Chaos Daemons: Plague Drones of Nurgle This box contains a multipart plastic kit that makes three Plague Drones that are multi-posable and offer collectors a large variety when assembling them € 46,00 / $60.00
Chaos Daemons: Burning Chariot of Tzeentch/Herald of Tzeentch on Burning Chariot of Tzeentch This box contains a multipart plastic kit that makes either a Burning Chariot of Tzeentch or a Herald of Tzeentch on a Burning Chariot of Tzeentch € 35,00 / $40.00
Chaos Daemons: Blood Throne of Khorne/Skull Cannon of Khorne This box contains a multipart plastic kit that makes either a Blood Throne of Khorne or a Skull Cannon of Khorne € 35,00 / $40.00
Herald of Nurgle This Clampack contains a new plastic Herald of Nurgle on a sculpted base € 20,00 / $25.00
New Finecast Releases
Herald of Khorne A clampack that contains one highly detailed Citadel Finecast resin miniature € 20,00 (probably $25.00 as well)
Herald of Slaanesh A clampack that contains one highly detailed Citadel Finecast resin miniature € 20,00 (probably $25.00 as well)
Available While Stocks Last These Items are highly limited, please request the quantity you require and we will supply you as close to this number as we can.
Warhammer Battle Magic: Daemons of Chaos A deck of 21 cards that contains the 6 spells for the Lores of Tzeentch, Nurgle and Slaanesh as well as their signature spells € 8,50
Psychic Powers: Chaos Daemons A deck of 12 cards that contains the Primaris powers and 3 Psychic powers for the Lores Tzeentch, Slaanesh, Nurgle as well € 6,00
Added:
WFB: Chaos Daemons Battalion/Battleforce $115.00
TastyTaste from Blood of Kittens wrote:
I am one to think that they aren't coming out just yet, but maybe with the April release. With rules rumors being hard to come by let us look at some obvious ones right in front us and others not so much.
As most people realize Daemons will lose both Fearless and Eternal Warrior replaced with 5+ invulnerable and Fear. Eternal Warrior never really made sense in the grand scheme of things anyway because wouldn't Force Weapons be perfect to "banish" Daemons back to the War? As for Fearless, see a return of "instability" which is going to be close to 5th edition Fearless.
As I stated in a previous rumor GW is hell-bent on having each army hate something. Daemons are no different they just seem to hate themselves now.
Taking a look at the Chaos Space Marine and Warriors of Chaos books you can see where this is going. Each Chaos God units will hate a certain other god. This leads into the next rules change right in front of us. Depending on the Daemon's God it will determine the special abilities they get.
Khorne: Furious Charge
Slaanesh: Rending, Run bonus, Fleet
Tzeentch: Re-roll 1s for saves
Nurgle: Slow & Purposeful, Shrouded
Other changes that will surely happen...
Flamers and Screamers are getting nerfed, but the real big change will be Deamons having standard Deployment rules: no more Daemonic Assault.
The big reason Deamons were fast tracked has to do with Alessio Cavatore. Chatting with a few inside GW there has been an everything Alessio purge, and Daemons are the last big chunk of Alessio material left. Yeah, I know it sounds kinda petty, but it was a major impetus to get Daemons done. Daemons will still primarily be an assault based army, but that is the nature of the models having to be used both for Fantasy and 40k. That means Daemons will rely on speed to get across the board. Expect Chariots, warp portals, beasts, cavalry, jump troops to help with all this. Then there is cover saves Nurgle is the first piece of the puzzle, but just like certain Dark Angel things expect a "Clouds of Flies" to provide bonuses to cover saves all around. Chaos Space Marines and Deamons ICs will be able to join each other as long as their gods match up.
Things have been spares from all rumor mongers, but a lot has to do with GW "renewed" lock down; translated GW rumor monger wack'a'mole.
Another good thing to understand is GW is moving quicker with releases than ever before. They had almost an entire year to create a backlog on sculpting and rules. To give you an example, the Chaos Space Marine codex was done in December of 2011. I am not talking about just the rules, but everything the photography, the layout, everything! Dark Angels same thing, done in March 2011. That means Daemons have been done since June and Tau and Eldar compelete or almost complete.
What I am getting at is this is going to be an epic year for releases, with only the Chapterhouse lawsuit and a new CEO possibly getting in the way.
Finally, I have a public service announcement from the dev team, they really want rules questions, so everyone keep on sending in any rules quandaries to
Gamefaqs@gwplc.com
The design team has made updating FAQs a priority, which has been a marked and great change from years past.
Rules information leaked to the german website GW Fanworld and translated by Mohoc:
Daemons: Daemon belong to a specific god and have USR Hatred for their opposing god (Nurgle/Tzeentch, Khorne/Slaanesh). Herald of one god cannot join a unit from another god.
Khorne USR: Rage, Re-Roll Charge distance
Tzeentch: +3 LD for Psykic tests, Re-Roll Saves of 1
Nurgle: Slow and Purposefull, Shrouded, Defensive Grenades
Slaanesh: Rending, Move thru Cover, +3” to run distance for infantry, +6 “to run distance for cavalry (only if the whole unit is cavalry), +3” Flat out for chariots
Daemonic Instability: Units with this USR may not be joined by units without this USR. Unit passes all Fear, Pinning and Moral tests. If a Unit with this USR looses in Close Combat, it must test for Instability on 2D6.
If the test is failed, the Unit takes wounds equal to the difference between its LD value and the roll.
If you roll Double 1, all wounds lost in this combat are restored. Place lost models back on the table
If you roll Double 6, the whole unit is removed from play.
Warlord Table: War Lord Table:
1) Warlord gains Instant Death USR 2) Warlord and his unit gain Hatred (Everything) USR 3) As long as the War Lord is alive, your opponent test for Fear at -1 LD 4) As Long as the War Lord is alive, units within 12” of the War Lord may re-roll Daemonic Instability
5) As long as the War Lord is alive, you may re-roll results on the Warp Storm Table
6) Units with the Daemon USR may Deep Strike within 6” of the War Lord without scatter.
Warp Storm Table: The Warp Storm Table is only used when Chaos Daemons are your Primary Detachment. Roll on the Warp Storm Table at the beginning of the Daemon Players Shooting Phase
2) The Storm is receding: All units with the Daemonic Instability USR (Friend and Foe) immediately test for Daemonic Instability
3) Punishment of the Gods: A random character model with Daemonic Instability (Friend or Foe) immediately tests for Daemonic Instability on 3D6. Wounds suffered in this manner can only be allocated to that model.
4) Warp Quake: All models with the Daemon USR suffer a -1 penalty to their saves until the next roll on this chart (friend or foe)
5) Storm of Fire: Roll a D6 for every unit with the Daemon of Nurgle USR or Mark of Nurgle or enemy unit that is not locked in combat. On a roll of 6, place a large blast marker on one of the models in the unit. Scatter 2D6. All models under the template suffer a S4 AP5 Ignore Cover, Pinning hit ).
6) Glorious Rot: Roll a D6 for every unit with the Daemon of Tzeentch or Mark of Tzeentch or enemy unit not locked in combat. On a roll of a 6, the unit suffers D6 S4 AP3 Poison (4+) hits. Vehicles are hit on Side Armor.
7) Calm Warp: Nothing happens
8) The Dark Prince Thirsts: Roll a D6 for every unit with the Daemon of Khorne USR or Mark of Khorne or enemy unit that is not locked in combat. On a roll of 6, the unit suffers D6 S6 AP- Ignore Cover, Rending hits.
9) Khornes Rage: Roll a D6 for every unit with the Daemon of Slaanesh USR or Mark of Slaanesh or enemy unit that is not locked in combat. On a roll of 6, center a small blast marker on a model of your choice in the unit and scatter 2D6. Models under the blast template suffer a S8 AP 3 Pinning hit.
10) Warp Flood: All units with the Daemon USR gain +1 to all saving throws until the next roll on the Warp Storm Table (friend or foe)
11) Daemonic Possesion: A random enemy non-vehicle .Psyker that is not a daemon must pass a Leadership test on 3D6. If the test is failed, the Psyker is removed from play. Place a Herald of a god of your choice within 6" of the removed model. The Herald does not receive any upgrades.
12) Blessing of the Warp: A new unit of 2D6+3 Bloodletters, Pink Horrors, Daemonetts or Plaguebearers (your choice) arrives via deep strike.
All Daemons have a 6+ Armor Save. Some daemons (for example Bloodthirster have a 3+)
Bloodthirster lost EW Skulltaker has EW and 3+ Armor
Lord Of Change is Level 2 Psyker and Flying FMC 11-15 Pink Horrors generate 2 Warp Points, 16-20 generate 3
Fateweaver has a 4++, Level 4 Psyker. He knows all Tzeentch powers. Right Head knows one power from Pyromancy and Divination, Left Head knows one power from Telepathy and Pyromancy. Declare which head you want to use at the beginning of each turn. May re-roll a single D6 each phase.
Blue Scribes are not Psykers, but generate one power each turn from the main rule book. They can use that power without rolling a psykic test.
The Changeling may exchange any of his stats with an enemy non-vehicle model stat in base contact (WS, S, W, I, A) until the end of the turn
Great Unclean One is Psyker Level 1, Biomancy and Nurgle
Beasts of Nurgle can charge in the opponents turn.
Ku'Gath can regenerate wounds on Nurgling Swarms
Epi only effects Daemons of Nurgle within 6" and tally works based on unsaved wounds caused by Daemons of Nurgle:
7+: +1 Strength
14+: +1 Toughness
21+: 2+ poison
28+: 4+ Feel No Pain
Keeper of Secrets has Prefered Enemy Eldar and Dark Eldar. Psyker Level 1, Telepathy and Slaanesh
The Mask re-rolls all failed saves. It has multiple different dances
There are Chaos Furies
Flamers of Tzeench: If they caused a wound, take a test every turn for that unit. If the test is failed, you take D3 wounds, if you pass the test, you gain FNP (6+)
Skull Cannon: If you assault a unit that has been hit by a shot from the Skull Cannon, you suffer no initiative penalty for assaulting thru difficult terrain.
Axe of Khorne: Instant Death on a roll of 6 to wound.
Mutated Warpknife (Tzeentch): If it kills a enemy Character or MC, that model is turned into a Chaos Spawn on a roll of 2+
Warp Poisoning: If a Character or MC looses its last wound due to a Close Combat attack from the Staff of Change, all units within D6 inches (friend and foe) suffer D6 hits at S5 AP -
Mace of Disease: Models that suffer an unsaved wound from this weapon must pass a Toughness Test or suffer an additional wound. No saves of any kind can be taken to prevent this additional wound.
Many Characters cannot buy equipment, but can buy Minor, Major and Legendary enhancements for a certain point cost. These are randomly determined at the same time as Warlord Traits are rolled. You may have the same enhancements more than once on each character, but the random result can only be applied once to each character. Re-roll doubles. Rolls can be exchanged for special weapons.
Minor Boons: Result 0: (May replace roll on the chart)
Magical Weapon: Etherknife (AP2, Mastercrafted, Specialist Weapon)
Daemon of Khorne may take an Axe of Khorne instead
Daemon of Tzeench may take a Staff of Change instead
Daemon of Nurgle mau take a Mace of Disease instead
Daemon of Slaanesh may take a Ghost Sword(?) instead
Daemon Princes: Skarbrand and Bloodthirster make Khorne DP Heavy Support
Fateweaver and Lord of Change make Tzeentch DP Heavy Support
Ku'Gath and Great Unclean One make DP of Nurgle Heavy Support
Keeper of Secrets makes DP of Slaanesh Heavy Support
DP costs 145 pts
Khorne +15 pts
Tzeentch +25 pts
Nurgle +15 pts
Slaanesh +10 pts
Daemonic Flight 40 pts
May take up to 50 points of gifts
none khorne DPs can buy Psyker levels up to level 3 at 25pts/lvl
Heralds may still be taken 2 per HQ slot. Every Herald adds a Boon to the unit he joins.
Icons can improve certain effects. Instruments can "summon" reserves or modify the result of the Warp Storm Table.
Old Post
Our best rumour source Hastings said that we will see Codex and armybook for Daemons of Chaos February latest, so it is time to collect some rumours:
Harry wrote:Daemons of Chaos:
I know we have only just had a wave of Daemons but now we have this from hastings:
Release Date:
"The daemon rules should be taken as a stepping stone to the updated book (much like the wdvc terrorgheist article) next 4 books (for both systems are all chaos (in one form or another) and will hit within 4-5 months for all of them". (Hastings).
To clarify....Books: CSM, WoC, DoC, Chaos Daemons
All will be realeased within 4-5 months of the CSM codex hitting (sep afaik) (Hastings)
So we are talking february at the latest?
Author:
Unknown
Rules:
Unknown ... Beyond those suggested by the rules booklet in the recent WD
Models:
All 4 greater Deamons will get plastic kits (with head/weapon options plus wfb/40k specific bits on sprues) and that there will be "resin conversion packs" to make "named greater Deamons". (Hastings) No idea of timescales on this. I am not expecting them to arrive together Or with this wave. (Harry)
Jes Goodwin is rumoured to be doing the Bloodthirster. (BRING IT ON! ) No timescale for this. (NatTreehouse)
75hastings69 wrote:By feb next year you'll have CSM, WoC, DA, DoC, CD (chaos daemons 40k codex before anyone starts with chaos dwarf crap!).
Obviously the 2 daemon books will be in one month sharing model releases
Harry wrote:Well, what I heard ... was two waves of models AND two 'waves' of Greater Daemons. In other words the Greater Daemons would be coming in two pairs.... which makes sense..... not many of us would be able to crash for all four in the same month! However ... until hastings posted I had heard nothing about a book .... for either system.
Stickmonkey wrote:The models I've had a lot of rumors on are:
Khorne chariot, two bloodcrushers pulling a wagon with herald option or some fire belching thing. Large base
Tzentch chariot, pulled by screamers, with horrors riding, but I've also heard it has a large flamer rider too. Large base
Nurgle palanquin, nurglings, daemon prince base, fat plague bearer.
4 GD with variants for named daemons and swappable options, most rumors point to resin packs, but I've heard wind its all in the plastic kits lately. I'd lean towards Harry's news, but I hope for all in one myself. I have heard that these may be moving to the larger base now, if so, they will be huge. One can hope, but I don't have a lot of confidence in this bit.
Furies (no dual kit options I've heard of.) in plastic.
Plastic fiends were being worked on at one point, but I haven't heard anything about them recently.
New elite daemon engine. 40k Dreadnought sized. Lots of options. Quasi-God specific bits like the soulgrinder. Supposedly unique to daemons not the same as this new unit for chaos space marines.
(...)
The list has been largely debunked by Hastings in the 40k thread. So I would not be sure, and my sources say furies are a single use box of 5. (however, the VC horrors kit also was told to me to be a single use kit...I think its pretty much a good example of how a dual kit furies might be.)
Both Khorne and Tzentch kits have been describe to me to build multiple units, similar to the slaaneshi chariot building 3 different models...albiet one which needs 2 boxes. So maybe not as obvious...
Avian wrote:Did anyone actually say anything to you about what exactly those other units were?
See original post.
Big khorn flame belcher thing
Tzeentch Larger flamer instead of horrors.
Sounded like more ranged options for the daemons.
Harry wrote:You seem to have named everything not done yet ...except Hounds of Khorne .... did you forget those?
Stickmonkey wrote:I asked and the answer has just been they are staying finecast for now. No plans for them or beasts of nurgle in plastic so far as I know... I'd love some plastic khorne dogs...they have been a staple in my daemons since day one, but assembling and painting more metal or finecast ones isn't appealling.
There has been some chatter on a demonic terrain piece, but I'm putting it down to wishlisting for now, nothing solid. Portal? meh. Shrine? meh.
I got to see the Ku'gath designs recently. Pretty Ace. The lab is wild, with nurgling assistants. I'm looking forward to seeing it translated to a model.
No more exalted chariots...at least not that I've heard of.
I did see a design for a big unaligned chaos beast of some kind. Looked like a oversized bear with a toothy maw instead of a head. No idea if it ever went on to be a model. Probably daemon prince sized. Design had a bloodletter drawn next to it which may have been half it's height.
I'm sure there is much more that could be coming. Can't imagine a new codex without a handful or more of new units.
Hmm would be interesting to see what the other chariots will look like, though I dont like alot of the new plastic daemons models so Id say its mainly the rules Im interested in.
New Greater Daemons would certainly be good, the current ones are rather dated.
Xeriapt wrote: Hmm would be interesting to see what the other chariots will look like, though I dont like alot of the new plastic daemons models so Id say its mainly the rules Im interested in.
New Greater Daemons would certainly be good, the current ones are rather dated.
Lord of Change has aged rather well IMHO, but yes, the other three not so much.
One thing puts me off, Why would they stick all the chaos stuff together? Daemons straight after chaos marines? I'm sorry Hastings, but this one seems a little off, your normally quite good but this time i don't think this is right.
We have too many people yelling Dark angles Tau and Eldar for me to take this straight at all.
I don't mind the chariots, there are options for them as is but people have to more or less convert for them currently. I'm sort of interested in the greater daemons. Sort of hoping for a cooler KoS, though the LoC will probably be pretty nice as well.
The engines sort of interest me as well. I'm sort of hoping for something for each god. A swift killy machine for Slaanesh, plain smashy for Khorne, shooty for Tzeentch and a mobile bunker for Nurgle.
Xeriapt wrote: Hmm would be interesting to see what the other chariots will look like, though I dont like alot of the new plastic daemons models so Id say its mainly the rules Im interested in.
New Greater Daemons would certainly be good, the current ones are rather dated.
Lord of Change has aged rather well IMHO, but yes, the other three not so much.
Agreed, the old LoC looks far better than the fateweaver model less than half it's age.
I have high hopes for a Kali/Shiva based cenobite styled KoS... in a similar vein to the Forgeworld perhaps?
New model are always nice. But honestly I could careless about the models. All I want is new rules, and adjusted points costs. Oh, and writer who gives a d*mn about daemons!
Below is the list of Codices from the last 2 years along with their release dates. That's 3 books releases (I don't count Sisters because there were no new models - not even a Finecast re-release) in 2 years. The list below is why I'm skeptical of seeing 3 books in the next 5 months or so (Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Daemons, and Dark Angels).
There also seems to be evidence that Tau and Eldar are sometime next year also. That release schedule would equal 5 codices in the next ~ 16 months. In order to find 5 codex releases you have to go back to January 2010 (Tyranids - January 2010, Blood Angels - April 2010) which is 32 months.
November 2010: Dark Eldar
April 2011: Grey Knights
November 2011: Necrons
I don't doubt that people have heard solid rumors, seem models, or anything. I unfortunately doubt that Games Workshop will follow through with an aggressive release schedule even if they currently have it planned. They have consistently demonstrated an inability to support their own lines. I'm not talking about a single army not receiving a new book either. For example, here was a 7 month gap between the first codex release of 5th Edition (Space Marines - October 2008) and the second codex (Imperial Guard - May 2009). Another example, there was an 8 month gap between WFB 8th edition (July 2010) and the the release of the first new Army Book (Orcs & Goblins - March 2011).
Ledabot wrote: One thing puts me off, Why would they stick all the chaos stuff together? Daemons straight after chaos marines? I'm sorry Hastings, but this one seems a little off, your normally quite good but this time i don't think this is right.
We have too many people yelling Dark angles Tau and Eldar for me to take this straight at all.
Warriors of Chaos have been rumored for Fall for nearly a year. Daemons are a joint release, for 40k and Fantasy, so it doesn't really mean that's taking a 40k release slot, it could be a month after another 40k release. Besides if the rumors are true and they are stepping up the release schedule, the old paradigm no longer applies.
Deathwolf wrote: Below is the list of Codices from the last 2 years along with their release dates. That's 3 books releases (I don't count Sisters because there were no new models - not even a Finecast re-release) in 2 years. The list below is why I'm skeptical of seeing 3 books in the next 5 months or so (Chaos Space Marines, Chaos Daemons, and Dark Angels).
There also seems to be evidence that Tau and Eldar are sometime next year also. That release schedule would equal 5 codices in the next ~ 16 months. In order to find 5 codex releases you have to go back to January 2010 (Tyranids - January 2010, Blood Angels - April 2010) which is 32 months.
November 2010: Dark Eldar
April 2011: Grey Knights
November 2011: Necrons
I don't doubt that people have heard solid rumors, seem models, or anything. I unfortunately doubt that Games Workshop will follow through with an aggressive release schedule even if they currently have it planned. They have consistently demonstrated an inability to support their own lines. I'm not talking about a single army not receiving a new book either. For example, here was a 7 month gap between the first codex release of 5th Edition (Space Marines - October 2008) and the second codex (Imperial Guard - May 2009). Another example, there was an 8 month gap between WFB 8th edition (July 2010) and the the release of the first new Army Book (Orcs & Goblins - March 2011).
And how many waves did we get along with those codex releases? Space Wolves, Tyranids, Daemons, Space Marines, Flyers just on the 40k side.
The main reason we can expect releases to come quicker, and with full models lines is directly related to GW lawsuit against Chapterhouse. They can no longer sit by and hold off kits, because the 3rd party will fill that void, and this is forcing them now to have every codex unit accompanied by a model release. I think what we can expect to see in the coming months is releases of completed kits and codexes that have been held back from release.
Lake wrote: I'd love see some more undivided daemons rather than just furies
like greater daemons of chaos undivided?
lol! Well played. I can agree with Lake though. I'd love to see some "infantry style" undivided daemons, or even some centaur-type daemons for chaos undivided. Furies are intended to be a sort of scavenger daemon, but I think that theme could work for infantry or cavalry-esque daemons.
Starfarer wrote: Warriors of Chaos have been rumored for Fall for nearly a year. Daemons are a joint release, for 40k and Fantasy, so it doesn't really mean that's taking a 40k release slot, it could be a month after another 40k release. Besides if the rumors are true and they are stepping up the release schedule, the old paradigm no longer applies.
Yeah, ordinary I'd be highly skeptical of a particularly fast release schedule, but I'm willing to believe CD/DoC could be a special case. Heck, GW may simply be considering it a WFB "slot" with a 40K stowaway.
Edit: For selfish reasons, I'm hoping we see CD soon. But I also hope it's not too long of a wait for the Tau and Eldar players. They certainly deserve new books.
Larry Vela wrote:So remember all that talk of Chaos Daemons coming soon on the heels of the Dark Angels? Well here is what the cold voices on the wind portend...
via tsetse fly
Incoming Chaos Daemon Wave:
It is believed to be a Q1 release. There is conflicting chatter as to whether the Codex is coming as well, or whether it is a miniatures-only wave with White Dwarf rules like we say in Q4-12.
Miniatures:
BloodThirster
Great Unclean One,
New Nurgle "jetbikes" - Described as GIANT FLIES with Plaguebearer Riders!!!
Khornate Chariot with dual-build options.
-Option 1: Transport (holds a big squad of daemons, opened top)
-Option 2: Cannon Variant (autocannon equivalent blast template, medium range)
~More as we get it. Nurgle flying cav sounds totally cool! This does sound like its is roughly along wiht lines of the last Chaos Daemons wave. It has a new cav unit, a chariot to use those new 40k chariot rules, and a couple of new Majors thrown in for good measure. This is a good thing. The current GW Major Daemons are ancient and kind of embarrassing by modern production standards.
Releasing the chariots is a fantastic thing. It always bugged me that there was the this massive gap in the HQ section of the daemons (no generic Herald models, no Chariot models).
The only things that could fill these roles were special char models, or scratchbuilds/kit bashes.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Releasing the chariots is a fantastic thing. It always bugged me that there was the this massive gap in the HQ section of the daemons (no generic Herald models, no Chariot models).
The only things that could fill these roles were special char models, or scratchbuilds/kit bashes.
Having proper kits is a long time coming.
Agreed, the Khorne Chariot (if it's happening) would be a nice addition to the range.
More and more it's sounding like CoD/DoC could be ANOTHER update instead of a new book. Which is disappointing and kinda strange at first blush. But then considering it's a whole new digital age for GW...maybe more rolling updates and fewer codex/book redos will be the wave of the future.
Plastic GD's would be something of a God-send as well (pun not intended). I love my Bloodthirster, but it'd be nice if I could use him without feeling like he's going to fall apart of I breathe too heavily on him. My KoS has actually exploded once. I put the pieces inside a Rhino until I worked up the strength to rebuild the entire thing (I'm not kidding about the 'explode' part either, it got caught on something and I pulled and every piece went flying). Only my GUO stays in one piece, but it's a GUO so that's obvious.
Don't have a LOC. Friend does. He's never been able to get the wings on.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Plastic GD's would be something of a God-send as well (pun not intended). I love my Bloodthirster, but it'd be nice if I could use him without feeling like he's going to fall apart of I breathe too heavily on him. My KoS has actually exploded once. I put the pieces inside a Rhino until I worked up the strength to rebuild the entire thing (I'm not kidding about the 'explode' part either, it got caught on something and I pulled and every piece went flying). Only my GUO stays in one piece, but it's a GUO so that's obvious.
Don't have a LOC. Friend does. He's never been able to get the wings on.
Assembling the finecast Lord of Change was a massive pain, espically with the wings and the "hopping" leg which had to have a good amount of green stuff to have it stay still. It doesn't even have a base pin for it's 'hopping' foot.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Only my GUO stays in one piece, but it's a GUO so that's obvious.
Oh. Mine leaves a slime trail and falls off it every movement phase. Luckily it's all imaginary though. Cause its a GUO.
It doesn't look any better than the others, espically to assemble. Though I find my Bloodthirster is quite resilient to damage, though his wings had to be mostly covered by green stuff just to make sure they don't fall off.
I have two LoCs with wings (one is a converted Kairos w/ BT wings on it), and both models sucked to build. But my wings stay on fairly well. It might be the super glue I use: generic black and yellow bottle from Walmart.
Larry Vela wrote:So remember all that talk of Chaos Daemons coming soon on the heels of the Dark Angels? Well here is what the cold voices on the wind portend...
via tsetse fly
Incoming Chaos Daemon Wave:
It is believed to be a Q1 release. There is conflicting chatter as to whether the Codex is coming as well, or whether it is a miniatures-only wave with White Dwarf rules like we say in Q4-12.
Miniatures:
BloodThirster
Great Unclean One,
New Nurgle "jetbikes" - Described as GIANT FLIES with Plaguebearer Riders!!!
Khornate Chariot with dual-build options.
-Option 1: Transport (holds a big squad of daemons, opened top)
-Option 2: Cannon Variant (autocannon equivalent blast template, medium range)
~More as we get it. Nurgle flying cav sounds totally cool! This does sound like its is roughly along wiht lines of the last Chaos Daemons wave. It has a new cav unit, a chariot to use those new 40k chariot rules, and a couple of new Majors thrown in for good measure. This is a good thing. The current GW Major Daemons are ancient and kind of embarrassing by modern production standards.
For the work blocked.
Hastings said late last year though we would getting "books".
Outside of his release months being off by a month or so, when was the last time Hastings confused army book/codex for 'WD rules'?!
Besides, Daemons need;
a) A serious balancing act in Fantasy, since it's still laughably easy to make auto-win builds.
b) A serious balancing act in 40k to bring them into line with proper pts costings, better deployment (ie: f -off with your BS rolling for waves stupidity!), a bit more shooty power outside of 'just play Tzeentch' and SOMETHING to make the army viable against Derp Knights.
If we keep the deep strike rules then we better get something to stop us getting shot up besides hoping that our deep strike keeps us out of los, even if it's something simple like the Warp Talon's rule (blinding everyone in so many inches) to a 4+ cover save, or even being able to assault the turn we deep strike (maybe on an int test or something? Although Nurgle wouldn't be pleased if it was on an int test.... And maybe something better than just fear.. I mean that rule is just weak as, especially since half the armies ignore it... [/rant]
Can't wait to see the rules for the new toys, and what changes are made...
Matt.Kingsley wrote: If we keep the deep strike rules then we better get something to stop us getting shot up besides hoping that our deep strike keeps us out of los, even if it's something simple like the Warp Talon's rule (blinding everyone in so many inches) to a 4+ cover save, or even being able to assault the turn we deep strike (maybe on an int test or something? Although Nurgle wouldn't be pleased if it was on an int test....
And maybe something better than just fear.. I mean that rule is just weak as, especially since half the armies ignore it...
[/rant]
Can't wait to see the rules for the new toys, and what changes are made...
Why not just Deep Strike into cover? Solves alot of problems for my own warp gribblies, and unless my dice are insanely borked, at most I lose maybe 2-3 models out of an entire wave... Hardly something to fear.
We really do need though;
a) Some kind of defense against Warp Quake!!! I'm sick of 5-10min games just because I lose one dice-off. b) Cheaper Icons. 25pts is so insanely over-costed, it makes you wonder what kind of drugs Alessio was high on at the time to think that even remotely viable.
c) Maybe an upgrade for a Slaaneshii unit or two to assault from Deep Strike similar to Vanguard Vets. Or better yet, just make it a rule for Furies - they'd even be worth taking at their current pts cost if they could do that!
Fear is fine. It works exactly the same in Fantasy, and can win you games even though there's a huge long list of units and whole armies who are immune to it.
It works every single round of combat, meaning against non-Loyalist Marines, it should kick in at least once or twice a game. It's really a perk more than anything, and a good one too when you get it to work, just like the Changeling.
And yes, new toys is cause for much-much excitement!!!
If the rumors are true, then aparently Mr.Vetock has written our new rules for both game - which should cause every single non-daemonic Fantasy player to jump for fething joy!
If the rumors are true, then aparently Mr.Vetock has written our new rules for both game - which should cause every single non-daemonic Fantasy player to jump for fething joy!
Not quite sure what you mean by that-Vetock wrote Ogres (most powerful 8th book) and Skaven (insanely good). If anything, it'll adjust points but still have them be awesome. He didn't weaken Skaven or Ogres, he made them better. So time will tell on whether non-daemon fantasy players will be ecstatic or not.
If the rumors are true, then aparently Mr.Vetock has written our new rules for both game - which should cause every single non-daemonic Fantasy player to jump for fething joy!
Not quite sure what you mean by that-Vetock wrote Ogres (most powerful 8th book) and Skaven (insanely good). If anything, it'll adjust points but still have them be awesome. He didn't weaken Skaven or Ogres, he made them better. So time will tell on whether non-daemon fantasy players will be ecstatic or not.
Skaven was his first book, so can be somewhat forgiven for the absolute mess it turned out to be.
He did however knock the SAD style army on the head though - remember the howls of rage from powergamers that Ratling Guns now have to roll to-hit for example? Or that Warplightning got nerfed?!
Sure there's new groaners like Hellpits being a bit too good for their pts, there's far too much Ld10, slaves are borderline broken and the Doomwheel is still a rules disaster. But it was his first army book and his Orcs & Gobbos book is solid. (though the magic items section is beyond awful!)
Ogres was a project he co-wrote with Jervis. So no one can know for sure if the excesses were more Vetock or Jervis. The chariot cannon is beyond silly, and Mournfangs are nasty while they have that one magic item that can be near auto-death for Undead.
Mind you, considering how pants Ogres were all through 7th, it's good to see them getting some love, and the power creep in the Ogres book is absolutely nothing compared to the power creep we've been dealing with in the recent past! (DoC ---> DE's ---> WoC being the unholy trinity of doom!)
Mind you, I probably should have said that Vetock being rumored to be writting the new Daemons book means every non-Daemon player will be jumping for fething joy because it's at least not Mr."Well, they're DAEMONS!1!!!" Ward again!
Excited for this, been looking to start Daemons this year for a while now.
Have to say that due to the ever spiralling prices and slightly suspect art direction that the last couple of updates have featured, I'm going to use as many 3rd party minis as poss to build a truly chaotic army, so the codex will be my only likely purchase unless the fly riders are made of awesome.
If the rumors are true, then aparently Mr.Vetock has written our new rules for both game - which should cause every single non-daemonic Fantasy player to jump for fething joy!
Not quite sure what you mean by that-Vetock wrote Ogres (most powerful 8th book) and Skaven (insanely good). If anything, it'll adjust points but still have them be awesome. He didn't weaken Skaven or Ogres, he made them better. So time will tell on whether non-daemon fantasy players will be ecstatic or not.
Skaven was his first book, so can be somewhat forgiven for the absolute mess it turned out to be.
He did however knock the SAD style army on the head though - remember the howls of rage from powergamers that Ratling Guns now have to roll to-hit for example? Or that Warplightning got nerfed?!
Sure there's new groaners like Hellpits being a bit too good for their pts, there's far too much Ld10, slaves are borderline broken and the Doomwheel is still a rules disaster. But it was his first army book and his Orcs & Gobbos book is solid. (though the magic items section is beyond awful!)
Ogres was a project he co-wrote with Jervis. So no one can know for sure if the excesses were more Vetock or Jervis. The chariot cannon is beyond silly, and Mournfangs are nasty while they have that one magic item that can be near auto-death for Undead.
Mind you, considering how pants Ogres were all through 7th, it's good to see them getting some love, and the power creep in the Ogres book is absolutely nothing compared to the power creep we've been dealing with in the recent past! (DoC ---> DE's ---> WoC being the unholy trinity of doom!)
Mind you, I probably should have said that Vetock being rumored to be writting the new Daemons book means every non-Daemon player will be jumping for fething joy because it's at least not Mr."Well, they're DAEMONS!1!!!" Ward again!
That's fair. Actually, I probably came of sounding like I didn't like Vetock's work. This is hardly the case: Vetock is probably my favorite writer in the company. I don't think Ogres are OP beyond belief, just the best of the 8th books that have come out so far (which are all fairly well in line with each other, even though some like Empire are lackluster). I know he took focus away from Skaven shooting and made them more melee, but the melee...wow. It's good. Of course, I'm the jerk who took a Grey Seer, Engineer with Doom Rocket, Clanrats, Stormvermin with Storm Banner, Censor Bearers and a Hellpit to a 1000 point tournament. So...melee...yeah, it's solid. Damn good, really. But it's not a forgiving army, and even though it has power, it can blow itself up (fairly easily, as it turns out). O&G are another totally solid, and quite good, army that he did. We'll see how he handled the DA book when it hits shelves, but he's shown that he's got fantasy down fairly well at this point, for being a fairly new writer. Hope he keeps up the good work.
That's fair. Actually, I probably came of sounding like I didn't like Vetock's work. This is hardly the case: Vetock is probably my favorite writer in the company. I don't think Ogres are OP beyond belief, just the best of the 8th books that have come out so far (which are all fairly well in line with each other, even though some like Empire are lackluster). I know he took focus away from Skaven shooting and made them more melee, but the melee...wow. It's good.
We'll say we both goof'ed and call it evensies!
I think it's more or less that Mr.Vetock is still 'new' by army book/codex standards though which leads alot of people to forgetting he's only got what, 2-and-a-half books under his belt so far?
timetowaste85 wrote: Of course, I'm the jerk who took a Grey Seer, Engineer with Doom Rocket, Clanrats, Stormvermin with Storm Banner, Censor Bearers and a Hellpit to a 1000 point tournament. So...melee...yeah, it's solid. Damn good, really. But it's not a forgiving army, and even though it has power, it can blow itself up (fairly easily, as it turns out). O&G are another totally solid, and quite good, army that he did. We'll see how he handled the DA book when it hits shelves, but he's shown that he's got fantasy down fairly well at this point, for being a fairly new writer. Hope he keeps up the good work.
Now I must say, as any self-respecting Skaven player knows, there is no such thing as a disastrous misfire, rather, you simply suffered a catastrophic success!
If the rumors are true, then aparently Mr.Vetock has written our new rules for both game - which should cause every single non-daemonic Fantasy player to jump for fething joy!
Not quite sure what you mean by that-Vetock wrote Ogres (most powerful 8th book) and Skaven (insanely good). If anything, it'll adjust points but still have them be awesome. He didn't weaken Skaven or Ogres, he made them better. So time will tell on whether non-daemon fantasy players will be ecstatic or not.
I'd be happy if daemons stayed mostly the way they are now. The only thing I really want to see go away is rolling for which wave I get.
Yeah, I'd be okay with that. But they'd never do a full codes with that being the only change. They might make new models and only update a couple rules, but sadly, I'd expect more than only one rule change: otherwise they'd WD it.
It'd be nice if you could start some stuff on the table. I never liked the whole "My army shows up to an empty field for no apparent reason and then DAEMONS EVERYWHERE!" part of Codexaemons.
If the idea is to represent a daemonic incursion or infestation, then maybe let's have it underway by the time the battle begins.
H.B.M.C. wrote: It'd be nice if you could start some stuff on the table. I never liked the whole "My army shows up to an empty field for no apparent reason and then DAEMONS EVERYWHERE!" part of Codexaemons.
If the idea is to represent a daemonic incursion or infestation, then maybe let's have it underway by the time the battle begins.
Or rather, it's more like, your army has seen the skies turn multi-coloured and rain frogs/rats/blood/whatever and they know something's up and are preparing their defensive positions before the Daemons finally erupt from the immaterium.
H.B.M.C. wrote: It'd be nice if you could start some stuff on the table. I never liked the whole "My army shows up to an empty field for no apparent reason and then DAEMONS EVERYWHERE!" part of Codexaemons.
If the idea is to represent a daemonic incursion or infestation, then maybe let's have it underway by the time the battle begins.
Perhaps the option to start something on the field, but I don't want a requirement to do so. Letting my opponent go first and denying him an entire turn of shooting is nice. Other than rolling for which wave I get, I'm pretty happy with how Daemons deploy.
via 75Hastings69 over on Warseer wrote:
I was under the impression that the khorne chariot was either built for a herald or built with a cannon option, not heard about this troop carrying option.
Autocannon strength blast weapon? Crazy talk! If they were planning on something like that, they may as well have put it in the BRB weapons summary, to futureproof it a little. Maybe call it something cool like a Macro-cannon.
Furies as Vanguard vets makes a lot of sense for making them useful.
Some of the Chariot Alt builds would be good for expanding the Heavy Support section, like this Khorne cannon. More Daemonforge stuff would also be nice.
Psychic power wise, I'd like to see Daemons be brought into line with everyone else, so psychic defenses work against them (psychic defenses work against the warp, which Daemons are a part of afterall) but just have Daemons ignore perils results. Then give them the three god aligned lores from the CSM book, and Divination, Telepathy, and Biomancy which match Tzeentch, Slaanesh, and Nurgle rather well respectively.
"Daemons
Daemons are currently one of those armies that I think really needs an update. While we had one just a few months back, it has lead to a lot of simple armies of nothing but screamers and flamers. Now do not get me wrong, I don't want to get down on people that are doing that, as they are amazing units, but for what they do with two wounds each, the point cost for them is incredible. I would go as far as saying that screamers might be the best overall single unit in the game right now. After all 3 base attacks at S5 AP2 with armourbane on a 2 wound T4 jebike that cannot be insta killed. Just put them in units of 9 (max) and go to town.
While I would really like to see a full codex release, it appears that a White Dwarf update is in the works. This is great, Slaanesh and Tzeentch received updates in the last one, so I am looking forward to seeing what looks like a Khorne and Nurgle update hit. I miss seeing those unruly Bloodletters hitting the battlefield in mass.
Now that we are getting lots of rumors about Daemons, they really are giving us the feel that they are coming next. While its always hard to tell for sure if the rumors are feeding off of each other, it does appear that we are getting a lot of the information from different sources.
So if Daemons are indeed scheduled for February, I am going to take the assumption that it means we will see pre-orders hit at the end of that month, and the release hit the first week of March."
MajorWesJanson wrote: Autocannon strength blast weapon? Crazy talk! If they were planning on something like that, they may as well have put it in the BRB weapons summary, to futureproof it a little. Maybe call it something cool like a Macro-cannon.
Furies as Vanguard vets makes a lot of sense for making them useful.
Some of the Chariot Alt builds would be good for expanding the Heavy Support section, like this Khorne cannon. More Daemonforge stuff would also be nice.
Psychic power wise, I'd like to see Daemons be brought into line with everyone else, so psychic defenses work against them (psychic defenses work against the warp, which Daemons are a part of afterall) but just have Daemons ignore perils results. Then give them the three god aligned lores from the CSM book, and Divination, Telepathy, and Biomancy which match Tzeentch, Slaanesh, and Nurgle rather well respectively.
Tzeentch without Pryomancy would be like an Eldar Farseer who's suddenly become iliterate and starts reading those runes of witnessing backwards.
Divination makes more sense for ol' Fateweaver, remember how Tzeentch couldn't see the future so he threw Fateweaver in and he emerged all "I can see the past and future but not the present!"
Since this is my wife's army, and I love watching her get excited about stuff like this, the chance that Daemons will see the second half of their update is making me smile.
Can't wait to see if the rumors are true.
It’s also good to see GW going out of their way to make as much of the daemon range in plastic as possible. Daemons have always been all metal (until the Daemon codex hit, that is).
Now with each release more and more are turning to plastic. Sure, the results aren’t always great (see any Slaaneshi plastic kit), but it’s almost always better than metal (except in the case of Diaz Daemonettes/Daemonette Cav).
If they could just get Flesh Hounds, Fiends and Beasts of Nurgle in plastic it’d be great.
I’m in two minds about it. I have a whole host of the old Plague Bearers, and I really like them. But I can see the need for plastic ones and the plastic ones are at least decent (unlike the Daemonettes, who are universally terrible).
I mean, I don’t really like the plastic Bloodletters at all and much prefer my big burly axe-wielding metal Bloodletters, but I know why they need to be plastic and I don’t mind the design too much.
I can see why GW changed from the old Daemonettes, to keep it kid friendly... but I agree that the whole "Humanoid Lizard Hermaphrodite Crab" thing was way to much. Turned them from pretty to your worst nightmare...
I hate the daemon plastics
they all went back to the really ugly metals (before the good ones) with exception of the horrors (the old metals being hilarious and awesome and-they look pretty much the same)
that is an army I love the idea and fluff for...but hate every model GW puts out for them these days and would rather have Matt Ward beat me over the head with the Hobbit rulebook I had to buy then paint any of those abominations again
I hate the previous edition Plaguebearers, but the edition of models just prior to them were amazing. I like these new plastics a lot though. Daemonettes don't bother me too much either, not as good as the Diaz-nettes, but the Diaz-nettes that I sold bought me triple the new 'nettes, so that was a bonus.
I do hope that the Juggers in the new Dex/Update get finaly considered has cavalry like in the CSM dex...
Also more synergy and wargear can't be a bad thing.
Oh, and please, please, please by the Dark Gods hairybutts, please let the "Skull for the Skull Throne" rule from the Skulltaker, be untouched or at least that it doesn't become listed has Deamonic gift..., its always funny to see Dreadknights trying to Excommuniate the Skulltaker and that his insta-gib rule still work, sometimes when i see this, i think there is a justice in this world...
I'm conflicted with one of the new GDs. On one hand, a plastic Lord of Change would be so useful.
On the other hand, my very first metal Lord of Change is worth a lot of sentimental value considering I assembled it 6 years ago with nothing but GW Superglue. No pinning, no magnetss, no greenstuff. Just superglue and holding wings in place for hours......
what makes me really sad is the idea of getting a new KoS (if we even get one at all according to BoLS). at first I couldn’t say how excited I was at the prospect of a 6th and final one but then I remembered......they've been basing all the new sculpts off the god awful old OLD metal ones (e.g, bloodletters no longer look like manic, axe swinging devils they look like warty...red....daemon things....)
which is why I'm dreading geting a plastic this:
as opposed to a plastic this :/ :
that being said the current one isn’t much to look at at all >.>
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Matt.Kingsley wrote: I can see why GW changed from the old Daemonettes, to keep it kid friendly... but I agree that the whole "Humanoid Lizard Hermaphrodite Crab" thing was way to much. Turned them from pretty to your worst nightmare...
To bad GW is dead-set to keep them ugly
which brings us back to the age old topic of gore, blood and skulls being fine but as soon as someone shows a boob, everybody grabs their power pitch forks
...which brings us back to the age old topic of gore, blood and skulls being fine but as soon as someone shows a boob, everybody grabs their power pitch forks
Blame the over-protective, religous zealot, politically correct, b -@$$ soccer moms of North America for this one.
For some reason over here, insane, gory violence is fine for Little Timmy.
But boobies are evil, perverting, devils that will make children do horrible things and teach them immoral values.
When I worked at the local GW for example, we had to 'bookshelf' the boxes of Diaz-Daemonettes to try and keep kids from seeing them because so many uptight, jumped-up, self-rightous b moms complained...
...These would be the same mothers thoug hwho thought it perfectly fine for their 8 or 9 year old kid to play games like Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto though.
gorgon wrote: More and more it's sounding like CoD/DoC could be ANOTHER update instead of a new book. Which is disappointing and kinda strange at first blush. But then considering it's a whole new digital age for GW...maybe more rolling updates and fewer codex/book redos will be the wave of the future.
It would make sencse in the short term as there are many models that could use aesthetic upgrades
Experiment 626 wrote:
For some reason over here, insane, gory violence is fine for Little Timmy.
But boobies are evil, perverting, devils that will make children do horrible things and teach them immoral values.
...which brings us back to the age old topic of gore, blood and skulls being fine but as soon as someone shows a boob, everybody grabs their power pitch forks
Blame the over-protective, religous zealot, politically correct, b -@$$ soccer moms of North America for this one.
For some reason over here, insane, gory violence is fine for Little Timmy.
But boobies are evil, perverting, devils that will make children do horrible things and teach them immoral values.
When I worked at the local GW for example, we had to 'bookshelf' the boxes of Diaz-Daemonettes to try and keep kids from seeing them because so many uptight, jumped-up, self-rightous b moms complained...
...These would be the same mothers thoug hwho thought it perfectly fine for their 8 or 9 year old kid to play games like Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto though.
I found the new Plague Bearers much better when you actually bought a box. The official pics didn't do the models justice, there were lots of nice little details.
I hated the old Plaguebearers and really like the new ones.
The GD I'm looking forward to the most is a new Greater Unclean One, the current model is horrible. I tolerate the Bloodthirster, and I actually like Fateweaver's model.
Flashman wrote: I found the new Plague Bearers much better when you actually bought a box. The official pics didn't do the models justice, there were lots of nice little details.
i totally agree. not to mention they're half the price, easy to assemble and don't look like melted terds.
...which brings us back to the age old topic of gore, blood and skulls being fine but as soon as someone shows a boob, everybody grabs their power pitch forks
Blame the over-protective, religous zealot, politically correct, b -@$$ soccer moms of North America for this one.
For some reason over here, insane, gory violence is fine for Little Timmy.
But boobies are evil, perverting, devils that will make children do horrible things and teach them immoral values.
When I worked at the local GW for example, we had to 'bookshelf' the boxes of Diaz-Daemonettes to try and keep kids from seeing them because so many uptight, jumped-up, self-rightous b moms complained...
...These would be the same mothers thoug hwho thought it perfectly fine for their 8 or 9 year old kid to play games like Call of Duty or Grand Theft Auto though.
ugh....tell me you're kidding ;-;
see, this is why we cant have nice things XD
Nope, 'fraid not...
Remember the 6th edition Dark Elf army book? It's release was delayed because GW had to edit out a good deal of the evil, half-naked pixies and naked Witch Elves becaus eit was deemed too sexually explicit for US release.
Anyways, for those who really like the old metal, beefier Bloodletters in place of the the newer, sleeker ones, try this conversion;
a) saw the torso off of a plastic Bestigor
b) add Bloodletter torso, arms & head.
Viola! taller, beefier & semi-armoured Bloodletters!
They actually stand ever so slightly taller than a marine, and they look meaner than the skiny, old-school throwback dudes!
If I had a camera, I'd post pics of my conversions... Sadly, technology hates me with a passion.
I remember being pretty pumped with the current generation of greater daemons came out. But they're looking pretty dated at this point. I know re-sculpts are guaranteed to be better, but I'm excited to see what GW could do with them in a sweet plastic kit (with extras and alternate parts!).
I don't know if I want the GD to be bigger or not.
If they get bigger, then my soon-to-be converted KoS from the Deciever (which is already boardering on being too small, width-wise) will definately not be playable as a GD...
On the otherhand, if they are bigger, Nemisis Baby Carriers won't seem so big.
via 75Hastings69 on Warseer wrote:
Whether the update will be a White Dwarf Release or Codex/Army Book
both army book & codex this time round, they'll include the new nurgle flies the khorne cannon thing as well as the stuff that was in the booklet last time in WD
regarding when we will see the Chaos Daemons codex pre-orders
My dates used to be pre-order dates
Really looking forward to this release if it truly is a full Codex.
It will basically seal the fate of my Chaos Marines. I don't want to ally with IG because they are lame and expensive, so I want my only battle bro to be a good one.
I prefer Khorne, so I'm hoping they get something to help Bloodletters from getting shot up as soon as they land. Bloodcrushers being Cavalry is awesome too... if only a Khorne Lord on a juggy could join them...
Natfka via an anonymous source wrote:
Here is the latest rumor bits
The next white dwarf previews the new daemons.
The previously white dwarf released units are changing slightly (some get better, some worse).
The following white dwarf previews flyers.
So feb daemons,
March flyers.
Oh p.s. No new god. No hybrid GDs. Expanded fluff on malice.
More rumors and inside sources are chiming in that it is indeed a full Chaos Daemons release coming, Hardback codex and all. This is excellent news, and a first that I can recall of 40k getting two codices released in successive months. Wow.
Talking about a fast and furious release schedule for Games Workshop. If this all comes to fruition, I just want to say thank you GW. If release schedules like this continue, we really could see a 4 codex release year for 2013. Exciting indeed.
Also of note, flyers are mentioned for a March release.
via an anonymous source
Here is the latest rumor bits
The next white dwarf previews the new daemons.
The previously white dwarf released units are changing slightly (some get better, some worse).
The following white dwarf previews flyers.
So feb daemons,
March flyers.
Oh p.s. No new god. No hybrid GDs. Expanded fluff on malice.
it's two separate books. Not one book that has rules for both like the white dwarf updates.
it's a hard cover full release not an insert.
Schedule
Look for dual 40K/WFB Chaos Daemons army book-codexes in Feb/March.
They should be in the March White Dwarf, and hit the street end of February
New Models (cut this list into two equal sized waves - one with the codex, one following up a quarter later).
- All four Greater Daemon plastic kits with named options
- Plastic Furies, dual-option kit with "Flesh Terrors"
- Plastic Khorne Chariot, herald, dual kit with a cannon, pulled by Bloodcrushers
- Plastic Tzeentch Chariot, herald, dual kit with "flame-beast" pulled by screamers, ( 40k: a Skimmer)
- Plastic Nurgle Palanquin, (chariot), carried by Nurglings, (combines with Nurgle GD kit for named character model - Ku'gath)
- Nurgle Plague-flies jetbikes/monsterous cavalry (40K-Elites, WFB-Rares)
- New Daemon-engine, bipedal with atypical porportions, uses ectoplasmic weaponry of CSMs, has numerous options for CC or Ranged loadout. (40K- Heavy, WFB-Special)
- New Daemon flying MC. (40K-Fast Attack-flyer, WFB-Rare)
Rules
- Daemon Princes with Wings will move slots in 40K.
- Look for across the board points increases in the codex/army book.
usa_supersonic wrote: So..i don't get it. Are demons for sure in fantasy? are they for sure in 40k?
For sure , meaning as sure as you can be- like the DA rumors
They are as 'for sure' as rumors get. Keep in mind that over 50% of the DA rumors were wrong.
usa_supersonic wrote: So..i don't get it. Are demons for sure in fantasy? are they for sure in 40k?
For sure , meaning as sure as you can be- like the DA rumors
They are as 'for sure' as rumors get. Keep in mind that over 50% of the DA rumors were wrong.
I mean, about the release date- not the rules per se. Do we know they are going to be release in february- or are there strong sources in that direction?
New Models (cut this list into two equal sized waves - one with the codex, one following up a quarter later).
- four plastic kits
- Plastic
- Plastic
- Plastic
- Plastic
- Nurgle Plague-flies
- New Daemon-engine,
- New Daemon flying MC.
That list is too long. Around a dozen kits, some of them likely to be huge, is far too much for two waves.
Hadn't heard all of this, the ectoplasm on the Engine, the daemonic flyer and princes moving slots was all new to me, and I've been following the rumours with interest.
Slightly baffled by the points increase though, isn't GW's normal MO to decrease points to force purchases?
Unless they are getting a bunch of nasty new rules like the Flamers.
Yeah, expect possibly chariots and any new units they are putting in. They are pretty crazy right now about making sure any models released have rules and that rules have models. At least so far moving forward. There wasn't a single unit in CSM or DA that didn't have a model.
...hmmm...got to love it when people reword something then don't give credit to Harry, Hastings, and Nat
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Hulksmash wrote: I could see a Tzeentch one too. But yeah, BS on most of the stuff.
Actually considering the source he borrowed the info from... ...I am betting that alot of it will come to pass though not all at once.
Harry, Warseer, 8-16-12 wrote:In an effort to pull together what few rumours we have …
I have started threads for each of the armies rumoured to be somewhere in the pipeline.
I will do my best to keep the first posts updated as more rumours appear in these threads.
I have tried to remember as much as I can of what has been posted so far.
I will have missed or forgotten some of it ... so, any rumours that have been posted please just remind me ‘who’ said ‘what’ and I will update this first post.
Daemons of Chaos:
I know we have only just had a wave of Daemons but now we have this from hastings:
Release Date:
Hastings wrote:"The daemon rules should be taken as a stepping stone to the updated book (much like the wdvc terrorgheist article) next 4 books (for both systems are all chaos (in one form or another) and will hit within 4-5 months for all of them".
All will be realeased within 4-5 months of the CSM codex hitting (sep afaik)
So we are talking february at the latest?
Author:
Unknown
Rules:
Unknown ... Beyond those suggested by the rules booklet in the recent WD
Models:
Hastings wrote:All 4 greater Deamons will get plastic kits (with head/weapon options plus wfb/40k specific bits on sprues) and that there will be "resin conversion packs" to make "named greater Deamons".
No idea of timescales on this. I am not expecting them to arrive together Or with this wave. (Harry)
NatTreeHouse wrote:Jes Goodwin is rumoured to be doing the Bloodthirster. (BRING IT ON! ) No timescale for this.
stickmonkey wrote:Khorne chariot, two bloodcrushers pulling a wagon with herald option or some fire belching thing. Large base
Tzentch chariot, pulled by screamers, with horrors riding, but I've also heard it has a large flamer rider too. Large base
Nurgle palanquin, nurglings, daemon prince base, fat plague bearer.
4 GD with variants for named daemons and swappable options, most rumors point to resin packs, but I've heard wind its all in the plastic kits lately. I'd lean towards Harry's news, but I hope for all in one myself. I have heard that these may be moving to the larger base now, if so, they will be huge. One can hope, but I don't have a lot of confidence in this bit.
Furies (no dual kit options I've heard of.) in plastic.
Plastic fiends were being worked on at one point, but I haven't heard anything about them recently.
New elite daemon engine. 40k Dreadnought sized. Lots of options. Quasi-God specific bits like the soulgrinder. Supposedly unique to daemons not the same as this new unit for chaos space marines.
stickmonkey wrote:Big khorn flame belcher thing
Tzeentch Larger flamer instead of horrors.
Sounded like more ranged options for the daemons.
BRING IT ON!
It is kinda hard to see at first light but Harry is quoting Hastings, NatTreeHouse, SM...actually most of the bottom items are from SM
Warseer 8-17-12:
Harry wrote:Well, what I heard ... was two waves of models AND two 'waves' of Greater Daemons. In other words the Greater Daemons would be coming in two pairs.... which makes sense..... not many of us would be able to crash for all four in the same month! However ... until hastings posted I had heard nothing about a book .... for either system.
Warseer 8-22-12:
Hastings wrote:
Harry referencing stickmonkey wrote:Khorne chariot, two bloodcrushers pulling a wagon with herald option or some fire belching thing. Large base
Interesting
Just noticed this so apologies for not crediting the OP, as usual Harry will take the glory I'm sure
..... I also hear a very loud buzzing noise
Warseer 10-9-12:
Hastings wrote:Already been answered on the forums (check the roundup Harry went to the trouble of doing in post #1). For those that didn't read it, khorne get a chariot...... But it has, erm, ...... Options
Warseer 1-10-13:
Hastings wrote:Hmmm, I do recall some chat about a Tzeentch chariot with the option of having 1 really big flamer on it, can't recall where I heard it though so please don't take it as gospel.
H.B.M.C. wrote: Besides, we have one report saying that the plastic GD's won't include parts for special chars, and then another right after it saying they will.
I'm calling yes to plastic GDs, but no to anything relating to special chars. I'm also calling bs on all the chariots other than the Khornate one.
Even after the Swarmlord? Just curious why you'd say BS. It would follow that monstrous creatures get SCs in the box.
...or am I just so hopeful it's true I'm deluding myself?
The GD's will come, I'm not calling BS on them, not 100% together on this release but they'll come. I'm calling BS on any of the crazier stuff because if it's geniunely a codex they want every unit in the codex to have a model. Expect the kits released to fill those gaps. They can always release a plastic replacement for existing models later. But GW has been pretty fanatical about having everything in a book released this edition. Probably in response to the CH stuff as well as other companies who would slide in first back in 5th edition.
Scottywan82 wrote: Even after the Swarmlord? Just curious why you'd say BS. It would follow that monstrous creatures get SCs in the box.
...or am I just so hopeful it's true I'm deluding myself?
Yes, true. Swarmlord and Karl Franz on Deathclaw as well. I certainly want there to be bits for the special characters in there, but I’m just not getting my hopes up.
But this release just seems to have so much stuff, so I expect only half of it to be true.
To sum up the BOLS rumours:
Daemons are in February, no March. Definitely covered in WD February, no March, with preorders late February. And Flyers March, no.
What bothers me is the rumor of point increases across the board for both games. In Fantasy, I can understand it. 40k? Not without some serious changes. Daemonettes should be cheaper, or be able to attack on the turn they DS. Honestly, they should only be about 10 points a piece, given the cost of where SMs are headed. Bloodletters need to gain AP2 on their swords and/or the option for axes, with preferred enemy everyone, or else a decrease in points down to 14ish, etc, etc. I can understand Flamers going up in price (23 is way too cheap for what they do), but some of the other things...to hell with that.
Yeah, if anything the points need to drop across the board for daemons. And as for the Screamers and Flamers if they remove the EW rule for Daemons then those two are costed correctly.
timetowaste85 wrote: What bothers me is the rumor of point increases across the board for both games. In Fantasy, I can understand it. 40k? Not without some serious changes. Daemonettes should be cheaper, or be able to attack on the turn they DS. Honestly, they should only be about 10 points a piece, given the cost of where SMs are headed. Bloodletters need to gain AP2 on their swords and/or the option for axes, with preferred enemy everyone, or else a decrease in points down to 14ish, etc, etc. I can understand Flamers going up in price (23 is way too cheap for what they do), but some of the other things...to hell with that.
I call absolute BS on "across the board pts increases".
GW's MO for both 8th ed & 6th ed has been to drastically cut the costs of Core/Troops and only really nerf those units that were spamed ad nausium over the past year or two. They want us bulking up on our basics and adding all the shiny new stuff, while also buying the old "crap/underpowered" units.
In Fantasy I can see Bloodletters getting a pts increase upto say 14-15pts/model since they are effectively non-armoured T3 Chaos Warriors! But then I can also postentially see GW giving 'Letters back their own armour save/scaley skin as well.
But Horrors are fine right now, perhaps even a bit nerfed by the Magic Phase changes, Plaugebearers are gimped and Daemonettes are over-costed!
In 40k, every one of our Scoring units are are dedly over-costed! Even Horrors who are considered 'the best' choice aren't worth +1pt more than a Tactical Marine. If anything, I can see Horrors costing the same as the new DA/CSM basic pts cost, Bloodletters drop slightly and perhaps even gain a slight armour save, Plaguebearers drop a point as well, and Daemonettes become 8-10pts or so per model. (really, T3/5++ is pretty much 'horde standard' and they need to be fielded as such to be viable!)
As for those rampaging Flamers/Screamers? As mentioned numerous itmes, ditch the army-wide Eternal Warrior and they're perfectly fine.
The fact that people have so much trouble dealing with them right now is more in part to opponents not bringing basic small arms & other anti-infantry options to the table... If you still insist on playing like it's 5th ed with max melta-spam then, well, it's not the Daemon player's fault you can't deal with their army!
BOLS wrote:
- New Daemon-engine, bipedal with atypical porportions, uses ectoplasmic weaponry of CSMs, has numerous options for CC or Ranged loadout. (40K- Heavy, WFB-Special)
- New Daemon flying MC. (40K-Fast Attack-flyer, WFB-Rare)
Please please pleeeease let them be more creative and interesting sculpts than the CSM dragonzord/gobots that just released!
BOLS wrote:
- New Daemon-engine, bipedal with atypical porportions, uses ectoplasmic weaponry of CSMs, has numerous options for CC or Ranged loadout. (40K- Heavy, WFB-Special)
- New Daemon flying MC. (40K-Fast Attack-flyer, WFB-Rare)
Please please pleeeease let them be more creative and interesting sculpts than the CSM dragonzord/gobots that just released!
PLEASE!
I'm actually less bothered about the models than the rules in this instance. It's normally a visual thing for me with a new army, the models HAVE to be right for me to start, which isbwhy I've struggled to start Warmachine as I don't like the aesthetic much.
For DoC though, there are soooo many alternate models out there, plus such scope for conversion that if I don't like a model I'll find an alternative that I do, and if I can't find one I'll create one. I can do that and actually make my army more fluffy and chaotic looking.
None of that matters if they're bonk on the tabletop though!
Larry Vela wrote:So remember all that talk of Chaos Daemons coming soon on the heels of the Dark Angels? Well here is what the cold voices on the wind portend...
via tsetse fly
Incoming Chaos Daemon Wave:
It is believed to be a Q1 release. There is conflicting chatter as to whether the Codex is coming as well, or whether it is a miniatures-only wave with White Dwarf rules like we say in Q4-12.
Miniatures:
BloodThirster
Great Unclean One,
New Nurgle "jetbikes" - Described as GIANT FLIES with Plaguebearer Riders!!!
Khornate Chariot with dual-build options.
-Option 1: Transport (holds a big squad of daemons, opened top)
-Option 2: Cannon Variant (autocannon equivalent blast template, medium range)
~More as we get it. Nurgle flying cav sounds totally cool! This does sound like its is roughly along wiht lines of the last Chaos Daemons wave. It has a new cav unit, a chariot to use those new 40k chariot rules, and a couple of new Majors thrown in for good measure. This is a good thing. The current GW Major Daemons are ancient and kind of embarrassing by modern production standards.
For the work blocked.
Hastings said late last year though we would getting "books".
Outside of his release months being off by a month or so, when was the last time Hastings confused army book/codex for 'WD rules'?!
Besides, Daemons need;
a) A serious balancing act in Fantasy, since it's still laughably easy to make auto-win builds.
b) A serious balancing act in 40k to bring them into line with proper pts costings, better deployment (ie: f -off with your BS rolling for waves stupidity!), a bit more shooty power outside of 'just play Tzeentch' and SOMETHING to make the army viable against Derp Knights.
I agree on the "derp knights". Im about to start playing 40k against a GK player, and my wife would like to get in on the action, but her collection/army so far is daemons...almost no point in their current condition.
Experiment 626 wrote: In 40k, every one of our Scoring units are are dedly over-costed! Even Horrors who are considered 'the best' choice aren't worth +1pt more than a Tactical Marine.
I can see Horrors costing the same as the new DA/CSM basic pts cost, Bloodletters drop slightly and perhaps even gain a slight armour save, Plaguebearers drop a point as well, and Daemonettes become 8-10pts or so per model. (really, T3/5++ is pretty much 'horde standard' and they need to be fielded as such to be viable!)
With the new DA book, the standard for Tac marines dropped to 14 points. 14 point Horrors would be nice for the Daemons player, but seems a bit undercosted. Maybe 15 points apiece?
Bloodletters - make them 15 points, give them an option to pay 3 points/model to gain a 4+ armor save.
Experiment 626 wrote: In 40k, every one of our Scoring units are are dedly over-costed! Even Horrors who are considered 'the best' choice aren't worth +1pt more than a Tactical Marine.
I can see Horrors costing the same as the new DA/CSM basic pts cost, Bloodletters drop slightly and perhaps even gain a slight armour save, Plaguebearers drop a point as well, and Daemonettes become 8-10pts or so per model. (really, T3/5++ is pretty much 'horde standard' and they need to be fielded as such to be viable!)
With the new DA book, the standard for Tac marines dropped to 14 points. 14 point Horrors would be nice for the Daemons player, but seems a bit undercosted. Maybe 15 points apiece?
Bloodletters - make them 15 points, give them an option to pay 3 points/model to gain a 4+ armor save.
Plaguebearers - current points cost is not bad at 15.
Nurglings - cost is fine, just make them scoring.
a) 14-15pts/model for Pinkies *IF* they keep Warpfire as it currently stands.
While their shooting does about the same damage as a rapid firing Tactical Squad, they're still kept in check by being just BS3 and T3/4++ could potentially become just the basic rulebook T3/5++ meaning they'll die in droves.
b) Bloodletters are complete terds right now, dropping them 1 entire whole point means litterly nothing has changed! Then jacking them upto a hypothetical total of 18pts/model for a 4+ save on an assault unit that is forced to always Deep Strike into play?
Congrats, you've just killed Bloodletters entirely!
15pts/model should include a 4+ save. They're only ap3 in combat and they don't need to improve on that, beyond a 'Champion only' upgrade and/or Heralds getting an ap2 option. (and IMHO, Bloodletters themselves don't need any kind of ap2 option since Slaaneshii units, Screamers, Heralds & MC's already exist!)
c) Daemonettes could still be 8pts/model and still be prettt fairly balanced...
I mean, how hard is really to kill a piddly little T3/5++ model that is forced to stand about doing nothing for a turn beyond a re-rollable D6" run move?! They're no harder to kill than Ork Boyz and they're damage output is about the equal of a Slugga Boy all told.
d) People only take 'Bearers currently to hold objectives and/or to protect Eppie. Even a point or two drop would be welcomed since they have no shooting, are saddled with Slow and Purposeful, and only boast a single attack per stinker.
They're good now yes, but expensive for what little overall impact they have since a bad scatter can easily ruin the unit's playability.
e) Swarms IIRC never count as Scoring. Nurglings should be no different!
via anonymous on Faeit212 wrote:
Nothing was wrong with the dates I provided, I guess I just wasn't clear.
Febuary WD is daemons, march WD is flyers.
At least, in so far as the white dwarf released in feb, etc.
The white dwarf released in december had DAngels for instance.
It's back to back releases with a heavier focus on 40k for the next year to two years to get all the army books up to date. Then expect new units in white dwarf releases and army updates to spot fill anything that needs a boost here or there. Then it will be a primary focus on expansions and supplements as opposed to just a revolving door of codexes.
via anonymous on Faeit212 wrote:
Nothing was wrong with the dates I provided, I guess I just wasn't clear.
Febuary WD is daemons, march WD is flyers.
At least, in so far as the white dwarf released in feb, etc.
The white dwarf released in december had DAngels for instance.
It's back to back releases with a heavier focus on 40k for the next year to two years to get all the army books up to date. Then expect new units in white dwarf releases and army updates to spot fill anything that needs a boost here or there. Then it will be a primary focus on expansions and supplements as opposed to just a revolving door of codexes.
6th edition is here to stay.
That sounds like it'll be announced at the end of February and available to buy in March. I had hope it would be announced in the next WD (at the end of January) and available to buy in February.
HarryLeChien wrote: It will be, from what the source says; the next WD is the February issue, released end Jan.
It looks like from what Faet was clarifying, was he meant the WD released in Feb, as the Feb WD.
I will honestly be really surprised if we See Daemons released in March. April, I could possiblely see, but I would be really surprised with a back to back release.
No worries, Sasori. If they don't come out in March, he'll just say he meant that they were in warehouses in Feb, pre-order in March and release in April.
Ah my mistake sorry, I assumed he was referring to the cover date not the publication date, re-reading what was said I think you are correct (I also think I got my WoC mixed up with my DoC ).
I think many of us will be surprised with back-to-back releases but rumours have pointed both to an increased rate of codex/book production and daemons out feb /march for a while now so I for one am hopeful.
pretre wrote: No worries, Sasori. If they don't come out in March, he'll just say he meant that they were in warehouses in Feb, pre-order in March and release in April.
Sounds like he's just trying to cover his ass to me too.
And nobody is at all disturbed by his comment of "6th is here to stay"? We all know it's GW's policy to keep making changes to editions to invalidate codexes so that the good stuff becomes bad and the bad becomes good (Spawn in the 4th->6th codex change? Bad->AMAZING!) If they didn't do this, they wouldn't keep selling all models, only a few. I don't buy the rumors at all, based on the source and the information he puts out that flies in the face of GW tradition. That said, with Wells gone, maybe there will be changes? Maybe that was the start to changing the game.
via anonymous on Faeit212 wrote:
Nothing was wrong with the dates I provided, I guess I just wasn't clear.
Febuary WD is daemons, march WD is flyers.
At least, in so far as the white dwarf released in feb, etc.
The white dwarf released in december had DAngels for instance.
It's back to back releases with a heavier focus on 40k for the next year to two years to get all the army books up to date. Then expect new units in white dwarf releases and army updates to spot fill anything that needs a boost here or there. Then it will be a primary focus on expansions and supplements as opposed to just a revolving door of codexes.
6th edition is here to stay.
I don't believe this rumor for a second. It is too logical and good for the fans and allows new players a chance to actually get to know the entire rules set for the first time in the history of 40k.
Lots of wish listing and talk of how to fix troops. What I would most like to see is pink horrors go old school and split into blues. GW could release a box of 20 blue horrors that are grot sized for the same cost as pink horrors, everyone with pinkies also has to buy blues, and GW doubled the $ price of pink horrors while making the player base happy.
As far as rules pinkies at 17 or 18 same stats except only a 5+ splitting into 2 blues with grot stats and the deamon usr sounds about right...one could wish.
They may well just release the models with no rules, then you'll have to wait for a codex update (whenever that comes) if this is true
The pamphlet idea suffers from identical problems to WD, it will eventually run out (and if free expect folk to grab it to ebay) so I can't imagine they'd do one.
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote: They may well just release the models with no rules, then you'll have to wait for a codex update (whenever that comes) if this is true
The pamphlet idea suffers from identical problems to WD, it will eventually run out (and if free expect folk to grab it to ebay) so I can't imagine they'd do one.
and GW and pdfs' don't mix
I've worked for about two dozen professional businesses in my time.
I've never seen another company as inaccessible and poorly managed and marketed as GW.
It's a testament to how loyal gamers are.
Actually I take that back. American car companies were as bad, if not worse (Maybe minus the marketing) and look what happened to them.
You have to admit Toyota was just as badly managed (look at the string of 'serious enough to kill you' recalls they've had to do recently), you just didn't see the problems on the surface
And Honda got fed up with Formula 1 and sold the team to Ross Braun when they'd just designed a championship winning car.
Edit: now if you'd said Nissan/Lexus I wouldn't have had a snappy comeback
Daemons do need a new army book. I imagine sales of flamers and screamers were terrible so they did the update to boost those sales knowing the new book would nerf them back to mediocre units.
I would love to see the tally ability shifted to a khorne daemon. Quite honestly it makes more sense than nurgle, at least to me.
Tick tock. I'm holding my breath hoping this is the truth. I'm hoping to gift my wife some new models and a new book. She plays Daemons and knows nothing about these rumors other than there is "Some rumor of new daemons"
Especially since I didn't get to start that DA army because of the prices. I sure hope they don't do the same to the new Daemons prices.
What I don't get is, if we have pictures from the latest WD and Daemons are meant to be March, shouldn't the "back page" have a teaser of what's to come. Unless they stopped doing that, why wouldn't somebody take a picture of that?
The 'Teasers' are now just a picture of a model with a quote, and that model almost always has nothing to do with next month.
At least, in the Australian WD it does.
Matt.Kingsley wrote: The 'Teasers' are now just a picture of a model with a quote, and that model almost always has nothing to do with next month.
At least, in the Australian WD it does.
Nope, it's all of them! No more back page teasers anymore...
Oh well, with the rumors of no more WD rules inserts, perhaps this means that the "Flyer Wave Rumors version 1,000.5" are way off base again and thus open the door for some long awaited Daemonic rules updates.
Overall Daemons are an utter mess in both games and need some serious work to fix the whole clusterfeth'ed issue.
Especially since I didn't get to start that DA army because of the prices. I sure hope they don't do the same to the new Daemons prices.
Good luck with that one.
Yeah prices are still going to be outrageous. I just hope they don't do another price increase this summer.
I would be utterly astonished if they didn't.
Agreed. Im getting back into 40k and Im going to get the vast majority of what I need within the next 4-8 weeks so I can avoid the major hit thats surely coming by mid summer. Im really leaning towards Tau, which means a whole new army from scratch...thats gonna be expensive enough as it is, never mind after another price increase. Actually if I had to wait until after Id likely just say nevermind and leave 40k alone and do something else.
All deamons of Khorne and Models with the MoK.
0-4 Kills-nothing
5-9 Gets armorbane
10-14 gets Flesh bane
15-19 Swords becomes AP2
21+ Gets Rampage rule.
Yeah wishlisting, i know, but its funny...
I do however hope that Blessing of the blood god stays like it is, its always funny to have your BT have a 2++ save against GK's...
Khorne cares not how many skulls are offered, only that they KEEP COMING and never stop!!
Odd that we had a flurry of posts regarding DoC and CD before the unexpected WoC release, and now its gone quiet again. Not that i have much cause for doubt when it comes to the kind of things Harry and Hastings say, their portents are more right than wrong from my observations.
Yeah prices are still going to be outrageous. I just hope they don't do another price increase this summer.
There has been a price increase every spring for as long as I can remember and the last two increases were especially outrageous on some of the most popular items like Space Marine vehicles. Increases occur around June 1 every year and I'm certain this year will be no different. I've already been kidding around with friends about being afraid to see what June 1 will bring from GW this year. If there's anything you want now be certain to buy it before the end of May.
Of course the new philosophy this past year has been to increase prices with every release from the earlier price point on comparable items. It's amazing and some of the pricing is absurd.
By the way, the re-boxed Chimera for Warriors of Chaos is going up slightly in price. In the US it's currently $41.25, it will be $45 in the new box with updated artwork.
Yeah prices are still going to be outrageous. I just hope they don't do another price increase this summer.
There has been a price increase every spring for as long as I can remember and the last two increases were especially outrageous on some of the most popular items like Space Marine vehicles.
I have been into 40k for almost 3 years. In that time, a Land Raider has gone from $60 to $66 to $74.25. I wonder how much will it go up this year??
Automatically Appended Next Post: Now, this is the same kit, no changes, same box, and I know inflation has not gone up that much.
The price of oil has gone down in that time, so it cannot be that - why do you want us to be poor GW?
Stickmonkey via Bols wrote:
Overview and Schedule
The Chaos Daemons release slot as last time around is a dual system release, updating the repsective armies for both Warhammer 40,000, and Warhammer Fantasy. There are a large number of models to be released as well as both books, so look for it to get broken up into 2 waves at least - with the lower possibility of 3 waves.
Look for the initial wave next month, and follow up waves a quarter later. That would put the first wave in March and the followup in June. Note however that Games Workshop has this thing for releasing Daemons in August - so that second wave might slide a little.
In any case, onto the waves themselves:
Wave 1
BloodThirster/Skarbrand (plastic)
Great Unclean One (plastic)
Chariot of Khorne/Herald of Khorne/Khorne Cannonade (anyone remember the old epic Doom Blaster)
Plague Flies of Nurgle
Palanquin of Nurgle/KuGath upgrade/Herald of Nurgle
Fiend of Slaanesh
There is also word of a named Daemon Prince and several smaller finecast models as well.
Last I heard they had been spotted and then vanished again, so this is the first firm inclusion of them I've seen in any rumour.
GDs with alternative parts has been going around for a while, flip flops between named characters and alternate options for modelling.
Can't recall a named DP before now either, so it's not entirely a retread.
One thing, while I quite like the idea of the Plague Flies, isn't it slightly counter to the whole Nurgle idea of Romero-esque shuffling plague monsters to have a unit that will likely be zipping around all over the shop?
I'm looking forward to the Chaos Daemon release. If only because it'll bring another range closer to being 100% plastic. Of the current models in the range only the Beasts of Nurgle, Fiends, Flesh Hounds, Furies, and Characters are metal/finecast. I'm personally looking forward to an almost entirely plastic range.
Is anyone else as deeply disturbed by the possibility (reality) that the Daemons will be similarly priced to match WoC? Greater Daemons will be around $85, Khorne chariots will be $40ish, etc. Good thing I already have all the old GDs and actually like them. I also have everything I need to make my own chariots, so I don't have to pay the outrageous upcoming fees.
timetowaste85 wrote: Is anyone else as deeply disturbed by the possibility (reality) that the Daemons will be similarly priced to match WoC? Greater Daemons will be around $85, Khorne chariots will be $40ish, etc. Good thing I already have all the old GDs and actually like them. I also have everything I need to make my own chariots, so I don't have to pay the outrageous upcoming fees.
Well on the bright side it will be cheaper to buy Ultraforge!
stickmonkey on BOLS wrote:This round of rumors is regarding the Second Wave, penciled in for June. Note however that Games Workshop has this thing for releasing Daemons in August - so that second wave might slide a little.
In any case, onto the waves themselves:
Wave 2
Keeper of Secrets/(Named GD of Slaanesh)
Lord of Change/Fateweaver
Furies/(Chaos ground daemons...I've heard this alternate kit unit has an "unstable" rules granting them an extra save, a 12" teleport, and a chance to lose models (determined randomly).
Hounds of Khorne
An all new Tzeentch Flyer... (NOT the Heldrake)
Chariot of Tzeentch/ Flame cannon alt kit)
Wouldn't GW be releasing all the 'new unit' kits in the first wave though?
Seems to be their new MO to get all the new units models w/book so as to avoid anymore 3rd party retailers beating them to the punch and making money off on unit entries with no models...
timetowaste85 wrote: Is anyone else as deeply disturbed by the possibility (reality) that the Daemons will be similarly priced to match WoC? Greater Daemons will be around $85, Khorne chariots will be $40ish, etc. Good thing I already have all the old GDs and actually like them. I also have everything I need to make my own chariots, so I don't have to pay the outrageous upcoming fees.
I have a Finecast Bloodthirster and Fateweaver. I actually like these two models and will not be replacing them, but if the Lord of Change is nice I'll probably pick one up.
Experiment 626 wrote: Wouldn't GW be releasing all the 'new unit' kits in the first wave though?
Seems to be their new MO to get all the new units models w/book so as to avoid anymore 3rd party retailers beating them to the punch and making money off on unit entries with no models...
This is my issue with the rumors. They don't match the last two releases which have had all new units released with the codex. Both 6th edition books have 100% of the units in the books available for purchase.
Sasori wrote: Yeah, I would think they would have the new Units in the release, and keep the Plastic GDs and Furies/hounds for later.
I would really like to see some new Fiend models though!
Me too, the butt-ugly current models are what has prevented me from buying any up to this point.
Although now that Screamers are so good, I still might not get any fiends. I know they fill slightly different niches, but in Screamers you get the same number of wounds, toughness and invulnerable save for less points. You trade a higher number of attacks at higher initiative for better mobility and S:5 AP:2 and Armorbane attacks.
Sasori wrote: Yeah, I would think they would have the new Units in the release, and keep the Plastic GDs and Furies/hounds for later.
I would really like to see some new Fiend models though!
Me too, the butt-ugly current models are what has prevented me from buying any up to this point.
Although now that Screamers are so good, I still might not get any fiends. I know they fill slightly different niches, but in Screamers you get the same number of wounds, toughness and invulnerable save for less points. You trade a higher number of attacks at higher initiative for better mobility and S:5 AP:2 and Armorbane attacks.
You mean Flamers?
Screamers are FA and Fiends are Elite, so there's nothing stopping you having both.
I plan, based on current rules, two large squads of flamers and one of Fiends, but I'm not pulling the trigger on the Fiends until I a) see the rules and b) see if they're any new models. If any rule changes suck, I'm out. If the models suck I'm shopping for alternates, as I doubt they'll be cheap and so they better look good!
Sasori wrote: Yeah, I would think they would have the new Units in the release, and keep the Plastic GDs and Furies/hounds for later.
I would really like to see some new Fiend models though!
Me too, the butt-ugly current models are what has prevented me from buying any up to this point.
Although now that Screamers are so good, I still might not get any fiends. I know they fill slightly different niches, but in Screamers you get the same number of wounds, toughness and invulnerable save for less points. You trade a higher number of attacks at higher initiative for better mobility and S:5 AP:2 and Armorbane attacks.
You mean Flamers?
Screamers are FA and Fiends are Elite, so there's nothing stopping you having both.
I plan, based on current rules, two large squads of flamers and one of Fiends, but I'm not pulling the trigger on the Fiends until I a) see the rules and b) see if they're any new models. If any rule changes suck, I'm out. If the models suck I'm shopping for alternates, as I doubt they'll be cheap and so they better look good!
No, I meant Screamers. I realize they're in different FOC slots, but they fill sort of the same role. Most places I'd want to use Fiends, I could replace them with Screamers and get a faster, cheaper unit with the same (or better) survivability.
Sasori wrote: Yeah, I would think they would have the new Units in the release, and keep the Plastic GDs and Furies/hounds for later.
I would really like to see some new Fiend models though!
Me too, the butt-ugly current models are what has prevented me from buying any up to this point.
Although now that Screamers are so good, I still might not get any fiends. I know they fill slightly different niches, but in Screamers you get the same number of wounds, toughness and invulnerable save for less points. You trade a higher number of attacks at higher initiative for better mobility and S:5 AP:2 and Armorbane attacks.
Yes, but I don't think anyone here honestly expects Screamers and flamers to stay the same. I'm sure in one way or another, they are going to get hit with the Nerfbat.
Sasori wrote: Yeah, I would think they would have the new Units in the release, and keep the Plastic GDs and Furies/hounds for later.
I would really like to see some new Fiend models though!
Me too, the butt-ugly current models are what has prevented me from buying any up to this point.
Although now that Screamers are so good, I still might not get any fiends. I know they fill slightly different niches, but in Screamers you get the same number of wounds, toughness and invulnerable save for less points. You trade a higher number of attacks at higher initiative for better mobility and S:5 AP:2 and Armorbane attacks.
Yes, but I don't think anyone here honestly expects Screamers and flamers to stay the same. I'm sure in one way or another, they are going to get hit with the Nerfbat.
Just remove Eternal Warrior from them and they're fine.
Sasori wrote: Yeah, I would think they would have the new Units in the release, and keep the Plastic GDs and Furies/hounds for later.
I would really like to see some new Fiend models though!
Me too, the butt-ugly current models are what has prevented me from buying any up to this point.
Although now that Screamers are so good, I still might not get any fiends. I know they fill slightly different niches, but in Screamers you get the same number of wounds, toughness and invulnerable save for less points. You trade a higher number of attacks at higher initiative for better mobility and S:5 AP:2 and Armorbane attacks.
Yes, but I don't think anyone here honestly expects Screamers and flamers to stay the same. I'm sure in one way or another, they are going to get hit with the Nerfbat.
That's likely, I'm nervous about any changes to be honest.
If this were still 5th Ed I'd want that new codex yesterday. But I think Daemons have come out ahead in the transition from 5th to 6th, even before the WD update which made use even better. I actually really like how my army plays and I'm happy with the options I have. I'm excited for new models, but wary of new rules and sweeping changes to an army that I love that has a unique play style.
Sasori wrote: Yeah, I would think they would have the new Units in the release, and keep the Plastic GDs and Furies/hounds for later.
I would really like to see some new Fiend models though!
Me too, the butt-ugly current models are what has prevented me from buying any up to this point.
Although now that Screamers are so good, I still might not get any fiends. I know they fill slightly different niches, but in Screamers you get the same number of wounds, toughness and invulnerable save for less points. You trade a higher number of attacks at higher initiative for better mobility and S:5 AP:2 and Armorbane attacks.
Yes, but I don't think anyone here honestly expects Screamers and flamers to stay the same. I'm sure in one way or another, they are going to get hit with the Nerfbat.
That's likely, I'm nervous about any changes to be honest.
If this were still 5th Ed I'd want that new codex yesterday. But I think Daemons have come out ahead in the transition from 5th to 6th, even before the WD update which made use even better. I actually really like how my army plays and I'm happy with the options I have. I'm excited for new models, but wary of new rules and sweeping changes to an army that I love that has a unique play style.
I've said this before, but that's my concern too. Daemons are probably the best catered for in terms of alternative models if some of the new sculpts suck, but if the book sucks, that all goes out the window.
I've only just started putting my collection together, so that would be the worst possible outcome.
Furies/(Chaos ground daemons...I've heard this alternate kit unit has an "unstable" rules granting them an extra save, a 12" teleport, and a chance to lose models (determined randomly).
GDs moving to the oval base seems an inevitability at this point; as the Bloodthirster is apparently the same size as a Dreadnight - at least height wise -, the Lord of Change is apparently the 'biggest' in height, even discounting the wings.
Also, given GWs more recent releases, bigger = better when concerning MCs. I for the life of me I cannot envision GDs staying on 60mm anymore, I just can't. Perhaps I'm wrong, but I think many of the later MCs have moved/been released on the Oval base. I could be wrong, I suppose.
Some say the GDs won't be present in the Codex/Army Book wave, but I doubt it. They're the centerpiece model by far and I cannot see what else would serve that purpose other than them. I think there is only a few 'new' units that need models as far as that priority goes, so I'd wager accuracy on Bloodthirster/Great Unclean One wave + others. All I know - and care for - is that GDs in whatever pairs will release the first time and the other pair the last wave.
For a Codex full of FMC I dont really see the use of an actual flyer, or are we in for some jump only GD (but then there would still be deamon princes)? Im sure I will spend a load of money on a flyer anyway.
A great Quetsalcoatl like serpent with beak and feathers would be great and fit nicely with GWs warped sense of mythology.
SanDiegoSurrealist via Warseer wrote:
Just talked to my local shop owner, he was placing orders today and it is confirmed that Daemons of Chaos will be released next month, what he could not tell me is if it is 40k, Fantasy, or both.
SanDiegoSurrealist via Warseer wrote:
Just talked to my local shop owner, he was placing orders today and it is confirmed that Daemons of Chaos will be released next month, what he could not tell me is if it is 40k, Fantasy, or both.
Can I get a squeeeeeeee?!!!!!
Although of course it will be both for a multitude of reasons.
SanDiegoSurrealist via Warseer wrote:
Just talked to my local shop owner, he was placing orders today and it is confirmed that Daemons of Chaos will be released next month, what he could not tell me is if it is 40k, Fantasy, or both.
Wooooooooooooot!!! *does the Happy Dance*
On the other hand, I think I just heard my wallet scream something commiting suicide...
Army Book + Codex + new toys AND I'll need to spend train+bus fare to get to the now "local" GW store... Gonna be an expensive month for sure.
Ah the first period of happiness with the announcement new army release. Then comes either the joy or horror at the new figs. Finally, the shock of the new prices and finally then resignation. Will still pick up the figs anyways
Only thing that doesn't sit right with these rumors of two waves has been GW has had all the new figures available at launch. Given the talk of people taking GW concept art and releasing copycat figs for units not officially released and that policy was to combat it. Will there be pictures of the new figures from wave 2 in the book? Will there be concept art?
These questions and more to be answered, sooooon...
96 page full colour, hardback Warhammer Armies book
Codex: Chaos Daemons
· 104 page full colour, hardback Codex
Chaos Daemons: Plague Drones of Nurgle
This box contains a multipart plastic kit that makes three Plague Drones that are multi-posable and offer collectors a large variety when assembling them
Chaos Daemons: Burning Chariot of Tzeentch/Herald of Tzeentch on Burning Chariot of Tzeentch
This box contains a multipart plastic kit that makes either a Burning Chariot of Tzeentch or a Herald of Tzeentch on a Burning Chariot of Tzeentch
Chaos Daemons: Blood Throne of Khorne/Skull Cannon of Khorne
This box contains a multipart plastic kit that makes either a Blood Throne of Khorne or a Skull Cannon of Khorne
Herald of Nurgle
This Clampack contains a new plastic Herald of Nurgle on a sculpted base
New Finecast Releases
Herald of Khorne
A clampack that contains one highly detailed Citadel Finecast resin miniature
Herald of Slaanesh
A clampack that contains one highly detailed Citadel Finecast resin miniature
Available While Stocks Last
These Items are highly limited, please request the quantity you require and we will supply you as close to this number as we can.
Warhammer Battle Magic: Daemons of Chaos
A deck of 21 cards that contains the 6 spells for the Lores of Tzeentch, Nurgle and Slaanesh as well as their signature spells
Psychic Powers: Chaos Daemons
A deck of 12 cards that contains the Primaris powers and 3 Psychic powers for the Lores Tzeentch, Slaanesh, Nurgle as well
Note: These will be released at the end of februrary
Codex: Chaos Daemons · 104 page full colour, hardback Codex
Yes!
Psychic Powers: Chaos Daemons - A deck of 12 cards that contains the Primaris powers and 3 Psychic powers for the Lores Tzeentch, Slaanesh, Nurgle as well
pizzaguardian wrote: A deck of 12 cards that contains the Primaris powers and 3 Psychic powers for the Lores Tzeentch, Slaanesh, Nurgle as well
This has me worried. While I wouldn't mind having some access to the BRB powers, I really don't want to have to roll on a table to get my anti-tank powers.
I guess on the plus side, Dark Excommunication won't work any more. Or, it won't work on some things.
I am in an GW-procucts embargo period and I do not think that I will change my opinion even if the minis are stunning. After all, there is the quite real limit in what you can buy with these prices!
No, you don't have to-this is the internet, after all. There are plenty who don't want to reveal their sources, because they don't want to make anybody else look bad if the rumor is false, or if GW has fed it to them to look for leaks. I'm in the same boat at the moment, myself. People just probably won't believe you until the stuff comes out, at worst case-but do you really care if a handful of guys you'll never meet believe you or not? If you're on par here, they'll listen to you without issue later. If you're not, they'll ignore you later. You know whether it's worth it to reveal or not.
TastyTaste from Blood of Kittens wrote:
I am one to think that they aren't coming out just yet, but maybe with the April release. With rules rumors being hard to come by let us look at some obvious ones right in front us and others not so much.
As most people realize Daemons will lose both Fearless and Eternal Warrior replaced with 5+ invulnerable and Fear. Eternal Warrior never really made sense in the grand scheme of things anyway because wouldn't Force Weapons be perfect to "banish" Daemons back to the War? As for Fearless, see a return of "instability" which is going to be close to 5th edition Fearless.
As I stated in a previous rumor GW is hell-bent on having each army hate something. Daemons are no different they just seem to hate themselves now.
Taking a look at the Chaos Space Marine and Warriors of Chaos books you can see where this is going. Each Chaos God units will hate a certain other god. This leads into the next rules change right in front of us. Depending on the Daemon's God it will determine the special abilities they get.
Khorne: Furious Charge
Slaanesh: Rending, Run bonus, Fleet
Tzeentch: Re-roll 1s for saves
Nurgle: Slow & Purposeful, Shrouded
Other changes that will surely happen...
Flamers and Screamers are getting nerfed, but the real big change will be Deamons having standard Deployment rules: no more Daemonic Assault.
The big reason Deamons were fast tracked has to do with Alessio Cavatore. Chatting with a few inside GW there has been an everything Alessio purge, and Daemons are the last big chunk of Alessio material left. Yeah, I know it sounds kinda petty, but it was a major impetus to get Daemons done. Daemons will still primarily be an assault based army, but that is the nature of the models having to be used both for Fantasy and 40k. That means Daemons will rely on speed to get across the board. Expect Chariots, warp portals, beasts, cavalry, jump troops to help with all this. Then there is cover saves Nurgle is the first piece of the puzzle, but just like certain Dark Angel things expect a "Clouds of Flies" to provide bonuses to cover saves all around. Chaos Space Marines and Deamons ICs will be able to join each other as long as their gods match up.
Things have been spares from all rumor mongers, but a lot has to do with GW "renewed" lock down; translated GW rumor monger wack'a'mole.
Petre was asking if you were quoting another rumormonger who posted in a separate thread or website. For example, are you quoting something that Harry posted up on Warseer or something that TastyTaste posted on Blood of Kittens.
If you are posting something that you heard through your own personal channel (like a friend or a quentenance who is involved in the industry), then you are effectively a rumor mounger and the internet source.
TastyTaste from Blood of Kittens wrote:
I am one to think that they aren't coming out just yet, but maybe with the April release. With rules rumors being hard to come by let us look at some obvious ones right in front us and others not so much.
As most people realize Daemons will lose both Fearless and Eternal Warrior replaced with 5+ invulnerable and Fear. Eternal Warrior never really made sense in the grand scheme of things anyway because wouldn't Force Weapons be perfect to "banish" Daemons back to the War? As for Fearless, see a return of "instability" which is going to be close to 5th edition Fearless.
As I stated in a previous rumor GW is hell-bent on having each army hate something. Daemons are no different they just seem to hate themselves now.
Taking a look at the Chaos Space Marine and Warriors of Chaos books you can see where this is going. Each Chaos God units will hate a certain other god. This leads into the next rules change right in front of us. Depending on the Daemon's God it will determine the special abilities they get.
Khorne: Furious Charge
Slaanesh: Rending, Run bonus, Fleet
Tzeentch: Re-roll 1s for saves
Nurgle: Slow & Purposeful, Shrouded
Other changes that will surely happen...
Flamers and Screamers are getting nerfed, but the real big change will be Deamons having standard Deployment rules: no more Daemonic Assault.
The big reason Deamons were fast tracked has to do with Alessio Cavatore. Chatting with a few inside GW there has been an everything Alessio purge, and Daemons are the last big chunk of Alessio material left. Yeah, I know it sounds kinda petty, but it was a major impetus to get Daemons done. Daemons will still primarily be an assault based army, but that is the nature of the models having to be used both for Fantasy and 40k. That means Daemons will rely on speed to get across the board. Expect Chariots, warp portals, beasts, cavalry, jump troops to help with all this. Then there is cover saves Nurgle is the first piece of the puzzle, but just like certain Dark Angel things expect a "Clouds of Flies" to provide bonuses to cover saves all around. Chaos Space Marines and Deamons ICs will be able to join each other as long as their gods match up.
Things have been spares from all rumor mongers, but a lot has to do with GW "renewed" lock down; translated GW rumor monger wack'a'mole.
I really don't like these rumors from Tastytaste. I looked him up in the tracker and he seems to have a good record. This makes me sad.
I'd be OK with losing Eternal Warrior on some or even all of my units, I even expect to see flamers and screamers nerfed. I really don't want to have to deploy stuff at the start of the game. I really don't want massive, sweeping changes to the army I love.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
UNCLEBADTOUCH wrote: So what are the chances that the plague drones in WFB will be flying monstrous cavalry, after all fantasy is all about the monstrous cavalry now lol
I wonder if they'll be like the Forgeworld blight drones, Jet bikes with Str:8 Ap:3 large blasts? Yes please.
Petre was asking if you were quoting another rumormonger who posted in a separate thread or website. For example, are you quoting something that Harry posted up on Warseer or something that TastyTaste posted on Blood of Kittens.
If you are posting something that you heard through your own personal channel (like a friend or a quentenance who is involved in the industry), then you are effectively a rumor mounger and the internet source.
Just so. I need to make myself more clear when I ask that question.
Well, feth, I hate these rumors. Hope TT is wrong. I realize new rules will pop up. BUT! So far we are losing everything that makes this army unique. Full on deep strike? Army wide EW? If they keep EW on DPs and GDs, I'll be happy. They SHOULD have it. Now we have psychic spells just like every other yahoo army here? What happened to the pure draw from the warp that made it shooting? Sigh. I'd rather keep the old book. New units=good. Removal of old rules=sucktacular.
Rumor lines up with GW practices of late. New units getting models at release with probable follow-up models in plastic for existing finecast/metal figures. Personally I'm looking forward to it. I'm a little sad that I'm likely to wind up with even more chariots. Already have 9 of the Slaanesh ones.
@Timetowaste
I wouldn't worry to much about it. We'll know for sure in about 2 weeks when pre-orders go up if he is right since he thinks april at the earliest for the books. Also this isn't as specific as normal and feels like he's grabbing things from the CSM book and running with it. Guess we'll see.
shouldn't we have some pictures floating around if it's coming out next week? or is that when they're expecting the pictures to drop and the aotual release date is in March?
buckero0 wrote: shouldn't we have some pictures floating around if it's coming out next week? or is that when they're expecting the pictures to drop and the aotual release date is in March?
The TastyTaste rumors are god-awful if they turn out to be true...
I don't care about losing army-wide Eternal Warrior, but everything else?
- Daemons IIRC have *always* been 'Fearless'. Instability has 0 place in 40k and I have a feeling that bringing such a mechanic will ultimently screw over the army and turn us into the newest punching bag.
- Always deploying normally now? Well crap, there goes our uniqueness right out the window.
- Psychic powers are fine as long as we still keep Daemonic Gifts!!! Now if GW has gone and made every single one of our shooting abilities into a fancy psychic power, well poop, Daemons are now crap. (I honestly doubt this will happen - more likely it's only the really 'big bang' effects and things like Warpfire & Doombolt will stay as they currently are... I hope...)
I'm eagerly awaiting the first model pics though! And hopefully GW doesn't royally screw us up for the third time in a row!
Before the "whaaaaat no GD's suckz!11!!1!" goes too far, remember this: GW now releases all the brand NEW! units to stop 3rd party producers from scooping their IP/sales.
H&H as well as Avian and a couple others are still pegging the new plastic Greaters as being a 2-per-month release over the summer.
But they currently have models, even if they're old as fossilised dung.
Also, I doubt this is entire release. 3 mid-sized kits + a few man-sized characters seems pretty underwhelming. Hopefully there's one more big kit we haven't heard about yet. (or else Tzeentch is being a giant d*** and simply pulling my leg...)
Chad Warden wrote: Almost certain Blessing of the Blood God is getting nerfed though
I hope not, but if it does, I'll almost certainly pull my Bloodthirster out of my lists for a bit and replace him with a Lord of Change.
I'm honestly hoping that the Greaters in 40k get a boost to bring them more in line with their Fantasy counterparts...
An un-upgraded Fantasy Bloodthirster is still miles above the sad, pathetic thing of his 40k rival.
Fantasy GUO's have 10 wounds for feth's sake!!! If ANYTHING in 40k deserves to be ultra resiliant, it should be grand-daddy Nurgle's boy getting T6/W8 or so.
Chad Warden wrote: Almost certain Blessing of the Blood God is getting nerfed though
I hope not, but if it does, I'll almost certainly pull my Bloodthirster out of my lists for a bit and replace him with a Lord of Change.
I'm honestly hoping that the Greaters in 40k get a boost to bring them more in line with their Fantasy counterparts...
An un-upgraded Fantasy Bloodthirster is still miles above the sad, pathetic thing of his 40k rival.
Fantasy GUO's have 10 wounds for feth's sake!!! If ANYTHING in 40k deserves to be ultra resiliant, it should be grand-daddy Nurgle's boy getting T6/W8 or so.
Yeah, I've always thought it was odd that a GUO had the same statline as a GD of Slaanesh or Tzeentch.
I'm not really interested in picking up any Heralds, unless the new codex makes them much better.
@ Mr. 'scorpion : good for you ! I'm assuming yours is the .. the... the threesome ... ?
Yes, thanks! Some of those pictures are also in my Dakkadakka Gallery.
I hope someone gets their White Dwarf a few days early (someone nearly always does!) and posts pics of the new Daemon models, though advance orders appear to only be five days away on Feb. 23 so we should have good official pics in just a few days.
Sigvatr wrote: Will we be able to get the leaked pictures (when released) here on dakka or do we have to go to Warseer again? :/
If you're asking about scanned copies of White Dwarf articles, no. That's been discussed many times, and Dakka doesn't want to get in trouble for hosting copy written information. Not sure why you're even asking, honestly.
I'm honestly hoping that the Greaters in 40k get a boost to bring them more in line with their Fantasy counterparts...
An un-upgraded Fantasy Bloodthirster is still miles above the sad, pathetic thing of his 40k rival.
Fantasy GUO's have 10 wounds for feth's sake!!! If ANYTHING in 40k deserves to be ultra resiliant, it should be grand-daddy Nurgle's boy getting T6/W8 or so.
Yeah, I've always thought it was odd that a GUO had the same statline as a GD of Slaanesh or Tzeentch.
I'm not really interested in picking up any Heralds, unless the new codex makes them much better.
JvK over at Librarium-Online mentioned about Heralds no longer being a 2-for-1 slot option, but gaining a good amount of new options & upgrades.
I'm hoping in a sense they become scaled like;
a) Taking just a single upgrade or two keeps them at their current state and keeps them cheap.
b) Fully kitting them out gives us something more akin to the old 'Exalted Daemons' from the Storm of Chaos Daemonic Legions army list - so something on the level of a Space Marine Captain/Chaos Lord level of abilities.
That could make for some real utility and variation in playstyles imho. Take a Greater and you can still take a cheapo Herald to run with another unit, or else sacrifice the Greater/s but still get a solid Warlord who's no pushover, (unlike the current Heralds who pretty much *need* a Jugger/Dice/Chariot to not hand-over the 'Slay the Warlord' victory point!)
Since we're only 2(?) weeks away from having the codex in our hands, I'm gonna guess that Tasty's info is mostly accurate.
It occurs to me that GW's answer to Daemons' problems in dealing with Warp Quake is to have the Daemons less reliant on DS in the first place. Didn't see that one coming, I gotta admit. Then again, it's believable that they'd run with the idea of making them more conventional. After all, we've had hints about them losing EW, (re-)gaining psychic powers, etc. So the removal of Daemonic Assault kinda fits into that, especially since some of their faster units have recently received new kits and buffs. Likewise, removal of the 2-for-1 heralds in exchange for more options makes their HQs more conventional.
From a sales and marketing perspective, this might make Daemons seem less random and more palatable to new players, while forcing existing players to make some significant changes to their armies.
gorgon wrote: Since we're only 2(?) weeks away from having the codex in our hands, I'm gonna guess that Tasty's info is mostly accurate.
It occurs to me that GW's answer to Daemons' problems in dealing with Warp Quake is to have the Daemons less reliant on DS in the first place. Didn't see that one coming, I gotta admit. Then again, it's believable that they'd run with the idea of making them more conventional. After all, we've had hints about them losing EW, (re-)gaining psychic powers, etc. So the removal of Daemonic Assault kinda fits into that, especially since some of their faster units have recently received new kits and buffs. Likewise, removal of the 2-for-1 heralds in exchange for more options makes their HQs more conventional.
From a sales and marketing perspective, this might make Daemons seem less random and more palatable to new players, while forcing existing players to make some significant changes to their armies.
No sure how accurate his informtion is when he posts he doesn't think they are coming out till at least April and the next morning information for the upcoming release pops up. But we'll see in 2-3 weeks
gorgon wrote: Since we're only 2(?) weeks away from having the codex in our hands, I'm gonna guess that Tasty's info is mostly accurate.
It occurs to me that GW's answer to Daemons' problems in dealing with Warp Quake is to have the Daemons less reliant on DS in the first place. Didn't see that one coming, I gotta admit. Then again, it's believable that they'd run with the idea of making them more conventional. After all, we've had hints about them losing EW, (re-)gaining psychic powers, etc. So the removal of Daemonic Assault kinda fits into that, especially since some of their faster units have recently received new kits and buffs. Likewise, removal of the 2-for-1 heralds in exchange for more options makes their HQs more conventional.
From a sales and marketing perspective, this might make Daemons seem less random and more palatable to new players, while forcing existing players to make some significant changes to their armies.
He actually prefaces his whole post with the fact he still believes they're due in April, so, accuracy, yeah...
gorgon wrote: Since we're only 2(?) weeks away from having the codex in our hands, I'm gonna guess that Tasty's info is mostly accurate.
It occurs to me that GW's answer to Daemons' problems in dealing with Warp Quake is to have the Daemons less reliant on DS in the first place. Didn't see that one coming, I gotta admit. Then again, it's believable that they'd run with the idea of making them more conventional. After all, we've had hints about them losing EW, (re-)gaining psychic powers, etc. So the removal of Daemonic Assault kinda fits into that, especially since some of their faster units have recently received new kits and buffs. Likewise, removal of the 2-for-1 heralds in exchange for more options makes their HQs more conventional.
From a sales and marketing perspective, this might make Daemons seem less random and more palatable to new players, while forcing existing players to make some significant changes to their armies.
And to add to this trend...
IIRC, ever since 3rd edition Daemons have only ever deployed via Deep Strike... so sure, Daemonic Assault isn't anything important like say, the army's entire defining identiy!
gorgon wrote: Since we're only 2(?) weeks away from having the codex in our hands, I'm gonna guess that Tasty's info is mostly accurate.
It occurs to me that GW's answer to Daemons' problems in dealing with Warp Quake is to have the Daemons less reliant on DS in the first place. Didn't see that one coming, I gotta admit. Then again, it's believable that they'd run with the idea of making them more conventional. After all, we've had hints about them losing EW, (re-)gaining psychic powers, etc. So the removal of Daemonic Assault kinda fits into that, especially since some of their faster units have recently received new kits and buffs. Likewise, removal of the 2-for-1 heralds in exchange for more options makes their HQs more conventional.
From a sales and marketing perspective, this might make Daemons seem less random and more palatable to new players, while forcing existing players to make some significant changes to their armies.
No sure how accurate his informtion is when he posts he doesn't think they are coming out till at least April and the next morning information for the upcoming release pops up. But we'll see in 2-3 weeks
His record in the rumor tracker thread is pretty good, but I do hope this gets added to his 'miss' column.
I wouldn't consider anything he posted in his post a rumor. It's pretty obvious speculation and he seems to frame it as such. Like I said earlier, when he actually knows something he's a lot more specific.
Hulksmash wrote: I wouldn't consider anything he posted in his post a rumor. It's pretty obvious speculation and he seems to frame it as such. Like I said earlier, when he actually knows something he's a lot more specific.
I don't know. I tried to carve the speculation out of that, but some of it uses pretty certain language. The problem with being a rumor monger is that when you speculate, people take it as rumor and a sign of things to come.
gorgon wrote: Since we're only 2(?) weeks away from having the codex in our hands, I'm gonna guess that Tasty's info is mostly accurate.
It occurs to me that GW's answer to Daemons' problems in dealing with Warp Quake is to have the Daemons less reliant on DS in the first place. Didn't see that one coming, I gotta admit. Then again, it's believable that they'd run with the idea of making them more conventional. After all, we've had hints about them losing EW, (re-)gaining psychic powers, etc. So the removal of Daemonic Assault kinda fits into that, especially since some of their faster units have recently received new kits and buffs. Likewise, removal of the 2-for-1 heralds in exchange for more options makes their HQs more conventional.
From a sales and marketing perspective, this might make Daemons seem less random and more palatable to new players, while forcing existing players to make some significant changes to their armies.
And to add to this trend...
IIRC, ever since 3rd edition Daemons have only ever deployed via Deep Strike... so sure, Daemonic Assault isn't anything important like say, the army's entire defining identiy!
Doesn't mean that some units in the codex wouldn't have DS, though. Or that there wouldn't be other kinds of mechanics, like warp portals. Hey, I personally figured that they'd take a "do no harm" approach to the army, much like they did with DA (heck, Belial even kept his weapon options, which is unusual for a SC). I guess I'm saying that it's believable that they could want to make the army more conventional, and some of these items would fit in that context.
I suppose some of these rumormongers -- especially the ones with blogs and traffic to consider -- might have little remorse or conscience about what they post. Still, given that we're going to know what's up in a couple weeks...would Tasty risk running with a bunch of speculation and/or sketchy info he didn't trust this close to the release date? Seems like there's more downside risk to his rep with this timeframe. *shrug* Guess we'll see soon.
Requiem wrote: Who would need to use these powers? Heralds? Regular units? Greater Daemons? Daemon Princes? All of them?
Traditionally, Greaters, Princes & Heralds/Exalted Daemons.
Of corse, in Fantasy, Pinkies are special snowflake who get their own set of magic spells & wizard levels to play with, depending on how big the unit is.
Now for the million dollar question: How will GW make Furies suck this edition?!
Experiment 626 wrote: Now for the million dollar question: How will GW make Furies suck this edition?!
For every point you spend on Furies, your opponent gets two points added to their points-limit.
For every point spent on Furies, you are shot in the leg. You're opponent recieves several medals congratulating him or her on the victory and is given £100,000 cash prize.
Experiment 626 wrote: Now for the million dollar question: How will GW make Furies suck this edition?!
For every point you spend on Furies, your opponent gets two points added to their points-limit.
Furies get a multi-option plastic kit including the must-have Super-Furies. Sorry that the limited edition plastic kit sold out in 3 minutes, but watch them getting 5 pages of posthumous advertising in next months WD.
BTW checked the TastyTaste original text, and this was cut off from the end:
TastyTaste wrote:Another good thing to understand is GW is moving quicker with releases than ever before. They had almost an entire year to create a backlog on sculpting and rules. To give you an example, the Chaos Space Marine codex was done in December of 2011. I am not talking about just the rules, but everything the photography, the layout, everything! Dark Angels same thing, done in March 2011. That means Daemons have been done since June and Tau and Eldar compelete or almost complete.
What I am getting at is this is going to be an epic year for releases, with only the Chapterhouse lawsuit and a new CEO possibly getting in the way.
Finally, I have a public service announcement from the dev team, they really want rules questions, so everyone keep on sending in any rules quandaries to
Gamefaqs@gwplc.com
The design team has made updating FAQs a priority, which has been a marked and great change from years past.
TL;DR:
CSM Codex completed December 2011, released October 2012
DA Codex completed March 2011, released January 2013
Ferrum_Sanguinis wrote: There better be a big drop in points for all units if Daemons no longer have EW...
What exactly did EW provide them? It doesn't seem that big of a deal when a bolter could drop most daemons.
Eternal Warrior is currently;
a) An absolute god-send on Greater & Princes and makes them solid choices for their inflated cost.
b) Breaks Flamers & Screamers who are insanely undercosted currently when EW is taken into consideration.
c) Is 100% useless on everything else bar Bloodcrushers, Fiends, Beasts, Nurgling swarms & Herals!
Overall losing EW balances the new Flamers/Screamers quite nicely, but is a kick in the nuts to every single HQ + Princes. Unless they get some solid stat buffs and/or pts reductions, they will be liabilities at best, or downright unplayable at worst. (looking at you Heralds!)
The heralds are so cheap anyway I dont mind losing ew on them, I'm looking toward to rocking my slaanesh deamons again...please please give me some decent looking fiends though, there bloody awful looking
Formosa wrote: The heralds are so cheap anyway I dont mind losing ew on them, I'm looking toward to rocking my slaanesh deamons again...please please give me some decent looking fiends though, there bloody awful looking
You could always try bitz ordering the current plastic steeds of slaanesh and slapping a pair of the chaos spawn crab claw arms onto them and then filing off the saddle?
Found on Warseer, thought it might be interesting;
Faeit 212 inbox wrote:.
via Matt (not his real name) from the Faeit 212 inbox Now that GW have released their teaser trailer I can give you the big scoop of information I have been holding. This information has only been told to a view of us and you must realise that is why we had to wait for GW to make their move. So this is what I know in the way of rules, stats and points - their is a view upgrades but nothing to amazing.
I will start with the big daemons - The bloodthirsters : 280pts WSBS S T W I A LDSV 10 4 9 7 5 5 5 10 5+ Daemonic gifts: blood axe, armour of terror, whip of destruction special rules: daemon, daemonic flight, furious charge, rage,blood without end blood axe - user gains a previously lost wound he has lost earlier in game for every kill he makes on a 4+ armour of terror - user gains a 2+ save and 5+ invulnerable. The bearer gains a 4+ feel no pain if the weapons AP in lower than 3 whip of destruction - 12'' shooting attack - strength 8 AP 4 rending daemon - see page 36 daemonic flight- see chaos special rules furious charge & rage - rule book (P41&37)
blood without end- the bloodthirsters gain +d6 attacks on the charge and makes another strike at initiative step 1 for every wound he causes. These extra strikes do not produce any further strikes.
Great unclean one : 260pts WSBS S T W I A LDSV 5 4 6 8 6 1 4 10 6+ Daemonic gifts: plague sword of death, bloated body, aura of decay special rules: daemon, slow and purposeful,my master gifts all,shrouded plague sword of death - wounds everything on 2+ with an ap of 3 - turns characters into spawn bloated body - the daemon has a 4+ armour save and a 3+ feel no pain on any weapon AP 5 or below. aura of decay - the great unclean one has defensive and assault grenades and causes all enemy weapons to count as -1 strength (I believe this is ranged and close combat)
my master gifts all - pick an enemy and friendly unit at the beginning of the game. The enemy unit gains -1 toughness and strength while a friendly plaguebearers count as +1 strength and +1 to there feel no pain rolls.
troop units : bloodletters: 14pts each WSBS S T W I A LDSV 5 0 5 4 1 4 2 10 6+ daemonic gifts: blood swords (strength: user AP: 4) special rules: daemon, furious charge,rage unit type: infantry Number/squad: 5-20
Daemonettes of slannesh: 12pts each WSBS S T W I A LDSV 4 0 4 3 1 6 2 10 6+ Daemonic gifts: rending claws special rules: fleet, make them suffer (+1 added to strength - already included) Unit type: infantry Number/squad: 5-15
Wargear: tzeench gift of betrayal -50pts (one use) pick an enemy independent character at random, that model or unit must pass a leadership test with a -4 penalty or be removed after being sucked into the warp for tzeench amusement, models from codex: space marine, dark angels,black templars,grey knights,space wolves,blood angels take a -2 penalty instead to represent their resistance from the dark gods temptations.
nurgle's blessing (30pts) pick a nurgle unit in your army, that model/unit gains +1 to their feel no pain roll.
sword of a thousand souls: 45pts the bearer must charge every enemy unit and must challenge but gain +2d6 extra attacks on the charge.
dance of death: 40pts pick an enemy unit at the beginning of the game, that unit must roll a initiative test every turn of the game or is under the control of the daemon player. The unit under control may charge friendly models but cannot move off the board or into any piece of terrain that can cause hard to the model. If the enemy passes the initiative test more than three times during the battle then the dance has been removed for the remainder of the game.
Fairly sure these are fake, but you never know....
Haven't read through the entire thread so forgive me if this has been mentioned/covered, but we finally get a proper Tzeentch chariot, and I bet the rules will not be nearly as good as they were in the previous codex. Crossing fingers...
The unit rumors are almost certainly fake judging by how insanely overpower the Bloodthirster is. He has a higher toughness than the Great Unclean One, strikes at strength 10 on the charge, is looking at ~10 attacks on the charge + extras for every wound he deals, recovers wounds very easily, has a 2+/5++ and FNP against some weapons, and flies. What IC in the game could deal with that? That's a complete nightmare even at 280 points. Add to this how ridiculous Dance of Death is (40 points is more than worth it to steal a deathstar on occasion even if they have I4 and it simply ruins Orks and Necrons) and I'd take these particular rumors with a giant grain of salt.
While I do wish that those are the stats for the Bloodthirster, on the other hand.... the troops above right now still seem fairly lackluster, especially if they really did lose daemonic assault.
I'm thinking that the demonic gifts might have to be purchased on top of the base points. You might be looking at close to 400 pts for a greater daemon.
Lol those had better be fake xD the BT is absolutely OP, while other units like bloodletters got hit with the nerf hammer again (ap4? seriously? now you can totally forget about bloodletters killing some marines if this is true)
I guess he would be top priority for all the enemies guns before it could reach combat, although either way atleast part of your army would be guaranteed to reach combat.
Requiem wrote: Lol those had better be fake xD the BT is absolutely OP, while other units like bloodletters got hit with the nerf hammer again (ap4? seriously? now you can totally forget about bloodletters killing some marines if this is true)
Bloodletters also getting a 6+ save and 2 wounds. That's a pretty radical change.
Requiem wrote: Lol those had better be fake xD the BT is absolutely OP, while other units like bloodletters got hit with the nerf hammer again (ap4? seriously? now you can totally forget about bloodletters killing some marines if this is true)
Bloodletters also getting a 6+ save and 2 wounds. That's a pretty radical change.
Should've taken a closer look at the stats then xD
still the 6+ save would be worse than the 5++ they have now...
Oh well, I guess we'll find out which rumours are correct before long
Why would you post such rumors if you believe they are fake.
They don't look solid to me. Of course they might be true, but still. If you want people to listen and create a reputation for yourself speed up your game.
If they are true, my apologies ... but they seem so unbalanced
cannot wait for one which is thirsty for blood.
falls off it every movement phase. Luckily it's all imaginary though. Cause its a 
...I am betting that alot of it will come to pass though not all at once.
).
