26241
Post by: Soo'Vah'Cha
Then I reccomend make as much of your purchases from stores that give discounts, many online right now will do 20%, and a few local stores in my experiance match that as well, I am fortunate to have one here in my area that has a flat 20% across the board GW discount, and a bit more for large orders, may also want to expedite before june, if GW's new sales restrictions take hold.
No doubt the prices are high..its GW no news there, I actually expected worse, and been planning this since the first leaked pics had the prices in them. So no real new, news there. 
10347
Post by: Fafnir
At those prices, you could just buy a bunch of Gundam or Kotobukiya kits and use those instead. It'll not only be cheaper, it'll look a hell of a lot better.
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Exactly what I did a few nights ago. Selling al of my GW Tau. Making a custom minis ally. There is zero GW support in my area, no tourney and no place to play.
26170
Post by: davethepak
Those prices are stunning.
I will convert most stuff, or just pick up extra bits on ebay (I have about 30 pathfinders).
Still excited about the book - here is hoping its solid.
24512
Post by: SonicPara
Riptide is $85 and is either static or slight poseability. Standard HG 1/144 Gundam kit is $15-$25 depending on bells and whistles, has not just poseability but full articulation, AND won't have any trademark Tau issues like weak ankles or anything..
Also lol at the prices for Farsight and the XV-8 Commander; their pricing just gets more and more unbelievable. The Pathfinder box (and perhaps the codex if it is long/pretty enough) is STILL the only somewhat understandable price in the lot.
Vote with your cash people. If you like the product and the prices, buy all you like. Otherwise, please PLEASE get creative with your conversions and use 3rd party models. GW will respond to sales so it is on all of us to either support this trend or strike it down.
5859
Post by: Ravenous D
 Fafnir wrote:At those prices, you could just buy a bunch of Gundam or Kotobukiya kits and use those instead. It'll not only be cheaper, it'll look a hell of a lot better.
Those prices are outlandish, especially when you look at the US vs Canadian prices.
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Post by: Azreal13
I have made this point elsewhere, but as the thread likely to be most directly connected to imminent GW purchases, I'll make it here to.
Buy independent.
It doesn't matter who or where from, but every kit not purchased directly nets GW ~40% less cash. If enough people do this, it will make a difference and it WILL get noticed, I promise you GW will monitor not only how much they sell, but where they sell it.
As an added bonus, you'll likely get a bit of a discount, will most likely more directly be supporting someone's livelihood and helping keep outlets open so other games can be stocked and grow, putting further pressure on GW in the marketplace.
There doesn't need to be any knee jerk boycott, just buy smart, save yourself some money and send a message all at once.
10347
Post by: Fafnir
 Ravenous D wrote: Fafnir wrote:At those prices, you could just buy a bunch of Gundam or Kotobukiya kits and use those instead. It'll not only be cheaper, it'll look a hell of a lot better.
Those prices are outlandish, especially when you look at the US vs Canadian prices.
I don't even want to see the Canadian prices.
51769
Post by: Snrub
Hey, HEY! None of you are allowed to complain. NONE OF YOU! 
Why?
Because you don't live in Australia.
So shut up and enjoy your CHEAP prices.*  
Unless your from Japan. You can complain. *expensive model brofist for my japenese mates*
10279
Post by: focusedfire
Brother Captain Alexander wrote:
"via The Astropate: News and Rumors
Codex: Tau Empire: $50.24
Tau Empire Battleforce: $130
Tau Empire XV8 Crisis Battlesuit Team (3): $75
Tau Empire Pathfinder Team (8): $35
Hammerhead: $57.96
Tau Empire Sun Shark Bomber/Razorshark Fighter: $65
Tau Empire XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: $85
Tau Empire XV88 Broadside Battlesuit: $50
Fireblade Cadre: $19.32
Crisis Suit commander: $42.51
Farsight: $50.24
Shi´vre (Finecast) $20.61
Sha´ng (Finecast): $16.75
Shi'vre is the Pathfinder SC, Darkstrider.
Sha'ng is the Tank Commander Longknife."
If this list is all of the new stuff then it gives me some concern. Not for the pricing, but for how limited of a release it is.
I'm not saying that the Tau needed a massive overhaul, because they don't. Aside from new models to help properly fill out the FOC, they only need a few rules tweaks & weapon profile adjustments.
Thing is, I'm not seeing the number and type of units that would properly fill the FOC.
Yes, we are getting the 104 and the much needed Broadside redo.
(Am glad the XV8's stayed the same because I've always felt the Broadsides should be a different weight category than the crisis suits.......only GW kept the name and designation for what is obviously a different chassis. Can't decide if the failure to update the XV designation was due to laziness, stupidity or just a sign of how little GW cares for following the backstory when it is a xeno army.)
Also got a multi-kit flier.
The SC's shown really do not sound that special and are coming across as not affecting the FOC.
So what we are really getting is re-designed/repurposed Broadsides, a giant suit and a flier that will fill 2 FOC slots.
The missing units that would bring the Tau up to par with other armies are:
a second transport/devilfish variant
a jet-bike unit
anti-heavy tank unit or rule to replace the gap left by the Broadside repurposing
1 additional troop choice(drone?)
I'm not all doom & gloom.
Hopefully we will see rules and some units being relocated in the FOC to fill these gaps. Actually, these gaps could be an indication that some units are getting moved to different slots. Will have to wait and see.
Later,
ff
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Post by: wowsmash
wow 50$ for farsight. does he gak gold or something? holy crap. well at least i dont play tau. Models look good but not that good sorry GW another pass for me.
63655
Post by: mh_mini
Brother Captain Alexander wrote:
Yes, we are getting the 104 and the much needed Broadside redo.
(Am glad the XV8's stayed the same because I've always felt the Broadsides should be a different weight category than the crisis suits.......only GW kept the name and designation for what is obviously a different chassis. Can't decide if the failure to update the XV designation was due to laziness, stupidity or just a sign of how little GW cares for following the backstory when it is a xeno army.)
Also got a multi-kit flier.
The SC's shown really are not that special and don't really fill anything missing from the FOC.
So what we are really getting is re-designed/repurposed Broadsides, a giant suit and a flier that will fill 2 FOC slots.
The missing units that would bring the Tau up to par with other armies are:
a second transport/devilfish variant
a jet-bike unit
anti-heavy tank unit or rule to replace the gap left by the Broadside repurposing
1 additional troop choice(drone?)
Prices are steep. Most things went up in price compared to last codex. Though suits in box of 3 actually saves some money. 30x3=90 vs $75. NOT BAD, Farsight... steep. Flier -- Valkyrie $80 Doomsythe $55. It's in the middle of the pack. As for the holes, a second transport would be nice, but not really mandatory. If Devilfish go down in points and depending on the upgrades it can fill different roles. Jetbike, the Piranha kinda has this covered (going down in points)? Not a jetbike and in the Fast slot to compete with the flier and pathfinders. But I dont really think Tau are a jetbike type of army. Antitank would be the Hammerhead and we'll see if anything new shows up in the troops. I was thinking the possibility of Stealsuits going to troops. EDIT. i screwed up my formatting and fixed it.
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Post by: Jayden63
Brother Captain Alexander wrote:
"via The Astropate: News and Rumors
Codex: Tau Empire: $50.24
Tau Empire Battleforce: $130
Tau Empire XV8 Crisis Battlesuit Team (3): $75
Tau Empire Pathfinder Team (8): $35
Hammerhead: $57.96
Tau Empire Sun Shark Bomber/Razorshark Fighter: $65
Tau Empire XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: $85
Tau Empire XV88 Broadside Battlesuit: $50
Fireblade Cadre: $19.32
Crisis Suit commander: $42.51
Farsight: $50.24
Shi´vre (Finecast) $20.61
Sha´ng (Finecast): $16.75
Shi'vre is the Pathfinder SC, Darkstrider.
Sha'ng is the Tank Commander Longknife."
That all looks terribly expensive, but I don't know if its telling the whole story.
No mention of Firewarriors, stealths, devilfish, kroot, vespid, etherials. Its just the new stuff. So who knows exactly where some of the older kits ended up in the FOC. Maybe the Tau will have a secondary transport based off the D-fish model that doesn't need any new parts. Or maybe an wargear upgrade kit (finecasted probably) in a second wave.
53375
Post by: hotsauceman1
Ant news on the commander and what he looks like?
22756
Post by: knighthaunter
on the limited release:
i kinda feel that way myself, but i think we are getting generic kroot and down the road when the merc book comes out (which does seem like something thats going to happen) we will get the kroot kits that are rumored.
that said, some of the prices are pretty crazy to me as well, the 85 megasuit is def just not going to happen for me, as a person who also buys military models, often which brass etch that are waay more detailed that anything GW makes 85 for a kit like this just seems crazy to me. The price on the pathfinder seems semi reasonable (by GW prices) 8 is annoying but im sure thats a trade off on the big drone.
overall its pretty  annoying as someone who has been waiting for Tau for eons it just sucks a little. that said i do hope to book is good and my army is still playable once it drops.
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Post by: focusedfire
mh_mini wrote:
*snip*
Farsight... steep.
Flier -- Valkyrie $80 Doomsythe $55. It's in the middle of the pack.
As for the holes, a second transport would be nice, but not really mandatory. If Devilfish go down in points and depending on the upgrades it can fill different roles.
Jetbike, the Piranha kinda has this covered (going down in points)? Not a jetbike and in the Fast slot to compete with the flier and pathfinders. But I dont really think Tau are a jetbike type of army.
Antitank would be the Hammerhead
and we'll see if anything new shows up in the troops. I was thinking the possibility of Stealsuits going to troops.
EDIT. i screwed up my formatting and fixed it.
Farsight- Yeah, at that price and being finecast just means that I will convert a Forge World model
Flier- I have mixed feelings about these. They are heavily influenced by US Predator Drones(Wonder if General Atomics will sue over IP infringement. )
The models are ok and I keep seeing a futuristic A-10 Warthog if the engines are move to the rear part of the fuselage. Will probably get one or two.
I agree that extra option could expand the Devilfish's role. Personally am hoping for door gunner option. Though, rumors have already suggested a much needed improvement if the sms really do become S7 AP4 Heavy 2 Twin-linked, ignores cover.
Imo, drones being jet-bike infantry when operating as independent squadrons would fit very well. We see things a little differently here but no worries.
Hammerhead as Anti-heavy tank will need some form of improvement. They just don't have the rof or mobility(losing multi-tracker?)to be considered dependable in that role. If the Rail Cannon was Heavy 2 or twin-linked and if the Tau tanks become fast then the Hammerhead would be about right.....unless we get a Hammerhead squadron option at which point the rail cannon would not need the rof increase.
Stealthsuits- yeah, I feel that they along with sniper drones and gun drones are all up for possible FOC moves.
Jayden63 wrote:
That all looks terribly expensive, but I don't know if its telling the whole story.
No mention of Firewarriors, stealths, devilfish, kroot, vespid, etherials. Its just the new stuff. So who knows exactly where some of the older kits ended up in the FOC. Maybe the Tau will have a secondary transport based off the D-fish model that doesn't need any new parts. Or maybe an wargear upgrade kit (finecasted probably) in a second wave.
I agree. Am currently hoping that the release list means something good for the units not mentioned. If my hope proves to be in vain then I can see the Tau being this editions equivalent of the 5th ed 'Nids.
Again, hoping that the rules and FOC leave us with 4-5 very viable non- op builds.
Later,
ff
36303
Post by: Puscifer
 Savageconvoy wrote:Apparently the VX-8 commander is $42 and Farsight is $50.
I want to tell myself that those will never sell for that price. But people always have to prove me wrong.
I still have to see the Finecast Crisis commander to make a judgement whether it is worth that price. Roughly £30? Hmmmm... cheaper to get a forgeworld xv89 and make it look as good if not better.
63655
Post by: mh_mini
 focusedfire wrote:
Farsight- Yeah, at that price and being finecast just means that I will convert a Forge World model
Flier- I have mixed feelings about these. They are heavily influenced by US Predator Drones(Wonder if General Atomics will sue over IP infringement. )
The models are ok and I keep seeing a futuristic A-10 Warthog if the engines are move to the rear part of the fuselage. Will probably get one or two.
I agree that extra option could expand the Devilfish's role. Personally am hoping for door gunner option. Though, rumors have already suggested a much needed improvement if the sms really do become S7 AP4 Heavy 2 Twin-linked, ignores cover.
Imo, drones being jet-bike infantry when operating as independent squadrons would fit very well. We see things a little differently here but no worries.
Hammerhead as Anti-heavy tank will need some form of improvement. They just don't have the rof or mobility(losing multi-tracker?)to be considered dependable in that role. If the Rail Cannon was Heavy 2 or twin-linked and if the Tau tanks become fast then the Hammerhead would be about right.....unless we get a Hammerhead squadron option at which point the rail cannon would not need the rof increase.
Stealthsuits- yeah, I feel that they along with sniper drones and gun drones are all up for possible FOC moves.
I don't think GW could afford legal fees. lol
I hadn't thought about the possibility of drones acting like jetbikes. I was thinking along the lines of I wouldn't expect to see Firewarriors riding Eldar style bikes.  That actually makes sense and could work. (However unlikely that it is at this point I would think)
Hammerheads losing multitrackers makes me really sad inside. Like you said, heavy 2 or TL. Gut tells me they wont become fast, but I can hope!
I wonder if HH will still have submuntions and in what form? looks like XV88s are getting them too and it's st6(?) so one would assume a higher strength on the new Hammerhead.
8815
Post by: Archonate
Puscifer wrote:As for painting, I'm going for a little bit of a tribute to Hyperion from Borderlands 2. Their lore in game is incredibly dark and that's how I want to follow it, with a yellow, black and white army with a leader hellbent on Conquest who will do anything to achieve it.
P&M Blog it! I would enjoy seeing your progress. My P&M Blog doesn't get updated a lot, but when I finish something I try to get pics up. Unique Tau schemes are, imo, some of the most interesting and cool.
focusedfire wrote:
The SC's shown really are not that special and don't really fill anything missing from the FOC.
The missing units that would bring the Tau up to par with other armies are:
a second transport/devilfish variant
a jet-bike unit
anti-heavy tank unit or rule to replace the gap left by the Broadside repurposing
1 additional troop choice(drone?)
We may well see such things in the new Codex. When DE came out and we were seeing new minis for the first time, we had no idea there would also be Wracks, Court of the Archon, Succubus, the Fliers, Venoms. If I remember right, these units got new models later, and so we weren't expecting them.
Hopefully we see several new units that just don't have models quite yet, when the codex appears.
10387
Post by: SabrX
I'm more of a budget gamer. Aside from my Tau (first army), my other four armies were mostly obtained through second markets such as online auctions. I'll even do conversions, albeit decent ones, just to save money. The only thing I don't do is proxy non-GW models.
With the new Tau release, I plan to purchase models I don't already have in the codex. This includes the Riptide and Sun Shark Bomber. No point in me discarding my old Broadsides and Tau commander models. The new Pathfinders however looks really awesome and they seem to have a lot of upgrades.
5859
Post by: Ravenous D
Fafnir wrote: Ravenous D wrote: Fafnir wrote:At those prices, you could just buy a bunch of Gundam or Kotobukiya kits and use those instead. It'll not only be cheaper, it'll look a hell of a lot better.
Those prices are outlandish, especially when you look at the US vs Canadian prices.
I don't even want to see the Canadian prices.
By the looks of that list the dex went up 75 cents, so that probably means $65 now after the price rise in Canada.
I'm getting sorely tempted to contact that shipping company in the states that lets you use their US address and then will ship it over from there, its for all those things that are from US only merchants that refuse to ship past the border.
71687
Post by: 93green
I just bought a whole heap of tau crisis battlesuits :(
10279
Post by: focusedfire
 Archonate wrote:
Brother Captain Alexander wrote:
The SC's shown really are not that special and don't really fill anything missing from the FOC.
The missing units that would bring the Tau up to par with other armies are:
a second transport/devilfish variant
a jet-bike unit
anti-heavy tank unit or rule to replace the gap left by the Broadside repurposing
1 additional troop choice(drone?)
We may well see such things in the new Codex. When DE came out and we were seeing new minis for the first time, we had no idea there would also be Wracks, Court of the Archon, Succubus, the Fliers, Venoms. If I remember right, these units got new models later, and so we weren't expecting them.
Hopefully we see several new units that just don't have models quite yet, when the codex appears.
Uh, one small thing, its my fault for not correcting this earlier.....
I am not Brother Captain Alexander.....My forum name is focusedfire.
No real worries, just don't want someone else accused of having said my ramblings.
As to your reply, I agree and am hopeful. My only concern would be if what we are seeing are the only real changes aside from the necessary repointing to bring the Tau up to 6th ed standards.
Later,
ff
6251
Post by: NecronLord3
Glad I won enough to almost buy the Tau codex in a tournament last Sunday. The rest will just have to come from online discount retailers. +1 from GW for not only failing to eliminate discount retailers but also increasing their business with each price increase.
36303
Post by: Puscifer
Archonate wrote:Puscifer wrote:As for painting, I'm going for a little bit of a tribute to Hyperion from Borderlands 2. Their lore in game is incredibly dark and that's how I want to follow it, with a yellow, black and white army with a leader hellbent on Conquest who will do anything to achieve it.
P&M Blog it! I would enjoy seeing your progress. My P&M Blog doesn't get updated a lot, but when I finish something I try to get pics up. Unique Tau schemes are, imo, some of the most interesting and cool.
My blog is in my sig. More stuff will follow as soon as the dex is released.
There's some other not gaming stuff on there too.
49823
Post by: silent25
Fafnir wrote:At those prices, you could just buy a bunch of Gundam or Kotobukiya kits and use those instead. It'll not only be cheaper, it'll look a hell of a lot better.
Depends.
This:
Yes
This:
Nooooooooooooooooo.......
Both though under $30 from Gundam Planet.
6778
Post by: newbis
I'm hoping some of those prices are wrong, because $50 for Farsight seems kinda ridiculous. Even for GW.
36303
Post by: Puscifer
I'm surprised that there are no codex leaks yet.
We saw the last three leaked nearly a fortnight before release.
34612
Post by: Ledabot
With the white dwarf leaks, I'm surprised that a cover leak hasn't happened yet too. I thought that they had an image of the codex under the preorder pages or something.
50832
Post by: Sigvatr
Those prices make me laugh so hard
52943
Post by: Bewareofthephil
Prices seem high compared to what we used to pay, but I've paid £100+ for a single anime figure before, so I'll probably just suck it up and buy things gradually here. One kit a month should keep the costs at bay whilst helping me spread out the hobbying with my other duties
67431
Post by: Ninjacommando
 Bewareofthephil wrote:Prices seem high compared to what we used to pay, but I've paid £100+ for a single anime figure before, so I'll probably just suck it up and buy things gradually here. One kit a month should keep the costs at bay whilst helping me spread out the hobbying with my other duties
going with you on this one, the last time we bought the "new" tau stuff things where 30%+ cheaper.
27214
Post by: IPS
was going to say that^^
I mean..
wow... XD
I don't even know what to say really^^
Please don't use this term on Dakka. Thanks.
54575
Post by: Capamaru
Well your answer for sure clarifies everything... You are much of a talkative person...
So people fond of tau are the ones fond of Mecha style and gun line armies. If the pricing is true and with no new crysis suits I don't see many new players in the tau ranks.
36276
Post by: Zweischneid
 Capamaru wrote:
Well your answer for sure clarifies everything... You are much of a talkative person...
So people fond of tau are the ones fond of Mecha style and gun line armies. If the pricing is true and with no new crysis suits I don't see many new players in the tau ranks.
What is there to clarify.
I ( and most of my gaming group ) are (over)excited about Tau, yet none are Mecha-style fans. Infact, the most lamentable part of the old Tau Codex is that you need Crisis suits for any decent list, and the more interesting miniatures (Fire Warriors, Sniper Teams, Drones, Vespids, Pathfinders) and a more "modern" combined-arms approach (e.g. markerlights) which are the main reason people are fond of Tau didn't get much lovin.
Besides, people fond of mecha-style armies play Eldar anyhow (or.. Heavy Gear, etc..). And people fond of gun-line armies play Space Wolves
Anyhow, there is actually a discussion on the 40K boards of this very forum on why people play Tau. Some do(!) like the suits, but they are hardly the majority.
But don't take my word for it
Savageconvoy wrote:I started with Tau late 5th edition. Mostly just liked the flexibility of loading out suits with equipment for specific tasks and the generally high mobility.
 Soo'Vah'Cha wrote:
And they are kinda a underdog race..always was a sucker for the little guy in a fight.
so thats why I "play" Tau.
 Bobthehero wrote:Don't play them (yet? Maybe, maybe), but their shootiness and modern tactics always appealed me.
 Shadox wrote:Firewarriors just look awesome and it's probably the army that fits my play style the most.
 Thranriel wrote:First and foremost the models - The firewarriors are just beautiful in my mind.
 Dogface 76 wrote:I was given a Firewarrior squad for a birthday back in the 3rd ed. and was hooked. The suits were always secondary to the Firewarrior appeal.
 -Loki- wrote:their focus on ranged combat rather than melee made for an interesting army to fight, and the mix of the super sleek, but still utilitarian Tau aesthetic and the tribal, brutal Kroot made a very different looking army on the table.
In short, for me personally, I love Tau for the same reason I love CSM (especially with Daemons in the mix and multiple Gods). It's about building an army that utilizes synergy to beat the enemy, getting vastly different unit-types to cooperate in a way that makes them more powerful than the sum of their parts.
It's the ultimate non-spam army.
71687
Post by: 93green
I doubt the authenticity of that video!
299
Post by: Kilkrazy
Don't worry. The kits are not changing for the Crisis suits.
52858
Post by: KaiserEddie
Hmmm... Right now, im happy to be european, that prices on dollars are brutal, but with some euro converting, you can take it more easily, even if we´re having a bad time around here :/
57935
Post by: Samurai_Eduh
Prices are higher, but not prohibitively so. Can't wait!
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
Brother Captain Alexander wrote:Get ready to cry out loud:
"via The Astropate: News and Rumors
Codex: Tau Empire: $50.24
Tau Empire Battleforce: $130
Tau Empire XV8 Crisis Battlesuit Team (3): $75
Tau Empire Pathfinder Team (8): $35
Hammerhead: $57.96
Tau Empire Sun Shark Bomber/Razorshark Fighter: $65
Tau Empire XV104 Riptide Battlesuit: $85
Tau Empire XV88 Broadside Battlesuit: $50
Fireblade Cadre: $19.32
Crisis Suit commander: $42.51
Farsight: $50.24
Shi´vre (Finecast) $20.61
Sha´ng (Finecast): $16.75
Shi'vre is the Pathfinder SC, Darkstrider.
Sha'ng is the Tank Commander Longknife."
Well, Natfka is really bad at quoting (so anyone copying from faeit212 should be aware) . This time he himself didn't understand what he was quoting. Some people including me provided the Euro prices of all releases, tiberius183 from ATT just converted them to US-Dollars using current exchange rates (except from the few US-prices we know from the first wave of WD pics), an Italian blog copied it without quoting the source and Natfka copied it from there without checking what the website really said.
We all know that this is not how US GW prices are made and that a Codex will not cost $50.24. That's how rumours start, when rumour posters are careless and bad quoters.
hotsauceman1 wrote:Ant news on the commander and what he looks like?
Again, gnat yet 
Capamaru wrote:
Well your answer for sure clarifies everything... You are much of a talkative person...
To answer in your sophisticated analysis style:
People that are overexcited about Tau are all damn communists of course
34612
Post by: Ledabot
Hmm, Would it not be easier to calculate an idea of the cost from the current codexs for 6th? if we know the ratio between the codex from these cost and the the true price, we can get a much nicer estimate of the costs.
Edit: considering that the current daemons codex is $49.50, these estimates seem pretty close to spot on.
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
 Ledabot wrote:Hmm, Would it not be easier to calculate an idea of the cost from the current codexs for 6th? if we know the ratio between the codex from these cost and the the true price, we can get a much nicer estimate of the costs.
Edit: considering that the current daemons codex is $49.50, these estimates seem pretty close to spot on.
1.) It is not presented as an estimate.
2.) The wrong source is attributed.
3.) Usually, those estimates are close, but as these are "political" prices not related to actual costs, GW sometimes changes them due to marketing considerations. See Canada and Australia as extreme examples.
299
Post by: Kilkrazy
I suspect the codex will be £30 in the UK, which argues for $45 or maybe $50 in the USA.
However, the Demons codex is over 100 pages. The current Tau codex is only 64pp, so GW will need to have done an awful lot of padding out to make it as big. There are only two new units and possibly three new characters compared to the last codex, which can't be more than four pages of content.
Tau might be a fairly small book, say 80pp, and carry a £25 price tag.
53564
Post by: Snufflesms
found this  on TaoBao http://item.taobao.com/item.htm?spm=2013.1.w426647869.5.49HToT&scm=1007.170.0.0&id=19438495804&ad_id=&am_id=&cm_id=&pm_id=
Could it be the new Codex Cover? I reverse searched the image and found nothing. Automatically Appended Next Post: Also, this  Which seems to be the contents of the battle force from a different angle.
65286
Post by: Brother Captain Alexander
I think it is, damn it looks epic.
The rumors about codex tells about battle suit firing it's weapon on some enemy, this looks about right.
As for the lower picture, it may very well be picture of Tau force from new codex.
70166
Post by: Pox Apostle
Wow. Yeah, that has to be the codex cover. I've never seen it before and it is pretty much exactly what was described as the cover. Good find! And a very good cover as well!
35006
Post by: Medium of Death
That Crisis suit matches the design of new Broadside and Riptide suits.
There is hope for new suits yet! Come on wave 2!
Also that is absolutely awesome looking.
27214
Post by: IPS
It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
71698
Post by: Obsidorox
I don't see how the crisis suit on the cover looks much different than the existing model... Just more detail and more curves I guess. Pretty awesome cover though.
35603
Post by: Tauownz
There are about 10 changes from what I see from that angle. Head is lower into the torso, 3rd aerial out the back, right below the head that is a new piece, the symbol off the chest is new. The weapon on his right arms looks like a new weapon or modified fusion gun, the bottom of the jet pak has those 3 slits in it. A new crotch guard, a new piece on both legs at the bottom of the armor, and fingers are more pronounced. That's about all I see. Will it transfer to the model, we'll see.
33541
Post by: Rented Tritium
 IPS wrote:It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
If the existing drone squad counted as jetbikes, people might play them.
53564
Post by: Snufflesms
I think we could be in for a second wave crisis update. This one shares a few similarities with the new Farsight Model, like the hips, which seem further down, also the shared bolt/circle on the cod piece, seen more clearly here.  
also larger picture.
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Post by: Rented Tritium
Snufflesms wrote:I think we could be in for a second wave crisis update. This one shares a few similarities with the new Farsight Model, like the hips, which seem further down, also the shared bolt/circle on the cod piece, seen more clearly here.
The biggest hint to me is the high collar armor, which is a signature of the new tau sculpter.
53564
Post by: Snufflesms
 Rented Tritium wrote: IPS wrote:It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
If the existing drone squad counted as jetbikes, people might play them.
Actually there is no drone squad. The original battleforce pic was deleted, but 6 drones come with the crisis suits, and 2 with the firewarriors, so that is just all the drones from the battleforce clumped together/
33541
Post by: Rented Tritium
Snufflesms wrote: Rented Tritium wrote: IPS wrote:It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
If the existing drone squad counted as jetbikes, people might play them.
Actually there is no drone squad. The original battleforce pic was deleted, but 6 drones come with the crisis suits, and 2 with the firewarriors, so that is just all the drones from the battleforce clumped together/
Read your codex again. It's in fast attack.
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Post by: Puscifer
That artwork is amazing. If it is the Codex art, it's the best cover art by far.
Also, I hope that all of those units will be good in the new ruleset... that Battleforce is too good for value when compared to the other stuff.
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Post by: Trasvi
Cover looks great.
Honestly though, it's no more different to the current suits than the current codex cover is.
Also, I don't like the new barefoot Tau look. Someone must have decided to emphasise that Tau are aliens and have hooves... but why the frack would you go to battle clad head to *ankle* in body armour?
33661
Post by: Mad4Minis
Ill definitely be getting a Riptide for my mecha collection. Price is about what was expected. Should be all over Ebay for $65-ish with free shipping.
58411
Post by: RogueRegault
Rented Tritium wrote: IPS wrote:It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
If the existing drone squad counted as jetbikes, people might play them.
But then they'd lose the move in assault phase.(Drones aren't eldar, after all.)
Drones would be worth taking if the pulse carbine was improved and the Leadership penalty went away.
Right now the only purpose for gun drones is to improve squad initiative when rolling against Sweeping Advance.
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Post by: Mad4Minis
 Kilkrazy wrote:I suspect the codex will be £30 in the UK, which argues for $45 or maybe $50 in the USA.
However, the Demons codex is over 100 pages. The current Tau codex is only 64pp, so GW will need to have done an awful lot of padding out to make it as big. There are only two new units and possibly three new characters compared to the last codex, which can't be more than four pages of content.
Tau might be a fairly small book, say 80pp, and carry a £25 price tag.
Its more likely that they will sell you some BS as to why its a new style premium book, and you should fork over the same price for less content.
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Post by: Snufflesms
Rented Tritium wrote:Snufflesms wrote: Rented Tritium wrote: IPS wrote:It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
If the existing drone squad counted as jetbikes, people might play them.
Actually there is no drone squad. The original battleforce pic was deleted, but 6 drones come with the crisis suits, and 2 with the firewarriors, so that is just all the drones from the battleforce clumped together/
Read your codex again. It's in fast attack.
I meant that there is no drone squad in the battle force. It is just a group of all the drones. Obviously I know there is a drone squad in the codex.
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Post by: Puscifer
If I get the Battleforce, I might have to squad up the Drones.
I've seen people in 4th and 5th ed use them for mobile cover.
Hopefully they are cheap enough and faster so they can be effective. BS3 would be good too.
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Post by: Rented Tritium
Snufflesms wrote: Rented Tritium wrote:Snufflesms wrote: Rented Tritium wrote: IPS wrote:It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
If the existing drone squad counted as jetbikes, people might play them.
Actually there is no drone squad. The original battleforce pic was deleted, but 6 drones come with the crisis suits, and 2 with the firewarriors, so that is just all the drones from the battleforce clumped together/
Read your codex again. It's in fast attack.
I meant that there is no drone squad in the battle force. It is just a group of all the drones. Obviously I know there is a drone squad in the codex.
The drones in the battleforce aren't specifically for one entry or another. They're models.
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Post by: IPS
Snufflesms wrote: Rented Tritium wrote:Snufflesms wrote: Rented Tritium wrote: IPS wrote:It would be intersting if they actually include a drone squad into the battleforce.
I personally think it would be cool to see them used on the battlefield
(maybe the speculations about drone troops are true? *hopes*)
If the existing drone squad counted as jetbikes, people might play them.
Actually there is no drone squad. The original battleforce pic was deleted, but 6 drones come with the crisis suits, and 2 with the firewarriors, so that is just all the drones from the battleforce clumped together/
Read your codex again. It's in fast attack.
I meant that there is no drone squad in the battle force. It is just a group of all the drones. Obviously I know there is a drone squad in the codex.
by that logic there would also have to be the stealth suit drones in there
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Post by: Samurai_Eduh
Love the cover art! Looking at the Battleforce picture, has the Pirhana changed? Doesnt look like it.
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Post by: whoadirty
 mh_mini wrote:
Prices are steep. Most things went up in price compared to last codex. Though suits in box of 3 actually saves some money.
30x3=90 vs $75. NOT BAD,
Farsight... steep.
Flier -- Valkyrie $80 Doomsythe $55. It's in the middle of the pack.
As for the holes, a second transport would be nice, but not really mandatory. If Devilfish go down in points and depending on the upgrades it can fill different roles.
Jetbike, the Piranha kinda has this covered (going down in points)? Not a jetbike and in the Fast slot to compete with the flier and pathfinders. But I dont really think Tau are a jetbike type of army.
Antitank would be the Hammerhead
and we'll see if anything new shows up in the troops. I was thinking the possibility of Stealsuits going to troops.
EDIT. i screwed up my formatting and fixed it.
Hate to break it to you, but these prices are US amounts. Or as Kroothawk pointed out, Euro prices converted to US prices. The Canadian price for a box of three Crisis suits is $90, which is a $0.75 increase.
71038
Post by: Kerrathyr
Here there are some new pictures for the new Tau;
pages from wd are in french, but there are some new.
There's also the cover (and yes, it is the image shown earlier here)
A couple of things I figured out (which I think I didn't read here)
- commander has the bit for the bonding knife
- tau suits have retractable hands, normally folded into the arms, the commander is sculpted with hands deployed (or something like this)
- Missile drone option for the broadsides
- Additional big-size shoulder-mount guidance missile (broadside)
- Sunshark has a "pulse bombs generator" (i think... never studied french) --> with photo of part of the underside.
- Interceptor drones of the Sunshark are detachable
- Riptide has (options for): induction cannon, ion accelerator, two defense drones (w/ missiles), three head choices, two repulsor/jet engines (and, of course, the Nova reactor)
27214
Post by: IPS
Hm.. I acutally like the standart krisis suit better
The new one has some nice design elemtents to it, but just looks too fragile and blocky, dunno, it kinda seems to lack proper proportions.
also: there i was hoping for independant interceptor drones.. another sadface^^
on a side note:
I want roberto cirillo back as tau designer :(
36303
Post by: Puscifer
Ok... there is something about the XV8 Crisis Commander that I don't like.
I can't quite put my finger on it.
I like the fact that he has multiple weapon options including a new type of weapon, but the pose is just a little off putting.
I hope he is easily poseable.
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Post by: Manchu
Nice cover
69829
Post by: Thatguyhsagun
Just a head up the Tau 'dex was just taken off the GW site. I'm counting the days till I can get new one. Buddy of mine has em and I play em sometimes but I wanted a more modern codex. Looks like my waiting has paid off
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Post by: Kroothawk
I can confirm that the Codex was indeed written by Jeremy Vetock (that is, he is credited, while many others of the design team contributed as well, as is usual nowadays)
Rented Tritium wrote:The drones in the battleforce aren't specifically for one entry or another. They're models.
You are slow today. Snufflesms is correct that 6 drones come from the Crisis Suit sprues and 2 from the Fire Warrior sprue. There are no extra drones not contained in one of the listed kits.
And just for convenience, here the repost of the pics in the above link, showing the generic commander suit (the last model we haven't seen yet):
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Post by: uberjoras
The new commander is kind of... strange. It's not inherently bad, but unless those joints can be articulated, that pose looks somewhat confused. The fire warrior shoulder plate is quite hilarious to me, as are the silly hands. He looks like he's prancing around like he gives all of 0 feths about what's going on around him. But hey, don't ask, don't tell - he's a good soldier most of the time.
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Post by: Goobi2
-edit- -edit- comp fail...
But I think he meant that the drones could be put into a squad of their own, regardless of what sprues they came from.
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Post by: Manchu
He looks kind of stretched out, like taffy.
Or like he was taken completely off-guard by somebody jumping out from behind a knarloc.
"What the --"
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Post by: Trasvi
IPS wrote:
by that logic there would also have to be the stealth suit drones in there
Stealth suits don't come with Gun drones, only a Marker Drone.
31456
Post by: Bolognesus
 Kroothawk wrote:I can confirm that the Codex was indeed written by Jeremy Vetock (that is, he is credited, while many others of the design team contributed as well, as is usual nowadays)
Rented Tritium wrote:The drones in the battleforce aren't specifically for one entry or another. They're models.
You are slow today. Snufflesms is correct that 6 drones come from the Crisis Suit sprues and 2 from the Fire Warrior sprue. There are no extra drones not contained in one of the listed kits.
And there's two from the stealth suits as well as two in the piranha. 14 drones in the box in total (of which 12 are separate sprues, if I'm not mistaken).
60137
Post by: BlueRift
 Kerrathyr wrote:Here there are some new pictures for the new Tau;
pages from wd are in french, but there are some new.
There's also the cover (and yes, it is the image shown earlier here)
A couple of things I figured out (which I think I didn't read here)
- commander has the bit for the bonding knife
- tau suits have retractable hands, normally folded into the arms, the commander is sculpted with hands deployed (or something like this)
- Missile drone option for the broadsides
- Additional big-size shoulder-mount guidance missile (broadside)
- Sunshark has a "pulse bombs generator" (i think... never studied french) --> with photo of part of the underside.
- Interceptor drones of the Sunshark are detachable
- Riptide has (options for): induction cannon, ion accelerator, two defense drones (w/ missiles), three head choices, two repulsor/jet engines (and, of course, the Nova reactor)
Boy, do I wish I could speak french to see what these pages say. Guess it's just a few days away until I can read them in English though. Any French-speakers care to translate the juicy bits? Google Translate doesn't work on pictures...
299
Post by: Kilkrazy
Trasvi wrote:Cover looks great. Honestly though, it's no more different to the current suits than the current codex cover is. Also, I don't like the new barefoot Tau look. Someone must have decided to emphasise that Tau are aliens and have hooves... but why the frack would you go to battle clad head to *ankle* in body armour?
Just paint the hooves boot leather colour. Though it must be said that various indicators make it plain that GW never decided about the foot anatomy of Tau.
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Post by: Lucarikx
All of my money... Gone..... *sob*
On a more serious note, that commander looks awesome. A little tall, but awesome. I would of actually liked if they changed all Crisis suits to look like that, honestly.
Lucarikx
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Post by: CthuluIsSpy
 Manchu wrote:He looks kind of stretched out, like taffy.
Or like he was taken completely off-guard by somebody jumping out from behind a knarloc.
"What the --"
It roughly says: Tau commanders are fire warriors who have proven their worth on battlefield. Sealed (Add better word here) in the imposing XV8-05 exo-suit, they fight on the front lines and slaughter their enemies, thanks to the most advanced weapons the Empire has to offer.
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Post by: airmang
I personally like the Commander suit (it's obviously what's on the cover too). I like that he's got some movement in the model and it's interesting to see the hands extended.
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Post by: KaiserEddie
Manchu wrote:He looks kind of stretched out, like taffy.
Or like he was taken completely off-guard by somebody jumping out from behind a knarloc.
"What the --"
Thats a mini-Ion Cannon/ CIB, isnt it? Were going for Ion-Tau then, i like the model on Enforcer amor, but i hope its posable, he looks more scared than anything, no will to fight with that pose :/ and even taking it like "Hey, i just get here, whats goin on?" not good enough
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Post by: PraetorDave
Did anyone else see the flyers and think of Tron: Legacy?
51948
Post by: The Infinite
Interceptor drones... nice!
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Post by: Trasvi
Translations from the page to english (via Google
1: Commander has a ritual knife to his side, ready to sign that oath to support his companions even in the worst circumstances.
2: exo-armor tau retractable usually have hands folded in their forearms. The exo-armor commander was sculpted with both hands outstretched.
3: The spark gap was cyclo-ion bursts [cyclic ion blaster?] may issue a formidable high rate of fire
4: The launcher loads a dispersion propels a projectile directly at the enemy. then it explodes cauant maximum damage.
5: Escorted by a team of exo-armor crisis, a tau commander brings the fight to the enemy
51948
Post by: The Infinite
It's not hard (just a little time consuming) to type into google translate, though most of it is legible with just a little knowledge of French.
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Post by: Rented Tritium
So I guess "suit" doesn't localize to french well.
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Post by: FearPeteySodes
Love that new armor. Like others have said though I hope it's posable. I also wonder how compatible it would be with the FW XV-89 bits, I've always loved the look of those.
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Post by: Trasvi
Broadsides:
2: Kit includes two broadside drones that can be equipped in various ways. It bears a pod of missiles, found exclusively in this kit.
3: the broadside possesses a particle accelerator goes behind his back to feed its formidable guns, heavy rail.
4: guide a missile can be mounted large as an additional weapon on the shoulder of the broadside
5: nacelles missiles are high yielding no less deadly alternative to heavy rail-guns are arming TWIN standard exo-armor XV88
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Post by: Desubot
Urg that torso makes me cry. everything else awesome.. but just the torso. long slender tau, then suddenly BAM box top.
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Post by: Trasvi
Bomber:
1: the pulse generator is bombs under the fuselage, and produces powerful energy explosives
2: UAVs interceptors arrived wings and can detach in the sun to defend against the enemy shark
Riptide:
1: Induction heavy barrel is a terrible antipersonnel weapon fire rate high. located under the mantle of the weapon can accommodate a secondary system armament, or even a support system if you wish.
2: the ion accelerator is a terrible weapon, particularly when the driver thanks to the supercharges reactor Nova shelters in its exo-armor Riptide.
3: Two drone missile defense are included in the kit. they protect the exo-armor enemy fire and answers has the aggressor with their own weapons.
Two massive repulsors confer riptide has a speed and agility exceptional on the field of battle.
the reactor nova the riptide (which you can see on the left image) is considerably larger than a conventional model, which earned him his status as experimental immense amount of energy that can generate
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Post by: Lovepug13
ok......for what its worth....
Sun Shark Bomber......has a pulse bomb generator and interceptor drones which can detach from the sun shark to defend it from attack.
Razorshark Strike Fighter......capable of engaging aircraft or ground targets, quad ion turret that can fire at ground or air. Has hidden seeker missile arrays in the wings above engines.
Riptide - Five support systems - heavy burst cannon or ion accelerator (Charged using the reactor). 2 shielded missile drones. Jet pack. Nova reactor
XV88 Broadside - Twin linked Heavy Rail Rifle or high yield missile pods.
XV8 Battlesuit Commander - experimental armour suit, experimental weapon systems, bonding knif in box, ion blaster / airbursting frag projector.
Pathfinder Team - armed with experimental ion rifle, pulse pistol - 6 types of drone including a grav inhibitor drone and the pulse accelerator drone. recon drone links with devilfish to provide comms relay and fire support.
CAdre fireblade - 3w IC with split fire a marker light and +1 shot to all fire warriors if they stood still.
Darkstrider - comes with a structural analyser to target weak points of enemy armour
Longstrike - wears XV02 battlesuit
Sky Ray - can target land or air targets
Firewarriors - Supporting fire special rule
Prices (UK)
Riptide - £50
Flyer - £40
Hammerhead / Skyray £35
Battleforce £80
Pathfinders £20
Broadside £30
Battlesuits £45
Cadre Fireblade £12
Tau Battlesuit Commander £25
Farsight £30
Darkstrider £11
Longstrike £9.50
Battle Report in WD - Tau vs Nids
Speaks about a puretide engram neurochip for HQ suit
repulser impact fields for crisis suits
Firewarriors now able to take target lock
stealth suits with counterfire defence systems
stealth suits with velocity tracker
seems all ion weapons can be overcharged - interceptor drones boosted ion rifles to strength 8.
thats about all at the moment....
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Post by: MajorTom11
Wow the commander suit looks great, I want to paint that!
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Post by: reds8n
Sounding good ! 
Thanks for that !
60541
Post by: YotsubaSnake
I think just rotating the head to look in the other direction would change him from having a surprised stance to a more aggressive stance. But that's just an inital guess. I'm in the same boat as others, if he's not posable, I'm not interested.
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Post by: Stormcrow
So does this mean the firewarrior box is the same?
47547
Post by: CthuluIsSpy
On those bullet points for the commander armor (again, roughly translated. Still better than google though )
1: The commander carries a bonding knife, signifying that he is ready to support is comrades in the most dire of circumstances.
2: Tau Exo-suits have retractable hands, which are normally folded into their fore-arms. The tau commander in this case is sculpted with both hands exposed.
3: The ionic cylic burster (forgot real name) deliverers formidable salvos at a high rate of fire.
4: The dispersion charge launcher (insert proper name here) fires a projectile directly into an enemy where it explodes, causing maximum damage.
5: Escorted by a team of Crisis Exo-suits, the Commander brings the fight to the enemy.
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Post by: Archonate
Oh wow, I didn't expect the new Commander suit to be so large. He looks about twice the height of the XV8s. In any case I think he looks fantastic.
I always wished those hands would retract. I love the collar, the lowered hips, the big shoulder shield, and the knee knobs somewhat like the XV9s have.
I always thought Crisis suits would look so much better with a little more space between their hips and chest.
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Post by: Fezman
Lovepug13 wrote:Darkstrider - comes with a structural analyser to target weak points of enemy
A sniper character who joins the Tau scout unit - you could call him a kind of....Tau-rios Tau-lion character?
...
Sorry...
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Post by: Trasvi
(Large?) Seeker Missile on Broadsides is very interesting.
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Post by: Lovepug13
Trasvi wrote:(Large?) Seeker Missile on Broadsides is very interesting.
they are called high yield missile pods....and it can add a seeker missile as well
and the drones can 100% detach to allow the bomber to complete it's bombing run
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Post by: Desubot
"High yield missile pods"
oh goody i wonder just how many missiles it will fire
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Post by: Lovepug13
velocity trackers give skyfire as far as we can make out
and the tank commander kills 28 (tyranid) models and they comment on how useful he is and was the "man of the match so to speak"
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Post by: Stormonu
hmm. I've got some old unassembled gundam models - wonder if they're the right size to kit-bash as riptides?
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Post by: airmang
The bomb generator on the flyer looks like something you would blow bubbles with...
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Post by: Thatguyhsagun
 airmang wrote:The bomb generator on the flyer looks like something you would blow bubbles with...
bubbles.... OF PLASMA-y DEATH
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Post by: Kroothawk
Small tidbits:
There is a mail order set of Farsight Enclave shoulder pads for Fire Warriors.
Darkstrider is male.
Kroot are in.
Farsight is a rebel but still loyal.
You see the heightened field on top of the bomber wings? You can push them open and see the seeker missiles underneath.
The missile Broadside is really full of missiles
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Post by: davou
Archonate wrote:Oh wow, I didn't expect the new Commander suit to be so large. He looks about twice the height of the XV8s. In any case I think he looks fantastic.
I always wished those hands would retract. I love the collar, the lowered hips, the big shoulder shield, and the knee knobs somewhat like the XV9s have.
I always thought Crisis suits would look so much better with a little more space between their hips and chest.
look at the photo, they have him standing on a box.
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Post by: Archonate
And it appears the Cyclic Ion Blaster looks dramatically different.
20774
Post by: pretre
davou wrote: Archonate wrote:Oh wow, I didn't expect the new Commander suit to be so large. He looks about twice the height of the XV8s. In any case I think he looks fantastic.
I always wished those hands would retract. I love the collar, the lowered hips, the big shoulder shield, and the knee knobs somewhat like the XV9s have.
I always thought Crisis suits would look so much better with a little more space between their hips and chest.
look at the photo, they have him standing on a box.
One: glue a base on a box.
Two: Put your tau on that box
Three: maker her look at that box
and that's the way you do it
It's my Tau on a box!
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Post by: YotsubaSnake
From what I can tell, there's really only one new weapon in that kit, the others are just new models of the old experimental weapons (thankfully) so I'm not required to buy the new stuff, just convert a custom version of the new cold plasma or whatever it is.
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Post by: mould2k
If the arms and legs on that tau commander are poseable, I can see me buying a lot of those parts from bits providers.
If not...I'll go back to petitioning 3rd party companies to make arms and legs of a similar scale that just happen to be compatible with XV8s.
Will only really rush to buy a Riptide and one of the set of pathfinders. Flyers don't tickle my fancy enough and I prefer the old shoulder-mounted railgun XV88s.
Darkstrider will probably get purchased eventually.
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Post by: Archonate
Trasvi wrote:(Large?) Seeker Missile on Broadsides is very interesting.
Seeker Missiles are always that large, (about as tall as a Firewarrior) but the one on the Broadsides is a much fancier sculpt.
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Post by: UltraPrime
For all those asking if the Commander has posable arms, ask youself this question. How many finecast models are posable?
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Post by: timetowaste85
Sigh, if Lovepug's price list of UK is correct, then the Riptide is the same cost as a Hellbrute from Warriors of Chaos: which translates to $85 USD. I know Kroot said not to get doom and gloom on the US prices yet because they probably weren't completely accurate, but now we have 2 sources for $85. As a non-Tau player, I wanted the Riptide. I think it's gorgeous. But I'm not paying $85 for one plastic model. I do play WoC, and I didn't buy the Hellbrute. Why would I buy an $85 model for an army I don't even play? It's an amazing model, but it's not worth the value. Make it $65 (retail price before discount), GW, and I'll pick one up.
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Post by: mould2k
UltraPrime wrote:For all those asking if the Commander has posable arms, ask youself this question. How many finecast models are posable?
Has it been confirmed as finecast? (genuine question, not being snarky.)
EDIT: Ah yes it has. Balls.
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Post by: Rented Tritium
airmang wrote:The bomb generator on the flyer looks like something you would blow bubbles with...
That's basically how the fluff is going to be. The circle creates bubbles or blobs of plasma that it spits downward with magnetic fields or whatever.
60137
Post by: BlueRift
airmang wrote:The bomb generator on the flyer looks like something you would blow bubbles with...
Does anyone else think that it looks vaguely necron-esque?
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Post by: Kilkrazy
Note that Hammerheads go up from £31 to £35.
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Post by: Rented Tritium
UltraPrime wrote:For all those asking if the Commander has posable arms, ask youself this question. How many finecast models are posable?
We have 2 pictures, one with an open fist and one with a closed fist.
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Post by: uberjoras
Might just be two different fist options...
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Post by: Rented Tritium
Something as small as a closed vs open hand hasn't been done in alternate parts in finecast either, though, so something new is happening in any event.
3333
Post by: milo
That might be acceptable if it includes all the Skyray bits and could be magnetized either/or. Anyone know if that's the case?
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Post by: Kingsley
milo wrote:
That might be acceptable if it includes all the Skyray bits and could be magnetized either/or. Anyone know if that's the case?
I suspect the Hammerhead and Skyray have officially become one kit, though in practice they already were because the Skyray contained all the Hammerhead bitz. If they haven't, GW is being extra silly, because people can just continue only ever buying Skyrays and the increased price will only affect newcomers.
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Post by: Earthbeard
2: UAVs interceptors arrived wings and can detach in the sun to defend against the enemy shark
Best translation i've ever read
I like the commander suit, making them limbs look like something other than a GW style dwarf, is a great improvement.
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Post by: Lovepug13
My source had the WD in her hand....so confirmed mate.
Also Hammerhead / Skyray one kit as suggested
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Post by: redkeyboard
Plus we saw from the original leaks that it had a £50 price tag. This is one expensive release indeed. Firts wave of fliers were bargins £27.50 then the rest have been £40+. Its sad really.
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Post by: Puscifer
After looking at those pics, I don't think it would be too difficult to convert the XV8-05.
Sticking him on a flying stand with a head turn and repositioning into a more heroic pose looks possible.
Atm he looks like Starscream landing towards the end of the first Michael Bay Transformers film.
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Post by: JudgeShamgar
Rented Tritium wrote:
Something as small as a closed vs open hand hasn't been done in alternate parts in finecast either, though, so something new is happening in any event.
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/catalog/productDetail.jsp?catId=cat440176a&prodId=prod1160028a&rootCatGameStyle=
This item has three hand options. I have one and it says so in the description.
11
Post by: ph34r
Not a fan of either new commander suit. The posing looks awkward and there is no strong silhouette, even worse so than the broadside and riptide in my opinion. It's just a "we made it bigger" crisis suit. Overall a big "miss" on new suit designs.
34439
Post by: Formosa
Am I the only one who has noticed the new commander looks like the dynamic entry trope.
35603
Post by: Tauownz
Loving the new commander suit. Looks to be an inch or 2 taller then an xv8 if you take that box out of the mix. Hoping to convert him to make him a little smaller, to take advantage to terrain better ...hello greenstuff. Any idea what the 2nd weapon is in the side pictures? The first looks like an ion head but some are saying it's an advanced cib. Any thoughts?
61618
Post by: Desubot
That second weapon is probably the air frag burst launchermagig.
3933
Post by: Kingsley
 Desubot wrote:That second weapon is probably the air frag burst launchermagig.
My limited French indicates that it is.
18698
Post by: kronk
Those prices seem kinda high...
53375
Post by: hotsauceman1
Wait, Intercepter drones.
Squeee.
63655
Post by: mh_mini
whoadirty wrote: mh_mini wrote:
Prices are steep. Most things went up in price compared to last codex. Though suits in box of 3 actually saves some money.
30x3=90 vs $75. NOT BAD,
Farsight... steep.
Flier -- Valkyrie $80 Doomsythe $55. It's in the middle of the pack.
As for the holes, a second transport would be nice, but not really mandatory. If Devilfish go down in points and depending on the upgrades it can fill different roles.
Jetbike, the Piranha kinda has this covered (going down in points)? Not a jetbike and in the Fast slot to compete with the flier and pathfinders. But I dont really think Tau are a jetbike type of army.
Antitank would be the Hammerhead
and we'll see if anything new shows up in the troops. I was thinking the possibility of Stealsuits going to troops.
EDIT. i screwed up my formatting and fixed it.
Hate to break it to you, but these prices are US amounts. Or as Kroothawk pointed out, Euro prices converted to US prices. The Canadian price for a box of three Crisis suits is $90, which is a $0.75 increase.
Ow. My hopes and dreams of having money im April are gone....
And also DAT CODEX PIC. I might need to change my pants.
34416
Post by: B0B MaRlEy
A few things I noticed glancing over a white dwarf:
The fireblade is an independant character who allows his unit to fire one more shot with pulse carbines/rifles if they don't move in the movement phase.
Overloading seems to be an ability common to several Ion weapons, as in the battle report the sun shark's drones overload theirs and get rid of a zoanthrope unit (with str 8 blasts!).
The new commander only comes with a plasma gun, and both experimental weapons you got from the old one .
I'll post a couple pics I noticed weren't leaked (notably the bomber's magical bomb-creating whirly device and hidden missiles on the fighter. Also the broadsides are way larger than standard crisis suits and can take all missiles weapons.)
58411
Post by: RogueRegault
Trasvi wrote:Translations from the page to english (via Google
1: Commander has a ritual knife to his side, ready to sign that oath to support his companions even in the worst circumstances.
2: exo-armor tau retractable usually have hands folded in their forearms. The exo-armor commander was sculpted with both hands outstretched.
3: The spark gap was cyclo-ion bursts [cyclic ion blaster?] may issue a formidable high rate of fire
4: The launcher loads a dispersion propels a projectile directly at the enemy. then it explodes cauant maximum damage.
5: Escorted by a team of exo-armor crisis, a tau commander brings the fight to the enemy
So I guess the CIB and ABF are remaining special issue than?
Sad. I was hoping there'd be a chance to get better anti-horde weapons on normal suits.
34416
Post by: B0B MaRlEy
rogueRegault Yeah they are special issue, it is actually mentionned in the French blurb.
About special issue things, I noticed that in the battle report the riptide had amongst its upgrade the combat drug dealio (that upgrade that used to give you FNP) . That thing will get so expensive point-wise ...
33172
Post by: ChiliPowderKeg
The new commander's pose looks very exploitable
8815
Post by: Archonate
RogueRegault wrote:Trasvi wrote:Translations from the page to english (via Google
1: Commander has a ritual knife to his side, ready to sign that oath to support his companions even in the worst circumstances.
2: exo-armor tau retractable usually have hands folded in their forearms. The exo-armor commander was sculpted with both hands outstretched.
3: The spark gap was cyclo-ion bursts [cyclic ion blaster?] may issue a formidable high rate of fire
4: The launcher loads a dispersion propels a projectile directly at the enemy. then it explodes cauant maximum damage.
5: Escorted by a team of exo-armor crisis, a tau commander brings the fight to the enemy
So I guess the CIB and ABF are remaining special issue than?
Sad. I was hoping there'd be a chance to get better anti-horde weapons on normal suits.
Meh, who knows what the new rules will allow, or how weapons might have changed. Personally I'm hoping the CIB has a higher S and maybe decent AP or perhaps Rending. Seems to me that an Ion weapon with an extremely high rate of fire should have Rending...
36213
Post by: Earthbeard
So did the metal version, your point?
15717
Post by: Backfire
I like new Commander otherwise, but perhaps bit more neutral pose would have been better. In my opinion, generic IC miniatures shouldn't have too "dramatic" poses. Also, they did nothing about the ankles. Just give them damn shin guards.
Farsight is really pricey...
57665
Post by: Malthor
Kroothawk wrote:Small tidbits:
There is a mail order set of Farsight Enclave shoulder pads for Fire Warriors.
Darkstrider is male.
Kroot are in.
Farsight is a rebel but still loyal.
You see the heightened field on top of the bomber wings? You can push them open and see the seeker missiles underneath.
The missile Broadside is really full of missiles
The missile broadside is awesome
Some other things I heard today:
- the squad Darkstrider joins(either pathfinder or Fire Warriors) treats enemies as -1 T for shooting
- the Tankcomander is a beast, he makes his tank BS 5, gives Tank Hunter and PE: IG
- it seems there was a typo in the WD and the 3 Krisis suits will be € 50 ( ~USD 67) instead of the price mentioned there
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Post by: SonicPara
Love the design changes shown by the new XV-8 commander but not enough to drop the massive $42 on him. Just need some proper 3rd party arms/hands for XV-8s that have them deployed and the novelty of the XV-8 commander is gone.
10886
Post by: Phanixis
- the Tankcomander is a beast, he makes his tank BS 5, gives Tank Hunter and PE: IG
I just pray our tanks retain their ability to fire as fast vehicles. Then a hammerhead with this guy will be fun.
16070
Post by: Sarge
Looks like some cool models to me. And they've been badly in need of an update.
256
Post by: Oaka
According to the battle report in the White Dwarf, Stealth Suits are still Elites choices and Pathfinders are still Fast Attack. No mention on whether Gun Drone Squads or Kroot are Troops choices.
I know there were some people hoping for suits to be Troops, but it doesn't look that way. It also looks like Pathfinders will compete with the new flyers, as they are also Fast Attack choices.
10578
Post by: Magc8Ball
 Oaka wrote:I know there were some people hoping for suits to be Troops, but it doesn't look that way.
I don't think many folks were expecting them to be a full-on Troops choice, but perhaps that a character might unlock them as such similar to Cult Marines in C: CSM.
Not sure if it's still worth holding out hope for that either.
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Post by: Bolognesus
 Malthor wrote:- it seems there was a typo in the WD and the 3 Krisis suits will be € 50 ( ~USD 67) instead of the price mentioned there
that would be a substantial price drop - kind of out of character.
Still, they might have just cut back on the number of drones, that might explain (and be a good thing too, I guess).
57665
Post by: Malthor
 Bolognesus wrote: Malthor wrote:- it seems there was a typo in the WD and the 3 Krisis suits will be € 50 ( ~USD 67) instead of the price mentioned there
that would be a substantial price drop - kind of out of character.
Still, they might have just cut back on the number of drones, that might explain (and be a good thing too, I guess).
I think the WD got prices wrong once again before, so it could be true I guess.
Also, the single Krisis will still be available, albeit direct only
299
Post by: Kilkrazy
The single Crisis suit costs £15.50 in the UK. When you subtract VAT (20%) the price becomes £12.91 which is $19.50 so three of them in a bargain box might be $50, though it seems unlikely.
Also there is the annual price increase to come.
34420
Post by: PraetorDave
Archonate wrote:RogueRegault wrote:Trasvi wrote:Translations from the page to english (via Google
1: Commander has a ritual knife to his side, ready to sign that oath to support his companions even in the worst circumstances.
2: exo-armor tau retractable usually have hands folded in their forearms. The exo-armor commander was sculpted with both hands outstretched.
3: The spark gap was cyclo-ion bursts [cyclic ion blaster?] may issue a formidable high rate of fire
4: The launcher loads a dispersion propels a projectile directly at the enemy. then it explodes cauant maximum damage.
5: Escorted by a team of exo-armor crisis, a tau commander brings the fight to the enemy
So I guess the CIB and ABF are remaining special issue than?
Sad. I was hoping there'd be a chance to get better anti-horde weapons on normal suits.
Meh, who knows what the new rules will allow, or how weapons might have changed. Personally I'm hoping the CIB has a higher S and maybe decent AP or perhaps Rending. Seems to me that an Ion weapon with an extremely high rate of fire should have Rending...
Actually the CIB has rending right now...sort of. It ignores armor on rolls to wound of 6. But it would be better if it actually had rending, since that allows it to wound on a 6 regardless of toughness. TBH the CIB is great right now, since it operates very similar to Burst cannons, so it a commander with that pairs well with a unit of suits armed with BC.
31456
Post by: Bolognesus
Malthor wrote: Bolognesus wrote: Malthor wrote:- it seems there was a typo in the WD and the 3 Krisis suits will be € 50 ( ~USD 67) instead of the price mentioned there
that would be a substantial price drop - kind of out of character.
Still, they might have just cut back on the number of drones, that might explain (and be a good thing too, I guess).
I think the WD got prices wrong once again before, so it could be true I guess.
Also, the single Krisis will still be available, albeit direct only
I suppose. Still think they'll cut back on the drones if that's true, though.
50012
Post by: Crimson
Bolognesus wrote:
that would be a substantial price drop - kind of out of character.
Still, they might have just cut back on the number of drones, that might explain (and be a good thing too, I guess).
If they're planning new Crisis suits for the second wave, they might want to sell the current ones at bargain price to get rid of them before that.
20774
Post by: pretre
Kilkrazy wrote:The single Crisis suit costs £15.50 in the UK. When you subtract VAT (20%) the price becomes £12.91 which is $19.50 so three of them in a bargain box might be $50, though it seems unlikely.
Also there is the annual price increase to come.
Single Crisis in the US is 24.75. So x3 is 74.25. $67 is a bargain.
58411
Post by: RogueRegault
Malthor wrote: Kroothawk wrote:Small tidbits:
There is a mail order set of Farsight Enclave shoulder pads for Fire Warriors.
Darkstrider is male.
Kroot are in.
Farsight is a rebel but still loyal.
You see the heightened field on top of the bomber wings? You can push them open and see the seeker missiles underneath.
The missile Broadside is really full of missiles
The missile broadside is awesome
Some other things I heard today:
- the squad Darkstrider joins(either pathfinder or Fire Warriors) treats enemies as -1 T for shooting
- the Tankcomander is a beast, he makes his tank BS 5, gives Tank Hunter and PE: IG
- it seems there was a typo in the WD and the 3 Krisis suits will be € 50 ( ~USD 67) instead of the price mentioned there
The question is whether Darkstrider's -1 T counts for seeker missiles fired by the squad's markerlights.(Past rulings on seekers in regards to cover and vehicle facings seem to treat them as originating from the markerlight unit.). Also, whether the penalty effects the strength required for Instant Death. ID'ing T3 characters with basic pulse rifles would be nasty.
So effectively the tank commander has a 35/36 chance in hitting, penetrates AV14 50% of the time, glances 25% of the time.
So a 24% chance of killing AV14 outright.
I just wish he granted Tank Hunters to all Hammerheads in your army.
70332
Post by: theninjabadger
What currency is OP?
8815
Post by: Archonate
 PraetorDave wrote: Archonate wrote:RogueRegault wrote:Trasvi wrote:Translations from the page to english (via Google
1: Commander has a ritual knife to his side, ready to sign that oath to support his companions even in the worst circumstances.
2: exo-armor tau retractable usually have hands folded in their forearms. The exo-armor commander was sculpted with both hands outstretched.
3: The spark gap was cyclo-ion bursts [cyclic ion blaster?] may issue a formidable high rate of fire
4: The launcher loads a dispersion propels a projectile directly at the enemy. then it explodes cauant maximum damage.
5: Escorted by a team of exo-armor crisis, a tau commander brings the fight to the enemy
So I guess the CIB and ABF are remaining special issue than?
Sad. I was hoping there'd be a chance to get better anti-horde weapons on normal suits.
Meh, who knows what the new rules will allow, or how weapons might have changed. Personally I'm hoping the CIB has a higher S and maybe decent AP or perhaps Rending. Seems to me that an Ion weapon with an extremely high rate of fire should have Rending...
Actually the CIB has rending right now...sort of. It ignores armor on rolls to wound of 6. But it would be better if it actually had rending, since that allows it to wound on a 6 regardless of toughness.
True, true. But it is a bit upsetting how few of its 5 shots ever end up killing anything. I picture the CIB to be like an assault cannon, but firing more volatile ammunition. I suppose it's just wishful thinking. But still, S3?? Awful...
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Post by: Kroothawk
Box with 3 Crisis Suits is indeed 50 €.
According to BOLS, official US-prices are:
Codex: Tau Empire (English, 104p, Full Color Hardcover) $49.50
XV8 Crisis Battlesuit Team $65.00
Pathfinder Team (13 minis, incl. Drones) $35.00
Hammerhead Gunship (repack with Skyray) $60.00
Sun Shark Bomber $65.00
XV104 Riptide Battlesuit $85.00
XV88 Broadside Battlesuit $50.00
Cadre Fireblade $20.00
Tau Empire Battleforce $120.00
More pics from WD, again posted by Senshi_Sama on the French Warhammer Forum http://www.warhammer-forum.com/index.php?showtopic=176222&st=700
Broadsides:
Flyer details:
Riptide details:
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Post by: Kilkrazy
...
...
...
True, true. But it is a bit upsetting how few of its 5 shots ever end up killing anything. I picture the CIB to be like an assault cannon, but firing more volatile ammunition. I suppose it's just wishful thinking. But still, S3?? Awful...
Many things in the previous codex were awful and did not get used. Let us hope that there are not many awful things in the new codex.
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Post by: pretre
So going off the French prices on the GW site, that's a pretty stiff increase. (10.50€ right now for 1)
Whereas the US are getting a huge discount.
Oh GW, you so crazy.
15717
Post by: Backfire
Samurai_Eduh wrote:Love the cover art! Looking at the Battleforce picture, has the Pirhana changed? Doesnt look like it.
No, it seems like same old Forgeworld Piranha which they have used in studio army. Funny actually that they haven't painted up their current stock Piranhas. Automatically Appended Next Post:  pretre wrote: So going off the French prices on the GW site, that's a pretty stiff increase. (10.50€ right now for 1) Whereas the US are getting a huge discount. Oh GW, you so crazy.
No, Euro price for Crisis suit is €19.50. Wow, it actually looks like they discounted Crisis suits after all?? Except for Brits who have to do with a modest £1.50 discount apparently.
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
pretre wrote:
So going off the French prices on the GW site, that's a pretty stiff increase. (10.50€ right now for 1)
Whereas the US are getting a huge discount.
Oh GW, you so crazy.
Look again: It is 19,50 €., so a 8.50€ discount.
20774
Post by: pretre
Rusty french time.
1) A duo of exoarmored XV88 Broadsides provide a solid anchor at the rear of a line of tau.
2) The Broadside kit includes two drones, who can be equipped a variety of ways. They can carry extra missile pods, which are found exclusively in this kit.
3) The broadside possesses a particle accelerator that feeds the powerful rail gun (ugh, that is sloppy translation on my part).
4) A seeker missile can be mounted on the shoulder of the broadside?
5) The missile pods can alternatively replace the rail cannon and the standard armament of the XV88.
Umm, Defense Drones that protect the suit (for Riptides). Comes with three heads to choose from.
Oh well, someone else can get the rest. I'm out for the night.
Re: Prices. Oh snap, I was looking at the conversion kit. Yay me!
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Post by: Ledabot
It looks like its time to strap a seeker to the back of my current XV88s! make him look like an ork jetpack fella. that will look funny.
25580
Post by: Maelstrom808
Wow on that missile pod broadside. [Insert "we heard you liked missile pods..." meme here]
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Post by: Desubot
Oh god the plasma bomb blower looks like a bubble wand.
Also finally i have a use for all these extra drones. converting tons of missile pod drone time. though i should still wait for the book first
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Post by: RogueRegault
pretre wrote:Rusty french time.
1) A duo of exoarmored XV88 Broadsides provide a solid anchor at the rear of a line of tau.
2) The Broadside kit includes two drones, who can be equipped a variety of ways. They can carry extra missile pods, which are found exclusively in this kit.
3) The broadside possesses a particle accelerator that feeds the powerful rail gun (ugh, that is sloppy translation on my part).
4) A seeker missile can be mounted on the shoulder of the broadside?
5) The missile pods can alternatively replace the rail cannon and the standard armament of the XV88.
Umm, Defense Drones that protect the suit (for Riptides). Comes with three heads to choose from.
Oh well, someone else can get the rest. I'm out for the night.
Re: Prices. Oh snap, I was looking at the conversion kit. Yay me!
Hopefully #3 means the railgun has an overcharge option.
52886
Post by: TheMind
Guys, guys. I don't think that missile broadside has enough missiles.
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
It's actually not bad, Pretre, I would have gone for something very, very similar for #3.
58411
Post by: RogueRegault
 TheMind wrote:
Guys, guys. I don't think that missile broadside has enough missiles.
Luckily, you can grab some missile drones to add more.
37755
Post by: Harriticus
Ugh, the Broadside Missile variant is too much. I liked the old design much more. GW knew the limit back then.
52886
Post by: TheMind
 Harriticus wrote:Ugh, the Broadside Missile variant is too much. I liked the old design much more. GW knew the limit back then.
Heresy! The missile broadside is the greatest thing since the regular broadside! ALL OF THE MISSILES FOREVER!!
801
Post by: buddha
I'm really likling the new broadsides. They are beefier, better armor, and the weapons are sick.
I can already envision my gundam heavyarms conversion for WTF!? missile ridiculousness.
52886
Post by: TheMind
 buddha wrote:I'm really likling the new broadsides. They are beefier, better armor, and the weapons are sick.
I can already envision my gundam heavyarms conversion for WTF!? missile ridiculousness.
I will have the maximum amount. All magnetized so they can be MMM or rail snipers.
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Post by: SonicPara
Didn't think they could make the new Broadside kit look worse than the air guitar railgun one but there ya go; have an underdetailed box of plastic with as many oddly designed missile launchers as possible.
FW Broadsides are still the way to go and putting them on the larger 60mm base gives you more area to do some impressive base-work.
10387
Post by: SabrX
Oaka wrote:According to the battle report in the White Dwarf, Stealth Suits are still Elites choices and Pathfinders are still Fast Attack. No mention on whether Gun Drone Squads or Kroot are Troops choices.
I know there were some people hoping for suits to be Troops, but it doesn't look that way. It also looks like Pathfinders will compete with the new flyers, as they are also Fast Attack choices.
Drats!
Well at least I can save money by not having to purchase Pathfinders. That could change however if GW screw the pooch just like they did with the DA flyers.
It's too bad Stealth Suits and Crisis Suits are still competing for elite slots. I was hoping GW will make the Stealth Suits more marketable by making them troops.
Losing Gun Drone squads isn't a major lost. I really want to know what happens to Kroots.
722
Post by: Kanluwen
Harriticus wrote:Ugh, the Broadside Missile variant is too much. I liked the old design much more. GW knew the limit back then.
I'm a bit leery of the Broadmissile, but I can understand what they're doing.
With the "old" Broadside, the Smart Missile System was an auxiliary weapon system. The Railguns were the main weapons, with the SMS as back-up or alternatively replaced with Plasma Rifles for a more reliable usage without needing Markerlights.
With the Broadmissile, the missile system is the primary weapon system.
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Post by: whoadirty
Kroothawk wrote: pretre wrote:
So going off the French prices on the GW site, that's a pretty stiff increase. (10.50€ right now for 1)
Whereas the US are getting a huge discount.
Oh GW, you so crazy.
Look again: It is 19,50 €., so a 8.50€ discount.
So are Canadians the only ones who got an increase, or did the Aussies get one too?
24567
Post by: Kroothawk
Now I need these for a conversion (Yo dawg!):
58411
Post by: RogueRegault
TheMind wrote: Harriticus wrote:Ugh, the Broadside Missile variant is too much. I liked the old design much more. GW knew the limit back then.
Heresy! The missile broadside is the greatest thing since the regular broadside! ALL OF THE MISSILES FOREVER!!
I just wish the missile pods were a bit more like the flip-up lid style on Gundams, Legioss, and Armored Valkyries rather than the featureless cylinders sticking out of a box. Might have to get some of the Paulson Games box launchers.
Someone's going to have to make a conversion with all the missiles launching with corkscrew contrails Itano Circus style.
In related news, apparently on the fighter version of the flyer, the disc areas for the interceptor drones are actually pop-up seeker missile bays.
59176
Post by: Mathieu Raymond
Aussies got the increase many, many moons ago, brah.
20774
Post by: pretre
 Mathieu Raymond wrote:It's actually not bad, Pretre, I would have gone for something very, very similar for #3.
thanks. I don't get much call to use my French nowadays.
58411
Post by: RogueRegault
 Kanluwen wrote: Harriticus wrote:Ugh, the Broadside Missile variant is too much. I liked the old design much more. GW knew the limit back then.
I'm a bit leery of the Broadmissile, but I can understand what they're doing.
With the "old" Broadside, the Smart Missile System was an auxiliary weapon system. The Railguns were the main weapons, with the SMS as back-up or alternatively replaced with Plasma Rifles for a more reliable usage without needing Markerlights.
With the Broadmissile, the missile system is the primary weapon system.
It reminds me of the EVE Online adage "don't mix ranges". This way, you can specialize the suits for a specific purpose.
44919
Post by: Fezman
Have to say I prefer the older Broadsides. The ones with shoulder mounted rail guns remind me of something from Armoured Core, and it's easy to imagine them settling into position and unleashing a couple of precise, devastating shots without the enemy even getting close. The new ones look more like they're meant to crash through walls and stomp on everyone who gets in their way. I suppose I prefer my Tau units to suggest lethal precision more than brute force. For the same reason I'm not keen on the big tall Pathfinder drone...I prefer the drones to have more of a compact look. Let the Imperium use the bulky, cumbersome gizmos, it suits their look better.
That said, the flyer has definitely grown on me. I would still do one or two conversions on it, but nothing too radical. Also, despite what I think of the new Broadsides I don't mind the Riptide, it's big but for the most part it looks more agile than bulky.
Quite a critical sounding post, I know, but on the whole I'm very excited for this release.
52886
Post by: TheMind
RogueRegault wrote: TheMind wrote: Harriticus wrote:Ugh, the Broadside Missile variant is too much. I liked the old design much more. GW knew the limit back then.
Heresy! The missile broadside is the greatest thing since the regular broadside! ALL OF THE MISSILES FOREVER!!
I just wish the missile pods were a bit more like the flip-up lid style on Gundams, Legioss, and Armored Valkyries rather than the featureless cylinders sticking out of a box. Might have to get some of the Paulson Games box launchers.
Someone's going to have to make a conversion with all the missiles launching with corkscrew contrails Itano Circus style.
You mean like this?:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nxnC6jkJyEM
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Post by: bit81
Damn it all I think I like tau ther eis no hope for me now lol
Was planning on having eldar army with maybe 1 oer 2 tau but now i think it is going to be other way round or just start up both of them and mix and match as I go lol
sitting with two squads of firewarriors a 6 man stealth team and the forge world commnader with subnition rifle painted with a hammer head needing painted and eldar force of 20 Dire avengers a wraith lord 5 pathfinders and an avatar and wave serpent painted and a fire prism needing painted
damn it all GW sucks there goes all my money lets hope they dont release any new ork stuff for a while lol
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Post by: Kroothawk
Some info extracted from WD by Siyath over at ATT:
I'm lucky enough to have my copy of the WD (English version) already in my hands. I've read only a couple of the first pages showcasing the release (literally just got home and sat down) and already I can say that, for example, the Razorshark can swap it's burst cannon for a missile pod, houses two seeker missiles in compartments above it's wings - plus that the main armament is indeed a quad ion weapon with 360 arc.
(...)
Well, more as I go: The Riptide. Apparently it's highly posable, "featuring joints at ankles, knees, hips, waist, shoulders and neck". So this is good news at least modeling-wise. Also, Riptide comes with five support systems - I'm not sure if this means the kit contains five of these or does it indeed have five hardpoints reserved for the various support systems. I suspect the former. There's a mention of a "velocity tracker" as a some kind of a new support system.
(...)
Okay, some more:
Missile drones as such apparently only come with the Broadside kit (not the shielded ones that come with Riptide). Not a difficult stretch to covert, though. The heavy rail rifles on Broadsides are twinlinked, and apparently either version, the heavy railrifle as well as the one packed with missiles can take a single seeker missile as an additional weapon.
Not much to say about the new commander with the Enforcer armour, apparently not too much compatible with existing XV8 models, since the pose is rather rigid. And yes, Finecast. The weapons portrayed are indeed the AFP and the CIB. The last picture on the page and especially the caption indicates the Crisis squad size has gone up from the previous 3, since there's 4 in the picture in addition to the commander and it's described as a squad.
Farsight, it's the Dawn Blade that we see there. Not much else to add, except perhaps the mention about there not being any question about where Farsight's loyalties lie since the "symbol of the Fire Caste proudly worn on his chest."
The Pathfinders' ion rifle is a new experimental weapon apprently exclusive to the Pathfinders. Six different drones can be built from the kit. Nothing to add about Darkstrider that we don't already know. Except that it's a "he", not "she" : ).
Squinting at the codex imagery, I can make out that the Cadre Fireblade has the following statistics:
WS4, BS5, S3, T3, W3, I3, A3, Ld9 and a 4+ save. He's Infantry(Character), and carries Combat armour (probably just the regular FW armor since it's listed on the FW entry too), pulse rifle, photon grenades and a markerlight.
He also has following Special Rules: Independent Character, Split Fire and Supporting Fire. Volley Fire: (paraphrased) not moving in the Movement phase, he and every model in his unit fire an additional shot (limited to pulse rifles and carbines).
Firewarrior stats:
WS2, BS3, S3, T3, W1, I2, A1, Ld7, 4+. Shas'uis are the same as these days. They carry combat armour, pulse rifles and photon grenades. Also have the Special Rule: Supporting Fire.
(...)
Alright, some more then. In random order, what I could deduce from the battlereport and decipher from the images.
All ion weapons are apparently overchargeable. This leads us to the two Interceptor Drones on the Sunshark. They're detachable, and armed with ionrifles that can be overcharged to produce a S8 Blast each. Fairly neat, I'd say. So the Sunshark's weaponry is twin-linked missile pod, 2 Interceptor Drones with twin-linked ionrifles, 2 seeker missiles and of course the main bombing armament. And the Sunshark is a Fast Attack choice in the FOC.
Speaking of FOC, looks like it's confirmed that the Riptide is indeed an Elite slot - no indication to the amount you can field, though. Curiously enough, in the 'rep lists the entry says "One XV104 Riptide..." which could be interpreted that there might be a way to field more in a single Elite slot. Don't know how far-fetched that is, but still...
Velocity Tracker is the Skyfire upgrade. Riptides and Broadsides at least can field these.
The ionrifle that the Pathfinders field contraticts a little with it being said being exclusive to the Pathfinders, but still the drones can field it too. But it seems to be the same weapon. Probably with severe restrictions (like 1 per team or 1 per 5 Pathfinders) but it does compete with the existing rail rifle. Pathfinders are still in Fast Attack.
Supporting Fire is an army special rule, so if not all, then at least a vast majority of the army possesses this. At least Broadsides did, according to the 'rep. And well, it is an army special rule. And yes, this is the one enabling nearby units to overwatch in addition to the just one that's being assaulted.
Stealth teams are still in Elite-slot. And the upgrade for BS2 overwatch is called "Counterfire defence systems". Hard to say if this is a support system or a team upgrade.
Broadsides still in Heavy Support.
For some odd reason all Crisis-suits seemed to be carrying the bonding knife. Not just the team leader anymore, apprently. And deducing from the hardpoint choices, multitracker indeed seems to be built in to the suits now. Still no idea what the elusive Puretide engram neurochip actually does, but it is carried by the XV8-05 commander in the 'rep. CIB and AFP are still experimental, it seems.
There's a codex size-comparison chart for the battlesuits, where it can be seen how the new Enforcer suit and the Broadside suit is 1,5 times as tall as the regular XV8. Not sure how well this translates to the models, but with what we've seen, that may be the case pretty accurately.
Deducing from the markerlight usage in the 'rep, the Crisis and the Broadsides still remain as BS3 units.
That's about it, I'll come back with more if I notice anything worthwhile.
[edit: Oh, and the Riptide's Ion Accelerator is S8 Large Blast when overcharged. Not S9, remembering that it's been speculated.]
8330
Post by: kestral
On the whole, I'm neutral to negative. There seems to be something wrong with the proportions of the fire warrior brandishing the sheathed knife - like his torso is too long or legs too short or something. Doubling the height of the commander suit takes away the last faint hope of actually hiding behind something, and makes no sense. The model is a bit more dynamic, but lacks the elegance of the FW alternative suit. I like the new broadside though. The flier is decent but not the equal of the manta. I can get behind an unlovely ground attack aircraft like the A-10 I suppose. Riptide is a good model, but somehow it seems like overkill visually. I'll have to see one in a live army. The video implies that the fluff has gone even further from the "innocent galactic newbies more or less trying to do the right thing" that really attracted me to the tau. And maybe I missed it, but are there no new allies?
52062
Post by: Wolfnid420
lol at the Misslesides. But it feels to me as though 88's are becoming 1 per squad. You kit them to a purpose and set them upon the enemy.
Im not a fan of finecast anything really. so making the Tau commander finecast in a terrible pose? Extremely disappointing.
Everything else release wise I cant wait lol ive even been having Tau related dreams...and i dont dream.... wonder what that means?
722
Post by: Kanluwen
kestral wrote:On the whole, I'm neutral to negative. There seems to be something wrong with the proportions of the fire warrior brandishing the sheathed knife - like his torso is too long or legs too short or something.
He's wearing parts of the XV22 suit that Shadowsun has in addition to his normal Fire Caste gear.
If you look, you can see that the chest armor is much bulkier and that there are "legplates" from the XV22's outer leg over top of his standard Fire Caste leg armor/fatigues.
The cape though is the biggest culprit in throwing things off.
15717
Post by: Backfire
Kroothawk wrote:Some info extracted from WD by Siyath over at ATT:
Not much to say about the new commander with the Enforcer armour, apparently not too much compatible with existing XV8 models, since the pose is rather rigid. And yes, Finecast. The weapons portrayed are indeed the AFP and the CIB. The last picture on the page and especially the caption indicates the Crisis squad size has gone up from the previous 3, since there's 4 in the picture in addition to the commander and it's described as a squad.
Hmm, curious, and possibly quite powerful if true.
Kroothawk wrote:
Squinting at the codex imagery, I can make out that the Cadre Fireblade has the following statistics:
WS4, BS5, S3, T3, W3, I3, A3, Ld9 and a 4+ save. He's Infantry(Character), and carries Combat armour (probably just the regular FW armor since it's listed on the FW entry too), pulse rifle, photon grenades and a markerlight.
Wow, that's rather huge statline for a Fire Warrior. Three wounds for non-Crisis character?
So Fire Warriors have Photon grenades as standard. I suspected it would be the case.
25580
Post by: Maelstrom808
This dex is sounding better and better. Depending on what they do with devilfish, it really sounds like they've started to nail down the "mobile gunline" feel that Tau should have while putting a lot of emphasis on tech, rather than raw stats. Being better at deterring assaults rather than being better in assault itself is also the direction I was hoping for. Interceptor drones sound vaguely terrifying to deepstrikers and outflankers.
63885
Post by: Rustgob
I was really stoked, But I really dislike the hand-mounted launchers of the Missileside, that and if I can't take Drones as troops, Stealthsuits as troops or have special weapons in my FW squads, I'm not as interested any-more.
42687
Post by: Coyote81
 Maelstrom808 wrote:
This dex is sounding better and better. Depending on what they do with devilfish, it really sounds like they've started to nail down the "mobile gunline" feel that Tau should have while putting a lot of emphasis on tech, rather than raw stats. Being better at deterring assaults rather than being better in assault itself is also the direction I was hoping for. Interceptor drones sound vaguely terrifying to deepstrikers and outflankers.
I think it's actually the opposite result. Don't get me wrong I like the changes (mostly because I just want changes), but honestly it reduces the mobile aspect of the army.
- Receive +1 shot when staying stationary when firing rifle or carbine. Reduce mobility for sure.
- Supporting Fire: We now need to keep a majority of our units closer together to make best use of their firepower, seems like a reduction in mobility since we are reduced to the speed of the slowest unit to maintain this formation. Firewarrior are slow for sure, especially if maintaining still for extra firepower.
- Rumored loss of Ability for our tanks to fire "as if they were fast"
None of these seem to make me think the army is headed to a more mobile gunline, I feel like we are headed toward a more IG type gunline. But I'm OK with the changes, I just want the codex to change and bring bout new tactics.
ps. Also concerned with the points costs, i really hope all these new addons are cheap and not similiar or higher priced then the current book. Otherwise i can see the Riptide quickly becoming a 300pt model and see now gameplay. I also dislike the idea of are fast attack becoming increasingly amazing as well. We can't afford to spend all of our points on elites and fast, they need to make some decent troops so we can field a competitive army. As of right now, I can predict farsight making crisis suits scoring, and every army is going to be 2 min firewarriors, lots of crisis suits and a few fast and heavy thrown in to fill. Are basic infanty are going to fall into the back drop.
25580
Post by: Maelstrom808
Rustgob wrote:I was really stoked, But I really dislike the hand-mounted launchers of the Missileside, that and if I can't take Drones as troops, Stealthsuits as troops or have special weapons in my FW squads, I'm not as interested any-more.
They really should have those as unlockable troops, but I'm more concerned about the overall playstyle of the army rather than individual choices. Of course, that probably stems from me not actually owning the army. I was going to pick it up, but my best friend chose them, so most of the games I play are vs tau. I'm excited/hoping to play against a strong, multi-facteted army that plays as the fluff I like describes.
52062
Post by: Wolfnid420
Rustgob wrote:I was really stoked, But I really dislike the hand-mounted launchers of the Missileside, that and if I can't take Drones as troops, Stealthsuits as troops or have special weapons in my FW squads, I'm not as interested any-more.
I was definitely excited for a new troop choice like stealths. Who knows? Maybe carbines and rifles will be so different it'll cause them to be separate troop entries?
63885
Post by: Rustgob
Wolfnid420 wrote:Rustgob wrote:I was really stoked, But I really dislike the hand-mounted launchers of the Missileside, that and if I can't take Drones as troops, Stealthsuits as troops or have special weapons in my FW squads, I'm not as interested any-more.
I was definitely excited for a new troop choice like stealths. Who knows? Maybe carbines and rifles will be so different it'll cause them to be separate troop entries?
I'd just like some more flexibility. I never field kroot, as it's the FW Aesthetic I like, and I never liked their rigidity. One of my favourite Tau units are XV25s.
Sadly, using special characters is Anathema to me, so even if I can 'unlock XV25 troops', it won't feel like it's my Army. Having -any- special character, even converted, makes me feel like I'm playing a pre-designed army and it saps the fun, personally.
It's weird, but oh well. Still going to keep my fingers crossed.
15717
Post by: Backfire
Rustgob wrote:
I'd just like some more flexibility. I never field kroot, as it's the FW Aesthetic I like, and I never liked their rigidity. One of my favourite Tau units are XV25s.
Sadly, using special characters is Anathema to me, so even if I can 'unlock XV25 troops', it won't feel like it's my Army. Having -any- special character, even converted, makes me feel like I'm playing a pre-designed army and it saps the fun, personally.
I agree, I've always thought that "use this pre-made named Character to make UberUnit as your Basic Troops" is pretty lame mechanic*. I'm just happy if Tau doesn't have that kind of gimmickry.
*which might seem funny given my other army is Deathwing, but hey, a guy needs some contradictions in his life.
6931
Post by: frgsinwntr
I found how I am going to Proxy my missile sides until i build them/paint them...
63885
Post by: Rustgob
 frgsinwntr wrote:I found how I am going to Proxy my missile sides until i build them/paint them...
[img removed]
An IG Missile Launcher sentinel? I'm not sure many would allow that! ;3
47877
Post by: Jefffar
Backfire wrote: Kroothawk wrote:Some info extracted from WD by Siyath over at ATT:
Not much to say about the new commander with the Enforcer armour, apparently not too much compatible with existing XV8 models, since the pose is rather rigid. And yes, Finecast. The weapons portrayed are indeed the AFP and the CIB. The last picture on the page and especially the caption indicates the Crisis squad size has gone up from the previous 3, since there's 4 in the picture in addition to the commander and it's described as a squad.
Hmm, curious, and possibly quite powerful if true.
Kroothawk wrote:
Squinting at the codex imagery, I can make out that the Cadre Fireblade has the following statistics:
WS4, BS5, S3, T3, W3, I3, A3, Ld9 and a 4+ save. He's Infantry(Character), and carries Combat armour (probably just the regular FW armor since it's listed on the FW entry too), pulse rifle, photon grenades and a markerlight.
Wow, that's rather huge statline for a Fire Warrior. Three wounds for non-Crisis character?
So Fire Warriors have Photon grenades as standard. I suspected it would be the case.
Still T3 with a 4+ save. Heavy Bolters and Heavy Flamers will mess him up right quick and heaven help you if they are Grey Knights with psybolt/psyflame ammo.
25580
Post by: Maelstrom808
Coyote81 wrote:I think it's actually the opposite result. Don't get me wrong I like the changes (mostly because I just want changes), but honestly it reduces the mobile aspect of the army.
- Receive +1 shot when staying stationary when firing rifle or carbine. Reduce mobility for sure.
- Supporting Fire: We now need to keep a majority of our units closer together to make best use of their firepower, seems like a reduction in mobility since we are reduced to the speed of the slowest unit to maintain this formation. Firewarrior are slow for sure, especially if maintaining still for extra firepower.
- Rumored loss of Ability for our tanks to fire "as if they were fast"
None of these seem to make me think the army is headed to a more mobile gunline, I feel like we are headed toward a more IG type gunline. But I'm OK with the changes, I just want the codex to change and bring bout new tactics.
ps. Also concerned with the points costs, i really hope all these new addons are cheap and not similiar or higher priced then the current book. Otherwise i can see the Riptide quickly becoming a 300pt model and see now gameplay. I also dislike the idea of are fast attack becoming increasingly amazing as well. We can't afford to spend all of our points on elites and fast, they need to make some decent troops so we can field a competitive army. As of right now, I can predict farsight making crisis suits scoring, and every army is going to be 2 min firewarriors, lots of crisis suits and a few fast and heavy thrown in to fill. Are basic infanty are going to fall into the back drop.
I think what you are seeing is the difference between a mobile gunline and just being mobile. To me, I see the option to deploy as a standard gunline, but then rapidly redeploy after you blunt the first wave. Other than the loss of firing as if they were vast vehicles, you don't really lose much by moving, you just gain advantages for staying still. They still have skimmer transports which are faster than your typical tracked transport.
On the riptide, I think it's just like many other units. It has a large variety of abilities, but you can't take them all, otherwise you end up with a bloated point cost. The question is whether or not it can be effective with a different minimal builds. If so then you have flexibility in your choices, which is a good thing.
FWs sound much improved (lower point cost, photon grenades as standard gear, multi-unit overwatch, and some hefty bonuses provided by characters) so you have a stronger basic troop choice and better options to support them.
34612
Post by: Ledabot
I would be interested if that can fit on a dread base. Is it not more a riptide proxy?
36521
Post by: orc master
From the looks of it the Skyray,Broadside upgrade and Commander upgrade are gone from the GW site.
EDIT? gundrones still are there
24153
Post by: tetrisphreak
I wonder with suits retaining bs3 standard if targeting arrays will remain 10 ppm. Also I haven't heard much on markerlight mechanics - I wonder if any of that will be different. Just over a week to go and there is so much undiscovered about the army. I can't wait for April 5.
Also, "Fire ze missiles!!"
53564
Post by: Snufflesms
I will be using the Forgeworld Broadsides : 
And using the Paulson Games missiles 
To make something Like this 
But with good bulk and the great looking forgeworld railguns, and poseability. Living In Australia I can probably get them all that for much cheaper than the probable GW asking price, which will probably be around $80.
42687
Post by: Coyote81
Maelstrom808 wrote:I think what you are seeing is the difference between a mobile gunline and just being mobile. To me, I see the option to deploy as a standard gunline, but then rapidly redeploy after you blunt the first wave. Other than the loss of firing as if they were vast vehicles, you don't really lose much by moving, you just gain advantages for staying still. They still have skimmer transports which are faster than your typical tracked transport.
On the riptide, I think it's just like many other units. It has a large variety of abilities, but you can't take them all, otherwise you end up with a bloated point cost. The question is whether or not it can be effective with a different minimal builds. If so then you have flexibility in your choices, which is a good thing.
FWs sound much improved (lower point cost, photon grenades as standard gear, multi-unit overwatch, and some hefty bonuses provided by characters) so you have a stronger basic troop choice and better options to support them.
But the advantages we get for standing still and the lack of ability to rapidly redeploy as you say is exactly why we aren't a mobile gunline, just a standard one. FWs are no faster then any one elses infantry, so if they attempt to stand and double fire, the are going to get run down because they haven't been backing up all gaem like people do right now. We are actually teased into not being mobile by having that buff.
On a different note:
I just ordered 2 underslung and 2 normal missle pods from paulson games about 30mins ago, so I can convert my first missileside. I may not use a bunch of them, but I'll make sure to own at least one, Paulson games may get more of my money as well since I doubt I will buy any broadsides/suits seeing as I have too many already.
21196
Post by: agnosto
Sooo... how many firewarrior squads can I fit behind a Aegis wall? The BS 5 character mans the guns, the rest lay down carpets of fire.
64422
Post by: Atheos
Has there been any information on the new Tau fluff?
60523
Post by: shad0wen
guys i just thought of something!!! the old farsight held his sword in his left hand. this new one holds it in his right hand.........*runs off to get old and new farsight kit for epic duel sword welding goodness.*
50012
Post by: Crimson
Still no word on whether anything was done to make the pulse carbines usable again. This interests me as I have some fire warriors modelled with them and I would prefer them not to suck.
24153
Post by: tetrisphreak
 Crimson wrote:Still no word on whether anything was done to make the pulse carbines usable again. This interests me as I have some fire warriors modelled with them and I would prefer them not to suck.
I just want more than 1 choice with my main troop slots.
65286
Post by: Brother Captain Alexander
 Atheos wrote:Has there been any information on the new Tau fluff?
As far as I noticed, nothing.
The only thing I saw is that Farsight is back and that he is both loyal and rebel 
We shall see, but seeing how this is Vetock and he did Dark Angels fluff nicely I expect nothing less then excellent fluff from him.
10886
Post by: Phanixis
I think it's actually the opposite result. Don't get me wrong I like the changes (mostly because I just want changes), but honestly it reduces the mobile aspect of the army.
- Receive +1 shot when staying stationary when firing rifle or carbine. Reduce mobility for sure.
- Supporting Fire: We now need to keep a majority of our units closer together to make best use of their firepower, seems like a reduction in mobility since we are reduced to the speed of the slowest unit to maintain this formation. Firewarrior are slow for sure, especially if maintaining still for extra firepower.
- Rumored loss of Ability for our tanks to fire "as if they were fast"
None of these seem to make me think the army is headed to a more mobile gunline, I feel like we are headed toward a more IG type gunline. But I'm OK with the changes, I just want the codex to change and bring bout new tactics
As more updated rumors have been coming in I am becoming more optimistic about the upcoming Tau codex, but this is what I truly fear the Tau codex might be. If I wanted to play IG, I would play IG. I want to play Tau, and that means continually moving around the battlefield, especially with the suits and the hovertanks. Granted, the first two bullets points are technically just buffs we are forfeiting by not playing static, which is not the end of the world because the choice is still their to play mobile. But that third rumor suggest our tanks will be hamstrung, losing the ability to effectively fire at all if they move over 6", which I find abhorrent. The suits should not be the only mobile ground based element of the army, I loved the fact that the tanks could keep pace with them and support them.
5859
Post by: Ravenous D
Everything will be known next Wednesday.
50012
Post by: Crimson
 tetrisphreak wrote: Crimson wrote:Still no word on whether anything was done to make the pulse carbines usable again. This interests me as I have some fire warriors modelled with them and I would prefer them not to suck.
I just want more than 1 choice with my main troop slots.
Indeed. and that's why it would be awfully nice if carbines were a real option. Then you at least could have differently armed fire warrior squads.
102
Post by: Jayden63
Phanixis wrote:I think it's actually the opposite result. Don't get me wrong I like the changes (mostly because I just want changes), but honestly it reduces the mobile aspect of the army.
- Receive +1 shot when staying stationary when firing rifle or carbine. Reduce mobility for sure.
- Supporting Fire: We now need to keep a majority of our units closer together to make best use of their firepower, seems like a reduction in mobility since we are reduced to the speed of the slowest unit to maintain this formation. Firewarrior are slow for sure, especially if maintaining still for extra firepower.
- Rumored loss of Ability for our tanks to fire "as if they were fast"
None of these seem to make me think the army is headed to a more mobile gunline, I feel like we are headed toward a more IG type gunline. But I'm OK with the changes, I just want the codex to change and bring bout new tactics
As more updated rumors have been coming in I am becoming more optimistic about the upcoming Tau codex, but this is what I truly fear the Tau codex might be. If I wanted to play IG, I would play IG. I want to play Tau, and that means continually moving around the battlefield, especially with the suits and the hovertanks. Granted, the first two bullets points are technically just buffs we are forfeiting by not playing static, which is not the end of the world because the choice is still their to play mobile. But that third rumor suggest our tanks will be hamstrung, losing the ability to effectively fire at all if they move over 6", which I find abhorrent. The suits should not be the only mobile ground based element of the army, I loved the fact that the tanks could keep pace with them and support them.
I'm confused. How has much of anything changed?
Who was running firewarriors around outside of d-fish? anyone, anyone? Hello?
Who didn't have pathfinders parked in cover using heavy markerlights? anyone, anyone? hello?
Who didn't have BS4 broadsides in ruins or behind and ADL? no ASS means, no move and shoot, or were others besides me walking their broadsides around? However, the new broadsides seem to have something similar to S&P so again, what change?
Crisis suits and stealth suits haven't changed.
Piranha's are still fast
The only thing that makes anything seem like it might be slower is the loss of making thing fire as if fast, but who knows if there isn't a piece of wargear or a special rule that just flat out let a tank fire all of its weapons. Hell, back in 5th edition hammerheads and D-fish lost 6" of movement thanks to defensive weapons nerf. I really don't see how this has slowed down much of anything.
Now you have a few rules that seem to benifit the tau if they stay closeish together. But with the nerfs to charging, multi-charging, and now supped up overwatch, maybe it wont be such a bad thing to keep your guys a little closer together. DA players don't seem to mind huddling together to get bennies from banners and what not. Hell, it might even be a boon as now you get even better bennies when you try to focus more of your force on a single part of the enemy army. Tau never had an all for me and screw you guys play style. The idea of a deathstar (unless you count Farsight's entourage) is non-existant for tau. We have historically had to keep our guys working in small groups together.
I see it not as a lack of mobility, but a much better representation of small unit tactics and unit assists.
But again, we don't know the whole story yet. Looking forward to it. However, that Tau unit with the commander and extra shot seems like it would be a great forward unit. Two shots out to 30" per guy, 3 shots out to 15, 3 shots when ultimately charged, and then everyone around also helping in. Not to mention the unit is wounding T4 and lower on a 2+. Hell, wounding Thunderwolves on a 3+. Now thats scary.
43229
Post by: Ovion
 Jayden63 wrote:Phanixis wrote:I think it's actually the opposite result. Don't get me wrong I like the changes (mostly because I just want changes), but honestly it reduces the mobile aspect of the army.
- Receive +1 shot when staying stationary when firing rifle or carbine. Reduce mobility for sure.
- Supporting Fire: We now need to keep a majority of our units closer together to make best use of their firepower, seems like a reduction in mobility since we are reduced to the speed of the slowest unit to maintain this formation. Firewarrior are slow for sure, especially if maintaining still for extra firepower.
- Rumored loss of Ability for our tanks to fire "as if they were fast"
None of these seem to make me think the army is headed to a more mobile gunline, I feel like we are headed toward a more IG type gunline. But I'm OK with the changes, I just want the codex to change and bring bout new tactics
As more updated rumors have been coming in I am becoming more optimistic about the upcoming Tau codex, but this is what I truly fear the Tau codex might be. If I wanted to play IG, I would play IG. I want to play Tau, and that means continually moving around the battlefield, especially with the suits and the hovertanks. Granted, the first two bullets points are technically just buffs we are forfeiting by not playing static, which is not the end of the world because the choice is still their to play mobile. But that third rumor suggest our tanks will be hamstrung, losing the ability to effectively fire at all if they move over 6", which I find abhorrent. The suits should not be the only mobile ground based element of the army, I loved the fact that the tanks could keep pace with them and support them.
I'm confused. How has much of anything changed? Who was running firewarriors around outside of d-fish? anyone, anyone? Hello? I do. I tend to run at least 6x6 Firewarriors, and haven't used D.Fish in quite a while. (Since I stopped using my Pathfinders.)
Infact, that it looks like we get a Firewarrior Commander, meaning can do a pure Firewarrior army makes me very happy. Who didn't have pathfinders parked in cover using heavy markerlights? anyone, anyone? hello? Who didn't have BS4 broadsides in ruins or behind and ADL? no ASS means, no move and shoot, or were others besides me walking their broadsides around? However, the new broadsides seem to have something similar to S&P so again, what change? Crisis suits and stealth suits haven't changed. Piranha's are still fast The only thing that makes anything seem like it might be slower is the loss of making thing fire as if fast, but who knows if there isn't a piece of wargear or a special rule that just flat out let a tank fire all of its weapons. Hell, back in 5th edition hammerheads and D-fish lost 6" of movement thanks to defensive weapons nerf. I really don't see how this has slowed down much of anything. Now you have a few rules that seem to benifit the tau if they stay closeish together. But with the nerfs to charging, multi-charging, and now supped up overwatch, maybe it wont be such a bad thing to keep your guys a little closer together. DA players don't seem to mind huddling together to get bennies from banners and what not. Hell, it might even be a boon as now you get even better bennies when you try to focus more of your force on a single part of the enemy army. Tau never had an all for me and screw you guys play style. The idea of a deathstar (unless you count Farsight's entourage) is non-existant for tau. We have historically had to keep our guys working in small groups together. I see it not as a lack of mobility, but a much better representation of small unit tactics and unit assists. But again, we don't know the whole story yet. Looking forward to it. However, that Tau unit with the commander and extra shot seems like it would be a great forward unit. Two shots out to 30" per guy, 3 shots out to 15, 3 shots when ultimately charged, and then everyone around also helping in. Not to mention the unit is wounding T4 and lower on a 2+. Hell, wounding Thunderwolves on a 3+. Now thats scary.
I mean, I'm only keeping one eye on the rumours, and mostly skimming stuff, preferring to wait for the codex in hand, but I love my Firewarriors, and they've served me well!
33172
Post by: ChiliPowderKeg
 Ovion wrote:
I mean, I'm only keeping one eye on the rumours, and mostly skimming stuff, preferring to wait for the codex in hand, but I love my Firewarriors, and they've served me well!
Ditto
38677
Post by: Ozomoto
Anyone know if the riptide is going to be a walker or a monstrous creature.
If you could inbox that would be great as the response will probably get lost in a million comments.
102
Post by: Jayden63
 ChiliPowderKeg wrote: Ovion wrote:
I mean, I'm only keeping one eye on the rumours, and mostly skimming stuff, preferring to wait for the codex in hand, but I love my Firewarriors, and they've served me well!
Ditto
Even though I said the above, I have 36 fully painted firewarriors ready to go, unfortunately 24 of them haven't left their case in ages. (two units of 6 both in D-fish). I'd really love to put more on the table if they become actually useful as a troops choice and actually do their job. Seeing LD7 in the leaked statline does not give me much faith that their ability as objective holders is going to be that strong.
5760
Post by: Drunkspleen
I don't think the Tau are meant to be a fully mobile force necessarily though, and that's why the extra shots aren't built into the firewarriors, they are an optional HQ you could choose to use if you want a static list, if not you pick a Crisis Commander who can redeploy as needed while still dishing out all his firepower. Arguably firewarriors are more mobile than many forces because they don't have heavy weapons mixed in that burden other armies, and even if you are using them in a static way, it's going to be more about moving to support them when they become threatened, it's not about running away from the enemy shooting necessarily so much as it's about moving units to support with a devastating overwatch volley. The force still has mobility, it also has options for giving up some of that mobility to make a more powerful static line, either way, the mobility isn't about being able to outpace the fastest units in the game, it's about responding to threats and adjusting to an evolving combat situation. What we have seen of the new fluff supports this idea, and they did a good job of translating it to the tabletop. Automatically Appended Next Post:  Ozomoto wrote:Anyone know if the riptide is going to be a walker or a monstrous creature. If you could inbox that would be great as the response will probably get lost in a million comments.
Rumours have been calling it a Monstrous Creature for a looooong time now. Could maybe turn out to be a walker, but it seems unlikely.
42687
Post by: Coyote81
I don't use d-fish, they're a waste of points, and firewarriors inside one don't do anything so are only worth about half their points.
Haven't used pathfinders since 5th. Went without marker lights for the start of 6th, got tetras now, so still don't use pathfinders.
Crisis suits are the whole army for the most part.
Stealthsuits just don't do anything taht firewarriors can do right now.
I stopped using piranha since the amount of landraiders diminished.
I want my army to change, I've done plenty well with it, but I want it to win tournaments without having to resort to using only 4 units and allies. (Currently FWS, Crisis Suits, Broadsides and Tetras. Bigger games get a Hammerhead. Aand spice with Eldar) Automatically Appended Next Post:  Drunkspleen wrote:Arguably firewarriors are more mobile than many forces because they don't have heavy weapons mixed in that burden other armies, and even if you are using them in a static way, it's going to be more about moving to support them when they become threatened, it's not about running away from the enemy shooting necessarily so much as it's about moving units to support with a devastating overwatch volley.
Ha, I truely laughed at that. I wish we COULD take heavy weapons on drones or something.
You have some decent points.
BTW, it's a monstrous creature. Lets just hope it has the options to shoot more tehn 2 weapons a turn.
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Post by: Ledabot
Devilfishs are great at delivering troops to the fight. They are quite fast being skimmers and don't have to worry as much about moving through terrain. They often get a 3+ cover on whatever they're worried about. You can flank your opponent with 2 devilfishs filled with fire warriors and really put the hurt on 1 or 2 squads, not to mention that if they're pathfinder fish borrowed from them, you can deepstrike guys to support you without worrying so much about losing the squad
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Post by: Coyote81
Ledabot wrote:Devilfishs are great at delivering troops to the fight. They are quite fast being skimmers and don't have to worry as much about moving through terrain. They often get a 3+ cover on whatever they're worried about. You can flank your opponent with 2 devilfishs filled with fire warriors and really put the hurt on 1 or 2 squads, not to mention that if they're pathfinder fish borrowed from them, you can deepstrike guys to support you without worrying so much about losing the squad
Since this is the Tau leaked information thread, i won't get started on the devilfish arguements, but lets just say a lot of people 9myself included) totally disagree with you.
Lets hope they reduced the price on Devilfish. Haven't heard and rumors on them.
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Post by: katfude
Devilfish get a lot of hate but I like mine, especially with 3+ cover almost all the time. A reduction in points and a firepoint or two would be very welcome, though, especially with all the new toys that will be competing for points.
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Post by: davou
RogueRegault wrote: Kanluwen wrote: Harriticus wrote:Ugh, the Broadside Missile variant is too much. I liked the old design much more. GW knew the limit back then.
I'm a bit leery of the Broadmissile, but I can understand what they're doing.
With the "old" Broadside, the Smart Missile System was an auxiliary weapon system. The Railguns were the main weapons, with the SMS as back-up or alternatively replaced with Plasma Rifles for a more reliable usage without needing Markerlights.
With the Broadmissile, the missile system is the primary weapon system.
It reminds me of the EVE Online adage "don't mix ranges". This way, you can specialize the suits for a specific purpose.
Not mixing ranges in eve has more to do with damage falloff than jack of all trades'ish ness. IN fact, it could be completely ignored if you were a caldari pilot, or hot-swapped if you were using t1 lazors. In 40k, you dont go from str 9 to str 4 when you range is reaching.
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Post by: Shas'O...Crap
I have always loved the Fire Warrior. I started playing Tau during 4ed, and even during 5th, when they were almost universally decried, my humble FCWs were always right there with me. I even wrote a thread attempting to extoll their virtues, though most vehemently disagreed with me.
Now, with 6th, Fire Warriors are even better, with the changes to Rapid Fire and Overwatch. This Fireblade dude attached to a 12 man FCW squad is gonna be pretty boss I imagine.
Note: For any that are interested here is the link to the article I wrote regarding Fire Warriors,
http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/354355.page
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Post by: Phanixis
Who was running firewarriors around outside of d-fish? anyone, anyone? Hello?
Who didn't have pathfinders parked in cover using heavy markerlights? anyone, anyone? hello?
Who didn't have BS4 broadsides in ruins or behind and ADL? no ASS means, no move and shoot, or were others besides me walking their broadsides around? However, the new broadsides seem to have something similar to S&P so again, what change?
I can't speak for anyone else, but I typically don't run any of these configurations. My firewarriors and kroot are on foot because devilfish are so expensive, I don't run pathfinders because they are too static and force me to run devilfish, I run Broadsides with the ASS so they can move around, and I don't field the ADL (rather bring in allied air support if I need more AA). This is the type of playstyle I hope to avoid (save the no devilfish, those just need a price markdown). I am hoping the new dex will maintain a mobile playstyle, hence why I dread loss of vehicle multitracker in particular (obviously if it is substituted with something else that does the same thing, then it really hasn't been lost).
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Post by: Archonate
I think it's actually the opposite result. Don't get me wrong I like the changes (mostly because I just want changes), but honestly it reduces the mobile aspect of the army.
- Receive +1 shot when staying stationary when firing rifle or carbine. Reduce mobility for sure.
- Supporting Fire: We now need to keep a majority of our units closer together to make best use of their firepower, seems like a reduction in mobility since we are reduced to the speed of the slowest unit to maintain this formation. Firewarrior are slow for sure, especially if maintaining still for extra firepower.
- Rumored loss of Ability for our tanks to fire "as if they were fast"
None of these seem to make me think the army is headed to a more mobile gunline, I feel like we are headed toward a more IG type gunline. But I'm OK with the changes, I just want the codex to change and bring bout new tactics
What you have to remember is that 3 Fireblades take up an HQ slot, therefore, a great many players will opt to not take them BECAUSE they plan to keep the mobility that they've been using and that slot is better used on other options. The mobile option is as viable as ever, only now they get Supporting Fire just in case they're not quite fast enough.
The only thing these new rules change is that now we HAVE to option to play the stationary gun line more effectively than ever, if we want to. Or some synergistic combination of mobile and stationary.
I'm betting that the gimped tank rumor was brought to us by the same people who told us that there's definitely an enormous Kroot monster in the new dex... Which was confirmed to be a blatant prevarication.
This is the Tau. Mobile heavy firepower is kinda their thing. Personally, I'm not worried.
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Post by: mh_mini
The Broadside:
 Automatically Appended Next Post: katfude wrote:Devilfish get a lot of hate but I like mine, especially with 3+ cover almost all the time. A reduction in points and a firepoint or two would be very welcome, though, especially with all the new toys that will be competing for points.
Hopefully you still can.
Unfortunately it appears that d-pods are only going to give +1 coversave. And knowing GW it's not gonna be 5pts anymore. Probly closer to 10-20.
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Post by: Ledabot
mh_mini wrote:The Broadside:
Automatically Appended Next Post:
katfude wrote:Devilfish get a lot of hate but I like mine, especially with 3+ cover almost all the time. A reduction in points and a firepoint or two would be very welcome, though, especially with all the new toys that will be competing for points.
Hopefully you still can.
Unfortunately it appears that d-pods are only going to give +1 coversave. And knowing GW it's not gonna be 5pts anymore. Probly closer to 10-20.
with the 2 editions that have pasts, maybe the base cost will be lower too. It might come to the same cost anyway.
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Post by: Liquid Squid
With how the prices are shaping up to be, I guess I'll have to decide between some Tau and a Borderlands Diamond-Plated Loot Chest. Decisions, decisions.
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Post by: Puscifer
Borderlands what now?
Automatically Appended Next Post:
Just seen it. Averting my eyes.
Carry on.
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Post by: RogueRegault
 Liquid Squid wrote:With how the prices are shaping up to be, I guess I'll have to decide between some Tau and a Borderlands Diamond-Plated Loot Chest. Decisions, decisions.
Everyone knows those things are just filled with crappy Hyperion white pistols every time you open them.
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Post by: Stonerhino
Ovion wrote: Jayden63 wrote:Phanixis wrote:I think it's actually the opposite result. Don't get me wrong I like the changes (mostly because I just want changes), but honestly it reduces the mobile aspect of the army.
- Receive +1 shot when staying stationary when firing rifle or carbine. Reduce mobility for sure.
- Supporting Fire: We now need to keep a majority of our units closer together to make best use of their firepower, seems like a reduction in mobility since we are reduced to the speed of the slowest unit to maintain this formation. Firewarrior are slow for sure, especially if maintaining still for extra firepower.
- Rumored loss of Ability for our tanks to fire "as if they were fast"
None of these seem to make me think the army is headed to a more mobile gunline, I feel like we are headed toward a more IG type gunline. But I'm OK with the changes, I just want the codex to change and bring bout new tactics
As more updated rumors have been coming in I am becoming more optimistic about the upcoming Tau codex, but this is what I truly fear the Tau codex might be. If I wanted to play IG, I would play IG. I want to play Tau, and that means continually moving around the battlefield, especially with the suits and the hovertanks. Granted, the first two bullets points are technically just buffs we are forfeiting by not playing static, which is not the end of the world because the choice is still their to play mobile. But that third rumor suggest our tanks will be hamstrung, losing the ability to effectively fire at all if they move over 6", which I find abhorrent. The suits should not be the only mobile ground based element of the army, I loved the fact that the tanks could keep pace with them and support them.
I'm confused. How has much of anything changed?
Who was running firewarriors around outside of d-fish? anyone, anyone? Hello?
I do. I tend to run at least 6x6 Firewarriors, and haven't used D.Fish in quite a while. (Since I stopped using my Pathfinders.)
Infact, that it looks like we get a Firewarrior Commander, meaning can do a pure Firewarrior army makes me very happy.
Who didn't have pathfinders parked in cover using heavy markerlights? anyone, anyone? hello?
Who didn't have BS4 broadsides in ruins or behind and ADL? no ASS means, no move and shoot, or were others besides me walking their broadsides around? However, the new broadsides seem to have something similar to S&P so again, what change?
Crisis suits and stealth suits haven't changed.
Piranha's are still fast
The only thing that makes anything seem like it might be slower is the loss of making thing fire as if fast, but who knows if there isn't a piece of wargear or a special rule that just flat out let a tank fire all of its weapons. Hell, back in 5th edition hammerheads and D-fish lost 6" of movement thanks to defensive weapons nerf. I really don't see how this has slowed down much of anything.
Now you have a few rules that seem to benifit the tau if they stay closeish together. But with the nerfs to charging, multi-charging, and now supped up overwatch, maybe it wont be such a bad thing to keep your guys a little closer together. DA players don't seem to mind huddling together to get bennies from banners and what not. Hell, it might even be a boon as now you get even better bennies when you try to focus more of your force on a single part of the enemy army. Tau never had an all for me and screw you guys play style. The idea of a deathstar (unless you count Farsight's entourage) is non-existant for tau. We have historically had to keep our guys working in small groups together.
I see it not as a lack of mobility, but a much better representation of small unit tactics and unit assists.
But again, we don't know the whole story yet. Looking forward to it. However, that Tau unit with the commander and extra shot seems like it would be a great forward unit. Two shots out to 30" per guy, 3 shots out to 15, 3 shots when ultimately charged, and then everyone around also helping in. Not to mention the unit is wounding T4 and lower on a 2+. Hell, wounding Thunderwolves on a 3+. Now thats scary.
I mean, I'm only keeping one eye on the rumours, and mostly skimming stuff, preferring to wait for the codex in hand, but I love my Firewarriors, and they've served me well!
My Fire Wariors roll deep.
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Post by: newbis
If the suits are still BS3, I'm gonna be a sad panda.
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Post by: Coyote81
After seeing the firewarrior stats, I'm a sad panda. What are my dudes I2?
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Post by: Kingsley
Coyote81 wrote:After seeing the firewarrior stats, I'm a sad panda. What are my dudes I2?
They've always been I2. To be honest, I'm surprised Cadre Fireblades' stats are so good. If cheap, they look like a near auto-include for Fire Warrior units, mitigating their main weakness (Leadership 7) while buffing their main strength (shooting the hell out of people) and providing strong personal combat stats as well. Split Fire to shoot a BS5 markerlight at a separate target while your Fire Warriors pump out 24 strength 5 shots at long range or 36 up close? Yes, please.
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Post by: Coyote81
Thats the kind of stuff I was hoping we didn't get, I don't want a few auto include units and watch the rest of the units get shoved in the closet for 8 more years. I really hope all the HQs are competitive.
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Post by: Drunkspleen
 Kingsley wrote:Split Fire to shoot a BS5 markerlight at a separate target while your Fire Warriors pump out 24 strength 5 shots at long range or 36 up close? Yes, please.
Or, split fire off an Icarus Lascannon / Quad Gun.
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Post by: lambsandlions
I think suits should be bs4 at least. I am fine with bs3 firewarriors but suits feel like they could have a tracker or something that makes them as good of a shot as a space marine. I LOVE markerlights, so I am kinda happy about the bs3 because that will force us to take them. I just wish that pathfinders were troops to help support the bigger guns. It is going to be hard to decide between pathfinders and the new flyers. But the thing that upsets me the most about tau stats is the leadership. I can't tell you how many games I have lost our stupidly low leadership. Kill one drone in a broadside team and watch 200pts run off the table. Kill three t3 4+armor firewarriors and watch them flee the objective. I just really wish we could get ld8 standard and ld9 and ld10 on leaders like just about every other army.
I wish they would allow us to overwatch at full bs instead of the squads in 6'' rule. It sounds overpowered but it would only kill like 2 marines before they got murdered in CC and tau could never be the aggressor it would just make player think twice before assaulting.
Automatically Appended Next Post: Kingsley wrote:Coyote81 wrote:After seeing the firewarrior stats, I'm a sad panda. What are my dudes I2?
They've always been I2. To be honest, I'm surprised Cadre Fireblades' stats are so good. If cheap, they look like a near auto-include for Fire Warrior units, mitigating their main weakness (Leadership 7) while buffing their main strength (shooting the hell out of people) and providing strong personal combat stats as well. Split Fire to shoot a BS5 markerlight at a separate target while your Fire Warriors pump out 24 strength 5 shots at long range or 36 up close? Yes, please.
Considering the Cadre Fireblades' are $20 each I think GW will make them cheap enough to take with every firewarrior unit.
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Post by: Lovepug13
Kingsley wrote:Coyote81 wrote:After seeing the firewarrior stats, I'm a sad panda. What are my dudes I2?
They've always been I2. To be honest, I'm surprised Cadre Fireblades' stats are so good. If cheap, they look like a near auto-include for Fire Warrior units, mitigating their main weakness (Leadership 7) while buffing their main strength (shooting the hell out of people) and providing strong personal combat stats as well. Split Fire to shoot a BS5 markerlight at a separate target while your Fire Warriors pump out 24 strength 5 shots at long range or 36 up close? Yes, please.
Cadre fire blades are hq choice though........potentially limiting other options ....
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Post by: Fenrir Kitsune
 lambsandlions wrote:
I wish they would allow us to overwatch at full bs instead of the squads in 6'' rule. It sounds overpowered but it would only kill like 2 marines before they got murdered in CC and tau could never be the aggressor it would just make player think twice before assaulting.
Marines would be alright, but its game over Tyranids at that point.
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Post by: IPS
lambsandlions wrote:
I wish they would allow us to overwatch at full bs instead of the squads in 6'' rule. It sounds overpowered but it would only kill like 2 marines before they got murdered in CC and tau could never be the aggressor it would just make player think twice before assaulting.
haha ^^
the only thing worse than assaulting a Tau gunline is standing there and NOT assaulting it
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Post by: OrlandotheTechnicoloured
Depending on the exact mechanics the overwatch from nearby units could be a double edged sword
Attack with a sacrafical unit to draw fire from multiple units, then they can be attacked by more important (or more overwatch vunerable) units without having to face any fire
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Post by: Backfire
mh_mini wrote:
Unfortunately it appears that d-pods are only going to give +1 coversave. And knowing GW it's not gonna be 5pts anymore. Probly closer to 10-20.
Decoy launchers will probably become useful again, though.
Personally I hope that new Codex will revive Mont'ka style of play. Gunline you can already play with old Codex. That aspect needs little improvement as it is.
Fireblade stats are kinda strange. It appears to have Shas'o like statline, but just Ld9?
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Post by: Veskrashen
 OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:Depending on the exact mechanics the overwatch from nearby units could be a double edged sword
Attack with a sacrafical unit to draw fire from multiple units, then they can be attacked by more important (or more overwatch vunerable) units without having to face any fire
IIRC, that's not exactly how overwatch works... as long as a unit isn't engaged in combat, it can still overwatch. So for example, you charge with Unit A into my lead FW unit, and e'rybody hoses into you with pulse fire, and you get one poor shmuck stuck in with that unit. Then you charge in with your more vulnerable units... and even though my lead FWs are locked in combat, their homies in the back still got their back... and are hosing you down with overwatch on the way in.
I think.
Will probably depend on how the rule is worded, of course, and if my reading of the overwatch rules is correct that you can still overwatch as long as you're not engaged in combat.
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Post by: RogueRegault
Backfire wrote: mh_mini wrote:
Unfortunately it appears that d-pods are only going to give +1 coversave. And knowing GW it's not gonna be 5pts anymore. Probly closer to 10-20.
Decoy launchers will probably become useful again, though.
Personally I hope that new Codex will revive Mont'ka style of play. Gunline you can already play with old Codex. That aspect needs little improvement as it is.
Fireblade stats are kinda strange. It appears to have Shas'o like statline, but just Ld9?
I have to wonder if Ethereals have been upgraded.
If Ethereals and Fireblades both give unit buffs, and if Shas'vre finally get BS4 like they should, then maybe people will start playing without Crisis Suit Commanders at all, considering they're just a Crisis Suit with a better statline. Automatically Appended Next Post: Veskrashen wrote: OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:Depending on the exact mechanics the overwatch from nearby units could be a double edged sword
Attack with a sacrafical unit to draw fire from multiple units, then they can be attacked by more important (or more overwatch vunerable) units without having to face any fire
IIRC, that's not exactly how overwatch works... as long as a unit isn't engaged in combat, it can still overwatch. So for example, you charge with Unit A into my lead FW unit, and e'rybody hoses into you with pulse fire, and you get one poor shmuck stuck in with that unit. Then you charge in with your more vulnerable units... and even though my lead FWs are locked in combat, their homies in the back still got their back... and are hosing you down with overwatch on the way in.
I think.
Will probably depend on how the rule is worded, of course, and if my reading of the overwatch rules is correct that you can still overwatch as long as you're not engaged in combat.
I'm pretty sure units are limited to using overwatch once per turn. Even if an assault fails and the enemy remains unengaged the squad can't overwatch again. What this does is discourage death stars.
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Post by: Drunkspleen
OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:Depending on the exact mechanics the overwatch from nearby units could be a double edged sword
Attack with a sacrafical unit to draw fire from multiple units, then they can be attacked by more important (or more overwatch vunerable) units without having to face any fire
But that's a standard tactic even without the area overwatch rule, in fact, what you are suggesting is the opposite of a drawback for the Tau, it's an advantage, you make a sacrificial charge into the target unit to try and draw overwatch, and only the unit being charged fires at what is clearly the less important unit, then when your proper unit tries to charge afterwards, everyone nearby who is still unengaged and didn't fire at the first unit blasts them.
If they didn't have the area overwatch, you either draw overwatch with the first unit, or lock the targets, either way you remove any risk of overwatch for the second.
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Post by: Jadenim
I thought you had to declare all your charges before any overwatch or range rolling happens, to avoid this kind of shennanigans?
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Post by: Veskrashen
Don't think you have to declare all charges and overwatch at once. Think it's one at a time.
Over in YMDC ( http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/470706.page) there was a discussion on passengers in a vehicle overwatching more than one charging unit. One guy points out that the rules state that a unit being charged can only overwatch once per turn.
If we get an area overwatch rule, then even though the unit that got charged can only overwatch once per turn, the rest aren't getting charged... so there wouldn't be any such restriction on them overwatching multiple times, would there? Unless, of course, the Supporting Fire rule includes such a restriction.
Otherwise, it'd still work out like above, with multiple units hosing down multiple chargers trying to get into combat with a single unit. Kroot screening FWs with Cadre Fireblades are going to make for interesting "come at me bro" scenarios.
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Post by: DaddyWarcrimes
Rustgob wrote: tetrisphreak wrote:Agreed on the razorback. However in recent kit releases I think GW has really put afieldable options in their boxes.
I think the last kit that I've personally had my hands on which struck me as having 'plenty of options' was the Space Marine Commander; lots of options! Still missing a couple though, I think.
When you find them, let me know where the two sets of twin-linked devourers are in my giant hive tyrant kit.
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Post by: tetrisphreak
DaddyWarcrimes wrote:Rustgob wrote: tetrisphreak wrote:Agreed on the razorback. However in recent kit releases I think GW has really put afieldable options in their boxes.
I think the last kit that I've personally had my hands on which struck me as having 'plenty of options' was the Space Marine Commander; lots of options! Still missing a couple though, I think.
When you find them, let me know where the two sets of twin-linked devourers are in my giant hive tyrant kit.
If you read White Dwarf's Kit Bash articles, you'll see that they use the Fleshborer Hive bits from the Tyrannofex kit. :-P
Listen I know there are lots of kits where the most "effective" or "efficient" options aren't represented (or in the case of things like killa kans, you only get one set of out of 3 models), but in the long-view GW is overall getting their act together. As new kits come out, most notably necrons for me since they're one of my armies, they tend to have sprues packed full of bits so that models can be assembled in all legal conformations. I have high hopes that with the new XV88 and XV104 kits, we will have all the weapon bits ready to go (and magnetize) to fully customize our new suits.
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Post by: Goat
 Jadenim wrote:I thought you had to declare all your charges before any overwatch or range rolling happens, to avoid this kind of shennanigans?
Declare -> Overwatch? Yes/No -> Roll distance, far enough? Yes/No, If Yes -> move in
You rinse/repeat this process for every unit you wish to try to assault with. So if you overwatch the first thing coming in you can't fire again, also if you decline your overwatch and get locked in by that unit you can't overwatch the next wave.
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Post by: Drunkspleen
Veskrashen wrote:Don't think you have to declare all charges and overwatch at once. Think it's one at a time.
Over in YMDC ( http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/470706.page) there was a discussion on passengers in a vehicle overwatching more than one charging unit. One guy points out that the rules state that a unit being charged can only overwatch once per turn.
If we get an area overwatch rule, then even though the unit that got charged can only overwatch once per turn, the rest aren't getting charged... so there wouldn't be any such restriction on them overwatching multiple times, would there? Unless, of course, the Supporting Fire rule includes such a restriction.
Otherwise, it'd still work out like above, with multiple units hosing down multiple chargers trying to get into combat with a single unit. Kroot screening FWs with Cadre Fireblades are going to make for interesting "come at me bro" scenarios.
Interestingly, it also stands to potentially break the game, by allowing a unit to fire mutliple supporting overwatches when friendly units are assaulted, only to be charged themselves afterwards, become a "unit being charged" and have illegally fired overwatch more than once in a turn.
I imagine even if the RAW doesn't restrict them to a single supporting overwatch per turn, any FAQ regarding the matter would.
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Post by: Veskrashen
Drunkspleen wrote:Veskrashen wrote:Don't think you have to declare all charges and overwatch at once. Think it's one at a time.
Over in YMDC ( http://www.dakkadakka.com/dakkaforum/posts/list/470706.page) there was a discussion on passengers in a vehicle overwatching more than one charging unit. One guy points out that the rules state that a unit being charged can only overwatch once per turn.
If we get an area overwatch rule, then even though the unit that got charged can only overwatch once per turn, the rest aren't getting charged... so there wouldn't be any such restriction on them overwatching multiple times, would there? Unless, of course, the Supporting Fire rule includes such a restriction.
Otherwise, it'd still work out like above, with multiple units hosing down multiple chargers trying to get into combat with a single unit. Kroot screening FWs with Cadre Fireblades are going to make for interesting "come at me bro" scenarios.
Interestingly, it also stands to potentially break the game, by allowing a unit to fire mutliple supporting overwatches when friendly units are assaulted, only to be charged themselves afterwards, become a "unit being charged" and have illegally fired overwatch more than once in a turn.
I imagine even if the RAW doesn't restrict them to a single supporting overwatch per turn, any FAQ regarding the matter would.
I could easily see the RAW written to restrict it to one per turn. Or, alternatively, a FAQ that says if they overwatched already that turn and got charged, they don't get to overwatch the unit that's charging them.
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Post by: Coyote81
I'm pretty confident that they'll state that a unit that uses supporting fire counts as having used it's overwatch for the turn and can neither use overwatch for themselves nor use supporting fire again.
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Post by: Jefffar
 newbis wrote:If the suits are still BS3, I'm gonna be a sad panda.
It sounds like Multi-Trackers and Black Sun Filters might be standard equipment on all battlesuits, that means we still have space for the Targeting Array on a Fireknife or Helios. So yes, functionally BS 4 suits unless you want something like a target lock, a shield generator or some other new widget. Automatically Appended Next Post: Coyote81 wrote:I'm pretty confident that they'll state that a unit that uses supporting fire counts as having used it's overwatch for the turn and can neither use overwatch for themselves nor use supporting fire again.
That's a pretty common sense thing to do.
Which means it probably isn't going to happen that way.
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Post by: gianlucafiorentini123
What's happening next Wednesday?
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Post by: Jefffar
Bunch of stuff, probably very little of it related to 40K in general or the Tau specifically.
But based on people getting WD on the Wednesday before it came out, that's likely when people will get the Tau codex before release.
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Post by: Veskrashen
I'd guess that's when the stores will get their copies of the new codex for sale on 06 April, which means that we'll get more rules leaks and point costs leaks at that time.
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Post by: Ravenous D
All stores GW or otherwise get their shipments on the wednesday (If the FLGs put their order in on monday this applies). They arent allowed to sell it until saturday, but if you happen to know the guys looking at it while in store wont hurt.
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Post by: YotsubaSnake
Phanixis wrote: I'm confused. How has much of anything changed? Who was running firewarriors around outside of d-fish? anyone, anyone? Hello?
*raises hand* I was. frequently had 4x squads of 6, two in DFish (reserve) and two on foot, deployed. Allowed me flexibility to reinforce where the lines got hot or send a squad deep late game for objectives. Who didn't have pathfinders parked in cover using heavy markerlights? anyone, anyone? hello?
*raises hand* Me again. I could rarely count on my pathfinders, but if I did I forward deployed them to wherever they had the best LOS. If that meant using the DFish as a seaturtle cover in the middle of an open area, then so be it. Who didn't have BS4 broadsides in ruins or behind and ADL? no ASS means, no move and shoot, or were others besides me walking their broadsides around? However, the new broadsides seem to have something similar to S&P so again, what change?
*raises hand yet again* The broadside rail cannons were great early game for popping difficult armor, but what happens when you can't see it? I ended up equipping mine with plasma rifles and just going to town on MEQs while still being able to move. Very VERY scary for your opponents. I hate being chained to one location anyways so I never ran an ADL. Just because you think there is only one way to run a codex doesn't mean that is the only way to run it. I'm sure everyone is going to jump into "SPAM THIS TAU UNIT FTW" mindset so I'll just cook together a different angle of attack and people won't know how to handle it when they think all tau players use the one strategy
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Post by: MechaBeast
I recommend that the missile spam broadside be lovingly dubbed as the MMM for macross missile massacre
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Post by: Veskrashen
Anyone heard if we can still take SMS on our Devilfish? If so, and if they're S7 AP4 TL ignore cover as some of the rumors have stated, that might give us the Razorback equivalent that a lot of us have been looking for.
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Post by: Kilkrazy
It had better be an option given the effort I have put into making vertical launch systems for my Devilfish.
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Post by: Jefffar
St7 AP 4 Heavy 4 Twin Linked Ignores Cover on a Devilfish?
That would be freaking vicious - and more or less eliminate the Deathrain and Fireknife as a useful suit configuration. Which would then open up the possibility for more Helios suits, giving us some more anti-AV 14 and great anti TEQ abilities.
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Post by: Veskrashen
Jefffar wrote:St7 AP 4 Heavy 4 Twin Linked Ignores Cover on a Devilfish?
That would be freaking vicious - and more or less eliminate the Deathrain and Fireknife as a useful suit configuration. Which would then open up the possibility for more Helios suits, giving us some more anti- AV 14 and great anti TEQ abilities.
My thoughts exactly. Even if it keeps the 24" range, that'd still be awesome. Quite frankly, anything more than S5 AP5 would probably be amazing, and even if it did stay as S5 AP5 as long as DFish are cheap enough it's still probably worth it for extra anti-infantry shots.
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Post by: Jefffar
I am feeling good things about lots of missiles flying around the board.
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Post by: Veskrashen
Jefffar wrote:I am feeling good things about lots of missiles flying around the board.
Back to old school mobile WarFish style warfare. With better guns, and more support options. I'm loving it, even if I'm looking at the need to strip and repaint a bunch of stuff (as well as get hatches off DFish and the like) with more than a bit of dread. Automatically Appended Next Post: Couple more tidbits scavenged from Warseer and ATT:
- Stealth teams keep Shrouded and Stealth, and can take a Homing Beacon.
- Crisis are apparently 3 suits + optional Shas'vre, for a total of 4 per unit.
If these are true, might give us a bit more flexibility in the Elites section - bigger Crisis units means we can still take 8 Crisis and fit in a Stealth team for Beacon and other support.
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Post by: AtoMaki
The S7 AP4 Heavy 4, TL, Ignores Cover missile launcher is the big one what replaces the Broadside's heavy rail rifle. Or at least that's what I've heard and sounds pretty reasonable.
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Post by: Jayden63
 MechaBeast wrote:I recommend that the missile spam broadside be lovingly dubbed as the MMM for macross missile massacre
That's all good as long as we don't have to rename the ADL the Minmay song defence grid.
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Post by: pretre
From Natfka
 Automatically Appended Next Post: Also from Natfka 
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Post by: Veskrashen
 AtoMaki wrote:The S7 AP4 Heavy 4, TL, Ignores Cover missile launcher is the big one what replaces the Broadside's heavy rail rifle. Or at least that's what I've heard and sounds pretty reasonable.
If that's the case, then SMS may remain S5 AP5, which would still be fine in my book.
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Post by: TechmarineNic
Nice Video, pictures look interesting.
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Post by: TheMind
Veskrashen wrote: AtoMaki wrote:The S7 AP4 Heavy 4, TL, Ignores Cover missile launcher is the big one what replaces the Broadside's heavy rail rifle. Or at least that's what I've heard and sounds pretty reasonable.
If that's the case, then SMS may remain S5 AP5, which would still be fine in my book.
That's going to absolutely ruin flyers. The Missileside is going to probably be our anti-flyer of choice.
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Post by: Samurai_Eduh
Kind of wondering what the limited edition will look like...Different artwork like the Demon codex would be nice.
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Post by: nolzur
 Ravenous D wrote:All stores GW or otherwise get their shipments on the wednesday (If the FLGs put their order in on monday this applies).
All the stores around here get their shipments of GW stuff the Friday before release, or, if they get really lucky, occasionally they will get it on Thursday. There have also been quite a few times that none of the local stores got things until almost a week after official release dates.
Ravenous D wrote: They arent allowed to sell it until saturday, but if you happen to know the guys looking at it while in store wont hurt.
Actually, as far as GW is concerned, showing the stuff to people before release date is a big no-no, and the stores doing it could get in trouble with them.
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Post by: Savageconvoy
I'm honestly a little confused about this so far. So Firewarriors get a minor point reduction but other wise stay the same. Get HQ units to add to their ranks. Only get one transport option. And Kroot are a blank right now. Stealth suits won't be troops, making the battleforce the first illegal battleforce?
So my biggest concern right now is that Tau have always had problems with the troop choices. The HQ will encourage Tau players to play gun line, where they regularly get out gunned due to lack of heavy/special weapons. Kroot have always been a let down. So will Tau be forced to rely heavily on allies for troops again?
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Post by: Ministry
Savageconvoy wrote:I'm honestly a little confused about this so far. So Firewarriors get a minor point reduction but other wise stay the same. Get HQ units to add to their ranks. Only get one transport option. And Kroot are a blank right now. Stealth suits won't be troops, making the battleforce the first illegal battleforce?
So my biggest concern right now is that Tau have always had problems with the troop choices. The HQ will encourage Tau players to play gun line, where they regularly get out gunned due to lack of heavy/special weapons. Kroot have always been a let down. So will Tau be forced to rely heavily on allies for troops again?
This is my biggest concern as well. Weak troop choices without any viable options is a huge downside for playing my Tau. If its not addressed it will definately hurt our ability to be competitve with this codex, just like it did with the old codex.
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Post by: Jayden63
The troop choices are a huge concern for me. The army has always done pretty good at killing stuff (when you brought the right tools). But its staying power in a game based on objective grabbing is pretty pathetic right now.
Troops need to be able to do their job, secure and hold objectives. If they can't do that reliably, then the army will always be subpar regardless of whatever the new toys bring to the table.
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Post by: Davylove21
Do the pre-orders go up tomorrow with the release of WD? Or perhaps at midnight tonight?
This is the first release in a long time I've been excited for. Tau got me back in to 40K and now it's time for me to get back into the Tau. Only problem is waiting on the new book to build my forgeworld suits and picking a colour scheme
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Post by: Lovepug13
I think it's Saturday morning.....i.e. 30th
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Post by: mh_mini
Veskrashen wrote: OrlandotheTechnicoloured wrote:Depending on the exact mechanics the overwatch from nearby units could be a double edged sword
Attack with a sacrafical unit to draw fire from multiple units, then they can be attacked by more important (or more overwatch vunerable) units without having to face any fire
IIRC, that's not exactly how overwatch works... as long as a unit isn't engaged in combat, it can still overwatch. So for example, you charge with Unit A into my lead FW unit, and e'rybody hoses into you with pulse fire, and you get one poor shmuck stuck in with that unit. Then you charge in with your more vulnerable units... and even though my lead FWs are locked in combat, their homies in the back still got their back... and are hosing you down with overwatch on the way in.
I think.
Will probably depend on how the rule is worded, of course, and if my reading of the overwatch rules is correct that you can still overwatch as long as you're not engaged in combat.
That's my understanding of it as well. I dont have the bgb on me but there has never been a rule like this before. I think the reason a unit cant overwatch twice is because previously they were always locked in combat for the second assault. Although if you kill the charger with overwatch can a unit overwatch a second assult? Im not sure.
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Post by: pretre
mh_mini wrote: I think the reason a unit cant overwatch twice is because previously they were always locked in combat for the second assault. Although if you kill the charger with overwatch can a unit overwatch a second assult? Im not sure.
No. "Also note that a unit being charged may only fire Overwatch once per turn." (Page 21)
Doesn't help when other units are doing the overwatch, but that hasn't come up yet.
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Post by: Lysenis
pretre wrote: mh_mini wrote: I think the reason a unit cant overwatch twice is because previously they were always locked in combat for the second assault. Although if you kill the charger with overwatch can a unit overwatch a second assult? Im not sure.
No. "Also note that a unit being charged may only fire Overwatch once per turn." (Page 21)
Doesn't help when other units are doing the overwatch, but that hasn't come up yet.
So it will have to RAW in the book OR a FAQ but if they dont then it is a way for them to make FW's better for what you get since Tau Troop choices are not so spectacular. Now on a side note, most people will cry Haxs! and they will ignore the weak troop choices regardless if Tau can multi Overwatch with units not being charged.
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Post by: SonicPara
Hammerhead/Sky Ray is a loser at $60 with its 20% price increase for no, as of yet discovered, reason. XV-8 team for $65 is surprisingly good and lessens the blow of paying for 12 year old flawed models.
I still think the Pathfinder team is the only quality buy in the bunch at $35 considering how they used to be available and the new importance of drones.
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Post by: Lysenis
13 models for $35 is most worth it!
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Post by: Kilkrazy
Savageconvoy wrote:I'm honestly a little confused about this so far. So Firewarriors get a minor point reduction but other wise stay the same. Get HQ units to add to their ranks. Only get one transport option. And Kroot are a blank right now. Stealth suits won't be troops, making the battleforce the first illegal battleforce?
So my biggest concern right now is that Tau have always had problems with the troop choices. The HQ will encourage Tau players to play gun line, where they regularly get out gunned due to lack of heavy/special weapons. Kroot have always been a let down. So will Tau be forced to rely heavily on allies for troops again?
It's almost as if GW have a vested interest in guiding players to buy a new set of models from a different army.
But no! Such cynicism could not be true of a hobby company with its customers' best interests at heart.
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Post by: Lysenis
Kilkrazy wrote: Savageconvoy wrote:I'm honestly a little confused about this so far. So Firewarriors get a minor point reduction but other wise stay the same. Get HQ units to add to their ranks. Only get one transport option. And Kroot are a blank right now. Stealth suits won't be troops, making the battleforce the first illegal battleforce?
So my biggest concern right now is that Tau have always had problems with the troop choices. The HQ will encourage Tau players to play gun line, where they regularly get out gunned due to lack of heavy/special weapons. Kroot have always been a let down. So will Tau be forced to rely heavily on allies for troops again?
It's almost as if GW have a vested interest in guiding players to buy a new set of models from a different army.
But no! Such cynicism could not be true of a hobby company with its customers' best interests at heart.
AHHHH Kilkrazy, always the sarcastic optimist
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Post by: AtoMaki
 Lysenis wrote:So it will have to RAW in the book OR a FAQ but if they dont then it is a way for them to make FW's better for what you get since Tau Troop choices are not so spectacular. Now on a side note, most people will cry Haxs! and they will ignore the weak troop choices regardless if Tau can multi Overwatch with units not being charged.
Word is that FWs will be 7 points/model. A guy on 4chan did some crazy math from the WD battle report and he concluded that FWs will be 8 ppm at maximum, but 7 is more likely. And at 7 ppm, they ain't that bad at all!
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Post by: Wolfnid420
7 or 8pts? Would be amazing! 1 or 2 pts more than a gaunt and WAAAAY more shootiness!! I haven't seen it anywhere but i just really hope markerlights can up the BS of overwatch......that wouldn't be broken would it?
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Post by: Kroothawk
Keep in mind that it is 10 Pathfinders and 3 Drones. Even the Broadside is listed as three models
Natfka posts a few more pics from WD (via a "Paul").
http://natfka.blogspot.de/2013/03/a-big-tau-pic-collection.html
Two highlights:
Proof that Kroot/Vespids are in the Codex:
Showing where seeker missiles are stored in the flyer:
Not sure if this pic has already been shown: pathfinder drone inserted in Devilfish (plus other details):
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Post by: agnosto
pretre wrote: mh_mini wrote: I think the reason a unit cant overwatch twice is because previously they were always locked in combat for the second assault. Although if you kill the charger with overwatch can a unit overwatch a second assult? Im not sure.
No. "Also note that a unit being charged may only fire Overwatch once per turn." (Page 21)
Doesn't help when other units are doing the overwatch, but that hasn't come up yet.
With GWs notoriously bad rule writing I can see an argument for multiple units shooting the same charger several times on a multi-charge. Warbike unit charges in and FW squads are so close together that they actually wind up charging more than one unit. You charged unit A so I get to shoot with units ABC and you charged unit B too so I get to shoot all of them again. ;-). A little mental gymnastics I know but funny to think about.
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Post by: Kingsley
AtoMaki wrote: Lysenis wrote:So it will have to RAW in the book OR a FAQ but if they dont then it is a way for them to make FW's better for what you get since Tau Troop choices are not so spectacular. Now on a side note, most people will cry Haxs! and they will ignore the weak troop choices regardless if Tau can multi Overwatch with units not being charged.
Word is that FWs will be 7 points/model. A guy on 4chan did some crazy math from the WD battle report and he concluded that FWs will be 8 ppm at maximum, but 7 is more likely. And at 7 ppm, they ain't that bad at all!
This does not seem at all likely to me. 7 point Fire Warriors would be extremely good-- perhaps one of the best Troops choices in the game. I currently believe that Fire Warriors are fine at 10 points, perhaps slightly weak, and it sounds like they are getting better. If they go below 9 points, expect to see lots and lots of Fire Warriors on the battlefield.
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