while Pulse Carbines are Assault 2. They also have some new drone options that we don't seem to have a full picture of yet.

The new drones are the recon drone (the one with the burst cannon) which acts as a beacon and gives some control concerning flank attacks. You also have an "inhibitor dron" which allows you to substract 1D3 to a specific unit charge distance charging you. Then the fabled +6 range on pulse carbines/rifles (pulse drone?). Cheers!

Are the other two drones available to other squads? The inhibitor drone would be pretty much mandatory for FW and Crisis suit squads.

Also, going by google translate the Iridium armor is +1 Toughness and 2+ Save with no drawbacks. That's pretty nice(And makes it a bit more annoying that Broadsides are T4 W2.)

Also annoyed that the Devilfish is still an overpriced pile of tin and the Shas'vre went from not increasing stats Tau use to not increasing stats at all.

I think what I would most want for Devilfish is "drones ride for free" so you could add drones to a FW squad without having to reduce squad size.

Wait, A wargear that makes all weapons Get hot?
FRFSRF will be so fun using this on them.

@Rogue I'm afraid that I didn't see any other squads (bar pathfinders) who can get any of those three special drones (recon, inhibitor,pulse)

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
double post and useless too for I've been NINJA-ed!

Sorry about that, just trying to help desubot

@hotsauceman It's all weapons get hot! for a single unit within 18'', but it could still be terrible to a big blob of guards

What's the armour save on a sheild drone? Does it still change with the unit?

I think the worst part of all this is pulse carbines still use the useless pinning rule.

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
@hotsauceman It's all weapons get hot! for a single unit within 18'', but it could still be terrible to a big blob of guards

Lul, I cant wait to drop that on my oppoent
"Ok, Nuro thingy on your blob squad"
"what does that do?"
"Your weapons get hot"
"FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUU"

FrozenSoul80 wrote:
I think the worst part of all this is pulse carbines still use the useless pinning rule.

In what respect is pinning useless? If you start fielding large FW squads with carbines-- very feasible with Devilfish, FW cost decreases, and Carbines at Assault 2-- Pinning is just a bonus.

 Kingsley wrote:

FrozenSoul80 wrote:
I think the worst part of all this is pulse carbines still use the useless pinning rule.

In what respect is pinning useless? If you start fielding large FW squads with carbines-- very feasible with Devilfish, FW cost decreases, and Carbines at Assault 2-- Pinning is just a bonus.

I think he means the that many armies flat-out ignore morale tests, meaning that pinning won't work around half the time. And most enemies that do have to take morale checks have a crazy high leadership skill anyways.

I was hoping for a Toughness test or be blinded (infantry fail Toughness tests far more often), but it appears to not be so.

After a long day of Google Translating all the photos, I feel I can finally share stuff with you guys.

Aun'Shi can choose to re-roll failed saves or be "Steely" for a phase. (Steely is what in Spanish 40k?)
All Ethereals allow Tau units to use their LD for tests. Only thing that happens when they die is an extra Victory Point.
The retreat after Overwatch (Tactical Retreat) applies only to Darkstrider's squad. (Or as far as I know)

Crisis suits have cost reduced. Any Crisis member can select Drones. Three support systems needed. Max Size: 3
Stealth suits are same points. Only Shas'vre can select Drones. One Support each. Max Size: 6 Can take Marker Beacon.
Riptide comes with Heavy Burst Cannon which can upgrade to Ion Accelerator. Also, twin-linked SMS which becomes Twin-linked Plasma or Fusion.
Can select two options. Can have two special Shield Missile Drones.

Devilfish is same price but weapon is half price.

Interceptor Drones do have both Skyfire and Interceptor.

SMS is Twin-Linked on Broadsides and Riptide.
Sniper Drones still come as one choice. Not sure if they can split from each other. (One choice or 1-3)

All Ion weapons (Rifle, Cannon, Accelerator) start at 7 and go to 8. Cyclic is now an Ion weapon.
Kroot can get Sniper ammo.
Burst Cannon finally fires the appropriate number of shots that its model represents.
Fusion Blaster range extended to equal Burst Cannon.
Kroot Rifle is now Two-Handed.
You get to choose the effect of the Nova Reactor.

Markerlights
I've seen Markerlights and Networked Markerlights so they're both still there.
Options are BS +1, Ignores Cover and Launch Seeker.
Doesn't give a limit for squad's usage.

Anything about positional relay?

so who gets the big manly 36in burst cannon? Do we get it on hammerheads and devilfish? Or just on the Riptide

Also, i can see running lots of ethereals these days, its a good thing i have a couple of dusty ones from the good ol days! Now to get me one of those pope mobile ethereals

Materia_Master wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

FrozenSoul80 wrote:
I think the worst part of all this is pulse carbines still use the useless pinning rule.

In what respect is pinning useless? If you start fielding large FW squads with carbines-- very feasible with Devilfish, FW cost decreases, and Carbines at Assault 2-- Pinning is just a bonus.

I think he means the that many armies flat-out ignore morale tests, meaning that pinning won't work around half the time. And most enemies that do have to take morale checks have a crazy high leadership skill anyways.

I was hoping for a Toughness test or be blinded (infantry fail Toughness tests far more often), but it appears to not be so.

There aren't that many armies that ignore pinning tests. Also, just because a unit has crazy high LD doesn't mean it's useless to try pinning them. Force enough pinning test and chances are they'll fail at some point.

Pinning i just icing on the cake. The real beauty of Pulse Carbines is move and scoot out of 12" rapid fire range (assuming they've dealt enough casualties). However, that makes Devilfish transportation necessary.

I've seen a couple lists, but does anyone have all the suit systems listed out yet?

Is "fusion" melta or is it now double dice at 18 for armor pen? Also what are stats for SMS now?

 Stormcrow wrote:
Is "fusion" melta or is it now double dice at 18 for armor pen? Also what are stats for SMS now?

fusion is still melta.

think seekers are the same... heavy 4 etc.. ignore cover now which is better

+1 toughness for irridium?! Is it still special issue?

Materia_Master wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

FrozenSoul80 wrote:
I think the worst part of all this is pulse carbines still use the useless pinning rule.

In what respect is pinning useless? If you start fielding large FW squads with carbines-- very feasible with Devilfish, FW cost decreases, and Carbines at Assault 2-- Pinning is just a bonus.

I think he means the that many armies flat-out ignore morale tests, meaning that pinning won't work around half the time. And most enemies that do have to take morale checks have a crazy high leadership skill anyways.

I was hoping for a Toughness test or be blinded (infantry fail Toughness tests far more often), but it appears to not be so.

Pretty much this. I've never successfully pinned a unit and I've been trying for four years.

davou wrote:
+1 toughness for irridium?! Is it still special issue?

I would assume so.. +1t 2+sv. probably will cost a few points

why didn't they market the new commander model as 'iridium' rather than 'enforcer'?

Anyone just have the same idea I did regarding the possibility of making a "EW/ECM" suit by equipping it with:

- Neurored. Enemy unit gets hot rule on their shooting phase.
- Command and control module. If he doesn't shoot, all his unit re-roll to hit.
- Multispecter sensor system. If he doesn't shoot, all his unit ignore cover.

That sounds like fun to me!

(Edited for Spelling)


Automatically Appended Next Post:
Or this:

- Repulse shock field. Assault, I10, 1d6 S4AP- hit to any enemy unit who succesfully charged.
- Command and control module. If he doesn't shoot, all his unit re-roll to hit.
- Multispecter sensor system. If he doesn't shoot, all his unit ignore cover.

FrozenSoul80 wrote:

Materia_Master wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

FrozenSoul80 wrote:
I think the worst part of all this is pulse carbines still use the useless pinning rule.

In what respect is pinning useless? If you start fielding large FW squads with carbines-- very feasible with Devilfish, FW cost decreases, and Carbines at Assault 2-- Pinning is just a bonus.

I think he means the that many armies flat-out ignore morale tests, meaning that pinning won't work around half the time. And most enemies that do have to take morale checks have a crazy high leadership skill anyways.

I was hoping for a Toughness test or be blinded (infantry fail Toughness tests far more often), but it appears to not be so.

Pretty much this. I've never successfully pinned a unit and I've been trying for four years.

Either your opponent's dice are loaded or you have insanely awful luck.

ECM suits. . . OHHHH interesting new depth added to the game.

FrozenSoul80 wrote:

Materia_Master wrote:

 Kingsley wrote:

FrozenSoul80 wrote:
I think the worst part of all this is pulse carbines still use the useless pinning rule.

In what respect is pinning useless? If you start fielding large FW squads with carbines-- very feasible with Devilfish, FW cost decreases, and Carbines at Assault 2-- Pinning is just a bonus.

I think he means the that many armies flat-out ignore morale tests, meaning that pinning won't work around half the time. And most enemies that do have to take morale checks have a crazy high leadership skill anyways.

I was hoping for a Toughness test or be blinded (infantry fail Toughness tests far more often), but it appears to not be so.

Pretty much this. I've never successfully pinned a unit and I've been trying for four years.

Exactly.
For example: I primarily play against Ork, Tyranids, CSM, and IG.

Ork and Tyranids are ussually immune, unless orks don't have the numbers (lol), or the Tyranids are out of synapse (double lol). So basically, those two immune.
CSM have a crazy good leadership, I managed to pin a squad once... while he was defending a point, so he just hunkered down.
IG i've pinned a grand total of 6 times... and I've played 30+ games against them.

Like I said, I wanted a Toughness test for blinded or something, but alas, still pinning.

I dont know if its posted already but, here it comes:

Puretide Neuronal Chip: At the begginig of the user Movement Phase, he can choose between the following USR: Counter-attack, Furious Charge, Monster Hunter, Tank hunter, Stubborn. The miniature has this special rule until the beginning of his next movement phase.

Go suicide Hellios, KILL ALL THE TANKS!!!

 KaiserEddie wrote:
I dont know if its posted already but, here it comes:

Puretide Neuronal Chip: At the begginig of the user Movement Phase, he can choose between the following USR: Counter-attack, Furious Charge, Monster Hunter, Tank hunter, Stubborn. The miniature has this special rule until the beginning of his next movement phase.

Go suicide Hellios, KILL ALL THE TANKS!!!

Be vewy vewy quiet... My FB / PR squad's going MC hunting.

Exactly.
For example: I primarily play against Ork, Tyranids, CSM, and IG.

Ork and Tyranids are ussually immune, unless orks don't have the numbers (lol), or the Tyranids are out of synapse (double lol). So basically, those two immune.
CSM have a crazy good leadership, I managed to pin a squad once... while he was defending a point, so he just hunkered down.
IG i've pinned a grand total of 6 times... and I've played 30+ games against them.

Like I said, I wanted a Toughness test for blinded or something, but alas, still pinning.

so.. two missile broadsides each with 2 missile drones.. that's a total of 16 str 7 ap 4 shots and 8 str 5 ap 5 shots that ignore cover. 24 missiles...

now the spare hardpoint.. one with a drone controller to up all 4 drones bs and one with skyfire.. that will do nicely I think

 boy wonder wrote:
so.. two missile broadsides each with 2 missile drones.. that's a total of 16 str 7 ap 4 shots and 8 str 5 ap 5 shots that ignore cover. 24 missiles...

now the spare hardpoint.. one with a drone controller to up all 4 drones bs and one with skyfire.. that will do nicely I think

I pretty much had this exact same thought. And it took me to a happy place.

 boy wonder wrote:
so.. two missile broadsides each with 2 missile drones.. that's a total of 16 str 7 ap 4 shots and 8 str 5 ap 5 shots that ignore cover. 24 missiles...

now the spare hardpoint.. one with a drone controller to up all 4 drones bs and one with skyfire.. that will do nicely I think

You might want to be careful with that. In practice giving drones to Broadsides can be very dangerous because the Drones can force Morale checks on the Broadsides and potentially send very resilient models off the table.

 Jayden63 wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
so.. two missile broadsides each with 2 missile drones.. that's a total of 16 str 7 ap 4 shots and 8 str 5 ap 5 shots that ignore cover. 24 missiles...

now the spare hardpoint.. one with a drone controller to up all 4 drones bs and one with skyfire.. that will do nicely I think

I pretty much had this exact same thought. And it took me to a happy place.

yes. its awesome..thats a lot of strength 7... esp since my gaming group doesn't run much av13+


Automatically Appended Next Post:

 Kingsley wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
so.. two missile broadsides each with 2 missile drones.. that's a total of 16 str 7 ap 4 shots and 8 str 5 ap 5 shots that ignore cover. 24 missiles...

now the spare hardpoint.. one with a drone controller to up all 4 drones bs and one with skyfire.. that will do nicely I think

You might want to be careful with that. In practice giving drones to Broadsides can be very dangerous because the Drones can force Morale checks on the Broadsides and potentially send very resilient models off the table.

yeah this is true.. but a single broadside dying also forces the check.. I will put the drones behind the broads most prob so I get the 2+ saves.

Morale checks may not be such an issue with ethereals having the amazing ability to be considered this time around.

Currently though people usually field shield drones with Broadsides anyways to soak up S8+ wounds that come around. I've never had an issue with them so far, especially if drones get the unit's armor save.

so the sniper drone team can have 3 controllers and up to 9 sniper drones.. that's a huge change... providing they stay as one unit of course.. if you can split them..well its not a huge change

im beginning to feel like TH/SS terminators may not be ruling to block much longer. Massive fire, high strength weapons, AP1 sniper rifles.......it will be sweet

I am really looking forward to a missile drone in FW squads, that way they can have some tactical flexibility in terms of range and heavy weapons, plus it does not interfere with basic tau battle principles restricting heavy weapons in infantry!

Sniper teams, the ultimate Killers, time to finish my team.

 generalchaos34 wrote:
im beginning to feel like TH/SS terminators may not be ruling to block much longer. Massive fire, high strength weapons, AP1 sniper rifles.......it will be sweet

I am really looking forward to a missile drone in FW squads, that way they can have some tactical flexibility in terms of range and heavy weapons, plus it does not interfere with basic tau battle principles restricting heavy weapons in infantry!

unfortunately th/ss are taken for that exact reason.. to not give a damn about your ap.. weight of fire will def do the trick though.. and yes I too cannot wait to have missiles in my FW squads

Have to admit, the new Tau releases are pretty impressive.

I don't generally bother much with GW stuff these days due to it being skull-infested or toylike nonsense.

but this release is really good, probably the best set of sculpts that GW has done since the dark eldar.

There's a distinct lack of "really, really dumb sculpts" that other releases have been plagued with (pretty much the entire necron release, GK baby carrier, dark angel church speeder etc.).

New battlesuits look great as does the plastic pathfinder kit. Solid release, hopefully the eldar will be just as good.

I like how it all looks like plausible sci-fi military hardware and not just some kind of stupid parody of the genre like a lot of other 40k armies feel like these days.

 boy wonder wrote:

 generalchaos34 wrote:
im beginning to feel like TH/SS terminators may not be ruling to block much longer. Massive fire, high strength weapons, AP1 sniper rifles.......it will be sweet

I am really looking forward to a missile drone in FW squads, that way they can have some tactical flexibility in terms of range and heavy weapons, plus it does not interfere with basic tau battle principles restricting heavy weapons in infantry!

unfortunately th/ss are taken for that exact reason.. to not give a damn about your ap.. weight of fire will def do the trick though.. and yes I too cannot wait to have missiles in my FW squads

excellent point, but this is ALOT of Ap1 at range, and hopefully after they have lost their Land Raider to a Railgun shot. Then when they try to assault said pathfinder squad, they take a a loss or two and darkstriider lets your consolidate and move just slightly out of range, i cant imagine anything more frustrating. Finally, revenge for all those terminators who attacked my FWs!!!!!

I agree the only issue I have is the fireblade who looks like he has tau'ns syndrome

It looks to me like all drones(except Riptide Drones) are now T4(R4) in the leaked pictures.

I keep reading different things on the Markerlights. Is it "spend a token" like now and then it is gone, so only one unit gets it's benefit, or is it the tokens stack so all units get the benefit when targeting the marked unit?

Did Weapon costs go up, stay the same, or go down for Battlesuits?

What do marker drones cost now?

 boy wonder wrote:
I agree the only issue I have is the fireblade who looks like he has tau'ns syndrome

Im going to give one of those tanker body taus with the binoculars a sword, then i dont have to worry about silly looking models

 generalchaos34 wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
I agree the only issue I have is the fireblade who looks like he has tau'ns syndrome

Im going to give one of those tanker body taus with the binoculars a sword, then i dont have to worry about silly looking models

luckily I have one of the 2002 metal fire warrior shas'uis.. I will use that as my fireblade


Automatically Appended Next Post:
devilfish... 90pts with a burst cannon and a seeker missile system. loaded with carbine FW. worth it?

Impressed with all but one The Sun Shark Bomber/Razor Shark Fighter.

What a hash up it really looks like a five minute wonder from a Piranah 2 straws and bit of duct tape.

(Flame Over)

I apologize if I missed this...

Any word on Piranha point cost?

 boy wonder wrote:

devilfish... 90pts with a burst cannon and a seeker missile system. loaded with carbine FW. worth it?

Why not just keep the drones? SMS is still only 4 shots, and carbines are 2 shots now. 188 points is 12 FW + d-fish, 32 s5 shots.

Also, can anyone confirm how many drones I can take with stealth suits?

I am not feeling very confident about this release. Overall, the units and most of the new weapons, save the Riptide, seem awfully weak. There are units and weapons that seem to have almost made it to the point were they would be truly potent, but just fell short of their true potential. For instance that quad ion gun on the fighter would probably be more useful if it were AP3, making it an ideal way to tackle Monstrous Creatures in addition to light vehicle and flyer hunting. Although I supposed the overload will be useful against hordes.

Problem is, I see far too much anti-horde and str 7, ap 4 type firepower, and very, very little hard hitting firepower needed to deal with heavy tanks, monstrous creatures, MEQ and TEQ. All most all of the later is concentrated in our elite slots + hammerheads (oddly enough, FW barracuda could be used to nuke MEQ if the ion cannon rule carries over to it, too bad it only has 2 HP). The Riptide is looking like an auto-include with its ion-accelerator. Its rather sad many of our other units aren't getting the same treatment as the Riptide and I have a feeling the Riptide is going to be overshadowing a lot of our other units.

Still have some hope for the bomber, but that hope depends a lot on how those interceptor drones will work in practice. If they don't benefit from flyer rules once detached, they are going to die in really short order, in which case most sensible players will keep them attached. This would be unfortunate, as then they would just be another str 7, ap 4 gun.

The shas'vre of a Stealth squad can take two drones: gun, marker, shield, or missile

That blows. I was hoping for 6 stealth suits/ 12 drones like I fielded one time - that would have been pretty hardcore with 18 more shots for the unit.

Also, is it just me, or should we just rename the army to Codex: T'AUtocannons? s7 ap4 dude...

Phanixis wrote:
I am not feeling very confident about this release. Overall, the units and most of the new weapons, save the Riptide, seem awfully weak. There are units and weapons that seem to have almost made it to the point were they would be truly potent, but just fell short of their true potential. For instance that quad ion gun on the fighter would probably be more useful if it were AP3, making it an ideal way to tackle Monstrous Creatures in addition to light vehicle and flyer hunting. Although I supposed the overload will be useful against hordes.

Problem is, I see far too much anti-horde and str 7, ap 4 type firepower, and very, very little hard hitting firepower needed to deal with heavy tanks, monstrous creatures, MEQ and TEQ. All most all of the later is concentrated in our elite slots + hammerheads (oddly enough, FW barracuda could be used to nuke MEQ if the ion cannon rule carries over to it, too bad it only has 2 HP). The Riptide is looking like an auto-include with its ion-accelerator. Its rather sad many of our other units aren't getting the same treatment as the Riptide and I have a feeling the Riptide is going to be overshadowing a lot of our other units.

Still have some hope for the bomber, but that hope depends a lot on how those interceptor drones will work in practice. If they don't benefit from flyer rules once detached, they are going to die in really short order, in which case most sensible players will keep them attached. This would be unfortunate, as then they would just be another str 7, ap 4 gun.

High volume of Str7 AP4 is actually pretty good against MC. There's also mass sniper Kroot, so high toughness isn't an issue. With Fusion Blaster now being 18" and Tau still having access to Str10 AP1 Hammerhead, I don't see an issue with heavy tanks. Heck, you can even use the Riptide to smash attack in assault!

Every time I see someone complaining about how the revealed stats we've seen so far for the codex seem weak, I keep thinking of how little they must have played with or against the old codex. I'm completely in love with the fact that we're actually getting more options on more platforms. TBH, the old codex was borderline competitive if played right. It didn't have much variety but it had strength where it counted so it could actually do some work with proper usage. Now it's pretty much just taking the base and giving it new toys and buffs all around? It may not be an overpowered uber codex, but from what we have seen so far, it is a straight up build off of the previous codex and that makes me SO happy.

Phanixis wrote:
I am not feeling very confident about this release. Overall, the units and most of the new weapons, save the Riptide, seem awfully weak. There are units and weapons that seem to have almost made it to the point were they would be truly potent, but just fell short of their true potential. For instance that quad ion gun on the fighter would probably be more useful if it were AP3, making it an ideal way to tackle Monstrous Creatures in addition to light vehicle and flyer hunting. Although I supposed the overload will be useful against hordes.

Problem is, I see far too much anti-horde and str 7, ap 4 type firepower, and very, very little hard hitting firepower needed to deal with heavy tanks, monstrous creatures, MEQ and TEQ. All most all of the later is concentrated in our elite slots + hammerheads (oddly enough, FW barracuda could be used to nuke MEQ if the ion cannon rule carries over to it, too bad it only has 2 HP). The Riptide is looking like an auto-include with its ion-accelerator. Its rather sad many of our other units aren't getting the same treatment as the Riptide and I have a feeling the Riptide is going to be overshadowing a lot of our other units.

Still have some hope for the bomber, but that hope depends a lot on how those interceptor drones will work in practice. If they don't benefit from flyer rules once detached, they are going to die in really short order, in which case most sensible players will keep them attached. This would be unfortunate, as then they would just be another str 7, ap 4 gun.

Dude, you were just handed a way to completely mitigate the ADL for 2 markerlights.

Anyone know if markerlights specify when you have to declare? Can I use them after I see how many hits I've scored? or after someone decides to goto ground?

 megatrons2nd wrote:
It looks to me like all drones(except Riptide Drones) are now T4(R4) in the leaked pictures.

I keep reading different things on the Markerlights. Is it "spend a token" like now and then it is gone, so only one unit gets it's benefit, or is it the tokens stack so all units get the benefit when targeting the marked unit?

The way I'm understanding Markerlights now, is that they haven't changed much. You can stack on BS as usual. But instead of 1 markerlight removing 1 point of cover, you just spend 2 markerslights to remove all cover. A nice improvement in some cases.

The New Codex...so many options...room spinning from all the options!?!....


Can't wait to try this stuff out, gonna come at my enemies like a spidermonkey!

davou wrote:

Phanixis wrote:
I am not feeling very confident about this release. Overall, the units and most of the new weapons, save the Riptide, seem awfully weak. There are units and weapons that seem to have almost made it to the point were they would be truly potent, but just fell short of their true potential. For instance that quad ion gun on the fighter would probably be more useful if it were AP3, making it an ideal way to tackle Monstrous Creatures in addition to light vehicle and flyer hunting. Although I supposed the overload will be useful against hordes.

Problem is, I see far too much anti-horde and str 7, ap 4 type firepower, and very, very little hard hitting firepower needed to deal with heavy tanks, monstrous creatures, MEQ and TEQ. All most all of the later is concentrated in our elite slots + hammerheads (oddly enough, FW barracuda could be used to nuke MEQ if the ion cannon rule carries over to it, too bad it only has 2 HP). The Riptide is looking like an auto-include with its ion-accelerator. Its rather sad many of our other units aren't getting the same treatment as the Riptide and I have a feeling the Riptide is going to be overshadowing a lot of our other units.

Still have some hope for the bomber, but that hope depends a lot on how those interceptor drones will work in practice. If they don't benefit from flyer rules once detached, they are going to die in really short order, in which case most sensible players will keep them attached. This would be unfortunate, as then they would just be another str 7, ap 4 gun.

Dude, you were just handed a way to completely mitigate the ADL for 2 markerlights.

Anyone know if markerlights specify when you have to declare? Can I use them after I see how many hits I've scored? or after someone decides to goto ground?

Currently, you declare the moment you remove the markerlight, which is right before the unit taking advantage of them fires. Can't imagine that has changed.

 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
The New Codex...so many options...room spinning from all the options!?!....


Can't wait to try this stuff out, gonna come at my enemies like a spidermonkey!

I just cant wait, Im taking my codex to a tourney a week later(small local one) Where i know ragers are.
Oh....yuo have a blob squad? Say hello to my str 7 blasts.
Or? Oh that is a nice flyer, Has it met my riptide?

High volume of Str7 AP4 is actually pretty good against MC. There's also mass sniper Kroot, so high toughness isn't an issue. With Fusion Blaster now being 18" and Tau still having access to Str10 AP1 Hammerhead, I don't see an issue with heavy tanks. Heck, you can even use the Riptide to smash attack in assault!

I have gotten a lot of mileage out of str7 ap4 in the past. Heck, in 5th edition I ran 3x3 deathrain+ because of all the light vehicles. That being said, even with that many missile pods tackling Tyranid Monstrous Creatures was still I chore. I would actually prefer it if I had the right tool for the right job, rather than using the missile pod or equivalent for bloody everything. After all, aren't the Tau supposed to be about hard-hitting firepower, not slowly grinding the enemy away (which is how missile pods seem to work)? I was hoping for some truly lethal firepower in this new codex.

 YotsubaSnake wrote:
Every time I see someone complaining about how the revealed stats we've seen so far for the codex seem weak, I keep thinking of how little they must have played with or against the old codex. I'm completely in love with the fact that we're actually getting more options on more platforms. TBH, the old codex was borderline competitive if played right. It didn't have much variety but it had strength where it counted so it could actually do some work with proper usage. Now it's pretty much just taking the base and giving it new toys and buffs all around? It may not be an overpowered uber codex, but from what we have seen so far, it is a straight up build off of the previous codex and that makes me SO happy.

I approve this post!

Tau with the CURRENT dex (not this new one) ARE capable of wining. Yes they have issues against thinks like the Helldrake but they are still capable of pulling off wins with minimal losses. I have seen it done against some of the NWP best players. This new dex gives 3+ times more options and adds more firepower than even IG can muster at times. Missile Drones, possible 48 shot overwatch on FW's (per squad) The buff on Burst Cannon shots . . . all this equates to awesomesauce in a bag!

Suits having anti Nightvision free is HUGE! Mass missiles, also big, I could EASILY go on. . .

I think we did get some pretty amazing firepower so far. And we did get the right tools for the right job. We have troops with sniper ammo to take down MCs. We have missile drones on stealthsuits to get early game alpha on units like manticores. We got beacons for reliable DS for units that can JSJ 3d6. That pretty effective imo. And they granted a lot of people's wishes with 18" Fusion and Assault 4 BCs. So far I'm satisfied. I just need to see some point values and GAME ON!

Well , if the Tau are selling as well as kroothawks post suggests, (they not being able to meet release day demands) maybe that will put a bit of starch in the ceo's underwear, and help the development of more of the xenos races, especially the ones that have languished for so long in the shadows of the limelight troopers.
Eldar, the Tau may have blazed a trail for you.

This new dex gives 3+ times more options and adds more firepower than even IG can muster at times.

Beating IG in terms of raw firepower remains to be seen. Thing about IG firepower is that it freaking HURTS! Lascannons, battlecannons, multimeltas, seige shells, heavy flamers, plasma cannons, you name it their weapons are absolutely deadly. When these weapons connect, models die, even the toughest on the board.

Most of our new stuff seems like we are going to need to shoot any reasonably resilient target repeatedly and pray they fail their saving throws. Death through massed fire as opposed to having particularly lethal firepower.

Almost seems like a role reversal. IG should be putting out more firepower do to shear numbers, but the Tau firepower should do more damage when it connects. Somehow GW got it backwards where Tau are putting out potential more firepower in terms of str 7, ap 4, while IG is putting out the higher quality firepower with lots of str 8+ and ap 2 and 3.

Suits having anti Nightvision free is HUGE!

Its 24 points of free hard-wired BSF tops. Granted its a welcome change, and makes sense just like free spotlights do (otherwise you are being asked to buy stuff that only works for 1/6 of the game), but I would hardly call huge.

Phanixis wrote:

Almost seems like a role reversal. IG should be putting out more firepower do to shear numbers, but the Tau firepower should do more damage when it connects. Somehow GW got it backwards where Tau are putting out potential more firepower in terms of str 7, ap 4, while IG is putting out the higher quality firepower with lots of str 8+ and ap 2 and 3.

Yeah what's with all these new high-strength weapons having gakky AP?
It doesn't bother me that much, it just looks silly. GW truly hates the thought of SMs dying easy, so matter how ridiculously powerful the guns are that shoot them.
Oh well. I'm fine with massed firepower as an alternative.

P.S. I just finished and added new pics of my flamey Hammerhead to my Blog of anyone wants to check it out!

In a game where you roll 6 sided dice, more will almost always be better, tau have always struggled with fire volume, they have had quality firepower, but not enough volume to deal with the horde armies in the game, tyranids, Orks, IG, SM have generally not been the hardest for me to deal with, a couple hundred IG...now that's a problem.

So the Tau lose some of the str 10 stuff..ohwell, just make the ones you bring count, target priority and everything counts in large amounts, frankly I look forward to rolling fistfuls of dice.

 Archonate wrote:

Phanixis wrote:

Almost seems like a role reversal. IG should be putting out more firepower do to shear numbers, but the Tau firepower should do more damage when it connects. Somehow GW got it backwards where Tau are putting out potential more firepower in terms of str 7, ap 4, while IG is putting out the higher quality firepower with lots of str 8+ and ap 2 and 3.

Yeah what's with all these new high-strength weapons having gakky AP?
It doesn't bother me that much, it just looks silly. GW truly hates the thought of SMs dying easy, so matter how ridiculously powerful the guns are that shoot them.
Oh well. I'm fine with massed firepower as an alternative.

P.S. I just finished and added new pics of my flamey Hammerhead to my Blog of anyone wants to check it out!

High strenght and high rate of fire means low ap. Otherwise you get something massively broken. Especially since we can almost ALWAYS ignore cover now.... People are getting it yet.... Everyone takes that fething ADL, and tau have just rendered it useless entirely.

The thing about outshooting guard is that, we can shoot way farther than them, and maintain rate of fire for almost that entire reach.

 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
The New Codex...so many options...room spinning from all the options!?!....


Can't wait to try this stuff out, gonna come at my enemies like a spidermonkey!

Agreed! I have spent several hours pouring through the latest rumors and the pics and I simply can't believe all of the options! Even with the most restrictive limitations on which units can take what and potentially some hidden point cost increases that we still haven't seen, there are finally options on how people would like to play their Tau! Would you like to play with all infantry (Firewarriors + Pathfinders) well that seems quite feasible, would you like to play all vehicles? seems quite doable, would you like to play with all suits and limited troop choice through firewarriors, kroot or allies? no problem! I mean for goodness sakes, a suit/suits? can even take a single S10 Ap1 kung fu spinning kick of death attack (ok i know its called gauntlet but a "this is sparta" or a kung-fu kick would be so much more cinematic). The Farsight bomb has a massive point decrease and can finally have a leadership upgrade (can be made stubborn) making it much much harder to be run down in combat! The S10 railguns on the broadsides have been lost, but now we are learning that the fusion blaster's range has been increased by 50%! The good news just keep pouring in!!!

Why do people hate on stealths so much? I had one squad of 6 in some cover survive almost 4 full turns of an entire army's worth of cron shooting. I feel like they can have a much stronger roll than people are giving them credit for.

Hopefully you can take markerlights as an additional upgrade weapon for them since they come with multitrackers and they are jetpack which means relentless. Imagine them running around firing a gun and a markerlight from some cover to really help the army as a whole. its little things sometimes....

 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
In a game where you roll 6 sided dice, more will almost always be better, tau have always struggled with fire volume, they have had quality firepower, but not enough volume to deal with the horde armies in the game, tyranids, Orks, IG, SM have generally not been the hardest for me to deal with, a couple hundred IG...now that's a problem.

So the Tau lose some of the str 10 stuff..ohwell, just make the ones you bring count, target priority and everything counts in large amounts, frankly I look forward to rolling fistfuls of dice.

Eh? I didn't have much problems using the old codex against horde armies. It takes a horde to fight a horde and that's what my 100 Kroots + 9 Broadsides excelled at. With the new codex, I hope the compulsory Fire Warrior unit is thrown out the window. If so, I'll purchase 20 more Kroots and have a complete 120 Kroot Merc army!

Now that Kroots and Broadsides dropped down in points (albeit both got slight nerf), I have more points to spend on other things!

Wolfnid420 wrote:
Why do people hate on stealths so much? I had one squad of 6 in some cover survive almost 4 full turns of an entire army's worth of cron shooting. I feel like they can have a much stronger roll than people are giving them credit for.

Hopefully you can take markerlights as an additional upgrade weapon for them since they come with multitrackers and they are jetpack which means relentless. Imagine them running around firing a gun and a markerlight from some cover to really help the army as a whole. its little things sometimes....

The army list entry says the Shas'vre can take markerlight with targetlock for 5 points.

Although the big question is whether the markerlight and the positional relay are and/or. Pretty much anyone who runs stealth suits will do it for the relay.


Here's what I like about the codex spoilers so far:

1. The only 12" weapon left in the codex is the pulse pistol. It was always odd how Tau were supposed to be a shooty army, and then everything outside of the pulse rifle and missile pod were short range. Assault weapons being 18" and rifles being 30" is a nice change of pace.

2. Special characters that actually belong in the Tau codex. After 3e's mediocre melee monsters and 4e's popemobile and solo stealth suit, having SCs that buff and interact with the other units in the Codex is awesome. Thanks to the warlord trait, Farsight is now the "drop 8 suits in your opponent's back line" guy instead of just the guy with the sword. Depending on Aun'shi's specials, even he might be useful as a challenge taker.

At this point, the only things that are left on my wishlist are rail/ion rifles on XV8s, additional kroot choices, plastic vespid/krootox/kroothounds, and drones not to take transport capacity when they're unit improvements.

I translated the drone rules for ya'll... Keep in mind, my spanish is weak so I may have borked some Can's for Cants. If I got it mostly right however, it seems that if you lose an IC, his drones remain with whatever unit he was in!

a unit composed entirely of drones is a non scoring unit that does not deny. The drones do not have the special rule burly(?)

Drones improvements count as additional members the squad in all aspects. They are unable to leave their unit and shall remain in choherency with the unit at all times. Drones improvements can not obtain options and therefore do not pay for them if your unit does.

Independent Characters and drones
The independent characters that have chosen drones as improvement may join other units but both the character and his drones will join the unit. If the independent character leaves the unit, all surviving drones so would, and form a new unit with the independant character.

If the independant character dies as part of a unit, its suvivind drones become part of that unit and can not leave. Character unit is considered destroyed independent EFFECTS victory points

If the independent character dies while not part of another unit, do not remove the drones survivors. The unit will not be removed until remaining drones are also destroyed. These drones may not join other units. Yet another independent character may unite the surviving drones, but as they are pruchased improvements, they must not be carried into other units he joins.

Drones in vehicles

Some vehicles include two drones. They begin the game attached to the vehicle

attached drones
While they are attached to vehicles, drones are treated as passengers boarded (but do not count toward the carrying capacity of the vehicle and can be attached to a vehicle that does not have transport capacity). This means that, while they are attached, make shooting attacks as passengers shooting from the trigger points, using his position on the vehicle to determine its line of vision, range, etc .... Unlike other models that shoot from firing points, drones attached must shoot the same target as the vehicle to which they are attached. The skills/rules acquired by vehicles used for tau, or squadron of vehicles also apply to any drone attached to the model.

If a vehicle is destroyed before it has unattached their drones, the latter are automatically destroyed.


Disembarking drones
During any friendly phase of movement , drones can disembar from ​​your vehicle in the same way that the infantry disembarks from an open topped vehicle. All attached drones must disembark, when a vehicle disembarks its drones. They Then form a new unit.

after disembarking, drones may not be re-attached to any vehicle, but may be placed in transport vehicles like other drones.

The drones that began the game attached to a vehicle do not provide victory points if destroyed. Also, your opponent will only need to destroy vehicles and not the drones that disembarked to gain the victory points for that kill.

 Kingsley wrote:

 boy wonder wrote:
so.. two missile broadsides each with 2 missile drones.. that's a total of 16 str 7 ap 4 shots and 8 str 5 ap 5 shots that ignore cover. 24 missiles...

now the spare hardpoint.. one with a drone controller to up all 4 drones bs and one with skyfire.. that will do nicely I think

You might want to be careful with that. In practice giving drones to Broadsides can be very dangerous because the Drones can force Morale checks on the Broadsides and potentially send very resilient models off the table.

We don't know if drones count for this in the new rules yet.

Unlearn, you must unlearn.... - yoda

repeating what someone had asked a page ago:

Does anyone know the new price for Piranhas? I really would want to use them, if only their price went down.

Also, any new weapon loadout for them?

@Materia Master The piranhas dropped a fair bit in points (-33%!) but their melta options went up (twice the old code price) All in all they still are cheaper. The seeker missiles might have gone up too, and I don't remember any new loadout

The information i'm looking for may have gotten lost in this forum somewhere...

what model is the special rule for that allows consolidation after overwatch....or did i just completely dream that...

cheers

Hans_Einberg wrote:
The information i'm looking for may have gotten lost in this forum somewhere...

what model is the special rule for that allows consolidation after overwatch....or did i just completely dream that...

cheers

That is the rumored special ability for Darkstrider. An HQ choice(based on the website entry) that give his unit that ability. (Might only work if he's in pathfinder since he himself wears pathfinder recon armor(once again from the website entry).

Coyote81 wrote:

Hans_Einberg wrote:
The information i'm looking for may have gotten lost in this forum somewhere...

what model is the special rule for that allows consolidation after overwatch....or did i just completely dream that...

cheers

That is the rumored special ability for Darkstrider. An HQ choice(based on the website entry) that give his unit that ability. (Might only work if he's in pathfinder since he himself wears pathfinder recon armor(once again from the website entry).

His ability isn't pathfinder only, but he may only join firewarriors or pathfinders

 YotsubaSnake wrote:
Every time I see someone complaining about how the revealed stats we've seen so far for the codex seem weak, I keep thinking of how little they must have played with or against the old codex.

It's just strange as the new book seems to gone so much to other extreme when it comes to dealing with heavy armour. OK, maybe the old staple of shoveling Broadsides on the board got old real fast, but now the Railgun has all but disappeared from the codex?? Once again, it looks like you need Broadsides and Hammerheads in your heavy support slots, except now you take more Hammerheads at expense of Broadsides, which leaves you with what exactly to put your Sky Rays and Sniper Drones in...? That's right, the trashcan, where they already spent the previous 2 editions. I just don't understand how this is supposed to work.

Sure, it looks like there is more stuff to deal with other threats, but still. I mean, imagine if next Space Marine codex had all it's Lascannons removed except from Predators, and even them only in turret armament. "But you can still take Missile launchers and we gave Meltagun bit more range so no prob!"

Other random musings...

-so it looks like there is only one Commander now, no more Shas'el/Shas'O distinction?
-Kroot hounds are Beasts.
-Vespid are I6. Neutron Blaster lost AP but gained range. Better this way IMO.
-Hammerhead & Sky ray come with Gun drones standard, pay little extra from SMS/BC.
-Smart missiles are 30" now. Secondary weapons for tanks got lot better.
-points costs are strange. They moved away from nice even numbers, throwback to old times.

Backfire wrote:

Other random musings...

-so it looks like there is only one Commander now, no more Shas'el/Shas'O distinction?
-Kroot hounds are Beasts.
-Vespid are I6. Neutron Blaster lost AP but gained range. Better this way IMO.
-Hammerhead & Sky ray come with Gun drones standard, pay little extra from SMS/BC.
-Smart missiles are 30" now. Secondary weapons for tanks got lot better.
-points costs are strange. They moved away from nice even numbers, throwback to old times.

Neutron Blaster is still AP 3... Unless 3 is the new 4 Check it for yourself, its the Blaster Neutronico entry, right under the fusion, even if blurry its still a 3, and you can check it out with the Cañon ionico (Ion Cannon) entry.

Any news on whether the Hammerhead can take the Burst Cannon and SMS?

As in one chin mounted BC and the SMS?

 KaiserEddie wrote:

Backfire wrote:

Other random musings...

-so it looks like there is only one Commander now, no more Shas'el/Shas'O distinction?
-Kroot hounds are Beasts.
-Vespid are I6. Neutron Blaster lost AP but gained range. Better this way IMO.

Neutron Blaster is still AP 3... Unless 3 is the new 4 Check it for yourself, its the Blaster Neutronico entry, right under the fusion, even if blurry its still a 3, and you can check it out with the Cañon ionico (Ion Cannon) entry.

Hmm...it's blurry, but looks like you're right. I'm not actually happy with this, because it means that Vespid are still overcosted. Problem with Vespid was always that they had AP3 gun which was not terribly useful but forced their points cost very high.

@Backfire The vespid's blaster are still S.5 AP 3.
Oddly enough they now have hit'n'Run USR, which with their I of 6 makes it weird ... Added not so useful things? Eh!

Backfire wrote:

 KaiserEddie wrote:

Backfire wrote:

Other random musings...

-so it looks like there is only one Commander now, no more Shas'el/Shas'O distinction?
-Kroot hounds are Beasts.
-Vespid are I6. Neutron Blaster lost AP but gained range. Better this way IMO.

Neutron Blaster is still AP 3... Unless 3 is the new 4 Check it for yourself, its the Blaster Neutronico entry, right under the fusion, even if blurry its still a 3, and you can check it out with the Cañon ionico (Ion Cannon) entry.

Hmm...it's blurry, but looks like you're right. I'm not actually happy with this, because it means that Vespid are still overcosted. Problem with Vespid was always that they had AP3 gun which was not terribly useful but forced their points cost very high.

AFAIK Vespids now have a 4+ armor save, a huge buf from 5+ wich was silly, stats wise they have WS 4 T 4 and I 6, they cost 15 points the normal one, and 22 the Strainleader, theyre jump infantry wich can avoid twisting ankleswith a reroll, and with a new shiny 18" reach theyre more worthy of their points cost for a unit of 6 wich is 97 points(With the actual pint cost, im not sure of 15, they stan on my codex at 16), and can use the ML to increase BS as long as the strainleader is alive. Vespids arent the new marines, but they are more of a solid choice against them now if you lack the flyers or have some spare points and your in need of more dakka

 KaiserEddie wrote:

Backfire wrote:

 KaiserEddie wrote:

Backfire wrote:

Other random musings...

-so it looks like there is only one Commander now, no more Shas'el/Shas'O distinction?
-Kroot hounds are Beasts.
-Vespid are I6. Neutron Blaster lost AP but gained range. Better this way IMO.

Neutron Blaster is still AP 3... Unless 3 is the new 4 Check it for yourself, its the Blaster Neutronico entry, right under the fusion, even if blurry its still a 3, and you can check it out with the Cañon ionico (Ion Cannon) entry.

Hmm...it's blurry, but looks like you're right. I'm not actually happy with this, because it means that Vespid are still overcosted. Problem with Vespid was always that they had AP3 gun which was not terribly useful but forced their points cost very high.

AFAIK Vespids now have a 4+ armor save, a huge buf from 5+ wich was silly 4 WS 4 T and 6 I, they cost 15 points the normal one, and 22 the Strainleader, theyre jump infantry wich can avoid twisting ankleswith a reroll, and with a new shiny 18" reach theyre more worthy of their points cost for a unit of 6 wich is 97 points(With the actual pint cost, im not sure of 15, they stan on my codex at 16), and can use the ML to increase BS as long as the strainleader is alive. Vespids arent the new marines, but they are more of a solid choice against them now if you lack the flyers or have some spare points and your in need of more dakka

Actually they don't have a reroll anymore , they have Move through Cover , allowing them to totally Ignore Dangerous terrain checks! ( IIRC, gotta check on that)

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:

 KaiserEddie wrote:

Backfire wrote:

 KaiserEddie wrote:

Backfire wrote:

Other random musings...

-so it looks like there is only one Commander now, no more Shas'el/Shas'O distinction?
-Kroot hounds are Beasts.
-Vespid are I6. Neutron Blaster lost AP but gained range. Better this way IMO.

Neutron Blaster is still AP 3... Unless 3 is the new 4 Check it for yourself, its the Blaster Neutronico entry, right under the fusion, even if blurry its still a 3, and you can check it out with the Cañon ionico (Ion Cannon) entry.

Hmm...it's blurry, but looks like you're right. I'm not actually happy with this, because it means that Vespid are still overcosted. Problem with Vespid was always that they had AP3 gun which was not terribly useful but forced their points cost very high.

AFAIK Vespids now have a 4+ armor save, a huge buf from 5+ wich was silly 4 WS 4 T and 6 I, they cost 15 points the normal one, and 22 the Strainleader, theyre jump infantry wich can avoid twisting ankleswith a reroll, and with a new shiny 18" reach theyre more worthy of their points cost for a unit of 6 wich is 97 points(With the actual pint cost, im not sure of 15, they stan on my codex at 16), and can use the ML to increase BS as long as the strainleader is alive. Vespids arent the new marines, but they are more of a solid choice against them now if you lack the flyers or have some spare points and your in need of more dakka

Actually they don't have a reroll anymore , they have Move through Cover , allowing them to totally Ignore Dangerous terrain checks! ( IIRC, gotta check on that)

They keep getting better and better, my god, im actually looking nicely at those old metal vespid models that are sitting on my FLGS lol

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
@Backfire The vespid's blaster are still S.5 AP 3.
Oddly enough they now have hit'n'Run USR, which with their I of 6 makes it weird ... Added not so useful things? Eh!

Hit & run is actually very nice. I wonder if they have poisoned attacks - the models have stingers...

So far, I think the only bad units we've seen are the Kroot and Devilfish and only because the Devilfish didn't drop in points.

Puscifer wrote:
So far, I think the only bad units we've seen are the Kroot and Devilfish and only because the Devilfish didn't drop in points.

Infiltrating sniper Troops for 7 points a pop isn't exactly bad TBH.

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
@Desubot Darkstrider's got that bigger makerlight thingy, allows his unit to consider targetted units -1T than they really are (even for instant deaths!) and allows his squad to consolidate 1d6 after the countercharging shots, before the enemy rolls his charge distance.

 Kingsley wrote:

They can take Ion Rifles, and Rail Rifles are now Rapid Fire while Pulse Carbines are Assault 2. They also have some new drone options that we don't seem to have a full picture of yet.

The new drones are the recon drone (the one with the burst cannon) which acts as a beacon and gives some control concerning flank attacks. You also have an "inhibitor dron" which allows you to substract 1D3 to a specific unit charge distance charging you. Then the fabled +6 range on pulse carbines/rifles (pulse drone?). Cheers!

So, a squad of 10 pathfinders with a grav inhibitor drone and Darkstrider takes up a forward position, lighting up targets with markerlights. When they get charged, you get 22 shots of pulse carbine, wounding T4 on a 2+ (thanks to S5 and Darkstrider's ability). Then they get to consolidate D6 inches away (avg 3.5) and the opponent charges D3 inches less (avg 2), meaning they need an additional 5.5 inches in order to get into close combat. On the next turn, assuming they fail the charge, you get to hit them with all the firepower of the carbines again, while moving further away if necessary.

If this can be combined with Supporting Fire, or the trait that lets you Overwatch as BS2, this gets really disgusting.

The pathfinders don't have stealth or infiltrate, do they?

Oh, just a thing I've seen asked but not answered about the DP . Only +1 cover save now (like stealth, but it's not really "Stealth"...dunno why)

the devilfish didn't get cheaper... but its burst cannon gained a shot.. its drones gained a shot each and don't give away victory points anymore... plus carbine warriors are much better with a fish. I don't think its so bad.

Anything about the suit weapon costs? Did they remain the same? Are there any new weapon options? Can a suit take 3 weapons (like, take 3 burst cannons, so it will end up with 1 TL and 1 normal)?

 boy wonder wrote:
the devilfish didn't get cheaper... but its burst cannon gained a shot.. its drones gained a shot each and don't give away victory points anymore... plus carbine warriors are much better with a fish. I don't think its so bad.

Don't forget the option to upgrade to 30" SMS or two Missile drones, and the pathfinder beacon drone.

apparently plasma rifles are now 15pts.. 20pts TL which is MUCH better.

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Oh, just a thing I've seen asked but not answered about the DP . Only +1 cover save now (like stealth, but it's not really "Stealth"...dunno why)

In your opinion, does it stack with the special rule "Jink"?

If it's a straight +1 cover, of course it will.
The real question would be, is it still only at over 12" away?

 Ovion wrote:
If it's a straight +1 cover, of course it will.
The real question would be, is it still only at over 12" away?

That is a good question and also if it is only +1 cover save then does it give an auto 6+ cover save when the vehicle is not in cover otherwise? The WD battle report makes me think it does (because the opponent is all nutty when the guy makes a 6+ DP save, which I presume he needed because he didn't move the Hammerhead?).

The advantage of being just a straight up +1 cover save bonus would be that when night fighting rolls around that +1 cover save is going to combo with the Stealth the vehicle can get from night fighting.

 boy wonder wrote:
apparently plasma rifles are now 15pts.. 20pts TL which is MUCH better.

15 pts plasma? The day keeps getting better and better if i get a hold of the Codex by tomorrow i think i can do some QnA for point cost, im actually looking forward to the Armory, all the special issue and such, if MP and PR got their points reduced to 10 and 15, im the happiest Tau player on the island

Things are looking solid...a lot of good combos in there.

I have one request for everyone reading this thread;

Please go to the forgeworld website, and and email them asking for them to please update their tau units for 6th.

Here is the address:
"If you have any rules suggestions or feedback about Imperial Armour rules then please e-mail them to us at

ImperialArmour@games-workshop.co.uk

Please Note: This e-mail address is not for sales, events enquires or customer service problems. Please use the Forge World e-mail address for any such queries as this will provide a far faster response. This address is for game related feedback and will be read by the Imperial Armour Editors, not the Forge World Customer Service Team."

Please be polite in your email, but also please email them, after all they WANT us to...

I love my fw models, some updated rules for them would be wonderful.

thank you.

 B0B MaRlEy wrote:
Oh, just a thing I've seen asked but not answered about the DP . Only +1 cover save now (like stealth, but it's not really "Stealth"...dunno why)

For nightfight.

Backfire wrote:

 YotsubaSnake wrote:
Every time I see someone complaining about how the revealed stats we've seen so far for the codex seem weak, I keep thinking of how little they must have played with or against the old codex.

It's just strange as the new book seems to gone so much to other extreme when it comes to dealing with heavy armour. OK, maybe the old staple of shoveling Broadsides on the board got old real fast, but now the Railgun has all but disappeared from the codex?? Once again, it looks like you need Broadsides and Hammerheads in your heavy support slots, except now you take more Hammerheads at expense of Broadsides, which leaves you with what exactly to put your Sky Rays and Sniper Drones in...? That's right, the trashcan, where they already spent the previous 2 editions. I just don't understand how this is supposed to work.

Maybe it is because I actually enjoyed fielding underplayed units, but I feel that there were plenty of unappreciated options for armor that the old codex could use. Of course, AV10-12 was a cake because you have so many options to deal with it, however AV14 is where it always was a challenge. Basically, what would happen is that if my opponent had a Land Raider on the table, he was going to do everything in his power to make sure my railguns were off the board as soon as possible. This leaves you in a situation where you have to just shoot it out, hope you kill things before they die or hide them and let them advance on you while you kept them safe until the right moment. I elected for a third option, however, and used fusion blasters. On stealth/crisis suits, you could easily jump them into 6" and if you hit they are more likely to blow up than if you hit them with a railgun. Now that I can do that from 9", I have no fear of being caught in the vehicle blowing up, reducing casualties and making it much easier for that unit to escape in the assault phase.

Since this is all happening in your elite/HQ slots, you now are left with more fexibility in your heavy support. I havn't even thrown in the posibilities of the Riptide suit yet, but I'm sure that it will just as awesome in that area.

Are the vespid able to be taken in squads of 12 finally? It's a minor point but an incredibly annoying one that in an army of squads of multiples of 3 (3,6,12) that the vespid could only get to 11. It certainly doesn't help that I have 12 vespid either. It's not game breaking but I'd imagine marine players would find it wierd to have a certain squad be a 9 max instead of 10.

Oh! Pulse Carbines are now Assault 2, so Gun Drones shoot a twin linked Assault 2. Gun Drone squads sound kinda scary for putting some lead in the air now.

 warboss wrote:
Are the vespid able to be taken in squads of 12 finally?

Yes, they are.
BTW no secret units in the book that need models in a second wave, everything will be released by Saturday, including all characters.
And no Psi-cards, which is good

Still, actually losing 2 points of str on broadsides, for a miraculous drop of 5 points per model, whilst not gaining the "iridium armor" or a natural invuln, makes broads not much more than a dungheap useful only for expensive, fairly uninspiring amounts of AA. I think this codex is going to be a lot more about "how can i get melta over there without losing all of my dudes in the process?", even moreso than most marine armies. Ravagers are better AT than railguns now for feth's sake lol. My prediction of the tau metagame is 3 hammerheads, cadre fireblades & ethereals (dunno how many you can take per slot), 9 helios/fireknife suits, 36+ FW and a token unit of 20 sniperkroot, and some pathfinders & vespids to round it out, plus an ADL - vespids if using fireknifes especially.

Alternative "may win local tourneys but never going to win GT's with regularity" lists will be farsight bomb, lists with 4+ missilesides, 2+ riptides, 2+flyers, and kroot heavy lists. Fish of Fury may see a comeback, but tbh the "stand still for more dakka" stuff will kill that meta right and quick.

This is without seeing any particularly groundbreaking new stuff in the special wargear section for generals. I think it's pretty safe to say Tau haven't lost their army feel, but it's going to be pretty tough to kill 3 predators, even, much less 3+ leman russ, or 3 hellturkeys (still...), and vendettas are now king of long range AT and antiflyer at the same time, whilst blapping their points worth of broadsides/crisis suits each turn because feth tau specifically.

Things may have gotten better for a lot of tau units, but the codex as a whole doesn't give me the "wow" feel GK did, where everything is pretty powerful, or the feeling IG did where you can take a hundred different lists, and fit enough firepower in no matter what you took, or heck, the feeling DE did which was making units that may not even be very great, worth taking simply because of beautiful models or fun rules. Strikes me as being like CSM sans helldrakes and cult marines, or DA sans bikes and terminators. Tau's special snowflakes are crisis suits, who carry special weapons because squads can't (and thus become target #1, as they're very vulnerable units), and pathfinders, who are target #2 and very very squishy now. When the snowflakes of other armies can at least be delivered to their target with a durable, reliable transport, or just stand around shooting because they're armored/costed for it, I feel like tau are missing that element.

Well, glad we've got all that figured out. We can go ahead and pack it in kids. Don't bother actually reading the book, the reviews are in!

On a more serious note the stuff I'm seeing is solid. It fits the 6th mindset they've been going with the last 3 books and also throws a huge wrench (again) in the current way armies will play. Honestly the insane anti-air is going to lead people back to playing more balanced lists. Especially given how popular Tau have always been.

 Hulksmash wrote:
Well, glad we've got all that figured out. We can go ahead and pack it in kids. Don't bother actually reading the book, the reviews are in!

I lol'd

On a more serious note the stuff I'm seeing is solid. It fits the 6th mindset they've been going with the last 3 books and also throws a huge wrench (again) in the current way armies will play. Honestly the insane anti-air is going to lead people back to playing more balanced lists. Especially given how popular Tau have always been.

This is very appealing to me. Flyer spam may have a hard counter now.

 Kroothawk wrote:

 warboss wrote:
Are the vespid able to be taken in squads of 12 finally?

Yes, they are.
BTW no secret units in the book that need models in a second wave, everything will be released by Saturday, including all characters.
And no Psi-cards, which is good

All in line with the rest of the 6th Edition releases...Chapterhouse definitely caused them to get their act together.

That being said, I do see second waves as a possibility...perhaps to give armies new sprues or models for ones carried over from previous editions (i.e. Crisis suits, FWs, etc.). One can hope, at least...lol

 pretre wrote:

 Hulksmash wrote:
Well, glad we've got all that figured out. We can go ahead and pack it in kids. Don't bother actually reading the book, the reviews are in!

I lol'd

Glad I could help make the day less tedious

Tau vs Tau battles are going to be bloody, with all the S7 Ap4 and AP2/3 ion shots going around

 Kroothawk wrote:

BTW no secret units in the book that need models in a second wave, everything will be released by Saturday, including all characters.
And no Psi-cards, which is good

Fantastic.

Trasvi wrote:
Tau vs Tau battles are going to be bloody, with all the S7 Ap4 and AP2/3 ion shots going around

All simulated blood in training skirmishes

uberjoras wrote:
Still, actually losing 2 points of str on broadsides, for a miraculous drop of 5 points per model, whilst not gaining the "iridium armor" or a natural invuln, makes broads not much more than a dungheap useful only for expensive, fairly uninspiring amounts of AA.

Well, let's take a look at the changes to Railgun Broadsides:

- lost 2 S from their primary weapon as well as 12" of range.
- 5 pt cost reduction per model
- Shas'vres got a +1 LD
- Plasma Rifles upgrade is 5 pts cheaper
- can get skyfire upgrades
- any suit can take up to two drones without eating a slot for a drone controller now

So overall, they took a substantial reduction in effectiveness against heavy armor and super high toughness MCs as well as lost some range. They still will pretty easily destroy almost any light armor at range and standard MCs and can cover most of the board. They are as resilient as ever, even more so when you consider that the charge protection the rest of the army can provide now. They are cheaper and give you more options to outfit them. Overall I think that they are still a very solid unit, and the changes to their railguns are better for the health of the game as they were a big deterrent to any TAC list utilizing heavy armor (certainly not the only deterrent, but definitely one of the primary reasons).

I agree Maelstrom. How often in this edition to really come across av14? Not much. With the range extension of fusion blasters I think they will become the weapon of choice for av14 and w/ all the S7 everywhere now we'll be glancing everything else to death.

Anyone seen the price of the pathfinder yet? I'm trying to think if they outweigh tetras yet.

uberjoras wrote:
This is without seeing any particularly groundbreaking new stuff in the special wargear section for generals. I think it's pretty safe to say Tau haven't lost their army feel, but it's going to be pretty tough to kill 3 predators, even, much less 3+ leman russ, or 3 hellturkeys (still...), and vendettas are now king of long range AT and antiflyer at the same time, whilst blapping their points worth of broadsides/crisis suits each turn because feth tau specifically.

I couldn't dissagree with you more. In fact, I showed some of these spanish-confirmations to my IG playing best friend this morning, he had nothing but lighthearted disdain for our new units. He's not excited to fight me now, considering other things, such as the new access to other str 8 weapons.

Sure, we lost ONE S10 option, but we gained how many other options did we get for S8 or more? We're still a huge threat against armor. Infact, I'd argue we're more dangerous now because of our improved general access to high strength weaponry.

But my opinion is forged from the fact that I've played Tau for 5 years, and last week I finished building my third (and final) broadside. So I'm a bit biased. I've always been a hammerhead man, and I know that many Tau players spam broadsides... my hunch is that's why broadsides had their gun nerfed. They were too good and all the tau players spammed them. It was boring and cheesy. Good riddace.

But then again, I disdain tournements and lists tailored for such things. I play what is fun.

Hulksmash has this one.

Not sure what all the lamentation is, this army will be able to blow airplanes out of the air, and if you don't see it you are blind. Tank-hunting str 8 ap 1 skyfire railguns (attach the commander with the Puretide Engram and pick tankhunter).

Riptide with fusion blaster/heavy guass with skyfire.

Crisis suits with winlinked fusion and skyfire.

Skyray.

I can't see how this list won't be a hard counter to air units. In addition even heavy armor can be dealt with. The LR is the only with with all direction armor 14. Run pirhana's with seekers up a side, fire the markerlights with no cover, str 8 on side armor 11 or 10 on vehicles.

Also, even landraiders you will be able to move up to 9 inches in, fire some markerlights and if your commander is present, use tank hunter. I don't know about you but I am already seeing twin fusion and plasma as my weapons of choice on the crisis suits.

As for tournament viable? We'll find out when I take them to Wargames Con in two months.

I think there is some legitimacy to the complaining about having lost access to some of our S10 stuff. Personally I think it would have been a better change to make Skyrays the Anti-Air of choice, and keep Broadsides' S10 but without Skyfire. I mean the seeker missile on their back would have been enough sky fire, imo.
Now we have too much anti-air, but maybe one good anti heavy armor shot per turn, IF we chose a Railgun over an Ion Cannon, which is a big 'if' now with the massed SM gibbing capacity of the Ion Cannon.
So now we have to glance LRs to death? Perhaps that was their intention behind the quantity of S8 stuff we get.

I'm actually not that bothered. I just think it would have made more sense to give us just a tiny bit more heavy tank busting and a tiny bit less sky fire. But it is what it is. I'll reserve my final assessment until after I take in all the info of the dex.

To be fair, I always had an issue with the Broadside and the Hammerhead Railguns having the same statline. The Hammerhead's railgun is significantly larger than the Broadside's railgun. Getting 40% larger just to gain submunitions seemed a little odd.

And Str8 AP1 skyfire is NOT something to be taken lightly. People will take Tau allies just for that.

New Tau bomber looks almost exactly like a NASA concept plane. I wish they would have stuck with the roots of tau design and followed something along the lines of a barracuda or tigershark form...

-Nikolakhs

looks like a B1 with a tail

I know this has been asked a few (4-5?) pages back, but can we get some confirmation as to the rumored FO limitations are with O'Shovah based lists? I have been doing my best to spot any sign of limitations from the pic of the O'Shovah pages but I am not seeing any and I don't speak Spanish

Also, has it been confirmed that Crisis Commanders can take Bodyguards and what the size limits are to the number of bodyguard (outside of O'Shovah 7)? I have not seen a picture of that page on the Spanish website, so any confirmation there would be helpful.

First in am a Marine Player [Space Wolves, Dark Angles mostly] and I don’t see the issue with the S8 AP 1 Weapons. Sure you can only glance a Land Raider on a 6, but everything else is going to vaporize on a 4+ on the damage charts. We don’t have a single weapon that can do that at 60”.
A Lack of AP 3, we don’t have a lot of AP 4 weapons out there. Yes we have them, but not a whole of them if we take a lot of AV 14.
You have whole squads armed with mobile “Heavy Bolters” [as far as Power Armor is concerned]. This is going to make them a very strong Shooty Army. With your 30” I am going to have to come out of my cover to shoot at you while you don’t have to.

I think you are going to have a good strong codex that will have more than one or builds to take on most armies, this actually makes me happy even as a Marine Player.

As a Tau player, I'm glad for all the changes. I was so sick of the 4x6 FWs in devilfish with max broadsides lists. BORING! Now there are several viable lists to make. Yeah we lost some strength 10. So what? it just means we have to be more manuverable to get those side/back armour shots; just the way Tau should be played.


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 spaceman spiff wrote:
I know this has been asked a few (4-5?) pages back, but can we get some confirmation as to the rumored FO limitations are with O'Shovah based lists? I have been doing my best to spot any sign of limitations from the pic of the O'Shovah pages but I am not seeing any and I don't speak Spanish

Also, has it been confirmed that Crisis Commanders can take Bodyguards and what the size limits are to the number of bodyguard (outside of O'Shovah 7)? I have not seen a picture of that page on the Spanish website, so any confirmation there would be helpful.

There are no farce org restrictions for Farsight. Also, commanders can have 3 bodyguards, while Farsight gets 7.

I don't know what some are complaining about. This codex opens up so many more ways for Tau to be even more strategic then before. In all honesty they seem borderline OP imo. Way more S5 AP5 pulse shots than before from the same amount of units, 20 infitrating snipers per kroot squad shots per turn, skyfire on anything and everything pretty much, more S7 AP4 missiles than you can count, fusion at 18" now, several different kinds of S8 or S9 large blast templates w/ ap2/3, cheaper more massed markerlights,the list goes on. No wonder they sold out, they went from middle to Extremely TOP Tier in one afternoon it seems so far. Not a big fan of playing other Tau armies but it's likely we all will see them everywhere in the coming weeks and months.

Im just glad it seems everything that i already have and modeled will be 100% relevant. and that i don't have to buy 20 new shinys to stay competitive. at least from current information.

Automatically Appended Next Post:

Also, commanders can have 3 bodyguards

Ahh, that is good news, so you could run 8 Crisis Suits out of the HQ, which keeps the Elites open for Riptide / Stealth options. It will be interesting to see if Target Lock / Split Fire will still be an option in order to maximize shooting options. Thanks!

Some more info on the pathfinders would be nice though.

^^^ I'm just hoping they get Stealth... Since the whole justification for having less armor was so they could make less noise.

 HoverBoy wrote:
Some more info on the pathfinders would be nice though.

+1

A lot of competitive Tau players might switch over from Tetras to Pathfinders depending on Pathfinders' point cost, markerlight effectiveness, survivability, and existence of Targeting Array and Target Lock (or split fire option) for vehicles.

Hmm, forgeworld speculation time - what do you think we'll see rules change wise there?

The TX-42 with Rail Rifles just got far more deadly. So did the Hammerhead with Twin Linked Heavy Burst cannons.

On the flip side the Hammerhead with Twin Linked Heavy Missile Pods probably took a downward turn.

Changes to the Ion Cannon on the Baracuda and the other Flyers would be nasty.

Heavy Gun Drones are pretty mean now too.

Just got told by my local store (independent retailer, not a GW store) that GW oversold the new Tau stuff and does not have enough plastics to fill orders. He will have the Codex and Finecast, but wasn't even given an ETA on the plastics. I saw the post from the EU yesterday and had a bad feeling it might happen here as well. There goes my weekend of assembly/painting I had planned.

Missile broadsides are okay AA, but railgun ones are awful in every aspect. With AA, railgun broadsides take about 7 broadsides to kill a helldrake (at 85 points/each that's almost 500 points of AA to kill a single flyer...), and that's regardless of exploding or hull point-ing av12, it's the same either way. Missile broadsides take about 5 broadsides to do the same thing, which again at 85 points each is over 400 points to kill one flyer. So I mean sure, Tau AA is better than other armies' AA; that's like saying a 3 year old is a better kickboxer than a newborn. When you have to throw more than 400 specialized points and two whole HS slots at a 100-odd point flyer just to kill it, there's something very wrong about that. I mean heck, a hammerhead with Jackie Chan Superstar DJ actually stands a fairly even chance of killing a helldrake, compared to skyfire broadsides. By the way, nobody noticed, but broadside missiles are NOT twin linked. They hit on BS3, with only snapfired markerlights being able to increase that versus a flyer outside of squad commanders buying TA's (if they exist and if it's a legal option). Aegis w/ quadgun and cadre fireblade + FW behind it, with the fireblade splitfiring, manning the quad at bs5 with 24(maybe even 36) snapfired s5 shots seems like similar AA capability to 3 broadsides, honestly.

The new tau codex is good, but I feel like we're still shoehorned into being a very predictable army with our HQ, elite, troops, FA, and Heavy slots each having very obvious choices that surpass the rest fairly solidly, with their alternatives being quite gimmicky and unreliable.

HQ - cadre fireblade, then ethereal or farsight

Elite - Crisis suits; riptide is about 50 points too expensive, and will die horribly to just a little bit of plasma unless it gives up its only real source of considerable firepower.

Troops - Fire warriors got better! Which is not saying much. Kroot got a total re-doing, and are fairly good at their new role, though not entirely stellar. Still not bad, but FW would do the job better.

FA - Vespids got much better, but Pathfinders certainly got buffs (though losing a point of armor stinks) as well. Piranhas got better due to fusion blaster range, so they may make or break some lists, though we havent seen if their cost went down or anything. The flyers are underwhelming especially at their points costs, so the choice is really down to pathfinders, vespids, and piranhas, in that order of preference.

Heavy - Hammerheads got minor buff in the form of points decrease and burst cannon buff, but overall they stay the same old "shoot railgun, probably roll a 1 to hit, if you hit, probably roll a 1 to pen, if you pen, probably roll a 1 on damage chart." I've already stated my opinion on broadsides, and skyrays/sniper drones are still total gack, so there goes that slot choice.


The new codex is really not as doom&gloom as I'm making it out to be, but seriously people, stop drinking each other's kool aid. Nerfs are nerfs, even if you want to call it a "repurposing". Kroot, broadsides, and sniper drones are all very much worse this edition, and two of those used to be very important parts of our army that we now have no solid replacement for outside of allies. Yes I'm already doing math - part of why I buy models is so I can actually use them to game with. If a model is bad, I won't buy it.

uberjoras wrote:

Heavy - Hammerheads got minor buff in the form of points decrease and burst cannon buff, but overall they stay the same old "shoot railgun, probably roll a 1 to hit, if you hit, probably roll a 1 to pen, if you pen, probably roll a 1 on damage chart."

Actually, Hammerheads will be more like "shoot Ion Cannon in overcharged mode at MEQ, use Markerlight to ignore cover, kill MEQ with S8 AP3 large blast". I think the Railhead will become obsolete with the dawn of Helios and Sunforge suits.

20 Snipers for 140pts is sweet. Kroot are, if anything, even better than the previous edition if not on par. And that's without seeing the specifics on them.

Broadsides are going to drop flyer's like it's hot and drop anything AV12 or less like it's going out of style. They also get more fire support in form of missile drones which is even nicers.

I'll give you that Sniper drones got worse against marines but honestly, who used them anyway?

You're doing your math before you have the solid point values of the entire book and specifics on the special rules. Seems a little hard to draw the correct conclusions on that.

tidalwake wrote:
Just got told by my local store (independent retailer, not a GW store) that GW oversold the new Tau stuff and does not have enough plastics to fill orders. He will have the Codex and Finecast, but wasn't even given an ETA on the plastics. I saw the post from the EU yesterday and had a bad feeling it might happen here as well. There goes my weekend of assembly/painting I had planned.

I better stop by my flgs to see if they are also affected... I just talked to him yesterday and the manager was telling me he already had his order approved by his supplier and the supplier was already asking about what the store wanted for the next shipment....

If only select retailers will get their orders filled, I'm not sure my flgs is big enough to be of any priority... I happen to know they ordered about $1200 in new tau units/codex, but I'm not sure how that compares to the average flgs.

Errrrm... that fighter is scary broken imo. Seriously.

Dunno if it's a spammable flyer like Heldrake, but definitely autotake one of.