Like I was hinting at this morning, it seems that the best way to go about OP3 is to just focus on blasting the other ships out of the sky. The ground war seems like a decent minigame, and may be best played for by a player who is losing the game as a last ditch effort to clutch victory from the jaws of defeat. I'm thinking of running a modified Klingon build now that I have the bird of prey.
Your other thread regarding OP3 was missing a vital piece of info.
If you retain control of the planet by eliminating your opponent's ground forces, you gain an extra Battle Point. So if you won and controlled the planet you would have 4 Battle Points vs 3 if you only won and the planet was contested.
Gordash wrote: This is true! I didn't even see that, as battle points haven't really been an issue up to this point in the location that I've been playing.
So for the purposes of determining a winner, it may come down to a critical planet control. Good to know.
Gordash wrote: This is true! I didn't even see that, as battle points haven't really been an issue up to this point in the location that I've been playing.
So for the purposes of determining a winner, it may come down to a critical planet control. Good to know.
I see 3-4 ship fleets having a distinct advantage of winning the ground war in the first few turns.
To begin with, I would almost always run a 3 ship fleet in Attack wing. I want the majority of the points I spend to be ship based. Typically, I have been spending about 75% to 80% of my points on ships.
I see your point about 3-4 ships being able to win the ground war in the first few turns, I just think that spending the first few turns giving up your attack to take the planet as a weaker strategy than just flying at the opposing ships and using your attacks to attack. If you could tool up the Defiant properly for defense, and could still have points left over for a decent attacking fleet, I could see you doing both but as in OP1, I found that those individuals that focused on taking over DS9 were able to do so, and then got the station blown out from underneath them on the next turn.
At this point, I'm considering fighting the ground war as a secondary strategy if for some reason I lose a ship or two in the first few turns.
What kind of fleet are you thinking of running to take advantage of the ground war?
Fitting your 3-4 ship build, how bout something like this
Defiant
Sisko
Sulu
Cloak
Ch'Tang
Skill 8 Martok
Two naked D7s.
If you don't have a Ch'Tang, you could swap in a Kronos One and swap out Martok for Gowron. Still decently hard hitting and Sisko can go and fight his ground war and just not attack, keeping his cloak up and suluing each turn- 8 defense dice. There are still points left over, so you could even through Donatra on one of the D7s if you wanted to pump up their abilities.
I see OP3 as a less painful version of OP2. Instead of using a buffer ship between you and the OWP, you need a small ship to fight the ground war while the rest of the fleet goes after the enemy. Hello naked science vessel it is your time to shine
First turn I would move straight 4 towards the planet. I beam down from all ships and activate the ground forces four times.
Second turn I place the mines down on one side of the planet based on where I think my opponent is going. I then start moving around the planet trying to keep the planet inbetween the fleets. I beam the rest of the ground forces and SAMs down and activate them up to four times.
By this time I hope to gain a large advantage on the ground against most other fleets. The next step is to cloak everything and start engaging the enemy.
Terell is a good fit for that strategy since you won't be cloaking the other ships in the first few turns.
If you have a chance, test it out against a 3 klingon ship build with Gowron, Martok and Donatra that is focused on taking out the ships, rather than fighting the ground war. Let me know how it goes, because your strategy is worth considering if you can get it off against that kind of build. You don't even really need an opponent to test it out since the 3 ship build pretty much plays itself- fly at ships, focus fire on one ship until it explodes- repeat.
One problem I do see is someone being the spoiler. Wait near the end to beam down ground forces to deny control of the planet.
However, if you try to ignore the planet and beam down near the end to deny control, that means you're only going for 3 battlepoints. The players that can get 4 a round will be playing for the prize. In a tournament situation I assume to play others that will want control of the planet
Month 5 should not be that bad. The OWP are relatively small. You should be able to them all on half the board. As long as the other guy placing them is not an you should be fine. I see most people placing them to one side and plaing an open space game on the other side.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also in 5 the rules say they can not be within12" of the starting area or 4" of each other. Does not say any thing about the side though. You can put 2 directly on the egde 4" apart and the rest every 4" and there should be plenty of room. Just tell yourselves it is a battle on the far flank of Cardassia
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Month 5 should not be that bad. The OWP are relatively small. You should be able to them all on half the board. As long as the other guy placing them is not an you should be fine. I see most people placing them to one side and plaing an open space game on the other side.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also in 5 the rules say they can not be within12" of the starting area or 4" of each other. Does not say any thing about the side though. You can put 2 directly on the egde 4" apart and the rest every 4" and there should be plenty of room. Just tell yourselves it is a battle on the far flank of Cardassia
In OP2 my first opponent's tactic was to run away and let the OWP's kill me. They did due to inexperience with movement and a stupid mistake. So I can see him placing them in the middle so he can turtle.
Na csimian was talkimg about month 5, I don't think it will be as bad as month 2.
Automatically Appended Next Post: You known I have been thinking that N'Vek is an under used crew card. For the Romulans he is ok, but he would be more useful on a federation ship. He is cheaper than scotty and only disables 1 shield for +1 attack. I think he could help with the federations problem of being out gunned for a very small investment.
Also since there are a lot of cloaking fleets out there, he also runs cheaper than torpedoes that won't get much use.
Torpedoes are getting rarer and rarer as the weeks go on at the club. No one was running Torpedoes at all.
Everyone, however, was running a Neg'Var. OP2 was dominated by Neg'Vars and Valdores.
Builds for OP3? The Ch'Tang is definitely going to feature in my build. I think it's a pretty solid ship, and I hope that something equivalent is released once the new release drops in December. The essentially free target lock on any ship is a bit too good. Nothing busted, but still... a bit too good.
What about this fleet to disrupt a four ship fleet from controlling the planet?
Kraxon
Picard
Counter Attack
Galor Class
Donatra
Galor Class
Martok LE
97 points (so far)
Idea is to go charge ahead at 5 the first turn and try to attack on the first or second turn using the 180 degree firing arcs to make sure you can target the other ships. Of course I would have to buy two more Kraxons to do this. But its a good mental exercise for now.
At my OP2 I was the only one without some form of torpedoes. Quantums are a when you are on the receiving end FYI. You should see more variety in OP3, the scenario will allow for much more maneuverability among fleets. I don't know if the klingon strike force will be so prevalent next month. With nothing but a planet out there enemy fleets can spread out and flank formations. The klingons do better in formation due to ability buffs.
Automatically Appended Next Post: -Crisiman
Honestly I would just take those leftover 3 points put picard on the big D and move Martok over to the Kraxon. The D has another hull point and the 360 ability for tight spots. With those clunky galors turning takes a while, their 180 is nice but the D can cover your back.
So we have our OP2 tomorrow, and I've come up with three lists I was thinking of running. I feel like having 4 ships will be very useful, and obviously the ability to cloak will be very handy, but what are your recommendations?
Vor'cha
Martok
k't'inga
Gowron
Kronos 1
Gorkon
D7
Klingon CPT
Romulans:
D'deridex
Toreth
counter attack
Polarized hull plating (I've found that crits are the main things that seem to take my cloaked ships out)
-spyguy
I like your klingon list except for Gorkon. It is great to make the opponent lose 2 attacks, but Kronos one only gets 4 attacks. Taking away 2 of your own attacks to hurt them is not doing you much good. It is basically stalemating. Gorkon is really for a larger ship with Gowron nearby so as to hurt the opponent and still deal damage. He is more suited for a vorcha.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Gordash wrote: What are you thinking of running for OP3 Baldrick?
Sorry I missed this in the single thread mess.
The klingons are doing well, but I would like to work on more effectively using Romulan warbirds. I am thinking something with the Khazara, generic warbird, and praetus. It is going to require some extensive play testing though.
Hi Guys I ot 2 list for and event this weekend let me know what you thik
List 1
Negh'Var class
Martok LE Attack Pattern Omega
kerla
Vor'cha
Gowron
Kronos One
Terrel
Sulu
18 Attack dice and mild evade/agility. I had 2 points left when so I put Kerla on Martoks ship
List 2
IKS Negh'var
Martok
Kerla
Klag
Vor'cha
Gowron
Data
K'T'inga
Terrel
Sulu
16 attack dice and alot of evade/ agility. I had 3 points here and since I have my actions planned out I added Kerla and Klag instead of a action based card, i considered a tractor beam however my actions might never allow me to use it.
I only have Klingon and Federations expansions so far. Next week I plan on buying all the romulan ones, but that doen't help me now.
I like your list. It's very defensive. Is there anything that you'd rather take than Attack Wing Omega? It's a one time discard for 3 pts, but it's quite good.
The Idea behind Kerla, Sulu and Data came from a series of lucky hits my opponents keep getting on me while I'm cloaked also poor evasion rolls on my part. I figured I could use them to help prevent damage. It does prevent me from locking on, however my Lock On rolls have been less than stellar.
So, my thinking on Sulu is that with Terel, you probably want to cloak each and every time it is possible to do so. I see Sulu getting 1-2 uses throughout the entire game before you're either winning outright, or the Kronos One is gone. I'd much rather take out Kerla and Sulu, and find room for Drex, probably on Martok's Neg'var- that way you get a 7 dice battlestationed alpha strike on the juiciest target.
The Kronos One actually has a decent ability. You should try to find the 2 pts for it. I don't see Data and Sulu fitting into a Klingon, Martok/Gowron build. You want every ship cloaked and gowron up every turn. You'll have 4 actions per turn. Bogging your ship down in crew member Action abilities means that there will, by necessity, be upgrades that you are paying for every turn that you're not getting any use out of. If you're going down this road, you want your crew member actions to be absolutely essential to your build. If you're activating Sulu and Data, you're not activating Cloak and Gowron- which is how you're going to win.
Focus fire on one ship at a time- don't split your fire if you can help it.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Mainly, I think the Klingon ships don't need much more oomph than they already have. Don't bog them down in upgrades/bog yourself down in decisions, when the main move is- Cloak then Shoot.
Ok, so I just finished our OP. I took first again.
List:
Martok in Neghvar with polarized hull plating
Gowron in Maht-H''a
Nu'daq in Kronos one
Elite Attack die
So, I'm pretty sure that the elite attack die rolled a battle station all but once...kind of disappointing.
First game, I played the other Klingon player. He went with Vor'cha, Neg'vhar, and two d-7s. I killed everything but the Neg'vhar by the time the round was up. The only thing of mine to die was the Kronos one. To an OWP. (the K1 died in a single phase every game...mostly due to bad evading)
Second game, I played the Federation player. Ent-D with Sulu and Spock and Picard (surprise), Reliant with Khan, and Defiant with Riker. Don't remember what other upgrades he had besides the cloaking device. At the end of the day, I only lost the K1 and killed all but tthe Ent-D.
Third game was the Dominion player. He had three of the new Jem'hadar ships and one Cardassian ship. I actually lost this game. I would have killed all but one of his ships, but his evasion dice were pretty killer in one crucial turn (out of about 13 hits, I did 1-2 damage after shields). He then wiped me off the board. Killing two of his ships put me in first by 5 points, so I can't complain.
I definitely think that the K'tinga class will probably work better if I spam them...but it's really hard to say since my dice rolling was so terrible. I'm not very whelmed thus far by it. I'm also very underwhelmed by the elite attack die, but again, I really only rolled the battle station result. Well, more playtesting, I guess.
Hey there Dakka Trekkies,
I had my second OP2 yesterday. I decided to try something a little different from my last event.
My Fleet:
28 Negvar Class
5 Martok
4 Cloaked Mines
28 Negvar Class
5 Donatra
4 Sulu
Vorcha Class
0 Klingon Captain
100 Total
Game 1 was against
Kronos one
Donatra
M’Tah
Martok
Negvar
Gowron
This was a crazy game for captains. The second round my Martok was hit with a Warp Core Breach and a Communications failure (captain skill 0). The next round his Martok got a communications failure. Round 4 his Donatra was hit with an injured captain. I lost my Martok in turn 4 to the core breach. I took out his in round 3 or 4. I don’t remember much else, but on the last round I did take out his other two ships with only one hull point left on my Donatra, and 3 left on the Vorcha. It was a harry game loosing Martok so early but the other two pulled it out. The mines helped and the OWP peppered us both evenly.
Game 2
Enterprise D
Picard
Spock
Defiant
Sisko
Quantum Torpedoes
Galaxy Class
Terrel
I set up all 3 of my ships on one side he opposed them with the D and his other galaxy. Sisko went down the other side. Turn 1 nothing happened except the D lost a shield to an OWP, this will be important. The high point of this game was turn 2 Martok fired on the Enterprise D at close range with an extra attack from Donatra, I rolled 7 hits WITHOUT a target lock. My opponent and the TO were shocked and the table next to us stopped playing to take a look. Donatra finished off the Enterprise, in all the bid D had 11 hits on it from only 2 ships. That left poor Terrel looking down the barrel at 3 Klingons while Sisko was on vacation. Terrel tried to meet up with Sisko and I took him out before he could get there. The rest of the game was a long chase of the defiant while he tried to get a torpedo lock on me. I took him out before he could.
Turn 2, I focused on his Negvar first putting 5 damage on it. He flew it into the Groth so Gowron was not helping the rest of this force. Turn 3 he flew the Groth into the mines and it was done, I finished off his Negvar the rest went after the M’Tah. Turn 4 the OWP and his M’Tah took out my Vorcha. Then after 3 more turn of exchanging “Come Abouts” I finished him off.
So I got 300 points and won. It was a great tournament with great players. Our TO is very cool, as well. This was my second OP2 win and I was very pleased to have:
Then I remembered I picked up these on eBay a few months back, and I have a cunning plan…
After about an hour and a half worth of work, I now have a Klingon swarm complete with dials and cards. Of course these are only for casual/home play, but it will be fun to see them in action. More honored warriors for the empire
Now I need to focus on OP3.
-Spyguyoda
Congrats on the win, glad to see you did not go with Gorkon. Nu'Daq is a much better fit for OP2.
I agree that Nu'Daq is definitely much better. Gorkon might have helped the third ship survive a little longer, but then he would have contributed even less, so it worked out.
Dude another tough one. You still did very well though. You might want to try dropping Picard for some more defensive up grades. Shooting first is nice but he draws a lot of attention.
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Gordash wrote: Any chance of getting a brief synopsis of your list/tactics for those of us stuck at work without access to Youtube?
He can correct me later if I am wrong but for the sake of furthering discussion acording to the video he took:
Negvar class
Picard
Vorcha class
Martok
vorcha class
koloth
drex
Like in X-wing, the list you bring matters less than the movement, but there are a few things about that list I don't really like. I don't like Martok with only one target for his ability. I really don't like Koloth instead of Gowron.
If you're looking to get max attack dice, there are some pretty straightforward klingon builds that can get you where you need to be without a lot of mucking about on your part. Martok/Donatra/Gowron- the holy trinity of the Klingon Min/Max build.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I don't mean to suggest that you shouldn't do it otherwise, and you can bring whatever you want and crush face, I just haven't seen a better Klingon Build than Two Vorchas, one Negvar, Martok/Donatra/Gowron. It's got everything you want!
The Ch'Tang is pretty awesome though. It's going into my build for OP3, which is starting to look something like this
Command Tokens 5
Neg'Var 28
Martok skill 8- 5
Ch'Tang 22
Gowron 4
Vorcha 26
Donatra 5
5 pts left over for something truly devastating. Probably Drex or advanced weapon system on Gowron.
Automatically Appended Next Post: My plan is to simply ignore the planet and take out opposing ships. I think it's a fine strategy for OP3.
That is putting a lot of eggs in one basket. Koloth is captain skill 7, which is good, but somebody on the other side could esily have a kirk, picard, or martok shoot before you. With only 3 hull points the Ch'Tang can esily be shot out from under you before you can fire.
With 35 points out of 100 tied up in a 3 hull ship that would be the first thing I went for, easy points for your opponent. If you are dead set on using BARRAGE OF FIRE, I would recommend you at least give it to martok on the vorcha.
Baldrick speaks the truth. The Ch'Tang is awesome, but don't think of it as your main ship. It's a support ship that is better than it has any right to be. Unless you WANT one of your ships to be targeted first, you should spread around your threat among several ships.
For Example-
In OP2, I faced two fleets both using the named Cardassian ship that soaks up damage. Both fleets intended to keep their Neg'Vars/Valdores alive by transferring hits onto the Cardy ship's shields. They also had that dude on the Cardy ship that heals shield points when within range 1 of a friendly ship. In my mind, this is an expert strategy- it requires the individual piloting the fleet to have a very good grasp of the range bands so that they can keep the Cardy ship close to his own ships, but far enough away from the opposing ships that the first few turns can be used soaking up damage. What my opponents did was fly them in close formation, and I just targeted the Cardy ship because it was the easiest target- It usually went down in one turn. Since the Cardy ship is about 1/3 of the total points, my opponent now had less firepower, and their strategy was nixed.
Part of playing this game well is identifying your opponent's strategy and seeing if you can throw a wrench in it. From your list, I know your strategy right off the bat, and you've made it easily disruptable due to the Ch'Tang's glass cannon-ness. Putting some of those upgrades on one of your Vorcha's make the strategy less disruptable.
I'm playing my Klingon lists kind of samey- you may want to play something with a bit more flair- but I would drop Drex, drop Barrage of Fire, drop Koloth, put Gowron on the Ch'Tang, put Donatra on the Vorcha, take command tokens and then find yourself a 3 pt upgrade- make a Vorcha a Neg'Var and you get something like this
Command Tokens
Ch'Tang
Donatra
Vorcha
Gowron
Neg'Var
Martok
Command Tokens are great.
The above list, barring any bad maneuvering and loss of actions, will use all of it's points every single turn, and will still be able to have cloaks up every turn.
I planned on running it behind the vor'chas for range 3, and allow an extra defence dice both ways. With 10 attack dice I don't think one extra defence will help them much . Koloth does force them to re roll a 1 critical or hit. which will help as well. i don't plan on using it much any more than once . I really shouldn't need to.
I atually like Koloth on the ChTang. The ships ability is good offense, koloth throws in some defense. Plus he is skill 7 so he will shoot before all of the Donatras out there. It is also nice to see a pure klingon build. I am by no means a faction pure nut, I think mixing it up is great but I also don't want to see half the people at an event with the same list.
Now that LE martok is out I think my fleet will be relying less on donatra.
Personally I think Koloth or N'Daq are perfect for the ChTang. Either of them can keep the ship cheap and use it as a flanker while you go head on with two bigger ships. The Ch'Tangs ability makes it a perfect ship to either stay in formation and get buffs from the main group OR go off on its own to hunt down pesky things like, science vessels, praetus, or in a pinch breen cruisers.
it is a multipurpose ship, which is good to keep in mind when taking it
Automatically Appended Next Post: So if we are talking press ganging Romulans into Klingon service what do you think of
28 Negvar class
6 Martok LE 26 vorcha
4 Gowron
22 Ch'Tang
5 Toreth
4 Attack Patter Omega
5 command tokens
100 total
Toreth with 6 attacks and a free reroll to cripple something early.
So I just created what i think is my first "real" STAW list. I'm more a Star Wars fan, and I've been told that these facions are enemies in the shows, but I love the flight path system and this was a way to get my Trekkie friends into miniatures games.
I call it "Angry Birds, Star Trek"
Negh'Var
Martok
Photon Torpedoes (Klingon)
Khazara
Toreth
In'Cha
Joachim
Photon Torpedoes (Federation)
Advanced Weapon System
I'm not sure what the best 3pt upgrade is from here, but in case it's not obvious Martok slingshots Toreth forward, who opens up with the Torpedoes or Primary weapon to hopefully do some serious damage to a lightly shielded enemy ship. It's a strong alpha strike and the combination of increased attack dice at all times from cloak plus that vicious ability to pick and choose the best critical damage is going to really put the hurt on people.
could more experienced players comment on this strategy or ways to improve the list? That 3pt deficit makes me think I could make this more effeective somehow.
thecactusman17 wrote: So I just created what i think is my first "real" STAW list. I'm more a Star Wars fan, and I've been told that these facions are enemies in the shows, but I love the flight path system and this was a way to get my Trekkie friends into miniatures games.
I call it "Angry Birds, Star Trek"
Negh'Var
Martok
Photon Torpedoes (Klingon)
Khazara
Toreth
In'Cha
Joachim
Photon Torpedoes (Federation)
Advanced Weapon System
I'm not sure what the best 3pt upgrade is from here, but in case it's not obvious Martok slingshots Toreth forward, who opens up with the Torpedoes or Primary weapon to hopefully do some serious damage to a lightly shielded enemy ship. It's a strong alpha strike and the combination of increased attack dice at all times from cloak plus that vicious ability to pick and choose the best critical damage is going to really put the hurt on people.
could more experienced players comment on this strategy or ways to improve the list? That 3pt deficit makes me think I could make this more effeective somehow.
In 100 point games, I always try to use 3 ships, and if I saw a heavily upgraded ship, I'd go for it first. The bad thing about Toreth; low command skill. That vessel is going to get eaten up by concentrated fire early. It just looks like all your eggs are in one basket. I like using Nu'Daq with the Kronos One and the Ktin'ga Photon Torpedoes, which will allow me to change up to two battle stations results into either a crit, or a hit... Plus, I cloak first turn anyways, then get right up on my enemy and take it out in one go. Usually, I'm firing 17 attack dice at each ship each turn.
Also, Elite Attack Die on the Negh'Var with its' ability, priceless..lol
I'm really enjoying the different builds that are coming out of our discussion. I also always try to get 3 ships in and will typically try for 75-80% of my list to be ship points.
The list with Toreth and Attack Pattern Omega is something that I hadn't thought of yet. I actually think Gowron works worse than Donatra in that list since Gowron is going to spend most of his actions on cloaking and not on his personal ability. But then you've got to regig around the list again. It's an issue of really small gains at this point, and there really is no objective best build.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I'd like to hear how the angry bird list works. I bet the slingshot ship unleashes hell and then gets blown up by the three ships facing it down. If you can shoot a ship straight on, your opponent can shoot you back!
For me I don't like mixing the romulan amd klingon fatties in a single list. It has nothing to do with theme, it is a matter of points. I did it once with 2 negvars and a valdor and was not pleased. The place the romulans shine is with their upgrades and you won't have many points for that mixing in expensive klingons. Romulan upgrades are desined to keep your big ships in the fight frustrating the opponent while they struggle against an average 6 evade dice and 6 hull.
Khazara and toreth are a great combo and really don't get enough respect. The khazara uncloaked is the toughest ship in the game, shields & hull together she can take 10 hits to take it down not even the enterprise d can bost that. That said she is not a cheap date, if you take the Khazara you have to build around her and put in other ships to support. This usually means a mostly romulan build to save on points.
in short khazara is good but to expensive to min max with.
I think the Khazara is my article today (not sure if it's today or tomorrow). I also think you have to build around it. I think it's a better overall ship than the Valdore on account of it's movement dial. That Toreth build you got there is, like I said, pretty good.
I'd like them to release an older Spock that could be used on Romulan ships. That would be pretty neat.
Automatically Appended Next Post: If you're using command tokens, I don't think you need Toreth given that you can set aside one attack dice on a crit anyway... unless you're thinking that you may not get the crit through... but the Ch'Tang will alpha strike a crit through a cloaked ship pretty easily on the first pass. If you're up against a federation build, just don't use the attack pattern omega.
What do you guys think about Pike with 2-3 red shirts for a 3rd federation build. Most likely your other ships will have either Picard, Kirk, or Sisko.
You don't see Pike taken that often but with him taking red shirts, or even Spock, down a point he starts to look more appealing for the 3rd chair.
Wouldn't it usually be Picard, Terell and other? Red Shirts are four point evasive maneuvers correct? I guess with Pike you could add 13 pts to your Enterprise D. I don't see it standing up to a Klingon Attack- compare Data at 3 pts- which is 2 evasive maneuvers. You're spending 10 extra points for something Data gets you more of over 2 turns. Unless I'm thinking of this wrong.
The red shirt cancels an attack die of your choice. So a crit, the ELITE ATTACK DIE, the new command tokens that can set a die to any side could be canceled by one red shirt. Data can't let you pick what to cancel and he makes you -2 attacks, plus uses an action. The red shirt is just a discard.
They are 4 points each, but with pike they become 3 and they are NOT unique. There is also they theory that you could take Wayoun as captain and use his anility to use one the same red shirt over and over. Wayoun can be disabled to keep you from discarding a crew for its ability. But that means you ship is doing nothing but enabling Wayoun the whole game. However 6-9 points with Pike the cancel attack dice of you choice os not a bad thought.
I would not take them on a non federation ship, but 1 or 2 of them attached to Pike is doable.
Oh, I see. It's attack dice of choice. I assume though, that you're not really going to encounter the EAD too often, and that you're always going to want to cancel crits before hits anyway, so I'm still not loving the red shirt, unless you specifically built for it. That's the thing about this game- I think most things can be effective if you specifically build around them.
Has anyone used Geordi to any great effect yet? Has anyone run the math on him vs spock?
There are a few guys in my area that are big on the attack die. Sorry I have not really seen anyone use Geordi. I think a guy I played in OP2 had him on a ship but never used him.
Did you feel like the ferengi missile launcher made up its points? I was hesitant to take one, expected a lot of cloaked ships.
Cheers
I find the science vessel is a vastly underated ship I have a tendency to use them with low skill pilots to firstly deploy some choice upgrades (muon tokens are pretty damn effective because they limit your opponents moves or cause damage and even after that take an action from them to rid themselves of it) and after that can be used to foul your opponents flight paths (again denying actions) or shoot to add more firepower (range 1 with donatra is a respectable 3 dice).
The Ferengi Missile Launcher was pretty awesome or should I say the IRW Valdore with Valdore captaining it and Donatra nearby was pretty awesome in every game I got a shot off with it with a 5 dice and 4 dice shot (2 basic +1 donatra +1 Valdore +1 to one of them for green move) which isn't to be sniffed at for something that costs 3pts (4 out of faction) and require no target lock to use.
The folks at the tournie were quite varied in both their skill and choice of tactics and ships. I fought 2 federation builds; one defiant, constitution and Enterprise D (Riker; Khan and Picard) and a two ship Enterprise D and Defiant (Picard and Kirk) with the last game against a 3 ship Rom/Kling Dederix Valdore Vorcha (Toreth; Donatra; NuDa?).
Congrats Strange Dude. Thanks for the thoughts on the science vessel. I mostly prefer to take it as the named one, but I can see how using a couple of them with upgrades could be useful.
I've been playing around with Engage Builds and have finally got something that's worth testing
Ent-D
Picard
Engage
Spock
Antimatter Mines
Uhura
Maht-Ha
Kirk
Corbomite maneuver+Engage
Advanced weapon system
Kerla
The Maht'Ha was chosen because of the number of green movements, and the Ent-D get's significantly better if you can move it properly. Corbomite Manuever and Uhura are insurance against terrible move choices. Spock makes the Ent D more effective. Both captains shoot first and can focus fire one ship a turn.
Interesting build. I am still torn between klingons and romulans. Klingons have the firepower but romulans can get all of the shenanigans cheap.
Automatically Appended Next Post: I think CORBOMITE MANEUVER is a good option for Kirk if the catch you from behind. I don't really see ENGAGE doing much for the M'Tah. It takes your action and you get an auxiliary power token. I think you would do better using that action soe sensor echo and not taking to AP token.
For the points ATTACK PATTERN DELTA might be better to reroll defence dice.
The fleet I used in our local op event seems to be on a completely different line of thought from most of the others on this thread. Thought i would post it for advice and see what you guys think.
Named Negh'var - 30
Koloth - 4
Kommel - 4
Vorcha - 26
Klingon capt - 0
D7 - 16
Gowron - 4
D7 - 16
Klingon capt - 0
The idea is that they stay together as a fairly close block of ships so gowron's extra attack buff affects all three other ships (he is on a d7 because so far most of my opponents don't look at a d7 and see a threat, which means he keeps buffing for longer). Negh'var is always going to absorb hits as a main priority so kommel and koloth are there to keep it alive and annoying people.
Going for sheer quantity of attack dice.
Its not a bad list at all. Though this are different in different areas. Close flying that many ships would not be good if your opponent has some anti matter mines. There are a few guys in my area that like to use them.
Personally I don't care for the D7. I think it got cheated. If it could cloak I would use it, but as is I don't use the 2 I have very much. Given that it only has 3 hull and 1 shield it will be shot out from under you quite often.
Now 5 of them with LE martok, koloth, gowron, and donatra for 99 points that I might worry about.
In my local op 2 event it was a romulan player with mines that won the event hands down - mix of mines, orbital platform and his shooting just stopped all of his opponents in their tracks without taking too much damage himself. Pure luck that I didn't play him.
whitehorn wrote: In my local op 2 event it was a romulan player with mines that won the event hands down - mix of mines, orbital platform and his shooting just stopped all of his opponents in their tracks without taking too much damage himself. Pure luck that I didn't play him.
I tested out my Engage build against a klingon fleet. The Enterprise D with Engage is a beast. That core of the list is fantastic. Won 2 lost 2, but the two losses were about being surprised by Chang, and not activating Uhura at a critical moment. The fleet definitely needs to be piloted by someone who knows what they're doing and has experience running it.
I tried Kirk out on the Kraxon but didn't like it- the 180 firing arc is pretty good though, so I'd consider running it again.
Engage on the Vor''Cha is used to make sure it can go toe to toe against a three ship attack build. Most of the time, you'll be able to avoid shooting, but you'll need it for hairy situations. I continue to test the list out, but so far it's looking like what I'm going to take to OP3.
So, I picked the game up, going head first with starter and an additional Klingon, Romulan and Miranda ship. I'm thinking Khan in the Enterprise D with Joachim and N'Vek as crew, plasma torpedos and counter attack (Khan makes all upgrades faction-penalty free) along with Clark Terrell in the basic Miranda and Donatra in the IRW Khazara. Donatra and Terrell use their abilities to boost Khan, so he can go nuts with his focus bonus and hopefully get a round of combining the plasma torpedo ability with his focus ability. It's 100 right on the money. If Donatra in the IRW costs a faction penalty because it's a different ship/captain from the other two, I can drop the IRW to the basic D'deridex freeing up 2 points to fit the faction penalty in. Thoughts?
I like your list, but would make one suggestion. If you are using khan you want to use battle stations as your action every turn, espesially if he is on the Ent D because it can shoot 360. So I say ditch the plasma torpedoes and give terell and the reliant 5 shot photons and use it a a little gun boat. That should but you at 99 pts and you will have initiative over other fleets.
you are fine, there is no faction cost for donatra on the khazara, its a romulan ship and she is a romulan, its all good in the family.
Sweet. Since you seem to have been playing the most on here, I was hoping to get your thoughts. I assume with doing that, I'm taking the Khazara down to the regular version, not the upgraded ship? Feels like the list has pretty decent synergy, as long as the captains stick together.
If I added it right off the top of my head, given the changes I suggested that puts you at 101, so I would say drop Na vek, and keep the khazara.
Navek is good and cheap on points but he takes up an action and khan should be using that action for battle stations. You want to keep the khazara it will give donatra an extra attack if fireing while cloaked and an extra shield when uncloaked.
The romulans don't have the attacks klingons do, so the key to making them work is using their crazy good tech upgrades and sensor echo to move you into a firing position and out of your enemy's. Don't just charge at someone like an angry klingon think trickster style.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: The romulans don't have the attacks klingons do, so the key to making them work is using their crazy good tech upgrades and sensor echo to move you into a firing position and out of your enemy's. Don't just charge at someone like an angry klingon think trickster style.
Well, I was netting a good 7+ shots a turn with Khazara, until I couldn't get my enemy ships into its' firing arc... :/
Nice, I am not saying it isn't possible to have one or 2 big shooters in a romulan fleet. Unlike klingons who can have multiple heavy hitters. With romulans it is kind of 2 sided either you build to be tricky or build for 2 heavies and a light weight. Romulan ships are so pricy it is difficult to fit 3 big ships and up grades in a list. It is possible to fit 3 valdors in a list and some good captains, but not much else.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Nice, I am not saying it isn't possible to have one or 2 big shooters in a romulan fleet. Unlike klingons who can have multiple heavy hitters. With romulans it is kind of 2 sided either you build to be tricky or build for 2 heavies and a light weight. Romulan ships are so pricy it is difficult to fit 3 big ships and up grades in a list. It is possible to fit 3 valdors in a list and some good captains, but not much else.
Yeah, I was just a little disappointed in the performance of the IRW Praetus, Here's what I ran.
And the Praetus dealt one damage to itself first move by cloaking... Then a 5th Wing attack ship came over and blew it up in the same turn... :/ Enterprise-era vessels should NOT be played seriously...lol
The Khazara's movement dial is fantastic. White Turn 2 and 3 is very rare on a ship.
It looks like you put a bit too many points into your Praetus.
I think Toreth works best on the Valdore since you can green and get 5 attacks.
Plague: You asked a question in the other thread about OP3 strategies. I've tested the scenario a few times now and I'm not convinced that domination of the planet is a realistic goal within the time limits of tournament play. If you get it, great, but I'd rather be attacking opposing ships than attacking the planet. If you're thinking of going the one rear ship to dominate the planet route, I'd take a naked science vessel. Otherwise, my play style is not really being affected by the scenario. If I can't get an attack off on my opponent, I'll go for the planet, but otherwise I want to destroy their fleet asap, like in every other match.
This could be a very nasty build IMO, but I haven't had enough practice maneuvering. So I'll likely end up making a mess of my movements. I see this as more training as I am not thrilled with the prizes.
And the Praetus dealt one damage to itself first move by cloaking... Then a 5th Wing attack ship came over and blew it up in the same turn... :/ Enterprise-era vessels should NOT be played seriously...lol
I too have been disappointed by the performance of the praetus, however I an trying to use it more as my sneak attack then a mine layer.
This weekend I managed to get my hands on the Aj'rmr, so now I can throw the weapons array on it so hopefully it will be more useful for what I want.
Okay, so I plan on writing about Cloaked mines very soon, but I really don't like them in multiples. If I see someone running Cloaked Mines, my plan is to get to them asap (and stay out of arcs etc., on the way but you get my drift). You don't want to drop them first turn, and by the third turn your ships should be close enough that the cloaked mines aren't going to be able to be dropped effectively. I'd only recommend one set of cloaked mines per ship. YMMV.
Donatra + Terell in a 4 ship build is great.
Why use GenKhan and not lvl9Martok? In a 4 ship build, lvl9 Martok is great.
I wouldn't run a naked B'rel- the named ship is so much better. Drop a mine, take the named ship.
This could be a very nasty build IMO, but I haven't had enough practice maneuvering. So I'll likely end up making a mess of my movements. I see this as more training as I am not thrilled with the prizes.
I like this build I lost my 3rd game in OP3 to a very similar list. While trying to avoid the mines all of those little buzzing ships start to hurt.
Gordash wrote: Okay, so I plan on writing about Cloaked mines very soon, but I really don't like them in multiples. If I see someone running Cloaked Mines, my plan is to get to them asap (and stay out of arcs etc., on the way but you get my drift). You don't want to drop them first turn, and by the third turn your ships should be close enough that the cloaked mines aren't going to be able to be dropped effectively. I'd only recommend one set of cloaked mines per ship. YMMV.
Donatra + Terell in a 4 ship build is great.
Why use GenKhan and not lvl9Martok? In a 4 ship build, lvl9 Martok is great.
I wouldn't run a naked B'rel- the named ship is so much better. Drop a mine, take the named ship.
I plan on using the Cloaked Mines mostly to disrupt my opponent's movement so I can gain control of the planet. I plan on placing them on either side of the planet. If they have a FWD 5 capable ship, I'll make sure I make the minefields cover the planet, else I will "block off" a large section of the map. If they go through the mines, I'm OK with that
GenKhan is simply cheap for the skill level and I am at 100 points.
Gordash wrote: Okay, so I plan on writing about Cloaked mines very soon, but I really don't like them in multiples. If I see someone running Cloaked Mines, my plan is to get to them asap (and stay out of arcs etc., on the way but you get my drift). You don't want to drop them first turn, and by the third turn your ships should be close enough that the cloaked mines aren't going to be able to be dropped effectively. I'd only recommend one set of cloaked mines per ship. YMMV.
Donatra + Terell in a 4 ship build is great.
Why use GenKhan and not lvl9Martok? In a 4 ship build, lvl9 Martok is great.
I wouldn't run a naked B'rel- the named ship is so much better. Drop a mine, take the named ship.
I am really starting to hate them. The game I lost was against a list that had 3 of them. Over on BGG Andrew Parks even admitted that they never imagined that people would take multiples when they designed them. Personally I would like to see them be unique, because there is really no way to deal with them.
-Gordash
I tried the above plan, first turn he moves directly opposite me leaving one behind him, then layed 2 in front of him making a nice bubble over a quarter of the board. He placed them very well so as you left one you entered another. So it was an up hill battle. In the end though it was the ships that hurt me not the mines. I was avoiding the mines well, but due to avoiding them GOT MYSELF into some bad spots.
I understood from the FAQ that you only get shot at by one set of mines, even where there is overlap. Make sure that your opponent isn't ganking you.
I just think they need more playing against and you'll find strategic counters. I've been playing with an Engage Build recently, so I rush first turn forward towards the opponent- in the Enterprise D, you can effectively move a straight 7 (3+3+ship base (1)). That brings you close enough that you aren't in range of anything, and far enough that sure, they can drop the one mine in front of them, but they won't get to drop two.
Following that, take a few hits to my shields and go to town. I actually haven't found them to be too onerous yet. That being said, if you're relying upon cloaks for survival, cloaked mines are going to wreak havoc- I think this is a good way to curb the Klingon Meta and open up play space. In OP2, people were still running Klingon builds even with the OWP- things were getting a bit too good for that attack build.
I've read that Andrew Parks admitted to the multiples issues. I'd like to know what was being playtested at the time- from my understanding, most of the first four waves were tested against each other and were not tested in waves.
One of the bigger advantages is that a person can use the measuring stick in the planning phase to drop the things- if you cross reference your straight templates with your attack template, you could do some premeasuring in the planning phase. That's an abuse that I don't really think benefits the game too much.
Automatically Appended Next Post: There's always scan!
Gordash wrote: I understood from the FAQ that you only get shot at by one set of mines, even where there is overlap. Make sure that your opponent isn't ganking you.
I just think they need more playing against and you'll find strategic counters. I've been playing with an Engage Build recently, so I rush first turn forward towards the opponent- in the Enterprise D, you can effectively move a straight 7 (3+3+ship base (1)). That brings you close enough that you aren't in range of anything, and far enough that sure, they can drop the one mine in front of them, but they won't get to drop two.
Following that, take a few hits to my shields and go to town. I actually haven't found them to be too onerous yet. That being said, if you're relying upon cloaks for survival, cloaked mines are going to wreak havoc- I think this is a good way to curb the Klingon Meta and open up play space. In OP2, people were still running Klingon builds even with the OWP- things were getting a bit too good for that attack build.
I've read that Andrew Parks admitted to the multiples issues. I'd like to know what was being playtested at the time- from my understanding, most of the first four waves were tested against each other and were not tested in waves.
One of the bigger advantages is that a person can use the measuring stick in the planning phase to drop the things- if you cross reference your straight templates with your attack template, you could do some premeasuring in the planning phase. That's an abuse that I don't really think benefits the game too much.
Automatically Appended Next Post: There's always scan!
If you enter a Cloaked Minefield, then leave its area of effect and enter a second Cloaked Minefield's area of effect (not counting the overlap), then you take damage from both.
If I see an Engage or Incha-based fleet in OP3, then I will simply line my ships to one side of the planet at the very back of the deployment area and move forward 1" and let them come to me.
If you enter a Cloaked Minefield, then leave its area of effect and enter a second Cloaked Minefield's area of effect (not counting the overlap), then you take damage from both.
If I see an Engage or Incha-based fleet in OP3, then I will simply line my ships to one side of the planet at the very back of the deployment area and move forward 1" and let them come to me.
Thus the problem with cloaked mines. Also not everyone can scan either. In this respect for once the dominion has the advantage.
"11. If the trigger areas for two Cloaked Mines overlap, does an enemy ship passing through the overlapping trigger area sustain damage from both Cloaked Mines?
No. In this case the ship would only be damaged by one of the Cloaked Mines.
However, if a ship passes through (and completely out of) the trigger area of one Cloaked Mine and into the trigger area of another Cloaked Mine, then the ship sustains damage from both Cloaked Mines."
The way I'm reading this is that in order to take damage, you have to move from an area completely out of the trigger area, into the trigger area, then completely out of the trigger area and into a new trigger area... on the same turn... in order to get hit by two mines. You don't get hit if you START in the trigger area and move out. The people that are playing it that way are wrong. If your ship doesn't move "completely out of" the area, it doesn't take damage from both mines- I'm interested to know whether completely out of means that the entirety of your base would have to be able to occupy a space outside of one of the minefields. I'll probably ask Andrew tonight on the BGG forums.
If you're getting hit by two triggers/turn, you've taken some upgrades that allow you to move twice and have done so in the worst way possible, or your movement overlapped two trigger areas and a wide space between those areas- in both cases, it sounds like a pretty terrible movement phase for you. And if there is ANY overlap, you only get hit by one mine on your fly through.
Unless you're flying aggressively, you should only get hit by one mine/turn and decide whether it's time to scan or not.
You should be able to take sensor echo as a way to get out of the field. THAT's a solution I could get behind, since it forces the player to decide re echo or cloak.
Automatically Appended Next Post: ... if I thought they were a problem, which I dont.
Gordash you CANNOT sensor echo out of the mine field if you ship passes within range 1 of the mine field at any point in its movement you are hit. So once you put your move template down at any point as you move the ship along the template if it gets with in range one the mines go off. Sensor echo is at the end of your inital movement so it doesn't help you as far as the mines are concerned.
Yes. I am aware. I was proposing it as a potential solution to the problem- if you immediately SE out of the trigger area, you don't get hit in addition to the scan mitigation. That would have been a decent addition to the card.
After thinking it over I believe it should have been one of those things that was 5 exyra points to put on any other ship. At 8 points on another romulan ship or 9 out of faction people would think before taking so many. It would also have been a good reeason to take a generic praetus which is kind of worthless right now.
seriously Park & Guild could see the Breen ED and Federation Cloak as abusive but not cloaked mines where were they on this one.
I can only speculate, but I think their meta is different- which is to say that they didn't spend a lot of time playing OP3 with only wave 1 and 2 ships. I think that the OP tournaments were probably made late in the process, after most of the ships had already been designed.
I think that having all the ships available probably skews the playtesting process... I actually don't think that the Federation Cloak at 5pts was seen as abusive- I think that its a flavourful move to make it more expensive to put on any ship and not really that it would be amazing on other ships.
Automatically Appended Next Post: That cloaked mines are REALLY good is not up for debate. They are REALLY good. They are really efficient and good for what they do. Are they too good? I think a lot of the problem stems from the fact that they affect the movement phase- which is the phase that requires the most skill- and makes that phase harder.
I really think that the metagame shifted significantly with Wave 2. It's like when a new MtG set changes all the previous decks- Wave 2 was a big shock to the status quo of Klingon Attack Builds and Cloaked Mines are that big shock.
So far we haven't seen the big cards from the new wave yet, but Alexander is great tool against Cloaked Mines- sure you take a hit, but now you have a free action on a ship that gets significantly better with Battlestations.
I don't think cloaked mines are going to change the klingon builds that much. I can see it decreasing cross faction builds with klingon ships, to allow the player to put more points into hull value over outside captains.
in all I was pleased with how my list did in OP3. I won my first 2 rounds and lost my last by one hull point, so I can not complain too much. I came in 2nd and got an Aj'rmr which is the most important thing. Soo many romulan goodies in that pack.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: I don't think cloaked mines are going to change the klingon builds that much. I can see it decreasing cross faction builds with klingon ships, to allow the player to put more points into hull value over outside captains.
in all I was pleased with how my list did in OP3. I won my first 2 rounds and lost my last by one hull point, so I can not complain too much. I came in 2nd and got an Aj'rmr which is the most important thing. Soo many romulan goodies in that pack.
What were other people's fleets like? Any surprises?
I'm probably taking my Engage Build to OP3 in two weeks. I need to test it out a bit more though. I'm not convinced that the 4 ship strategy that a lot of people are touting is going to work for me. I want to make sure that I can deploy on the same side as my opponent, so I want really high skill captains- Picard for sure and possibly Kirk. The problem with the second ship in the Engage Build is that nothing is really as good as the Enterprise D... so I'm stuck on deciding between the Vorcha and the Valdore. I tried out the Galor, but didn't like the movement. I may be forcing Engage onto a second ship when I really should just be happy with my 50 pt Enterprise.
The D with Engage is my favourite ship in the game right now. It's so much fun to play.
What were other people's fleets like? Any surprises?
first up my fleet
Negvar class
Martok (regular)
Hull plating
Negvar class
Picard
Hull plating
ChTang
Gowron
and if IRRC
round 1
Negvar
Klingon Captain
MaTah
Martok
Defiant
Gowron
He had stuffmon the ships but I can't remember what. I won this game and never lost a ship. Sensor echo threw him off wnd he only focused on the planet the first few turns. Turn 3 I think I got him down to 1 ship then chased him with the ChTang and took the planet from him. I never though about using the defiant in klingon fleet before but he got me thinking...
round 2
Enterprise D
Picard
Sulu
MaTah
GEN Khan
Cheat Death
cloaked mines
science vessel
sar
cloaked mines
This was my favorite game this guy really new how to fly his ships ( probably why he won the OP) and he was a great person. The game was close, in one turn my picard and Gen Kahn killed each other in a simultaneous attack. The last turn was just my ChTang and his science vessel. I one shotted him, but he had the planet. Great game.
Round 3
Khazara
Valdor
cloaked mines
Preatus
Donatra
cloaked mines
cloaked mines
B'rel class
klingon captain
B'rel class
klingon captain
I screwed my self this game, tried too hard to avoid the mines. Should have just gone for it. Martok and Gowron got Khazara down to 1 hull, but khazara returned fire and took out Gowron. Then everyone gang banged martok. Wasted too many turns flying picard around the planet.
Oh well even if I wom I was still goimg for 2nd place the guy I beat in round 2 won his other 2 games and had the planet in both.
Other lists I did not play
federation pure list
Ent D
Picard
sulu
spock
defiant
sisko
quantums
reliant
terrel
and stuff
klingon pure
negvar
Martok
vorcha
chang
kronos one
krell
photons
and there was a mixed klingon list in there too but I have no idea what he had. I did here him say his negvar was one shotted by the guy with picard and spock. Apparently rolled 2 hits and 3 crits. He evaded one and two of the crits were double damage... Ouch town population you bro.
Thats it we had a bye the first round and the klingon pure guy left before round 2 started nursing a hangover. I should have another later this week we will see how yhat goes.
Unfortunately in our OP the federation guy never player the 3 cloaked mine guy. He lost to the guy with 2, but I think his Ent D taking a core breach early had a lot to do with that. The guy with 3 played against mostly the klingon lists, go figure.
I think I'll be trying this out for my OP3 tomorrow:
Romulan Science Vessel
Gowron (he can do science!)
Cloaked Mine
K'Tinga
GenKhan
Barrage of Fire
K'Tinga
Terrel
B'rel
Donatra
100 points
The RSV will move up in the middle of the field to deploy mines on the side of the planet the opposing force veers to. If the opposing fleet is using In'Chas or Engages to deny mine deployment, then I will save the mines for later.
Donatra will be GenKhan's wingman. I'll use GenKhan to alpha (if I can get into range) any big ship or if they bum-rushed me.
I figure this gives me a little of everything with a fair amount of attack dice, Barrage of Fire, one set of Cloaked Mines and 4 ships to conduct the ground battle. Thoughts?
The one cloaked mine is good stuff. The Barrage of Fire isn't bad with GenKhan, just don't pop it right away. I still think the B'rel is so outclassed by the named ship.
Gordash wrote: The one cloaked mine is good stuff. The Barrage of Fire isn't bad with GenKhan, just don't pop it right away. I still think the B'rel is so outclassed by the named ship.
2nd that on the ChTang. It is a free target lock every time you are cloaked & it works against cloaked ships for only 2 more points. I would think about ddropping something for it. Will pay off in the long run.
True it is not a real target lock, it is better. As we had to point out to someone at my last OP because you can't use that romulan tactical officer with the ChTang's ability
Honestly I would think of upgrading to LE martok. Most of the time the regular martok's free action is used so gowron can cloak & buff in the same turn, but on a science vessel he will probably won't be shooting much. So gowrons action is free most of the time for buffing other ships. So use the LE martok to really boost those k'tingas and with his captain skill 9 there is little chance of a picard one shotting him before you can fire. Remember only 3 hull on the chtang. A picard valdor/negvar could easily take it out, even with a cloak.
I figured that this is a list that could benefit from a sensor echo over +1 attacks, which is why I thought that regular martok was better- I generally think that regular Martok is better, since it opens up actions, rather than buffs.
Wow, when the dice aren't with you the are against you!
I played in my second OP3 last night. I did terrible, lost all three games. There was nothing stellar about my opponents, my luck was just BAD.
I tried something a little different fleet wise:
negvar class
martok
hull plating
vorcha
khan
hull plating
attack pattern omega
chtang
koloth
In all I think it has potential, however I think my klingons were offended by the presence of khan. I counted through all three games (except planet rolls aced them) I only had 2 attack rolls with more than 2 hits One round I had khan fixed on a reliant with no shields and whiffed on all dice. Same turn had martok shooting at an uncloaked vorcha in the back at close rankge... 2 hits I hade the planet in all three games, game 2 I lost by one point, but it was a good friend so I don't mind too much. In all an awful night for my fleet, the only bright note was that I picked up a 2nd AJ'RMR for being the red shirt.
Oh well, regroup and plan again. Though next time Khan is staying at home.
The rationale was he is still skill 8 and no faction penalty for upgrades and to be a little different all of the players took picard. Its a little boring to see him everywhere.
For OP4 at my FLGS, I am expecting to see more Cloaked Mines (they tested the waters with them last night) and maybe a few Keldon Class Cardassian ships. The winning fleet last night had two Captains with a nine skill.
I need to measure this but my intention is to start in a corner, do a 1 or 2 bank and try to get in range of the SFHQ token without the OWP having range on me. I would try to run across the field for a couple of turns without approaching my opponent giving me time to load up from my Sideboard:
Negh'Var Class
Generic Captain
Vor'Cha Class
Donatra
Vor'Cha Class
GenKhan
89 Points
Sideboard:
LE Martok
Defense Condition One
Barrage of Fire
Alexander
The first turn I would equip the Negh'Var with Martok.
That leaves 4 pts left over for Sulu on the Valdore or on the D.
I like your idea to engage the opponent's fleet quickly. Not sure how it would do though, I don't have enough experience with those kinds of fleets (or in general) to give you much feedback
Yeah, you have to be able to go last, so that your opponent can't mess around further with your movement. It's a toss up between Toreth and Kirk, or LE Martok and Kirk, but I'd be throwing away Martok's ability. If It's not Toreth, it'll be Kirk and I don't have access to GenKhan, or else that may have been a decent addition to the fleet.
I'd really rather be able to play with Gul Dukat now, but that'll be OP4.
Automatically Appended Next Post: And you should try out the Engage build. It's a lot of fun.
Not talking OP here, just fun games of screwing with your friends, but what do you guys think about using either the romulan weapons array or ferengi missile launcher on a breen ship after the energy dissipater. The idea is mostly for action economy so you don't have to target lock, on that note cardassian weapons grid may not be a bad idea either. Any of you guys try anything like this?
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Not talking OP here, just fun games of screwing with your friends, but what do you guys think about using either the romulan weapons array or ferengi missile launcher on a breen ship after the energy dissipater. The idea is mostly for action economy so you don't have to target lock, on that note cardassian weapons grid may not be a bad idea either. Any of you guys try anything like this?
Interesting. Something I want to try one day:
Reliant
Khan
Joachim
Tac Officer
Ferengi Missiles
Kraxon
Donatra
Counter Attack
Command Tokens
And then another ship with either Martok.
Basic goal is use Battlestations and Target Lock with the Reliant to launch the Ferengi Missiles. Have the first attack increased by Donatra, a command token and range if possible. Use the target lock to re-roll twice with Tac Officer hoping to get as many criticals and battlestations as possible. Use Khan to change the battlestations to crits. Then any unblocked crits go directly to the hull bypassing shields. Then use Joachim to try to pick the double damage critical hits. All of this to take out a ship's hull while bypassing shields.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: That sounds cool, I have never been sold on Joachim though. What were you thinking for the 3rd ship?
I don't know; I keep changing my mind... But with the stats of the 4th Division Battleship out now, I would definitely consider this tactic to counter that ship
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: That sounds cool, I have never been sold on Joachim though. What were you thinking for the 3rd ship?
I don't know; I keep changing my mind... But with the stats of the 4th Division Battleship out now, I would definitely consider this tactic to counter that ship
Yeah I saw it, that beast needs a Joachim or Attack Pattern Omega thrown at it. I don't think I am looking forward to that one.
I also saw the ship leaks. The Intrepid looks great. The 4th Wing battleship looks bonkers- although those tight formations already have a decent foil- the cloaked mine.
Changeling Martok on a 4th Wing battleship, giving out two actions per turn to surrounding vessels- it's NUTS.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, don't expect the Dominion Battleship to be very maneuverable. It'll be fairly easy to flank it and start removing those shields. 4 hits/turn against agility 0 is going to stack pretty quickly.
Also the only actions on the 4th division's bar are target lock, battle stations and scan. So unless they have Dukot or Picard they can't' even evade. I am sure the thing turns like a limo ina parking garage, if you stay out of its arc you can pepper it to death.
What is the best way of dealing with a mine laying romulan build?
I have been getting a lot of practise in recently, but its been mostly against federation players, where i am winning most of my games by the simple virtue that my klingon build is throwing far more attack dice than they can deal with.
Now, though, I have started playing my local big romulan player with his mine laying scout vessel and two tooled up valdores and he is absolutely demolishing me every time we play.
What is the best way for a klingon player to deal with mines?
whitehorn wrote: I have started playing my local big romulan player with his mine laying scout vessel and two tooled up valdores and he is absolutely demolishing me every time we play.
What is the best way for a klingon player to deal with mines?
I definately do NOT recommend flying through the mine-affected area! I've had the mine-player roll two hits and a crit so even with shields up I'm being critted with warp core breaches!
Dude, that's a tough one. Thanks for showing the video. Mines are a to deal with.
-whitehorn
I jave found that for 1 or 2 mines careful maneuvering or simply pushing through with shields up is the best way to deal with them. Once you get past them however just try and avoid that part of the board. Remember once they put down the template you are allowed to change your dial. That being said there isn't much anyone can do against 3+ though. There are things like Konmel and Secondary Shield Emitters that help. One thing that helps is to keep play testing against it.
Hopefully next month mines will not be so prevalent, due to the fact that everyone will be having some new and very useful toys coming. Plus if OP4 follows the pattern the planetary defense platforms should count as ships so between them and your fleet there will be limited room to drop mines.
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I went to my 3rd OP3 last night. I finally came out on top. I went 3-0 with 9 battle points, taking the planet in all 3 games. This time I stuckmto my original plan, focus on the enemy first. I only paid attention to the planet if no one was in my firing arc. Once I got my opponents down to one ship i started loading up the planet with troops and used one of my ships to chase them. For me this strategy worked best, and it pais off
So that is one OP coming in 1st, one 2nd, and one dead last. But now my Romulan fleet has some more muscle.
"Wesley slowly back us out of the neutral zone"
I am hoping to put all of those Warbirds to good use. Over the holidays my friend and I are planning to try a 500 point game. It will be either Romulans vs Federation or Romulans vs Klingons. I'll keep you guys posted and we'll try and take some pics.
What list did you take to win? I've got mine tonight and I'm still trying to figure out whether to play Kirk in a Vorcha or Toreth in a Valdore, but I'm leaning more towards the Valdore at this point.
This is the list
Ent D
Picard
Engage
Uhura
Spock
Ant-Mines
Valdore
Toreth
Engage
Tactical officer
Command Tokens
Any thoughts on what I should spend that last 4 points on? Im leaning towards McCoy on the Ent-D to back up Uhura.
I went back to my action economy klingons, pretty much what I had in my 1st OP3.
4 points is tough in that list. You have no tech slots so all of those options are out. 3 pt photons is not a bad option for the D. Gives you a decent range 3 threat as you are turning. Another option would be nevek for the valdor. If you get in behind someone go to shields and hit them with 6 attacks on the valdor. Use the other 2 for starter set obrian, being able to disable a mine before it drops or BoF could be useful.
Action Economy Klingons are soooo good. I won't be too miffed if I don't get a copy of the ship, so I'm taking it easy on bringing the klingons again. If I take McCoy, i'll be able to Uhura twice to get out of a bad situation with the D.
In the abstract, how much would you pay to be able to change your movement dial AFTER you've seen all of your opponent's moves, in an engage build, AND do that twice? I'm thinking that that card would be pretty nuts.
McCoy will not work on Uhura. She is a discard not an action. McCoy allows a crew to perform their ACTION as a free action. Uhura is is just discarded and then you get the ability to change the dial. What you are proposing will only work with Wayoun as captain, but he can not take Engage.
Well if there is nothing else you really need then take a red shirt. They are basically like giving your ship an extra hull point. A little pricy but if there is nothing else you need why not.
I think I'm going to take a Red Shirt on the Enterprise. It's a bit too many eggs in one basket, but it'll be a good chance to see for myself if there's any merit to a big capital ship strategy in a competitive environment. I'd much prefer to have an Excelsior over the Valdore, but we'll see how it goes.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Personally I am not a big fan of the 2 ship build. But you have picked 2 of the best to build around.
In my OP3 I did not see anyone use a 2 ship build. Most common was 3 and I had a 4 ship build. Depending on how others do (and how many rounds and players there are), you may not be able to win the tourney w/o controlling the planet once.
I've done some calculations for OP4. There is a very small space where you can target the SFHQ token w/o being shot by the PDTs. Getting there is so difficult that I no longer think it is viable.
My new build is the following:
USS Defiant
Picard
Quantum Torpedoes
Scotty
Lojur
Cheat Death
IKS Maht-H'A
LE Martok
Dorsal Weapons Array
Interphase Generator
Konmel
Command Tokens (will include a Scan)
99 points
I will have two 9 skill level captains. This may make it so I can react to my opponent's ship placement. They might even place all of their fleet first. I figure this is a nice little bonus.
My general strategy is to start out going straight toward the planet using FWD 1's on the first turn. Both ships will use an Evade as their action and fire at SFHQ. The next turn I will try to move the opposite direction my opponent is going with a 1 Bank. Actions could be to repair shields as needed. When I do have the opportunity, and only one or two PDTs target me, I will use the Dorsal Weapons Array to fire at SFHQ; then use a turn or two to repair shields.
When I do engage the other fleet, I intend to have one turn at Range 2-3. I hope to fire first. I use Scotty to bump up the Quantum Torpedoes, Battlestations, and Target Lock (Picard/Command Token) to to some serious damage on the way in. The next turn I try to fly past so I get them in my rear arcs from both ships. Then fly away and repair/reload.
I have the Cheat Death and the Interphase Generator to help stop a One-shot against my ships.
I've been very reticent about using the Defiant in a two ship strategy. I don't think it's hearty enough to work without a third ship. I'd also say that you need Sulu on the Defiant if you want to make those hull and shield points last as long as possible.
I'd take a look at the Excelsior as I think it will probably perform better in a two ship build.
I also don't necessarily like the Quantum Torpedo/Scotty strategy as it relies upon your opponent not being cloaked on first engagement. If you're looking to use Torpedoes, I think you have to plan to use them on your escape from fracas, after your opponent has dropped their cloak to shoot and you can aquire a target lock. In the first few turns, you'll need some defence on your Defiant or it's going to get shot up.
I think the scotty quantum torpedo idea will be much better on an excelsior class rather than the defiant. I would also rethink the dorsal weapons array. Just go with a negvar, or if firing backwards is really a concern take the koraga and 5 shot torpedoes.
Two ship builds have really struggled in my local meta. I don't think I have seen many do well at all.
Most of the two ship players have added a cheap buffing ship into their list somewhere.
Terrell captaining a Miranda is the usual buff in my area.
Two ship builds have generally struggled in my meta as well, but it's been mostly because of the way they are built.
My general experience with the two ship build is that both ships should be reasonably independent, and beefy, but not built with redundant upgrades- this includes multiple action crew, and multiple action tech/weapon cards. Two ship builds are bad because redundant upgrades effectively reduce your per turn list pt total. I generally build towards a very efficient per turn list pt total.
If you look at my build above, the Enterprise D hopes to stay out of arcs using Engage, and then Scanning to get Spock buffs. You should be able to lay on hits and weather any storm for several turns. The second ship will sensor echo out of arcs as its action and either save the cloak for the subsequent turn if it cannot fire, or it will target lock and get some use out of the tactical officer. Aside from my Uhura Insurance Policy and my Red Shirt (a questionable upgrade to begin with!), the build does not have very many point redundancies, which means that if I'm able to take actions, I should get a 90pt/turn efficiency.
Secondly, you should not play these ships in formation, so as to be able to use creative movements and Engage. Non-squandroned ships' movements are harder to predict than squadroned ships. My list is specifically tailored to combat against the growing tide of Romulan and Klingon Attack Builds.
Against a cloaked mine build, well, we're all struggling right now, but tailoring towards scan certainly goes a long way to mitigate some of that noise.
I would prefer the Valdore to be an Excelsior, but that'll have to wait. I chose the valdore because of the high hull and movement dial, which can be exploited quite nicely with Engage. It was a toss up between the Valdore and the Vorcha, but ultimately I thought the Valdore is more resilient.
3 ship Klingon/Romulan attack builds are so good because they can bring almost 100pts to bear on the opponent per turn, if built properly. They have to stay in formation for this to work, which makes such builds predictable. If one moves off from the others to mitigate your movement, well, I think they're playing into the two ship player's hands. So the Attack player is generally quite predictable in the movement phase, which is offset by the absolute awesomeness of their attack phase.
I've seen an enterprise d and defiant two ship fleet work well, but they have to be played defensively. The moment you go on the offensive with the defiant and lose the cloak the game is basically over.
He used the defiant to absorb damage and buff, while the enterprise dealt it out.
Downside was the list just didn't have the raw attack dice to take ships out quick enough.
I'm not a big fan of the Excellsior's movement dial. And I intend to be maneuverable for OP4. I could replace the Defiant with the Valdore. In fact Valdore + Green Movement + Scotty + Dorsal Weapons = 6 attack with 360 degree arc....
So, I attended at my OP3 tournament last night. I could only make one of the nights for OP3 and took a 2 ship Engage Build. I got 6 pts total and the person who won the tournament got 8pts. All of my points were from the 2 pts for wiping out the opposing player.
Things I learned:
1. The two ship Engage build is great. While it creates point redundancies, I should have swapped out the Red Shirt for Sulu on the Enterprise D. I wouldn't have used him every turn, but it would have saved the Enterprise from a few hairy situations. Engage on the Enterprise D completely messes with the Opponent's strategy, and allows you to get almost anywhere on the board in two turns. Watch as your opponent smiles as you move into his arc, and then gets dejected as you YET AGAIN blow past him to get unreturned shots on his ships. The Antimatter mines hitting two ships are fantastic and really turned games right around.
2. The Valdore, while awesome, is not the amazing second ship in an Engage Build. I have yet to find that ship.
3. I may be moving to a modified Engage Build, keeping the Enterprise D, but going with two smaller ships in later tournaments.
4. Ignoring the planet was not the best strategy, but it made wiping out the opponent easier.
In OP4, I think I'm going to shake it up and bring something a bit more aggressive. With the Sons of Mogh coming out, I may go to a 4 ship LE Martok Build.
I'm not going to have access to two B'rel's... first world problems!
I'm posting up an article today about running the Vo with three other klingon ships, and using the Vo to toss out EM Pulses at skill 1. Could be something neat.
Ferengi. It would be a Vo with generic Captain and the 5pt EMPulse. With the Vo you'd get 7 defense dice and an evade, AND you'd get to EMpulse before most other ships move. It would be really hard to bring down as well.
You know what, it probably wasn't the Valdore's fault. I agree with you that the dial is pretty great. It actually was able to survive a long time. I'm thinking that something with a rear arc that could get another Antimatter Mine down may be the best way to go, but I'm not fully on board with that option yet.
An Excelsior with Dukat, Transwarp Drive, Engage and Antimatter mines may be a better way to go... I'm thinking that in any of these two ship builds going forward I want Picard and Dukat.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Something like this...
Enterprise D 45pts
Picard
Engage
Spock (I also saw Scotty in this slot, which gave the Enterprise 5 attacks at 360 degrees, and did that every turn. Engage and Scotty may be pretty awesome).
Uhura
Valdore 30pts
Dukat 6
Engage 4
That's 85pts. You could toss Antimatter Mines on the Enterprise D, and then take a Reinforcements with Quantum Torpedoes, Sulu, and other upgrades. What do you guys think? Is there a better second ship for this build?
Automatically Appended Next Post: I did use Command Tokens, which I thought were pretty good, but not amazing. They saved the Valdore from Barrage of Fire LIKE A BOSS though.
I have the feeling that Dukat is going to be nuts on a Neg'Var or the Valdore. Access to Battlestations on either of those ships is fantastic.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Okay, from my understanding, every ship can use the Reinforcement Sideboard every turn, in place of their action. The theory behind the below is that you you use the Sideboard to equip in upgrades on the first turn, pursuant to Sideboard rule 2(a).
Here it is, 110 pt Klingon Attack Sideboard Build.
I'm a bit iffy on whether I'd take Synon. I really like Sensor Echo at 3.
First turn, equip Martok on the Negvar, Photons on the Ch'Tang and Advanced Weapon System on the Vorcha. You've got a 105 pt list ready to go. Then you move forward again slowly, equip synon where appropriate and then on the next turns, race towards the opponent with 110pts of full Klingon death.
I like Synon on the Valdore (If you're facing down three ships to one, why not just get out of the way and live to fight another day? Maybe lose two of the ships), and there were a few instances where Sulu would have saved the Enterprise from a few hairy situations- situations where Engage won't get you out of a tight spot and you've used up your Uhura.
If you have the OP3 kit, I would recommend using the Romulan Pilot on the Valdore. You can make a normal move, use him once to make a green move, and then engage to make another green move. But it only works one time.
I did not get the OP3 kit, unfortunately. Since wave 2 will be out, i'm deciding between running Klingons and Engage. The big decision with Klingons is whether to Sideboard or Command Tokens. I like the Sideboard because I can sub in Quantums onto the Ch'Tang for rear fire arcs and advanced weapon systems onto LE Martok's ship. The rest of the subs aren't so great. If I just went with Command Tokens, I could stick with a basic build and toss Alexander onto Martok's ship and take Advanced Weapon System.
Tried out my Engage Build yet again in OP4 tests. Im finding that it's best to avoid the planet and take the 10pts. My opponent can muck around with the planet if they want, I'll just focus on blowing things up good. I was originally deploying the two ships together, but am going to be putting one on the extreme left and another on the extreme right, and wait for the opponent to commit to one side over the other. The Antimatter mines wreck face, and I'm going to sub in Dukat on the Valdore, but I'll have to take out the Tactical Officer- not too upset about that given I didn't do too much target locking the other night.
Just back managed to squeak a win out in my op 3 event with my faithful Romulans (even after losing the first game).
List was
IRW Valdore w/Valdore and tac officer
Valdore Class w/Mirok
Science Vessel w/Donatra and cloaked mines
Science Vessel w/Romulan and cloaked mines
First game faced a guy with a 3 ship fed build (ent d; defiant; and reliant) he played a very tactical cagey game and we went to time with him taking out my Valdore and me his reliant getting him the win but very few fleet points.
Second game was against a 3 ship Klingon build 2 D7 and a K'tinga with every upgrade you can think of flown by a guy on his 3rd game of attack wing ever. I won this one 112 to 0 and captured the planet.
Last game was Klingons again C'tang w/ barrage of fire; Neghvar w/Martok 9 and Ma'tah w/ Donatra. I quickly lost the ground war but managed to put up both cloaked mines either side of the planet. His only two mistakes were passing Martoks firing option when out of range for the barrage of fire and trying to power through the mines. It was a good match but Valdore was relentless and took out all three whilst I only lost Donatra in her science vessel 6 defence dice and not a single evade.
Got the win down to fleet points. Looking forward to next event.
Baldrick- I'm also not sold on the Tactical officer. After more testing, I'd probably drop him. Dukat's battlestations are just so good. Would you not rather have battlestations than one crit per turn?
Gordash wrote: Baldrick- I'm also not sold on the Tactical officer. After more testing, I'd probably drop him. Dukat's battlestations are just so good. Would you not rather have battlestations than one crit per turn?
I see the benefit, but Dukat is going to cost 2 points more so it depends on how pressed I was for points.
It depends on what type of captians you want. If you really want a negh'var your most Likly looking at d7's and k't'inga's as your support ships if you want good captians skills mixed in.
if you not looking for great captains and have access to a B'rel you can do a Negvar, 2x K'tinga, and a B'rel for 92 pts. That leaves you 8 points for captains, Martok(8) and either Nu'daq or Worf.
-Rune Stonegrinder
I like the list, the new keldon class is very nice. It is not as maneuverable as other ships but the 180 arc and 5 attacks makes up for it. Also dukot and donatra look to be a good combo. Though you might also want to think about boosting the galor up to the kraxon and switching donatra for mirok. With the kraxon's ability to take the damage off of your other ships and mirok's ability to heal damage they could really help you other two ships.
Yea according to the FAQ only one command token can be used per turn.
Rune Stonegrinder wrote: I was thinking of trying something different for my next event, with the new ships
Keldon
Dukat
Breen aide
Positron scan (+1 attack while scanning and target no shields)
Keldon
Ranar
Breen aide
Positron scan
Galor
Donatra
A few extra points to spend
Also I have a question op2 command tokens how many can you use per round. I assume 1
any thoughts here guys?
With the command tokens you can only spend one per turn as per the FAQ on boardgame geek .
As to your list it depends on which op your doing and when as different ops have different needs and the admirals orders are valid from January. To get the unified force upgrade and an extra 10pts in upgrades you only have to swap out Donatra (and honestly your opponents will thank you possibly the most used out of faction card ever). I'm not familiar with named version of keldon but may be worth the upgrade as well as to the kraxon just for the extra shields. My biggest tip would be practice moving as the galor is one of the most unwieldy ships in the game.
In my current gaming area I've been hearing way to much whining about klingons so I was considering something new, and alas my area is very heavy Klingon/ Romulan.
As for the named Keldon: Koranak, for one extra shield and the ability to fire on 2 targets at -2 attack dice only if you have a scan token is not worth the 2 points. IMO the shield is nice but I think I can get better stuff with the 2 points like Tetryon Emmissions (Action +3 Defence This Round at 3 points) awesome in my book. Now I'm thinking Gul Evek would work wonders with that card.
Does anyone else feel like the cardassians should be thier own faction?
It's a tough list to evaluate. You're going to have to run these three poorly maneuvering ships in close proximity if you're running Donatra. Klingon lists SHOULD just fly towards this with a view to chucking dice at one target, and repeating. I wouldn't think it would do very well from what I know about Cardassian ships, but I obviously haven't played against the new ships yet (but I'd think they would have a tough time against a klingon attack build).
I would consider running a few of the Jem Hadar fighters with a view to flanking a Klingon build.
You could run something with two attack ships and two keldons, which wouldn't be too bad.
Otherwise, I like your list, let us know how it does.
What do we think about the Dorsal Weapons Array being a meta shifter? I'm hearing rumblings and think it may be the next big "BROKENONOES" upgrade. The fact that it gets buffed by Donatra/Gowron leads me to build something like the following...
Vorcha
Dorsal Weapons Array
Vorcha
Gowron
Dorsal Weapons Array
Vorcha
LE Martok
Dorsal Weapons Array
That low end Vorcha would have 5 attacks 360, and every other ship would have 4 attack 360. This seems to me to be pretty good.
I don't think they will be that bad. The dorsal array will be 4 pts for a non dominion ship and the will have to spend an action to enable them again. I see them as being gimmicky in a dominion fleet but I would not really worry about them in others. For any klingon player that wants the dorsal array over drex is ok with me and my fleet.
Keldon
Dukat
Breen aide
Positron scan (+1 attack while scanning and target no shields)
Keldon
Ranar
Breen aide
Positron scan
Galor
Donatra
Tetryon Emmisions
Failed aslo tried Mirok and the the named Galor they failed as well. However I learned its captians skill that defeated me not the build. befor i got a sht in Dukat was killed because 2 ships hit him while locked on. I'm going to try crossing factions to get some shots in.
Keldon
Gul Dukat
Tetryon Emmissions (+3 Defence)
Keldon
Khan Singh (CS 8) Or Picard
Tetryon Emmissions
Keldon
Gul Evek (re-rolls all blank defence dice) and only had 2 points left
Tetryon Emmisions
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: I don't think they will be that bad. The dorsal array will be 4 pts for a non dominion ship and the will have to spend an action to enable them again. I see them as being gimmicky in a dominion fleet but I would not really worry about them in others. For any klingon player that wants the dorsal array over drex is ok with me and my fleet.
I want to try a Romulan fleet with the named Valdore and Khazara with Dorsal Weapon Mounts and Engage (and maybe a Romulan Pilot or two). Basically try to outmaneuver your opponent where you can fire at them but they have no shot at you. The Valdore and Khazara can boost the DWM's firepower along with some other boosts and high Captain Skill I think this could be a fun build. I was almost going to try this out at my OP4 event tonight, but decided against it in favor of a SFHQ 4 shot in the first turn 3 Klingon ship build.
-Rune Stonegrinder
Here is what I am thinking for you
26 Keldon Class
5 Dukot
4 Cloaking Device
26 Keldon Class
6 Kahn
4 Cloaking device
26 Kraxon
3 mirok
Activate the cloak as soon a possible to get you up to5 evade dice on the first turn of shooting. Use khan and dukot to deal out damage. Soak up damage with the kraxon. Mirok can heal hull and shields on the kraxon.
This is similar to a list I was thinking of using. I am not saying it is perfect but it sticks close to your original idea but gives you some more survivability.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: I don't think they will be that bad. The dorsal array will be 4 pts for a non dominion ship and the will have to spend an action to enable them again. I see them as being gimmicky in a dominion fleet but I would not really worry about them in others. For any klingon player that wants the dorsal array over drex is ok with me and my fleet.
I want to try a Romulan fleet with the named Valdore and Khazara with Dorsal Weapon Mounts and Engage (and maybe a Romulan Pilot or two). Basically try to outmaneuver your opponent where you can fire at them but they have no shot at you. The Valdore and Khazara can boost the DWM's firepower along with some other boosts and high Captain Skill I think this could be a fun build. I was almost going to try this out at my OP4 event tonight, but decided against it in favor of a SFHQ 4 shot in the first turn 3 Klingon ship build.
it could work for some romulan builds. But the problem there is you are putting a lot into a 2 ship build. Right now I don't really care for the 2 ship build.I think that the secondary weapons array is a better investment on a smaller ship like the praetus.
klingons are hace greaf maneuverability and way better things to spend points on so they don't really need it.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: I don't think they will be that bad. The dorsal array will be 4 pts for a non dominion ship and the will have to spend an action to enable them again. I see them as being gimmicky in a dominion fleet but I would not really worry about them in others. For any klingon player that wants the dorsal array over drex is ok with me and my fleet.
I want to try a Romulan fleet with the named Valdore and Khazara with Dorsal Weapon Mounts and Engage (and maybe a Romulan Pilot or two). Basically try to outmaneuver your opponent where you can fire at them but they have no shot at you. The Valdore and Khazara can boost the DWM's firepower along with some other boosts and high Captain Skill I think this could be a fun build. I was almost going to try this out at my OP4 event tonight, but decided against it in favor of a SFHQ 4 shot in the first turn 3 Klingon ship build.
it could work for some romulan builds. But the problem there is you are putting a lot into a 2 ship build. Right now I don't really care for the 2 ship build.I think that the secondary weapons array is a better investment on a smaller ship like the praetus.
klingons are hace greaf maneuverability and way better things to spend points on so they don't really need it.
I just wanted to try it out. Unfortunately OP events seem to be the only time I get to play lately. It may work better with the Admiral's Orders: Strike Force
Night 2 of testing out a non klingon build and trying to get the Cardassians to work for me as a OP list. Still not great came down to the wire against the Klingon dream team. Mirok does work for about one turn. then then klingons get mad and kill him. I wish the Keldons where a spot cheaper so I can put a fe extra upgrades in the mix to repair the Kraxon faster like the reliant guy who repairs a shield when making a green move.
Well I got cheesy and teamed up with romulans (Tal Shiar / Obsidian Order) and brought cloaked mines into the mix this really helped out and comletely turn the tables. then again thats what cloaked mines do. Sigh I hate cloaked mines and feel dirty when using them. Must wash the sin away
Automatically Appended Next Post: So I was looking at the Unified Force upgrade. not sure if I like it, it will bring extra power to many single faction fleets however I think it will only help to foster makeing Klingons a little more powerful. I'm primarily a Klingon player and I play pure klingon faction (9/10 games). so I look at it this way if my opponents start taking this i almost have to to keep my edge.
What do you guys think about Unified force? Objectively of course
I like the united force order, it is thematic and encourages faction pure builds without punishing those who want to mix it up.
I don't know what OP you are getting ready for, but in OP 4 the defense platforms around star fleet HQ count as ships for card text. So you will not be able to put mines down within range 2 of them. That will give you opponent a big bubble to hang in.
Automatically Appended Next Post: -Rune Stongrinder
My math was off earlier, that is what you get for working all night and being the stay at home dad during the day. Try:
24 keldon class
5 dukot
4 cloaking device
24 keldon class
6 khan
4 cloaking device
26 kraxon
3 mirok
3 tetryon emissions
99 total
I was shorting 4 point for some reason had the keldons as 26. Above I have tetryon emissions for the kraxon, but you could also use the for Kyle ans heal 2 shields a turn on the kraxon.
I did notice the math and had tetryon emmissions on, three vor'cha can beat through the the kraxon really fast. Kyle seems like he might help the kraxon and it would have survived on more turn in our practice game if i had him. As for OP I was more looking for a compettive list.
They effectively do the same thing but Boheeka seems a better. Put him on Dukot's ship because you will probably be using battle stations & evade more often then scan.
I need an opinion on a short, simple list for the upcoming OP4.
Negh'Var Class (38pts Total)
Martok
Once more Unto the Breach
Vor'Cha Class (31pts Total)
Gowron
K'T'Inga Class (31pts Total)
Donatra
Counter Attack
I'm giving Donatra the CA because with her penalty, I need to save 1 point and this was the easy way to get a dangerous, can't-ignore model with the slot some free return hits. I'm hoping to have a consistent barrage of at least 18 attacks per turn until Gowron or Donatra bites it.
I'm wondering, though, if I should put Gowron in the K'T'Inga and let him hang further back due to his longer ability range. I'm not sure on the maneuver dial for the Kronos/K'T'Inga but I'm assuming it's no worse than the D7 and can match the two heavier ships easily.
DESTROY THE SCIMITAR! mission video batrep: I tried this scenario with a new player because we work together. We tried it twice so there are two battles in this video. It's a very, very good scenario to do with an inexperienced player.
Automatically Appended Next Post: This is a video of the PATROL THE BADLANDS scenario that comes with the Koraga/K'vort expansion pack. Great 80 points versus 50 points recon mission with lots of cool terrain features. Awesome scenario. Here's the batrep:
thecactusman17 wrote: I need an opinion on a short, simple list for the upcoming OP4.
Negh'Var Class (38pts Total)
Martok
Once more Unto the Breach
Vor'Cha Class (31pts Total)
Gowron
K'T'Inga Class (31pts Total)
Donatra
Counter Attack
I'm giving Donatra the CA because with her penalty, I need to save 1 point and this was the easy way to get a dangerous, can't-ignore model with the slot some free return hits. I'm hoping to have a consistent barrage of at least 18 attacks per turn until Gowron or Donatra bites it.
I'm wondering, though, if I should put Gowron in the K'T'Inga and let him hang further back due to his longer ability range. I'm not sure on the maneuver dial for the Kronos/K'T'Inga but I'm assuming it's no worse than the D7 and can match the two heavier ships easily.
So I went ahead and swapped Donatra/CA and Gowron so that Donatra takes the Vor'Cha. It basically lets me keep Donatra and her Counter Attack closer to the front lines and gives me better leeway in choosing when to trigger cloak/uncloak because I don't need to worry about a bad call instantly ripping away all her hull points.
I had a potential scenario occur earlier today and I need a neutral FAQ ruling if there isn't an official one: If Counter Attack shooting Riker (or another CA) triggers a response that causes my opponent to damage me, do they go off infinitely until a ship is gone? Or is there a limit? I had an opportunity to smack Riker for solid damage, trigger his auto-attack, and then potentially hit him again for ANOTHER attack, which would have almost certainly finished him off. Thankfully, the first attack killed him outright so we didn't need to argue over anything.
The preliminary FAQ, written by the one of the fame's actual developers, Andrew Parks, is on the boardgamegeek website here: http://boardgamegeek.com/thread/1031156/st-aw-official-preliminary-faq/page/1 . Counter Attack, btw, only ever triggers once, as written in the FAQ, under the section, Elite Talent Cards:
2. Can the effect of Counter Attack trigger multiple times during the same round?
No. However, a player may choose to not trigger the effect if he wishes (e.g. to use the effect against a ship firing later in the round).
The FAQ is considered official because it is not fan-made but game designer-made and is used at both the FLGS I play at that run OP events.
I'm playing in my OP4 tonight, going to again run a two ship engage build with the Valdore and the enterprise D. The 50 pt Enterprise D build, with a Valdore with Dukat, Engage, and Drex. Command Tokens as well. Drex on the Valdore is my controversial pick. I'm thinking that it may be better to equip the Valdore with Chekov. Thoughts?
We finally played our op3 event on Sunday, the venue finally got the players pack.
My 2 negh'var and kronos one fleet got stamped all over by another klingon player. Both used very similar ideas in building our fleets but he built his a lot better than I did mine.
Both had 2 big ships to do the real damage and one smaller buffing ship. He had the named vorcha instead of an un-named negh'var and the ch'tang instead of kronos one.
Have to say, thought, Gowron, donatera and ch'tang martock are an horrific combination of captains to face.
For the next event I was thinking about going back to a 4 ship klingon fleet:
Negh'var class - Koloth and Kommel
Vorcha class - ch'tang martock
D7 - Gowron
D7 - Generic
I know I'm losing out on a lot by not using any named ships but going for sheer amounts of attack dice and a couple of good buffs I think this list has to work?
Only other option is o jack it all in and go for a proper swarm. How many D7's can i fit into a list with gowron and martock?
For the next event I was thinking about going back to a 4 ship klingon fleet:
Negh'var class - Koloth and Kommel
Vorcha class - ch'tang martock
D7 - Gowron
D7 - Generic
It all about your alpha strike because the D7's are going to be gone if you fail to roll well. I prefer 3 ship builds. rolling massive dice don't always make a good fleet
My list next list:
Negh'var Class
Martok 8
IKS Ch'Tang
Koloth
Defence Condition One
Vor'cha Class
Gowron
Command Tokens
re roll any of your defence dice
+1 Defence Die
chage one defence Die
battle stations
Either scan or re-roll any of your attack dice
1st Battle phase:
Negh'var Class Lock-on
IKS Ch'Tang Evade or sensor echo and Defence Condition One as ordered by Martok
Vor'cha Class lock-on
Save command token for any one of the defence based ones as needed
So now I have 3 lock-ons and 3 battle stations (most likly using one for defence along with a defence command token) this is going to put a serious whooping on any fleet
The idea is to eliminate heavy hitters unless fielding a fleet like yours, then I go for the D7's Gowron first
Both our Martoks and Koloths will be able to fire with out destruction in a balanced dice game... but the fate of the D7's 4-5 hits is all I need and with lock on and battle stations I should be able to do that. If not the vor'cha will clean up the 2nd D7 if needed
For the next event I was thinking about going back to a 4 ship klingon fleet:
Negh'var class - Koloth and Kommel
Vorcha class - ch'tang martock
D7 - Gowron
D7 - Generic
It all about your alpha strike because the D7's are going to be gone if you fail to roll well. I prefer 3 ship builds. rolling massive dice don't always make a good fleet
My list next list:
Negh'var Class
Martok 8
IKS Ch'Tang
Koloth
Defence Condition One
Vor'cha Class
Gowron
Command Tokens
re roll any of your defence dice
+1 Defence Die
chage one defence Die
battle stations
Either scan or re-roll any of your attack dice
1st Battle phase:
Negh'var Class Lock-on
IKS Ch'Tang Evade or sensor echo and Defence Condition One as ordered by Martok
Vor'cha Class lock-on
Save command token for any one of the defence based ones as needed
So now I have 3 lock-ons and 3 battle stations (most likly using one for defence along with a defence command token) this is going to put a serious whooping on any fleet
The idea is to eliminate heavy hitters unless fielding a fleet like yours, then I go for the D7's Gowron first
Both our Martoks and Koloths will be able to fire with out destruction in a balanced dice game... but the fate of the D7's 4-5 hits is all I need and with lock on and battle stations I should be able to do that. If not the vor'cha will clean up the 2nd D7 if needed
Hmmm, Thanks.
Thats something to think about. There are some really good ideas in there to think about.
Yeah Defence Condition One and lock on make for a awesome combo, re-roll all blank results then spend Battle stations to change all to hits works just like Drex or N'Garen (or whatever her name is). It only works one time, but on all of your ships with the bonus you can use it in the defencephase if you choose. Honestly my list is 99 points I've been considering droping the Nagh'var class for a second Vor'cha and placing Alexnander with Martok. to see howmay time I can benefit from battle stations before being destroyed.
I would like some feedback on how you would try to defeat this fleet. Assume that both Admiral's Orders are available.
4th Division Battleship
Independent/Klingon Flagship Card
Jean Luc Picard
Counter Attack
Omet'Iklan - When attacking, convert 1 result to a hit
Boheeka - when using BS token, convert 1 result to a hit
Long Range Tachyon Scan
66 points
5th Wing Patrol Ship
Donatra
Breen Aide - when using Scan, convert 1 result to a hit
29 Points
Admiral's Orders: Strike Force 5 points
Total: 100 Points
General Strategy:
5th Wing stays in the Battleship's shadow buffing its attack to 8 (or 9 with the Admiral's Orders). Use Picard's skill to attack lower skill ships. Use Counter Attack each turn to almost double the firepower.
Well it is tough to have a plan without knowing how the battleship moves, butt I will tak a stab at it.
It is a safe assumption that the thing is going to move like a snail with a limp. So I would say load up on things that cancel attacks or reduce them to get past itsnfirst volley, ie INTERPHASE GENERATOR, CONDITIONAL SURENDER, ferengi EM PULSE. Fly past the thing, shoot the patrol ship as you fly by. After that stay behind the battleship and light it up as it slowly turns.
It works on Galor Class fleets, but the 4th division ship only has a 90 degree arc so it is not going to shoot back until it turns completely around. It should be fairly eady to out maneuver.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Well it is tough to have a plan without knowing how the battleship moves, butt I will tak a stab at it.
It is a safe assumption that the thing is going to move like a snail with a limp. So I would say load up on things that cancel attacks or reduce them to get past itsnfirst volley, ie INTERPHASE GENERATOR, CONDITIONAL SURENDER, ferengi EM PULSE. Fly past the thing, shoot the patrol ship as you fly by. After that stay behind the battleship and light it up as it slowly turns.
It works on Galor Class fleets, but the 4th division ship only has a 90 degree arc so it is not going to shoot back until it turns completely around. It should be fairly eady to out maneuver.
I figured the Interphone Generator may be a little more popular. Maybe if I used O'Brien to disable it first. ..
After my first OP3 was a disaster I found it much better to go after the opponent first. Get them, down to 1ship then start focusing on the planet battle. My second OP3 I took 2nd and my third I took 1st. Do not be distracted by the planet.
Played the OP3 event yesterday. It went so much better than OP2. The scenario was actually fun and I scored points based on my play rather than the turrets stealing my kills.
U.S.S. Defiant - 24
Jean Luc Picard - 6
Mr. Spock - 5
Cloaking Device - 4
U.S.S. Excelsior - 26
William T. Riker - 4 (would've been Sisko, but he was on the planet, clearly.)
Dmitri Valtane - 3
Miranda Class - 18
Clark Terrell - 1
Worf (Defiant) - 3
Elite Attack Die - 5
99 Points
Came in tied for 2nd in battle points, but ended up in third due to fleet points because my opponent in the first game ran and I only got the point for men on the planet. (14 point win. Kind of demoralizing) Ended up losing the second because I didn't have the punch to get through cloaked Romulans, but secured the planet for a BP. Won the third fairly convincingly and secured the planet. Overall had a really good time. Hoping the OP4 scenario is as fun.
My attack dice were much more potent due to all the scan synergy. Unfortunately, there were still only a few of them, so going up against cloaked ships is still a crapshoot.
Riker is so situational, that I never really got a chance to use him. I popped the action twice, but when I did the opponent would just focus fire somewhere else.
The Defiant survived in both wins and was the last to drop in my loss. It's the most potent vessel of this list.
So I managed to go 3-0 in OP4 on Sunday and bring home the Sutherland. Now that I have had a good look at all the cards I want to use them all. The only issue is with 2 exceptions they are very pricy for what they do. Data is cool for his points, but to utilize him correctly you have to invest in a weapon, a none discard crew and an elite talent. Hobson is good but at 4pts I think I would only ever take him with Pike as captain. By far the best card in the set is DISOBEY ORDERS for 2 pts and it is not unique, very cool.
Though I am severely tempted to test out the Gor Portas with ED, Dominion photons, and Secondary Torpedo Launcher. Will have to see how that one playes out.
OP4 is a blast, it is so much more fun when only the opponent is shooting at you.
Gordash wrote: That's good to hear re the Defiant. I'm going to start looking at it's inclusion in a few lists.
OP4 is SOOOO much better than OP2.
One time I saw someone in an OP put Gowron on the defiant to support other klingons. It worked well supporting and taking damage, I also think he had someone repairing shields too and martok throwing around more actions. Haven't tried it myself but it worked good for him I think he went 2-1.
list isn't finished but what do you think? Picard get 2 orders Dukat recieves 3
Scotty and Tribbles give Picard 7 attack and Dukat 5 attack on first combat (I plan on using transporting one tribble to picard)
I think so. You have 2 big shields, big hull ships and all the right equipment. I think it has a lot of potential, but you should play test it a few times before you commit it to an OP so you kmow where the holes are.
It has potential, but it has the same issues that led me to run such lists with Engage. The Enterprise D is too vulnerable to weight of dice without Sulu or Engage to make it a great build. If you're finding that it's working out for you, let me know because I'm very interested in running large two ship lists- I just think you need maneuverability and control in order to do so, not more attacks.
I was able to win, but not because the Suicide Attacks did anything particularly impressive. If they were actually attacks, they would be great, but as they stand, I'll likely not buy a second attack ship. Too bad, because they were decent in terms of maneuverability, but would cost too much to throw stuff on them to exploit. The Valdore is the best part of that list, and is the primary reason why I was able to win.
I was able to win, but not because the Suicide Attacks did anything particularly impressive. If they were actually attacks, they would be great, but as they stand, I'll likely not buy a second attack ship. Too bad, because they were decent in terms of maneuverability, but would cost too much to throw stuff on them to exploit. The Valdore is the best part of that list, and is the primary reason why I was able to win.
So why take the battle stations flagship when dukat gives you battle stations?
It was the +1 to defense that made me take it. I was using it to keep the attack ships alive. The other flagships may have been more useful though- I was also just putting my foot into the flagship waters.
Gotcha, makes sense. Those attack ships could be useful with 3 defense dice each. But I would ditch the suicide attack and take some more aggressive upgrades.
Here is a little ditty I have been thinking about:
26 vorcha class
6 martok (9)
28 negvar class
6 khan (8)
2 disobey orders
3 alexander
22 chatang
7 picard
100
The idea is picard and martok shooting first to take down shields and khan cleaning up with crits. Disobey orders can give khan his first battle station by swapping an evade until alexander gets going.
I like the idea, but you're not getting a ton of value out of Martok aside from his level 9 awesomeness. It might be better to swap out lvl 9 martok for lvl 8 martok so that you can give Khan an extra action- 3 action Neg'Var is pretty great.
Gordash wrote: I like the idea, but you're not getting a ton of value out of Martok aside from his level 9 awesomeness. It might be better to swap out lvl 9 martok for lvl 8 martok so that you can give Khan an extra action- 3 action Neg'Var is pretty great.
yeah I like free action martok better, but there are some kirk picard combos in my area. But really after khan should only have to do an evade a few times before he can use disobey orders after that all he should beed to do is cloak. Alexander does not take an action. However martok can throw an extra attack and a reroll khans way.
Fair enough. People are doing well with the Picard Kirk combo? What talents are they running on Kirk? I've heard that Cheat Death is really popular in some areas.
One guy just runs cheat death on kirk and nothing on picard. The other guy rus kirk on excelsior with demitri and dominion photons, plus picard on difiant with spock and quantoms. Sombody in there has feint, too. There is more to it but thats the abridged version.
My opponent ran 4 Dominion Ships, here's what I remember
Gor Portas
breen dude
Generic Breen Ship
Keldon Class
CS 3 Cardassian dude
Kraxon
Dukat
Guy that lets him reroll a blank if he has Battle Stations.
Needless to say, the station got blown up... but I got Portas and the breen ship down to 2 and 1 hull points with it respectively.
Nudaq almost took out the Keldon class by itself at range 1 using Martok's ability. (took out all of its' shields and all but 1 hull point with its' attack.)
After the station was blown up, I proceeded to destroy the breen ships before they could utilize their energy dissipators.
The keldon was destroyed by Nudaq, after suffering major damage at its' hands.
Dukat took out Nudaq AND Martok in successive order, So we had sisko and ducat fighting each other, how funny.
Sisko manages to score 2 critical hits on the Kraxon's hull, one which gave him another point of hull damage, and the other, Warp Core breach.
Final roll which took out the Kraxon, range 1, 4 shots, 3 critical hits and a hit, lol...
I'm really liking the defiant as an offensive ship, it's more maneuverable than most federation ships.
Wish wizkids would release MORE modern ships like that, instead of NX era crap...
Argh lost 2nd place in OP4 by 5 points (came in 3rd). Would have taken first if my second opponent hadn't 100% tabled me with no losses (FRAKKING MINES).
Negh'Var Class
--Martok (8)
--Once More Into the Breach (E)
Vor'Cha Class
--Donatra
--Counter Attack
K'T'Inga Class
--Gowron
Performed beautifully for two rounds, but had serious problems against a Enterprise-D / Excelsior (Picard and Kahn, respectively) that dropped Antimatter mnes in the most abusive way possible (basically turned into a shield on the port side of the ship). I came THIS CLOSE to killing Picard, but by the time I had the chance the Enterprise was way outside my arc of fire and I was down to one very badly damaged Donatra.
I made up for it slightly by taking 20 points of mission tokens in round 3. If only I had taken 25, but with the last player being a (very slow) Keldon Class Gul Dukat player I h.
ad to just kill him or risk taking another ten minutes to take three turns where me opponent couldn't actually do anything.
Hey there guys I had my second OP4 the other day. It was a blast. I lost round 2 to the guy who came in 1st. We werecruisern to one ship and he got a lucky shot off, but a great game none the less. In round 3 I quickly got my opponent down to 1 ship and then focused on star fleet HQ. I managed to get 30 points out of star fleet before my opponent decided to fly off the board to deny me the final 5 points. However my efforts paid off and my attack on star fleet was enough to squeak me into 2nd place and bring home a 2nd sutherland
Two is nice, but thanks to some ebay purchases I now have a Nebula class squadron The clix ships are slightly darker in color but they fit in fine.
Sorry for the crappy pics but my camera is dead and I had to use my tablet. Now i really want to run a couple of breen battle cruisers with secondary torpedo launchers.
Automatically Appended Next Post: This is the second mission in the rulebook, found on page 25. Loads of fun with lots to do besides blowing the enemy up - though that works too! Here it is:
Automatically Appended Next Post: This mission comes with the Negh'var expansion pack.
I find it heavily favours the attacker as the defender has so many points tied up in the stationary space station. If his other ships move forward too quickly his ships will be destroyed piecemeal without the support of the space station.
However, if he moves forward too late, the space station will be left vulnerable and on its own.
I think the "Destroy the station" scenario would be a little more balanced it you modified it a little and use the DS9 token from OP1. The station is a lot more menacing when it can throw out 4 5die attacks a turn, pluse crew.
My mate is entering the op 4 event with me next weekend but is dead set on a pure federation fleet.
He's only played a couple of games and that against me, using a list I wrote for him.
I gave him:
ENT-D - picard and chekov,
Defiant - sisko and cheat death,
Galaxy class - Terrell and sulu.
Was supposed to be a hard hitting ent-d, with a defiant that absorbs damage and another big hitter, buffing the other two but hopefully being overlooked a bit.
He really didn't get on with it.
Do any of you have any suggestions on a federation fleet that would work better than my attempt? It can't include the sutherland or excelsior as neither are out in the UK yet.
He's not aiming for a win, just a fleet that won't constantly get tabled.
P.S. before you say anything I realised during the game I had miss-understood Chekov's abilities. Why he seems to be a weird choice in there.
To be a threat the defiant needs torpedoes. If your venue is going to allow the admirals orders and your friend like those ships I would recomend:
Enterprise D
Sisko
Defiant
Picard
Photons (5 shot)
Chekov
Federation Flagship
Galaxy Class
Terrell
Sulu
110 on the nose.
The defiant will be much more durable as the flagship. 4 attacks, 4 hull, 5 shields, and free battle stations. That way when shooting the main weapon you get free battle stations, the ship can evade, and picard can target lock or scan.
However if your friend can't use the admirals orders I would suggest going slightly out of faction.
Enterprise D
Picard
Galaxy
Terrell
Defiant
Independant Flagship w/battle stations
Khan (8skill)
That would give kahn a free battle station, and his ship can evade, plus he shoots at 8 skill with lethal crits and 4 attacks. Also with the independent flagship the defiant becomes duel faction so khan is only 5 pts. This way he has 3 ships coming in with 4 attacks each. Khan's abiloty is more lethal than torpedoes.
Feds can be very competitive, but are more complicated then other races. Klingons can get away with just hooking up good captains with ships. Romulans are about combining tech, ships and captains. Feds are about combining crew, ships and caps. It is just tough to balance out some factions when klingons are so easy. I am having a hell of a time with my romulans right now, but that will chang next month just a lot of trial and error.
Hey there Dakka,
My local store os replaying OPs 1-4 this month so far I am doing well. Last weekend we had 7 peoplefor OP1. The usual guys didn't show up and it was mostly new people so I decided to tone down my usual shenanigans and flew:
Vorch class
Martok (9)
Advanced Weapon System
Vorcha class
Koloth
Advanced Weapon System
K'vort class
Worf
It was a week ago so I don't remember a lot of details
. Round 1 was against a 2 ship build with Khazara and Enterprise D. I know I destroyed the station and the big D. I lost as the Khazara took me out and she had one hull left.
Round 2 was against a pure klingon list. I think he had a vorch, k'tinga, and k'vort. He had lower captains but weapons systems and torpedoes on 2 ships. I won this round. He took the station early. I was going to try and take it back but he was hammering me with its shots so I destroyed it in the next to last round. I do remember that I had all 3 ships left at the end, bit 2 of them had only 1 hull left.
Round 3 was against a pure federation list, Defiant, big D, amd Excelsior. I got some lucky hits through the defiants cloak and took it out on turn 2 and hurt the excelsior bad. I also took the station for myself and took 4 shileds off of the enterprise and it went down the next turn.. Excelsior took one of my ships on a long chance that lasted a few turns until I caught him in a corner. When the dust settled I still had all 3 ships and DS9.
The guy I lost round 1 to, lost round 2 and that together with me taking the station in round 3 put me over the top for a win and another Krayton
Automatically Appended Next Post: Today we did our OP2 replay and only 3 of us showed up. We usually have 8-10 but I think the NFL playoffs are interfering with our turn out. For this I flew something a little different:
Neg'var class
Picard
Interphase Generator
Neg'var class
Dukat
Interphase Generator
Vo
Sar
Ferengi EM Pulse
I got the bye round 1
. Round 2 wwas a united force Picard on flagship Ent D, Donatra on Praetus, and Martok on the Neg'var. We inched it out with 1 maneuvers. One turn 4 or 5 my picard and dukat focused and took out his enterprise. He focused fire on my picard and he went down. Next turn I em pulsed his martok. Dukat one shoted the praetus. He was determined to do a 1 green with martok to get rid of the auxiliary power token so I flew the vo in front of him and he bumped 2 turns in a row and dukat was able to chip away at him. So I only lost picard and the Vo started gaining some respect.
Round 3 was a united strike force kirk on the big D with everything, and Gen Khan on a valdor independent flagship. We traded some early shots taking out the shields on the D. Then the Vo EM pulesed the Valdor. He took out Dukat on turn 3 or 4. The Vo got into a good pposition to bump the valdor and I was able to get some hits on it with my picard while the enterprise D slowly turned around on the other side of the table. The valdor took 3 turns of shooting to get through the Vo and Picard was all alone. I got behind the valdor as he turned around and got him down to 1 hull point and the Obital Weapons Platform finished him off. It was then kirk on picard. I had 3 hull and my shields left. Kirkmhad one hull and 3 shields. It came down toma turn of simultaneous fire amd Picard limped home with 1 hull point left and VICTORY. That was probably one of the best games I have played, despite the OWPs a lot of crafty maneuvers and fun on both sides.
I was the only one with 2 wins so I now have a 3rd real B'rel and my 20th Klingon ship
We had our OP 4 event yesterday and I ended up winning 3-0.
Federation Alliance United Force - 110 points
U.S.S. Defiant
Jean Luc Picard
Mr. Spock
Photon Torpedoes
U.S.S Excelsior
Clark Terrell
Dmitri Valtane
Hikaru Sulu
I.R.W. Valdore
Donatra
Tactical Officer
Had enough potency to tear through two klingon lists that were pretty scary. Assuming the orders are still available, I'll probably fly the same list next month, and see how it goes.
DeathwingCrusader wrote: Here's a video of my OP4 experience. There are three battles. My batreps are becoming more of a warning of what not to do, lol.
DeathwingCrusader wrote: Here's a video of my OP4 experience. There are three battles. My batreps are becoming more of a warning of what not to do, lol.
I wanted the rear-firing arcs, which both the Negh'var and Vor'cha lack. In retrospect, I might swing back to the Negh'var and Vor'cha.
Gotcha, I can see that.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Maybe for more bang for the buck try
Neg'var class
martok
drex
negvar class
koloth
Nagaren
k'tinga
Gowron
Klag
the use the united force to give martok & koloth either advanced weapon systems or someone once more unto the breach. The INCHA talents didn't seem to be doing much for you.
So OP events are fun and all, but sometimes they leave you wanting more One hundred points is so limiting. Well I like to think big. When I first heard of Attack Wing coming out I thought of epic battles like we saw in DS9, not little skirmishes. Here is my idea of Attack Wing; I like to call it…
RUMBLE IN THE NEUTRAL ZONE:
What we have here is a 600 pt game with 34 ships of Romulan vs. Federation goodness. I think we used everyone in the box for this one
This is just the pregame phase, but my wife, my friend, and I will be playing this one out over the next few weeks when we have days off that coincide. This is just a tease for now, however I will be documenting the game as it progresses. So if you guys want to see more I will post it as a full report when it is finished.
DeathwingCrusader wrote: Here's a video of my OP4 experience. There are three battles. My batreps are becoming more of a warning of what not to do, lol.
DeathwingCrusader wrote: Here's a video of my OP4 experience. There are three battles. My batreps are becoming more of a warning of what not to do, lol.
PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote: Interesting, however, likely me and the other guy I play with would be able to finish that game in 4 hours max, lol.
PS, I'm very good with my attack die, lol. GO GO 7 Critical shots!!!
WAIT, how are you using the Intrepid, Oberth, and Constellation classes?
It would only take me and an exexperienced player about 4 hours to play, but my wife doesn't do OPs and likes to have time to think about her moves/actions. She can also only stay focused on the game for about 90 minutes after that she is ready for a Facebook break. It loook like nowit will just be us on this one, my buddy told me last night he has to work 7 days a week for the next month, so he is out. He is even going to miss OP 4, guess I will have to try and win a Sutherland for him.
As to your other question, we use the Oberth class as Mirandas and the Constellation is a micro machine replacement to give the Constitution class for a more Next Gen era feel. The intrepid class is the Bellerophon from tactics. We are using it as a Galaxcy flagship for admiral Ross... until april when we get Voyager in April. We just wanted a little more variety for larger games than the current models allow.
PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote: So, Kronos one, or generic K'Vort? kinda wanted all 3 ships to have Advanced Weapon System...lole
I would go K'vort, form some reason Kronos One doesn't have a tech slot so it can't take the advanced weapon system. For whatever reasone the gave it 2 crew and 2 weapons.
Koranak w/ cloaking device captain by Dukat crew with Boheeka
Kraxon captain by a Cardi captain
D'deridex captain by Donatra
Came it 2nd because I forgot about the 180 arc on the Excelsior.
But for all the Ops I have run Donatra in Valdore except this last one and the first; that time Donatra was in a D7 with 3 other D7s and Gowron and Martok. Actually that might have been 3 D7s and a Vorcha, but I still got that Krayton.
I play Klingons, and up until this month, I've been thrashing my fellow dominion player...
Now, with the simple addition of the Independent Flagship card (reverse Klingon side) to his fleet, I can't even destroy one of his ships... And I'm running an all star lineup of ships too that usually kick ass...
Here's what I generally run
Reinforcements Sideboard 10
Martok (9)
Advanced Weapons System
Barrage of Fire
Defense Condition one
I.K.S. Koraga
Klingon Captain - 0
I.K.S Ch'Tang
Koloth
K'Vort Class
Worf
Alexander
There may be a few things I'm missing, and I run with united Force Admiral Orders, so I usually buy some more upgrades.
Should I be eschewing the Sideboard for the Flagship cards? What about the Command Tokens?
PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote: Why though? I can fit an extra 10 points on the sideboard so total it's like I'm running 120 points worth of stuff...
Yes, but the side board takes an action to use and you can only use it once a turn. The flagship can give you a free action and increase the stats of your ship. Being able to cloak and sensor echo in the same turn is nice The command tokens are also free actions and the rerolls could save a ship or finish off an opponent.
The side board takes too long to get the full advantage from it. If your opponent is on you fast and takes out a ship or 2 you will not get much out of it. Or you might need you actions for other things, cloaking, target locks, martok, etc. Extra stuff doesn't do you any good if you can't use it.
I think there is also a problem with your list 26 Koraga
00 klingon captain
22 Ch'Tang
04 Koloth
24 Kavort class
03 Worf
03 Alexander
20 Sideboard
102 total
PlaguelordHobbyServices wrote: Why though? I can fit an extra 10 points on the sideboard so total it's like I'm running 120 points worth of stuff...
Yes, but the side board takes an action to use and you can only use it once a turn. The flagship can give you a free action and increase the stats of your ship. Being able to cloak and sensor echo in the same turn is nice The command tokens are also free actions and the rerolls could save a ship or finish off an opponent.
The side board takes too long to get the full advantage from it. If your opponent is on you fast and takes out a ship or 2 you will not get much out of it. Or you might need you actions for other things, cloaking, target locks, martok, etc. Extra stuff doesn't do you any good if you can't use it.
I think there is also a problem with your list 26 Koraga
00 klingon captain
22 Ch'Tang
04 Koloth
24 Kavort class
03 Worf
03 Alexander
20 Sideboard
102 total
your 2 points over
Actually, the sideboard only costs 10 pts to use, so technically, I'm 8 points under...
Ok this is what i can think of:
26 Koraga
06 martok (LE)
00 advanced weapons system*
05 defense condition one
22 Ch'tang
04 Koloth
0 advanced weapons system*
05 barrage of fire
24 kavort class
03 worf
05 command tokens
100
*10 points united force
Koloth will shoot at the same time as Dukat. Use matok for a plus one to the attack. Have koloth use a battle station from the command tokens and hit dukat with barrage of fire, supported by martok. 9 attacks with battle stations and the Ch'Tangs reroll should be enough to handle Dukats flagship. Worf can then be used to put some hurt on a 2nd ship. Save defense condition one for the next round all 3 of your ships can shoot.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Ok this is what i can think of:
26 Koraga
06 martok (LE)
00 advanced weapons system*
05 defense condition one
22 Ch'tang
04 Koloth
0 advanced weapons system*
05 barrage of fire
24 kavort class
03 worf
05 command tokens
100
*10 points united force
Koloth will shoot at the same time as Dukat. Use matok for a plus one to the attack. Have koloth use a battle station from the command tokens and hit dukat with barrage of fire, supported by martok. 9 attacks with battle stations and the Ch'Tangs reroll should be enough to handle Dukats flagship. Worf can then be used to put some hurt on a 2nd ship. Save defense condition one for the next round all 3 of your ships can shoot.
Na, they are only 5 points. You only get 5 of then10 tokens though. When intake them I like attack reroll, battle stations, set attack, defense reroll, and set defense die.
The list is a pure faction klingon list, but I have had sucess with something similar:
22 Ch'Tang
07 Picard
05 Barrage of fire
28 negvar
06 Martok
26 vorcha
05 donatra
99 total
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Na, they are only 5 points. You only get 5 of then10 tokens though. When intake them I like attack reroll, battle stations, set attack, defense reroll, and set defense die.
The list is a pure faction klingon list, but I have had sucess with something similar:
22 Ch'Tang
07 Picard
05 Barrage of fire
28 negvar
06 Martok
26 vorcha
05 donatra
99 total
Oh, I think I see what you're trying to do with Picard on the Ch'tang, ensure a first strike with Barrage of Fire and using Picard's free action to give the Ch'Tang Battlestations, correct?
One OP I played in I was able to one shot an Enterprise D in each game. Its killer, though I would not recommend it for OP5. The Ch'tang is too fragile to go up against OWPs. The list did great in OP3 & 4, however with only 3 hull points the extra shots from the OWPs will take picard out fast.
Another thing to keep in mind with barrage of fire is the auxiliary power tokens you have to take for it. One shotting a ship is nice but it leaves 2 of your ships vulnerable, because either your moves are predictable greens, or you are left defenseless. Now that the admiral orders have have changed there may not be so many 2 ship fleets for OP5, so that will be 2 ships coming back at you, plus the OWPs.
Nicely played, and good use of Synon. Did you see the FAQ on BGG today, now Parks says that the OWPs are placed before ships.
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I think OP5 was poorly written. Having the OWPs setting up within 12 inches of the table edge is too close. They were never a factor in my games because in all 3 we just took our time destroying them before the fleets met. Though with the new set up some of them probably be so far away from the action that people will leave them alone. I like how you guys did it in the video, seems more thematic to how they were in the show.
My own OP5 experience was not so great. I swept the first 2 opponents, but in game 3 I just couldn't land a hit and ended up coming in 3rd. I have 2 more OP5s on the calendar. Hopefully they will go better. Though nobody in my group feels sorry for me because I won 3 OP4s and came in 2nd in another. So even without a Rav Laerst I am sitting on 4 Sutherlands.
I will be giving one to a friend of mine that couldn't make it to OP4. He is all about the federation and never even got a chance to play for one.
Great videos as always. He really messed with you attack plan with those mines. Sneaky Romulans Was he using some micro machine war birds? 2 of them looked a little different. Alternative models are great, but you should hook your bud up with a Valdor
I.K.S. Maht-H'A + Scotty + Klingon Flagship OR Admiral's Orders: Strike Force
Basically use your ship's action for Scotty and then cloak using a free action. It's probably come up before, but I just realized you could do this and easily get up to 8 attack dice w/o buffs from other ships.
Hello there guys I have been meaning to bring you guys this report for a while, but things have been crazy around here for the past 2 weeks. I found out after the first turn that it was a little much to keep track of ever action so I only recorded what ships were lost and a few highlight moments. They only house rules we imposed were to allow one resource for every 100 points and we allowed multiple of the named Preatus, the generic Romulan BoP is really worthless. Also since we both took command tokens we decided to allow all 10 or them to be taken as one resource. In all we have two 17 ship fleets and 600 points a side.
Sutherland
Riker
Red shirt
High Energy Sensor Sweep
Nebula Class
Terrell
High Energy Sensor Sweep
Nebula Class
Styles
Positron Beam
Nebula Class
Kira
Positron Beam
USS Excelsior
Captain Sulu
Transwarp drive
Photons (5)
Valentine
Feint
Rand
Excelsior Class
Captain Data
Transwarp drive
Photons (5)
Geordi
Disobey orders
Excelsior class
Positron beam
Photons (5)
USS Reliant
Captain Nog (skill 1 ferengi captain)
Photons (3)
Miranda Class
Photons (3)
Oberth Class (Miranda Rules)
Photons (3)
Oberth Class (Miranda Rules)
Photons (3)
Constellation Class (constitution rules)
Photons (3)
Command Tokens
Elite Attack Die
600 points total
Rumble in the Neutral Zone:
Spoiler:
Set up
Turn 1
Fleets move towards each other nothing else happens
Turn 2
Fleets still closing
Turn 3
Fleets move into shooting range.
Romulans score first blood. Romuland flagship cripples Pikes Galaxy and a generic Warbird finishes him off.
Turn 4
Things getting messy now. Feds loose Flagship, Terrell’s Nebula, and Styles Nebula. Romulans loose Donatra
Turn 5
Romulans loose a Preatus that failed its cloaking test.
Feds loose Picard with the Big D and Nog on the Reliant. Romulans don’t loose any ships to combat but there are a lot of smoking Warbirds.
Turn 6
Feds loose an Oberth Class. Romulans loose Letant with the flagship.
Turn 7
Rough Combat. Feds loose Sisko & Data. Romulans loose Valdor on the Valdor Class, a Generic Warbird, and a Science Vessel.
Turn 8
Feds loose Kira on a Nebula Class. Romulans loose Tomalok & Jerok
Turn 9
Lots of fancy flying, nobody looses a ship.
Turn 10
Riker tries to rally the Federation forces before the Romulans turn around.
Turn 11
Feds loose a Miranda while the Romulans loose Warbird.
Turn 12
Romulans loose another Warbird.
Turn 13
Feds finally loose the old Constellation Class. Romulans loose the last Preatus in return.
Turn 14
Riker and his Nebula Class are lost, a tough blow for the Feds
Turn 15
Unfortunately I forgot to take a pic of the end of this turn. Sulu was all set to hit Mirok with a full salvo of torpedoes. However Toreth and the Khazara shot first and Sulu when down without firing a shot. The Feds also lost the last Oberth class.
Turn 16
Worf hits Mirok at point blank range and takes out the slippery Romulan.
Turn 18
Looking rough for the Feds as they loose another the last Excelsior Class. However the romulans loss another Warbird.
Turn 18
Circling and evading
Turn 19
Toreth and Worf exchange shots but to no serious damage.
Turn 20
More cross eyed shooting for nothing. “I said fire a warning shot across her nose, NOT up it”
Turn 21
More circling.
Turn 22
More circling, are we still awake
Turn 23
Worf locks on with his Quantum Torpedoes.
But Toreth shoots first and takes out the son of Mogh.
Romulans WIN
Graveyard of ships
Toreth and Khazara survives with one hull and one shield left.
So things I learned:
1) Romulans really shine in higher point games. Bigger games give them a chance to load up those expensive ships with upgrades. A Warbird is pretty fierce when packing both plasma and photon torpedoes.
2) When there are lots of ships on the table higher captains skills don’t really mean much. Picard didn’t do much before he was killed and he didn’t worry me all that much when I had 4 Warbirds to fire back at him. Higher captain skills didn’t really become a factor until later in the game when there were less ships with fewer hull points left.
3) Look out for Miranda torpedo boats. When those things started firing salvos of torpedoes all at one target look out.
4) Never underestimate the Constitution class. They get ripped a lot for not having a rear firing arc, but it did really well in our game. We used it as a Constellation Class so it fit into the Next Gen era, but it was the Constitution Class rules we used. That thing delivered the killing blow to the Aj’Rmr, Valdor, Valdor Class, and at least one generic Warbird. It was really the star for the Federation.
It was a blast to play, I hope you had fun reading it.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Great videos as always. He really messed with you attack plan with those mines. Sneaky Romulans Was he using some micro machine war birds? 2 of them looked a little different. Alternative models are great, but you should hook your bud up with a Valdor
Micromachines. Valdore doesn't have a Tech slot for Cloaked Mines or a reverse, both of which my buddy considers essential.
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Great videos as always. He really messed with you attack plan with those mines. Sneaky Romulans Was he using some micro machine war birds? 2 of them looked a little different. Alternative models are great, but you should hook your bud up with a Valdor
Micromachines. Valdore doesn't have a Tech slot for Cloaked Mines or a reverse, both of which my buddy considers essential.
I can see how he likes having those 2 options. Though once the Gal Gathong comes out he might change his mind. You never told us if you won the ship in your OP5 video.
yeah I got rocked at op 5 by romulans with cloaked mines as well, was my first time against them, next time maybe Ill try circling the board edge or something, because you cant just 90 degree away from them and lose all your arcs for shooting.
they sure are good for a 4 pt card!
that being said, It was still a good close game where I took out 2/4 of his ships (150pts at this op)
Mr. S Baldrick wrote: Great videos as always. He really messed with you attack plan with those mines. Sneaky Romulans Was he using some micro machine war birds? 2 of them looked a little different. Alternative models are great, but you should hook your bud up with a Valdor
Micromachines. Valdore doesn't have a Tech slot for Cloaked Mines or a reverse, both of which my buddy considers essential.
I can see how he likes having those 2 options. Though once the Gal Gathong comes out he might change his mind. You never told us if you won the ship in your OP5 video.
Yes, I won the OP5 ship Rav Laerst, but I gave it to my brother who has a Dominion fleet.
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easysauce wrote: yeah I got rocked at op 5 by romulans with cloaked mines as well, was my first time against them, next time maybe Ill try circling the board edge or something, because you cant just 90 degree away from them and lose all your arcs for shooting.
they sure are good for a 4 pt card!
Romulan Cloaked Mines are a 3 point card. They get extremely overpowered the higher the points the battle is. Facing 1 or 2 mines is hard at 100 points, facing 4 or 5 mines (over have the board covered) at 150 points and higher is just no fun at all. For 15 points (3x5), your opponent limits you to half the battlefield while he has the whole thing.
My personal feelings on cloaked mines is the should go away after triggered the first time OR they should be unique. Some where over on BGG Andrew Parks admited that they didn't make them unique because they never thought people would take more than one of them I feel that since they were play tested with that in mind then the mines should have been FAQed to be unique or cost more point for a non Romulan BoP, like the breen ED.
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Though I would like to point out to all folks who say "don't leave home without them" to cloaked mines, in my 600 point game I didn't have 1 of them and still beat the federation
Well this weekend went way better than 2 weeks ago. Two tournaments and two victories
I am glad I was able to get these. I am working on an all breen fleet and it is really helpful to have 3 breen cruisers that now have tech slots Plus INVALUABLE ADVICE & THOT PRAN are great cards.
Interesting thing I noticed was it looks like the Rav Laerst was a little rushed coming out ofmthe factory.
The 2 on the left are the Rav Laerst an the 4 on the right are the Gor Portas expansions. Notice how the green on the fins is missing from the Laerst and the tail on the one isn't even painted at all. I don't really bother me because I am not repainting anything, but I did find it interesting.
wow... i only just now realised my rav laerst has the extra tech upgrade instead of another weapon one... same with the generic version of rav....
thanks for mentioning that baldrick
odd that there are two different generic versions....
Wizkids did the same thing with the Romulan warbird. The Khazara has 1 tech, 1 weapon, and 3 crew slots, the generic drops a crew. The Aj'rmr from OP 3 has 1 tech, 2 weapons and 2 crew, once again the OP generic drops a crew. So you can have a generic warbird with both plasma & photon torpedoes.
Now that we have seen this in 2 different OP prizes it bodes well for things to come. Imagine an OP Galaxy class with a tech slot or a romulan scout with a weapon. I for one can't wait to see what the Collective OP prizes are.
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Oh, I also played some casual games last night. Rav Laerst with Sar & Tetryon Emissions FTW.
Vor'cha Class
Gul Dukat
Dorsal Weapons Array
Interphase Generator
Admiral's Orders: Strike Force
My general strategy was to line up directly across from my opponent and point at a nearly 90 degree angle. I would move away from them and let them take out some OWPs. I then came about and we would joust a bit. Theory was the fleets would pass each other and I would enter the region they de-OWP'ed. They would have to turn around and deal with the OWPs I 'neglected'
In practice this worked out quite well. I also discovered the joy of Sensor Echoes. That came in handy to get out of the way of some OWPs. I went 2-1 with the last win being a roll-off. Unfortunately my idea also took up a lot of time. The only loss was by 7 points and was a very enjoyable game of high-stakes maneuvers.
The biggest stars of my fleet were the ships, the Klingon Flagship, the captains, and the Interphase Generators.
I've been thinking of using Hideki Fighters in OP6, but my OP5 fleet was so fun that I am considering a variant of it.
I was a little unsure of this build at first but wanted to try something different. I was surprised when I went 3-0.
I never thought I would do that well, i really just made the list to see how much i could mess with the AO fleets. I was the only person out of 8 not using admirals orders. The first 2 fleets were united force and round 3 was against a strike force. All the action stacking in the world doesn't help when you get double EM pulsed Martok was a champ because he allowed me to use an em pulse every turn. I was also happy to find a good use for the science vessel.
I would love to see a Jem'hadar Battleship with 2 Aux tokens on it; or a Borg ship for that matter I like it!
So here's what I'm planning for OP6:
IKS Maht-H'A
KLI FLGSHP
Picard
Scotty
Int. Gen Boheeka
Vorcha
Dukat
Int. Gen Klag
AO:SF
Total: 100
I have had some time to plan my manuevers against DS9 on my dinner table. I will start at the DS9 edge of my deployment zone. Dukat will start at the corner on the map's edge and Picard will be at the other corner; both are facing the map's edge that DS9 is adjacent to (flying parallel to my starting edge). Both will start with a lazy 3 and sensor echo; Dukat will sensor echo closer to DS9 and Picard will Sensor echo away; both sensor echos will move them closer to the map's edge. This will allow Picard to Target Lock DS9 and then move out of its range. Dukat will then be in position to do a straight 3 the next turn to just be within Range 2 of DS9. This movement also keeps me away from my opponent. This way I may be able to stay out of range of them on turn 2 so I can focus on DS9.
Use AO:SF for either Sensor Echo to move Picard back out of range of enemy; to give one of the ships an evade token; or give Dukat a Target Lock on DS9
If DS9 is contested, then I am committed to destroy it; and likely will. Beaming Klag over guarantees that I get to fire at DS9 before it does.
If DS9 is not contested, then I have to make a decision to blow it up or not; if I think opponent will try to take DS9 then I blow it up.
One thing that may be interesting is an opposing fleet that is intent on taking DS9. Since I will have it Target Locked on turn 1 and make my intentions of destroying it known; what will they do? If they take DS9 on turn one, will they try to beam back; or will they think they will still get a shot against me from DS9? (I will be going directly into a pylon's firing arc). But they may not realize the my Klag will be a sacrifice I intend to use to tie up DS9. Or they may abbandon DS9 and I may be able to take it with just Klag.
Just be careful going for the station on turn 2. There are several ways now, that did not exist in OP1, to get extra moves. We now have the Romulan pilot, transwarp drive, and flagship. So if your opponent goes for it on turn 1 you could be looking down the barrel of their fleet plus the station. The station could make quick work of that battleship.
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Also double check that your venue is still allowing the Admirals Orders. They were only supposed to be for January & February at first and then wizkids said after that they should only be used "occasionally". Ultimately it is up to the TO, but I know that many places have banned them going forward.
you should be fine. I see most people placing them to one side and plaing an open space game on the other side.
not even the enterprise d can bost that. That said she is not a cheap date, if you take the Khazara you have to build around her and put in other ships to support. This usually means a mostly romulan build to save on points.
One round I had khan fixed on a reliant with no shields and whiffed on all dice. Same turn had martok shooting at an uncloaked vorcha in the back at close rankge... 2 hits 
One hundred points is so limiting. Well I like to think big. When I first heard of Attack Wing coming out I thought of epic battles like we saw in DS9, not little skirmishes. Here is my idea of Attack Wing; I like to call it…
