Celestine
2x (9 BSS, repressor, melta, heavy flamer, superior, priest)
5 seraphim, 2x hand flamers, superior
Dominions, 4x melta, immolator
Retributors, 4x heavy bolters
Ordo Hereticus, ML1, force sword
2x (3 acolytes, PA, plasma gun, rhino)
My group is running a team game (randomised teams, odds are the other guys'll be running Dark Eldar, Pre Heresy marines and then either Tau or Blood Angels), how does this shape up for 1250 points? We'll be using 6th Edition rules, some of us are a little slow at updating. Any advice would be great.
BlackTalos wrote: Yeah, exactly. You also need to "keep the same list", so i could not take an aegis for game 2 and drop it in game 3....
being mostly in rhinos, i should be able to out-manoeuvre a flyer, but the risk is still there...
Saving the points on Plasma pistols is only 20points, so i'd need to find another 40 for the immo.... Exorcists already have Storm Bolters =)
I meant dropping a rhino and taking an immolator instead
Alternatively, you could 'upgrade' the immolator to a repressor?
pretre wrote: Maybe drop the command squad and shuffle them to a later game.
I thought that it was one of the most important ones for game 1?
Seeing as we are only allowed 2 wounds max, 3+ armor and no vehicle more than 2 HP, that's going to be a lot of foot units, which the command Squad would dispatch quite well
BlackTalos wrote: Yeah, exactly. You also need to "keep the same list", so i could not take an aegis for game 2 and drop it in game 3....
being mostly in rhinos, i should be able to out-manoeuvre a flyer, but the risk is still there...
Saving the points on Plasma pistols is only 20points, so i'd need to find another 40 for the immo.... Exorcists already have Storm Bolters =)
I meant dropping a rhino and taking an immolator instead
Alternatively, you could 'upgrade' the immolator to a repressor?
Ah yes, of course. that does indeed sound like a good plan for one of the 5-girl BSS.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Farseer Anath'lan wrote: Celestine
2x (9 BSS, repressor, melta, heavy flamer, superior, priest)
5 seraphim, 2x hand flamers, superior
Dominions, 4x melta, immolator
Retributors, 4x heavy bolters
Ordo Hereticus, ML1, force sword
2x (3 acolytes, PA, plasma gun, rhino)
My group is running a team game (randomised teams, odds are the other guys'll be running Dark Eldar, Pre Heresy marines and then either Tau or Blood Angels), how does this shape up for 1250 points? We'll be using 6th Edition rules, some of us are a little slow at updating. Any advice would be great.
EDIT: Removing points.
The lack of Exorcists is troubling...
Who is going to wreck all the DE transports turn 1 from range? because when they get close, it's almost a definite loss...
I'd recommend dropping the retributors and get a few points for an Exorcist. Also, why have a superior on the Seraphim? if they are with Celestine, the only reason you'd do that is to buy a Power Weapon. 1 extra S3 AP- attack is a little pointless :S
Same for the Inquisitor with Acolytes, what is their purpose really? I'd see a second Exorcist being much more useful, and the spare points could be useful. Dominion's Immolator has a Laud Hailer right? Dominion superior could take a combi-melta.
pretre wrote: Maybe drop the command squad and shuffle them to a later game.
I thought that it was one of the most important ones for game 1?
Seeing as we are only allowed 2 wounds max, 3+ armor and no vehicle more than 2 HP, that's going to be a lot of foot units, which the command Squad would dispatch quite well
Ahh, I missed some of the requirements.
Farseer Anath'lan wrote: Celestine
2x (9 BSS, repressor, melta, heavy flamer, superior, priest)
5 seraphim, 2x hand flamers, superior
Dominions, 4x melta, immolator
Retributors, 4x heavy bolters
Ordo Hereticus, ML1, force sword
2x (3 acolytes, PA, plasma gun, rhino)
My group is running a team game (randomised teams, odds are the other guys'll be running Dark Eldar, Pre Heresy marines and then either Tau or Blood Angels), how does this shape up for 1250 points? We'll be using 6th Edition rules, some of us are a little slow at updating. Any advice would be great.
EDIT: Removing points.
The lack of Exorcists is troubling...
Who is going to wreck all the DE transports turn 1 from range? because when they get close, it's almost a definite loss...
I'd recommend dropping the retributors and get a few points for an Exorcist. Also, why have a superior on the Seraphim? if they are with Celestine, the only reason you'd do that is to buy a Power Weapon. 1 extra S3 AP- attack is a little pointless :S
Same for the Inquisitor with Acolytes, what is their purpose really? I'd see a second Exorcist being much more useful, and the spare points could be useful. Dominion's Immolator has a Laud Hailer right? Dominion superior could take a combi-melta.
I would go for a simulacrum on the Rets if you want to keep them. Although I second Exorcists. Sup on Superior can suck up bad challenges. Not sure why to take the Acolytes though.
No Exorcists? I don't have any, and I'm trying to keep things simple.
The superior is there in case Celestine moves off on her own to bully some troops.
I'm trying to find points for the Simulacrum, but it's tricky. We've never played 1250 points before, it was a little random, and this is the truncated version of my 1500pts list, which is why it seems a little haphazard. That 250 points made more difference then I thought.
The Acolytes are there to provide some anti MEQ and light vehicle fire. Personal preference over anything.
Please, any suggestions. I'm kinda puzzled myself.
For those who don't know him, SabrX was one of my regular opponents who I used to play against a lot. However, he was gone for most of 6th Edition and hasn't even touched 7th yet. At least not until today. Well, now he's back and he is trying to get into tournament form for the Bay Area Open (BAO) in just 2 weeks without having even read the 7th Ed. rules! Now as his friend, I am going to help him get up to snuff with the 7E competitive scene by throwing some of my toughest armies against his. This is the 1st of 2 battles against his Sisters of Battle. This is also the debut of my new Daemons - the Seekerstar Daemons. Get ready for an entertaining and bloody battle coming up.
1850 Seekerstar Daemons (My list)
Fateweaver - Molten Beam + Forewarning, Life Leech + Shrouding Herald - Slaanesh, Lvl 2, Steed, Exalted Gift(Grimoire of True Names, Etherblade), Loci of Beguilement - Invisibility, Incursion Herald - Slaanesh, Lvl 2, Steed, Greater Gift (Greater Etherblade), Loci of Grace - Psychic Shriek, Sacrifice
Had that game today. Teams were Sisters and Dark Eldar vs pre heresy Iron Warriors and Tau. Turns out all of us were running meched up armies, gave us all a bit of a laugh.
The game ended a tie, 15 all, after some insane play that went back and forth for hours, with some hilarious moments. We tied with them by grabbing objectives, and killing all their troops.
Celestine was a bit of a let down, but my luck with her was insanely bad. 3 1's out of 4 bolted saves? Ugh.
The heavy bolter Retributors didn't kill much, but they ensured that everyone kept their heads were they couldn't be seen. Kept them off our side, prevented them scoring line breaker.
Sisters were the most intact army at the end of it. Those basic girl squads take a lot of fire power to shift, and tar pit nicely in CC.
Had an interesting little game on the weekend myself. It was a 2v1 with 1500 of my Sisters+Inquisition and 1500 of Clan Raukaan vs 3000 of Black Templars allied with Grey Knights.
My Inquisition allies did really well. I took the Ordo Malleus Inquisitor with his 3 Plasma Servitors inside a Chimera, and they cleaned up quite nicely. To be fair though, the enemy only had a single Land Raider for transport so pretty much all his army was exposed for plasma blasts.
I took a Canoness with Eviscerator/Inferno Pistol/Rosarius/Mantle alongside a 7 Woman Celestian squad with 2 Priests with Eviscerators/Litanies in a Rhino. It's the first time I've really used Celestians and they actually performed reasonably well. Despite the Canoness rolling a 1 everytime she went to shoot her pistol.... I wanted to blow the Land Raider up with a Pistol D:
Anyway, they had a combat with some Grey Knight Terminators all equipped with the Force Halberds... and utterly cleaned up. The Priests allowing re-rolls of saves meant the Canoness tanked the challenge no problem, majority WS4 from the Celestians meant he was only hitting me on 4s (though to be fair he did flub almost all his attack rolls from the Terminators) so only a few Celestians died, Celestians getting 3 attacks on the charge is pretty nice especially with Hatred and S4 on the Charge and come I1 the AP1 Eviscerator swings tore through the rest of the Termies. I know its hardly a proof of everything, but after all the naysaying about Celestians/Canoness' I was pretty happy with how they performed. I'm gonna try it out again.
Yeah. One of the guys actually had a pretty slick explanation for that, something like the Ordo Hereticus 'fed' information to the Dark Eldar (volunteers or did they simply have too many heretics in the cells? ) about a planet ripe for the picking, and then attacked in the confusion to ensure their target was taken out. Cause, you know, clearly the Iron Warriors and Tau were actually the heretics.
Yeah. One of the guys actually had a pretty slick explanation for that, something like the Ordo Hereticus 'fed' information to the Dark Eldar (volunteers or did they simply have too many heretics in the cells? ) about a planet ripe for the picking, and then attacked in the confusion to ensure their target was taken out. Cause, you know, clearly the Iron Warriors and Tau were actually the heretics.
You could also run (most) things as 'the Dark Eldar brought some toys with them), and the Sisters were slaves, their gear captured.
Battered and broken, given the chance to see the sky, avoid the pain, maybe embrace the sweet release of Death, the forces do as their masters command~
Or the DE were counts as Frateris Militia using civilian equipment to assist the valiant Sisters of Battle to defeat the villainous scum and Xeno trash threatening the Imperium.
So, going back to Tactics a bit more:
In my 1000pt game yesterday, i found myself struggling against a CSM Daemon Prince with the Torrent AP3 Flamer.
Flew around killing stuff until he decided to land for a charge, got the shooting phase and counter-charge of my blob on it (although only 10 left from the original 22) where the Priest accepted the challenge, died on the 1st wound, while the other 4 killed 3 more BSS. The surviving models and Canoness with Eviserator finished off the beast.
The Burning Brand is a tough ask to fight, especially if it's on a FMC. The best bet would be stay inside rhinos/immos, since the Burning Brand isn't doing jack to them then. It's a 300pt unit if it takes Psyker Lvl2, 250 without any Psyker levels, so it's a full 1/4 at least of the entire army.
If it wasn't a Psyker, then all it could really do against boxed up units while it's Swooping is Vector Strike, which is a pretty big waste of those points. Then all you do is wait until he drops to Gliding and waste him with Exorcist fire while he's standing around fiddling his thumbs until he can charge the next turn.
Problem was i took canoness and blob of 20 with priest, which was obviously prime target for him... He only killed about 4 a Turn, but it was still 4 a turn...
Focused fire on it turn 2, but he passed the 1 grounding test.(took 1 wound)
Dispatched him on turn 4 but a lot of damage was done... No Air force or Anti-air in the list at 1K, which i guess is the downfall.
Just wondering if there was any tactical advice against it when i'm playing an army (list) that is pretty much ideal for it.
250+
If there's any more wargear than Mark, Wings, Power Armour, Brand it'll be greater than 250.
And really, if it killed what... 10 BSS and a Priest? it only got 150-170pts worth of models for that and basic troops at that, so didn't really pull its weight at the end of the day.
But yeah, it's a LOT of points, it's a good chunk of your army (mine is a Psyker with the Black Mace and around 330 or something like that, so about 1/5th my army in standard games), I expect it to put out some serious hurt, or absorb a massive amount of punishment on behalf of my army.
Which means taking out key targets (fire support, elite troops, HQs), or at least its points in models, or eating the Anti-Armour / Elite fire of the enemy army for 2-3 turns.
And when I face one, I know to respect it, and focus fire it as soon as is convenient.
Honestly, I think the Black Mace is a bit better, though the Brand is still pretty damn nasty.
Well although it did not kill much, as you say, to make up its points, it did take up a full 2 turns of my entire 1000pts firepower to do 1 wound.....
As to Jacobus, it would not make a massive difference i don't think?
5++ and just killier in combat? I don't think it would help too much against the Daemon Prince, but a little....
Automatically Appended Next Post: Thanks for the advice though =)
If it's swooping around, and you don't have any AA, then I'd probably just ignore it. Really depends on what else the CSM had of course. But running a Blob certainly has huge weaknesses against AP3 Templates/Blasts, so I would almost write if off simply as a poor matchup. If you were boxed up in Rhinos/Immos you would have had a much better time, particularly with the nerfs to FMC and Smash.
Has anyone had success with the Storm Wing formation detachment with primary C.A.D. Sisters? It seems useful against Necron flyers and Nids Sky Blight.
I would consider the Avenger if it weren't for its AV10 sides and 2 HP. Mere bolters can glance it!
So I want to push my Sisters into Apocalypse forces by adding in some of the massive tanks and I hit on a thought. It could be fun to make the centerpiece(s) of the Apcoalypse force some of those troop-transporting Baneblade variants for my Sisters, though I'm not sure which one would be the best fit. Thoughts?
Personally, I'm leaning towards the Doomhammer variant.
Fluffwise I'd go for the stormlord, having a weapon part of the holy trinity and all. However, the hellhammer is really nasty, but unfortunately not a transport.
SabrX wrote: Has anyone had success with the Storm Wing formation detachment with primary C.A.D. Sisters? It seems useful against Necron flyers and Nids Sky Blight.
I would consider the Avenger if it weren't for its AV10 sides and 2 HP. Mere bolters can glance it!
Yes. It is expensive, but totally worth it. In 2000-3000 pt games, I run 2. 6 SM flyers are devastating at BS5 against ground targets.
GoonBandito wrote: If it's swooping around, and you don't have any AA, then I'd probably just ignore it. Really depends on what else the CSM had of course. But running a Blob certainly has huge weaknesses against AP3 Templates/Blasts, so I would almost write if off simply as a poor matchup. If you were boxed up in Rhinos/Immos you would have had a much better time, particularly with the nerfs to FMC and Smash.
The rest of the 1000pts was Helldrake
Kharn with 5 Berzekers in Rhino
5 Berzekers in Rhino
and 3 Spawns
Exorcist Dealt potshots at the Rhinos turn 1 so he disembarked and Bersekers just about made into combat Turn 6
Helldrake only appeared at turn 4
So my target priority was either Daemon Prince or Spawns.
In Hindsight, the Spawns were the threat, wreaking Exorcist, my 5-man Rhino and dealing more damage in combat with the blob than the Daemon Prince ever did.
Sinking 2 turns of shooting in the Prince for 1 wounds should have taken out the spawns and their 12" mvt instead...
Brother Michael wrote: Fluffwise I'd go for the stormlord, having a weapon part of the holy trinity and all. However, the hellhammer is really nasty, but unfortunately not a transport.
True, but that Doomhammer cannon is hard to deny in an army lacking in S9-10 weapons.
The mental image I'm getting of my Apoc force is that I have as many units in transports as possible, centered or backed by two super heavy transports. Ideally, if I get turn one, I advance with everything and fire, and when the opponent gets their turn, I use the blind barrage asset to force them forward or out of position (blow the asset close enough to my line that I can advance through it on my turn). Turn 2 hits and my armor pushes through the barrage just as all of my Seraphim and deep striking terminator allies hit at the same time. The idea is to get as many Sisters engaged in short range firefights as possible, as that is where they are best and also it reduces the risk of large large templates as I will be too close for them to be safely fired.
Hey there currently playing an escalation event at my local FLGS and we are on the final week at 1500pts the winner of this event will gain some kind of bonus for their army for the 1850 tournament coming up later. The points for the escalation is giving by wins,fully painted army,new army (since the last escalation event), WYSIWYG, and sportsmanship. So far unless i'm forgetting about a game I haven't lost once and as a sorta new player i feel very proud of myself representing the sisters so well. I was hoping for some help for the 1850 coming up to fine tune my list and get some advice on my current list. Unbound is allowed as well as LOW so my list focus for what sisters do best. MELTA MELTA MELTA.
HQ Saint Celestine (with the seraphim squad)
Uriah Jacobus, Protector of the Faith (my warlord with the first troop unit inside an immolator)
Depending on set up i'll have celestine and the seraphim with dante in reserve and deepstrike them in with no scatter as well as an extra inferno pistol and 2/4 body to protect the girls (sometimes I play hot potatoe between dante and celestine for who are getting the wounds shot at). They are my non-vehicle problem solving unit deep striking on a horde and mowing them down with 5 flamers or dumping a bucket of wounds on a unit hiding out o LOS or the enemy's warlord. The Sanguinary guard are another distraction unit although expensive I haven't fough to much that goes through their 2+ armor and I deepstrike them near any vehicles that do have it and blast them with 5 meltas. I'm loving the scatter only 1d6 and trying to get as much as possible out of it. If all goes according to plan giving them a tough choice on what to shoot at between the exorcist, SG, and the seraphim that are up in their face.The immolators i keep hiding while on the move if i can, if i go 2nd or move them out getting some shots off with their TLMM before they go down and I get my sisters into place keeping a careful eye on where jacobus and his unit are. Exorcist i for the most part have them castled up with the 3rd somewhere in the middle for ideal blanket fire and support for one of the other two.
The type of people at my local FLGS arn't WAAC but they aren't 100% fluff only players either. I feel like everyone is at a good mix and the army diversity is very large with almost every army being played by at least someone. Not many people run flyers either but some do there is an imp guard player with two flyers that i forgot the name of but can have 2 las cannons and can deploy. And there is a necron player with a doom scythe. And a tau player running a riptide and couple of other vehicles hammerheads i think?
I'd like to stay WYSIWYG as much as possible so aside from my list i posted here is what i have for my sisters (I don't have any more BA or any other marines/imp guard. I came to sisters from Necrons as my first army if someone wants a list of the necron stuff i have I'll post it here as well.)
1xHeavy flamer Battle sister
1xSister Superior W/ chain sword and plasma pistol
1x flamer Battle sister
2xMelta gun battle sisters
i also have an ADL w/quad gun, an Imperial knight and zero flyers for any army.
Tbh, sadly, I think I might offload my sisters. Whilst they're a self-contained force, I have (a) too much stuff and (b) no £$. So, I'll mention it here before swap shop as you guys have been so kind, and if interested just pm me for details.
Maybe personal preference, but i'd say Melta - Heavy Flamer rather than the other way around. Removes Heavy weapons restrictions while on the move (but not really relevant if in an Immo) and that turn when you DO jump out, you don't need to snap fire.
Also allows them to charge more easily with Jacobus (Don't forget all sisters have Bolt pistols). If that is ever considered...
Repressor already comes with a Heavy Flamer. I tend to field F/MM for static objective guards and dual meltas for aggressive objective takers. All BSS units taking Repressors.
BlackTalos wrote: So, finally got my list pretty much ready for the upcoming 2000pts escalation, could do with a bit of advice on organisation (force split up in 500 "bunches")
Game 2 - Add 500pts:
Jacobus
Rhino
Rhino
Immolator (MM, Laud H.)
Exorcist x 2
Game 3 - Add 510:
Priest (Power maul)
Priest
BSS 20 with Flamer, HF Rhino
Avenger
Game 4 - Add 500:
Canoness
Errant Knight
Canoness kinda needed for the Command squad. I'm thinking of dropping the 2 plasma Pistols for a Combi-Melta in the dominions, and get Litanies + Dozer blade with the spare.
Game 2 i might struggle against Flyers (and maybe more) but i'd have good mobility - we're playing Game 1: Vanguard, Game 2 Scourging objectives, Game 3urge the alien and Game 4: Relic
So, got an updated list as i fiddled things around, mainly due to Command Squad being illegal without Canoness, even crossing over games.
I decided i really needed the HB in game 1, and so decided that they'd go in as Retributors, dropping the Avenger (who could only play in game 3 - not earlier) as it seemed a bit week as a reinforcement for the 3rd game.
So:
Game 3 - Add 500:
Priest
BSS 5 with Melta, HF Rhino
BSS 5 with Flamer, HF Rhino
Exorcist (S.bolter)
Bastion (Icarus Las)
Game 4 - Add 505:
Celestine
Errant Knight
Game 1 seems solid, although i had a chat with an opponent and it seems like the match-up could be: 10 Necron warriors, 10 Necron warriors, 2 Destroyers, 5 Tomb blades
I just hope that the Dominions/HB get the destroyers before they get me with their AP3....
Game 2 mechanises the Dominions, and makes the blob the army strong point. Exorcist is nice and extra 5-girl squad for objectives.
Game 3 goes for MSU while keeping good firepower. Gives the Retributors a home.
Game 4, is well.... game 4. Celestine boosts the blob a bit more and the Knight will hopefully be of good use. Especially VS any 500pts or less super-heavy (probably other knights lol)
Question on priests: 1 with Jacobus and blob?
Or 2? If 2, why? so that Jacobus can smash and as backup? was thinking of having the 1 or 2 extra in the 5-girl BSS...
On a side note, I have a 1850 3 game tournament in Sept. BAO Style.
Here's my list if SW don't come out:
Uriah Jacobus
3 Priests (Litanies)
BSS (5) with Flamer/MM in Repressor
BSS (5) with Flamer/MM in Repressor
BSS (20) with HF/Melta/MB Dominions (5) with 4 Melta in TL-MM Dominions (5) with 3 Melta, Sim Imp in Repressor
Exorcist
Exorcist
Retributors (6) with 4 HB and Sim Imp
Bastion with Ammunition Dump, Void Shield
Coteaz
Xenos with Psychotroke, Liber, Rad, Servoskull
8 Henchmen with 1 Plasma, 3 Plasma Cannons
1850 on the nose.
Coteaz with the Servs on top of the Bastion. Rets inside. Ammo dump within 2 of the bastion and at least one exorcist.
Just had a really fun 1500pt game against a mixed AM/MT army. There were only two less fun things:
- My avenger strike fighter I just bought got destroyed first.
- I don't mean in-game. It literally fell off the table and broke one of the rear wings while the glue of the other rear wing and one of the front ones let loose :(
(also Celestine rolled 11 for her AoF but that doesn't really bother me as much )
Bay Area Open is tomorrow. I've settled on my AV13 spam list with Knight Paladin. That's 10 AV13 vehicles, 16 Meltaguns, 1 MM, and 3 Exorcists. I've only had 4 practice games with it. I won't mention results since I plan to write a couple battle reports, but overall, I'm very satisfied with my list works.
Tried the Canoness + Celestian + Priest retinue again today, this time in a 2v2 vs Tyranids and Chaos Space Marines with a Marine on my team. Again, they seemed to do alright. Charged a Carnifex and absolutely krumped it. Of course Carnifex's aren't super-great against Infantry in melee, but they're still a S9, T6 MC. S4 Celestians with 3 Attacks on the charge put a couple of wounds on, then the S7 Eviscerators swings cleaned it up. Then they ate a charge from The Swarmlord+Tyrant Guard and a Hive Tyrant. Despite the unit being roasted by the Chaos Lord's Burning Brand and a shot up by a squad of Plague Marines in the shooting phase which killed 5 Celestians, the Superior and the other Priest, the Canoness and a Priest with the Litanies faced down two of the biggest baddest MC that Nid's can throw at you... and held. Re-rolling To Hits from Hatred, and being S6 from the Eviscerators, the Priest and Canoness put some AP2 wounds on the Hive Tyrant and despite the 8 AP2 Wounds the Nids threw back, pass all of the re-rollable 4++.
Next combat saw 2 wounds get through my saves, popping the priest and putting a wound on the Canoness (she had the Mantle for Eternal Warrior). Flubbed all her attack rolls though. Still, she held and on our next turn a squad of Tactical Marines joined in to hand out some Krak Grenades. Hive Tyrant down to 1 wound, Tyrant Guard had eaten some wounds for the Swarmlord and a combination of poor attack rolling and the 4++ Rosarius meant the Canoness was still kicking. Unfortunately we ran out of time and had to end there, probably on the losing side of a drawn out combat since the Swarmlord was basically at full strength but I'm pretty sure we would have killed the Hive Tyrant at least.
I'm starting to like the Canoness + Celestian + Priest retinue. I mean it's not cheap - my loadout for the squad comes to about 420pts, which includes a Rhino, Canoness with Mantle/Rosarius/Inferno Pistol/Eviscerator, 2 Priests with Evicerators and 1 with the Litanies, 5 Celestians and a Superior. I don't have any Repentia or Death Cult Assassins, and to be fair most of the CC nastiness comes from the Priests and Canoness so you could probably replace the Celestians with Repentia or DCA and be just as, if not more, effective. But it definitely gives you CC options that you couldn't do with St. Celestine. For example, there's no way I'd be getting Celestine anywhere near a 'Nid or Demon Monstrous Creature since she'd be Insta Death'd. Plus Celestine being Jump Infantry makes it awkward to keep a retinue of Priests with her. But on the other hand a Canoness with an Eviscerator, Rosarius, Mantle and some Priests to back her up would let me at least feel like I have a reasonable chance of putting some pain on.
I'd give 1 or 2 the priests a power maul and save 15 pts, if not both. the eviscerators only give you str 6, and the maul gives you str 5 ap4, str 5 ap2 when you use smash at full attacks, or str 8 ap2 at 1 attack.
deviantduck wrote: I'd give 1 or 2 the priests a power maul and save 15 pts, if not both. the eviscerators only give you str 6, and the maul gives you str 5 ap4, str 5 ap2 when you use smash at full attacks, or str 8 ap2 at 1 attack.
Problem then is you then have to use a War Hymn to get Smash/AP2. The other two hymns are significantly better, mainly because they buff the entire unit whereas Smash only applies to the individual priest. Being able to reroll all those Celestian wounds is pretty nice, given they are doing 3 attacks on the charge, with Hatred, at WS4.
Uriah Jacobus
3 Priests (Litanies)
BSS (5) with Flamer/MM in Repressor
BSS (5) with Flamer/MM in Repressor
BSS (20) with HF/Melta/MB Dominions (5) with 4 Melta in TL-MM Dominions (5) with 3 Melta, Sim Imp in Repressor
Thought i put the question somewhere but as we're talking about it i'll go again:
In such a setup, how many priests (and jacobus) would you put in the 20 squad?
Jacob+1 for the 2 "important" acts, or Jacob+2 to get some smash?
So in the rumors section is says the itunes Ebook was updated today. Android for this guy. Anyone check the update yet? the blacklibrary epub version is the same as the one from june 13.
Question: is the Celestian AoF so good that the 5 of them are better than a command squad? If not, you could give your unit FNP and/or an extra attack each.
deviantduck wrote: So in the rumors section is says the itunes Ebook was updated today. Android for this guy. Anyone check the update yet? the blacklibrary epub version is the same as the one from june 13.
Uriah Jacobus
3 Priests (Litanies)
BSS (5) with Flamer/MM in Repressor
BSS (5) with Flamer/MM in Repressor
BSS (20) with HF/Melta/MB Dominions (5) with 4 Melta in TL-MM Dominions (5) with 3 Melta, Sim Imp in Repressor
Thought i put the question somewhere but as we're talking about it i'll go again:
In such a setup, how many priests (and jacobus) would you put in the 20 squad?
Jacob+1 for the 2 "important" acts, or Jacob+2 to get some smash?
thx
All the priests go in the 20. 2 for hymns, 2 for smash. Keep in mind you don't have to smash attack to get the ap2 with your normal attacks.
Exactly. You need 2 for reroll to wound, and reroll saves, and then the rest you give power mauls so they can use smash and hit at str 5 ap2 x4 attacks on the charge.
Mavnas wrote: Question: is the Celestian AoF so good that the 5 of them are better than a command squad? If not, you could give your unit FNP and/or an extra attack each.
Cost and FNP not being terribly effective on T3 models. If you drop the Sacred Banner it's about the same cost, but then you're missing out on an attack with the Hospitaller and you don't get to be S4 on the charge. FNP will help, but it will only really apply to attacks that you're probably going to get an Armour Save against anyway. AP1/AP2 and even alot of AP3 stuff tends to be S6+ anyway, so no FNP since you are being Insta Death from T3. Command Squad Act of Faith is also really really situational, to the point of uselessness, since Fleet and Move through Cover will only apply to the Charge Move. Crusader will only help if you win combat, the enemy fails morale, and you actually wanted to sweep them.
The only benefit I could see to a Command Squad is that any Celestian in the unit that's not carrying a banner or simulacrum can take a power weapon. 4 Power Axes and a Sacred Banner could be pretty sweet. 20 S4 AP2 swings on the charge from the Celestians with re-rolls to hit and wound from Priests might ruin someone's day.
The benefit i prefer with the command squad is the ability to take 5 meltas/flamers in the unit. So they are extremely effective when not in assautl, which is most of the time.
deviantduck wrote: The benefit i prefer with the command squad is the ability to take 5 meltas/flamers in the unit. So they are extremely effective when not in assautl, which is most of the time.
That is a point, however Dominions can do the same and get the benefit of far superior Act of Faith as well as the Scout rule.
Rending can be twice a game, and is the thing that makes heavy bolters versatile. Without it, they're a bit lackluster against heavily armored armies (Pretty much everything I've fought).
- Dominions do special weapons better than command. - Rets do Heavies better if you can afford the heavy slot. - Command squads have a Canoness tax which makes them MUCH more expensive than any other heavy squad unless you were already taking a canoness (and why would you unless you were looking for a cheap HQ)
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Mavnas wrote: Rending can be twice a game, and is the thing that makes heavy bolters versatile. Without it, they're a bit lackluster against heavily armored armies (Pretty much everything I've fought).
Also, keep in mind that Rets synergize very nicely with Bastions. I'm running Bastion with Void and Ammo Dump (external)
1-2 Extra heavy bolters, AV14 shell with Void, reroll all 1's on Rets and any other units within 2" of the ammo dump (generally exorcists). It's a nasty little firebase.
Bastion is a VERY good option for SOB. The emplaced HB can be manually fired by Retributors. Depending on where your opponent is, that's 1-2 extra heavy bolters with rending. If you put a quad-gun on top, you can also manually fire that. Muhahahah
I just have suspension of disbelief problems with "oh look, my army just happens to find a fortified structure of the exact same type within heavy bolter range of the enemy every time we fight."
SisterSydney wrote: I just have suspension of disbelief problems with "oh look, my army just happens to find a fortified structure of the exact same type within heavy bolter range of the enemy every time we fight."
No i also really agree on the "Airdrop" part of this.... Without any aerodynamics at all, just leap of faith for the bastion.
I'm sure the retributors are inside already when it drops
SisterSydney wrote: I just have suspension of disbelief problems with "oh look, my army just happens to find a fortified structure of the exact same type within heavy bolter range of the enemy every time we fight."
No i also really agree on the "Airdrop" part of this.... Without any aerodynamics at all, just leap of faith for the bastion.
I'm sure the retributors are inside already when it drops
Now to glue some retro-thrusters on mine....
Battles usually happen around things that are valuable. A fortified position is valuable. That's why mine is always next to an objective.
Mavnas wrote: So has anyone considered allying in the new SW flyers? One is an assault transport with a cap of 16. Both seem slightly cheaper than a Land Raider.
So counter-question, what does that give that a Land Raider Crusader doesn't?
More mobility the turn before the charge, harder to pop by some armies (easier for others), can do AA duties, but you lose the assault grenades that are helpful to DCAs.
also depending on the environment you play in, you might not be allowed to ally in both an inquisitor and SW (though without being able to auto-take Hammerhand...) We'd have to see the new rules for SWICs to see if this is a big loss.
SW's previous codex was known for having inexpensive Terminators that were 7 points cheaper than their SM counterparts. If the new codex retains that feature, SW would be an ideal ally for Sisters of Battle. Sisters lacks strong assault units and flyers.
Mavnas wrote: More mobility the turn before the charge, harder to pop by some armies (easier for others), can do AA duties, but you lose the assault grenades that are helpful to DCAs.
also depending on the environment you play in, you might not be allowed to ally in both an inquisitor and SW (though without being able to auto-take Hammerhand...) We'd have to see the new rules for SWICs to see if this is a big loss.
Problem with the flyer is the same as with the Land Raider: Getting into it.
To put any of your SoB squads inside, it would have to arrive first, probably in hover, and embark the troops. Then you fly across (or hover further) and then exit out from hover mode.
It just seems hard to do without dying on the way or something...
Whereas jumping into a LR you've deployed right behind of in Turn 1 just seems... simple.
Rumors seem to indicate that the answer to that question is yes. (They can be taken in a slot or a few of the units can take them as dedicated transports.) obviously, if they are dedicated transports their utility to SoB units would be minimal.
Playing around with some ideas for competitive lists, I liked this Knight-Immo spam list. It lacks AA, but with the TL Multimeltas on the Immos it isn't totally helpless. Since the Knights are the primary detachment they are super scoring along with the rest of the list.
3 Knight Paladins (Warlord) (1125)
Canoness (65)
5 Battle Sisters, 2 flamers, Immolator with TLMM and dozer blades
5 Battle Sisters, 2 flamers, Immolator with TLMM and dozer blades
5 Battle Sisters, 2 flamers, Immolator with TLMM and dozer blades
5 Battle Sisters, 2 flamers, Immolator with TLMM and dozer blades
5 Battle Sisters, 2 flamers, Immolator with TLMM and dozer blades
5 Battle Sisters, 2 flamers, Immolator with TLMM and dozer blades
(2000)
In all 15 super scoring units, plenty of anti-horde and anti-tank.
The question is: competitive TAAC, or does it lack too much?
I am making the Knights the Primary Detachment with one if the Knights being the Warlord.
I can swap two of my Sisters+Immolator for two Exorcists for the same points, would this make the list better?
That would make it 3 Knights, 2 Exorcists, 4 Immolators plus the girls. Better?
Since your Knights are all Paladins, i.e. ones with long-range guns, you might not actually need Exorcists -- and yes that seems like heresy i know i know don't burn me please don't burn me.
I'd agree with Petre: your best bet is to swap 2 or even 3 troop squads for Dominions to get Scouting, Ignores Cover melta goodness. That would mean less flamer power, so you might want to switch some of the Immolators from TLMM to TLHF to compensate -- probably 1-2 of the BSS Immos since by the time they get in range the Paladins and Dominions have hopefully murdered everything with high AV.
davidgr33n wrote: I am making the Knights the Primary Detachment with one if the Knights being the Warlord.
I can swap two of my Sisters+Immolator for two Exorcists for the same points, would this make the list better?
That would make it 3 Knights, 2 Exorcists, 4 Immolators plus the girls. Better?
Not sure you understood my point: Knights cannot get Objective Secured. I was pointing out that your statement of having 15 ObSec units was incorrect, as you only had 12 listed.
Can anyone tell me what the sisters of battle are? Are they like the female counterparts to the Astartes? But a battle-sister is not as good as a Space Marine!
I could see some Battle Conclaves. 9 + priest + drop pod is still under 200. Throw in enough 3++ in the mix to make shooting them hard. Now, you've either drawn a lot of fire or your opponent's given your deathcult assassins free reign. All without paying for a Land Raider.
Mavnas wrote: I could see some Battle Conclaves. 9 + priest + drop pod is still under 200. Throw in enough 3++ in the mix to make shooting them hard. Now, you've either drawn a lot of fire or your opponent's given your deathcult assassins free reign. All without paying for a Land Raider.
Meh. I like Retributors much better. A ton of rending flamer templates will take care of pretty much anything. Giving them a precision drop is just crazy good.
I feel like I've been neglecting my Rets. It looks like Heavy Flamers are the best weapon for them if they're in a vehicle (most likely a Repressor?), and if you just want them to sit somewhere, Heavy Bolters?
Hoitash wrote: I feel like I've been neglecting my Rets. It looks like Heavy Flamers are the best weapon for them if they're in a vehicle (most likely a Repressor?), and if you just want them to sit somewhere, Heavy Bolters?
Heavy Bolters are just the best weapons for Rets. Put them in a bastion with 2 extra girls and a Simulacrum and you're golden.
Heavy Flamers suffer from 'getting to the target' issues. No one in their right mind will allow them to get across the board no matter what you put them in (except a drop pod!).
Waaaaay too many flyers in my area to not take the quad gun. I stick jacobus in the bastion and the rets use his AoF first turn, then on turn two when flyers are on the board he runs up to the roof to chuck norris some birds. Leaving the rets in the bastion with 2 more AoF.
Which is in itself an interesting question: are Sisters better of firing from what little distance they can, or should they charge up and let the bolters rip, ah la fluff?
deviantduck wrote: Waaaaay too many flyers in my area to not take the quad gun. I stick jacobus in the bastion and the rets use his AoF first turn, then on turn two when flyers are on the board he runs up to the roof to chuck norris some birds. Leaving the rets in the bastion with 2 more AoF.
Two things. One, the quad isn't that big a help. Two, since Stronghold Assault, the bastion can fire the quad from inside.
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Hoitash wrote: Which is in itself an interesting question: are Sisters better of firing from what little distance they can, or should they charge up and let the bolters rip, ah la fluff?
In general, if you can't wipe it out, don't get close.
More specifically, she who bails, fails. I.e. Stay in your transport.
Hoitash wrote: I feel like I've been neglecting my Rets. It looks like Heavy Flamers are the best weapon for them if they're in a vehicle (most likely a Repressor?), and if you just want them to sit somewhere, Heavy Bolters?
Heavy Bolters are just the best weapons for Rets. Put them in a bastion with 2 extra girls and a Simulacrum and you're golden.
Heavy Flamers suffer from 'getting to the target' issues. No one in their right mind will allow them to get across the board no matter what you put them in (except a drop pod!).
While I have generally frowned upon flamers so far, I'd be curious to see 4 heavy flamers (with Rending!!) in action if I could deepstrike the unit in.
Personally, I think I'd take a Wolf Priest and stick him in the pod too. Try to get some witchfires on him since they can be fired at a different target from the main shooting attack. This could give a chance to soften up other big threats to the unit. Ideally, I'd like to drop some melta doms and have them survive to shoot again.
Voldrak wrote: Did I read this right as well? Spacewolves have access to drop pods in fast slot that are not dedicated transports?
I knew it, I fething knew it would come true after Trukks became fast attack in the ork codex but didn't want to say anything to jinx it. So I wonder how many opponents would want to play against an unbound Sisters drop pod list.
Pft. Forget unbound. I'm sure they'll eventually errata, or update, the other Marine codices to include drop pods as a fast attach choice. Even if they don't, if you don't mind breaking fluff, you just need to take two (or more) CADs. Since I'm unaware of any rule that says you have to have two HQs for Space pups in a CAD, you take the minimum 1 HQ, two small units of Grey Hunters (or Blood Claws if they're still troops), and then three drop pods.
Edit: For the record, I'm not dismissing your idea. A drop podding Sisters army, against the right opponent, is a terrifying thought. I'm just not willing to give up Objective Secured
I've been using Celestians recently, in Kill Team. Found them to be excellent. Can still take heavy/special, better stat line for leadership and better melee, and exchanging one essentially useless Act of Faith for another. They have been well worth the 10pts surcharge.
I think the biggest problem with using drop pods, outside of unbound, is that we need a double CAD rather then allies. Even with the 2nd CAD, we only have 3 pods. It seems to be a big investment for little. Even worse, there is the fluff thing. I can't really see Sisters hanging around with Space Wolves.
Farseer Anath'lan wrote: I've been using Celestians recently, in Kill Team. Found them to be excellent. Can still take heavy/special, better stat line for leadership and better melee, and exchanging one essentially useless Act of Faith for another. They have been well worth the 10pts surcharge.
I think the biggest problem with using drop pods, outside of unbound, is that we need a double CAD rather then allies. Even with the 2nd CAD, we only have 3 pods. It seems to be a big investment for little. Even worse, there is the fluff thing. I can't really see Sisters hanging around with Space Wolves.
Yeah. Although with double CAD, you can take both the space wolves troops in pods and bring yourself up to 5. I imagine when other marine chapters that have pods come out, theirs will also be non-dedicated and we'll have more options.
If your opponent's feeling accommodating, there's a homebrewed update of the old Sororitas-specific "Dominica Pattern Drop Pod" from Citadel Journal here.
(Not pimping my own stuff, for once, this is Clockwork Zion's).
lliu wrote: Does anyone even play sisters if battle anymore?
Unless you're trying to troll us, you must be missing the fact that you are posting in a 95 page thread discussion on how to play SOB and how they work.
I suggest taking a look at a couple pages of that before asking a silly question like that again.
How about allying in some IG, and then field a bunch of Sisters Repentia (or Melta Sisters) in a CRASSUS ARMOURED ASSAULT TRANSPORT?
Had to meme it up... but you could also churchify your CAAT and claim the IG is Frateris Militia.
That gets a lot of firepower into the grills of the enemy very quickly and reasonably safely.
If you want (house) rules rather than counts-as, I homebrewed up some Frateris militia and some Sororitas superheavies, including a Stormlord variant (the "Storm Queen") and a general template you can apply to "Sororitze" any IG superheavy.
P.S.: Ok, that was 50% back on topic and 50% relentless self-promotion. Being a narcissist is being than being a troll, right?
Anyone irked by the fact that the new Blood Claw from the new codex Space Wolves cost the same amount of points as a Battle Sister? Stat wise, a Blood Claw is WS3, BS3, S4, T4, W1, I4, A1, and LD8. A Battle Sisters is WS3, BS4, S3, T3, W1, I3, and LD8. Standard Equipment is similar except a Blood Claw trades a Chainsword. Is trading BS and Bolter for a boost in S, T, I, and additional attack in CC worth it?
SabrX wrote: Anyone irked by the fact that the new Blood Claw from the new codex Space Wolves cost the same amount of points as a Battle Sister? Stat wise, a Blood Claw is WS3, BS3, S4, T4, W1, I4, A1, and LD8. A Battle Sisters is WS3, BS4, S3, T3, W1, I3, and LD8. Standard Equipment is similar except a Blood Claw trades a Chainsword. Is trading BS and Bolter for a boost in S, T, I, and additional attack in CC worth it?
And preferred enemy faith, and a 6+ invul and cheaper access to fearless, and and and...
Yeah, blood claws are of questionable utility unless you spend more on transporting them in an assault transport or as part of a big drop pod force.
Sisters also have better access to melta guns 2 per 5. You can build a battle forged army where only 4 of your models don't shoot at AP1 or 2 (not that this is optimal).
Yeah, Shield of Faith plus Acts of Faith plus two special weapons per squad is at best equal to ATSKNF plus Chapter Tactics plus Combat Squads. Then the vanilla Tac Marine has +1 to WS, S, T, and I for a mere 17% cost increase (two points). And they have many more workable army builds. So, argh.
At least Celestine cuts through MEQ a lot better than anything most armies can field for 135 points. I think our real problem is not being able to spend 200+ points for someone more able to survive stray autocannon shots and bad rolls.
In one 750 point game she killed about 2/3rds of the enemy army solo (my poor attempt at an inquisition deathstar took out a Dreadnought before themselves being horribly murdered). The only reason that one didn't go better is that I tried to deep strike her in and mishapped (and I stopped deepstriking her in ever).
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, if we could take drop pods (I expect to see more armies get those as FA choices opening up our options), I think melta doms and heavy flamer rets are among the most effective units that could be put in them.
True. Four heavy flamers that Rend is brutal. Four meltaguns that Ignore Cover and Scout is really brutal. Either of them in a Drop Pod is ludicrously brutal.
Mavnas wrote: At least Celestine cuts through MEQ a lot better than anything most armies can field for 135 points. I think our real problem is not being able to spend 200+ points for someone more able to survive stray autocannon shots and bad rolls.
We can, with the caveat that it works in Close Combat Only. Consider a Canoness (Eviscerator, Bolt Pistol, Mantle, Rosarius) with 2 Priests (Las Pistol/Chainsword, 1 with the Litanies) vs a Space Marine Captain (Artificer Armour, Shield Eternal, Power Fist). Both have invulnerable saves, both have Eternal Warrior and both have high strength, low AP melee weapons. The Sisters cost 200pts, the Captain is 190.
If I've done my mathhammer right, then on the first round of combat the Sisters will cause just over 1 unsaved wound to the Captain, while the Captain will cause just over 0.4 unsaved wounds back. When Hatred stops working on the subsequent rounds, the Sisters will be doing 0.67 unsaved wounds. Not that mathhammer really means that much for any specific combat, since luck of the roll can easily have the results swing wildly one way or the other, but at least they're reasonably on par with each other.
Mavnas wrote: At least Celestine cuts through MEQ a lot better than anything most armies can field for 135 points. I think our real problem is not being able to spend 200+ points for someone more able to survive stray autocannon shots and bad rolls.
We can, with the caveat that it works in Close Combat Only. Consider a Canoness (Eviscerator, Bolt Pistol, Mantle, Rosarius) with 2 Priests (Las Pistol/Chainsword, 1 with the Litanies) vs a Space Marine Captain (Artificer Armour, Shield Eternal, Power Fist). Both have invulnerable saves, both have Eternal Warrior and both have high strength, low AP melee weapons. The Sisters cost 200pts, the Captain is 190.
If I've done my mathhammer right, then on the first round of combat the Sisters will cause just over 1 unsaved wound to the Captain, while the Captain will cause just over 0.4 unsaved wounds back. When Hatred stops working on the subsequent rounds, the Sisters will be doing 0.67 unsaved wounds. Not that mathhammer really means that much for any specific combat, since luck of the roll can easily have the results swing wildly one way or the other, but at least they're reasonably on par with each other.
Yeah, but that captain could have taken a bike and be a lot more mobile. Though, I suppose both those priests could have maces and make 6 more S5 AP2 attacks (I think smash is worth more than re-rolling to wound. The saves one is debatable.)
If the canoness could take a jump pack at least, you'd see her used more. Right now most lists seem to use Celestine or Uriah Jacobus.
We have arguably the best banner (since it buffs all friendlies to have +1 attack) but it's not enough to see use.
I've been doing some more thoughts on the oft neglected Penitent Engine now that I finally found a model that I can use for them that is not ugly to me (what I'm thinking of using are slight converted http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Images/Product/DefaultFW/xlarge/castellaxmm-4.jpg ). But I've been thinking, with harder to kill vehicles and the resurgence in dreadnought CCWs as the king of S10 melee, I think PEs in a squadron could be pretty nasty, as their harder to kill nature plus their numbers means it would be difficult to pop all three in one go.
curran12 wrote: I've been doing some more thoughts on the oft neglected Penitent Engine now that I finally found a model that I can use for them that is not ugly to me (what I'm thinking of using are slight converted http://www.forgeworld.co.uk/Images/Product/DefaultFW/xlarge/castellaxmm-4.jpg ). But I've been thinking, with harder to kill vehicles and the resurgence in dreadnought CCWs as the king of S10 melee, I think PEs in a squadron could be pretty nasty, as their harder to kill nature plus their numbers means it would be difficult to pop all three in one go.
I love the models, have so many and want to field them but...
I think to make them work, they'd need to be very central to the list. Like you'd need at least...6 or so spread over 3 units. Horde walkers, so to speak.
curran12 wrote: I think to make them work, they'd need to be very central to the list. Like you'd need at least...6 or so spread over 3 units. Horde walkers, so to speak.
Even so, that's a ton of points for little bang. That's always been my problem. They suck up heavy slots and cost a lot.
Yeah, that is the unfortunate case. I might try them out. As I said before, what was holding me back was the models, but I think converting some of those Mecahanicum things would work out okay for me.
Trying to find out if the rules have changed from the 5th edition grey knight codex or if its just another one of those copy/paste job they are selling for $20.
AdeptSister wrote: Quick question: How do you update your epub Codex? I heard there have been some minor changes since it was first released. Thank you for your help.
In 7th edition, Warlord can be anyone in primary detachment as long as it's a character. Any thoughts on making a Veteran Sister Superior, Sister Superior, or a cheapo priest the Warlord and have them hunker down inside a Bastion or some AV14 shell far away from enemy models?
SabrX wrote: In 7th edition, Warlord can be anyone in primary detachment as long as it's a character. Any thoughts on making a Veteran Sister Superior, Sister Superior, or a cheapo priest the Warlord and have them hunker down inside a Bastion or some AV14 shell far away from enemy models?
It'd make you miss out on Jakobus' or Celestine's warlord trait though... Of course, if you don't include either, it might be worth it, but I definitely suggest including one of them or both.
Played my first game with Sisters of Battle on Saturday. It was a 1000 point game against Orks. I got back into 40k in May this year after over a decade away (left when 3rd ed came out), so still getting used to all the micro-rules.
The Orks went first and through luck of the card draw claimed 4 victory points off the bat. It was a position I never recovered from and my decision to play for the tabling paid off in turn 5.
++Exorcists++
I wasn't too sure how well these would play. Stats on the page and general Internet comments (without testing) aren't always true on the battlefield. I'm happy to say that the Exorcists proved vital. The AP1 missiles are the key - an Exorcist cleaned out the Warlord whose 2+ rerollable save (through lucky sticks) was my final barrier to victory. I learnt to pick my targets well - anything that can jink greatly reduces it's effectiveness.
++Celestine and Seraphins++
Template-a-rama. The overwatch these women can put off via wall of death is pretty terrifying and is enough to stop some charges in their tracks. In my first turn I moved them forward 12", roasting an open topped vehicle with 5 template hits and killing half the Orks within, then assaulted and wrecked the vehicle itself. Hit'n'Run got me back enough to make the player consider what to do in retaliation.
Half way through the game I then split Celestine (2+ save makes a big difference) away from the squad so the Seraphins would sacrifice themselves by holding down a mob of 20 Orks from getting to the vehicles. The 6+ invulnerable save worked a treat against rockets; must remember they can re-roll it too.
++Immolator + Dominions++
Due to poor reserve rolling this squad came on in turn 4. The player was hiding a 'Kopter at their back end behind los blocking terrain to ensure I didn't win via tabling. So I brought these on via outflank, drove behind it, meltas hopped out, passed their ignore cover ability and blasted it at point blank range (no jink thanks to that ability).
++Battle Sisters and Represor++
The AV13 front armour of the Repressor is worth the points. It removes the Rhino being an easy target to pop with high powered weaponry. Plus the 6+ invulnerable actually kept one on the board a turn longer. The heavy flamer is a further deterrent to squads getting too close. The two basic squads with melta/heavy flamer combos did well. The preferred enemy ability helped out in two key shooting phases - rerolling to wound on a heavy flamer against troops is nasty.
What Sisters aren't good at is combat; they got slaughter when the Orks got close through sheer volume. Which is fine - it's what I expected.
​Overall, I'm impressed with how well they performed in my first game with them. The Repressor front AV stops them being an easier target in the first turn, and the included dozer blade and smoke gives them move through ruins + cover against long range weaponry.
The gun-slinging hand flamers are very cool; both in action, model and narrative.
If you want Close Combat sisters, get a Celestian Squad and attach two Ministorum Priests, taking The Litanies of the Faith (it's a relic) on one of the Priests to auto-pass the War Hymn/Act of Faith tests for the Unit.
Now your Celestians are:
S4 on the charge due to their Furious Charge Act of Faith
WS4, with 2 Attacks Base
re-rolling To Hits in the first round of combat due to Hatred from the Priests
effectively fearless due to Zealot from the Priests
re-rolling failed armour and invulnerable saving throws from one Priest's War Hymn
re-rolling Wounds from the other Priest's War Hymn.
The Priests themselves each have 2 attacks base plus an additional attack for 2 weapons (laspistol/chainsword), as well as carrying Rosarius's for 4+ Invulnerable saves. They're only WS3 though.
A Unit of 5 Celestians and two Priests with the Litanies is 125pts. If you charge a mob of 19 Slugga Boyz with a PK/BP Nob (160pts), they will statistically deal just shy of 10 unsaved wounds on the charge at I3 (I'm ignoring Overwatch btw). The Nob will actually statistically deal less than 1 unsaved wound back to the Celestian Superior in the challenge (and even less if you want to risk a Priest in the challenge on his 4+ Invuln), and the remaining boyz left alive at I2 will also deal just under 1 unsaved wound. Things go worse for the Sisters on subsequent rounds because they drop back to S3 and lose Hatred, but odds are definitely on your side to win combat in the first round and potentially cause a crippling Mob Rule check - especially if the Nob goes splat. Hilariously, even if the Celestians get charged by the full 20 Boy squad they will still statistically win combat but only just (again ignoring Overwatch casualties).
Priests go a long way to making up for the Sisters shortcomings in close combat - re-rollable 3+ saves are insane (watch the feth out for AP3 or better though, since you only have a re-rollable 6+ then... which is still better than a Marine though lol). And S3 isn't so bad when you can re-roll Wounds.
Can Priests go in normal battle sister units?
I have contemplated adding them when I step up to 1250 points. It's whether I use the points to make my current squads less paper-like in combat or use it to get more troops. Buff against assault or except the risk. It's a strategy choice I'll play around with. Will probably get an Avenger Strike Fighter on the step from 1000 to 1250 (love the model).
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Josey4u wrote: I'm so ready to start an army of these. I got the E based codex, but its just not the same being able to read and flip through pages.
I heard new models were coming (fall?).
You guys take a priest with your cannoness normally? What does the command squad typically look like?
How about armor options. It doesn't look like anythign other than an immolater
The FW Repressor is an armoured up Rhino. Sisters only. Immolator is a must for the Dominions due to Scout and melta frenzy. No new models for a while...GW keep hinting but don't hold any hope for a good while yet.
SabrX wrote: In 7th edition, Warlord can be anyone in primary detachment as long as it's a character. Any thoughts on making a Veteran Sister Superior, Sister Superior, or a cheapo priest the Warlord and have them hunker down inside a Bastion or some AV14 shell far away from enemy models?
It'd make you miss out on Jakobus' or Celestine's warlord trait though... Of course, if you don't include either, it might be worth it, but I definitely suggest including one of them or both.
Can Priests go in normal battle sister units?
I have contemplated adding them when I step up to 1250 points. It's whether I use the points to make my current squads less paper-like in combat or use it to get more troops. Buff against assault or except the risk. It's a strategy choice I'll play around with. Will probably get an Avenger Strike Fighter on the step from 1000 to 1250 (love the model).
It's generally not worth it unless it's a BIG unit.
The other thing to consider is adding a priest with a power mace to that Celestian unit, with litanies guaranteeing that War hymns will go off, he can get 4 S6AP2 attacks at initiative on the charge. I would risk that guy in a challenge against some enemy 1W char that's swinging at I1, since wth rerollable hits and wounds you're looking at 2 wounds on average against a guy that probably has no invuln.
lliu wrote: Does anyone even play sisters if battle anymore?
Unless you're trying to troll us, you must be missing the fact that you are posting in a 95 page thread discussion on how to play SOB and how they work.
I suggest taking a look at a couple pages of that before asking a silly question like that again.
lliu wrote: Still, I've played hundreds of battles, but none against the sisters of battle. Does anyone still play them?
I don't understand what you are getting at. This thread is dedicated to SoB tactics and its very existence shows people still plays them. Someone already answered your question and yet you make the same assertion. You just took your local meta, made a generalization, and asserts no one plays them for lack of games against them. The world is a big place. Sisters aren't popular due to their high cost barrier to entry, but people still play them.
But hey, if you want to help boost SoB popularity, then purchase a few models, build an army, and use them in a few games. Show your local meta what these girls are made of.
In a 2 CAD, 2 sources maximum army this was pretty strong... Did some heavy work... and was decently fun to play. (2k points)
HQ Uriah 100
HQ 2 priests with power mauls, one with litanies and an evisorator priest 150
Troop 20 sisters 240
Troop 20 sisters 240
Fast 5 seraphim with 2 hand flamers on 2 models 95
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
Heavy exorcist 125
FORT bastion with quad gun 125
HQ Ironhands chaptermaster on bike with artificer armor, fist, and shield eternal 245
Troop 5 scouts with bolters, camo cloaks 65
Troop 5 scouts with bolters, sargent with combi melta 65
Heavy Thunderfire cannon 100
Heavy Thunderfire cannon 100
Heavy Thunderfire cannon 100
The addition of thunderfire cannons gives the sisters some long range barrage... which seems to do very well... lets be honest.. that chapter master in a blob gives them more killing power and late game objective contesting/threat which they lack
That's a neat list. What was the bastion for though? And no specials for the SOB squads?
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Josey4u wrote: Just getting into them, so it was mentioned on using the immolater for repentia. Is the immolater and assault vehicle? As in special rule type
I updated my codex and it still states that a character can only have one relic. I thought that this changed (or did I just misunderstand)? I was hoping I could have an EW Canoness carry the Litanies. Oh well.
Does anyone run Inferno pistol Seraphim? The 7th edition vehicle changes makes me question their worth (Due to AP 2).
Agreeing with pretre here. The problem with their AoF, Seraphim are really good anti-infantry, and the IP kinda pulls them in a direction they don't really get a lot out of.
I might try them in, say, apocalypse games where I could use assets for accurate deep strikes, but that's about it.
I run triple Exorcists and triple mech Dominions with 4 Meltaguns each. No problems whatsoever against MC unless they are flying or have invisibility on them.
SabrX wrote: I run triple Exorcists and triple mech Dominions with 4 Meltaguns each. No problems whatsoever against MC unless they are flying or have invisibility on them.
Yep. MC's get sad when they see SOB. Or they should.
If you got MC problems, I feel bad for you son. I got 99 problems and a Riptide ain't one.
I ran IP for awhile, but they were seldom effective. Their range is just so short and everytime I did manage to land them within. 3" of an enemy vehicle, it just exploded in my face and cost me 1-2 seraphim (which is a bad trade if the vehicle was a rhino).
While not so much a tactical thing, I do need to give one of my Immolator and the Doms inside a gold star. This weekend, they tank shock in from outflank onto 20 enhanced Necron Warriors, who bolt off the board and the Doms nuke Czeras.
curran12 wrote: While not so much a tactical thing, I do need to give one of my Immolator and the Doms inside a gold star. This weekend, they tank shock in from outflank onto 20 enhanced Necron Warriors, who bolt off the board and the Doms nuke Czeras.
Mavnas wrote: How does a unit that starts off the board give up first blood? Shouldn't they be sweeping in, blow up some enemy vehicle and claim first blood?
What?
Doms do one of two things: 1) Scout up and nuke something. 2) Outflank and nuke something.
This changes depending on whether you get first turn or not. If you put them on the board, scout them forward and you don't get first turn, you're going to lose them.
I prefer to outflank my doms. I find that the psychology of "my big stuff feels safe in the corner" or "I am safer flanking than going down the middle" plays well into outflanking Doms. The only person in my meta who has really beat this is a Nid player who devotes tons to centering and protecting his venomthropes.
curran12 wrote: I prefer to outflank my doms. I find that the psychology of "my big stuff feels safe in the corner" or "I am safer flanking than going down the middle" plays well into outflanking Doms. The only person in my meta who has really beat this is a Nid player who devotes tons to centering and protecting his venomthropes.
Really? I find the turn 1 alpha strike is well worth having them on the board (if you go first, of course). You can just eliminate a good chunk of your opponents army.
I think that becomes a matter of playstyle, then. I generally try not to rely on alpha strike ability, as you said it relies on you getting the first turn or stealing. My larger battle plans usually involve me baiting and drawing out the strikes with units that can soak up damage and not give up first blood (my usual 2k list puts 3 20-woman strong squads on the table with 2 exorcists with 2 Doms and Seraphim in reserve). They can take firepower and draw the enemy forward and then, come turn 2-3, the reserves hit and I usually can partially encircle the dangerous parts of the opponent and destroy them.
Of course. I didn't mean to give that impression. More that I've come to like a counterattack mindset.
I think this is mostly a result of my meta, which tends to have more aggressive players. Combine that with the general sense of underestimating Sisters and I've found that most opponents (barring Guard and the more static Tau forces) are eager to get in and engage, thinking Sisters easy prey. I like capitalizing on that.
curran12 wrote: Combine that with the general sense of underestimating Sisters
I like it when they perk up, after you've revealed you're T3 and they get all excited. Mind you, this is when they're shooting at you with things like Plasma or Autocannons which would be wounding Marines on 2's anyway... Then they automatically assume their AP3/2/1 weapons straight up kill your models. It's always fun to tell them to "hold the fk up - 6+ Invuln suckers". And then roll all 1s, but whatever lol.
curran12 wrote: Combine that with the general sense of underestimating Sisters
I like it when they perk up, after you've revealed you're T3 and they get all excited. Mind you, this is when they're shooting at you with things like Plasma or Autocannons which would be wounding Marines on 2's anyway... Then they automatically assume their AP3/2/1 weapons straight up kill your models. It's always fun to tell them to "hold the fk up - 6+ Invuln suckers". And then roll all 1s, but whatever lol.
There's nothing quite like it when you make that invul on one of your vehicles. The look on your opponents face: priceless.
I'd like to praise the only exorcist tank I own: its weapon got destroyed first turn, yet it survived till the end of the game ramming an armoured sentinel to scrap in the process
I've only played one game with my Sisters (last Saturday); however, I often play against Tau and IG so low AV is a no go regardless of army. This made me go straight in for Repressors over Rhinos. More expensive but they get front AV13, Heavy Flamer, Storm Bolter, smoke and a dozer blade (plus the usual 6+ invul). That front AV increase made a big difference.
I also just spent £130 to get up to 1000 points of Sisters (was half real, half proxy on Saturday). They're not cheap when running a lot of vehicles.
As for the weapon destroyed - I added Storm Bolters to both my Exorcists to give them a 50/50 chance of not losing the main weapon.
curran12 wrote: Combine that with the general sense of underestimating Sisters
I like it when they perk up, after you've revealed you're T3 and they get all excited. Mind you, this is when they're shooting at you with things like Plasma or Autocannons which would be wounding Marines on 2's anyway... Then they automatically assume their AP3/2/1 weapons straight up kill your models. It's always fun to tell them to "hold the fk up - 6+ Invuln suckers". And then roll all 1s, but whatever lol.
There's nothing quite like it when you make that invul on one of your vehicles. The look on your opponents face: priceless.
It's even better when they only keep 1 spare Las Cannon to get your rhino, and 2 turns in a row it gets 6s and then the unit inside kills said lascannon.
pretre wrote: That's a neat list. What was the bastion for though? And no specials for the SOB squads?
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Josey4u wrote: Just getting into them, so it was mentioned on using the immolater for repentia. Is the immolater and assault vehicle? As in special rule type
SOB don't have any assault vehicles.
But you can easily ally in a Land Raider Crusader via 1 Inquisitor and Warband(ranged).
Deploy the Dedicated Transport on it's own and embark on turn 1. Multiple ways of doing so, and unless you went second, you would not charge turn 1 anyway....
ShaneTB wrote: I've only played one game with my Sisters (last Saturday); however, I often play against Tau and IG so low AV is a no go regardless of army. This made me go straight in for Repressors over Rhinos. More expensive but they get front AV13, Heavy Flamer, Storm Bolter, smoke and a dozer blade (plus the usual 6+ invul). That front AV increase made a big difference.
I also just spent £130 to get up to 1000 points of Sisters (was half real, half proxy on Saturday). They're not cheap when running a lot of vehicles.
As for the weapon destroyed - I added Storm Bolters to both my Exorcists to give them a 50/50 chance of not losing the main weapon.
Totally agree on repressors. They are a great unit for SOB.
Totally disagree for Storm Bolters. But we've had that discussion maaaany times in this thread.
3x squads of 5 with 2 flamers and the Superior has a combi and melta bombs in rhino's
Squad of domms in a immo with a TLMM
Full squad of seraphim with hand flamers the Superior has melta bombs
2 exo's with storm bolters
Looking at semi competitive take all list. I knows there will be lots horde armies (orks and tyranids)
I was thinking the bss stay in their rhino burning things out of the fire points. Celestine hangs out with the seraphim causing trouble. Domms do their thing and the exo's form a fire base.
pretre wrote: That's a neat list. What was the bastion for though? And no specials for the SOB squads?
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Josey4u wrote: Just getting into them, so it was mentioned on using the immolater for repentia. Is the immolater and assault vehicle? As in special rule type
SOB don't have any assault vehicles.
But you can easily ally in a Land Raider Crusader via 1 Inquisitor and Warband(ranged).
Deploy the Dedicated Transport on it's own and embark on turn 1. Multiple ways of doing so, and unless you went second, you would not charge turn 1 anyway....
IIRC in seventh you can start embarked on allied transports.
The problem is not starting inside an allied transport, but about starting inside a dedicated transport.
The only unit that can start inside a dedicated transport is the unit that purchased it and codex inquisition cannot buy land raiders other than through a dedicated transport.
I find I rarely have the opportunity to get close enough to flame something flammable without dying/getting un-rhino'ed first.
I usually want more melta because my local meta is vehicle/MC-heavy and I play a lot of marines with their pesky 3+ save.
The change is that wounds are only pooled by weapon type and can only be allocated to models in range of said weapon. Also flamers are not heavy flamers so one will remove targets before the other can place its template.
Personally I prefer the superior range and AP of melta gun. I tend to have heavy bolter rets to help keep hordes in check, but they're just not that popular in my local meta. Aside from a few SM scouts, I've faced nothing with a save worse than 3+ in my last five games.
Pretty much. Ideally, from what I can tell, you want to use your shortest range weapons first and work your way up since casualties must also be removed from closest models first. Something like:
Inferno pistols
Flamers
Heavy Flamers
Salvo with max range <=12"
Assault with max range <=12"
Multi-shot Heavy with max range <=12"
Double-firing rapid fire weapon <=12"
Single-shot Heavy with max range <=12"
Pistols
Salvo with max range 12-24"
Assault with max range 12-24"
Multi-shot Heavy with max range 12-24"
Double-firing rapid fire weapons <15"
Single-firing rapid fire weapons to max range
Single-shot Heavy with max range 12-24"
Salvo with max range range > 24"
Assault with max range > 24"
Heavy with max range > 24" - multi-shot before single shot
Considering a small Space Wolves force since I got the Sanctus Reach box. I've picked up the codex and am thinking a Wolf Lord to join my Priest buffed blob squad.
Now, I feel a little cheesy for suggesting this but let me know your thoughts. The Wolfen Stone rules state "the bear and his unit, have the furious charge special rule..." note and his unit, not a thing about needing to be in the SW faction. So furious charging blob squad by RAW, right? I do feel dirty as the fluff blurb clearly suggests it only affects SW.
Also, there's nothing stopping a Wolf Lord joining an infantry unit if he has a thunder wolf, right?
Mavnas wrote: The change is that wounds are only pooled by weapon type and can only be allocated to models in range of said weapon. Also flamers are not heavy flamers so one will remove targets before the other can place its template.
Personally I prefer the superior range and AP of melta gun. I tend to have heavy bolter rets to help keep hordes in check, but they're just not that popular in my local meta. Aside from a few SM scouts, I've faced nothing with a save worse than 3+ in my last five games.
Doesn't the template section specify that they all get shot at the same time?
Mavnas wrote: The change is that wounds are only pooled by weapon type and can only be allocated to models in range of said weapon. Also flamers are not heavy flamers so one will remove targets before the other can place its template.
Personally I prefer the superior range and AP of melta gun. I tend to have heavy bolter rets to help keep hordes in check, but they're just not that popular in my local meta. Aside from a few SM scouts, I've faced nothing with a save worse than 3+ in my last five games.
Doesn't the template section specify that they all get shot at the same time?
All the templates of the same weapon, so 4 flamers don't interfere with each other. I think there was a long YMDC thread on this.
2x 10 girl squads with combi flamer, flamer and heavy flamer in rhinos
10 girl Seraphim squad with hand flamers.
Min domm squad with 4 meltas in a immo.
Exo with storm bolter.
My opponent used a Sentinels of Terra drop pod army with
Lysander
Sternguard squad 6 guys with 2x meltas and 2x combi meltas
2 full tac squads with melta gun and combi melta on the sergeant
Iron clad with 2x Heavy Flamers
Marine Turn 1
He got the first turn and and the Sterguard with Lysander and one Tac squad came in with no scatter. He killed a bunch of Seraphim and poor Celestine got insta gibbed One of my rhino's blew up and managed to cause a wound on Lysander But my Superior bought it in the explosion as well.
Sisters Turn 1
Celestine gets back up and she and her squad moves towards a objective and out of los. My immo fires a hefty 6 missiles but due to poor rolling only a single guy in the tac squad bites it. My rhino drive up and I unleash my HF and flamer but fail to kill anything. The BSS squad that had their transport blown up pop their faith hose the Sternguard with their flamer weapons fail to cause any wounds. The the bolter girls opened fire they killed the whole sternguard squad That was the only time my dice liked me though lol.
Marine Turn 2
Ironclad and his second Tac squad comes in with only the Tac squad pod scattering. They shoot Celestine and the reaming Seraphim killing all of the Seraphim. Iron clad kills a bunch of girls that killed the sternguard squad with his HF causing them to fall back. The other Tac squad kills my Exo with melta fire and Lysander blows up my second rhino with his hammer.
Sisters Turn 2
The BSS falling back rallies and shoots the Tac squad without much effect. The BSS that had their rhino blown up shoot Lysander and the Tac squad with the combi flamer, flamer and HF scoring like 15 hits once everything was said and done. Only 2 Marines were left alive. Immo comes on from reverses and fires everything it's got at the wall of drop pods in my DZ but only shake one and strip 2 HP off another. Celestine flames the Tac squad hitting all 10 guys! But fails to cause a single wound I am only 5" from the Tac squad and I roll for my charge range eating overwatch and suffering a wound I then reroll my charge distance because I didn't use her jump pack to move and roll 3"
Marine Turn 3
Lysander kills all of the BSS squad from the rhino he destroyed last turn. The Ironclad kills the other BSS that had rallied. The Tac squad kills Celestine. Storm Bolter fire from all of the pods kill a a melta domm.
Sisters Turn 3
I try to kill 2 pods but fail to roll anything above a 2 for my damage roll. Even with the AP 1 bonus I never rolled higher then a stun the whole game.
Marine Turn 4
He cleans up my immo and the few reaming melta guns.
Still had a great time playing though. I'm a pretty laid back causal player and so was he so it was a really relaxed game.
So in the Codex, it doesn't list the Eviscerator as Unwieldy, but it is in the BRB. Do we luck out and get a non-unwieldy variant or is this an oversight?
Shandara wrote: I find I rarely have the opportunity to get close enough to flame something flammable without dying/getting un-rhino'ed first.
I usually want more melta because my local meta is vehicle/MC-heavy and I play a lot of marines with their pesky 3+ save.
I'd agree that it's meta-based.
I'm still immensely happy with my flamer/Heavy Flamer combo frying up Necrons Orks and Guard. It's also a weapon that is more than useful on the blob in overwatch, something that happens quite often.
Wall of Fire rule has no range, so they can happily sit mid-unit waiting for it, moving forward only on your turn if you decide you're doing the charging.
Same on the MSU in Rhino: Drive up to target and flame. They usually then try to charge the rhino (duh you're 1" away from them - if you didn't tank shock too, because i'd suggest that too) and get hit again by the 2D3 of attacks. Usually stripping 1-2 HP afterwards, but they're toast (including Pun).
Templar_Grist wrote: So in the Codex, it doesn't list the Eviscerator as Unwieldy, but it is in the BRB. Do we luck out and get a non-unwieldy variant or is this an oversight?
Under the melee weapon section is says to look in the main rulebook for full rules on those weapons and this includes the Eviscerator.
I have found myself using less and less flamers. My meta is not very friendly to them so I rarely get to use them. My last game against the new spacewolves I had 4 heavy flamers accross 4 basic sister squads and only ever got to shoot one in overwatch. Rest of them were basically useless.
Otherwise I regularly face Tau farsight gunlines, necron flyers wings, daemons or space marines with knight titans. My flamers rarely get in range of anything before dying.
It's been really hard to get a decent TAC list done that can deal with all these various threats
I did cause a Salamanders Chapter unit of Tac Marines to break and flee from my Celestine+Seraphim the other week. Piled on something like 27 wounds because of Shred with Celestine's Heavy Flamer, the 2 Seraphim with dual hand flamers and the other Seraphim with Bolt Pistols, and caused 3 casualties. And then they failed their morale and run. Was pretty hilarious.
GoonBandito wrote: I did cause a Salamanders Chapter unit of Tac Marines to break and flee from my Celestine+Seraphim the other week. Piled on something like 27 wounds because of Shred with Celestine's Heavy Flamer, the 2 Seraphim with dual hand flamers and the other Seraphim with Bolt Pistols, and caused 3 casualties. And then they failed their morale and run. Was pretty hilarious.
I've had Celestine hit squads of bikers kill 2 with her flamer the fail the 4" charge she needed to make.
So the new Grey Knights codex is leaked, and there's an interesting change to Psyk-Out Grenades. They can now also be thrown in the shooting phase as 8", S2, AP-, Assault1, Blast, Psi-Shock.
Psi-Shock: Any unit that contains a Psyker, Brotherhood of Pysker or Psychic Pilot model is hit by a weapon with this rule, a randomly selected Psyker Model in that unit suffers Perils of the Warp.
Now that may sound familiar, because that was basically the original wording of the Condemnor Boltgun's Psi-Shock rule. So Sisters and Inquisition get the nerfed Psi-Shock rule (where you need to cause a Wound on a Psyker) and now Grey Knights get the original awesome rule (where you just have to hit a unit containing a Psyker).
Too much to hope that GW will update the Sisters and Inquisition codex's to match the new Psyk-Out Grenade and Psi-Shock rules?
I used the same list as before and my opponent had 2 bike squads with a biker captain and 2 devastator squads using IF chapter tactics.
This time my dice cooperated with me and I won. I even had 2 melta domms alive at the end of the game. The best moment was killing his biker captain with over watch wall of fire
I felt like i played smart and was rewarded with the win.
I only pay with fully painted armies and because sisters are so rare everybody came over and had a look at my army even though it's just tabletop standard.
I used the same list as before and my opponent had 2 bike squads with a biker captain and 2 devastator squads using IF chapter tactics.
This time my dice cooperated with me and I won. I even had 2 melta domms alive at the end of the game. The best moment was killing his biker captain with over watch wall of fire
I felt like i played smart and was rewarded with the win.
I only pay with fully painted armies and because sisters are so rare everybody came over and had a look at my army even though it's just tabletop standard.
Excellent to hear!
As to the last part, I completely agree. I only go out of the house with fully painted armies (I play in my garage with the work in progress though). It is just so much nicer!
Played another game today same list as the last 2 games.
Played a Crimson Fist army using IF CT.
His army was:
Librarian
5 man Tac squad Drop Pod (combat squaded)
Storm Raven
Venerable Dreadnaught
5 man sniper scouts with a heavy bolter
5 man Tac squad with grav gun and a lascannon in rhino.
10 man assault squad with flamers.
I won again but only because I was super lucky. His Storm Raven came in on turn 2 and opened fire on my Exo. Even with the 2D6 on the multi melta he failed to scratch my Exo. I returned fire in my turn rolling 5 missiles and got 2 hits on snap shots! I roll 2 penetrating hits and got 2 immobilized results. First roll was 5 the second was 2! The Storm Raven crashed and burned. The dreadnaught it was carrying luckier only being stunned and losing a HP. I took care of it the next turn though with my Exo
My opponent had some bad luck though. His Librarian killed himself by a combination of plasma overheats and perils.
What do you guys think of the new Culexus (anti-psyker assassin in the new data sheet)? It seems perfect for giving us some counters to psykers and you could model her as a Saint or Sister of Silence.
Personally I'm quite excited to try out the new assassins. They'll add some variety to the lists for us and yeah the Culexus seems like a major boost to a psyker-less army. The vindicare seems awesome too with the multiple ammunition types. A very safe bet to throw in a list if you're not sure what your opponent will throw at you.
ShaneTB: That's an awesome pic. I'm always impressed by 40k cosplay (or cosplayers in general!) but The Passion (teehee) SoB cosplayers put into their outfits are astounding.
So I was planning on trying the Bastion + Retributors with an ammunition dump outside, within two inches to benefit my rets and my exorcists.
I then got into an argument with my opponent about the rets not being able to benefit from the ammo dump since they are inside the building, technically not on the table, and things inside transports/buildings cannot benefit from outside effects.
I could not find any rules to refute him so had to alter my strategy.
Since I saw this combo posted here, I figured I would this by veteran sister players and find out if anyone knows of a rule to justify this?
I could see this becoming a problem as well with the Culexus and his power to prevent psykers from generating warp charges... if said Psykers is inside a transport or a building, he's technically not on the table so someone could argue the culexus's power does not affect him.
"If the players need to measure a range involving the embarked unit (except for its shooting), this is measured to or from the vehicle's hull."
bit of the embarkation rules in the vehicles section. It doesn't strictly speaking address them being on the table or not, but you can certainly determine whether or not they are within 2" of the depot.
Inquisition gives a Null Rod and Psyocculum for a blob of sisters to be death to any psykers that they can see. Now the Assassins let us shut down invisibility...
Mavnas wrote: I would imagine it's covered under the:
"If the players need to measure a range involving the embarked unit (except for its shooting), this is measured to or from the vehicle's hull."
bit of the embarkation rules in the vehicles section. It doesn't strictly speaking address them being on the table or not, but you can certainly determine whether or not they are within 2" of the depot.
If models inside the bastion were able to benefit from the ammo dump, why would they also have an upgrade called ammo store that does the exact same thing, except only for models inside the bastion?
The ammo store upgrades the bastion itself, the other is merely an additional piece of terrain that can be bought by a variety of other fortifications too.
I've never thought about this before, but can a ministorum priest be a legit HQ option for a detachment of sisters? It doesn't seem right, but off the top of my head i can't think of why it doesn't work. Is it because priests don't take up a slot in the FoC?
deviantduck wrote: I've never thought about this before, but can a ministorum priest be a legit HQ option for a detachment of sisters? It doesn't seem right, but off the top of my head i can't think of why it doesn't work. Is it because priests don't take up a slot in the FoC?
"An Adepta Sororitas Detachment may include 0-5 Ministorum Priests. They do not take up a Force Organisation slot, and do not qualify as a mandatory HQ selection."
deviantduck wrote: You're the best. Now that won't be on my brain until i get home from work.
Also, thursday, i think i'm going to run a vindicare in a bastion with a void shield, and put the retributors on the roof.
You should do the opposite. Rets inside and Vindicare on the roof. Rets can run the extra HB.
I'd agree with this for the 5th rending HB. If it makes the assassin a bit more of a target, meh
Plus, remember that being in the battlements he's still Void shield covered, so Turn 1 that 2 Las canons at least...
And on the second Las shot, i'd rather roll a 4++ (or 3+ Ruins+stealth) for the guy than loosing 3 units (Bastion+Rets+Vindicaire) because he crumbled the building...
I have always heard "shoot the building he's in, not the vindicaire" so that'd be my tactic against one!
Babysitting a vindicate in a tooled up bastion seems awfully expensive for what he brings to the table.
I am not even sure he's really that worthwhile compared to some other assassins. He will likely draw some anti tank fire and it only takes one lucky missile to finish him off. There's only so much a 3+ cover save can do.
Assuming he survives past the early turns he kill 1 model a phase at best, sniper kills no longer make you do pinning checks so he's not messing with the unit either. Shooting at tanks he can do some damage, but he's not that great at outright blowing them up.
I like the Calidus best myself. Calidus can really mess up heavy weapons team. Deploy her as close as possible out of line of sight and watch your opponent either move his heavys to charge you first or lose them on the next turn.
Culexus is nice, but delivering him to where the psykers are, when all your opponent need to do is stay 12 inches away, is not going to be easy.
Ill try fielding one of each in my next game and see how they fare.
Has anyone thought about borrowing a GK librarian or two to put in a unit of Repentia and use Gate of Infinity to get them across the board? Any reasons it wouldn't work now we're BBFs?
Furyou Miko wrote: Has anyone thought about borrowing a GK librarian or two to put in a unit of Repentia and use Gate of Infinity to get them across the board? Any reasons it wouldn't work now we're BBFs?
That just means they still can't assault when they get there... If you have to use repentia, a land raider is probably a better idea.
Repentias in a land raider are very under whelming for testing them.
Any lucky over watch shots will more than likely kill a few and once they've slaughtered whatever they hit (which usually happens the turn they charge), they will get shot to death. They are honestly too much of a one trick pony to work well.
If you're getting a land raider, get one for an inquisition henchman team of Crusaders and Death cults and attach 2 or 3 priests.
The above has never let me down. They have killed everything they have hit including a solid space wolves cavalry death star.
I've had limited successes with a Land Raider and Repentia by including one or 2 characters with a real save (Coteaz or Canoness for instance), some priests and then multi-charging.
Of course the same can by done with Crusaders/Death Cultists, but my Sisters Repentia want table time!
The change to their Act of Faith really hurts though against opponents that kill em before they can strike.
What has everyone been running as far as lists go? I'm a long-time player just starting Sisters and I've been following this thread awhile. I'm starting to wrap my head around the unit-by-unit tactics but I haven't seen anyone put it all together in a way that really speaks to me yet.
Any ideas? What lists have you guys had the most success/fun with?
blackarmchair wrote: What has everyone been running as far as lists go? I'm a long-time player just starting Sisters and I've been following this thread awhile. I'm starting to wrap my head around the unit-by-unit tactics but I haven't seen anyone put it all together in a way that really speaks to me yet.
Any ideas? What lists have you guys had the most success/fun with?
I'm still having fun with the 'priest bomb' blob squad. Jaco, 4 priests, 3 with bp and mauls, one with lits of faith, 20 battle sisters, special/heavy weapons of choice, put an inquisitor with the scout book and you're laughing.
Combine this with 2 squads of Melta doms in rhino and 2 Exorcists, then fill out the rest off your list with BSS in MM immos. Solid and scary.
blackarmchair wrote: What has everyone been running as far as lists go? I'm a long-time player just starting Sisters and I've been following this thread awhile. I'm starting to wrap my head around the unit-by-unit tactics but I haven't seen anyone put it all together in a way that really speaks to me yet.
Any ideas? What lists have you guys had the most success/fun with?
Seraphim with Celestine attached is rocking my world. Get them into position to shoot a priority enemy unit pop their faith so they have shred and watch the enemies of the Emperor burn. Then charge in to tie them up. On your opponents assault phase hit and run so you can either shoot that unit again or break away to engage something else. Celestine makes the hit and run tests taken on her Int 7 and she boosts their faith check LD to 10. Finally, Celestine is great at cutting through meq troops so don't worry if your normal girls don't hurt the enemy in cc too much, Celestine will do the heavy lifting until you can hit and run.
I'm still having fun with the 'priest bomb' blob squad. Jaco, 4 priests, 3 with bp and mauls, one with lits of faith, 20 battle sisters, special/heavy weapons of choice, put an inquisitor with the scout book and you're laughing.
Combine this with 2 squads of Melta doms in rhino and 2 Exorcists, then fill out the rest off your list with BSS in MM immos. Solid and scary.
D
That's an interesting idea. I take it the priests are using smash for their hymns (maybe one would proc re-rolls to saves). That's actually make them pretty nasty in cc...
Actually, when you have a blob of 20 Battle Sisters plus 5-6 characters, you really want your "buff everyone" prayers to work: all those rerolls of to-wound and saves make a big impact. 4 priests means you are almost certain to get both of those off, and any surplus priest can try for smash then.
(Are priests rolling on their own natural Ld of 7 or on the unit's Ld? Can never bloody remember).
blackarmchair wrote: What has everyone been running as far as lists go? I'm a long-time player just starting Sisters and I've been following this thread awhile. I'm starting to wrap my head around the unit-by-unit tactics but I haven't seen anyone put it all together in a way that really speaks to me yet.
Any ideas? What lists have you guys had the most success/fun with?
What points level are you going to start at? I only have enough models for about 750 points if I stretch it so I tend to just stick to a comfortable 500 points. I know Celestine and Jacobus are very popular for their own reasons that are apparent based on their rules and excorcists are pretty much an auto-include. Personally I don't like taking named characters and so I stick to the generic HQ choices. This is my 500 point list that I've had good success with:
HQ- Canoness, Power weapon, rosaries, melta bombs
Troops- Battle Sister Squad, 4 Battle Sisters, Veteran Sister Superior, Flamer, Heavy Flamer, Immolater Transport with TLMM Troops- Battle Sister Squad, 4 Battle Sisters, Veteran Sister Superior, Flamer, Heavy Flamer, Immolater Transport with TLMM
Heavy Support- Retributors, 4 Retributors, Veteran Sister Superior, 4 Heavy Bolters
Points: 500
As I expand I'll be including the newly released assassins digi-dex into my roster.
My list is far from highly competitive btw. The others on this thread have some amazing lists built. Having said that I really enjoy this list and it's a great intro to some of the things Sisters have to offer. Last match I had I made 3 successful shield of faith rolls on one immolater from my opponents shooting. He dumped all his anti-armour firepower into it turn one and didn't even scratch it. Really lucky rolling on my part but still funny to watch your opponents face as he realizes his efforts were futile.
If Celestine is your warlord and is nearby, the priests can use her Ld? Also litanies is what makes the priest bomb because you succeed at all your War Hymns. I'd be interested to see if that unit would work just as well with Celestians. With Jacobus that's 3 furious charges, though I guess with the amount of S5 AP2 you put out, it might not matter.
Mavnas wrote: If Celestine is your warlord and is nearby, the priests can use her Ld? Also litanies is what makes the priest bomb because you succeed at all your War Hymns. I'd be interested to see if that unit would work just as well with Celestians. With Jacobus that's 3 furious charges, though I guess with the amount of S5 AP2 you put out, it might not matter.
Yes Celestine's Warlord trait allows you to use her leadership for all aof and war hyms test. So as long as she is within range your priests are testing on LD 10
Typically in my battles she's way far away from all my other units , but I had a vision of a rhino/immo rush where every unit has a priest and Celestine is in the middle making them all sing their hymns better.
As a side note to using Celestine in the 21+ blob with Jacobus and company, in a recent League game at 2000 points she Tanked all 17 Wounds from a SM Fellblade (the AP3 7" Blast) quite happily loosing no Wounds...
I thank Pretre for that method of using her (Just Tanking for the blob until it reaches combat) and can recommend it to others. It's a pretty good replacement if (like me) you play pure sisters, with no Inquisition.
I'm still having fun with the 'priest bomb' blob squad. Jaco, 4 priests, 3 with bp and mauls, one with lits of faith, 20 battle sisters, special/heavy weapons of choice, put an inquisitor with the scout book and you're laughing.
Combine this with 2 squads of Melta doms in rhino and 2 Exorcists, then fill out the rest off your list with BSS in MM immos. Solid and scary.
D
That's an interesting idea. I take it the priests are using smash for their hymns (maybe one would proc re-rolls to saves). That's actually make them pretty nasty in cc...
Remember Jacobus gets a War Hymn too, so I have re-roll saves, re-roll to wound, and Re-roll to wound and 3 priests smashing with maces. All going of automatically because of the Lits of Faith. Give the Inquisitor Rad and Psycochoke grenades for extra fun.
If a Model has to make a leadership test, as opposed to a Unit, then the model uses its own leadership and not the highest amongst the Unit. In 6th Edition it was ambiguous on how it worked, but 7th Edition made it specifically clear. Have a look in the 7th BRB where it talks about Leadership tests.
That's why Sisters get the best Priests. For 15pts you get the Litanies of the Faith which makes the whole Unit auto-pass both War Hymn and Act of Faith tests. Astra Militarum and Inquisition Priests can't take the Litanies, so they're stuck with testing on Ld7 to activate the Hymns.
25 points for Zealot and Hatred is still really good though, especially when it applies to a big blob of Guardsmen. They've effectively replaced Commissars for making Guard blobs Fearless. Think of War Hymns as a nice little surprise when it goes off.
Sisters also get Celestine who can make all priests in 12" pass the test on a 10. Inquisition priests aren't ICs and AM priests don't get the full range of upgrade options.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also it is possible to do a solid ish list with what I have so far...two canonesses, Jacobus, two priests, 40 bolter sisters, four heavy flamers sisters, four meltagun sisters, two storm bolter sisters, 10 repentia, 6 seraphim and four exorcists
Ideally you want more Meltagun models, as well as transports. Without any transports, I'd probably look at blobbing a big group of Sisters (like 15-20), attaching Jacobus and another Priest and marching them into combat. You might struggle with vehicles though, because by the time you footslog your meltaguns to where they're needed it might be too late...
4 Exorcists are nice though - maybe go with two Combined Arms Detachments so you can fit all 4 into a Battle-Forged Army. Use Jacobus as one CAD's HQ and a Canoness as the HQ for the other CAD.
Celestine's trait is usually useless in the way that I run here (in the enemy's face killing his squishy, flammable troops far from my own), but I could see it becoming more of a thing if I had more units mechanized and scouting forward.
Keep in mind that Celestine is the ultimate in Slay the Warlord denial. If you choose not to roll for her standup, she doesn't give away the STW point.
I usually use Jacobus as my warlord for the 5++ on the blob though.
pretre wrote: I think you could do it better with an EBC or pretty much any other unit.
That bad? What about...I think they are called Celestians? If I remember right, aren't they the CC sister unit?
That being said, taking a Land Raider Crusader as transport, what would you recommend for decent composition. It's what, 12 models a Conclave? Off the top of my head, I would say 4 Crusaders, DCAs, and Arco-Flagellants.
pretre wrote: Keep in mind that Celestine is the ultimate in Slay the Warlord denial. If you choose not to roll for her standup, she doesn't give away the STW point.
Be warned that actually trying this may get you labelled as a "TFG".
pretre wrote: Keep in mind that Celestine is the ultimate in Slay the Warlord denial. If you choose not to roll for her standup, she doesn't give away the STW point.
Be warned that actually trying this may get you labelled as a "TFG".
Hey, it's the rules as written.
I think it's interesting now that you could give a priest warlord to get book traits though.
Still wouldn't do it because it feels like cheating to me.
You gotta think that it's a pretty high cost to deny your opponent the point though. You're giving up a chance to bring Celestine back (and all the ass-whooping she would do) to do it.
Still wouldn't do it because it feels like cheating to me.
You gotta think that it's a pretty high cost to deny your opponent the point though. You're giving up a chance to bring Celestine back (and all the ass-whooping she would do) to do it.
Yeah, but it's also taking the most favorable rules interpretation solely to deny that point too. RAW or not, I wouldn't play like that in that situation.
One of my rhino's blew up and managed to cause a wound on Lysander 
That was the only time my dice liked me though 
I am only 5" from the 
